Latest / Pod Save America / “Honeymoon in Vegas.” (Debate recap special!)

Transcript

“Honeymoon in Vegas.” (Debate recap special!) · Pod Save America

0:20
Speaker 1: Welcome to Pod Save America, I'm Jon Favreau.
0:22
Speaker 2: I'm Jon Lovett.
0:22
Speaker 3: I'm Tommy Vitor.
0:23
Speaker 1: Later in the pod, you'll hear Tommy's conversation with Jessica Cisneros,
0:26
Speaker 1: a progressive candidate in Texas challenging incumbent congressman Henry Cuellar.
0:30
Speaker 1: Before that, we're going to dive deep into last night's
0:33
Speaker 1: Democratic presidential debate in Las Vegas, which was certainly the
0:37
Speaker 1: spiciest debate we've seen so far. Tommy, how was Pod
0:40
Speaker 1: Save the World? Let's start there.
0:41
Speaker 3: Hell of an episode.
0:42
Speaker 1: Hell of an episode.
0:43
Speaker 2: Timely.
0:44
Speaker 4: One of the big things we talked through was Mike
0:46
Speaker 4: Bloomberg's foreign policy record and platform. I don't think we
0:49
Speaker 4: haven't had a chance to talk about that much on
0:50
Speaker 4: Pod Save the World. I don't think he's gotten that
0:53
Speaker 4: hard of a scrubbing on these foreign policy views to date.
0:55
Speaker 1: Did you give him like an Elizabeth Warren scrubbing or a.
0:59
Speaker 3: You mean.
1:00
Speaker 2: To the bone?
1:01
Speaker 4: Yeah, that involves a baseball bat and brass knuckles. And
1:04
Speaker 4: we also talked about some of the other 2020 candidates,
1:07
Speaker 4: the situation in Syria, all kinds of good stuff.
1:09
Speaker 3: Excellent.
1:10
Speaker 2: Excellent.
1:11
Speaker 1: Also, we crossed the $ 200, 000 mark for our Leave It
1:14
Speaker 1: All on the Field Fund. This is almost halfway to
1:17
Speaker 1: our goal of $ 500, 000 to support Organizing Corps 2020, which
1:21
Speaker 1: is recruiting, training, and paying 1,000 organizers on the ground
1:24
Speaker 1: in key battleground states ahead of the general election. To
1:27
Speaker 1: help them make this happen and maybe sleep a little
1:30
Speaker 1: easier during the primary, donate at votesaveamerica.com slash field. Finally,
1:36
Speaker 1: we're going on tour. Come see Pod Save America and
1:39
Speaker 1: love it or leave it live in your town or
1:42
Speaker 1: near your town. We're not going to all the towns.
1:45
Speaker 2: Yeah, we can't go to all the towns. We're in
1:47
Speaker 2: spitting distance of most of you.
1:49
Speaker 1: Yeah. You can get tickets and see where we're heading
1:52
Speaker 1: at crooked.com slash events. Well... The Democratic candidates finally had
1:59
Speaker 1: a debate last night in Las Vegas. It was the
2:02
Speaker 1: first to include former New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg,
2:05
Speaker 1: and he probably left hoping it's the last. The debate
2:09
Speaker 1: also included Bernie Sanders, Pete Buttigieg, Elizabeth Warren, Joe Biden,
2:12
Speaker 1: and Amy Klobuchar, who went after each other and really
2:14
Speaker 1: went after Bloomberg. Last night, someone changed Bloomberg's Wikipedia page
2:18
Speaker 1: so that it said, cause of death, Elizabeth Warren.
2:21
Speaker 2: Oh, man.
2:22
Speaker 1: And here's why. This is a clip of Warren challenging
2:24
Speaker 1: him on whether he'd release former employees from nondisclosure agreements
2:28
Speaker 1: so that they could talk about their sexual harassment claims.
2:31
Speaker 5: Mr.
2:32
Speaker 6: Mayor, are you willing to release all of those women
2:35
Speaker 6: from those nondisclosure agreements so we can hear their side
2:38
Speaker 6: of the story?
2:46
Speaker 7: We have a very few non-disclosure agreements.
2:50
Speaker 1: How many is that?
2:51
Speaker 8: Let me finish.
2:52
Speaker 6: How many is that?
2:53
Speaker 7: None of them accuse me of doing anything other than
2:57
Speaker 7: maybe they didn't like the joke I told. And let
2:59
Speaker 7: me just put, and let me put, there's agreements between
3:03
Speaker 7: two parties that wanted to keep it quiet, and that's
3:06
Speaker 7: up to them. They sign those agreements, and we'll live
3:09
Speaker 7: with it.
3:09
Speaker 6: So wait, when you say it is up to, I
3:11
Speaker 6: just want to be clear. Some is how many? And
3:17
Speaker 6: when you say they signed them and they wanted them,
3:21
Speaker 6: if they wish now to speak out and tell their
3:24
Speaker 6: side of the story about what it is they allege,
3:27
Speaker 6: that's now okay with you? You're releasing them on television tonight?
3:30
Speaker 7: Senator, no.
3:31
Speaker 1: Is that right?
3:36
Speaker 7: Senator, the company and somebody else, in this case, a
3:39
Speaker 7: man or a woman, or it could be more than that,
3:42
Speaker 7: they decided when they made an agreement that they wanted
3:44
Speaker 7: to keep it quiet for everybody's interest. They signed the agreements,
3:48
Speaker 7: and that's what we're going to live with.
3:49
Speaker 5: I'm sorry.
3:50
Speaker 6: No, the question is, are the women bound by being
3:53
Speaker 6: muzzled by you? And you could release them from that immediately.
3:58
Speaker 6: Because understand, this is not just a question of the
4:02
Speaker 6: mayor's character. This is also a question about electability. We
4:07
Speaker 6: are not going to beat Donald Trump with a man
4:10
Speaker 6: who has who knows how many nondisclosure agreements and the drip, drip,
4:15
Speaker 6: drip of stories of women saying they have been harassed
4:20
Speaker 6: and discriminated against.
4:22
Speaker 1: So that went well. So I want to talk about
4:26
Speaker 1: the tour de force of a performance that Elizabeth Warren
4:29
Speaker 1: turned in here. But I just want to start since
4:31
Speaker 1: we've all seen debate preps unfold. Was Mike Bloomberg, did
4:36
Speaker 1: they not think that was coming? Did they not prepare
4:38
Speaker 1: for that? I can't imagine.
4:41
Speaker 4: I can't imagine hearing that answer in debate prep and saying, yeah, boss,
4:45
Speaker 4: that'll get us through this one. I mean, that was
4:47
Speaker 4: disastrous and it's not going away. The NDA question is
4:50
Speaker 4: going to come up in every interview and every debate.
4:52
Speaker 4: I mean, that's what happens when something like this gets
4:54
Speaker 4: introduced to the American people.
4:56
Speaker 3: On a big stage.
4:57
Speaker 4: I think You know, the story of this debate to
4:59
Speaker 4: me was Bernie had a good, not great debate, but
5:02
Speaker 4: he had the best night of anyone because he's winning
5:05
Speaker 4: and running away with it maybe, and everyone kicked the
5:07
Speaker 4: shit out of Mike Bloomberg, who's maybe his primary opponent.
5:10
Speaker 4: But I think it was probably a big mistake for
5:12
Speaker 4: Bloomberg to have entered this debate tonight. I mean, at
5:14
Speaker 4: some point he asked a debate, but this was pretty
5:17
Speaker 4: close to Super Tuesday when he needs to rack up
5:19
Speaker 4: a whole bunch of delegates to really get in the game,
5:21
Speaker 4: and he got pummeled. And so, like, you never know
5:24
Speaker 4: if the person... getting pummeled or the person doing the
5:27
Speaker 4: pummeling is going to get penalized by voters the most. But,
5:32
Speaker 4: you know, the narrative coming out of this thing was
5:34
Speaker 4: that he's terrible at debating.
5:36
Speaker 9: Yeah.
5:36
Speaker 10: I mean, look, you know, you've seen this over the
5:39
Speaker 10: course of the past couple of weeks as Bloomberg has
5:42
Speaker 10: risen in the polls and used his money to buy
5:45
Speaker 10: name ID and support. There are all these terrible clips
5:48
Speaker 10: of Mayor Bloomberg giving awful interviews. There's just tons of them.
5:51
Speaker 10: And and Sometimes it's the way he says something. Often
5:54
Speaker 10: it's his sort of like, I'm going to tell you
5:56
Speaker 10: what's really going on here, kids. And then he says
5:58
Speaker 10: something despicable as if he's the only one willing to
6:01
Speaker 10: tell the truth. And the truth is something everyone knows
6:03
Speaker 10: and it's not. But the thing that is important to
6:07
Speaker 10: me about the debate is unlike the rest of these
6:10
Speaker 10: people on this stage, because they don't have the resources
6:13
Speaker 10: he does. He didn't spend a year in Iowa talking
6:16
Speaker 10: to people, learning how to listen, learning what's on people's minds,
6:20
Speaker 10: learning the ways in which being a septuagenarian billionaire for
6:25
Speaker 10: 40 years has maybe made him out of touch.
6:27
Speaker 1: And so- Yeah, talk to the other two septuagenarians, you know?
6:29
Speaker 2: Yeah, right.
6:30
Speaker 1: Get some advice from them. Yeah, exactly.
6:33
Speaker 4: You get a lucky tie and you're fine.
6:36
Speaker 10: But so here he is on this stage, you know,
6:38
Speaker 10: his helicopter landing him right next to the stage so
6:40
Speaker 10: he can walk onto the stage for the first time
6:42
Speaker 10: exposed to the actual politics of the Democratic primary. And
6:45
Speaker 10: he's wholly unprepared because he is an untested candidate because
6:49
Speaker 10: throughout his career in politics, he's used his wealth- for
6:53
Speaker 10: often incredibly important and noble causes, but also to inoculate
6:57
Speaker 10: himself from ordinary day-to-day on the grounds, in the dirt
7:01
Speaker 10: with human beings politics.
7:02
Speaker 2: And it showed.
7:03
Speaker 10: And that's why, to me, all these questions about Bloomberg
7:06
Speaker 10: are really important. Whatever you think about Bloomberg, the most
7:09
Speaker 10: important thing in this primary is whoever our nominee is
7:12
Speaker 10: going to be, they need to be put through their
7:14
Speaker 10: fucking paces because we only get one shot to pick
7:17
Speaker 10: the person. And I don't want to learn how bad
7:19
Speaker 10: a candidate Michael Bloomberg is after he's the nominee.
7:22
Speaker 1: So, yeah, I mean, what it tells me about Bloomberg is, look,
7:25
Speaker 1: he hasn't inoculated himself from this kind of stuff through
7:27
Speaker 1: his whole life. He ran for mayor three times in
7:29
Speaker 1: New York City, so he's been in debates before. But
7:31
Speaker 1: it is a problem that he has that a lot
7:33
Speaker 1: of other candidates, some other candidates who've been in this
7:36
Speaker 1: race who haven't done well, who hadn't been in politics
7:39
Speaker 1: for a while and who hadn't had to compete in
7:41
Speaker 1: politics for a while have had, which is, you know,
7:44
Speaker 1: he probably hasn't done a debate in 10 years.
7:45
Speaker 10: But also, like, the point is that he almost lost
7:48
Speaker 10: in his reelection in New York, uh, despite having outspent
7:51
Speaker 10: that person 14 to 1, and it was a surprise,
7:54
Speaker 10: in part because he had used his resources to overcome
7:57
Speaker 10: his liabilities as a candidate.
7:58
Speaker 1: That's all. Yeah, no, he clearly does that. I'm just
8:00
Speaker 1: saying from a debate performance standpoint. And you saw this with, like,
8:04
Speaker 1: you know, I would say he's a completely different person
8:07
Speaker 1: in a million different ways, but, like, Deval Patrick was
8:09
Speaker 1: a very successful two-term governor of Massachusetts and then was
8:12
Speaker 1: totally lost in this race. Like, people who haven't been
8:16
Speaker 1: in politics for a while tend to have some real trouble.
8:19
Speaker 9: And.
8:20
Speaker 1: I will say, you know, Bloomberg has probably the best
8:22
Speaker 1: debate team that money can buy. And, you know, we
8:24
Speaker 1: all know Howard Wolfson. Tommy and I have been on
8:26
Speaker 1: the opposite sides of a campaign from him. You've been
8:28
Speaker 1: on his campaign. Kevin Cheeky is also very good. Like,
8:32
Speaker 1: it was not a... I do not think this is
8:33
Speaker 1: a problem of the debate team prepping Mike Bloomberg, which
8:36
Speaker 1: is a bigger issue for him. This is the candidate.
8:38
Speaker 1: This is sometimes you have a candidate and you can
8:40
Speaker 1: prep them all you want. You can spend all the
8:42
Speaker 1: money you want. And they don't want to listen. Yeah,
8:45
Speaker 1: but look.
8:45
Speaker 4: you can spend as much time in the gym as
8:47
Speaker 4: you want. When you play a game, it's a different thing.
8:49
Speaker 4: And he was not prepared for this game. And also
8:52
Speaker 4: that coincides with like a bacchanalia, like an orgy of
8:56
Speaker 4: opposition research. And this reminds me of like the early
8:58
Speaker 4: days when Sarah Palin was picked as vice president, when
9:02
Speaker 4: like the oppa was hiding in plain sight.
9:04
Speaker 3: Reporters were just Googling.
9:06
Speaker 4: And right now, journalists are just YouTubing Mike Bloomberg clips
9:10
Speaker 4: that were posted at the time from events that he
9:12
Speaker 4: did and finding like incredibly damaging commentary on fill in
9:17
Speaker 4: the blank, stop and frisk, dozens of other things. So
9:19
Speaker 4: he's going to be in the barrel for a long time.
9:22
Speaker 4: And now I think there's a pretty good chance that
9:24
Speaker 4: you can buy your way or spend your way out
9:27
Speaker 4: of that barrel, or at least most of the way
9:29
Speaker 4: out of it. That's just the reality of the, of
9:31
Speaker 4: the media today. A lot more people are going to
9:33
Speaker 4: see his ads or see his Facebook, you know, clips
9:36
Speaker 4: or whatever the fuck it is. Then there are going
9:38
Speaker 4: to read some deep investigative report in the Washington Post,
9:41
Speaker 4: but it's gonna make for an uncomfortable couple weeks.
9:44
Speaker 1: What I'm saying is, when you have a candidate who
9:46
Speaker 1: refuses to listen, grow, who is stubborn, that is maybe
9:51
Speaker 1: one of the more unsolvable problems that you have on
9:53
Speaker 1: a campaign. There's a lot of problems that can be
9:55
Speaker 1: solved by money, there's a lot of problems that can
9:57
Speaker 1: be solved by other staff, here and there, But if
10:00
Speaker 1: at the core of the campaign, there is a candidate
10:02
Speaker 1: who cannot learn and change and grow, which I would
10:06
Speaker 1: argue some of the other candidates on the stage have,
10:08
Speaker 1: and in past campaigns winning candidates do, you have a
10:13
Speaker 1: real problem. And to me, that was the biggest problem
10:14
Speaker 1: with Bloomberg last night. It's like, this guy is a
10:16
Speaker 1: 78-year-old billionaire who is set in his ways and no
10:20
Speaker 1: matter what you're going to.
