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The Kenny Report | 3 September · The Kenny Report

0:02
Speaker 1: This is The Kenny Report.
0:05
Speaker 2: Thanks for joining me tonight. An exclusive report as John
0:08
Speaker 2: Howard calls on Anthony Albanese to extend the Bondi Royal
0:12
Speaker 2: Commission and be man enough to appear before it himself.
0:15
Speaker 2: Those exclusive comments from the former Prime Minister in just
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Speaker 2: a moment. I'll get reaction from Shadow Immigration Minister Jonathan
0:23
Speaker 2: Duniam and former Foreign Minister Alexander Downer as well. Also,
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Speaker 2: the gangland killings in Sydney that have taken nine innocent lives.
0:32
Speaker 2: I'll speak with criminologist Xanthi Weston. Sport with Robbo with
0:36
Speaker 2: incredible emotion in the NRL and drama in the AFL finals.
0:42
Speaker 2: And in the National Cabinet with Tim and Mark, we'll
0:44
Speaker 2: look at coalition plans to kill the illegal tobacco trade.
0:48
Speaker 2: Let's get cracking. In an important new development that I
0:54
Speaker 2: can bring to you exclusively, former Prime Minister John Howard
0:58
Speaker 2: has intensified pressure on the federal government over the Bondi
1:02
Speaker 2: Royal Commission, or as they've termed it, the Royal Commission
1:06
Speaker 2: into Anti-Semitism and Social Cohesion. In an interview with me
1:10
Speaker 2: this afternoon, John Howard was careful not to criticise the
1:13
Speaker 2: Royal Commissioner, Virginia Bell, but said the current Prime Minister,
1:17
Speaker 2: Anthony Albanese, should appear before the inquiry to face questioning.
1:23
Speaker 3: I believe that the Prime Minister should appear. And I'm
1:29
Speaker 3: really calling on the government... because they set up the
1:33
Speaker 3: Royal Commission. Rather than calling on her, it's a bit
1:36
Speaker 3: isolating of her. I'd say to the Prime Minister, you're
1:41
Speaker 3: the man who called this Royal Commission. I know you
1:45
Speaker 3: didn't want to, but why don't you be man enough
1:48
Speaker 3: and just extend the terms of reference and give her
1:51
Speaker 3: the flexibility that I think the public.
1:54
Speaker 2: Would agree with and would appreciate?
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Speaker 3: So I'm calling on the Prime Minister to act rather
2:00
Speaker 3: than her.
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Speaker 2: You can almost hear the majority of Australians nodding in
2:05
Speaker 2: agreement with that strong and sensible position. Apart from his
2:09
Speaker 2: status as a successful long-term Prime Minister and the leader
2:14
Speaker 2: who led the country through the period after 9-11, the
2:17
Speaker 2: Bali bombings, other Islamist terrorist attacks and the war on terror,
2:22
Speaker 2: John Howard's view carries extra weight because, as Prime Minister,
2:26
Speaker 2: he faced a difficult controversy, the AWB scandal. He called
2:31
Speaker 2: a royal commission... and he agreed to appear and be
2:34
Speaker 2: interrogated himself.
2:37
Speaker 3: I'd like it to be continued, but I guess the
2:44
Speaker 3: proof of the pudding will be in the eating.
2:46
Speaker 2: I'd like to hear.
2:47
Speaker 3: What Virginia Bell's got to say. We did need a
2:52
Speaker 3: royal commission, and I think it's a pity that some
2:55
Speaker 3: of the leaders of the government haven't appeared. I remember
2:57
Speaker 3: when I called a judicial inquiry into... The Australian Wheat
3:01
Speaker 3: Board allegations, I went into the witness box. I was
3:05
Speaker 3: cross-examined as was my trade minister and my foreign minister.
3:10
Speaker 3: So I don't see why Mr Albanese should.
3:15
Speaker 2: I was going to remind you about that. You've jumped
3:17
Speaker 2: the gun there. I'm sorry about that. No, it's powerful
3:21
Speaker 2: because I was working for the foreign minister at the time.
3:23
Speaker 2: There was the Australian Wheat Board controversy. It was a
3:26
Speaker 2: controversy that was very difficult for your government and your ministers.
3:30
Speaker 2: You called your own royal commission into it. You fronted it.
3:34
Speaker 2: Alexander Downer fronted it and Mark Vale fronted it and
3:38
Speaker 2: you dealt with it. Do you think we've lost an
3:41
Speaker 2: opportunity here? The Royal Commissioner has lost an opportunity by
3:44
Speaker 2: not calling, firstly, the Prime Minister and Anthony Albanese and
3:48
Speaker 2: his Home Affairs Minister, Tony Burke, but also not calling
3:52
Speaker 2: any of the leaders of the Islamist hatred, such as
3:55
Speaker 2: Sheikh Ibrahim Daddoun.
3:56
Speaker 3: Well, that clown who harangued the crowd in Belmore or Lakemba,
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Speaker 3: where it was.
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Speaker 2: Lakemba, yes. Sheikh Ibrahim Daddoun celebrating this.
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Speaker 3: He celebrates how happy he was.
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Speaker 4: That man.
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Speaker 3: At the very least, deserve to be cross-examined for the
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Speaker 3: Royal Commission.
4:15
Speaker 2: This development comes as the Royal Commission announced today that
4:18
Speaker 2: it had been given permission to run just four days extra.
4:23
Speaker 2: Given its reporting date was December the 14th, the first
4:26
Speaker 2: anniversary of the Bondi attack, the Commission has issued a
4:29
Speaker 2: statement saying it didn't want to distract from that solemn occasion,
4:33
Speaker 2: so will report four days later. No-one would want the
4:37
Speaker 2: anniversary overshadowed, of course, but you have to wonder... Why
4:40
Speaker 2: they couldn't report earlier? Or are they worried the anniversary
4:43
Speaker 2: could become a day to focus on how the Royal
4:46
Speaker 2: Commission might have let the country down? Either way, the
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Speaker 2: Royal Commission will now report on Friday, December the 18th,
4:55
Speaker 2: what would be the last working day before Christmas for many,
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Speaker 2: a convenient day for a government wanting to avoid scrutiny
5:03
Speaker 2: over a suboptimal inquiry. As you know, we've focused on
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Speaker 2: this issue for many months here, highlighting how the Royal
5:10
Speaker 2: Commission has not interrogated hate preachers who celebrated slaughter and
5:15
Speaker 2: intimidated Jewish Australians, has not cross-examined the Prime Minister or
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Speaker 2: his ministers, the people responsible for tackling emerging extremism. It's
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Speaker 2: failed to focus on the countless public warnings and pleas
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Speaker 2: for more action against Islamist extremism, anti-Semitism, and anti-Zionism, and
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Speaker 2: it didn't even call Josh Frydenberg, the former treasurer and
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Speaker 2: leading Jewish Australian who led the campaign to have the
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Speaker 2: Royal Commission established in the first place. Sporting legend Dawn Fraser,
5:49
Speaker 2: who also advocated to have the inquiry established, has also
5:53
Speaker 2: criticised these omissions and called for the commission to be extended.
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Speaker 2: So pressure is mounting and the criticism has reached such
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Speaker 2: a level now that it's likely to undermine public confidence
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Speaker 2: in the Commission's findings.
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Speaker 3: I can be critical, independently of her, I can be
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Speaker 3: critical of the fact that whereas it was good enough
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Speaker 3: for me and Alexander Downer and Mark Bale to appear
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Speaker 3: before a Royal Commission, in effect a Royal Commission, that
6:22
Speaker 3: we'd called into the activities of a government agency, it
6:26
Speaker 3: ought to be good enough for at least the Prime
6:28
Speaker 3: Minister and the person responsible for security agencies to turn
6:32
Speaker 3: up and say whether they received any advice. Now, they've
6:37
Speaker 3: got to think. Did they?
