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Write the Wrong · The Schmidt Show PDX

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_03: A quick word from our show sponsor,
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• 0:59
  SPEAKER_03: Welcome back.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_03: My name is Mike Schmidt,
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_03: former Multnomah County District Attorney,
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_03: absolute fall enthusiast and part time podcaster.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_03: And fall is officially here, which means the kids are back in school.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_03: And while they're busy meeting new teachers,
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_03: making new friends and settling into the rhythm of homework and
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_03: after school activities,
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_03: the parents attention turns back to the institution in charge
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_03: of equipping our children.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_03: With the skills they need to live happy, productive lives.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_03: And while that sounds great, it actually brings back a lot of drama.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_03: This past week,
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_03: news headlines in Portland were dominated by the renewal of
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_03: the superintendent's contract,
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_03: the closure of physical school buildings, and the consolidation of classrooms.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_03: And today, I get to talk with someone, well, something.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_03: Well,
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_03: the person behind the inanimate object who decided to run for governor as a pencil,
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_03: that universal symbol of schoolwork.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_03: Pencil and the creator behind it,
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_03: Jay Schuberth,
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_03: joins me today to talk about the bigger issue that sometimes gets lost in all
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_03: the smaller issues of the day.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_03: The kids, they might not be all right, at least not in reading test scores.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_03: Oregon currently reads.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_03: My guest today will push us to do three things.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_03: Name the problem, accept the reality, and then focus on solutions.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_03: We haven't always been 50th in the nation,
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_03: and some states that were once in
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_03: a similar spot have genuinely turned things around.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_03: Whose homework should Oregon be copying to get back to the front of the class?
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_03: And why does it take a pencil running for governor and talking about the issues
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_03: and solutions to elevate this conversation to the level it deserves?
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_03: We're going to cover all that and more.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_03: But first,
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_03: I'd like to welcome back our special trash news correspondent,
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_03: Eleanor Jones,
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_03: for a back to school themed edition of our now recurring segment in the news.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_03: In the news.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_03: Eleanor, there's been a lot in the news this week about kids going back to school.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_03: What are you seeing out there?
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_00: Well, what I'm seeing a lot of is the very darling pictures
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_00: of families putting their children holding the little cardboard sign or
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_00: the little chalkboard sign saying back to school.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_03: First grade, second grade.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_00: For one thing,
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_00: when my kids started going back to school,
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_00: I really thought that those were just kind of like a blip.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_00: And I didn't think that people were going to continue on this trend.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_00: And I didn't want to bite into it.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_00: And so now all of my kids' pictures are very plain
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_00: and those chalkboard things have really taken off.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm sorry in advance to my child who will have a really shitty back
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_00: to school pictures compared to everyone else.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_00: But in doing these back to school pictures,
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_00: so like the pictures of my kid,
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just trying to position her in front of the door to hide
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_00: where our paint is chipped.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_00: I'm trying to hide the overgrown dandelions in our front yard.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_03: We have a busted out screen on one of our windows that is right near the front door.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_00: So that's where you put the backpack.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_03: That's right.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_00: Whereas celebrities are doing entire balloon arches specific to each of their children.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_00: And I am talking about the Kardashians, which I am sorry in advance to do.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, my God.
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_00: But we're talking even the lesser Kardashians are spending God knows how much money
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_00: on individualized single use balloon arches.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_00: And of all of the really horrible things that family has done to the culture
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: at large,
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_00: which I love,
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_00: obviously,
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_00: as a trash correspondent, the balloon arches really drive me fucking nuts.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I'll tell you why.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_00: I recently went to see a movie at a large movie theater,
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_00: not even one of the indie ones,
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_00: not even one of the ones that was supposed to be community friendly.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_00: And the straw that I was given
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_00: to accompany my not even largest size Diet Coke couldn't hack it through
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_00: the entire movie.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_00: Where I had to get up in the middle of He-Man.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, like the straws, like one of those paper unraveling straws.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_00: The paper completely broke,
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_00: could not support the amount of Diet Coke that I wanted for the length of
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_00: the movie He-Man, which isn't even that long.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_00: And so I missed an important part, maybe,
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_00: of He-Man because I had to get a different straw because they're trying to tell me
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_00: that the plastic that I want to use for a straw will kill turtles.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_03: That's right.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_00: Meanwhile,
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_00: the Kardashians
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_00: and their 20 fucking grandkids can have single-use balloon arches every time their
• 5:07
  SPEAKER_00: children have a day of note.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_03: They're creating entire like balloon trash islands in the Pacific.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_03: Meanwhile,
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_03: Eleanor is trying to like tip up a giant soda in the movie theater with ice smashing
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_03: into your face.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_00: This is exactly what I'm saying.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_00: And so rich people are acting like they're just like all of us with all their back
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_00: to school pictures with their kids.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_00: But they're not just like all of us because they waste however much plastic they want.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_00: And I feel bad.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_00: Try to see all the fucking He-Man at once.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_00: But it's not right.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_03: It's not right.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_00: Speaking of celebrities going back to school,
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_00: Meghan Markle and Prince Harry are getting a lot of shit because they're moving back
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_00: to the UK and they're sending their kids to a private school there.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_00: And allegedly it costs something like $30,000 a year.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_00: So this is all coming out of page six,
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_00: which is basically known to be pretty much a mouthpiece for Kate and Will.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_03: Whoa.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_00: Which I don't know if you knew that or not,
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_00: but like anything that you'll see about Meghan Markle from page six is going
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_00: to be really negative.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_00: And so what's hilarious about this thing is that they're like,
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_00: these are what the uniforms look like.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_00: This is what the lunches consist of.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_00: This is this and this, that.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_00: And then they're like, oh, but we weren't going to name the school for privacy concerns.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_03: It's Hogwarts, right?
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_03: It's Hogwarts is a school.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's definitely Hogwarts, and these kids are for sure giving Ravenclaw energy.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_00: But allegedly, this school costs $30,000 per year.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_00: And they're giving all sorts of shit for spending so much money on a school.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_03: But wait, I have to just go back.
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_03: This is all being fed by Kate and...
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_00: Allegedly.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_03: Allegedly.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_03: Whose kids go to public school?
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, they'll do anything to make Meghan Markle seem like a bad person.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_00: But the state of Oregon, I looked up, spends something like $20,000 per pupil per year.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_00: And chances are Meghan Markle's kids aren't eating chicken nuggets.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_00: And they probably have all the pencils that they need.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: Like I had to send my child to school with copy paper for their classroom.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, I had to send a box of tissues and a roll of paper towels.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_00: And so like the $30,000 a year really isn't that much money.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think that Meghan Markle should get a little bit of grace for
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_00: where she wants to send her kids to school.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_03: Jeez, cut her some slack.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_00: Cut her some slack is what I will say.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, and in final parenting news, J.D.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_00: Vance is in the news because he is proposing a new stipend for stay-at-home parents
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_00: who,
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_00: if one of the parents doesn't work,
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_00: and when they say one of the parents, they're of course meaning the mom.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_00: The mom.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_00: And it's a stipend for them to...
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_00: To, yeah, stay at home.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_00: And the money is coming from a fund for working families.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_00: And 80% of the money in that fund is going to single working moms.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_00: So they're basically taking away money from single working moms and giving it
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_00: to married non-working moms.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_00: So I just want to end it on a little piece of like really strong outrage for all
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_00: of your listeners on, you know.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_03: Just when you think J.D.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_03: Vance can't out J.D.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_03: Vance himself, you know, the guy who first attacked, what was it, cat ladies.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_03: And of course,
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_03: he has his own relationships with Ottomans and couches that has become quite famous.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_03: And now this taking from one group of moms and giving to another.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, exactly.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_00: And the but the ultimate goal is to, like, make women stay at home and to punish working moms.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_03: Imagine if they took that energy and put it towards,
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_03: helping us get better educational outcomes for all kids,
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_03: no matter where they went to school.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that'd be awesome.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_00: Or having functioning straws.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_00: There's plenty of better things that J.D.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_00: Vance could be doing with his time than this.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_00: But anyway,
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_00: it's just like when we're thinking about all of the things that are happening
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_00: in back to school times, rich people aren't the same as the rest of us.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_00: They're not like us.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_00: J.D.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_00: Vance doesn't care about you.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_03: J.D.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_03: Vance doesn't care.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_03: Eleanor Jones, thank you so much for taking us back to school this week in the news.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_00: And if you want to hear or actually read more of me being pretty loose
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_00: and ill-prepared, check out The Trash Report on Portland Mercury.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_03: At Portland Mercury.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you so much, Eleanor.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_03: And now to the interview with my guest, Jay Schuberth.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_03: Jay Schuberth, welcome to The Schmidt Show.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_03: Thanks so much.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_03: Well, so I'm very excited to talk to you today and Pencil, your alter ego or...
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_03: Mascot, I suppose.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, my inner self.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_03: Your inner self projected on an inanimate object.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you for being here.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_03: But before we get into pencil and what you've been going on,
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_03: just tell us a little bit about you.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_03: Who are you?
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_01: Sure.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_01: So my name is Jay Schubert and I've had a couple of different careers.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_01: I was in finance, but then I went back and got a degree in philosophy religion.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_01: And that's what actually brought me out to Portland 20 years ago.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_01: I started teaching at PSU and I taught freshman for quite a while.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_01: And then I started getting involved with more education reform, I would say, as an advocate.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_01: And so, you know, then...
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_01: 20 years later, clearly I'm running for governor dressed as a pencil.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, who knew 20 years later you'd be running for governor?
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_01: My Halloween costumes before this were amazing, so there was some indication.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_03: Well, you know, I actually showed up on Oregon shores about 20 years ago myself.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_03: I was fortunate enough to leave New Orleans before Hurricane Katrina hit.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_03: But this is a topic near and dear to my heart.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_03: I'm really excited to get into it because,
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_03: as you know,
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_03: I started out my professional career teaching middle school in New Orleans.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_03: So that, you know.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_03: Is one of the reasons that I'm excited to have this conversation.
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_03: And even back then, 20 years ago, 25 years ago, right?
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_03: It was George Bush and No Child Left Behind.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_03: And we were having a national conversation about our education system leaving children behind.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_03: And we all had feelings about No Child Left Behind back then.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_03: But fast forward, here we are 25 years later, the conversation continues.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_03: What about this is personal to you?
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_03: Like, why are you personally invested in this conversation?
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_01: Why do I spend my weekends dressed as a six foot tall pencil?
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_01: Is that what you're asking?
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_01: That was a subtle way of like, what drives someone to this?
