Transcript

Credlin | 3 June · Credlin

0:02
Speaker 1: Peter Krendland live on Sky News Australia.
0:07
Speaker 2: Good evening, Welcome to the program. Here's what's coming up
0:10
Speaker 2: to nine on credline. The part time Parliament. That's what
0:12
Speaker 2: Labour's current sitting schedules being dubbed as government plans to
0:16
Speaker 2: sit for the fewest days in twenty years.
0:19
Speaker 3: So why are they so afraid of scrutiny?
0:22
Speaker 2: Tony Abbitts, just returned from Ukraine this morning, joins me
0:24
Speaker 2: live in the studio as we discuss the audacious drone strike,
0:28
Speaker 2: the Prime Minister's unwillingness to increase our defense budget here
0:31
Speaker 2: despite the calls from the US, and just what the
0:33
Speaker 2: Liberal Party's got to do to get back in the
0:35
Speaker 2: game as a second term opposition. Plus, for all the
0:38
Speaker 2: tough redtreet from the Dama Labor government in the UK,
0:42
Speaker 2: illegal migration appears to be as worse as ever. One
0:46
Speaker 2: thousand people crossing the channel in just a single day
0:49
Speaker 2: across live to the UK and joined by author Iron
0:53
Speaker 2: hers Ali, and they might not be able to control
0:55
Speaker 2: their borders. The lads in the UK Labor government is
0:58
Speaker 2: getting serious about they are defense spending, which is more
1:02
Speaker 2: than I can say for Australia. The UK says it
1:06
Speaker 2: was then three percent GDP of defense.
1:08
Speaker 4: By twenty thirty.
1:09
Speaker 5: Good on them.
1:09
Speaker 3: Would really be acting in line with their allies.
1:12
Speaker 6: What with the UK. The UK's in a different place
1:17
Speaker 6: from Australia. We determine our defense policy here where a
1:22
Speaker 6: sovereign nation.
1:25
Speaker 2: Different place from the UK, Sure we are, but we're
1:27
Speaker 2: actually closer to China. Prime Minister for first, more than
1:31
Speaker 2: one thousand boat people who made it across the English
1:34
Speaker 2: Channel last Saturday alone, showing the magnitude of the potential
1:38
Speaker 2: people movement that is now out of control. And yes,
1:41
Speaker 2: here in Australia we've managed to stop illegal arrivals by boat,
1:45
Speaker 2: or at least coalition governments have, but we've still got
1:49
Speaker 2: almost one hundred thousand people in this country with outstanding
1:53
Speaker 2: legal claims, most of them rejected as asylum seekers but
1:56
Speaker 2: refusing to leave. Many of them former boat arrivals from
2:00
Speaker 2: Labour's time, plus tens of thousands have come legally on
2:04
Speaker 2: temporary visas to study aur as tourists, only to subsequently
2:09
Speaker 2: try and claim asylum once in Australia. In Britain, the
2:13
Speaker 2: BBC reports one thousand, one hundred and ninety five people
2:16
Speaker 2: arrived on Saturday May thirty one in nineteen small boats.
2:22
Speaker 2: So far this year, almost fifteen thousand people across the
2:25
Speaker 2: Channel to claim asylum in Britain.
2:27
Speaker 3: Now.
2:27
Speaker 2: That's up forty two percent on last year and up
2:31
Speaker 2: ninety five percent for the same period in twenty twenty three.
2:37
Speaker 2: At the beginning of the year in Britain there were
2:39
Speaker 2: some thirty eight thousand asylum seekers, all accommodated in more
2:43
Speaker 2: than two hundred hotels across the country, with a recent
2:47
Speaker 2: government report estimating the cost of housing these asylum seekers
2:51
Speaker 2: at some fifteen billion pounds, so over thirty billion Australian
2:56
Speaker 2: dollars over the decade. Not only is the cost he read,
3:00
Speaker 2: but illegal migrants feed into other social problems and exacerbate
3:05
Speaker 2: a sense that society's spinning out of control. Part of
3:09
Speaker 2: the problem in Britain is active as lawyers and judges
3:11
Speaker 2: who make it almost impossible for people to be deported.
3:15
Speaker 2: But off our bigger obstacle is the European Convention on
3:18
Speaker 2: Human Rights, which both sides of politics in the UK
3:22
Speaker 2: are reluctant to abrogate, even though it's this that's frustrated
3:26
Speaker 2: the previous Conservative government's plan to ship both people to
3:30
Speaker 2: Rwander for processing. Now, when that idea, the Rwanda plan,
3:35
Speaker 2: was conceived, it was supposed to be Britain's version of
3:39
Speaker 2: our offshore processing in Niru. There is more to this mess,
3:44
Speaker 2: and that's the interplay in all of this with the
3:47
Speaker 2: UN Convention on Refugees. The nineteen fifty one UN Convention
3:52
Speaker 2: on Refugees was meant to deal with people temporarily displaced
3:56
Speaker 2: from their homelands in the wake of the Second World War.
4:00
Speaker 2: It's now though being gained by economic would be migrants.
4:04
Speaker 2: The UN Convention merely obliges nations have signed up to
4:08
Speaker 2: it to provide temporary asylum, temporary protection from the threat of,
4:13
Speaker 2: in the convention's words, the well founded fear of persecution. Instead,
4:19
Speaker 2: two things have happened since the Convention was brought into
4:21
Speaker 2: international law.
4:23
Speaker 3: First, a very small.
4:24
Speaker 2: Number of countries, around twenty four of them. We are
4:27
Speaker 2: one of them. So to is Britain go further than
4:30
Speaker 2: the Convention requires us. So we don't just offer temporary asylum,
4:35
Speaker 2: but instead we offer permanent resettlement in our countries and
4:39
Speaker 2: a pathway to citizenship, So a whole new life for
4:42
Speaker 2: these refugees not just protection as originally intended.
4:47
Speaker 3: Now one of those.
4:48
Speaker 2: Who thinks this is a good thing, because resettling people
4:51
Speaker 2: who fled their homelands fearing for their lives and want
4:54
Speaker 2: to build a new life here in our country is
4:56
Speaker 2: what's helped to make Australia what it is today. Second,
5:00
Speaker 2: since the Convention was brought into international law, much of
5:04
Speaker 2: the people movement around the world is based not on
5:06
Speaker 2: a well founded fear of persecution, so not people fleeing
5:10
Speaker 2: for their lives, but people wanting to move to the
5:12
Speaker 2: West and live a better economic life, so life in
5:16
Speaker 2: a democracy under the rule of law, with a very
5:19
Speaker 2: generous social security system built in. Now, I strongly support
5:24
Speaker 2: our refugee program, as I said, but not the gaming
5:27
Speaker 2: of the system. Few Australians support that. We did not
5:31
Speaker 2: want to see people coming here pretending our tourists, trying
5:34
Speaker 2: it on as refugees when they get here, having their
5:37
Speaker 2: applications to stay rejected time and time again, and then
5:41
Speaker 2: refusing to leave. These people would be economic migrants. They
5:46
Speaker 2: are not refugees under the law, and they often make
5:50
Speaker 2: convenient claims such as I've just converted to Christianity.
5:53
Speaker 3: They say I am.
5:55
Speaker 2: Gay, to avoid being sent back to repressive Muslim countries.
6:00
Speaker 2: And this is what stopping the boats, as Australia year
6:03
Speaker 2: did and Britain needs to do, is all about. It's
6:07
Speaker 2: not about stopping the genuine refugees that only about as
6:11
Speaker 2: I say, twenty four countries in the world actually take in,
6:14
Speaker 2: meaning some one hundred and seventy countries do not stopping
6:18
Speaker 2: the boats as that are putting an end to the
6:21
Speaker 2: people who are not refugees at all. And these people
6:24
Speaker 2: are predominantly young men who cross the English Channel to
6:28
Speaker 2: gain the system and trespass on the good will of
6:31
Speaker 2: the British people. Last year, there were thought to be
6:35
Speaker 2: about a million people are legally president in Europe, mostly
6:38
Speaker 2: from the Middle East and Africa. Over the term of
6:41
Speaker 2: the Biden administration, some ten million people are thought to
6:45
Speaker 2: have entered the United States illegally across the southern border. Now,
6:49
Speaker 2: the promise to restore border control was probably the biggest
6:52
Speaker 2: factor in the election of Donald Trump, and he's done
6:56
Speaker 2: that because a country that loses control of its borders
7:00
Speaker 2: is effectively opening itself up to peaceful invasion. And while
7:05
Speaker 2: no one wants race or religion to determine immigration, policy.