10:21
Speaker 10: Do, you're not going to change that. And it's even
10:24
Speaker 10: in like, look, the answer is terrible. His answer on
10:26
Speaker 10: the end is absolutely terrible, but also his tone is terrible.
10:29
Speaker 1: I mean, well, that's right. It's sort of like a,
10:32
Speaker 1: why am I, why do I have to be here?
10:33
Speaker 10: It's like this, uh, like obvious that it's all perfunctory that,
10:36
Speaker 10: that he just needs to say, I've apologized for stop
10:39
Speaker 10: and frisk without accounting for the harm it did.
10:41
Speaker 9: Right.
10:41
Speaker 10: Like there's a study that shows that it affected the
10:45
Speaker 10: high school graduation rates. of kids affected by the policy.
10:49
Speaker 10: It is a deep and lasting pain caused by his
10:52
Speaker 10: decisions as mayor of New York. And you don't see
10:54
Speaker 10: in his answer that there's any sense of.
10:58
Speaker 2: Emotional... Yeah, it's bloodless. It's bloodless. It's bloodless. And the
11:01
Speaker 2: same thing applies to the NDAs and a bunch of
11:03
Speaker 2: his other answers.
11:04
Speaker 1: So we've said for a long time that Warren's strength
11:07
Speaker 1: in these debates, which has been incredible message discipline, has
11:11
Speaker 1: almost become a bit of a weakness now that she's
11:13
Speaker 1: fallen behind It certainly seemed last night like she threw
11:17
Speaker 1: out the playbook for this debate. And it could not
11:22
Speaker 1: have worked better. I mean, it was her best performance
11:25
Speaker 1: of the campaign. I think it was maybe the best
11:27
Speaker 1: debate performance of any debate in the entire primary campaign.
11:32
Speaker 1: What do you guys think it does? Because it's funny,
11:36
Speaker 1: I do agree with Tommy's point that it's hard to
11:38
Speaker 1: say that Elizabeth Warren had the best performance in the
11:40
Speaker 1: debate but that at this stage in the primary, Bernie
11:43
Speaker 1: probably won because he left largely unscathed. And I think,
11:48
Speaker 1: I don't mean to say that to be unfair to
11:49
Speaker 1: Warren because she fucking crushed it. And I think it
11:52
Speaker 1: helped her campaign a lot. Or it may help her
11:55
Speaker 1: campaign a lot, but I just, you know.
11:57
Speaker 2: I think it's a matter of time.
11:59
Speaker 10: I feel like, I think the way I had the
12:01
Speaker 10: same opinion, which is I think Elizabeth Warren won the debate.
12:04
Speaker 10: You know, I'm a gay person, but I do think
12:07
Speaker 10: I've discovered a new kink, which is, Elizabeth Warren doing
12:11
Speaker 10: to Mike Bloomberg what Netflix did to Blockbuster.
12:18
Speaker 1: Anyway, you get it. Go ahead. You have to explain it.
12:20
Speaker 2: I didn't have to explain it. I didn't have to
12:22
Speaker 2: explain it. I didn't explain anything. It's just out there now.
12:24
Speaker 3: You made Jordan cry.
12:25
Speaker 10: That joke was so bad. The reason I say it's
12:30
Speaker 10: a matter of time is that we are so close
12:33
Speaker 10: to Super Tuesday.
12:34
Speaker 2: You felt that on the stage.
12:36
Speaker 10: Even Bloomberg coming out of the box by saying that
12:38
Speaker 10: Bernie can't win and his campaign saying other candidates need
12:41
Speaker 10: to drop out, which is incredible hubris for someone who doesn't.
12:43
Speaker 2: Have a delegate.
12:44
Speaker 10: And you now have Warren, for the very first time,
12:46
Speaker 10: I think, deciding to go from a unity candidate who
12:51
Speaker 10: is above the fray and delivering her message to someone
12:53
Speaker 10: who's going to decide to own the debate stage by
12:55
Speaker 10: contrasting herself with every single person on that stage and
12:59
Speaker 10: having the incredible intelligence and deft touch and grasp of.
13:05
Speaker 10: Of debating to successfully do that, which is incredible, but
13:08
Speaker 10: you think, well, okay, so she's going to get another look,
13:11
Speaker 10: but here we are hurtling towards Super Tuesday, a national
13:14
Speaker 10: vote that depends on an incredible amount of ground game, organization, advertising,
13:18
Speaker 10: and set views about a big chunk of the party,
13:20
Speaker 10: and you just wonder if there's enough time for that
13:22
Speaker 10: to make a difference.
13:23
Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't think Super Tuesday requires organizing basically anywhere.
13:27
Speaker 4: I think it's all momentum, and I think that this
13:29
Speaker 4: might be too little too late. I mean, she raised
13:32
Speaker 4: a bunch of money here, and she... You know, this
13:34
Speaker 4: was a new approach, but she went from like Wine
13:37
Speaker 4: Cave to Unity to I'm bringing a baseball bat to
13:40
Speaker 4: my podium and I'm going to beat the fuck out
13:42
Speaker 4: of Mike Bloomberg.
13:43
Speaker 3: But the problem.
13:43
Speaker 4: Was her opening anecdote was you're a billionaire who calls
13:47
Speaker 4: women fat broads and horse-faced lesbians, which was about the
13:50
Speaker 4: most brutal attack or opening shot I've ever seen in
13:54
Speaker 4: a debate. But again, everyone is losing to Bernie Sanders.
13:58
Speaker 4: And she was one of the, you know, everyone on
14:01
Speaker 4: stage was turning their fire on Mike Bloomberg. She did
14:03
Speaker 4: come back around during a health care discussion when she
14:07
Speaker 4: criticized Amy Klobuchar and Mayor Pete's plan. And in that,
14:11
Speaker 4: she had a hit on Bernie where she said Bernie's
14:13
Speaker 4: campaign relentlessly attacks anyone that asks a question about his
14:17
Speaker 4: health care campaign. But, you know, I don't know that
14:20
Speaker 4: that's really going to do any damage.
14:23
Speaker 1: And we'll get to that in a clip a little
14:25
Speaker 1: bit later, but I would say that Warren, obliquely, Pete,
14:29
Speaker 1: and then Bloomberg did challenge Bernie here. But of course,
14:32
Speaker 1: the story out of the debate, as we're all talking about,
14:34
Speaker 1: is the hits on Bloomberg, because I think that is
14:37
Speaker 1: deeply satisfying to a lot of us who follow politics
14:40
Speaker 1: very closely. And I think the question is, did the
14:43
Speaker 1: rest of the viewers in the country who saw that debate,
14:46
Speaker 1: were they as satisfied as some of us by watching
14:48
Speaker 1: those hits? But let's, you know, we have a couple
14:51
Speaker 1: other clips to do here. So yeah, so like we
14:52
Speaker 1: were saying, most candidates, except for those three that I mentioned,
14:55
Speaker 1: sort of shied away from attacking the Democratic frontrunner, Bernie Sanders.
14:59
Speaker 1: But at one point, Bloomberg tried to make an electability
15:03
Speaker 1: case for himself and attacked Sanders in the process. The
15:07
Speaker 1: moderators then asked Bernie about whether the socialist label will
15:09
Speaker 1: scare voters away in the general election, and Bernie pushed
15:12
Speaker 1: back pretty hard.
15:12
Speaker 3: Let's listen.
15:13
Speaker 7: I don't think there's any chance of the senator beating
15:16
Speaker 7: President Trump. You don't start out by saying, I've got
15:20
Speaker 7: 160 million people. I'm going to take away the insurance
15:24
Speaker 7: plan that they love. That's just not a ways that
15:27
Speaker 7: you go and start building the coalition that the Sanders
15:32
Speaker 7: camp thinks that they can do. I don't think there's
15:35
Speaker 7: any chance whatsoever. And if he goes and is the candidate,
15:39
Speaker 7: we will have Donald Trump for another four years, and
15:43
Speaker 7: we can't stand that.
15:45
Speaker 11: Senator Sanders, our latest NBC News Wall Street Journal poll
15:47
Speaker 11: released yesterday, two-thirds of all voters said they were uncomfortable
15:52
Speaker 11: with a socialist candidate for president. What do you say
15:55
Speaker 11: to those voters, sir? What was the result of that poll?
15:59
Speaker 2: Who was winning?
16:02
Speaker 11: Questions to you.
16:04
Speaker 9: Well, the question was that I was winning, and I
16:05
Speaker 9: think by a fairly comfortable margin.
16:07
Speaker 1: I might mention that.
16:08
Speaker 9: But here is the point. Let's talk about democratic socialism,
16:12
Speaker 9: not communism, Mr.
16:13
Speaker 12: Bloomberg.
16:13
Speaker 3: That's a cheap shot.
16:15
Speaker 2: Let's talk about democracy.
16:16
Speaker 9: Let's talk about what goes on in countries like Denmark,
16:19
Speaker 9: where Pete correctly pointed out they have a much higher
16:22
Speaker 9: quality of life in many respects than we do.
16:24
Speaker 1: What are we talking about?
16:25
Speaker 9: We are living in many ways in a socialist society
16:29
Speaker 9: right now.
16:30
Speaker 1: Problem is, as Dr.
16:31
Speaker 9: Martin Luther King reminded us, we have socialism for the
16:34
Speaker 9: very rich, rugged individualism for the poor. Let me finish.
16:41
Speaker 9: When Donald Trump gets $ 800 million in tax breaks and
16:47
Speaker 9: subsidies to build luxury condominiums, that's socialism.
16:52
Speaker 2: For the rich.
16:53
Speaker 9: When Walmart, we have to subsidize Walmart's workers who are
16:58
Speaker 9: on Medicaid and food stamps because the wealthiest family in
17:02
Speaker 9: America pays starvation wages, that's socialism for the rich.
17:07
Speaker 1: This is I believe in.
17:09
Speaker 9: Democratic socialism for working people, not billionaires, health care for all,
17:15
Speaker 9: educational opportunity for all, creating a government that works for all,
17:21
Speaker 9: not just for Bloomberg.
17:22
Speaker 7: What a wonderful country we have. The best-known socialist in
17:24
Speaker 7: the country happens to be a millionaire with three houses.
17:27
Speaker 7: What did I miss here?
17:28
Speaker 1: It was probably one of Bloomberg's best lines, I think.
17:32
Speaker 2: I guess, yeah.
17:34
Speaker 1: Also, I just have to say about that answer for Bernie, like,
17:37
Speaker 1: I pray that is not the answer he gives in
17:39
Speaker 1: a general election about fucking democratic socialism. Because, like... That
17:43
Speaker 1: sounds too theoretical to me. Like, comparing it to... Let
17:47
Speaker 1: me tell you about Denmark. Denmark's a great country. Like,
17:50
Speaker 1: he can easily root this in his theory of the
17:54
Speaker 1: case and his politics and his ideology is far more
17:57
Speaker 1: American than Donald Trump. And it is rooted in the America...
18:02
Speaker 1: I mean, he's talked about this before. FDR's New Deal,
18:04
Speaker 1: Lyndon Johnson's Great Society. He can draw... comparisons to Barack Obama, whatever.
18:08
Speaker 1: Like it's American to make sure that everyone's taken care
18:11
Speaker 1: of it. You know, like just saying democratic socialism over
18:14
Speaker 1: and over again is not going to expand your coalition.
18:18
Speaker 1: And I think he has a really good case to make.
18:20
Speaker 1: I've heard him make it before, but like getting caught
18:22
Speaker 1: in the definition of socialism over and over again is just,
18:26
Speaker 1: it worries me.
18:27
Speaker 9: Yeah.
18:27
Speaker 10: I see it a little bit differently. I guess I
18:29
Speaker 10: agree in terms of just the exact word choices. I
18:31
Speaker 10: don't think it's the going to Denmark. I do think
18:34
Speaker 10: he's going to have to There's going to be a
18:35
Speaker 10: debate where basically if Bernie Sanders is the nominee, there's
18:39
Speaker 10: going to be an incredible effort to paint Bernie Sanders
18:42
Speaker 10: as the equivalent of what's happening in Venezuela or Cuba
18:45
Speaker 10: or elsewhere.
18:45
Speaker 2: And there's going to be.
18:46
Speaker 10: An effort on the part of those who are democratic
18:48
Speaker 10: socialists or like us who want, who will be desperately
18:51
Speaker 10: trying to help the democratic socialists win to say, hold
18:53
Speaker 10: on a second, we're talking about the democratic socialism of Scandinavia.
18:56
Speaker 2: We're talking about the democratic.
18:57
Speaker 1: Socialism of Europe. I think you have to fit it
18:58
Speaker 1: squarely in the American tradition.
18:59
Speaker 2: No, no, I agree.
19:00
Speaker 10: So what I'm just saying, I'm getting it. I think
19:02
Speaker 10: that the argument he's making is correct. It is the
19:04
Speaker 10: good argument. I think it's about the words he's using. Like,
19:06
Speaker 10: I think there's a way to basically say exactly what
19:08
Speaker 10: he's saying, that currently we have a government that doles
19:11
Speaker 10: things out for the rich and we need to take
19:12
Speaker 10: care of people.
19:13
Speaker 6: Right.
19:14
Speaker 1: Yes, of course. That's much better than what he says.
19:16
Speaker 2: Of course, of course. I think it's just the argument
19:19
Speaker 2: he's making is the argument.
19:21
Speaker 10: I think it's just a matter of How do you
19:23
Speaker 10: frame it in a way that's going to make as
19:24
Speaker 10: many people susceptible to it as possible?
19:26
Speaker 1: Go ahead, Tom.
19:27
Speaker 2: I know.
19:28
Speaker 3: I just worry we're all whistling past the graveyard here.
19:31
Speaker 4: And it's real fucking easy to run a nationalist, jingoistic
19:35
Speaker 4: campaign where you scare people.
19:37
Speaker 3: And if your defense is correcting.
19:39
Speaker 4: People who say you're a socialist and you say democratic socialist,
19:42
Speaker 4: I think you're starting off on a defensive foot and
19:45
Speaker 4: going down a very confusing theoretical road to explain your
19:48
Speaker 4: theory of the case when you're going to see a
19:51
Speaker 4: a smear mongering, like nasty negative campaign that's like, oh,
19:56
Speaker 4: Bernie's a communist. Here he is in the Soviet Union
19:58
Speaker 4: conflating all these things in a totally unfair way. And
20:01
Speaker 4: they they need to be ready for that with an answer,
20:04
Speaker 4: not this high minded conversation we're having, not the high
20:07
Speaker 4: minded conversation on a democratic debate. They need to be
20:09
Speaker 4: ready for the nastiest shit possible.
20:11
Speaker 3: And like, there are some people who say, oh, they're
20:12
Speaker 3: going to call everyone a socialist.