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_01: So as I said, I started teaching at PSU and I came from Chicago.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_01: I had taught at the University of Chicago, but I'd also taught at community colleges.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_01: So I knew a wide range of students.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_01: When I came to Portland State 20 years ago, 2007, I started teaching.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_01: And I was mostly teaching the freshmen,
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_01: which meant most of those students were coming from the Oregon K-12 system.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_01: I was shocked by the lack of skills that my students had and
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_01: that I was really ending up just having to teach some basic skills.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_01: Reading and writing skills.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_01: And so, you know, I went and started going, OK, I'm a researcher.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_01: I'm going to look into this.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_01: I started seeing, oh, wow, like I did not realize how far behind Oregon was.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_01: And I started getting involved in advocacy.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_01: I would go down to Salem and we had an Oregon Education Investment Board.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_01: You might have remembered that the OEIB that doesn't exist anymore.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_01: But then I so I'm seeing that.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_01: And then I had kids and one of my kids struggled.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, congratulations.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_01: You think you send your kid to a school and sort of the basic thing.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's when I got involved with advocates in decoding dyslexia,
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_01: but also Oregon Kids Read and really started to look and go, well, wait a minute.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_01: There's a bunch of other states that are doing things like why aren't we doing these things?
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's when I really started to get more involved.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_01: And now that my children are moving on,
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_01: you know, you could say maybe this is an empty nesting project.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_01: But I don't think you should have to get lucky and have a parent that has resources
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_01: in order to be taught to read.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_01: And so that is why pencil.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_03: Well, thank you so much for your service on this, truly.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_03: My sister is actually a teacher herself.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_03: She went to Columbia, got her degree, and she works with decoding dyslexia.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_03: Morgan Bolson, she's been very involved in that.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_03: So shout out to my sister and educators everywhere who are helping kids read.
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_03: So thank you.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_03: So also, let's mention Oregon Kids Read.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_03: Tell us a little bit about Oregon Kids Read and what's the work there and the theory of change.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so Oregon Kids Read,
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_01: if you go to the website,
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_01: what you're going to notice, and people often call us a nonprofit, it's not.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_01: This is a group of people, again,
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_01: that care about these issues and are in different levels of some of us are parents,
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_01: some of us are teachers, some of us are in the higher ed system in education.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_01: And it's people that are trying to fix the system.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_01: And one of the things that is really important about Oregon Kids Read is
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_01: that it is not a nonprofit.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_01: We're not taking money from anyone.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_01: There's no donations.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_01: And also we are not providing any services.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_01: We don't get any money from the state or anything.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_01: And so I say that because it affects the theory of change,
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_01: which is our theory of change is let's look at other states and learn from them
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_01: and figure out what we need.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_01: And what we found was that there's a lot of organizations that receive a lot
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_01: of money from the state that this isn't to put any shade on any
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_01: of those organizations, but we found people don't speak up quite as much.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_01: And so one of the theories of change there is we really need independent voices
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_01: and parents are and children.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_01: And that's why I put pencil here.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_01: And pencil is a representation of when we are talking about education,
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_01: we think of ourselves at Oregon Kids Read as were the kids in the room saying that.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_01: We're the point of education.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like education, the education system is not in order to employ adults.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_01: It is not in order, all these other things, kids, like teachers and kids, right?
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_01: Are we giving the teachers what they need to teach the kids so that they're successful?
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_01: And so as far as the theory of change goes,
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_01: you can only do that at the systemic level of the state's relationship to
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_01: the districts.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's where we really work.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_03: I'm going to just draw a parallel.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_03: You know, my career after law school has been mainly in criminal justice.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_03: And I always get very frustrated when people say we're going to improve public safety.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_03: We need to hire 400 police as if hiring police.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_03: So you mentioned our friend here, Pencil,
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_03: who's sitting at the table for those of you who are watching this online
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_03: or maybe you're seeing a clip.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_03: We've got our friend here.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_03: Give me Pencil's origin story.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, it's not as exciting as some of the Marvel movies out there,
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_01: although I'm hoping, you know, Marvel hasn't called yet, but there's still hope.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_01: So I, as I said, I've been involved in advocacy for many years.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_01: And after particularly difficult meetings where we leave pretty disappointed
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_01: from either the Oregon Department of Ed or somewhere else,
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_01: I would say to my fellow advocates,
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_01: you know, maybe I need to run for governor as pencil.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_01: And it was a joke.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_01: It was a way to just blow off steam.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_01: But then last year when we came in 50th out of 50 in fourth grade literacy,
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_01: Oregon did,
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_01: and there was complete silence from the governor to the Department of Ed to
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_01: the teachers unions to COSA, which is our administrators, all the way down.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_01: That's when I said, I think pencil needs to run for governor.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_01: And then I went and bought some fabric and some duct tape and I went in my basement and went.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_03: Pencil emerged.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_03: This is like a – I'm envisioning like Frankenstein, like a mad scientist.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_03: You're down there like duct tapes flying, scissors.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_01: There were many prototypes.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_03: Well, how has it been?
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_03: Obviously, so that's the origin story.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_03: And then you are engaging with people as the alter ego pencil.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_03: How has that been?
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_03: Does that open people up?
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_03: Like what's the experience?
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_03: What's that like?
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_03: You're standing on the corner.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_03: You're handing out pamphlets.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_03: You're a giant inanimate object.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_01: So people love talking to an inanimate object, it turns out.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_03: More than other people.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_01: More than other people, right?
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_01: So just on a very basic level,
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_01: when I'm talking to people,
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_01: I'm also handing them a A postcard that you have in there, actually.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe you could grab one of them.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_01: And so for those who can see it on the postcard is an adorable picture drawing that
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_01: the amazing cartoonist just kind of Aaron Nels Steinke.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_01: He does Mr. Wolf comics, but he's developed this amazing cartoon character.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_01: And so you have a little bit of joy.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_01: And then on the back.
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_01: You have a little bit of reality,
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_01: which is it says that Oregon is 50th and fourth grade literacy,
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_01: but it also says this is a fixable problem.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_01: And so it opens up people like, oh my gosh, there's a silly person.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_01: I want to take a picture with you and what have you.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_01: And then they're feeling a little bit good so that I can deliver both the message,
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_01: which is we're 50th and this is also fixable.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_03: You're like, I'm going to lead with the bad news.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_01: But then we actually engage in a conversation.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_01: The thing that is most shocking,
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_01: and this goes back to the utter silence from the governor on down,
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_01: is most people are shocked.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_03: They don't know.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_01: They have no idea because they think,
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_01: oh, Oregon, there's sort of this idea of Oregon's so liberal and whatever it is.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_01: They're like, wait, what?
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_01: How is that happening?
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_01: Especially people with small babies go, tell me more.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_01: How do we fix this before my kid goes to school?
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_01: So that's one interaction.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_01: The other is I have really serious policy talks with people, which is amazing.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_01: And at some point in the five minute conversation,
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_01: they go, I can't believe I'm having this conversation with a pencil.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_01: But- What's amazing is, you know, I think people want to solve problems.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_01: And that's one of the things that I feel like is so great talking to people because
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_01: when you talk to them and you give them actual information and numbers
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_01: and you get away from,
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_01: as you said,
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_01: just like,
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_01: you know, this budget number or that budget number, or we're going to do that.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_01: And that's when you hear people really want change.
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_01: People, who doesn't want kids to, I
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_00: mean, right?
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_00: Like no one,
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_00: no one has come up to me and said,
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_01: Actually, I don't want children to learn to agree.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_03: Actually, the less they can read, the better.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_03: Have you seen children?
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_03: They're scary.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_01: Although one person did say, wait, 50th?
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_01: I thought we were 47th.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_01: And you're like.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_01: That would be so much better.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_03: Let's say you're right.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_01: So it's really been amazing.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that that's but but there's something about pencil that allows people
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_01: to engage with it,
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_01: because I think the one message I want to get out there is that this is
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_01: a fixable problem.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_01: Like we have a crisis.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_01: We have to acknowledge that.
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_01: That's the first thing.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_01: The second thing is it's not parents, teachers, kids fault.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_01: It's a systemic problem.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_01: But we built the system, which means it's fixable.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_01: And this is a hope sandwich here.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_01: And It's not just like hope and change year or whatever.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_01: Sorry, I'm showing my age.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_01: That goes back a while.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_01: But...
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_01: In between there is, okay, we can hope.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_01: But the reason I have hope is because I've seen other states do it.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_01: And that's what we need to do.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_03: And we're going to get into that because I'm very interested in seeing what works.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_03: I think one of the things you just said that resonates with me,
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_03: a lot of times people feel like, oh, well, it's the system.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_03: And as if it's this like written in the stars, it's inevitable.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_03: It's got to happen.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_03: There's just no way.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_03: And it's like,
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_03: When you actually think about it,
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_03: systems are made of people and people are making choices.
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_03: And so therefore, you can make different choices and change systems.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, really, it can feel out of control.
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_03: But what I love about what you're doing and I strive to do on this podcast is step one, educate.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_03: And then step two, give people an action step.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_03: What is the thing that you can do?
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_03: For you, one of the things that you could do is to run for governor.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_03: And as you know, I'm a politician elected once and not elected once.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_03: And so I'm fascinated with just the idea of launching a campaign.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_03: Campaigning is hard and I don't care who you are or what you are or what you are.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_03: Sorry, I want to be inclusive of all our candidates.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_03: It's and I say this,
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_03: I frequently get contacted by people running for office and they want to talk to me
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_03: about it or get my endorsement or whatever.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_03: And I always say, and this is genuine, it's a public service.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_03: Running for office is a public service because you are giving voters.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_03: You are raising issues that maybe are being neglected.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_03: And I think that's true of human beings running against each other.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_03: But that has been the goal of your campaign.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_03: You obviously, an inanimate object is not eligible to be the governor of the state of Oregon.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_03: And I assume you knew that setting out.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe you learned it along the way.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_01: I actually did call the Secretary of State and that was a very fun conversation
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_01: to have trying to explain what I'm doing and which kind of pack I needed to open
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_01: because I can't have a candidate pack because I'm not actually a human being.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_01: Fascinating.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_01: And I bless them in the elections office because they didn't laugh once.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_01: They took it totally seriously and it was great.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I guess that's good.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_03: Or maybe I'm pitching like the FBI men in black.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_03: They need a little bit more humor in their lives.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_03: So one,
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_03: thank you for your service to our community in doing this because it truly is
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_03: a labor and clearly a labor of love.
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_03: What's it like to run a campaign where you're not trying to win?
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_01: Campaigning.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_01: I have so much more empathy for candidates now.
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I don't even have to show my face.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_01: And people want to talk to a giant pencil.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_01: They really don't want to talk to someone running for office.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_01: So bless you all.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_01: But why do this?
