Latest / Foul Territory / Buck Showalter and Tom Verducci join FT: Check-swing controversy, Relentless Brewers lead 2-0

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Buck Showalter and Tom Verducci join FT: Check-swing controversy, Relentless Brewers lead 2-0 · Foul Territory

• 0:04
  Speaker 1: Here's the deal. Happy Monday.
• 0:05
  Speaker 2: We're going to see a team win the World Series
• 0:06
  Speaker 2: for the first time in franchise history. We do have
• 0:09
  Speaker 2: someone who has experience in long, long, long gaps between
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: World Series titles for franchises. On this day in history
• 0:21
  Speaker 2: in 2005, AJ, you cracked the code for the White Sox.
• 0:25
  Speaker 3: We sure did. One of those games you'll never forget. Crouch,
• 0:29
  Speaker 3: you had those. 1-0. Freddy Garcia Pitched seven scoreless innings.
• 0:36
  Speaker 3: This is the last out. Juan Uribe.
• 0:38
  Speaker 4: Juan Uribe made two unbelievable plays in this inning, by
• 0:40
  Speaker 4: the way. If you haven't seen the catch for the
• 0:43
  Speaker 4: second hour, he goes into the stands, which wouldn't even
• 0:45
  Speaker 4: be possible today. You know, fans always say if Derek
• 0:48
  Speaker 4: Jeter would have made that catch, you'd see it on replay,
• 0:50
  Speaker 4: which is probably true. Uribe dove into the crowd. We
• 0:53
  Speaker 4: won the World Series for the first time since 1917,
• 0:55
  Speaker 4: which was a longer, by the way, longer streak than
• 0:59
  Speaker 4: what the Red Sox had, who had won it the
• 1:01
  Speaker 4: year before, and nobody cared.
• 1:02
  Speaker 3: So, except for the White Sox fans.
• 1:04
  Speaker 4: So it was pretty awesome to be a part of that,
• 1:06
  Speaker 4: win the first World Series in Chicago in 88 years.
• 1:10
  Speaker 3: Just a special day.
• 1:11
  Speaker 4: Every time it pops up on Twitter and Instagram, it's
• 1:13
  Speaker 4: pretty cool that Forever will be known as that team.
• 1:16
  Speaker 3: And yeah, it's pretty awesome.
• 1:19
  Speaker 4: And so one team, one of these Rays or Brewers
• 1:22
  Speaker 4: is going to get the opportunity to do that this week.
• 1:26
  Speaker 3: And good luck to whoever it is. Would you rather
• 1:29
  Speaker 3: won it in Chicago?
• 1:31
  Speaker 5: Or was it awesome to land when you got back
• 1:33
  Speaker 5: to Chicago as world champs?
• 1:36
  Speaker 4: You know what's funny is we didn't win one thing
• 1:39
  Speaker 4: in Chicago. We didn't win the division in Chicago. We
• 1:41
  Speaker 4: didn't win the DS in Chicago. We didn't win the
• 1:43
  Speaker 4: LCS in Chicago. Everything we won was on the road.
• 1:46
  Speaker 4: So there was never a big party. There was never
• 1:49
  Speaker 4: a celebration that we got to go through. Do I
• 1:52
  Speaker 4: wish we would have won it in Chicago? Of course,
• 1:54
  Speaker 4: because I just can't imagine. I know the party we had. Um,
• 1:58
  Speaker 4: when we got back to Chicago, cause we flew back
• 2:00
  Speaker 4: the next day after game, after we swept, swept the
• 2:02
  Speaker 4: Astros game four, we had a big party at the hotel.
• 2:06
  Speaker 4: And then we had a big party when we got back,
• 2:08
  Speaker 4: everyone kind of went down to rush street and sat
• 2:10
  Speaker 4: outside and we just drank and drank and drank.
• 2:12
  Speaker 3: So yeah.
• 2:14
  Speaker 4: Do I wish we would have won it at home?
• 2:16
  Speaker 4: A hundred percent, but listen, you win it anywhere you can.
• 2:18
  Speaker 4: It doesn't matter if you win at home road on
• 2:19
  Speaker 4: the moon, uh, under the ocean, whatever it takes, you
• 2:22
  Speaker 4: just want to win it.
• 2:25
  Speaker 6: Very cool.
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: Well, this is the anniversary day, and we'll see. The
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: Brewers are two wins away from doing something special.
• 2:32
  Speaker 3: Have you guys ever heard this story? I told about
• 2:36
  Speaker 3: Freddie Garcia.
• 2:37
  Speaker 4: I've told this story a bunch of times, but the
• 2:39
  Speaker 4: night we landed after game two, because teams now fly
• 2:42
  Speaker 4: the next day.
• 2:42
  Speaker 3: We used to fly after.
• 2:45
  Speaker 4: Freddie had had a couple drinks, and we land in
• 2:48
  Speaker 4: Houston at like, I don't know, two in the morning,
• 2:49
  Speaker 4: three in the morning, whatever time it was. We had
• 2:52
  Speaker 4: the next day off as a workout day, whatever. And
• 2:54
  Speaker 4: Freddie was always on the mic. And he gets the
• 2:56
  Speaker 4: mic and he says, listen, guys, if you win game three,
• 2:58
  Speaker 4: I promise you they won't score in game four. And
• 3:01
  Speaker 4: he went out and threw seven shutout innings. So Freddie Garcia,
• 3:04
  Speaker 4: one of the best big game pitchers I ever played with.
• 3:07
  Speaker 4: If I had to win one game, I'd probably pick
• 3:09
  Speaker 4: Freddie Garcia.
• 3:10
  Speaker 6: Wow.
• 3:11
  Speaker 3: Bold.
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: Very confident man. And he lived up to it.
• 3:16
  Speaker 6: I like it.
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: Well, Yandy Diaz was very confident last round, just remember.
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: He was like, hey, this thing's over, and it was.
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: This time around, his team's down 0-2. We will have
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: a postgame show tonight to see if the Rays are
• 3:31
  Speaker 2: either down 3-0, which basically means you toast. It's a
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: must-win game tonight for Tampa Bay, and we'll be on
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: after it with Todd, Father, and Kratz, and myself, and AJ,
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: you're going to be out there, right?
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: Aren't you going?
• 3:45
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm going to the game. I'm going tonight and
• 3:47
  Speaker 4: tomorrow's game. If the Brewers win tonight, I could possibly
• 3:51
  Speaker 4: see them clinch tomorrow. And if not, I'm guaranteed to
• 3:55
  Speaker 4: see two games. I won't go to game five, but
• 3:57
  Speaker 4: three and four, I'll be there.
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: There you go. All right, well, let's talk about what
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: we've seen so far in the first two.
• 4:04
  Speaker 6: It's a bowl count.
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: Bowl count fueled by a marathon. I want to give
• 4:12
  Speaker 2: love to the Brewers. We'll talk more on Ray's mistakes later. AJ,
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: the Brewers don't care about deficits.
• 4:22
  Speaker 6: No.
• 4:23
  Speaker 3: No, they don't. They never stop. That's why. They never stop.
• 4:28
  Speaker 4: We talked about it when I did the Padres series
• 4:30
  Speaker 4: against the Brewers. Every time the Padres would go up
• 4:32
  Speaker 4: one or two runs, it was first and second no
• 4:34
  Speaker 4: outs for the Brewers the next inning. Then you watch
• 4:36
  Speaker 4: the Dodgers. They go up, and then boom, it's first
• 4:38
  Speaker 4: and second no outs. Base is loaded, and boom, they
• 4:40
  Speaker 4: score one or two and start the comeback. Then they
• 4:42
  Speaker 4: go down 4-0 in game one. You're thinking, oh, Rasmussen's
• 4:44
  Speaker 4: on the mound. This game's over.
• 4:46
  Speaker 3: But what do they do?
• 4:47
  Speaker 4: They score two right away. And they had pressure, pressure, pressure,
• 4:49
  Speaker 4: knocked Rasmussen out early in this game. And then they
• 4:53
  Speaker 4: got to the bullpen of the Rays, which is good,
• 4:55
  Speaker 4: but not as good as the Brewers. The bullpen for
• 4:57
  Speaker 4: the Brewers, Romero, Ashby, Ribe, these guys just never give
• 5:02
  Speaker 4: up runs. So, yeah, they're really good. And we've said
• 5:05
  Speaker 4: this from the beginning of the playoffs. The Brewers are really,
• 5:07
  Speaker 4: really good. And if it comes down to a battle
• 5:09
  Speaker 4: of the bullpens, they win it almost every time.
• 5:13
  Speaker 3: AJ, what's the biggest rally killer? I mean, joking, but
• 5:16
  Speaker 3: it's funny. Home run. Home run. Home run.
• 5:19
  Speaker 4: Wait, Joe, they say that all the time. I tell
• 5:21
  Speaker 4: people that all the time, and they don't understand. They say, oh,
• 5:23
  Speaker 4: what do you mean a home run?
• 5:24
  Speaker 3: It gets a run on the board.
• 5:25
  Speaker 4: I say, yeah, but if it's first and second, you
• 5:27
  Speaker 4: hit a three-run homer, you're down four. You'd rather have
• 5:29
  Speaker 4: like three more hits and then hit the home run.
• 5:31
  Speaker 5: You don't want to hit the home run right away. Obviously,
• 5:34
  Speaker 5: everybody wants the three-run homer. Everybody loves home runs. But
• 5:38
  Speaker 5: the idea that going for the home run against Drew
• 5:41
  Speaker 5: Rasmussen with a four-run lead is, in my opinion, what
• 5:46
  Speaker 5: kills a lot of teams. Yes, it's very hard to
• 5:49
  Speaker 5: string hits together. I will agree with that. But when
• 5:52
  Speaker 5: you have a four-run lead, for myself as a catcher,
• 5:56
  Speaker 5: I'm going, okay, Jackson Cheerio, I'm fine. I'm going to
• 5:59
  Speaker 5: give you a fastball away, or I'm giving you my
• 6:01
  Speaker 5: best pitch, just outer half. I'll let you get your single.
• 6:04
  Speaker 5: What the Brewers do is they say, okay, we'll take
• 6:08
  Speaker 5: our single, where I think a lot of teams go, well, how.
• 6:11
  Speaker 3: Am I supposed to hit a homer?
• 6:12
  Speaker 5: Like, that's a pitch that I can't hit out, and
• 6:15
  Speaker 5: that's why they're tough and able to claw back in
• 6:18
  Speaker 5: these games.
• 6:21
  Speaker 2: And then to me, AJ, it's so fitting that Sal Freelick,
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: who is Murph's favorite player, goes deep against the left-handed pitcher,
• 6:30
  Speaker 2: which he just about never does. I mean, he had
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: done it one other time this season, and that was
• 6:35
  Speaker 2: against your White Sox on opening day against Tyler Gilbert.
• 6:39
  Speaker 1: And then in his entire, what was it?
• 6:41
  Speaker 2: That was once in two years in his entire career,
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: he's done it three times left on left crime.
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: You have him up.
• 6:47
  Speaker 2: The odds of Sal Freelick hitting a tying homer in
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: the sixth inning off Ian Seymour is just about as
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: long as it gets for any major league player, and
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: he does it.
• 6:56
  Speaker 3: Yeah, true. But also, I mean, Ian Seymour, it's funny
• 6:59
  Speaker 3: how Cash has had to use Ian Seymour. Don't you agree, Kratz?
• 7:02
  Speaker 3: He keeps bringing him into face lefties. He's a reverse
• 7:04
  Speaker 3: splits guy.
• 7:05
  Speaker 4: His pitch is a changeup, not a breaking ball, and
• 7:08
  Speaker 4: he keeps having to use him because they've had to
• 7:09
  Speaker 4: use Boozer so much in so many situations. So, I mean,
• 7:12
  Speaker 4: Sal Freelick is awesome. If you haven't ever talked to
• 7:14
  Speaker 4: Sal Freelick, he's awesome. You've got to talk to him.
• 7:16
  Speaker 4: No wonder Murph loves him. He's kind of an undersized guy,
• 7:19
  Speaker 4: but he's a gamer, and he's one of Murph's guys,
• 7:22
  Speaker 4: and good for him. But to craft me, the question
• 7:25
  Speaker 4: is more of Seymour's having to come in to face
• 7:27
  Speaker 4: all these lefties because they're having to use Boozer at
• 7:30
  Speaker 4: different times. Is there someone else the race could use
• 7:32
  Speaker 4: down there? Clevenger being hurt. Obviously, he's hurting them.
• 7:35
  Speaker 5: They added Clevenger onto the roster, but I said it
• 7:41
  Speaker 5: before the series started. I felt like the Tyler Wells,
• 7:44
  Speaker 5: Ian Seymour conversation connection in the bullpen how they had
• 7:47
  Speaker 5: to use them people hey Tyler Wells did great against
• 7:51
  Speaker 5: the guard I mean he did okay against the Guardians
• 7:54
  Speaker 5: he wasn't perfect but he was coming off of he
• 7:57
  Speaker 5: was coming off of being hurt I felt like those
• 7:59
  Speaker 5: were the two guys that were in very pressure-packed situations
• 8:04
  Speaker 5: that I felt like going into this Brewers series you'd
• 8:07
  Speaker 5: be like Brewers got a few but few more better
• 8:10
  Speaker 5: hitters than what the Guardians what they had to face
• 8:13
  Speaker 5: and You know, it came back to haunt him. I
• 8:16
  Speaker 5: think it's just that depth of the Rays' pen.
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and then also the length of the lineups, right?
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: I mean, the Rays were able to score early. They
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: put up four. But then, like AJ mentioned, the bullpen
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: held them down the rest of the way after Henderson
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: did not give them their best. Neither starter was great
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: in game two. But one guy I want to point out, AJ,
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: is Cooper Pratt. He hasn't been the cleanest defensive linebacker
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: performance from him in October.
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: I mean, he's a baby.
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: He was, as they mentioned on the broadcast, in high
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: school three years ago. Now he's playing in the World Series.
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: But they feel like someone like him is going to
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: give them better at-bats than Joey Ortiz. And the two-strike
• 8:56
  Speaker 2: knock to put them ahead for good was the difference there.
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: And I think the Brewers are right. You are sacrificing
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: a little bit of defense there. Not saying that he, long-term,
• 9:05
  Speaker 2: is not going to be fantastic at the position, but
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: the game can speed up on you like it is
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: for the Rays right now. And I think they trust
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: that they have a little bit more in his bat
• 9:14
  Speaker 2: in the lower part of the lineup than a team
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: like the Rays do, or than what they have on
• 9:18
  Speaker 2: the bench.
• 9:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 9:20
  Speaker 4: Well, Cooper Pratt's a really good player. He's made some
• 9:22
  Speaker 4: errors in this postseason, but his range is outstanding. His
• 9:24
  Speaker 4: arm is outstanding. When he gets to it, he usually
• 9:26
  Speaker 4: catches it. Listen, everyone makes errors. So I'm not going
• 9:29
  Speaker 4: to sit here and say, oh man, this guy's bad defensively,
• 9:31
  Speaker 4: but he's had some big hits for him in this postseason.
• 9:33
  Speaker 4: And I think that they like his upside. They like
• 9:36
  Speaker 4: his athleticism. He's, He's really young. I know talking to him,
• 9:40
  Speaker 4: he's really nice to talk to. He had the mistake
• 9:42
  Speaker 4: in the Padres series where the broken bat and Bogarts
• 9:45
  Speaker 4: jumped over the ball and he threw it away. And
• 9:47
  Speaker 4: I talked to him the next day and I said, hey,
• 9:48
  Speaker 4: what happened? He goes, man, I just made a bad throw.
• 9:50
  Speaker 4: He goes, I didn't get my feet set and I
• 9:52
  Speaker 4: made a bad throw. And I said, oh, okay, no problem.
• 9:54
  Speaker 4: He didn't say anything about the bat. He could have said, oh,
• 9:56
  Speaker 4: Bogart's got.
• 9:57
  Speaker 3: In the way. The bat got in the way. You know,
• 9:59
  Speaker 3: he's like, you know what?
• 9:59
  Speaker 4: I just didn't get my feet set, and I made
• 10:01
  Speaker 4: a bad throw, but I'll make the play today. And
• 10:03
  Speaker 4: he's made a lot of really nice plays. So Cooper
• 10:05
  Speaker 4: Pratt is young. He's going to be a really good
• 10:08
  Speaker 4: player down the road. That's why they sent him to
• 10:09
  Speaker 4: a long-term deal.
• 10:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah. I agree.
• 10:16
  Speaker 5: I mean, he doesn't have the– He doesn't have whatever
• 10:20
  Speaker 5: the defensive metrics that Taylor Walls does. But I think
• 10:25
  Speaker 5: in eight years, when he's the same age as Taylor Walls,
• 10:27
  Speaker 5: I think he has that ability to be the perfect
• 10:35
  Speaker 5: shortstop for a team. And that's at the end of
• 10:38
  Speaker 5: his long-term contract. I think people dismiss what long-term contracts
• 10:43
  Speaker 5: actually mean to players. Is there a lot of pressure
• 10:46
  Speaker 5: in the postseason?
