Latest / Skin Anarchy / Ada Polla, CEO of Alchimie Forever Skincare

Transcript

Ada Polla, CEO of Alchimie Forever Skincare · Skin Anarchy

• 0:00
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• 0:54
  SPEAKER_02: I'm in love with her line.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_02: It is definitely one of the products she makes is actually one of my all-time favorite products.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm super excited to introduce you guys to Ada Pola, who is the founder of Ultra Me Forever.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome to the show, Ada.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_02: I'm so excited you're here.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much for having me.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, it's my honor, and I would love to get started because I I know that you have um, you know, a wonderful journey that I'm sure you, you know, we would love to hear.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_02: And I would love to get started by you telling us about how you got started in the skincare industry and how the brand really came to be.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, thank you.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_01: You you said I was the founder of Al Shami Forever, which I love to think I am, but I must give credit where credit is due.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_01: My father, uh Dr.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_01: Luigi Pola, actually started the line.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_01: I only took what he created and and um maybe commercialized it or made it more available.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_01: But it really all starts with him.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_01: He is um the leading dermatologist in Switzerland.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_01: He has been practicing for about 30 years.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_01: And he made his name in the world of dermatology by being the first physician to bring laser technology to Europe.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_01: So he went to medical school in Switzerland and then he did his postdoctoral fellowship at Mass General Hospital in Boston, Massachusetts, where he worked in the Wellman Labs, which is where this was in the mid-80s, and this is where lasers for use in dermatology really were created, were invented.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_01: So he was, you know, at the right place at the right time, brought that technology back to Europe, uh, to Switzerland when he finished his postdoctoral fellowship, opened his own dermatology practice, and that's really, you know, how how it all started.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_01: Um, the mask that you mentioned, Arcantic Brightening Moisture Mask, is actually the first product that we ever created.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_01: And the whole reason we have a skincare brand.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_01: Um, do you want to should I keep on going?
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I want you to keep telling us because that is, you know, for everyone listening, that is the product that is a game-changing product.
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I use I use that mask like I think more than any time I've ever used a mask.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_02: It's so beautiful, it works, and it's like this instant effect, you know, like the brightening and the it's just been lovely for my skin.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_02: So I would love for you to tell us all about that.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_01: Well, thank you.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_01: So, as I mentioned, my father went back and opened his soloderm practice.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, now we think of lasers and we think of tattoo removal, wrinkle removal, hair removal, all those very cosmetic related things.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_01: But the first application of lasers in dermatology was actually to treat infants and young children that were suffering from port wine stains and hemangiomas.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_01: And so these are big dark red birthmarks that are very um very, you know, that are appear on the face and that can become very uh debilitating and actually lead to diseases, not just cosmetic uh issues.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_01: And so my father was using these lasers to help these young kids that were often under, you know, the age of five with these birthmarks.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_01: And of course, the the first lasers, you know, were big and painful, and the treatment caused these kids to cry.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_01: It created inflammation in the skin, heat, pain, uh, extra redness.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_01: And so my father, being the big softie that he is, really wanted to find a product that would help heal and soothe these kids' skin post-laser, immediately post-procedure, so that they would stop crying in his office.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_01: And so he couldn't find the right product, you know, that that worked for him and for his patients.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_01: And so he asked a friend of his who uh owned and still owns a compounding pharmacy not far from where his office uh is located.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_01: And he said, you know, can you make me a couple jars of this product?
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_01: This is what I have in mind.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_01: These are the ingredients that I envisioned.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_01: I wanted to have it a slight cooling sensation so that it can help kind of take the heat out of the laser treatment.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and she did.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's how it all started.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_01: The the kids loved it.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_01: Um, the parents took, you know, the the those little prototypes home with them.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_01: Um, some of the moms even applied it on their faces to kind of show the child it was okay to put this strange product on their face and help with compliance.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_01: And then the next time that they went for their follow-up um appointments and follow-up treatments, they wanted two jars of the mask, one for the child and one for the mom, because she felt like her skin looked so glowing and beautiful, you know, after the mask application.
