Latest / Skin Anarchy / Revolutionizing Skincare for Gen Xers and Zenials with A.P. Chem’s Science-Driven Formulas and Adaptogenic Innovation

Transcript

Revolutionizing Skincare for Gen Xers and Zenials with A.P. Chem’s Science-Driven Formulas and Adaptogenic Innovation · Skin Anarchy

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_02: Hi guys, welcome back to Father Anarchy.
• 0:02
  SPEAKER_02: This is your host Ekta and I am really excited about our guest today.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_02: I am absolutely in love with this brand and the science is just it's gonna blow your mind and I really really can't wait to dive in.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_02: So without further ado, I want to introduce you guys to the founder and CEO and the co-founder and chief scientific officer of AP Chem Skincare.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome, Sandra and Dr.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_02: Parek to the show.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much for coming on.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_02: I'm really excited to host you guys because I really love the brand and I fall in love with your moisturizer.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not gonna lie.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_02: It's literally game changing.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_02: And so, you know, I can't wait to learn about the formulas and stuff and the science.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_02: But if you could get us started, maybe Sandra, telling us a little bit about your backgrounds, you know, and what led you to creating a skincare line.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_03: So I I'm a beauty industry veteran.
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_03: I've been, let's see, I've worked at Clinique.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_03: Actually, that's how Sharon and I met.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_03: I was working on a skincare team at Clinique for several years, and I had hyperpigmentation after several rounds of IVF, and the product development team there told me about Dr.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_03: Parik and said, you've got to go see him.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_03: And we just hit it off instantly.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_03: Um since then, you know, in um throughout my career in the beauty industry, I worked at, I worked on um color cosmetics, hair care, um, body care.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_03: So I've been at Soldo Janeiro, I've been at La Mer, Guerlin, etc.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_03: So I've just been in the industry for a really long time, but my passion's always been skincare.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_03: Obviously, Sherwin's too.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_02: So what about you, Dr.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_02: Park?
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_02: I know you have quite an impressive medical background.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_02: I'd love to learn a little bit more about you.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, thanks.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I became a dermatologist after finishing uh medical school Columbia in the late 90s, and I do now at this point at our office Tribeca Skin Center, we do, there are four of us dermatologists.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: We do general dermatology, skin cancer screenings, rashes, cosmetic dermatology, skincare improvement.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and so it's a nice mix of people that we see from all around Manhattan and Brooklyn.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_00: And the idea of starting a skincare line has come up off and on, but not until meeting Sandra did it feel like it felt right.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_00: Someone who actually knew the industry from the inside and understood what was happening and what was needed and filling a space.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_00: And so that's why we started working on it a couple years ago and launched recently AP Chem.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we thought of AP Chem as being cute because we both have kind of nerdy children of immigrants, you know, science background.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_02: I definitely immediately resonated with the within.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_00: I feel like I got a four, but maybe it was a five.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_00: Can I change that?
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_02: Well, you are way smarter than me because I dreaded AP Chem.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_02: So it was hard for me.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I asked for it.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_00: You're right.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_00: And so we thought that would be a really fun sort of throwback to our high school years, and then to kind of like do all the homework that other kids didn't do, and now we have it ready for people, the all the science behind the skincare.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, no.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_02: I love it.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_02: I love it.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_02: That's so cool.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_02: And the whole I love that you guys partnered up because this is a brilliant.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_02: Like it, I don't even want to call it marketing, it just is really cool.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_00: Like, you it is smarter.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, if you need an MBA and an MD.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_00: I I know it sounds a little bit strange to me, so whatever, but like a couple of advanced degrees kind of help in this industry, it feels yeah.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it's and not only that, but just also like a meeting of the minds, right?
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_03: Like people who come from two different sides of the coin and can come together and make something that yeah, other than yeah, and other than just being the cool nerds that we are, or or if Sherman likes to say, Sonda, we were nerds in high school, now we're cool nerds.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_03: But we we, you know, other than being cool nerds, um, we just share a lot of common philosophies about skin health and uh mental and physical health and how that affects your skin health.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_03: And when we started talking about starting AB Chem together, we first said, you know, initially, if we make this brand together, can we make something for that we can use?
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_03: And it just sort of the light bulb went off that, you know, especially with my background, having worked at the likes of LaMaire, which is an amazing brand.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_03: I just thought for you know, Gen Xers like us, there are certainly skincare brands for them, but I'm hard pressed to find ones that don't cost a fortune.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_03: And also the ones that really specifically focus on the community of Gen Xers and Xennials, not trying to be a catch-all brand.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_03: So we formulate for our community, our Gen Xers and Xennials.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_02: It's just so it's just vibes.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_02: Like I feel like the brand, the name, the the way it works.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I like my experience, if I could share as a consumer of the products, was it was very, very cool for all the nerds to like you know what I mean?
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_02: To connect.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_02: I I was a nerd.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_02: I still am not I'm just a nerd.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_02: You guys are cool nerds I'm just so for me, obviously, you know, the name really drew me in, but then the formula, it's like literally like you know, when you're working on something, and you know, even in high school, like I know a lot of people can relate all those projects and stuff when you worked on something really hard, like a science fair or something, and it just really performed, you know.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_02: That's the vibe I got from the marketing side.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, I'm done with this.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I love that.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_03: Well, you know, obviously the formulas had to work, and we can talk about our unique um ingredients and our our formulation philosophy.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_03: But we like to see skincare should be a trip, not a tour.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_03: We wanted our products to not just be super efficacious, but really fun to look at.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_03: And the textures, you know, we put a lot of work into the textures.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_03: So the moisturizer, we wanted it to be deeply nourishing, but not too heavy.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_03: So it works for virtually all skin types.
