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Normally Podcast: Supreme Court Showdown: Parental Rights in Education · Normally

• 0:02
  Speaker 1: Hey, guys, we are batting along normally the show with
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: normal she takes.
• 0:06
  Speaker 2: But when the news gets weird, I am Mary Catherine.
• 0:09
  Speaker 3: And I am Carol Marko. I'm Mary Catherine.
• 0:11
  Speaker 4: I feel like it's been a month since I spoke
• 0:13
  Speaker 4: to you.
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: Look, the news cycle never stops, my friend.
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: There's a lot going on, by the way, programming note,
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: if you did not listen to us on the Ruthless podcast,
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: you should.
• 0:25
  Speaker 3: That's fun.
• 0:26
  Speaker 2: Got to make a guest visit with the fellas, so
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: that was good.
• 0:29
  Speaker 4: Well, some of the fellas you know comfortably. Smug is
• 0:31
  Speaker 4: afraid afraid to face.
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: Me, so you can't face you just can't.
• 0:36
  Speaker 3: I'm joking.
• 0:37
  Speaker 4: Smug and I are friends, but we got a lot
• 0:39
  Speaker 4: of lib jokes on each other. And I've been on
• 0:42
  Speaker 4: Ruthless twice now and he did not appear for either
• 0:46
  Speaker 4: the show. So it's a running joke that he is afraid.
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: Why is he scared?
• 0:51
  Speaker 4: I don't know.
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: I don't know, man, But it was nice to be
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: on with them and uh to reach some other folks.
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: So should we get straight into the.
• 1:00
  Speaker 3: Get it straight into it?
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we had an important case at the Supreme Court yesterday.
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: Now this one's been brewing for a while, and you
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: and I have been following it. Yeah, one, because your
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: book Stolen Youth covers this subject exactly, and your co author,
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: Bethany Mandel, lives in the county where this big case originated.
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: So the Montgomery County school Board wanted to have and
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: did inflict upon the parents of Montgomery County a lot
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: of gender and sexual instruction, instruction starting as early as
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: three and into the very early grades of elementary school
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: through various means and story books and this kind of thing.
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: And the parents in Montgomery County said, hey, we'd love
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: to opt out of this, and Montgomery County was like, no,
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: we take away that option.
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: Is that correct?
• 1:58
  Speaker 4: That is actually exactly what happened. And it's crazy because
• 2:03
  Speaker 4: they're not saying, and you know, I don't think they
• 2:05
  Speaker 4: should be taught in schools.
• 2:06
  Speaker 3: So that's where I am. But the parents who have
• 2:09
  Speaker 3: a problem with this aren't even saying that.
• 2:12
  Speaker 4: They're just saying, I don't want my kid being taught this,
• 2:16
  Speaker 4: and I want to opt them out. And that should
• 2:18
  Speaker 4: be a fairly easy call, right And yet here we
• 2:22
  Speaker 4: are at the Supreme Court, and it's worth.
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: Noting that the plaintiff in this case is a Muslim family.
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: There are many religious Jewish families in this area as
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: well as Christians, of course, and it's not obviously just
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: religious families that have objections to this kind of instruction,
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: but it is an interesting alliance of all three of
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: the major religion.
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: In Montgomery in.
• 2:49
  Speaker 4: Very you know, I would just guess all the minor
• 2:52
  Speaker 4: ones are also against teaching porn to kids.
• 2:55
  Speaker 3: I don't know.
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: Yes, in the very liberal county of Montgomery County, these
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: three groups nonetheless come together and say this is our line.
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: Man.
• 3:05
  Speaker 1: So the school board says, no, you can't opt out.
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: And what was hilarious to me is once this gets
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: to the Supreme Court and the school board's lawyer is
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: arguing with one of the justices, and well the justice
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: says like, well, like, why couldn't you just do an
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: opt out? There's opt outs for all sorts of things
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: for parents, and the lawyers basically like, well, so many
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: people opted out that it really became a problem.
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: It's like, yeah, so is it the parents that are
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: the problem or is it the curriculum that is the problem.
• 3:41
  Speaker 4: That's right, And Bethany points out that Montgomery County public
• 3:45
  Speaker 4: schools must have spent about two million dollars to get
• 3:49
  Speaker 4: this argument about forcing families to read these books that
• 3:54
  Speaker 4: are counter to their religious beliefs. As Bethany points out
• 3:57
  Speaker 4: to Scotus, that is congratts guys that should have been
• 4:01
  Speaker 4: spent elsewhere.
• 4:03
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: Well, and it strikes me that, you know, again, you'll
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: see it framed in a lot of media as parents
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: want to make decisions about the curriculum.
• 4:14
  Speaker 2: These parents did not wish to.
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: Change the curriculum like some of them might have wished
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: on the margins to change them if they had their brothers.
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: But their request is simply, can we just pull our
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: kids out of this part of instruction? And there's this telling.
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: It's a little long, it's two minutes, but I want
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: you to listen to the Montgomery County lawyer speak to
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: Justice Gorsich about one of the books that they introduced
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: as early as three years old, and just think about
• 4:45
  Speaker 1: the fact that parents have to bring this to the
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: Supreme Court to be adjudicated. Here's Justice Gorsus talking to
• 4:53
  Speaker 1: the school board's lawyer.
• 4:56
  Speaker 6: What age do you in Montgomery County teach students normally
• 5:00
  Speaker 6: about human sexuality?
• 5:03
  Speaker 5: I think that it begins in either fourth or fifth grade.
• 5:07
  Speaker 7: The Human Sexuality class.
• 5:09
  Speaker 5: Family Life and Human Sexuality curriculum. I'm not entirely sure.
• 5:13
  Speaker 6: It starts in fourth or fifth grade. I think, is
• 5:15
  Speaker 6: there anything you can point us to in the record on.
• 5:17
  Speaker 5: That, I don't think so?
• 5:19
  Speaker 7: Okay. And second, these books are being used in English class.
