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Patriots Catch-22 7/9: Listener Q&A · Patriots Catch-22

0:02
Speaker 1: This is the Patriots Catch twenty two podcasts with Evan
0:06
Speaker 1: Lazar and Alex Bars from Lazarre.
0:10
Speaker 2: Hello, everybody, nailed it, Joined us always by our bark.
0:17
Speaker 1: Here is Evan Lazar and Alex Bars.
0:20
Speaker 2: Hello everybody, and welcome into a special pre taped edition
0:24
Speaker 2: of Catch twenty two. If you're wondering why Alex and
0:26
Speaker 2: I are wearing the same exact clothes that we were
0:28
Speaker 2: wearing last week, it's because we pre taped this show,
0:32
Speaker 2: so we are not live. This is us coming to
0:35
Speaker 2: you about a week before I'm about to tie the knot,
0:38
Speaker 2: so I'm going to be off getting married, which is
0:41
Speaker 2: why I Am not going to be here for a
0:43
Speaker 2: live show in our typical spot. But we didn't want
0:45
Speaker 2: to leave you guys completely hanging. We wanted to give
0:48
Speaker 2: you some Patriots content while I am on a vacation
0:51
Speaker 2: on our honeymoon. But Alex, we wanted to do this
0:54
Speaker 2: training camp heavy because when I come back, this.
0:57
Speaker 3: Is our last day is going to be rolling. It's
1:00
Speaker 3: easy to think about it.
1:00
Speaker 2: Yeah, I can't believe summer is already over. We're gonna
1:04
Speaker 2: spend July fourth on the beach, and then I'm getting
1:07
Speaker 2: married and then our honeymoon, and then training camp is
1:10
Speaker 2: right there, so we're we're three weeks away as we
1:13
Speaker 2: tape this from training camp. So before I should say,
1:17
Speaker 2: we also asked for a bunch of male bag questions
1:20
Speaker 2: from you guys on the X machine, and I really
1:23
Speaker 2: appreciate it. We got over thirty responses to that tweet
1:26
Speaker 2: that I just tweeted out this morning, so we got
1:29
Speaker 2: a ton of responses. We're gonna go We are terrible
1:32
Speaker 2: at rapid fire, but we're gonna rapid fire through these.
1:35
Speaker 3: Responses here there are, and I'll try to get through
1:40
Speaker 3: all of them as I possibly can't, because we really
1:42
Speaker 3: do appreciate all these questions from you guys.
1:45
Speaker 2: So that's the show today. We're gonna start with the
1:47
Speaker 2: big picture thought from each of us on training camp,
1:50
Speaker 2: and then we're gonna get into your mail bag questions.
1:52
Speaker 2: But let's start there, Bartha, what's on your mind about
1:56
Speaker 2: training camp? Kind of big picture that you're looking forward to.
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Speaker 3: I mean, I think the two big things, and we
2:01
Speaker 3: just talked about this in the show we finished wrapping up.
2:03
Speaker 3: I'm gonna put the offensive line to the side, because yes,
2:05
Speaker 3: we're gonna be interesting. How will Campbell looks or he'd
2:08
Speaker 3: be interested to see the battle left guard. That doesn't
2:11
Speaker 3: really gear up until the preseason, so like just training
2:15
Speaker 3: camp right. The two things one Drake may obviously what
2:19
Speaker 3: does the year two leap look like? Does he look
2:21
Speaker 3: more confident? Does he look more comfortable? How is he
2:24
Speaker 3: picking up the new offensive system? Does he pick up
2:27
Speaker 3: we left off in the spring? And is he taking
2:28
Speaker 3: care of the football? Just everything we've talked about Drake
2:31
Speaker 3: made this offseason, all that he had an encouraging rookie
2:34
Speaker 3: year butt. Everything that comes after that butt is what
2:36
Speaker 3: we're looking at. The second thing defense Schematically, we have
2:39
Speaker 3: a general idea of what this is gonna look like
2:42
Speaker 3: right under Mike Vrabel, just based on his time in Tennessee.
2:45
Speaker 3: But there still are a few loose odds and ends.
2:48
Speaker 3: How are they gonna use Kyle Dugger and Jabrill Peppers
2:51
Speaker 3: after Duger missed the spring due to an injury, Does
2:54
Speaker 3: Anthonny Jennings fit in? Where does he fit in? What
2:57
Speaker 3: are they gonna do about the linebackers who's primarily playing
3:00
Speaker 3: next to Robert s Blane. There's just still a how
3:03
Speaker 3: much are they gonna use that big slot? There's just
3:05
Speaker 3: still a few scheme questions schematically for this defense that
3:09
Speaker 3: I don't think we'll get answered one hundred percent because
3:11
Speaker 3: obviously they're not gonna show everything before they get into
3:13
Speaker 3: the regular season. But I think we'll get some big
3:16
Speaker 3: picture answers to that.
3:17
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a lot of really good stuff there, I
3:19
Speaker 2: would say the defensively, just looking at that for a second,
3:24
Speaker 2: how they defend the slot and how they defend tight
3:27
Speaker 2: ends is something that I'm not entirely I don't feel
3:31
Speaker 2: like I have a great grasp quite yet of how
3:33
Speaker 2: they're gonna do that, because in a Belichick style defense,
3:36
Speaker 2: it was very obvious they like to have the Jonathan
3:40
Speaker 2: Jones Marcus Jones type of true nickel corner in the
3:44
Speaker 2: slot that could play man to man against shifty receivers. Yeah,
3:47
Speaker 2: that was typically their slot. And then they had the
3:50
Speaker 2: hybrids playing against the tight ends, you know, the Chungs,
3:54
Speaker 2: the duggers, those types of players. How they decide to
3:59
Speaker 2: do that is a little bit of an unknown under vlabel.
4:02
Speaker 2: In Tennessee they did it a little bit differently. They
4:05
Speaker 2: did also have guys towards the end, especially with like
4:08
Speaker 2: a player like a Moni Hooker, who was a little
4:09
Speaker 2: bit more in that mold of like a chunk, but
4:13
Speaker 2: it wasn't always the same. You mentioned the big slot
4:17
Speaker 2: when you have a corner, and I really like Marcus
4:19
Speaker 2: Jones as a player, But when you have Marcus Jones
4:21
Speaker 2: who's five 'ot nine, right, that's a very big difference
4:25
Speaker 2: between the big slot and Marcus Jones. So how do
4:27
Speaker 2: they kind of find that happy meeting in there. Your
4:30
Speaker 2: Drake May point is really good as well. I want
4:32
Speaker 2: to go even further up for a second. This is
4:34
Speaker 2: a little Felger and Mas for you go true bird's
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Speaker 2: eye view on it. There's a lot of talk about
4:42
Speaker 2: Drake May his year two leap, what he can do individually,
4:48
Speaker 2: performance in the clutch, cutting down on turnovers, carrying over
4:52
Speaker 2: the good things that he did from his rookie season.
4:55
Speaker 2: My question when we go into training camp, because I
4:57
Speaker 2: don't know if we're truly going to answer has Drake
5:00
Speaker 2: made made the leap until we get into them.
5:03
Speaker 3: We can there will be early indication.
5:06
Speaker 2: There'll be early indications, and I promise you we will
5:08
Speaker 2: break down every little early indication one way or another.
5:12
Speaker 2: But big picture, my thought is have the Patriots done
5:17
Speaker 2: enough to support Drake May. Do the Patriots have enough
5:21
Speaker 2: of an infrastructure around Drake May that he can truly flourish,
5:25
Speaker 2: Because I don't think we're in a world anymore where
5:28
Speaker 2: it's enough to just expect, especially a second year quarterback, yeah,
5:32
Speaker 2: to just pull the truck all by himself. Like, I
5:36
Speaker 2: just don't think you can really ask him for that.