7:10
Speaker 2: Countries do have a right to keep their character and
7:14
Speaker 2: their values. As John Howard famously said in the two
7:17
Speaker 2: thousand and one election campaign, we will decide who comes
7:21
Speaker 2: to this country in the circumstances under which they come.
7:24
Speaker 2: But given the scale of people movement around the world,
7:27
Speaker 2: it's not enough just to have stopped illegal migration by vote.
7:32
Speaker 2: The legal system shouldn't let people string out asylum claims
7:36
Speaker 2: more or less indefinitely. And this is where we in
7:39
Speaker 2: Australia must have changed to our system. Just one application,
7:44
Speaker 2: one review of that decision.
7:46
Speaker 3: That's it.
7:47
Speaker 2: If you're not successful, you're out. No longer should we
7:51
Speaker 2: allow people six or seven legal appeals and stays of
7:54
Speaker 2: ten years or more courtesy the Australian taxpayer, to wait
7:59
Speaker 2: out the decision. Sovereign Borders means, or did mean under
8:04
Speaker 2: Tony Abbott and John Howard, that people who have lost
8:07
Speaker 2: their asylum claims should face swift deportation. Now this matters
8:12
Speaker 2: because we do not want to end up like Britain.
8:16
Speaker 2: And while they might not be coming in boats for
8:18
Speaker 2: the moment, we are just as susceptible via air traffic.
8:24
Speaker 2: It's why countries like ours, with about two million people
8:28
Speaker 2: here right now, temporarily here on visas. It's why countries
8:34
Speaker 2: like ours have to be careful about who we let
8:37
Speaker 2: in and if we don't want them, the likelihood of
8:42
Speaker 2: sending them home. It's why we should change the law
8:45
Speaker 2: in this country to deny entreat to anyone from any
8:48
Speaker 2: country that refuses to take back their citizens if we
8:52
Speaker 2: choose to deport them, countries like Iran, Afghanistan and a
8:57
Speaker 2: whole raft of others. It would be a real mistake
9:01
Speaker 2: for any Australian politician to get smug and think we
9:04
Speaker 2: have avoided the border chaos that's afflicting Britain. We had
9:09
Speaker 2: it once and we could just as easily have it
9:12
Speaker 2: again if we are complacent. Because the price of ongoing
9:17
Speaker 2: security is eternal and constant vigilance. Let's got to camin
9:26
Speaker 2: out the headline Skinnies political reporter Ribbon Spargo.
9:31
Speaker 7: Millions of Australian workers will receive a pay rise after
9:35
Speaker 7: the Fair Work Commission revealed its decision. An above inflation
9:39
Speaker 7: increase of three and a half percent will be applied
9:41
Speaker 7: to minimum and award wages.
9:44
Speaker 6: Will be welcomed by people who keep our economy going.
9:48
Speaker 6: The essential workers.
9:50
Speaker 7: The Australian Chamber of Commerce claims the wage increase will
9:53
Speaker 7: be challenging to afford for vulnerable businesses. It will come
9:57
Speaker 7: to effect from July one. Siations between Labour and the
10:01
Speaker 7: Greens could become more complicated after Senator Derinda Cox defected
10:06
Speaker 7: from the minor party to join the government. The Prime
10:09
Speaker 7: Minister is welcoming the senator, brushing off bullying allegations. Last year,
10:14
Speaker 7: it emerged twenty staff left Senator Cox's office in three years.
10:18
Speaker 7: Senator Cox denies the claims Labour needs either the support
10:22
Speaker 7: of the Greens in the Senate or the entire crossbench
10:25
Speaker 7: to pass legislation. The Prime Minister is not ruling out
10:29
Speaker 7: tweaks to Labour's planned superannuation tax. To garner the coalition's support,
10:34
Speaker 7: the government is doubling the tax on earnings for balances
10:37
Speaker 7: more than three million dollars. The Opposition claims it will
10:40
Speaker 7: work with Labor providing it indexes the threshold and abandons
10:45
Speaker 7: taxing unrealized gains.
10:47
Speaker 6: We do not have a majority in the Senate, we
10:49
Speaker 6: obviously work with different parties.
10:52
Speaker 7: The Greens are calling for a two million dollar threshold,
10:55
Speaker 7: but support indexing it to inflation.
10:59
Speaker 2: To get across tonight to me now Sky News political contributor,
11:02
Speaker 2: the one for Chris Human.
11:03
Speaker 3: Chris welcome. I want to start tonight with an early.
11:05
Speaker 2: Discussion about something that will be ubiquitous in a couple
11:09
Speaker 2: of years time. It's already here. It's going to grow
11:12
Speaker 2: and grow and grow. Of course, this is artificial intelligence.
11:15
Speaker 2: A few stories around in the last couple of days.
11:17
Speaker 2: One is which the Business Council of Australia they're warning
11:20
Speaker 2: the government not to get too heavy handed, not to
11:23
Speaker 2: drowned in regulation. They want artificial intelligence sort of unfettered
11:28
Speaker 2: because they want innovation, they say. However, today the new
11:32
Speaker 2: Science and Industry Minister Tim Airs he has signaled the
11:35
Speaker 2: need for regulation and he sees a very strong role
11:38
Speaker 2: here for the trade unions have a listen.
11:42
Speaker 4: The Australian challenge is to lean in and to adopt
11:46
Speaker 4: artificial intelligence, to lift productivity and living standards, to deliver
11:51
Speaker 4: investment in infrastructure and capability, and to protect their security.
11:56
Speaker 4: So I'll be looking in particular at how we can
11:58
Speaker 4: strengthen work a voice in our agency as technology is
12:02
Speaker 4: diffused into every workplace in the Australian economy. And I
12:05
Speaker 4: look forward to working with their trade union movement on
12:08
Speaker 4: all of this.
12:12
Speaker 2: Now I tend to agree with the minister here and
12:14
Speaker 2: the unions on this. I work for Richard Austin. In
12:16
Speaker 2: the time the Internet arrived in Australia and there was
12:19
Speaker 2: a whole debate this is the late nineties early two
12:21
Speaker 2: thousands about the government stepping in and putting some sort
12:24
Speaker 2: of ring fencing, some regulation about around the Internet. Now
12:28
Speaker 2: that was screamed at by business and the government rolled over.
12:32
Speaker 2: It didn't regulate the Internet. It agreed that it should
12:36
Speaker 2: be as unfettered as possible. I think we'd all agree. Now, yes,
12:39
Speaker 2: it's been a lot good with the Internet, but it's
12:40
Speaker 2: also brought us a lot of harm. And I think
12:42
Speaker 2: with AI, I don't want to end up doing what
12:44
Speaker 2: we did with the Internet, and now it's sourcing the
12:46
Speaker 2: whole thing, indeed, our sovereignty to all those billionaires in
12:50
Speaker 2: Silicon Valley.
12:53
Speaker 8: Oh yeah, Peter, we're told this is a workplace revolution, right,
12:57
Speaker 8: so there should be some workers involved.
12:58
Speaker 1: In this revolution.