• 5:25
  Speaker 5: The division between English class and other things in a
• 5:28
  Speaker 5: second grade classroom doesn't really exist. You're sort of in
• 5:30
  Speaker 5: a room with a teacher.
• 5:31
  Speaker 6: And sometimes I appreciate that I went to second grade too,
• 5:35
  Speaker 6: but it's part of the English curriculum that these books
• 5:40
  Speaker 6: are being used in. That's I thought that was.
• 5:42
  Speaker 5: Yeah. I'm not fighting the premise.
• 5:44
  Speaker 6: I'm just saying, it's not the math class, it's not
• 5:46
  Speaker 6: the human sexuality class.
• 5:47
  Speaker 5: It's it is certainly not the human sexuality class. I'm
• 5:51
  Speaker 5: just sort of fighting the premise that there's a neat disciser.
• 5:53
  Speaker 6: Okay, And they're being used in English language instruction at
• 5:58
  Speaker 6: age three, some of them.
• 6:00
  Speaker 5: So Pride Puppy was the book that was used for
• 6:03
  Speaker 5: the pre kindergarten curriculum. That's no longer in the curriculum.
• 6:06
  Speaker 6: That's the one where they are supposed to look for
• 6:07
  Speaker 6: the leather and things and bondage things like that.
• 6:11
  Speaker 5: It's not bomb site a woman and a leather.
• 6:13
  Speaker 7: Sex worker, right, No, no, it's not correct.
• 6:15
  Speaker 3: No, gosh, I read it directly.
• 6:21
  Speaker 5: The leather that they're pointing to is a woman in
• 6:23
  Speaker 5: a leather jacket and one of the words is drag.
• 6:26
  Speaker 7: Queen in this and they're supposed to look for those.
• 6:29
  Speaker 5: It is an option at the end of the book.
• 6:30
  Speaker 6: Correct, Okay, And you're you've included these in the English
• 6:36
  Speaker 6: language curriculum rather than the Human Sexuality curriculum to influence students.
• 6:43
  Speaker 7: Is that fair? That's what the district court found.
• 6:47
  Speaker 5: I think to the extent the district Court found that
• 6:49
  Speaker 5: it was to influence. It was to influence them towards
• 6:51
  Speaker 5: civility then natural consequence of being exposed.
• 6:54
  Speaker 7: Whatever, But to influence them.
• 6:57
  Speaker 5: In the manner that I just mentioned.
• 6:58
  Speaker 2: Yes, what a I enjoy that. Whatever. There's a couple
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: of things happening here.
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: One Gourse is just pointing out you're introducing this to
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: three year olds because you didn't put it in the Human.
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: Sexuality which starts much later.
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: You smuggled it into three year olds in pre K
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: under the English guidelines. And then he goes on to
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: describe some of the things that are in this book,
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: and he does get it slightly wrong that this is
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: not a sex worker. There is a drag queen in
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: the book. There is a piece of There is a
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: leather garment to which students are supposed to point at
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: some point, and it is just it's like a lady
• 7:37
  Speaker 1: wearing a leather jacket.
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: It's chaps.
• 7:40
  Speaker 3: But is it a drag queen wearing a leather joe?
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: It possibly everyone is a confusing and uncertain gender identification
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: in this book. But again the idea and the district
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: is the district has also admitted in lower courts that
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: the point of introducing this was to influence children. That
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: was the point of having this book, right, this inclusive book,
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: quote unquote, was to influence children in a direction by
• 8:10
  Speaker 1: the way the parents have lost at the lower courts
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: because sanity could not be understood there.
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: And I'm just trying to imagine, like.
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: My parents in the eighties having to go to the
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: Supreme Court to say, like maybe a book with a
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: drag queen in it should not be presented to three
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: year olds. That's the conversation we must have. Those are
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: the scraps of sanity that Montgomery County parents must go
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: to the mats form.
• 8:37
  Speaker 4: Right, it's crazy because when you tell the story to people,
• 8:42
  Speaker 4: I think just the normies listening and the normies who
• 8:46
  Speaker 4: we love are like, this can't be happening. This can't
• 8:49
  Speaker 4: be happening. But this is at the Supreme Court and
• 8:52
  Speaker 4: it is happening. And I have to tell you also
• 8:55
  Speaker 4: that one of the kind of scarier things of the
• 8:57
  Speaker 4: last few years was that the other side did such
• 9:01
  Speaker 4: a great job of portraying this kind of thing as
• 9:05
  Speaker 4: book banning. So book banning. If you don't wand want
• 9:09
  Speaker 4: Pride Puppy read to your three year old three year old, right,
• 9:13
  Speaker 4: that is an example of book banning by these people.
• 9:16
  Speaker 4: So and I have seen you know it's been pulled,
• 9:21
  Speaker 4: this banning banning quote unquote, these kinds of books did
• 9:25
  Speaker 4: not pull well.
• 9:27
  Speaker 3: It's very interesting.
• 9:28
  Speaker 4: That they actually got this to be a problem, that
• 9:33
  Speaker 4: taking these kinds of books out of schools became a
• 9:35
  Speaker 4: problem and an issue. But when you hear what's in
• 9:39
  Speaker 4: the books, it really changes people's minds.
• 9:41
  Speaker 5: Well.
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: And so one of the things that tripped up the
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: lawyer in this case for the school board is that
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: the justices had read these books, they had seen what
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: was in them. And this is a This is a
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: straw man that the left often uses, particularly at high
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: school and middle school levels, where they're like, this is
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: just a graphic novel, and then you actually see some
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: of the graphic novel or the parents those one of
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: my favorite moves. The parents will read the graphic novel
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: at a school board meeting and the school board will
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: be like, you can't say that at our meeting, and
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: they're like, well, that sort of proves my point, right.
