Latest / Do Small Business Like a Big Boss Podcast / The Bootstrapped EdTech Playbook: Offshore Teams, DIY PR, and 20K Users
Transcript
- Aisha Massengill: I always tell my people that companies are only people. So, you know, it's a logo, but it's people behind the logo. And at the end of the day, we're only going to go as far as our relationships. So I make it a point to continue to build rapport, build meaningful, long lasting relationships. And with that, I feel like if that continues to be our basis, the technology itself helps us scale that. But foundationally, people determine everything. And there's people behind every logo. Welcome to Do Small Business Like a Big Boss, where we explore the real stories, hard-earned lessons. and game-changing strategies of entrepreneurs who've moved beyond the side hustle and built businesses that scale with confidence. This show is proudly sponsored by Project Icon. I'm your host, Aisha Jorge-Masingil, your Small Business Legal Guide. Let's dive in. Hey, bosses. Welcome to the latest episode of Do Small Business Like a Big Boss. I'm your host, Aisha Jorge-Masingil. your small business legal guide. And today I'm excited to be chatting with Renaud Drake Sanders. Renaud is a serial entrepreneur and ed tech founder who built School Economy Inc. out of a simple but powerful idea. School is a student's first job, so students should get paid for it. He's spoken on Microsoft's campus in front of education and thought leaders and has been on Fox 5 in Atlanta. Renault is equal parts technologist and business strategist. Welcome, Renault. Hey, thanks for having me, Aisha. I'm so happy to be here. And I'm ready to help people do business like a big boss. There you go. That's the energy that I want on the front end. Yes. Absolutely. So before we ⁓ get too deep down the road, just tell me when school economy kind of became an idea for you. Well, while I was in school at Kennesaw State, I would think to the same, you have a job, it's called school. So on one hand, you do a ton of work, but on the other hand, you haven't had the opportunity to get paid for it. So that spawned the idea for School Economy. Since then, it's been amazing. As you spoke to, we've been picked up by Fox 5 News and a multitude of other outlets. That's the primary focus is just helping students stay motivated in the classroom and giving them an opportunity to learn and earn. Love that idea. And one of the things that I learned is your strategy of not necessarily going after those A students right away. Is that correct? And tell me a little bit about that. Yeah. So with that, students need that additional motivation for their grades to get up. What I found is that the students right in the middle are a few good decisions away from an amazing life and a few bad decisions away from turmoil. So we were created to save them. Man, that's so, so powerful right there because part of what I talk about in this show is the messy middle, right? So it's like the beginning, you're trying to start up, you're scrappy, and then eventually you get almost to where you want to get, because I believe like... There's no destination, it's a journey. But it is that messy middle. And I would imagine, you know, for kids, I have three kids and I know one of my sons in particular, if he would have had the motivation to be paid for what he was doing in school, he really would have tapped into his brilliance a lot sooner. You also talked about your cousin dropping out of 11th grade to make money, having an impact on how and why you started. Can you tell us a little bit more about that? Yeah, so during that time period while I was in school, he was in a position where he wanted to get out in the real world and make money. And being in Atlanta, we see a ton of the illusion of money all around us at all times. So with that, luckily, he was able to be an anomaly and step out and start his own business and find that success. But with that, it was a ton of skepticism from the aunties in the family that wanted me to talk with him and keep him in school. And he made some good points. And essentially, can't tell anybody what to do with their finances, about finances. So a lot of the things that I was saying about staying in school and pushing your earning opportunities back. He wasn't hearing it. And like I said, he was one of the anomalies that did have a successful outcome from it. But with that, everybody isn't so lucky. So I wanted to create an environment where students can feel like their academic tenure is producing an economic impact for their families. I've had kids as young as fifth grade say, I wanna make money to help my mom with rent. And when I hear heartbreaking things like that, I understand that this is real life and real world is going on around these students and there is no separation from it anymore. I feel when we were coming up, we didn't think about money until we got to high school and college, but. Now with social media, instant gratification being so prevalent, these students are exposed to so much more. And along with being exposed to more, they're also being exposed to misinformation in the economic and financial space. So their understanding of how they'll actually be able to learn is