5:38
Speaker 2: Last year, even though he had the flashes, even though
5:41
Speaker 2: we came out of his rookie season feeling really good
5:43
Speaker 2: about his upward trajectory, there was clearly a failure organizationally
5:50
Speaker 2: around him, the coaching, the infrastructure, personnel wise. Have they
5:54
Speaker 2: built up the offensive line enough? Do they have enough weapons?
5:57
Speaker 2: Is Mike Rabel and Josh McDaniel's this as of coaching
6:00
Speaker 2: upgrade that we think it is on paper? Defensively? Can
6:04
Speaker 2: they get back to the level that they were twenty one,
6:06
Speaker 2: twenty two to twenty three where he doesn't have to
6:09
Speaker 2: score thirty a game to win, you know, win all
6:11
Speaker 2: the time? Have they done enough to help Drake May?
6:15
Speaker 2: Because I'm of the belief, because you know, I'm a
6:17
Speaker 2: Drake May guy. Yeah, I'm the belief that if everything
6:20
Speaker 2: around Drake May is at a level of a standard
6:25
Speaker 2: of just competent to above. I think Drake May is
6:29
Speaker 2: gonna be a franchise quarterback. I think Drake May is
6:32
Speaker 2: gonna do the rest. But you can't expect Drake May
6:34
Speaker 2: in the second season in the NFL to take a
6:38
Speaker 2: team that is undermanned and turn them into a good
6:42
Speaker 2: football team all on his own. So in your mind,
6:45
Speaker 2: have they done enough on paper and now we have
6:48
Speaker 2: to go from paper to actually performance to really set
6:52
Speaker 2: him up to succeed in year two because it's.
6:54
Speaker 3: As much on them as it is on him to
6:56
Speaker 3: set him up. I think for year two they still
6:58
Speaker 3: need to do more long term the answers. Maybe like
7:04
Speaker 3: on paper they did, but it hinges on Will Campbell
7:07
Speaker 3: and hinges on Stephan Diggs, and you're talking about a
7:09
Speaker 3: rookie and you're talking about a thirty old guy coming
7:12
Speaker 3: off with torn AZL. So that's if those guys both hit. Yeah,
7:15
Speaker 3: I think May's in a really good spot. If neither
7:18
Speaker 3: of those guys can play at a starter level, you're
7:21
Speaker 3: not quite back to where you were last year, but
7:23
Speaker 3: you're definitely not a great place.
7:25
Speaker 2: I just feel as though there's been a lot of
7:27
Speaker 2: talk about this about Drake, about him taking the year
7:31
Speaker 2: or two leap, about him individually succeeding, and him is succeeding.
7:36
Speaker 2: Maybe the only other thing I hear frequently about that
7:40
Speaker 2: is Josh McDaniels, right, Josh McDaniels' role in Drake succeeding.
7:45
Speaker 2: But to me, making a quarterback work is an organizational thing. Yes,
7:49
Speaker 2: it's a top down organizational thing. Are you doing all
7:52
Speaker 2: the right things to point the bus in the direction
7:54
Speaker 2: of making your quarterback succeed. It's not just enough for
7:58
Speaker 2: Drake May to be good on his own vacuum. It's
8:00
Speaker 2: not good enough for him to have a good play
8:02
Speaker 2: Calier in a vacuum. He needs to have the talent
8:04
Speaker 2: around him and the support around him, and that to
8:07
Speaker 2: me is a question mark. But it's also not totally
8:11
Speaker 2: out of the realm that they did enough. But I
8:13
Speaker 2: just have to see it. We have to see it now,
8:15
Speaker 2: some of these win totals we hear ten and eleven,
8:17
Speaker 2: twelve wins. If they're really going to reach that, it's
8:19
Speaker 2: not going to just be Drake May. It's going to
8:21
Speaker 2: be all of it. All of it's going to be better.
8:23
Speaker 2: The defense is going to be better, the offensive line
8:25
Speaker 2: is going to be better, the receivers are going to
8:27
Speaker 2: be better, the situation will play, and coaching is going
8:29
Speaker 2: to be better. All your stuff, you know, end a half,
8:32
Speaker 2: end of game, how they handle clock and all that
8:34
Speaker 2: kind of stuff will be better. So I put as
8:37
Speaker 2: much of it on the organization, on Elliott Wolf, on Vrabel,
8:40
Speaker 2: on McDaniel's on the players around Drake May as they
8:43
Speaker 2: do on Drake May. So I'm curious to see where
8:45
Speaker 2: they're at with that. So those are our big picture thoughts.
8:48
Speaker 2: Let's get to your questions here. Start here with Andrew.
8:53
Speaker 2: He's at Nest PGS. I'm sure a lot of you
8:56
Speaker 2: people follow him out there. He said, Aside for maybe
9:00
Speaker 2: a pass rusher and a tight end, what position do
9:03
Speaker 2: you have in the back of your mind as a
9:05
Speaker 2: sneaky need early in the draft next year?
9:09
Speaker 3: Pass rusher and tight end? I mean wide receiver. I
9:12
Speaker 3: guess isn't sneaky.
9:13
Speaker 2: Right, I think that's no. That's the offant the right.
9:16
Speaker 3: I'll go back to old reliable deep safety, real free safety.
9:19
Speaker 3: Like that, real free safety. I'm gonna stay on that
9:21
Speaker 3: one until you get that guy.
9:22
Speaker 2: I'm gonna go linebacker, off ball linebacker, I really like
9:25
Speaker 2: Robert Splane. I think they're higher on guys like Jack
9:28
Speaker 2: Gibbons and Christian Ellis and Tavia potentially as well as
9:32
Speaker 2: maybe some of the fans are, some of the outside
9:34
Speaker 2: observers are. But they set themselves up nicely. Where Drake
9:40
Speaker 2: may is the you know, obviously the twenty four draft,
9:43
Speaker 2: the twenty five draft, you go left tackle, wide receiver,
9:47
Speaker 2: like you go premium position yep, at the top of
9:49
Speaker 2: both of these drafts. So in theory, the third draft
9:53
Speaker 2: here with Elliott Wolf should be able to be some
9:57
Speaker 2: of these other things right free safety, off ball linebacker,
10:01
Speaker 2: guard like positions that aren't quite as valuable as left tackle, quarterback,
10:05
Speaker 2: wide receiver. But if you have to keep repeating that
10:09
Speaker 2: cycle of drafting receivers and left tackles, and you've done
10:12
Speaker 2: something wrong in the previous drafts. So in order to
10:16
Speaker 2: project and hope that they're building someplace of success, it's
10:20
Speaker 2: there going in that direction of now they can hit
10:23
Speaker 2: on an off ball linebacker, now they can hit on
10:26
Speaker 2: free safety, now they can hit on tight ends. Like
10:29
Speaker 2: these are not necessarily those types of positions that one
10:32
Speaker 2: Boston fan he asks, well, we finally beat the Dolphins
10:35
Speaker 2: this season after all their moves. Can't remember the last
10:38
Speaker 2: time we beat them. So they beat the Dolphins at
10:40
Speaker 2: the end of twenty twenty two. We talked about this
10:42
Speaker 2: on last week's show. It was a Scoop Huntley Tyler,
10:46
Speaker 2: what's there? Skyler Thompson Scoot Huntley game. It wasn't scoop
10:50
Speaker 2: or snoop snoop Puntley. I thank you, Snoop Huntly game.
10:54
Speaker 2: Not a too a game. But the Dolphins have beaten
10:57
Speaker 2: the Patriots eight out of the last nine, and we
11:01
Speaker 2: know that Tua has their number. Do they finally beat
11:03
Speaker 2: the Tua Dolphins this year?