13:00
Speaker 8: And the thing that I've noticed about chat GPT, which
13:02
Speaker 8: I began looking at last year, is how rapidly it
13:05
Speaker 8: has acquired more and more knowledge and how useful a
13:09
Speaker 8: tool it's become and you can see it replacing a
13:12
Speaker 8: whole lot of white collar jobs down the track. Now
13:14
Speaker 8: I've heard everything from it will be a workplace burned
13:18
Speaker 8: to the fact that it will be aged. And let's
13:20
Speaker 8: assume that we can't know the future and it might
13:22
Speaker 8: be somewhere in between, and assume also.
13:24
Speaker 1: There will be benefits and there will be costs.
13:26
Speaker 8: Well, we should be trying to measure those things, and
13:29
Speaker 8: I think government policy should be trying to make sure
13:31
Speaker 8: that we get more benefits than costs out of this.
13:34
Speaker 8: My fear, though, Peter, is that policy will lag a
13:36
Speaker 8: long way behind this technology.
13:38
Speaker 1: We will be racing to catch up.
13:42
Speaker 2: Yeah, we know China is so much further ahead than
13:46
Speaker 2: most Western nations. We also known Chris. And this is
13:48
Speaker 2: to your usual issues that you focus on energy. It
13:52
Speaker 2: needs gargantuan amounts of energy. It's not going to survive
13:56
Speaker 2: AI in this country or flourish if it's just a
13:59
Speaker 2: bit we in and a bit of soul. This is
14:01
Speaker 2: why America is going back with Three Mile Island into nuclear.
14:05
Speaker 3: But again, what worries me.
14:07
Speaker 2: Let's say it replaces as Dick Smith once said to
14:10
Speaker 2: me about a third of the workforce. What do these
14:13
Speaker 2: human beings do? Where is the dignity of their work
14:16
Speaker 2: every day? What's their purpose? How do they earn money?
14:19
Speaker 2: Are we supposed to just have everybody or a good
14:21
Speaker 2: third of the population on the doll I mean, these
14:24
Speaker 2: are I think some of the challenges that we've got
14:26
Speaker 2: to talk about. I feel like we're just being hit
14:29
Speaker 2: with AI and we're scrambling, you know, behind, trying to
14:33
Speaker 2: catch up.
14:35
Speaker 8: I think scrambling is the word. And we have seen
14:38
Speaker 8: what's happened when you outsource blue collar jobs, right what
14:40
Speaker 8: happened to men in the nineteen nineties who were bounced
14:44
Speaker 8: out of a job. They were told there would be
14:45
Speaker 8: new jobs, and in fact none really came along, and
14:48
Speaker 8: a lot of them went into disability pensions. And we're very,
14:51
Speaker 8: very disappointed with the way that both major parties essentially
14:54
Speaker 8: back that inning.
14:54
Speaker 1: Then guess what, there are all these people voting.
14:56
Speaker 8: For one nation, and everyone wondered where all these angry
14:59
Speaker 8: white men came from. The same thing happened in the
15:01
Speaker 8: United States on a much larger scale. Now, those who
15:03
Speaker 8: are in white collar jobs may well face the same
15:06
Speaker 8: kind of crisis.
15:07
Speaker 1: So we absolutely should be having a conversation about this.
15:10
Speaker 8: I don't know that we'll be having one that's fast
15:12
Speaker 8: enough to keep up with the pace of change.
15:17
Speaker 2: Another conversation, certainly the lives of South Australia want is
15:20
Speaker 2: net zero. They have taken a formal vote in a
15:24
Speaker 2: Liberal Party you know, management body, if I can call
15:28
Speaker 2: it that, to say that they don't want net zero
15:31
Speaker 2: and they want the Federal Party to make this their
15:33
Speaker 2: official position. There's some moderates, of course, they're not happy
15:37
Speaker 2: about this, but this is a party division.
15:39
Speaker 3: It's got a bit of clout.
15:41
Speaker 2: We've got to see the beginning of the end perhaps
15:44
Speaker 2: of net zero.
15:46
Speaker 8: Yeah, Perter, I certainly don't think that this is the
15:48
Speaker 8: last division that's going to have this kind of vote.
15:51
Speaker 8: And now you have the circumstance in South Australia where
15:53
Speaker 8: the division has a different view than the Labor Party
15:56
Speaker 8: party in Parliament. They're in a different view again from
16:00
Speaker 8: the Federal Party which has got this under review. And
16:03
Speaker 8: I think it's a perfectly reasonable argument to have, because
16:06
Speaker 8: I think that there are really sound arguments against net one.
16:09
Speaker 8: Is that it's a target, it's not actually a policy,
16:11
Speaker 8: and we don't have the policies in place to do it,
16:13
Speaker 8: we don't have the technology in place to do it,
16:15
Speaker 8: the major economies of the world essentially aren't doing it,
16:18
Speaker 8: and it will cost you trillion dollars to try. Now,
16:20
Speaker 8: they're all reasonable arguments, Peter, that I think reasonable people
16:23
Speaker 8: could make. My problem with the Liberal Party is that
16:26
Speaker 8: I don't think they have the capacity to make those arguments,
16:28
Speaker 8: or at least to decide on a position that they
16:30
Speaker 8: can defend. And when we've seen them way into energy
16:33
Speaker 8: arguments in the past, they leave the rest of us
16:36
Speaker 8: basically struggling to try and make sensible arguments because they've
16:39
Speaker 8: so cruel the playing field. Along the way, say, look,
16:42
Speaker 8: I think it would be a great idea for the
16:44
Speaker 8: Liberal Party to get its act together and to try
16:47
Speaker 8: and work out how it might win the next election
16:49
Speaker 8: in South Australia, whatever its policies might be. But I
16:52
Speaker 8: think there's this too, that if you've got nothing to say,
16:55
Speaker 8: say nothing, for God's sake, shut up until you get
16:58
Speaker 8: your act together.
16:59
Speaker 1: Although I doubt.
17:00
Speaker 8: That's likely to be a policy position that they will
17:02
Speaker 8: adopt it, they will fight among themselves and do themselves
17:04
Speaker 8: incredible damage, and do this argument damage along the way.
17:09
Speaker 3: Tough but fair. Christilman, you're on fire tonight. Hey.
17:12
Speaker 2: You know, part of the I guess concern I have
17:15
Speaker 2: is I look over the horizon.
17:16
Speaker 3: We talked about AI, We've talked about.
17:19
Speaker 2: There, all these big and obviously the rise of China,
17:22
Speaker 2: to all these big issues facing our country. I want
17:25
Speaker 2: to see our parliamentarians have adult debates about this stuff.
17:28
Speaker 2: I want to see them, you know, put the rank
17:31
Speaker 2: at on one side, have the conversations in the parliament.
17:34
Speaker 2: Do the proper inquiries, not the cursory inquiries, but the
17:37
Speaker 2: proper inquiries that they used to have ten and twenty
17:39
Speaker 2: years ago, into legislation, into big issues, get around the country,
17:43
Speaker 2: debate the big stuff.
17:44
Speaker 3: Right, How can.
17:45
Speaker 2: They do that if we're going to have the skinniest
17:49
Speaker 2: parliamentary sitting schedule in twenty plus years, I mean just
17:55
Speaker 2: forty days between.
17:56
Speaker 3: Now and the end of the year. If the House
17:58
Speaker 3: of Reps.
18:00
Speaker 2: This is extraordinary and I don't think this is what
18:02
Speaker 2: Austrains voted for.
18:05
Speaker 4: Yeah.
18:06
Speaker 8: All the thing is, as you know, Peter, is that
18:07
Speaker 8: the one iron rule of politics is if you have
18:09
Speaker 8: the numbers, you make the rules. And the government has
18:11
Speaker 8: the numbers, it's now making the rules, and I've always
18:14
Speaker 8: found that governments, no matter what they're stripe, really don't
18:16
Speaker 8: like transparency all that much. And I would love to
18:18
Speaker 8: see some adult debates in parliament. Unfortunately, I do begin
18:22
Speaker 8: tend to believe at the moment that there is essentially
18:24
Speaker 8: a dominant ideas in the Lower and Upper House, and
18:27
Speaker 8: if the Liberal Party the science that's going to back
18:29
Speaker 8: in net zero, well then you're not going to see
18:32
Speaker 8: much difference when it comes to energy debates. And you
18:34
Speaker 8: do have to wonder why people would bother changing their
18:37
Speaker 8: vote next time around it. That's a big issue if
18:39
Speaker 8: everyone's on the same page. So you know, my issue
18:42
Speaker 8: about Federal Parliament at the moment is that everyone's on
18:44
Speaker 8: the same page and will agree with each other, and
18:46
Speaker 8: that we may see some very.