20:14
Speaker 4: So it doesn't matter. That's such bullshit. I'm so sick
20:16
Speaker 4: of hearing that. It absolutely matters how you define yourself
20:20
Speaker 4: in an election and suggesting otherwise is naive to the
20:23
Speaker 4: point of absurdity.
20:24
Speaker 1: Yeah. And I think it's like, it's so easy to
20:26
Speaker 1: just say like, This is not a campaign about labels
20:31
Speaker 1: or ideology. This is what I believe, and this is
20:33
Speaker 1: what Donald Trump believes, and just move on. Go back
20:36
Speaker 1: and read Bernie's speech about democratic socialism earlier in the campaign.
20:39
Speaker 1: It's my favorite speech he's given in the campaign, minus
20:43
Speaker 1: all the parts where he uses the phrase democratic socialism
20:45
Speaker 1: because you could have removed them from the speech, and
20:47
Speaker 1: it would have been a speech about how Bernie is
20:49
Speaker 1: right in line with everything that FDR proposed and is
20:52
Speaker 1: actually finishing the job that FDR and the Democratic Party
20:55
Speaker 1: once started. It's a great speech, except for all the
20:57
Speaker 1: parts about democratic socialism. So there was one other pretty
21:02
Speaker 1: odd exchange between Bernie and Bloomberg over transparency that we
21:06
Speaker 1: just have to play, so take a listen.
21:07
Speaker 9: And I think the one area maybe that Mayor Bloomberg
21:10
Speaker 9: and I share, you have two stents as well.
21:13
Speaker 1: 25 years ago. Well, we both have two stents.
21:16
Speaker 9: It's a procedure that it's done about a million times
21:19
Speaker 9: a year.
21:20
Speaker 1: Just a couple of Democratic frontrunners pushing 80, arguing over
21:22
Speaker 1: their stents, huh?
21:24
Speaker 10: It's the most old New York Jew thing that's ever
21:26
Speaker 10: happened in the history of American politics. Two septuagenarian Jews
21:30
Speaker 10: comparing their heart procedures.
21:31
Speaker 2: It is glorious.
21:33
Speaker 10: The way in which New York culture has taken over
21:37
Speaker 10: American politics is extraordinary.
21:39
Speaker 2: I don't know how to deal with it. I just...
21:41
Speaker 2: The Donald Trump.
21:43
Speaker 10: racist small business owner from the outer boroughs archetype, the
21:47
Speaker 10: buttoned up business Jew and the hippie dippy Takuna alum Jew.
21:51
Speaker 10: Like it is incredible. I feel like I'm watching my, my,
21:54
Speaker 10: my childhood on stage and that's all I have to
21:57
Speaker 10: say about it.
21:58
Speaker 1: Elizabeth Warren should have jumped in and said, did someone
22:00
Speaker 1: say two cents? Let me talk about my wealth tax.
22:04
Speaker 2: That's great. I can't believe you say that. It wasn't
22:07
Speaker 2: in the group thread. Just dropping it here.
22:09
Speaker 1: She could have, she could have just taken it over.
22:11
Speaker 2: Yeah.
22:12
Speaker 1: I have to hand it to Bernie for doing that
22:14
Speaker 1: because basically he's like, I'm not going to hide the
22:15
Speaker 1: fact that I had a heart attack a while back
22:18
Speaker 1: and have two stents. I'm just going to drag Bloomberg
22:20
Speaker 1: down with me.
22:20
Speaker 4: Well, certainly better than his spokesperson just alleging that Bloomberg
22:24
Speaker 4: had had two heart attacks on television earlier in the day.
22:27
Speaker 10: It is amazing, though, too, because it's like, hey, here's
22:29
Speaker 10: the situation, folks. They're all really old people. And they've
22:34
Speaker 10: all had health problems. And if you only care about.
22:36
Speaker 1: Well, they're all. I mean, no. The three of them
22:38
Speaker 1: that are talked to as the frontrunners are old. Elizabeth
22:41
Speaker 1: Warren is 70, but she seems like 40 on that
22:43
Speaker 1: stage compared to the rest of them.
22:44
Speaker 2: Yeah, she's the millennial of the group.
22:46
Speaker 3: Yeah, right.
22:47
Speaker 10: I think she's a couple years younger than Pete. But yeah,
22:51
Speaker 10: they're all old. It is amazing to watch the debate.
22:54
Speaker 10: People who only care about the agedness of the candidates
22:56
Speaker 10: they don't like, I find very frustrating on Twitter.
22:58
Speaker 2: It's like, look.
22:59
Speaker 10: Their birth certificates are their health records and they have
23:02
Speaker 10: a number on them and it is a ticking time bomb.
23:05
Speaker 1: That's all.
23:05
Speaker 3: I just want to say, I hope Democrats don't get
23:08
Speaker 3: bogged down in this. Like, you know what?
23:09
Speaker 4: Donald Trump has completely changed what is allowable in terms
23:13
Speaker 4: of what you should disclose about your health record. So
23:15
Speaker 4: as long as you make it to the finish line,
23:16
Speaker 4: I no longer give a shit about what these Democrats release.
23:19
Speaker 4: I also thought it was very funny when Bernie was like, like,
23:23
Speaker 4: It's like, follow me around the campaign trail.
23:24
Speaker 1: See how you're doing. Very funny.
23:27
Speaker 3: He is very good at attacking the moderator and make
23:30
Speaker 3: you laugh.
23:30
Speaker 10: And also just worth remembering that Donald Trump is a
23:32
Speaker 10: couple years younger, but his blood is basically horsey sauce.
23:34
Speaker 2: So it's like, let's just.
23:36
Speaker 1: Keep our eyes on the prize. So another candidate who
23:38
Speaker 1: targeted Bloomberg was Joe Biden. And it's not surprising that
23:41
Speaker 1: his target was Bloomberg's newfound admiration for Barack Obama. Let's
23:44
Speaker 1: play the clip.
23:45
Speaker 13: I'm the only one on this stage that's actually got
23:47
Speaker 13: anything done on health care. I'm the guy the president
23:51
Speaker 13: turned to and said, go get the votes for Obamacare.
23:54
Speaker 13: And I noticed what everybody's talking about is the plan
23:57
Speaker 13: that I first introduced. That is to go and add
24:00
Speaker 13: to Obamacare, provide a public option, a Medicare-like option. It
24:04
Speaker 13: costs to increase the subsidies. It costs a lot of money.
24:07
Speaker 13: It costs $ 750 billion over 10 years. But I pay
24:11
Speaker 13: for it by making sure that Mike and other people
24:14
Speaker 13: pay at the same tax rate their secretary pays at.
24:17
Speaker 13: That's how we get it paid, number one. Number two,
24:20
Speaker 13: you know, from the moment we pass that signature legislation,
24:25
Speaker 13: Mike called it a disgrace.
24:26
Speaker 9: So.
24:27
Speaker 1: What's the truth about Bloomberg's position on the Affordable Care
24:29
Speaker 1: Act there?
24:31
Speaker 10: We were talking about this yesterday, that Mike Bloomberg has
24:34
Speaker 10: had a very Morning Joe-like relationship to Obamacare.
24:37
Speaker 1: It was the Acela Corridor position.
24:39
Speaker 2: On the Affordable Care Act. He was in favor of it.
24:43
Speaker 10: Spoke in favor of it when it was unpopular he
24:46
Speaker 10: decried it and thought it was a huge disaster and
24:48
Speaker 10: now that it's once again popular he's back.
24:50
Speaker 1: It's his plan and now his plan is a public
24:52
Speaker 1: option which his campaign also said he was originally thought
24:54
Speaker 1: it didn't go far enough and liked the public option
24:56
Speaker 1: back in 2009 which then they couldn't really provide any
24:58
Speaker 1: actual evidence of that so let's talk about joe biden
25:02
Speaker 1: what how do you guys think joe biden did last
25:04
Speaker 1: night generally he.
25:06
Speaker 4: Goes back to this, I'm the only one formulation a lot.
25:09
Speaker 4: I'm the only one that's actually gotten healthcare passed. I'm
25:11
Speaker 4: the only one that spent time with the president of
25:13
Speaker 4: Mexico and the one before that and the one before that.
25:16
Speaker 4: And it's true in some instances, it speaks to his experience,
25:20
Speaker 4: but it also sounds a little bit like he's shouting
25:23
Speaker 4: at you in a defensive manner. And I can't tell
25:26
Speaker 4: how it plays. Like maybe it, maybe for some people
25:29
Speaker 4: he's like, oh yeah, that is.
25:30
Speaker 3: That's true.
25:31
Speaker 4: Joe is the only one with experience on that stage.
25:33
Speaker 4: He's tested, he's ready on day one, et cetera, et cetera. But,
25:35
Speaker 4: I just can't tell how that plays at this point.
25:37
Speaker 10: It's got a real like Sunset Boulevard vibe in that
25:40
Speaker 10: it's like, I am big. It's the debates that got small.
25:44
Speaker 2: I'm ready. I'm ready, Mr.
25:46
Speaker 1: Todd.
25:47
Speaker 2: Zoom in, Mr.
25:48
Speaker 1: Todd.
25:48
Speaker 2: I have to go bury my monkey.
25:51
Speaker 3: Hope y'all caught that movie.
25:56
Speaker 1: Joe Biden did.
25:57
Speaker 2: Yeah, Joe Biden's at the premiere.
25:59
Speaker 1: Mike Bloomberg and Bernie Sanders did. They were all there.
26:01
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is a debate.
26:02
Speaker 10: This is a good, yeah, this is great for the
26:03
Speaker 10: debate participating audience. But I just think from the very beginning,
26:08
Speaker 10: even when the very first clip of Warren dipping Mike
26:12
Speaker 10: Bloomberg's bones in line, there's an aged grunt coming from
26:15
Speaker 10: the side and it's Biden ready to cut in.
26:17
Speaker 2: And I think that's how it felt throughout the debate.
26:19
Speaker 10: It felt like a candidate who is watching the real
26:22
Speaker 10: core of the debate and moving around him and trying
26:24
Speaker 10: to bring it back to him at the center. And
26:27
Speaker 10: he struggles to do it. And he struggles to do it.
26:29
Speaker 10: I do think this was his best night. And I
26:31
Speaker 10: saw a lot of people noting that. I actually agree.
26:33
Speaker 10: I thought he was stronger in this debate than he
26:35
Speaker 10: has been throughout the entire campaign. That said, at his strongest,
26:39
Speaker 10: I do not believe he is. If this was the
26:41
Speaker 10: first Joe Biden we had seen, I think we'd be
26:43
Speaker 10: criticizing some of his answers as being hard to follow,
26:46
Speaker 10: while some of them I thought were his best answers
26:47
Speaker 10: he's given to date. So I think all of his
26:49
Speaker 10: liabilities and strengths were on display as they have been
26:53
Speaker 10: for the past year, and it's led him to the
26:55
Speaker 10: exact position he's in.
26:56
Speaker 1: I thought that we've criticized him before for not having
26:59
Speaker 1: a lot of energy at these debates, and he had
27:01
Speaker 1: plenty of energy. So he absolutely brought the energy. Joe
27:04
Speaker 1: took an Adderall. He was good.
27:05
Speaker 11: Yeah, right.
27:06
Speaker 1: I think what he brought in energy, he sort of
27:07
Speaker 1: lacked in precision. And I don't mean precision in his
27:10
Speaker 1: answers themselves, which you're right. I think many of them
27:12
Speaker 1: were quite good. It seemed like of all the candidates,
27:15
Speaker 1: he didn't quite have a strategy. Like, I didn't know
27:18
Speaker 1: what his, the story he was trying to tell, how
27:21
Speaker 1: he was trying to position himself. what kind of candidate
27:23
Speaker 1: he was supposed to be. Out of the gate, it
27:25
Speaker 1: was electability, right?
27:26
Speaker 4: Because his first thing was, like, he started shouting at
27:29
Speaker 4: the moderators because he was winning in the NBC poll,
27:31
Speaker 4: and they hadn't mentioned that yet.
27:33
Speaker 3: Which was, you know, smart.
27:34
Speaker 1: It's good to put out there. Both Bernie and Biden
27:36
Speaker 1: have the, like, yelling at the TV about the polls
27:39
Speaker 1: kind of thing, you know?
27:40
Speaker 10: I saw, this was a debate, it's funny, it was
27:42
Speaker 10: an incredibly messy debate, it was an incredibly angry debate,
27:46
Speaker 10: and yet I think we all came away with it
27:47
Speaker 10: feeling kind of oddly giddy in part because it was
27:50
Speaker 10: letting off a lot of steam that we've been wanting
27:52
Speaker 10: to let off. But despite its messiness, I think everyone
27:55
Speaker 10: kind of collectively realized that the conclusions were relatively obvious, right?
27:59
Speaker 10: That like Bernie had a good night because he's the
28:01
Speaker 10: front runner and really nobody laid a hand on him.
28:03
Speaker 10: Warren eviscerates Bloomberg and Pete and Klobuchar didn't like each
28:07
Speaker 10: other very much.
28:08
Speaker 2: I will get to it.
28:09
Speaker 10: But what I'm saying is that inside of that grand
28:10
Speaker 10: summary of what happened, there's very little to say about
28:12
Speaker 10: what Biden's role in the debate was.
28:14
Speaker 1: No, I think that's the tough thing. And look, if
28:17
Speaker 1: this was Five or six debates ago, you'd say, who cares?
28:20
Speaker 1: Joe Biden brought a lot of energy. He's the front
28:21
Speaker 1: runner in the polls.
28:22
Speaker 2: Great.
28:23
Speaker 1: Now, what he needs right now is a strong second
28:26
Speaker 1: in Nevada, and he needs to win South Carolina or else,
28:29
Speaker 1: you know, I don't think he continues.
28:30
Speaker 10: It's really interesting because we talked about this before the
28:32
Speaker 10: last debate. We thought, all right, here we go. The
28:34
Speaker 10: sparks are going to fly. And honestly, they should have.
28:37
Speaker 10: This debate should have been the last debate. So there
28:40
Speaker 10: was time for this to unfurl over the couple of weeks.
28:42
Speaker 10: But it took somehow, for whatever reason, like a sitcom–
28:45
Speaker 10: in its later years, trying to inject some new life
28:47
Speaker 10: into the stories. They needed a new character like Bloomberg
28:49
Speaker 10: to come on to make it exciting again. And I
28:52
Speaker 10: think that that was a shame.
28:55
Speaker 1: All right. Let's talk about one of our favorite subplots
29:06
Speaker 1: of the night, the blossoming friendship between Amy Klobuchar and
29:08
Speaker 1: Pete Buttigieg.
29:10
Speaker 2: Will they or won't they?
29:13
Speaker 1: It started when Klobuchar was asked a question about her
29:15
Speaker 1: failure to remember the president of Mexico in a recent
29:17
Speaker 1: interview and got even more heated when the two of
29:19
Speaker 1: them talked about her votes to confirm Trump's judicial nominees
29:22
Speaker 1: and for positions at places like Customs and Border Protection.