6:40
Speaker 2: Were they warned?
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Speaker 5: We don't know.
6:43
Speaker 2: Again, an eminently reasonable call from a man with all
6:46
Speaker 2: the experience to know best. That interview with John Howard
6:50
Speaker 2: was primarily about the 25th anniversary of 9-11, which falls
6:55
Speaker 2: next week. I'll bring that to you on Monday. We
7:02
Speaker 2: hear a lot about social media, how we need to
7:04
Speaker 2: protect children, how it can be toxic and even how
7:07
Speaker 2: it can affect politics and elections. A number of Labor
7:11
Speaker 2: figures have even blamed social media and misinformation for their
7:16
Speaker 2: loss in the Secret Harbour by-election in West Australia last weekend. Yeah,
7:21
Speaker 2: the Albanese Labor government seems to have its sights now
7:25
Speaker 2: on social media just at the moment.
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Speaker 6: I find it really disturbing... the rubbish that is fed
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Speaker 6: to our kids and to our population more broadly with
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Speaker 6: these algorithms.
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Speaker 1: I think it's.
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Speaker 6: Self-evident that social media and particularly the way that these
7:46
Speaker 6: algorithms work are not doing us a lot of good.
7:50
Speaker 7: A real basic approach really to politics is going to
7:54
Speaker 7: be what's needed in the face of misinformation and some
7:59
Speaker 7: extraordinary things we see happening on the internet. And I
8:01
Speaker 7: don't blame any party or any campaign about this, but
8:04
Speaker 7: we know, and we've known this ever since the American
8:07
Speaker 7: election in 2016, the rise and rise of bots into
8:11
Speaker 7: the social media space and comments.
8:16
Speaker 2: Now, this is a little hard to swallow, isn't it,
8:18
Speaker 2: given the Labor Party and its MPs seem to be
8:21
Speaker 2: addicted to social media. For years, they've filled it with
8:25
Speaker 2: aggressive political attack ads, and with some of the most
8:29
Speaker 2: puerile political content you could ever imagine.
8:33
Speaker 8: To fix that problem and increase supply, at the last budget,
8:36
Speaker 8: Labor told housing investors, or ushi collectors, you can keep
8:40
Speaker 8: using the tax system to buy ushis, but only new ones.
8:44
Speaker 1: Happy Friday. It's now been one whole year since.
8:49
Speaker 3: Every worker had the right to disconnect.
8:52
Speaker 1: Enjoy your weekend.
9:01
Speaker 8: How are the Secret Lives of Mormon Wives and Headline
9:03
Speaker 8: Inflation related? This is Policy is Pop Culture, your pre-election
9:06
Speaker 8: guide to the big issues.
9:09
Speaker 2: We could fill a show with embarrassing Labor posts. There's
9:14
Speaker 2: some silliness from the Coalition too, but believe me, it's
9:17
Speaker 2: not in the same league and doesn't amount to the
9:20
Speaker 2: same quantity as the inane stuff from the left. So
9:24
Speaker 2: it's just a little hypocritical for Labor to try to
9:26
Speaker 2: call out this nonsense now when there's a case to
9:29
Speaker 2: be made that one of the main reasons it's in
9:31
Speaker 2: power is because of Labor's vile social media-driven attacks on
9:37
Speaker 2: Scott Morrison and then Peter Dutton and its deliberate and
9:41
Speaker 2: constant appeal to low-information voters via social media. I mean,
9:47
Speaker 2: why else do you think Anthony Albanese would be juggling
9:50
Speaker 2: melons and humiliating the Prime Minister of Japan... on some podcast.
9:55
Speaker 2: In fact, our great mate Johannes Leek summed it up
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Speaker 2: brilliantly in his cartoon in the Australian yesterday. He had
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Speaker 2: the Minister for Sports, Rorts and Ooshies, Annika Wells, about
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Speaker 2: to record another Ooshie economics post, but Anthony Mellon's Albanese
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Speaker 2: intervenes to tell her, no more puerile stunts, please, Annika,
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Speaker 2: or people are going to stop taking us seriously. And
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Speaker 2: there he is, wet lettuce by his side, in his underpants,
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Speaker 2: melons in.
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Speaker 9: Hand, dribbling on about being taken seriously. Johannes was on
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Speaker 9: to him long ago. Let's now go.
10:34
Speaker 2: To Jonathan Duniam, who's the Shadow Home Affairs Minister, joins
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Speaker 2: me live from Hobart. Good to speak to you again, Jonathan.
10:40
Speaker 2: I want to get your reaction first up to John
10:43
Speaker 2: Howard's strong call for Anthony Albanese to front the Bondi
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Speaker 2: Royal Commission.
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Speaker 10: Well, Chris, I think it's important that every effort is
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Speaker 10: gone to ensure that the Royal Commission has every bit
10:56
Speaker 10: of information to make sure this never happens again in
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Speaker 10: our country. That was the point of having a Royal Commission.
11:02
Speaker 10: And that includes getting decision makers before the Commission. We've
11:06
Speaker 10: seen a history of prime ministers, ministers, former ministers, all
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Speaker 10: front royal commissions on different topics. Why one that relates
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Speaker 10: to the biggest terror event that has ever occurred in
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Speaker 10: our history is somehow different, I'm not sure. So I
11:19
Speaker 10: agree and echo those calls and indeed I think we
11:22
Speaker 10: should be looking at a longer schedule for this. There
11:25
Speaker 10: is so much that is yet to be canvassed, I believe,
11:28
Speaker 10: by the commission and I think more hearings are required.
11:30
Speaker 2: What do you make of a four-day extension as announced today?
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Speaker 10: Well, I'm not sure how you can get through all
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Speaker 10: of the information that we've been able to traverse in
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Speaker 10: the public domain. I mean, earlier in the week, of course,
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Speaker 10: News 24 had the information around the whistleblowers report and
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Speaker 10: the AFP document that sort of never existed around lack
11:50
Speaker 10: of resources. Those sorts of pieces of information are going
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Speaker 10: to necessitate a degree more interrogation by senior officials at
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Speaker 10: the AFP. perhaps even the Minister for Home Affairs and
12:03
Speaker 10: others inside government.
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Speaker 1: So four days, a good start.
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Speaker 10: But again, this is the biggest terror event that has
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Speaker 10: occurred in our nation's history on our soil. And to
12:12
Speaker 10: that end, I think we need to make sure that
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Speaker 10: we have a proper interrogation and an extension of some
12:18
Speaker 10: substances needed.
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Speaker 2: Yeah, you see, my position is that there's so much
12:21
Speaker 2: on the public record that demands answers from the Prime Minister.
12:26
Speaker 2: We knew from October the 8th when we saw those
12:29
Speaker 2: horrible celebrations at Lakemba and then October the 9th, the
12:34
Speaker 2: other celebration at the Opera House, which gets more attention,
12:37
Speaker 2: we knew then about the hatred and the threats on
12:40
Speaker 2: our streets. And our Prime Minister did next to nothing
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Speaker 2: after that. Later on, he took some action, but immediately
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Speaker 2: there was no public call, there was no summoning of
12:50
Speaker 2: Muslim leaders and leaders of those communities to deal with
12:53
Speaker 2: that hatred. And this is where I think the Royal
12:56
Speaker 2: Commission needs to focus. All those public warnings that went
12:59
Speaker 2: on then for many months and years afterwards, where people
13:02
Speaker 2: were demanding that the federal government do more, and they
13:06
Speaker 2: did so little. So, how does Albanese ever get held
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Speaker 2: to account for that? if he doesn't even front the
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Speaker 2: Royal Commission.
