Latest / Rugby Direct / Rugby Direct Episode 240: Rennie's first big calls: Right or wrong?

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Rugby Direct Episode 240: Rennie's first big calls: Right or wrong? · Rugby Direct

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Speaker 2: and your business to a higher level. Elliott Smith with
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Speaker 2: me Liam Napier. Testmatch City, eight o'clock on a Thursday
0:47
Speaker 2: night and we are podcasting, Lillam. Great to see you.
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Speaker 2: As always, we have our first All Black seam of
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Speaker 2: the year.
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Speaker 3: First Test Match. Fever has gripped the Garden City.
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Speaker 2: Simpy has hasn't it? You can feel it? That or
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Speaker 2: this minus one degree? Something's gripping the city. First and foremost, Liam,
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Speaker 2: what did you make of the twenty three named by
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Speaker 2: Dave Rennie? It was different to the twenty three's we
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Speaker 2: put out there earlier in the week on the podcast.
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Speaker 2: Some surprises there overall, What did you make of it?
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Speaker 3: Absolutely? Some surprises? Yeah, I think brave and bolds and interesting.
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Speaker 3: I think Dave Rennie has immediately stamped his authority on
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Speaker 3: this All Black regime, and I don't agree with all
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Speaker 3: of the selections, but I like the fact that he
1:36
Speaker 3: has made change and as doing things differently. It's not
1:41
Speaker 3: the same tried and true he's backing Ruben Love. He's
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Speaker 3: trying a few different things, not necessarily what I would
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Speaker 3: have done, but there is a real conviction and it
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Speaker 3: does feel like a new regime, doesn't it.
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Speaker 2: It does. There's a lot of change there. You look
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Speaker 2: at the team that he's named and Ruben Love, you know,
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Speaker 2: jumps out handed the keys at ten on the back
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Speaker 2: of that excellent Super Rugby season with the Hurricanes. I
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Speaker 2: think it would have a hard cell in the media
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Speaker 2: conference today if he'd picked Damien McKenzie at ten, if
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Speaker 2: he'd picked Boden Barrett at ten and overlooked them for
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Speaker 2: Ruben Love. Their time will come again, probably in the
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Speaker 2: ten jusy for the All Blacks at some point, inevitably
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Speaker 2: there'll be injuries, whatever it might be, but he's gone.
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Speaker 2: Ruben Love is the ten to lead this All Blacks
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Speaker 2: team into a new era. And I ultimately admire that.
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Speaker 3: Yeah, he's picked him on form and rewarded him and
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Speaker 3: he had to. I think it would have sense the
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Speaker 3: complete wrong message if you go to McKenzie who was
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Speaker 3: completely upstaged by Love in the Super Rugby Final, or
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Speaker 3: Boden Barrett who had a very underwhelming Super Rugby season.
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Speaker 3: Just quickly on Barrett, this is the first time since
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Speaker 3: twenty fifteen that he has missed selection in the All
2:54
Speaker 3: Blacks first Test of the year, so very a crossroads
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Speaker 3: for him potentially, although Dave Rennie did spoke glowingly about
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Speaker 3: what he's bringing behind the scenes. But just on Love,
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Speaker 3: the conviction, the confidence to play freely. That should suit
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Speaker 3: the style of rugby that Rennie wants to play. Look,
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Speaker 3: Test rugby is a different beast. He's going to have
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Speaker 3: much less time and space. He wasn't put under a
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Speaker 3: great deal of pressure throughout the Hurricanes playoff run. You know,
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Speaker 3: they did it so easy. But he scored twenty five
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Speaker 3: points in that final two tries. He was player of
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Speaker 3: the game. It was impossible not to select him for
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Speaker 3: this game at ten, wasn't.
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Speaker 2: It was? And he's got conviction in his ability and
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Speaker 2: he's said previously on to be the best player in
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Speaker 2: the world. Well in the final he played like the
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Speaker 2: best player in the world. So now let's see it
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Speaker 2: on the test match stage. He's had a crack at
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Speaker 2: fifteen a couple of times, some bench appearances, but ultimately
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Speaker 2: he's been having to collect airpoints rather than All Blacks
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Speaker 2: appearances the last couple of years in this All Blacks team.