11:05
Speaker 3: I don't know that Tua has their number so much
11:08
Speaker 3: as the defense did. Like the Dolphins haven't scored a
11:11
Speaker 3: ton of points in a lot of these games. They
11:13
Speaker 3: scored timely touchdowns. You go back to the open up
11:15
Speaker 3: one last year except for one last year. But like
11:19
Speaker 3: the I remember crunching the numbers before the first game
11:21
Speaker 3: last year, so maybe last year changed it. But the
11:24
Speaker 3: Dolphins were scoring like below average against the Patriots. But
11:27
Speaker 3: the Patriots offense was just non existent against the Dolphins,
11:30
Speaker 3: and obviously some of that goes back to Brian Flores
11:31
Speaker 3: who's a great defensive coach. But the Dolphin we talked
11:35
Speaker 3: about this in the last show. The Dolphins defenses or
11:37
Speaker 3: the Dolphins roster is not good, and the Patriots might
11:40
Speaker 3: have a better roster on paper. You also have the
11:43
Speaker 3: benefit of your playing Miami here or there early, here late,
11:48
Speaker 3: both of which should be advantageous to the Patriots.
11:51
Speaker 2: It is.
11:52
Speaker 3: It is set up for them to at least split
11:54
Speaker 3: with Miami this year.
11:55
Speaker 2: The Miami game in Week two in Miami scares me
11:58
Speaker 2: always will A. That's just a house of horrors for
12:01
Speaker 2: the Patriots. Yeah, B it's terrible weather to hit Miami.
12:05
Speaker 2: That's it's gonna bee hundred degrees. It's gonna be Miami
12:08
Speaker 2: hot down there. And one of the things I give
12:11
Speaker 2: the Dolphins a lot of credit for this. I don't
12:13
Speaker 2: give the Dolphins credit often, but them putting the road
12:16
Speaker 2: team in the sun when the home team sideline has
12:19
Speaker 2: the shade, very very smart. So it's hot as balls
12:22
Speaker 2: down there. So we're in the side like like we're
12:27
Speaker 2: gonna shut the ac off and turn the hot water
12:29
Speaker 2: off in the road team locker room. Uh, it's good stuff.
12:33
Speaker 2: The Dolphins Week two of the season two is probably
12:36
Speaker 2: gonna play by the end of the season. I don't
12:38
Speaker 2: know if it's gonna be the quarterback right week two.
12:40
Speaker 2: I feel pretty good about Tua being the quarterback for
12:43
Speaker 2: the Dolphins, so that game worries me a little bit.
12:45
Speaker 2: But the one here at the end of the season,
12:47
Speaker 2: you would like to think the Patriots, that's gonna be
12:49
Speaker 2: where they're gonna find their stride and they're gonna be
12:51
Speaker 2: a second half team this year. We don't know what's
12:54
Speaker 2: gonna happen with Miami. That could go upside down. And
12:57
Speaker 2: then two, it might not be the quarterback, so if
12:59
Speaker 2: he's hurt, so I like them winning the game here
13:02
Speaker 2: later on in the year. Uh. This is from Jeremiah
13:06
Speaker 2: He Jeremiah Vasquez. He asked in y'all's opinion, what does
13:10
Speaker 2: a successful rookie season look like for Will Campbell?
13:14
Speaker 3: Uh? I mean baseline, he stays at left tackle. Obviously,
13:22
Speaker 3: city doesn't look like out over work. I don't know
13:25
Speaker 3: starting caliber left tackle. Yeah, to put a number on that.
13:28
Speaker 2: I don't even I don't think. I don't think there
13:30
Speaker 2: needs to be a number. I think starting caliber left
13:32
Speaker 2: tackle looks the part.
13:34
Speaker 3: You know what it's successful season is rookie season is
13:36
Speaker 3: for Will Campbell. We're not talking about Will Campbell. Could
13:39
Speaker 3: that's a success. The less we say his name this year,
13:42
Speaker 3: the better. If we get to the end of the
13:43
Speaker 3: year and we're like, yeah, well Campbell was pretty good,
13:45
Speaker 3: we didn't really have to talk about him much like
13:47
Speaker 3: that would be great. I would love to not have
13:49
Speaker 3: to talk about Will Campbell this year. You know, offense
13:51
Speaker 3: to Will Campbell, but like you know, if he's if
13:54
Speaker 3: he's a stud, you know, I'm going to talk about him.
13:56
Speaker 3: That's true this show, we'll talk about him. I guess
13:58
Speaker 3: say we will talk about him.
14:01
Speaker 2: See that? Did you see that poll?
14:03
Speaker 3: A successful season is ninety eight five? Is not talking
14:06
Speaker 3: about Will Campbell.
14:07
Speaker 2: There you go, good way to put it. I would
14:09
Speaker 2: also just the one number that I would like to
14:12
Speaker 2: see for Will campbeill be respectable as penalties. He did
14:16
Speaker 2: have some issues at LSU with fall Stars, so.
14:18
Speaker 3: That was really just last year. Wasn't a problem his
14:21
Speaker 3: first two years.
14:21
Speaker 2: So I'm not like, it's not a it's a small
14:24
Speaker 2: seat concern, right, It's that it's not a big seat concern.
14:26
Speaker 2: But I I don't know if I have a number
14:29
Speaker 2: in mind for sacks because that's so subjective. It depends
14:32
Speaker 2: on the matchup, it depends on this game script, like
14:35
Speaker 2: all that kind of stuff. It's hard to say. Uh,
14:37
Speaker 2: but in terms of penalties, that's a controllable, like he
14:40
Speaker 2: can control.
14:41
Speaker 3: Getting that they have a gauntlet of pass rushers at
14:44
Speaker 3: the gate. It's gonna be Max Crosby.
14:47
Speaker 2: Yeah, who typically does Those two guys typically line up
14:51
Speaker 2: over the right side. But maybe because the rookies.
14:52
Speaker 3: I would think if any coach worthy, dam's gonna hunt them.
14:56
Speaker 2: Well, I don't know anyways that's true.
14:59
Speaker 3: Well, I'll be Carrol, I'll get Pee Caroll. No, it's
15:01
Speaker 3: Pete Carroll and Mike Tomlin. Don't figure it out.
15:03
Speaker 2: I don't know if there were not. They're great leaders, great,
15:06
Speaker 2: great Raw Raw guys. You know how I feel about
15:08
Speaker 2: the Raw Rock guys.
15:09
Speaker 3: Uh.
15:09
Speaker 2: What are your This is from Jason m longtime listener.
15:13
Speaker 2: What are your favorite prospects coming into the twenty twenty
15:16
Speaker 2: five college football season. This is a big barth question.
15:19
Speaker 3: My favorite prospect So we talked about one guy a
15:22
Speaker 3: little bit last week, and that's Jordan Tyson, the wide
15:26
Speaker 3: receiver from Arizona. Yep, I know Arizona State.
15:28
Speaker 2: You keep on trying to get me to watch him.
15:30
Speaker 3: So, first of all, not to kill Harry. Don't do that.
15:32
Speaker 3: I'm not doing that this year. I know he went
15:34
Speaker 3: to Arizona State. I know that's where na Kiel Harry went. Brandon,
15:37
Speaker 3: now you went there too. I'm not doing that. I
15:39
Speaker 3: really like Jordan Tyson. There's a couple pass rushers I
15:43
Speaker 3: like in this draft, and he Dennis Sutton from Penn State. Yeah,
15:47
Speaker 3: I don't know. I'm not I was saying to somebody
15:49
Speaker 3: the other day. I'm not really at the stage where
15:50
Speaker 3: it's like I'm having like these hard hitting draft takes.
15:54
Speaker 3: I'm kind of just that boy nice at this point.
15:58
Speaker 3: One guy I am really looking forward to watching. Oddly,
16:01
Speaker 3: and I'm gonna be big Arizona State guy this year.