missing. So that's why we also wanted to roll out our financial literacy quizzes, social emotional learning, mental health and wellness, helping create a foundation for those students to truly excel in life. And it all starts from those individual conversations that I'm having with the youth. That's amazing. Do you ever get pushback from people saying school is supposed to be about learning, not the earning part, and that that focus is misplaced for the students? Yeah. Well, of course, when you are coming out with a new product, anything innovative depends on you changing the behavior of the market. So early on, we got a lot more pushback than we are now. So the more is proven, the more PR opportunities we're getting and the more success stories we're getting from students have really helped us be able to change the behavior of that market. just from a basic standpoint. Tell us how school economy works and you do it from both sides. You're dealing with motivating the students, but also developing partnerships, et cetera, with different corporate entities. just, can you just walk us through like what it is, what it does and how it's been so successful? Certainly. We keep it free for students always. That was important to me that every student has the same opportunity on our platform. With that, a student finds out about it from their friend. that sends them their referral code. And once they sign up with that referral code, they immediately are cast into our ecosystem where they can upload their first grade. When they upload their grade, that grade has them receive a point in a weighted capacity, of course. Once they receive their points, they might determine, I see the reward that I want, but I don't yet have enough points to redeem it. So now, They go and engage with a social and emotional learning quiz to earn some points. Then they'll go and engage with a mental health and wellness quiz to earn more points. Once they've earned enough points for that reward that they want to redeem, they go into our rewards marketplace, select that reward, and then that reward is sent to their email address, and they receive it in their email. From the corporate side, we feel top of funnel engagement for our brand partners. And we span across different types of companies, gaming companies, other ed tech companies. We've worked with the NBA G League to distribute tickets for the Texas legends out in Dallas for words, movie tickets at Look Dine In cinemas. And we were even the primary engagement. feature at the Macy's and Polo rollout at the Linnit Square location of Macy's. So we've been able to be utilized in a ton of different capacities. But for us, our primary focus is the more rewards we have to get to our students, the better life outcomes we can produce for our students. you just dropped some gems, because I think I just heard you say basically that you got affiliate links for the babies. the people, the kids who give the referral link. what kind of reward do they get? So when they do the referral, they get 1,000 points every time someone uses their referral link. So my thought process behind that was some people are popular in the school but don't have the best grades. So I want to get that popular kid an opportunity to earn points for knowing a ton of people too. ⁓ That's fantastic. it continues to then circulate and grow your ecosystem with the kids. ⁓ And I would also imagine, too, it makes it cool, makes learning cool, makes learning fun in a way that maybe hasn't been done before. I've just never heard of a program like this. I I've heard of getting rewards and stuff like that. But on this level, it's just incredible what you're doing. Thank you so much. I'm glad that resonates with you. And that was the objective to create an ecosystem that's a win-win environment for everyone, for everyone involved. additionally, giving those corporate sponsors an opportunity to truly make their corporate social responsibility and have clear visibility into the impact that they are making. let's talk about that a little bit, because I'm just curious. There was a time in recent vintage where A lot of corporations were very outspoken about supporting mission-driven work like yours. Have you experienced any dip in the support from your corporate partners and sponsors over the last year or two, or has it been steadily climbing for you? For us, it's been steadily climbing primarily because of our positioning to be a marketing spin more so than strictly corporate social responsibility. So because we have that element where we can show you data of the impact of the engagement on your bottom line, that's helped us continue to close deals. Awesome. Awesome. And so you're talking about deals and that makes me go into when you're starting, how are you funding this? How did you get that piece of the business started? Yeah. initially I funded. $2,000 of Amazon gift cards directly from my pocket to prove out that it worked. And once we got the traction from users on the platform, then I was able to... collaborate with other rewards partners to start getting rewards onto the app. And in terms of closing the deals, we work with marketing departments that are looking to engage with that youth market. And we've