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Speaker 2: Now Rindy's gone, we back you and we're going to
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Speaker 2: put Roy Guard you know, and number nine inside you.
4:01
Speaker 2: We're going to put Jordi Barrett there at twelve, so
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Speaker 2: there is safety nets the wrong term, but some familiarity
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Speaker 2: either side of him. So it's those Hurricanes players again
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Speaker 2: that will be inside him, and Jordi Barrett will as
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Speaker 2: he does because he's quality player. Tacks and pressure off Love,
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Speaker 2: whether it's a kicking game, whatever it might be, distribution
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Speaker 2: and you've got Roy Guards there who was one of
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Speaker 2: the best half backs in the world. So ultimately they've
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Speaker 2: given him the best possible chance to succeed in this
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Speaker 2: Test match.
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Speaker 3: It's risk and reward, isn't it. That combination is key.
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Speaker 3: The familiarity that you speak about. Yeah, Reuben Love. It's
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Speaker 3: an interesting scenario because of his relative inexperience. He's only
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Speaker 3: played five tests, two starts at fullback, never started at
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Speaker 3: ten for the All Blacks. That speaks to how much
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Speaker 3: he's been kept on ice, and also the fact that
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Speaker 3: he's only really committed to number ten this year. He
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Speaker 3: played ten at the back end of the year for
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Speaker 3: the Hurricanes last year, but was still largely seen as
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Speaker 3: a fallback. Actually played but a wing for the All
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Speaker 3: Blacks as well. This year. He's had a full campaign
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Speaker 3: at ten and it made such a difference that clarity.
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Speaker 3: That's his position and he's carried that through with a
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Speaker 3: new regime and now he gets the keys. I think
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Speaker 3: it's too early to say that this is a definitive
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Speaker 3: changing of the guard at ten, because of course Richie
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Speaker 3: Muwanga is in the wings waiting to satisfy the eligibility
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Speaker 3: criteria and be recalled. But Ruben Love needed this chance
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Speaker 3: and the fact that Mwanga's in that background only enhances
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Speaker 3: the fact that Love had to have his time now.
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Speaker 3: So it's a big chance it.
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Speaker 2: Is, indeed, and you mentioned obviously Mackenzie at fullback, which
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Speaker 2: we'll get to in a moment, but you know, Davin,
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Speaker 2: he was very effusive about what Boden Barrat's done since
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Speaker 2: being in camp. I guess Mackenzie maybe now it was
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Speaker 2: interesting to hear him say that he thinks they've got
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Speaker 2: the two best fullbacks in the world. There might be
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Speaker 2: some cubbling around that from the rest of the.
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Speaker 3: World, but I think there will be so for France.
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Speaker 2: Yeah, potentially. But if you look and deeper into that,
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Speaker 2: does that suggest he believes that Damon McKenzie is best
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Speaker 2: employed as a fullback rather than a ten. You know,
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Speaker 2: was there some not secret meaning in those words? But
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Speaker 2: does it suggest that maybe he's an out and out
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Speaker 2: fifteen rather than a ten in this all blacks environment.
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Speaker 3: I don't think so. No, because at the back end
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Speaker 3: of this game, I expect McKenzie to come into ten,
6:25
Speaker 3: Jordan to go back to fullback, Fennonga North fourth to
6:27
Speaker 3: debut on the right wing. But who knows how the
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Speaker 3: game plays out. If Rumen loves having a blinder, maybe
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Speaker 3: he finishes at ten. But I think Ruben, Damien, Boden,
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Speaker 3: will Jordan. They all have that versatility, which is a strength,
6:44
Speaker 3: but it is a big core in many respects. Despite
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Speaker 3: Reuben being the form horse to Usurp, Boden and Damien,
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Speaker 3: these guys have been around for the best part of
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Speaker 3: a decade. Boden's played hundreds of tests McKenzie's been in
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Speaker 3: that environment, so it does a real statement of faith.