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Speaker 10: Well, and that's the point, Chris, is that people will
13:17
Speaker 10: be forgiven for lacking faith in the outcome and the
13:21
Speaker 10: findings of the Royal Commission if we aren't going to
13:23
Speaker 10: go and look at those things.
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Speaker 1: As you say, there were so many warnings.
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Speaker 10: We had the terror threat level lifted by our intelligence agency, ASIO,
13:33
Speaker 10: and a specific reference to anti-Semitic hate being a driver
13:36
Speaker 10: for some of these issues. And apparently an NSC decision
13:40
Speaker 10: to not add extra funding to if it's to stamp
13:44
Speaker 10: this out, I'm sorry, that does warrant interrogation. That does
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Speaker 10: warrant decision makers, ministers, and the prime minister included answering questions.
13:53
Speaker 2: Let's go to the Coalition's big policy announcement today. It's
13:55
Speaker 2: about trying to get rid of the illegal tobacco trade,
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Speaker 2: the black market in tobacco that sprung up because cigarettes
14:02
Speaker 2: are now so expensive. Let's have a listen to Angus Taylor,
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Speaker 2: who announced this tax cut today as part of the message.
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Speaker 11: The current policy is protecting the business model of organised
14:14
Speaker 11: crime in this country. We need to smash the business
14:18
Speaker 11: model of organised crime in this country, and that is
14:22
Speaker 11: what an 80% cut to the excise, combined with $ 200
14:26
Speaker 11: million of law enforcement, will do.
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Speaker 2: Jonathan, explain to us how this would work and also
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Speaker 2: what you're planning to do when it comes to vapes.
14:35
Speaker 1: Sure.
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Speaker 10: Look, the cut in excise of 80%, based on the
14:39
Speaker 10: modelling we have done through the Parliamentary Budget Office, will
14:42
Speaker 10: bring legal cigarettes, the price point for those to a
14:46
Speaker 10: comparative level with illegal cigarettes. Again, in the modelling we've done,
14:50
Speaker 10: that indicates people's behaviour will be to choose those legal cigarettes.
14:56
Speaker 10: That is something naturally human beings do. They want to
14:58
Speaker 10: obey the law.
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Speaker 1: Absolutely.
15:00
Speaker 10: But the increase in excise driving the price so high
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Speaker 10: for legal products has paved the way, rolled out the
15:06
Speaker 10: red carpet for these crime gangs to set up as
15:09
Speaker 10: they have.
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Speaker 1: They are well entrenched in Australia, as we know.
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Speaker 10: Where we were in Melbourne earlier today with Angus and
15:15
Speaker 10: Mary Aldred and Jane Hume, the site of firebombings because
15:18
Speaker 10: of this illegal trade, which is running rampant through Australia,
15:21
Speaker 10: particularly in Melbourne. So bringing down the price and undercutting
15:27
Speaker 10: their business model, coupled with An investment, a significant investment,
15:31
Speaker 10: $ 200 million to surge law enforcement and border efforts to
15:35
Speaker 10: stop these goods from getting into the country. The kind
15:39
Speaker 10: of thing we believe is necessary, and based on the
15:41
Speaker 10: modelling we've done, to cripple the crime gang's business model.
15:44
Speaker 10: When it comes to vapes, they should be treated like cigarettes.
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Speaker 1: They are out there.
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Speaker 10: As I've said to every interview I've done today, Anyone
15:51
Speaker 10: who finishes doing the interview goes outside from their studio,
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Speaker 10: they'll see half a dozen, a dozen, two dozen people
15:57
Speaker 10: chuffing on these things and exhaling these vapour clouds.
16:01
Speaker 4: They are not legal.
16:02
Speaker 10: They are not prescribed to these individuals. They are buying
16:04
Speaker 10: them illegally. So let's treat them like cigarettes. Let's regulate them.
16:07
Speaker 10: Let's lock them up behind the counter, plain packaging, not
16:10
Speaker 10: on display, and that way at least we're going to
16:13
Speaker 10: stop our kids. and, of course, these crime gangs from
16:16
Speaker 10: running rampant and selling them to whoever they like in
16:18
Speaker 10: this unregulated way.
16:19
Speaker 1: And, of course, at the end of the.
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Speaker 10: Day, this tax cut, coupled with this investment, does net
16:25
Speaker 10: greater gains through the excise collections on legal cigarettes.
16:28
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's costings from the Parliamentary Budget Office, not
16:32
Speaker 2: the Liberal Party, so it carries a lot of independent weight.
16:36
Speaker 2: It makes a lot of sense. I know a lot
16:38
Speaker 2: of our viewers agree with this, but it doesn't make
16:40
Speaker 2: sense to Jim Chalmers. Here he is.
16:43
Speaker 12: All I can say is from a government's point of view,
16:46
Speaker 12: we take our advice from law enforcement, we take our
16:49
Speaker 12: advice from the health authorities, and our focus from a
16:52
Speaker 12: government point of view has been resourcing these law and
16:56
Speaker 12: order and compliance efforts, trying to bust up what we
16:58
Speaker 12: do acknowledge is a very substantial challenge in communities right
17:04
Speaker 12: around Australia.
17:06
Speaker 2: Yeah, then again, that's the same bloke who says his
17:08
Speaker 2: advice was that housing prices will continue to rise just
17:11
Speaker 2: more slowly.
17:13
Speaker 9: Yeah, yeah.
17:14
Speaker 10: Look, I think you've got to take anything that comes
17:17
Speaker 10: out of the Treasurer's mouth, sadly, with a very large
17:20
Speaker 10: grain of salt because their advice, I'd be baffled if
17:24
Speaker 10: the advice they're receiving didn't indicate they needed to do
17:26
Speaker 10: something like this. What they're doing, the status quo, has
17:30
Speaker 10: led us to where we're at. And I heard the
17:32
Speaker 10: AMA today saying, oh, this will just bring about cheap smokes.
17:35
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, cheap smokes are out there now.
17:37
Speaker 4: Exactly. They're illegal.
17:40
Speaker 1: So we've got to cripple that business model.
17:42
Speaker 10: And to hear Tanya Plibersek this morning saying people will
17:45
Speaker 10: die as a result of our.
17:46
Speaker 1: Policy, people are dying now.
17:48
Speaker 10: People, innocent people, have died in firebombings and horrendous crimes
17:51
Speaker 10: related to illegal tobacco. And this is why something has
17:54
Speaker 10: to be done and that's why we've put this policy forward.
17:57
Speaker 2: Thanks for joining us, Jonathan. I appreciate it. Jonathan Duniam there, Shadow...
18:01
Speaker 2: Immigration and Home Affairs Minister joining us live from Hobart.
18:04
Speaker 2: Let's go to Adelaide now and catch up with former
18:07
Speaker 2: Foreign Minister Alexander Downer. Thanks for joining us, Alexander. I
18:10
Speaker 2: don't know whether you got to hear what John Howard
18:12
Speaker 2: had to say, but he's put the wood on Anthony
18:15
Speaker 2: Albanese to appear before the Bondi Royal Commission, and he
18:18
Speaker 2: makes the very strong and valid point... that he called
18:21
Speaker 2: the Commission of Inquiry into the AWB scandal, which was
18:25
Speaker 2: very difficult for you when you were Minister. I was
18:27
Speaker 2: working for you at the time. You fronted that inquiry.
18:31
Speaker 2: The Trade Minister, Mark Vale, fronted it, and so did
18:34
Speaker 2: Prime Minister, then Prime Minister, John Howard.
