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Darth Vader: A Star Wars Story · Aggressive Negotiations: A Star Wars Podcast

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Careful what you Google.
• 0:02
  Speaker 2: Welcome to the Nerd Party.
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: Hi, this is Nick Anastasio, lead editor and writer on
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: Maul Shadowlord, and you're listening to Aggressive Negotiations.
• 0:19
  Speaker 2: Welcome to Aggressive Negotiations, the Star Wars podcast episode. that
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: seeks to explore every nook and cranny of that Star
• 0:26
  Speaker 2: Wars galaxy far, far away that you have also wanted
• 0:30
  Speaker 2: to explore. I am one of your hosts, Jedi Master
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: John Mills, and with me, as always, is my dear friend,
• 0:36
  Speaker 2: my close compatriot, Jedi Master Matthew Rushing. Matt, we have
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: a great topic for today. I'm presuming that your robes
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: are freshly pressed, cleaned, and ready for public presentation today.
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: John, they absolutely are. I've actually, I'm wearing my best
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: robes right now. These are the ones with the gold fringe.
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: And goodness, I look fantastic, if I do say so myself.
• 1:04
  Speaker 2: Very sparkly, folks. When he lights up his lightsaber, it
• 1:07
  Speaker 2: just sparkles like a disco ball. It's an amazing thing
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: to behold. But another amazing thing to behold is to
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: wander on over to Apple Podcasts and give us a
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: star rating and review. We would appreciate it if you
• 1:18
  Speaker 2: have not done so already. But we are happy that
• 1:21
  Speaker 2: you are just listening to us because we do this
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: for the love of the game. And you can also
• 1:26
  Speaker 2: love us over on social media at the Jedi Masters
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: on X and at Join Nerd Party on X, the
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: Nerd Party on Facebook and Instagram. And with all of
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: that said, our topic today, Matt, is there is a
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: persistent rumor. No idea if it's true. We usually don't
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: delve into release rumors, but it's a good topic, I think,
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: to discuss because... Star Wars has continually tried to find
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: its footing outside of the scope of the saga movies.
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: We've had ranging success, everything from Rogue One to Solo,
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: a Star Wars story, to Star Wars, The Mandalorian, and Grogu.
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: We can't even get our titling conceits consistent across them.
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: We went seven years without a movie release, which is,
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: you know, I mean, For those of us who grew
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: up with the original films and then the prequels, that's
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: nothing that's standing on your head, kids. I don't know
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: what you're complaining about. But in today's environment, everybody's expectation
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: is if you don't have a movie a year, then
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: you're as irrelevant as James Gunn's DC Universe. So with
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: that said, the persistent rumor right now is that there
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: will be a Star Wars Darth Vader movie focused on
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: the early years of Darth Vader featuring Hayden Christensen coming back.
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: to the role. Let's set aside whether this rumor is
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: true or not. Is a Darth Vader standalone movie something
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: you would want to see? And what potential do you
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: see in it?
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: Well, I think the interesting thing is this does feel
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: like something that people would want. So I think on
• 3:07
  Speaker 1: that front alone, I can't see people not being interested
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: in a Darth Vader film. And yet I think the
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: first question that I want to ask you and I
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: think we need to kind of wrestle with is Darth
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: Vader as Darth Vader main character material.
• 3:28
  Speaker 2: It's a good question.
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: So I think let's discuss that for a second because
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: I think I struggle with whether or not that's the
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: case because I feel like every time we see him
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: used well, whether that's.
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: In Rebels or Maul.
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: Or even Rogue One, and in many ways, even throughout
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: the original trilogy, right, he is not the main character.
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: He is very much there to support everything else that's happening.
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: And so what do you think? I mean, do you
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: think he is the main character material?
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: I think that Vader can be main character, protagonist material
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: under a very specific set of conditions. I don't think
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: no matter how much certain aspects of the fan base
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: want to pretend that everybody wants a super gritty, murderous,
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: R-rated Star Wars movie full of death and destruction and
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: unhappiness and unearned cynicism that they have about life. when
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: Star Wars movies are about hope, I think that under
• 4:38
  Speaker 2: a very specific set of conditions, and this is going
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: to sound counterintuitive, is if you keep it small and
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: you keep it very personal in the sense that you
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: would see something experimental and different in terms of exploring
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: the split that Lucas himself saw between the spirit of
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: Anakin Skywalker and the spirit of Darth Vader. And I
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: could see a movie more abstract with Vader having visions
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: or seeing his alternate life had he not become the
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: galaxy's biggest animal. And I think that movie has potential.
