Latest / QUESTION EVERYTHING / How to Unleash the Magic and Authenticity of Drag + Be the Main Character In Your Own Life with Bob the Drag Queen

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How to Unleash the Magic and Authenticity of Drag + Be the Main Character In Your Own Life with Bob the Drag Queen · QUESTION EVERYTHING

• 0:04
  Speaker 1: Big things happen when you're pretty, pretty bold, pretty clever,
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: pretty strong. I'm Danielle Robe, and each week my guests
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: and I have conversations that put a new spin on pretty.
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: This is pretty smart. We're all born naked, and the
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: rest is drag. These are words for RuPaul, one of
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: history's most famous drag artists and the self proclaimed Queen
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: of Drag. Drag is an art form that has existed
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: since ancient times and has recently rocketed to mainstream popularity.
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: Drag is a gender bending art form in which a
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: person dresses in clothing and makeup meant to exaggerate a
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: specific gender identity, usually of the opposite sex. When I
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: watch drag shows, I'm in awe. To me, drag is
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: about confidence and self expression. External influences will say you
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: should do this or you should do that, and your job,
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: our job as individuals is to locate what makes you you.
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: Drag queens have taught me that you are the architect
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: of your own life. Drag is just what we see
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: or want to emphasize, so really everyone is in drag
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: to some extent. I wanted to talk to one of
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: the most well known and renowned queens out there to
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: learn about how we can all unleash the magic and
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: authenticity of drag and be the main character in our
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: own lives. Today, we have Bob the Drag Queen. Bob
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: is a stand up comedian, actor, podcaster, and activist. You
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: might have caught Bob as the star and consulting producer
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: of the Emmy nominated HBO unscripted series We're Here, or
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: you may recognize Bob's fierce poise and signature sense of humor,
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: which helps Bob win Season eight of RuPaul's Drag Race.
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: Let's get into it. So, Bob, where did you grow up?
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: I grew up in the South, like grouping Georgia, Alabama,
• 1:55
  Speaker 2: and Mississippi. And I wasn't in the military. We just
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: moved a lot. We just want those times that just
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: was always moving for one reason or the other. And yes,
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: I just grew up all of that mostly Georgia, though
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: most of my growing up was in Georgia.
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: How do you think people in high school would describe you?
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: Oh, my high school people would from high school. I mean,
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: it's funny. I actually ran into a girl from high
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: school recently because my brother is dating a girl. I
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: went to high school with and her sister was in
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: my class. And I mean, they probably say I was gay,
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: they say I was funny, they'd probably say that I
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: was loud. I mean, gay would probably be the first
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: thing they used to describe me, like, oh, the gay guy.
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you're so much more than that.
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: I think it's a compliment to me. It's not a
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: detriment to me being the gay guy. I mean it's
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: but also now I'm not the gay guy anymore because
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: all my friends are queer. You know, in high school
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: there were like three queer people, and now all my
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: friends are queer. So when you know, once you was
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: surround yourself with people like you, you're no longer you know,
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: the gay guy.
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: Well, you moved to New York when you were twenty two,
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: which is a bold move from Georgia. I read you.
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: I also, in high school had very long hair. How long? Well,
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: when I graduated high school, it's probably say here, And
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: then by the time I cut my hair in college,
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: it was probably like down a.
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: Here, curly strait, give me like a.
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: I had locks. I had long locks that were really
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: quite beautiful. I can probably even find a picture and
• 3:24
  Speaker 2: show you.
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: I can I post it. I love that.
• 3:28
  Speaker 2: Of course I was very I mean, I'm I'm follically
• 3:31
  Speaker 2: challenged these days, so I'm really glad to anyone listening.
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: I gotta say, if you have the opportunity to play
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: with your hair, especially if you're a sign mail at birth,
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: and it's not exclusive to people sign mail at birth,
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: but it affects us proportionally more than who are sign
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: female at birth, play with your hair because it is
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: not guaranteed to be around forever. So enjoy your hair
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: because one day you might be like Bob the Dragway.
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: Because tomorrow is not promised.
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: Tomorrow is really not promised for your hair.
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: Mary, you moved to New York. I read that you
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: had two suitcases and five hundred dollars.
• 4:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah that's true. Yeah, why you really got you really
• 4:16
  Speaker 2: got the information right? Yeah? I moved there with two
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: suitcases and one of them was a carry on.
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: I mean, what did what did you even pack? You
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: just had a few pairs of shoes and clothes and
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: just some clothes. What was the plan.
• 4:32
  Speaker 2: The plan was to make it on Broadway. That was
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: my That was my big plan. The plan was just
• 4:37
  Speaker 2: to make it hit the ground running and make it
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: as a Broadway actor.
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: That was the plan, and then you got there and
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: what happened because five hundred dollars does not go a
• 4:46
  Speaker 1: long way in New York City.
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: No, Well, I got there, and I found out that
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: to make it on Broadway you don't have to but
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: it really helps to be able to sing and dance.
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: I don't mean kind of singing dance. I mean you
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: have to be like one of the best singers and
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: one of the best dancers in the world. And I'm not.
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: I can dance and I can carry a tune, but
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: those people are Broadway are next level. So I quickly
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: found out that I needed to try to forge my
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: own path, and I began writing my own shows. I
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: continued writing stand up comedy. I started writing standup comedy
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: years ago, but I had never actually performed it. So
• 5:17
  Speaker 2: I got into the stand up comedy scene, which was
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: really amazing. And then I, you know, tripped and fell
• 5:23
  Speaker 2: and landed in a dress, and then I became a
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  Speaker 2: drag queen.