18:37
Speaker 13: Each of us spent what must have been a whole
18:40
Speaker 13: day before the Royal... It was a Commission of Inquiry
18:46
Speaker 13: with the powers of a Royal Commission... We spent a
18:50
Speaker 13: whole day, each of us, before the Commission answering questions.
18:56
Speaker 2: It was.
18:58
Speaker 13: Quite a harrowing process. But we didn't set up that
19:02
Speaker 13: Commission of Inquiry to do anything but get to the
19:06
Speaker 13: heart of what had happened with the breaching of the
19:12
Speaker 13: Iraqi sanctions by AWB. What Anthony Albanese has done, and he's.
19:21
Speaker 2: Very clever politically.
19:23
Speaker 13: He's set up a Royal Commission to assuage public anger.
19:27
Speaker 13: but he's made sure that the terms of reference are
19:31
Speaker 13: such that people like him and Tony Burke and so
19:35
Speaker 13: on won't ever have to appear before the Royal Commission.
19:39
Speaker 13: So one of the things the Royal Commission won't be
19:42
Speaker 13: looking into is whether government rhetoric, decisions like the recognition
19:48
Speaker 13: of a Palestinian state and other condemnation of Israel, constant
19:56
Speaker 13: condemnation of Israel, whether that didn't contribute to a rise
20:02
Speaker 13: of anti-Semitism, which I think, to be brutal about it,
20:06
Speaker 13: I think it definitely did. But no, the Royal Commission
20:10
Speaker 13: is not allowed to look into any of that. That's
20:14
Speaker 13: where Albanese is so clever. He'll make sure that he
20:19
Speaker 13: and his ministers never have to appear before the Royal
20:22
Speaker 13: Commission so they won't be embarrassed.
20:25
Speaker 2: Well, of course, Albanese's foreign policy decisions were publicly welcomed
20:30
Speaker 2: by Hamas, so the idea that they didn't have any
20:34
Speaker 2: impact on the public debate in a deleterious way to
20:38
Speaker 2: Australians who are Jewish is nonsense. What are the key questions, then,
20:42
Speaker 2: you'd like to see the Commission ask Anthony Albanese in?
20:47
Speaker 2: I want.
20:49
Speaker 13: The Royal Commission to ask two lots of questions. One
20:54
Speaker 13: is what advice did he get from different government agencies,
20:58
Speaker 13: from the Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet, from
21:02
Speaker 13: the Australian Federal Police, from ASIO? What advice went to
21:07
Speaker 13: his office and to what extent did he look at
21:10
Speaker 13: that advice? What information did he have about the rise
21:14
Speaker 13: of anti-Semitism? I mean, surely he wasn't just reading the
21:18
Speaker 13: Australian and the Sydney Morning Herald and his preferred electronic
21:24
Speaker 13: media outlet, the ABC. He must be going through advisers,
21:31
Speaker 13: finding out about issues. I mean, you have this rise
21:34
Speaker 13: of anti-Semitism.
21:36
Speaker 2: In Australia today.
21:37
Speaker 13: Which was more vicious than in almost any other country
21:41
Speaker 13: in the world. Did no one talk to the Prime
21:45
Speaker 13: Minister about it? Did no one give him advice? I
21:50
Speaker 13: think we need to know the answers to those questions.
21:53
Speaker 13: And I would ask him a lot of questions about
21:56
Speaker 13: the decisions they made to criticise Israel, condemn Israel, attack
22:01
Speaker 13: the Israeli government and to recognise the state of Palestine,
22:09
Speaker 13: thereby granting a huge diplomatic victory to Hamas, which is
22:14
Speaker 13: a terrorist organisation. I'd like him to answer questions on
22:18
Speaker 13: that as well. Actually, I have a lot of questions
22:21
Speaker 13: I would put to him myself.
22:23
Speaker 2: You do indeed. And I think the whole country would
22:26
Speaker 2: like to see him answer those questions. It's such a
22:28
Speaker 2: crucial issue. Let me bring you back to events of
22:31
Speaker 2: the last 24 hours and our Defence Minister and Deputy
22:34
Speaker 2: Prime Minister Richard Miles has been in the US meeting
22:38
Speaker 2: with Pete Hegseth talking about our defence ties, talking up
22:42
Speaker 2: AUKUS very strongly. Here is Richard Miles.
22:46
Speaker 14: The work that we are doing today, the way in
22:48
Speaker 14: which our two Defence Forces are so closely embedded and
22:53
Speaker 14: integrated with each other, and the programs and challenges and
22:58
Speaker 14: progress that we're making in terms of what we have ahead,
23:01
Speaker 14: and AUKUS is a good example of that.
23:03
Speaker 2: 75 years of ANZUS morphed into AUKUS. You would support
23:08
Speaker 2: AUKUS strongly, Alexander Downer, but do you still believe that
23:12
Speaker 2: there will be no nuclear submarines built in that fair
23:15
Speaker 2: city behind you?
23:17
Speaker 13: I don't think they'll ever be built in Adelaide, but
23:20
Speaker 13: I think the important thing is not to use AUKUS
23:24
Speaker 13: as an industrial policy, but to use AUKUS as a
23:28
Speaker 13: way of strengthening ours and our allies' defence and the
23:32
Speaker 13: power balance with China in the Indo-Pacific region. So, number one,
23:38
Speaker 13: we need to get our hands on the Virginia-class submarines,
23:43
Speaker 13: and as many as we possibly can get it, If
23:46
Speaker 13: it's three or even five, that will be a fantastic thing. Secondly,
23:53
Speaker 13: in time, the AUKUS-class submarine designed by Australia, the UK
23:59
Speaker 13: and the US will be built. We may as well
24:02
Speaker 13: just buy them off the shelf from the UK where
24:05
Speaker 13: they already have the capacity to build nuclear submarines rather
24:10
Speaker 13: than spending 30% or 40% premium building them in Adelaide.
24:16
Speaker 13: I mean, give South Australia some compensatory money, but, honestly,
24:22
Speaker 13: it's just a huge waste of the defence budget to
24:26
Speaker 13: be building the submarines here in Australia. We don't build
24:30
Speaker 13: F-35s in Australia for good reason. It would be too expensive.
24:36
Speaker 13: When it comes to defence, focus on defence. Don't focus
24:40
Speaker 13: on votes in Adelaide suburbs.
24:43
Speaker 2: Thanks for joining us, Alexander. Appreciate it greatly. Cutting to
24:46
Speaker 2: the chase there, the former Foreign Minister, Alexander Downer, live
24:50
Speaker 2: from Adelaide. We'll take a break. On the other side,
24:52
Speaker 2: we're going to look at these gangland killings in Sydney. Now,
24:55
Speaker 2: over a number of years, nine innocent lives have been
24:58
Speaker 2: taken out in gang warfare. We'll catch up with criminologist
25:01
Speaker 2: Xanthi Weston. Two innocent people have been shot and killed
25:10
Speaker 2: in Sydney in as many days in a fresh escalation
25:13
Speaker 2: of gang violence. The New South Wales government says it's
25:16
Speaker 2: doing everything it can and has rejected claims that it's
25:19
Speaker 2: lost control of the city streets. Here's the latest from
25:22
Speaker 2: News 24's Matt Taylor.
25:25
Speaker 15: Gang warfare on the streets of Western Sydney. the latest victim,
25:36
Speaker 15: a 40-year-old man, gunned down in a driveway in Maryland.
25:40
Speaker 15: The latest violence is believed to be an escalation between
25:43
Speaker 15: the city's organised crime syndicates. Earlier in the week, a
25:47
Speaker 15: university student was gunned down inside his home following a
25:50
Speaker 15: home invasion. Both victims are believed to have been killed
25:54
Speaker 15: in cases of mistaken identity.