• 10:46
  Speaker 4: Absolutely.
• 10:47
  Speaker 3: Absolutely.
• 10:48
  Speaker 5: Making a player feel as confident and comfortable as possible.
• 10:52
  Speaker 5: He was a guy that they were– he didn't play
• 10:54
  Speaker 5: every single game. There were some times when he would–
• 10:56
  Speaker 5: they would sit him. So it's not like they treated
• 10:58
  Speaker 5: him like he's this end-of-day superstar that will play shortstop forever.
• 11:03
  Speaker 5: But they've gone with him in this postseason even after
• 11:07
  Speaker 5: he's made some mistakes and he comes up with a
• 11:09
  Speaker 5: huge hit where he didn't try to.
• 11:10
  Speaker 3: Do too much.
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: And then back to the bullpen for a moment, A.J.,
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: I brought this up right away and I know he's
• 11:18
  Speaker 2: on the record board too. And I think that's the
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: last person he's chasing for no runs through X amount
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: of innings in the post season. But this is Andrew
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: Miller like dominance. Obviously they're different pitchers, but when Andrew
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: Miller was dominating, what was it about a decade ago?
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: It was basically like pick a pocket right of the game.
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: It doesn't have to be the end of the game.
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: It could be the end of the game. It could
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: be the sixth inning, whatever it is. And we're just
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: going to get auto outs for that time period as
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: long as possible. That's what Ashby's doing right now for them.
• 11:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah, no kidding.
• 11:50
  Speaker 4: It doesn't matter righty, lefty, middle of the order, top
• 11:53
  Speaker 4: of the order. He's giving them multi, multi innings. He's
• 11:55
  Speaker 4: giving them two, three innings. He's not giving them one inning.
• 11:58
  Speaker 4: He's giving them two and three innings, and that is
• 11:59
  Speaker 4: such the ultimate weapon for Murph to have come down.
• 12:02
  Speaker 4: He's been so good he hasn't even used his closer
• 12:04
  Speaker 4: in some of these games to close it out because
• 12:06
  Speaker 4: Ashby's been so good. So, I mean, dang, Ashby, man.
• 12:09
  Speaker 4: I don't know what it is, but you figure it somehow. And, again,
• 12:12
  Speaker 4: another guy the Brewers signed to an extension, so they
• 12:14
  Speaker 4: don't got to worry about paying him for a little while.
• 12:17
  Speaker 5: And that was a risk. That was a risk for
• 12:19
  Speaker 5: them because he was a hurt guy. That was his M.O.
• 12:22
  Speaker 5: Lots of talent. He's hurt. He's a failed starter type
• 12:28
  Speaker 5: of thing. With his stuff, I feel like you can't
• 12:31
  Speaker 5: call him a long guy, but he'll give you a
• 12:34
  Speaker 5: ton of innings. Teams would be like, oh, we've got
• 12:37
  Speaker 5: to start him. But he's been the biggest weapon. I
• 12:41
  Speaker 5: get it. William Contreras is doing incredible stuff.
• 12:44
  Speaker 3: They win this.
• 12:45
  Speaker 5: How do you not choose Aaron Ashby as the World
• 12:49
  Speaker 5: Series MVP right now?
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, if he keeps doing this and impacting every game,
• 12:53
  Speaker 2: I mean, he might pitch in every game, right? He
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: hasn't shown any signs of wearing down. You might as
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: well keep using him. You're almost at the finish line.
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: And by the way, he wants to be a starter
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: again in the future. He mentioned that the other day.
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: But for now, multi-inning ace works out of the bullpen.
• 13:08
  Speaker 5: And good for Murph. And I know it's not like, oh, wow,
• 13:11
  Speaker 5: he's so smart. How did he see something that nobody
• 13:13
  Speaker 5: else sees? How many managers nowadays, and I think Cash
• 13:17
  Speaker 5: has been doing a good job of reading it in
• 13:19
  Speaker 5: different situations, but how many managers nowadays would be like,
• 13:23
  Speaker 5: here's your pocket, here's your window. It feels like Murph
• 13:26
  Speaker 5: is just looking at it and being like, I'll let
• 13:29
  Speaker 5: the hitters tell me if I'm going to take you
• 13:30
  Speaker 5: out of the game, especially in the clincher game four
• 13:33
  Speaker 5: against the Dodgers. I'll let the hitters know, or the
• 13:37
  Speaker 5: hitters will let me know when to take you out
• 13:39
  Speaker 5: of the game instead of, well, you know, it is
• 13:41
  Speaker 5: a better matchup with the with the late-life fastball and blah, blah, blah.
• 13:45
  Speaker 5: He left him in the face Yandy the other day,
• 13:48
  Speaker 5: which I agreed, because I think Yandy has a tougher time,
• 13:52
  Speaker 5: even though it's left-right. So many managers go the opposite
• 13:56
  Speaker 5: way and just go straight to McGill.
• 13:59
  Speaker 2: Quick question on that, too, going back a game, because, AJ,
• 14:02
  Speaker 2: we haven't spoken. Did you see after game one how
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: they asked Kevin Cash about not using Palacios to finish
• 14:09
  Speaker 2: the game, and it was DeLuca instead, and he said
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: they were worried They were going to bring someone in
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: for McGill to neutralize him. And I'm like, they're going
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: to take their closer.
• 14:18
  Speaker 6: Out in that spot.
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: I would have been shocked. And Ashby was already used
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: at that point. He said that.
• 14:25
  Speaker 4: I mean, even then, I'd rather have had Romero in
• 14:28
  Speaker 4: there than McGill or whoever, Gasser, whoever, Drohan, whoever.
• 14:32
  Speaker 3: Whatever lefty they wanted to bring. And there was no
• 14:33
  Speaker 3: lefty up, I don't think, was there?
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: I don't know. That's what they were worried about. He
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: said it. For sure. And when I saw it, I
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: was confused. And I don't know if it was a follow-up,
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: but I was like, what? You think they're taking McGill.
• 14:45
  Speaker 6: Out in that spot?
• 14:46
  Speaker 3: It doesn't matter who it is.
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: He's staying in.
• 14:48
  Speaker 3: And actually, he probably won. Well, I guess it doesn't matter.
• 14:51
  Speaker 3: I don't know. Maybe he just thought DeLuca was a
• 14:53
  Speaker 3: better option right there. I don't know.
• 14:56
  Speaker 5: That's a tough at-bat for DeLuca. I love DeLuca's at-bats.
• 14:59
  Speaker 5: I think he gives you a short stroke to the ball.
• 15:02
  Speaker 5: He fights stuff. That's a tough at-bat since April. McGill
• 15:08
  Speaker 5: is a tough customer.
• 15:10
  Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly.
• 15:13
  Speaker 4: When he's on the mound, you don't score. He doesn't
• 15:16
  Speaker 4: give up home runs. He never gives up home runs.
• 15:19
  Speaker 4: Here's the way you score on McGill. I'll tell you
• 15:21
  Speaker 4: what I've watched.
• 15:22
  Speaker 3: The only thing I'll say about McGill is if he
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: can't land his curveball, okay, now he'll throw it with
• 15:27
  Speaker 3: nobody on base. When he starts.
• 15:28
  Speaker 4: Bouncing them heavy, though, and listen, give William Contreras so
• 15:32
  Speaker 4: much credit for how many balls he blocked the other day.
• 15:34
  Speaker 4: But normally when McGill comes in, A, you can run
• 15:37
  Speaker 4: on him, and B, with people on base, he doesn't
• 15:40
  Speaker 4: want to throw his curveball. And he doesn't throw for
• 15:42
  Speaker 4: strikes a lot. So you can almost just sell out
• 15:44
  Speaker 4: for a heater because, again, guys on base, he doesn't
• 15:48
  Speaker 4: want to throw the curveball because he bounces it. He
• 15:50
  Speaker 4: lawn darts it so much, especially with guys on third. Again,
• 15:53
  Speaker 4: give Contreras all the credit in the world because he
• 15:54
  Speaker 4: made some unbelievable blocks. But that's the thing. If I'm
• 15:57
  Speaker 4: facing McGill, there's a guy on base. First of all,
• 15:59
  Speaker 4: I want a fast guy that can steal. And then
• 16:02
  Speaker 4: second of all, I'm saying, all right, he's going to
• 16:03
  Speaker 4: have to throw me three curveballs. He throws me three
• 16:05
  Speaker 4: curveballs in the strike zone. It's in my half, and
• 16:07
  Speaker 4: I'm looking for a heater, and I'm trying to get
• 16:08
  Speaker 4: the head out.
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and Kratz mentioned, I mean, what, he had a
• 16:13
  Speaker 2: blip like a couple weeks into the season, fixed, and
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: then that was it. I mean, the rest of the way,
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: he's been nails. This bullpen has been one of the
• 16:20
  Speaker 2: best we've seen, I think, in postseason.
• 16:22
  Speaker 6: History.
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: So we'll ask Andy McCullough about this. He's covering the Brewers.
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: So he's coming up in a moment, but that'll put
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: a lid on full count. It is fueled by marathon
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: where fun runs on full save up to $ 1 a
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: gallon with marathon rewards. Hey, we've got things happening around
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: baseball while the world series goes on. And then a
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: lot of news will flood in right after the world series,
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: but Rocco Baldelli has spent the last year as a
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: Dodgers special assistant after his managerial role with the twins.
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: He was talking to the Mariners and he has taken
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: himself out of the mix. According to Ken Rosenthal, Adam Jude,
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: who covers the team for the Seattle times added on
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: said manners have been tight-lipped throughout their search, which is
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: why just three names have been linked to the opening
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: so far, but there are mystery candidates being seriously considered
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: expecting quite a bit of movement in the next handful
• 17:05
  Speaker 2: of days. And AJ, the reasons seem to be family reasons. So,
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: In my mind, here's my educated guess. Rocco talking to
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: the Mariners. Sure, I'll have combos. Starts to get serious.
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: It sounded like he's the front runner. You have the
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: family conversation. And it didn't go well.
• 17:23
  Speaker 4: Is one of the mystery candidates Eric Kratz? Because, I mean,
• 17:26
  Speaker 4: their last two hires have kind of been catchers. On
• 17:31
  Speaker 4: the quieter side, you.
• 17:33
  Speaker 3: Know, long right-handed hitters. I mean.
• 17:36
  Speaker 4: It seems like Eric Kratz might be one of the–
• 17:38
  Speaker 4: Eric Kratz, are you one of the mystery candidates of this?
• 17:40
  Speaker 4: Because you seem to kind of fit the bill perfectly
• 17:43
  Speaker 4: for what they've hired their last two managers.
• 17:45
  Speaker 3: They told me not to talk about it. That's what
• 17:48
  Speaker 3: they just said. They want to keep it tight-lipped.
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: I was going to say the quiet side is what
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: lost me, AJ.
• 17:54
  Speaker 5: I feel like I have a lot more energy and
• 17:58
  Speaker 5: spunk than their last two managers. So they're going outside
• 18:01
  Speaker 5: the box to hire me.
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he's a little too talky.
• 18:04
  Speaker 3: They said they wanted something different. That would be different.
• 18:09
  Speaker 5: I mean, Rocco's got two baby boy twins.
• 18:13
  Speaker 4: Like, that's a long way to go. I mean, he
• 18:16
  Speaker 4: did work for the Dodgers. He doesn't live in Rhode Island,
• 18:19
  Speaker 4: so he works for the Dodgers. So it's not like
• 18:20
  Speaker 4: the Dodgers are close to Rhode Island.
• 18:22
  Speaker 5: There's a lot of dudes that work for the Dodgers.
• 18:24
  Speaker 5: And if you talk to them, that is talk about
• 18:26
  Speaker 5: cushy job.
• 18:27
  Speaker 3: Poof. Those dudes have it. Have it.
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: Very remote gig. We'll put it that way.
• 18:35
  Speaker 3: Very remote.
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: Rocco is different from the previous two, but it's also
• 18:40
  Speaker 2: not like it's an out-of-the-box hire. This is someone who
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: was managing for the Twins for a while, and I
• 18:44
  Speaker 2: think it would have been a nice fit, but they
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: move on.
• 18:47
  Speaker 5: Yeah, but is he fiery? Maybe they don't want a
• 18:49
  Speaker 5: fiery guy. Maybe that's not DiPoto. Maybe DiPoto's not wanting somebody.
• 18:53
  Speaker 3: That's not fiery. He's not fiery. Have you ever talked
• 18:54
  Speaker 3: to Rocco? Rocco's not fiery. Rocco's like this.
• 18:58
  Speaker 4: Rocco's less fiery than the last two guys they had,
• 19:01
  Speaker 4: which is saying something because... Rocco is just, I mean,
• 19:04
  Speaker 4: you go in there, I'd go twins be on 10
• 19:07
  Speaker 4: game losing streak and Rocco would be like, man, we're
• 19:08
  Speaker 4: the best team ever.
• 19:09
  Speaker 3: I'm like, Rocco, are you watching the same games?
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: The check swing heard around the world. So was it
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: a check swing? What would the replay review system have done?
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: Will that eventually happen? Does any of this even matter
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: if Yandy Diaz takes a walk and then maybe Aranda
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: strikes out against Ashby? But let's start with the important
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: part here because Rays fans were furious. Some baseball fans
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: were furious that a game ends like this. AJ, give
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: me everything.
• 19:53
  Speaker 4: I don't know that he swung. I just know you
• 19:55
  Speaker 4: shouldn't end a game on that. It's too close. And
• 19:58
  Speaker 4: I think, I don't know, I think it was James Hoy,
• 19:59
  Speaker 4: who was the umpire first. Veteran guy's been around a
• 20:03
  Speaker 4: long time. I'm not sure on that, but I need
• 20:05
  Speaker 4: to check that.
• 20:06
  Speaker 3: I believe that's it. I believe that's who it was.
• 20:09
  Speaker 3: I just don't think you can end a game like that.
• 20:11
  Speaker 3: It's too close.
• 20:11
  Speaker 4: Now, if you take the full swing, I get it.
• 20:14
  Speaker 4: But that was such a close call that I just
• 20:17
  Speaker 4: don't know how you can call that to end the game.
• 20:19
  Speaker 4: And I don't think– I think people have done the
• 20:21
  Speaker 4: research instead of the new check swing system that's possibly coming.
• 20:25
  Speaker 3: It wouldn't have been a swing. You can't end a
• 20:28
  Speaker 3: game like that. I'm sorry.
• 20:29
  Speaker 4: The ball either has to be swung and missed fully
• 20:31
  Speaker 4: yet or it has to be put into play somehow.
• 20:35
  Speaker 4: It just can't end on a questionable call like that.
• 20:38
  Speaker 3: And it did.
• 20:39
  Speaker 4: And the Rays have to get over it. And now
• 20:41
  Speaker 4: they get James Hoy behind the plate for game three.
• 20:43
  Speaker 4: So when Yandy Diaz comes up to lead off the game,
• 20:46
  Speaker 4: he can say something to him.
• 20:48
  Speaker 5: And Yandy will not say anything to him, nor will
• 20:51
  Speaker 5: he challenge it, nor would Yandy have challenged it if
• 20:54
  Speaker 5: the challenge system was in place. Angel Hernandez used to say,
• 20:58
  Speaker 5: because he would see somebody check swing and he'd go
• 21:01
  Speaker 5: like this, he'd go, and he'd look at their face.
• 21:05
  Speaker 5: So I was like, Angel, why do you do that?
• 21:07
  Speaker 5: Why do you check their face? He goes, you can
• 21:12
  Speaker 5: tell a lot by a check swing in their face.
• 21:15
  Speaker 3: And I was like, what?
• 21:17
  Speaker 5: So every umpire has their own view of it. James Hoy,
• 21:22
  Speaker 5: I think he made the right call because it's a
• 21:24
  Speaker 5: 50-50 call. You know, he shouldn't end on it. I
• 21:29
  Speaker 5: get it, what everyone's saying, what AJ said. It shouldn't
• 21:32
  Speaker 5: end on that. So he should just be.
• 21:33
  Speaker 3: Like, no, he didn't go?
• 21:35
  Speaker 5: Like he thought he went, he thought it was because
• 21:39
  Speaker 5: it's a very, it's a very subjective call and all
• 21:42
  Speaker 5: these angles that we have, even the, even the high
• 21:45
  Speaker 5: home cam is different, looks different than the first base angle.