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: So some of the titles of these books for very
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: very young kids again Born Ready, the True Story of
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: a Boy named Penelope, Rainbow Revolutionaries, fifty LGBTQ plus people
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: who made history. And suddenly Montgomery County is faced with
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: a very diverse crowd of objectors to these titles. And
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: they were sort of like, wait, wait, wait, we're good libs.
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: Why are the ethnic minorities in our district upset about this?
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: And that's because they're often more normal than the libs.
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: The white no true are not the normal. Right.
• 10:48
  Speaker 4: So I've told the story on here before, but I
• 10:51
  Speaker 4: moved to Florida from a very white liberal neighborhood of
• 10:54
  Speaker 4: Park Slope. My kids were given books to take home
• 10:59
  Speaker 4: from their school so often, and it was always on
• 11:04
  Speaker 4: a trans topic.
• 11:05
  Speaker 3: We have like five copies I only have three kids.
• 11:07
  Speaker 3: We have five copies.
• 11:08
  Speaker 4: Of Julian is a Mermaid, which is a mad a
• 11:11
  Speaker 4: little boy who wants to be a girl, and et cetera.
• 11:14
  Speaker 4: It's crazy how openly this has pushed in some areas,
• 11:18
  Speaker 4: and the fact that they're getting pushed back and that's
• 11:21
  Speaker 4: gone all the way to.
• 11:22
  Speaker 3: The Supreme Court.
• 11:23
  Speaker 4: I love that this is going to get attention to
• 11:25
  Speaker 4: this because I think people just don't understand how prevalent
• 11:29
  Speaker 4: this is.
• 11:30
  Speaker 7: Well.
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: And you know, I'm a person who look, if my
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: kids came across Pride Puppy, I'm not.
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: Going to be like, oh no, right, oh they yeah,
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: shield their eyes whatever.
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: I do think it's weird if you want to be
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: pushing that at three to my child. I get to
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: make those decisions. And also, the prevalence is what you're
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: talking about where I mean, it's changed a bit in
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: the vibe shift. We used to go to Barnes and
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: Noble or any bookstore. I actually, to illustrate this, I
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: went to a bookstore in pennsylv And I saw a
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: children's display that had all, I think, almost exclusively non
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: woke titles.
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: And I don't mean anti woke titles.
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: I just mean classic children's books, things that are stories
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: about children that are not trans stories about children that
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: are not race related.
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: Like it, if you go to a Barnes and Noble,
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: that's almost exclusively.
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: What you see, or was up until like a year
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: and a half ago, right, And so the prevalence is
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: weird where what you're being offered and what you're being
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: pushed is almost exclusively this stuff. And every time I
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: read a novel for my kids that's come out in
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: the last five years, I'm like, just brace for it,
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: like whatever it is, it's coming, right, it's coming.
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: They can't do it without.
• 12:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I think we're going to look back at this
• 12:49
  Speaker 4: era and see how insane it was. And it's not
• 12:54
  Speaker 4: just children's books either. One of my favorite fiction writers
• 12:57
  Speaker 4: is a guy named Blake Nelson. He wrote a lot
• 12:59
  Speaker 4: of nine.
• 13:00
  Speaker 3: These books, like Girl It Goes Wade into a movie.
• 13:02
  Speaker 4: He had this piece on his substack the other day
• 13:05
  Speaker 4: where he was talking about how every book he picks
• 13:08
  Speaker 4: up by a female writer is anti men, and he's like.
• 13:12
  Speaker 3: I just don't want to read this anymore. And he's
• 13:15
  Speaker 3: a left of central guy.
• 13:16
  Speaker 4: Who would it is actively seeking out female writers to
• 13:21
  Speaker 4: read and is just like, I don't want to read
• 13:23
  Speaker 4: about how I'm trash, and I think this whole era
• 13:27
  Speaker 4: is going to look so dated when we get past it,
• 13:31
  Speaker 4: if we get past it.
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: Well, And this is one of those things too where
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: Greg Lukianov calls it the gauntlet of conformity, where in
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: order to get a book published as a woman writer,
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: let's say, if that's not in your book, right, you
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: ain't getting to the next level of the process. That
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: thing's not getting published, and it will take a couple
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: of years for that to work itself out of the system,
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: unless like you're you and me and you can maybe
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: get an explicitly political right published.
• 14:00
  Speaker 4: Or a conservative publisher specifically. Yeah, but it's sad that
• 14:04
  Speaker 4: it has to come to that. And you know, Mary
• 14:07
  Speaker 4: Margaret I forgot her last name from Daily Wire all
• 14:10
  Speaker 4: in right from Daily Wire.
• 14:13
  Speaker 3: Somebody called her.
• 14:14
  Speaker 4: A maga writer or a maga journalist the other day
• 14:18
  Speaker 4: because she reports from the White House briefing room, and
• 14:21
  Speaker 4: her comment was, if I'm maga reporter. Who are what
• 14:25
  Speaker 4: are you guys reporters?
• 14:27
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 14:27
  Speaker 4: So I think that when we say, like, oh, only
• 14:29
  Speaker 4: conservative publishers would publish this kind of book, who are
• 14:33
  Speaker 4: the other publishers? You know, they're all political leftist publishers
• 14:37
  Speaker 4: and they kind of need to be ascribed.
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: Well, it sounded like the justices were friendly to the
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: argument of the parents in this case.
• 14:46
  Speaker 2: To me, it makes absolute.
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: Sense that they should just have an option to not
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: do this kind of content. And one of the things
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: I noted that I think is such a huge difference
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: between my childhood and the way I'm raising my kids.
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: I was raised in a liberal area. My kids are
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: raised in a liberal area. In order for me to
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: get them in just neutral activities, almost they're almost exclusively
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: religious activities, right, because explicitly religious is normal now as
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: opposed to secular, which used to be normal and now
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: has become liberal religious.
• 15:20
  Speaker 3: Right, it's so crazy.