25:57
Speaker 2: Joining me now is Associate Professor of Criminology from the
26:00
Speaker 2: Central Queensland University, Dr Xanthi Weston. Xanthi, good to talk
26:04
Speaker 2: to you again. Look, we often have these outbreaks of
26:07
Speaker 2: gang crime, or have had in Sydney and Melbourne. The
26:11
Speaker 2: one comfort has always been it's sort of good riddance
26:14
Speaker 2: to bad rubbish, badies doing each other in. But why
26:18
Speaker 2: are we seeing so many innocent people now being, not targeted,
26:23
Speaker 2: accidental victims of this gang warfare?
26:26
Speaker 16: Good afternoon, Chris. Well, I think one of the problems
26:28
Speaker 16: is that these organised criminals are using people that they
26:32
Speaker 16: are seeking out online, often very young, inexperienced individuals who
26:36
Speaker 16: want to engage with these gangs. And they're paying them
26:39
Speaker 16: very small sums of money to undertake these criminal acts.
26:42
Speaker 16: And they are simply making very naive, very foolish mistakes.
26:45
Speaker 16: And innocent people are dying as a result.
26:49
Speaker 2: This is incredible, really, what you say, because you have
26:52
Speaker 2: these hardened criminals, organised crime, who want someone dead over
26:58
Speaker 2: some turf war or some sort of issue of trust.
27:04
Speaker 2: But there are people out there, young, inexperienced people, who
27:07
Speaker 2: are prepared to kill for small sums of money.
27:11
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely.
27:12
Speaker 16: We're talking, you know, a couple of hundred dollars, because ultimately,
27:15
Speaker 16: for some young people, they want entrance into these gangs.
27:17
Speaker 16: And For the gangs, it works because they're not using
27:20
Speaker 16: any of their actual members. They're not risking anyone. So
27:23
Speaker 16: for them, you can see why they.
27:25
Speaker 1: Would do this.
27:26
Speaker 16: But ultimately, we're seeing daylight shootings. We're seeing people's homes
27:30
Speaker 16: being broken into, fathers being shot in front of their
27:33
Speaker 16: children because they've just mistaken case of identity. So it's
27:38
Speaker 16: a really worrying trend that we've seen grow recently. We're
27:41
Speaker 16: seeing the same thing in Melbourne in some respects. And
27:44
Speaker 16: I think really this is what the police are going
27:45
Speaker 16: to be focusing on, breaking up these young people getting
27:48
Speaker 16: involved and undertaking the shootings and fire bombings and bringing
27:53
Speaker 16: in the public and putting the public at risk.
27:56
Speaker 2: Did you say a couple of hundred dollars?
27:59
Speaker 16: Well, yeah, we're talking very small amounts, you know. Yes,
28:03
Speaker 16: we're talking, you know, very, very small amounts of cash,
28:06
Speaker 16: but it's really what they want is to become involved
28:08
Speaker 16: in these gangs and they see this as an entrance
28:10
Speaker 16: way to do so.
28:11
Speaker 2: Let me show viewers the victims of this.
28:15
Speaker 17: The true cost of Sydney's underworld war. Nine innocent lives
28:20
Speaker 17: in five years. Among them, grandfathers, sons, mothers and daughters
28:27
Speaker 17: killed by mistake.
28:30
Speaker 2: Just shocking. And here's what the police commissioner had to
28:32
Speaker 2: say today.
28:33
Speaker 18: The murder of two innocent people is something that as
28:35
Speaker 18: an organisation we will never tolerate and it's not something
28:38
Speaker 18: the community has to stand for.
28:40
Speaker 2: We're not going to accept it.
28:42
Speaker 18: No community and I don't want any family to go
28:44
Speaker 18: through the loss of a loved one.
28:47
Speaker 2: Xanthi, how do they get on top of it?
28:50
Speaker 16: Well, they are going to be putting more resources into it.
28:52
Speaker 16: I think that's certainly something that we have seen. We've
28:54
Speaker 16: seen two people die in the last two days. We've
28:57
Speaker 16: had 800 arrests, though, in the last 12 months. So
29:00
Speaker 16: certainly this is going to be a very strong focus
29:03
Speaker 16: for the police. They know this is unacceptable. They do
29:05
Speaker 16: not want this to get any further out of hand.
29:07
Speaker 16: So I think we're going to be seeing more resources
29:09
Speaker 16: poured into this because ultimately they do need to get
29:12
Speaker 16: this under control before we see more war on the
29:15
Speaker 16: streets of Sydney.
29:16
Speaker 2: I'll come back to you for a little bit more
29:18
Speaker 2: in a moment, but let's just go to the police
29:20
Speaker 2: commissioner and the... Sorry, the police minister and the opposition
29:24
Speaker 2: leader here.
29:25
Speaker 19: I do not accept that this is out of control because...
29:28
Speaker 19: As I said, we will not surrender our streets to
29:32
Speaker 19: organised crime gangs. Not now, not ever. The New South
29:35
Speaker 19: Wales Police are working around the clock to... address these issues,
29:42
Speaker 19: to really hone in with intelligence, with the intelligence that
29:46
Speaker 19: they have for these incidents, and they're not going to stop.
29:50
Speaker 20: People of Sydney are right to be terrified and they're
29:53
Speaker 20: right to feel like they've been let down by their government,
29:56
Speaker 20: a government that has lost control of organised crime on
30:00
Speaker 20: our streets.
30:02
Speaker 2: Xanthi, I want to just talk about the trade behind
30:04
Speaker 2: this because we've seen a big focus recently on pill testing,
30:08
Speaker 2: government pill testing at music festivals, and obviously the trade
30:12
Speaker 2: in those sorts of drugs is very much what some
30:15
Speaker 2: of the gangs get into. And I'm also interested in
30:17
Speaker 2: the illegal tobacco trade, whether that has exacerbated the situation.
30:22
Speaker 16: It certainly has. I mean, this started back in really
30:24
Speaker 16: 2020 that we saw these shootings beginning in Sydney, and
30:27
Speaker 16: that was really around the drug trade. as you mentioned,
30:29
Speaker 16: but more recently, certainly the illegal tobacco trade. And we've
30:32
Speaker 16: seen just announcements today on reducing the tax on tobacco,
30:36
Speaker 16: because basically tobacco being so expensive, the trade is being
30:40
Speaker 16: pushed underground. More and more people are buying that illicit tobacco,
30:43
Speaker 16: which is fueling this trade, because ultimately these warring gangs,
30:46
Speaker 16: which is what is causing this, want control over that trade.
30:50
Speaker 16: And so that's where they really need to focus their
30:53
Speaker 16: attention is reducing the those wars and those options for
30:57
Speaker 16: the gangs to make money off this illicit activity.
31:00
Speaker 2: Xanthi, thanks so much. Really appreciate it. Xanthi Weston there
31:04
Speaker 2: from the University of Central Queensland. All these things are
31:07
Speaker 2: connected and governments need to make those connections and protect
31:12
Speaker 2: the public. We'll have some sport after the break with Robbo.
31:15
Speaker 2: There's been incredible emotion in the NRL and more to
31:19
Speaker 2: come on the weekend and lots of drama as the
31:21
Speaker 2: AFL finals heat up. Let's go to the regional health minister,
31:29
Speaker 2: shadow health minister, that is, Anne Webster, live from Mildura, Victoria.
31:33
Speaker 2: I accidentally put you into government there for a moment, Anne.
31:36
Speaker 2: That would be a welcome thing to you, no doubt.
31:38
Speaker 2: I hope you've got us there. I wanted to start
31:41
Speaker 2: off on house prices because Jim Chalmers made a concession
31:46
Speaker 2: on this on radio this morning. Have a listen.