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Speaker 3: I like McKenzie at fullback. I think he played his
7:07
Speaker 3: best rugby for the All Blacks last year. He was
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Speaker 3: very brave in the air. He had some great cameos
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Speaker 3: off the bench. You think about Edinburgh match turning efforts. Yeah, ah,
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Speaker 3: and with Love coming in, one of mackenzie or Barrett
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Speaker 3: had to miss out, didn't they They did?
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Speaker 2: Yep, absolutely. I mean they could have added one on
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Speaker 2: the bench, but it would have been kind of a
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Speaker 2: pointless selection in many ways. I'm not totally sure on
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Speaker 2: the bench as a whole. We can come back to
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Speaker 2: that in a moment potentially.
7:38
Speaker 3: What about Will Jordan? Is he now as his future
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Speaker 3: now on the right wing for the All Blacks under
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Speaker 3: Dave Rennie?
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Speaker 2: Maybe it is, But again Rennie goes back and says,
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Speaker 2: you know, these are the two best fullbacks in the world.
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Speaker 2: So I tend to sueduce he will see some time
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Speaker 2: at fullback, whether that's next week, whether it's in three
7:55
Speaker 2: or four months time, whether it's in South Africa. But
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Speaker 2: he wants his best players out there, and we know
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Speaker 2: that Jordan is capable on the right wing, and he's
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Speaker 2: probably played his best All Blacks rugby on the right wing.
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Speaker 2: But time comes for everyone wingers, as I know you've
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Speaker 2: written about extensively, and you know, twenty seven, twenty eight
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Speaker 2: years of age, when your pay starts to go. I'm
8:15
Speaker 2: not saying Will Jordan's has necessarily, but at some point
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Speaker 2: that probably will have to be a live discussion whether
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Speaker 2: he can still play on the wing and add what
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Speaker 2: the All Blacks want them to there.
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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a funny how things come full circle or
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Speaker 3: they change complexion because during Ian Foster's regime he was
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Speaker 3: heavily criticized for not playing Will Jordan at fullback, and
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Speaker 3: Jordan was open towards the back end of that time
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Speaker 3: about his preference being to play fullback. Now, Dave Rennie
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Speaker 3: recounted something today about how when he visited the Crusaders
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Speaker 3: he talked to Will about that and Will apparently said, well,
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Speaker 3: I'm not fuss as you probably would do with a
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Speaker 3: new All Blacks coach, say oh, I'm happy to play anywhere.
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Speaker 3: And now he finds himself on the right wing, where
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Speaker 3: as you point out, he scored the bulk of his
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Speaker 3: tries whoever roaming Commission, he will get highly involved. I
9:00
Speaker 3: think the big big question up with Will Jordan's game
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Speaker 3: is his aerial ability, and that seems strange for a
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Speaker 3: guy that's predominantly played at full back, but you're not
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Speaker 3: really tested there in Super rugby, and last year he
9:12
Speaker 3: was part of the problem, recurring problem with the All
9:16
Speaker 3: Blacks issues on.
9:17
Speaker 2: He was he couldn't quite get it right, and so
9:22
Speaker 2: that's going to be interesting to see how that happens
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Speaker 2: and whether it's been something that All Blacks have focused
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Speaker 2: on to get right under this new coaching regime. You'd hope,
9:29
Speaker 2: because it remains a major part of world rugby and
9:31
Speaker 2: Test rugby in the way that opposition teams now attack
9:35
Speaker 2: these days, and you'd hope the All Blacks likewise will
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Speaker 2: be doing that on attack themselves and deploying a kicking game.
9:42
Speaker 2: Let's get into the lose forward trier, because that was
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Speaker 2: a surprise. Peter Larche at six, Luke Jacobson at seven,
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Speaker 2: Ardisa Villa at eight. Peter Luckeye has never started a
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Speaker 2: first class game at blindside. Flanker. Dave Reny said in
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Speaker 2: the media conference that those numbers don't matter as much
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Speaker 2: as they maybe did ten years ago, apart from sort
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Speaker 2: of setting at scrums, but this is still a surprise.