18:47
Speaker 1: Bad legislation as a result of that. So I'd rather they.
18:50
Speaker 8: Sat even fewer days and gave them less opportunity to
18:52
Speaker 8: pass bad laws that we're all going to have to
18:54
Speaker 8: suffer with.
18:56
Speaker 3: I hear, I hear you.
18:58
Speaker 2: I mean I want small governments, big government, and the
19:01
Speaker 2: problem with them going to camera too often is they
19:03
Speaker 2: tend to make government bigger and bigger to justify their existence.
19:06
Speaker 2: But I do want to have these debates. I feel
19:08
Speaker 2: like I'm crying at the moon. I want government to
19:11
Speaker 2: take us into their confidence. I want business to step up,
19:14
Speaker 2: you know, business to stop being cowards and sitting on
19:17
Speaker 2: the fence on this stuff. I want business to have
19:19
Speaker 2: the arguments. As I said, I'm prepared to back the
19:21
Speaker 2: unions at least having more say over something like ai
19:25
Speaker 2: but at least treat us like like the adult voters
19:28
Speaker 2: that we are and don't just you know, take our
19:31
Speaker 2: ballot and forget about us for the next three years.
19:33
Speaker 3: I think this is really important.
19:37
Speaker 8: I think we're at a time of enormous global change.
19:41
Speaker 8: It is raking change. It will have an effect on
19:43
Speaker 8: this country. That debate was not really represented at the
19:46
Speaker 8: last election.
19:47
Speaker 1: It's not being represented at the moment.
19:49
Speaker 8: And look at the things you've covered this evening defense.
19:51
Speaker 8: The Prime Minister says, we live in a different part
19:53
Speaker 8: of the world to the United Kingdom.
19:54
Speaker 1: Damn right, we do.
19:55
Speaker 8: We live in the Pacific, which is going to be
19:57
Speaker 8: one of the most volatile regions in the world, and
19:59
Speaker 8: particularly China. The science it's going to take Taiwan. We
20:02
Speaker 8: need to be having a discussion about what we spend
20:04
Speaker 8: on defense. We need to be having a discussion about
20:07
Speaker 8: the benefits and the threats of artificial intelligence.
20:09
Speaker 1: And we really need to be having a discussion about energy.
20:12
Speaker 8: Because it is the master resource. Without it, nothing else
20:16
Speaker 8: will work. So all of these things are big questions.
20:19
Speaker 8: I'd love to see a big debate. Unfortunately, most of
20:21
Speaker 8: the debates we have are juvenile.
20:26
Speaker 5: You know.
20:26
Speaker 2: The Greens like to say that they're really progressive. It's
20:28
Speaker 2: certainly more progressive think the conservative side of politics, but
20:30
Speaker 2: the conservative side of politics has more Aboriginal people in
20:34
Speaker 2: the Parliament as their branded MPs than the Greens. The
20:38
Speaker 2: Greens have lost her in the Cox as she's defected
20:41
Speaker 2: to the Labor Party. What's been going on here?
20:46
Speaker 8: Yeah, well, look at it reminds me of Oscar Wilds.
20:48
Speaker 8: I was saying, right, to lose one indigenous senator looks
20:50
Speaker 8: like a misfortune. To lose two looks like carelessness. And
20:54
Speaker 8: I don't know what it says about the internals of
20:56
Speaker 8: the Greens political party, but I will say this, Peter,
20:58
Speaker 8: I've got an old world view comes to being a
21:01
Speaker 8: senator who was.
21:02
Speaker 1: Elected for a political.
21:03
Speaker 8: Party, and that is, if you decide to jump out
21:06
Speaker 8: of the party you should jump out of parliament. I
21:08
Speaker 8: think she should resign from parliament. And it doesn't matter
21:10
Speaker 8: who it is. A Liberal senator, a Labour senator, Green senator.
21:13
Speaker 8: You were elected on behalf of your party, on behalf
21:17
Speaker 8: of your state, and if you're going to jump out
21:19
Speaker 8: of that party.
21:19
Speaker 1: Then you should have the decency to resign.
21:22
Speaker 8: And I wonder how people in the Labor Party in
21:24
Speaker 8: Western Australia feel about having an extra senator and what
21:27
Speaker 8: that might mean for the ticket next time a vote
21:29
Speaker 8: comes up in the next selection.
21:34
Speaker 2: Dunce with the one who brung out on with you.
21:37
Speaker 2: That's my view as well.
21:38
Speaker 3: Thank you Chris.
21:39
Speaker 2: All right, as I said last night, whether you want
21:41
Speaker 2: more renewables in the system or less, one thing's clear.
21:44
Speaker 2: Australia needs more gas and we.
21:46
Speaker 3: Got plenty of gas. We have absolutely plenty of gas.
21:49
Speaker 2: It's just that most of our government, state and federal
21:51
Speaker 2: are doing their level best to keep it in the
21:53
Speaker 2: ground or expected overseas. Do not buy this idea that
21:58
Speaker 2: we do not have gas, that we've got some short
22:00
Speaker 2: We've got supply constraints, not a shortage, and right now,
22:03
Speaker 2: anyone who wants to develop gas in this country, or
22:06
Speaker 2: they are drowned in red tape, or that they're at
22:09
Speaker 2: the other crazy end, as we've seen in Victoria, where
22:12
Speaker 2: they want to import that gas from elsewhere rather than
22:16
Speaker 2: use what they have. Let's unscramble the energy egg with
22:19
Speaker 2: one of the best around, MST Financial Senior energy analyst,
22:24
Speaker 2: Saul Cavonic.
22:26
Speaker 3: So welcome.
22:27
Speaker 2: We're going to start with gas, because gas has been
22:29
Speaker 2: everywhere in the last couple of days. What on earth
22:31
Speaker 2: or how on earth have we got to the position
22:33
Speaker 2: where Victoria rich in gas is going to build a
22:37
Speaker 2: very expensive import gas terminal to then ship the gas
22:41
Speaker 2: from somewhere else in the country, maybe even overseas, and
22:44
Speaker 2: then put it on the port and back into supply
22:48
Speaker 2: in the state. What can they use their own gas
22:49
Speaker 2: out of the ground.
22:53
Speaker 9: Well, A lot of the irony of this is it's
22:57
Speaker 9: been the Victorian government who's been vetoing having any discussion
23:01
Speaker 9: about gas in the Ministerial Council meetings over the last
23:05
Speaker 9: few years, only to now at the last minute ambush
23:09
Speaker 9: everyone demanding support for an import terminal to make up
23:14
Speaker 9: four years of hostility towards any gas development in Victoria.
23:20
Speaker 9: I'm hearing industry folks referring to Lily Dembrosio as lights
23:24
Speaker 9: out Lily. And what's crazy about importing LNG is it's
23:29
Speaker 9: not just higher cost, it's also higher emissions. So for
23:32
Speaker 9: the state of Victoria, which is so focused on decarbonization
23:36
Speaker 9: and green policies, they're now resorting to tax looking to
23:40
Speaker 9: have taxpayer funded, higher emissions, higher cost gas imported into
23:45
Speaker 9: their state rather than use what's using what's are under
23:48
Speaker 9: the ground that they have there themselves.
23:52
Speaker 2: Yeah, I laughed when you said lights out, Lily Dean Brosio.