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_03: And the eye treatment, we wanted it to be, you know, as well.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_03: We wanted it to be very nourishing, but we didn't want it to slide around if you're wearing concealer over it.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_03: We didn't want it to travel into people's eyes if you wear contacts or you know, so we we really focused on all aspects of it.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_03: So it really is an experiential brand and it's fun.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_02: I was talking about the science because that's really you named one of you know some of the really key features I love as a consumer as well.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it's just it's really, really um obvious that you've done your homework from the science side, and that's where I would love to learn about the ingredients and your approach to the ingredients.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_02: If um, you know, if you could start it, you know, tell us a little bit about that.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_02: Like, how did you really approach the formulation aspect of it?
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_03: Sure.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_03: We we refer to our in some of our hero ingredients as alt-farming ingredients.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_03: Um actually let me take a step back.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_03: When Sherman and I were working on our formulas, we obviously wanted them to be super efficacious, in particular for the skincare concerns for the average Gen X and Xennial customer, age decelerating concerns from lifting and firming to smoothing the appearance of lines and wrinkles, etc.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_03: But aside from just being super efficacious, as nerds, as cool nerds, we wanted we're we're always experimenting, right?
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_03: We're we always want to discover and learn about the latest innovations.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_03: So we we approach our formulas by combining the classics, as Sharon calls the workhorses.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_00: Polyuronic acid, you know, things people know about.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_03: We combine classics with unique ingredients that we refer to as alt-farming ingredients.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_00: Like polyglutamic acid, right?
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_00: So you probably know about things like that, which is not sort of top of mind for virtually all skincare companies.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but the idea is that polyglutamic acid has even a synergistic effect with hyuronic and to bind more moisture and retain more moisture, which is why when you put on the microdose moisturizer, you're like, oh, this feels terrific.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_00: And then even eight hours later, you're like, oh, the morning, it still feels great.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_00: And that has to do with that combination of H A and PGA, right?
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_00: Combos are synergistic and terrific, right?
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_02: Also, why it's like a good primer too, right?
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, that makes sense.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_02: Like, and then that's where I'm curious because I know you guys use stuff like neuropeptides and you know, and adaptogens, and you know, for example, like give us some examples like of the these ingredients because I feel like there's not enough education.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_02: Like, honestly, like um, you know, Sherwin, you know, like they're in the skincare industry, there's very little like real knowledge about how these ingredients work together, you know.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_02: So, like if you could dive in to some of these hero ones, I'd love that.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_00: So, what you just mentioned, right?
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_00: Like sort of peptides, neuropeptides, and adaptogens, like nootropics and nootropics as well.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, these are the things that this science forward approach, I think, is gonna be coming up more and more, but it hasn't been embraced fully.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_00: So we're starting to understand that from everything from skincare to body care to our supplements, but specifically things like GABA, right?
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_00: Gamma aminobutyric acid.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_00: It's a well, I had a neuropsychiatrist who I know, she said to me, Oh my God, I see that in your ingredient list.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_00: We're an oral medication to relax people's nerves.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_00: It's not a high-level prescription, it doesn't, you know, cause any trouble or any side effects.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_00: She goes, You put that in topically.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_00: And I said, Yeah, and we have the white papers that show that topical application of GABA aminobutyric acid can relax the fine lines and relax the small motor neurons of the face.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, albeit temporarily, nothing as aggressive or as efficacious as Botox, for example.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_00: But in that, in that vein, in that vibe, you're like, oh, why does my skin look like it's actually a little bit smoother?
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_00: It's not just the HA, the PGA, it's also the gamma aminobutyric acid, the GABA, right?
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_00: GABA.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_00: And an element like that in is specific and it has to be monitored by our pharmaceutical, like our laboratory telling us this percentage is working well, this percentage is working better, this percentage is too strong, et cetera.
• 10:08
  SPEAKER_00: So we need to do that work.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_03: And the reason why we we take this approach, it's not again, it's not using these unique ingredients for the sake of doing it.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_03: As we were developing the brand and working on the formulas, we did want to use unique ingredients, but not for the sake of doing so.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_03: We call them alt-pharma ingredients because as we were developing the brand, I was diagnosed with an autoimmune disease.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_03: And long story short, I think like most people that find themselves in that position where they certainly know a friend or a family member that's in that situation, you're willing to try anything from treatment to what we call alt-pharma treatment.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_03: So GABA is a perfect example of alt-pharma.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_03: You can take it as a supplement which to promote relaxation, the same way that on the skin it relaxes those tense facial muscles, which is why it's uh it's known as nature's botox.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_03: It's our alt-pharma version to Botox in our no, that makes so much sense scientifically.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_02: It's it's brilliant because you know, and sure, and I I think you can relate to this is that in medicine and academia, we call this repurposing of drugs in a lot of cancer treatments.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_02: Like that's that's what this reminds me of.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_02: Is like right now there's so much research.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I'll give everyone let's say an example in like Leo Blasedoma, which is the most aggressive brain tumor.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_02: We're talking about things like niacin again, you know what I mean?