10:04
Speaker 2: Is it the right core to go with these players
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Speaker 2: in the way that they have.
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Speaker 3: I'm personally not a fan of that loose Ford trio.
10:11
Speaker 3: I can understand the rationale that they see Luke Jacobson
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Speaker 3: as a complimentary presence to Artie Severe and Peter Luckey.
10:21
Speaker 3: Jacobson has a seven on his back, but his strengths
10:24
Speaker 3: predominantly defensively, strong shoulders, his work great, pretty good at
10:30
Speaker 3: the line out as well, so not a traditional pilfering fetcher,
10:34
Speaker 3: open side flanker by any stretch. Did play there for
10:36
Speaker 3: the Chiefs. Personally, I like Peter Luckeye at eight. I
10:41
Speaker 3: thought he was superb there for the Hurricanes this year,
10:45
Speaker 3: and Artie's in my mind an open side flanka. He
10:49
Speaker 3: has played some good rugby for the All Blacks at eight.
10:51
Speaker 3: I just feel like you're over complicating it playing players
10:54
Speaker 3: out of position. Yes, they're interchangeable, but they are quite
10:58
Speaker 3: defined roles in some way as well. So look, it's
11:03
Speaker 3: the first test of the year. I think there'd be
11:04
Speaker 3: a lot of change in that loose Ford trio. But
11:07
Speaker 3: we've talked a bit about Luke Jacobson as well. He's
11:10
Speaker 3: played a number of tests, but in my mind, probably
11:13
Speaker 3: in yours, never really nailed it at test rugby. So
11:16
Speaker 3: this is a big opportunity for him as well.
11:18
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it is and a chance for him
11:20
Speaker 2: to maybe just reset his all black's career. He's been
11:23
Speaker 2: coached by a coach that he's previously worked with and
11:25
Speaker 2: Dave Rennie maybe not for a long time, and Luke
11:27
Speaker 2: Jacobson was a you know, little Vigiemite probably back in
11:30
Speaker 2: those days so to speak. But I think it's a
11:33
Speaker 2: big chance for Luke Jacobson to reset his test career
11:36
Speaker 2: somewhat Veggimer momte, I prefer Vegimite. I know that's the
11:39
Speaker 2: Australian controversial might taste better to me. Yeah, look, I
11:46
Speaker 2: think it's a chance for him to reset his test
11:48
Speaker 2: career a little bit. Because I have sat on this
11:50
Speaker 2: podcast before that I can't think of a test where
11:52
Speaker 2: Luke Jacobson has gone out and it had an absolute
11:55
Speaker 2: storman gone you know that was Luke Jacobson's best test
11:58
Speaker 2: because I can't think of one. It might he's a
12:00
Speaker 2: great player at super rapi level, but I just haven't
12:02
Speaker 2: seen him take that step up. Now with a clean
12:05
Speaker 2: slate of sorts, this could be the opportunity that he
12:07
Speaker 2: needs to really lockdown a jersey in this loose Ford trio.
12:12
Speaker 2: And his versatility is a strength and the fact that
12:14
Speaker 2: apparently we don't see numbers anymore or roles in this
12:17
Speaker 2: loose Ward trio, you know he can slide between all
12:20
Speaker 2: of those roles. So I think it's a big opportunity
12:22
Speaker 2: for Lou Jacobson on Saturday Night to stamp his authority
12:25
Speaker 2: and make him the first choice open side flankert in
12:29
Speaker 2: this mix going forward, because previously to this point, I
12:32
Speaker 2: don't think he has.
12:33
Speaker 3: Well in the big caveat to that is it sounds
12:36
Speaker 3: like Dave Rennie views Artie Severe as an eight first
12:39
Speaker 3: and foremost, and so that leaves the open side jersey
12:43
Speaker 3: potentially open, not just for Jacobson, but Anton Signer as well.