23:55
Speaker 2: But I shouldn't laugh because it'll be my lights out
23:58
Speaker 2: in Victoria because that's where I live. Explain for people
24:01
Speaker 2: in other states who listen and are watching this train
24:04
Speaker 2: wreck in Victoria across so many fronts, why should they
24:08
Speaker 2: care if they're in Brisbane or Wa. WA's on a
24:11
Speaker 2: separate grid, let's say South Australia or Sydney, and they
24:14
Speaker 2: say it doesn't really apply to me. I'm not going
24:15
Speaker 2: to leave in Victoria. It's a basket case. Why should
24:19
Speaker 2: they worry about what's happening down South?
24:23
Speaker 9: Well, unfortunately the market's interconnected, so Victoria's failures and I
24:28
Speaker 9: must say New South Wales has had very similar failures
24:31
Speaker 9: as well have implications about the States. So there's a
24:35
Speaker 9: threefold impact to here. The first one is taxpayer funded imports.
24:39
Speaker 9: The Victorian government's looking to force that onto federal coffers,
24:43
Speaker 9: so we're all going to end up paying for it.
24:45
Speaker 9: And just to be clear, this isn't just a few
24:47
Speaker 9: hundred million dollar commitment to actually have an import terminal.
24:50
Speaker 9: You're looking at not just a few hundred million dollars
24:52
Speaker 9: for the terminal itself, but you're going to have to
24:54
Speaker 9: start importing gas year round, buying on an international market,
24:57
Speaker 9: selling in the local markets just to keep that tap full.
25:00
Speaker 9: Plus upgrades to the gas infrastructure and domestic storage. You
25:04
Speaker 9: put that together, it's a multi billion dollar tax paid commitment.
25:07
Speaker 9: Plus it results in higher prices in Victoria, which is
25:12
Speaker 9: connected through the NAM into the rest of the market,
25:14
Speaker 9: so you end up with higher price marker across the market.
25:17
Speaker 9: An example would be in late twenty twenty two when
25:20
Speaker 9: labor imposted the gas price cap of twelve dollars, it
25:22
Speaker 9: ended up not being a cap but a floor, and
25:26
Speaker 9: even though it really only impacted the Queensland projects in
25:31
Speaker 9: terms of the wave, was fundamentally designed. We've seen the
25:34
Speaker 9: prices up higher across the entire East and Sea borders result.
25:40
Speaker 2: We also saw yesterday from Victoria. But this will be
25:43
Speaker 2: replicated right around the country. They budgeted about four billion
25:47
Speaker 2: dollars for the polls and wires to get renewable energy,
25:51
Speaker 2: which will be sparsely located in geography areas around the
25:54
Speaker 2: states to the market areas where you know you've got
25:57
Speaker 2: to urban populations. He will need a supply. They got
26:00
Speaker 2: it wrong, really really wrong, like twenty billion dollars wrong.
26:04
Speaker 2: I mean, this is where I guess the Prime Minister
26:08
Speaker 2: and Chris Bowen are absolutely negligent. Nowhere have we the
26:13
Speaker 2: taxpayer been given a plan that says here are all
26:17
Speaker 2: the elements that go into net zero, and here at
26:20
Speaker 2: the bodom Australia is what you will be required to spend,
26:23
Speaker 2: either as a taxpayer or passed on to you as
26:27
Speaker 2: a power user for all of this. So when they
26:30
Speaker 2: say it's going to be for and it's going to
26:31
Speaker 2: be twenty, it'll be like that everywhere. I mean, the
26:34
Speaker 2: costs here are astronomical.
26:40
Speaker 9: Well, it's not all just in competence, Peter. I think
26:43
Speaker 9: the issue is it's very deliberate hiding of costs, and
26:46
Speaker 9: it all stems from the root of the targets we're setting,
26:50
Speaker 9: whether the decarbonization targets or renewable energy targets. The basis
26:54
Speaker 9: of these targets is, for example, a political desire to
26:57
Speaker 9: phase out coal by an arbitrary date, not actually based
27:01
Speaker 9: on what is on a logistical basis achievable when you
27:05
Speaker 9: look at it from the ground up to actually roll
27:07
Speaker 9: out the investment needed to replace coal. And so when
27:10
Speaker 9: you've got an artificial, fairytale target and it's impossible to me,
27:14
Speaker 9: then you start facing all these infrastructure lockjams. And what
27:18
Speaker 9: you're seeing here with is blowing up of infrastructure cost
27:21
Speaker 9: estimates is just part of that. And there's huge infrastructure
27:25
Speaker 9: constraction the engineering, procure and construction sector, particularly for poles
27:29
Speaker 9: and wires. There's not a lot of competition in a
27:32
Speaker 9: really hot sector. Those numbers which you've already mentioned, which
27:35
Speaker 9: are four or five times blowouts versus the previous estimates,
27:38
Speaker 9: I can guarantee you they're going to end up highest
27:40
Speaker 9: still because none of this has actually been planned through
27:44
Speaker 9: in the details to deliver.
27:48
Speaker 3: And you're going to wonder why.
27:49
Speaker 2: And we heard those words from the boss of Santos.
27:54
Speaker 2: You know that we are like North Korea in terms
27:56
Speaker 2: of an investment profile. Why the heck you put your
27:59
Speaker 2: money in Australia has got me buggered. I'll leave it there,
28:02
Speaker 2: Sulkovonic thank you orright after the break. Despite all the
28:05
Speaker 2: tough retoric from the Starma government, the UK has just
28:08
Speaker 2: recorded its worst day for legal migrant crossings this year,
28:11
Speaker 2: plus the violence it now comes with the so called
28:14
Speaker 2: Free Palestine movement. And while we should be concerned here
28:17
Speaker 2: in Australia about its growing influence, welcome back literally straight
28:26
Speaker 2: off the plane from Ukraine this morning, and Tony Abbott
28:28
Speaker 2: will joined me at the desk in a moment. But Furst,
28:30
Speaker 2: the UK Defense Secretary, has admitted that Britain, has admitted
28:34
Speaker 2: that Britain has lost control of its borders in recent years.
28:37
Speaker 2: After more than one thousand migrants crossed the English Channel
28:41
Speaker 2: in nineteen small boats on Saturday. The annual total now
28:44
Speaker 2: fifteen thousand, forty two percent increase from the same time
28:48
Speaker 2: last year, and ninety five percent higher than in twenty
28:51
Speaker 2: twenty three. Jomming out to discuss is a more author
28:55
Speaker 2: and Sky News contributor Ian herziali iron welcome to the program.
29:00
Speaker 2: In case, Armer says citizens have every ride. He says,
29:03
Speaker 2: to be angry about this small white crossing, so he
29:05
Speaker 2: says he's angry too fair enough. He says he's ramping
29:09
Speaker 2: up his efforts. But what's he doing here? Because this
29:13
Speaker 2: looks like just a whole lot of hand ringing to me.
29:18
Speaker 10: And that's exactly what it is. It's a lot of
29:20
Speaker 10: hand ringing. I don't think he is sincere. I think
29:22
Speaker 10: he wants to suite talk the public into voting for
29:26
Speaker 10: him again in twenty twenty nine. But what he really
29:29
Speaker 10: needs to do are four things which would make him
29:32
Speaker 10: more his heetoric more credible. And the first one is
29:35
Speaker 10: obviously to depart immediately anyone who enters the United Kingdom
29:41
Speaker 10: through these small boats. The second thing is to slash,
29:45
Speaker 10: to hire military contractors to slash the small boats. This
29:49
Speaker 10: is an idea that was floated by a former British soldier,
29:53
Speaker 10: James Glancy, in an interview with Winston Marshall recently. And
29:58
Speaker 10: the third step is for Starmer to see he's going
30:01
Speaker 10: to withdraw from the European Convention on Human Rights because
30:04
Speaker 10: it's that legal system that frustrates the UK's ability to
30:09
Speaker 10: depart people they don't want. And finally, obviously it is
30:13
Speaker 10: to end these welfare benefits these illegals. They are brought in,
30:17
Speaker 10: they're put up in hotels, they're given free food, shelter, healthcare, school,
30:21
Speaker 10: and that's an incentive, that's a magnet for them. So
30:24
Speaker 10: if someone were to do these four things, then I
30:27
Speaker 10: think his words would be more credible.