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: If you have a movie where it's just Vader going
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: around killing people and chasing a rebel or killing Jedi,
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: I mean, that's a thrill for 20 minutes, but it's
• 5:33
  Speaker 2: not sustainable for two hours. So, I mean, what do
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: you say to that? Do you think that the small,
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: personal Vader movie, dealing with his demons, seeing alternate visions,
• 5:43
  Speaker 2: a little bit more abstract, do you think that could
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: sustain it?
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: I mean, to me, that does seem like a much
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: more interesting type of film. And I think you did
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: rightly hit on the idea of, you know, everybody thinks
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: that they want a movie with Darth Vader, you know,
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: tracking down Jedi characters. And I mean I think there
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: is something to that in the sense that it could
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: be interesting. But there needs to be more than that, right?
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: Like there needs to be something. And I think like
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: even– we've obviously talked through the entire Obi-Wan series and
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: you can go back to the archives here and listen
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: to it. We'd love it if you would and let
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: us know your thoughts. But in that, it's very personal, right?
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: He is hunting down Obi-Wan Kenobi. in that sense, you know,
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: and so when he gets very involved in that, it's
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: because of that reason, and he's utilized in the same
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: way that we see him basically utilized in every other
• 6:44
  Speaker 1: area that, you know, post-Lucas, he's been used, which is sparingly.
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: And I think, like, you rightly honed in, because for
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: Vader to be used other than the boogeyman, which is
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: what he is in this time period there isn't tons
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: to explore with him other than what you're saying which
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: is the and i think it's actually the early years
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: of vader where he's just become darth vader that are
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: actually the most interesting because i think that there is
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: um The most turmoil in him at that moment, especially
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: once he's learned that Padme's died, you know, and, you know,
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: that he has nothing left to live for and that
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: he's most plagued by what you're talking about in those
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: early years. And I think that there's those middle years,
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: you know, all the way through Rogue One where really
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: he's just dead inside. He is literally just the machines.
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: And because he has killed everything else in him. So
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: I think the journey of watching him kill those leftover demons,
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: or I mean, honestly, it was- Leftover angels.
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: Exactly.
• 8:06
  Speaker 1: I was just about to say that. 100%. That's the
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: thing that I think is most interesting.
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, I would even love to see, like,
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: I want them to flip the safeties off and have
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: something really weird. Something really wild. Don't even- put it
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: in the world between worlds, or put it there if
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: you feel the need to to explain it, but have
• 8:29
  Speaker 2: literally Vader in the suit versus Anakin without the suit
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: of comparable age fighting himself and have that moment where
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: Like I go back to the old Star Wars Tales
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: comic where they had Vader face Maul through different Sith
• 8:52
  Speaker 2: magic or whatever. And Maul, when Vader finally defeats him,
• 8:57
  Speaker 2: he stabs himself through his own gut to kill Maul.
• 9:01
  Speaker 2: And Maul says, what could you possibly hate enough to
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: be more powerful than me? And Vader says, myself. Take
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: that sort of sentiment and have Vader in the suit
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: and spiritually kill Anakin and say something along those lines of,
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: I hate you and I hate me and I hate
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: that I ever left Tatooine so that we get a
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: really clear look at Vader. His amount of self-loathing is
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: what motivates him. His amount of self-loathing is what motivates him.
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: His amount of self-loathing is everything that drives him. And That,
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: I think, would, if we had that moment, and then
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: you can then wind up redeeming, in a sense, the
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: Obi-Wan series by having him say, we already have the
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: line on screen. where he says, you didn't kill Anakin,
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: I did. We see that spiritual battle, but even go
• 10:08
  Speaker 2: and help redeem some of the sequel aspects that people
• 10:12
  Speaker 2: didn't like and show Vader out of control the same
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: way Kylo Ren is in The Force Awakens, where he's
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: having temper tantrums and even have the emperor show up
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: and be like, dude, I'm sending you away. You got
• 10:27
  Speaker 2: to work through this and send him off somewhere. Show
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: the establishment of his castle on Mustafar. All of those
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: sorts of things.
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I agree with that. And I love that idea.
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: I think it really is the hallmark of what could
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: make this movie really interesting. And I think you coming
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: up with the connection there with what we saw in
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: Obi-Wan becomes actually the why of the story. Because when
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: you're telling any story in Star Wars specifically with characters
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: like this, there has to be a why that makes
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: it worthwhile to touch this character in this way. Otherwise,
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: you're just– Doing the thing that we see happen with
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: so many of these media companies where they have these
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: franchises and they're just trying to milk it for whatever
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: it's worth. But Star Wars in many ways is– Pretty
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: special in the sense that these characters have to have
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: an incredibly legitimate why as to why to tell more
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: stories about them. You know, I think, you know, what
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: we're seeing there, you pulled the idea from some of
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: the legacy comics of like, with things that happened with
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: Vader and Maul. And, you know, I think the Maul
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: show is a great example of, okay, if we're going
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: to bring this character back, why are we doing it?