• 15:22
  Speaker 4: Oh, this is really bane of my existence because I'm
• 15:25
  Speaker 4: not religious and this I mean or not observant in
• 15:28
  Speaker 4: Jewish terms.
• 15:29
  Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, it's really tough.
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: Well, that's what I was saying, Like, even if you're
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: not particularly religious, if you want your kid in a
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: basically normal craft group or scouting group, Like you just
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: pick the one that's sort of religious and they might
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: just be like a normal eighties group. That's my this
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: is my tactic, this is how I go about it.
• 15:51
  Speaker 4: Yeah, how far we've come. I think this is going
• 15:54
  Speaker 4: to be nine zero at the Supreme Court, and if
• 15:57
  Speaker 4: it's not, I'm going to be surprised and appalled.
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: So a big win would be great for parents everywhere
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: and a nice rebuke to people who have gotten us
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: to the point where you have to go to the
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: Supreme Court to say, can I please.
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: Off my kid out of pride? Puppy right people?
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and they wonder why I'm not in the public
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: schools era.
• 16:16
  Speaker 4: Now I we'll be right back on normally. Our next
• 16:23
  Speaker 4: topic is the Pete Hegseeth story, which is continuing to
• 16:29
  Speaker 4: be an ongoing story. I went pretty hard to support
• 16:34
  Speaker 4: Pete before he was nominated or when he was nominated,
• 16:38
  Speaker 4: and now I feel very defensive of him in this position.
• 16:43
  Speaker 4: I think that he has had some missteps. I can't
• 16:47
  Speaker 4: say that the Signal group chat was a moment of
• 16:52
  Speaker 4: you know where I thought things were going amazing for him,
• 16:55
  Speaker 4: But it does seem like the knives are out for
• 16:58
  Speaker 4: him beyond any of that. So let's get into it.
• 17:05
  Speaker 4: Dan Caldwell, he was a senior advisor to heg Seth,
• 17:08
  Speaker 4: has been placed on administrative leave for leaking information to
• 17:14
  Speaker 4: the media. And he went on Tucker Carlson and he
• 17:17
  Speaker 4: said that none of that. You know, the language that
• 17:20
  Speaker 4: they used was he didn't leak classified information, which left
• 17:25
  Speaker 4: a lot of room to say he did leak information.
• 17:28
  Speaker 4: I'm sorry, good riddance. Good people who leak information to
• 17:33
  Speaker 4: the media should be kicked out. And I think that
• 17:36
  Speaker 4: some of what is going on with Pete heg Seth
• 17:40
  Speaker 4: is very inside baseball. We'll try to get into it here.
• 17:43
  Speaker 4: We'll try to keep it as normy as possible. But
• 17:46
  Speaker 4: John Oulat resigned last week as a Pentagon spokesperson, Yes,
• 17:50
  Speaker 4: and he wrote an article in political trashing heg Sath.
• 17:54
  Speaker 4: Then Donald Trump Junior took to X and said, I've
• 17:57
  Speaker 4: been hearing for years that he oh yet works his
• 18:01
  Speaker 4: ass off to subvert my father's agenda.
• 18:04
  Speaker 3: That ends today.
• 18:05
  Speaker 4: He's officially exiled from our movement. I do think that
• 18:10
  Speaker 4: some of this really is a split.
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: On the right policy.
• 18:15
  Speaker 4: Yeah, on policy.
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: So Eli Lake is always interesting to read on this
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: stuff because he has a lot of defense contacts and
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: policy contacts. So he wrote in the Free Press, and
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: he just gives a nice, like three paragraph outlay of
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: like kind of what the lay of the land his here.
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: It's been nearly one hundred days into the Trump presidency
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: and his administration appears bitterly divided over what to do
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: about Iran Secretary of State was not present for the
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: negotiations between the Mulla's diplomats and Trump's personal friend and
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: special on voice, Steve Whitcoff. Mago world influencers have staked
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: out opposing positions on whether to bomb Moren's nuclear facilities
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: or go for an Obama style deal. The battle is
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: at its nastiest inside the Pentagon, where the restrainer wing
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: of the administration and the more hawkish Defense Secretary Pete
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: Hegsas with whom we both I think agree on this,
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: are now in direct bureaucratic conflict. On Tuesday, he Seth
• 19:02
  Speaker 1: told Fox News that three recently fired senior officials are
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: now attempting to leak and sabotage to President's agenda. But
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: is this civil war about foreign policy ideology? Or is
• 19:11
  Speaker 1: it about a breach and trust between a cabinet secretary
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: and his closest advisors. Either way, a deep friendship has
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: been torn asunder. So the question is is the underlying
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: thing the foreign policy differences or is it a personality
• 19:24
  Speaker 1: dispute that is being sort of using the foreign policy
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: dispute as its cover, and people are sort of knifing
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: as they sometimes do in Washington. It is interesting because
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: Caldwell and several of these other folks have been very
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: close allies of.
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: Hegsath for a long time.
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: This guy's not new to the crew, right, and so
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: that part is concerning in Oliat And I don't know
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: what the real deal is on his motivations, but his
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: peace and Politico also puts in there kind of some
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: pretty flowery language about the things they were able to
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: accomplish with at Defense and the things that he was
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: proud of, and how he wants this administration to work.
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: So I'm a little confused about what's happening here.
• 20:10
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, I try not to be the when
• 20:15
  Speaker 4: you have a hammer, the whole world like looks like
• 20:17
  Speaker 4: a nail. But a lot of this to me is
• 20:19
  Speaker 4: also tied into kind of the growing anti Semitism on
• 20:23
  Speaker 4: the right, and I have been foolishly on the for
• 20:28
  Speaker 4: you tab on x, which has really fallen off recently.
• 20:31
  Speaker 4: Actually a lot of people have mentioned it, like it
• 20:33
  Speaker 4: was really good for a minute there and now it's like,
• 20:35
  Speaker 4: I actually don't want to see any of these people.
• 20:37
  Speaker 3: They're not for me.
