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Oscar Mike Radio – 449 – Lechon Kirb · Military Broadcast Radio | MBR Talk

0:53
We come here and we're going to conquer and we're going to take
0:56
some. Is that understood, Sir?
0:58
That's what we're going to do, sweetheart.
0:59
We are going to go and get some. All right, people on the ready
1:03
line. Are you here?
1:06
Are you? Hello and welcome to OM Radio.
1:18
My name is Travis Marine Corps veteran and your host OM Rio is
1:23
Co produced with since 1 productions.
1:25
What's your podcast doing? I want to thank my sponsor Joyce
1:28
Asac of ASAC real estate and my supporters Army National Guard
1:32
veteran Travis Arnold with caisson shaving company
1:35
exceptional parent magazine. Thank you Faye and fight camp be
1:40
your strongest combination. I have another Marine Corps
1:45
guest on with me right now and chest he's looking down from the
1:49
pearly gates where he has isn't permanent duty watch smiling on
1:54
what we're about to do. And I met my guest at the
1:57
military creator conference. Thank you James Van Pureen and
2:01
Merrill Largo and it just became something like like, wow, this
2:05
guy's really on to something. So I want to welcome Lashawn
2:09
curb to OM radio. Lashawn, thank you so much.
2:13
Man, thank you so much for having me.
2:14
I'm excited to be here. We met at Military Creator
2:17
Conference and you were part of the tracks about the the
2:21
business side and what we're doing.
2:22
You talked about AI, you talked about the need to be able to
2:26
have good processes around what any business does and how your
2:30
company helps put people into what you do.
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And by you getting to know them, you can help them grow their
2:37
business in a way they might not understand.
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So we got a lot to unpack. Lot to unpack, but Chesty is
2:42
watching. We're both Marines.
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Semper Fi. Give.
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Us. Give us a little, you know, run
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through of what your Marine Corps experience was like.
2:53
My Marine Corps experience, I guess the the best way to to say
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it, it's like it's the it's the most terrible and the most
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incredible experience you get all yeah, you know, that's
3:07
that's really what it looks like from day-to-day.
3:09
It's, it's excruciating, it's invigorating.
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It's, you're every day, you're kind of walking into the unknown
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and you're, you're really immersed in this environment
3:20
that is quite complex in many different ways.
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A lot of people that you, you get to meet and you, you build
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friendships with are coming from different walks of life,
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different cultures, you know, and then when you're all kind of
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thrust into the Marine Corps, it has its own culture that you all
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need to kind of abide by, right? So it's, it's complex to say the
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least. And and my my journey was
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complex just like many others. What was your mosi went?
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In AS 2311, which is like ammo tech and explosives.
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Came out of Redstone Arsenal explosive and disposal training
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down there and then went to Camp Lejeune for a couple years and
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then I got transferred to Marine Security Forces.
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MSFI had a corporal who was MSF and he was a security guard,
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like a couple other Marines I'd met.
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But security forces, Marines were they, they, they, they were
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changed and changed like Marine Corps changes you.
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But MSF definitely gives you a different perspective on things.
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It really does. It gives you a different
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perspective on things. And and also like the timing
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that I went to was kind of, I guess you could say a special
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time. It was right about when they
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were blending fast team and Marine, Marine security forces.
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So I ended up kind of going there in the in the in the
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perfect timing in regards to that.
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But yeah, it was very interesting opportunity for me.
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I had some, I guess you could say, challenges when I was at
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Camp Lejeune. I got in some trouble and I got
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the beautiful opportunity to take advantage of this new
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billet and Marine security forces.
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So lucky me. We'll leave it at that
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sometimes. Sometimes opportunity graces
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itself with different rappers. But OK, so you did that and and
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what was what was getting out like?
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Because, you know, we all go in, we're all different when we go
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in, but everybody's story getting out is has a couple
5:09
different things, but it's very, very different from from person
5:12
to person, service to service situation.
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What was it like for you? Getting out for me was weird,
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you know, I didn't really have any very good plans.
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I didn't know really what I wanted to do.
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And to be fair, I, I planned on when I, when I was basically
5:33
checking out checked out of, of Quantico, but I was planning to
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actually move to Europe and, and go live in Spain for a little
5:38
while. And I, I didn't end up doing
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that, but I had full plans on doing that.
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But yeah, it was, it was a little bit jagged, I guess you
5:45
could say, because I didn't have any very good plans.
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I will say that when I was in my last duty station, I had a buddy
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that sold me in like an old film camera and I would go and take
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it on like training missions and different things around the
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world with me. And it, it kind of laid the seed
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for for me creatively and, and I wanted to pursue that a little
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further. Like I didn't know what it would
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become, but it really became a big part of my life.
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I got into branding. I got into like, you know,
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commercial photography and, and I started, you know, getting
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stuff on, on billboards and editorials and it was just
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became this thing. But it honestly, a lot of it had
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to do with luck in an environment.
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So yeah, shout out to him. You know, it's funny, I was
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given a, a little Fuji 35mm, you know, Walmart special and I took
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almost 1000 pictures while I was in and then, you know, I was one
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of those crazy, you know, there he is the camera again, get away
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from me. But I got some of some cactus
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people. People don't believe how big
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cactus can get. And I don't know about you,
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Lashawn, but I, I, I got some pictures of some brothers who
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are no longer with us. And man, those are priceless.
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Those are priceless. And then just certain things,
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I'm like, wow, really. I'm really glad I did that.
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So I, I definitely understand that whole creative thing that
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can happen behind a camera. Absolutely.
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I didn't to your point, like I didn't understand the value of
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what I was doing at that time either.
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I was just kind of exploring a thing.
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And I, I think the biggest thing that really stands out to me at
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this stage is just how fast the time goes.
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And to your point, people go like, you know, they pass on
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they, you know, get they get injured, they move on in life.
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And, and you just you just don't really grab how fast, how young
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and how, how you know, vibrant your life was.
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And then then you look back at those images and you're like
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snapped right back. You're like, Oh my God, I looked
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like that, you know, raising my chin.
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Oh my goodness, it's it's a weird time.
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I seen I had a buddy that I I met with this is about a month
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ago and I hadn't seen him since we were in Camp Lejeune.
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And it was the time like it felt like nothing had passed.
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But man, it was so weird because we look different now and but
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we're very, very similar than we were then.