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: And why are we telling this story? Right. Because there's
• 12:02
  Speaker 1: so much more to tell. And a biggest, the biggest
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: part of, I think the Maul series really is, is
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: it inability to be able to overcome his limitations, just,
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: just his base limitations, you know, and as much as he,
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: can succeed, there's always going to be a ceiling that
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: he's going to hit in and of himself because he's
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: just limited himself in some ways. And I think that's
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: what makes this really interesting then for the character of
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: Darth Vader. And I think the beauty of that is,
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: is that, you know, That's the type of thing– look,
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: the Obi-Wan show gave us the flashbacks and that's where
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: you can utilize that kind of thing, right? You can
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: utilize flashbacks to things from the Clone Wars or whatever
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: that kind of– Hit that. You can you can use
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: flashbacks with Ahsoka, you know, the same kind of things
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: they're actually doing in the Ahsoka show that we're.
• 13:06
  Speaker 2: Seeing, you know.
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: So I think that's the other thing, too, is that
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: this could actually tie so well into who he is
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: then in the Ahsoka series as the force ghost who
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: is working to help Ahsoka overcome her demons, actually.
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: And some of those demons, actually, that Anakin helped instill
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: in her. And I think that's also incredibly interesting. And so,
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: as we're talking about this, it's funny because, you know,
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: I came in actually with this question of this real
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: skepticism of whether or not this can work, but I'm
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: finding myself, like, I'm talking myself into it.
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: Well, I mean, even think about it like this, where,
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: you know, Vader, you know, quote unquote, kills the spirit
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: of Anakin. And the spirit of Anakin's last words are,
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: you can't destroy me. I'm more power. He, and he
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: has a line that echoes Obi-Wan. I've become more powerful
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: than you could possibly imagine. And Vader has to wrestle
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: with that because that stings him in the sense that
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: he never got the power through the dark side that
• 14:09
  Speaker 2: he thought he was going to get, that it was
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: always a lie. And then that ties into Anakin coming
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: back in the later and saying, yeah, you might've won
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: this round, but I'm not gone forever. And, you know,
• 14:22
  Speaker 2: Vader dealing with that and that deals with that sort
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: of crazy concept of separating the two halves that was
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: peeking through in Lucas's sequel trilogy stuff that he was
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: dealing with. And I think that, I think that what
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: it is, and my hope is that Filoni can get
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: Lucasfilm back on the track of embracing some weirdness. Star
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: Wars became A franchise owned by Disney. And there are
• 14:58
  Speaker 2: people who truly enjoy the sequel trilogy. And I respect that.
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: And people love Rogue One. People like Rogue One. People
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: love Solo, a Star Wars story. People didn't go see
• 15:10
  Speaker 2: a Solo, a Star Wars story. People think this. People
• 15:13
  Speaker 2: think that. But what Lucas was always willing to do
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: was swing for the fences and do weird stuff. Unexpected stuff.
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: the prequels were not at all what people thought the
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: movies were going to be at all. And that's what
• 15:29
  Speaker 2: they need to embrace. And I think a Vader movie
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: works like we're saying here, if you're willing to be
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: weird and say, you know what? I don't need to
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: play by any rules. This doesn't need to be a
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: black Panther origin story. This doesn't need to be captain America.
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: This needs to be something weird and different and experimental
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: and just go crazy with it. Just, do something different.
• 15:55
  Speaker 2: And I think that's where a Vader movie could work. But,
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: you know, I think we're both at a place where
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: we agree we could make a Vader movie work. But
• 16:04
  Speaker 2: before we go, I want to ask you one question.
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: Is there a character that you think is ripe for
• 16:13
  Speaker 2: a standalone movie that isn't being talked about? If like
• 16:17
  Speaker 2: you get to sit down with Dave Filoni and he
• 16:20
  Speaker 2: doesn't let you touch his hat, Because he won't let
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: you do that. But he will let you pitch an
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: idea for a character that gets a standalone movie. Who
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: are you pitching? Oh, man.
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: I mean, I think that's actually a really tough question
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: to answer.
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: Supposed to be.
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, no. I think that– Man, I don't know, dude.
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: I'm literally like, I don't know.
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: I stumped you? Yeah. All these years and I finally
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: stumped you?