• 21:51
  Speaker 5: Like it is hard, but in the game, I feel
• 21:55
  Speaker 5: like AJ, you would agree with me that you have
• 21:59
  Speaker 5: a sense of what's going on on the field. And if,
• 22:02
  Speaker 5: James thought it was. I think I go with his
• 22:05
  Speaker 5: call because of you. You get the feeling of, did
• 22:08
  Speaker 5: he attempt to swing at it?
• 22:10
  Speaker 3: And he said, yes. So I, I have, I can't,
• 22:13
  Speaker 3: I can't argue with this call. I'm not arguing with
• 22:16
  Speaker 3: this call. I just think you just, he didn't swing.
• 22:19
  Speaker 3: I just, I don't think he swung.
• 22:21
  Speaker 4: And I don't think that there, because even in the one,
• 22:24
  Speaker 4: the one that everyone uses, the one from above, but
• 22:26
  Speaker 4: as bad as actually at an angle where it makes
• 22:28
  Speaker 4: like it looked like it went farther. even though it
• 22:31
  Speaker 4: didn't because his body's turned.
• 22:33
  Speaker 3: But I don't know.
• 22:34
  Speaker 4: I just don't think you make that call. And umpires
• 22:38
  Speaker 4: are supposed to be able to talk to read the room.
• 22:40
  Speaker 4: They're not really taught that anymore because they have to
• 22:41
  Speaker 4: go by the rules, and I understand that. I just
• 22:43
  Speaker 4: didn't think he swung, and I thought they should have
• 22:45
  Speaker 4: been at least have to make another pitch to– well,
• 22:48
  Speaker 4: I guess he would have walked, and then we would
• 22:50
  Speaker 4: have had to see the next– it would have been
• 22:52
  Speaker 4: a rondo. So I just don't think you make this
• 22:55
  Speaker 4: call at the game in line.
• 22:56
  Speaker 3: Sorry. My opinion– I think.
• 22:59
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, and that shows how close the swing
• 23:01
  Speaker 5: is because there's a lot of people like that. But
• 23:03
  Speaker 5: if you've seen, anybody's seen the check swing system, I
• 23:07
  Speaker 5: don't agree with where the check swing system is. You
• 23:10
  Speaker 5: got to go a long way. And to me, the bat,
• 23:14
  Speaker 5: the bat angle, like Yandy held up close to his body.
• 23:20
  Speaker 5: So it's not like it's like a full swing and
• 23:23
  Speaker 5: then his bat goes that far. Like, I don't love
• 23:26
  Speaker 5: the challenge system. The few times that I've seen it,
• 23:29
  Speaker 5: I don't love where it's at, but you know what?
• 23:33
  Speaker 5: When it happens on a big stage, people.
• 23:34
  Speaker 3: Call for it.
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that was my last question for you, AJ.
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: Joe Davis said at the end of the game that
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: we might need to get that challenge system going, the
• 23:43
  Speaker 2: check swing challenge system going up in the big leagues.
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: Do you think so?
• 23:48
  Speaker 4: I mean, I'd have to look at it before they
• 23:50
  Speaker 4: do it. I mean, listen, I love Joe, but I mean,
• 23:52
  Speaker 4: he's heard about this. We've all heard about this, and
• 23:53
  Speaker 4: I've seen videos of it, and it's all about where
• 23:55
  Speaker 4: your angle is and all this, but Kratz, you said
• 23:57
  Speaker 4: something interesting. He goes, did he attempt to swing at it?
• 24:00
  Speaker 4: How many times did you attempt to swing at a ball,
• 24:02
  Speaker 4: but you stopped yourself? I mean, if you go like this,
• 24:05
  Speaker 4: if you go like this, you've attempted to swing at it.
• 24:08
  Speaker 4: I mean, all you got to do is move your
• 24:09
  Speaker 4: hands forward and you're attempting to swing at it. So
• 24:11
  Speaker 4: there has to be a rule. Then this is the
• 24:13
  Speaker 4: least defined rule in baseball. Nobody can tell you, you
• 24:15
  Speaker 4: can ask a hundred umpires and they'll all give you
• 24:19
  Speaker 4: a different account of it. But I know this for
• 24:21
  Speaker 4: a fact. Can we show the picture above from Yandy again?
• 24:24
  Speaker 4: Is there a way we can show the one from
• 24:25
  Speaker 4: above where it's from right above home plate? The one
• 24:29
  Speaker 4: kind of looking down?
• 24:29
  Speaker 5: Yeah, it's not even high home.
• 24:32
  Speaker 3: That's just like the roof cam or whatever it is.
• 24:34
  Speaker 4: Yeah, whatever. The one right above home plate. I don't
• 24:38
  Speaker 4: know if we can pull it up again.
• 24:39
  Speaker 3: Which they wouldn't have that camera if you don't have
• 24:42
  Speaker 3: a roof.
• 24:43
  Speaker 4: Okay, so see, it looks like he went farther than
• 24:45
  Speaker 4: he did because of the way the angle is. But
• 24:47
  Speaker 4: I'm going to tell you this, and I swear by this,
• 24:49
  Speaker 4: and I've used this my whole career.
• 24:51
  Speaker 3: Yandy Diaz. Don't use a brown bat.
• 24:54
  Speaker 4: You always use a black bat because the umpires can't
• 24:56
  Speaker 4: see it, and therefore they call less check swings on you.
• 25:01
  Speaker 3: Yes. Yes. The black bat theory. It might be an
• 25:07
  Speaker 3: urban legend. I don't know.
• 25:09
  Speaker 4: It might be like the ghost at the Pfister and
• 25:11
  Speaker 4: the Vinoy. I don't know, but I used a black
• 25:13
  Speaker 4: bat my whole career, and I got less check swings. Plus,
• 25:15
  Speaker 4: I think umpires are just scared to call them on
• 25:17
  Speaker 4: me because they knew that I probably might go a
• 25:19
  Speaker 4: little mad.
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: Also, if you Wikipedia check swings right now, AJ Pruszynski
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: is the cover boy for check swings.
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: So he's on there too, which I think is funny.
• 25:30
  Speaker 3: If you haven't seen that, by the way, I don't
• 25:32
  Speaker 3: know when we're going to show that, but there it is.
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: There it is.
• 25:36
  Speaker 3: Check swing. Look at that. That is clearly a check
• 25:39
  Speaker 3: swing too, by the way. You attempted. You attempted. Nope,
• 25:42
  Speaker 3: did not. I was trying to play cricket and I
• 25:44
  Speaker 3: held up.
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: Well, this article needs more citations, so it's still... The
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: factual accuracy is disputed. It says it at the top.
• 25:54
  Speaker 6: You see that?
• 25:55
  Speaker 3: I love that. I love that. I love that Kratz
• 25:57
  Speaker 3: found that today too, by the way.
• 25:59
  Speaker 1: Me too.
• 25:59
  Speaker 3: It's such a great thing. I love that. It just
• 26:01
  Speaker 3: happens to be. Such a Kratz find.
• 26:02
  Speaker 4: And it's like, it's such like a 15 year old.
• 26:05
  Speaker 4: It's such a 15 year old swing too, which is
• 26:07
  Speaker 4: even better.
• 26:07
  Speaker 6: All right.
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: See geek.
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: I think AJ can help us out with this one
• 26:12
  Speaker 2: since we'll have two, if not three games coming up
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: in Tampa Bay, depending on how things go.
• 26:17
  Speaker 6: So.
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: You can use the code TERRITORY10 for 10% off tickets
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: on SeatGeek. Over 35 million downloads, number one rated ticketing app.
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: You've got to get there. But if you only can
• 26:26
  Speaker 2: go to one game, AJ, and you're in that area,
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: which one would you choose to go to? Is it
• 26:32
  Speaker 2: game three because you'll get a little bit more of
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: the pomp and circumstance that MLB likes to do when
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: the first game happens in the respective ballpark for a
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: team in the World Series?
• 26:42
  Speaker 4: I would go to game three just because you get
• 26:44
  Speaker 4: to see Freddy Peralta pitch against his former team. in
• 26:47
  Speaker 4: his new home. I think that's the one for me. Plus,
• 26:50
  Speaker 4: you get a better starting pitching matchup. I guess game four,
• 26:54
  Speaker 4: we don't really know who's pitching game four for either team,
• 26:56
  Speaker 4: do we? So I'm always looking at the starting pitching matchups. Plus, yes,
• 26:59
  Speaker 4: it's the first game in Tampa in a World Series
• 27:02
  Speaker 4: since 2008. I think there's going to be a lot
• 27:04
  Speaker 4: of both fans. It's going to be fired up. I
• 27:06
  Speaker 4: heard somewhere they're expecting 100,000 people to be in the
• 27:09
  Speaker 4: area for around St. Petersburg and Tropicana Field. So you
• 27:14
  Speaker 4: know what? I would pick game three. But I'm happy that, well,
• 27:19
  Speaker 4: not thanks to SeatGeek. I'm happy I didn't have to
• 27:21
  Speaker 4: use SeatGeek and I got my tickets to my other employer.
• 27:25
  Speaker 4: So thank you to the people that took care of
• 27:27
  Speaker 4: me at the Fox side. But if I was going
• 27:29
  Speaker 4: to buy tickets, I would go on SeatGeek like I
• 27:31
  Speaker 4: had to do for other games this year and for
• 27:34
  Speaker 4: football games and for other things that I use when
• 27:36
  Speaker 4: I go to, I call SeatGeek and get it done.
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: And like many Brewers fans are doing, apparently there's a
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: heavy dosage of Brewers traveling going on. There are planes
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: full of Brewers fans that are chanting, let's go Brewers,
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: heading down to Tampa.
• 27:56
  Speaker 4: By the way, somebody asked me if I could use
• 27:58
  Speaker 4: my gold card. I don't think you can use gold
• 28:00
  Speaker 4: cards in the postseason. I think it's only regular season.
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: We asked you.
• 28:05
  Speaker 3: I'm pretty sure.
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: Last week, no way, you can't. I'll tell you why
• 28:09
  Speaker 2: you can't. Because how many people have a gold card,
• 28:12
  Speaker 2: which means you can get access to any park?
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: A lot.
• 28:15
  Speaker 6: How many? There's problems.
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but how many?
• 28:17
  Speaker 3: Two tickets.
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: No, but two tickets. But how many people hold a
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: gold card in your mind?
• 28:22
  Speaker 3: A thousand maybe?
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: Okay, so that's 2,000 seats, guys. That's a lot of
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: money in the playoffs.
• 28:30
  Speaker 3: That's less than the Brewers needed for the forever ticket. Oof.
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: Or the section they got rid of in right field.
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: We didn't get to.
• 28:38
  Speaker 4: That story yet. Those are nice offices. Matt Arnold loves
• 28:42
  Speaker 4: those offices, he told me. No, they're in right field.
• 28:45
  Speaker 4: They're in right field.
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: Oh, crats.
• 28:49
  Speaker 4: They're in right field. They're down the right field line.
• 28:51
  Speaker 4: That's why I would joke with Murph that that's where
• 28:53
  Speaker 4: the ivory tower would look over.
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: Buckle up, people. Long time manager, Buck Showalter, joining us
• 29:10
  Speaker 2: right now. Buck, happy Bucktober to you. And I see
• 29:13
  Speaker 2: you shaking your head, but I learn from you as
• 29:15
  Speaker 2: much as I do anyone in baseball. And we're going
• 29:17
  Speaker 2: to do a nice class here on check swings and
• 29:20
  Speaker 2: eventually maybe on box, too. But what do you got
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: for me on check swings?
• 29:25
  Speaker 6: You know, I've listened to you a little bit and
• 29:27
  Speaker 6: you're right on the button. There's a lot of people
• 29:30
  Speaker 6: weighing in on this, though, have never stood in a
• 29:32
  Speaker 6: batter's box. You know, we talk about the velocity and
• 29:35
  Speaker 6: all the things. You can debate whether they're throwing harder
• 29:37
  Speaker 6: or whatever and where they're guns and all that stuff
• 29:41
  Speaker 6: but you know you guys have all cheated to a
• 29:44
  Speaker 6: fastball and when you commit that much it's really hard
• 29:48
  Speaker 6: to check swing i think we've got a lot of
• 29:50
  Speaker 6: people weighing in on stuff that haven't actually stood in
• 29:52
  Speaker 6: a batter's box and what it requires to hit and
• 29:56
  Speaker 6: um you know the They've always said to you, it's intent, intent. Well,
• 30:00
  Speaker 6: how do you judge intent? Maybe that's what Angel was
• 30:03
  Speaker 6: talking about, was intent. But I just, I hate to
• 30:08
  Speaker 6: see a game end on a check swing call. And
• 30:11
  Speaker 6: I know the umpires do, but you know, the umpires
• 30:12
  Speaker 6: have been in the mode of making the tough calls
• 30:16
  Speaker 6: and dealing with all the fallout. So they don't mind
• 30:19
  Speaker 6: making that tough call. But think about how many things,
• 30:22
  Speaker 6: this is about the only thing we're really talking about
• 30:25
  Speaker 6: as far as umpire's decisions. We've eliminated so many things
• 30:28
  Speaker 6: that are a topic of conversation, diddy or didn't, and
• 30:31
  Speaker 6: you can debate whether that's good or bad. But why
• 30:35
  Speaker 6: can't we get this right? The big thing is everybody's
• 30:38
  Speaker 6: got to sit down in a room, hitters and pitchers,
• 30:41
  Speaker 6: and you've got to decide what a check swing is
• 30:43
  Speaker 6: and isn't. Whether it's right or wrong, let's have a
• 30:46
  Speaker 6: definitive idea And if you have to tweak it along
• 30:50
  Speaker 6: the way and whether you do it, you get a
• 30:52
  Speaker 6: check swing challenge after the seventh inning or you got
• 30:54
  Speaker 6: it all game. And if you use it, it's out.
• 30:57
  Speaker 6: But we have got to eliminate a game ending on
• 31:00
  Speaker 6: a check swing call. That's so debatable. You know, the
• 31:03
  Speaker 6: intent or maybe the bad angle and then X number
• 31:06
  Speaker 6: where you got exactly a number. Maybe we have a
• 31:10
  Speaker 6: check swing umpire. That's all he does is sit up
• 31:13
  Speaker 6: in the booth. in New York or wherever, and he
• 31:17
  Speaker 6: defines and decides what a check swing is. That's why
• 31:20
  Speaker 6: I've always said we should have ball strike umpires. You know,
• 31:23
  Speaker 6: let them be paid more. The better ball strike umpires
• 31:26
  Speaker 6: should be the guys that are calling balls and strikes.
• 31:29
  Speaker 6: I mean, what do you guys think?
• 31:31
  Speaker 4: Well, Buck, first of all, I think that idea is
• 31:32
  Speaker 4: dumb because we're going to press a green button or
• 31:34
  Speaker 4: a red button whether you swung or not. I mean,
• 31:37
  Speaker 4: we don't usually agree most of the time, Buck, but
• 31:39
  Speaker 4: on this one, you can't have a guy sitting in
• 31:40
  Speaker 4: New York watching and going, green, he swung. Red, he
• 31:44
  Speaker 4: didn't swing because you said– Because it'll take too long.
• 31:47
  Speaker 4: And the guy might– what if a guy gets up
• 31:49
  Speaker 4: to get a cup of coffee, Buck? He's got to
• 31:50
  Speaker 4: go pee.
• 31:50
  Speaker 3: And everyone's like, there's no green or red. We can't
• 31:53
  Speaker 3: play baseball without that.
• 31:55
  Speaker 6: It takes less time than we're doing ball strikes now
• 31:58
  Speaker 6: with the ABS. I mean, I've seen it. It's real
• 32:01
  Speaker 6: easy to do. But if you want to think it's dumb,
• 32:03
  Speaker 6: that's okay.
• 32:05
  Speaker 3: That's fine. I know. I think a lot of things
• 32:06
  Speaker 3: are dumb, Buck. But also people think I'm dumb. So
• 32:08
  Speaker 3: it's fair. It's fair.
• 32:10
  Speaker 4: But the thing is about the minor league one that
• 32:12
  Speaker 4: we just showed too– the 45 degrees way out in
• 32:15
  Speaker 4: front of, like, that's a full swing. The ones that
• 32:17
  Speaker 4: are harder, like the one Yanni did where he kind
• 32:19
  Speaker 4: of went down and he turned his body, right? So
• 32:22
  Speaker 4: it made it look like he went far. He was,
• 32:24
  Speaker 4: it was more of like a woo, right? And as
• 32:26
  Speaker 4: I told Kratz, and I think you would agree with
• 32:28
  Speaker 4: this as someone that played, if you go like this,
• 32:31
  Speaker 4: if you're standing in your stance and you just go
• 32:32
  Speaker 4: like this, then isn't that intent to swing? Like if you're,
• 32:36
  Speaker 4: if you see a pitch and you're like, oh, I
• 32:37
  Speaker 4: might want to swing that. Oh, like, couldn't that be
• 32:39
  Speaker 4: called if you're just going off intent to swing?