• 5:28
  SPEAKER_01: So that's so cool.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_01: All about crying children is what I always tell, what I always tell people.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_02: That is the coolest story, and I love that.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_02: And you know what?
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_02: It's like I I feel like every time true like innovation and something magical happens, it's from this this like need and you know, in like medical practice that comes out from you know what we are used to as like the big procedures and stuff.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_02: So this is really, really cool to me.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_02: I I love that you know, the story behind this is really just trying to help kids and it turned into this beautiful wow.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, what about the rest of the brand though?
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_02: Because I know, you know, every product is, you know, I've I've definitely heard nothing but great things about the brand.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_02: And that's you know, very well deserved, obviously.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_02: You know, how was that in terms of expanding the line and expanding the range?
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_02: How you know, did your dad just want to like keep going with um more products, or how did that come about?
• 6:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, thank you for asking.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_01: So um uh what happened, I'd say, for you know, the next decade or so is my father felt some other needs.
• 6:33
  SPEAKER_01: Little by little, um, the mask became this one product.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and for many years we only had that one product.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_01: It wasn't even called Al Shimmy Forever, it was just in a white jar with a little sticker on it.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_01: So there was no branding, no marketing.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_01: Um, the the but my dad liked this idea of creating a product that really filled a gap in what he saw was was the need, the skincare needs of his patients.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_01: And so, over I'd say the next decade or so, he created just a couple other products.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_01: Um, our second product we still have, and is still one of our top sellers, also, is our firming gel for neck and bust, um, because he felt like his patients were taking really good care of their faces.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_01: They were being diligent with um SPF, with antioxidant treatments, but they were not taking care of their neck, chest, decolleté, shoulders, and arms, which, you know, depending on where you live and the climate and the weather, get a lot of exposure to the sun and to UV.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_01: And often there was a discord or disharmony between what your skin was saying, your age was between your chest and your face.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so the you know, the the products kind of continued to develop quite, I'd say haphazardly, not at all with any systematic um or fo, you know, thought or focus groups or anything like that, just like a true organic uh family story of this dermatologist who who felt some some needs in the in the marketplace.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_01: And then things became a little bit more, I don't want to say official because that sounds that sounds bad, but let's say more um strategic when I got involved, and this happened when I was in business school at Georgetown Um McDonough School of Business in 2003 and 2004.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_01: And so, you know, the brand, while the stories I've been telling you are from the mid to late 80s and through the 90s, um, the brand as you know it now, with the brand name, with some sort of branding and packaging, with some type of semi-coherent product assortment, that really came to be in 2004.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I think at the time we maybe had six or seven products called Al Shemi Forever.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, since then we've been we've been launching new products.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_01: We do so very carefully and again very strategically, but we've grown to be uh to have 17 products um for you know for retail use.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_01: So we have a more normal assortment now that includes cleansers and eye creams and moisturizers and a scrub, um, a couple serums, as well as a few additional body products.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, no, you have a lot of wonderful products, and it's like, you know, it's not at all oversaturated in terms of like there's no redundancy, you know, in the line.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_02: And I really like that, you know, you the products you can tell by just you know browsing the website and looking through that everything has its purpose, everything has a place, um, you know, and it's designed for keeping you know the consumers in mind that you're serving.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_02: So I really actually very much appreciate that about your brand is that you know it's not redundant because you know, there are so many lines now.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, obviously I have you know the privilege of talking to so many brand owners and you know, and and it's wonderful, but we don't need eight cleansers, you know what I mean?
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_02: Like one line doesn't need to come out with like eight different cleansers, like we should have products that are multi-use, multi-functional, and I think that's exactly what um you know Ultra Me Forever is doing is that you have beautiful products.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, the mask that I was uh referring to, you can honestly have I I think I've put this mask up on my personal uh dermal unity account like 18 times.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_02: Like I'm obsessed, like every time I mask with it, I literally, and it's not because I'm trying to promote or anything, it's because I genuinely every time that I use the product feel like my skin is benefiting and it's getting the results I want like immediately.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm just I love the whole experience of it.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, that's my point is like when you shop for a product as a consumer, you should feel like this product is something I absolutely need because I know exactly how I'm gonna feel when I use it.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_02: And that's also where the self-care aspect, you know, ties in for consumerism, if you really think about it, you know?