29:25
Speaker 1: Let's listen to both of those moments.
29:28
Speaker 8: I wouldn't liken this to trivia. I actually didn't know
29:30
Speaker 8: how many members were in the Knesset, so you got
29:32
Speaker 8: me there.
29:32
Speaker 2: Well, there you go.
29:33
Speaker 8: But you're staking your candidacy on your Washington experience. You're
29:37
Speaker 8: on the committee that oversees border security. You're on the
29:41
Speaker 8: committee that does trade. You're literally part of the committee
29:45
Speaker 8: that's overseeing these things. And we're not able to speak
29:48
Speaker 8: to literally the first thing about the politics of the.
29:51
Speaker 5: Country to ourself.
29:52
Speaker 12: Are you trying to say that I'm dumb, or are
29:54
Speaker 12: you mocking me here, Pete?
29:56
Speaker 2: I'm saying that you shouldn't trivialize that knowledge. I made
29:57
Speaker 2: an error.
29:58
Speaker 12: People sometimes forget names.
30:01
Speaker 8: You voted to confirm the head of Customs and Border
30:04
Speaker 8: Protection under Trump, who is one of the architects of
30:07
Speaker 8: the family separation policy. You voted to make English the
30:11
Speaker 8: national language. Do you know the message that sends in
30:14
Speaker 8: as multilingual a state as Nevada to immigrants? You have
30:18
Speaker 8: been unusual among Democrats. I think the Democrat among all
30:22
Speaker 8: of the senators running for president. most likely to vote
30:25
Speaker 8: for Donald Trump's judges, who we know are especially hostile
30:29
Speaker 8: to DREAMers and to the rights of immigrants. Now, in
30:32
Speaker 8: South Bend, it was not always easy to stand up
30:35
Speaker 8: in a conservative place like Indiana on immigration, but we delivered.
30:39
Speaker 8: We created a municipal ID program so that DREAMers and
30:42
Speaker 8: others who were undocumented were able to navigate everyday life.
30:46
Speaker 8: We stood up for those rights and stood with members
30:48
Speaker 8: of our community with the message that they were as
30:50
Speaker 8: American as we are. Thank you. I wish everyone was
30:54
Speaker 8: as perfect as.
30:54
Speaker 13: You, Pete, but let me tell you what it's like.
31:03
Speaker 12: To be in the arena. Number one, do the math.
31:06
Speaker 12: If my friend Andrew Yang was up here, that's what
31:09
Speaker 12: he'd say. In fact, I have opposed and not supported
31:13
Speaker 12: two-thirds of the Trump judges, so get your numbers right.
31:17
Speaker 12: And I am in the top 10 to 15 of
31:19
Speaker 12: opposing them. Number two, when it comes to immigration reform,
31:24
Speaker 12: the things that you are referring to, that official that
31:27
Speaker 12: you are referring to was supported by about half the Democrats,
31:31
Speaker 12: including someone in this room.
31:33
Speaker 1: So I would watch a dark comedy about the two
31:37
Speaker 1: of them being forced to run on a ticket together.
31:40
Speaker 10: What do you mean we inherited the mansion together, the
31:42
Speaker 10: old mansion that needs to be fixed up so we
31:44
Speaker 10: can sell it?
31:46
Speaker 4: The are you saying I'm dumb response sent a chill
31:50
Speaker 4: down my spine because it was so clearly not what
31:52
Speaker 4: he was saying.
31:53
Speaker 3: And it so scared me about what was coming next.
31:55
Speaker 4: I mean, I think Klobuchar, look, Klobuchar had an incredible
31:57
Speaker 4: debate in New Hampshire, and she set a very high
31:59
Speaker 4: bar for herself. But I also think that she had
32:01
Speaker 4: a pretty rough night. She got hammered by Warren on
32:04
Speaker 4: health care. She got hammered by Pete on this immigration exchange.
32:07
Speaker 4: She got asked about her record, sending this teenager to
32:11
Speaker 4: life in prison. And I don't think that answered the
32:14
Speaker 4: mail on the broader question.
32:16
Speaker 1: I mean, this was tough. Can't we all be as
32:18
Speaker 1: perfect as you, Pete? That is a line that I
32:22
Speaker 1: am sure a lot of people following the debate online
32:26
Speaker 1: who don't care that much for Pete Buttigieg probably liked
32:29
Speaker 1: very much. I do not think that helped Amy Klobuchar
32:31
Speaker 1: all that much. I mean, I think what happened here
32:34
Speaker 1: is Amy Klobuchar, because she's sort of been under the radar,
32:37
Speaker 1: has not really had to defend her record at all
32:40
Speaker 1: in these debates. She's been the aggressor. And I think
32:43
Speaker 1: she had the best debate of anyone in New Hampshire
32:45
Speaker 1: in the last debate that was sort of slower. I
32:47
Speaker 1: think in this debate, she was on the defensive and
32:50
Speaker 1: as opposed to either going on the offensive in a
32:54
Speaker 1: productive way or just hitting back, let her anger at
32:57
Speaker 1: Pete sort of get the better of her.
33:00
Speaker 10: Yeah, I do think, you know, I wish we were
33:04
Speaker 10: all as perfect as you, Pete. I do think that
33:06
Speaker 10: Pete's critique on her confirmation record was a far more
33:11
Speaker 10: valid hit than really digging in on the Mexico question
33:16
Speaker 10: and forgetting the name.
33:17
Speaker 2: I agree with that, yeah, for sure.
33:18
Speaker 10: Which is why I found that the saying, I wish
33:20
Speaker 10: we were all as perfect as you, had maybe come
33:22
Speaker 10: at a different moment, because I do think it's, for
33:25
Speaker 10: a less substantive attack, it's good to have that less
33:27
Speaker 10: substantive response. But I think she's facing for the first
33:31
Speaker 10: time an actual substantive rebuke of what she's been arguing
33:37
Speaker 10: for as a candidate, which is in some ways like
33:38
Speaker 10: normal politics, like consensus-building normal politics.
33:41
Speaker 2: Well, hey, hold on a second.
33:42
Speaker 10: If you've been trying to do consensus-building normal politics in
33:44
Speaker 10: the age of Trump, And that has meant confirming some
33:47
Speaker 10: of these judges or voting for some of these Trump
33:49
Speaker 10: appointments that have then become part of an administration that
33:53
Speaker 10: has pursued family separation and other heinous policies. You should
33:56
Speaker 10: be held accountable for that, because while she can claim
33:58
Speaker 10: that she didn't vote for the majority of Trump judges.
34:01
Speaker 1: She's in the top 10 to 15.
34:03
Speaker 2: That's not great. It's not that great. So I do
34:06
Speaker 2: think it's a substantive attack. She wasn't prepared to answer.
34:08
Speaker 2: That's what I also do. I was thinking about this
34:10
Speaker 2: this morning. Just I was.
34:12
Speaker 10: I was somewhat sympathetic to Amy Klobuchar in that I
34:14
Speaker 10: do think she got a bit of a raw deal
34:16
Speaker 10: in terms of the questions that came to her. I
34:18
Speaker 10: don't think she totally handled the questions that would have
34:20
Speaker 10: allowed her to go on offense as well as she could.
34:22
Speaker 10: That first question she got at the very opening of
34:24
Speaker 10: the debate, I don't think she totally nailed. That said,
34:29
Speaker 10: the questions she got were beyond, I think, the very
34:31
Speaker 10: fair question about her record as a prosecutor.
34:34
Speaker 2: She was pushed so hard.
34:35
Speaker 10: On this question about Mexico. I mean, she fucked it
34:37
Speaker 10: up like two days ago. She has to be ready
34:39
Speaker 10: for this.
34:40
Speaker 2: Of course.
34:41
Speaker 3: I don't agree that it's in any way unfair to
34:43
Speaker 3: ask that question.
34:44
Speaker 2: I don't think it's unfair.
34:44
Speaker 4: She got ready to parry it. Also, Pete got it right.
34:46
Speaker 4: So she should know that he's going to come after
34:48
Speaker 4: her on this. But then her substantive response and critique
34:51
Speaker 4: of him was something about designated cartels as a terrorist organization.
34:55
Speaker 4: But she didn't really explain the problem there or what
34:57
Speaker 4: policy issues it would create. It's just you should have
34:59
Speaker 4: been ready for this.
35:00
Speaker 10: No, I totally agree with that. I guess I just
35:01
Speaker 10: mean that she was asked a question about it by
35:03
Speaker 10: the moderator. Then the moderator followed up with a really
35:06
Speaker 10: hard follow-up. Then Pete hit her on it. Then Elizabeth
35:09
Speaker 10: Warren damned her with faint praise to protect her from it.
35:12
Speaker 10: So in a debate that was covering every issue under
35:14
Speaker 10: the sun, it was a huge her biggest moment of
35:17
Speaker 10: the debate was a long conversation about this issue. And
35:20
Speaker 10: I felt like that was that was a lot of stuff.
35:22
Speaker 11: Yeah.
35:23
Speaker 1: Let's talk about Pete, who was the one candidate who
35:25
Speaker 1: really did try to take on both Bloomberg and Bernie.
35:28
Speaker 1: Here's him making an electability case.
35:29
Speaker 8: We could wake up two weeks from today, the day
35:32
Speaker 8: after Super Tuesday, and the only candidates left standing will
35:36
Speaker 8: be Bernie Sanders and Mike Bloomberg, the two most polarizing
35:40
Speaker 8: figures on this stage. And most Americans don't see where
35:45
Speaker 8: they fit if they've got to choose between a socialist
35:48
Speaker 8: who thinks that capitalism is the root of all evil
35:51
Speaker 8: and a billionaire who thinks that money ought to be
35:53
Speaker 8: the root of all power. Let's put forward somebody who
35:56
Speaker 8: actually lives and works in a middle-class neighborhood in an
36:01
Speaker 8: industrial Midwestern city. Let's put forward somebody who's actually a Democrat. Look,
36:14
Speaker 8: We shouldn't have to choose between one candidate who wants
36:18
Speaker 8: to burn this party down and another candidate who wants
36:21
Speaker 8: to buy this party out.
36:23
Speaker 1: I have to say, I think it's maybe the best
36:25
Speaker 1: argument Pete Buttigieg can make for his candidacy that he
36:28
Speaker 1: made at this moment in time in the race.
36:31
Speaker 2: I agree with that. I do agree with that.
36:33
Speaker 10: I do think it would be fun to give Pete
36:34
Speaker 10: kind of like an essay test where he's given two
36:38
Speaker 10: things and has to find the middle. Like just two
36:40
Speaker 10: opposite things, like apple and cake in the middle.
36:43
Speaker 1: But honestly, you couldn't give a test that's easier than
36:46
Speaker 1: this with Bernie Sanders and Mike Bloomberg. He's not placing
36:49
Speaker 1: himself between Elizabeth Warren and Amy Klobuchar.
36:51
Speaker 8: Right, right, right.
36:52
Speaker 3: No, totally.
36:52
Speaker 1: Burn it down is an exaggeration. Capitalism, the root of
36:55
Speaker 1: all evil, is an exaggeration. It's probably slightly less of
36:59
Speaker 1: an exaggeration with Bloomberg, but it's close.
37:01
Speaker 4: Um, but it's like, it is if Pete is the
37:04
Speaker 4: only one who has someone on his team who knows
37:05
Speaker 4: how to count delegates, because he seemingly is the only
37:07
Speaker 4: one who realizes that Bernie is running away with the nomination.
37:11
Speaker 3: He might be over 30%.
37:12
Speaker 4: And there was a poll the other day that has
37:14
Speaker 4: him over 30% in California, which means he could have
37:16
Speaker 4: an insurmountable delegate lead. So Pete wisely in terms of
37:20
Speaker 4: strategy went after Bernie Sanders and, you know, he makes
37:22
Speaker 4: this false choice about the burn it down or who
37:24
Speaker 4: wants to buy it. But, you know, I thought it
37:26
Speaker 4: was pretty savvy positioning.
37:28
Speaker 3: Um, he also.
37:29
Speaker 4: Criticized Bernie for his supporters going after the culinary workers,
37:33
Speaker 4: which led to a broader conversation about Bernie's online supporters,
37:38
Speaker 4: some small sect of them being assholes online, which is
37:40
Speaker 4: an uncomfortable couple minutes for Bernie as well. And that
37:42
Speaker 4: was one of the only other times he actually took
37:45
Speaker 4: some flack. I'm not sure I totally get the strategy
37:47
Speaker 4: of just crushing Amy Klobuchar four different times, but maybe
37:51
Speaker 4: when you know she's going to go after you, you
37:54
Speaker 4: have to be prepared to respond.
37:55
Speaker 1: Yeah. So I had the same thought, Tommy. And then
37:58
Speaker 1: I was thinking about it last night and I realized like,
38:00
Speaker 1: this was all about what happened in New Hampshire with
38:02
Speaker 1: Amy Klobuchar, right? And so when you, because it's a,
38:05
Speaker 1: there's a good argument to make that if Amy Klobuchar
38:08
Speaker 1: didn't have a fantastic debate in New Hampshire and get
38:10
Speaker 1: all that momentum, Pete wins New Hampshire because he was
38:12
Speaker 1: so close to winning anyway. And he really did split
38:15
Speaker 1: so much of the more moderate liberal vote with Klobuchar
38:20
Speaker 1: in New Hampshire. And I think Everyone on that stage
38:22
Speaker 1: has a couple different things to take care of.
38:25
Speaker 3: Right. Yeah.
38:25
Speaker 1: All of them. And for Pete, he wants to position
38:28
Speaker 1: himself between Bloomberg and and Bernie, which is also what
38:32
Speaker 1: Warren wants to do in Klobuchar and Biden. But Pete
38:35
Speaker 1: also has to fend off Klobuchar trying to. take all
38:38
Speaker 1: of his sort of moderate liberal vote. And so I
38:40
Speaker 1: think that's what that was about. And he also, I
38:42
Speaker 1: think Pete also knew that he could probably trigger Klobuchar
38:44
Speaker 1: because she does not like him on a visceral level.
38:47
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah.
38:48
Speaker 1: Unlocked.
38:48
Speaker 2: I didn't pick that up.
38:50
Speaker 6: Skill unlocked.
38:51
Speaker 2: Stay too soft.
38:51
Speaker 1: But no, I thought, look, it was, I thought it
38:53
Speaker 1: was a very, very strong case from Buttigieg there. So
38:57
Speaker 1: I do want to go back to Elizabeth Warren, who
39:00
Speaker 1: was asked about her identification as a capitalist towards the
39:02
Speaker 1: end of the debate and used the question to contrast
39:04
Speaker 1: her own electability case with nearly everyone else's. Let's listen.
39:08
Speaker 6: Look, Democrats want to beat Donald Trump, but they are worried.