31:49
Speaker 8: So you don't think the current changes are because of
31:51
Speaker 8: your changes to capital gains tax?
31:55
Speaker 1: I think that's one of a number of reasons.
31:59
Speaker 2: So Jim Chalmers has admitted, Ann Webster, that his own
32:03
Speaker 2: policies are part of the reason housing prices are going down.
32:12
Speaker 21: Chris, I've missed some of that, but I'm assuming that
32:15
Speaker 21: you are talking about housing and also about the settings,
32:19
Speaker 21: the tax settings. Of course, it came in in May,
32:22
Speaker 21: the lack of confidence that the market is now showing.
32:26
Speaker 21: First home buyers not being able to get into the
32:29
Speaker 21: market despite Labor's rhetoric. And then, of course, we've got
32:33
Speaker 21: 3,400 construction businesses who have gone under. This is an
32:39
Speaker 21: absolute shame on the Labor government, who are great with
32:42
Speaker 21: the spin, as we've said often enough, but not great
32:46
Speaker 21: with delivery. Under the coalition, we had an average of
32:48
Speaker 21: 200,000 homes being built a year. And now under Labor,
32:53
Speaker 21: it's 170,000. So this is not a good story. And look,
32:58
Speaker 21: it's nice that Jim Chalmers can admit that some of
33:01
Speaker 21: those tax settings are part of the problem, but they've
33:05
Speaker 21: got to do something about it.
33:07
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's very obvious the whole country can
33:09
Speaker 2: see what's going on. Of course, there are other factors
33:11
Speaker 2: at play. Everyone knows that as well. But it was
33:13
Speaker 2: the worst time in the world to make it less
33:17
Speaker 2: ideal to invest in property. Last time Labor did this,
33:21
Speaker 2: back in the mid-' 80s, they recognised the error and repealed
33:24
Speaker 2: it within a couple of years. I wonder whether Labor
33:27
Speaker 2: will be forced to do the same here. We will see.
33:30
Speaker 2: I want to get your thoughts, though, on immigration, because
33:33
Speaker 2: I know you've got concerns about temporary visas for farmworkers. Absolutely.
33:41
Speaker 21: The Working Holiday Maker visa is very popular with broadacre
33:45
Speaker 21: farmers particularly. They have multi-million dollar pieces of equipment and
33:50
Speaker 21: they bring in the same workers from the UK, Canada,
33:54
Speaker 21: Ireland every year. And across my electorate, I've been out
33:58
Speaker 21: in my electorate this week, and let's remember I have
34:01
Speaker 21: the largest grain market belt, shall I call it, over
34:04
Speaker 21: a third of Victoria, which is largely broad acre farming.
34:08
Speaker 21: And farmers are ringing me, talking to me in the
34:11
Speaker 21: streets about the fact that instead of working holidaymakers visas
34:16
Speaker 21: taking one day, which is what the department actually has
34:19
Speaker 21: on its website, now we have them taking 40 days
34:23
Speaker 21: or not actually happening. And you can see Tony Burke
34:27
Speaker 21: and Anthony Albanese anxiously going, how do we reduce our
34:31
Speaker 21: net overseas migration? Well, I can tell them it is
34:34
Speaker 21: not by reducing farm workers. And I've got another piece
34:38
Speaker 21: of news for the Labor government, that our harvests don't
34:43
Speaker 21: wait for them to sort out their visa mess.
34:45
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, they shouldn't add to net overseas migration anyway
34:49
Speaker 2: because they're only here for a short stay. And this
34:51
Speaker 2: is a government that's added 40,000 federal public servants, so
34:55
Speaker 2: they ought to be processing things more quickly.
34:59
Speaker 21: You'd think so. Absolutely, you would think so. And that's
35:02
Speaker 21: what I've said to the farmers today. You'd think that
35:04
Speaker 21: in the public service that they have increased astronomically that
35:09
Speaker 21: these visas would be processed very quickly. But I actually
35:12
Speaker 21: think it's a political issue, Chris. I think it's Tony
35:15
Speaker 21: Burke who, remember, he didn't give his press conference or
35:20
Speaker 21: press address a few weeks ago. He didn't give it
35:25
Speaker 21: because obviously the people even higher up, i.e. Anthony Albanese,
35:30
Speaker 21: saw it and went, maybe this is not a great time.
35:33
Speaker 21: We need to tweak those numbers again. I repeat, it
35:37
Speaker 21: is not with our farm workers who are desperately needed.
35:41
Speaker 2: Thanks for joining us, Anne. Appreciate it. Anne Webster there
35:44
Speaker 2: joining us from Mildura. I want to get into sport
35:47
Speaker 2: with sports broadcaster Mark Robertson joining us from Victoria as well.
35:50
Speaker 2: Good to talk to you, Robbo. I want to kick
35:52
Speaker 2: off with NRL. We flagged this last week with Jai Arrow,
35:57
Speaker 2: the player for the Rabbitohs who had to retire prematurely
36:01
Speaker 2: earlier this year because of MND. But the Rabideaus are
36:04
Speaker 2: putting him on the bench for the last couple of
36:06
Speaker 2: games to make sure he can retire from the game
36:10
Speaker 2: as a 100-game Rabideaus player. Let's have a look at
36:13
Speaker 2: his game last weekend, which was game number 99. Just
36:38
Speaker 2: incredibly emotional scenes there in that game against the Titans.
36:41
Speaker 2: And Robbo, he lines up tomorrow night against their arch rivals,
36:45
Speaker 2: the Roosters. It's going to be a special, special moment.
36:49
Speaker 22: Yeah, we spoke about this last week, and I'm sure
36:51
Speaker 22: all of Sydney have been speaking about it, but this
36:53
Speaker 22: is a national story.
36:54
Speaker 4: Jai Arrow.
36:56
Speaker 22: We always talk about sport and emotion and achievement. I
36:59
Speaker 22: don't think there's been a more emotional and life footage
37:05
Speaker 22: this year. then Jai Arrow walking out on the ground
37:09
Speaker 22: last week, and Bennett, you know, putting his socks on.
37:12
Speaker 22: We all know he's got MND, and we know that
37:17
Speaker 22: eventually is a death sentence. And for the Rugby League
37:20
Speaker 22: and the Rabbit Hoes and for everyone in Sydney and
37:23
Speaker 22: Rugby League to agree to this, I think it just
37:26
Speaker 22: shows that sport, listening to you, this show, and the
37:29
Speaker 22: problems in this country, and then we have these moments
37:33
Speaker 22: of sport where you think, Yeah, life is good. It's
37:37
Speaker 22: not for Joy Arrow, but the emotional impact of sports
37:41
Speaker 22: is enormous, mate.
37:42
Speaker 2: It sure is. There's been a lot of drama on
37:45
Speaker 2: the downside in the lead-up to the AFL finals. Of course,
37:49
Speaker 2: the Kangaroos sacking Alistair Clarkson, one of the most decorated
37:53
Speaker 2: coaches in the games.
37:55
Speaker 4: Time comes for everyone, Chris. One day it'll come for you.
37:58
Speaker 4: We all know that. It was a shock.
38:02
Speaker 22: North Melbourne had been working on this for quite some
38:05
Speaker 22: time And they were able to keep it under wraps.
38:08
Speaker 22: The criticism has come because North were quite honest.
38:12
Speaker 4: Some say brutal. I would say.
38:15
Speaker 22: Direct with the reasons why Alistair Clarkson got sacked. And
38:18
Speaker 22: it's a funny world, mate, because when other clubs sack
38:21
Speaker 22: coaches and they don't give the.