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But more seasons, luckily. Season for certain, man.
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I think this it's also true, Lesean, you never know when the
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last time is you're going to say goodbye to someone or see them
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again. And and so to your point, man,
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those pictures are priceless. Those images are just just
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priceless. Priceless now.
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Yeah man, 100%. You know, I, I looked at your
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website and we'll get into all that in a minute, but it really
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kind of the story you told about your mother really kind of like
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brought this all in focus real quick about who you are and, and
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you get out. What started you on this journey
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to market theory, What you do now?
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Was it your mother's story and do you want to share that, or
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was it a couple of other different things?
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You know, when I was six years old, I was playing hide and go
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seek with my cousin who my sister.
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And I think I told you a little bit about this before, but
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essentially I locked myself in the refrigerator in the basement
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and I got trapped in there. And I was, you know, screaming
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and clawing for air. And I think really that was the
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the first moment that I discovered I needed freedom,
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like I needed oxygen. And my mom came to save the day,
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luckily. And she that wasn't the first
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time or the last time she would save the day, but luckily she
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did that time. And I think the thing that
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really stood out for me right then was like, I need to have
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freedom. I need to figure out what that
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looks like. And I knew that she had some
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sense of what it was. And she also had like a creative
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bug type of thing. There was a lot more that she
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could have done. And I always knew that.
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Like I knew there was a lot more she could have done.
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And by the way, she did a lot like she was, she was in like 7
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different editions of Who's Who in American women at the time.
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Her bio was longer than Oprah Winfrey.
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So she had done so much stuff. She had her own television show
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where she would like interview like music artists and creative
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artists. So she knew Lionel Richie and
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and Sammy Davis Junior and Lena Horne and all these like
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superstars really well. She was really well known in
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what she did and she ended up getting like kind of health
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started getting the better of her, right.
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And so she she really couldn't move the way that she used to
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and it really impacted her business.
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It really kind of like crumbled it in a lot of ways.
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And I just felt, I always kind of felt like if she had more
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infrastructure, if she had more support, if she had more teams
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and, and economical economic power to do certain things, like
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she wouldn't have been in that position.
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And so I had always been kind of thinking like, wow, what, what
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could I have done differently? What, what can I learn from this
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and how can I employ it? I mean, the biggest lesson
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really was that like anything that you're doing is in exchange
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for everything, every other possibility in your life.
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And when you're trading that time for dollars, you're, you're
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still trading the time. It's not really time that you're
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trading. It's, it's literally your life
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that you're trading. And so, and there are ways that
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people are using these things to make money and, and grow their
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awareness and elevate their brands and give them more
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freedom, but they're not necessarily trading their time
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for it. I had to know what that was.
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So yeah, she definitely was a a big inspiration of why I would
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lean in the direction that I do today.
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In the direction was to say, you know, when I'm on the Marine
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Corps and I want to create this, this entity that allows me to
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have the freedom I I want to go in the direction so my life can
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be the kind of life I want to have.
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Is that what I get or is it something else?
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Well, you know, at at that stage, leaving the Marine Corps,
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it wasn't as clear for me. It was just like, I want to
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explore what things can become. I don't know what that is.
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I know I'm good with people. I know I'm creative, but it
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really when I started elevating my brand, like I got into
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photography, like I said, editorials and billboards and
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magazines and stuff like that. I had a few big brands that
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really picked up my work. So I ended up seeing my stuff at
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Universal and Forbes and BT and, you know, Centric in VH1, which
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was amazing. However, I didn't feel like it
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was paying me to the degree that it it should, given how much my
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stuff is getting out there. I always thought that if I got
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enough awareness that they would just translate into money, and
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that wasn't necessarily the case.
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And so I had to kind of fix that piece of it.
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And during that journey, I met this guy who essentially he was
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also really passionate about photography and branding and
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that kind of thing. When he had this really big
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production studio that he paid for from the software company
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that he had. And through his software
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company, he was making millions and millions of dollars a month.
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And as we became friends, I discovered he didn't know any
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software. And so, you know, in, in, in AI,
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guess you could say stroke of luck conversation.
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I asked him one day, like, how did you, how did you build this
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like company where you're making millions of dollars a month and
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you don't know any software? And he said to me something that
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I would never forget. And that was, I don't need to
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know any software. I need to know some people who
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know some software, and I do. And so it really just kind of
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like the light bulbs just went off.
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I was like, Oh my God, like everyone's out here thinking
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that if they work hard enough and they just grip their teeth
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and they do everything day-to-day, do all the right
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things, don't just make them money and they won't because
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they have to trade their essence for it, you know?
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And luckily at that point, when I learned that lesson, it, it
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led me down a track where I started really kind of
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considering, well, how are people making money in their
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sleep? How are they making their lives
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scalable? How are they making their
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businesses scalable? What does that look like?
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What are the steps? Who else is doing this?
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How much can you make, you know? And that really changed my whole
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entire outlook. When did your outlook change
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too? After you start exploring all
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these concepts and what it could do for you.
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Yeah, well, it did change in terms of, first of all, knowing
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that it's a possibility, but then secondly, after I started
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doing it, you know, I started trying it and learning how it's
14:09
working and, and making some money at it and really kind of
14:13
measuring against everything else I had I had done
14:16
previously. And it wasn't even close.
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I was making way more money. I had way more freedom.
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I had way more flexibility. And I just knew right then I was
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like, OK, I need to, I need to do more of this.
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And as I started doing more of it, I felt like it was something
14:30
important for people to share, you know, especially for me,
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like I came from like, like underserved backgrounds, you
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know, like inner City Schools and that whole thing.
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And I just all the information that I've ever been told was
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just about how hard you can work your life away and not
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necessarily how you can, you know, soar.
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And I really wanted people to get that.
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So when did the idea become that I'm going to create official
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company, I'm going to incorporate, I'm going to become
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a, a service provider, a console, the teacher to other
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people who you know, you go back to your mother's example, you're
15:07
trying to help them move past what she never could.
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Because, I mean, I guess what we're trying to say is, does
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your mother's story still drive a lot of what you do?
15:17
Yeah, I mean it. It definitely drives a lot of
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what I do and why I do it in the first place.
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I want to say around 2014 is when I left software.