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, for sure.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_01: And I love your comment about how you appreciate, you know, the the tightness of the line or how we don't have a million skews.
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_01: We get a lot of questions always about, you know, what's your newest product?
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_01: When are you launching a new product?
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_01: What's coming down the pipeline?
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_01: What's you know, what's the next thing you're gonna launch?
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_01: And we launch products maybe every two years, and only if we feel that we have a gap in our assortment and that we can contribute a product that is better than what's already on the market.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_01: And we are not, you know, our ambition is not to be a brand with a hundred SKUs.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um, like you said, we don't need 17 cleansers.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_01: Uh we we would like to address, we would like to offer a complete line in the sense that if you would like to use Al Shumi Forever products only for your skincare, you have what you need.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_01: Although we don't even say you must.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I mean, I I own a skincare brand and I still use products from other brands.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_01: I like to cocktail.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_01: I think that most consumers cocktail different brands.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I think different brands shine in different areas.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_01: And so we really try to make products that are exceptional and that fill a need, and we don't do newness for for newness's sake.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and you know, you mentioned self-care, and of course, taking care of your skin is part of self-care.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_01: We actually, one of our trademarked uh slogans is self-care through skincare.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_01: And so, of course, I encourage everybody always to use many skincare products because it really is like a timeout from you know a busy day that's spent for most of us taking care of other people, and it is your time to take care of yourself.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_01: But you also don't need to have 17 cleansers, 17 serums, three moisturizers, um, and what have you.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_01: So I I it's it's this fine line between spending time on yourself, taking care of all of your skincare concerns, but also not forcing consumers into spending thousands of dollars and hours in the bathroom.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, no, I really love that.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_02: And I, you know, I definitely as a consumer, um, I really appreciate that.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_02: You know, whenever I find a brand that's like that, and you know, I'm the same way.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_02: Obviously, you know, all of us we like to mix and match with different brands, and that's a beautiful thing.
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_02: That's wonderful, you know.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_02: I and not every brand can make the best of everything, or even if it they do, it might not be suitable for you.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_02: But I think that, you know, but I think that it's important that whatever you're picking from the brand, that product is something that's going to really make you happy on multiple levels.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_02: And that's why, you know, for me as a consumer, that's kind of like my bar that I set for myself that, you know, is this a is this a product that I'm gonna keep right next to me on my vanity?
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_02: And every night I have access to it.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_02: So it's like, and I can if I can say that about a brand, even if it's one product by them, then to me, that's a phenomenal line.
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_02: Because they've created something that I can really trust.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_02: And that's exactly how I feel about your brand.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_02: So um, you know, I I really, really commend you and and definitely commend your father for creating such a beautiful, you know, especially the mask.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_01: Beautiful.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_01: I love what you say about, you know, products that make you feel uh that give you happiness on multiple levels.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_01: And certainly the the, you know, our number one goal is to make your skin happy.
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_01: So to make a difference in your skin and and make your skin the best version of what it can be.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but certainly I also believe that, you know, to, and this again goes back to the self-self-care piece that taking care of your skin is a way to feel happier.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um, whether it's because you have taken a few minutes of downtime for yourself, whether it is because your skin looks better and so you feel more confident, and so you're acting kind of as the best version of yourself.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but certainly there there's a there's a happiness um impact or there's a happiness um option that's that's bigger than only skin.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, if you think of skin, and I take this very seriously and I think about this a lot, there's there are few things that are more intimate than skincare.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you're you're taking products that we create and applying them on your face and on your body.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_01: And this is a it's a very important, very intimate um um uh gesture or you know, process exactly.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_01: And we we think of that when we create products and make sure, and again, that kind of drives the standards that we, you know, that we hold ourselves to when we're creating product.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, I love that you said that because honestly, you know, it's it's very much true because you know, when I look at products, and this is really genuinely, I'm gonna be honest with you, Yada, it's it's it's why I created this podcast in some ways, because you know, I wanted to be able to look at products and feel like the people that are behind these products are kind of like, you know, they're there and I know about them and I know who they are, and I know that wherever this is coming from, this is coming from people that I believe in and I believe in them and their vision and what they're doing.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_02: And and that is, you know, it's part of it.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_02: You're right.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_02: You know, putting something on your face or your skin, this is the most intimate you can get when it comes to beauty products, you know, especially like with skincare.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_02: Because if you use something terrible and your skin looks terrible, you're gonna have this like feeling yeah, a bad day, but also a feeling towards the brand, the founders, the people who made you know created the product, the chemists, and that's that's a terrible thing.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, it's very, very important, it's very personal.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_02: So I love that you brought that up.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that, you know, as consumers, we really should think about that as who is behind these products?
