Latest / Rosters to Rings Podcast / Yamamoto Haunts the Jays and What Ja Hell in Memphis?

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Yamamoto Haunts the Jays and What Ja Hell in Memphis? · Rosters to Rings Podcast

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Welcome back to Rosters to Rings everyone. I am Ryan McDonald,
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: joined as always by Thad Levine. That we have a
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: pack show today. The NFL trade deadline is taking place.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: We'll have more on that on next week's episode. We
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: can look back and analyze all the deals that went
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: down and those that didn't. We're a couple weeks now
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: into the NBA season. We have some early impressions through
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: a few weeks of NBA basketball. We'll get into that
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: on this show. And we also have listener questions and
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: for the first time, our producer why it will come
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: in ask some of the listener questions at our listeners
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: who have been great submitting. We'll get into all of
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: that and more Thad. But where I want to start
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: the show today. I think it's pretty obvious because it
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: dominated sports over the past couple weeks that the Major
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: League Baseball playoffs, specifically the World Series. And I want
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: to start with an admission Thad, that I was wrong.
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: You were wrong. You had the Dodgers winning the World
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: Series in five games. I had the Dodgers winning the
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: World Series the six game. So we both had the
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: right team, Thad. But I want to give a lot
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: of credit to the Toronto Blue Jays. They played what
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: I thought was a tremendous series, one of the best
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: world series of my lifetime, Thad, And that's where I
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: want to start this show, just with your general impressions
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: of the Dodgers winning the third World Championship in six years,
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: even though you.
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: Were slightly more right than I am. I think the
• 1:19
  Speaker 2: key takeaway is we were both wrong in our prognostication,
• 1:23
  Speaker 2: so Ryan, I thought it was exceptionally entertaining. I think
• 1:26
  Speaker 2: this was one of the best World series I've seen
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: in the last twenty years. The stars shined during this
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: World series. It was excellent for the game. It was
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: tremendous theater. Hopefully fans were watching this all over the place.
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: But a few highlights for me were that in an
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: era where executives are building out rosters that optimize for
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: offense at every single position, there was exceptional defense in
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: these games, an exceptional defense from some of the most
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: offensive players in the game. Vladimir Guerrero, for instance, a
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: dynamo at first base during this series. Tommy Edmond made
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: some exceptional plays at second base. Kk Arnandez had some
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: adventures in left field, but also had some heart stopping
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: plays out there, and I'm sure we're going to talk
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: about the catch that Andy pah has made in center
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: field that ultimately extended the chance for the Dodgers to win.
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: But just a few things to consider. I think the
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: Blue Jays may have it may look back at this
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: with a little bit of a haunt factor. They outscored
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: the Dodgers thirty four to twenty six, which over the
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: course of a regular season that should have amounted to
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: them winning four and a half games in a seven
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: game series, which would have been enough to secure the
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: World Championship. They had fewer strikeouts as hitters, they had
• 2:36
  Speaker 2: a better batting average, on base percentage, slugging percentage, and
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: the Dodgers the vaunted Dodgers offense, but the Dodgers had
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: more home runs. They out homered eleven to eight, and remarkably,
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: in the postseasons since twenty one, eighty three percent of
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: the time when you out homer your opponent, you win
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: baseball games. And that's exactly what the Dodgers did, which
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: was just incredible. You know a few other things that
• 2:59
  Speaker 2: the the Blue Jays did which made it feel like
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: everything was falling their way. Ernie Clement, a exceptional utility
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: player for them, set a major league record for thirty
• 3:08
  Speaker 2: hits in the postseason. Vladdy Guerrero was right behind him
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: with twenty nine. Those both would have set records for
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: hits in the postseason. Addison Barger hit four to eighty
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: in the postseason, which is just a remarkable figure, especially
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: for a guy who didn't spend the whole year in
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: the big leagues. He started the year at Triple A
• 3:24
  Speaker 2: from them. Treya Savage started the year at single A
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: for them, and this postseason was a coming out party
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: for them, and Toronto fans has to be ecstatic about
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: the notion of him being at the top of their rotation.
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: The Blue Jays, though devastating le Ryan, had a ninety
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: one percent chance to win the World Series and that
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: top of the ninth inning with one out, fortunes did
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: not shine on them, and so that was really tough.
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: I don't know, Ryan, what were some of your initial
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: takes watching the World Series.
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: I think the biggest takeaway for me, Thad was it
• 3:53
  Speaker 1: seemed like the Blue Jays had the World Series won
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: about three or four different times. The play at Home
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: played Smith's towed down or not was kind of Falaffa's
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: lead big enough. They'll talk about that in Toronto, unfortunately forever.
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: And then even after that, Fad the flyball to the
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: warning track and left center the infield was playing in.
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: I'm not a Major League Baseball outfielding expert, but it
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: seemed like Key k Hernandez took a pretty poor angle
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: on that ball. And as someone who played baseball through
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: high school, when I see an outfielder with his back
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: turned sprinting, I'm saying, well, this is desperation, and the
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: way the camera was set up, it was focused on him.
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: Piz was nowhere in the picture in center field, so
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: I said, the game's over, and unfortunately it seemed like
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: the Blue Jays fans in Toronto thought it was over
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: as well. And then Paz is one of the great
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: catches of all time. The collision and left center field,
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: and that was so riveting that I think the rate
• 4:45
  Speaker 1: ratings reflect this. Close to thirty million people watched Game
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: seven of the World Series live. You didn't know what
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: was going to happen, So that was one takeaway Thad.
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: And then for me, it sounds simplistic in a sport
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: with twenty six man rosters fifty two in the World Series.
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: But there's always a difference maker, and to me, the
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: difference maker in this series was obvious in Yamamoto. He
• 5:06
  Speaker 1: was historically great. I'd say, even beyond baseball. That one
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: of the best sporting performances of my lifetime. And I'll
• 5:13
  Speaker 1: ask you watched a lot more baseball than I have.
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: But is there any comp to that? Is there anything
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: like that? When he pitched in Game six, threw that
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: many pitches, I said, there's no way he's going to
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: come back in Game seven. Well, sure enough, here he comes.
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: And that he was reportedly so tired after the game
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: that he could barely lift the championship trophy in a
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: series which in which you need four wins, he got
• 5:34
  Speaker 1: three of them. Sad and to me, you can't overstate
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: his value and importance to the Dodgers winning yet another
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: World Series. Oh, it's incredible.
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: And you heard through his interpreter he said when he
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: went to warm up, he wasn't sure if he's going
• 5:47
  Speaker 2: to be able to throw one pitch, let alone coming
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: and throw three innings. I mean, for the listeners, he
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: pitched ninety six pitches in Game six with zero days off.
• 5:55
  Speaker 2: He goes out and throws not one batter, but he
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: throws three innings to win that game. And as you
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: referenced Ryan, he wins three of the four games in
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: the World Series. The closest performance I can remember was
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: in twenty fourteen when Madison Bumgarner basically put the San
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: Francisco Giants on his back, beating the Kansas City Royals
• 6:13
  Speaker 2: in what amounted to a dynasty run for the San
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: Francisco Giants. He ends up winning Game one, he wins
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: Game five, and then he comes back in Game seven.
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: Now he had two days off. He came back in
• 6:23
  Speaker 2: Game seven, gets to save He throws five innings in
• 6:26
  Speaker 2: that game. In that series, he throws twenty one innings
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: and gives up one earned run over those games. And
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: it's just incredible when these starting pitchers can take over
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: a series. But I'm just curious, like, how many owners
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: are going to be pushing general managers this offseason when
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: we say, hey, these guys need five and six days
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: off between outings. Well, Yamamoto came out there, It didn't
• 6:46
  Speaker 2: back to back days heroically, and it was just one
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: of the most spellbinding performances I've ever seen. In professional sports.
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: I agree with the entirely.
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: Ryan.
• 6:55
  Speaker 2: It was a game changer. Without him, they do not
• 6:58
  Speaker 2: win that World Series, and they don't come close.
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: I agree with that, and the way he did it,
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: the variety of pitches he threw, some memorable moment moments
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: him tipping his captive Lad Guerrero Junior as a sign
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: of respect in extra innings Game seven of the World Series.
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: Then you know they get the broken bat on that
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: game winning double play to Mookie Betts. Moments will live
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: forever in Dodgers' history. That the Blue Jays fans, I
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: think wish they already forgot him, even though the games
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: were just a few days ago at this point. That's
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: how riveting and compelling the series was. Now, let's talk
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: about the guys in the dugout, because the players on
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: the field get a lot of the attention. But when
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: a series is this close, and you pointed out all
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: the advantages that the Toronto Blue Jays had in terms
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: of the numbers, if you looked at it objectively without
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: knowing the results, and said who won this series? Toronto?
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: You know, on paper would have won the series, but
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: they didn't. That it was the La Dodgers winning yet
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: another championship. So looking at the guys in the dugout,
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: John Schneider for Toronto and especially Dave Roberts on the
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: Dodgers side, that to me as a fan, it seemed
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: like Roberts pulled all the right strand.
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: So you know, a little background on Dave Roberts's I
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: think he's one of the most popular managers in the game.
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: You're talking about two managers, and John Schneider and Dave Roberts,
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: who players love. These are player managers and for two reasons.
• 8:13
  Speaker 2: One there exceptional communicators, are great motivators, but they also
• 8:16
  Speaker 2: put their players in positions to succeed, and that was
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: on full display. I think in this World Series. Dave
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: Roberts magically inserts Miguel Rojas in the starting lineup for
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: Games six and seven. He plays a huge role in
• 8:30
  Speaker 2: those games that everyone will remember the home run in
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: the ninth inning, but I harken back to Game six.