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I'd met my then now wife who was a consultant in the marketing
15:33
space, which also kind of like got my wheels turning and I
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convinced her to leave her then consulting company to come work
15:40
with me. So I convinced her to come work
15:43
with me because I I was very. Well, Sean, well, Sean, I mean,
15:47
how, how, how does that work? What works?
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Because I was at the time very, I guess, notable in branding.
15:55
So I knew that like, hey, I can brand you.
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I can get you the awareness, I can make you look the way you
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need to look. She had the skills, right?
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She had the skills. She was already a scholar, very
16:05
knowledgeable in what she did. And it just so happened that she
16:08
was helping organizations build online courses, but she was kind
16:13
of like the money arm behind all this, this consultancy.
16:16
And I didn't think she was getting enough awareness around
16:18
that. And I was like, you need to be
16:20
in the front. Let me put you in the front and
16:22
we can go in and, and get more clients and find, you know, what
16:26
to do. And and that became like the
16:28
beginning of the journey of what what would become market theory,
16:31
right? We had some luck along the way,
16:34
but we also looked, we took some really important steps.
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You know, they took some really important steps that given given
16:43
what they were like, they were just high risk, you know,
16:45
because I didn't have like a lot of money even leaving software
16:49
and it was going to really take something.
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But there was, there was one particular step at this time
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that I think made a huge difference for me.
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And it that's essentially I went to this event, you know, and at
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this event, we got invited to this business mastermind.
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And I thought to myself, you know, if we could get into this
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business mastermind, we could connect with the right people,
17:12
we can learn more about what they're doing.
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I had no, the idea like what that would really be or what
17:17
that would take. And when we got the bill for it
17:19
was like $10,000. And I was like, Oh my God.
17:23
And I wasn't familiar with, with that kind of thing at this, you
17:27
know, at this stage, like pay $10,000 to go to, you know,
17:29
private event type of thing. And I sold everything of value
17:32
to go to it. And when I got there, things
17:38
really changed a lot because I just didn't, I knew the people
17:44
and they were successful. And to be fair, like we really
17:47
didn't belong yet. Like we had the skills and
17:49
people like us and all that kind of stuff.
17:51
We just hadn't, we, we didn't have the experience with that.
17:54
And I had this product that was probably around $2500.
17:58
I was selling for $2500, not really selling that many of
18:00
them. And when I got in this business
18:03
mastermind, I discovered probably within the hour that
18:08
nobody even in there was selling anything remotely that low.
18:12
I was like everybody's, every even the people that had offers
18:17
that were similar to mine, they were like 10 times more
18:19
expensive. And at the time I was just
18:22
thinking like, Oh my God, like who, who was buying this?
18:26
Well, how, how do you get to the place where you even think that
18:28
you could say this number to someone for this, what you're
18:31
offering? Like how do you even get there
18:32
psychologically? I didn't, I didn't get the
18:34
connection. And so it was probably a couple
18:38
hours before I decided like, you know what, I'm going to, I'm
18:40
going to price, I'm going to, I'm going to bump our price.
18:43
And I bumped it to probably 25K for this thing that we had.
18:47
And I sold the first one within that week.
18:49
And it was mind blowing. And it really gave me a big
18:54
lesson in terms of like how price matches value or doesn't,
18:58
you know, and how market change and, and who you're aiming this
19:03
toward makes all the difference in the value of the problem that
19:07
you solve for. But it was like really a, a
19:10
massive shift for me. Obviously we made some money and
19:13
we made some new relationships and these, these business owners
19:16
were really doing well, like minimum 7 figures, but quite a
19:19
few of them were 8 and 9 figure businesses.
19:21
So we were like learning their mindset, their, their
19:24
challenges, what, what kind of tools did they use and, and also
19:27
building the right kind of connections.
19:28
And it was a big deal for us at the time.
19:32
So is there an aspect, because I've been told this about stuff
19:36
I do that like there's going to come a point where you're going
19:39
to put a dollar amount on what you do and you should not sell
19:43
yourself short to do that. So how do you, if you're, you
19:49
know, listening to you right now, understand what your value
19:52
actually is? Lashawn.
19:56
Yeah, that's a great question. There's quite a few ways that we
19:58
look at it. One of the things that you
20:01
really need to do is. You need to be able to assess
20:06
the problem that you're solving for.
20:08
Like let's say that you have a business and you're offering a
20:11
service or a product or something like that, right?
20:13
When you're in a conversation with someone that wants to
20:15
potentially buy or you know, kind of leverage your services,
20:20
the conversation usually looks like you have a price.
20:23
You're going to do a thing for them and they may or may not buy
20:26
that thing, right? But what's almost never a part
20:29
of that equation is that if you don't offer them this service or
20:35
they don't take advantage of your service, how this then
20:37
impacts their business, right? Does it impact their, if it's
20:42
awareness, does that impact their traffic?
20:44
If they get a certain amount of traffic, how does that impact
20:46
their sales and over how much time, right?
20:48
Or is this a short term problem solved?
20:51
Or is this a long term problem solved?
20:53
Like even for several things? Let's say you're a videographer.
20:56
You think you're selling video services, but you're really not.
20:59
You're selling this opportunity that if someone buys your video
21:03
services that the right video could sell for them into
21:08
eternity. It could sell for years and
21:10
years and years on autopilot just because you were able to
21:13
document them in the appropriate way.
21:15
They think they're buying video services, you think you're
21:17
selling it, but really you're selling this, this asset that
21:21
that then could sell for them in a positive way in perpetuity and
21:25
paint for the rest of the world how extraordinary they are just
21:28
given your what your ability to document them.
21:30
So you're not really even selling the thing that you think
21:33
you're selling in most cases. And so to answer your question,
21:35
short term is like you really have to look at the value of the
21:40
problem that you're solving for that organization or for that
21:43
person, not the price and not what you think you're selling.
21:46
The value of the problem, OK, well that makes sense because
21:51
the more complex the problem, the more impacts the org, the
21:55
more value there is and gain it addressed.
21:57
If you can meet that value, they're going to compensate you
22:01
accordingly, if I understood you correctly.
22:03
If you understand how it impacts them, if you don't understand
22:07
how it impacts them and you can't articulate it, they're not
22:10
going to compensate you appropriately.
22:12
And that's the that's the real trick.