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_02: And that's actually niacin, uh statins, that kind of stuff.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_02: So when I think of what you guys are doing, I'm looking at you, you know, you're really reapplying these known ingredients in a more intelligent way, in my opinion.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_02: You know, like people don't realize like GABA is these are receptors, they are you know receptors, yeah, yeah.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_00: It is normal, it has receptors, it has, yeah, exactly right.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, exactly.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_02: And then we have all these magnesium supplements now, you know what I mean?
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_02: And they're essentially acting on GABA receptors.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_02: So this is what that reminds me of.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_02: It's brilliant.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_02: I love it.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_00: You know, the adaptogens, like the mushrooms, people have really become smarter about.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_00: They understand it, right?
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_00: People are figuring out that there are calming effects, there are energizing effects, there are brightening effects, right?
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_00: So both consumption of functional mushrooms, again, this is all going to be developed in the next decade or so more aggressively by people who are interested in not just allopathic, but homeopathic and osteopathic medicine.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_00: They're going to be investigating things more because people want these alternatives.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_00: But it is clear that in skincare, you can derive benefit from applying them topically.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_00: Rishi, shaga, right, right?
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_03: So our moisturizer has eight adaptogenic mushrooms in them, eight adaptogenic mushroom extracts.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_03: And Sherman and I were just before we jumped on this podcast with you, we were talking about our rise mushroom coffee.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_03: And I was, we were saying that we're like the rise coffee for skincare.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_03: There was all those, it's a shroom room going on.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_03: There are so many people that are taking care of what they put in their body.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_03: Why don't we equally care about what you put on your face?
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_03: So these ingredients, these alt farm ingredients we're using, they're they're super safe.
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_03: They just have these really amazing benefits that we're really proud to say that we're harnessing that you really don't often see other skincare brands using.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_02: I love it.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_02: I love it.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_02: And I think, you know, there is, I wanted to um ask you guys this about, you know, um, being, you know, an Indian American, I feel like Ayurveda is one of those things that's talked about like in the wrong way.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_02: Like the Ayurveda.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_02: I thought that conversations about that.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_00: I thought we were gonna go there.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_00: I love it.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, because that's what it is, right?
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, it's like Ayurveda never gets talked about in the right way, but you guys are practicing it's like scientific, like you know, Western science level of Ayurveda, kind of you know that there is there is turmeric extract in the dopamine serum, but like at the end of the day, people don't, it's very there's a so much information people consume that they get confused.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, we've done our homework for you.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_00: We're the APCAM nerds.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_00: We can give you skincare that you will enjoy and you don't have to worry.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_00: Now, do we we can definitely talk about Ayurveda, but we've done, I'm sure you growing up and and myself as well.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_00: It was just sort of like always in the background, and so we always kind of knew it, and now everyone is either catching on or wholly confused.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_00: Can you actually consume turmeric consistently?
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_00: Is it gonna be absorbed correctly?
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_00: Does it help?
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_00: For how long?
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_00: Ashwagandha, actually, you shouldn't take it for long periods of time because of the actual other effects of taking ashwagandha for too long, but for a short period you can.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_00: There is science behind these things, and like Western medicine, in quotes, um, will be catching up.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_00: But again, it's gonna take a decade.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, absolutely.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_03: No, go ahead.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_03: We want to take away from the real edgy, the cutting edge science behind the formulas and position it as something that I think a lot of uh customers might perceive as, I don't know, all natural or it just not the natural fun.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_02: No, I get that though.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_02: I get that because you know what?
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_02: Let me just say this honestly, on I I want everyone like listening who's a consumer to think about because the thing is Ayurveda, I don't like the way that we are conventionally marketing it.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_02: You know why?
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_02: Because there's real hidden gems and leads in Ayurveda for modern medicine to follow.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_02: And what sucks is we think of it as like you know, like clay from the ground and non-processed ingredients and non-sophisticated ingredients, but in reality, the real value of Ayurveda is in the knowledge of it.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_02: Like you know, and that's why I'm so glad you didn't do that, because your brand is what I would I wish more Ayurvedic kind of brands would like kind of understand, you know what I mean?
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_02: Like, do that because it's you're taking away from the true potentials because the people perceive things a certain way, and it's just right now is not a good time the way Ayurvedas being perceived.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm glad that you did it.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, I want to ask though, I do have a question, and this is more for like, you know, uh obviously you guys are you're creating a product that is good for all skin types, and this is something I you know, I'm curious when you were in the formulation process and the manufacturing process, was it hard for you to um like explain things like this is how much of something we want or this is the factor we're going for?
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_02: Like, how was the formulation process for you?