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: Well, I couldn't believe that your mom owned a drag
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: bar in Georgia and you never decided to try it
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: until you saw RuPaul's drag Race.
• 5:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I was kind of afraid of drag queens.
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: One of my mom's friends who worked at the club
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: and his name was Sidney. Rest in peace to Sydney.
• 5:43
  Speaker 2: By the way, Sidney came home was like, you know,
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: never trusted. I remember Sidney coming home one day very
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: angry and like then like just clearly upset, and was like,
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: never trust the drag queen. Never trust the drag queen,
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: because he had been shot by a drag queen, a
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: drag a stray bullet, like so a dragon was trying
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: to shoot someone else, but the bullet hit Sydney in
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: his leg. And he was like, drab queens are shady.
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: Never trust them. They all have weapons and they're violent,
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  Speaker 2: so do not trust drag queens. And I was like,
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: all right, Sidney noted, I will never trust the drag
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  Speaker 2: queen ever. And then I started watching Tuong Fu and
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: I became obsessed, like obsessed with tuong Fou. I'm very
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: lucky to I'm not the only queer person in my family.
• 6:27
  Speaker 2: I have a queer uncle, my uncle Steve, and he
• 6:30
  Speaker 2: had tu loong Fou, and I would go to his
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: apartment in Atlanta and while the whole family was like
• 6:35
  Speaker 2: in the living room hanging out. I would just be
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: in his bedroom on his waterbed by myself, eating these
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: baked he used to make baked apples, eating baked apples
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: and watching Tu Loong Foo like NonStop, like and once
• 6:46
  Speaker 2: it was over, I would just rewind the movie and
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: start it again.
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: I always think when we admire people, it's because we
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: see something in them that we think we have within
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  Speaker 1: ourselves that just hasn't come out yet. What about two
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: Loong Foo did you feel like? What did you see?
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: Well? It was it was glamor, it was funny, it
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  Speaker 2: was campy, it was a reverent, it was bucking against
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  Speaker 2: the system. It was dress up, it was everything was
• 7:12
  Speaker 2: just so. It was just I was immediately pulled it
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: into it. You know. It was and it was queer.
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: If you could, like in your own words, describe what
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: drag is. What is drag?
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  Speaker 2: Drag is creating art and blurring the gender line. Is
• 7:27
  Speaker 2: that simple? Yeah? And I wish the answer was more complicated.
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  Speaker 2: But if you're creating art and blowing the gender line,
• 7:32
  Speaker 2: because you don't have to be a performer, you don't
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  Speaker 2: have to be a comedian, you don't have to be
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: a lip syncer. You don't have to be a dancer.
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: It doesn't have to be man. Dress's woman. It doesn't
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: have to be warm addresses man. It can just be
• 7:42
  Speaker 2: as long as you're just blurring the gender line and
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: creating art.
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: Is dragged And what's the story behind your drag name?
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: How'd you come up with Bob the drag Queen?
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  Speaker 2: Okay, the truth is, the real truth isn't as fun
• 7:53
  Speaker 2: as the made up story. The real truth is I
• 7:55
  Speaker 2: used to have an old drag name my first three
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: or four years, and drag was kid with a whip.
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  Speaker 2: And then people kept mispronouncing my name. They called me
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: Katie or Kitty or kit and I was like, that's
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: not my name, Like, my name is not My name
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  Speaker 2: is Kitten. And then one day it was karaoke and
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: he was like, guys, give it up your host Kim,
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: and I was like, Kim, yeah, because Kim's a drag name. Hey, guys,
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  Speaker 2: give it up for me. I'm Kim the drag Queen.
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: And then every time they would come up, I kept
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: changing my name. I give it up for me. I'm
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: your host, Kate the drag Queen. And then by the
• 8:21
  Speaker 2: end I was like and don't forget me your host
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  Speaker 2: Bob Bob the Drag Queen, And I was like, that's
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: so funny. And I told all my friends and they
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: were like, that's a really bad name and you should
• 8:29
  Speaker 2: not change your name to that. And I was like, well,
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: now I have to do it.
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  Speaker 1: So it's within you to you want to push up
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: against the system. That is like, that is so everything
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: you just said. I love that for sure.
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: I mean, even if you think about how my drag
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: really also started with activism. You know, my early early
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: days of drag, it didn't start with activism, but pretty
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: early in my drags started with stand up comedy. But
• 8:50
  Speaker 2: pretty early in my drag I started doing activism, and
• 8:52
  Speaker 2: I was doing these protests called Drag Queen Weddings for
• 8:55
  Speaker 2: Equality every Saturday in Times Square and getting arrested and
• 8:58
  Speaker 2: doing demonstrations. So you know, bucking against the system has
• 9:01
  Speaker 2: always been a part of my drag.
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: So last night I watched RuPaul's masterclass mm hmm, and
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: it's sort of changed my life. Ruth says, everybody's born
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: naked and the rest is dragged, So in essence, we're
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: all born and the rest is built.
• 9:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that makes sense. I mean, I think that because
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: of RuPaul's Drag Race in my time when that show,
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: I've already taken the masterclass.
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, probably just being around Rue is probably pretty well.