22:13
It's like when you really understand how what you're going
22:17
to provide for them is going to create a solution that has
22:20
multipliers and what those multipliers are long term, short
22:25
term, right? Then you can say, hey, listen, I
22:28
understand what me giving you this is going to do for your
22:31
business or is going to prevent your business from being able to
22:35
do. And this impacts you in this
22:36
way. It's going to cost you this.
22:38
You know, it's going to take you this amount of time to figure it
22:41
out yourself, right? You're trying to leverage the
22:42
time based on me, right? And so if you can figure that
22:47
out going into that conversation, it gives you a
22:49
different position of leverage to have that conversation with.
22:53
And if you can help articulate that to who you're selling it
22:56
to, you have all the power. You start market theory up with
23:03
your wife, you know, so you're, you're truly a team members and
23:07
you're, you're truly, you know, for each other.
23:11
What was it like getting it going and starting to see?
23:14
Because it seems like you had to bet on yourself multiple times
23:18
in your life. But this is the big one.
23:21
This has implications if it doesn't work and you believe in
23:24
yourself. So, so you're going to put the
23:26
effort in. What was it like seeing at work
23:29
after you 2 had come together, started this and and now we're
23:33
talking? Yeah.
23:37
You know, like I said, I'm pretty prone to taking
23:42
calculated risks now. I think that I think that
23:45
they're required. In my opinion, they're the toll
23:47
that you must pay to get to where you want to get to.
23:50
You have to take a specific set of risks, and I'm almost always
23:55
willing to do that. I do think it was very, very
23:59
challenging because there were a lot of things I didn't have
24:03
figured out yet, you know, like I didn't really understand
24:06
business. Luckily, I had paid a bunch of
24:08
money to get around people that did understand business.
24:10
And so I could leverage their experience and their challenges
24:13
and their tools and strategies and things like that, which I
24:16
would say probably speed up my growth journey by years and
24:20
years and years. Like, thank God, you know?
24:24
But yeah, that was quite challenging.
24:27
But I did once again, have a few things that really went in my
24:31
favor. And I think this happens if you
24:33
throw your hat in the ring. Sometimes you just get some, you
24:35
get catch a windfall sometimes, right?
24:38
I met a guy. Matter of fact, I met him at the
24:41
event that was supposed to that that was prior to me getting
24:46
invited to the business mastermind, right?
24:49
And he was doing at the time like virtual summits.
24:52
This was fairly new. He's doing virtual summits.
24:55
And I thought to myself, man, that's an interesting play, you
25:00
know, so we get it in our head that let me back up.
25:06
I get it in my head and then I go to convince her like we
25:09
should do some virtual summits, right?
25:11
Because we're, we had now been kind of like establishing
25:13
ourselves as like, you know, these kind of people in the
25:17
online course industry. By the way, we got a little bit
25:20
of no notoriety because we were doing something quite unique.
25:25
And that thing is we were solving the problem of intention
25:29
rates and engagement rates. And mostly in the marketing
25:32
space, people didn't think that they cared about that.
25:35
They, they really didn't, right. They were making enough money,
25:38
they didn't get enough sales. Their, their thought process was
25:41
like, well, I wouldn't get sales if it wasn't good.
25:45
Well, it doesn't necessarily mean that you, you could still
25:47
get sales if you are convincing enough and if you say the right
25:51
things and if your packaging looks pretty enough, people will
25:54
buy it. But it's after they buy it that
25:56
they're get disappointed, right. And most people don't even
25:58
complain after that happens. They just don't go do business
26:01
with you again. So our thought process was like,
26:03
OK, well, what if we could solve that particular problem, right?
26:08
And so we ended up creating this process using over 500 plus
26:11
research studies of which learning strategies have like
26:15
the highest degree of impact on someone's ability to consume
26:18
content. A lot of words to say we wanted
26:21
to figure out how to get more people to get the most that they
26:25
can out of a virtual learning environment.
26:28
Now, luckily my wife is a doctor professional development.
26:32
She's a, she's a long lifelong educator and like a world class
26:36
trainer, right. And so, so I could go and sell
26:39
that and I did. But that was the problem that we
26:42
went into the marketing industry to solve because they were
26:44
mostly selling education and they had no idea how to make it
26:47
happen, but they did know how to sell it.
26:49
However, their thought processes are we're more of like, if I can
26:54
get enough attention and I can get enough traffic, I can sell
26:58
this thing and it's sold. Who cares what happens after
27:01
that? And our argument was like, you
27:03
should care because if you can serve more of those people, if
27:06
the average completion rate is only three to 5%, what about the
27:10
other 95% of your own audience? What if you had other offers
27:14
that you could put in front of them?
27:16
Well, if you've already disenfranchise them, you can't
27:18
put it in front of them. You can't offer them that.
27:20
And if you haven't really helped them solve those valuable
27:23
problems that they had when they first were betting on you, you
27:26
really can't. They don't want to go deeper
27:27
with you. But what if they did?
27:29
And what if you could? How would that then impact your
27:31
business long term? Would they spend way more money
27:34
with you? Would they stay way longer with
27:36
you? Would they start recommending
27:38
your business at a higher rate? The answer to that question is
27:40
absolutely, they will. And so that was what started
27:43
getting us some notoriety. I know I started running off the
27:47
mouth here to try to explain this, but the short answer is
27:50
like once we figured out that component, we felt like if we
27:54
can get the right partnerships, we can get a lot more traffic on
27:57
what we were doing. And those virtual summits really
27:59
helped us kind of figure that out.
28:02
So a virtual summits, kind of like a virtual networking
28:06
meeting where it's a big Zoom room and you're doing
28:09
presentations. Is that what that is?
28:11
Women's terms? I'm sorry.
28:13
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, it could be, right.
28:15
It think of like a conference, but online, right.
28:17
And So what we would do is I, I got this bright idea, which I
28:22
tend to do is like, if we go and do this virtual summit, how can
28:27
we make it more valuable? And we approached a software
28:32
company at the time, Thinkific Learning Management System with
28:35
the idea of doing an online course success Summit, because
28:39
we knew like, hey, yeah, you can go and build an online course
28:42
and make money, but there's a lot of other things that you
28:44
need to know. You need to know copywriting,
28:46
you need to know social media, you need to know e-mail
28:49
marketing. And we weren't experts at that
28:51
stuff. So we, our idea was like if we
28:54
went and got all the experts at that stuff to come to our
28:57
virtual summit and teach them these other components, we could
29:00
teach about online courses and we can teach in alignment with
29:03
this learning management system because they sell a platform
29:07
that people would put their courses on.