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: Mine is real hit and miss I get.
• 20:40
  Speaker 1: I get this is a weird thing, but I get
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: a lot of Hailey Bieber news in for you.
• 20:44
  Speaker 3: I actually would prefer that to what.
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: I don't understand how it happened, Like I just clicked
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: on one too many Selena and Haley conspiracy theories.
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: Here I am so and aside.
• 20:54
  Speaker 4: So I'll get like an account like Patriot one nine seven,
• 20:57
  Speaker 4: four to two, and they'll be spit absolute fire about
• 21:02
  Speaker 4: like somebody in the administration. And I'm not talking about
• 21:05
  Speaker 4: like Marco Rubio or even like Pam Bondi, but sort
• 21:08
  Speaker 4: of like the real deal mega members like Pete Hegsett,
• 21:11
  Speaker 4: dom Gino, Cash Patel. And then I'll click over to
• 21:14
  Speaker 4: the page and most of the tweets are Cash Bateel
• 21:18
  Speaker 4: is a sellout, And then the next tweet will almost
• 21:21
  Speaker 4: always be and the Jews did nine to eleven and
• 21:24
  Speaker 4: so I feel like there is this and you know,
• 21:27
  Speaker 4: it's a through line kind of from this jew hatred
• 21:30
  Speaker 4: to trying to bring down the Trump administration. I don't
• 21:34
  Speaker 4: know if these accounts are American or a foreign op.
• 21:37
  Speaker 4: It obviously could be very much a foreign op. But
• 21:41
  Speaker 4: there's absolutely an online movement to seem like the right
• 21:45
  Speaker 4: is turning on the Trump administration, and it's driven by
• 21:48
  Speaker 4: this conspiratorial anti Semitic gunch. And to see these people,
• 21:55
  Speaker 4: you know, again they're anonymous on X but then watch
• 21:58
  Speaker 4: their kind of insan play out in real time elsewhere
• 22:03
  Speaker 4: is concerning.
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't love the Caldwell to Tucker pipeline. As
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: soon as you leave, you go straight there.
• 22:11
  Speaker 4: Well, the question is who was called Well leaking to
• 22:14
  Speaker 4: And the answer is maybe the guy who tweeted about
• 22:17
  Speaker 4: the I'm not going to war where Iran at a
• 22:19
  Speaker 4: really random time in the last few weeks.
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: So well, and he says he didn't like you said.
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: He says he didn't classified info. We have yet to
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: see if he's under investigation. It doesn't I mean not
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: to be a sap, but it does make me a
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: little sad that this seems like several major longtime friendships, yeah,
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: have fallen apart hearing. And the thing for heg Seth, Look,
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: I don't think Trump is getting rid of him, because
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: I think Trump was invested him in him and liked
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: the way that he fought and got over the hill
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: in his confirmation hearings. Heg Seth was treated unfairly during
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: the investigations of his personal life and past during his
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: confirmation hearings, and he was right to fight back, and
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: I think that's one of the reasons he did get confirmed. Yeah,
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: the signal stuff is boneheaded and they need to This
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: is what we said after the original signal story broke, right,
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: what are you doing to make sure that none.
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: Of this happens again?
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and you have a story of another signal chat
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: that existed, right, so whatever that is.
• 23:17
  Speaker 4: Maybe that one is kind of unnamed sources and we
• 23:20
  Speaker 4: don't really know, but the first one was really bad,
• 23:24
  Speaker 4: you know, so whatever, even if the second one doesn't exist,
• 23:27
  Speaker 4: the first one was no good.
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: Yes, can we just nip that in the butt, make
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: sure that we're taking care of that. And then I
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: do think for my hesitation such that it was on
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: Hegseth was about management and if this is the drama
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: that has fallen out, Yeah, part of his job is
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: to manage this so that you do not have this
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: drama that ends up spilling over and perhaps hurting the
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: administration's goals. Although I'm not sure what the administration's goals
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: are either, because there is a lot of talk about
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: some deal with Iran, and I'm like, why why would Yeah,
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: can we not be depoa which is the Obama deal
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: that you turned you know, you got rid of.
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: So much that.
• 24:06
  Speaker 4: Yeah, And I want to just say unequivocally, I pose
• 24:10
  Speaker 4: war with Iran. I feel like the options presented to
• 24:15
  Speaker 4: us always are we need to make a deal with
• 24:17
  Speaker 4: Iran like Obama did, or we go to war like
• 24:20
  Speaker 4: I feel like there's some other things in between there
• 24:23
  Speaker 4: that we can potentially work out. And a lot of
• 24:25
  Speaker 4: this again, to bring it back to Israel, is US
• 24:29
  Speaker 4: giving Israel permission to do what they need to do
• 24:32
  Speaker 4: to keep themselves safe and sort of keep Iran contained.
• 24:36
  Speaker 2: Win.
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: By the way, Iran is basically naked before the world
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: because many of their defenses have been already taken out.
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's part of it too.
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: There's a time there's a time crunch here so before
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: they rebuild their defenses, you could have a clearer shot.
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 24:51
  Speaker 4: And of course there was the night where the missiles
• 24:54
  Speaker 4: took like ten hours to get to Israel, and everyone
• 24:56
  Speaker 4: just like it, partied in Israel and then went to
• 24:58
  Speaker 4: the bunkers because they were like, the missiles.
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: Aren't even here. Set in alarm, right in alarm.
• 25:05
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 25:06
  Speaker 4: John and Rassic from five for Fighting actually had a
• 25:08
  Speaker 4: concert that night, and he said that everybody was like,
• 25:10
  Speaker 4: we have reservations to a restaurant, so we're going and
• 25:15
  Speaker 4: then we'll be at the bunker when you know, when
• 25:17
  Speaker 4: they get closer. Anyway, Trump defended Hegseth. He said, ask
• 25:21
  Speaker 4: the whotis how he's doing.
• 25:23
  Speaker 3: And you and I have.