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_03: You know, um that approach we knew that we wanted to focus on Gen X and Genuel customers.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_03: So let's say customers, uh men and women ages 35 to 55 plus.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_03: So what we did was we started out by evaluating the types of concerns we wanted to make sure our formulas were addressing with high levels of efficacy.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_03: And there were certainly some ingredients that Sherwin, with his expertise, we wanted to include.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_03: And we would work very closely with the cosmetic chemists at our lab to say we do want some of these specific ingredients, but it's a real partnership too, because some of the ingredients we might have wanted to use, they would say you can, but it might not be compatible with another ingredient you're talking about.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_03: And we have a different idea for you to achieve the same types of benefits that you're looking for.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_03: But I think we have really a lot of fun with GABA because our lab had not worked with it before, and it's really not that easy to source because most people, most brands don't use it.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_03: I'm hard pressed to think of one that does.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_03: And we had such a field day with it.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_03: I should say actually our cosmetic device at the lab had such a blast using it because I think Sherwin had mentioned earlier, you do have to, and you mentioned it too, Ekta, is that you have to make sure that you're using the right concentrations of these.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_03: You can use too little and then you're putting something in and it's not doing anything.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_03: You can you can put in too much.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_03: So we found the right balance, but in the as we were working on the various lab samples until we really nailed the level that we wanted in the three different formulas that we have.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_03: We we had the the cosmetic chemists went at a much higher level than we put in our current in our formulas.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_03: And they were like, I think my face is frozen.
• 18:45
  SPEAKER_03: They were having such a blast because it really was acting like Botox, and they could not believe how smooth and firm and tight their skin was.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_03: But they're like, it might be a little too much.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, to your point, some of this stuff is like experiments in high school where like there is a bit of trial and error, and I think in the lab.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_01: In the lab, in the chemistry lab.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_00: And you blow things up.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_00: But I think like even because we would say, like, I we know that like hexapeptides are super important.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_00: Will they, are they, will they mix well with this?
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_00: Will they the serum has to be airless, the eye has to be airless, they have they in airless pumps, right?
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_00: They cannot contact.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_02: So the little things came up as challenges, and Sandra and I met them, you know, along the way, saying, Okay, if that's the need, because this will expose to air and they'll do this, or you know, we understood those things, and it it was a bit of a process, but yeah, yeah, no, I can imagine though, because then that's really why I asked her, and because you know, you know with with a medical or science background, I think it's hard to not be like, wait a minute, how much of this are we using?
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_02: So, like the dosing comes naturally, and that's why I asked because you guys aren't having these ridiculous claims of like 20% vitamin C.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_02: Why do you need 20% vitamin C?
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_00: Right, extra niacinamide can be irritating.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_00: Look, even the serum, even the single-use serums that you are out there that are so um per pervasive in the sort of younger millennial culture of like, I'm gonna use one of this serum and one of that serum and one of this serum, and I'm gonna layer six or seven on top.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_00: You're like, well, but are they all really doing the job that you want?
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_00: How are they mixed together?
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, how much is too much?
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_03: But we were very conscientious about the levels of the key actives that we put in our formulas.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_03: We didn't want to put the highest level just for the sake of doing it.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_03: Like, so for example, with GABA, it there you could certainly put more in than we did, but we did um you it could cause irritation, which leads me to another core component of how we approach our formulations, which is homeostasis, balance for both, you know, again, not to bastardize the Ayurvedic approach.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_03: I know what you're trying to say, and I know that the public industry is.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_03: Inflammaging, right?
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_00: That inflammation and aging, that's where it's too much inflammation is not good for your body.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_03: We want to make sure that we're putting in the highest concentration of our key actives without upsetting your skin.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_03: So we that's why we also focus on inflammation.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_03: We have a key alt-pharma anti-inflammatory ingredient in all of our formula is called bicalin.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, yeah, yeah.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_02: No, I mean, I feel like that's the interesting part is that this you you know, your anti-inflammation like approach, I think is it's part of what I see, what you guys are trying to do, which is create something that we, if you have had any background in science or taken any kind of science course, like the first thing you're taught is like one, you need to know why you're using what you're using.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_02: And does theory come into translatable sense?
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_02: Can theory be translated?
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_02: And that's where I see you guys as like a very 360 brand because like I really like first of all, your products work.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_02: Let me just start there.
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I as a consumer, my feedback is your product.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_02: Work and they work really well.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_02: And I don't think anybody, like teenagers, anybody would have a problem using these products because of the way you formulated it.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_02: The anti-inflammation conversation is huge right now.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_02: Like, you know what I mean?
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_02: It's big right now.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_02: But when we think about anti-inflammation, I think people get so hyper focused on one thing, and that becomes the center.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_02: But really, anti-inflammation is using the right concentrations of the right stuff.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_02: And like making sure it all makes sense together.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_02: And so that's why I'm like, I love it.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_02: I it's it's a beautiful idea.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it works.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_03: We started out focusing on inflammation because one of the first things Sherwin said to me when I was his patient was inflammation is the core component of virtually every skin condition, if not most health conditions.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_03: So the reason why we all and that kicked off a conversation about not just the concentrations of the actives that we use, but some of the unique ingredients we use from the nootropics to the neuropeptides, because we were also talking about, or what Sherwin was teaching me when we first met, was it's not just about sun exposure.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_03: Certainly, yes, the hormone therapy you were doing with IVF is triggering your dark spots, but what else is going on?
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_03: We know that how our the state of our mental health can impact our physical health.
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_03: And so that also led us to start looking into nootropics, uh, neuropeptides and adaptens too.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_03: We're creating this mind-body connection with by using ingredients that you would typically find in supplements for your mental or your physical health, but have these clinically proven applications for your skin health.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_02: That makes complete sense.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_02: And you know what's crazy, and and we don't talk about it at all, is the idea that these tissues, like Sherman, as you know, like I a lot of people know, like you know, embryology, when you think about it, your skin and your brain come from the same source the neuroactoderms.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_02: So, like, this stop, but like the it makes sense, it it makes sense though, because it's like the things you want your brain to do, which is one, if you're anxious, you want to calm down, right?