12:47
Speaker 3: Could really state his case as this series progresses. And
12:51
Speaker 3: it also the recurring question about number six and it's
12:58
Speaker 3: the profile of your loose Fords as a combination, and
13:01
Speaker 3: Reny admitted that this was the area that they discussed
13:03
Speaker 3: the most and successive all black coaches or trios of
13:09
Speaker 3: loose forwards generally have one combative, hard hitting, hard working
13:16
Speaker 3: player that Simon Parker fulfilled that role or was supposed
13:19
Speaker 3: to fulfill that role under Scott Robertson, you're going back
13:23
Speaker 3: to Shannon Frazelle or Liam Squire. You know, it's been
13:30
Speaker 3: a perennial problem. So now Peter Luckeye gets thrown the jersey?
13:33
Speaker 2: Do you think that there? And we've talked about oviously
13:36
Speaker 2: about the jerseys and not meeting maybe as much, but
13:38
Speaker 2: are they trying to fashion Luckhaie into that role? So
13:41
Speaker 2: they've seen something. Obviously he's an excellent player and storming
13:44
Speaker 2: Super Rugby Final, but have they gone yep, there's enough
13:47
Speaker 2: elements there that we can make him a blindside flanker
13:50
Speaker 2: and make him into the next Jerome Cano going back
13:53
Speaker 2: ten plus years now, and he's the kind of guy
13:55
Speaker 2: that we can see feeling that even though traditionally he's
13:58
Speaker 2: played Steven or Raight.
14:00
Speaker 3: I think it's a case of we're picking Ardie at
14:02
Speaker 3: eight and so we need Peter Luckeye in the trio.
14:06
Speaker 3: So weird is he fit and they've gone six. It
14:08
Speaker 3: seems a bit strange because if it'd probably be less
14:12
Speaker 3: polarizing if you put Peter Lukeye at seven and Jacobson
14:16
Speaker 3: at eight. But they've obviously got a rationale for it.
14:18
Speaker 2: Yeah, they do again, but numbers don't matter. Well that
14:21
Speaker 2: you know, the less importance. But we're getting very tangled
14:23
Speaker 2: and going, well, why are players wearing certain numbers? Wallace
14:27
Speaker 2: Satisi comes off the bench as well. Haven't seen him
14:30
Speaker 2: since that horrible head knock in the game against the
14:33
Speaker 2: Reds in the first round of the Super Ruggy Plaffs.
14:36
Speaker 2: He played a little bit of impact last year off
14:39
Speaker 2: the All Blacks bench. He can bring impact in the
14:42
Speaker 2: last in the closing minutes of games. You wouldntn't wouldn't
14:46
Speaker 2: want a pigeonhole him there necessarily, But in the way
14:49
Speaker 2: that they've selected this team, I can see him, you know,
14:51
Speaker 2: hading some impact in it closing stage.
14:54
Speaker 3: Absolutely yeah. And I think look from an attacking dynamic
15:01
Speaker 3: point of view, Setti starts in your loose Ford trio.
15:05
Speaker 3: But it comes back to those complementary skill sets and
15:09
Speaker 3: at this stage of his career, he probably doesn't bring
15:11
Speaker 3: that hard defensive presence that compliments Ardi and Lackaye, and
15:18
Speaker 3: so he's the one that misses out.
15:20
Speaker 2: I think it's exactly it. He's had to miss out
15:22
Speaker 2: on this occasion. Maybe they'll tweak it again depending on
15:25
Speaker 2: how it goes this weekend.
15:27
Speaker 3: And Jason Ryan also said earlier in the week that
15:29
Speaker 3: they view him as an eight, so now he's stuck
15:32
Speaker 3: behind Ardi.
15:33
Speaker 2: Yeah, just interesting reading and dissecting some of the comments
15:37
Speaker 2: that have been made this week alone. Elsewhere in the
15:41
Speaker 2: twenty three, the Locks kind of picked themselves with Darry
15:44
Speaker 2: and Josh Lord to start to provide out with concussion.