• 25:24
  Speaker 4: Talked about how we saw Hegseth as a magnet for
• 25:28
  Speaker 4: young men to rejoin the military. I can tell you
• 25:31
  Speaker 4: as of last week, the army has enlisted fifty one,
• 25:34
  Speaker 4: eight hundred and thirty seven recruits, or eighty five percent
• 25:38
  Speaker 4: of its goal for twenty twenty five, which is sixty
• 25:41
  Speaker 4: one thousand. They enlisted nearly three hundred and fifty soldiers
• 25:46
  Speaker 4: every day in December twenty twenty four. It was the
• 25:49
  Speaker 4: most productive december for the military branch in fifteen years.
• 25:54
  Speaker 3: I believe in Pete Hegseth.
• 25:56
  Speaker 4: I hope he holds on and I that this is
• 26:00
  Speaker 4: a split that is contained in this administration.
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: I'm with you and I'm with them. I'm like one,
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: I want the administration to succeed. Yeah, not an a
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: JCPOA oh yeah yeah that talk is making me nervous,
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: but yes, and such that it will succeed. That you
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: need somebody who is you know, backed by good people
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: and keeping those people within the circle.
• 26:25
  Speaker 4: We're going to take a short break and come right
• 26:27
  Speaker 4: back with normally.
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: Shall we move on to still mad?
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: Bro?
• 26:33
  Speaker 5: Yeah?
• 26:33
  Speaker 3: Are you still mad?
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: Bro?
• 26:34
  Speaker 3: I am like so, ma newly mad Bro? Why do
• 26:38
  Speaker 3: they keep making me mad?
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: Bro?
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 26:42
  Speaker 3: Go ahead.
• 26:42
  Speaker 1: I'm about to get really mad because I just got
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: David's Wige's book in the mail, which is an abundance
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: of caution American schools, the virus and a story of
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: bad decisions. And I would have even just added a
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: very bad decision.
• 26:54
  Speaker 3: In there, super bad decision.
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: So I keep saying I'm looking forward to reading this book,
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: But am I? Because I'm going to be lived for
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: like three days.
• 27:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you're gonna have to relive all of that. But again,
• 27:06
  Speaker 4: these people are making us relive it anyway, so we
• 27:10
  Speaker 4: may as well get mad.
• 27:12
  Speaker 3: And that's it. That's right.
• 27:15
  Speaker 4: So Claire Leyman, she is the founder and editor of Couillette.
• 27:20
  Speaker 4: She was a COVID zealot. She tweeted really crazy things
• 27:26
  Speaker 4: at the time. She lives in Australia. Australia went absolutely bananas.
• 27:30
  Speaker 4: They locked down in a really serious way for a
• 27:33
  Speaker 4: very long time. I met a woman in Florida who
• 27:37
  Speaker 4: moved here from Australia and her talking about it, she
• 27:40
  Speaker 4: just broke into tears, like it was a trying time.
• 27:45
  Speaker 4: So Claire tweeted out a Tyler Cohen article we'll get
• 27:50
  Speaker 4: to that in a second in the Free Press. But
• 27:53
  Speaker 4: she said her tweet was lablique possible but not proven.
• 27:57
  Speaker 4: No evidence of international collusion with China NPIs, which means
• 28:02
  Speaker 4: non pharmaceutical interventions. Yeah, showed measurable effectiveness vaccine messaging. Optimistic
• 28:10
  Speaker 4: claims do not equal deliberate lies, and obvious hyperbole does
• 28:15
  Speaker 4: not make for a compelling argument. And I was like,
• 28:19
  Speaker 4: I am sending this to Mary Catherine Ham because we
• 28:21
  Speaker 4: are talking about this tomorrow.
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's wrong. Wrong, wrong, wrong, right wrong.
• 28:27
  Speaker 4: The NPI is more than anything else.
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: I know.
• 28:29
  Speaker 4: Everybody has their own kind of bugaboos about this kind
• 28:32
  Speaker 4: of thing. I know for some people it's vaccine messaging.
• 28:36
  Speaker 4: For me, it's the non pharmaceutical interventions worked. No, they
• 28:41
  Speaker 4: didn't know, they didn't and masking did not work, distancing
• 28:46
  Speaker 4: did not work.
• 28:47
  Speaker 3: None of it worked.
• 28:48
  Speaker 4: And I need people to accept that and internalize it
• 28:51
  Speaker 4: because should we have COVID twenty twenty nine, I need
• 28:56
  Speaker 4: people to not make the same mistakes again.
• 28:58
  Speaker 3: So it's really.
• 28:58
  Speaker 4: Important to continue to say these things didn't work and
• 29:03
  Speaker 4: we can't do them again. Lockdowns did not work at all,
• 29:08
  Speaker 4: And that's you know where I am on this.
• 29:10
  Speaker 3: I am still mad, bro.
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm still mad, bro. And one of the things
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: I'm mad about, and we can get to the Tyler
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: Cown piece, is that so few who continue to say
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: these things really weren't so bad will contend with the
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: fact that freedom itself is worth something. Right that what
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: DeSantis did, which was in general to default to the
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: side of freedom as much freedom as is possible in
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: an emergency situation for as many people as possible, while
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: trying to do responsible things that in and of itself
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: is much closer to pandemic plans of the past, to
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: actual plans that Fauci tossed out the window, to the
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: American spirit, to our actual constitution. There's given that pesty constitution.
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: No one gives value to that part of it. They're
• 30:08
  Speaker 1: just like, I mean, yes, we destroyed your lives, but
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: like not as bad as you think we.
• 30:12
  Speaker 3: Did, right, And I are like, we had to do it.