29:09
And what if we can just get our people that we've been meeting
29:11
in the industry to come talk about it on this virtual summit.
29:14
We can get a lot of attention, we can get a lot of sales and we
29:16
can help a lot of people. And we did that and there was a,
29:20
there was a piece of that that I wasn't really anticipating.
29:23
And that was around like how we could get sponsorships.
29:26
So we convinced this company to come do the virtual summit with
29:29
us, which they came on as a sponsor, but they gave us money.
29:34
They also agreed to like market for our summit to their e-mail
29:40
list. So they put a ton of people on
29:41
our e-mail list, right, thousands and thousands.
29:44
And they also ran paid traffic ads for us.
29:48
Now, if we were to try to go get that that amount of like
29:51
momentum and marketing ourselves, it would have
29:53
probably cost us 5 to $10 million in Facebook ads.
29:56
But instead, we had this like, really cool joint venture
29:59
partnership where they kind of fronted the bill for all the
30:02
marketing because the audience we were going after were all the
30:05
people that they wanted to get. And here's why it worked.
30:08
If they were to go try to just throw ads at Facebook, it would
30:12
have cost them 25 to $50 per acquisition per person that
30:17
e-mail opted in. And the way that we did it with
30:19
this content, we were getting so much traffic that it it came
30:22
down to a being about $5.00. So they were reducing their cost
30:25
of acquisition by just participating with us.
30:28
And so it was like a really a really smart play and it just
30:31
like really gave us a lot of momentum.
30:33
And obviously we made a lot of friends and then we helped a lot
30:36
of people kind of figure out this thing.
30:38
I was curious because it it's hard to get people to to click
30:43
that button. It's hard to engage with people,
30:46
but it's it's a challenge you have to overcome, you know, for
30:50
a, a new business owner or for someone who, you know, maybe
30:53
they're not in business, maybe they're in something else, a non
30:55
profit or what have you. What are some basic things you
31:00
want to see from potential client before they come to you
31:04
for you know, guidance and your services?
31:12
I think the main thing for us is that they, they're open to what
31:18
they don't already know. Like, you know, a lot of times
31:22
people come to us and they're already industry experts and
31:24
they're like, I know a bunch of stuff.
31:26
And we agree with that, like, you know, a bunch of stuff.
31:29
But it's not what you know, that's not giving you the
31:31
momentum. It's what you don't know.
31:32
It's what's inside of your, you know, your blind spots that's
31:35
impacting you that you don't have access to.
31:37
And so sometimes people come to us and they're really smart and
31:40
they're already very successful. So successful in fact, that they
31:44
often don't see what's in their way.
31:47
Like, let me give you an example.
31:48
We had this organization that came to us and they were doing
31:52
about $100 million a year in their online course, which is
31:56
amazing. They're crushing it in
31:58
marketing. They're they're doing
32:00
incredible, right. Once we did an audit though of
32:04
their program, we found that it had a 3.9% completion rate,
32:07
meaning they were pretty much crapping the bed on serving
32:11
their people, even though their intention was to do that.
32:14
Now they're obviously really good at marketing and they had a
32:16
budget for they were putting toward their marketing, but
32:18
really they didn't know how to deliver upon giving their people
32:21
the right experience. And here's why this sucks is
32:24
because they built the company based off of like healing their
32:27
mom's gut health and they were so passionate about doing that
32:30
and they had like 50 products on the back end that people could
32:33
have bought. It's just that people weren't
32:35
getting to the back end because they once they bought the
32:37
course, they got stuck there, they hated and they just
32:39
disappeared, right? And so they really should have
32:41
had a billion dollar company that they ended up selling for a
32:44
little over 100 million. That's not terrible, but like
32:46
compared to what? It's terrible when you should
32:49
have a multi billion dollar company, right?
32:50
A multi billion dollar exit. So you know, it's, I would say
32:54
for people that are good for us, first of all, there's a range of
32:57
people that we support in different ways.
32:59
Some people come to us, they're just starting out, they have an
33:02
idea, we have some different solutions to help them kind of
33:04
get going and figure out how to get some momentum, get some
33:07
early wins, some sales, some money.
33:09
We we can support them with that.
33:11
If they're already kind of going already like they're an author
33:13
or speaker coach or something like that consultant.
33:16
We have a lot of experience working with them at this stage.
33:19
Obviously we've been doing it for since 2014 and we can help
33:24
them and if they're an organization, we can show them
33:26
how to to take their organization and make it more
33:28
human and really help people in that way.
33:31
So yeah, there's a lot of different ways that we can
33:32
support them, but the main things are that they are open to
33:36
the things that they don't know so that we can give them some
33:38
some real insight to this. The customer doesn't always know
33:42
best. They.
33:44
Or or they don't know. They they, they really don't
33:46
know. They don't know.
33:47
They don't know what they don't know like.
33:49
They don't have enough like they don't have enough insight and
33:52
context into what's impacting them in most cases.
33:55
But I don't know about your line of work.
33:56
But in my line of work, they don't know what they don't know
33:59
but but it can be really an arduous exercise to get them to
34:05
see a different viewpoint. Yeah, yeah.
34:09
That's a lot of like billable time that your personality and
34:14
knowledge transfer to get an outcome your desire, right?
34:17
I mean, I'm just saying. I mean, that's what I've
34:20
experienced sometimes in my line of work.
34:23
Sometimes it's a challenge, you know, but like for me, it's kind
34:28
of easy to take on that challenge because at the end of
34:30
the day, like what we do is very, very scalable.
34:35
So if it's something that I'm choosing to do or be a part of
34:39
and it's not scalable, it's got to make sense.
34:41
Meaning we believe in the mission, we believe in the
34:43
people, we believe that the skill set and the, and the
34:46
experience that we have to make a real difference for them.
34:48
And if those things are out of alignment, they're just not a
34:50
fit, right? And so we don't really stress
34:52
over that. Like I'm not trying to convince
34:53
people of the thing they're convinced of, but if they know
34:56
it's not working and they don't, they don't, they don't have a
34:59
solution for it. And, and they fall into our
35:01
hands and come into a conversation with us.