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_01: I think this is where I.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_01: The first thing I want to say is that this is a nonpartisan issue.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_01: OK, pencil pencil is not registered in any party because pencil can't vote.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_01: But this is a nonpartisan issue.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_01: But I am going to just talk about the Democrats for a second,
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_01: because if you're trying to make change, you look at who's in power and.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_01: In Oregon, Democrats have been in power for a very long time.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_01: And so one of the things that is really concerning is the complete lack
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_01: of prioritization when it comes to really changing education.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_01: And just recently, Tina Kotech just put out her prioritization.
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_01: She said, these are my top priorities.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_01: And she sent it out to everyone.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_01: Education is not mentioned once in it.
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_01: Clearly Pencil,
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_01: like campaigning while hard,
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_01: like that's the point of Pencil is to say, no, no, this needs to be a priority.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_01: And so I am a single issue candidate, except that I'm not.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_01: And here's why.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_01: I think that we have all these different problems, right?
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_01: And you can say addiction and the houselessness and all these things.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_01: Those begin with poor education.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_01: Our economic woes,
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_01: I don't really,
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_01: the Moda Center have your opinion,
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_01: but you know what's really gonna change things is if we have students who
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_01: then get strong skills and then they attract businesses
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_01: or they wanna start businesses and they know they can hire employees, right?
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_01: That's what builds a strong economy.
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's focused on education, but that connection to everything else.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_01: And by the way, just from an economic point of view, It's way cheaper.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, yeah.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_01: Like helping a kid learn to read in K through three, you
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_03: earn that money back.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_01: Over and over again.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's the question of what's it like to run.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_01: That was a little off,
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_01: but the campaign is really to,
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_01: as you said, and I like this idea of giving people choices.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_01: The thing is right now,
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_01: there is no candidate that is taught I would love to be able to just support
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_01: a candidate.
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_01: I can't.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_01: And that's why I needed to run,
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_01: because I want people to know that there are choices in these policies and
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_01: that we need to push our legislators to actually do those things, right?
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_01: And I want to go back to one point you said,
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_01: which is this idea that systems are made of people and we can fix them.
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_01: I can't tell you how many times I've been in conversations with people,
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_01: legislators,
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_01: and And they use words like when I say,
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_01: for instance, that we need to all have a single curriculum, right?
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_01: This is one of the things that like everybody needs to be using
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_01: the same reading curriculum so that, you know, it's cheaper.
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_01: But also we know that they're getting a good curriculum and I'll get,
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_01: well, the districts will never, never allow you to do that.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_01: And I said, whoa, whoa, whoa.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_01: The districts work for our children and us.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_01: They're not these other entities.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_01: And so even just I think that trying the campaign,
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_01: part of the campaign's point is to remind people that these entities are made
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_01: of people and also legislators and the schools.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_01: They work for our children.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know if I answered your question.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_03: No, I so appreciate it.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_03: And one of the things that you said that resonated with me was about
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_03: the great investment that it is to,
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_03: and I know, I mean, Again,
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_03: my experience in the criminal justice system,
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_03: we talked all the time about root causes.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_03: We talked all the time about investments and interventions you could make.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_03: One of the things that drove me angry as a professional was to see children be victims of crime.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_03: And our system acts like the prosecution of the perpetrator is going to help that child.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_03: And that trauma that that child experienced,
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_03: and I'm sure you're all aware of ACEs and adverse childhood experiences,
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_03: all the things.
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_03: As a former teacher,
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_03: I had a lot of children who were victims of crime or lived around crime or violence
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_03: in their community.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_03: And I can tell you from First hand,
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_03: what the impact of that is of them in the classroom and their ability to succeed.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_03: And so one of the things as a criminal justice practitioner is our lack
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_03: of investments in victims, any victims, but children victims.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, talk about a dollar well spent and there's all kinds of literature on that.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_03: And just maybe to get a little bit more dark is in Louisiana when I was teaching.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_03: We would say it was discussed that the literacy rate,
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_03: you could take that and forecast how many jails and prisons you needed to build.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_03: And the worst, the literacy rate, obviously start building more jails and prisons.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_03: And so that's the marriage of my two professions that I've had in my career,
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_03: public safety and education.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_03: And it's exactly what you're saying.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_03: These investments pay off in our community.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_03: And also, if we don't make them, we are going to be paying.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_03: And so that's huge.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I appreciate you engaging voters on the corner and thank you
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_03: for acknowledging how challenging it is to be a candidate.
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_03: It really feels that way.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_03: And shout out to any of the candidates out there.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_03: And I hope that they're paying attention to this and going to put education
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_03: on their list of priorities because this is crucial.
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_03: We've jumped into this a little bit,
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_03: but talk to us more about the actual statistics of our education system here
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_03: in Oregon.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_01: Sure.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_01: So I think there's two, which is the student outcomes.
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_01: And so I'll talk about that first.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_01: And then the other part is around kind of where we are putting our money
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_01: and why it's not working.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_01: So the first is that I want to start with just very basics.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_01: 95% of children given the right instruction and support can learn to read.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_01: By fourth grade in Oregon, only 40% are proficient at reading.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_01: And of those about half are at what are called is called a basic level.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_01: So this is a fourth grader.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_01: It means they've been in school for three, four years.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_01: And they can barely do the alphabet.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_01: So, and I just want to start there because there's numbers,
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_01: but there's also the emotional impact.
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_01: And you talked about trauma and I think we need to talk about the trauma imposed on children.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_01: And I think trauma gets used way too often as like this, that,
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_01: but actually,
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_01: You see this because my partner works with men in the criminal justice system.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_01: He's a therapist and he works with men who are addicted and have criminal justice
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_01: in their backgrounds.
• 30:56
  SPEAKER_01: And he constantly sees that they talk about, many of them struggle with reading.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_01: And then they talk about pretty awful experiences in school.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_01: And you can kind of see this.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_01: Let's play this.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_01: It's very obvious,
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_01: but I think if you don't,
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_01: if you're not around kids all the time, you don't sort of think about this.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_01: You're in kindergarten,
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_01: you're in first grade,
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_01: you're in second grade,
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_01: and the kids around you are starting to learn to read,
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_01: but you're kind of struggling.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_01: What do you do?
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_01: You act out.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_01: You shut down.
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_01: You think you're stupid.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_01: You think you're the problem, right?
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_01: And so you can see that it's just the social emotional cannot be separated from the academic.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_01: And the problem is that when you get to be fourth grade or third grade, really,
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_01: we switch from teaching,
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_01: learning, sorry, learning to read to That's actually trauma.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think that just we need to start with that's the experience of 60 percent
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_01: of our fourth graders in Oregon.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_01: And there's a real disconnect here because that means 40 percent are proficient.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_01: When you ask parents, 90 percent of them think their kids at grade level.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_01: So you can see we have an honesty gap here.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_01: They don't even know their kids behind.
• 32:27
  SPEAKER_01: And one thing I would say is.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_01: We have a real aversion to assessment here in Oregon,
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_01: and I can get to that a little bit later with some of the policies we need.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_01: But this idea that we're going to hurt kids' feelings if we tell them that they're,
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_01: you know, you're not reading.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_01: Kids know they're struggling.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_01: You're actually being quite cruel because you're just delaying the moment in
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_01: which they realize how far behind.
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_01: And I can tell you,
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_01: as a parent of a kid that struggled to read,
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_01: it's extremely painful, both for the parent and for the child.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_01: And so just on numbers, that's where we're at.
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_01: We are 50th in fourth grade literacy in the country,
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_01: and that means 60% of our fourth graders are not reading at grade level.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_01: And then,
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_01: as I mentioned,
• 33:13
  SPEAKER_01: that also means that Within that,
• 33:15
  SPEAKER_01: there's even a subgroup that is not learning to read,
• 33:18
  SPEAKER_01: whereas 95% of children can learn to read.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so there's nothing wrong with Oregon children.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_01: I think we just need to remember that.
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_01: We are special in so many ways, but in this way, our kids are great.
• 33:30
  SPEAKER_03: As you were talking, it made me think of compounding interest in investments, right?
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_03: And in making that investment in a young person, that's compounding interest.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_03: And it sets them up because I love what you said.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_03: You learn to read and then it's read to learn, right?
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_03: Because if you're...
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_03: If you're struggling with reading, well,
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_03: then in fifth grade,
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_03: when you're doing science and in sixth grade,
• 33:51
  SPEAKER_03: you're doing,
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_03: English and literature and you're trying to do all the things that are going to be
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_03: the foundation for your entire life.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_03: If you're already behind.
• 34:01
  SPEAKER_03: And that interest is not building that,
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_03: you know, a lot of us, I guess maybe I'm getting towards retirement age.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_02: That's why I'm thinking of compounding interest,
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_03: but right.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_03: It's, it's so crucial of advice to like,
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_03: make those investments when you're younger because it's,
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_03: it compounds and what you're seeing and saying,
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_03: it just resonates with me that those children are missing out on the benefits
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_03: of those early investments.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_03: And it's hard to catch up.
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_01: And can I, you, you taught middle school, right?
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 34:29
  SPEAKER_01: You, you, Bless you and all middle school teachers out there.
• 34:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like you're doing the work you do.
• 34:36
  SPEAKER_01: And here's in part why.
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_01: And this applies to high school a little bit,
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_01: but a lot of kids drop out actually in high school if they're struggling this much.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_01: If we don't have students being taught to read and you have some kids that are
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_01: and some aren't,
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_01: by the time you get to middle school,
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_01: you in one class may have a child that's reading at a first grade level.
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_01: So let's just pretend it's seventh grade.
• 34:59
  SPEAKER_01: A child that is reading at a first grade level,
• 35:02
  SPEAKER_01: a second grade level,
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_01: a fifth grade level,
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_01: and then you might have a couple kids that are,
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_01: at seventh grade level,
• 35:07
  SPEAKER_01: but then a couple kids that are, but there's no way you as one teacher can teach.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_01: I don't care how good you are.
• 35:13
  SPEAKER_01: It's impossible to teach to a classroom where you have reading levels
• 35:17
  SPEAKER_01: from first grade through, you know, 10th grade.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_01: And so this also makes sense.
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_01: All the teachers above,
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_01: every teacher should want the kids to have strong reading skills by
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_01: the time they're getting into that.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_01: And I do want to mention...
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_01: What Pencil's talking about, and people may be familiar with this term, science of reading.
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_01: And the science of reading, sometimes people reduce it to phonics.
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_01: And that's one very small part of it, an important part.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_01: But science of reading is 40 years of research that says we now know how people learn to read.
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_01: And the part that we're focusing on that K through three is things like phonics
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_01: and phonemic awareness.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_01: And that's what people often talk about.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_01: And you need those foundations, but then you keep learning more and more complex skills.