• 30:14
  Speaker 4: We didn't know that. We didn't know really bothers me
• 30:17
  Speaker 4: and you bring up to Santis. But you know, it's
• 30:20
  Speaker 4: interesting because he had taken some precautions, and I think
• 30:24
  Speaker 4: Florida had taken some precautions, but as they got new
• 30:28
  Speaker 4: information and realized that these precautions weren't working, they abandoned
• 30:33
  Speaker 4: those precautions. So I lived in Florida for we call
• 30:37
  Speaker 4: it our Florida Test Run for about five and a
• 30:39
  Speaker 4: half months in twenty twenty one January to middle of
• 30:44
  Speaker 4: May twenty twenty one.
• 30:46
  Speaker 3: People were masking.
• 30:47
  Speaker 4: My kids were masked in public school. We were kind
• 30:51
  Speaker 4: of the cold. I mean, we were very loose for
• 30:53
  Speaker 4: New York, but we were kind of tight for Florida. Yeah,
• 30:56
  Speaker 4: we were like looked around crowded restaurants and we're like,
• 30:58
  Speaker 4: these people are gonna die, you.
• 31:00
  Speaker 2: Know, you know, I culture shock.
• 31:05
  Speaker 3: I understand, you know.
• 31:06
  Speaker 4: I often tell the story of my friend John Cardillo.
• 31:09
  Speaker 4: I walked into a restaurant and he was sitting at
• 31:11
  Speaker 4: the bar, and that was something that wouldn't happen in
• 31:13
  Speaker 4: New York I think for another year plus. No, I
• 31:15
  Speaker 4: was like sitting at a bar during this crazy time.
• 31:18
  Speaker 5: I don't know.
• 31:20
  Speaker 4: So I get that people were afraid. I get that
• 31:22
  Speaker 4: people didn't know. I think that all of that needs
• 31:25
  Speaker 4: to be taken into consideration.
• 31:27
  Speaker 3: But but we figured it out, and the people who
• 31:32
  Speaker 3: maintained the.
• 31:33
  Speaker 4: Things that we knew didn't work for a very long time,
• 31:37
  Speaker 4: they should be held accountable. They absolutely knew at the
• 31:41
  Speaker 4: time that you and I knew.
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: This is the part, too, is that your intentional ignorance
• 31:48
  Speaker 1: of the facts. A lot of people were intentionally ignorant
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: on school openings because to them it was the correct,
• 31:55
  Speaker 1: left coded.
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: Vision, yes, to be out of school. And this is
• 31:59
  Speaker 2: what I call it facts. They didn't want to know.
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: They didn't want to know Achy facts because those Achy
• 32:04
  Speaker 1: facts were write coded and to know those or to
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: certainly to profess them would have made you icky and
• 32:09
  Speaker 1: write coded. This is the paragraph of the Tyler Cowen
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: Free Press piece that a lot of people take issue with,
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: and something that I think he's not wrestling with, which
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: is like, there was not only Willferral ignorance.
• 32:22
  Speaker 2: But there was also lying.
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: There was also very obvious confessed lying that we have
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: in emails and testimony, like we know people were lying.
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: He says, a lot of people do not want to
• 32:32
  Speaker 2: admit it.
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: But when it comes to the COVID nineteen pandemic, the
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: elites by and large actually got a lot right. Most importantly,
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: the people who got vaccinated fared much better than the
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: people who did not. We also got a vaccine in
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: record time, against most expectations, Operation work speed was a success.
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: Long COVID did turn out to be a real thing.
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: This one gets me because he's an economist. Low personal
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: mobility levels meant that often lockdowns were not the real issue.
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: Most of that economic activity was going away. In any case,
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: most states should have ended lockdown sooner, but they mattered
• 33:06
  Speaker 1: less than many critics have suggested. Furthermore, in contrast to
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: what many were predicting, these restrictions on our liberty proved
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: entirely temporary.
• 33:14
  Speaker 2: Not that mean, not necessarily true.
• 33:16
  Speaker 1: And also your freedom matters during the time that it
• 33:19
  Speaker 1: was restricted.
• 33:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah, back to the whole freedom mattering. But also people suffered.
• 33:23
  Speaker 4: I knew gym owners, for example, in New Jersey who
• 33:27
  Speaker 4: they suffered. They didn't sleep at night, they worried about
• 33:30
  Speaker 4: their business, they worried about their employees. I took my
• 33:32
  Speaker 4: middle son to the barber the other day in Florida
• 33:35
  Speaker 4: and the guy had moved to Florida during COVID and
• 33:38
  Speaker 4: he was still very enraged about the fact that he
• 33:42
  Speaker 4: was forced to shut down. And his comment was, you know,
• 33:45
  Speaker 4: liquor stores were open, home depot was open, all the
• 33:49
  Speaker 4: big businesses were open. I had to be closed. And
• 33:52
  Speaker 4: he and I reminisced about how Governor Andrewcomo, you know,
• 33:55
  Speaker 4: would go on TV and be very solemn and about
• 34:00
  Speaker 4: how great a job he was doing, but he would
• 34:03
  Speaker 4: show up with a fresh haircut every few days, like
• 34:05
  Speaker 4: where's he getting his haircut?
• 34:07
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 34:07
  Speaker 1: Right? Of course, you know, they all were full of it.
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: That was my favorite thing during the pandemics. I was
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: just tweet these stories where Nancy Pelosi gets her hair
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: done and be like, we're all in this together asterisk.
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: It's just an asterisk because it's not all of us together.
• 34:20
  Speaker 1: Sir Cowan's piece is called our elites don't deserve this
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: much hatred, and he has some points that are worth considering,
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: which is like, but I think he's like, he's just
• 34:27
  Speaker 1: sort of mashing it all together, and he's ignoring the
• 34:30
  Speaker 1: bad behavior of the elites. He says, a truly elite
• 34:33
  Speaker 1: method is based in science, open in quiry, and truth
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: seeking behavior. That's true, and I love to sniff those
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: people out, and that's what I did during COVID and
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: found that they were not the people who had been
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: crowned elites. The people who were critical thinkers were often
• 34:48
  Speaker 1: not those who were blessed to give the.