16:03
Speaker 3: Forks up Sam Levitt from Arizona State. Their quarterback isn't
16:08
Speaker 3: getting nearly enough attention. We've talked about this before. I'm
16:11
Speaker 3: not a big believer in Arch Manning. I'm not a
16:13
Speaker 3: big believer in Kate Clubnick. I'm not a big believer
16:15
Speaker 3: in Garrett nuss Meyer. I'm not a big believer in
16:18
Speaker 3: Drew Aller. These are a lot of the top, not
16:19
Speaker 3: all but a lot of the top rank quarterbacks in
16:21
Speaker 3: this draft. I think Sam Levitt could surprise a lot
16:24
Speaker 3: of people this year. Could He's young, you know, he's
16:27
Speaker 3: relatively raw. Last year he made some plays, but the
16:29
Speaker 3: youth is a parent. But that Arizona State team and
16:32
Speaker 3: Jordan Tyson's young too. Jordan Tyson's gonna be I think
16:34
Speaker 3: a red yard sophomore. So I'm really excited. There's some
16:38
Speaker 3: potentially really fun players on that team. So I get
16:42
Speaker 3: I don't know, I guess just Arizona State.
16:44
Speaker 2: So I hope the Patriots aren't drafting high enough to
16:46
Speaker 2: draft Caden Proctor. But that guy's a stud.
16:49
Speaker 3: So there's But here's the thing, Francis Moigoa, I think
16:54
Speaker 3: it is in Spencer Finot. The next two tackles in
16:57
Speaker 3: the draft both right tackles.
16:59
Speaker 2: Okay, so that's a good segue because our.
17:02
Speaker 3: Next way, I got one more.
17:03
Speaker 2: No, No, we got Caleb down. Okay, fine, but we
17:05
Speaker 2: gotta go fast camp down. We're already twenty minutes and
17:08
Speaker 2: we've answered like three questions. This next question it goes
17:11
Speaker 2: with that last point you were just making. You probably
17:13
Speaker 2: recognize this account. Boom eight zero five one seven asks
17:18
Speaker 2: do we have a future starting right tackle on our
17:20
Speaker 2: roster at the moment? Really curious how you think they
17:23
Speaker 2: view Caden Wallace. I love this question because the answer
17:28
Speaker 2: today as we record this on July second, is no.
17:31
Speaker 2: I don't believe that they have a starting right tackle
17:34
Speaker 2: on this roster of the future. Morgan Moses is the
17:37
Speaker 2: twenty twenty five starter. But of the future. That doesn't
17:40
Speaker 2: mean it can't be Caden Wallace. He just has to
17:42
Speaker 2: show it, like he hasn't proved that to me yet.
17:44
Speaker 2: So to your point, is there a world and I
17:47
Speaker 2: know it would be somewhat unfortunate to use back to
17:49
Speaker 2: back first round picks on tackles, but is there a
17:53
Speaker 2: world where Will Campbell looks the part at left tackle?
17:56
Speaker 2: We feel really good about that. So then you draft
17:58
Speaker 2: a college right tackle to play right tackle in the
18:00
Speaker 2: NFL with a high draft pick.
18:02
Speaker 3: It's absolutely a possibility. I mean, we'll see what happens
18:05
Speaker 3: with Kayden Wallace, We'll see what happens with the draft
18:07
Speaker 3: where they're picking. I'm not gonna sit here and tell
18:09
Speaker 3: you that's what's gonna happen. I don't know that it
18:10
Speaker 3: would be the worst thing in the world. You know,
18:12
Speaker 3: have your quarterback, both tackles on rookie deals, they're all
18:15
Speaker 3: growing together. Like I'd be into that. We'll say, but
18:18
Speaker 3: if Cayden Wallace works out, great, that's one less need.
18:20
Speaker 3: Obviously you'd rather fill it in house. But if they
18:23
Speaker 3: have to go into the draft to get a right tackle,
18:24
Speaker 3: I wouldn't have a problem with that.
18:25
Speaker 2: So I really think that Caiden Wallace has an NFL future.
18:29
Speaker 2: I just don't know if it's starting caliber future, and
18:31
Speaker 2: I don't know if it's at tackle. It might be
18:33
Speaker 2: a starting caliber guard. And so with Kayden Wallace, I'm
18:38
Speaker 2: really curious to see him in camp. I'm gonna be
18:40
Speaker 2: looking hard at Kayden Wallace in training camp and hoping
18:42
Speaker 2: it works out. So that's that's from Boom. From Jeff,
18:46
Speaker 2: he asks everyone uses the Cam Newton offense when describing
18:49
Speaker 2: how McDaniels uses will use May. I know May is
18:52
Speaker 2: a way more talented player, but could it approach? Could
18:55
Speaker 2: it be more like the Matt Castle offense in two
18:58
Speaker 2: thousand and eight? So I was in high school. We
19:01
Speaker 2: were in high school in two thousand and eight, So
19:03
Speaker 2: I don't I'm not going to sit here and pretend
19:05
Speaker 2: to know the ins and outs of the scheme that
19:07
Speaker 2: they were running from Matt Castle in two thousand and eight.
19:10
Speaker 2: But I do remember that they ran Matt Castle a
19:13
Speaker 2: decent amount comparatively speaking, obviously compared to Brady. I could
19:17
Speaker 2: see it. But I think with Drake May he has
19:19
Speaker 2: so much more arm talent than Matt Castle did that
19:22
Speaker 2: there's more, there's more available that you can order on
19:25
Speaker 2: the menu with Drake May than with Matt Castle in
19:27
Speaker 2: the passing game, So I could maybe see where he's
19:30
Speaker 2: coming from in terms of the amount of true runs
19:33
Speaker 2: like design runs like it's not going to be Cam Newton.
19:35
Speaker 2: He's not going to design run the ball one hundred
19:37
Speaker 2: times like Cam did in twenty twenty. So I could
19:39
Speaker 2: see where he's coming from. But I don't remember Matt
19:42
Speaker 2: Castle running read option, like I don't really think that
19:46
Speaker 2: was a big thing in the NFL to begin with
19:47
Speaker 2: back then, and I don't really remember him doing it
19:50
Speaker 2: a ton from what I'm watching as a fan back then,
19:54
Speaker 2: But it's not a I could see where he's coming
19:56
Speaker 2: from because maybe the skill sets are a little bit
19:58
Speaker 2: more apples to apples, where Cam was a two hundred
20:00
Speaker 2: and fifty pounds battering ram like body type wise, Drake
20:03
Speaker 2: may is probably a little closer to Matt Castle, even
20:05
Speaker 2: though he's more talented.
20:06
Speaker 3: Yeah, a serious coming from it's gonna be its own thing.
20:09
Speaker 3: I think it's really just gonna be its own thing.
20:11
Speaker 2: All right. Uh. Jason asks, what is a realistic, realistic
20:16
Speaker 2: floor or ceiling for this team in terms of wins?
20:19
Speaker 2: I feel like this is a popular question. Hype has
20:22
Speaker 2: people putting them at like twelve wins and I just
20:23
Speaker 2: can't believe that. So what's your floor and ceiling for
20:25
Speaker 2: this team?
20:27
Speaker 3: I mean, the ceiling if everything goes right. Will Campbell
20:30
Speaker 3: justifies that pick. He's a Pro Bowl caliber tackle. Stefan
20:33
Speaker 3: Diggs is fully healthy, He's a thousand yard receiver. Duggar
20:36
Speaker 3: Pepper's both fully healthy. They bounce back, you know, for
20:39
Speaker 3: the there's gonna be injuries for the most part, they
20:41
Speaker 3: stay healthy. That's the core al year with Mondrie Stevenson
20:44
Speaker 3: gets back in shape. So your ceiling, yeah, twelve thirteen wins? Wow?