• 32:43
  Speaker 6: It better be. That's what I said, AJ, about in
• 32:47
  Speaker 6: the box. You've got to be in the batter's box. Yeah,
• 32:49
  Speaker 6: you intend to swing at every pitch. That's the argument
• 32:52
  Speaker 6: I have with some of these people that are chasing walks.
• 32:54
  Speaker 6: You can't take until you hit. You've got to hit
• 32:59
  Speaker 6: until you take. These guys that are always in that
• 33:03
  Speaker 6: take mode, they're not very good hitters. So people that
• 33:06
  Speaker 6: have stood in the box knows that you can't just
• 33:09
  Speaker 6: sit there and go, okay, let me sit here on
• 33:10
  Speaker 6: my backside. Oh, by the way, that's a great pitch
• 33:13
  Speaker 6: to hit. Let me make an offer at it. It's
• 33:15
  Speaker 6: too late. So these guys are geared up for certain things.
• 33:18
  Speaker 6: So the ability to stop on a check swing, it's
• 33:21
  Speaker 6: hard to do. And a talent, quite frankly. Talent.
• 33:25
  Speaker 5: Buck, you are going to get that clipped. And it
• 33:27
  Speaker 5: is going to be all over every single social media
• 33:30
  Speaker 5: just because of what you said.
• 33:32
  Speaker 3: You have to be ready to hit. And then you
• 33:34
  Speaker 3: shut it down. Not now. probably going to be a ball.
• 33:37
  Speaker 6: Ah!
• 33:38
  Speaker 3: I got a swing.
• 33:39
  Speaker 5: But my question to you is, as a manager, or
• 33:42
  Speaker 5: even if you put yourself in the shoes of an umpire,
• 33:45
  Speaker 5: this question was asked to Ken Rosenthal on his show.
• 33:49
  Speaker 5: What is harder to call or define a bulk or
• 33:53
  Speaker 5: a check swing?
• 33:55
  Speaker 6: Check swing. Check swing. And they're both hard. They're both hard.
• 34:00
  Speaker 6: Check swing, it's been this way forever. One of you guys,
• 34:03
  Speaker 6: I think AJ brought up a great point. Years ago,
• 34:05
  Speaker 6: you think They're getting by with some now and then here.
• 34:08
  Speaker 6: You should see the check swings that were called balls
• 34:11
  Speaker 6: years ago. The umpires just refused to call it. Getting
• 34:15
  Speaker 6: a check swing call 20 years ago was impossible. It's
• 34:19
  Speaker 6: almost impossible. Guys would get so frustrated with it, so
• 34:22
  Speaker 6: frustrated with it.
• 34:25
  Speaker 4: Bad umpiring, Buck. Bad umpiring, by the way, with the
• 34:28
  Speaker 4: check swings. And by the way, do you ever believe
• 34:30
  Speaker 4: in the black bat theory? Because I was told.
• 34:32
  Speaker 3: That at a young age.
• 34:33
  Speaker 6: I agree with that.
• 34:35
  Speaker 3: I would. I agree with that. I always wanted matte, right?
• 34:39
  Speaker 4: I always wanted a darker black than the shinier black
• 34:42
  Speaker 4: because it probably didn't mean anything, but I don't know.
• 34:45
  Speaker 4: It was something that we all thought about. So if
• 34:49
  Speaker 4: you're the Rays, okay, and you're Kevin Cash and you
• 34:51
  Speaker 4: lose the game like that and you're down 2-0 and
• 34:54
  Speaker 4: now you're coming home, what's your message to your team?
• 34:57
  Speaker 4: Do you have a message for your team on the plane?
• 34:59
  Speaker 4: Do you say something after the game? How do you
• 35:02
  Speaker 4: go about managing when you're down 2-0?
• 35:04
  Speaker 6: Well, you know, you don't want to be contradicted to
• 35:07
  Speaker 6: players and say, wait a minute, now all of a
• 35:09
  Speaker 6: sudden he's in full panic mode and he wants to
• 35:11
  Speaker 6: change everything. No, there's a trust there. You know, it's
• 35:15
  Speaker 6: one game. Really, they win tonight, the series is back on.
• 35:19
  Speaker 6: Simple as that. This is the game that they've got
• 35:20
  Speaker 6: to win. If they win this game, then they've got
• 35:22
  Speaker 6: to win one out of two and they take it
• 35:24
  Speaker 6: back to Milwaukee where anything can happen. We've seen that
• 35:28
  Speaker 6: these games are going to hinge on one or two plays.
• 35:31
  Speaker 6: You know, there's not going to be somebody just bludgeoning
• 35:33
  Speaker 6: somebody and just beats up a bad pitcher and a
• 35:36
  Speaker 6: beat up bullpen. You know, it's one game. Heck with
• 35:41
  Speaker 6: what it means down the road. If we can figure
• 35:43
  Speaker 6: out a way to beat these guys, we're very close
• 35:45
  Speaker 6: to do it. And we can take that invincible karma
• 35:48
  Speaker 6: around them that they're always going to find a way
• 35:51
  Speaker 6: to get. And they're the team of destiny. That whole
• 35:53
  Speaker 6: thing can switch quickly. It can switch quickly. And you
• 35:56
  Speaker 6: got to stay with who you are and not start
• 35:59
  Speaker 6: trying to reinvent the wheel and try all these things.
• 36:02
  Speaker 6: I thought it was interesting that when I look at
• 36:03
  Speaker 6: rosters that Tampa went with 12 pitchers and Milwaukee went
• 36:07
  Speaker 6: with 13. I always looked at the rosters in the
• 36:09
  Speaker 6: playoffs and you can tell kind of what type of
• 36:11
  Speaker 6: game a team's going to try to play when you
• 36:14
  Speaker 6: look at their roster. Because, you know, Tampa's got an
• 36:17
  Speaker 6: extra guy on the bench and one less pitcher. But
• 36:20
  Speaker 6: I think that tells you they would expect a little
• 36:21
  Speaker 6: bit more out of their starters. But I don't think
• 36:25
  Speaker 6: you get in panic mode. Yeah, I mean, those around
• 36:27
  Speaker 6: you are. But there's going to be a lot of
• 36:29
  Speaker 6: emotion with Tampa. And if they can get a W
• 36:31
  Speaker 6: under their belt tonight, it's on. It's on again.
• 36:35
  Speaker 3: Do you think the Rays and Kevin Cash made the
• 36:37
  Speaker 3: right choice to start Nick Martinez and not Drew Rasmussen
• 36:42
  Speaker 3: in game one, knowing that you would get five, four
• 36:46
  Speaker 3: games in six days with your two best pitchers?
• 36:50
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I don't know. I kind of lean towards him
• 36:52
  Speaker 6: knowing his players and knowing his pitchers and knowing what
• 36:56
  Speaker 6: their best mode of operation. They're both going to be
• 36:58
  Speaker 6: able to pitch twice in a seven-game series. Used to
• 37:02
  Speaker 6: be you had a chance to pitch three. The off
• 37:04
  Speaker 6: days take it away from what you do in the
• 37:06
  Speaker 6: regular season. I've told you many times I would play
• 37:09
  Speaker 6: all the games in a row unless you're playing the
• 37:11
  Speaker 6: East Coast, West Coast series. I think you should have
• 37:14
  Speaker 6: the same scenario that you have during the regular season
• 37:17
  Speaker 6: where all your pitchers get used and you play Potentially
• 37:21
  Speaker 6: seven days in a row. I think that would be
• 37:24
  Speaker 6: more of a reflection. But, you know, both of these
• 37:26
  Speaker 6: guys didn't beat their team with their starts. Nick Martinez.
• 37:30
  Speaker 6: But nobody seems to go six or seven innings anymore.
• 37:34
  Speaker 6: I was looking. Someone told me today that, like, Max
• 37:36
  Speaker 6: Scherzer's got 200-something wins, and the next closest is, like, 160.
• 37:41
  Speaker 6: I think we've seen our last 200-game winner because this
• 37:44
  Speaker 6: is the mode of operation that we're in now. Yeah.
• 37:50
  Speaker 3: What about the Braves? What about the Rays' base running?
• 37:54
  Speaker 6: Pardon?
• 37:55
  Speaker 5: What about the Rays' base running? What do you think
• 37:58
  Speaker 5: about a team that's aggressive but has made some negligibly
• 38:04
  Speaker 5: aggressive mistakes?
• 38:05
  Speaker 6: It's going to happen. It just gets magnified here. Like,
• 38:09
  Speaker 6: their minor league system, I don't know if it's still
• 38:10
  Speaker 6: the same. All of our minor league managers used to say,
• 38:13
  Speaker 6: when you play Tampa Bay, they almost run until they're out.
• 38:16
  Speaker 6: You know, you need to know how far you can
• 38:18
  Speaker 6: stretch something. They're always aggressive. And you can play the
• 38:21
  Speaker 6: infill in on these guys, but you better, their breaks
• 38:24
  Speaker 6: at third base. AJ, if you're not willing to pick
• 38:27
  Speaker 6: at third base with a catcher, the secondary lead these
• 38:30
  Speaker 6: guys get at third base on the contact, down angle,
• 38:33
  Speaker 6: whatever you want to call it, play, they're still going
• 38:35
  Speaker 6: to score a lot. And it's just their base running
• 38:40
  Speaker 6: has a lot more good things, but they're going to
• 38:41
  Speaker 6: have moments where they're going to have some negative things.
• 38:43
  Speaker 6: They're still in third with two outs. Is it ever
• 38:46
  Speaker 6: a good play? You know, there was a play, I
• 38:49
  Speaker 6: forget who was rounding second, where he stumbled. You guys
• 38:52
  Speaker 6: refresh my memory. But little things. Yeah. You notice he
• 38:57
  Speaker 6: hit it with his right foot. I know you guys
• 38:59
  Speaker 6: have been around instructors that you're always taught to hit
• 39:01
  Speaker 6: the back of your left foot so you don't stumble
• 39:03
  Speaker 6: and you straighten up and you get a shorter line
• 39:06
  Speaker 6: to third base. That really hit me. When he hit
• 39:08
  Speaker 6: it with his right foot, so many veteran base running
• 39:11
  Speaker 6: coaches went, there it is, there it is. I would
• 39:13
  Speaker 6: be showing that next spring training. Remember I used to
• 39:15
  Speaker 6: run down the line and if I did today and
• 39:17
  Speaker 6: I couldn't, if I hit first base bag on a
• 39:21
  Speaker 6: 6-3 routine ground ball, my head would go to the right.
• 39:24
  Speaker 6: We were taught to look to the right when you
• 39:25
  Speaker 6: hit the front of the bag and see if there's
• 39:27
  Speaker 6: an overthrow. You were taught on extra base hit to
• 39:30
  Speaker 6: always hit the bag with your left foot to straighten
• 39:33
  Speaker 6: yourself up. And that was such a great example of
• 39:36
  Speaker 6: why you don't hit it with your right foot.
• 39:39
  Speaker 4: Well, Buck, some of us were slow enough that it
• 39:41
  Speaker 4: didn't matter which foot we hit it with, right or left,
• 39:43
  Speaker 4: and it didn't matter.
• 39:43
  Speaker 6: Some of my best face runners didn't run particularly well.
• 39:47
  Speaker 4: You were a good face runner. We knew how to
• 39:49
  Speaker 4: run the bases. We just couldn't do it particularly fast.
• 39:51
  Speaker 4: It's like people say, why didn't you slide your head first?
• 39:53
  Speaker 4: And I'd say, because I didn't want to stick. But
• 39:55
  Speaker 4: I will say this about the Brewers. They teach this
• 39:58
  Speaker 4: because I remember I was talking, I think it was
• 40:00
  Speaker 4: Sal Frelick, whoever scored a run, a big run in
• 40:04
  Speaker 4: the DS when I was talking to him, said one
• 40:06
  Speaker 4: of the prouder moments was they teach them when, if
• 40:09
  Speaker 4: you look at the field from ahead, when they come
• 40:11
  Speaker 4: around third, they're taught to stay inside the logo, right?
• 40:14
  Speaker 4: And he's like, we don't want to touch the logo
• 40:16
  Speaker 4: when we come home from third base. And when he
• 40:19
  Speaker 4: scored a big run, when he came around third overhead,
• 40:21
  Speaker 4: you could see he stayed inside the logo. So I
• 40:24
  Speaker 4: think both these teams teach base running very, very well.
• 40:28
  Speaker 4: And we've seen it in this series and throughout these
• 40:31
  Speaker 4: playoffs that it's taken them to the next level. And
• 40:33
  Speaker 4: they've taken advantage of small mistakes by the other team.
• 40:37
  Speaker 4: Right now, though, with the way Contreras is throwing and
• 40:40
  Speaker 4: the way the Brewers are playing, it just seems like, oh,
• 40:43
  Speaker 4: anything the Rays do is wrong, even though it's the
• 40:45
  Speaker 4: same way they played all year.
• 40:47
  Speaker 6: You know what's funny, AJ, and you know this better
• 40:49
  Speaker 6: than anybody. We talk about, oh, he's throwing well. He's
• 40:52
  Speaker 6: throwing well.
• 40:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah, he is.
• 40:53
  Speaker 6: There was one where he didn't even attempt to throw.
• 40:54
  Speaker 6: Milwaukee does a great job of holding runners. Their right-handed
• 40:59
  Speaker 6: pitchers give him a chance to throw. I used to
• 41:01
  Speaker 6: tell our pitchers, we've got this great asset in Matt
• 41:04
  Speaker 6: Wieters throwing, for instance. Why wouldn't we take advantage of it?
• 41:08
  Speaker 6: You guys are out here learning the changeup so that
• 41:10
  Speaker 6: you can keep a guy from going 90 feet to
• 41:12
  Speaker 6: first base. You're teaching how to throw a breaking ball
• 41:14
  Speaker 6: for a strike and trying to learn that. but yet
• 41:17
  Speaker 6: you're one-sixth of the plate giving up 90 feet all
• 41:20
  Speaker 6: the time. You know, if you can get down in
• 41:22
  Speaker 6: the twos, they're not going to be able to take
• 41:25
  Speaker 6: 90 feet on an asset we have like Contreras. Everybody
• 41:29
  Speaker 6: talks about, wow, look how he throws. Look how they
• 41:31
  Speaker 6: give him a chance to throw.
• 41:34
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you steal off the pitcher, not off the catcher.
• 41:36
  Speaker 5: For everybody who's listening, not just two catchers talking, but
• 41:40
  Speaker 5: what have you seen from this bullpen in Milwaukee?
• 41:42
  Speaker 3: Specifically, Aaron Ashby.
• 41:45
  Speaker 5: Have you seen or does somebody remind you of what
• 41:48
  Speaker 5: he's doing in the postseason?
• 41:51
  Speaker 6: Andrew Miller. Andrew Miller. When we got him in a trade,
• 41:55
  Speaker 6: it was like, oh my goodness. When you got a
• 41:57
  Speaker 6: left-handed pitcher that you can leave out there against right-handed
• 42:01
  Speaker 6: good hitters late in the game, but you also can
• 42:03
  Speaker 6: see it in his face. He's got it going on.
• 42:06
  Speaker 6: You can see it in his face like, what's the
• 42:09
  Speaker 6: big deal? Yeah, this is what I can do when
• 42:10
  Speaker 6: I'm given the chance or whatever. He and I think
• 42:14
  Speaker 6: Murph's doing a great job of going with the hot hand. Oh,
• 42:16
  Speaker 6: we're going to bring our closer in now. We're going
• 42:19
  Speaker 6: to do this. We're going to do that. That's what
• 42:20
  Speaker 6: it calls for. No, there's a feel going on right here.
• 42:23
  Speaker 6: You know another advantage that these two teams have? You know,
• 42:26
  Speaker 6: they obviously, the similarity of ours is they both play inside,
• 42:29
  Speaker 6: which really helps the grip on the baseball. You don't
• 42:32
  Speaker 6: have a lot of sweat. You don't have cold. You
• 42:33
  Speaker 6: don't have wind. But think about this. They don't play
• 42:37
  Speaker 6: a home doubleheader all year. Both teams. I don't even
• 42:40
  Speaker 6: want to think how many doubleheaders the Yankees played. Some
• 42:43
  Speaker 6: of these teams that are in bad weather. Not having
• 42:46
  Speaker 6: to expend your bullpen and have your roster completely disrupted
• 42:51
  Speaker 6: for a week after a doubleheader. And also, home doubleheaders.
• 42:56
  Speaker 6: They never play them in Milwaukee, Boer, and Tampa. That's
• 43:00
  Speaker 6: a huge advantage.