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_01: It covers the whole spectrum.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_01: But again,
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_01: if you're that middle school teacher,
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_01: You can't be teaching the alphabet to one kid and then teaching a kid Greek roots
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_01: for their biology class at the same time.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like those two kids, I mean, it's just a very challenging, as you probably know, situation.
• 36:25
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I completely agree.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_03: I completely remember exactly what you're describing is my kids, my students at various levels.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_03: And, you know,
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_03: you try your best and I look back and I cringe at some of the things that I tried,
• 36:38
  SPEAKER_03: but you try and you try to,
• 36:39
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 36:40
  SPEAKER_03: appeal to the visual learners,
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_03: the auditory learners, which I think were pretty rare.
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_03: And then the tactile need to touch it, need to be moving learners and you try your best.
• 36:51
  SPEAKER_03: Children are left behind and you as a teacher,
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_03: unfortunately,
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_03: sometimes feel like you have to make decisions about where you're going
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_03: to focus your energy.
• 36:58
  SPEAKER_03: And that has consequences for other children in the classroom.
• 37:02
  SPEAKER_03: And so I completely that you're bringing me back to my time in the classroom.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_03: You also touched on children dropping out of school.
• 37:12
  SPEAKER_03: And that has been,
• 37:13
  SPEAKER_03: and I'm not like you have not been super invested or paying attention into Oregon's,
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_03: but you can't have missed the headlines that that has been a challenge
• 37:23
  SPEAKER_03: for Oregon is just graduating kids, students.
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_03: And that's one of the things that I hear, oh, we're making progress.
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_03: But we started off this conversation as your time in PSU and seeing the kids coming
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_03: into your classroom.
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_03: What do you make of that as an outcome measure of children graduating?
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm just going to say that it is a political number.
• 37:51
  SPEAKER_01: It's a joke.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_01: So we keep saying, oh, we've raised it.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_01: And now it's at like 81% of kids are graduating,
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_01: except that during COVID, we got rid of all standards to graduate.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_01: And so I taught before COVID and things were bad.
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_01: My friends that are still in academics,
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_01: basically Portland State had to put in a huge bridge program because the kids were
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_01: so far behind.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, like anyone you talk to in college says,
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_01: oh my God, yeah, the kids are graduating, but they don't have any of the skills.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_01: That helps no one.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_01: And again,
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_01: those kids,
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_01: they know then when they get into...
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_01: And by the way,
• 38:27
  SPEAKER_01: these are the kids,
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_01: the small group of kids that even go to community college or go to Portland State.
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_01: If you think about it,
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_01: Portland State is the small group of students that goes to the university out of...
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_01: A lot of students just disappear from the system.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it shows where the level of...
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_01: The abysmal graduation rates,
• 38:53
  SPEAKER_01: if you look at them in community college,
• 38:55
  SPEAKER_01: kids are not getting through even in six years for a two year degree
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_01: and things like this.
• 38:59
  SPEAKER_01: And Portland State also has a huge problem with this.
• 39:03
  SPEAKER_01: And that is because we're graduating students Great.
• 39:09
  SPEAKER_01: It's a piece of paper.
• 39:11
  SPEAKER_01: And the other thing is,
• 39:11
  SPEAKER_01: if you talk to businesses,
• 39:13
  SPEAKER_01: talk to people all the time, they're like, oh, my God, I hired this person.
• 39:15
  SPEAKER_01: I've actually started asking for them to sit down and write something
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_01: because they're using they can't write.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_01: They can't do some basic, basic stuff.
• 39:25
  SPEAKER_01: And that doesn't help anyone.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_01: That doesn't help that student.
• 39:28
  SPEAKER_01: That doesn't help our economy or what have you.
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_01: And so this idea like this is where I think we have an honesty gap like that number.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_01: We're back to this is about children.
• 39:38
  SPEAKER_01: This is right.
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_01: I'm shaking pencil here.
• 39:41
  SPEAKER_01: Children, not pieces of paper and numbers.
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_01: And that when I tell people that when I say we dropped all standards and by the way.
• 39:51
  SPEAKER_01: Other states have them and brought them back.
• 39:54
  SPEAKER_01: We voted to not bring them back.
• 39:56
  SPEAKER_01: So we still don't have them.
• 39:57
  SPEAKER_01: So post covid.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, covid was a long time ago, people.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 40:01
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's.
• 40:04
  SPEAKER_01: I think this is at the core of the problem,
• 40:07
  SPEAKER_01: which is we're not even admitting there's a problem.
• 40:09
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, yeah.
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_01: You can't fix something.
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_01: Step one.
• 40:12
  SPEAKER_01: Step one.
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_01: And this is the other thing is, what do you want to teach your children?
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_01: What do you want to teach kids?
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_01: Like, no, you have to identify problems so you can solve them.
• 40:19
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 40:19
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_01: And we're not even, you know, being honest with people.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_03: All right.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_03: Let's pause for just a second.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_03: We'll be right back with more from Jay Schubert after a quick word from our sponsor
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_03: for this week's program, Corbett Hill Wellness.
• 40:32
  SPEAKER_03: A quick word from our show sponsor,
• 40:34
  SPEAKER_03: Dr. Adam Moret at Corbett Hill Wellness Center, people I know and trust.
• 40:38
  SPEAKER_02: Hi, I'm Dr. Moret from Corbett Hill Wellness Center.
• 40:41
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• 41:03
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• 41:06
  SPEAKER_03: I want to talk about this idea of how much money we're investing in our system.
• 41:11
  SPEAKER_03: I talked to an individual who was running for office and education actually was his issue.
• 41:17
  SPEAKER_03: And I said, well, what do we need to improve our education system?
• 41:19
  SPEAKER_03: And he said, well, we don't invest enough in our education system.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_03: And that kind of struck me as a little odd.
• 41:26
  SPEAKER_03: I, again, don't know all the numbers like you do, but I think we do pretty good.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_03: Good.
• 41:32
  SPEAKER_03: Relative to other states.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_03: So maybe is do we just need more investment in education?
• 41:37
  SPEAKER_03: What are you seeing as you look into this?
• 41:39
  SPEAKER_01: So the top line is we don't need more funding, although more funding is always great.
• 41:45
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 41:45
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm not going to say no.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_01: But there's the reality of like we have lots of competing priorities.
• 41:51
  SPEAKER_01: And this is where what's just as important as And
• 41:54
  SPEAKER_01: so people can make their own judgments,
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_01: but just compared to other states, recently we're number 19.
• 41:57
  SPEAKER_01: So we're in the top half per pupil spending.
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_01: And in terms of average teacher pay, we're number 10.
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_01: Which is very good.
• 42:23
  SPEAKER_01: And we should be proud of that.
• 42:25
  SPEAKER_03: As a former Louisiana teacher, that would have been nice.
• 42:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 42:28
  SPEAKER_01: And we are number three.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_01: So three out of 50.
• 42:31
  SPEAKER_01: This is amazing.
• 42:31
  SPEAKER_01: Top three for benefits compensation for our teachers.
• 42:35
  SPEAKER_01: So that's phenomenal.
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_01: And we shouldn't,
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_01: this is not say take that away,
• 42:39
  SPEAKER_01: but now we have to say,
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_01: okay, so this more money narrative, what are we doing with the money?
• 42:45
  SPEAKER_01: And so I would love to show a few things.
• 42:48
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 42:48
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 42:48
  SPEAKER_03: So what are we doing with the money?
• 42:50
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 42:52
  SPEAKER_03: And just like you say,
• 42:53
  SPEAKER_03: to be clear,
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_03: I think that we should be proud that we're paying teachers well and
• 42:57
  SPEAKER_03: that they have great benefits.
• 42:59
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, that's something to be proud of.
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_03: And what are we doing with all the money?
• 43:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 43:03
  SPEAKER_01: And so there's a couple of different places that that money is going.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_01: But one thing.
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_01: So for those who are listening, I'm showing Oregon and Washington a little comparison here.
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_01: And
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_01: In Washington, they have almost twice as many.
• 43:20
  SPEAKER_01: We have about 500,000 students.
• 43:21
  SPEAKER_01: They have about a million students in their K-12 system.
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_01: And when you look at their Department of Education, so they have twice as many students.
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_01: They have 491 students.
• 43:33
  SPEAKER_01: Employees in their Department of Ed.
• 43:36
  SPEAKER_01: We have 665.
• 43:37
  SPEAKER_01: So half the students in Oregon,
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_01: but almost 175 more employees in the state Department of Education.
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_01: So that's like...
• 43:49
  SPEAKER_03: It's admin.
• 43:49
  SPEAKER_03: It's administrative services.
• 43:51
  SPEAKER_03: Those aren't teachers.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_01: These are not teachers.
• 43:53
  SPEAKER_01: These are people that,
• 43:53
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 43:54
  SPEAKER_01: they don't,
• 43:54
  SPEAKER_01: they may virtually sit in Salem, but they are in the Department of Education.
• 43:58
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 43:58
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 43:59
  SPEAKER_01: And so this isn't, oh, we should be like them and fire a bunch of people.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_01: But I want to talk about your Louisiana.
• 44:05
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_01: Looked at what are we doing for our students and how can we better serve them?
• 44:12
  SPEAKER_01: Because they wanted to look at what Mississippi was doing and Maryland and some other places.
• 44:19
  SPEAKER_01: And what they did was they said, OK, what is the goal?
• 44:22
  SPEAKER_01: And we'll go back to pencil.
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_01: The goal is to get teachers resources so that they can help kids learn and thrive.
• 44:28
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 44:29
  SPEAKER_01: What does a comprehensive state strategy look like for that?
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_01: And then they said, how many employees do we need to do that at the state level?
• 44:35
  SPEAKER_01: And they had 600.
• 44:36
  SPEAKER_01: And when they finished this project, they had 300.
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_01: And you can see that the point isn't we should have fewer staff, cut staff, right?
• 44:44
  SPEAKER_01: That's what people are like, oh, you're saying cut staff.
• 44:46
  SPEAKER_01: No, what we're saying is how many people are needed in order to get
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_01: the results
• 44:53
  SPEAKER_01: we want this strategy.
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_01: And we don't have a strategy.
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_01: Like we are a completely fragmented system.
• 44:59
  SPEAKER_01: We have 197 school districts and each
• 45:02
  SPEAKER_01: of those school districts really can do almost anything they want.
• 45:08
  SPEAKER_01: And that's that doesn't it's clearly that's not working.
• 45:11
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 45:11
  SPEAKER_01: So that's the first place that I would say, again, it's not about a number.
• 45:16
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know what the exact number is, but it's really.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_01: Why?