been able to show, improve ourself in that regard. And what is the, I think I've seen some numbers on your website and some of the other things that I've read. How many schools or kids do you have in your app or in your program now? Right now we have 20,000 students active using the platform, spanning across the US. Our primary markets are New York, Atlanta, and Dallas. lot of traction in Orlando currently also. Excellent, excellent. And then what are your plans for continued growth? Are you going to stay focused on those cities? So the plan for continued growth is to... truly lean into that New York market and serve the students of New York. Our relationship with the Queens Chamber of Commerce has been fruitful and we understand the need in New York is there. So our relationships there are also pulling us in that direction. So we want to be sure to serve them. Our partnership with the CUNY University system, more specifically Queens College, being able to work with them and the students out of there. We've been able to partner with them and give them internship opportunities. Another huge segue into the internship opportunities with us being able to work with interns at different universities throughout the U.S. that helps us keep our ear to the heartbeat of students and also allowing students to make a real time impact on what we're building. That's the most important. Every year I get older, I get a step away from the culture, but being able to utilize our interns, allowing them to be practitioners of whatever talents and skills they have in real time has been huge. We've had interns from Georgia Tech, Georgia State, Kennesaw State, my alma mater, but also up in the New York area, we work with students from FIT, NYU, Columbia, and we're looking forward to building those relationships over time. I'm smiling just because ⁓ I have a lot of siblings and my baby sister, I'm a good deal older than her. And I swear, like the way that I stayed relevant back in the day was like... She would watch 106 at Park and I would just be in the room, why, okay, this is what's happening now. And you talk about like the importance of staying connected so that you have something where you're servicing the needs of kids. But at some point, I joke now, I always say, well, I aged out of that system. At some point you do kind of lose that connection. So it's wonderful that you recognize that. The other thing you recognize, and I want to hear from you about your approach, is the importance of. relationship building and these strategic partnerships. I'm a New Yorker by birth. when you say CUNY for the folks who are listening, that's the City University of New York. How did you go about being, being that you're in Atlanta, what made you say like, let me get into, let me tap into New York, what's happening there, what's happening in Orlando, what's happening in Texas. And then how did you actually like get connected with those folks? Right. So. I love what you said about relationships. Relationships are everything. I always tell my people that companies are only people. You know, it's a logo, but it's people behind the logo at the end of the day. With that, when I launched the product in January of 23, I knew that Georgia wasn't as progressive. in the Ed Tech space. So when we got our first 50 users, I took a flight to Dallas, Texas and went into North Dallas High School. just knocking on random doors. This was the second school I went to. The first school was Highland Park High School. The second school was North Dallas High School. When I got in there, I came across a teacher in the front office and she invited me to come speak to her class. And from there, we got our first 50 users. I got feedback on what type of rewards they wanted to see. And I also had an opportunity to speak to four periods of students. let them know what they needed to be focused on as they were progressing forward towards college or what other post-graduation opportunities there were out there. From there, made it back to Atlanta, started getting more traction in Atlanta because of my attraction in Dallas. I reached out to the, what foundation was it? Ron Artest Foundation. He's a Queensbridge guy. That's right. His executive director invited us out to their holiday party. When I got there, I got an opportunity to build rapport with his father, Ron Artest Senior. I got an opportunity to build rapport with. different people in the community, especially like T3I Sports. They've been a great partner of ours out in New York as we've been able to grow in that direction. And that's also how we crossed paths with Donovan Richards, the Queensborough president's office. And from there, Thomas Gretch from the Queens Chamber of Commerce felt that he resonated. greatly with what we were doing. Him and Neil Wagner out at the Queens Chamber of Commerce made sure that we were taken care of and we were able to erect an auxiliary office in Queens. And that's been huge for our growth since then. So I really appreciate the Queens Chamber of Commerce and Queensborough as a whole. That's really amazing. First of all, Ron Autest, AKA, Federal Peace is like one of my favorite Hoopers just because of his tenacity. He's a little bit eccentric, but I