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Plato's Republic Book 1: What is Justice? · Mahon McCann

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  SPEAKER_00: Book one of Plato's Republic is essentially negative.
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  SPEAKER_00: It tells us what justice is not.
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  SPEAKER_00: The structure of the first dialogue is in four parts.
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  SPEAKER_00: The first part is the opening.
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  SPEAKER_00: So we're going to go through each of these in order in this video.
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  SPEAKER_00: Part one, the opening.
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  SPEAKER_00: The very first line of Plato's Republic.
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  SPEAKER_00: Socrates goes down to the Piraeus.
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  SPEAKER_00: The reason Socrates goes down to the Piraeus is,
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  SPEAKER_00: first of all,
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  SPEAKER_00: literal,
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  SPEAKER_00: because the Piraeus is a port town.
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  SPEAKER_00: below Athens.
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  So you would have to walk from Athens in order to get there
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  about eight kilometers.
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  SPEAKER_00: But the second reason some thinkers argue,
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  SPEAKER_00: like DC Schindler,
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  is Plato's inviting us to think of this first book as taking
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  place in the world of appearances.
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  Socrates goes down to the Piraeus because it's like the
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  philosopher going down to the cave.
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  SPEAKER_00: This is a key theme in the Republic,
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  SPEAKER_00: the ascent and descent of the philosopher through the levels of being.
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  The philosopher ascends to the truth and descends to the world
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  of appearances.
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  SPEAKER_00: Socrates says that philosophy is an ascent to what is,
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  SPEAKER_00: or an upward journey from appearance to reality.
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  SPEAKER_00: When Socrates goes down to the Piraeus,
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  SPEAKER_00: he's actually going down into the cave,
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  SPEAKER_00: into the world of appearances,
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  SPEAKER_00: where truth and reality don't exist.
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  SPEAKER_00: It's a world of images, of facsimiles.
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  SPEAKER_00: And as we'll see with the different thinkers' definitions of justice,
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  SPEAKER_00: this holds up that they're definitions borrowed from poets,
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  SPEAKER_00: from tradition,
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  SPEAKER_00: or in the case of Thrasymachus,
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  that he doesn't believe that justice exists at all in the case
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  of a pure relativist.
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  This very first page of the Republic tells you what the book is
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  going to be about.
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  SPEAKER_00: Socrates and Glaucon,
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  SPEAKER_00: who is Plato's brother in real life,
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  SPEAKER_00: and so is Adamantius,
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  SPEAKER_00: who will become a main character later on in the dialogue,
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  SPEAKER_00: were down in Piraeus to see the festivities.
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  SPEAKER_00: The festivities were the introduction of a Thracian goddess, Bendis,
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  SPEAKER_00: goddess of a hunt like Artemis into the Greek panoply.
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  They've finished the festivities and they've prayed and they're
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  going to return to Athens.
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  SPEAKER_00: But their return is interrupted by a slave boy who works for Polymarcus.
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  SPEAKER_00: Polymarcus's name means war leader.
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  SPEAKER_00: He's essentially a young aristocrat,
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  SPEAKER_00: more wealthy and well-heeled than Socrates,
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  SPEAKER_00: but a lot is younger.
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  SPEAKER_00: The slave boy tells Socrates, Polymarcus orders you to wait.
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  Polymarcus catches up to them and tells Socrates,
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  do you see how many we are?
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  SPEAKER_00: You must prove stronger than we are or you will have to stay here.
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  Socrates says,
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  isn't there another option that I can persuade you to let us go?
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  Polymarcus says,
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  how can you persuade them if they won't listen to any arguments?
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  SPEAKER_00: This is key for the entire republic, really.
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  In the first page,
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  how can you reason with people if they won't listen to reason?
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  SPEAKER_00: This is the problem of the sophists for a lot of the Athenian democracy,
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  SPEAKER_00: was that they would no longer listen to reason.
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  SPEAKER_00: They didn't care about the truth.
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  SPEAKER_00: They just cared about influence and power and winning arguments.
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  SPEAKER_00: So here we see Socrates,
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  the guy who has the knowledge and wisdom is being ordered
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  around by Polymarcus,
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  SPEAKER_00: a guy who doesn't have knowledge or wisdom,
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  SPEAKER_00: but has a lot more power.
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  This is key to the dynamic between power and truth or power and
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  wisdom that takes
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  SPEAKER_00: place in the Republic.