• 45:21
  SPEAKER_01: Why do you have these people working there?
• 45:24
  SPEAKER_01: So that's one.
• 45:25
  SPEAKER_01: And that's a lot of money, right?
• 45:26
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_01: The second thing I would say is right now what's hard is we're talking about the state level.
• 45:33
  SPEAKER_01: Most people don't experience the system in that way.
• 45:36
  SPEAKER_01: They experience it with their local schools, right?
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_01: And if you're a parent in a local school right now,
• 45:40
  SPEAKER_01: for instance,
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_01: Portland Public,
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_01: what you're hearing is,
• 45:43
  SPEAKER_01: They're going to close maybe 20 schools and they're laying off a bunch of teachers
• 45:48
  SPEAKER_01: and they're going to have combined classes.
• 45:50
  SPEAKER_01: There's all this.
• 45:51
  SPEAKER_01: And they use the word budget crisis.
• 45:53
  SPEAKER_01: That is the constant budget crisis.
• 45:55
  SPEAKER_01: And they asked for 50,
• 45:56
  SPEAKER_01: they being Portland Public and a couple other districts,
• 46:00
  SPEAKER_01: they were asking for emergency funds to fill in these budget holes
• 46:05
  SPEAKER_01: and this budget crisis.
• 46:06
  SPEAKER_01: And I think this is where we really need to stop and look at some real numbers
• 46:10
  SPEAKER_01: and look underneath the emergency.
• 46:13
  SPEAKER_01: And so between I have a chart here.
• 46:19
  SPEAKER_03: I love it.
• 46:19
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, you know, once a teacher, always a teacher.
• 46:21
  SPEAKER_03: You're taking care of our visual learners, our auditory learners.
• 46:24
  SPEAKER_01: I know.
• 46:24
  SPEAKER_01: I know.
• 46:25
  SPEAKER_01: OK, so what I'm showing here is that.
• 46:28
  SPEAKER_01: In a seven-year period, 2018-2025, we have 64,000 fewer students in Oregon's K-12 system.
• 46:36
  SPEAKER_01: And that's just demographics.
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_03: I've been hearing a lot about that, right?
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_03: Less and less students.
• 46:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 46:42
  SPEAKER_01: We've known this for a long time.
• 46:44
  SPEAKER_01: But at the same period, we increased the number of adults in those schools by almost 11,000.
• 46:52
  SPEAKER_01: So 64,000 fewer students in the system, 11,000 more adults in the system.
• 46:57
  SPEAKER_01: So you might think, well, wait, one, we should be getting better outcomes.
• 47:03
  SPEAKER_01: But- What we really need to look at is those people were hired with one-time funds.
• 47:10
  SPEAKER_01: During COVID, $1.7 billion came into the state.
• 47:14
  SPEAKER_03: The ARPA dollars.
• 47:15
  SPEAKER_01: Well, they were ESSER, they called them.
• 47:17
  SPEAKER_01: ESSER, okay.
• 47:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes.
• 47:18
  SPEAKER_01: But investments
• 47:18
  SPEAKER_03: during the COVID too.
• 47:19
  SPEAKER_01: All those, right?
• 47:20
  SPEAKER_01: And the education ones were called ESSER.
• 47:22
  SPEAKER_01: And so those $1.7 billion, they come into the state.
• 47:25
  SPEAKER_01: And what we did was we just said, OK, we're going to distribute it to all the districts.
• 47:29
  SPEAKER_01: Good luck.
• 47:29
  SPEAKER_01: Do what you want.
• 47:30
  SPEAKER_01: Some bought curtains.
• 47:31
  SPEAKER_01: Some put AstroTurf down.
• 47:33
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 47:33
  SPEAKER_01: And we what others did was even though they were warned,
• 47:37
  SPEAKER_01: if you hire people after these funds go out,
• 47:40
  SPEAKER_01: you're going to have to then be paying them out of your budget.
• 47:43
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_01: Don't do that.
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_01: Well, a lot of districts hired a bunch of people knowing they were one-time funds.
• 47:51
  SPEAKER_01: They were going to run out after two years.
• 47:52
  SPEAKER_01: And so now this idea that this is a budget crisis,
• 47:56
  SPEAKER_01: I think we really need to step back and say,
• 47:58
  SPEAKER_01: is this a budget crisis or a mismanagement of funds crisis?
• 48:02
  SPEAKER_01: And the second one is with closing schools.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_01: If you are at a point in looking at the demographics over these years
• 48:09
  SPEAKER_01: and you are now at a point where you're going to close 20 schools,
• 48:11
  SPEAKER_01: that means someone didn't want to make hard decisions for those years before.
• 48:16
  SPEAKER_01: You should have been closing schools and facilities and right sizing all along so
• 48:20
  SPEAKER_01: that it didn't feel like a crisis.
• 48:21
  SPEAKER_03: So it's not a cliff.
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_01: It felt like managing a situation, which is we have fewer students.
• 48:27
  SPEAKER_01: We're not going to need as many.
• 48:28
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_01: And so now I don't envy Dr.
• 48:31
  SPEAKER_01: Armstrong,
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_01: for instance, in PPS, which I appreciate she's doing what needs to be done.
• 48:37
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 48:38
  SPEAKER_01: That's hard.
• 48:39
  SPEAKER_01: And it feels awful.
• 48:40
  SPEAKER_01: But really, this is because there's been mismanagement all along.
• 48:45
  SPEAKER_01: And what this is about is a deeper problem,
• 48:47
  SPEAKER_01: which is the relationship between 197 school districts in the state.
• 48:52
  SPEAKER_01: And just to give an illustration of that,
• 48:54
  SPEAKER_01: you know, because people like, well, what would you have people do?
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_01: You know, you know, that that sounds good.
• 48:59
  SPEAKER_01: Other states, for instance, Tennessee got their COVID money, right?
• 49:02
  SPEAKER_01: So they get these billions of dollars.
• 49:03
  SPEAKER_01: And instead of sending out to the districts, they did this brilliant thing.
• 49:06
  SPEAKER_01: They set up an amazing tutoring program and then they assessed kids and said, who's behind?
• 49:12
  SPEAKER_01: Who needs help?
• 49:13
  SPEAKER_01: And so they then sent out from the state the tutors.
• 49:17
  SPEAKER_01: And so you have two great things from that,
• 49:19
  SPEAKER_01: which is kids got what they needed and the state knew that.
• 49:22
  SPEAKER_01: But the second thing is there weren't a bunch of employees who then needed to be paid after.
• 49:26
  SPEAKER_03: Well, that's a that's a perfect lead into exactly where I was going,
• 49:28
  SPEAKER_03: which is we've talked a lot about the challenges.
• 49:32
  SPEAKER_03: We've talked about our literacy rate at fourth grade.
• 49:34
  SPEAKER_03: We've talked about our graduation rate numbers and what does that actually mean
• 49:38
  SPEAKER_03: for preparedness into for
• 49:43
  SPEAKER_03: We've talked about maybe money is not necessarily the answer.
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_03: So who's doing well across the country?
• 49:51
  SPEAKER_03: You just mentioned Tennessee.
• 49:54
  SPEAKER_03: What are you seeing out there?
• 49:55
  SPEAKER_03: Whose homework can we copy off of?
• 49:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, exactly.
• 50:01
  SPEAKER_01: This is where when I got involved with this because I'm a researcher,
• 50:04
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, oh, gosh, like, wait, other people are doing better.
• 50:07
  SPEAKER_01: So clearly what I should do is go read all of their policies.
• 50:10
  SPEAKER_01: And then I'm going to call everyone that wrote the policy,
• 50:12
  SPEAKER_01: implemented the policy or got the policy passed in their legislation.
• 50:15
  SPEAKER_01: And so I talked to people in Mississippi, Louisiana, North Carolina, Tennessee, Colorado.
• 50:20
  SPEAKER_01: And here's the thing.
• 50:21
  SPEAKER_01: Educators are amazingly generous with their time.
• 50:24
  SPEAKER_01: It was phenomenal.
• 50:25
  SPEAKER_01: So we had all this stuff.
• 50:26
  SPEAKER_01: And just to give a couple of examples on literacy,
• 50:30
  SPEAKER_01: people have heard about the Mississippi miracle.
• 50:33
  SPEAKER_01: And I think two things, which is it's not a miracle.
• 50:36
  SPEAKER_01: A miracle makes it seem like it came out of nowhere.
• 50:38
  SPEAKER_01: No, it came out of really hard work and like adults making changes.
• 50:42
  SPEAKER_01: And the thing that people don't talk about,
• 50:45
  SPEAKER_01: Mississippi didn't simply people say,
• 50:47
  SPEAKER_01: oh, they just trained everyone and it's just literacy.
• 50:50
  SPEAKER_01: They completely revamped,
• 50:51
  SPEAKER_01: like we were talking about Louisiana,
• 50:53
  SPEAKER_01: they completely revamped their Department of Education.
• 50:57
  SPEAKER_01: And the Dr. Wright,
• 50:59
  SPEAKER_01: who was brought in, basically said, okay, this is going to be our North Star.
• 51:04
  SPEAKER_01: Everyone,
• 51:05
  SPEAKER_01: we're going to all row from the, right,
• 51:06
  SPEAKER_01: that you have to have the department, right,
• 51:08
  SPEAKER_01: state level to the district level to the school level where this is your goal.
• 51:12
  SPEAKER_01: We're going to get rid of all the other stuff that doesn't matter because there's
• 51:15
  SPEAKER_01: a lot of stuff that people are No, no, this is what we're doing.
• 51:19
  SPEAKER_01: And then I'm only going to hire the people in the Department of Ed.
• 51:24
  SPEAKER_01: That's what their job is, right?
• 51:27
  SPEAKER_01: And the rest, and that may mean people are gone.
• 51:30
  SPEAKER_01: And the other thing is that focus on one goal, right?
• 51:38
  SPEAKER_01: And that has to be a just...
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_01: It has to come from the top.
• 51:43
  SPEAKER_01: And the governor in our state is actually the head of public instruction,
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_01: like literally her number one job,
• 51:50
  SPEAKER_01: even though it's not on her top priorities or any of her priorities, apparently.
• 51:54
  SPEAKER_01: Her number one job and anyone that's in the governor is education.
• 51:59
  SPEAKER_01: And so when I talked to the people in Mississippi, they said education.
• 52:02
  SPEAKER_01: Every moment that they had the governor, the Department of Ed had like legislate.
• 52:08
  SPEAKER_01: Everyone was talking about the same goals.
• 52:10
  SPEAKER_01: And so everyone felt invested.
• 52:12
  SPEAKER_01: Everyone felt like, oh, we know what we're supposed to be doing.