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: It's such a hard question because, you know, when I
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: think of characters in Star Wars, right, I think one
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: of the things that I don't necessarily think of is
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: characters divorced from all the other things, right? You know, like, yes,
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: the show is called Ahsoka, right? But there's so much
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: more that the show is about, right? The show was
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: the Book of Boba Fett, but there was more than
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: it was about. The Mandalorian, but it turned out to
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: be about more than just the Mandalorian. So I think
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: in many ways, and you even think about Star Wars
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: as a movie, right? You come in and kind of
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: the main character is Luke Skywalker, but then you bring
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: in Han Solo, and you bring in Princess Leia, and
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: you've got Obi-Wan Kenobi there, and all of them feel
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: as important as the other to making this work. And
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: so I think in many ways, Star Wars almost works
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: best when it is more ensemble in that sense. And
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: so thinking of just one singular character that is the
• 18:12
  Speaker 1: one that I would want to have that movie about, uh, is,
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: is a, I honestly, right now, I just can't think
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: of a character where it's like, I think they deserve
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: to have their movie labeled on their own. The only
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: character that I can think about is this. I still
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: believe that solo as a character and that storyline deserves
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: to be finished.
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: I agree.
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: I think that wholeheartedly. And so therefore, for me, that's
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: the only character where it's like, I just want you
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: to continue what you started, which is to give a
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: solo two and solo three. I know that's probably never
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: going to happen. And it breaks my freaking heart that
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: that's the case. But that's really what I would love.
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: I think that's very fair, very valid. And I am
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: completely on board with what you're saying. I agree with you.
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: It's very tough. And when I asked the question, I
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: didn't have anybody in mind. And so like the whole
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: time that I've been listening to you, very valid points. Very,
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: very valid points.
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: We're going to sample that.
• 19:20
  Speaker 2: Well, I know. The first time in more than 450 episodes,
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: we finally got there, folks. Look at that. You know,
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: I would say that if there is an individual character
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: where I'd be like, you know, that's a Star Wars
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: movie I want to see about just that person. I
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: think that putting it in the context of the larger story,
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: I would still come back to I would want to
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: take the story of someone between episode one and episode
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: two and have it be their story dedicated strictly to
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: them and that's the difficult part is that era feels
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: completely unexplored, but it feels like it belongs to Obi-Wan
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: and Anakin. So who else could possibly fall into that
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: span and tell their story? That would be compelling enough.
• 20:26
  Speaker 2: That's where I get stuck. Era, completely clear on. Who
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: the person is in those years, I don't know how
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: you could possibly do it cleanly, but I would probably
• 20:40
  Speaker 2: say Dooku. I would love to see the idealist fall,
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: like see the progress of his fall.
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: The downside of that is that Tales of the Jedi
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: handled it so expertly that I can't, I'm like, you know,
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: that's what I would love to see. But at the
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: same time, I've already seen the highlights. There's nothing left
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: to do with him. Anybody who's listening to this that
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: has not watched Tales of the Jedi, come on. Like,
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: they're 15-minute episodes with credits. It's 12 minutes. Like, you
• 21:15
  Speaker 2: got the time. You've got the time. You can knock
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: out whole arcs. So, yeah, I think it's a very
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: valid point that you have. I think it could probably
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: be pretty interesting to find a character like Maydean or
• 21:32
  Speaker 2: Ackbar and tell their origin. But again, it's within the
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: context of the birth of the rebellion. Yeah, and I
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: think that's– It feels like we've explored that.
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: It's also the hard part, right? Because to create a film, right,
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: based around a person, you need the name of that
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: person in Star Wars to be big enough to draw
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: the general audience because that's why you're making a movie.
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: And so– I think that's the other difficulty is that
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: because we've, you know, cut off so much from what
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: happened in this, you know, the sequel trilogy, so we
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: don't have the ability to really utilize those characters anymore. And,
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: you know, there's the storylines of, you know, look, I
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: think the ultimate thing that you could do, which will
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: never happen, I don't believe, is Yoda.
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: Like an early Yoda movie. Yoda between the movies movie.
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: I could see it, but the thing is with him
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: stranded on Dagobah, but at the same time, the Obi-Wan
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: series wasn't afraid to have him leave Tatooine. Yoda having
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: to leave Dagobah for one thing would be interesting because
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: it would establish that Yoda, what would, This is the hook.