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  SPEAKER_00: Part two, Cephalus.
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  Polymarcus gets his way and Socrates and Glaucon follow the
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  group of lads back to
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  SPEAKER_00: Polymarcus's house,
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  SPEAKER_00: or more accurately,
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  SPEAKER_00: the house of his father,
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  SPEAKER_00: Cephalus.
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  SPEAKER_00: When they come to the house, Cephalus is there.
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  SPEAKER_00: He's sitting in the center of the room on a cushion stool.
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  He's crowned with a wreath because he's just performed a
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  sacrifice in the court chart.
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  SPEAKER_00: He's the man of the house.
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  SPEAKER_00: He's a senior figure.
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  SPEAKER_00: He's even older than Socrates.
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  SPEAKER_00: And in Athens, that commands respect.
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  SPEAKER_00: Cephalus' name literally means old head.
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  So he's wealthy and old,
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  upper class,
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  and he represents the old tradition of Athens.
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  We'll see even in his definition of justice,
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  he gives the typical definition of justice.
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  SPEAKER_00: It's interesting how Socrates approaches him.
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  SPEAKER_00: Socrates says to him,
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  It's as if he's been released from a tyrannical master of his
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  younger eros,
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  SPEAKER_00: his sexual desires and his troublemaking.
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  SPEAKER_00: He was a bit of a passionate man in his youth, you could say.
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  SPEAKER_00: Now for him being old,
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  he's not troubled by a lot of the passions that were difficult
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  for him as a youth.
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  SPEAKER_00: Cephalus' response is very interesting to Socrates.
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  SPEAKER_00: He plays devil advocate with him and he says,
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  a lot of people would say the reason that you're able to bear
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  old age well is
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  SPEAKER_00: because you have a lot of money.
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  SPEAKER_00: It's not really got to do with character or anything.
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  It's because you have great substance and being rich is a real consolation.
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  SPEAKER_00: Cephalus objects to this.
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  He says that the decent man would not bear old age of poverty
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  very easily.
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  SPEAKER_00: Near would the one who is not a decent sort ever be content with himself,
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  SPEAKER_00: even if he were wealthy.
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  SPEAKER_00: Socrates asks him,
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  what is it that you suppose is the greatest good that you have
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  enjoyed from
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  SPEAKER_00: possessing great wealth?
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  The answer that he gives Socrates is essentially that he
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  believes the greatest
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  SPEAKER_00: advantage of wealth is to make sacrifices to atone for your injustice.
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  SPEAKER_00: This is a very old Athenian idea.
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  SPEAKER_00: You would see it in the Odyssey,
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  whereby they would make sacrifices of animals and different
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  kinds of valuable
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  SPEAKER_00: things in order to curry favor with the gods.
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  SPEAKER_00: It was
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  SPEAKER_00: Essentially, you could sack a city and kill a bunch of people.
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  But if you made the right sacrifices,
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  the gods would leave you alone and it would be cool.
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  Cephalus is basically saying the real advantage of having well
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  is to curry favor
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  SPEAKER_00: with gods for the bad things you've done in the past.
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  SPEAKER_00: For him, his lustful and passionate deeds as a young man.
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  And so this is his account of justice,
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  that justice is giving each what is owed to them.
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  Socrates objects to this definition of justice and slightly
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  rephrases it.
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  Shall we so simply assert that it is the truth and giving back
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  what a man has taken
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  SPEAKER_00: from another,
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  SPEAKER_00: or is to do these very things sometimes just and sometimes unjust?
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  Socrates provides a counter example of a friend who lends one a
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  weapon while he's sane,
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  and then the friend loses his mind and comes back and asks for
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  the weapon back
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  SPEAKER_00: while he's already insane.
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  SPEAKER_00: Would it be just then to give the insane guy a
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  SPEAKER_00: his weapon back if he's going to kill himself and other people.
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  SPEAKER_00: Cephalus relents and says, oh yeah, that's right.
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  SPEAKER_00: That is an exception to the definition of just as I get.
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  SPEAKER_00: But he doesn't really engage with Socrates.
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  SPEAKER_00: He immediately says, I'm out of here.
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  SPEAKER_00: I got to go make a few sacrifices.
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  SPEAKER_00: Polymarcus's name literally means war leader.