35:03
We are happy to help them revolutionize the way that they
35:06
think about it, the systems that they use to do it.
35:08
And also like how to get more momentum out of it.
35:11
Like we, we do that, you know, and we do that at a very high
35:13
level at this stage. We, we were very fortunate
35:18
because when we were targeting these like marketing company,
35:23
it's not really marketing companies.
35:24
We were targeting the marketing industry, But we ended up
35:27
working with a lot of marketing companies, which was helpful for
35:30
us because when we started like really working on the back end
35:34
as consultants with these organizations and some of the
35:36
top ones in the in the US, we really learned like a lot of the
35:40
mistakes that they're making, like they, you know, in terms of
35:42
how they support people. And we also learned like what
35:46
systems they're using, how they think about it, how
35:50
transactional they were being, which is not obviously not good
35:53
if you want to build long term relationships, but I can get you
35:55
money. So how do you find that balance?
35:57
Right? But it helped us a lot, you
35:58
know, as consultants, because when we left, we're like, OK,
36:00
well, we understand marketing at a very high level now.
36:03
You know, we understand like these systems, we understand how
36:05
to use it. And then we understood how to
36:07
bring it to earth when it comes to like really creating a
36:10
positive outcome for people. So if they do come to us, we, we
36:14
are very prepared to to help them revolutionize their thought
36:16
processes and and probably their business as well.
36:20
You've been in business now for effectively over a decade at
36:24
this time, right? Yeah.
36:26
I'm just curious, you know, social media has changed in the
36:30
last 10 years, automation has changed in the last 10 years.
36:34
You add in AI. So like with any business,
36:37
there's, there's changes. It just seems like in your
36:39
world, you know, a tractor's been a tractor for, you know, 50
36:43
years before they really started changing, right?
36:45
Even cars to a degree. But there's been a lot of
36:49
changes compressed into a very short time.
36:52
So just me being me, how do you adjust around those changes and
36:58
still deliver to your clients and understand your purpose?
37:03
Yeah, that's a great question. You know, the fundamentals are
37:06
really the same. You know, if, if someone comes
37:09
to you and they just they want to make more money, that's what
37:13
they come to us, they want to make more money, right?
37:15
That's, that's normally the argument.
37:17
I mean, they, they present it as though they want to help the
37:20
world and good on them. Like they want to help people
37:22
and I get it, like they want to help them and also they
37:25
understand that it's profitable to help them.
37:27
How do they make it profitable? OK, we help solve that for them.
37:31
But mostly for us, like we've been since the beginning, really
37:35
kind of like technologically advanced.
37:38
So we've been on the edge in terms of what's happening with
37:41
AI. We've been on the edge in terms
37:43
of what's happening with marketing and learning
37:44
management systems and all this kind of stuff.
37:46
And when these new innovations come along, we are we're very
37:50
nimble. So we're able to to take them
37:52
learn how to implement some of these things to make what we do
37:56
even more efficient. And we do that, you know, so, so
37:59
for us it, it has been really a multiplier in a lot of ways
38:04
because now we can use things that used to be a really long
38:08
drawn out process for us to do and make them way, way more
38:13
efficient. Everything from like image
38:16
production to copywriting and, and video editing and all these
38:20
kinds of landing page development and web development
38:22
and software development, like all these things have become
38:24
significantly easier and made it so much more, made us some so
38:29
much more powerful than we were originally.
38:31
Because we would have to go get large amounts of, of people to
38:34
help us do this stuff and it would be slow.
38:36
And so now it's not slow and also it's not as complex.
38:39
So it just allows us to be much more impactful and and gives us
38:44
a lot more velocity behind everything that we do.
38:47
So it seems like again, Marine Corps style here, you know, and
38:50
I was airwing Lashawn. OK, Yeah.
38:54
The base element is still the story and the relationship to
39:01
move the the goal and the outcome forward.
39:03
That's the base and and to me that's this hasn't changed.
39:08
If I understand you correctly, all the other elements help you
39:12
do it faster, better, stronger. Yeah, the technology helps us do
39:16
it better, faster, stronger and to be fair, like they're we're
39:21
in the people business and everybody.
39:23
Is. We're in the people business,
39:25
man, like that 100%. Like there's even with these
39:28
organizations, we have conversations with them and it's
39:31
just like on the other side of the organization is the people,
39:34
right? Like, and so, yeah, we're in the
39:37
people business and we just help people understand how to be more
39:42
efficient with the way that they use these systems to create more
39:45
scale and to create more monetization for themselves.
39:48
And do we add technology into that?
39:51
Yes, we do, because it, it just allows us to to really multiply
39:55
ourselves in our, in our output. So yeah, but we're in the people
39:58
business. And you know, I, I will add
40:01
this, you know, not only are we in the people business, but we
40:07
understand that the technology is speeding up.
40:10
The technology is speeding up the pressure of people feeling
40:14
like they need to make something happen.
40:16
The cost of things are are speeding up and increasing,
40:18
right. So we feel like it's more more
40:23
impactful to just really dig deeper, right?
40:26
A lot of people are trying to go wide, like how do they go wide?
40:29
You know, we feel like it's more impactful to dig deeper and, and
40:32
for a lot of people, that means they can like build, reinforce
40:36
communities, like serve people in a way that's going to make a
40:41
real difference for their business, but actually care
40:43
about it versus like what you can sell them.
40:45
You know, I'm and for years we've been like this, but we're
40:48
not even interested in doing business with people that we
40:51
wouldn't want to be friends with.
40:53
It doesn't mean that we are friends with everyone.
40:55
It means that we like we would want to, we would feel good
40:58
inside of those conversations. If I give you my experience, my
41:02
knowledge and my skill set and I lend any amount of energy toward
41:05
that, I would feel good about that contribution regardless of
41:08
if we had a monetary exchange. And so that allows me to really
41:11
take the best of me and the best of my relationships and my best
41:15
of my understanding and really give to you in a way that gives
41:18
you some momentum. So we do very good at that
41:21
because so we get to pick and choose because what we do is
41:23
very scalable. So when it comes to doing
41:25
something not scalable and it's like a one to one thing, we can
41:29
be selective about it, you know, So yeah.
41:31
But it we're in the people business and everybody is.