• 52:15
  SPEAKER_01: And they put in an accountability system.
• 52:17
  SPEAKER_01: And this is something Louisiana just did as well.
• 52:19
  SPEAKER_01: Louisiana's new accountability bill and now their system is amazing.
• 52:23
  SPEAKER_01: It's a coherent system.
• 52:26
  SPEAKER_01: And they all are rowing in the same way.
• 52:28
  SPEAKER_01: And they last year had the highest growth in The reading scores for fourth grade.
• 52:34
  SPEAKER_01: So congratulations to Louisiana.
• 52:37
  SPEAKER_01: And so you can see a pattern here forming, which is there's specific things you need to do.
• 52:42
  SPEAKER_01: You need to train teachers properly, all of these things.
• 52:44
  SPEAKER_01: But really, fundamentally, you have to have a relationship between the Department of Ed.
• 52:49
  SPEAKER_01: So the state and the districts in which the state is really supporting students.
• 52:56
  SPEAKER_01: This is what you're supposed to be doing.
• 52:58
  SPEAKER_01: And then there's got to be a feedback loop, which is we're assessing you.
• 53:01
  SPEAKER_01: And assessments are not to punish people.
• 53:03
  SPEAKER_01: They're to say, oh, we're testing the system to say, oh, people need more resources here.
• 53:07
  SPEAKER_01: And what does the state are going to bring more resources?
• 53:10
  SPEAKER_01: We're not punishing you.
• 53:12
  SPEAKER_03: I spoke with a teacher friend of mine last night,
• 53:14
  SPEAKER_03: actually, in preparation for this interview, doing a little bit of my own homework.
• 53:18
  SPEAKER_03: And he said to me,
• 53:20
  SPEAKER_03: and this kind of resonates with what you're saying,
• 53:22
  SPEAKER_03: is he said that he's been to over his,
• 53:27
  SPEAKER_03: I think, 13,
• 53:28
  SPEAKER_03: 14 year career as a teacher here in Oregon,
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_03: he's been to many, many in-service trainings.
• 53:33
  SPEAKER_03: He said he cannot think of one time he left that training thinking, oh, this is going to help.
• 53:39
  SPEAKER_03: Like, this is the this is going to really make a difference for my kids.
• 53:42
  SPEAKER_03: And in fact,
• 53:43
  SPEAKER_03: what he said was,
• 53:44
  SPEAKER_03: I wish every one of those would have just been instructional time
• 53:47
  SPEAKER_03: because I felt like.
• 53:49
  SPEAKER_03: My time was wasted.
• 53:50
  SPEAKER_03: And what that actually did was interrupted any momentum that I may have had in the classroom.
• 53:55
  SPEAKER_03: And what I hear you saying is some of these other states have looked at,
• 54:01
  SPEAKER_03: hey, what are all these other things?
• 54:03
  SPEAKER_03: We've added this requirement.
• 54:03
  SPEAKER_03: We've added this requirement.
• 54:04
  SPEAKER_03: We're doing this curriculum,
• 54:05
  SPEAKER_03: we're doing this,
• 54:05
  SPEAKER_03: and this is a,
• 54:06
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 54:07
  SPEAKER_03: you bring in a new superintendent and they've got a new shiny thing that they want
• 54:11
  SPEAKER_03: to move and that they've sold to get their job.
• 54:14
  SPEAKER_03: And you look backwards and all of a sudden you've got all these things added on, right?
• 54:19
  SPEAKER_03: And it sounds like those states have just said, hey, we're going to streamline.
• 54:23
  SPEAKER_03: We've got one.
• 54:25
  SPEAKER_03: We're all rolling in the same direction.
• 54:26
  SPEAKER_03: We've got one focus.
• 54:27
  SPEAKER_03: Obviously, the outcome we're all focused on is kids, but we're focused on literacy.
• 54:33
  SPEAKER_03: Is that the magic sauce?
• 54:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and focus on literacy, but they also are focusing on other things.
• 54:40
  SPEAKER_01: But when you have a coherent...
• 54:44
  SPEAKER_01: And you have these feedback loops in which we say,
• 54:46
  SPEAKER_01: these are the things we want you to focus on,
• 54:48
  SPEAKER_01: we're assessing, and then we're sending more resources so that you feel supported.
• 54:52
  SPEAKER_01: Then you can say, okay,
• 54:53
  SPEAKER_01: we're also working on math,
• 54:54
  SPEAKER_01: but this is what we're doing, or we're working on, right?
• 54:56
  SPEAKER_01: So you create that.
• 54:57
  SPEAKER_01: The underlying system so that whether it's literacy or math or science or any
• 55:02
  SPEAKER_01: of these things, you can implement them.
• 55:07
  SPEAKER_01: And one thing I draw people's attention to is there's a 2022 risk assessment
• 55:12
  SPEAKER_01: that was done by the Secretary of State with follow-up letters.
• 55:15
  SPEAKER_01: And in that risk assessment,
• 55:16
  SPEAKER_01: it was very clear that local control, they said, is pretty much out of control.
• 55:21
  SPEAKER_01: Like local control has become this thing that people just say, local control.
• 55:27
  SPEAKER_01: As if it's some legal doctrine and it has to be balanced with the state.
• 55:31
  SPEAKER_01: And so what local control has come to mean here is Right.
• 55:35
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 55:35
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 55:35
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 55:58
  SPEAKER_01: Every teacher in the state is receiving the same training.
• 56:01
  SPEAKER_01: Every teacher in the state is using the same curriculum.
• 56:04
  SPEAKER_01: What that means is that if a child or a teacher switches schools or districts,
• 56:10
  SPEAKER_01: they are in the same place.
• 56:12
  SPEAKER_01: They can immediately plug in.
• 56:14
  SPEAKER_01: By the way, you save tons of money because you're doing it at scale and you don't waste time.
• 56:19
  SPEAKER_01: 197 school districts.
• 56:20
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know if people knew this.
• 56:21
  SPEAKER_01: When I discovered this, I went, what?
• 56:24
  SPEAKER_01: They all choose their own curriculum.
• 56:27
  SPEAKER_01: They spend hundreds of hours and time going over curriculums.
• 56:32
  SPEAKER_01: And also a lot of the curriculums are being shopped to them
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_01: by these different companies and stuff like this.
• 56:39
  SPEAKER_01: And that is just right there.
• 56:41
  SPEAKER_01: That's waste of hundreds of hours, right?
• 56:44
  SPEAKER_01: Of people's time that could be used something else.
• 56:47
  SPEAKER_01: I don't understand.
• 56:48
  SPEAKER_01: Literally people will say,
• 56:49
  SPEAKER_01: we have a lot of small districts, a district here and a district two miles away.
• 56:54
  SPEAKER_01: Are the kids so different that they can't use the same curriculum?
• 56:57
  SPEAKER_01: Come on, guys.
• 56:58
  SPEAKER_03: Well, to analogize to my experience in the public safety system,
• 57:01
  SPEAKER_03: one of the things that I think we do really well in
• 57:03
  SPEAKER_03: the public safety system is we have what we call the Department
• 57:06
  SPEAKER_03: of Public Safety Standards and Training, DPSST.
• 57:09
  SPEAKER_03: Every firefighter,
• 57:11
  SPEAKER_03: every police officer have to go,
• 57:14
  SPEAKER_03: every parole and probation officer have to go through DPSST.
• 57:18
  SPEAKER_03: And exactly what you said is what it accomplishes.
• 57:21
  SPEAKER_03: They all speak the same language.
• 57:24
  SPEAKER_03: And I know that states across the country come and look at how we accomplish that.
• 57:50
  SPEAKER_01: Good job, Oregon.
• 57:51
  SPEAKER_03: Good job, Oregon.
• 57:52
  SPEAKER_03: Well, you know,
• 57:54
  SPEAKER_03: I always like to on this show unpack issues,
• 57:57
  SPEAKER_03: and I feel like we have done some unpacking.
• 57:59
  SPEAKER_03: We've looked at some other states.
• 58:01
  SPEAKER_03: We're trying to cheat off some homework.
• 58:03
  SPEAKER_03: You have been really...
• 58:06
  SPEAKER_03: Looking at what Oregon can do.
• 58:08
  SPEAKER_03: And I know you've developed a five steps pledge.
• 58:12
  SPEAKER_03: And so why don't you talk to us about that?
• 58:13
  SPEAKER_03: Because I like to give people an action step.
• 58:15
  SPEAKER_03: You've just heard maybe some bad news,
• 58:17
  SPEAKER_03: maybe some things that is not comfortable to hear, but we're not hopeless.
• 58:22
  SPEAKER_03: We're not helpless.
• 58:23
  SPEAKER_03: So what is the five steps pledge?
• 58:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 58:26
  SPEAKER_01: So the five steps forward petition, and I'll just show you my little clipboard here.
• 58:32
  SPEAKER_01: So the This is something that you can go on to pencilforgov.com and that's
• 58:39
  SPEAKER_01: a number four pencil, number four gov.com.
• 58:42
  SPEAKER_03: Not a number two pencil.
• 58:43
  SPEAKER_03: No, no, that's my,
• 58:45
  SPEAKER_03: those are my relatives back in Ticonderoga.
• 58:48
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 58:48
  SPEAKER_01: So what the five steps forward plan is,
• 58:51
  SPEAKER_01: is five things that have been really successful in other states for getting children
• 58:56
  SPEAKER_01: to read.
• 58:56
  SPEAKER_01: And so this is not as I talked about, there are lots of other things we need to do.
• 59:00
  SPEAKER_01: But this is something that when I talk to all of those people from North Carolina
• 59:04
  SPEAKER_01: to Mississippi, Louisiana, they said, start here, because if you do this well.
• 59:10
  SPEAKER_01: You will, one,
• 59:11
  SPEAKER_01: do these things well,
• 59:12
  SPEAKER_01: but also you'll have to put the infrastructure in that will help you
• 59:15
  SPEAKER_01: with other things, okay?
• 59:17
  SPEAKER_01: And so the first is teacher training in what is called the science of reading,
• 59:21
  SPEAKER_01: and that's for all K-3 teachers and principals.
• 59:25
  SPEAKER_01: And that is just fundamental.
• 59:26
  SPEAKER_01: We need people to understand and be on the same page about teaching kids to read.
• 59:31
  SPEAKER_01: The second is a reading licensure exam.
• 59:34
  SPEAKER_01: And we didn't get into higher education,
• 59:35
  SPEAKER_01: but this is where the problem really starts of you shouldn't have to train all
• 59:39
  SPEAKER_01: the teachers again.
• 59:41
  SPEAKER_01: But because a lot of our teacher prep programs are not actually teaching the science
• 59:45
  SPEAKER_01: of reading, then teachers come out and they don't have the proper training.