20:49
Speaker 2: Really?
20:49
Speaker 3: If everything I mean, if everything goes right on defense,
20:52
Speaker 3: there are top five defense.
20:53
Speaker 2: Okay, what's your floor?
20:56
Speaker 3: Five six wins?
20:57
Speaker 2: Right? So I'm with you on the floor. I still
21:00
Speaker 2: I could still see a world because remember they went
21:02
Speaker 2: four games last year. Yeah, so even if they are
21:04
Speaker 2: at like six or seven wins, I know it's not
21:06
Speaker 2: the improvement that everybody wants, but depending on how it
21:09
Speaker 2: looks like, it still could be an improvement.
21:10
Speaker 3: Well, so here's my thing. They have ten games on
21:14
Speaker 3: their schedule that they should win.
21:16
Speaker 2: Yeah that they now I would say they're ceiling is
21:19
Speaker 2: ten or eleven.
21:20
Speaker 3: Well, okay, but here's the think they have ten on
21:21
Speaker 3: their schedule they should win. They had six or seven
21:25
Speaker 3: on their schedule last year that they should have won
21:28
Speaker 3: at this time, and they won really three throwing out
21:32
Speaker 3: Week eighteen. Right, So it goes back to what Mike
21:35
Speaker 3: Vrabel said. It is introductory press conference. They need be
21:37
Speaker 3: good enough take advantage of bad football. If you want
21:40
Speaker 3: to talk true ceiling, best case scenario, that means winning
21:43
Speaker 3: all the games you should win and stealing one or
21:46
Speaker 3: two you probably shouldn't. That's how I get to twelve.
21:48
Speaker 2: So I went to I have more around ten or
21:50
Speaker 2: eleven because I think some of those games that we
21:54
Speaker 2: think on paper right now that they should win are
21:57
Speaker 2: gonna flip, and then some of the other games that
21:58
Speaker 2: we think are not are going to flip the other
22:01
Speaker 2: one game balances out to around ten or eleven games.
22:05
Speaker 3: Yeah, all right, but that's not a ceiling.
22:07
Speaker 2: That's my ceiling.
22:08
Speaker 3: But that's not a like a ceiling is like everything
22:10
Speaker 3: best case.
22:11
Speaker 2: The ceilings they win the super Bowl, if we want
22:12
Speaker 2: to go that, I guess like realistic ceiling. I think
22:16
Speaker 2: eleven wins is asking a lot. That's almost three times
22:20
Speaker 2: as if they won.
22:21
Speaker 3: Every single thing goes their way, they can win twelve games. Wow,
22:24
Speaker 3: I hope you're right every single well, but it's not
22:26
Speaker 3: because that's not how life works.
22:27
Speaker 2: Okay, Alexander asks, what's something you want Drake May to
22:31
Speaker 2: get better at? Like, what's one individual thing? So I'm
22:35
Speaker 2: with you.
22:35
Speaker 3: What else did you think I was going to know? Now?
22:37
Speaker 2: I would say, but specifically to not turning the ball
22:40
Speaker 2: over fumbles? Yeah, that's a good strip sacks, Like if
22:44
Speaker 2: they can eliminate the strip sacks. You got to live
22:45
Speaker 2: with some of the picks because he's a gunslinger and
22:47
Speaker 2: you don't want to take away that aggressiveness from his game.
22:51
Speaker 2: But protecting the football, not fumbling the ball on strip sacks,
22:56
Speaker 2: Like if you can just protect the football a little
22:58
Speaker 2: bit better in the pocket and that's gonna go a
23:01
Speaker 2: long way to cutting down the overall turnover number, which
23:03
Speaker 2: is what we're really getting at here. Uh V he asks, uh,
23:08
Speaker 2: this is a good one, Like this is my favorite one.
23:10
Speaker 2: I enjoy watching you guys have arguments about analytics. Not
23:14
Speaker 2: everybody does. Yeah, I'm I'm glad that V enjoys it.
23:19
Speaker 2: What are your top three to five favorite metrics? Like
23:22
Speaker 2: he's talking to me, of course, give an explainer of them,
23:24
Speaker 2: and does Alex agree with your usage? Why or why not? Okay,
23:27
Speaker 2: So I'm not gonna give a full in depth explainer
23:29
Speaker 2: because I don't want to beat a dead horse.
23:31
Speaker 3: E p A, DVA and expected something or other.
23:34
Speaker 2: Okay, so you're two out of three, I'm gonna give three.
23:37
Speaker 2: E p A yeah, which I think is the best
23:39
Speaker 2: stat we have in football. Yeah, DVA also really good.
23:42
Speaker 2: E p A to me, measures better which offenses are
23:47
Speaker 2: more dangerous, like more explosive? What's more volatile? Like whether
23:51
Speaker 2: more explosive or more detrimental?
23:53
Speaker 3: You can win games being explosive on offense, you definitely
23:56
Speaker 3: can't check your way out.
23:57
Speaker 2: So to me, I look at it like it's not
23:59
Speaker 2: just explosive, it's like which offense would you fear the most?
24:02
Speaker 3: No, it's exploit you talked about last week. It's exclosive
24:04
Speaker 3: which offense would you fear the most? Versus which offenses
24:07
Speaker 3: actively lose themselves points by like turning the ball over
24:11
Speaker 3: in negative plays and things like that. We have stats
24:13
Speaker 3: for those. They're called turnovers and negative plays DVA.
24:15
Speaker 2: I love for consistency, like who's the most play to
24:18
Speaker 2: play efficient consistent football teams.
24:20
Speaker 3: With the secret formula?
24:22
Speaker 2: And then my last one is QBR, which I think
24:25
Speaker 2: ESPN's QBR right now, to me is the best quarterback
24:29
Speaker 2: metric we have.
24:30
Speaker 3: Isn't that another secret formula one?
24:32
Speaker 2: It might be, yeah, okay, but it's the best in
24:35
Speaker 2: terms of measuring quarterback efficiency. This is production bas This
24:39
Speaker 2: isn't fugazi expected things that you hate. This is what
24:43
Speaker 2: did they do on the field production wise.
24:45
Speaker 3: You can't tell me exactly what it is.
24:46
Speaker 2: No, But the thing that I like so much about
24:48
Speaker 2: QBR is that it also factors in rushing for quarterbacks,
24:55
Speaker 2: which I think if you're going to tell the full
24:56
Speaker 2: story of the quarterback in twenty twenty five, you have
24:59
Speaker 2: to include scramble yards, design runs, rushing, touch I'll.
25:03
Speaker 3: Say this, I add quarterback rating, not QBR, like old
25:07
Speaker 3: school quarterback rating antiquated and is a definitive number. There's
25:11
Speaker 3: no expected it's stupid, it's random. I will stand with you.
25:14
Speaker 3: I don't like quarterback rating, minor points, score, points allowed,
25:18
Speaker 3: turnover margin. I'll tell you which teams are good, which
25:22
Speaker 3: teams are bad. You show me those three things. H
25:26
Speaker 3: point different let me do this, point differential, turnover margin,
25:30
Speaker 3: third down conversion differential.
25:32
Speaker 2: So I don't you show me those three things. I'll
25:34
Speaker 2: tell you which I don't hate it. I don't hate
25:36
Speaker 2: those necessarily. I love QBR. I think QBR is a
25:38
Speaker 2: great sat. I also love the fact that QBR is
25:40
Speaker 2: on a zero to one hundred scale that's based off
25:43
Speaker 2: of win probability. So like, if you have a quarterback
25:46
Speaker 2: that has a seventy QBR, you are expected to win
25:49
Speaker 2: seventy percent of those games.
25:51
Speaker 3: I think that word.