• 43:03
  Speaker 4: That was one of the big things when we were
• 43:04
  Speaker 4: in the Metrodome. We knew we were playing. We knew
• 43:06
  Speaker 4: we were having BP at a time and we knew
• 43:08
  Speaker 4: we were playing. Did they schedule doubleheaders sometimes for no reason? Yes,
• 43:12
  Speaker 4: but we knew we were playing and we knew exactly
• 43:16
  Speaker 4: what time we were playing on this. Now, how much
• 43:19
  Speaker 4: time does it take to learn some of these things?
• 43:21
  Speaker 4: Because Murph was a college coach for a long time.
• 43:24
  Speaker 4: Then he was a minor league manager. Then he was
• 43:26
  Speaker 4: a bench coach for a long time. And then he
• 43:28
  Speaker 4: became a big league manager, right? You look at Kevin Cash,
• 43:32
  Speaker 4: he was under Tito forever, right? And then he became
• 43:34
  Speaker 4: a big league manager, and he's been there, and he's
• 43:36
  Speaker 4: been there for a long time. I believe he's the
• 43:38
  Speaker 4: longest-tenured manager in baseball, and he just learned and learned
• 43:41
  Speaker 4: and learned, and now he has all these fields for
• 43:43
  Speaker 4: his guys, right? Whereas then you look at some other,
• 43:46
  Speaker 4: and I'm not calling these guys out, but their first year,
• 43:48
  Speaker 4: Tony Vitello, right, who was new in San Francisco. There
• 43:50
  Speaker 4: were some questions and some things, and some other guys
• 43:53
  Speaker 4: that were first-timers. How much time does it take to
• 43:56
  Speaker 4: learn these things and learn how to communicate and learn
• 43:59
  Speaker 4: how to handle a bullpen and your players?
• 44:01
  Speaker 6: You know, Murph was at Arizona State when I was
• 44:03
  Speaker 6: with the Diamondbacks, and we used to have some talks.
• 44:07
  Speaker 6: I look at guys, when I see a new manager,
• 44:09
  Speaker 6: and I'm not sure who they are or whatever, I
• 44:10
  Speaker 6: look at their path. I look at their apprenticeship, you know,
• 44:13
  Speaker 6: who they were around, and was there a path that
• 44:16
  Speaker 6: gave them a chance to run a bullpen? You know,
• 44:20
  Speaker 6: in today's minor leagues, the guys don't really get to manage.
• 44:23
  Speaker 6: When a job comes open, there's not a lot of
• 44:26
  Speaker 6: guys that have a path that you can lean on,
• 44:29
  Speaker 6: and it's tough. but I can look at a guy's background.
• 44:33
  Speaker 6: I know whether or not they're going to be learning
• 44:35
  Speaker 6: on the job. A guy like Andy Green, you've got
• 44:37
  Speaker 6: to fail a little bit sometimes to understand, Hey, I'm
• 44:40
  Speaker 6: not doing that again. I think Andy Green's learned a
• 44:42
  Speaker 6: lot of things along the way, being in player development,
• 44:45
  Speaker 6: you know, having some failure with the Padres and maybe
• 44:48
  Speaker 6: there's a better way to handle these situations. You've got
• 44:50
  Speaker 6: to step on your tail some and you don't get
• 44:52
  Speaker 6: a chance to, you know, you're not getting blamed for
• 44:54
  Speaker 6: stuff in the minor leagues because everything's kind of orchestrated
• 44:57
  Speaker 6: for you and scripted. But, uh, Luckily, I was doing
• 45:01
  Speaker 6: it in extended spring. You know, I'll never start guys 3-2,
• 45:05
  Speaker 6: first and second with nobody out again because I had
• 45:07
  Speaker 6: a triple play in extended spring. And calling that in
• 45:10
  Speaker 6: to the farm director got me in a lot of trouble.
• 45:12
  Speaker 6: So I never did it again. So I think the
• 45:14
  Speaker 6: apprenticeship gets a little fast, like the players are coming
• 45:18
  Speaker 6: up from AA and AAA. There's nothing you can assume anymore.
• 45:22
  Speaker 6: We used to assume things when guys came to the
• 45:25
  Speaker 6: big ones. You know, Billy Martin would tell us, we're
• 45:27
  Speaker 6: minor league managers in spring training. all seven of us.
• 45:30
  Speaker 6: And he said, if I get a guy that came
• 45:32
  Speaker 6: through your club and he doesn't know how to do this,
• 45:36
  Speaker 6: we got a problem. So we knew exactly how he
• 45:39
  Speaker 6: wanted rundowns and relays and pickoffs and everything that goes on,
• 45:43
  Speaker 6: pop flies, calls and priorities. You better get it done
• 45:46
  Speaker 6: because you were accountable for that. So it's really not
• 45:50
  Speaker 6: their fault as much because they really aren't exposed to
• 45:54
  Speaker 6: those things. You know, Tony's learning some on the job.
• 45:57
  Speaker 6: And I think the biggest thing that you've got to
• 45:59
  Speaker 6: learn is handling a bullpen, knowing how to handle a bullpen.
• 46:03
  Speaker 6: And you can see how seamless it may look with
• 46:05
  Speaker 6: Kevin and Murph, but it's not that seamless. That's from
• 46:09
  Speaker 6: a lot of experience through the years.
• 46:12
  Speaker 5: All right, last one for me. They're going into Tampa.
• 46:15
  Speaker 5: They play three games. Are you managing tonight's game differently
• 46:20
  Speaker 5: because of the fact that there's three games ahead in
• 46:24
  Speaker 5: this day and age of pitchers, what you just said,
• 46:27
  Speaker 5: They don't pitch three in a row. So are you
• 46:29
  Speaker 5: managing it differently if you are the Brewers?
• 46:32
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I'm managing like this game. The Brewers, yeah. Yeah,
• 46:36
  Speaker 6: I do know that if I win tonight, I thought
• 46:38
  Speaker 6: you were talking about Tampa. Yeah, I think you live
• 46:41
  Speaker 6: to fight another day. But if you see an opening
• 46:44
  Speaker 6: where you got a chance to go for it, I
• 46:46
  Speaker 6: think you go for it. And especially with Milwaukee carrying
• 46:49
  Speaker 6: 13 pitchers instead of 12, they've got a little more
• 46:52
  Speaker 6: leeway there. But I think that comes like a feel.
• 46:56
  Speaker 6: I see an opening here. I see a lane, so
• 46:59
  Speaker 6: to speak. There's a way to win this game. By gosh,
• 47:02
  Speaker 6: I'm going to go for it. And Kevin, it's like
• 47:05
  Speaker 6: game seven. He's going to let it hang out. You're
• 47:08
  Speaker 6: going to see some things very unconventional probably with his pitching.
• 47:11
  Speaker 6: Of course, what is conventional anymore, Gus?
• 47:16
  Speaker 2: If you're looking for conventional, you're in the wrong place
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: right now with this World Series, right?
• 47:21
  Speaker 6: What was your take on Caminero's home run trot? I'd
• 47:24
  Speaker 6: love to hear what you all said because I'll shut up.
• 47:29
  Speaker 2: No, you can get it off the finish line here.
• 47:31
  Speaker 2: I don't know how we all will feel. For me,
• 47:34
  Speaker 2: I'm a fan, Buck, right? I didn't play a lick,
• 47:37
  Speaker 2: so I had a good time watching it. And we've
• 47:39
  Speaker 2: got two holding with different T-shirts for him. So, A.J.,
• 47:43
  Speaker 2: you good or did you want to shave a.
• 47:44
  Speaker 3: Few seconds off? I didn't have any problem.
• 47:45
  Speaker 4: Listen, Buck, I've learned now that I don't play baseball
• 47:48
  Speaker 4: and I don't have a stake in it. I don't
• 47:51
  Speaker 4: give a crap what these guys do anymore because I
• 47:53
  Speaker 4: don't have to deal with it. If I was catching
• 47:55
  Speaker 4: or I was on the other team, I might have
• 47:57
  Speaker 4: had a different feeling, but I'm at the point now
• 47:59
  Speaker 4: where this is how they want the game to be played.
• 48:01
  Speaker 3: Let the kids play, man.
• 48:02
  Speaker 4: If you want to take 40 seconds to trot around
• 48:04
  Speaker 4: the bases, good for you because I think it's good
• 48:06
  Speaker 4: fun and gets people to notice. But if I was playing,
• 48:09
  Speaker 4: probably a different story. But again, Buck, I don't have
• 48:11
  Speaker 4: any skin in the game, so I don't care. Do
• 48:13
  Speaker 4: whatever the hell you want.
• 48:14
  Speaker 3: I don't care. If you want to stop and eat
• 48:16
  Speaker 3: a hot dog around the bases, go for it.
• 48:19
  Speaker 6: I'm not a fan, Buck. I, you know, it's a
• 48:22
  Speaker 6: good debate back and forth, but I used to, I
• 48:24
  Speaker 6: found out I would always look to the right and
• 48:27
  Speaker 6: look at the players. And if they weren't mad or
• 48:29
  Speaker 6: didn't bother them at all, who am I to impose
• 48:32
  Speaker 6: the way I was brought up in the game? You know, Hey,
• 48:35
  Speaker 6: Hey guys, you're supposed to be mad at that. Come on,
• 48:38
  Speaker 6: let's get mad together.
• 48:39
  Speaker 4: Really?
• 48:40
  Speaker 6: That's like, I remember Manny Machado kind of laughing about
• 48:44
  Speaker 6: the way somebody did something. He really enjoyed it. And I,
• 48:46
  Speaker 6: I really stepped back and said, okay, The things have changed.
• 48:49
  Speaker 6: So that was my precursor, so to speak. I would
• 48:52
  Speaker 6: look at the players and I would never say, hey, guys,
• 48:55
  Speaker 6: you should be upset about that. I mean, I remember
• 48:58
  Speaker 6: John Russell looking at me and going, you can't believe
• 49:00
  Speaker 6: nobody said a word about that. I said, John, it's
• 49:02
  Speaker 6: their game. It's the way it is now. And you
• 49:04
  Speaker 6: better understand that and make sure you understand where you
• 49:08
  Speaker 6: are on the food chain when it comes to the game.
• 49:11
  Speaker 1: John Russell spoke?
• 49:13
  Speaker 3: John Russell spoke? He didn't talk. He never talked.
• 49:16
  Speaker 6: We had some of the funniest lines in a Titan.
• 49:20
  Speaker 6: of a game. John's got one of the great sense
• 49:22
  Speaker 6: of humor that's under the radar though. It's hilarious.
• 49:27
  Speaker 5: I had him as a manager and the Pirates told
• 49:29
  Speaker 5: him to not talk to any of the players. I
• 49:32
  Speaker 5: had John Russell when he was forced to be a mute.
• 49:35
  Speaker 6: John's got personality. I love John. Well, Buck, we love
• 49:40
  Speaker 6: the combo.
• 49:40
  Speaker 3: All the time in the minor leagues.
• 49:41
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 49:41
  Speaker 2: Quality over quantity, the Pirates told him, I guess, on
• 49:44
  Speaker 2: the word count. Buck, good stuff. Thanks for stopping by.
• 49:48
  Speaker 2: We'll catch you soon, okay?
• 49:49
  Speaker 6: Hey, good talking to you guys. Take care. You too.
• 49:51
  Speaker 2: Hey, Mike Rizzo is a candidate to be the general
• 49:54
  Speaker 2: manager of the Houston Astros.
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: What do we think in there?
• 49:57
  Speaker 2: AJ, for me, I think Mike Rizzo is someone that
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: would have a strong voice in the room with Jim Crane,
• 50:04
  Speaker 2: like somebody needs to be able to, and again, we've
• 50:06
  Speaker 2: talked a lot about Jim for a good reason. He's
• 50:08
  Speaker 2: very involved with the team and it's been successful, but
• 50:10
  Speaker 2: I think you need somebody that's going to be like, no, Jim,
• 50:12
  Speaker 2: we're doing this.
• 50:13
  Speaker 1: Trust me.
• 50:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Good luck with that. Cause he fires those guys. Cause, uh,
• 50:18
  Speaker 3: Brown tried that. James Click tried that. Lunau tried that.
• 50:21
  Speaker 4: Uh, the only guy who seems to be able to
• 50:23
  Speaker 4: tell Jim anything is Jeff Bagwell. So, uh, maybe Jeff Bagwell,
• 50:27
  Speaker 4: we've said this should be the GM because he seems
• 50:29
  Speaker 4: to listen to Jeff Bagwell. But other than that, Jim Crane, uh,
• 50:32
  Speaker 4: Kind of does whatever he wants.
• 50:33
  Speaker 3: I don't know.
• 50:34
  Speaker 4: I love Rizzo. I think Rizzo's done a great job.
• 50:36
  Speaker 4: He has a World Series winning experience behind him.
• 50:39
  Speaker 3: Would he fit?
• 50:40
  Speaker 6: Sure.
• 50:40
  Speaker 3: Will they hire him?
• 50:41
  Speaker 4: I have no idea what the Astros are going to do.
• 50:44
  Speaker 4: We talk about how the Mariners are being quiet about it.
• 50:46
  Speaker 4: The Astros are interviewing everybody I heard. I don't know
• 50:52
  Speaker 4: if he's a good fit or not. What would be
• 50:54
  Speaker 4: a good fit for a GM for a team? Somebody
• 50:56
  Speaker 4: that gets the team to the World Series and wins it?
• 51:00
  Speaker 4: Somebody that gets a team that probably shouldn't have made
• 51:03
  Speaker 4: the playoffs to the playoffs and gets there.
• 51:06
  Speaker 3: Like, I don't know.
• 51:08
  Speaker 5: I don't know if Rizzo has the chops or what
• 51:10
  Speaker 5: do you need to be a good GM for Jim Crane?
• 51:16
  Speaker 3: I don't know. I don't know. That's a Jim Crane question.
• 51:20
  Speaker 2: Well, what are you looking for? Are you looking for
• 51:21
  Speaker 2: a title or are you looking for longevity? If you're
• 51:23
  Speaker 2: looking for longevity, you're probably in the wrong place. But
• 51:25
  Speaker 2: if you're looking for a title, I mean, it'll give
• 51:27
  Speaker 2: you the resources to do it.
• 51:30
  Speaker 3: Really? You're saying.
• 51:32
  Speaker 5: So that'd be great for Rizzo then. He's already been
• 51:34
  Speaker 5: a GM. He doesn't have to play the, well, these
• 51:36
  Speaker 5: prospects are going to be ready in five years. He
• 51:39
  Speaker 5: wants somebody that hits the ground running. And so I
• 51:42
  Speaker 5: think that would be a good hire then because he's
• 51:45
  Speaker 5: hitting the ground running. He's been fired. I've been fired.
• 51:48
  Speaker 5: I've been through that.
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: My point is he's more on the Dombrowski side of things.
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: He's not going to be phased. He's not worried about
• 51:54
  Speaker 2: his job the same way in my mind. Here for
• 51:57
  Speaker 2: a good time, not for a long time necessarily. And
• 52:00
  Speaker 2: I think that's important in that kind of role.
• 52:03
  Speaker 5: I don't think it's a great job. If you're, if
• 52:05
  Speaker 5: you're looking to be a GM, I don't think being
• 52:07
  Speaker 5: the Astros GM is like the, they've depleted the minor
• 52:10
  Speaker 5: league system. Your owner has a quick trigger. Like, so
• 52:17
  Speaker 5: I think it's great for Rizzo. He's like, I've done
• 52:19
  Speaker 5: the long-term thing. I can come in and just be a,
• 52:22
  Speaker 5: you know, rent a GM, see what I can do.
• 52:24
  Speaker 3: And we'll go from there.
• 52:26
  Speaker 1: I disagree.
• 52:27
  Speaker 2: If you're looking for short-terms, Good organization with structure, core
• 52:31
  Speaker 2: pieces in place.
• 52:33
  Speaker 1: You can win there.
• 52:37
  Speaker 3: Maybe.
• 52:49
  Speaker 2: In the Weed, take good article from Ken Rosenthal on
• 52:51
  Speaker 2: what's going on with the race. We're going to spend
• 52:53
  Speaker 2: a little time on them since we did a lot
• 52:55
  Speaker 2: on the brewers earlier in the show.
• 52:57
  Speaker 3: A.J.
• 52:58
  Speaker 2: What is wrong with the Rays right now that they're
• 53:00
  Speaker 2: down two games to none, and they're losing very close
• 53:03
  Speaker 2: games here in the first two, but at the end
• 53:06
  Speaker 2: of the day, a win's a win, a loss is
• 53:07
  Speaker 2: a loss, and there are some outs on the bases,
• 53:10
  Speaker 2: there's some defense, like Aranda was the guy to pick
• 53:13
  Speaker 2: on in game two, that is costing them. Do you
• 53:16
  Speaker 2: think that's the ultimate issue right now with the Rays?
• 53:19
  Speaker 2: If they were playing cleaner baseball, would they have taken
• 53:21
  Speaker 2: a game in Milwaukee?