• 34:50
  Speaker 2: Message exactly and sanctioned to give the message.
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: Furthermore, I just looked it up because the point about
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: the economic activity bothered me LA times, which is of
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: course friendly to California's approach. Compared California and Florida similar populations,
• 35:06
  Speaker 1: although Florida's older and unemployment in December twenty twenty in California,
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: so that his hypothesis is that without the lockdowns, you
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: were going to lose this economic activity. Anyway, So let's
• 35:19
  Speaker 1: do harsh lockdown versus not lockdown. California twelve December twenty
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: twenty nine point three percent unemployment, Florida five point one.
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: By February, Florida's was down to that's twenty twenty one,
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: three point three, and California is still hanging out around
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: five because they had slowly opened back up.
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: Florida retained its like economy from parks and amusement rides
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: and all that, you know, the Disney stuff. California did not.
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: Jobs lost California one point six to three million, Florida
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: five hundred and eighty k. That's almost three times almost
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: three times more in California.
• 36:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah, And there's something to be said for all of that,
• 36:07
  Speaker 4: and for the people who were losing those jobs. And
• 36:11
  Speaker 4: I called them, you know, the pajama class. Some people
• 36:13
  Speaker 4: say the laptop class. And I admit I am part
• 36:15
  Speaker 4: of that class. I Tuesday in my pajamas, don't work
• 36:18
  Speaker 4: on my laptop.
• 36:19
  Speaker 3: That's me.
• 36:21
  Speaker 4: But the thing is that those people didn't have to
• 36:23
  Speaker 4: worry about losing their jobs. And I've met and I
• 36:25
  Speaker 4: know so many people that did have to worry about it.
• 36:29
  Speaker 4: The lockdowns didn't help they did not help prevent spread,
• 36:33
  Speaker 4: and that is kind of the endgame here, I would think.
• 36:38
  Speaker 4: So don't tell me now in twenty twenty five that
• 36:40
  Speaker 4: they worked, or that some part of it worked.
• 36:43
  Speaker 3: And you know, I tweeted out that.
• 36:44
  Speaker 4: Article and I said, it's now impossible to find anyone
• 36:48
  Speaker 4: who supported school closures during COVID, Like, find someone, find
• 36:51
  Speaker 4: someone who's like, yeah, that was the right thing to do.
• 36:53
  Speaker 4: It seems like everyone wanted schools open. No one called
• 36:56
  Speaker 4: me a teacher killer. Randy Weingarten herself fought to open schools,
• 37:00
  Speaker 4: but who was she fighting, you know, I'm.
• 37:03
  Speaker 2: Like, so strange.
• 37:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Actually, the Randy Winegarden lie is so blatant because
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: Randy Weingarten backed her unions suing Florida and rond de
• 37:14
  Speaker 1: Santis to keep schools closed.
• 37:17
  Speaker 2: I mean, you were literally on the other side of.
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: Legal action to make this happen. I'm going to read
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: one more from the cow and Piece to take you off.
• 37:23
  Speaker 1: One of the reasons it takes me off is because
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: I think of him as like a libertarian ish economists, right,
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: so it seems like maybe he should have more a
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: little more criticism for these things, not reopening the schools
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: was a big mistake and meant a lot of lost learning.
• 37:38
  Speaker 2: But plenty of elites protested at the time.
• 37:42
  Speaker 3: Come on, where were these elites?
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: Which ones?
• 37:44
  Speaker 3: Right?
• 37:45
  Speaker 2: I meanhich ones? Does he mean us or elites?
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: This is a perfect example of where like, yes, there
• 37:53
  Speaker 1: was a class of elites that was conformist and cowardly.
• 37:58
  Speaker 1: Those were the blessed, sanctioned elites. And then there were
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: the David's wides of the world. Yea, who did the
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: real work and who were crapped on for it frankly, aggressively.
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: And now I'm going to read this book and find
• 38:09
  Speaker 1: all the elites that protested at.
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: The time time.
• 38:12
  Speaker 4: I can't wait to hear who those elites were. Let
• 38:14
  Speaker 4: us know if we are mentioned, because.
• 38:20
  Speaker 3: Carol, I know this account.
• 38:22
  Speaker 4: On X responded to the Claire Lehman tweet about it
• 38:26
  Speaker 4: about the you know schools and all of that when
• 38:30
  Speaker 4: she linked to the Tyler Cowen piece. Alex Joffe is
• 38:33
  Speaker 4: the account and he says children who went to Zoom
• 38:36
  Speaker 4: School would agree if they could actually read. Yeah, yeah,
• 38:41
  Speaker 4: we're mad bro today, We're still mad bro.
• 38:44
  Speaker 3: We could do I mean, we could just keep going
• 38:46
  Speaker 3: on this forever.
• 38:46
  Speaker 4: This. I need accountability, and we're not only moving away
• 38:50
  Speaker 4: from accountability, we seem to be moving towards. They all
• 38:53
  Speaker 4: did the right thing, everybody acted correctly.
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: Keys closed, and just.
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: On sixty minutes this week there was a scientist talk
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: about the next virus that's gonna make COVID look like
• 39:02
  Speaker 1: a walk in the park.
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: And I'm like, you know what, you know what, girl.
• 39:05
  Speaker 4: I can't live. Yeah, I'm yeah, I'll just stay in.
• 39:10
  Speaker 3: Florida and hope for the best.
• 39:11
  Speaker 2: Actually stick with the Santas, let's.
• 39:14
  Speaker 4: Hang on to him.
• 39:15
  Speaker 3: Thanks for joining us on Normally.
• 39:17
  Speaker 4: Normally airs Tuesdays and Thursdays, and you can subscribe anywhere.
• 39:21
  Speaker 3: You get your podcasts. Get in touch with us.
• 39:23
  Speaker 4: At normallythepod at gmail dot com. Thanks for listening, and
• 39:27
  Speaker 4: when things get weird, act normally