39:14
Speaker 6: They are worried about gambling on a narrow vision that
39:19
Speaker 6: doesn't address the fears of millions of Americans across this
39:23
Speaker 6: country who see real problems and want real change. They
39:27
Speaker 6: are worried about gambling on a revolution that won't bring
39:30
Speaker 6: along a majority of this country. Amy and Joe's hearts
39:36
Speaker 6: are in the right place, but we can't be so
39:39
Speaker 6: eager to be liked by Mitch McConnell that we forget
39:43
Speaker 6: how to fight the Republicans. Mayor Buttigieg has been taking
39:49
Speaker 6: money from big donors and changing his positions. So it
39:53
Speaker 6: makes it unclear what it is he stands for other
39:57
Speaker 6: than his own.
39:57
Speaker 1: Senator, thank you. I heard that, and I actually thought
40:02
Speaker 1: that was, she probably did more good for herself with
40:04
Speaker 1: that answer than the takedown of Bloomberg at the top.
40:09
Speaker 1: The takedown of Bloomberg at the top was for all
40:10
Speaker 1: of us that love that kind of stuff. But I think,
40:13
Speaker 1: like we just said Pete did in the answer before that,
40:15
Speaker 1: that was Elizabeth Warren positioning herself in the field for explicitly,
40:21
Speaker 1: probably more explicitly than she has ever done, by saying
40:25
Speaker 1: the revolution is not going to bring everyone along. Everyone
40:28
Speaker 1: else's vision is too narrow to address the real problems
40:30
Speaker 1: that people face. I thought it was sort of a
40:32
Speaker 1: masterful answer there.
40:34
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree.
40:34
Speaker 10: I actually think, I was thinking about this, that this
40:36
Speaker 10: idea that Bernie sort of ultimately won because no one
40:39
Speaker 10: laid a hand on him, I think is probably true.
40:41
Speaker 10: That said, what Warren did with going after Bloomberg and
40:44
Speaker 10: what she's actually done for previous debates is give people
40:46
Speaker 10: a case, a positive case for why they should be
40:48
Speaker 10: behind her. And she did that really well by saying, hey,
40:50
Speaker 10: remember me? I'm a really fucking smart fighter. Like I'm
40:53
Speaker 10: a warrior and you should remember that. but she also
40:56
Speaker 10: has to do this other piece of it, which is
40:58
Speaker 10: tell people why they shouldn't vote for the rest. And
41:00
Speaker 10: I think coming back to that, I do think was
41:02
Speaker 10: incredibly valuable.
41:03
Speaker 4: I mean, Elizabeth Warren was Tony Montana at the end
41:05
Speaker 4: of Scarface. She was just fucking mowing down everybody on electability.
41:09
Speaker 4: And it was compelling in the moment. And I think
41:12
Speaker 4: all of us as nerds who love politics were very
41:15
Speaker 4: impressed by the performance, but it can sometimes be hard
41:18
Speaker 4: to be negative about every single candidate.
41:20
Speaker 3: So I just don't know how it's going to cut.
41:22
Speaker 4: The one thing I would say about a lot of
41:25
Speaker 4: the attacks over the course of the night on Bloomberg
41:28
Speaker 4: is that a lot of people brought it back to
41:29
Speaker 4: electability and why stop and frisk comments about women will
41:33
Speaker 4: make it harder for him to win, which was very,
41:35
Speaker 4: very savvy for Warren and everybody else, because we know
41:38
Speaker 4: that's what democratic primary voters are obsessed with.
41:41
Speaker 1: I'll just say something else about Warren and Pete too,
41:44
Speaker 1: as debaters. I think, you know, there's one level of
41:47
Speaker 1: being a good debater, which is you come armed with
41:50
Speaker 1: a bunch of zingers and plan moments and, you know,
41:54
Speaker 1: They both have that. Other candidates have that, too. There's
41:56
Speaker 1: another sort of like the next level of being a
41:59
Speaker 1: really good debater where you don't always have a planned
42:02
Speaker 1: zinger for a moment, but you can just push and
42:05
Speaker 1: do it in the moment. And apparently I read this
42:07
Speaker 1: morning in The New York Times that Warren's hit on
42:10
Speaker 1: Bloomberg at the beginning, she was prepared to say something
42:12
Speaker 1: about the NDAs, but that was not scripted. And just
42:16
Speaker 1: her continuing to press him. How many? How many? Will
42:19
Speaker 1: you release them tonight? Just doing that in the moment.
42:21
Speaker 1: She's very deft on stage. She's very nimble. And I
42:24
Speaker 1: think and Pete, while he is much more sort of
42:27
Speaker 1: prepared and has the prepared talking points, he can also
42:29
Speaker 1: be very nimble, too. And when you think about everyone's like,
42:33
Speaker 1: what's it going to take to have someone take on
42:34
Speaker 1: Donald Trump, which I think there's plenty of problems with
42:37
Speaker 1: picking a candidate based on who's going to stand on
42:39
Speaker 1: stage with Donald Trump. As Tommy's pointed out, Donald Trump
42:41
Speaker 1: might not come to the debate stage. So who knows?
42:44
Speaker 1: And I think Hillary Clinton beat Donald Trump in all
42:46
Speaker 1: those debates and still lost. But when you think about
42:49
Speaker 1: who can take on Donald Trump, you do think about
42:51
Speaker 1: who is most nimble in the moment. Um, and I
42:55
Speaker 1: think both Warren and Buttigieg showed that last night.
42:57
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree.
42:58
Speaker 10: You know, Pete and Warren are two of the smartest
43:00
Speaker 10: human beings in politics. They're incredibly talented people. And I
43:03
Speaker 10: think you saw that, uh, last night, you know, but up,
43:07
Speaker 10: up about gay news, uh, uh, you know, Pete like
43:10
Speaker 10: looked looser.
43:11
Speaker 2: He had a little bit of five o'clock shadow.
43:12
Speaker 10: His eyebrows were, uh, controlled, but not, uh, fully inside
43:16
Speaker 10: of the box as was his performance. And I think that,
43:19
Speaker 10: but I do think there was a kind of comfort
43:21
Speaker 10: for both Warren and Pete that came from seeing, their
43:24
Speaker 10: possibility of being the nominee dwindling. And there was something in, in,
43:28
Speaker 10: in Warren specifically, uh, you know, it said in one
43:31
Speaker 10: of these pieces that she had a cold, she was
43:33
Speaker 10: desperately trying to get over her cold. There's a quality
43:36
Speaker 10: to Elizabeth Warren that that's almost like she's been counted out, right?
43:39
Speaker 10: She wasn't, wasn't even pulled by NBC on a lot
43:42
Speaker 10: of these questions. And she just came out there and
43:46
Speaker 10: you never see her flinch. You never see her feel
43:48
Speaker 10: as though she's, uh, unsure how she's supposed to handle herself.
43:51
Speaker 10: There's such a, um, inspiring quality and seeing this woman
43:55
Speaker 10: who has, uh, kind of fought her way to be
43:57
Speaker 10: on this stage, just sort of leave it all out
44:00
Speaker 10: on the field. And I, I was like our fund,
44:02
Speaker 10: like our fund, like our phone.
44:03
Speaker 3: Yeah.
44:03
Speaker 4: I mean, look, you know, she got beat up at
44:05
Speaker 4: some of the earlier debates and it was interesting to
44:06
Speaker 4: see her come out and not give a fuck. And
44:08
Speaker 4: I think a lot of people have the, I don't
44:10
Speaker 4: give a fuck approach to the bait tonight, which not
44:12
Speaker 4: surprisingly made them all better, especially in contrast to Mike Bloomberg,
44:16
Speaker 4: who sometimes seemed like, uh, he was worried that if
44:18
Speaker 4: he talks too fast, he would fart or something like
44:21
Speaker 4: he seemed so uptight and, and so unwilling to even
44:24
Speaker 4: move that it was uncomfortable to watch.
44:27
Speaker 1: I will say that for Bloomberg, the spin from his
44:30
Speaker 1: campaign was interesting and probably okay spin because they didn't
44:35
Speaker 1: do like, no, no, everything was fine. They basically said, yeah,
44:39
Speaker 1: he took a while to get warmed up, which, you know,
44:44
Speaker 1: the latter half of the debate was better than the first.
44:46
Speaker 1: The first half of the debate, he looked like fucking lost.
44:49
Speaker 3: Deer in headlights.
44:50
Speaker 1: Didn't want to be there. Speaking too slow. Wasn't making
44:53
Speaker 1: any of the points. Just crazy.
44:54
Speaker 2: A billionaire at a Hampton Inn.
44:55
Speaker 1: Yeah. What do I do?
44:57
Speaker 2: It's like, what do you mean I got to make
44:58
Speaker 2: a waffle?
44:59
Speaker 1: Crazy, crazy bad.
45:00
Speaker 2: I've never made a waffle.
45:01
Speaker 1: And I do think he got better towards the latter
45:04
Speaker 1: half of the debate. And I'm very curious as to
45:06
Speaker 1: how he'll do in South Carolina when he does it again.
45:09
Speaker 3: It helps him to have.
45:10
Speaker 4: Climate change in the middle, an area where he has
45:12
Speaker 4: real expertise and a real record and something.
45:14
Speaker 3: To talk about.
45:15
Speaker 4: That said, though, he somehow got to a place where
45:18
Speaker 4: he was talking about his support for fracking done right,
45:20
Speaker 4: which is not going to help you in a Democratic primary.
45:23
Speaker 4: It might be critical to winning in the general.
45:25
Speaker 1: I don't know.
45:25
Speaker 4: There was an episode of The Daily that scared the
45:27
Speaker 4: hell out of me about this topic, but it was weird. Yeah,
45:29
Speaker 4: fracking bins don't play too well in Pennsylvania, so that's
45:31
Speaker 4: going to be an issue.
45:32
Speaker 10: And I know he landed this punch about Bernie having
45:35
Speaker 10: three houses and he's a millionaire, which felt like clearly
45:38
Speaker 10: a prep line.
45:39
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's just.
45:42
Speaker 3: That shit works, man. That shit works.
45:44
Speaker 2: Maybe. I know.
45:45
Speaker 4: As a guy who helped plant a fucking question about
45:49
Speaker 4: how many houses John McCain had, we ran with that.
45:52
Speaker 1: And again, Bernie's the nominee. I'm glad he's being forced
45:55
Speaker 1: to answer this kind of stuff now. So now we
45:57
Speaker 1: can see what, because of course Donald Trump's going to
46:00
Speaker 1: say Bernie's a millionaire. And what are you going to
46:01
Speaker 1: do about that? And, and, Bernie's dealing with it now. Good.
46:05
Speaker 1: Whoever our nominee is should deal with all the shit
46:07
Speaker 1: that's going to come at them in general now and
46:09
Speaker 1: see how they do.
46:09
Speaker 3: Democrats, liberals.
46:10
Speaker 1: Why are you smiling?
46:11
Speaker 2: I'm just thinking about Bernie at his little cabin.
46:13
Speaker 3: I don't know that it's that little.
46:16
Speaker 1: He's the guy with the house.
46:18
Speaker 3: Good for him.
46:18
Speaker 1: He wrote a good book. You know why? Because Bernie
46:20
Speaker 1: fundamentally believes in capitalism. That's the thing. And it's okay. Democrats.
46:25
Speaker 4: All Democrats deal with this hypocrisy charge all the time
46:28
Speaker 4: of like, oh, you believe that climate change is real?
46:31
Speaker 4: Why did you take a plane in 2018? It's just
46:33
Speaker 4: stupid and frustrating crap that we have to deal with
46:35
Speaker 4: from Republicans that Bernie will have to deal with even
46:38
Speaker 4: more so because he calls himself a socialist and it's
46:40
Speaker 4: annoying and it's unfair, but we got to win. And
46:44
Speaker 4: like I said, it's, yeah, I made money and I
46:46
Speaker 4: bought some things.
46:47
Speaker 1: Great. I just want to make the society more fair
46:49
Speaker 1: for people. That's the right answer. All right, let's end
46:54
Speaker 1: with the last question, which was all process, but very interesting,
46:57
Speaker 1: perhaps alarming. The candidates were asked, should the person who
47:00
Speaker 1: wins the most pledged delegates be the nominee, even if
47:03
Speaker 1: they don't get a majority of the delegates and win
47:05
Speaker 1: the nomination outright? Let's hear what they all had to say.
47:08
Speaker 2: We'll start with you, Mayor Bloomberg.
47:10
Speaker 7: Whatever the rules of the Democratic Party are, they should
47:13
Speaker 7: be followed. And if they have a process, which I
47:15
Speaker 7: believe they do, so that everybody else, everybody can.
47:19
Speaker 6: So you want the convention to work its will?
47:21
Speaker 3: Yes.
47:22
Speaker 1: Senator Warren.
47:23
Speaker 6: But a convention working its will means that people have
47:25
Speaker 6: the delegates that are pledged to them and they keep
47:27
Speaker 6: those delegates until you come to the convention.
47:31
Speaker 1: All of the people. All righty. Vice President Biden. Play
47:34
Speaker 1: by the rules.
47:35
Speaker 5: Yes or no?
47:35
Speaker 1: Leading person with the delegates. Should they be the nominee
47:37
Speaker 1: or not?
47:37
Speaker 13: No.
47:38
Speaker 7: Let the process work its way out.
47:39
Speaker 1: Mayor Buttigieg.
47:40
Speaker 8: Not necessarily.
47:41
Speaker 2: Not to lose.
47:41
Speaker 3: Senator Klobuchar.
47:42
Speaker 12: Let the process work.
47:44
Speaker 1: Senator Sanders.
47:45
Speaker 9: Well, the process includes 500 superdelegates on the second ballot.
47:50
Speaker 9: So I think that the will of the people should prevail.
47:53
Speaker 10: Yes.
47:54
Speaker 3: Thank you, guys.
47:57
Speaker 1: So I was not surprised by Bloomberg's answer or Bernie's answer,
48:01
Speaker 1: but I was not expecting everyone else to side with
48:04
Speaker 1: Bloomberg there. It tells me that they think that Bernie's
48:07
Speaker 1: going to end up with the lead in pledged delegates
48:10
Speaker 1: at the convention, and they may not.
48:13
Speaker 10: Yeah, I guess I would say even if everyone gave
48:17
Speaker 10: the same answer as Bloomberg, I think they may all
48:20
Speaker 10: mean different things.
48:21
Speaker 2: How do you mean? In this way.
48:24
Speaker 10: I think Bloomberg means I would like to be the
48:27
Speaker 10: nominee and even if Bernie gets the most pledged delegates,
48:30
Speaker 10: I would like to take them from him.
48:32
Speaker 1: Whatever.
48:33
Speaker 10: He would be part of a broker convention. He doesn't
48:35
Speaker 10: mind that. He's interested in that. That's part of, I think,
48:38
Speaker 10: that's in their... That's a possibility in their minds. I
48:41
Speaker 10: think for the other candidates, I would be I think
48:45
Speaker 10: is a little bit more about just sort of basic
48:47
Speaker 10: power and expectations that if you make that point, you're
48:50
Speaker 10: saying I have some say in a convention in which
48:53
Speaker 10: there is no pledged delegate majority going into the second ballot.