• 53:23
  Speaker 4: I think they ran into a really good team on
• 53:25
  Speaker 4: the road that feels like they can't lose. And the
• 53:29
  Speaker 4: Rays haven't played terrible. I mean, I guess the Aranda
• 53:32
  Speaker 4: error between his legs was the one, but they made
• 53:34
  Speaker 4: some base running mistakes. But they're always going to be aggressive.
• 53:37
  Speaker 4: The biggest thing, here's what we would always say, and
• 53:39
  Speaker 4: I think crowds would agree. When you get the big hit,
• 53:42
  Speaker 4: everyone thinks like you're more into the game and you're
• 53:44
  Speaker 4: more excited and you play better. When you don't get
• 53:47
  Speaker 4: the big hit, they're like, oh, what's wrong with the team?
• 53:49
  Speaker 4: It pretty much always comes down to who gets the
• 53:52
  Speaker 4: big hit in the big situation. And for this entire postseason,
• 53:55
  Speaker 4: That mostly has been the Milwaukee Brewers.
• 53:59
  Speaker 5: Yeah, and the Brewers haven't played perfectly. We've talked about
• 54:04
  Speaker 5: it a lot with Cooper Pratt. I mean, they talked
• 54:06
  Speaker 5: about it on the telecast. He hasn't played perfectly, and
• 54:10
  Speaker 5: the Rays haven't taken advantage of it.
• 54:13
  Speaker 3: The same as the Brewers. To me, I.
• 54:16
  Speaker 5: Think the Brewers are a better team just overall. I
• 54:21
  Speaker 5: think it is one of those things that the Rays–
• 54:24
  Speaker 5: almost have to play perfect because you see what happens.
• 54:27
  Speaker 5: The drop pop-up, the ball between his legs. David Hamilton
• 54:31
  Speaker 5: ends up beating that out. It scores a run. I
• 54:34
  Speaker 5: think the drop pop-up ended up leading to two runs.
• 54:37
  Speaker 5: So I think it is a– it is definitely something
• 54:42
  Speaker 5: I think the Brewers are the better team. And then
• 54:45
  Speaker 5: when the Rays make mistakes, it's so much harder to
• 54:49
  Speaker 5: beat a team that is top, top-down– Better than you overall.
• 54:55
  Speaker 2: See, that's where I want to go the other way.
• 54:57
  Speaker 2: You're saying they have to play perfect to beat them.
• 55:00
  Speaker 2: I don't even think they're playing close to perfect, right?
• 55:02
  Speaker 2: I mean, we watch games all year. This is where
• 55:04
  Speaker 2: we have the advantage. Here's the difference for me, Kratz,
• 55:08
  Speaker 2: and you can disagree. Buck mentioned, it's like the Rays
• 55:11
  Speaker 2: sometimes will run themselves into outs. That's how aggressive they are.
• 55:14
  Speaker 3: Cool, get it.
• 55:15
  Speaker 1: I watch that during the regular season. Should you adjust
• 55:17
  Speaker 1: a little bit based on the way this team plays?
• 55:19
  Speaker 6: Sure.
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: Should you be sending Liam Hicks at that moment in
• 55:21
  Speaker 1: the six? Probably not.
• 55:22
  Speaker 2: But that is the Rays' brand. The other part of
• 55:24
  Speaker 2: the Rays brand is that they are a top three
• 55:27
  Speaker 2: defense in baseball. They're not playing anything close to that.
• 55:31
  Speaker 2: That's the difference for me. And I know Aranda is
• 55:33
  Speaker 2: probably one of the weak links there. I've been following
• 55:34
  Speaker 2: Aranda for years. He's always had the bat, right?
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: He was discovered. He's in the minors. He's hitting. And
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: they're like, where are we playing him? So that's part
• 55:41
  Speaker 1: of it.
• 55:41
  Speaker 2: But I mean, if you look at defensive ranks, it's
• 55:43
  Speaker 2: like the Rays and the Cubs are the two best
• 55:45
  Speaker 2: defensive teams in baseball. And they're not playing anything close
• 55:48
  Speaker 2: to that. I mean, Simpson, DeLuca, like there's plays they
• 55:51
  Speaker 2: usually make it. It's not a baseball, but it's not great.
• 55:54
  Speaker 2: I mean, to me, there's a big difference between playing
• 55:57
  Speaker 2: perfect and what the Rays are doing right now on defense.
• 56:01
  Speaker 7: Okay.
• 56:02
  Speaker 5: So the Rays' worst position defensively is first base. They're
• 56:07
  Speaker 5: minus 10 defensive runs saved. And in center field, they're
• 56:13
  Speaker 5: not the best. You're looking at they're a good defensive.
• 56:19
  Speaker 5: They're the second best defensive team based on defensive runs saved.
• 56:23
  Speaker 5: but they're not perfect. I think we have to realize
• 56:27
  Speaker 5: we've played two games. There's been two games.
• 56:31
  Speaker 3: Should Walls have caught that line drive by William Contreras? Yes.
• 56:35
  Speaker 3: Is Walls a bad fielder? No.
• 56:38
  Speaker 5: So it's a different story than what we heard all
• 56:40
  Speaker 5: the Dodgers talking about when they got drunk, talking about
• 56:43
  Speaker 5: the Yankees after they beat them. We knew if we
• 56:45
  Speaker 5: just put the ball in play, they were going to
• 56:47
  Speaker 5: do things that were going to make mistakes. I don't
• 56:51
  Speaker 5: think the Rays are at that level in the sense
• 56:55
  Speaker 5: of like, oh, they're screwing up here.
• 56:57
  Speaker 3: I think they're still good. It's a two-game sample size.
• 57:01
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 57:01
  Speaker 2: I mean, Caminero was kind of yelling and gesturing, and
• 57:04
  Speaker 2: he said he was trying to spark the team, but
• 57:05
  Speaker 2: also was pointing out this was not the way that
• 57:08
  Speaker 2: they've played in the regular season defense-wise. And same with
• 57:10
  Speaker 2: DeLuca said after game two that the game's speeding up
• 57:13
  Speaker 2: on them a little bit right now. So that's a
• 57:14
  Speaker 2: little bit of honesty. I get what you're saying, Kratz.
• 57:17
  Speaker 2: It's not like it's the worst defense we've ever seen.
• 57:19
  Speaker 2: But it's not great. The first two games, I mean,
• 57:21
  Speaker 2: if you're a Rays fan, you watch this team.
• 57:24
  Speaker 3: The Brewers also put pressure on you, though. That's the
• 57:26
  Speaker 3: thing they do. They always know.
• 57:27
  Speaker 4: And trust me, I've talked to a lot of managers
• 57:30
  Speaker 4: and teams that have played against the Brewers, and the
• 57:32
  Speaker 4: Rays are also a team that does this. They just
• 57:35
  Speaker 4: put pressure on you, take the extra base, make hard turns.
• 57:38
  Speaker 4: But they're going to steal. They're always looking for that advantage.
• 57:41
  Speaker 4: So as a team, you know, man, they might go
• 57:43
  Speaker 4: with the infield. If they're running around third, they're going
• 57:45
  Speaker 4: on contact.
• 57:46
  Speaker 3: We've got to be quick.
• 57:47
  Speaker 4: They might go first to third, and we think they're
• 57:48
  Speaker 4: not going to. They might steal any chance they get.
• 57:51
  Speaker 4: And the Rays have done this to other teams, and
• 57:53
  Speaker 4: right now the Brewers are beating them kind of at
• 57:55
  Speaker 4: their own game.
• 57:56
  Speaker 2: Did you guys see this Trevor McGill quote, AJ? He
• 58:00
  Speaker 2: shows up to the trap. He goes, whoever decided to
• 58:02
  Speaker 2: make the roof the same color as the baseball is
• 58:04
  Speaker 2: a bleeping idiot.
• 58:07
  Speaker 3: Agreed. Agreed.
• 58:08
  Speaker 4: I just remember Vaughn Hayes back in the day had
• 58:11
  Speaker 4: to go there. This was like in the 80s and
• 58:13
  Speaker 4: had to– take fly balls to prove that it was
• 58:17
  Speaker 4: viable for baseball. So, and also it changes colors due
• 58:20
  Speaker 4: to the sunlight. If it's raining out, you played there
• 58:22
  Speaker 4: a lot. If it's sunny out, it's a different color
• 58:24
  Speaker 4: than when it's rainy out. If it's dark out, it's
• 58:26
  Speaker 4: a different color. It's kind of an interesting thing, but
• 58:29
  Speaker 4: you know, guys don't lose. I mean, guys lose balls,
• 58:32
  Speaker 4: but not as often as you think that they would.
• 58:35
  Speaker 5: The reason you, when I got traded there, the very
• 58:38
  Speaker 5: first time I got traded, we were in New York.
• 58:41
  Speaker 5: So I played in Yankee stadium and then we flew
• 58:44
  Speaker 5: down and they were like, first day, extra hitting early,
• 58:48
  Speaker 5: they set up the machine and they go catch some pop-ups.
• 58:52
  Speaker 3: And I was like, well, this is easy.
• 58:55
  Speaker 5: And then you caught three of them and then they go,
• 58:56
  Speaker 5: all right, now when it goes up, find the ball,
• 59:00
  Speaker 5: look at the fence and then find the ball again.
• 59:02
  Speaker 5: And I was like, all right, look at the fence.
• 59:05
  Speaker 5: And I was like, oh Lord, where'd it go? So
• 59:08
  Speaker 5: if you see somebody look away, that's when they lose it.
• 59:11
  Speaker 5: You just never take your eye off it, and you
• 59:14
  Speaker 5: don't lose it. When you take your eye off it
• 59:16
  Speaker 5: to see if somebody's coming near you or if you're
• 59:18
  Speaker 5: getting near the fence, that's when guys lose it.
• 59:22
  Speaker 4: By the way, when I was with the Twins, because
• 59:24
  Speaker 4: this is how the Twins were run, We had to
• 59:27
  Speaker 4: do pop-ups after games because they wouldn't turn the lights
• 59:30
  Speaker 4: fully on except for when the game started. And so
• 59:34
  Speaker 4: we had to do pop-ups after games because that was
• 59:38
  Speaker 4: the only time you could get the full effect in
• 59:39
  Speaker 4: the Metrodome of the lights being on. They didn't want
• 59:42
  Speaker 4: to turn the lights on too early, so they had
• 59:44
  Speaker 4: to turn them on right before the game started. So
• 59:45
  Speaker 4: the only way you could get work on pop-ups was
• 59:48
  Speaker 4: after the game.
• 59:49
  Speaker 3: Yep, Coach wins. Because of cost?
• 59:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 59:52
  Speaker 4: I don't know why, but that is a true story.
• 59:54
  Speaker 4: We also didn't have a batting cage or a weight room. So,
• 59:57
  Speaker 4: I mean, you know, it just was the twin way.
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 3: We had to hit. We had to hit.
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 4: Extra hitting was after a game, they'd drop a net
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 4: on the baggie, and we would hit into the baggie net.
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 4: That was like our flips. You know, we used to
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 4: do flips.
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 2: On the Record, presented by Fox One, Fox One apps
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 2: where you can watch the World Series, along with Fox,
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 2: of course, on the TV side. That's where Tom Verducci...
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 2: is part of the broadcast team. Tom, great to have
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 2: you on here. And we were just talking about the
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 2: Rays and how parts of what you're seeing from them
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 2: looks normal and parts doesn't.
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 1: Do you agree with that? What are you seeing from
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 1: them compared to the regular season?
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 7: Yeah, no question. I think it's partly because of the Brewers.
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 7: They do put a tremendous amount of pressure on you.
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 7: I mean, they saw 184 pitches in eight turns at
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 7: bat the other night. I mean, that's just crazy. They're
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 7: wearing people out. And they also can steal their bags.
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 7: We saw that. But, you know, I didn't have a
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 7: problem with the send on Liam Hicks with two outs.
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 7: Taylor Walls is on deck. That guy's hitting a buck
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 7: 33 in the postseason. It is the way that they play.
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 7: It didn't take a great throw.
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 3: To get him.
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 7: I realized that. I didn't have a huge problem with that.
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 7: The Mesa situation, clearly, just a brain cramp. I mean,
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 7: first of all, Yandy Diaz does not want runners moving
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 7: when he's hitting, and he's the best hitter in Major
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 7: League Baseball with runners in scoring position. He knew it.
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 7: Mesa knew it. It was just a bad call right there.
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 7: But they have to keep playing this way. There's no
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 7: doubt that they run into outs on the bases. They
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 7: were fourth in Major League Baseball making outs on the bases.
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 7: They're going to sign up for a few of those.
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 7: But they have to keep the pedal to the metal
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 7: here because that lineup is just not as deep as
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 7: the Brewers lineup. So they're going to have to create
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 7: runs by getting extra bases.
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 3: Tom, is that their path? Is that their path?
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 4: Obviously, they need Freddy Peralta to come out tonight in
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 4: Game 3 and pitch really well. But is that their path?
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 4: They have to kind of put so much pressure on
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 4: the Brewers. And they finally cracked. They haven't cracked all
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 4: postseason because nobody's been able to do it except for
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 4: the one game in San Diego. Other than that, it's
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 4: been just the Brewers' pressure, pressure, pressure, and no one
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 4: has been able to do it to them back.
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 7: Yeah, it reminds me of what Dave Roberts said when
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 7: they faced the Brewers. But I think game two, he said,
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 7: we have to keep Aaron Ashby out of the game.
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 7: And it really is that simple because if it's a
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 7: tie game, maybe even minus one, Ashby's in the game
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 7: and you're done. So you have to separate yourself. in
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 7: the first six things of the game and really have
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 7: teams have not been able to do that. You know, they've,
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 7: the Brewers have faced 11 deficits in this post season.
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 7: They've made up 10 of them. I mean, that's just crazy, right?
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 7: So the path for the race, here it is guys.
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 7: First of all, it starts with Freddie Peralta has to
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 7: go six innings. This is a must win game. Well,
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 7: it's not, you know, sugarcoat this. It's not an elimination game,
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 7: but it's a must win game. And they must get
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 7: six innings out of Freddie Peralta. And that's hard to
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 7: do because he's a below average strike thrower. He's above
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 7: average in pitches per plate appearance. We just talked about
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 7: the Brewers and how they wear teams down, and their
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 7: pitches per plate appearance is way north of four in
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 7: this postseason. That's not a good combination for Freddie Peralta.
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 7: He wants to try to get you to chase that
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 7: high fastball and change up down. They just don't do that.
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 7: So he's going to have to be in the zone
• 1:02:59
  Speaker 7: more because they do need six innings at him. Because
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 7: the biggest difference for me, and I knew this going in,
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 7: it's not just the bullpen, and we're seeing it in
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 7: two games, is pure stuff. The Brewers' average fastball VLO,
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 7: and I know that's not everything, is over 98. The Rays'
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 7: fastball average VLO is 94. The Rays have thrown one
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 7: pitch at 98 miles an hour. That'll change tonight with Peralta,
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 7: but one pitch. The Brewers have 94 of them. Breaking pitches.
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 7: The Brewers have thrown 24% breaking pitches. The Rays, it's
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 7: only 9%. That's all they do. So pure stuff on
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 7: the mound, and when you look at exit VLO, the
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 7: Rays have the lowest exit VLO, and I know it's
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 7: only two games, of any team in the World Series
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 7: since 2015, since we measured these things. The Brewers are
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 7: just purely outstuffing the Rays right now, and Peralta has
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 7: to change that. He's throwing the hardest he's ever thrown
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 7: in his life this month, and he's got to bring
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 7: that in the strike zone in Game 3.
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 5: Isn't that a tough road to hoe? If you're talking
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 5: about Freddie P needing to go long... But it's a must-win.
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 5: Where does that lie for Kevin Cash, who has been
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 5: way different than the Kevin Cash we knew in 2020, where.
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 3: He stuck with his guys?
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 5: Is that where the game's going to hinge tonight, if
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 5: he has to stay with Freddie too long? Or is
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 5: it more dangerous to take him out too early?
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 7: Well, look at his circle of trust behind his starting pitchers.
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 7: It's gotten really thin right now. Seymour is almost unusable
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 7: in a high-leverage spot. Kevin Kelly is the best right-handed
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 7: setup guy, and he has been hit. And he is
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 7: just not getting swing and miss right now. Not many
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 7: great options. Cam Boozer is probably it. And remember this
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 7: about Brian Baker. His fastball velo is way down. Now,
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 7: he can still throw a changeup and tell you he's
• 1:04:52
  Speaker 7: throwing it and get you to miss. But I'm telling
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 7: you right now, Cash is not using him for more
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 7: than three outs. Even in a must-win game, he's not
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 7: coming in to get four or five outs. the way
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 7: that Ashby can, and even sometimes McGill can. So he's
• 1:05:06
  Speaker 7: a little– Kevin Cash is a little hamstrung about when
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 7: he can go to the bullpen, and especially the high-leverage guys.