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: He was the receiver on key Ky Hernandez's throw from
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: leftfield to double off Addison Barger at second base. He
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: plays makes an exceptional scoop play at second base, a
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: really awkward play. He makes it look athletic. I think
• 8:49
  Speaker 2: inserting Miguel Rojas, who really hadn't been a factor for
• 8:52
  Speaker 2: that team for the last three to four weeks of
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: the season, was an amazing play by Dave Roberts. Furthermore,
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: I've almost never seen it where a manager makes an
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: in in inning defensive switch, and he did that. He
• 9:06
  Speaker 2: traded out his centerfielder Tommy Edmund for Pahes in centerfield,
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: and then Payes makes that exceptional catch that you referenced
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: a little bit earlier. Normally, in those circumstances, it's a
• 9:18
  Speaker 2: do or die play. The bases are loaded. They have
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: to be able to make the play at the plate
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: in the first place, So it wouldn't be uncommon to
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: bring in a fifth infielder and replace one of your outfielders.
• 9:29
  Speaker 2: What he did is he replaced his center fielder with
• 9:31
  Speaker 2: a different centerfielder, a guy who was a little bit
• 9:34
  Speaker 2: more capable. Edmund was dealing with some leg issues, Pies
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: had better sprint speed. He put him out in center
• 9:39
  Speaker 2: field and weaved magic for that team. On the other side,
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: I just got to talk a little bit about John
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: Schneider because he did some incredible things, too subtle as
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: they may have been, so he changed his starting rotation
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: going into the World Series. Bieber had pitched Game three
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: in the ALCS sureser Game four. He switched those two guys,
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: which strategically aligned Schurzer, the Game three starter, to also
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: be the Game seven starter in the event that the
• 10:05
  Speaker 2: series went to Game seven, which it absolutely did. He
• 10:07
  Speaker 2: wanted the guy with the most championship experience on the
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: mound in Game seven. I think that proved to be
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: a great decision, as Shuzer pitched extremely well and effectively
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: in Game seven. And keep in mind, Schuzer had been
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: one of the worst starters in the American League. The
• 10:22
  Speaker 2: last month of the season. He had a ten to
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: two EER. The league was hitting three forty eight off
• 10:27
  Speaker 2: him with a one oho three to one OPS, and
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: just as a point of reference, Shoeotani had a one
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: oh one to four OPS during the season. So during September,
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: Schuzer was turning the average hitter into something better than Shoeotani.
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: Schneider had the wherewithal to prioritize him in the World Series.
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: He wasn't even on the first Division Series roster. He
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: shows up in the ALCS pitch as well and pitches
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: extremely competitively in the World Series. The thing I will
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: say about John Schneider is he has done a magical
• 10:56
  Speaker 2: job throughout the year of engaging his entire thirteen man
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: position player. The postseason was no different. I think that's
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: something he's going to look back at. He made a
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: lot of decisions in that eighteen inning game. He ended
• 11:08
  Speaker 2: up taking a lot of their offense out. Springer was
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: already out of the game. He Pincher in for Bishett,
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: and then Barger and then Kirk. In each case, the
• 11:18
  Speaker 2: offense got a little bit weaker, the team got a
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: little bit faster. Unfortunately, the guys that he brought in
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: and what proved to be an eighteen in game went
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: one for fourteen, didn't necessarily help the team win again
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: in Game seven. I think there will be a lot
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: of conversation about pinch running for Bischett Kinder full f
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: as you reference, didn't get the lead he wanted to get,
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: didn't get the secondary doesn't score there. Then his spot
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: comes up in the order later he has to bunt
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: to try to help the team win and it doesn't
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: work out. And in that case, they ended up trying
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: to play for a tie. When Guerrero let off with
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: a double. I think you have to try to win
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: the game there. He probably just didn't have the right
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: personnel as he hoped in that situation. But Ryan, shifting
• 11:56
  Speaker 2: a little bit to the NBA, do do you feel
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: like head coach which makes significant impacts in teams ability
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: to win championships? Because in this case, I thought these
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: two guys were really instrumental in the outcomes of these games.
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: It's not always the case. Usually it's one on the field.
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: These guys were monumental to the outcomes of the World Series.
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: I think the experience, the ability to stay calm and
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: cool under pressure, especially on the road, that I think,
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: you know, the road playoff environments we talked about a
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: relative to the World Series going up to Toronto. The
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: road playoff environments in the NBA can be brutal. The
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: fans are going nuts. The role players tend to play
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: a lot better at home, more confident, more comfortable, especially
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: shooting the basketball, than they are on the road, and
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: so I think having somebody who's been there, done that,
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: so to speak, has that confidence is important. I also
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: think that managing the team through the course of eighty
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: two games, you talked about how the managers adjusted in
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: the playoffs and in the World Series, specifically in MLB.
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: But there's an art to it, skill to it in
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: both sports. I think, you know, you don't want to
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: be playing your best basketball or baseball in the middle
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: of the season then be out of gas when it
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: comes time to the finish line. And it's easy to
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: say that in theory. It's a lot harder to do
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: that when when you're judged by wins and losses every night,
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: to maybe leave a winner two here and there on
• 13:16
  Speaker 1: the table to rest your stars a little bit more
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: than maybe you would like to, but you're playing the
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: long game. So I think that's it in the NBA,
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: and I think ultimately that in the NBA more than
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: any other sport, it does come down to your star
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: players and how they play on the biggest stage. But
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: you know, the the the head coaches roles, you know,
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: I think of Greg Popovich with Tim Duncan and company
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: in San Antonio, Steve Kerr with Steph Curry and company
• 13:40
  Speaker 1: in Golden State, Eric Spolster with a couple of different groups,
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: specifically the Lebron led groups down in Miami. You know
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: that that confidence that kind of wherewith all the fact
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: that they've been there, done that, I think when the
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: proverbial stuff hits the fan, the fact that they are calm,
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: cool and collected under pressure and and they've been there
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: and done that before, it gives their team a lot
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: of confidence as well and lets them, you know, play
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: through especially some of the valleys and come back on
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: the other side that. Another listener question is we go
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: back and forth year between the NBA and baseball. Amanda
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: from Santa Barbara, California asked that what do you make
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: of Dave roberts managing of the Dodgers' pitching staff in
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: Game seven? A little bit unusual because he went with
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: almost all starters that take us behind that decision, and again,
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: Roberts to me, seemed to pull all the right strings.
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: I think it was sheer sorcery.
• 14:30
  Speaker 2: I think he may have been consulting Joe bu before
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: that one, because I mean, just pulled all the right
• 14:35
  Speaker 2: strings here. So you know, the Dodgers walk into the
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: playoffs as vaunted as they were, as prohibitive a favorite
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: as they were, their bullpen was leaking a little oil.
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: It was not their strongest unit, and you just referenced
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: it in your answer. Ryan, I think one of the
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: things that Dave Roberts did as well as anybody is
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: he understood the one hundred and sixty two game grind,
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: you know. So over the course of the season, you know,
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: no particular or almost all of their starters, Snell, Yamamoto,
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: and Glasnow all spent time on the il.
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: So they got a little bit of rest.
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: Also, they you know, Otani didn't start pitching until the
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: second half of the season, so these guys had something
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: left in the tank, which was significant because in light
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: of the fact that the relievers were not performing as well,
• 15:20
  Speaker 2: he really leaned on his starters. So just a few
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: numbers the Dodgers pitching staff in Game seven of the
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: World Series, there was one hundred and ninety two pitches.
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: Dave Roberts, whose nickname is Doc Doc only in trusts
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: twenty one of those pitches. Eleven percent of the pitches
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: to an actual reliever. All the other pitchers were thrown
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: by starters. They used all four of their playoff starters.
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: We already talked about Yamamoto pitching on zero day's rest,
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: Well Snell pitched on one day's rest, and Glasnew was
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: in and he had closed out the previous game. It's
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: just an incredible decision by him, and it really worked
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: out exceptionally well. John Schneider wasn't too far behind. He
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: had only thirty four percent of his pitch is thrown
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: by his team the one hundred and seventy two day
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: threw or by relievers. The two teams combined for thirteen pitchers,
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: nine of them were actual starters. So you go into
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: a playoff series where each team has four starters designed.
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: The only starter who didn't pitch in Game seven was
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: Kevin Gosman, who had pitched Game six for the Blue Jays,
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: and who knows how much longer the game was going
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: to have to go before he was going to come in.
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: So it was a tail of really leaning on the starters,
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: not going to the relievers. And keep in mind, the
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: average game seven, with the way games are managed now,
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: the average starter is going to go three or four innings,
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: So that means you're relying on your relief relievers for
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: about sixty to sixty six percent of the pitches. In
• 16:40
  Speaker 2: this case, one manager used the pen for thirty four percent,
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: the other one for eleven percent. It was incredible how
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: they manage that. You know, one other thing, I just
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: you know, tied back into what you said, Ryan, about
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: how the fact that the Blue Jays may look back
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: at this one and feel like something slipped through their fingers.
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: Vegas has already got the eye out. For twenty twenty six.
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: ESPN bet has the Dodgers as the prohibitive favorite to
• 17:05
  Speaker 2: win the World Series in twenty twenty six. They have
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: the Blue Jays at twenty to one, which would be
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: the twelfth best odds and the third best in their
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: own division, behind the Yankees and.
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: The Red Sox.
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: So it just goes to show when you have these
• 17:17
  Speaker 2: opportunities and you don't capitalize on them, how troublesome they
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: can be. And I will tell you, Ryan, we've shared
• 17:24
  Speaker 2: with the listeners in the past our own personal experiences
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: with near misses and championships. About halfway through that game,
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: I started having some PTSD recollecting the twenty eleven World
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: Series when the Texas Rangers, who I was working for,
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: unfortunately missed an opportunity to beat the Saint Louis Cardinals.