25:52
Speaker 2: I think that's a great way to uh encapsulate quarterback
25:58
Speaker 2: on field quarterback production, actual yards and touchdowns made by
26:02
Speaker 2: your quarterback, and suffice the QB wins crowd at the
26:06
Speaker 2: same time. Right, So if I, if it was up
26:09
Speaker 2: to me, we would throw away antiquated passer rating. I
26:12
Speaker 2: don't think anybody really uses pass I would never see
26:14
Speaker 2: passer rating in an NFL box score ever. Again, do
26:16
Speaker 2: you still see it in box scores?
26:17
Speaker 3: And we would only be using the ESPN box score
26:20
Speaker 3: uses QBR their stats the better stats. I don't need either.
26:23
Speaker 2: Room all right, quick asks, as the team is currently
26:27
Speaker 2: constructed and realizing you're building roster, will take a few drafts.
26:30
Speaker 2: Do you see Rabel and company using more high round
26:33
Speaker 2: draft picks to rebuild the old line? So we kind
26:35
Speaker 2: of answered this question already. I could definitely see that.
26:38
Speaker 2: I think that they're gonna want to build from the inside.
26:39
Speaker 3: They're gonna they're gonna make that a priority.
26:41
Speaker 2: All Right. I hear a lot of they only won
26:43
Speaker 2: four games last year, as from Will, why is there
26:46
Speaker 2: so much comparison to last year's team? And besides like
26:49
Speaker 2: twelve stars being between offense and defense, this team is
26:53
Speaker 2: drastically different. So the fair point, I think the reason
26:56
Speaker 2: why there's so much comparison is just it doesn't it
26:59
Speaker 2: does happened that, oh, you know, one or two teams
27:02
Speaker 2: a year ago, from Worris to first. We know that
27:04
Speaker 2: the Patriots are definitely, possibly could do that. But there's
27:07
Speaker 2: also the opposite, which is like a cyclical level of
27:10
Speaker 2: losing where you see the same you know, the the Jaguars,
27:13
Speaker 2: the Browns, the Titans, like these teams have been drafting
27:15
Speaker 2: in the top five. It feels like for like ten years, right. Yeah,
27:18
Speaker 2: maybe not the Titans because you know, if Rabel was there,
27:20
Speaker 2: but recently with the Titans. So I think that that's
27:23
Speaker 2: you know, the difference there. But it's a fair point.
27:26
Speaker 2: I can't I don't really have a great rebuttal to that,
27:28
Speaker 2: I think that's a It's a different team, there's no
27:30
Speaker 2: doubt about that. Colin. He asks, what are three things
27:33
Speaker 2: you're most excited to watch in training camp?
27:37
Speaker 3: Three things? Well, we got to talk about Drake May.
27:41
Speaker 3: See the defensive scheme and I guess see, I don't
27:43
Speaker 3: know how much we'll see if Diggs, but see where
27:44
Speaker 3: Diggs is at.
27:46
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree with that, Drake May. I would say
27:52
Speaker 2: it's hard with the offensive line and defensive lines. But
27:56
Speaker 2: Drake May whoever goes up against Christian Zales? Could any
28:01
Speaker 2: receiver beat Christian Zales consistently in training camp? Because then
28:05
Speaker 2: I might feel good about that receiver, Like if it's
28:07
Speaker 2: Keishan Boodie, if it's Kyle Williams, if it's Stefon Diggs,
28:12
Speaker 2: if that is like a true toe to toe, iron
28:14
Speaker 2: sharpening iron type of matchup, will be excited about that.
28:17
Speaker 2: In the offensive line, Drake made receiver, offensive line shocker?
28:22
Speaker 2: Who will be this from Sasha? Who will be the
28:25
Speaker 2: starting left guard to open camp? I'm saying col strange.
28:27
Speaker 2: I'm saying col strange from Tim. Do you think the
28:30
Speaker 2: Patriots offense will have a better year than the Dolphins offense? Yes,
28:35
Speaker 2: I'm gonna say no. I still think the Dolphins have
28:38
Speaker 2: too much skill talent, like a hill waddle they're running.
28:41
Speaker 3: Who's not gonna play the full season? The line's bad.
28:44
Speaker 3: The Dolphins offense will have higher highs over the course
28:47
Speaker 3: of seventeen games. Which unit will be better the Patriots?
28:50
Speaker 2: I think the Dolphins offense with two is still going
28:52
Speaker 2: to be a really good offense.
28:53
Speaker 3: How many games are going to do ten? The Dolphins
28:56
Speaker 3: seems to be the number all the time. Who averages
28:59
Speaker 3: more points per game? Well, it'll be the Dolphins because
29:01
Speaker 3: they'll have one game. Will they randomly score fifty?
29:05
Speaker 2: I don't know. Probably Dolphins are gonna have games where
29:09
Speaker 2: they're gonna be like like they were last year when
29:11
Speaker 2: they played the Patriots. Like they're gonna have games where
29:13
Speaker 2: they're knife hot, knife through, but.
29:14
Speaker 3: They're also gonna have gas where they can't. It'll be cold.
29:16
Speaker 3: They'll be playing a team over five hundred, theyll struggle
29:18
Speaker 3: to put up fourteen points. Fair enough, You're probably right
29:21
Speaker 3: they'll be The Dolphins offense is much more volatile, and
29:23
Speaker 3: I appreciate consistency, So I'll take the Patriots.
29:27
Speaker 2: Drew asks. Christian Gonzales took the leap last year to
29:30
Speaker 2: all Pro caliber player. Who do do you who do
29:33
Speaker 2: you think will be the player to make that jump
29:35
Speaker 2: this year?
29:36
Speaker 3: Wait?
29:36
Speaker 2: Say that again, who do you think the player would
29:40
Speaker 2: make the jump this year? Like a Christian Zales esque
29:42
Speaker 2: jump like Gonzales front from rookie good rookie to all.
29:45
Speaker 3: Pro Keon White. I just I just think this defense
29:48
Speaker 3: suits him so well. It's it's such a great spot
29:52
Speaker 3: for him, It's a good coaching staff for him. You know,
29:55
Speaker 3: there's gonna be a lot of attention on the in
29:57
Speaker 3: the middle to Milton Williams and Christian Barmore. It's gonna
29:59
Speaker 3: freem up, you know, will he be at the level
30:02
Speaker 3: that Gonzales is relative to position. I don't know about that,
30:05
Speaker 3: but you know, could key On White flirt with double
30:08
Speaker 3: digit sacks this year? I could see it.
30:11
Speaker 2: Karen White is the right answer. It's a good answer.
30:15
Speaker 2: I don't know if like all pro's not gonna happen.
30:17
Speaker 3: So I don't know that he's gonna do it.
30:18
Speaker 2: Yah, I'm saying that about my answer, but I think
30:20
Speaker 2: the same thing.
30:21
Speaker 3: So yeah, I don't know that he'll do it to
30:22
Speaker 3: the extent that Christian Gonzalez did, but like he could,
30:25
Speaker 3: I think he'll go to another level.
30:27
Speaker 2: Is there another love for Tomorrow Douglas.
30:30
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean he's just already pretty cool.
30:32
Speaker 2: That one stands out to me just I was tempted.
30:37
Speaker 2: There's still some trade chatter out there from our colleagues
30:40
Speaker 2: on the beat. I saw Greg Bdard said that, you know,
30:42
Speaker 2: he was one of the guys he listed his potential
30:45
Speaker 2: trades out of that winer.
30:46
Speaker 3: They don't love that.
30:47
Speaker 2: I just don't see that. I don't see it. I'm
30:49
Speaker 2: not saying that the reporting is wrong.
30:51
Speaker 3: I know that's the guy would hold on to. I
30:53
Speaker 3: think he's a good player.
30:54
Speaker 2: This is a cool question from Elliott who is your
30:56
Speaker 2: favorite Patriot player that didn't get enough recognition? He says
31:00
Speaker 2: his is Kyle van Noy.