48:57
Speaker 1: Why do you think that, though, about the other candidates?
48:59
Speaker 1: What evidence is there that they are they're just trying
49:01
Speaker 1: to be players in the convention and not doing what
49:04
Speaker 1: Bloomberg's doing and thinking I could win if it's a
49:06
Speaker 1: brokered convention?
49:07
Speaker 10: I guess this is my gut belief in the in
49:08
Speaker 10: the way they view the process. Like, I can't see
49:10
Speaker 10: Elizabeth Warren participating in that kind of a burn it
49:13
Speaker 10: down Democratic convention, but I can see a lot of
49:16
Speaker 10: negotiations about role in the party and all that that
49:18
Speaker 10: will go on in a convention in which Bernie has
49:20
Speaker 10: the pledged delegate lead but not a majority going to
49:22
Speaker 10: the second ballot.
49:23
Speaker 1: That's all. Yeah.
49:24
Speaker 3: I mean, God.
49:25
Speaker 2: I don't know, obviously.
49:26
Speaker 1: Yeah.
49:26
Speaker 4: It just made me start to think about a broker
49:28
Speaker 4: convention and how catastrophic it would be. Look, everyone should
49:32
Speaker 4: just go read about 1968 and.
49:34
Speaker 4: What happened there when you had a bunch, you know,
49:36
Speaker 4: the will of the Democratic Party was behind like McCarthy
49:38
Speaker 4: or McGovern or RFK until he was assassinated in an
49:41
Speaker 4: anti-war platform. And then they hand the nomination to Hubert Humphrey,
49:46
Speaker 4: who was, you know, continuing the war in Vietnam after
49:48
Speaker 4: 13 years.
49:49
Speaker 3: And it was a bloodbath.
49:50
Speaker 4: And it handed the election to Nixon in a lot
49:53
Speaker 4: of ways. And like, look, you know, history is not
49:55
Speaker 4: necessarily going to repeat itself, but there were riots in
49:58
Speaker 4: the streets.
49:59
Speaker 3: There was horrible violence. It tore the party apart.
50:01
Speaker 4: I mean, my biggest concern coming out of this primary
50:04
Speaker 4: is going to be democratic unity behind whoever the nominee is.
50:08
Speaker 4: And this kind of talk about potentially handing the nomination
50:13
Speaker 4: to someone who doesn't have the most delegates, which is,
50:16
Speaker 4: I think, the best benchmark of who is winning, seems
50:19
Speaker 4: nuts to me.
50:20
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've thought that too. I'm wondering, just listening to
50:25
Speaker 1: all these candidates say that, I was wondering if, and
50:28
Speaker 1: Matt Iglesias made this point this morning on Twitter, if
50:30
Speaker 1: Bernie walks in there with a lead of 100 delegates,
50:33
Speaker 1: then it's like, good night, it's over, give Bernie the nomination.
50:37
Speaker 1: If Bernie's like 30 delegates ahead of two candidates who
50:41
Speaker 1: are tied behind him and it's like really close, then
50:45
Speaker 1: what do you do? But I don't see a fair
50:49
Speaker 1: way to adjudicate that other than a pledged delegate lead,
50:53
Speaker 1: a popular vote lead, whatever it may be. And I
50:55
Speaker 1: don't know how you get out of that mess in
50:57
Speaker 1: a way that makes people feel good. Now, the interesting
51:00
Speaker 1: thing is what I didn't realize and a lot of
51:02
Speaker 1: people are saying today is that the person who was
51:04
Speaker 1: making an argument in 2016 that let's have that the
51:08
Speaker 1: superdelegates could possibly overturn the will of the voters was
51:10
Speaker 1: Bernie Sanders, which I did. Apparently in 2016, he said,
51:13
Speaker 1: I hope that we win the pledge delegates. But at
51:15
Speaker 1: the end of the day, the responsibility that superdelegates have
51:18
Speaker 1: is to decide what is best for this country and
51:19
Speaker 1: what's best for the party. In my view, it's incumbent
51:22
Speaker 1: upon every superdelegate to take a hard and objective look
51:24
Speaker 1: at which candidate stands the better chance of defeating Donald Trump.
51:26
Speaker 10: So, again, that makes sense to me because ultimately this
51:30
Speaker 10: is about power and expectations and leaving your options open.
51:33
Speaker 10: I guess my naive view is that I sincerely believe
51:38
Speaker 10: that Elizabeth Warren, Amy Klobuchar, Joe Biden, Pete Buttigieg, and
51:43
Speaker 10: Bernie Sanders want what is best for this country at
51:47
Speaker 10: that convention. And I do not believe any one of
51:49
Speaker 10: them would grab that nomination if they believed it would
51:53
Speaker 10: mean we leave a convention, a broken party, unable to
51:56
Speaker 10: unify and win.
51:57
Speaker 4: I think there are a bunch of politicians who think
51:59
Speaker 4: that they're the best to lead the country and the
52:02
Speaker 4: most likely to win. So they'll do whatever it takes
52:04
Speaker 4: to get to that place. Like Bernie's a politician.
52:06
Speaker 3: He's not pure.
52:07
Speaker 4: He said something that sounds hypocritical in 2016 about superdelegates, which,
52:11
Speaker 4: you know, the difference between 2016 and today is the
52:14
Speaker 4: superdelegates rules have been changed. So they will no longer
52:17
Speaker 4: be allowed to vote on the first ballot. So it's
52:20
Speaker 4: not an issue until the second, third, fourth ballot, like
52:22
Speaker 4: whenever we would move on. But all of these men
52:24
Speaker 4: and women are in it to win. They all want power.
52:27
Speaker 4: They're all fucking politicians. And I think that they're just
52:30
Speaker 4: going to scrap and scrape until they get what they want.
52:33
Speaker 1: And, you know, there's some people now saying, you know,
52:36
Speaker 1: only two states have voted. Why are we saying this
52:38
Speaker 1: thing's almost wrapped up? And I think they are not
52:40
Speaker 1: quite understanding that Bernie's, that Bernie winning California by a
52:44
Speaker 1: good amount could theoretically end the ability of any other
52:48
Speaker 1: candidate to win even a plurality of pledge delegates. I
52:51
Speaker 1: don't think people quite are getting the math right now.
52:54
Speaker 1: But at the same time, it is going to be
52:56
Speaker 1: a long primary. And you can see these candidates thinking
53:00
Speaker 1: to themselves, okay, say Bernie does well on Super Tuesday
53:03
Speaker 1: and has a pretty good delegate lead. But then, you know,
53:06
Speaker 1: more oppo comes out. And as we keep voting in
53:10
Speaker 1: all these other states, suddenly Bernie's losing by like 60-40, 70-30.
53:14
Speaker 1: All this is unlikely, I think, but it could happen.
53:16
Speaker 1: And then we're getting to the convention and suddenly he's
53:18
Speaker 1: lost the last 15 states. They're probably thinking to themselves,
53:21
Speaker 1: then maybe I have a chance. Now, I still think
53:23
Speaker 1: you need a standard. You need a standard for how
53:26
Speaker 1: to select a nominee that's not just, and then a
53:29
Speaker 1: bunch of people get together and say, well, this person
53:32
Speaker 1: should get it instead.
53:32
Speaker 10: But this is why I do think part of it
53:33
Speaker 10: is just about expectations. Look, my sincere hope is that
53:37
Speaker 10: we do not have to check this conversation against the
53:40
Speaker 10: fucking record at the time. That said, one of the
53:43
Speaker 10: reasons I do think part of this is just pure
53:45
Speaker 10: expectations is is if every candidate on that stage said,
53:48
Speaker 10: pledge delegate leader is the nominee, it means it would
53:51
Speaker 10: be setting a standard for the media to just see
53:54
Speaker 10: who has the plurality. And once it became clear that
53:56
Speaker 10: it was impossible for anyone to catch Bernie on the plurality,
53:59
Speaker 10: we'd basically be saying it's wrapped up while these candidates
54:01
Speaker 10: are still campaigning in some of the late states. So
54:04
Speaker 10: a little bit of it is just saying, hey, hold
54:05
Speaker 10: on a second. Don't let plurality leader determine the outcome
54:10
Speaker 10: before we get to some of the last contests to
54:12
Speaker 10: just let the contest.
54:14
Speaker 1: But what are they hoping for?
54:15
Speaker 3: They're holding onto their leverage.
54:16
Speaker 1: Yeah.
54:17
Speaker 4: But I mean, just so people know, I mean, super Tuesday,
54:19
Speaker 4: a miracle, maybe a super Tuesday, you will have allotted
54:21
Speaker 4: about a third of the pledge delegates by March 17th.
54:24
Speaker 4: You will have allotted 61% of the pledge delegates. So
54:27
Speaker 4: we are going to figure this out real fast.
54:30
Speaker 1: Yeah. Faster than in 08 when it was more spread out.
54:33
Speaker 1: I think, I think that's just, people are not quite
54:35
Speaker 1: understanding this yet. Um, So final thoughts on how well
54:38
Speaker 1: the candidates made their case to voters last night. Any
54:40
Speaker 1: final thoughts on this thing and where we go from here?
54:44
Speaker 2: Well, we go to another debate on Tuesday, John. We
54:46
Speaker 2: have to do this again. Nevada, then a debate.
54:49
Speaker 1: We should say in terms of like, you know, Elizabeth
54:52
Speaker 1: Warren did really well last night. We'll see what, you know,
54:54
Speaker 1: some of the after debate reaction is among voters. But
54:58
Speaker 1: one of the challenges in Nevada for some of these
55:00
Speaker 1: candidates who did well last night is that we've already
55:02
Speaker 1: now had three, four days of early voting in Nevada.
55:04
Speaker 7: Mm-hmm.
55:05
Speaker 4: And so a lot of the vote is baked. And
55:07
Speaker 4: lots in California too. And lots in California.
55:10
Speaker 1: Yeah.
55:11
Speaker 4: Watching last night, it's hard for me not to, I
55:13
Speaker 4: judge on performance too much just because this is what
55:15
Speaker 4: I do for a living.
55:16
Speaker 3: I thought Warren was great. Pete was very good. Bernie
55:18
Speaker 3: was good. But like I said earlier, I think he
55:19
Speaker 3: had the best night just strategically.
55:21
Speaker 4: Klobuchar had a bad night. I thought she had a
55:23
Speaker 4: really tough debate. I thought Bloomberg got pummeled. So will
55:26
Speaker 4: any of this change the race? you know, this is
55:29
Speaker 4: the classic pundit bromide.
55:30
Speaker 3: We don't know.
55:31
Speaker 1: Right, right, right.
55:32
Speaker 3: But I kind of think it did.
55:33
Speaker 4: I mean, I do think that I was getting texts
55:36
Speaker 4: from people that are like tangentially related to politics or,
55:40
Speaker 4: you know, sort of observing being like, Oh my God,
55:41
Speaker 4: I couldn't believe how bad Bloomberg was. And I think
55:44
Speaker 4: the shine rubbed off in a big way last night.
55:46
Speaker 1: And a lot of people who have liked Warren and
55:48
Speaker 1: liked Warren at the beginning of the race saying like,
55:51
Speaker 1: this is the Elizabeth Warren I loved. And I, you know,
55:53
Speaker 1: and I got, I did our little Pod Save America
55:56
Speaker 1: text phone thing yesterday for a while, and I got
55:59
Speaker 1: a message from someone in Colorado who said, I've loved
56:02
Speaker 1: Elizabeth Warren from the beginning of this race, and now
56:04
Speaker 1: I'm thinking of tactically voting for Bernie Sanders in the
56:07
Speaker 1: primary in Colorado because I think that, like, she can't
56:10
Speaker 1: win anymore, and what's your advice? And this was before
56:12
Speaker 1: the debate, and I was just like, you should vote
56:14
Speaker 1: for who you believe in and who wants to, you know,
56:16
Speaker 1: who's going to be the best president, and, you know,
56:17
Speaker 1: maybe wait to vote until the Colorado primary and you
56:20
Speaker 1: see who's still in the race. Like, I would do that,
56:22
Speaker 1: but at the time, like, don't, don't sit there thinking about,
56:25
Speaker 1: you know, if I vote for Elizabeth Warren is, am
56:28
Speaker 1: I going to prevent Bernie from winning? And I want
56:30
Speaker 1: a progressive candidate just if you like or vote for.
56:32
Speaker 9: Yeah.
56:32
Speaker 10: It's interesting to, you know, all those polls show that, uh,
56:35
Speaker 10: the candidate whose supporters say they will unite behind whoever
56:38
Speaker 10: the democratic is the most tend to be Warren supporters, right?
56:41
Speaker 10: They're just, there's a kind of in fitting with her campaign,
56:44
Speaker 10: a kind of rationality and maturity and goodness to her supporters.
56:48
Speaker 10: They are like, and I see this when I meet them,
56:50
Speaker 10: there's a, genuine wholesomeness to this coalition. And that means
56:55
Speaker 10: that these are people that love their candidate, but also
56:57
Speaker 10: just want to do the right thing and want to
56:58
Speaker 10: make sure that the right person wins. And she last night,
57:01
Speaker 10: I think, sent a message to millions of people who
57:03
Speaker 10: like her saying like, just stick with me a little longer.
57:06
Speaker 2: This isn't done.
57:07
Speaker 6: Yeah.
57:07
Speaker 1: Yeah. Okay. Uh, when we come back, we'll have Tommy's
57:10
Speaker 1: interview with a democratic congressional candidate, Jessica Cisneros. Yeah. Hey, everyone.
57:20
Speaker 1: Pod Save America and Love It or Leave It are
57:22
Speaker 1: going on tour for 2020.
57:24
Speaker 2: Between the news, this primary, and the general election.
57:27
Speaker 1: That's right.
57:27
Speaker 10: We're going to have a lot to talk about. So
57:30
Speaker 10: come see us live when we're in your town.
57:33
Speaker 1: Get those tickets at crooked.com slash events and come hang out.
57:36
Speaker 1: That's crooked.com slash events. So we've told you before that
57:40
Speaker 1: one of our many challenges is that the contested primary
57:43
Speaker 1: has given Trump a head start in the general. Democratic
57:46
Speaker 1: candidates are spending money against each other. He's spending money
57:49
Speaker 1: on building an enormous field operation.
57:51
Speaker 10: That's why we're launching a brand new fund to help
57:53
Speaker 10: build our field operation starting right now. It's called Leave
57:56
Speaker 10: It All on the Field, and it will help support
57:58
Speaker 10: groups who are putting organizers in the battleground states to make.
58:01
Speaker 2: Sure we do what we have to do to win.
58:03
Speaker 4: The first group we're helping is called Organizing Corps 2020,
58:06
Speaker 4: which is recruiting, training, and paying 1,000 organizers ahead of
58:09
Speaker 4: the general election in eight key battleground states.
58:12
Speaker 1: Current Corps members have already been making voter and volunteer calls, canvassing,
58:15
Speaker 1: and organizing on college campuses.
58:17
Speaker 10: All of this work will directly support our eventual Democratic nominee,
58:20
Speaker 10: and every Democratic campaign supports this effort.