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: You start having that gut feeling like the Blue Jays
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: weren't doing enough to win the game, and they were
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: putting themselves at risk to lose it. The Dodgers went
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: out there and won it. I'm concerned. I think the
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: Blue Jay should look back and be exceptionally proud of
• 17:56
  Speaker 2: what they accomplished this year. It was a tremendous season
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: for them. Nonetheless, it will be something where they look
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: back and they think something slipped through their fingers on
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: this World Series that unfortunately may hunt them for quite
• 18:07
  Speaker 2: some time.
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: You're right that, and it's easy to say all they'll
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: be back, but there are no guarantees of that. You
• 18:12
  Speaker 1: pointed to your own to your own personal example with
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: the Texas Rangers. The year before twenty ten, with the
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: Boston Celtics, We're up three to two in the NBA Finals,
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: went to Staples Center, lost Game six, got blown out,
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: and then had a fourteen point lead in Game seven.
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: Kobe Bryant pagosall and the Lakers came rolling back to
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: win the twenty ten championship. And that was the last
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: time I was part of the finals. Now, Luckily for
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: the Celtics, they did a great job resetting it after
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: I left. Some brilliant moves by Danny Aging Company, and
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: they got back to the finals a couple times now,
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: including winning the championship in twenty twenty four, But there
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: are no guarantees that you'll be back. We know some
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: of the long suffering fan bases in different sports. The
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: Phoenix Suns, who I work for historically, obviously going way back,
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: they've since broken the curses. But the Boston Red Sox
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: and the Chicago Cubs, those went generations. People lived long,
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: in full lives and never saw those teams win a
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: World Series. So that what are your thoughts on that?
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: It just seems so difficult and mentally as much as physically,
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: because the season's over. The Dodgers are holding the trophy
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: that the Blue Jays were right there, but right there
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: doesn't mean anything when you go to spring training in
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: February and you have to do the whole thing again
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: and you realize how difficult it's going to be to
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: get back to the top of the mountain.
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: Well, and I think Toronto has to look at it
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: and see how much went right for them this year,
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: whether it was you know, Garrett Cole being hurt for
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: the Yankees. The Red Sox are on the up and come,
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: but they're not quite there just yet. Baltimore had a
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: little bit of a challenging season this year, so it's
• 19:39
  Speaker 2: just going to be so hard for them to get
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: back and they have to look back and say they
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: got so much value out of some of their their
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: star players. Bobaschet's now a free agent, so they're going
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: to have to replace him unless they resign him, and
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: so it's just it's so difficult to get back there.
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: The one thing I think is so cruel about sports
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: is that they ended up finishing second teams, but in
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: summer regards their viewed as the first loser, and that's
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: a shame that we look at things that way. They
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: really should be able to hold their head high. I mean,
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: it was just a spellbinding season and the reality is
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: they outplayed the Dodgers. The Dodgers starting rotation, which the
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: Dodgers have invested over a billion dollars in that Toronto
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: went toe to toe with those guys. The offense, which
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: was so star studded on the Dodgers side so much
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: has made they have at least three, if not four,
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: Hall of Famers in that lineup. Toronto has some guys
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: who are less well known. Five of the six best
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: hitters in this world series were Toronto Blue Jays. The
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: sixth one was obviously Otani. Six of the top eight
• 20:40
  Speaker 2: were Toronto Blue Jays. They outperformed their counterparts across the diamond.
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: They didn't end up winning. It doesn't take away from
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: how magical the season should be for the Toronto Blue
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: Jays fans. But nonetheless, as the dust settles, the Dodgers
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: have another championship. And Ryan, one of the things that
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: we talked about, I think in a recent episode, which
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: is so unfortunate, is now Isaiah kinder Filefi. You referenced
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: that he didn't get the greatest lead at third base.
• 21:05
  Speaker 2: He's literally a toe's length away from still scoring on
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: that play that milguil Rojas made, that exceptional play. He
• 21:11
  Speaker 2: doesn't score, they don't win right there, and now all
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: of a sudden, he's getting threats of bodily harmed to
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: him through social media outlets and maybe even death threats.
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: And that's just such an unfortunate blight on sports that
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: fans feel compelled or entitled to share those sentiments with players.
• 21:29
  Speaker 2: He was unequivocally trying his best. He's already taken accountability
• 21:33
  Speaker 2: for that play. He wishes he did it a little
• 21:35
  Speaker 2: bit different, but I would like to fans to keep
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: in mind. Game six ended with Adison Bargarer at second
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: base getting doubled off on a second and third situation
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: with one out. I can imagine that John Schneider, as
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: they were preparing for Game seven, if you didn't say
• 21:48
  Speaker 2: let's be a little bit more conservative on the bass pass,
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: I'm guessing the players actively chose to do that because
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: you can't afford to have that happen a second time.
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: Barger was a little aggressive in Game six, it didn't
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: work out. Lef unfortunately, was a little conservative in Game seven,
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: it also didn't work out. I'm not so certain that
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: that doesn't mean they both were acting the best interests
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: in the team at the time.
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: Well, it's easy to say, sitting on your couch, you
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: should have done this or should have done that, But
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: we've seen in sports the margin at the highest levels
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: is often razor thin. It certainly was in this series
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: with the play as you mentioned that, the catch in
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: left center field when it looked like the Blue Jays
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: we had won the World Series, and others so tremendous
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: series that we'll have more on the baseball offseason here
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: on Rosters to Rings in a minute that we're going
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: to come back right after this in segment two. We're
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: going to get into the NBA. A couple of big
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: storylines in the NBA with John Moranz, teams underperforming, teams
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: overperforming so far. I we'll get into that some of
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: your listener questions as well. Stay with us. We'll be
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: right back on Rosters to Rings.
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: Welcome back to Rosters the Rings alongside Ryan McDonough. I
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: am fad Levine.
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: Ryan.
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: We got a listener question from Tasha from Knoxville, Tennessee,
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: surrounding John morint and the Memphis Grizzlies. But first of all,
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: let's listen to some audio from post game Friday night.
• 23:17
  Speaker 2: Why can you cueue up the audio for us?
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: What went wrong to you today? A glass coach stoff?
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: Do you feel like I mean, it was anything you
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: could do differently like this re rot so they had
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: a whole spill to here. So from the outside and
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: outside may be wrong, but from the outside it didn't
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: look like you had.
• 23:39
  Speaker 3: Your usual energy tonight after stop, Well, okay, do you
• 23:43
  Speaker 3: feel like you should play more? Oh?
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: A coach store or.
• 23:49
  Speaker 3: What had been done? What could have been done different,
• 23:52
  Speaker 3: get a different outcome other than asking the coaching staff.
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: Uh, according to the don't probably don't play me.
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: Honestly, that's who basically a message will after.
• 24:00
  Speaker 3: So it's cool.
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: The coaching staffs were cool. We're good.
• 24:06
  Speaker 3: You'd have anything physically wrong from his illness or anything.
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: Okay, oh fall all right, Ryan a ton to unpack.
• 24:15
  Speaker 2: They're clearly a disconnect between John Morant and the coaching staff.
• 24:20
  Speaker 2: Tasha from Knoxville wants you to weigh in on how
• 24:23
  Speaker 2: concerned should she be about the latest development with Ja
• 24:26
  Speaker 2: Morant and the Memphis Grizzlies coaching staff.
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: It's certainly concerning that as a fan of the NBA,
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: especially if you're a Grizzlies fan, in particular this early
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: in the season. We're only a handful of games into
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: the NBA season. After those comments you heard on Friday night,
• 24:42
  Speaker 1: John Morant was suspended for one game for conduct detrimental
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: to the team. That is a team suspension. They have
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: the right to do that. The suspension came on the
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: heels of Grizzlies coach Thomas Isalo, who was new this
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: year in the full time role. He was named the
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: interim coach last year taking over for Taylor Jenkins. Isallo
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: challenged Moran's leadership in effort in a postgame exchange after
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: Friday Night's loss to the LA Lakers. Morant responded, in
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: the tone you heard there, the team felt it was inappropriate,
• 25:14
  Speaker 1: So hence the one game suspension. A lot of layers
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: here at that, because think of the situation. Islo's in
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: European born head coach. There haven't been many in NBA history.
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: He takes over his interim head coach. Frankly, the team
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: does not do great at the end of the year
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: last year, in the regular season or in the playoffs,
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: He's given the head job regardless. And think of the
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: guy he replaced, Taylor Jenkins, who is the Grizzlies all
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: time regular season wins leader. He went past Lionel Hollins.
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: Taylor Jenkins had a career record of two hundred and
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: fifty wins and two hundred and fourteen losses with the Grizzlies.
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: His tenure endured when he was fired this past March.
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: So a lot of layers here at that. I think
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: another important one. It's really not ideal in any way
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: for the Grizzlies or for John Moran, frankly individually on
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: a big contract that he's got three years, one hundred
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: and twenty six million dollars remaining on his deal, that's
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: at about forty two million dollars per year, and his
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: teams around the league evaluate Morant. One of the main
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: concerns they have that in addition to this kind of
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: behavior is the health that John Morant's been in the
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: league for six years. He's never played more than sixty
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: seven games in a season. So even if he is playing,
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: how available is he going to be, how durable is
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: he going to be for a team training for him.
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: You combine that with the big contract, also the fact
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: that John Morant is extension eligible next offseason, so it's
• 26:36
  Speaker 1: not ideal. And one final point that I think on
• 26:38
  Speaker 1: Jah in the Grizzlies and how it impacts the franchise. Well,
• 26:42
  Speaker 1: Memphis is obviously one of the smallest markets in the NBA,
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: but the business impact. Some of the tickets on Monday
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: Night for sale in the Grizzlies home game against the
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: Detroit pistonstad they were selling for just two dollars. You
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: could pay two dollars to get in the building for
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: the Detroit Pistons at Memphis Grizzlies game on Monday night.