love him nonetheless. But you just touched on something for me really interesting about you have a tech company, but it sounds like so much of the growth of it is because you're outside. You're meeting people and humans. that, you know, is that intentional in how you're building your company, making sure that you have those human touch points, even though you have a tech company? Yes, that is intentional. We're a people company first. And at the end of the day, we're only gonna go as far as our relationships. So I make it a point to continue to build rapport, build meaningful, long-lasting relationships. And with that, I feel like if that continues to be our basis, the technology itself helps us scale that. But foundationally, people determine everything. And it's people behind every logo. Yes. And technology is important. So tell me a little bit about that because I was reading that you built the company using offshore development team before everything was like fully funded. What was that like, especially being able to manage the quality control and any challenges you encountered going that route? So I'll frame this more so in the advice. Whenever you're working with the offshore team, always be sure to have someone who is technical that is near you that you can have speak to them so that they feel your company is bigger and more official. You don't want to be a solopreneur that's non-technical talking to these technical offshore people because then they know you don't know how to vet my work. You don't know how the pricing should be. You don't understand the timetables behind it. And I was starting fresh with no technical experience. I was completely a marketer and sales guy only. So what I did was reached out to two of my guys in my network. who were working at technical jobs that didn't have time to be on my team, but they had a bit of time to vet out our talent. So they had the meetings with them, with me on it, of course, and that set us up in a position to get the best deal and the best work possible. And the offshore team we worked with to start the company, we're still working with them now. The relationship has been great. People say that we were lucky for that to happen, but I feel like it was more so in the preparation and those first conversations that got us set off on the right foot. They understood how serious we were as a corporation and what we were aiming at. So they were able to fully buy into our vision. That's a really major. point making sure that you have that expertise by your side to fill in your gaps. made me think about if you ever ⁓ work with a contractor, no disrespect to the construction contractors out there or mechanics, right? If you don't have some level of fluency in those areas. then people will sniff that out and they'll take advantage of you. And so the fact that you were able to identify that is really important, especially in the technology space. There has to be some fluency there or having the people like you did to help you bridge that gap so that you could validate their work. for folks out there who are... going along this process, think that's something really, really important to lock in on. Absolutely. That is the most important element when working with the offshore team. Be sure to have somebody else. And it also adds the element when you can say, hey, this is our chief technology officer. It just makes the company look better. Mm-hmm. Yep. You talked about Amazon gift cards, and that was your start. And then now, I think you don't take outside funding. How are you funding operations? How do you decide where to place your bets in terms of what you're spending and what you're spending it on? And when you're like, nah, that's not an investment for us right now. Yeah, so our primary sales motion is two partners that are looking to reach the youth market and they pay a fee to be on our platform and have that visibility on our platform. That's amazing. ⁓ And do you have concerns about being limited to just a couple of partners? So for example, if one decided to leave, do you feel confident that your business would still be able to stabilize? Certainly the way our platform is set up, we serve different types of partners across all industries. So we're not over concentrated in one specific deal or one specific vertical. So with that. Our unit economics work well, not a ton of overhead. I wanted to make sure we didn't have a ton of overhead when we got started. And the distribution is nicely done at this point. So students resonate with what we're doing. They resonate with the story and they tell their friends about it. So tell me a little bit about, you mentioned, you know, the importance of kind of having that CTO strategic partnerships. What are some of the other back, back end? kind of processes or structural things that you have in place to make sure that the organization hums. Like how much of it is you're still really driving stuff and how much of it is you have systems and people supporting you on the back end? So early on, I was like a, I don't even know the word for it, but I was all over the place. I was spinning every gear. And essentially, Guy has been able to make me Iron Man. essentially what I've been able to do is