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  He's a young warlike youth of Athens and he inherits the
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  argument from his father,
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  SPEAKER_00: but pretty much immediately defers to the authority of tradition.
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  In this case,
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  the tradition of the poets,
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  one poet in particular called Simonides.
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  Socrates presses Polymarcus with the same counter argument that
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  he made to his father.
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  SPEAKER_00: And Polymarcus changes the definition of justice based on Simonides.
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  SPEAKER_00: Justice is benefiting your friends and harming your enemies.
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  SPEAKER_00: a very typical definition of justice for Athenian society.
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  SPEAKER_00: Socrates raises a counter argument to Polymarcus's definition.
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  SPEAKER_00: He says,
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  SPEAKER_00: with respect to disease and health,
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  SPEAKER_00: who is most able to do good to sick friends and bad to enemies?
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  SPEAKER_00: The answer is a doctor.
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  And with respect to the danger of the sea,
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  who has the power over those who are sailing?
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  SPEAKER_00: A pilot.
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  SPEAKER_00: What about the just man?
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  In what action with respect to what work is he most able to
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  help friends and harm enemies?
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  SPEAKER_00: And here,
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  SPEAKER_00: Polymarcus really shows his true stripes,
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  SPEAKER_00: which is that,
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  SPEAKER_00: in my opinion,
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  SPEAKER_00: it is in making war and being an ally in battle.
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  SPEAKER_00: Socrates points out, to men who are not sick, a doctor is useless.
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  Is this definition of justice valid in times of peace like it
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  is in times of war?
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  SPEAKER_00: Polymarcus gets a bit confused with this,
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  SPEAKER_00: and he says,
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  SPEAKER_00: in terms of contracts or in terms of business,
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  SPEAKER_00: this definition of justice is all right.
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  SPEAKER_00: Of course...
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  He's thinking in terms of war and now he's thinking in terms of business.
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  So he hasn't really managed to get out of these quite typical
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  frames for justice
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  SPEAKER_00: for an Athenian young man.
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  SPEAKER_00: Socrates does some of his Socrates Kung Fu on Polymarcus.
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  SPEAKER_00: And as it turns out,
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  the person who's best at benefiting one's friends and hurting
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  one's enemies is
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  SPEAKER_00: actually a thief.
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  SPEAKER_00: Therefore,
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  SPEAKER_00: the most just person by this definition will be a thief,
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  which clearly nobody's going to accept that being a thief makes
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  you the most just
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  SPEAKER_00: person in the world.
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  SPEAKER_00: Polymarcus is on the back foot here.
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  SPEAKER_00: Socrates then raises a second argument,
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  which is that we can be wrong about who our friends are and who
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  our enemies are.
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  SPEAKER_00: So in that case,
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  we could think a friend is an enemy and we could hurt somebody
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  that we should
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  SPEAKER_00: really be helping.
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  Or we could think an enemy is a friend and we could help
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  somebody that we shouldn't be helping.
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  This is a very important introduction here because this is one
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  of the key themes of
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  SPEAKER_00: the Republic,
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  SPEAKER_00: which is how do we know the difference between appearance and reality?
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  Like somebody who appears like a friend and then somebody who's
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  actually a friend.
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  SPEAKER_00: A real friend is somebody who doesn't just seem to be good.
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  SPEAKER_00: It's somebody who really is good.
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  SPEAKER_00: Socrates then throws a real curveball in here,
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  SPEAKER_00: which he says,
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  SPEAKER_00: is it the part of the just man to harm anybody?
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  SPEAKER_00: And Polymarcus says it is to harm his enemies.
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  And Socrates says,
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  well,
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  do horses that have become harmed become better or worse?
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  SPEAKER_00: He says, worse.
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  SPEAKER_00: What about dogs?
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  SPEAKER_00: Dogs that are harmed, do they become better or worse?
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  SPEAKER_00: Do they become worse?
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  worse so socrates says should we not assert the same thing of
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  human beings that
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  when they're harmed they become worse in respect to human
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  virtue this is the first
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  introduction of virtue here virtue in the greek is arate
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  meaning excellence and
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  it's the opposite of vice kakia meaning bad or evil so the
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  assumption that there's
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  a human virtue is assumption that there's a human purpose or
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  end a knife that's
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  really excellent at cutting things would have arate because we
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  know that the
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  SPEAKER_00: function of a knife is to cut
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  Slightly more complicated for people,
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  but we'll discuss it as the Republic goes on.