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_02: Who do I believe in them?
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_02: Do I believe in their genuine nature?
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, like that kind of thing.
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, that's a great point on your part.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_02: I completely agree.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_02: I want to move on though, and I want to talk about, you know, right now, especially in the industry, the buzz is all about ingredients and formulations and all that, all that stuff.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_02: So, um, how has that been the journey of that for your brand in terms of you know, when your dad first created the mask and you know, um back then to now, in terms of like who you hired to formulate, and um have you changed that a lot at all?
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_02: Or is that something that's been tried and true for the brand throughout?
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, definitely.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_01: We have evolved our formulations uh since we started.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_01: The mask I think has gone through maybe three different key iterations.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_01: You know, back in the mid-80s, we used parabens, for example, because the the whole paraben controversy had not come to the surface and they were still believed to be the best and the safest preservatives for beauty products.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_01: Um obviously, the opinion, you know, whether you think of the scientific opinion or the consumer opinion, that shifted.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_01: And so we removed parabens from our formulations.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_01: We did this maybe I can't I can't think of the exact time, but it's it's been a while.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_01: But and that was definitely a first iteration of, you know, we position ourselves as clean and clinical.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_01: So that was definitely the start of that positioning is to re-look at our preservative systems.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then we started working with different labs.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we work with we work with different, we still work with uh three different labs.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um so we have labs that have different expertise in different areas, but definitely one of the labs that we work with has a special focus on clean formulations, um on using botanicals and natural ingredients.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_01: So that that has helped us evolve.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_01: Um and then, you know, more recently, I'd say over the last five years, we've removed some additional ingredients, including sulfates, um, ethoxiliated ingredients, pegs.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_01: Um, those are, I'd say, the main other categories of ingredients that that we've removed to to continue to um improve our formulations with the developing body of knowledge that um you know that that evolves on a, I don't know about a daily basis, but that evolves very regularly, which is how science works.
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_01: You have new experiments that come out, uh, new papers that are published, new ingredients that are developed.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_01: And so the the body of knowledge evolves.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_01: And we have worked very hard to not to you know poo-poo our past by any means, but to stay, we always say, you know, one of our values is being accountable to science.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_01: And so we work to remain accountable to science and to the most current science, I guess I should say.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so we've certainly evolved our formulations, and you know, it is, I mean, sometimes I feel like I want to pull my hair out because it is very, very difficult, and I'm sure you know this, to tweak a formula of an existing product and have the existing product remain the same.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_01: It's like you're making your grandmother's tomato sauce recipe with a completely different type of tomato than what she used, it is very hard to make that come out the same way.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_01: And that's for existing products where we've had to evolve our formulations.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_01: That is the closest thing that I can describe, the closest analogy that I can use to what we're trying to do.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_01: So um is it's for sure the right thing to do.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, but from a formulation uh perspective, from a uh chemistry perspective, it certainly is much more challenging than I think what the you know, the the consumer knows.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_01: And and it's not up, I mean, she sh why should she know?