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: So certainly not an ideal situation all the way around,
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: and at that, I think the toughest part for anybody
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: who's a Grizzlies fan in particular is this was a
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: team that looked like one of the up and coming
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: squads last year, a couple of years ago, not only
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: just in the Western Conference, but in the NBA. They
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: had John Morant looked like a young superstar, Jared Jackson Junior,
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: and Desmond Baine. Well, we talked about the issues with Morant.
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: Desmond Bain is gone, he was traded to Orlando this offseason.
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: Jaron Jackson Junior is injured despite recently signing a contract extension.
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: So with that, we've talked about it a lot, and
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: I think we will continue to do so on this show.
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: How quickly things can change in pro sports. Look like
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: the Grizzlies are going to be a force to be
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: reckoned with for five or ten years in the NBA.
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: A few years back now we're wondering how long is
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: Joah Morant going to be in Memphis, And well, the
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: Grizzlies fully blow it up and go through a full
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: blown rebuild, which is difficult because the core of their
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: team was very talented and looked like they were going
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: to be in Grizzlies uniforms for a while just a
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: few years ago. Ryan, you've talked about this before.
• 27:58
  Speaker 2: It's really unfortunately remarkable to see the slide that this
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: franchise has had Tyler Jenkins on top of it, was
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: like one of the NBA starred coaches as well in
• 28:09
  Speaker 2: this group, and you know, it's amazing how quickly things
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: can fall apart, and so much of his you know,
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: it hinges upon the character of some of your stars
• 28:18
  Speaker 2: on your team and how reliable, how available they are.
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: But what type of tone they said, And when you
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: watch this video, it's hard not to see that there
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: is a chasm between that one of their star players
• 28:30
  Speaker 2: and now they're coaching staff and perhaps the front office
• 28:32
  Speaker 2: as well. It seems as if they're in very tenuous footing.
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: From your perspective as a former general manager in the NBA,
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: what is John Morant's trade value right now and what
• 28:42
  Speaker 2: would you recommend that they do right now with him
• 28:44
  Speaker 2: as an asset.
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's severely diminished. And that's the hard part that
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: one of the challenges that I think those of us
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: who have been executive in the team side have. If
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: a player is upset, he's underperforming, he's not playing his best.
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: That makes him more difficult to trade. And so that
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: was always the message from the front office if a
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: player was upset, say look, I understand you're upset, and
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: you have to be honest as far as whether you'd
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: potentially consider moving the player or not. But there were
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: certain times where I thought the relationship was maybe too
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: far gone between the player and the franchise where we'd say, look,
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: we'll try to trade you, but you need to help us.
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: You need to do your part, you need to play well,
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: you need to be a good citizen. If that happens,
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: that rebuilds your value. We're only going to trade you
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: if it's in the best interests of the franchise. And so,
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: you know, that conversation to me a little difficult because
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: the opposite of that that is kind of the desk spiral,
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: where the player gets more and more frustrated, he shuts
• 29:37
  Speaker 1: down on the coaching staff and the organization. He plays worse.
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: The other twenty nine teams are now given pause. Either
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: they're not making any kind of trade offer, or they're
• 29:46
  Speaker 1: making low ball trade offers, you know, basically in some
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: cases maybe just unloading their bad contracts and saying, look,
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: we're not really going to give you anything of a value.
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: In fact, we want you to take back some of
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: these contracts we think are negative value for just kind
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: of taking a problem off your hands. That's bottom fishing.
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: I imagine that happens in MLB as well. And one example,
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: one thing I was thinking of with Job, because I
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: imagine there's a significant segment of fans of our listeners
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: are probably saying, well, why does Memphis just you know,
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: just get rid of them? Set an example and re
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: set it that a lot of people said that about
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: Kyrie Irving after Kyrie's issues initially with the Cleveland Cavaliers
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: and then with the Boston Celtics where he committed to
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: re sign verbally and then backed out in his commitment
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: and went to the Brooklyn Nets, and then especially in
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: Brooklyn's that so that's three different places, the first three
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: teams of Kyrie Irving's career where there are issues. And
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: I bring that up relative to Job because I think
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: Brooklyn had no choice. They felt that they didn't have
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: a choice. They traded Kyrie Irving to the Dallas Mavericks
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: for not much, and we know what happened in Dallas.
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: Kyrie Irving with Luka Donsis. Those were the two best
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: players on a team that won the Western Conference and
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: went to the NBA Finals, and Dallas really didn't have
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: to give up much value. So that's why you don't
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: do it that. There are reasons to trade a John
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: Moran in the situation, the impact on the locker room,
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: the impact on the young players, making the coaches job easier.
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: All of those things may be true, but the reality
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: is of it in pro sports, in the NBA in particular,
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: where your franchise usually defined by your best players. John
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: Morant is an extremely talented player, and we've seen what
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: he can do when his head is screwed on straight
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: and he's motivated and fully committed. So that's the challenge, Todd,
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: and as you know as an executive, that's what keeps
• 31:26
  Speaker 1: you up at night, because you don't want to be
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: the general manager who gives them away for pennies and
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: the dollar and have them him be recommitted and figure
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: it out somewhere else and then come back and kick
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: your behinds for the next couple of years because he's
• 31:39
  Speaker 1: motivated now to prove that you made a poor decision.
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: Well, and I think ran you hit on it is
• 31:44
  Speaker 2: our goal is ideally to always buy low and sell
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: high like that's what we're trying to do, and so
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: we're constantly using all the information at our disposal to
• 31:52
  Speaker 2: understand what is the fair market value for our players
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: and make sure we don't sell them for anything less
• 31:58
  Speaker 2: than that. But I think there is a position there
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: you talked about it. It's every team has principles, and
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: you know, your stars have to be available to play
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: your reference, you only play sixty seven games a year.
• 32:10
  Speaker 2: Your stars also have to elevate the play of the
• 32:12
  Speaker 2: players around them, not detract from it. And you know,
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: I think our goal is to always treat every player
• 32:19
  Speaker 2: fairly but not necessarily the same. If you have a
• 32:21
  Speaker 2: superstar player, they're going to get more consideration as you
• 32:24
  Speaker 2: just reference, they are going to get more opportunities, and
• 32:26
  Speaker 2: they're going to get more latitude. But there is a
• 32:28
  Speaker 2: point at which your principles as your team and what
• 32:32
  Speaker 2: the divisive nature some of your players have does supersede
• 32:35
  Speaker 2: the just sheer talent and so I thinks as listeners
• 32:39
  Speaker 2: out there, when you question some trades that are made
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: and you think that that doesn't seem fair, or maybe
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: we gave up too much talent there. Sometimes there are
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: things going on behind the scenes, There are other elements
• 32:50
  Speaker 2: that are factoring into that player's value. And so you
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: see players like Raphael Devers, who we've talked about, getting
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: traded a perennial All Star. You reference Kyrie Irving, We'll
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: see what they do with John Morant. And then on
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: the other side of the coin too, you have the
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: Luka Doncic trade, where I think Nico Harrison in the
• 33:07
  Speaker 2: Mavericks front office felt that was the right time to
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: move him. It left a lot of the fans scratching
• 33:12
  Speaker 2: their heads because it seemed disproportionate to the talent. They
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: didn't get necessarily the talent in return that they should have.
• 33:19
  Speaker 2: There are other things going on behind the scenes. Sadly
• 33:21
  Speaker 2: that probably hasn't worked out, and so it's important that
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: executives always remain patient and objective, don't put your own
• 33:28
  Speaker 2: emotions into these deals. But if you have a group
• 33:31
  Speaker 2: of people around you, if you've got systems that help
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: you really understand what the value of your player is
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: then we're still try and commit to selling high. But
• 33:39
  Speaker 2: the caveat there is it's not just about the talent
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: on the court. It's not just about the talent on
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: the field. It's also the influence within the clubhouse at times.
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: No question about it. That And it's easy to say
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: from the outside while they should trade a player or not,
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: but the reality of it is, if your team is underperforming,
• 33:57
  Speaker 1: you know, the Grizzlies front office took some criticism for
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: firing Taylor Jenkins back in the spring, as we mentioned,
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: the winningest coach in the history of that franchise, then
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: for trading Desmond Bane to the Orlando Magic. That move
• 34:08
  Speaker 1: was largely financially related. I think some of the frustration
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: that from Morant is that Jaron Jackson Junior just got
• 34:15
  Speaker 1: a big contract extension and then it came out shortly
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: after he'd signed the huge extension that he's injured and
• 34:20
  Speaker 1: get to miss a significant part of time to start
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: the year. Moran's eligible for an extension next offseason, it
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: doesn't seem like the Grizzlies want to give it to
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: him at this point, I think for reasons that are understandable.
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: So then the question then that becomes what reverses this?
• 34:33
  Speaker 1: How do we change the momentum short of firing a
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: head coach again, which I think would set a really
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: bad precedent and be very unfair to Thomas Sisilo seven
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: games into his first season as a permanent head coach.
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: So how do we shift this and is it salvageable?
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: Keep in mind, we're recording this show in early November.
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: The trade deadline in the NBA is not till early February,
• 34:55
  Speaker 1: so they got about three months that to figure this out.
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: Will John Morant be in a Grizzlies uniform? But I
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: know this, the other teams are lined up with their
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: pro personnel guys. There'll be a lot more of them
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: at Grizzlies games, you know, talking to people around the program.