• 23:09
  Speaker 2: Last question I'll leave you with. What could be important
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: enough for Yoda to risk exposure to leave Dagobah? That's
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: the one question. Can't have him go to Coruscant. Can't
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: have him face Imperials. What is the one thing? What
• 23:29
  Speaker 2: is that why? I agree with you. Yoda would be
• 23:32
  Speaker 2: a good one as a stand-alone. I would set it
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: with him on Dagobah between the films. But what would
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: be his why? Why are we following Yoda at this time? Yeah.
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: I mean, the hard part is the feeling I get
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: is that we never leave Tatooine. We never leave Dagobah.
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: I don't feel like he ever leaves there. Because– Yoda,
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: it seems as though, feels very resigned to his fate
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: on purpose in the sense that he says, into exile
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: I must go, and he means it. And there's nothing
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: that's dragging him away. And I think the reason that is,
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: is because Yoda knows he does have to survive. To
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: be a part of the training of the next Jedi.
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: And so, therefore, it's like, I think your question is
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: incredibly valid because I don't, this is the hard part
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: with that. I don't know. I don't think there's a
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: story that you can tell with him where he leaves.
• 24:46
  Speaker 2: I think you're right. He can't leave. But what if,
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: playing against expectations, one of the beautiful surprises of Mandalorian
• 24:56
  Speaker 2: and Grogu was Gatori. What if there's someone or several
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: someones living on Dagobah when he gets there that he
• 25:06
  Speaker 2: doesn't know about? And the big question is, does he
• 25:11
  Speaker 2: chase them off somehow? How does he live with them
• 25:15
  Speaker 2: and trust that they're never going to say, oh, hey,
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: I found this little green dude, right? How do we
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: deal with that moment? Getting there would be the job
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: of a talented screenwriter. which I think the two of
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: us could make this happen. So Mr. Filoni, if you're
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: listening- We're here. This is our pitch right here. We're
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: willing to work through this and trust us, we will
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: work cheaper.
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: Than any other screenwriter- It's very true.
• 25:42
  Speaker 2: That you could hire right now.
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: It's absolutely true.
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: That doesn't mean for free. We're not working for free here.
• 25:47
  Speaker 2: Not for free, but we'll work cheaper. Just let us
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: work remote. Okay. We're willing to do that. We're willing
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: to do it.
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: Right?
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: Well, we are here to serve you. And I can
• 25:57
  Speaker 2: promise you also, not a single word will be written
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: by ChatGPT. We don't need it. I promise you that. No.
• 26:05
  Speaker 2: Why would we need that crap? We could feed 450
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: plus episodes of this show to ChatGPT and say, base
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: a movie off of what we're rambling about. And it
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: still wouldn't be as good as what the two of
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: us would come up with. This is true. Give us
• 26:23
  Speaker 2: a call, bro. We're here for you. We've always supported
• 26:25
  Speaker 2: you and your hat. So, Matt, if people wanted to
• 26:29
  Speaker 2: reach out to you and pitch a movie about a
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: Star Wars standalone character movie that they want, where could
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: they find you online?
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: Oh, please find me all over social media under the
• 26:36
  Speaker 1: name MattRushing02. Of course, here on the network, you can
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: find me with a show called Outpost, talking about every
• 26:42
  Speaker 1: single chapter of the Harry Potter series one chapter at
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: a time. And then I'm over on the TFM network
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: with a bunch of shows, a lot of great Star
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: Trek talk over there with my good friend Chris Jones.
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: And of course, doing a lot under the banner of
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: the 602 Club, where we talk about all of the
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: franchises we love outside of Star Trek. But John, you know,
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: people wanted to catch up with you and see what
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: those new fancy robes look like. Where can people find you?
• 27:09
  Speaker 2: Well, you can find me as Kessel Junkie on your
• 27:12
  Speaker 2: social network of choice. I am out there on Goodreads
• 27:15
  Speaker 2: and on Letterboxd. Those are the places I love to
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: be more than anything. occasionally I'm over on KesselJunkie.com having
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: some fun with my blog. And right here on the network,
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: I am co-hosting a show called House Lights with Darren
• 27:29
  Speaker 2: Moser and Tristan Riddell, where we look at the work
• 27:31
  Speaker 2: of directors. We have a lot of fun. I'm usually right.
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: Sometimes they agree with me, which means they're right. Sometimes
• 27:38
  Speaker 2: they disagree with me, which means they're wrong. And that's
• 27:40
  Speaker 2: how that show goes. But Matt, you know what? I
• 27:44
  Speaker 2: do want to make sure that we have a chance
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: to go and party on Coruscant and show off these fancy,
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: fancy robes that we have. So I think it's time
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: to close these negotiations.
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: John, negotiations are closed.
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: Join the revolution. Join the nerd party.