15:48
Speaker 2: Obviously Barrett's not there, I Fabien Holan's not there, and
15:51
Speaker 2: Patrick Tepilotto. It's being a Pigeonholing has been very much
15:55
Speaker 2: given the impact role at test level for two coaches now,
15:59
Speaker 2: if not longer. It's really fulfills very well. So I
16:02
Speaker 2: suppose they haven't changed it there front row. They've gone
16:05
Speaker 2: with the starters there and de Groot Taylor then in
16:09
Speaker 2: an all Hurricanes replacement trio via which you can see
16:12
Speaker 2: the benefits of anything stand out from the rest of
16:15
Speaker 2: the twenty three.
16:16
Speaker 3: I think it's a test you're locking depth, you're into
16:18
Speaker 3: your fourth and fifth choice locks because there's no Scott Barrett,
16:21
Speaker 3: no Fabian Holland, no TUPUVIAI so big responsibility on those
16:25
Speaker 3: guys to own the line out and bring physical presences
16:29
Speaker 3: around the park. Josh Lord has been superb this year
16:33
Speaker 3: for the Chiefs. Big opportunity for Sam Darry. I really
16:36
Speaker 3: do like largely the composition of the All Blacks bench,
16:40
Speaker 3: if we separate it out. Though I'm a big fan
16:42
Speaker 3: of the Fords. They all hurricanes front row, no mere
16:47
Speaker 3: more lomax man like unleashing them in the last half
16:52
Speaker 3: an hour. That's a real point of difference with toy
16:55
Speaker 3: Polotu and Sititi. I would have selected Kyle Preston over
17:00
Speaker 3: Cortes Ratima. Billy Proctor I think probably deserves his selection
17:05
Speaker 3: on the base of what he puts together this year
17:07
Speaker 3: in Superbriate, but I'm also not sold on him being
17:11
Speaker 3: an impact player as yet and then fitting enough for
17:15
Speaker 3: there be a few nerves there, hopefully get some early
17:17
Speaker 3: touches and can impress. So I do largely like certainly
17:22
Speaker 3: that the Fords on that bench, and I don't think
17:25
Speaker 3: the All Blacks have got that element right in recent
17:28
Speaker 3: years either.
17:29
Speaker 2: No, I don't think they have, and hopefully this is
17:30
Speaker 2: a step towards I tend to agree about the backs,
17:32
Speaker 2: Billy Procter can only play center. I mean, maybe you
17:35
Speaker 2: could put him on the wing. Potentially hasn't played a
17:38
Speaker 2: lot there, but maybe you could taken a role, but
17:41
Speaker 2: you've already got a wing there, so I think I'm
17:44
Speaker 2: not quite sold on that necessarily, But otherwise I think
17:48
Speaker 2: are pretty well rounded and interesting. Twenty three from Dave
17:52
Speaker 2: Rennie and you can quibble with it, but I think
17:55
Speaker 2: ultimately does you know, represent a step forward for this
17:58
Speaker 2: All Blacks team who are going to face a French
18:00
Speaker 2: side on the weekend with a lot of Bordeaux players
18:04
Speaker 2: in the mix. They've named their squad this evening as well,
18:07
Speaker 2: the headline being Luku and Jellowbeert nine and ten for
18:10
Speaker 2: a million names to a New Zealand audience. More fun
18:14
Speaker 2: at second five Damienos and the mix as well.
18:18
Speaker 3: The other wing twenty one year olds was one of
18:22
Speaker 3: their standouts last year as well. So yeah, quite lanky, tall, fast, skillful,
18:29
Speaker 3: great in the air. He really impressed me this time
18:32
Speaker 3: last year.
18:32
Speaker 2: Yeah, he was excellent, and I think ye know that.
18:35
Speaker 2: You know, this French team has once again been written
18:37
Speaker 2: off to an extent, but they've got a lot of
18:41
Speaker 2: Bordeaux players who are the European champions. They're going to
18:43
Speaker 2: come in.