41:35
Well, the, the reason I want to emphasize that it is so I played
41:40
in your world a little bit with other people and it's, it's
41:44
almost like they're the person's removed and it's people
41:48
processing technology with the real focus on processing
41:50
technology. And people are just there to,
41:53
you know, look at the look at what's created, sign off on the,
41:57
the contract and, you know, get the PO in order.
42:00
Whereas it seems like when I and I remember meeting you at MCC,
42:04
you know, at the time we were recording this last month and,
42:08
and you, you really didn't focus on, you know, what I did in
42:12
terms of number of downloads, listeners, emails like that.
42:16
You kind of want to understand the broader story of, of what I
42:19
did in my journey to understand me better than other people did.
42:24
Where, where I've gone to these is, you know, you got to have a
42:27
certain number of listeners, followers, downloads metrics.
42:31
And that's going to indicate if I want to, you know, talk with
42:35
you. But I did notice in that form,
42:39
you didn't start off that way. You kind of want to understand
42:42
who I was. And it wasn't just me.
42:45
You did with other people, too. And I felt that was very
42:47
different than what I usually run into.
42:49
And I thought I found it refreshing.
42:52
Well, first of all, thank you, man.
42:55
You know I'll take that is I'll take that to heart.
42:58
You know, I won't take that lightly.
43:00
I do. I do feel as though like it's
43:06
it's my perception that people that I'm not friends with yet
43:11
are just friends waiting to happen.
43:13
If they're a stranger, they're friends waiting to happen.
43:15
What a Warren. Rogers Moment.
43:17
Lesean. You know, yeah, man, I just, I,
43:19
I really, I really feel that way.
43:21
And when I do meet people, I think it's a real mistake when
43:26
people go into things and they're and they're hyper
43:28
transactional about whatever it is metrics and this and that or,
43:33
or kind of beating their chest. I, I really think that it puts
43:37
barriers in between the space of the relationships that you're
43:41
hoping to build. You know, if you, if you're just
43:44
thinking about what you, what you can get from it or what you
43:46
can take from it versus like what you could give to it, very
43:49
different thing. And so.
43:51
Yeah. For me, if I show up in any
43:53
environment, my real intention underneath my skin is to be
43:57
present, to be interested, to be curious and to look at things
44:01
from from the angle of what, how can I, how can I make it better
44:04
or how can I really connect with this person.
44:06
And some of that is natural. Some of that's natural.
44:09
Some of this might be an adaptation.
44:11
You know, I went to 14 different schools before I got out of high
44:14
school. But I will say that like
44:16
everything extraordinary that's happened in my life at this
44:20
stage has been really on the on the back end of some amazing
44:25
relationship I've been able to build.
44:26
Like some, some relationships, some someone I spoke to felt
44:31
that something about it was impacted by the way that they
44:35
interacted with me, opened doors for me, made calls for me, made
44:39
introductions for me. And I don't take those things
44:41
lightly either. And so I, I do think there's
44:44
something really special about just meeting a person eye to
44:49
eye, face to face, heart to heart, without making it mean
44:52
something and trying to extract from it.
44:55
But but I think the beautiful things happen when you do that
44:57
and you just show up. Well, so many people, veterans,
45:02
active duty civilians, laymen, I think missed that, you know,
45:07
there's, there's such a hyper focus on either extracting value
45:11
out of every minute or making sure that billable hour is fully
45:15
blocked And, and you know, the money's collected that they
45:18
forget that we are, we're, we're in the human experience.
45:23
And you know, I'm not in your line of work, but what I do is
45:27
in, in my line of work is I want to understand who's behind the
45:31
product and do they stand behind it before I let them into to my
45:36
world. And I think a lot of people miss
45:37
that the, the power of the relationship is, is widely
45:40
understated, widely understated. As you go into and we're when
45:46
this releases, it'll be almost halfway through the year, You
45:51
know, as you go through the second-half of 2025 and into
45:54
2026, you know, what do you see for your line of work and how
45:59
that can relate to the veteran experience?
46:02
Leshawn. Well, I've been working on a
46:04
project. It's called Entry and Entry.
46:09
Funny enough, like I I wasn't even planning to talk about
46:12
this, but since we're talking right, let's.
46:14
Go. Since we're talking about
46:15
relationships and things like that and, and my belief in like
46:19
what's possible and once you have the right relationships is
46:22
that you're able to elevate your profile, you know, you're able
46:26
to gain a certain level of access, you're able to get the
46:29
right introductions and it makes a real difference.
46:31
You know, like it, it makes it, it just closes the distance
46:34
between what you want to do and what you want access to.
46:38
And so entry is really a software platform that I'm
46:41
building. It's an like an AI booking
46:43
platform that helps you get basically booked on stages so
46:47
that once you create something or you're, you're an author,
46:50
you're a speaker, you're a coach.
46:52
You then get the opportunity to get on stage and speak about it
46:54
and get the right eyeballs on you and get the right
46:57
opportunities to, to sell your thing.
46:59
But more than anything, you get to elevate your profile and you
47:03
get the appropriate amount of awareness that that you should
47:06
be getting, you know, given your experience and your interests,
47:09
right? So, so entry has been really,
47:10
really good. There's an arm of it that's
47:12
supposed to be kind of like a series of networking events that
47:16
we're going to do once 1/4 that we're planning to turn into its
47:20
own conference. And so it's really all about
47:22
like elevating your profile and getting the right introductions
47:26
and seeing where those introductions lead.
47:28
And so it's, it's really been kind of a, a passion project.
47:31
I've been putting a lot of work in behind the scenes because I
47:35
really believe that that is like a missing piece.
47:37
Like when it comes to business, I can help people with like
47:39
monetization stuff, but if they don't have like, like an
47:43
infrastructure in place where people are knowing about them
47:46
and people are trying to find out about them or they're not
47:48
getting enough awareness, you know, it just doesn't really
47:52
help them that much unless they're already set, you know?
47:54
And so entry is designed to help people get that early stage
47:58
momentum, get the right partnerships, brand deals,
48:03
elevation and awareness so that you can really, you know, take
48:06
off in your life. And I'm, I'm very excited about
48:08
where that's going. So over the next, you know,
48:10
couple quarters, that's what I'll be focusing on behind the
48:13
scenes. That's very interesting because
48:16
I talked to a lot of authors here in OM Radio and I'm, I'm,
48:20
I'm doing my own writing project.