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: I'm not around RuPaul very often. I mean, I haven't
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: been around RuPaul since I mean for like probably six
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: years now, since I was on Reaul's Drag Race, And
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: every once in a while at a finale or something,
• 9:36
  Speaker 2: I'll run into RuPaul. But it is a magical thing
• 9:39
  Speaker 2: to be around real, I mean, to be around someone
• 9:42
  Speaker 2: who's I always think to myself when I'm sixty one,
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: I really hope I look that good in drag when
• 9:46
  Speaker 2: I'm sixty one years old.
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, or just in general, ru has legs for days, right, Yeah,
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: Ruth said, once you see yourself from the outside, that's
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: when the party begins.
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: Think that that makes a lot of sense. I remember.
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: It's basically getting a chance to reflecting yourself and seeing
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: yourself through the way other people see you, you know
• 10:07
  Speaker 2: what I mean. And the best way I found to
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: get to figure out how people see is to just
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: ask how you're perceived and how you navigate the world.
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: You know, like you would just ask friends.
• 10:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I asked friends A lot. Yeah.
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: Still to this day, a lot of my.
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: Friends laugh at me because of the way that I interact,
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: which I think it's it feels normal to me, but
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: my friends are always like, who talks like that? And
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: I'm like, I guess I do.
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: I actually just learned in a podcast earlier this week
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: that people who go around and ask sort of like
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: uncomfortable questions in public like that have a higher EQ.
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: So it's actually a great thing. You can tell them
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: you have a higher EQ than all of them.
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: What's an EQ?
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: Emotional like emotional intelligence?
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: Oh okay, cool?
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah? Nice? Yeah, So what is the process of building
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: a drag persona? Like how do you decide after you
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: pick your name, how do you decide what goes into it?
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: So I'm going to say, you know, there's some people
• 11:00
  Speaker 2: who have what people looking at today drag persona, meaning
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: that their their identity and drag is very different than
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: their identity out of drag. There are people like Varla
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: g and Merman, who's created like a whole character where
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: Barla gen Merman is the daughter of Ethel Mermon and
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: she's just like singer. There's like Dame Edna Average who
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: has an entire other character for herself and for me,
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: I don't know that I have a drag persona as
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: much as I have a nickname and work clothes. You
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: know what I mean, Bob, but just become my nickname
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: that everyone calls me because they called Bob even out
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: of drag, even when I'm just like when me and
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: my friend the thing like, I'm just my friends call
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: me Bob, and my I look at my drag as
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: my work clothes because I don't. I don't really change
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: my personality. I don't change the way I talk, I
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: don't change my mannerisms. Everything is pretty much all the same.
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: But there are people who do create a persona around
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: their drag. And I think that if your drag is
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: performance based or something like that, then it's probably maybe wise.
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: And I am performance based, but my drag persona is
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: really just a nickname and work clothes.
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: So that's really interesting because my next question for you
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: was do you feel the power in drag that you
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: do out of drag?
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure. And what it is I don't want
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: to cheapen the power of drag. What it is is
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: just is really just dressing up really nicely, like it's
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: just you're dressed up, and you're taller than everyone else,
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: and there's a thing in your head where you know,
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: I probably put more time and effort into my appearance
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: today than anybody in this fucking room. And it gives
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: you a sense of power.
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: You know, interesting because from on the outside, I'll tell
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: you what the power seems to me, and then you
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: tell me if I'm off base. Okay, So have you
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: seen the movie King Richard?
• 12:46
  Speaker 2: By any chance, I have not. So it's the Venus
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: and Serena's father biopic.
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: With exactly and when I was watching that, I realized
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: that King Richard or Richard, has this incredible belief. It
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: almost feels superhuman, like he has no doubt that his
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: two girls are going to make it.
• 13:10
  Speaker 2: Okay, that makes sense to me because I know that
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: I have a real sense of belief in myself and
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: my abilities as a performer and an entertainer, being able
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: to entertain people. It's probably because growing up I had
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: a King Richard in my life. It was Queen Martha,
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: who's my mom. And you know, my mom thinks that
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: I am just the funniest and most talented person who
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: has ever walked this earth. My mom thinks the sun
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: comes up when I wake up in the morning and
• 13:32
  Speaker 2: it goes down when I go to sleep at night.
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: And having a parent or just having someone in your
• 13:37
  Speaker 2: life that you really respect and love believing you so
• 13:40
  Speaker 2: fiercely has a really positive impact on someone's ability to
• 13:44
  Speaker 2: be able to perform well.
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: In my opinion, Yeah, I agree with you. There's also
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: it seems like an element to me that when the
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: world outside is mainstream or telling you no, the type
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: of belief that you have to have in yourself is
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: so great that I think it propels you forward if
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: you're able to get there.
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think so. I mean there is a dangerous
• 14:09
  Speaker 2: side to that. Succeeding out of spite is a is
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: a tricky line because then your existence is based on
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: other people's perceptions of you, which I think can be
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: kind of a weird place to navigate. So I try
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: not to exist out of spite. Instead, I would like
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: to have my art and my performance and my online
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: presence be out of inspiration.
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: That's a really great distinction.
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because I'm very I'm a very spiteful person. I am.
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: That's the truth about me.
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: I'm very spiteful, are you?
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: I'm very vindictive. I'm very vengeful and I'm very spiteful.
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: So it's like, oh, I pray for whoever dates you.
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: It's like constant me trying to, you know, battle against
• 14:54
  Speaker 2: my urge to always want to be right. And like
• 14:58
  Speaker 2: my friends make a joke about something I say. Years ago,
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: we were gonna do a pie baking contest for our
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: friends giving, and then one of my friends like, you
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: can't bake pies? And I said I could learn to
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: bake a pie, and they were like, how what makes
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: you think you could learn a big pie like by Thanksgiving?