18:43
Speaker 3: With eight from Bordeaux and the squad. Yeah, so there
18:47
Speaker 3: are established combinations they might be. I think the All
18:50
Speaker 3: Blacks will fancy themselves at the scrum because France don't
18:53
Speaker 3: have their first choice props, so they may come for
18:57
Speaker 3: them there. And they have gone with their strong, very
18:59
Speaker 3: strong scrummages and the grout and nule, so I think
19:03
Speaker 3: that's one area they may target the French. But as
19:07
Speaker 3: we saw last year the Test of the Year, it
19:09
Speaker 3: was pretty squeaky and France love being written off, don't they.
19:13
Speaker 2: They do, and they've got a lot of quality players
19:15
Speaker 2: and will play in different ways to the All Blacks
19:19
Speaker 2: have played in recent times in Super Rugby, So not
19:23
Speaker 2: a lot of time together for the All Blacks opponents
19:25
Speaker 2: that are spending a lot of time to give the
19:27
Speaker 2: club level. How's this going to play out on Saturday night?
19:32
Speaker 3: Who knows. Look, there's a lot of familiarity in the
19:37
Speaker 3: All Black team when you talk about Roy guard Love, Barretts.
19:41
Speaker 3: There's enough class in that team the All Blacks should win.
19:45
Speaker 3: But first Test of the Year traditionally rusty French it's
19:50
Speaker 3: a tied trope, but they are unpredictable, not necessarily in
19:52
Speaker 3: the way they play, but if they get their tails up,
19:56
Speaker 3: if they get a bit of momentum, they can be
19:58
Speaker 3: incredibly dangerous. If they are allowed to offloads, if they
20:02
Speaker 3: can pressure the All Blacks under the high ball and
20:05
Speaker 3: live off some scraps and put some school board pressure
20:07
Speaker 3: on and you know, put some heat on Ruben Love
20:11
Speaker 3: force a few early mistakes, that they are a live chance.
20:16
Speaker 3: I would not be writing off this French team, but
20:19
Speaker 3: missing I think it's eight top fourteen finalists. Reny you know,
20:24
Speaker 3: starting his tenure. It doesn't really matter how it happens,
20:28
Speaker 3: but They'll Blacks have to win. Just win, get on
20:32
Speaker 3: the board and then you can progress from there.
20:34
Speaker 2: Let's think back two years ago. The All Blacks played
20:36
Speaker 2: England in Dunedin and they squeaked.
20:39
Speaker 3: Home absolutely Marcus Smith had he had a better night
20:42
Speaker 3: off the team in England won that game.
20:44
Speaker 2: If the All Black's winning that fashion on Saturday night,
20:46
Speaker 2: will that be enough?
20:49
Speaker 3: Well, not for the public probably, you know, it's it's
20:54
Speaker 3: not enough for the All Blacks to win. It's how
20:55
Speaker 3: they win more by how much. But internally I think
20:58
Speaker 3: they'd probably take a starting points. But look, there's enough
21:02
Speaker 3: experience in that all Black team to deliver a performance.
21:07
Speaker 3: There'll be a lot of overtivation coming back to christ
21:09
Speaker 3: Church playing in a pristine venue, starting a new era.
21:13
Speaker 3: There's a whole lot of talk about optimism, but there
21:16
Speaker 3: is a reality of bringing a new management team together,
21:19
Speaker 3: sharing a lot of new calls, making changes that that
21:24
Speaker 3: generally takes time. So I do expect there to be
21:26
Speaker 3: a bit of clunkiness.
21:27
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it will be right before we go
21:29
Speaker 2: Super Rugby announcing the format for next year ten teams.
21:34
Speaker 2: Obviously there's still a top six, although the lucky loser
21:37
Speaker 2: has been sent to the graveyards of Super Rugby ideas
21:42
Speaker 2: joining who else? It's quite full that some wolves, what
21:46
Speaker 2: is the Rebels, Kings, Kings South Africa in general? Yeah,
21:51
Speaker 2: so welcome in the lucky Loserana Lana, Yep. What do
21:54
Speaker 2: you make of the format for next year?