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 7: That's a huge advantage for the Milwaukee Brewers. I mean,
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 7: you see the way Murph is running these games. He
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 7: can't wait to put the game in the hands of
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 7: his bullpen because he has multiple options who are platoon
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 7: neutral who get more than three outs. I mean, it's
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 7: a luxury that he has, and they've all been great.
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 3: Tom, you brought it up, and I keep asking this
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 3: question with Seymour.
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 4: Is Clevenger hurt because– They keep using Seymour left on left,
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 4: left on left.
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 3: He's a reverse splits guy.
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 4: They want to save Boozer for the bigger spots, right,
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 4: for the bigger left-handed at-bats. Where's Clevenger? I know he
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 4: was hurt. He's back on the roster now. Does Kevin
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 4: Cash just not have any enough trust in him to
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 4: use him in those big situations?
• 1:05:49
  Speaker 7: Yeah, you mentioned he was hurt, so he wasn't quite
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 7: right when they first brought him back. But I think
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 7: right now, yes, he's now in that circle of trust
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 7: as much as you can. Again, a little bit behind Boozer,
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 7: but you're going to need those lefties here against the Brewers.
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 7: They liked the way he threw the ball the other day.
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 7: And Seymour has been so home run prone. I mean,
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 7: even to Sal Free, like that was just a 3-2,
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 7: you know, throw it over the middle of the plate.
• 1:06:11
  Speaker 7: He's not going to hit a home run. He got
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 7: burned by it. So, yeah, I think Clevenger is definitely
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 7: in the mix. Maybe not as certain as he was
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 7: early in the season. The other key for me, guys,
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 7: and I remember talking to Murph before this series started,
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 7: like who is the one guy you have to control
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 7: in that lineup? And we all think it's Junior Caminero, right?
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 7: He said Yandy Diaz. That was striking to me. Diaz
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 7: is like the heart and soul of this team who
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 7: hits really good pitching, has very few holes. Look what
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 7: they've done to Yandy Diaz. They've made him look bad.
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 7: I have not seen this guy look bad. He's 0
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 7: for 9, and he's 0 for 7 on pitches out
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 7: of the strike zone. Game 2, he struck out three
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 7: times swinging on pitches out of the zone against three
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 7: different pitchers. He had never done that in his career
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 7: in more than 1,000 games played. They've made him look
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 7: bad with fastballs up and chase spin. The Rays ain't
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 7: winning this series unless Yandy Diaz contributes. He's just too important.
• 1:07:08
  Speaker 7: He's a pillar of that offense, pillar of the franchise,
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 7: and the Brewers have just shut him down.
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 5: Yandy hasn't chased since 2017 when we played together in Columbus. So, yes,
• 1:07:19
  Speaker 5: Yandy doesn't chase. You talked about the Rays lineup there.
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 5: Do you think cash goes with a little bit different
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 5: of a configuration to maybe get a few more pitches
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 5: for guys like Yandy and moving– Chandler Simpson out of
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 5: that spot that he's in.
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 7: Yeah, I would do that. I mean, I like Chandler
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 7: Simpson a lot. I mean, how do you not like him?
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 7: Because he's going to put the ball in play. It's
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 7: kind of like that Luisa rise for them. But I
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 7: want to get Caminero to the plate as often as possible.
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 7: I don't want to have to go through three hitters
• 1:07:46
  Speaker 7: to get to Caminero to have that fourth or fifth
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 7: plate appearance late in the game. I would move him up.
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 7: I'd probably Chandler Simpson behind him. You know, it's not
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 7: a lot he can do. I think tonight against the lefty,
• 1:07:58
  Speaker 7: the question is, what does he do with catcher? you know,
• 1:08:01
  Speaker 7: with Hicks and Fortes, he has been going to Fortes
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 7: against lefties, you know, the way Hicks swinging the bat
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 7: right now, maybe you lead a little, a little bit
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 7: more towards offense right there. My guess is it'll be Hicks,
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 7: but I'm not sure which way he'll go. Obviously Williamson
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 7: will be in playing second base instead of Palacios. But yeah,
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 7: I wouldn't expect a whole lot. You know, it's interesting
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 7: that Yanni really likes hitting lead off and in a
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 7: perfect world, Chandler Simpson would be the leadoff hitter for
• 1:08:26
  Speaker 7: the race.
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 7: And maybe it's going to be that way in the future,
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 7: but right now it's, You don't want to upset it
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 7: too much by just completely gerrymandering the lineup.
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 4: Tom, you brought up Chandler Simpson. Game one, there was
• 1:08:40
  Speaker 4: an opportunity to pinch hit with Richie. Sorry, you brought
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 4: up Richie Palacios. Palacios for Johnny DeLuca off McGill.
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 3: Is there a reason?
• 1:08:47
  Speaker 4: I mean, did Kevin Cash say because he didn't want
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 4: him to bring in a lefty to face Palacios?
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 3: But hadn't Ashby.
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 4: Already been used? So who was the left? Did they
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 4: have a lefty up? Because I don't remember seeing a
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 4: lefty up at that time.
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 3: I'm glad.
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 7: You brought that up because that's the first thing I
• 1:09:01
  Speaker 7: thought about in that situation. DeLuca and McGill, not a
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 7: great matchup, right? Game on the line. And yes, D.L.
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 7: Hall was warm in the bullpen. And that's what Kevin
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 7: Cash said, that he knew they were going to bring
• 1:09:13
  Speaker 7: in the lefty if you sent up Palacios. Now, Palacios
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 7: said good at bats against lefties in the postseason. My
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 7: question was to Murph. Are you really taking your closer
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 7: out if it's Richie Palacios pinch hitting against Trevor McGill?
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 7: The answer is probably no. He gave me a sly smile.
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 7: He's not going to tell me yes or no, what
• 1:09:32
  Speaker 7: he would do in a hypothetical. But if I'm Kevin Cash,
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 7: I am putting the pressure on Murphy right there. Do
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 7: you really want to take your closer out of the
• 1:09:41
  Speaker 7: game just to go left on left matchup? And otherwise,
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 7: if you don't, I'd rather have the lefty against McGill.
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 3: You have Griffin Jacks, who's done starting, who's done relieving.
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 5: Is it too much to ask or too much second-guessing
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 5: to say, well, was Griffin Jacks available on whatever day,
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 5: Saturday night?
• 1:10:05
  Speaker 7: Well, you know, I know he was in Game 1.
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 7: Both Peralta and Jacks were available. They were actually in
• 1:10:10
  Speaker 7: the bullpen in Game 1. I didn't see them in
• 1:10:13
  Speaker 7: Game 2. It doesn't mean they weren't there in the
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 7: way these guys have played. you would think that those
• 1:10:19
  Speaker 7: pitchers would be like holding off their throw days and
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 7: being available in the bullpen. It's a great question, Eric,
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 7: because I think the way the Rays have done things,
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 7: we saw Peralta do that in the last round. When
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 7: you're losing options in terms of your circle of trust,
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 7: why not one of those starters? Now, you have to
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 7: be careful about when you plug them in the game. Generally,
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 7: even though Jax has had a history of doing it,
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 7: generally giving them a lot of time to warm up
• 1:10:43
  Speaker 7: and not just hurrying them in with runners on base.
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 7: But that's a good point because the Rays have shown
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 7: they're not afraid to do that. And I think in
• 1:10:50
  Speaker 7: this case, especially down to, oh, it's probably not going
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 7: to happen tonight. But yeah, that should be more of
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 7: an option for the Rays in those go-to situations. Middle
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 7: innings keep the game close. Because I did think in
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 7: game one, Kevin Cash was trying to chase a deficit.
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 7: You have to. It's only one run. And I know
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 7: the Brewers' bullpen is great. Matz was in because Seymour
• 1:11:10
  Speaker 7: is out of that circle of trust, right? Matz actually
• 1:11:13
  Speaker 7: threw the ball well. They just wouldn't chase against him.
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 7: And then Kelly was his best right-handed guy. So it
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 7: wasn't like he wasn't chasing a deficit. But the option
• 1:11:21
  Speaker 7: of bringing in one of those starters, I think, yeah,
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 7: that certainly, at least as a question, should have been
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 7: on the table.
• 1:11:27
  Speaker 3: Tom, we haven't even asked you yet. Did he swing?
• 1:11:30
  Speaker 3: You keep mentioning Yanni Diaz. Did you think he swung?
• 1:11:33
  Speaker 4: That's what I want to know because we've been this
• 1:11:35
  Speaker 4: far in the interview and we haven't even brought it
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 4: up yet.
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 3: So did he swing?
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 7: Yeah, he swung. And Kevin Cash even admitted it. It's
• 1:11:41
  Speaker 7: weird because it was like the slowest check swing you'd
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 7: ever seen in the world. What the umpires do, they
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 7: stand on the line, the base umpires. They're looking right
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 7: down the chalk line. And they use that as a guide.
• 1:11:53
  Speaker 7: It's not a rule. The swing is not defined in
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 7: the rule book. But their guide is a base umpire.
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 7: Look down the line. When you see that barrel across
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 7: the white line, that's a swing. Now, again, that's not
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 7: a rule. That's a thumbnail for these umpires. And you
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 7: see it's clearly passing The line. Now, probably as soon
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 7: as next year, we will get the challenge on check
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 7: swings and there'll be no argument. But even on the
• 1:12:14
  Speaker 7: Tampa Bay race side, when they saw it on replay,
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 7: they agreed it was a swing.
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 6: AJ.
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 3: Crotty? Oh, I thought Crotty had a question. Sorry. All right.
• 1:12:27
  Speaker 4: Well, then I'm going to go to my next one then.
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 4: The Brewers have– do they ever worry about these guys
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 4: getting tired? I mean, Ashby's thrown unbelievable amounts, and he
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 4: throws two, three innings.
• 1:12:38
  Speaker 3: At a time.
• 1:12:39
  Speaker 4: And then, you know, he's used Romero. They've used Hall.
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 4: They've used– Arriba throws every game, right? The one guy
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 4: who they seem to be able to rest is McGill.
• 1:12:49
  Speaker 4: Will Ashby– will we see Ashby? Because even the great
• 1:12:53
  Speaker 4: Andrew Miller, right, in 2016, got tired towards the end
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 4: of that series because– They kept going to him in Cleveland,
• 1:13:00
  Speaker 4: going to him. And finally, he's like, man, I'm tired.
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 4: So we ever see this with the Brewers. But then again,
• 1:13:05
  Speaker 4: I guess the answer would be if they ever get
• 1:13:07
  Speaker 4: into a long enough series.
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 3: Where they're able to get tired.
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 7: Yeah, that's a great question. I brought that. I'm glad
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 7: you brought it up because Aaron Ashby to me is
• 1:13:14
  Speaker 7: unlike any pitcher in baseball. He might be the most
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 7: valuable pitcher as far as changing outcomes of games because
• 1:13:19
  Speaker 7: he just completely shuts the game down. Platoon neutral. He's
• 1:13:22
  Speaker 7: got that high delivery with a short stride. His curveball
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 7: drops more than any curveball in baseball. He throws 100
• 1:13:28
  Speaker 7: miles an hour. He's got a great changeup for pitch guy.
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 7: I mean, what more can you want? And the guy
• 1:13:32
  Speaker 7: literally wants to pitch every day. I've stopped asking the Brewers, like,
• 1:13:36
  Speaker 7: is he available today? Just assume if you're watching the game,
• 1:13:40
  Speaker 7: no matter how much he's pitched or how many pitches
• 1:13:42
  Speaker 7: he's thrown, he's available to pitch multiple innings. He's just
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 7: that kind of a guy. I mean, he's just a freak.
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 7: in terms of his availability and his stuff. It's just crazy.
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 7: Now you mentioned Miller. Yes, that was a case to me.
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 7: It was classic example of exposure in a seven game series.
• 1:13:59
  Speaker 7: I remember the Cubs telling me in 16, by the
• 1:14:01
  Speaker 7: time they saw Miller in game seven, they understood when
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 7: to swing on the arc of his breaking ball. Like
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 7: you see it enough times you realize if it starts
• 1:14:11
  Speaker 7: at you, it's going to be out of the strike zone.
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 7: If it starts behind you as a left-handed hitter, that's
• 1:14:16
  Speaker 7: when you pull the cord on it and take a
• 1:14:17
  Speaker 7: rip at it. They figured that out after seeing him
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 7: in a seven-game series. The problem is the Brewers haven't
• 1:14:22
  Speaker 7: been stretched in these series, and the off days, having
• 1:14:25
  Speaker 7: 11 days off between the LCS and the World Series,
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 7: has really emboldened that bullpen. I mean, they got a
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 7: last stop for gas here and gassed up again, filled
• 1:14:35
  Speaker 7: the tank before this series. That was the worst-case scenario
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 7: for the Rays. So when you're watching these World Series games,
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 7: even if we get to three games in a row
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 7: in Tampa– I'm telling you, Ashby's going to be available
• 1:14:46
  Speaker 7: for all of them. Now, Murph thinks that D.L. Hall
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 7: is going to play a big role in these three
• 1:14:50
  Speaker 7: games as well because he's like your B alternative, the
• 1:14:54
  Speaker 7: B side to Aaron Ashby. He will figure it. He
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 7: may even close a game and hold him back if
• 1:14:59
  Speaker 7: McGill or Ashby's not around. So, again, we're getting to
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 7: a situation where Murph has just so many good options.
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 7: But the big three, Uribe, Ashby, McGill, you know, they
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 7: just keep taking the ball. And I don't see any
• 1:15:11
  Speaker 7: drop off in their stuff.
• 1:15:13
  Speaker 3: Two comments, Tom.
• 1:15:15
  Speaker 5: B-side, Tom was talking about cassette tapes. For people who
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 5: don't know, it's the other side of a cassette tape.
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 5: He said the B-side for their relievers. And the other
• 1:15:23
  Speaker 5: comment is, I knew Andrew Miller was going to throw
• 1:15:26
  Speaker 5: a slider, and I still couldn't hit it. And I
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 5: was not a good hitter, but I don't care what
• 1:15:31
  Speaker 5: people say. During that time, he was nasty. My question
• 1:15:35
  Speaker 5: to you is about Big Woo. Since he's been put
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 5: on the roster, has there been the question of is
• 1:15:41
  Speaker 5: he best used– in this moment? Is it game four
• 1:15:46
  Speaker 5: spot start to get him out there so it's a
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 5: controlled environment?
• 1:15:52
  Speaker 7: Yeah, that's a great point. I actually thought, and there
• 1:15:54
  Speaker 7: was some consideration on Milwaukee's part, to use him as
• 1:15:57
  Speaker 7: an opener in tonight's game, in game three, and then
• 1:16:00
  Speaker 7: go to Gasser. Because let's face it, you prefer with
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 7: Diaz and then Cabanero at four, a right-hander in that
• 1:16:07
  Speaker 7: first inning, if you just wanted to go pure opener.
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 7: And right now, he can only go At most, I
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 7: would say two innings, right? This guy hasn't pitched since July.
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 7: Hasn't even been on a rehab. They said he was
• 1:16:18
  Speaker 7: lights out in their intra-squad game. He went up against
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 7: the varsity in their intra-squad game and was throwing 92
• 1:16:24
  Speaker 7: and was getting swings and misses. That's what got him
• 1:16:27
  Speaker 7: on the roster. Now, when do you use him? I
• 1:16:31
  Speaker 7: think an opener spot is perfect for him. But listen,
• 1:16:34
  Speaker 7: Gasser has been throwing the ball so well. That would
• 1:16:36
  Speaker 7: have been a terrible message to send to Gasser. Like,
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 7: we don't trust you to pitch to the top of
• 1:16:40
  Speaker 7: the lineup In the first inning, we're going to use
• 1:16:42
  Speaker 7: a guy who hasn't pitched in four months. So just
• 1:16:45
  Speaker 7: send Gasser out there. You know, he's earned it. Gasser
• 1:16:47
  Speaker 7: pitched great in two hostile places in San Diego and L.A.
• 1:16:51
  Speaker 7: So I get it for tonight. Maybe for four. I
• 1:16:54
  Speaker 7: still don't know. It's just you trust Wu's heart. You know,
• 1:16:59
  Speaker 7: nobody's got a bigger heart. He's going to come right
• 1:17:00
  Speaker 7: at you with his fastball. He's got, you know, six
• 1:17:04
  Speaker 7: or seven, maybe eight batters in that arm at a time.
• 1:17:07
  Speaker 7: I don't know if you're going to bring them in
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 7: with runners on base. So short answer is I'm not
• 1:17:10
  Speaker 7: sure where the spot is. It's probably best as an
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 7: opener so we can prep for that. But I don't
• 1:17:16
  Speaker 7: know if the Brewers want to do that right now.