31:02
Speaker 3: That's a good one.
31:03
Speaker 2: Here's Larry Centers.
31:05
Speaker 3: But like Larry Centers, it's think Larry Center should be
31:08
Speaker 3: in the Hall of Fame. Yeah, but he by the
31:09
Speaker 3: time he got to the Patriots, that was like the end.
31:11
Speaker 3: I'm like somebody who didn't get enough credit with the Patriots.
31:15
Speaker 3: Where do I start? You know the guy that I've
31:18
Speaker 3: always said that they've they've been chasing this guy since
31:21
Speaker 3: he left, Adrian Waddle. L Adrian Waddle was a true
31:26
Speaker 3: swing tackle at a time they needed one. They've been
31:30
Speaker 3: fighting tackle.
31:32
Speaker 2: Disrespect. But Adrian Waddle is your answer.
31:34
Speaker 3: How many times does this team needed a serviceable swing
31:37
Speaker 3: tackle in the last five years and he wasn't here.
31:40
Speaker 3: Now he I think he had a career any injury
31:42
Speaker 3: after he left. He's not playing anymore. But I remember
31:44
Speaker 3: saying to you that next year when he left, we
31:47
Speaker 3: were talking in the locker room and saying they missed
31:49
Speaker 3: la Adrian Waddle, and you were like, that's crazy, but
31:51
Speaker 3: it's true. I don't know why he's the first name
31:53
Speaker 3: who came to mind. There's probably a better answer. Martella's
31:55
Speaker 3: Bennett would be one super underrated Patriot. Loved having him here.
31:59
Speaker 3: But I was just talking to somebody about this the
32:01
Speaker 3: other day. They sneaky missed Ladrey and Wada when they
32:05
Speaker 3: moved on. I bet I can think of it.
32:08
Speaker 2: So my biggest one, I don't know if he didn't
32:10
Speaker 2: get enough recognition, but I don't think he got as
32:13
Speaker 2: much high was Trey Flowers. Trey Flowers at his peak
32:17
Speaker 2: with the Patriots was a darn good pass rushing. He
32:20
Speaker 2: was really good. He's versatile, rush out on the edge,
32:22
Speaker 2: you could rush over the center. He was like dynamite rushing.
32:25
Speaker 3: Made me think of a couple. And maybe it's just
32:27
Speaker 3: because this defense was so loaded. There were so many
32:29
Speaker 3: dudes on that defense. Alan Branch was a really good
32:32
Speaker 3: player and he was playing next Evince, and he kind
32:35
Speaker 3: of came here late in his career, so I get
32:37
Speaker 3: what I came.
32:38
Speaker 2: Hicks were kind of like ones that got away a
32:39
Speaker 2: little bit, like especially Hicks. Well Hicks Hicks went, but
32:42
Speaker 2: that was like a scheme change.
32:43
Speaker 3: Alan Branch came here when people thought his career was over.
32:46
Speaker 2: Yeah it wasn't.
32:47
Speaker 3: It wasn't.
32:47
Speaker 2: Uncle Phil's nickname.
32:48
Speaker 3: Yeah, because he looks like and he kind of turned around.
32:50
Speaker 3: And then also from that defense, Kyle Arrington because he
32:53
Speaker 3: got followed by Jonathan Jones, who's obviously been this incredible Patriot,
32:57
Speaker 3: But Kyle Arrington was going, I'm trying to think back
32:59
Speaker 3: to like the earlier, earlier teams.
33:03
Speaker 2: Earlier teams like a lot of not not that they
33:07
Speaker 2: shouldn't have, but a lot of those early Patriots teams.
33:09
Speaker 2: All those guys got loved, I know, which they should have.
33:11
Speaker 2: Like I'm not saying it shouldn't have.
33:12
Speaker 3: I mean, I don't like Roman Fifer Roman fight.
33:15
Speaker 2: So what was I watching? Maybe it was just on Twitter?
33:17
Speaker 2: And then we got to move on from this question,
33:19
Speaker 2: but always do the rest to show on this they
33:21
Speaker 2: were naming I want it was one of the early
33:24
Speaker 2: two thousands defenses two thousand and one, three or four,
33:27
Speaker 2: and they just I think it was four because I
33:29
Speaker 2: think Vince was was already on the team.
33:31
Speaker 3: Yes, it would have been four.
33:32
Speaker 2: Seymour, will Fork Warren.
33:36
Speaker 3: Yeah.
33:37
Speaker 2: And then when they got and I was like, okay, yeah,
33:39
Speaker 2: it's stack dye line. Then they get to the linebackers
33:42
Speaker 2: and they go Willie McGinnis to usc Teddy Bruski, Yeah, Arizona,
33:48
Speaker 2: Roman Fifer, Mike Rabel, and I was just like, holy crap, Like,
33:53
Speaker 2: how is this not talked about? Is like one of
33:55
Speaker 2: the best linebacker rooms of the two thousands, So this
33:58
Speaker 2: is insane.
33:59
Speaker 3: I kind of him or I'll just bring this up
34:00
Speaker 3: because we're in this conversation. I'm working on something with
34:05
Speaker 3: Matt Doloff over at the Sports Hub. It actually might
34:08
Speaker 3: be up by the time people see this. We haven't
34:09
Speaker 3: recorded it yet, but again recording this show early. We
34:13
Speaker 3: kind of want to do like an all sports sub
34:15
Speaker 3: Patriots team. So the sports Sub started in two thousand
34:17
Speaker 3: and nine, so but I want to do it as
34:19
Speaker 3: like a fifty three man roster projection, So maybe not
34:22
Speaker 3: the fifty three best players, but build out the roster.
34:25
Speaker 3: Here's who I have to choose from a corner. This
34:27
Speaker 3: is just since two thousand and nine.
34:28
Speaker 2: Okay, herr Yeah, because we're trying to keep this shorter.
34:31
Speaker 3: Steph Gilmore, Malcolm Butler, Jonathan Jones, j C. Jackson, Christian
34:35
Speaker 3: Zalez and keep to leave Drell Reeves, Jason mccordy, Kyle Arrington,
34:38
Speaker 3: Jonathan Jones. It's tough group that's insane.
34:42
Speaker 2: So we're talking to you're taking two.
34:44
Speaker 3: Well, no, it's gonna be a fifth. We're gonna build
34:46
Speaker 3: like a fifty three man, so you can have as
34:47
Speaker 3: many as like five. So yeah, we'll probably have two
34:51
Speaker 3: boundary guys, two slot guys, and then a tweener. So
34:53
Speaker 3: like Gilmour is obviously on, I.
34:55
Speaker 2: Think Gilmore Revis to lead law have to be.
34:59
Speaker 3: Hon It's all sports ups. So two thousand and nine,
35:03
Speaker 3: so those three, those are the four. But okay, but
35:05
Speaker 3: like here's the thing, how do you weigh one year
35:08
Speaker 3: of Darrell Revis versus like Jonathan Jones was here for
35:12
Speaker 3: a decade and was really well, Johnthan Jones might be
35:15
Speaker 3: your slot corner, that's true. One year of Revis versus
35:20
Speaker 3: four years of Malcolm Butler who also had to pick
35:23
Speaker 3: in Super Bowl forty nine. Me and me and Matt
35:25
Speaker 3: are going to do this on a podcast. But that
35:28
Speaker 3: what an insane run? Like Christian Zhaus at the bottom
35:31
Speaker 3: of this list. Yeah, he's the last guy I put
35:34
Speaker 3: on there. He's an all pro insane run.