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_02: If your skin is acting flaring up, you want it to calm down, right?
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_02: So that's that kind of parallel, it makes sense, you know.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_02: And so I think like with the science forward approach, this is why I loved, you know, Sandra, what you had you know brought up about the the Ayurveda stuff.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_02: I loved it because I think sometimes with when we get caught up in things like clean beauty, fresh beauty, whatever, you know, Ayurveda, these words, these marketing words, we forget that like there's like hard science here that needs to be addressed, you know what I mean?
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_02: And that underlines everything.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_02: You know, so yeah, it's it's a really cool concept.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_02: So I, you know, one thing I want to ask is right now there's a big buzz around like you know, younger skin types using um skincare products more readily, right?
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_02: I'm a millennial.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_02: I know when I was 15, I didn't use anything, you know what I mean?
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_02: Like I was like, yeah, I was kidding.
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_02: I had my zebrees.
• 25:04
  unknown: Yeah.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_02: I think wipes.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I mean, there were like a few things, but like I wasn't into it like they are, and you know, so my question really is from a brand perspective, like, and maybe Sandra, you can address this is like what has been something that you've encountered about the the you know, the what is it, Xenalials or oh, the Xennials?
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_03: Zennials this um sort of generation that's a little bit older than millennials and a little bit younger than than Gen X.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_03: But if you're talking about younger consumers, are you asking about younger customers?
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_00: Like, yeah, like 12 and 13 years going to Sephora right now and like trying to buy drunk elephants and spending tons of kids between you and getting Botox and filler.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_03: There's no shame in the game.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_03: There's a lot of that.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_00: I think, yeah.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_00: What do you think about like 12, like the young teenagers and branding for skincare?
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_03: I'm all for people wanting to take care of their skin.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I I maybe there is an outlet um or a resource for I'm calling them kids because I mean they are kids though.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_03: They are they are kids in a place.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_03: You should be taking care of you should be taking care of your skin, but you don't, there's so much that you don't need.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_03: You can certainly, like I had said, you can certainly use our formulas if you're younger.
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_03: We we focus on Gen X because we feel like it's uh a white space.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_03: They're not really that our our audience doesn't really get catered to often and they get overlooked.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_03: Um but we if you know if I had a I do have, let's I have like a 16-year-old niece or nephew, I wouldn't tell them that to use our products, not because they're not perfectly safe, but there's stuff in it that they don't need.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_00: That's it.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly right.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_00: I think a lot of these current kids that you read about in the Times and other newspaper outlets and like you know, social media, is that they're to they're being told that they need to do these things, they need to spend money and time on skincare.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_00: And at 12 and 13 and 14 years old, I'm like, just go to school.
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, just exist.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_00: Drink water, it's not good food.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_00: Like, listen to your parents if they're nice people.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_00: Like, yeah, I don't know.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_00: It feels like it feels like they shouldn't be indulging in skin care.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_00: It feels um because like to your point, we didn't do it when we were that age, and it wasn't nothing bad happened to us.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_00: We caught we didn't go into tanning boots, hopefully.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe I did once, um weird as it sounds.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_00: We didn't know enough about sunscreen, but we died.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_00: The great thing about the current 12, and 13, and 14-year-olds is they do understand that they should be wearing sunscreen, and that knowledge wasn't around 15, 20, 25 years ago as much, right?
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_00: So parents are good about that, and that's about it.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_00: Like wear your sunscreen and wash the dirt off your face if you go like a sport.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and from a you know, from a brand marketer perspective, I I there are certainly brands and retailers that are intentionally targeting younger customers more and more.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_03: I think the point is just keep it simple.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_03: Unless you have a very challenging concern, like acne, that's really chronic and very difficult to address.
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, you as a DERMC, younger people come in and just I, you know, I certainly have people asking me all the time that are young, and I think the idea is to don't overuse anything, don't use anything you don't need.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_03: Try and keep it as simple as possible.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_03: You really just need to wash your face.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, simple, non-irritating moisturizer and wear your SPS.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_00: And for some 14-year-olds, we have to tell them like this is the opposite of the ones who actually need oral medication and need something a little more hardcore, the genetic history in their family and their parents took medications when they were kids and all that kind of stuff.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_00: For a lot of kids, we have to tell them just don't keep looking in the mirror so much.
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_00: Like it's just not this is not that important, it shouldn't be, right?
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly, exactly.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_02: And you know what?
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_02: I that's really like I want to clarify that's why I asked you guys because you you know, you have created a brand that just reminds me of like you know, breaking out with acne and you know, like looking for someone who really knew their chemistry to help me, you know, or their medicine.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_02: But it's like we relate to that because we've had a journey, you know what I mean, in our adulthood.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_02: But it's like for these kids, I'm just like, if you don't have acne or something, you know, or something, and you you know, go to a derm, first of all, you know, but that's why I'd asked, it's just your opinions about it because I'm just seeing it everywhere, you know what I mean?
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_02: And it's just I it's so different than when we were growing up, where there were no options to now it's like you know, they have options, but they don't know how to approach things, so it's just like that was my thing.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_00: And they're being spoken, and the thing is that they're being spoken to by the generation just above them, right?