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_01: She doesn't work, she just knows she wants good products that are free of certain ingredients that she doesn't want to see.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_01: And that's what she wants, and that's what we're trying to make.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and I think, you know, um, that's a very, very good point that you made about staying true to science.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_02: I absolutely love that.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_02: I think that that should be, you know, something that everyone realizes is that, you know, a good brand is always going to have that as one of their pillars, is that they're being, you know, scientifically forward.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_02: And I I really uh I appreciate that a lot as a consumer that you guys do that because, you know, yeah, the nurture is always changing.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I often have this conversation with um, you know, a lot of clin clinical colleagues and a lot of uh very, very uh amazing doctors, you know, that see patients day in and day out.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_02: And and we talk about, you know, we all talk about skincare and if the ingredients are really doing anything.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_02: And it's always this the, you know, I think the general consensus amongst everybody really becomes this idea that, you know, there's a lot of there's a lot of questions, you know, it's a very dermatology is a very gray area, you know, and if we and and the literature is always changing.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it is the responsibility of brands and you know, um, really everybody to keep up with that literature and to keep up with the science because you know, the PhDs already have enough on their hands, they're the ones churning out the you know, the information.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, it's a it's definitely uh it's definitely something that I think we should all look for in in the lines that we invest in.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_02: So I love that.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_02: Um I wanna um I wanna actually ask you though, because you know, the the line is actually very gentle, and I've noticed that because you know the mask, like I said, it's obviously my favorite product.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember one day specifically, I was uh I was using the mask and it was a very long day.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it was one of those days where you just you don't know what time it is, you know.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_02: Like the hours go by and I had put it on and I just kind of like fell asleep in it, and it was perfectly fine, you know, and it was like a I I I had it on for longer than I would normally have it on.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_02: It wasn't like, you know, hours or overnight, but it it I remember like waking up and I just being like, oh my gosh, I still have my mask on.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_02: And I was totally fine.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_02: My skin was wonderful.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_02: It was totally fine.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, one thing I want to ask you is how that's been in terms of creating products that are gentle, you know, and they are so friendly for the skin.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_02: Because, you know, I think that's very rare to have that.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, you know, I usually set a timer for every product that I use, you know, and obviously we should all be doing that.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_02: But um, I'm just saying that, you know, if something goes over time, you know, this is a product that I know is still is still safe for my skin.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_02: So I would love for you to comment on that.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_01: So um there's a few points I'd like to make.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_01: First, you know, this is true of the mask in particular, as it was the first product we developed and that it was developed specifically for post-procedure for children.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_01: It would, it, I mean, we we were we, my father was using this on kids that were from six months to you know five, six, seven years of age.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_01: And he was using this product on their skin after having traumatized their skin by using a laser, a pulse eye laser on it.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_01: So their skin was already inflamed, it was red, it was hot, it was painful.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so that product specifically has as its purpose to heal, reduce redness, quell inflammation, calm irritation.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and yes, it also gives you an amazing glow and you get some antioxidants, but it really is a calming, soothing product.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so so that is very specific to the origin story of the mask.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_01: Now, in the, you know, I wouldn't call us a post-procedure line today.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_01: We've certainly evolved from that heritage, but that remains our heritage.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_01: And from the very beginning, my father had an anti-inflammatory approach to aging.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, now I think everyone is much, much better versed in what that means.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_01: But if you think back to the early 90s, I mean it was all about acids, you know, glycolic acid.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm not saying these ingredients are bad, these are great ingredients, but it was all like uh obviously types of brands.
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_01: And again, I'm not saying anything negative about obhibie, but I'm sure you have in your mind that woman who's walking down the street, and you can see she is over-treating her skin so dramatically, it's like red angry skin.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_01: Um we we never took that route.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_01: And so as a result, some people, you know, we got the feedback over many years that we weren't like quote unquote effective enough.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_01: Although I absolutely do not believe that a gentle product is not effective, but we always took this anti-inflammatory approach to aging because inflammation is a pro-ager.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_01: Inflammation accelerates aging, whether it's on your skin or in your body, it just that is what inflammation does.