• 1:17:19
  Speaker 4: Tom, by the way, I know you're a big Springsteen guy.
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 4: So B-side is actually a record, Kratz. We're older than you,
• 1:17:24
  Speaker 4: so we actually understand.
• 1:17:26
  Speaker 7: As long as you didn't say 45s. Remember those little ones,
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 7: the 45s?
• 1:17:32
  Speaker 3: Yeah. They had to be 45s too.
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I know I know so it's it was it
• 1:17:36
  Speaker 4: was like side error was side one inside two for
• 1:17:38
  Speaker 4: a cassette and it was a and B for That's right.
• 1:17:41
  Speaker 3: That's right, but it's fine.
• 1:17:42
  Speaker 4: It's fine We we all we all started losing our
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 4: memory at an advanced age, by the way, two things
• 1:17:47
  Speaker 4: Tom for that You go one. Do you have a
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 4: tattoo of Springsteen like Murph does?
• 1:17:53
  Speaker 7: You know, he's racing called him the other day you
• 1:17:55
  Speaker 7: guys probably heard that story. I mean, that's like an
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 7: old timer Yeah Murph, as you guys said, huge Springsteen fan.
• 1:18:02
  Speaker 7: He's seen him at least 10 times. He's got the
• 1:18:04
  Speaker 7: tattoos and everything. So when they beat the Dodgers, Murph
• 1:18:07
  Speaker 7: is talking to his team before they pop the champagne,
• 1:18:11
  Speaker 7: and he's like, blah, blah, blah. We want to be
• 1:18:13
  Speaker 7: the last man standing, which is from a Springsteen song
• 1:18:16
  Speaker 7: from about six, seven years ago. Bruce was watching. I mean,
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 7: this guy watching the postgame show, not just the game,
• 1:18:22
  Speaker 7: watching the postgame show, calls up the Brewers and said,
• 1:18:24
  Speaker 7: get me Murph's number. Murph is sitting around, I think
• 1:18:28
  Speaker 7: it was Wednesday before the World Series. He sees his
• 1:18:31
  Speaker 7: phone rings, look at the caller ID. It's 732 from
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 7: Freehold Township, New Jersey. He's like, whoa. And it was
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 7: Bruce FaceTiming from his backyard from the boss to the boss.
• 1:18:44
  Speaker 7: How cool is that? That was like an all-time moment
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 7: for Murph.
• 1:18:48
  Speaker 3: Murph's moved up in the world. Murph's moved up in
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 3: the world.
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 4: Speaking of moving up in the world, we just had
• 1:18:52
  Speaker 4: this conversation earlier with Andy McCullough about the Haunted Hotel
• 1:18:56
  Speaker 4: in St.
• 1:18:57
  Speaker 3: Petersburg.
• 1:18:58
  Speaker 4: Now, I'm not going to say where you're staying, and
• 1:19:00
  Speaker 4: I know you're not at the Haunted Hotel, but have
• 1:19:03
  Speaker 4: you ever seen a ghost in Milwaukee or St.
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 3: Petersburg?
• 1:19:08
  Speaker 7: I never have. But I don't know if you saw
• 1:19:11
  Speaker 7: the explanation from Matt Arnold. You talk about analytics department.
• 1:19:14
  Speaker 7: He broke it down scientifically at the Pfister Hotel in Milwaukee.
• 1:19:18
  Speaker 7: He said if you're on the old side of the hotel,
• 1:19:21
  Speaker 7: that you saw a different tower for the remote controls
• 1:19:24
  Speaker 7: on the TV. So that when you press that remote
• 1:19:28
  Speaker 7: on your side in the old tower, you can actually
• 1:19:31
  Speaker 7: zap the TV in the next room. So he's like
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 7: dispelling anything about the extraterrestrial world or mystical things that
• 1:19:41
  Speaker 7: are happening at the Pfister by saying, no, we broke
• 1:19:44
  Speaker 7: it down analytically. That is so Brewers.
• 1:19:47
  Speaker 4: Well, by the way, that ruins a lot of people's
• 1:19:48
  Speaker 4: stories about ghosts in the Pfister. That ruins a lot
• 1:19:51
  Speaker 4: of people's stories.
• 1:19:52
  Speaker 7: You're still not getting Mookie Betts to stay there.
• 1:19:55
  Speaker 4: Mookie Yachty wouldn't stay there. There's a whole list of
• 1:19:58
  Speaker 4: guys that wouldn't stay there.
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 3: Never.
• 1:20:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think Mookie would rather buy a house than
• 1:20:03
  Speaker 2: have to stay there. And I know what he's been
• 1:20:06
  Speaker 2: renting now. So whatever he does, he's like, I'll spend
• 1:20:08
  Speaker 2: whatever it takes. It's not for me. So, well, Tom,
• 1:20:11
  Speaker 2: great coverage. It's been fun to watch. Appreciate the time.
• 1:20:14
  Speaker 2: Thanks for stopping by. Enjoy the rest of this one.
• 1:20:17
  Speaker 7: Yeah, thanks for having me, guys.
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 6: A lot of fun.
• 1:20:19
  Speaker 2: Tom Verducci, Fox. Fox One also is where you can
• 1:20:22
  Speaker 2: find the World Series streaming there at home or on
• 1:20:26
  Speaker 2: the go, live or on demand. Never miss a moment.
• 1:20:27
  Speaker 1: Stream now.
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 2: Start your Fox One three-day free trial today. I mean,
• 1:20:30
  Speaker 2: if you don't have it at this point for the
• 1:20:31
  Speaker 2: World Series, now's the time. FoxOne.com.
• 1:20:46
  Speaker 3: Pat Murphy loves to play an aggressive style ball game.
• 1:20:49
  Speaker 7: Kevin Cash at first base who likes to hit lefties.
• 1:20:52
  Speaker 3: That's one of the reasons he's in there.
• 1:20:53
  Speaker 4: Punch it right to the first baseman who goes to
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 4: second against the force and they got it.
• 1:20:59
  Speaker 7: Well Cash comes in here and plays this just beautifully.
• 1:21:02
  Speaker 5: Watch him all the way now and this is set
• 1:21:04
  Speaker 5: up on the pitch to throw over to first base
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 5: because he knew immediately. Oh, wow.
• 1:21:09
  Speaker 2: That's a 1998 clip. No, I didn't know that or
• 1:21:13
  Speaker 2: hear that one.
• 1:21:13
  Speaker 1: That was Harold Reynolds from the College World Series, right?
• 1:21:16
  Speaker 3: It was.
• 1:21:16
  Speaker 4: It was. And Murph ended up winning, I think, 11
• 1:21:20
  Speaker 4: to 10. And Cash had a nice game. 11 to 10.
• 1:21:23
  Speaker 4: And Cash was playing first base. Everyone thought Cash was
• 1:21:25
  Speaker 4: a catcher. He was playing first base for the old
• 1:21:27
  Speaker 4: criminals back in the day.
• 1:21:29
  Speaker 5: He was a third baseman that the Blue Jays drafted.
• 1:21:32
  Speaker 5: I mean, I knew everything about Kevin Cash because he
• 1:21:34
  Speaker 5: was a Blue Jays prospect. When I got drafted, they
• 1:21:37
  Speaker 5: talked about him like a legend. And, like, I think
• 1:21:40
  Speaker 5: Cash made the last out of that game, actually. Fly
• 1:21:43
  Speaker 5: ball to left field.
• 1:21:45
  Speaker 1: Did they mean future manager legend?
• 1:21:48
  Speaker 5: He was the catching prospect legend for Blue Jay young
• 1:21:53
  Speaker 5: catching prospects.
• 1:21:55
  Speaker 2: Well, it is tough to predict catching prospects. Toughest position
• 1:21:59
  Speaker 2: to predict. It's no offense to cash. He's the one
• 1:22:02
  Speaker 2: who makes fun of himself for, for his playing career
• 1:22:04
  Speaker 2: compared to how many years he's already notched with the race.
• 1:22:07
  Speaker 2: So he's done a great job with this team. Also
• 1:22:10
  Speaker 2: just want to shout out brewer territory. They've been doing
• 1:22:11
  Speaker 2: a lot of shows. So JP fire eyes and then
• 1:22:14
  Speaker 2: Corey can able on postgame shows, Kurt Hogue joining them.
• 1:22:17
  Speaker 2: Who's covering the series for the journal Sentinel. So if
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 2: you want a little more brewers coverage, And then the
• 1:22:22
  Speaker 2: shirts that you see for Kratz and AJ can be
• 1:22:25
  Speaker 2: available and bought on FoulTerritoryShop.com. There's a lot of spice
• 1:22:29
  Speaker 2: with both Rays and Brewers merch. We created many, many
• 1:22:32
  Speaker 2: more items for those two teams World Series time. So
• 1:22:36
  Speaker 2: if you want to check that out or you're looking
• 1:22:37
  Speaker 2: for some early holiday shopping.
• 1:22:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, postgame show tonight.
• 1:22:41
  Speaker 2: After the World Series Game 3 goes down.
• 1:22:45
  Speaker 1: We're looking forward to it. AJ, what's the drive for you,
• 1:22:48
  Speaker 1: by the way? What are we looking at?
• 1:22:51
  Speaker 3: Hold on. I'll look right now. Over the bridge.
• 1:22:56
  Speaker 6: 220.
• 1:22:56
  Speaker 2: 220.
• 1:22:56
  Speaker 3: 220-ish. 220.
• 1:22:57
  Speaker 4: So that's why I will not be on the postgame
• 1:23:02
  Speaker 4: because I have to drive to Tampa. Staying the night
• 1:23:05
  Speaker 4: over in Tampa. Going to game four tomorrow. Could be
• 1:23:07
  Speaker 4: a clincher for the Brewers, Kratz. Maybe I'll ask Shoggs
• 1:23:11
  Speaker 4: for your champagne. By the way, speaking of Shoggs, Kratz,
• 1:23:14
  Speaker 4: did you see when William Contreras gave him the the
• 1:23:18
  Speaker 4: high five and he shook his hand and he goes, GD.
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 3: I texted him. He goes, I got hands of stone.
• 1:23:22
  Speaker 3: I'm like, the hell you do.
• 1:23:24
  Speaker 5: That is, I texted in the exact same video on Instagram.
• 1:23:28
  Speaker 5: And I was like, and I, and then I texted the, my,
• 1:23:31
  Speaker 5: one of my favorite gifts to text the, the Kobe soft.
• 1:23:36
  Speaker 5: I was just like, where Kobe's just like soft. And
• 1:23:40
  Speaker 5: he's like, I'm not soft. I just didn't expect him
• 1:23:42
  Speaker 5: to hit me so hard. I was like, cause you're soft.
• 1:23:45
  Speaker 5: I was like, they just, they don't make them like
• 1:23:47
  Speaker 5: they used to. Like more slick back hair for my
• 1:23:50
  Speaker 5: guy Schauger.
• 1:23:52
  Speaker 1: What's his role for people that don't know?
• 1:23:55
  Speaker 3: Head President of Equipment Managing.
• 1:24:00
  Speaker 1: Head President? Is that really the exact term?
• 1:24:04
  Speaker 6: No.
• 1:24:04
  Speaker 5: He's the Equipment Manager, but we'll call him the President
• 1:24:09
  Speaker 5: of Equipment Managing.
• 1:24:11
  Speaker 3: He's hilarious. By the way, both these staffs are awesome,
• 1:24:16
  Speaker 3: by the way. Both teams.
• 1:24:18
  Speaker 4: I mean, we haven't really talked about it, but from
• 1:24:21
  Speaker 4: the PR staffs to the equipment staffs for both these
• 1:24:24
  Speaker 4: teams have been great to me over the years. I'm
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 4: sure they have to you, Kratz, too. But they're both very,
• 1:24:31
  Speaker 4: very solid on both sides. And that matters.
• 1:24:34
  Speaker 3: It does matter. That matters. It totally matters.
• 1:24:38
  Speaker 5: Because you look at what the Brewers are doing. They
• 1:24:40
  Speaker 5: have like five airplanes or something. They're flying down to
• 1:24:43
  Speaker 5: Tampa with scouts and front office and families and all
• 1:24:47
  Speaker 5: that stuff. But to me, when you have guys in
• 1:24:51
  Speaker 5: those positions, whether it's the head of travel or the
• 1:24:56
  Speaker 5: equipment manager or the clubbies or the assistant clubbies, if
• 1:24:59
  Speaker 5: there's too much ego in those people, I think it
• 1:25:04
  Speaker 5: overshadows what the players need to do. But also, if
• 1:25:07
  Speaker 5: the players have too much ego and are like, hey...
• 1:25:11
  Speaker 5: Bring me this. Hey, get me a rental car. It's
• 1:25:14
  Speaker 5: a collective group. So when they're talking about, oh, I
• 1:25:16
  Speaker 5: love these guys in this room. I love this team.
• 1:25:19
  Speaker 5: It is a collective group that if you talk to
• 1:25:21
  Speaker 5: Matt Arnold, if you talk to David Stearns when he
• 1:25:23
  Speaker 5: was the GM or Matt Klein, who's one of the
• 1:25:26
  Speaker 5: assistant GMs, possibly getting the Astros job, like that is
• 1:25:30
  Speaker 5: what they're about. And they create this environment. Both teams do.
• 1:25:35
  Speaker 5: And there's a value in that. I can't give you
• 1:25:37
  Speaker 5: a money price to it, but I can tell you
• 1:25:39
  Speaker 5: they're both in the World Series. And they're doing it
• 1:25:41
  Speaker 5: the right way. I think the guardians do it the
• 1:25:43
  Speaker 5: right way. I think the Dodgers do it the right
• 1:25:45
  Speaker 5: way in those senses of like those jobs matter. And
• 1:25:50
  Speaker 5: those people are treated like those jobs matter.
• 1:25:55
  Speaker 2: They were playing FT on the big board yesterday at
• 1:25:59
  Speaker 2: one point. If you guys didn't see that, I'll text
• 1:26:01
  Speaker 2: it to you. But there was an Ashby interview from
• 1:26:04
  Speaker 2: at some point during the season we did that was
• 1:26:06
  Speaker 2: on the screen like playing. I thought it was just
• 1:26:09
  Speaker 2: maybe like a fast flash during a montage, but it
• 1:26:11
  Speaker 2: was just playing. So bonus points, brownie points. Maybe they're
• 1:26:14
  Speaker 2: just getting it all warmed up for AJ's arrival.
• 1:26:18
  Speaker 4: I don't think I can wear this shirt, though, today.
• 1:26:20
  Speaker 4: I'm going to have to probably not wear this shirt.
• 1:26:22
  Speaker 6: Why?
• 1:26:23
  Speaker 4: Why?
• 1:26:23
  Speaker 3: Because you look like you're cheering for one team? Yes.
• 1:26:26
  Speaker 5: Well, we already know that you're a huge Dodgers fan,
• 1:26:31
  Speaker 5: and we already know that you're a huge Brewers fan,
• 1:26:34
  Speaker 5: and we already know that you're a huge Padres fan.
• 1:26:37
  Speaker 2: Yep, I was going to say, don't forget the Padres.
• 1:26:39
  Speaker 2: All right, Dodgers territory, by the way. AJ's favorite show
• 1:26:42
  Speaker 2: coming up next. They're going to talk about the team's
• 1:26:45
  Speaker 2: aging issue or not. One of the oldest teams in baseball.
• 1:26:49
  Speaker 2: See what they say about it.
• 1:26:50
  Speaker 1: They're getting so old. Walkers for the Dodgers next.
• 1:26:54
  Speaker 3: Stop. They won 100 games, Clint. They're not old.
• 1:26:57
  Speaker 1: It's not enough.
• 1:26:58
  Speaker 3: Not enough.
• 1:27:03
  Speaker 2: And also remember that today is the 33rd Sports Equinox.
• 1:27:07
  Speaker 2: So you've got the big four North American sports all
• 1:27:09
  Speaker 2: in action on the same day. We've got our game
• 1:27:11
  Speaker 2: for World Series, NFL Monday Night Football, NBA has nine games,
• 1:27:14
  Speaker 2: NHL has three games, and even the WNBA with their
• 1:27:17
  Speaker 2: game five of the finals. So that is sweet. And
• 1:27:22
  Speaker 2: you can use an any sport parlay boost token to
• 1:27:25
  Speaker 2: take advantage of that. If you want to watch multiple games,
• 1:27:27
  Speaker 2: then it's inside your BetMGM app.
• 1:27:29
  Speaker 1: Go look for it.
• 1:27:30
  Speaker 2: And if you activate it and win, you'll win a
• 1:27:33
  Speaker 2: little more if your bet hits. gambling problem or concern,
• 1:27:38
  Speaker 2: of course, there's help.
• 1:27:38
  Speaker 1: Call 1-800-GAMBLER.