58:23
Speaker 4: So please donate at votesaveamerica.com slash field. I am honored
58:30
Speaker 4: to be joined by Jessica Cisneros. She's an immigration and
58:34
Speaker 4: human rights lawyer. She's running for Congress in Texas's 28th
58:37
Speaker 4: congressional district. Her primary against Democratic incumbent Henry Cuéllar is
58:42
Speaker 4: on March 3rd. Jessica, thank you so much for doing
58:44
Speaker 4: the show.
58:45
Speaker 5: Thank you so much for inviting me.
58:47
Speaker 3: It is truly our pleasure.
58:48
Speaker 4: So I want to be clear from the jump that
58:50
Speaker 4: we are having this conversation today because we're huge fans
58:54
Speaker 4: of yours. We think people should support your campaign. And
58:57
Speaker 4: full disclosure, I personally donated money to your campaign in
59:01
Speaker 4: my personal capacity. So I don't want to mislead anyone here.
59:04
Speaker 4: But I should also note that you didn't enter this
59:06
Speaker 4: race lightly. I mean, you're running against an incumbent who
59:09
Speaker 4: I believe you interrogated. for at one point. What made
59:12
Speaker 4: you ultimately decide that it was time for new leadership
59:15
Speaker 4: in your district and that you were going to get
59:17
Speaker 4: in the ring and put yourself up for that job?
59:19
Speaker 14: Yeah, and also for full disclosure, I need to tell
59:22
Speaker 14: you that my team and I are big fans as well.
59:26
Speaker 14: So that's why we're super excited to be on here.
59:29
Speaker 14: And yes, so my district and the reason why I'm
59:33
Speaker 14: running to represent my district, it really has to do
59:36
Speaker 14: with my story of being born and raised in Laredo, Texas.
59:41
Speaker 14: So Laredo is right on the Rio Grande River. And
59:45
Speaker 14: for a little context for people that might not be
59:48
Speaker 14: familiar with the district, It starts from Northeast San Antonio
59:51
Speaker 14: down to Laredo, Texas, and then down to the Rio
59:53
Speaker 14: Grande Valley. So it's a pretty big district, very diverse
59:57
Speaker 14: in terms of the geographical locations. 77% Latinx, 65% Spanish-speaking.
1:00:04
Speaker 14: As you can imagine, being from the border, there is
1:00:07
Speaker 14: this very beautiful bicultural culture here. It's an area of
1:00:13
Speaker 14: the country where people go back and forth between Mexico
1:00:15
Speaker 14: and the United States. There's so many children of immigrants there.
1:00:19
Speaker 14: Everyone has their own immigration story. And I have my
1:00:23
Speaker 14: own and it's through my parents. My parents were able
1:00:25
Speaker 14: to get a shot at the American dream, you know,
1:00:29
Speaker 14: more than three decades ago after they were beneficiaries of
1:00:33
Speaker 14: the 1986 immigration reform because they started off as farm
1:00:36
Speaker 14: workers here in this country. And our story is so
1:00:39
Speaker 14: similar to many others in South Texas. And As you
1:00:42
Speaker 14: can imagine, I became inspired to be an immigration attorney
1:00:45
Speaker 14: to fight for that American dream for many other families.
1:00:48
Speaker 14: But as you can imagine, under the Trump administration, this
1:00:52
Speaker 14: work has been incredibly difficult and heartbreaking in the past
1:00:55
Speaker 14: few years. It's even to the point that many people
1:00:58
Speaker 14: where we live, a lot of folks don't know that
1:01:01
Speaker 14: we have checkpoints. That's something that was very normalized to
1:01:04
Speaker 14: us while growing up. We have to go through a
1:01:06
Speaker 14: checkpoint to get, for example, from Laredo to San Antonio.
1:01:09
Speaker 14: We carry our passports with us, right? You never know
1:01:12
Speaker 14: what could happen. And there's a lot of anxiety right
1:01:16
Speaker 14: now within our communities. And for me, seeing so many
1:01:20
Speaker 14: families torn apart, doing a lot of work in the
1:01:22
Speaker 14: detention centers and seeing human rights violations on the daily,
1:01:26
Speaker 14: it was outrageous to me that my congressman, someone from
1:01:32
Speaker 14: a deep blue seat that went to Hillary Clinton by
1:01:34
Speaker 14: 20 points in the last presidential election, well, this district
1:01:38
Speaker 14: voted for her by more than 20 points, he was
1:01:41
Speaker 14: voting with Trump 70% of the time and enabling Trump's agenda.
1:01:46
Speaker 14: So for me, that was a moment where I realized
1:01:48
Speaker 14: I needed to step up.
1:01:50
Speaker 2: Yeah.
1:01:50
Speaker 4: So you talked about how you're a human rights attorney
1:01:53
Speaker 4: by trade. Where do you want to see the Democratic
1:01:56
Speaker 4: Party go on immigration, particularly in a year where Trump's
1:02:01
Speaker 4: going to be running in the fall. It seems very
1:02:03
Speaker 4: likely that we're going to see a 2018 redux where
1:02:06
Speaker 4: he pretends there's a caravan of like ISIS members with
1:02:09
Speaker 4: the coronavirus heading to the border and demagogues the issue.
1:02:13
Speaker 4: Like how do Democrats in your view fight back against
1:02:16
Speaker 4: that kind of racist scaremongering?
1:02:20
Speaker 5: Well, this is the thing.
1:02:21
Speaker 14: This is why it's so important to have true representation
1:02:24
Speaker 14: and a real voice in Congress. I feel like right now,
1:02:27
Speaker 14: in the political atmosphere, in the national conversation, you hear
1:02:30
Speaker 14: a lot about the border, right?
1:02:32
Speaker 5: And its inhabitants, people who live there. But you don't
1:02:35
Speaker 5: really hear from us.
1:02:36
Speaker 14: And I think that's exactly what we're trying to do
1:02:38
Speaker 14: with this race, is lift up the voices in our community,
1:02:41
Speaker 14: paint an accurate picture of the hardworking people that we
1:02:43
Speaker 14: have in our communities that are, like I said, many
1:02:47
Speaker 14: of us have immigrant stories. So for me, I think
1:02:52
Speaker 14: this is one of the things that we're trying to
1:02:53
Speaker 14: accomplish with the campaign. Obviously, there's so many folks that
1:02:58
Speaker 14: empathize with the immigrant plight, right? And it's inhumane the
1:03:04
Speaker 14: way that many of these immigrants are treated. The fact
1:03:07
Speaker 14: that right next to my childhood park under the International
1:03:10
Speaker 14: Bridge in Laredo, the sham tent courts are there, right?
1:03:14
Speaker 14: And for those of, you know, many people who do
1:03:16
Speaker 14: not understand what a tent court is, it people, refugees
1:03:24
Speaker 14: are coming into the United States and they're being provided
1:03:28
Speaker 14: this facade of due process. And when in reality, they're basically, well,
1:03:34
Speaker 14: the Trump administration is undermining the due process that is
1:03:36
Speaker 14: granted to these folks under laws passed by Congress.
1:03:41
Speaker 3: Question about your opponent.
1:03:42
Speaker 4: I mean, so Cuellar, you know, he says he believes
1:03:45
Speaker 4: in this idea of a big tent, right? And that
1:03:48
Speaker 4: candidates that run in primaries against incumbents, you know, it
1:03:52
Speaker 4: seems like he He thinks that's bad, obviously, in this
1:03:54
Speaker 4: narrow instance. But in the larger instance, he believes that,
1:03:58
Speaker 4: you know, you should go start your own party if
1:04:00
Speaker 4: you think the Democratic Party doesn't include people like him.
1:04:03
Speaker 4: Where do you stand on that argument that the Democrats
1:04:05
Speaker 4: need to be a big tent party? And are there
1:04:08
Speaker 4: issues that you feel like are litmus tests or dividing
1:04:12
Speaker 4: lines for who should or should not be called a Democrat?
1:04:16
Speaker 14: Well, when we're talking about expanding the tent for the
1:04:18
Speaker 14: Democratic Party, I mean, I really can't take his comments
1:04:22
Speaker 14: seriously when he's the one who fundraisers and endorses for
1:04:25
Speaker 14: Tea Party Republicans within the state.
1:04:27
Speaker 9: Right.
1:04:28
Speaker 14: I mean, he's done it as recently as in the
1:04:29
Speaker 14: last cycle. He endorsed John Carter, who, you know, was
1:04:34
Speaker 14: behind the was supporting the birther conspiracy theory for Obama.
1:04:38
Speaker 10: Right.
1:04:38
Speaker 14: It's like, how can you be supporting someone like that
1:04:41
Speaker 14: over a Democrat that was so close to winning that race?
1:04:44
Speaker 14: So I don't take those comments seriously because all he's
1:04:50
Speaker 14: doing is trying to protect, trying to not have to
1:04:55
Speaker 14: justify why he's been voting the way he's been voting.
1:04:58
Speaker 14: I mean, even before becoming a member of Congress, he
1:05:02
Speaker 14: was Rick Perry's Secretary of State here in Texas, and
1:05:06
Speaker 14: he endorsed Bush. And I think his brand of bipartisanship
1:05:09
Speaker 14: is basically putting the Democrat stamp of approval on Republican legislation.
1:05:14
Speaker 14: That isn't true bipartisanship. And here, you know, for us,
1:05:20
Speaker 14: what we're trying to do is actually make sure that
1:05:23
Speaker 14: we do elect more Democrats up and down the ballot.
1:05:26
Speaker 14: Like what I see my role between March and November
1:05:29
Speaker 14: is using the national platform that's going to come with
1:05:32
Speaker 14: taking on a 15 year incumbent and winning and And,
1:05:35
Speaker 14: you know, be a resource, be able to do my
1:05:38
Speaker 14: part in helping increasing voter turnout in South Texas as well,
1:05:42
Speaker 14: because it's very low. Even though we're very democratic, you know,
1:05:45
Speaker 14: Democrat can win between 60 to 85 percent of the
1:05:48
Speaker 14: vote here. We have very low voter turnout. And I
1:05:52
Speaker 14: think when we're talking about flipping Texas and making it blue,
1:05:55
Speaker 14: a lot of folks tend to think about the red
1:05:58
Speaker 14: to blue areas, which are obviously important. And we want
1:06:00
Speaker 14: to support that way, too. Um, but we also need
1:06:03
Speaker 14: to think about South Texas where voter turnout, for example,
1:06:06
Speaker 14: in the last primary was 11% and we can do
1:06:09
Speaker 14: way better.
1:06:10
Speaker 4: Um, so he refuses to debate you, I believe. Um,
1:06:16
Speaker 4: if you had a chance to, to debate him, you know,
1:06:20
Speaker 4: what would you push him on? Like what issues do
1:06:22
Speaker 4: you think you hear about the most in your constituents? Uh,
1:06:25
Speaker 4: and how is he failing them?
1:06:28
Speaker 14: Yeah, I think the top issues, I mean, The issues
1:06:32
Speaker 14: we tend to hear about a lot are health care,
1:06:35
Speaker 14: immigration and jobs. But also besides policy, I think it's
1:06:39
Speaker 14: just the kind of leadership that he's demonstrating or lack thereof.
1:06:44
Speaker 5: He's very absent from the community.
1:06:46
Speaker 14: I think that's the number one complaint that we get
1:06:48
Speaker 14: from people at the doors.
1:06:49
Speaker 5: And we've been at it since June.
1:06:51
Speaker 10: Right.
1:06:52
Speaker 5: Even just right now, before this, I was out there
1:06:54
Speaker 5: talking to voters.
1:06:55
Speaker 14: And it's astonishing how many folks, especially once you leave Laredo, have.
1:07:00
Speaker 5: No idea who their congressperson is.
1:07:03
Speaker 14: We've been pushing for a debate since several months ago,
1:07:07
Speaker 14: and he refuses to meet me on the debate stage.
1:07:11
Speaker 14: Today was the closest that we got, which was kind
1:07:16
Speaker 14: of this weird pre-recording section from his part and a
1:07:20
Speaker 14: live section on my part on Texas Public Radio.
1:07:23
Speaker 5: We had an interview.
1:07:24
Speaker 14: I was the only one that was able to receive
1:07:27
Speaker 14: live questions from folks that were listening. Um, cause again,
1:07:31
Speaker 14: he refuses to actually confront me. And it's interesting cause
1:07:35
Speaker 14: he's been spending tens of thousands of dollars, you know,
1:07:37
Speaker 14: smear attacks saying that I'm not from the district, which
1:07:40
Speaker 14: is ridiculous cause I was born and raised in Laredo. Um,
1:07:45
Speaker 14: but he doesn't have, you know, he doesn't have a,
1:07:49
Speaker 14: he just doesn't want to debate me. Um, but again,
1:07:51
Speaker 14: this is because he just is afraid of having to
1:07:56
Speaker 14: be held accountable for the first time in 13 years
1:07:59
Speaker 14: because this is the first true primary challenge.
1:08:02
Speaker 5: In that time.
1:08:03
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm sure he doesn't love that.
1:08:05
Speaker 4: One policy area where he's criticized you is support for
1:08:09
Speaker 4: the Green New Deal. He's been arguing that it's going
1:08:12
Speaker 4: to take away jobs from, I think he said, 17,000
1:08:15
Speaker 4: oil and gas field workers. And you hear similar arguments
1:08:18
Speaker 4: about Medicare for all and jobs that might be lost
1:08:21
Speaker 4: in the insurance industry. And You know, I think obviously
1:08:24
Speaker 4: proponents of Medicare for All or Green New Deal would
1:08:27
Speaker 4: argue that the good that will come from that legislation
1:08:30
Speaker 4: far outweighs the bad, right? But maybe that answer doesn't
1:08:34
Speaker 4: satisfy you if you're working on an oil rig and
1:08:37
Speaker 4: you lose your job. How do you think we should
1:08:40
Speaker 4: message that challenge or speak to those workers who are
1:08:43
Speaker 4: worried about the personal impact of these big policies?
1:08:47
Speaker 14: Yeah, I think, for example, on a topic like the
1:08:49
Speaker 14: Green New Deal and our campaign's approach, this is a
1:08:52
Speaker 14: perfect place to be able to highlight the broad coalition
1:08:56
Speaker 14: we've been able to build behind our campaign. We're obviously,
1:08:59
Speaker 14: you know, endorsed and supported by the Sunrise Movement.
1:09:03
Speaker 5: They were one of our first supporters.
1:09:05
Speaker 14: And one of our most recent endorsements that we're very
1:09:08
Speaker 14: proud of is the Texas AFL-CIO. And then we also
1:09:13
Speaker 14: have other unions supporting us. And then, of course, LCV
1:09:16
Speaker 14: and Sierra Club as well. people tend to think that
1:09:21
Speaker 14: they might be on opposite sides, right, when they're talking
1:09:23
Speaker 14: about this issue, because especially here in Texas, that means
1:09:26
Speaker 14: that there are oil rig workers that also fall under
1:09:29
Speaker 14: the Texas AFL-CIO as well. The reason why they felt,
1:09:34
Speaker 14: you know, that they could trust someone like me in
1:09:36
Speaker 14: this position was because, well, I'm here out here fighting
1:09:40
Speaker 14: for workers, and I'm never going to vote for a
1:09:43
Speaker 14: version or support a version of the Green New Deal
1:09:45
Speaker 14: that doesn't take workers' voices in account when you're talking
1:09:49
Speaker 14: about the transition, right?