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  So Socrates persuades Polymarcus that it's not just to harm
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  anybody and that
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  SPEAKER_00: harming people makes them worse.
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  SPEAKER_00: And so now Polymarcus is on the same side as Socrates.
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  SPEAKER_00: And Socrates says,
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  SPEAKER_00: Says,
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  I suppose it belongs to Periander or Paradicus or Xerxes or
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  Ismanius the Theban or
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  SPEAKER_00: some other rich man who has a high opinion of what he can do.
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  SPEAKER_00: These are all tyrants, essentially.
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  He's saying that the definition of justice for a tyrant is to
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  help your friends and
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  SPEAKER_00: harm your friends.
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  It is this conclusion that calls forth the third character of
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  this dialogue,
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  SPEAKER_00: which is Thrasymachus.
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  SPEAKER_00: Par four, Thrasymachus.
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  SPEAKER_00: Thrasymachus' name literally means fierce fighter.
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  SPEAKER_00: He's a sophist.
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  SPEAKER_00: in the sense that he's a professional teacher of rhetoric.
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  SPEAKER_00: When we are introduced to Thrasymachus,
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  he literally jumps out like a wild animal and disturbs the
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  dialogue that's been
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  SPEAKER_00: going on.
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  SPEAKER_00: Polymarcus and Socrates have come together.
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  They've agreed that justice isn't benefiting your friends and
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  harming your enemies.
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  SPEAKER_00: And Thrasymachus jumps into the fray ready to fight.
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  SPEAKER_00: Initially,
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  Socrates is frightened by Thrasymachus because he's so wild and
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  out of control in a sense.
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  SPEAKER_00: This is because as a sophist, he doesn't really care about reason.
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  SPEAKER_00: He doesn't really care about the truth.
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  He actually thinks Socrates is manipulating Polymarcus for his
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  love of honor.
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  SPEAKER_00: He accuses him of doing it because he wants to win.
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  This is obviously Thrasymachus' own motivations being put on
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  Socrates because
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  SPEAKER_00: Socrates is the lover of truth.
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  SPEAKER_00: He's doing it to try and get to what's genuinely the case.
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  SPEAKER_00: Thrasymachus can't see things like that.
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  SPEAKER_00: Socrates' response to Thrasymachus is very interesting.
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  SPEAKER_00: Thrasymachus, don't be hard on us.
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  SPEAKER_00: If we are making any mistake in the consideration of the arguments,
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  SPEAKER_00: Polymarchus and I know well that we're making an unwilling mistake.
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  SPEAKER_00: Essentially,
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  SPEAKER_00: We're doing the best that we can, okay?
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  SPEAKER_00: We're just not very good at it.
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  SPEAKER_00: Thrasymachus obviously doesn't accept this.
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  SPEAKER_00: He says, Hercules, here is that habitual irony of Socrates.
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  SPEAKER_00: I knew it.
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  SPEAKER_00: And I predicted to these fellows that you wouldn't be willing to answer.
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  You would be ironic and do anything rather than answer if
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  someone asked you something.
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  SPEAKER_00: Socrates kind of placates Thrasymachus a lot in this dialogue.
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  SPEAKER_00: He says, because you're so wise, Thrasymachus, obviously you'd know that.
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  SPEAKER_00: And so he asked him, why don't you tell us a little bit about it?
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  SPEAKER_00: Thrasymachus actually says, I get paid for this stuff.
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  SPEAKER_00: I'm not going to do this for free.
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  If you want me to philosophize with you,
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  you're going to have to actually pay me.
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  SPEAKER_00: Glaucon ships in and says,
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  SPEAKER_00: now for money's sake,
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  SPEAKER_00: speak Thrasymachus,
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  SPEAKER_00: we shall all contribute to Socrates.
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  SPEAKER_00: Socrates himself doesn't charge for his teaching and is much poorer,
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  SPEAKER_00: which is an indication of his virtue in this case,
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  SPEAKER_00: that he
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  SPEAKER_00: He's not greedy like the sophist.
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  SPEAKER_00: He really does care about the truth.
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  SPEAKER_00: Thrasymachus then gives his own definition of justice,
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  SPEAKER_00: which is nothing other than the advantage of the stronger.