35:37
Speaker 2: Okay, So moving on, Rick asks, currently, I see the
35:41
Speaker 2: Patriots top five wy receivers as Digs, Pop, Booty, Williams, Boorn,
35:45
Speaker 2: to me, Digs and Williams are the only locks. My
35:47
Speaker 2: question is do you trade Bourne to give Baker more
35:51
Speaker 2: reps in preseason to see what they can do? So basically,
35:53
Speaker 2: do you trade Kennrin Bourne.
35:54
Speaker 3: I wouldn't. I also don't. If you'd want those two
35:57
Speaker 3: guys to get reps, you can give him reps. I
35:59
Speaker 3: don't think you need a trade anybody. These people forget
36:01
Speaker 3: how long these preseason games are. Yeah, like you can
36:03
Speaker 3: get them reps. I wouldn't trade Kendrick Bourne unless it's
36:06
Speaker 3: in like we talked about last week, one of those
36:09
Speaker 3: deals where all right, you know Terry McLaurin for a
36:11
Speaker 3: second and born right, I would do that, But I'm
36:13
Speaker 3: not rushing Kendrick Bourne out the door. He has chemistry
36:16
Speaker 3: with Drake May, he has experience in Josh McDaniel's offense.
36:19
Speaker 3: He's another year removed from that torn ACL so I
36:21
Speaker 3: think he's gonna move a little bit better. I wouldn't
36:24
Speaker 3: rush him out the door. And he's more proven, and
36:26
Speaker 3: they need some proven commodities, even if it's not proven
36:29
Speaker 3: at a high level. They need some guys who you
36:31
Speaker 3: kind of just know what you're getting out of. That's
36:33
Speaker 3: definitely not Polkin Baker.
36:35
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's fair, all right. Tammy asks who hits six
36:41
Speaker 2: six hundred and fifty yards from scrimmage first, Travon Henderson
36:44
Speaker 2: or Kyle Williams. I'm going Henderson as well. I think
36:47
Speaker 2: that's not really fair, No, because he's running totally differ
36:50
Speaker 2: different because Henderson you can force feed the ball. Kyle
36:52
Speaker 2: Williams has to get open and catch the ball. Yeah,
36:54
Speaker 2: that's very different.
36:55
Speaker 3: Nothing against Kyle Williams, but that's not it's not the same,
37:01
Speaker 3: all right.
37:01
Speaker 2: Rick asks after free agency in the draft, which position
37:04
Speaker 2: group still is in need of a talent upgrade? So
37:07
Speaker 2: my answer to this question is different. Like talent upgrade
37:10
Speaker 2: versus which position am I most concerned about, I think
37:13
Speaker 2: are two different things because I don't think you need
37:17
Speaker 2: the Zach Martin of left guards, like I don't think
37:19
Speaker 2: you need a stud at left guard. But if I
37:21
Speaker 2: had to say what the biggest hole on the team
37:23
Speaker 2: is right now, it's probably left guard just in terms
37:26
Speaker 2: of starting caliber player. But the area where I feel
37:29
Speaker 2: like they're the most talent deficient might be a little
37:33
Speaker 2: bit different than that. I would say talent deficient. I
37:36
Speaker 2: would more lean towards either receiver or edge rusher. I'm
37:40
Speaker 2: with you, But in terms of where I think the
37:43
Speaker 2: biggest hole is, it's still left guard, still the interior
37:45
Speaker 2: offensive line. Quick asks, Could the Patriots take a flyer
37:49
Speaker 2: on Zadarius Smith, Gabe Davis or Will Hernandez if they
37:52
Speaker 2: get the veteran manhim, Will Hernandez guard played a little
37:55
Speaker 2: bit in the league, was drafted by the Giants. Zadarius Smith.
38:00
Speaker 2: I could see it, But like you already have Harold Randrey,
38:03
Speaker 2: Harold Landry and Chase On Like those are kind of
38:05
Speaker 2: your veteran edge rushers. I don't know if you need
38:08
Speaker 2: a third one of those types of guys on the team.
38:11
Speaker 2: So if I had to guess out of those three,
38:12
Speaker 2: I'd say Will Hernandez or just you know, we talked
38:15
Speaker 2: about Sheriff last week on the show. Want to say
38:17
Speaker 2: Smith had nine sacks last year still, and I think
38:22
Speaker 2: he has some between the Packers and Vikings, he must
38:24
Speaker 2: have some overlap with the current car Oh and Mike Rablers,
38:26
Speaker 2: with Mike Rable and Cleveland for part of last year.
38:29
Speaker 2: I wouldn't hate Sindarius Smith again, You're you're creating a
38:31
Speaker 2: little bit of a log jam that might not be
38:34
Speaker 2: the worst thing in the world for how they're set
38:35
Speaker 2: up right now, especially if they're planning on moving on
38:38
Speaker 2: for me Anfredy Jennings, Yeah, I could see that all right.
38:41
Speaker 2: Last one here, this is from Matt. How do you
38:44
Speaker 2: think all the offensive line offensive mines, excuse me, offensive
38:49
Speaker 2: mines in the room? Mesh. So I'm thinking he's talking
38:51
Speaker 2: about the coaching staff. Yeah, there's a lot of guys
38:53
Speaker 2: from different backgrounds. How do I think that they're gonna, Mesh.
38:57
Speaker 2: Josh McDaniels is in charge, So I think they're gonna
39:00
Speaker 2: as much as I want to have an open mind
39:04
Speaker 2: and have you know, have McDaniels have an open mind
39:07
Speaker 2: and hear out other people and bring in other ideas
39:10
Speaker 2: and bring in fresh concepts. At the end of the day,
39:12
Speaker 2: the way that you, Mesh, is that you recognize as
39:15
Speaker 2: a positional coach that the offensive the buck stops with
39:19
Speaker 2: the offensive coordinator. And I think that the onus is
39:21
Speaker 2: on everybody for that. But I would say that there's
39:24
Speaker 2: some bus on the positional coaches, like don't don't overstep,
39:27
Speaker 2: like don't don't get too big for your bridges. You know,
39:30
Speaker 2: you're the quarterbacks coach, you're the tight ends coach, you're
39:33
Speaker 2: the receivers coach. You know, just do your job and
39:36
Speaker 2: I think everything will be fine. But I that's not
39:37
Speaker 2: to say live in an echo chamber, right, Like you
39:40
Speaker 2: want to have those other ideas, but that if you
39:42
Speaker 2: ask me how they mesh, they meshed by realizing that
39:44
Speaker 2: Josh McDaniels is the guy in charge. Yeah, there we go.
39:47
Speaker 2: So we did pretty good there. That was pretty rapid fire. Yeah,
39:50
Speaker 2: right around forty minutes. So that's the show for this week. Sorry,
39:53
Speaker 2: that's a little bit shorter, but I have some big
39:55
Speaker 2: things going on, so I think I have a pretty
39:57
Speaker 2: good excuse. But Alex and I will be back on
40:00
Speaker 2: the twenty third, the first day of training camp. I
40:02
Speaker 2: can't believe I'm saying that. That's absolutely crazy. So we'll
40:06
Speaker 2: be back on Catch twenty two live on Wednesday, the
40:09
Speaker 2: twenty third of July for the very first day of
40:12
Speaker 2: Patriots training camp. So thanks so much for watching and listening,
40:16
Speaker 2: as you guys always do. Big thanks to all the
40:19
Speaker 2: male bag questions as well. Hopefully we got to all
40:22
Speaker 2: of them and we'll see you guys in a few weeks.
40:24
Speaker 2: Thanks for watching.
40:27
Speaker 3: Hey, this is Deuce Thanks for tuning into the show.
40:29
Speaker 3: If you really want to help us, make sure you
40:30
Speaker 3: like us wherever you get your podcasts, like Apple Podcasts
40:33
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40:35
Speaker 3: New England Patriots YouTube channel to see this show and
40:37
Speaker 3: everything else that we do here at the Patriots. Thanks
40:40
Speaker 3: a lot,