1:09:52
Speaker 5: I tell this to folks all the time.
1:09:53
Speaker 14: I understand where, you know, the fear of change is
1:09:56
Speaker 14: coming from because as someone that has, you know, was
1:10:00
Speaker 14: raised in the 30% poverty rate that Laredo has, I
1:10:04
Speaker 14: know what it's like seeing your family struggle having to
1:10:07
Speaker 14: work two or three jobs just to make ends meet.
1:10:09
Speaker 14: And you're still not sure where, you know, how bills
1:10:12
Speaker 14: are going to get paid. I saw that with my parents.
1:10:15
Speaker 14: And I don't want any working family having to go
1:10:17
Speaker 14: through that either. So I get where they're coming from.
1:10:20
Speaker 14: And I think this is why it's so important to
1:10:23
Speaker 14: have voices like ours that are truly reflective of people
1:10:26
Speaker 14: in the district at the forefront. Because I think that
1:10:30
Speaker 14: my part in what the Green New Deal would look like,
1:10:33
Speaker 14: coming from an oil state, is going to focus so
1:10:36
Speaker 14: much on that transition to make sure that the workers
1:10:39
Speaker 14: get the training and skills necessary and be placed into
1:10:42
Speaker 14: a job if they choose to go that route.
1:10:45
Speaker 3: Yeah.
1:10:45
Speaker 4: So having someone like you sort of in the policy
1:10:48
Speaker 4: creation process can actually ease the transition in a way
1:10:50
Speaker 4: where someone dug in and fighting it.
1:10:52
Speaker 3: Maybe could not.
1:10:54
Speaker 5: Exactly.
1:10:54
Speaker 14: And I think, I mean, Henrik Wehr is never going
1:10:57
Speaker 14: to back something like this because just take a look
1:10:59
Speaker 14: at where he's getting his money to fund his campaign.
1:11:02
Speaker 7: Right.
1:11:02
Speaker 14: Like he's one of the top congressional recipients from the
1:11:05
Speaker 14: fossil fuel industry. Whereas for us, this is where we're
1:11:09
Speaker 14: so proud to be able to have raised more than
1:11:12
Speaker 14: a million dollars for this campaign with grassroots contributions.
1:11:16
Speaker 5: And PACs that actually align with our interests.
1:11:19
Speaker 14: So that allows us the freedom to be able to
1:11:22
Speaker 14: advocate for what is actually best for the district.
1:11:25
Speaker 3: Yeah.
1:11:26
Speaker 4: So Democrats have been salivating over the prospect of winning
1:11:31
Speaker 4: Texas for years, but it hasn't quite panned out yet.
1:11:34
Speaker 4: I mean, Beto O'Rourke ran hard for Senate in 2018.
1:11:37
Speaker 4: He got close, but unfortunately he lost. How do you
1:11:41
Speaker 4: think Democrats can flip Texas blue?
1:11:44
Speaker 3: Is there a pathway? that you see or a strategy
1:11:47
Speaker 3: that they should take?
1:11:49
Speaker 5: Definitely.
1:11:49
Speaker 14: And I think it really goes, that strategy runs through
1:11:53
Speaker 14: South Texas. I think we need to invest in making
1:11:56
Speaker 14: sure we're increasing the voter turnout because Beto O'Rourke only
1:11:59
Speaker 14: lost by a few points, right? And I mentioned how
1:12:02
Speaker 14: low the voter turnout is in South Texas for the
1:12:05
Speaker 14: primary was 11%. For the general, it tends to be
1:12:09
Speaker 14: a little bit higher, but not by much. So what
1:12:11
Speaker 14: would it have looked like had South Texas come out
1:12:14
Speaker 14: at 10, 20 percent more?
1:12:16
Speaker 7: Right.
1:12:16
Speaker 5: I really do believe that would have been the difference.
1:12:19
Speaker 14: And again, I think having a true Democrat in the.
1:12:23
Speaker 5: Seat, I think it gives us the luxury, but also.
1:12:28
Speaker 14: The obligation to focus on what we can provide the
1:12:32
Speaker 14: Democratic Party to be able to flip Texas. I think
1:12:37
Speaker 14: initiatives like, for example, voting by mail, making it easier
1:12:40
Speaker 14: to vote by mail here would be huge because right
1:12:43
Speaker 14: now only certain people can qualify for a mail-in ballot.
1:12:47
Speaker 14: You are either a senior or you're going to be
1:12:50
Speaker 14: absent from the district during the voting period, and that's
1:12:52
Speaker 14: pretty much it. So if we actually made it easier
1:12:55
Speaker 14: for folks to be able to vote, I think that
1:12:58
Speaker 14: would be wonders for, you know, so many of us
1:13:00
Speaker 14: down here.
1:13:01
Speaker 3: Yeah.
1:13:03
Speaker 4: Just Zooming out a little bit and thinking nationally, I
1:13:07
Speaker 4: worry that sometimes Democrats talk about reaching groups of voters
1:13:12
Speaker 4: like they're monolithic, right? Like you talk about reaching the
1:13:14
Speaker 4: African-American community without any discussion of different ages or incomes
1:13:18
Speaker 4: or places or reaching Latino voters without talking about how,
1:13:22
Speaker 4: you know, their Venezuelans or Cubans might have different views
1:13:25
Speaker 4: than folks who are, you know, Mexican in origin or
1:13:28
Speaker 4: Puerto Rican. Like when you look at the Democratic effort's
1:13:31
Speaker 4: to reach out to Latino voters generally, how are they doing?
1:13:35
Speaker 4: And are there things that people could take from your
1:13:37
Speaker 4: race that could do a better job of speaking to
1:13:40
Speaker 4: the specific needs of specific communities?
1:13:43
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, I think there's always room to improve, right?
1:13:46
Speaker 14: I think the fact that we're talking about even that
1:13:49
Speaker 14: being a priority, I think is huge, right? Because I
1:13:51
Speaker 14: don't think that was a conversation even a few years ago.
1:13:56
Speaker 14: I think the reason why our message has been resonating
1:13:58
Speaker 14: so strongly with the people of the district is that
1:14:01
Speaker 14: my team is mostly composed of people from the district, right?
1:14:04
Speaker 14: So we're able to talk about these issues in a
1:14:07
Speaker 14: way that makes sense for many folks here. We're able
1:14:09
Speaker 14: to pull from our personal experiences and break policy down
1:14:14
Speaker 14: through anecdotes. For example, you know, Medicare for All is
1:14:18
Speaker 14: such a new concept for folks here. It's not like
1:14:21
Speaker 14: Henry Cuellar was talking about it. We forced him to
1:14:25
Speaker 14: do it. And obviously he doesn't have nice things to
1:14:27
Speaker 14: say about it. And again, you can look into his
1:14:30
Speaker 14: FEC record as to why. But, you know, when we
1:14:34
Speaker 14: go to doors, we lean heavily into our experiences. The
1:14:39
Speaker 14: fact that there's so many folks here that have buried
1:14:41
Speaker 14: loved ones because they haven't been able to afford care
1:14:44
Speaker 14: or they have to go into Mexico across the border
1:14:47
Speaker 14: to be able to get cheaper medications, prescriptions, any kind
1:14:50
Speaker 14: of operation. And I mean, I recently had to go
1:14:54
Speaker 14: over there to go get a dental procedure done because
1:14:57
Speaker 14: even with my dental insurance, it was just too much
1:14:59
Speaker 14: out of pocket, right? Like that is so normalized for
1:15:02
Speaker 14: people over here. And when you are able to relate
1:15:06
Speaker 14: that way, people can definitely see why these policies or
1:15:12
Speaker 14: how these policies would have an impact on their day
1:15:14
Speaker 14: to day. So I think if there's something that, you know,
1:15:18
Speaker 14: can be taken in terms of a lesson and how
1:15:21
Speaker 14: to outreach to certain communities, It's by including those communities
1:15:25
Speaker 14: in the messages and investing in them. So making sure
1:15:28
Speaker 14: that staff is local, making sure that you're putting those
1:15:31
Speaker 14: voices at the forefront so that they can have a
1:15:33
Speaker 14: genuine connection with the communities.
1:15:36
Speaker 5: You're trying to reach.
1:15:37
Speaker 6: Yeah.
1:15:38
Speaker 4: So last question for you. It feels like, you know,
1:15:40
Speaker 4: your campaign's on a roll, right? It looks like Secretary
1:15:43
Speaker 4: Castro just endorsed you. You're hitting a lot of doors,
1:15:46
Speaker 4: judging by your Twitter feed. It sounds like the Pipes
1:15:48
Speaker 4: and Stripes car show was a good time early voting.
1:15:52
Speaker 4: Early voting has started. Like, how can people listening help
1:15:55
Speaker 4: you out? How can they get involved? I know the
1:15:57
Speaker 4: primary is coming up, but what can people do if
1:15:59
Speaker 4: they're listening and they're like, I want her in Congress?
1:16:02
Speaker 9: Yeah.
1:16:02
Speaker 14: And thank you so much for the retweet on that one.
1:16:05
Speaker 14: The challenger next to the challenger. I couldn't pass up
1:16:08
Speaker 14: on that opportunity.
1:16:09
Speaker 5: I love it.
1:16:11
Speaker 14: But yeah, obviously, you know, if folks can, we are
1:16:15
Speaker 14: a grassroots campaign. So donations and volunteers are going to
1:16:19
Speaker 14: be crucial heading into the homestretch campaign. We're on day
1:16:22
Speaker 14: two of early voting. So if y'all wanna, if y'all
1:16:26
Speaker 14: are far away and wanna contribute to the work that
1:16:29
Speaker 14: we're doing, please send some donations over our way because
1:16:35
Speaker 14: the same day that we got the endorsement from Secretary
1:16:37
Speaker 14: Castro was the same day that the Koch News Network
1:16:42
Speaker 14: also endorsed Henry Cuellar.
1:16:45
Speaker 5: So he was.
1:16:47
Speaker 14: Endorsed by the Libre Network and they're spending money on
1:16:51
Speaker 14: him Trying to defend his seat. Right. And that was
1:16:54
Speaker 14: the first time that they've ever endorsed a Democrat. So
1:16:56
Speaker 14: you can tell that, you know, where and who where
1:16:59
Speaker 14: he stands and who he's fighting for. So for us,
1:17:03
Speaker 14: like if y'all can donate, please go to my website.
1:17:06
Speaker 14: It's Jessica Cisneros for Congress dot com. My last name
1:17:09
Speaker 14: is C-I-S-N-E-R-O-S. And then the four is spelled out F-O-R
1:17:15
Speaker 14: Congress dot com. We really appreciate the support. And we're
1:17:18
Speaker 14: also looking for Spanish speaking volunteers. I mentioned that our
1:17:23
Speaker 14: district is predominantly Spanish speaking. There's voters, for example, like
1:17:27
Speaker 14: my mother, who has lived in this country for many
1:17:29
Speaker 14: years and is a citizen and goes out and votes.
1:17:31
Speaker 5: But Spanish is her predominant language.
1:17:35
Speaker 14: So making sure we're reaching those voters and bringing them
1:17:37
Speaker 14: in so we can increase the voter turnout as well,
1:17:39
Speaker 14: I think is especially important.
1:17:41
Speaker 3: Awesome.
1:17:42
Speaker 4: Jessica Cisneros for congress.com. I just want to say one
1:17:45
Speaker 4: more time. Thank you so much for doing the show.
1:17:47
Speaker 4: Good luck out there. Uh, it's exciting times, uh, and
1:17:51
Speaker 4: we'll be watching and cheering for you.
1:17:53
Speaker 2: Amazing.
1:17:53
Speaker 5: Thank y'all so much.
1:18:00
Speaker 1: Thanks to Jessica Cisneros for joining us today. And, um,
1:18:03
Speaker 1: When will we talk to people next, guys? Oh, we're
1:18:06
Speaker 1: going to Nevada this weekend.
1:18:07
Speaker 2: Oh, yeah.
1:18:07
Speaker 1: We're going to Vegas tomorrow. The three of us.
1:18:10
Speaker 2: Watch a caucus. Maybe do some other stuff. Yeah.
1:18:14
Speaker 4: Listen, if this were the Utah caucuses, I would be
1:18:18
Speaker 4: there because it's my job. I care about politics.
1:18:20
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:18:20
Speaker 2: I mean, sure. Can we expense two nights in Las
1:18:24
Speaker 2: Vegas because we're covering it? Of course we can. But
1:18:27
Speaker 2: we would have done that in New Hampshire.
1:18:28
Speaker 1: We didn't. The other thing you know is when we
1:18:31
Speaker 1: go to a caucus, the caucus goes well.
1:18:34
Speaker 2: Yeah, we've got to keep our eyes on this thing.
1:18:35
Speaker 2: Who watches the Watchers, people? Us, we do.
1:18:38
Speaker 10: Because you know what made Iowa– the problem with the
1:18:40
Speaker 10: Iowa caucuses is what you needed is to take that
1:18:43
Speaker 10: whole event, put it inside of a casino.
1:18:46
Speaker 2: That's how you're going to make it work the best.
1:18:48
Speaker 2: You want pit bosses involved.
1:18:49
Speaker 1: Yeah, literally around. union bosses in there.
1:18:52
Speaker 2: Yeah, let's get pit bosses watching people voting. That's the key.
1:18:56
Speaker 3: Old people, shitty technology, casinos, what could go wrong?
1:18:59
Speaker 1: We're going to go to some events tomorrow and Friday.
1:19:01
Speaker 1: We're going to watch the caucus at a site on Saturday,
1:19:04
Speaker 1: and then you'll hear the resulting pod on Monday.
1:19:07
Speaker 2: Yeah.
1:19:08
Speaker 3: All right, guys.
1:19:08
Speaker 1: Bye.
1:19:09
Speaker 3: We hope.
1:19:09
Speaker 1: We hope. Pod Save America is a product of Cricket Media.
1:19:14
Speaker 1: The executive producer is Michael Martinez. Our assistant producer is
1:19:17
Speaker 1: Jordan Waller. It's mixed and edited by Andrew Chadwick. Kyle
1:19:20
Speaker 1: Seglin is our sound engineer. Thanks to Tanya Somenator, Katie Long,
1:19:24
Speaker 1: Roman Papadimitriou, Caroline Reston, and Elisa Gutierrez for production support.
1:19:28
Speaker 1: And to our digital team, Elijah Cohn, Nar Melkonian, Yale Freed,
1:19:31
Speaker 1: and Milo Kim, who film and upload these episodes as
1:19:34
Speaker 1: videos every week.
1:19:37
Speaker 12: Bye.