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: Any of us can watch on TV and see what
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: the broadcast shows us. But this is what teams do
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: that in the NBA, in Major League Baseball, they're really
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: going to dig in to see, all right, how much
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: of these issues are John Morant created? How much would
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: be alleviated if our team traded for him? And then
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: they'll report back to the team president and GM and
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: ultimately those guys need to make a call. So, yeah,
• 35:28
  Speaker 1: I'm fascinated to see how this is going to end
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: up that because I don't think there's a clear right
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: answer here. The Grizzlies, obviously, historically in that market, are
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: not a free agent destination. So if you trade John
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: Morant to and keep in mind he's still in his
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: mid twenties, theoretically his best basketball should be in front
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: of him. He could blow up somewhere else. And that's
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: one of those decisions where if you don't do it right,
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: could come back to hunt your franchise for years. On
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: the other hand, he could drag down your franchise with
• 35:52
  Speaker 1: some promising young talent. Cedric Howard, the rookie out of
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: Washington State who was committed to Duke before going into
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: the draft, he looks like one of the deal, like
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: one of the better rookies in the draft. So they
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: have some young talent on that roster. Thad, you know
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: what will Moran's impact on them be if he's negative
• 36:07
  Speaker 1: and moping As these guys begin their NBA careers, all
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: of those decisions come in And I know this, and
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: I know you know this, but for our listeners, when
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: you're in that bubble. In that storm, everybody has a
• 36:17
  Speaker 1: strong opinion one way or another, and it is exhausting
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: to whether that and figure out what is the right
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: decision and what is the right time to make a decision.
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: But that is you know, that's why head coaches and
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: gms in particular get paid pretty well. You got to
• 36:30
  Speaker 1: have thick skin in these situations. Try to block out
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: the outside noise and make the right decision for your franchise,
• 36:35
  Speaker 1: even if that decision is not popular or it takes
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: some time to arrive at the right conclusion.
• 36:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think he nailed it, Ryan, And I think
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: John Morant, when motivated and engaged, is one of the
• 36:46
  Speaker 2: best playmakers in the game. So you have to be
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: very thoughtful before you trade him. And I harken back
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: to a conversation we had with Greg Anthony in one
• 36:53
  Speaker 2: of our first episodes when he said, when you acquire
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: a star player, you have to understand how he fits
• 36:58
  Speaker 2: into your system in your personnel. I think he's a
• 37:01
  Speaker 2: unique fit. He's so dynamic on the court. But in
• 37:04
  Speaker 2: addition to what we're talking about here, he probably fits
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: into some environments better than others. I'm sure there'll be
• 37:10
  Speaker 2: a lot of suitors for him, you know, will track
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: this to see how they how they handle the situation
• 37:16
  Speaker 2: because the future of the franchise could pivot on this decision.
• 37:19
  Speaker 2: Right shifting a little bit, but staying in the NBA.
• 37:21
  Speaker 2: We talked in the first segment about what is now
• 37:23
  Speaker 2: a clear dynasty with the Los Angeles Dodgers. Well, the
• 37:26
  Speaker 2: last dynasty in the NBA was a Golden State Warriors,
• 37:30
  Speaker 2: And you've talked a lot about the fact that one
• 37:32
  Speaker 2: of the beauties of the game is in the last
• 37:34
  Speaker 2: seven years, there's been ultimate parodies seven different champions in
• 37:37
  Speaker 2: the NBA in the last seven years. Which do you
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: think has been better for the league when when there
• 37:42
  Speaker 2: was the dynasty of the Golden State Warriors or the
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: era of parody right now?
• 37:46
  Speaker 1: I think it depends on the seat you sit in
• 37:49
  Speaker 1: and what market you're in. That if you're in a
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: big market, no, you want the dynasties, you know, you
• 37:53
  Speaker 1: want those teams, the Celtics, Lakers, Warriors, Bowls, you know,
• 37:58
  Speaker 1: the big market teams to have those kind of advantages
• 38:01
  Speaker 1: that the LA Dodgers have right now in Major League Baseball,
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: as did the New York Yankees, the Chicago Cubs and
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: a few others, with the Dodgers being at the top
• 38:08
  Speaker 1: of the pyramid. So I think when I was with
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: the Celtics that I probably liked it a little bit
• 38:13
  Speaker 1: more because you know, we had a near dynasty team
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: that won a championship, went to the finals another time,
• 38:19
  Speaker 1: and to the conference finals another time in a six
• 38:21
  Speaker 1: year run from two thousand and eight to twenty thirteen.
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: But I think, frankly, looking at it objectively, for the
• 38:27
  Speaker 1: good of the league, parody is better, and as we
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: know in the NBA, ectually me in the pro sports landscape,
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: the NFL is king, and I think part of the
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: reason the NFL is so popular that that you see
• 38:38
  Speaker 1: teams come from you know, barely in the playoffs or
• 38:40
  Speaker 1: even out of the playoffs, and go on to win
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: the Super Bowl the next year. The thought that not
• 38:45
  Speaker 1: every team has a chance, but a lot of teams
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: have a chance because the league is so balanced and
• 38:49
  Speaker 1: the NBA, as you reference, for the first time in
• 38:52
  Speaker 1: the history league, there have been seven different champions in
• 38:55
  Speaker 1: the past seven years, and I think that's a good
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: thing for the sport. I personally do I don't know
• 38:59
  Speaker 1: if the rates reflect that. I think New York Knicks,
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: LA Lakers finals would probably daw bigger numbers from a
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: national TV standpoint. But I think if you're a fan
• 39:08
  Speaker 1: of the OKAC Thunder the Indiana Pacers, we know what
• 39:12
  Speaker 1: San Antonio has done historically with their five championships. You
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: want this balance. I think this parody and this is
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: something I think Major League Baseball could learn from that.
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: I want to get your take on it. But you
• 39:22
  Speaker 1: and I have discussed a salary floor, and I think
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: that's one of the things the NBA has done very well.
• 39:27
  Speaker 1: You know, in addition to penalizing the highest spending teams
• 39:31
  Speaker 1: and kind of putting a harder cap on the system,
• 39:34
  Speaker 1: they bring the floor up and the teams kind of
• 39:36
  Speaker 1: operate in that middle range. So I think this is
• 39:39
  Speaker 1: the new normal in the NBA. And so I don't
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: think you're going to see a team win, say four
• 39:45
  Speaker 1: championships in six years, for example. I just don't think
• 39:48
  Speaker 1: that's going to happen again. That OKAC has as good
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: a chance of any but so much has to go right,
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: and at some point when you're in that second aprin territory,
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: in particular in the luxury tax, that after about three
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: years you're going to have to get out of that.
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: You're going to have to cut payroll. So that makes
• 40:02
  Speaker 1: it difficult to sustain a dynasty, and I think opens
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: the playing field to you know, more teams and teams
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: that weren't maybe in the mix a couple of years back.
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: I'll say, like the Houston Rockets, for example, now or
• 40:13
  Speaker 1: the Cleveland Cavaliers now have a real chance to contend
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: for a championship.
• 40:18
  Speaker 2: You know, Ryan, I worked for our teams for twenty
• 40:21
  Speaker 2: five years, and twenty four of those twenty five I
• 40:23
  Speaker 2: was outside the top ten payroll. So I'm a big
• 40:25
  Speaker 2: fan of the parody concept. I'm not on the dynasty,
• 40:28
  Speaker 2: but I think, you know, more than anything, you want
• 40:31
  Speaker 2: as many fan bases to start the season with genuine,
• 40:34
  Speaker 2: authentic hope that they can win a championship. I just
• 40:36
  Speaker 2: think it matters to the sport. And as much as
• 40:39
  Speaker 2: we talked about Toronto versus the Dodgers, Toronto was the
• 40:42
  Speaker 2: fifth highest payroll, so they weren't they weren't, you know,
• 40:44
  Speaker 2: one of the lower payroll teams, but they were much
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: junior to the Dodgers that that franchise hadn't won a
• 40:50
  Speaker 2: World Series since nineteen ninety three. That was part of
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: the narrative that you know, tug at all of our heartstrings,
• 40:56
  Speaker 2: that you wanted to see that market, you know now
• 40:58
  Speaker 2: the only team and can in Major League Baseball. You
• 41:01
  Speaker 2: wanted that country, You wanted that market to get a
• 41:03
  Speaker 2: chance to celebrate a championship. I think it's just so
• 41:06
  Speaker 2: vital to sports to spread that euphoria around because it's
• 41:10
  Speaker 2: it really is life altering. I mean, I think I've
• 41:12
  Speaker 2: experienced in my career. I'm not sure there's anything more
• 41:15
  Speaker 2: galvanizing than a gut wrenching loss. The second best thing
• 41:19
  Speaker 2: is to actually win a championship. I wish for the
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: Toronto Blue Jays that they had that opportunity and that
• 41:25
  Speaker 2: more franchises started the season in Major League Baseball with
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: the genuine hope that they could actually win come season's end,
• 41:32
  Speaker 2: No question.
• 41:33
  Speaker 1: About it, that you don't want it to feel like
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: a disappointment. Toronto was the American League champions. They were
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: right there in the World Series. Yes, it's bitter, it's things,
• 41:41
  Speaker 1: but in a league with thirty teams that have come
• 41:43
  Speaker 1: in second, there's no shame in that fat We're going
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: to be right back after this with a new segment
• 41:48
  Speaker 1: here on Rosters to Rings. I'm excited for this one.
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: Our producer Wyatt is going to get into some listener questions.
• 41:53
  Speaker 1: You and I will respond to those questions. Eastad Levine,
• 41:56
  Speaker 1: I'm Ryan McDonough. Stick with us. We're back with your
• 41:58
  Speaker 1: listener questions right after.