• 59:50
  SPEAKER_01: The licensure exam makes sure that they have that knowledge before they go into the classroom.
• 59:55
  SPEAKER_01: And this is what, again, other successful states have done.
• 59:58
  SPEAKER_01: The third is high dosage tutoring for students that really struggle.
• 1:00:01
  SPEAKER_01: And this is where you talked about for every dollar we spend,
• 1:00:05
  SPEAKER_01: people like, oh, it's too expensive.
• 1:00:06
  SPEAKER_01: No, if you can catch a child up, And get them by fourth grade.
• 1:00:11
  SPEAKER_01: And some kids will need more high dosage tutoring.
• 1:00:15
  SPEAKER_01: And that has to be during the day in school.
• 1:00:17
  SPEAKER_01: There's a lot of like after school or before school.
• 1:00:20
  SPEAKER_01: No, this has to be actually part of the literacy during the school.
• 1:00:25
  SPEAKER_01: And it's especially important for students that are multilingual learners.
• 1:00:29
  SPEAKER_01: And the reason for that is simply because if they've been
• 1:00:31
  SPEAKER_01: at home hearing one language and they come into school to And English is
• 1:00:36
  SPEAKER_01: the primary language.
• 1:00:38
  SPEAKER_01: What's called the phonemes, they just need more practice and things.
• 1:00:42
  SPEAKER_01: The third is we need to count poverty accurately.
• 1:00:45
  SPEAKER_01: And not to get into the weeds on this, but right now we're using an estimate.
• 1:00:50
  SPEAKER_01: Instead of real numbers.
• 1:00:51
  SPEAKER_01: And so like there are districts that are owed millions of dollars,
• 1:00:55
  SPEAKER_01: hundreds of millions of dollars because we're not actually counting the number
• 1:00:59
  SPEAKER_01: of students that are living in poverty.
• 1:01:01
  SPEAKER_01: And in our formula, you you get extra funds for that.
• 1:01:04
  SPEAKER_01: And that's actually something that the governor could do tomorrow if they wanted to.
• 1:01:08
  SPEAKER_01: It's not a legislative issue.
• 1:01:10
  SPEAKER_01: And so we're hoping that that will be taken up.
• 1:01:13
  SPEAKER_01: And the last is measure outcomes.
• 1:01:14
  SPEAKER_01: And this seems really obvious, but this gets back to what accountability means.
• 1:01:19
  SPEAKER_01: And measuring outcomes means that we are holding people accountable and we have
• 1:01:25
  SPEAKER_01: to have a measure.
• 1:01:26
  SPEAKER_01: And the reason for that is not to...
• 1:01:29
  SPEAKER_01: You know, punish students or teachers or anything.
• 1:01:32
  SPEAKER_01: It's to test the system.
• 1:01:34
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's how you create feedback loops so you can say, oh, what is working?
• 1:01:37
  SPEAKER_01: What's not working?
• 1:01:39
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, that district is really struggling.
• 1:01:41
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, maybe they need more coaches or maybe they need more high dosage tutoring
• 1:01:46
  SPEAKER_01: and things like that.
• 1:01:47
  SPEAKER_01: And so these five things together really it's this is a list, but it creates a virtuous circle.
• 1:01:55
  SPEAKER_03: Well.
• 1:01:58
  SPEAKER_03: Where I want to kind of my final questions and thoughts are,
• 1:02:02
  SPEAKER_03: I purposefully timed this episode to come out when school's starting.
• 1:02:07
  SPEAKER_03: One, because I felt like thematically it was clever.
• 1:02:11
  SPEAKER_03: The other reason is because I think People are thinking about this again right now, right?
• 1:02:15
  SPEAKER_03: Parents are just either this week or next week.
• 1:02:17
  SPEAKER_03: And by the time this episode airs, the kids will already all be back at school.
• 1:02:21
  SPEAKER_03: So this is top of mind for folks right now.
• 1:02:25
  SPEAKER_03: So if you're a parent or I mean,
• 1:02:27
  SPEAKER_03: any community member that just cares about our society and everything else.
• 1:02:30
  SPEAKER_03: But if you're a parent,
• 1:02:32
  SPEAKER_03: what are the action steps that you can take to make sure
• 1:02:35
  SPEAKER_03: that this issue is elevated,
• 1:02:36
  SPEAKER_03: that your child's well-being is really top of mind for the governor all
• 1:02:41
  SPEAKER_03: the way down?
• 1:02:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, thanks.
• 1:02:43
  SPEAKER_01: So I want to do a shout out also if you're a parent whose child is struggling to read.
• 1:02:49
  SPEAKER_01: We do have some resources on the web page.
• 1:02:52
  SPEAKER_01: And please feel free to email me if you find I am pencil.
• 1:02:56
  SPEAKER_01: So if you email me, I will connect you.
• 1:02:58
  SPEAKER_01: So that's the first thing because it's very lonely when your kid is struggling to read.
• 1:03:20
  SPEAKER_01: The first thing is find out who your rep is and email them,
• 1:03:23
  SPEAKER_01: especially if your rep is on the education committee.
• 1:03:26
  SPEAKER_01: That's, you know, even more important.
• 1:03:28
  SPEAKER_01: Bonus points.
• 1:03:28
  SPEAKER_01: Bonus points, right?
• 1:03:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:03:31
  SPEAKER_01: So your reps work for you.
• 1:03:33
  SPEAKER_01: They're also your neighbors.
• 1:03:34
  SPEAKER_01: I talk to my rep all the time.
• 1:03:35
  SPEAKER_01: He lives a couple blocks from me.
• 1:03:38
  SPEAKER_01: Who's your rep?
• 1:03:39
  SPEAKER_01: Rob knows.
• 1:03:40
  SPEAKER_01: Mine too?
• 1:03:41
  SPEAKER_01: And the thing is that it can feel weird,
• 1:03:44
  SPEAKER_01: but actually you have to remember that they actually do work for us, right?
• 1:03:50
  SPEAKER_01: Be nice to them,
• 1:03:51
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 1:03:51
  SPEAKER_01: but at the same time,
• 1:03:54
  SPEAKER_01: And that's literally what they went to public service to represent you.
• 1:03:59
  SPEAKER_01: They don't know how to represent you unless you tell them what we want.
• 1:04:01
  SPEAKER_01: And so they need to hear more from people that this is what we want.
• 1:04:05
  SPEAKER_01: And these are very specific things.
• 1:04:07
  SPEAKER_01: So that's the.
• 1:04:09
  SPEAKER_01: Sort of, you know, the two things, sign the petition and then do that.
• 1:04:13
  SPEAKER_01: And I would say if you do have networks of,
• 1:04:18
  SPEAKER_01: you know, parents or business people or what have you, just talk about the issue.
• 1:04:22
  SPEAKER_01: I know that sounds like, oh, does it?
• 1:04:24
  SPEAKER_01: No, no, it helps because- People have to have something on the radar, right?
• 1:04:41
  SPEAKER_01: We have to be honest about it.
• 1:04:43
  SPEAKER_01: We have to see that it is a systemic problem.
• 1:04:45
  SPEAKER_01: It's not kids, it's not teachers, it's not parents, but that it is fixable, right?
• 1:04:50
  SPEAKER_01: And that's going to come from changing a narrative that we have gotten into.
• 1:04:54
  SPEAKER_01: So yes, sign the petition, talk to your rep and talk about the issue.
• 1:05:00
  SPEAKER_03: Awesome.
• 1:05:00
  SPEAKER_03: Jay Schuberth,
• 1:05:01
  SPEAKER_03: I'm going to wrap the interview portion there,
• 1:05:04
  SPEAKER_03: but I did create a little game for us,
• 1:05:07
  SPEAKER_03: which was since you ran for governor as Pencil,
• 1:05:12
  SPEAKER_03: since Pencil ran for governor,
• 1:05:14
  SPEAKER_03: I should say, I'm wondering, let's imagine that just for a day, Pencil's governor.
• 1:05:20
  SPEAKER_03: So this is going to be an action-packed day.
• 1:05:22
  SPEAKER_03: You might not sleep.
• 1:05:24
  SPEAKER_03: Pencil might not go to bed that night.
• 1:05:26
  SPEAKER_01: Pencil actually can't close their eyes.
• 1:05:28
  SPEAKER_03: That's horrific.
• 1:05:31
  SPEAKER_03: So I'm going to give you some prompts and I just want you a quick, you know, one, two liners.
• 1:05:36
  SPEAKER_03: What are we going to do with the prompt?
• 1:05:38
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 1:05:38
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 1:05:39
  SPEAKER_03: All right.
• 1:05:40
  SPEAKER_03: There's no losing this game, but you might not win.
• 1:05:43
  SPEAKER_03: So we'll see.
• 1:05:43
  SPEAKER_03: We'll see how you do.
• 1:05:44
  SPEAKER_01: It's like politics.
• 1:05:46
  SPEAKER_03: All right.
• 1:05:47
  SPEAKER_03: So here we go.
• 1:05:48
  SPEAKER_03: Pencil is governor for a day.
• 1:05:51
  SPEAKER_03: First executive order that you write.
• 1:05:55
  SPEAKER_01: Wait, is this supposed to be funny or am I trying to educate people?
• 1:06:00
  SPEAKER_03: Well, choose your own adventure.
• 1:06:02
  SPEAKER_03: And if you can do both bonus points.
• 1:06:04
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 1:06:05
  SPEAKER_01: I would ban all of those pencil sharpeners that are the ones on the wall
• 1:06:09
  SPEAKER_01: that are like, look like- Barbaric.
• 1:06:12
  SPEAKER_01: Barbaric.
• 1:06:12
  SPEAKER_01: Like, yeah, not acceptable.
• 1:06:14
  SPEAKER_01: They are just horrible, horrible.
• 1:06:16
  SPEAKER_03: It's a little self-interested pencil.
• 1:06:18
  SPEAKER_03: Let's stick to the kids.
• 1:06:19
  SPEAKER_01: It is.
• 1:06:20
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, oh, right.
• 1:06:20
  SPEAKER_01: The kids, the kids.
• 1:06:21
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, focus.
• 1:06:23
  SPEAKER_01: On the kids level,
• 1:06:24
  SPEAKER_01: the first thing I would do is actually the- K-3 science of reading for all teachers
• 1:06:31
  SPEAKER_01: and principals because the change is going to have to happen, right?
• 1:06:34
  SPEAKER_01: The teachers are where change happens.
• 1:06:37
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's what I would do.
• 1:06:39
  SPEAKER_03: Perfect.
• 1:06:40
  SPEAKER_03: The first school you visit.