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  If we look at these characters as almost peeling back layers of
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  the Athenian
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  SPEAKER_00: definition of justice,
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  SPEAKER_00: with Cephalus kind of giving the...
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  SPEAKER_00: a slightly noble one of oaths for the gods.
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  SPEAKER_00: Polymarcus coming down where it's benefiting friends and harming enemies.
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  SPEAKER_00: And now Thrasymachus is laid bare where he's saying,
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  SPEAKER_00: no,
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  SPEAKER_00: justice is purely the advantage of the stronger over the weaker.
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  SPEAKER_00: Might makes right.
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  The stronger person is the one that decides what justice is and
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  justice isn't.
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  SPEAKER_00: There's no
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  SPEAKER_00: objective standard of justice that everybody is subject to.
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  This is important for the mission of the Republic because
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  Socrates is searching for
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  SPEAKER_00: a super individual measurement for justice.
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  SPEAKER_00: In the introductory lecture,
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  we talked about the issue with the sophists and with the
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  natural philosophers.
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  SPEAKER_00: And the natural philosophers looked at the world as mechanical,
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  SPEAKER_00: as material,
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  SPEAKER_00: and therefore the gods couldn't endorse virtue and vice.
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  SPEAKER_00: Socrates is looking for a solution to that.
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  SPEAKER_00: He's looking for a rational grounding to justice, to morality.
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  Socrates makes a counter argument that the stronger in this
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  case would be the
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  SPEAKER_00: rulers of the city.
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  But sometimes the rulers of the city command things that aren't
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  actually in their best interest.
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  In this case,
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  they would be commanding things that would be to their disadvantage.
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  SPEAKER_00: And so if everybody does what they say,
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  SPEAKER_00: the advantage of the stronger would actually be a disadvantage.
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  SPEAKER_00: Socrates adds another argument to this,
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  SPEAKER_00: which he uses with a doctor example or a shepherd,
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  which is that the normative measure of good or bad for a doctor
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  is the health of
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  SPEAKER_00: the patient.
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  The normative measure of good or bad for a shepherd is the
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  health of the sheep.
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  SPEAKER_00: So the stronger don't necessarily...
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  SPEAKER_00: govern the people for their own advantage,
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  the measurement of the ruler is the health of the ruled or the
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  well-being of the ruled.
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  Socrates makes the argument that every art from being a doctor
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  or a shepherd or a
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  SPEAKER_00: ruler is actually to the advantage of somebody else.
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  Therefore,
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  Thrasymachus' definition of justice is the advantage of the
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  stronger collapses.
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  SPEAKER_00: This is where Trasimachus really shows his true colors in the dialogue.
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  SPEAKER_00: Instead of contending with Socrates' argument against his,
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_00: he instead makes an ad hominem argument and says,
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_00: tell me,
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_00: Socrates,
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_00: do you have a wet nurse?
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_00: Trasimachus really reveals himself more and more here.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_00: He argues that the just man always gets less than the unjust man.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_00: that it's a perpetually worse position.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_00: And so we start to see if,
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_00: like Trasymachus,
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_00: you're a lover of gain or a lover of profit,
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_00: justice could eat into that profit.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_00: It could be a problem for you.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_00: And so if you really want to have everything,
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_00: which is what he suggests as the ultimate injustice,
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_00: which is
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_00: Overthrowing a city,
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_00: putting yourself in place,
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_00: changing all of the rules and laws to benefit yourself.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_00: A complete injustice is really the greatest manifestation of justice.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_00: The end of the speech marks a change in the argument.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_00: It's no longer about the definition of justice,
• 15:32
  but an argument that the unjust life is more profitable than
• 15:36
  the just life.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: This argument isn't resolved,
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_00: but in book two,
• 15:38
  when Adamantius and Glaucon beg Socrates to articulate for them
• 15:43
  why the just life
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_00: is more profitable than the unjust life.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_00: Socrates asks Thrasymachus, answer us from the beginning.
• 15:49
  Do you assert that perfect injustice is more profitable than
• 15:52
  justice when it is perfect?
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_00: I most certainly do assert it, Thrasymachus said, and I've said why.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_00: Then how do you speak about them in this respect?
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_00: Surely you call one of them virtue and the other vice?
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_00: Of course.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_00: Then do you call justice virtue and injustice vice?
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_00: That's likely, you agreeable man, he said.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_00: When I also say that injustice is profitable and justice isn't.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_00: What then?