30:31
Speaker 2: You know, you spot on when we faced a crisis,
30:33
Speaker 2: and then John Howard eero. We've had two times, John
30:36
Speaker 2: Howard and Tony Abbott. Both times the boats were stopped.
30:40
Speaker 2: The Indonesian president said to Australia, take the sugar off
30:45
Speaker 2: the table, stop allowing these people to arrive in your
30:48
Speaker 2: country and giving them all the benefits we're talking about there.
30:51
Speaker 2: But the other thing we did in Australia is we
30:54
Speaker 2: had the navy at our northernmost border. I mean, why
30:58
Speaker 2: don't British navy once ruled world, right, why isn't the
31:01
Speaker 2: British Navy there in the channel and doing exactly what
31:04
Speaker 2: you say, turn the boats around, literally turn them around
31:07
Speaker 2: and have some sort of barricade there to say you
31:10
Speaker 2: will not cross the channel and put your foot on
31:12
Speaker 2: English soil, because you can do that, a sovereign nation
31:16
Speaker 2: can do that. It just requires political will.
31:22
Speaker 10: Exactly, and that's exactly what's missing. And Kea Sturmer thinks
31:25
Speaker 10: and his Labor Party that he can sweeztok the public
31:30
Speaker 10: that he can see, he can pretend he's doing something
31:33
Speaker 10: without doing anything. But just given the skill of illegal
31:37
Speaker 10: immigration and all the unintended consequences of that, I think
31:42
Speaker 10: the British public have had enough and I think he's
31:44
Speaker 10: going to be voted out of office. What will happen
31:47
Speaker 10: to the Labor Party is what happened to the Conservative
31:49
Speaker 10: Party last year.
31:53
Speaker 3: I guess you know.
31:54
Speaker 2: The other thing that not many people want to talk
31:55
Speaker 2: about is the nature of these your arrivals. I mean
31:58
Speaker 2: they're not women and children flaying refugee camps in the Sedan.
32:03
Speaker 2: I mean these are young men. They passed through a
32:07
Speaker 2: number of countries and under the Refugee Convention, if you
32:10
Speaker 2: really are refugee, you're supposed to seek asylum at the
32:12
Speaker 2: first safe country you come to.
32:14
Speaker 3: They're not doing that.
32:15
Speaker 2: They're wanting an economic outcome. But as I say, there
32:19
Speaker 2: are a lot of them young men, and that's causing
32:23
Speaker 2: problems of as OIME.
32:25
Speaker 10: Young fighting age men, and I think many of them
32:28
Speaker 10: were also putting our heads in the sound about this.
32:32
Speaker 10: Many of them. I saw some of the footage and
32:35
Speaker 10: one of them was holding his index fingers. Many of
32:38
Speaker 10: them were holding the peace sign, but one of them
32:41
Speaker 10: was holding his index finger up. That is the isis
32:44
Speaker 10: the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria back then, which
32:48
Speaker 10: is a radical terrorist organization. And so we really don't
32:53
Speaker 10: know who are the people who are on these boats,
32:56
Speaker 10: and it's causing a.
32:57
Speaker 4: Lot of problems.
32:58
Speaker 10: When I talk to British people they see they feel
33:01
Speaker 10: as if the company is being invaded and as if
33:04
Speaker 10: this is being facilitated by their own political leaders.
33:10
Speaker 2: Let's go to what happened in Colorado. We know I
33:13
Speaker 2: suspect there has been charged with multiple counter attempt and
33:15
Speaker 2: murder and hate crimes, of course, targeting Jewish supporters who
33:19
Speaker 2: are holding a peaceful protest regarding the hostages. We know
33:24
Speaker 2: too a couple that work for the Israeli embassy was
33:26
Speaker 2: shot dead in Washington, DC. This is a violence inside
33:31
Speaker 2: the Free Palestine movement. It's not a benign movement, and
33:36
Speaker 2: it's not just in the United States.
33:37
Speaker 3: Is it, because I mean there's.
33:38
Speaker 2: A lot of concern about this movement in Australia as
33:42
Speaker 2: well well.
33:44
Speaker 10: I think it's important for us to note that the
33:46
Speaker 10: Few Palistine movement is made up of a mishmash of Marxists,
33:50
Speaker 10: Moist and Islamist elements, and their wish is to eliminate
33:55
Speaker 10: the seat of Israel, to demonize the idea of Zionism,
33:59
Speaker 10: which is foundational creed of Israel. And then on the
34:03
Speaker 10: Islemist wing, they want to kill all Jews regardless of
34:06
Speaker 10: where they are.
34:07
Speaker 3: That is their goal.
34:09
Speaker 10: So it is definitely not just in America as we've
34:11
Speaker 10: seen now in Washington, DC and in Colorado, and I
34:14
Speaker 10: think it's going to escalate. But this Free Palestine movement
34:17
Speaker 10: is in Europe and it's definitely in Australia. And if
34:20
Speaker 10: you ask me what should Australians do, it is to
34:23
Speaker 10: infiltrate this organization, to stop this movement, and to treat
34:27
Speaker 10: it as a terrorist organization because ultimately that's what it is.
34:34
Speaker 2: Oh, that's why I called for us, isn't it.
34:36
Speaker 3: Thank you?
34:37
Speaker 2: I An, let's kept chat with you next week, all right, Toney,
34:40
Speaker 2: have it after the break. You know, it's fair a
34:41
Speaker 2: bit about opposition. He was there and very successfully got
34:45
Speaker 2: out of opposition. So what would his advice be to
34:48
Speaker 2: the Party of.
34:49
Speaker 3: Mendsys where to now.
34:56
Speaker 2: Welcome back to the car. I'm not content to just
34:58
Speaker 2: lecture some climate change. Gaza, Greta, Greta Tumberg and a
35:01
Speaker 2: whole lot of other self opinionated elites are on their
35:04
Speaker 2: way for Gaza. I hope you realize it's the terra
35:06
Speaker 2: zone and this is going to be pretty extraordinary or
35:09
Speaker 2: that in a moment, first fresh from the Black Sea
35:11
Speaker 2: Security Forum in own Dessa, my next scuares has some
35:14
Speaker 2: choice words and what Australia should be doing in the
35:17
Speaker 2: face of significant global pressure, particularly around our region of course,
35:22
Speaker 2: but in places like Ukraine. I'm pleased to say Former
35:25
Speaker 2: Prime Mister Australia Tony Abit joins me in Melbourne.
35:27
Speaker 3: On the desk live sarting. You've been away a lot, hey.
35:31
Speaker 2: I want to start with defense spending if I can, Tony,
35:33
Speaker 2: because the Shangri La dialogue really tough comments from the
35:39
Speaker 2: US Defense Secretary basically telling Australia you're not pulling your weight.
35:43
Speaker 3: We know that the.
35:44
Speaker 2: UK Prime Minister, a labor Prime Minister has increased their spending,
35:49
Speaker 2: a bit of tea and sympathy from Richard Miles when
35:51
Speaker 2: he was there. He gets back to Australia and our
35:54
Speaker 2: Prime Minister slaps him down and says that's not needed.
35:57
Speaker 2: And when I asked the question today, actually they said
36:01
Speaker 2: the Prime Minister said, well, don't you know. I mean,
36:03
Speaker 2: Britain's in a completely different area of the world. That's right,
36:06
Speaker 2: They're a long way from China and we're.
36:08
Speaker 11: Next door exactly right. Look, we do have to spend
36:11
Speaker 11: a lot more on defense. We are, as I've said before, Peter,
36:17
Speaker 11: we are sleepwalking through Lotus land to disaster as things stand.