48:22
We'll talk about that, you know, offline.
48:24
But one of the things a couple authors have told me and, and
48:27
it's almost becoming a common theme is sure, it's working
48:32
writing the book and it's working adding the book.
48:35
But the real battle, if you want to call it that, is the
48:41
marketing and getting your name out there.
48:45
And it's, it's I've had a couple veterans of Sean telling me
48:48
that, Hey, you know, if I had known how hard it was to get my
48:54
book in front of people, I would have allocated money and time
48:57
differently. And the, the last part of that
49:00
is I'm fine as I've been told very bluntly, get ready to pay a
49:05
middleman to put your book in front of certain people, to
49:08
speak of certain conferences, author groups, so on, so forth.
49:12
You've almost got to pay like a not an agent, but like a, an
49:16
agent to put you in those positions.
49:19
And if you don't have that, you're never gonna go anywhere
49:22
at all. And so I'm very interested to
49:24
see how this platform turns out. Yeah, I mean, it's, it's very
49:28
difficult to get the momentum because you got to figure, first
49:31
of all, there's a lot of noise in the world.
49:33
And if you don't have the right awareness yet, you've got to cut
49:37
through the noise in early stage.
49:39
Who cares about what you do? Like nobody cares yet that's
49:43
true. They don't know you.
49:45
They don't know what it's like to to spend time with you.
49:47
They don't know why you care. They don't know why you're
49:49
trying to tell them this. They don't know that you're even
49:51
like a good source of this information, a valid source for
49:55
this information. There's a lot of unknowns.
49:57
And so you have to, you really have to pay your dues and your
50:01
dues can be leveraged by someone, someone else, some
50:04
other relationships, some other, like you said, like a booking
50:06
partner or something like that. But if you get the right amount
50:10
of awareness and you get the right attention, can't you
50:13
leverage that too? You can leverage that too.
50:15
You can get people finding out about your book and wanting to
50:17
know more and hearing you talk for a little bit and making
50:20
decisions about if they like you or not and if they would like to
50:23
go deeper. That's really hard to do when
50:26
you don't have enough traffic and you don't have enough
50:28
eyeballs. But if you can solve for that
50:30
piece and really put yourself in the right light, I think that
50:35
when people see you enough, if you are actually a good source
50:38
and you are trustworthy and likable and interesting and
50:41
creative and people want to do stuff with you, even if you
50:44
don't have a lot of the other things figured out, they might
50:46
even be the people that bring that to the table.
50:48
And that's been my experience. Like, I've been to the Grammys.
50:51
I'm not a Grammy award-winning, like music artist.
50:54
Like I play sometimes on my, you know, computer making stuff.
50:56
But like, I've been invited to the Grammys.
50:58
I've had stuff on billboards, editorials, you know, magazines,
51:02
I met tons of celebrities, all just because I knew someone else
51:05
who was like, man, you guys have to meet this guy.
51:09
And it's, it's quite, I go to LA sometimes I get put into movies
51:12
because I have a friend. It's like a big time casting
51:14
director out there. I'm not an actor, but you know,
51:17
I make some good friends, you know, and, and I think they're
51:19
like getting the right around awareness just allows other
51:22
people to be able to do that for themselves, for the thing that
51:24
they're passionate about. So I'm excited about it.
51:28
Awesome, awesome. Hey, it was great meeting you at
51:30
Military Creator Con 2025 in Orlando and had a great time and
51:35
it was, you know, very cool. You know, because you start, we
51:39
both start about the same time in our respective, you know,
51:42
areas. Things have changed in the last
51:44
10 years. 10 years ago, that wasn't even a, a blip on the
51:46
radar. We didn't have a place at all.
51:49
And so it was nice seeing all these other craters and business
51:52
people there for the military space.
51:55
So looking forward to seeing what the entry platform looks
51:59
like. And I, I just had a great time
52:01
talking with you just now. Yeah, man, first of all, thank
52:05
you for having me. Thank you for all the kind words
52:07
as well. I feel the same.
52:08
Same energy, same, same thankfulness, really just a warm
52:12
human. And I was excited to be there
52:14
with you. And I look forward to connecting
52:15
further. You know, I, I will keep you
52:16
updated how things progress. You know, we're, we're putting a
52:20
lot of work in behind the scenes, having lots of meetings
52:22
and stuff. But the main thing is like for
52:23
people to be able to elevate their profile and, and get more
52:26
awareness so they can live a life that they, they love.
52:28
And for me, that seems like the right thing to be doing at this
52:32
stage. So yeah, thank you for having
52:33
me. So we'll, we'll, the most
52:36
important thing, if someone's listening to this, how, how do
52:39
they connect with you? How do they, you know, reach out
52:41
to you and and look at market theory as a provider in this
52:44
space. La Shawn.
52:47
Yeah, actually we got a couple different brands, but yeah, you
52:49
can go to Market Theory dot US or you can just find me on
52:52
social media. Probably more recently.
52:55
I'm using LinkedIn a lot. So you can find me on LinkedIn.
52:57
It's just La Shawn Kerb, LECHONKIRB and putting different
53:03
kind of content there, putting my rants there, sometimes
53:06
putting videos or ideas for people to share and stuff like
53:09
that. And that's probably the easiest
53:10
way to grab me. But yeah, you can find me
53:13
anywhere on the on the net if you just look up with Sean Kerb.
53:15
And I look forward to connecting with you guys.
53:17
And if I could be helpful, I will certainly do that.
53:20
So I'm gonna have his LinkedIn URL and the website link in the
53:24
Austin Mike video show post. You can reach out to him there.
53:28
He's extremely knowledgeable. It's not gonna be a waste of
53:31
time to reach out to him. Well, Shawn, I thank you for
53:33
coming on OM Radio. Learned a whole lot today.
53:35
Can't wait to see the entry platform.
53:37
If you sing OM Radio, we are mission in flight.
53:40
Thank you so much. Thank you man, the biggest fear
53:47
Goldstar families have that their child will be forgotten.
53:49
We need to never forget. Freedom wasn't the fact that
53:54
they give us the life we have now.
53:56
We should remember them and like, give thanks to them.
53:59
If I can be a part of something today that's going to make the
54:02
surviving family of any of these veterans, these heroes, feel
54:05
better tomorrow, than it's worth it.
54:06
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54:11
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54:20
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