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: So then I was like so obsessed, and they always
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: laugh at this quote. I said, oh, when you show
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: for Thanksgiving, there will be a fleet of pies here
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: waiting for you. And I ended up spending my time
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: making I made like two pecan pies, and I was
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: trying to perfect this pecan pie so I could win
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: this competition. I had never baked a pie in my
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: life then, you know, before this day. But I was
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: like spending all this time perfecting this pie so just
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: so I could beat them. I didn't win. My friend
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: Matteo Lane actually won the pie contest with a key
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: line pie. But my pecan pie did really well for itself,
• 15:47
  Speaker 2: which I'm very very proud of.
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: Are we vengeful against Mateo to this day?
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: No, no, no, Mateotayo. I'm now Mateo is a superior
• 15:55
  Speaker 2: cook and he comes from a family of cooks, and
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: I do too, but I just never took to the cooking.
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: If it's not noodles or oatmeal, I legitimately probably cook
• 16:04
  Speaker 2: three times a year. So I was proud of myself
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: for achieving what I did. And I want everyone to
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: know that I made handmade crust. My crust was handmade.
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: That is that is very important. Everyone knows that it
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: was not story about. It was completely handmade pie.
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: I read this quote you said in Drag I was
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: celebrated for all the things I was told were not
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: good about me.
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: Can you expand on that?
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: So you know I was especially being an actor in
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: trying to make it on Broadway or in film and
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: in acting school. I'm saying acting school like I went
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: to presigious school. I went to Columbus State University and
• 16:40
  Speaker 2: Columbus Georgia. It was not prestigious. It was a it
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: was a nursing school and a teaching school. With that
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: happened to have a theater program, and also growing up
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: and living in society, you're told that if you're gay
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: and feminine and black and big and dark skin and lanky.
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: At the time, I was very scinny and lanky. Those
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: are the days that these things aren't good. You'll be
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: a leading man, You'll never be able to you know,
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: you'll always be the goofy sidekick. I mean, I had
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: to excel despite all of that. But what I've noticed
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: with the drag was all that stuff it was to
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: my benefit, not my detriment. That was crazy. I couldn't
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: believe that, Like being as black as I am was great,
• 17:17
  Speaker 2: Being as femine as I am was wonderful. Being way
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: too loud was fierce, Like I didn't have to be
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: this like in drag when you're like, oh like loud
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: or umbunctionus, you're not the sidekick. You're the main character,
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: you know what I mean. It's the difference between being
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: Oloff and else and Elsa, you know what I mean.
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: In the drag world, Olof is the main character, you know,
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: and the and the drag World Donkey from Shrek is
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: the main character. And I've noticed with my friends too,
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: you know, my friends who felt like they couldn't be
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: considered beautiful because they were fat, or because they were
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: differently able or whatever. In drag, that's so celebrated. It
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: is just truly celebrated. That's why I encourage everyone to
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: watch We're Here, especially the Selma and Become Colorado episode
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: and some I'm working with, this really lovely one my
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: name Aquila, who's over the trans experience in living in Selm,
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: Alabama at the time, and how she just gets to
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: be wonderful not in spite of her transidentity, but because
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: of that. And the same with Dustin Van Dyke from
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: Come From Colorado. You know, he's differently abled, he's in
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: a wheelchair, he has quadriplegic spastic multiple sclerosis, and it's
• 18:21
  Speaker 2: a part of what makes him so wonderful and so beautiful.
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: I think when people think of drag, they think of
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: lipstick and lashes and foundation, and they also think of
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: joy and self confidence and self expression. And so to
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: hear that you were able to bring that out through
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: this art form is I think encouraging.
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I well, thank you, And I really encourage
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: anyone out there listening to this to get a chance
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: to go down. If you've never been to a drag show,
• 18:54
  Speaker 2: go down and check one out. The love around the
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: drag community, and I mean the real drag community, not
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: this online drag community. They're real. There is a huge difference,
• 19:05
  Speaker 2: and I found that out after getting on a Repulse
• 19:07
  Speaker 2: drag race, because when you're in Repose drag race, you're
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: thrust into the world of internet drag. And when I
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: was in New York City for those seven years before
• 19:14
  Speaker 2: drag Race, I was part of the most uplifting community
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: I had ever ever set foot in. And I mean
• 19:20
  Speaker 2: a place where truly everyone's welcome. I mean truly there
• 19:23
  Speaker 2: is to get turned away in the night life community.
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: You have to be a fucking monster, you know what
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: I mean, because in the nightlight, we will give you
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: a thousand tries to get it right, over and over
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: and over again. And there's so much grace and so
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: much space and so much room to grow. Like it
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: is the night life community is specifically in New York.
• 19:44
  Speaker 2: I can't speak about the place, but in New York
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: City is truly the most accepting place I've ever been.
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: It's the only place I've ever seen where clergy members
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: and sex workers and teachers and performance artists. You know,
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: tax attorneys are all breaking bread in the same space
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: having fun. There's nowhere else in the world I've ever
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: seen that.
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: When I was nine and my brother was seven, we
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: were my parents took us to San Francisco and took
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: us to a drag bar and they were so nice
• 20:15
  Speaker 1: to us. They gave us. They went in the back
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: and gave us jewelry that they like that was theirs,
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: and my brother and I held on to it for years,
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: Like I don't even think it was like crappy plastic jewelry,
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: but it meant so much to us, Like I think
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: I only threw it out when I went to college.