36:22
Speaker 11: We've got to appreciate that the world is getting much
36:25
Speaker 11: more dangerous. It's becoming more dangerous by the day. Communist China,
36:30
Speaker 11: fascist Russia, and Islamist Iran are in an alliance of convenience,
36:36
Speaker 11: united only by hater of the West. It's no accident
36:41
Speaker 11: that the Putin attack on Ukraine happened just a few
36:44
Speaker 11: days after the No Limits alliance signed between communist China
36:50
Speaker 11: and fascist Russia. So we in this country do need
36:53
Speaker 11: to wake up to ourselves, and frankly, if we want
36:56
Speaker 11: the American alliance to survive, we have got to be
37:00
Speaker 11: a much better ally than we look right now.
37:03
Speaker 2: It feels like the pmsor defunding our capability in the
37:07
Speaker 2: hope that if things got crook, we're just not going
37:10
Speaker 2: to get asked to get involved.
37:12
Speaker 11: We will certainly be asked. The question is will we
37:16
Speaker 11: be able to respond? And I think a foretaste of
37:20
Speaker 11: what's to come was the current government's response to the
37:25
Speaker 11: request that came in about eighteen months ago for a
37:28
Speaker 11: frigate for the Red Sea. Now we said that we
37:32
Speaker 11: don't actually have a frigate descend because they're all needed
37:37
Speaker 11: closer to home. Well, I happened to be looking out
37:40
Speaker 11: my office window that day and there were five frigates
37:43
Speaker 11: and destroyers tied up at Garden Island, so they weren't
37:47
Speaker 11: doing anything, and frankly and frankly, at least one of
37:52
Speaker 11: them should have been in the Red Sea. I think
37:54
Speaker 11: there's a quasi pacivist element this government, and rather than
37:59
Speaker 11: say no to the Americans, they'd prefer to say we can't.
38:03
Speaker 4: And that's what they're doing.
38:04
Speaker 11: They are steadily winding down the actual fighting capability of
38:09
Speaker 11: our armed forces.
38:11
Speaker 2: Well, someone in a country that had no choice in
38:13
Speaker 2: the matter. Was Ukraine when its border was crossed again
38:15
Speaker 2: by Russia. I know you've been there three times since
38:19
Speaker 2: the war began. Good on you, because it's not like
38:21
Speaker 2: the old days when you go in with armed sort
38:24
Speaker 2: of security. You're going in there as a civilian who
38:26
Speaker 2: cares about the country. How's the mood, how are they going?
38:30
Speaker 2: We saw that drone strike. It's almost like this poor
38:34
Speaker 2: little country has got better military capability than we have here.
38:38
Speaker 11: Well, it's interesting you should say that, Peter, because the
38:41
Speaker 11: Ukrainians have become world experts in drone warfare, and as
38:49
Speaker 11: we are discovering, the actual battle space is changing by
38:53
Speaker 11: the day at the moment as different drone techniques become and.
39:03
Speaker 1: There's really far more.
39:04
Speaker 11: That they could teach us right now than that we
39:06
Speaker 11: could teach them. I mean, we have our infantry trainers
39:10
Speaker 11: in Britain helping the Ukrainian infantry. But in terms of
39:17
Speaker 11: where warfare is really at right now, well, there are
39:22
Speaker 11: lessons every day on the Ukrainian battle space and this
39:27
Speaker 11: is where frankly, we should have some of our people,
39:32
Speaker 11: not as combatants, but certainly as very close students of
39:36
Speaker 11: exactly what's going on.
39:37
Speaker 2: Just quickly on my movement to the Liberal Party. But
39:39
Speaker 2: have they got their tanks yet? We promised the tanks
39:41
Speaker 2: what two years ago?
39:42
Speaker 11: It wasn't it was sometime last year? And I'm told
39:45
Speaker 11: that they are on the way. We're posting them, are
39:48
Speaker 11: we it's a female I suppose, for they're two everything.
39:54
Speaker 4: But no, they're promised but as yet undelivered.
39:57
Speaker 2: All right, talk to me about the Liberal Party because
39:59
Speaker 2: you know what it's like to four leaders in three years.
40:02
Speaker 2: When you became the leader of nine. I think one
40:05
Speaker 2: of the criticisms of Peter Dutton, who's a very good man,
40:08
Speaker 2: is that there wasn't enough internal debate. And you know,
40:11
Speaker 2: you've got the South Australian Liberals now saying we've got
40:14
Speaker 2: a dump net zero. I think that's going to be
40:16
Speaker 2: something other divisions will vote on as well. You certainly
40:19
Speaker 2: got that push inside the National Party, not a declared
40:22
Speaker 2: position yet you've got a debate about nuclear You know
40:25
Speaker 2: what it's like to be there when everyone's a bit.
40:27
Speaker 3: Broken hearted and demoralized.
40:29
Speaker 11: What would your advice be, Well, you've got to know
40:32
Speaker 11: what you stand for and then you've got to go
40:34
Speaker 11: out and argue for it in the community, and the
40:37
Speaker 11: problem with my side out side of politics, if you like,
40:42
Speaker 11: is that there has been a deficit of conviction, of courage,
40:49
Speaker 11: and perhaps even of character, because we just have not
40:54
Speaker 11: been sufficiently up for the fight.
40:56
Speaker 1: Now I agree with you, Peter.
40:57
Speaker 11: I think that Peter Dutton is a very very decent
41:00
Speaker 11: human being, and he gave it his very very best shot.
41:05
Speaker 11: But unfortunately we didn't oppose the bad things that the
41:11
Speaker 11: government is doing strongly enough and we didn't have enough
41:16
Speaker 11: of a program of our own to substitute. Because I
41:19
Speaker 11: guess the two questions that people ask going into an
41:22
Speaker 11: election is A does the government deserve to be reelected?
41:25
Speaker 11: And I think that clearly said no at Christmas time
41:28
Speaker 11: b and B is the opposition ready for government? And
41:33
Speaker 11: we weren't able to persuade them.
41:34
Speaker 2: So just quickly, you don't sign up to the theory
41:37
Speaker 2: put around yet again, we've got to get closer to
41:41
Speaker 2: the middle.
41:42
Speaker 3: We've got to hug the left in order to win.
41:44
Speaker 11: The job of an opposition is to be a clear
41:47
Speaker 11: and strong alternative, not to be a weak echo of
41:50
Speaker 11: a bad government.
41:51
Speaker 2: I don't believe it there. You might know what you're
41:53
Speaker 2: talking about, Tony Anatt thank you all. Right after the break,
41:56
Speaker 2: credit Tumberg sailing into trouble in Gaza. We'll see Greta Gaza,
41:59
Speaker 2: Gaza Gros and former Liberal premier there's one of them
42:02
Speaker 2: out there, calling on the lip party to Bayola, John
42:05
Speaker 2: Pezzuto as he faces bankruptcy.
42:12
Speaker 3: Welcome back, let's bring my panel.
42:13
Speaker 2: Page Research Center chief executive Jared Holland and Columbus with
42:17
Speaker 2: the Spectator. Also a former staff Tony Abbots. They had
42:20
Speaker 2: a bit of a catch up there, Terry Barnes. Gents,
42:22
Speaker 2: welcome Greta Tunberg. I call a Gaza Greta. Now she's
42:26
Speaker 2: in this freedom flotilla coalition on her mission to deliver
42:30
Speaker 2: a and good tidings and all these things with a
42:33
Speaker 2: bunch of terrorists. I mean, I do think this is extraordinary.
42:37
Speaker 3: Jared.
42:38
Speaker 2: I don't suppose they kill her. That'd be pretty bad.
42:41
Speaker 2: Pr But what's this going to achieve?
42:46
Speaker 12: Well, I mean, pe to be honest, it's performative activism.
42:49
Speaker 12: This group, they've done these kind of stunts back since
42:52
Speaker 12: two thousand and seven and can actually get quite dangerous.
42:54
Speaker 12: Back in twenty eleven, a couple of Turkish activists actually
42:57
Speaker 12: lost their lives. I mean, the UN are already provide
43:00
Speaker 12: aid into Gaza and Greta. I don't think is going
43:02
Speaker 12: to be the big difference here. But these kind of
43:05
Speaker 12: tactics are the way the radical left tries to wedge
43:07
Speaker 12: the debate.