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_00: The opposite, he said.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_00: Is justice then vice?
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_00: No, but very high-minded innocence.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_00: Do you call injustice corruption?
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_00: No, rather good counsel.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_00: Are the unjust, in your opinion, good as well as prudent, Thrasymachus?
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, those who can do injustice perfectly, he said.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_00: and are able to subjugate cities and tribes of men to themselves.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_00: As to what,
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_00: I said,
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_00: Socrates,
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not unaware of what you want to say,
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_00: but I wondered what went before you.
• 16:31
  He put injustice in the camp of virtue and wisdom and justice
• 16:34
  among their opposites.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_00: Trasymachus defines virtue as vice and vice as virtue.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_00: This is because his aim is different to Socrates.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_00: The telos of his moral compass is the tyrant.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_00: And to become a tyrant, the virtue that you have to pursue is injustice.
• 16:51
  A vice that would take you away from becoming a tyrant would be
• 16:54
  helping other people.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_00: Trasymachus has an inverted hierarchy of justice compared to Socrates.
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_00: The ideal for him would be like a tyrant that's enslaved everybody.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_00: And so anything that moves you towards becoming that tyrant is a virtue,
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_00: and anything that moves you away from it is considered a vice.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_00: Socrates' question is whether Thrasymachus really believes this or not,
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_00: that if injustice is a virtue and justice is a vice,
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_00: then wisdom would be ignorance.
• 17:21
  Socrates proves to Thrasymachus that justice is a virtue and
• 17:24
  injustice is vice and ignorance,
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_00: and Thrasymachus blushes.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_00: This is a very famous part of the Republic.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_00: And rather than Trasymachus admitting defeat, he simply blushes.
• 17:33
  And this shows the kind of literary quality of the
• 17:36
  philosophical dialogue.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_00: Trasymachus takes a backseat now and Socrates progresses the argument.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_00: He says,
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_00: do you think that a city,
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_00: an army,
• 17:43
  a band of robbers or thieves or any other tribe with a common
• 17:46
  unjust purpose would
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_00: be able to achieve it if they're unjust to each other?
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_00: This is the classic thing in TV shows or movies where the villain is,
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_00: I'm thinking of the penguin as a very good example of this,
• 17:57
  where he's so corrupt that he can't really even have friends or
• 18:00
  family anymore.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_00: How can they trust each other?
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_00: If you're willing to betray anybody in the pursuit of your own gain,
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_00: how can you have relationships with people?
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_00: So even amongst unjust people,
• 18:10
  there has to be some level of justice in order for them to
• 18:13
  carry out unjust
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_00: purposes together.
• 18:16
  Finally,
• 18:16
  at the end of book one,
• 18:17
  they return to the question of how to live.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_00: Is it better to be just or to be unjust?
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_00: Is it more profitable?
• 18:24
  He provides a teleological argument in that what is the
• 18:27
  function of the soul,
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_00: of the psyche,
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_00: of a person?
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_00: And that the function of a thing is living well.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_00: Living well is an excellence.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_00: It's a virtue.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_00: Justice is the virtue and injustice is the vice.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_00: Therefore, if one is unjust, one won't be able to live well.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_00: Ergo, it's more profitable to be just than unjust.
• 18:45
  SPEAKER_00: Of course, this matter isn't resolved in this book.
• 18:49
  It's going to be taken up in book two and form the whole course
• 18:52
  of the Republic.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_00: Socrates concludes, but it is not profitable to be wretched.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_00: Rather, it is profitable to be happy, of course.
• 18:58
  Then my blessed Thrasymachus,
• 18:59
  injustice is never more profitable than justice.
• 19:02
  Thrasymachus replies,
• 19:03
  let that,
• 19:04
  he said,
• 19:04
  be the fill of your banquet at the festival of Bendis.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_00: Socrates.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_00: In book one of The Republic, we really learn what justice isn't.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_00: We don't get a positive definition of justice,
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_00: but it clears away a lot of the traditional definitions of justice,
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_00: things like helping your friends and harming your enemies,
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_00: or that justice is the advantage of the stronger,
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_00: that simply there is no justice.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_00: It's just whoever is in charge calls the shots.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_00: So really,
• 19:30
  book one clears out a lot of this stuff in order to pursue the
• 19:33
  positive account in
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_00: book two as we start to leave the cave.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_00: So join us for the next one.