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: It is such a loving community. I felt that as
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: a like as a viewer.
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: You know, yeah, and you know if you go to
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: drag Con. These drag drag Con is that is the
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: world's largest drag conference that happened in London, New York
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: and LA And when you're there in real life, you'll
• 20:48
  Speaker 2: see the love.
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: It's real for people who are not wanting to maybe
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: like step into the drag world themselves as a performer,
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: but want to tap into the authenticity and magic that
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: I think drag brings. Do you have any recommendations, Well,
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: I would say it's not exclusive to drag, you know
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: what I mean.
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: Confidence is not exclusive to drag queens and drag performers.
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: It's actually available to everyone. And I know that this
• 21:19
  Speaker 2: is just the way that I One of the ways
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: that I have been able to tap into my confidence
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: and my ability to connect with others is through the
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: art of drag. But you can find that confidence in
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: playing chess with your friends. You can find it in
• 21:32
  Speaker 2: playing video games. You can find it in visual art.
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: You can find it in singing, you can find it
• 21:37
  Speaker 2: in teaching. You can find it, and there are so
• 21:39
  Speaker 2: many ways to be able to What makes drag remarks
• 21:43
  Speaker 2: You're building up your outside to reflect how you feel
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: the inside. You know what I mean. And sometimes it's
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: because you feel like a clown. Sometimes you feel like
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: a queen. Sometimes you feel like a diva. Sometimes you
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: feel angry and you get to manifest that on your
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: vessel and being out an outward reflection of majesty.
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: Well said, do you have any secrets to confidence? I
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: think it's a it's an ever lasting journey for people
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: and with ebbs and flows. But when you don't feel
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: like the best Bob?
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: What do you do?
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: What do you tap into?
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: What does the secret is that I'm I mean, I'm
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: not what one hundred percent confident? I mean that's but
• 22:23
  Speaker 2: I also don't make it a secret. You know, this
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: idea that I like, I'm always feeling completely confident is
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: not true. And I think that I allow myself to
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: feel that without beating myself up for it's okay, and
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: I feel one hundred percent every day, that is that
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: is okay. You don't have to feel one hundred percent
• 22:44
  Speaker 2: every single day.
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: What do you think people get wrong about drag?
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: I mean, I think that a lot of people think
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: that what they see on TV is the truest reflection
• 22:54
  Speaker 2: of drag. And while Repaul's Drag Race and Dragula and
• 23:00
  Speaker 2: or here are a reflection of drag, it's just a
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: reflection of one of a few specific types of drag.
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: But it's actually a much more inclusive r form than
• 23:08
  Speaker 2: I think TV would lend you to believe. Yeah, there's
• 23:11
  Speaker 2: also an idea that drag is really is I would
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: say this too. This is important to note because you
• 23:17
  Speaker 2: don't see this on TV. Drag is not Disney. And
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: then y'all need to know this drag is not Disney
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: Drag happens primarily in nightclubs and bars, usually after eleven
• 23:32
  Speaker 2: o'clock at night, so it is not exclusively but mostly
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: adult entertainment. That's another just random side of, you know,
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: effect of having television drag. So like people go to
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: my shows and I'm a stand with a comedian and
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: and I do comedy for adults. I think people think
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: that I'm gonna be you know, coming to my show
• 23:52
  Speaker 2: is not If you go to my stand up show,
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: it's not going to be an episode of We're Here.
• 23:56
  Speaker 2: It's not going to be crying and hugging. It's going
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: to be you know, comedy for adults.
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I know you described the drag community as like
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: a sorority and really loving. What do you think the
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: best part of the community is and what's one thing
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: that you would like to see change.
• 24:14
  Speaker 2: I think the best part is how truly accepting the
• 24:16
  Speaker 2: real life drag community is. That's my favorite part of
• 24:20
  Speaker 2: and how uplifting it is, and especially in New York City.
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: How in New York City, we'll just we'll just tell
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: you how great you are for what you do well.
• 24:27
  Speaker 2: And also encourage you to be better at what you're
• 24:29
  Speaker 2: not great at without tearing you down. You know, I wish,
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: I wish the online drag community was was more reflective
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: of what it's like to be actually be a part
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: of the drag community. I really wish that was possible.
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: So when you say online drag community, like because I've interviewed,
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: Like I did a morning show in Chicago and there
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: were a few pretty well known drag queens there and
• 24:49
  Speaker 1: they came on the show and I started following.
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: Once I probably know them with a Shako and kim
• 24:53
  Speaker 2: Chi and yeah and the Vixen.
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: And all three. Yeah, that was exactly those were the
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: three I interviewed, but I follow them online and that's
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: that was kind of my foray into the online I
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: didn't know that there was sort of a difference. Can
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: you elaborate, like what is the difference? So?
• 25:11
  Speaker 2: Okay, So the rupose drag Race fandom is very, very loyal, dedicated,
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: and vapid.
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: Rupolse drag Race subreddit is the biggest television based subreddit
• 25:22
  Speaker 2: on Reddit. It is, which is crazy because Rupol's drag
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: Race isn't even close to having the largest viewership. It
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: surpassed Game of Thrones, which lets you know how I mean.