38:23
Speaker 4: Reasons why, everyone goes, oh, that's weak. Just tell us
38:26
Speaker 4: the truth.
38:26
Speaker 22: And when North Melbourne tells the truth, some of Clarkson's
38:29
Speaker 22: mates in the media say, oh, that's a terrible way
38:32
Speaker 22: to treat Alistair Clarkson.
38:33
Speaker 4: He's a legend.
38:34
Speaker 22: Life's tough, mate. He's made tough decisions before about players.
38:39
Speaker 2: He sure has.
38:40
Speaker 4: He took the receiving end of it four years into
38:43
Speaker 4: a five-year contract.
38:45
Speaker 22: And most telling for me was his great mate, Todd Viney,
38:50
Speaker 22: who was his assistant, his head of football. And Todd
38:54
Speaker 22: Viney basically turned on Alistair Clarkson. And for a mate
38:58
Speaker 22: to do that to another mate, That shows to me
39:01
Speaker 22: that there was major issues with Alistair Clarkson as senior coach.
39:04
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's pretty tough. An old sturt man is Todd Viney.
39:07
Speaker 2: Let's have a listen to the president, Sonia Hood.
39:11
Speaker 16: It's become clear that Alistair no longer has the belief
39:14
Speaker 16: from enough people at the club that he is the
39:16
Speaker 16: right coach to take this group forward.
39:18
Speaker 1: This club needs a coach who can coach for the
39:20
Speaker 1: modern game.
39:21
Speaker 8: It'll be a coach who knows what they're doing and
39:22
Speaker 8: it'll be the coach who's the best fit.
39:24
Speaker 17: For this club.
39:26
Speaker 2: Tough words and honest, just as you said, Robbo, quite
39:29
Speaker 2: incredible to see some big names who are former North
39:33
Speaker 2: Melbourne players. I'm thinking of Longmire and Simpson. They could
39:39
Speaker 2: get someone like that back to the club.
39:41
Speaker 4: Oh, there's no doubt that they'll be interviewed.
39:43
Speaker 22: But what's happening in footy, Chris, and as you're aware
39:46
Speaker 22: of people who follow AFL, They're going a lot younger
39:49
Speaker 22: with their coaches, aren't they?
39:50
Speaker 4: First-timers are getting a lot of gigs.
39:53
Speaker 22: And I think Adam Simpson, a 300-gamer, I think his
39:58
Speaker 22: heart would be in it. I can't say the same
40:00
Speaker 22: about John. I haven't listened to him speak as yet.
40:03
Speaker 22: But I think Adam Simpson will be up to his
40:06
Speaker 22: nose in this.
40:08
Speaker 4: But... Yeah, extraordinary week. But all the greats go, mate.
40:12
Speaker 4: All the greats go. John Long, my left. Sydney, he
40:16
Speaker 4: may get it again, but life goes on.
40:18
Speaker 2: Apart from footy, I take an interest in politics as well,
40:22
Speaker 2: and most politicians don't go out at a time of
40:24
Speaker 2: their choosing either, certainly once they get to the leadership job.
40:28
Speaker 2: Let's just finish on the Swans, because as they get
40:31
Speaker 2: ready for their first final on Saturday, the whole sex
40:34
Speaker 2: assault drama has been drummed up because the interviews occurred
40:38
Speaker 2: in Sydney yesterday. Earlier this week, here's Coach Dean Cox today.
40:43
Speaker 23: The players certainly understand that the leadership of the footy club,
40:47
Speaker 23: whether it's the chairman, the CEO, myself, have as much
40:51
Speaker 23: belief in this group to achieve what we want to achieve.
40:55
Speaker 2: And, you know, I think for the majority of the year,
40:57
Speaker 2: we've shown that the brand.
41:00
Speaker 23: Of footy, the style of footy that we play, has
41:04
Speaker 23: put us in a position to have a big impact
41:06
Speaker 23: and earn a qualifying final.
41:08
Speaker 2: Let's leave the legal issues for the Victoria Police. Can
41:12
Speaker 2: the Swans defeat the reigning premiers without three of their
41:16
Speaker 2: best players?
41:18
Speaker 4: Oh, it's going to be tough.
41:19
Speaker 22: You know, footy is decided on attitude and footy is decided,
41:24
Speaker 22: most sports, decided on talent. They've had a big talent
41:28
Speaker 22: hit with, you know, those five players not playing. The
41:32
Speaker 22: one thing that's really strange in football is the emotional
41:36
Speaker 22: pressure Last week, they had a very, very convincing win
41:41
Speaker 22: and are emotional after the game. You just don't know
41:44
Speaker 22: how long the emotional wave can go. But everyone will
41:49
Speaker 22: be watching this weekend to see how they go. They
41:51
Speaker 22: play Brisbane, who is one of the premiership favourites. Your team,
41:54
Speaker 22: your team is going.
41:56
Speaker 4: Look out.
41:58
Speaker 2: We will see, Robbo. Thanks very much. Go the Crows.
42:01
Speaker 4: Let's hope so.
42:01
Speaker 2: It's going to be a big weekend of footy. We'd
42:04
Speaker 2: better get to a break. On the other side, we'll
42:06
Speaker 2: have the National Cabinet with Tim and Mark, and we're
42:08
Speaker 2: going to talk about these coalition plans to kill off
42:11
Speaker 2: the illegal tobacco trade. We like to wrap up on
42:18
Speaker 2: Thursdays with our National Cabinet. Tim Blair's been away for
42:23
Speaker 2: a while, so Mark Nicholson from Stepmate Studio has been
42:27
Speaker 2: doing things on his own. And, Tim, I've got to
42:30
Speaker 2: tell you... He had a quorum. We had a quorum
42:33
Speaker 2: while you were away.
42:34
Speaker 9: Oh, no.
42:34
Speaker 2: And Mark certainly did take a lot of secret portfolios,
42:38
Speaker 2: Morrison style, but the very surprising you is you return
42:43
Speaker 2: to a Mark Nicholson who's no longer just a satirist
42:47
Speaker 2: and cartoonist and mocker of politicians, but a prospective politician himself,
42:54
Speaker 2: a One Nation candidate. Does this worry you?
42:57
Speaker 24: No, no, no, I'm very interested to watch his career
42:59
Speaker 24: arc continue. I'm also intrigued as to whether he's getting
43:05
Speaker 24: any parliamentary lessons, given that his election is imminent. Is
43:10
Speaker 24: he getting schooled on parliamentary processes, you know? The Honourable
43:13
Speaker 24: Member will withdraw his assertion that Labor are all communist garbage.
43:18
Speaker 24: The Honourable Member will stop making those gestures. The Honourable
43:21
Speaker 24: Member will restore his pants to the on position. There's
43:25
Speaker 24: quite a number of things that he's going to have
43:26
Speaker 24: to get a few lessons on. I'm just tipping. But, yeah,
43:29
Speaker 24: we'll see how we go.
43:30
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think what Tim's saying, Mark, is if you've
43:32
Speaker 2: had lessons in how to rort the travel... Entirely, yeah.
43:37
Speaker 5: Mate, I've been looking over the legislation carefully. It's been
43:41
Speaker 5: priority number one. That's the first thing you do as
43:43
Speaker 5: a politician, right? Now, look, Tim, the open invitation, I
43:46
Speaker 5: gave it to Chris as well. If you ever catch
43:48
Speaker 5: me acting or speaking like a politician, you give me
43:52
Speaker 5: a clip.
43:52
Speaker 4: Around the ears.
43:53
Speaker 5: This is the National Cabinet. This is the most important
43:55
Speaker 5: thing to me. This is the safest space in the
43:58
Speaker 5: country right now where common sense prevails. So if you
44:01
Speaker 5: ever catch me, you give.