43:08
Speaker 1: In the community.
43:08
Speaker 12: They put their agent provocateurs into dangerous positions, try and
43:12
Speaker 12: provoke the authorities into enacting or silencing or stopping them,
43:16
Speaker 12: and then that man makes international headlines and gets the
43:19
Speaker 12: community up in arms about the overuse of force. So
43:22
Speaker 12: these tactics we saw them with just stop oil. Greta
43:25
Speaker 12: is using the old playbook again, but unfortunately it's just
43:29
Speaker 12: putting her and her cruise lives in danger in a
43:32
Speaker 12: quite dangerous part of the world.
43:35
Speaker 3: Now this one's interesting.
43:36
Speaker 2: I thought the Libs were reviewing all their policies, that
43:39
Speaker 2: nothing was on the table, everything was up in the air.
43:42
Speaker 2: But we've got Senator Andrew Bragg out today saying they're
43:45
Speaker 2: all gung home now about working from home. They think
43:48
Speaker 2: it's a great way to boost productivity. I'm not so
43:51
Speaker 2: sure about that. I haven't seen much productivity from public
43:54
Speaker 2: servants full stop, let alone if they get to sit
43:56
Speaker 2: at home. But this is a course, you know, I
44:00
Speaker 2: think something that's up to private business is good luck
44:02
Speaker 2: to them. But Terry Barnes, I don't think that the
44:06
Speaker 2: political class should give up with the Commonwealth Public Service.
44:09
Speaker 2: I think they should have to turn up into an office.
44:12
Speaker 2: And I have to say, you know this whole work
44:15
Speaker 2: from home is middle class privilege. So many Australians in
44:20
Speaker 2: working class jobs can't work from home in the lounge
44:24
Speaker 2: room on a laptop.
44:26
Speaker 5: Well that's right. You can't clear somebody's block drain you're
44:29
Speaker 5: sitting in your lounge room, can you.
44:31
Speaker 3: We'll melk the cow.
44:33
Speaker 5: Look, I declare an interest. I work from home and
44:35
Speaker 5: I have for a while because it's saved the office
44:37
Speaker 5: costs as a self employed consultant. But productive were productive,
44:42
Speaker 5: But I don't think so. I think I could do
44:44
Speaker 5: part better working out of an office. To be honest
44:46
Speaker 5: with you, Look, I think Andrew bagg has done to
44:49
Speaker 5: look at me announced but it's a full one eighty
44:51
Speaker 5: from where they were in the election campaign.
44:53
Speaker 1: But the thing is it's privilege, not a right. Peter.
44:57
Speaker 5: You have to actually balance employers rights with employees rights,
45:01
Speaker 5: and I think we need to have a conversation about this.
45:04
Speaker 5: The reality is it's there but we need to be
45:06
Speaker 5: honest about it and recognize that employers actually pay for it,
45:11
Speaker 5: so they're entitled to something in return, especially in terms
45:15
Speaker 5: of productivity, for what they allow to happen.
45:18
Speaker 2: Let's go to what's happening in Queensland. A coal mine
45:21
Speaker 2: to be blocked. This is the risk over human rights concerns.
45:25
Speaker 2: The Queensland Conservation Council will be relying on the precedent
45:29
Speaker 2: of the twenty twenty two decision from the Queensland Land
45:32
Speaker 2: Court which rejected warrata called Galilee Mine on the grounds
45:37
Speaker 2: of human rights. Jared, what do you make of all
45:39
Speaker 2: of this?
45:42
Speaker 12: So, actually, Peter, I think this is one of the
45:43
Speaker 12: most important stories that is developing because what this would
45:47
Speaker 12: do was set a precedent that allows the courts to
45:49
Speaker 12: then make injunctions and to block future developments based on
45:53
Speaker 12: the kind of social impact that carbon dioxide and other
45:56
Speaker 12: emissions will have on the community. Now, the decision back
45:58
Speaker 12: in twenty twenty two, it was challenged, and I think
46:01
Speaker 12: it's really important that the bodies involved this time don't
46:04
Speaker 12: take it lying down and they really do bring up
46:06
Speaker 12: the fight to this one. I mean, the interesting thing
46:09
Speaker 12: is this wasn't even thermal coal. This was metallurgical coal,
46:12
Speaker 12: which is used to make steel, which is going to
46:14
Speaker 12: be needed to build the so called renewable transition, but
46:17
Speaker 12: it's also needed for all of our houses, our infrastructure,
46:20
Speaker 12: our roads. And this just goes to show how anti
46:23
Speaker 12: human this climate agenda is. Because if you dig it,
46:27
Speaker 12: if you grow it out of the ground, if you
46:29
Speaker 12: move it, if you package it, if you transport, if
46:31
Speaker 12: you manufacture, if you consume it, you need energy. And
46:34
Speaker 12: any movement that tries to deny that from civilization, that
46:37
Speaker 12: tries to deny that from working people, and deny that
46:39
Speaker 12: from our country, that is a fundamentally anti human agenda.
46:44
Speaker 2: I want to play something from AFL Extraordinary Eddie mcg
46:50
Speaker 2: Eddie maguire. This is about the AFL in Victoria Place
46:53
Speaker 2: getting a lot of pressure to overhaul its illicit drugs policy.
46:58
Speaker 3: Have a listen.
47:00
Speaker 13: I've been to too many funerals, I've seen too many players.
47:03
Speaker 13: It's happening every other week. Wake up and smell the roses.
47:07
Speaker 13: For God's sake. The community does not want to copy
47:10
Speaker 13: this anymore. If there's one thing that the AFL can
47:13
Speaker 13: stand up and do in life is be against drugs
47:16
Speaker 13: it's killing our community. Three things in life that you
47:19
Speaker 13: live by if you want to be successful. Don't do drugs.
47:22
Speaker 13: Don't do drugs. Don't do drugs.
47:26
Speaker 2: I love this message, Terry. I hate this idea that
47:29
Speaker 2: we just give over it. You know, we do a
47:31
Speaker 2: bit of pill testing. We let people have Carton blanche.
47:33
Speaker 2: You can't smoke, but you can use a list of drugs.
47:36
Speaker 2: And the AFL, I might add, they do not pay tax.
47:40
Speaker 3: They've got to do better.
47:41
Speaker 5: Surely, Oh, absolutely, Peter, and then certainly, look, I'm a
47:44
Speaker 5: Carton supporter and Eddie Maguire, President Collingwood, reported, the president
47:48
Speaker 5: of Collingwood, he actually is talking sense. This is real
47:51
Speaker 5: worry for me. But seriously, Eddie is right. Any drugs
47:57
Speaker 5: policy that does not throw the book at people who
48:01
Speaker 5: do drugs and risk themselves, risk their teammates, risk their club,
48:04
Speaker 5: risk their reputation, they deserve to have the book thrown
48:07
Speaker 5: that And the AFL needs to take a stand. It
48:09
Speaker 5: needs to worry about the welfare of those players. It
48:12
Speaker 5: needs to worry about the messages that's sending. But clearly
48:15
Speaker 5: they're not because they're worried about other things, you know,
48:18
Speaker 5: in terms of their gate revenues in terms of their
48:21
Speaker 5: TV rights whatever. Focus on the message don't do drugs
48:25
Speaker 5: it he is absolutely right, all.
48:27
Speaker 3: Right, five seconds.
48:28
Speaker 2: John Pozerto should to be bailed out by the Liberal
48:30
Speaker 2: Party in Victoria.
48:31
Speaker 5: Terry short answer, privately yes party.
48:35
Speaker 3: No party.
48:36
Speaker 2: No. I think that you speak for a lot of
48:38
Speaker 2: a lot of liberals in the state.
48:39
Speaker 3: All right, that's it for me. Up next and your
48:42
Speaker 3: built