• 25:33
  Speaker 2: Drag reupolse. Drag race is a is a phenomenon of
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: a television show. It is the It's one of the
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: only shows that is getting more and more popular by
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: his fourteenth season. You don't really see that very often ever,
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: Paul now has a record for winning the same Immy
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: the most times in a row. That kind of stuff,
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: you know what I mean. So the fan base gets
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: really obsessive and possessive over certain queens and people in spaces,
• 25:57
  Speaker 2: and then it turns into toxicity. An example is, you know,
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: years ago a drag queen named mena bunny in a
• 26:02
  Speaker 2: brown sent home a drag Queenie and Valentina and both
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: very popular drag queens, and when when Nina sit her home,
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: she just got a lot of death threats and like
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: really racist things being said about her. And the fan
• 26:14
  Speaker 2: base thought they were standing up for Valentina by being
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: racist and mean toward Nina Bunny and a Brown And
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: I think they're just in such a haze they can't
• 26:23
  Speaker 2: see pass why that's problematic. Yeah, but then but then
• 26:27
  Speaker 2: they do stuff like if you are one of us
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: from that show, you go online and promote your your
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: sales and then within you know minutes, your show is
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: completely sold out. So that's part of like the positives
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: that they're so they're so supportive, but on the other side,
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: like they get really aggressive and mean and not everyone
• 26:46
  Speaker 2: it's not the whole fan base, just to be clear,
• 26:48
  Speaker 2: it's probably a very vocal minority, but they're you know,
• 26:51
  Speaker 2: when you were at a show, if everyone's clapping, but
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: one person's booing, that boo is louder than any applause
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: in the room.
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: It's the same online, right, one hundred comments and one
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: mean one. Is there a hierarchy like if you've been
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: on RuPaul's drag race, are you seen as sort of
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: like the queen of queens?
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: What depends on who the queen is. I mean, there
• 27:13
  Speaker 2: are queens who have been able to really excel at
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: internet drag despite having never been on Repel's drag race.
• 27:22
  Speaker 2: Queens like Alexis Stone, Jackie beat Sherry Vine. You know,
• 27:28
  Speaker 2: there's tons and tons of queens who who haven't been
• 27:30
  Speaker 2: on drag race, Peaches Christ and then but then also
• 27:33
  Speaker 2: queens who have been on drag race and maybe for
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: whatever reason, weren't able to optimize their screen time. And
• 27:41
  Speaker 2: of course there's the queens who win drag race, the
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: queens who are the fan favorites, the queen who produces
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: the show. So yeah, I would say there is a there.
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: I would be lying if I said there without a
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: social hierarchy in terms of drag and I'm very high
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: on that hierarchy.
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: Of course, that's why you're on Pretty Smart. What is
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: your most treasured item in your drag closet?
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: Oh, my crown anceptor hands down, hand I don't even
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: think about that. It is my crown anceptor. Easily.
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: If I'm in New York, which like drag bar? Or
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: where should I go? What's the best one?
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: I'm going to tay you to go to so hard
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: to pick one. If I have to pick one, I'm
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: going to say.
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: Industry, okay, And then how about in La.
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: In Los Angeles, I'm going to take you to go
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: to Mickey's.
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: So can we talk? We're here on HBO course, of course.
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: So for people who don't know, you travel to small
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: cities and towns across America and you transform locals into
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: fabulous drag queens.
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: Yes, we do.
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: What about making the show made you the most proud.
• 28:45
  Speaker 2: The Selma episode is the is my proudest television moment ever.
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: What we did in some Alabama working with Tequila Blue
• 28:52
  Speaker 2: is legit one of my proudest moments of television I've
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: ever been a part of. And getting a chance to
• 28:59
  Speaker 2: So what we do is we really I mean, yes,
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: we go into town to make people directly, but what
• 29:03
  Speaker 2: we really do on the show is we really are
• 29:04
  Speaker 2: amplifying the voices of queer people in small towns in America.
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: That's really what we're doing.
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: What about that episode touched you? Like? Why? Because I've
• 29:14
  Speaker 1: cried in several of those episodes, so they're very moving.
• 29:17
  Speaker 2: Why that one, Well, we get a chance to talk
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: about the intersectionality of what it means to be black
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: queer and trands and living in a small town. And
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: we also get to talk to some of the foot
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: soldiers who were actually on the Edmond Pett's Bridge on
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: Bloody Sunday. And you know, for a long time I
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: was afraid, not afraid, but like, oh yeah, afraid afraid
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: of being judged by elder black people, just feeling like
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: they wouldn't like me. And then I got a chance
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: to be really embraced by these three absolutely lovely women
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: who were just as loving and accepting as a person
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: can be. And I also felt deeply indebted to these
• 29:53
  Speaker 2: women for their for their activism.
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: Why didn't you think that people would like you?
• 29:59
  Speaker 2: Well, being a black queer person, sometimes you get throughout
• 30:02
  Speaker 2: your life you have experiences with demographics of people, in
• 30:08
  Speaker 2: this case, older, older Southern Black people where you feel
• 30:12
  Speaker 2: not loved by them and more than not loved, but
• 30:14
  Speaker 2: condemned by them. So it was it was just trauma.
• 30:19
  Speaker 2: It was just it was just past trauma. Yeah.
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: Do you feel like the tide has has turned a
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: bit with that?
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: Well, in that room, it did, that's for sure, you know.
• 30:27
  Speaker 2: And I don't want to spek on a tournament because
• 30:29
  Speaker 2: I'm in a really specific place. I am a gay
• 30:31
  Speaker 2: celebrity who has very curated interactions, you know what I mean.