44:02
Speaker 23: Me a clip.
44:03
Speaker 2: You sound a hell of a lot like a politician
44:05
Speaker 2: when you do the Anthony Albanese impersonation.
44:08
Speaker 5: Oh, yeah.
44:11
Speaker 2: Now, let's get your thoughts there. Let's start in Victoria,
44:14
Speaker 2: and that's where the Coalition today announced this illegal cigarette plan. Now, Tim, 80%
44:21
Speaker 2: cut in the excise. If you get the legal cigarettes
44:25
Speaker 2: down to the same price as the illegal cigarettes, and
44:28
Speaker 2: they're better quality from everything I've seen, of course it's
44:31
Speaker 2: going to work. Of course you're going to kill the
44:34
Speaker 2: illegal trade, which would be a good thing.
44:36
Speaker 4: Absolutely.
44:37
Speaker 24: I think a lot of people have missed the fact
44:39
Speaker 24: that one of the great things that have worked against
44:44
Speaker 24: cigarette use in Australia, it hasn't been the price necessarily.
44:47
Speaker 24: That's a massive part of it. But also social trends
44:50
Speaker 24: have gone away. There's been no huge price impacts on booze,
44:53
Speaker 24: for example, but I guess they have to a certain degree,
44:56
Speaker 24: but nowhere near tobacco. And alcohol consumption is way down
45:00
Speaker 24: as well. So if they can get the black market
45:04
Speaker 24: out of it, the black tar lung market out of it,
45:08
Speaker 24: then all to the good.
45:09
Speaker 2: Mark, I know you've had these horrible illegal tobacco-related firebombings
45:15
Speaker 2: of stores and whatever in Victoria, but I was fascinated
45:18
Speaker 2: to hear criminologist Xanthi Weston earlier in this program say
45:22
Speaker 2: that even the gangland killings, the gangland warfare we're seeing
45:26
Speaker 2: in Sydney, would be exacerbated by this illegal tobacco trade.
45:32
Speaker 5: Yeah, and there's another theory as well, that there are these.
45:36
Speaker 5: These killings that are happening out there are just because
45:38
Speaker 5: either the cost of living is hitting the gangland at
45:41
Speaker 5: the moment as well and they can't afford quality hitmen
45:45
Speaker 5: and they're going out there and shooting the wrong people.
45:48
Speaker 2: It's horrible.
45:48
Speaker 5: Everyone's copping it under this Albanese government. It's unbelievable. But
45:52
Speaker 5: this is just a good common sense. I wonder where
45:55
Speaker 5: they got it from, Chris. I wonder where they got
45:58
Speaker 5: this idea about the excise pack. I seem to remember
46:00
Speaker 5: Pauline Anson going on about this last week, but imitation
46:04
Speaker 5: is the best form of flattery, as you said in
46:06
Speaker 5: your doco, as long as the coalition come around to
46:09
Speaker 5: good common sense policies because of what she's saying, that's
46:13
Speaker 5: a win for this side of politics.
46:14
Speaker 2: So we're all happy. You might be right there, Mark,
46:16
Speaker 2: but it almost sounded like a political point almost.
46:20
Speaker 1: LAUGHTER Ooh, you got me, Chris.
46:24
Speaker 2: I tell you what, though, if you want to see
46:26
Speaker 2: a political point, you can't go past Annika Wells. Have
46:30
Speaker 2: a look at this.
46:34
Speaker 8: To fix that problem and increase supply, at the last budget,
46:37
Speaker 8: Labor told housing investors, or ushi collectors, you can keep
46:42
Speaker 8: using the tax system to buy ushis, but only new ones.
46:46
Speaker 8: In turn, that means more new ushis to rent and
46:49
Speaker 8: more existing ushis for first-time buyers.
46:52
Speaker 2: Tim, how are we going to make this stop? How
46:54
Speaker 2: can these people actually do posts that essentially say, you're
46:58
Speaker 2: an idiot, but I still want you to vote for me?
47:01
Speaker 24: You know, until I saw that from Annika Wells, I
47:03
Speaker 24: didn't realise that four-year-olds were in the housing market. I
47:06
Speaker 24: didn't know that slow infants were somehow involved in property purchasing.
47:14
Speaker 24: That's an astonishing bit of work from her, and that's
47:17
Speaker 24: going to be hanging around her neck for a long time.
47:18
Speaker 24: You know, the internet is forever, Annika. You know, bad
47:21
Speaker 24: luck with that.
47:22
Speaker 2: She's not alone, though. There's plenty of people in this game.
47:25
Speaker 2: Have a look at this little sample.
47:27
Speaker 5: Oh, please.
47:28
Speaker 15: After one week of campaigning, Mummy needs a cocktail.
47:31
Speaker 1: Pink gin from Four Pillars.
47:34
Speaker 16: This is the seat of Casey where we're voting one
47:36
Speaker 16: Aaron Violi.
47:39
Speaker 11: Because when Labor runs out of money, they come after yours.
47:46
Speaker 6: We're banning supermarket price gouging to give Aussies a fair
47:50
Speaker 6: go at the checkout.
47:51
Speaker 8: How are the Secret Lives of Women and Wives and
47:53
Speaker 8: headline inflation related? This is Policy as Pop Culture, your
47:56
Speaker 8: pre-election guide to the big issues.
47:59
Speaker 2: Oh, Mark, I hope you just stick to the cartoons
48:02
Speaker 2: and don't try and emulate this stuff.
48:04
Speaker 5: Mate, no, no, no. Well, this stuff's great, isn't it?
48:07
Speaker 5: It's like this is the, you know, you never interrupt
48:09
Speaker 5: your enemy when they're making a mistake. I'm not going
48:10
Speaker 5: to criticise it much at all.
48:12
Speaker 4: I love this.
48:13
Speaker 2: I think it's good.
48:14
Speaker 5: But to Tim's point as well, there are no four-year-olds
48:16
Speaker 5: on social media, but they're talking to you like you're
48:19
Speaker 5: a four-year-old in all of this because that's what they
48:22
Speaker 5: think you are. That's how smart they think you are.
48:24
Speaker 5: They are very patronising this. So it's great.
48:28
Speaker 2: Now, we're nearly out of time, but Donald Trump often
48:31
Speaker 2: divides people and their opinions, I reckon, on this point.
48:34
Speaker 2: about Harry and Meghan going back to the UK, everybody
48:38
Speaker 2: surely agrees with the Donald.
48:41
Speaker 4: I'm happy about it. I was not a fan.
48:44
Speaker 5: I thought they treated the royal family with great disrespect.
48:48
Speaker 4: I didn't like it. I didn't like the way she acted.
48:50
Speaker 18: I thought she was terribly disrespectful to the Queen, to
48:55
Speaker 18: King Charles.
48:57
Speaker 4: And I don't know. Maybe I'm different. I wouldn't have
49:01
Speaker 4: taken him back.
49:03
Speaker 2: Only a couple of seconds each. You with him, Mark? Mate,
49:06
Speaker 2: I love it, mate.
49:07
Speaker 5: Look at him bringing the world together. He's such a
49:09
Speaker 5: beautiful man. I love this stuff.
49:12
Speaker 24: We've just seen someone who actually can do popular culture
49:15
Speaker 24: as a politician.
49:16
Speaker 2: Exactly.
49:17
Speaker 4: He gets it.
49:18
Speaker 2: Thanks for joining us, gents. We'll catch you next time.
49:20
Speaker 5: Week.
49:20
Speaker 2: Mark Nicholson and Tim Blair there. I'll see you next week.
49:23
Speaker 2: Here's Peter Credlin.