Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / How a deadly school shooter 'slipped' through cracks and went on murder rampage

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How a deadly school shooter 'slipped' through cracks and went on murder rampage · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Climb Stories with Nancy Grace on Serious x M Triumph
0:08
Speaker 1: Channel one thirty two. Around two thirty PM, the Broward
0:13
Speaker 1: County Sheriff's Office responds to reports of a shooting with
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Speaker 1: multiple injuries at Marjorie Stoneman Douglas High School. Oh my god,
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Speaker 1: I haven't gone god By, but what on the what
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Speaker 1: side of the school? Kids were freaking out? Stunt kids
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Speaker 1: from some kids are on the phone. SWAT teams go
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Speaker 1: from room to room, securing areas before allowing students and
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Speaker 1: teachers to evacuate. The Broward County Sheriff says, at least
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Speaker 1: seventeen people are dead. Seventeen people. It's insane, it's it's
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Speaker 1: it's unnecessary, and there's no words to describe how I feel. Right.
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Speaker 1: I'm like I was shaking, I was I was panicking,
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Speaker 1: was all out panic about the school. One of the
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Speaker 1: were school shootings in you. As history goes down the
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Speaker 1: morning after, everybody's saying could have, would have, should have
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Speaker 1: looking back at all the red flags that were waving
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Speaker 1: at the authorities right under their noses. This as the defendant.
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Speaker 1: There is no doubt. This is the shooter. Appears in
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Speaker 1: court being hugged by his defense attorney. He says he
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Speaker 1: was just misguided. That is cold comfort for the families
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Speaker 1: of seventeen dead children. I mean, see, Grace, this is
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Speaker 1: Crime Stories, and we want justice. More important than justice even,
1:50
Speaker 1: we want the truth. Joining me right now and all
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Speaker 1: Star panel, John Limley, Karen Starr, Ashley Wilcott, Joseph Scott, Oregon,
2:00
Speaker 1: David Kat's, Rob Hessel, Brian Level, Brian Levin to John Limley,
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Speaker 1: Crime Stories investigative reporter. The shooter who had the wherewithal
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Speaker 1: to plan the attack, carefully bringing in a semi assault rifle,
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Speaker 1: extra magazines of ammunition hidden in a backpack, smoke grenades,
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Speaker 1: thought to pull the fire alarm, to create chaos and
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Speaker 1: confusion and bring his victims out so he could pick
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Speaker 1: them off one by one, like shooting a fish in
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Speaker 1: a barrel and then thanking. To put on a hat
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Speaker 1: and blend in with all the students pouring out, to
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Speaker 1: leave undetected, to stop at a sub sandwich place, to
2:52
Speaker 1: stop at a McDonald's and kick back. Are you kidding me,
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Speaker 1: John Limley? What happened? According to authorities, the gunman who
3:05
Speaker 1: as we know now no killed seventeen people inside that
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Speaker 1: school in Florida, has told police that he heard voices
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Speaker 1: in his head that gave him instructions for the attack.
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Speaker 1: The voices were described as demons by law enforcement sources. Meanwhile,
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Speaker 1: it emerged that police were called to Nicholas Cruz's family's
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Speaker 1: Parkland home thirty nine times since the Sheriff's office received
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Speaker 1: a range of emergency calls that included mentally ill person, child,
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Speaker 1: elderly abuse, domestic disturbance, missing person, several others. Cruz moved
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Speaker 1: in with a friends family with his adoptive mother, sixty
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Speaker 1: eight year old Linda Cruz. She passed away in November
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Speaker 1: from pneumonia. During this first court appearance on Thursday, Cruise,
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Speaker 1: as you've mentioned, was comforted by his public to Fender
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Speaker 1: as he was ordered held without bail in connection to
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Speaker 1: the deadly shooting at Marjorie Stoneman Douglas High School on Wednesday. Question,
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Speaker 1: I got a question, have we heard anything to suggest
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Speaker 1: um that the demon voices told him to go to
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Speaker 1: Subway Sandwich and pick up a six inch white because
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Speaker 1: I don't think so, emerged. I hear all that, but
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Speaker 1: I'm looking at the images taken from a student's cell
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Speaker 1: phone shows a girl's lifeless body lying in the middle
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Speaker 1: of a classroom in a pool of blood, neighbors and
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Speaker 1: relative saying that his mom, who adopted him as a child,
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Speaker 1: along with her husband, the Crews family, sacrificed herself to
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Speaker 1: give them a beautiful home, a loving home, to make
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Speaker 1: their life better, to do everything she could for them.