• 30:36
  Speaker 2: So for me to be sitting there with three people
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: who have been vetted with cameras pointed at them, it
• 30:42
  Speaker 2: might be a different experience than just a random gay
• 30:44
  Speaker 2: person walking around some Alabama.
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: Very true. Would you do an episode in your hometown?
• 30:50
  Speaker 2: Okay, so I've been watching episode of a queer Eye
• 30:53
  Speaker 2: where they went to June at the Vanessa's high school,
• 30:55
  Speaker 2: and I remember my first thought was I would never
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: go to my my high school because I feel like
• 31:04
  Speaker 2: Jonathan VanNess. They were like so they were like, I
• 31:07
  Speaker 2: just let's just say Johnathan VanNess did not go to
• 31:10
  Speaker 2: school in the suburbs of Atlanta. Jonathan VanNess didn't go
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: Tomorrow High School in Clayton County, you know what I mean.
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: I don't know that I would be as warmly received
• 31:19
  Speaker 2: at my but I probably would be. But it's also
• 31:21
  Speaker 2: that trauma in fear of being like I remember what
• 31:24
  Speaker 2: it was like to be I wasn't even out in
• 31:26
  Speaker 2: high school. I was clearly gay, but I wasn't out.
• 31:27
  Speaker 2: We had one actually gay guy at my high school
• 31:29
  Speaker 2: who was out, like out out, and it was not
• 31:32
  Speaker 2: easy for him. And I remember watching this episode of
• 31:35
  Speaker 2: with Vants and I was like, Wow, it really seems
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: like he just had a really sweet time in high
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: school being like loudp like and gay, and that was
• 31:43
  Speaker 2: not my experience. I feel like if I went back,
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: it just be like a whole trauma healing episode in
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: bad school.
• 31:52
  Speaker 1: I wonder if you should do it.
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: Honestly, maybe I don't even know if all those teachers
• 31:57
  Speaker 2: are still there. I graduate high Swowow thousand and four
• 31:59
  Speaker 2: was seventeen years ago.
• 32:02
  Speaker 1: All right, I do a little rapid fire. Okay, what's
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: a performance? You'll never forget my.
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: Hair performance in cell My, Alabama, where my niece performed
• 32:12
  Speaker 2: with me. It was it was my first time of
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: performing with someone in my.
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: Family's really cute. What's your favorite tattoo.
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: On my body? I have a tattoo right here that
• 32:22
  Speaker 2: says it's okay to make mistakes, and it's a really
• 32:24
  Speaker 2: bad tattoo. And the joke was that I used the
• 32:27
  Speaker 2: wrong too, But then the kind of the point that
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: I've been a's just a horrible tattoo and it is
• 32:32
  Speaker 2: a mistake, but it's okay.
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: It's okay. As the kids say, litten, fig what does
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: that mean? Literally and figuratively? What would younger you not
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: believe about your life today?
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: I think younger me would believe it all. I think
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: youngerman would be like, this makes sense, this makes sense.
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: I've always to be honest, I've always had an ego,
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: and I always thought that was a big deal. So
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: younger me would be like, yeah, this all makes sense.
• 32:54
  Speaker 2: Why wouldn't thank your mom, wouldn't. Yeah, why wouldn't you
• 32:59
  Speaker 2: be a world miss radqueen?
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: Do you think that you that you require anybody requires
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: a little bit of that ego to follow their dreams.
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: It certainly helps. I'll tell you that it certainly helps.
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: I do think the younger you would probably shocked at
• 33:12
  Speaker 2: how open I am about my sexuality these days. There
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: was a point where I was really like exclusive, like
• 33:17
  Speaker 2: it has to I'm gay, it has to be gay,
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: blah blah blah. I got older, I started realizing that
• 33:21
  Speaker 2: sexuality really is a spectrum, not just for straight people,
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: but for poor people too.
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, one is the last time you've felt rejected.
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: Probably don't grinder like a few days ago.
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: I'm sorry for that, man. Okay, something about RuPaul that
• 33:40
  Speaker 1: would surprise us.
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: Repol is really funny and very quick off the cup,
• 33:43
  Speaker 2: like off the top of her head. She's really really funny,
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: And almost every single time I see RuPaul, I laugh
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: genuinely laugh.
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: So because I mean, I think she's funny. I don't
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: know if I've seen her be hilarious. I do know
• 33:57
  Speaker 1: that I think that they're like, she's in the top
• 34:01
  Speaker 1: five people that I've learned from I think every interview
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: I see I take away big nuggets.
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, like even like even when I like, I've run
• 34:09
  Speaker 2: into Repaul randomly twice once the airport was the Broadway
• 34:13
  Speaker 2: show and I remember being like, I left like laughing,
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: like that was funny. That was a funny little interactions
• 34:19
  Speaker 2: so short and I laughed.
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: That's important. Humor is really important. Yeah, Okay, this is
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: maybe the most important question I've asked you all hours.
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: As pretty you know how beautiful l Paul is on TV?
• 34:31
  Speaker 2: That really is how beautiful she is in person, really truly, truly,
• 34:35
  Speaker 2: and I've been I've been this close to the to
• 34:38
  Speaker 2: the beast.
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: All right, most important question all hour? What is your
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: best makeup tip?