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_00: So they're listening as we all did when we were 12.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_00: We listened to the 18-year-old when we're 16, the 22-year-old.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_00: And those 20 and 22-year-olds currently are super heavy into developing a skincare routine and publicizing it on their TikToks and their Instagram.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_00: And you're like, oh, so that's what you're getting caught up in.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, yes, and you don't really need to.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_00: You can give it five or ten years and decide if that's what you really are.
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, I agree.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_02: Take your time with it, but you know, that and that's what I mean.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_02: Like, Sandra, like I I think you brought up a really great point about, you know, just it's it's you know, the overall, like when we were first discussing it, you really brought up a good point about the marketing side of all of it, because at the end of the day, I think brands are some brands, you know, I don't know what they are.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not naming any names, but people are kind of like you know, they're not making it clear, you know what I mean?
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_02: Like that, they're not talking about it enough, if that makes sense.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_02: But anyway, uh to shift focus.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_02: I want to focus a little bit more on your actual formulas and stuff.
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_02: And so, you know, for somebody like your ideal customer, like who would who is that?
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_02: Like, you know, who do you really target in terms of your demographic and audience?
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_02: Like, is it acne-prone skin or is it you know, just anything, like all skin concerns?
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_03: It's uh it's for all it's well, I should say it's for both um men and women, yeah.
• 31:10
  SPEAKER_03: Um, however, you identify, and we really wanted to, because we were really only launching with three products, we didn't want to, we wanted to be as inclusive as possible across types as well as tones.
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_03: So I would say from a texture standpoint, with the active standpoint, unless you have very oily, oily skin or very, very dry skin, you can use our formulas.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_03: Age-wise, we do focus on you say Gen X, because that's who we are.
• 31:41
  SPEAKER_03: We did we didn't want to be able to use our own products, and because we did really feel as if there was this white space where we you can certainly buy some of the$300 moisturizers that I won't name, they're great.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah, but you don't have to.
• 31:58
  SPEAKER_03: So we do focus on who we feel I maybe it's a little dramatic to say overlooked, but I think if you're in your 30s and your 40s and you're looking to address common skincare concerns or common skin concerns like dullness, wrinkles, lifting, sadness.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_02: That's why I'm asking though, because there's a really great for anyone listening, if you're falling, you know, if you go to AP Chem Beauty, you guys have an amazing slide like right on the front page, and it's your research results.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_02: And I love that.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_02: I love the transparency with that based on a four-week study.
• 32:27
  SPEAKER_02: And that's why I asked, because it's like people saw, you know, skin softness, suppleness, a glowier, you know, like skin tone, like healthier skin.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_02: That's why I asked you that because you know, I feel like you know, people get so caught up in we're either an acne brand or we're a wrinkle brand, you know, anti-aging brand.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_02: You guys are really like it's unique, I think, because you're it's targeting like really anybody, you know.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_02: If you're if you're looking for just better skin, you know, it's a really great brand.
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's that moment at which you're like, wait a minute, I've lost something that I remember I had in my 20s.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, yeah, it'll it'll come back.
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_03: Time to up my game.
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_00: Just AP can.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_00: Like if you've you know, you just at that moment, you're like, what happened to me?
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's where we're at right now.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_00: Start time to up your game.
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_03: Come in by an AP level of skincare.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_00: A little advanced placement.
• 33:18
  SPEAKER_03: We didn't want catch-all formulas for everybody because we did want to use it ourselves.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, let's face it, Sherwin and I do have, you know, we have a few wrinkles here and there.
• 33:27
  SPEAKER_03: I definitely can see, you know, the definition along my jawline isn't what it used to be.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_03: Luckily, I'm not on social media like I was, or like you know, a lot of kids are.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_03: I'm having to see what I used to look like.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_02: Oh god, I'm the same way.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_02: Don't worry, Finn.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_02: I'm the same way.
• 33:44
  unknown: Yeah.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_03: No, I mean you can have you could have, you know, we have customers that are in their late 20s, early 30s, and I see it as them, you know, not just doing their homework, they're doing a little extra credit because they're getting ahead of the game and they're they're maintaining the beautiful, supple skin that I so envy.
• 34:01
  SPEAKER_03: But then we've got customers uh in their you know, like late 30s, early 40s, into their 50s, who are really so happy after just a couple of years.
• 34:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, they're like, okay, that's what I need.
• 34:14
  SPEAKER_03: Sherwin has so he sells AP Kam at his practice, and he's got a lot of patients coming back, obviously, to see him and his other his other and to buy the product, but they've been using the, you know, then maybe the next time they see you four or six weeks later, they're talking about how they really see this difference.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_03: Yep.
• 34:33
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 34:33
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_02: No, that's like it makes sense though, because like we talked about the ingredients earlier and it just makes sense.
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_02: And I think, you know, what's unique is too like I'm like lately I've been advocating a lot for like baseline skincare routines.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_02: And I feel like a lot of people don't have that, you know.
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_02: Like I feel like we don't have that three-step routine, most of us, that we are like, this is what I use, okay, and this maintains my skin.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_02: And then if I want an active that's extra or whatever, I add it in once in a while.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_02: That's the thing that I feel like is missing in this space, you know, in the industry is like a real baseline routine.
• 35:11
  SPEAKER_02: And I feel like you guys really speak to that because you know, um, you it it it's important to take care of your skin overall.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, I'm sure you guys know much more about this than me, but it's like the baseline maintenance, you know, like just any other organ in your body, like your liver, you're not gonna drink alcohol every day because you're gonna kill your liver.