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Speaker 1: All the times, many of the times police were called
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Speaker 1: to their home, it was for harassing neighbors. This boy
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Speaker 1: harassing neighbors to the point they were called police. But
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Speaker 1: after all those calls, not one single arrest. Joining me now,
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Speaker 1: Rob Hessel, author of Safe City from Law Enforcement to
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Speaker 1: Neighborhood Watches, a security and safety analyst who specializes and
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Speaker 1: how to keep your community safe. Rob, what do you
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Speaker 1: make of it? Well, this is this is horrible, And
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Speaker 1: all the signs were there that this boy had such
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Speaker 1: a troubled past, and I'm not sure how he was
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Speaker 1: able to assemble arsenal of weapons. But even more concerning
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Speaker 1: for me was how was this boy who had a
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Speaker 1: history of violence, who had already been kicked out of
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Speaker 1: two schools and identified by a school that he was
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Speaker 1: a threat. How did he get on campus in the
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Speaker 1: first place. That's my question to Brian Levin, director of
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Speaker 1: the Center for the Study of Hate and Extremism at
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Speaker 1: University Californi, NYA, San Bernardina. Brian, thank you for being
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Speaker 1: with us. At first you get I'm glad you're with us, Brian.
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Speaker 1: You know, at first some extremist right wing nut job
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Speaker 1: group claimed he was their member. That's been debunked. Yeah,
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Speaker 1: that that was first reported when there was some rumors
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Speaker 1: on four Chan and various entities. Respectable entities, by the way,
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Speaker 1: such as the A d L as well as the
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Speaker 1: Associated Press, spoke to the rather not very illuminating head
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Speaker 1: of a hate group called the Republic of Florida, who
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Speaker 1: said that this individual went to a training camp uh
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Speaker 1: and then UM he later backtracked on it. UH. The
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Speaker 1: sheriff Sheriff Israel down in Broward County UH did not
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Speaker 1: confirm a connection during the day, and then later on
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Speaker 1: papers throughout the state appeared to have debunked that. That
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Speaker 1: being said, it is not unusual for extremist groups of
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Speaker 1: all types to try to ensnare unstable people. It just
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Speaker 1: appears in this case it didn't happen. The Florida Gunman
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Speaker 1: now says quote demon voices tell him how to pull
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Speaker 1: off a school shooting. Police revealing, as John Limley has reported,
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Speaker 1: they were called out to the family home thirty nine times,
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Speaker 1: thirty nine times joining me actually Wilcot, Wilcot lawyer and
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Speaker 1: child advocate. I mean this was planned. This was not
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Speaker 1: some snap as it's um referred to in the vernacular.
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Speaker 1: There's no defense called snap. But that didn't happen. This
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Speaker 1: was planned out. Everybody quote new he was a sick, weird,
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Speaker 1: psychotic guy. That's the way the classmates describe him to me.
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Speaker 1: Their words, not mine. The school had kicked him out.
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Speaker 1: He had been kicked out of two schools before. He
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Speaker 1: was told he couldn't come back in a backpack because
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Speaker 1: they're afraid to have a gun in bullets. Um Bill
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Speaker 1: Bondsman out of Mississippi, called the f b I six
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Speaker 1: months ago and told them about this guy making threats
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Speaker 1: on schools online. Ashley, you know I always saw a
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Speaker 1: law enforcement No, this is totally lame. Heads need to roll.
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Speaker 1: They said they couldn't identify him. Hello, he had his
8:44
Speaker 1: his real name and his face on there right. Yeah,
8:50
Speaker 1: this is a situation where clearly you had a troubled
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Speaker 1: child and he's done all kinds of things that he
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Speaker 1: could have been held responsible for and could have been
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Speaker 1: charged with, and could have been prosecuted for and could
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Speaker 1: have been jailed for. None of that happened. The other
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Speaker 1: thing that's really troubling to me is that here he says, oh,
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Speaker 1: I heard demons and my voices. But everything you just
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Speaker 1: laid out Nancy makes very very clear it was premeditated,
9:15
Speaker 1: well planned out, and then the whole Oh, he blended
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Speaker 1: in with the students, walked away, went to get something
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Speaker 1: to eat, went the subway. It is too premeditated for
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Speaker 1: me to believe that all of a sudden heard voices
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Speaker 1: that said, oh, the demons telling me, go kill all
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Speaker 1: these people. I am a future school shooter. I want
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Speaker 1: to pre a professional school shooter. David Katz, CEO of
9:41
Speaker 1: the Global Security Group, Active Shooter Response Expert, former d
9:46
Speaker 1: E A firearms expert, terror analyst. You know, when we
9:51
Speaker 1: think of terror, we think of the evil isis. We
9:55
Speaker 1: think of nine one one, the attack on the World
9:58
Speaker 1: Trade Center. I will never forget that being in New
10:00
Speaker 1: York that day, But this is just as terrifying to
10:05
Speaker 1: those children. Under the law, they are children that were
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Speaker 1: gunned down in their own school. When I drove away
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Speaker 1: from the Twin school this morning, my heart, my stomach
10:15
Speaker 1: just felt sick. I actually drove back through Davy Cats
10:19
Speaker 1: to make sure the doors were all locked. Well, it
10:23
Speaker 1: doesn't matter to the victims whether the shooter was ideologically
10:27
Speaker 1: motivated or psychotic. Like this, this is one of these
10:30
Speaker 1: incidents where every single thing done on it, from every
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Speaker 1: possible aspect, was exactly opposite what we teach people to do.