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_01: And so our brand as a whole has this inflammatory focus, and that's how we treat aging.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_01: I would say the one product within our brand that probably falls out of this concept is our advanced retinol serum, you know, which is made with 0.75% pure lab-made retinol.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_01: Retinol is by definition an ingredient that creates inflammation.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_01: That's how it works.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_01: So that falls a little bit outside of this general anti-inflammatory philosophy, but that has always been our philosophy.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that that's, you know, how the consumer will translate that into, oh, your products are gentle.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_01: And again, they are.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_01: They certainly will not create side effects, even if you're a sensitized, reactive, sensitive skin type.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but that doesn't mean that they don't work, they have an incredible effect, as you, you know, as you've experienced.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, no, absolutely.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_02: And I think your father was very much ahead of his time in terms of the you know, the medical uh insight that he had about what skincare and skin good skin needs, which is anti-inflammation products.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_02: Because let's be honest, you know, it it's exactly what you said.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not going to, you know, beat a dead horse.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah, exactly.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_02: You know, inflammation is a marker of stress.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_02: You know, that's exactly what it is.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_02: And so, you know, when your skin is red and you look like you are tomato, you know, like that's not normal.
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_02: No, yeah.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, I know, yeah, go ahead.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_02: Go ahead.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_01: No, sorry.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_01: I always tell people also, I'm like, look, your skin can't talk to you, it can't say, stop using this product, it's hurting me.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_01: But your skin talks to you by the way it looks.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_01: And so if if if a product, again with certain exceptions, but if a product is making you look like a tomato, unless you know for a fact, and this is under you know professional skincare supervision, that that's an anticipated and expected temporary side effect.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_01: Outside of that situation, then this is your skin trying to talk to you and you must listen.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_01: And I talk to so many people who are like, no, but you know, it's good, it means the product is working.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_01: And I always tell them, I'm like, look, is your skin does it feel good right now?
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_01: Like, do you feel comfortable in your skin?
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_01: Does your skin and they're like, no, it my skin hurts.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_01: And I say you can have efficacy without having skin that that hurts.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_01: And I think oftentimes we we forget, you know, to listen to ourselves and to listen to our skin.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_02: And I agree with you.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_02: Now, I have a question in terms of because I know this is always something consumers love asking now, which I kind of have a problem with because I don't think people understand what they're asking when they ask it, is about clinical trials.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_02: Um, have you guys run clinical trials?
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_02: And if so, how has that been for the brand and etc.?
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_01: Uh we we I don't use the word clinical trials.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_01: This to me implies much more, um a much bigger project than what what we've done.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_01: We have clinical studies on two of our products, and these are studies that are made uh in third-party labs.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_01: So it's you know, not under our control.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_01: We give products, we give the the expected the question that we're trying to answer, and it's a third-party independent lab that runs.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_01: So these, but it's not a clinical trial to me, you know, implies like something that you would do for a drug.
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_01: It is not to that extent.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_01: So we have clinical studies on two on two of our products.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_01: We also have numerous patch test studies, which are not um focused on results or or the effects of products, but focus on the fact that, you know, we can say our products are perfectly fine for sensitive or sensitized skin types, for example.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_01: So we have all of those, all of those tests, um, which again fall a little bit outside of clinical studies.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_01: But otherwise, you know, we're a we're a niche, family run, independently owned, family funded brand.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_01: Clinical studies are incredibly expensive to run.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_01: And we don't, we just frankly don't have the budget to to do that.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, we have taken more of a uh, I don't know what the right word is, but we've we've all of these products have been created and have been birthed, for lack of a better word, in my father's dermatology practice.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_01: And so all of these formulations have been tested on his patients over, you know, yeah, 20 plus years.
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_01: I don't I don't know that that officially qualifies as clinical studies, but there's certainly been hundreds, if not thousands, of patients that have tested these products before we put them out on the market.