• 1:06:44
  SPEAKER_01: Corvallis' Lincoln Elementary.
• 1:06:46
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, why?
• 1:06:47
  SPEAKER_01: Because they're doing all the things that they should be.
• 1:06:51
  SPEAKER_01: They are an amazing model.
• 1:06:52
  SPEAKER_01: They changed their curriculum.
• 1:06:54
  SPEAKER_01: They trained all the teachers.
• 1:06:55
  SPEAKER_01: They have an amazing intervention system.
• 1:06:57
  SPEAKER_01: They're doing tutoring.
• 1:06:59
  SPEAKER_01: And so, yeah,
• 1:07:00
  SPEAKER_01: I think I would go there and I would bring a bunch of legislators and say,
• 1:07:03
  SPEAKER_01: you should look at this.
• 1:07:04
  SPEAKER_03: Shout out Corvallis.
• 1:07:05
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 1:07:06
  SPEAKER_03: Your first press conference.
• 1:07:08
  SPEAKER_03: What's the one liner that's going to run on the evening news?
• 1:07:11
  SPEAKER_01: We can fix this.
• 1:07:13
  SPEAKER_03: We can fix this.
• 1:07:14
  SPEAKER_03: Love it.
• 1:07:18
  SPEAKER_03: You can hire or fire one person.
• 1:07:21
  SPEAKER_03: Is there a magic maker out there that you would bring in or is there somebody who's
• 1:07:25
  SPEAKER_03: an impediment that needs to go?
• 1:07:27
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I'm in politics, so I'm not going to throw anybody under the bus.
• 1:07:29
  SPEAKER_01: Give me a break.
• 1:07:30
  SPEAKER_01: Nice try.
• 1:07:31
  SPEAKER_03: Fair play.
• 1:07:31
  SPEAKER_01: But I would bring in Dr. Carrie Wright.
• 1:07:34
  SPEAKER_01: And Dr. Carrie Wright was brought in in Mississippi and was part of the Mississippi change.
• 1:07:39
  SPEAKER_01: She's now working in Maryland and she's doing the same thing for them.
• 1:07:43
  SPEAKER_01: And she is just an extraordinary leader.
• 1:07:46
  SPEAKER_03: Awesome.
• 1:07:48
  SPEAKER_03: You get one photo op.
• 1:07:49
  SPEAKER_03: Who's in the photo?
• 1:07:50
  SPEAKER_03: Who's in the picture with you or where?
• 1:07:56
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I can't do a beaver or a duck because then I'm going to throw somebody under the bus.
• 1:07:59
  SPEAKER_01: See, politics is hard.
• 1:08:02
  SPEAKER_01: It's hard.
• 1:08:02
  SPEAKER_01: And then the Timbers guy, he chops wood, so that's scary.
• 1:08:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, for console.
• 1:08:07
  SPEAKER_01: You know, so maybe, you know what, it would be with the new sausage, the bangers.
• 1:08:13
  SPEAKER_01: The bangers.
• 1:08:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:08:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:08:15
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's who I would want to go.
• 1:08:17
  SPEAKER_01: And well, the pickles.
• 1:08:17
  SPEAKER_01: Can I do too?
• 1:08:18
  SPEAKER_01: Can I have the bangers and the pickles?
• 1:08:19
  SPEAKER_01: Of course.
• 1:08:19
  SPEAKER_01: Of course.
• 1:08:19
  SPEAKER_01: Bangers and the pickles.
• 1:08:20
  SPEAKER_03: Bangers and the pickles.
• 1:08:21
  SPEAKER_03: Love it.
• 1:08:22
  SPEAKER_03: I bet you we could make that happen.
• 1:08:24
  SPEAKER_03: What is on your governor's desk?
• 1:08:28
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I have a little sharpener, you know, because I got a-
• 1:08:31
  SPEAKER_03: Humane sharpener.
• 1:08:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:08:32
  SPEAKER_01: But I got to stay looking good for the cameras.
• 1:08:35
  SPEAKER_01: And then it is a picture of every,
• 1:08:40
  SPEAKER_01: I think I want a picture of kids from every school,
• 1:08:45
  SPEAKER_01: at least every district, because there's a lot of schools, 197 pictures.
• 1:08:49
  SPEAKER_01: They'd be very tiny pictures,
• 1:08:51
  SPEAKER_01: but I want them on my desk,
• 1:08:52
  SPEAKER_01: like a wall,
• 1:08:54
  SPEAKER_01: so that whenever I'm doing something,
• 1:08:56
  SPEAKER_01: I am accountable to all those little tiny faces.
• 1:08:59
  SPEAKER_03: I love it.
• 1:09:00
  SPEAKER_03: The clock's about to strike midnight.
• 1:09:02
  SPEAKER_03: You got five minutes left.
• 1:09:03
  SPEAKER_03: What's the last thing you do before the lights go out?
• 1:09:06
  SPEAKER_01: Wait, like the world's going to end?
• 1:09:08
  SPEAKER_03: The clock is at midnight.
• 1:09:10
  SPEAKER_03: Your day in office, your one 24 hours as governor is about to come to an end.
• 1:09:16
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I think I'd go give my human at home a kiss and say,
• 1:09:20
  SPEAKER_01: thank you so much for staying with me when I said I'm going to run
• 1:09:24
  SPEAKER_01: for governor dressed as a pencil.
• 1:09:27
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, God.
• 1:09:27
  SPEAKER_01: What a human.
• 1:09:28
  SPEAKER_03: Shout out to the humans, the ones who support us when we take these crazy endeavors on.
• 1:09:36
  SPEAKER_03: That's fantastic.
• 1:09:37
  SPEAKER_03: OK, closing closing prompt here.
• 1:09:42
  SPEAKER_03: So tomorrow you're a pencil again.
• 1:09:45
  SPEAKER_03: You're not the governor.
• 1:09:47
  SPEAKER_03: What's the one thing from today's list that you actually think is achievable for real?
• 1:09:52
  SPEAKER_03: Not necessarily as governor,
• 1:09:53
  SPEAKER_03: but what is what is the thing that we can achieve as a state of Oregon?
• 1:09:58
  SPEAKER_01: All of those things.
• 1:09:59
  SPEAKER_01: I know you said one thing, so you're trying to be practical.
• 1:10:01
  SPEAKER_01: But other states have done these things.
• 1:10:05
  SPEAKER_01: There's a lot of problems I don't know how to fix.
• 1:10:07
  SPEAKER_01: This is actually a pretty fixable problem, so I'm going to start there.
• 1:10:10
  SPEAKER_01: And then what I would say in the next legislative session,
• 1:10:12
  SPEAKER_01: just to get practical,
• 1:10:14
  SPEAKER_01: is literally those five things that are on that list,
• 1:10:16
  SPEAKER_01: we've been asking for those for years.
• 1:10:20
  SPEAKER_01: They're infinitely doable.
• 1:10:22
  SPEAKER_01: The money is there.
• 1:10:24
  SPEAKER_01: And for instance,
• 1:10:25
  SPEAKER_01: all that money that I showed that was other places,
• 1:10:27
  SPEAKER_01: including your friend doing things that don't help him.
• 1:10:30
  SPEAKER_01: Instead of that professional development, take that money and do good professional development.
• 1:10:34
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 1:10:34
  SPEAKER_01: And so I would say the top five things that we were talking about,
• 1:10:39
  SPEAKER_01: totally doable in the next legislative session.
• 1:10:41
  SPEAKER_03: Well, Jay Schuberth, let's get it done.
• 1:10:43
  SPEAKER_01: All right.
• 1:10:44
  SPEAKER_03: Thanks for being on the show.
• 1:10:45
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks so much, Mike.
• 1:10:45
  SPEAKER_03: And that's a wrap on today's conversation with Jay Schuberth,
• 1:10:48
  SPEAKER_03: pencil for governor and the person behind the pencil.
• 1:10:51
  SPEAKER_03: We covered a lot of ground,
• 1:10:53
  SPEAKER_03: how a joke among friends turned into a gubernatorial campaign,
• 1:10:56
  SPEAKER_03: what it's actually like knocking on doors and doing interviews in a pencil costume
• 1:11:00
  SPEAKER_03: for a race you're structurally barred from winning,
• 1:11:02
  SPEAKER_03: And why Oregon's 50th place ranking
• 1:11:04
  SPEAKER_03: in fourth grade reading might be telling only part of the story.
• 1:11:08
  SPEAKER_03: We dug into what Mississippi, Louisiana, and Tennessee actually did differently.
• 1:11:12
  SPEAKER_03: We walked through the Five Steps Forward pledge and what you can do to lend your voice.
• 1:11:17
  SPEAKER_03: And we ended with the question that matters most.
• 1:11:19
  SPEAKER_03: What does winning this campaign actually look like?
• 1:11:22
  SPEAKER_03: And hint, it's about the kids.
• 1:11:25
  SPEAKER_03: Whether you came into this episode thinking a pencil running for governor was
• 1:11:28
  SPEAKER_03: a stunt or a statement,
• 1:11:29
  SPEAKER_03: I hope you leave it thinking a little harder about what it says that it took
• 1:11:33
  SPEAKER_03: that campaign to get this conversation going.
• 1:11:36
  SPEAKER_03: Before you go, a huge thank you to our sponsor, Corbett Hill Wellness, for supporting this show.
• 1:11:41
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• 1:11:45
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• 1:11:48
  SPEAKER_03: If you liked what you heard,
• 1:11:49
  SPEAKER_03: please like and subscribe and head over to Substack to follow along for updates
• 1:11:53
  SPEAKER_03: and all the latest episodes.
• 1:11:55
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• 1:11:56
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• 1:12:01
  SPEAKER_03: Got an idea for a guest or a topic you think we should cover?
• 1:12:04
  SPEAKER_03: Reach out.
• 1:12:04
  SPEAKER_03: We're always listening.
• 1:12:06
  SPEAKER_03: That's it for this week.
• 1:12:07
  SPEAKER_03: We'll see you next time right here on Schmidt Show PDX.
• 1:12:10
  SPEAKER_03: If you're a pumpkin spice enthusiast, go get your latte.
• 1:12:14
  SPEAKER_03: And if you're not, well, hang in there.
• 1:12:16
  SPEAKER_03: It's only a couple months.
• 1:12:21
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• 1:12:23
  SPEAKER_03: Dr. Adam Moret at Corbett Hill Wellness Center, people I know and trust.
• 1:12:27
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• 1:12:29
  SPEAKER_02: People ask me, how do I know if I really need a chiropractor?
• 1:12:33
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• 1:12:35
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• 1:12:40
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• 1:12:41
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• 1:12:42
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• 1:12:49
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• 1:12:51
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• 1:12:53
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• 1:12:56
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