• 34:46
  Speaker 2: I'm good, Okay, So a friend taught me this tip
• 34:49
  Speaker 2: a while back. Now, if you I feel like I
• 34:51
  Speaker 2: have to, like show you your eyebrow. When you're drawing
• 34:55
  Speaker 2: on your eyebrows, the the tip that is closest to
• 34:59
  Speaker 2: your nose should be either rounded or it should be
• 35:04
  Speaker 2: parallel with the other tip. But you don't want it
• 35:07
  Speaker 2: facing down and you don't want it facing up. Yeah,
• 35:10
  Speaker 2: that is one tip that really changed my drag. I
• 35:14
  Speaker 2: used to draw my eyebrows facing down. Then a friend
• 35:16
  Speaker 2: of mine name as Raya, was like, girl, what are
• 35:18
  Speaker 2: you doing? It should be either parallel with the other
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: eyebrow or your tip should be rounded in ombre like
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: faded out. And that will if you can get your
• 35:26
  Speaker 2: eyebrows together, that like eighty percent of your eye makeup.
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: Looking good is having nice eyebrows.
• 35:33
  Speaker 1: It's actually true because it could totally lift your face.
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, Do you do the same lip color every
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: time or do you switch it up? Now?
• 35:38
  Speaker 2: I switched it up. I switch it up, But mostly
• 35:40
  Speaker 2: I use Velvet Teddy by mac An American Doll by
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: lap Class by Anasasia Beverly Hill. That's my favorite combination.
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: What should be required reading for every human being?
• 35:50
  Speaker 2: The Color Purple. Everyone should read The Color Purple, Alse Walker. Everyone.
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: It's the best book ever written. It's better than the Bible.
• 35:58
  Speaker 2: It's the best book ever written.
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: I just saw a great interview with her. Ari Melber
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: had her on on MSNBC and Kendrick Lamar used some
• 36:07
  Speaker 1: of Alice Walker's words in his song and he played
• 36:11
  Speaker 1: the Kendrick song for her and got her reaction.
• 36:13
  Speaker 2: It was it was moving, and she does she love it?
• 36:17
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 36:17
  Speaker 1: I liked that she was unfazed because she was like,
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: that's great that he used my words. It resonated with him,
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: Like she.
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: Did feel like a Pulitzerprise winner at this point. Probably
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: she's like, you know, I'm good like King's Lomar. This
• 36:31
  Speaker 2: is nice, but it's not the ultimate. I'm Alice Walker. Yeah,
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: Steven Spielberg and Wi Pi Goldberg worked on my so
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: I'm good.
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: That's really what it was. But it was she she
• 36:40
  Speaker 1: was like respectful and appreciative, but she was like, I'm
• 36:43
  Speaker 1: Alice Walker. I have a card deck of fifty two questions,
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: so each interview we pick one at random. Tell me
• 36:51
  Speaker 1: when to stop and stop? Okay, what is your superpower?
• 36:58
  Speaker 2: If I had a superpower, it would be minding control.
• 37:01
  Speaker 2: I am very sneaky and I can be very manipulative,
• 37:04
  Speaker 2: so like controlling people's minds would definitely be my superpower
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: without a doubt.
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: And this is the last question that I ask everybody,
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: What is the smartest decision you've ever made? For me?
• 37:17
  Speaker 2: The smartest designment was the day I chose, like actively
• 37:20
  Speaker 2: chose to stop being a people pleaser. I remember I
• 37:23
  Speaker 2: was like, I gotta I used to be a huge
• 37:26
  Speaker 2: people pleased, Like making people happy was like it is
• 37:29
  Speaker 2: the only way I found my happiness for a really
• 37:31
  Speaker 2: long time. And then one day I realized that I
• 37:34
  Speaker 2: could just be myself. And then ironically I started pleasing
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: a lot more people because I was being authentic with myself.
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: I have to tell you, without being in the drag community,
• 37:46
  Speaker 1: just an admirer, that is the lesson that I've taken
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: from the shows and the queens is that that's the superpower.
• 37:54
  Speaker 1: That's what you have to tap into.
• 37:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and it really it changed. It's just everything. And
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: when I started, when I started making my existence about
• 38:02
  Speaker 2: me and that about other people, I was like, holy smokes,
• 38:05
  Speaker 2: this actually makes it and you can also help a
• 38:07
  Speaker 2: lot more people.
• 38:08
  Speaker 1: How'd you shift it?
• 38:09
  Speaker 2: What did you do? I think it was living in
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: New York City. It was like just living in New
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: York City and like the difference between that, like Georgia
• 38:16
  Speaker 2: and New York City. New Yorkers will teach you after
• 38:18
  Speaker 2: a long time, they're just like you. It did it
• 38:21
  Speaker 2: Like this whole performance you're doing trying to make people
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: happy is only it's not benefiting me. And when I
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: realized that New Yorkers aren't mean they're just mining their
• 38:33
  Speaker 2: own business. That was I think that might have been
• 38:36
  Speaker 2: actually a big part of the shift living in New
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: York City for me.
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: I think I have to move to New York just
• 38:41
  Speaker 1: for like a year or two together to get that together.
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: It probably took us solid seven years for me. I
• 38:48
  Speaker 2: lived there for twelve years altogether.
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: Don't tell me that, Bob, I don't have that kind
• 38:52
  Speaker 1: of time. I really appreciate your time. You're so wonderful, No.
• 38:57
  Speaker 2: My pleasure, Thank you so much. And this is against it.
• 39:27
  Speaker 1: All right, Today is a good day. To have a
• 39:29
  Speaker 1: good day. I'll see you next week.