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_02: Well, that is clinical data, you know.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_02: That's something that that's exactly why I prefaced my question the way I did, because you know, I think consumers don't understand that to have a clinical study done, you need IRB approval.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_02: You need to go through the actual, like it's like a governmental process in a lot of ways.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_02: It's usually done not for specific products, it's done for ingredients and agents and ingredients.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, exactly.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_02: And so if we want as a community, as a skinned year community, for everything to be run as clinical trials, then I would really urge all consumers and all doctors and everybody out there to start urging, you know, labs and you know, universities and academia run facilities to start running clinical trials on ingredients.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_02: You know, they're the ones that with the NIH funding, they're the ones that have, you know, all of this these resources available to them.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_02: And it would be lovely to create a database or a data bank where now brands can go and say that okay, clinical studies have been run on these ingredients, and so we can utilize them.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_02: That is, I think, the better approach when it comes to skincare in terms of asking for clinical data because you can't hold brands accountable to be running these extensive studies that, like you said, they're very, very expensive, and also they're not going to be able to do justice to them the way that they would want to, because there are just some simply there are restrictions in place that you know you can't do.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_02: No, for sure.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_01: And it really is, and you mentioned all of the paperwork and the regulatory approvals to run a true clinical trial or clinical study, and you know, this would, I mean, we would need to have like a clinical trial department in the company, and we don't have that, we don't have the expertise, we don't have the funds.
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so we we certainly rely, and this is again part of remaining accountable to science and remaining current and relevant.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_01: We certainly read all of, well, I shouldn't say all, but a lot of the industry literature, mostly the scientific literature, uh, you know, the Journal of American Academy of Dermatology or what have you, we're we're constantly um updating ourselves and reading other clinical studies performed by by, like you say, the PhDs, the labs, the scientists, um, and incorporating their knowledge into our formulations when when relevant.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but yes, that's so so it's it's it's more complic.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_01: It's more that it's more complicated than a yes or no answer, let's say.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely, absolutely.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_02: And I completely agree with you.
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_02: And I think this is definitely, you know, a message that I'm going to try to, you know, create another episode and try to really push this, you know, idea and this information because it's a lot of, you know, there's a lot of uh gray area and a lack of understanding on the end of the consumers when it comes to just clinical data and what really goes behind it.
• 32:36
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, you know, holding brands completely accountable and 100% it's their response.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_02: That's just nonsense.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it's nonsense.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_02: It doesn't make sense.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_02: Academically doesn't make sense, it scientifically doesn't make sense.
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, I agree with you.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that, you know, the fact that your dad formulated this specifically for his patients and it was used on patients, especially pediatric patients, is huge.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_02: That's a huge testament to the efficacy of the line and the product.
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, I really want everyone to really focus on that when you're looking at Ulshamie Forever because that's you know, you're not going to see a lot of data that's been generated on pediatric dermatological patients.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 33:15
  SPEAKER_02: That's a huge, huge uh, you know, feat in itself.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_02: So I I I I think that's a that's a wonderful thing that you guys have that a lot of brands don't have.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_02: Well, thank you for highlighting that.
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so I don't I just want to say, you know, say thank you so much for your time.
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_02: This has been a lovely interview, lovely conversation.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_02: I am a huge fan of the line.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_02: And, you know, I urge everyone out there, please go check them out if you have not already.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, it's you know, it's definitely something that I'm very passionate about when I find a brand that I really believe in.
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_02: I think um, you know, I want to do everything I can to spread the word.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_02: So this is definitely one of those lines.
• 33:51
  SPEAKER_02: And, you know, if you want a place to start for everyone listening, try the mask.
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_01: It's really great.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_01: So thank you so much, um, Ecta.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_01: I so appreciate you inviting me.
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I love your podcast and you have such amazing guests.
• 34:05
  SPEAKER_01: I feel very honored to be in such company.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_01: And I love your your you know, science forward, uh no BS approach to to beauty.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's definitely a message and uh that we share and that needs to be needs to be put out there more in the beauty universe.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_01: So thank you for everything that you're doing.
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_02: That means the world to me.
• 34:29
  SPEAKER_02: And you guys, I hope you enjoyed the episode.
• 34:31
  SPEAKER_02: Leave us some comments, uh, some questions, some rave reviews about the amazing line, and I will definitely pass it along to Ada's team.
• 34:39
  SPEAKER_02: And I, you know, I I can't rave enough about the line.
• 34:41
  SPEAKER_02: So thank you, and I will be back next time.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_02: Hey guys, so I hope you love that episode.
• 34:47
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• 34:52
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• 34:54
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• 34:58
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• 35:09
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• 35:24
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• 35:26
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• 35:30
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• 35:35
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• 35:40
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• 35:47
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• 35:52
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you.