• 41:59
  Speaker 2: This Welcome back to Roster's Strings with Ryan McDonagh and
• 42:12
  Speaker 2: fad Levigne. Ryan were dusting off a new segment here
• 42:16
  Speaker 2: our producer why it is going to catch us up
• 42:18
  Speaker 2: on some of the listeners questions that we haven't been
• 42:20
  Speaker 2: able to get to for the last couple of weeks.
• 42:22
  Speaker 1: So back by.
• 42:23
  Speaker 2: Popular demand, we are going to engage more closely with
• 42:26
  Speaker 2: the listeners. Why kick us off with our first question?
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: Please?
• 42:30
  Speaker 3: All right, guys, just want to remind our listeners out
• 42:33
  Speaker 3: there to submit any questions you have for Ryan and
• 42:35
  Speaker 3: that on x or Instagram at Rosters to Rings. Can
• 42:39
  Speaker 3: dm us reply comment on a post, We'll find it
• 42:42
  Speaker 3: and do the best we can to answer it on
• 42:44
  Speaker 3: the show. So, first question for both of you from
• 42:47
  Speaker 3: Elliott in Iowa. How much does a World Series or
• 42:51
  Speaker 3: Championship run impact a GM's job security the following season?
• 42:55
  Speaker 3: Does it buy you time or raise expectations.
• 42:59
  Speaker 1: I think you time that in the NBA. Certainly in
• 43:03
  Speaker 1: the short term it does. It's been the history of it.
• 43:05
  Speaker 1: Now after a season or two, there's no guarantee. I
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: think as much of it foreign NBA executive is your
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: body of work in terms of if you've produced consistently
• 43:15
  Speaker 1: good teams over a period of say five, ten, fifteen years,
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: that even if you have a down year, that buys
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: you some time. I think it's much or even more
• 43:23
  Speaker 1: so than a championship does. A couple examples on both
• 43:27
  Speaker 1: sides of it, I think, most recently on the negative front,
• 43:31
  Speaker 1: Calvin Booth the first time GM takes over for the
• 43:34
  Speaker 1: Denver Nuggets from when Tim Connolly leaves and goes to Minnesota.
• 43:37
  Speaker 1: Conley got and deserved a lot of credit for building
• 43:40
  Speaker 1: the core of that Nuggets team that won the championship
• 43:43
  Speaker 1: in twenty twenty three, well earlier this spring this past year.
• 43:48
  Speaker 1: Calvin Booth gets gets fired less than two years later,
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: as does Michael Malone, the head coach of the Nuggets.
• 43:53
  Speaker 1: So that's a negative example. Others, though Bob Myers was
• 43:56
  Speaker 1: in Golden State for four titles, they had a couple
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: down years when Staph and Clay and those guys got injured,
• 44:01
  Speaker 1: he left on his own terms and left a contract
• 44:04
  Speaker 1: extension on the table. RC Buford and San Antonio has
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: five championships. The Spurs had a downstretch here last handful
• 44:11
  Speaker 1: of years. They have not been in the playoffs, after
• 44:13
  Speaker 1: the longest playoff streak in NBA history. He's still there
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: and entrenched and not going anywhere other than to the
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: Hall of Fame someday, despite the team missing the playoffs
• 44:21
  Speaker 1: for a handful of years. So how about in MLBF
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: that does a World Series title guarantee you anything? Or
• 44:27
  Speaker 1: is it what's more of my interpretation of it, is
• 44:30
  Speaker 1: it pro sports or what have you done for me Latelyly?
• 44:32
  Speaker 1: Just ask some of these college football coaches about that
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: that the historical performance doesn't always guarantee that you're going
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: to be employed in your current spot for a number
• 44:42
  Speaker 1: of years.
• 44:43
  Speaker 2: Well, no doubt, ownership sometimes has short term memories and
• 44:45
  Speaker 2: they're very responsive to the uproar from fans. So I'm
• 44:48
  Speaker 2: going to come up with a few examples as well.
• 44:51
  Speaker 2: You know, we talk about Ross Atkins, who's the general
• 44:53
  Speaker 2: manager of the Toronto Blue Jays. He entered the season
• 44:56
  Speaker 2: coming off a last place finished. Both he and John Schneider,
• 44:59
  Speaker 2: the the manager, were both on the hot seat kind
• 45:01
  Speaker 2: of entering this season, and there was a sense of
• 45:04
  Speaker 2: if they didn't perform this well this year, they may
• 45:06
  Speaker 2: be in trouble. Well, they end up going to the
• 45:08
  Speaker 2: World Series and now probably are both in line to
• 45:10
  Speaker 2: win the Manager of the Year and the Executive of
• 45:12
  Speaker 2: the Year and hopefully get job security that is commensurate
• 45:16
  Speaker 2: with their performance this year. I'm thinking of a few
• 45:18
  Speaker 2: other guys. Ben Sherrington famously led the Boston Red Sox
• 45:22
  Speaker 2: to the twenty thirteen World Series. Unfortunately, the team finishes
• 45:25
  Speaker 2: in last place the next two years and he loses
• 45:27
  Speaker 2: his job after twenty fifteen. James Click was a very
• 45:31
  Speaker 2: unique situation in baseball. In his third year with the
• 45:34
  Speaker 2: Houston Astros as their general manager, they actually won the
• 45:37
  Speaker 2: World Series in twenty twenty two. He departs after that
• 45:40
  Speaker 2: season when he and ownership could not get on the
• 45:42
  Speaker 2: same page for a contract moving forward. And then famously
• 45:46
  Speaker 2: Dave Dombrowski, who is en route to going to the.
• 45:49
  Speaker 1: Hall of Fame.
• 45:50
  Speaker 2: Over the last thirty three years, he's remarkably been a
• 45:53
  Speaker 2: GM for thirty of those years for five different teams,
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: taking four of them to the World Series. But he's
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: also moved around a lot, so he's had a tremendous
• 46:01
  Speaker 2: job security, but not with the same team. So that's
• 46:04
  Speaker 2: a little bit of a different route to go, but
• 46:05
  Speaker 2: three clearly different examples in Major League Baseball.
• 46:09
  Speaker 1: I think Whyatt's got another one for us? Why what
• 46:12
  Speaker 1: do you have in the can? All right?
• 46:14
  Speaker 3: Next question is from Timmy Kay in Portland, Oregon. Ryan,
• 46:18
  Speaker 3: how much should we make of a team getting off
• 46:20
  Speaker 3: to a hot start or if our team gets off
• 46:22
  Speaker 3: to a rough start in the NBA?
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Historically they're both pretty good indicators. The teams usually
• 46:28
  Speaker 1: start four or five and zero or more almost always
• 46:31
  Speaker 1: make the playoffs. On the other hand, the teams start
• 46:33
  Speaker 1: out oh four, oh and five or have more loss
• 46:35
  Speaker 1: than that rarely make the playoffs. So that early there
• 46:39
  Speaker 1: are a couple of surprises in the NBA. I think
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: Chicago at five and one. Josh Getty has played great.
• 46:44
  Speaker 1: Keep an eye on modest Buzealis, especially for any Bulls
• 46:47
  Speaker 1: fans listening. They're young. Ford I think has a chance
• 46:50
  Speaker 1: to be an All Star in a couple of years.
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: Really bouncy can shoot it. You know, both fans have
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: been waiting a long time for a player to build around.
• 46:56
  Speaker 1: They may have one in Buzelli's. So those are on
• 46:59
  Speaker 1: the positive side, and then on the negative side, a
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: few disappointments, the Brooklyn Nets have been awful. That I
• 47:06
  Speaker 1: was wrong too as far as what the Brooklyn Nets
• 47:08
  Speaker 1: were going to do in the draft. Last year and
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: the lead up to the twenty twenty five draft, the
• 47:12
  Speaker 1: Brooklyn Nets had five first round picks. I said on
• 47:15
  Speaker 1: record on radio NTV, there's no way they're going to
• 47:18
  Speaker 1: use all five first round picks. They did, so I
• 47:20
  Speaker 1: was wrong as far as what they were going to
• 47:22
  Speaker 1: do that. I'm not sure I was wrong as far
• 47:24
  Speaker 1: as the logic and why they shouldn't have done it.
• 47:26
  Speaker 1: Because this is a non competitive team and Vegas had
• 47:30
  Speaker 1: them with a preseason win total somewhere maybe in the
• 47:33
  Speaker 1: upper teams to around twenty. I think they're going to
• 47:36
  Speaker 1: struggle to reach that. This is a team that playing
• 47:39
  Speaker 1: so many young guys, they just don't look like a
• 47:41
  Speaker 1: basketball team that against any competent team, has a real
• 47:44
  Speaker 1: chance to win night in, night out. So I feel
• 47:46
  Speaker 1: for Jordy Fernandez in company and Fernandez already a week
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: or so into the season's talking about he's trying to
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: figure out what he can do to try to get
• 47:53
  Speaker 1: his team to play hard. As you know that that's
• 47:55
  Speaker 1: a red flag. We've seen teams let go of the
• 47:57
  Speaker 1: rope late in the year, win a week or week
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: and half of the season. Head coach is saying with
• 48:01
  Speaker 1: a young roster, trying to figure out how to get
• 48:03
  Speaker 1: these guys to play harder. That's a pretty major red
• 48:06
  Speaker 1: flag from my experience. And then a couple others Dad
• 48:08
  Speaker 1: in the Western Conference who have underperformed New Orleans Pelicans.
• 48:12
  Speaker 1: They're not just ohero and six that they're getting blown
• 48:15
  Speaker 1: out routinely. Willie Green, their head coaches on the hot seat.