• 35:30
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 35:30
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly right.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you need a detox and it'll show up in your skin too.
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_03: Well, and we also didn't want to make it complicated either.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_03: We didn't want to have a 20-step routine.
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_03: I think you really I look, I've been in a position where I must have had like 15 steps in my skincare routine, but that's also because I was working for multiple brands across my career, um, you know, from LVMH to water, and I had access for free to all these products, but I not for nothing.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_03: I have to remind myself that not everybody lives in New York City, not everybody gets Botox.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_03: I've got plenty of friends that can afford it, but they want to keep it simple.
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_03: They do want the benefits.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_03: And so that's another great thing about our products.
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_03: We would never say that it replaces Botox.
• 36:13
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, having GAP as you know, nature's Botox, it's certainly more efficacious than I think the average ingredients you see in some age decelerated.
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_03: Right, right.
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but I think it's it becomes really great for people that are looking to, you know, up their skincare game, but they're not looking to go get peels, they're not ready for Botox, or they're enough, they just don't want to do it.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_03: And they're not doing too much.
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_03: And there's no shame in the game, you know.
• 36:38
  SPEAKER_03: Wink wink.
• 36:39
  SPEAKER_03: I've I've had some Botox before.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I do think I think look, adding an eye cream becomes essential when people start to talk about, oh, I have these fine lines, I have these dark circles, right?
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_00: There is a reason why the ayahuasca eye serum has the ingredients that it does, including one would consider hyurvedic elements like daisy and hawkweed extract to reduce dark circles, because that's you don't start noticing that until a certain point in your life, and then you think there's nothing I can do.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, you can take a pump into the eye balm and you apply half on under each eyelid and even the upper lid, it's safe, right?
• 37:13
  SPEAKER_00: Like all this stuff has been tested and has been shown to be safe.
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_00: And get into it.
• 37:18
  SPEAKER_00: It takes an extra two seconds, but but it should be done if because you don't want to complain when you're 40 or 45 that you're exactly in your 30s, right?
• 37:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, exactly.
• 37:26
  SPEAKER_02: And you know what's interesting, you say that, you know, Sharon, because I was talking to a derm also like you know, uh the other day about aesthetics, right?
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_02: And like one of the things that came up was we need to start taking it, doesn't matter what you get done, skincare has to be there, you know, in your routine.
• 37:44
  SPEAKER_02: You have to have this like preventative approach in your mind about your skin health.
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_02: And it's like, you know, that's where I feel like you know the understanding needs to get to where it's like, you know, you're not just doing it because it's yeah, it's fun, it is, you know, and I and I love like for example with you guys, like I love your your branding and the and the vibe and all that, but it's like also just like good for your skin, and like that's you have to do things that are good for your skin, you know, and you can get the Botox and you can get the injectables, but those are probably gonna perform a lot better if you're taking care of your skin as well.
• 38:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, exactly right.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_03: Extra, have you tried have you tried the ayahuasca eye treatment?
• 38:23
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think so.
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_03: And I haven't I haven't yet.
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, you must.
• 38:27
  SPEAKER_03: Sherman and I have our favorites.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_03: I think ayahuasca is my favorite, and one of the I brought it up because one of the ingredients we have in it is palmetol aceleucine.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 38:35
  SPEAKER_03: Sherman and I were talking about dark circles.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_03: I think, you know, depending on your, you know, there are a lot of different skin tones.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_03: Where darker tones have darker, darker toned eyes.
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_03: And it's not just about the thinning skin, um, where you see, I'm probably not saying this right, so let Sherman talk in the blood vessels.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_03: You got it.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_03: So, you know, I think a lot of people look for eye treatments or eye creams that have um brightening ingredients in them.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_03: But what I think that what Sherman taught me is about how palmetyl isoleucine works when it comes to heme.
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_03: You've got to describe it because I never do a justice.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_00: So you're like palmatyl isoleucine also acts as a slight bit of a filler, right?
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_00: It can start, it can start to improve the collagen synthesis under the skin.
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_00: And people think, oh, if I get filler done, then the skin will lift up under the eye and then I won't see the dark circles, which is true because sometimes the dark circles are from the heme and the blood underneath the skin, so it's showing up as a blue or a blue-brown or a blue-black under the eyes.
• 39:30
  SPEAKER_00: So the filler is not ideal for many people's faces.
• 39:34
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't look right injecting filler.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_00: So we say try to use products that create a little bit of a lifting.
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_00: And palmetol isoleucine, one of the ingredients in ayahuasca eye serum, is acting to do that slowly over time.
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_00: And then combine that with the daisy and the hawkweed, which will break up the heme.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_00: That is what I think is so discolorations.
• 39:55
  SPEAKER_02: That's brilliant.
• 39:56
  SPEAKER_02: That is freaking brilliant.
• 39:57
  SPEAKER_02: I love that.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, because I think a lot of people really do just think about the thinner their skin gets.
• 40:02
  SPEAKER_03: As you're saying, Sean, as the thinner the skin gets under your eye, the more visible the dark circles are gonna be.
• 40:07
  SPEAKER_03: Correct.
• 40:07
  SPEAKER_03: A lot of the time because of the heme.
• 40:09
  SPEAKER_03: So using an ingredient like Daisy and hawkweed extract that actually breaks up the heme.