create standard operating procedures and then transform those standard operating procedures into AI workflows through tools like Zapier or N. And that's been the complete game changer. Yeah. ⁓ This is like a personal moment of pride because I am not techie, but I have zapped. I've used Zapier integrations and workflows and things like that. And so it is, it's been a journey for me to gain. If you're a business owner, you have to have some level of fluency in these things. ⁓ and so I'm like patting myself on the back that I actually understood what the heck you just said to me. Recognize the different companies you're talking about. Yes. One of the things that you've. congratulations on is the visibility, getting the news coverage and being picked up. Was that organic? Was that something that you actively went out and courted? How did that happen? How does it continue to happen for you? Yeah. So with that, I've had to learn every part of the business. When you step in to be a CEO, you got to do everything from sweeping up the floors to handling the accounting. So. One of the skillsets I had to learn was how to get the attention for PR opportunities. And with that, I just pressed up a press release and started reaching out. The first news feature we got was on Atlanta News First. It was a small segment, about 10 seconds, but I got it from riding on 85 in the middle of Midtown. We were in traffic. I saw Atlanta News First truck. And I told the guy, roll the window down. How can I get a story? I got an app that reward kids. This is when we were first launching. And he gave me an email to reach out to. I sent them my press release. And maybe a week later, I started getting calls like, hey, I just saw your app on the news. And from there, I was able to connect. through a third party to get my press release to a producer at Fox 5 News. And that led to Alex Whitler at Fox 5 News picking up our story, telling our story. And we were actually featured back to back on Fox 5 News at that point in time. So it was really great and amazing time. That truly helped with our distribution since the syndicated network picked us up. With that. The PR opportunities are huge. That's something to continue to keep flowing over time. I believe in compounding over time. I knew that because I was doing something innovative, people would want to talk about the feel good story. So really just taking advantage of that. And for anybody that's building in a niche market, something that's a cool story, the PR opportunities are immense. in growing your platform, especially when you get opportunity to get those. Or if you don't get an opportunity, make an opportunity for yourself. Listen, shout out to you for stopping the truck. You never know when the opportunity is going to present itself. And the fact that you just shot your shot and it materialized into something is really amazing. And it's something that you created for yourself. So definitely shout out for doing that. I want to fast forward to 2028 because my understanding is that you want 1 million students to be on school economy. What does that, what will that look like in your world, in the world for the kids when that happens? When that happens, a student will be able to upload their grades on earn points to they'll be able to learn about. any topic under the sun in our quiz environment. They'll have any resource at the touch of a button in our marketplace. And that's everything from dental care to glasses and everything in between on top of, you know, the gift cards and the games and things like that. But we want to step into the more need-based resources that students are going to need. Excellent. Excellent. All right, Renaud, I'm almost... I'm almost done. I got to ask you the question that I ask all of my guests. What we got? When you hear the phrase, do small business like a big boss, what does that mean to you? Do small business like a big boss. All seeds grow from within. So whatever DNA you have internally, that's the fruit that you'll bear. So when your mindset is on the wavelength of moving like a big boss, Being a big boss and you do small business like a big boss, big returns will come from it. But it all starts from tuning your mind that you are the big boss today, no matter where you are on your journey. Let the church say amen. Where can the people find you? Check us out at schooleconomy.com. That's school and economy with no E, all one word. School economy. You can Google us, School Economy, S-C-H-O-O-L-C-O-N-O-M-Y. We love to connect with you and collaborate with you guys. Check us out there. You can find all of my personal information there also. Well, Renaud, this has been some fun. This has been love the mission. I love. the success and your grind and wish you continued success. Thank you so much for being on the show. Thank you so much for having me. I appreciate you. And we're going to continue to do small business like big bosses. Yeah. All right, bosses. That's all we have for today. If anything struck a chord with you, please take a moment to like, rate and subscribe. It really helps the pod grow. And as always, just remember, build that dream messy. Build that dream scared, but just don't build it small. We'll see you next time.