• 48:19
  Speaker 1: Zion continues to be in and out of lineup, and
• 48:22
  Speaker 1: we talked about John Morant earlier in the show. Unfortunately,
• 48:25
  Speaker 1: as we look back at the twenty nineteen draft, as
• 48:27
  Speaker 1: we sit here today, it's really a case of the
• 48:29
  Speaker 1: what IF's dad with Zion, Williamson much harold a number
• 48:33
  Speaker 1: one pick out of Duke, John Morant much harolded number
• 48:36
  Speaker 1: two pick out of Murray State. We know how talented
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: those guys are at that, but we also know, a
• 48:40
  Speaker 1: lot of nonsense is surrounded both of them, and hopefully
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: they can get on track and figure it out. They're
• 48:44
  Speaker 1: still young in their career's Dad. But the Pelicans, they
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: have a minus eighteen point one point differential through six games, Dad,
• 48:51
  Speaker 1: that's historically bad. In fact, usually if your minus double digits,
• 48:55
  Speaker 1: that's generally awful. They're minus eighteen points. So they haven't
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: been competitive. And when one final one that that I
• 49:01
  Speaker 1: think is really interesting. I want to get your take
• 49:03
  Speaker 1: on it as well. That is the Dallas Mavericks. We
• 49:06
  Speaker 1: talked about it earlier in the show. Bringing in Kyrie
• 49:08
  Speaker 1: Irving was a win for the organization. Trading away Luca
• 49:12
  Speaker 1: Donstis looks like a major loss for the organization at
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: this point if we had a Peggott. The Dallas Mavericks
• 49:17
  Speaker 1: are two and five, that is fourteenth or second to
• 49:21
  Speaker 1: last in the Western Conference. Kyrie Irving is injured to
• 49:24
  Speaker 1: start the year. Anthony Davis, as he tends to be,
• 49:27
  Speaker 1: is in and out of the lineup, and a real
• 49:29
  Speaker 1: concern for me as I really got granular and broke
• 49:32
  Speaker 1: down the map. Schedule is Dallas had the first five
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: games at home. Their sixth game was in Mexico City,
• 49:37
  Speaker 1: so that means their first true road game wasn't until
• 49:40
  Speaker 1: this past Monday night in Houston. They lost that game,
• 49:43
  Speaker 1: so that now Dallas is two and five. They have
• 49:45
  Speaker 1: the fourth worst point differential in the league, behind only
• 49:49
  Speaker 1: the aforementioned New Orleans Pelicans and the two teams that
• 49:51
  Speaker 1: I thought and still think are going to end up
• 49:53
  Speaker 1: as the worst teams league, the Brooklyn Nets and the
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: Washington Wizards. So that I want to get your take
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: from a fan perspective, though, if you're Nico Harrison, Jason
• 50:01
  Speaker 1: Kidd and company in Dallas, it's not great that you're
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: down with those teams. I know you've had some injuries,
• 50:07
  Speaker 1: but they're also decent expectations that would at least be
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: a playoff competitive team. It's not great that you're mentioned
• 50:12
  Speaker 1: with those teams toward the bottom of the barrel, especially
• 50:15
  Speaker 1: with the guy you traded away, Luka Donsich driving in
• 50:18
  Speaker 1: a Lakers' uniform. Well, Ryan, I just look at it
• 50:20
  Speaker 1: from a fans perspective, where would they be without getting
• 50:23
  Speaker 1: the first pick in the draft and getting Cooper flagged?
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: Would people have already lost their jobs? You know, none
• 50:28
  Speaker 2: of us like to hear this none like to report
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: on this, but you hear the chance in the stands
• 50:33
  Speaker 2: of you know, fire their general manager and that those
• 50:36
  Speaker 2: are starting to percolate again. We heard them last year,
• 50:40
  Speaker 2: we're hearing them again this year. In addition to all
• 50:42
  Speaker 2: the talent they have on the court, what is regarded
• 50:45
  Speaker 2: I imagine as one of the better head coaches and
• 50:47
  Speaker 2: Jason Kidd it's not working right now. Another just observation
• 50:51
  Speaker 2: I'd have relative to the Brooklyn nets is we talked
• 50:54
  Speaker 2: in the first question we answered was about how does
• 50:57
  Speaker 2: winning championships impact your job security? Well, that doesn't always
• 51:01
  Speaker 2: correlate highly to job security. Well, when you tell your
• 51:04
  Speaker 2: owner that we're rebuilding and we're going to struggle, how
• 51:07
  Speaker 2: much can you struggle before your job security is impaired?
• 51:09
  Speaker 2: Again on that side of the ball, because once you lose,
• 51:12
  Speaker 2: and when you're losing, you know sixty to eighty percent
• 51:16
  Speaker 2: of your games, you get associated with the losses. It's
• 51:19
  Speaker 2: tough for head coaches, for managers, and for general managers
• 51:22
  Speaker 2: to weather that storm when you become intrinsically linked to
• 51:26
  Speaker 2: the losing. And so I would be curious to follow
• 51:29
  Speaker 2: those teams as well to see how much despite the
• 51:31
  Speaker 2: owners being on board with those those strategies to rebuild
• 51:35
  Speaker 2: living it is an entirely different thing. Why what do
• 51:38
  Speaker 2: we have up next?
• 51:39
  Speaker 3: All right, next question from James Fox nine to one
• 51:42
  Speaker 3: seven on x fad your thoughts on the qualifying offer
• 51:47
  Speaker 3: system and why MLB penalizes clubs for trying to spend
• 51:50
  Speaker 3: money on players.
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: So I think what James just for the listeners to understand,
• 51:55
  Speaker 2: so that the qualifying offer this year is going to
• 51:57
  Speaker 2: be twenty two million dollars right around there. And what
• 52:00
  Speaker 2: it is is it's an average of the top one
• 52:03
  Speaker 2: hundred and twenty five contracts in the game. For a
• 52:05
  Speaker 2: player to be eligiblely, he has to be on your
• 52:07
  Speaker 2: roster for the full season, he has to be free
• 52:09
  Speaker 2: agent eligible, and he must not have been traded during
• 52:13
  Speaker 2: the season. So there are a number of players who
• 52:15
  Speaker 2: are in consideration this year, in no particular order, Guys
• 52:18
  Speaker 2: who I think will most likely get qualifying offers Kyle Schwarber,
• 52:21
  Speaker 2: Kyle Tucker, Edwin Diaz, Franbur Valdez, Rangers, Swore Az Bobashett,
• 52:27
  Speaker 2: Dylan Cees. Those guys are most likely going to get them,
• 52:30
  Speaker 2: and I think it will be very fascinating to watch
• 52:32
  Speaker 2: because since twenty twelve, I think only fourteen of the
• 52:36
  Speaker 2: close to one hundred and forty five players who have
• 52:38
  Speaker 2: been offered qualifying offers have actually accepted them, which means
• 52:41
  Speaker 2: that they are on a one year deal for that
• 52:44
  Speaker 2: average of the top one hundred and twenty five salaries.
• 52:47
  Speaker 2: Once again, this year that'll be twenty two million. It's
• 52:49
  Speaker 2: a one year deal. If they don't accept, they become
• 52:52
  Speaker 2: free agents, and then the team that signs them has
• 52:55
  Speaker 2: to yield one of their high draft picks and the
• 52:57
  Speaker 2: team that lost them gets a draft And I think
• 53:00
  Speaker 2: what James is referring to here, and I think an
• 53:03
  Speaker 2: easy fix here is the team that is losing the player.
• 53:06
  Speaker 2: When Kyle Tucker signs elsewhere, the Chicago Cubs should get
• 53:10
  Speaker 2: an additional draft pick, but perhaps the team that signs
• 53:13
  Speaker 2: them shouldn't have to give up a draft pick. What
• 53:15
  Speaker 2: that has proven to be is a real drag on
• 53:17
  Speaker 2: the earning potential of the players who are very good
• 53:21
  Speaker 2: but maybe aren't elite, so that probably won't impact Actually
• 53:24
  Speaker 2: Kyle Tucker, that was a bad example, but guys who
• 53:26
  Speaker 2: are a little bit more on the margins, teams will
• 53:29
  Speaker 2: be reluctant to give up that first round pick. We
• 53:32
  Speaker 2: value those so highly, so in addition to having to
• 53:34
  Speaker 2: pay the player aggressively to sign them, you have to
• 53:37
  Speaker 2: factor into that valuation while I'm also giving up my
• 53:40
  Speaker 2: first round pick or in some cases second or third
• 53:43
  Speaker 2: round pick, depending on where you are on the payroll structure.
• 53:46
  Speaker 2: That is a real drag. It's proven unequivocally to be
• 53:48
  Speaker 2: a real drag on those good to not elite players
• 53:51
  Speaker 2: who hit the free agent market.
• 53:53
  Speaker 1: So I think a really.
• 53:56
  Speaker 2: Meaningful workaround is just remove the giving of the draft pick.
• 54:01
  Speaker 2: The team that loses the player should receive one. Now
• 54:04
  Speaker 2: we don't have the drag on the earning potential. You
• 54:06
  Speaker 2: still accomplish what you set out to do, which is
• 54:08
  Speaker 2: give the team that lost the player some compensation for
• 54:11
  Speaker 2: losing them. But make no mistake, the way the rule
• 54:14
  Speaker 2: is written right now, it's meant to not only protect
• 54:17
  Speaker 2: a team who loses them, but also to put a
• 54:19
  Speaker 2: little bit of a drag on the earning potential that
• 54:21
  Speaker 2: player hitting the market, giving them more incentive just to
• 54:24
  Speaker 2: resign that one year deal with the team.
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: And we'll see if that changes in the next collective
• 54:29
  Speaker 1: bardaining agreement that we know potential workstoppage in m Major
• 54:33
  Speaker 1: League Baseball after the twenty twenty sixth season. Why what
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: do we have next?