• 40:15
  unknown: Yeah.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_03: So I get, you know, Sean explained it to me, and the best way I can explain it to other people, it's almost like having spider veins under the eyes.
• 40:23
  SPEAKER_03: And then you're gonna, you know, you're getting boiled.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_03: Or like, you know, um blood stains under the eyes.
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_03: So the fact that we're not just using palm to ice leucine, which is like nature's filler, to to fill out that plump up the skin a little bit.
• 40:35
  SPEAKER_03: We're actually breaking up the heme that is a lot of times what people are seeing when they're in the mirror, when they see dark circles.
• 40:41
  SPEAKER_03: And that's what I think is really cool about that formula and the textures, the bomb.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_02: That's brilliant.
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 40:48
  SPEAKER_02: Go ahead, sorry.
• 40:48
  SPEAKER_02: I interrupted you.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_03: No, but if you don't have it, we're gonna we've got to make sure we get you one.
• 40:53
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, no, I I think that's absolutely brilliant because it's like, you know, that's most people don't think about that.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_02: That's why you have dark circles, you know.
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_02: That's not something that's readily talked about.
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that one of the interesting components of what you just described is that we do this in other places in the body too.
• 41:11
  SPEAKER_02: You don't just want heat floating around in like your bloodstream, you know, on like attached to anything.
• 41:17
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, like it's like a whole thing.
• 41:19
  SPEAKER_02: Like it I feel like we approach the skin differently for some reason, you know, as a society than we approach other organs, and it just blows my mind.
• 41:27
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm getting there, we're realizing it, you know.
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_02: We're realizing it, yeah.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_02: But that's really brilliant.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_02: I want to on that same note that I want to learn about the keta uh the keto amino acid complex.
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_02: If you could explain that, Sherwin, just like what is that?
• 41:41
  SPEAKER_02: I know it's your proprietary technology, but if we could do a little um intro into that, that goes back to the idea of peptides, right?
• 41:48
  SPEAKER_00: So people are f are learning a lot about peptides in skin care, and peptides are the building blocks for amino acids.
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_00: So we combine numerous peptides, which are in our serum and in our moisturizer, and we combine them in different concentrations for the thickness and the viscosity of the particular formulations, and we called it the ketaminoacid complex because it's just a really good, fun name because it includes amino acid in it.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_00: But conceptually, the idea is you need to have or want to have, I should say, um, peptides to help improve collagen synthesis because we do start to lose, I think, a quarter teaspoon of collagen a year in our skin after our late 20s.
• 42:30
  SPEAKER_00: So it's why you don't want to see a little bit of it's what people register as like a loss of volume or a loss of contour because that sort of thing that we see is baby fat when we're kids or teenagers that starts to go away and give us a more kind of lovely sculpted look in our late 20s starts to then look a little bit not as awesome after that.
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_00: So we are trying hard to maintain collagen, not only by eating well and by exercising and sleeping and hydrating, but also by using topical skincare that provides those benefits.
• 43:05
  SPEAKER_02: That's yeah, that is scary, like that fact, but like I'm I know I shouldn't have said it, but I feel like it's often coded and I wasn't the first person, so I feel I don't feel terrible.
• 43:18
  SPEAKER_00: We know that we lose bone mass, we know that we lose muscle mass as decades go on.
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_00: It's natural, it is what it is, which is why you're just going to the gym and exercise better and you know have calcium for your bones, but whatever.
• 43:29
  SPEAKER_00: It's all if the skin is very similar organ-wise, and we know that amino acids are building blocks of collagen and peptides are a long chain amino acids.
• 43:36
  SPEAKER_00: You can, by applying them topically, improve your skin tone and make yourself look and feel better.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_02: I love that.
• 43:45
  SPEAKER_02: And I I think that that's that's so solid.
• 43:47
  SPEAKER_02: And I, you know, I I really think that it's just unique, you know, what you guys are doing.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_02: You're doing it in a fun way, and I think that's the most interesting part to me, you know, as a consumer and in this industry, I've seen a lot of brands that try to talk about science in a very like we need to explain science, right?
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_02: To the tower generations, even though like as like a millennial, like I love like you know, uh learning about things and I love understanding why my skin is doing what it's doing now.
• 44:14
  SPEAKER_02: But it's like I think that there is such a need for what you guys have created, which is just a fun way to talk about really science-backed, you know, products and start that conversation.
• 44:25
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm a huge fan.
• 44:26
  SPEAKER_02: I've I've I'm a huge fan of what you're doing, and for everyone listening, you guys have to check out the brand.
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um go to what's that we're a huge fan of you.
• 44:36
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, thank you so much.
• 44:37
  SPEAKER_02: No, I really am.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_02: And I I I think everyone should definitely check out the brand.
• 44:41
  SPEAKER_02: If you're interested, go to apcampbeauty.com and I will tag everything in the in the concept part for the episode.
• 44:46
  SPEAKER_02: But if you have any questions at all for you know for the the you know Sandra's team and uh Sherman's team, please let us know.
• 44:53
  SPEAKER_02: We'll definitely pass it along.
• 44:55
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much.
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_02: And you guys, this has been such an honor.
• 44:57
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you for coming on the show.
• 44:59
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much.
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 45:02
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
• 45:02
  SPEAKER_02: Okay guys, so I hope you love that episode.
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• 45:10
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• 46:04
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• 46:09
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