21:58
Speaker 3: Two more weeks could be quite a hard sell? Look,
22:03
Speaker 3: I think the format as such as probably probably the
22:08
Speaker 3: best that they could come up with the time in
22:10
Speaker 3: the allotted time frame. It's not completely fair because the
22:14
Speaker 3: Australians won't play the Kiwi teams as much, so that's
22:17
Speaker 3: a leg up for them. And I have major issues
22:20
Speaker 3: with the top six even that, even though the first
22:25
Speaker 3: two teams have the week off, six teams making the
22:28
Speaker 3: postseason from ten is quite fascical, really, isn't it. And
22:33
Speaker 3: from my mind, a top you can satisfy the broadcasters
22:37
Speaker 3: and the fans here. What you do is you have
22:39
Speaker 3: a top four and you have home and away semis
22:44
Speaker 3: and then you still get six finals matches and you
22:48
Speaker 3: don't have to have a top six.
22:49
Speaker 2: Yeah. I'm coming around to that idea of having the
22:52
Speaker 2: top four semi finals one place four, you play away first,
22:55
Speaker 2: and then the home team gets a benefit of knowing
22:57
Speaker 2: sort of what they've got to chase in Week two.
23:00
Speaker 2: I think there's a lot of benefit to that. And
23:01
Speaker 2: you have the best teams of the competition playing more
23:05
Speaker 2: often at the back end.
23:07
Speaker 3: It's got to be some jeper throughout the season.
23:09
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, And I don't think it is particularly fan
23:13
Speaker 2: centric to extend the regular season out by two weeks
23:18
Speaker 2: and then still put a top six in. You're giving
23:19
Speaker 2: more games in the regular season for a top six
23:22
Speaker 2: that I could probably tell you right now is probably
23:25
Speaker 2: going to be the same as this year, maybe give
23:27
Speaker 2: or take one team. Yeah, yeah, exactly, come on, Force
23:31
Speaker 2: surprised me. Drewors surprised me.
23:34
Speaker 3: You know, yeah, the Force got quite a high turnover,
23:36
Speaker 3: but they were the big movies and Aussie this.
23:38
Speaker 2: Year surprised me, Like I could tell, barring massive changes,
23:42
Speaker 2: it's probably going to be around the same top six.
23:45
Speaker 2: So we're playing sixteen, seventeen weeks, whatever it is. I
23:48
Speaker 2: think sixteen off the top of me head. To get
23:50
Speaker 2: to the same or similar top six needs to be
23:53
Speaker 2: jepandine needs to be a top four and that puts
23:55
Speaker 2: more emphasis on the regular season games. If there is
23:59
Speaker 2: only a top four to make it.
24:01
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, you had me at hello, I just I can't.
24:08
Speaker 3: You could tune out for the best part of half
24:10
Speaker 3: the year and tune into the back end, and like
24:13
Speaker 3: you say, you can pick your top six now. So
24:15
Speaker 3: if it's not home and away semi finals, maybe you
24:18
Speaker 3: have a home and away grand final. Yeah you know,
24:21
Speaker 3: and you still get your three weeks of finals. But
24:25
Speaker 3: it's an elite professional competition because there's jeopardy and not
24:30
Speaker 3: over half your teams are making the postseason.
24:32
Speaker 2: Yeah, this just doesn't work with ten teams sixteen plaff,
24:37
Speaker 2: but there needs to be some path towards expansion.
24:40
Speaker 3: I think.
24:40
Speaker 2: Yeah.
24:41
Speaker 3: The only tick I would give them is they resisted
24:44
Speaker 3: the urge or the push from Australia to go to
24:46
Speaker 3: conferences which would have guaranteed an Australian presence in the finals.
24:51
Speaker 3: And we just don't need that.
24:53
Speaker 2: No, we don't. I said enough about Australia the other day.
24:57
Speaker 2: You're not welcome across it. It would be very interesting
25:00
Speaker 2: to get there in September October for the.
25:03
Speaker 3: You better hope your family in Perth give your safe housels.
25:06
Speaker 2: Yeah, it might be the best possible so around that.
25:10
Speaker 2: Thanks to Mark Kelly for producing this Right by Direct
25:13
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Speaker 2: elevating you and your business to a higher level.
25:20
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