• 54:38
  Speaker 3: Next question from Shannon in Indiana. Ryan, your thoughts on
• 54:43
  Speaker 3: Miles Turner's recent comments about free agency.
• 54:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's very interesting. On Monday night, Miles Turner returned
• 54:49
  Speaker 1: to Indianapolis for the first time as a visitor. He
• 54:53
  Speaker 1: spent a decade in a Pacers uniform, leading that team
• 54:56
  Speaker 1: to the Eastern Conference Finals two years ago. And then
• 54:59
  Speaker 1: the NBA. We know how close the Pacers were, losing
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: in Game seven just this past season to the OKC
• 55:04
  Speaker 1: Thunder and then that the Milwaukee Bucks really surprised a
• 55:08
  Speaker 1: lot of people, myself included in the NBA world being
• 55:11
  Speaker 1: as aggressive as they were to get Miles Turner. It
• 55:14
  Speaker 1: was a weak free agent class overall. So the Bucks
• 55:17
  Speaker 1: did something that frankly, no team has ever done before,
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: at least at the level Milwaukee did it. They waved
• 55:22
  Speaker 1: and stretched a star and Damian Lillard. They waved him
• 55:25
  Speaker 1: off the roster, they stretched out his contracts, they blew
• 55:28
  Speaker 1: open a bunch of salary cap space. It was really unexpected,
• 55:31
  Speaker 1: and that's, as you know, one of the hard things
• 55:32
  Speaker 1: when you're running a team, you try to anticipate every
• 55:35
  Speaker 1: scenario and analyze the competition. What are other teams going
• 55:38
  Speaker 1: to do, what are they not going to do, what's
• 55:40
  Speaker 1: most likely to happen. But there's always the wildcart that
• 55:43
  Speaker 1: the kind of black swan that you weren't anticipating. I
• 55:45
  Speaker 1: think that was the Milwaukee Bucks doing what they did
• 55:48
  Speaker 1: with Dame to get Miles Turner. And so his comments
• 55:50
  Speaker 1: I thought were really interesting. He claims that Indiana and
• 55:54
  Speaker 1: Milwaukee made the following offers. That he said the Pacers
• 55:57
  Speaker 1: offer was just three years, sixty six million dollars total,
• 56:01
  Speaker 1: that's twenty two million a year. Contrast that with the
• 56:03
  Speaker 1: deal he signs in Milwaukee that four years, one hundred
• 56:07
  Speaker 1: and seven million, that's about twenty eight million a year.
• 56:10
  Speaker 1: So we're talking about forty million dollars more guaranteed from
• 56:14
  Speaker 1: the Milwaukee Bucks than the Pacers had on the table.
• 56:17
  Speaker 1: And this is at least according to Turner, which is
• 56:19
  Speaker 1: you know that these negotiations are fluid and sometimes people
• 56:21
  Speaker 1: have different versions of what was offered or not, especially
• 56:24
  Speaker 1: when a deal falls apart. But that I thought the
• 56:27
  Speaker 1: comments were really interesting. I want to get your take
• 56:29
  Speaker 1: on it, because they asked him, was it a tough
• 56:32
  Speaker 1: decision to take Milwaukee's offer and leave the Pacers the
• 56:35
  Speaker 1: only franchise that Miles Turner's ever known, And he said,
• 56:37
  Speaker 1: quote that I've always been told when I was in
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: trade rumors, this is a business. It's a forty million
• 56:43
  Speaker 1: dollar difference at the end of the day. Close quote.
• 56:46
  Speaker 1: So that Miles Turner is one of the sharpest guys
• 56:48
  Speaker 1: in the NBA, you know, always represented the team and
• 56:52
  Speaker 1: himself well on and off the court. And I was
• 56:54
  Speaker 1: impressed really to hear him put it this bluntly. I
• 56:56
  Speaker 1: know it's not necessarily what Pacers fans want to hear,
• 56:59
  Speaker 1: but he just said, you know, basically I'm paraphrasing, but
• 57:02
  Speaker 1: this is my last big contract. I've never been paid
• 57:04
  Speaker 1: to this level before, so I wanted to maximize earnings,
• 57:06
  Speaker 1: which is essentially what he did well.
• 57:08
  Speaker 2: And you know, I think as fans, as executives, as owners,
• 57:12
  Speaker 2: people want the players to prioritize the name on the front,
• 57:15
  Speaker 2: the name of their team the city, over the name
• 57:18
  Speaker 2: on the back, which is their last name. But in practice,
• 57:21
  Speaker 2: this is a business, and I think, you know, the
• 57:23
  Speaker 2: reality of it is they should be able to honor
• 57:25
  Speaker 2: both the name on the front and the name on
• 57:27
  Speaker 2: the back. I think most players are geared and aligned
• 57:30
  Speaker 2: with giving the hometown team a little bit of a discount.
• 57:33
  Speaker 2: That sounded like it was a significant discount, and I
• 57:36
  Speaker 2: don't think we should expect our star players to give
• 57:38
  Speaker 2: a significant discount. Maybe some consideration, but not that magnitude.
• 57:43
  Speaker 3: All right, Next question from Jason in Los Angeles that
• 57:48
  Speaker 3: after watching Shoho Tani starre in another world series, how
• 57:52
  Speaker 3: much is a player like him really worth?
• 57:55
  Speaker 2: Well, to answer Jason's question, I think we're going to
• 57:58
  Speaker 2: have to have some fun with men. So let's look
• 58:01
  Speaker 2: at his contract to start with, which is to say
• 58:05
  Speaker 2: they signed him to a ten year, seven hundred million
• 58:07
  Speaker 2: dollar deal. But there's a lot to this contract. He's
• 58:10
  Speaker 2: actually only getting paid twenty million dollars over the first
• 58:13
  Speaker 2: ten years. Six hundred and eighty million of it is
• 58:15
  Speaker 2: deferred for the next the next ten years, so the
• 58:19
  Speaker 2: actual net present value of this deal is four hundred
• 58:22
  Speaker 2: and sixty million, or forty six million dollars per year.
• 58:25
  Speaker 2: So in addition, there's a conservative estimate that the Dodgers
• 58:29
  Speaker 2: have garnered seventy million dollars in new sponsorship dollars as
• 58:34
  Speaker 2: a function of signing shoe Aotani. So let's assume those
• 58:38
  Speaker 2: are five year deals. I don't know that that's the case.
• 58:40
  Speaker 2: Well let's assume it, which means that they'll have a
• 58:42
  Speaker 2: second bite in this ten year deal. So they'll get
• 58:44
  Speaker 2: one hundred and forty million dollars approximately in sponsorship dollars.
• 58:48
  Speaker 2: That may end up being a very conservative number, but
• 58:51
  Speaker 2: now you take that and subtract it from the four
• 58:53
  Speaker 2: to sixty. Now the deal is down to a three
• 58:56
  Speaker 2: hundred and twenty million dollar deal, or thirty two million dollars.
• 59:00
  Speaker 2: So now let's look at the other side of the equation.
• 59:03
  Speaker 2: How much value has Otani already delivered. As teams, we
• 59:07
  Speaker 2: tend to pay about eight to twelve million dollars per
• 59:10
  Speaker 2: unit of war, depending on where we are in the
• 59:12
  Speaker 2: payroll structure. The Dodgers are at the highest, so let's
• 59:14
  Speaker 2: assume they're willing to pay twelve million dollars per unit
• 59:17
  Speaker 2: of war. Over his first two years, Otani has averaged
• 59:21
  Speaker 2: eight point two units of war per year for the Dodgers.
• 59:26
  Speaker 2: So that is a cool one hundred and ninety six
• 59:29
  Speaker 2: million dollars of value in the first two years. Keep
• 59:31
  Speaker 2: in mind the total cost of this deal is around
• 59:33
  Speaker 2: three hundred twenty million based upon our back of the
• 59:35
  Speaker 2: envelope math. So, but not all wars created equal. The
• 59:39
  Speaker 2: first three units are probably worth about twelve million. I
• 59:41
  Speaker 2: think you could argue the next five are worth considerably more,
• 59:43
  Speaker 2: but let's put.
• 59:44
  Speaker 1: That off to the side for this this evaluation.
• 59:47
  Speaker 2: Let's also actually, you know, as he's moving through the
• 59:51
  Speaker 2: remaining eight years, will apply a reasonable agent curve and
• 59:55
  Speaker 2: that should net him a total value over ten years.
• 59:59
  Speaker 2: Once again, these are total rough numbers of about seven
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 2: hundred and eighty five million dollars that he will deliver
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 2: in value to the Los Angeles Dodgers. Juxtaposed against a
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 2: three hundred and twenty million dollar cost, it's two and
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 2: a half times the value is contract. I think the
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 2: Dodgers feel unequivocally like they've got to steal with sho
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 2: Hey Otani.
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 1: Well, that's always the debate in pro sports that your
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 1: superstars in the NBA in particular, you can't value them
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 1: highly enough. The most underplayed underpaid player statistically in the
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 1: NBA in last couple decades is Lebron James, who's actually
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 1: one of the highest paid but his productivity is just
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 1: off the charts statistically in a major league baseball Otani
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 1: looks like that kind of guy as well. Thanks for
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 1: joining us this week four thad Levine for our producer Wyatt,
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 1: who I think is taking his check and going with
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 1: the Rolls Royce dealership right after the show, I am
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 1: Ryan McDonald. Join us next week. We'll have some NFL
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 1: trade deadline talk, we'll have more Major League baseball off season,
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 1: and we'll talk more about the NBA and college basketball
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 1: underway as well. Thanks for listening. The Rosters the Ranks, Sush,