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Speaker 1: As I like to say, Bass Ackwards, Yeah, I mean
10:44
Speaker 1: there's there's no I mean in every single you know,
10:47
Speaker 1: in some cases there are no warning signs in this one.
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Speaker 1: I mean, how much more would this kid have have
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Speaker 1: had to have done before someone took it? Seriously, I'm
10:57
Speaker 1: really interested to see what the FBI did with that
11:00
Speaker 1: information that was got gained from that bail bondsman. Somebody,
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Speaker 1: if somebody, if no one wrote a report on that,
11:06
Speaker 1: exactly right, heads got a role. If there is a report,
11:09
Speaker 1: like in the e A, we would do, if we
11:10
Speaker 1: didn't open a case, we would do what it's called
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Speaker 1: the general file report. Maybe there is a general file report.
11:15
Speaker 1: Why wasn't Why wasn't that followed up? Why is there
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Speaker 1: thirty nine thirty visits by the police and not a
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Speaker 1: single arrest. You mentioned earlier how he how he was
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Speaker 1: able to assemble an arsenal, well if he had a
11:26
Speaker 1: felony conviction, you can't bike on legally, and certainly at
11:30
Speaker 1: this point in in our culture, there needs to be
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Speaker 1: some mechanism by which if a school administrator or school psychologist,
11:37
Speaker 1: because psychologist, or some medical professional or otherwise identify as
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Speaker 1: a person a child, anyone who probably should not should
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Speaker 1: be on the equipal, the gun equivalent of the no
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Speaker 1: fly list. We've got to have a mechanism where this
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Speaker 1: person cannot walk into a sporting good store, gun store
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Speaker 1: and purchase a fire on period. I'm just looking at
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Speaker 1: the cruise home. I mean, Jackie, have you seen this?
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Speaker 1: I mean, Ashley, it looks like it's a French design.
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Speaker 1: I mean, it's nice. It's a beautiful manicured lawn. I know,
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Speaker 1: all you men just tune out because it's not gonna
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Speaker 1: be anything, I mean anything to you except for Ashley
12:21
Speaker 1: and Karen Starr and I. We're gonna know what we're
12:23
Speaker 1: talking about here, guys. Ashley, Karen, there's a beautiful, uh
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Speaker 1: stand of trees beside the home. There are. It's a
12:32
Speaker 1: well kept yard. The shrubs, there's a lot of shrub
12:35
Speaker 1: word that that takes time and money. We know this.
12:39
Speaker 1: There's a white paved driveway leading up to a circular
12:45
Speaker 1: roundabout in front of the home with an attached two
12:48
Speaker 1: door two car garage possibly three, a giant archway over
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Speaker 1: the front. Uh this, this is a well kept home
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Speaker 1: in the Mediterranean style, and somebody had some money somewhere
13:05
Speaker 1: and took care of the home. Sources tell me Karen Stark,
13:11
Speaker 1: New York psychologists joining us Karen that the mother and
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Speaker 1: the father wanted these children desperately took in him and
13:21
Speaker 1: his brother. I haven't heard much about the brother. And
13:25
Speaker 1: she spent her life, she worked and was devoted to
13:30
Speaker 1: quote giving them a beautiful home. And I don't mean
13:33
Speaker 1: necessarily looking beautiful, which it does. I mean, hey, I
13:37
Speaker 1: move into that heartbeat, but a beautiful home as in
13:42
Speaker 1: loving homie, comforting for these two boys. That she really
13:47
Speaker 1: devoted her life to them, and the father wanted them
13:51
Speaker 1: just as much. Now he passed away. I think of
13:54
Speaker 1: a heart attack several years ago, about five years ago. Uh.
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Speaker 1: Then a mom just passed away with pneumonia recently in
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Speaker 1: the last month or so. But all people could say, argue,
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Speaker 1: Karen Start, that he went off the rails when his
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Speaker 1: mom passed away. But these thirty nine arrest reports that
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Speaker 1: John Lemley, Brian Levin, Rob Hustle, and David Katz were
14:18
Speaker 1: talking about those all happened while the mom was alive.
14:22
Speaker 1: That he was kicked out of school. He reportedly brought
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Speaker 1: a bullet to school in his backpack one day, got
14:28
Speaker 1: in a fight with his ex girlfriend's new boyfriend because
14:31
Speaker 1: he had been abusive to her. I mean, all this
14:33
Speaker 1: was brewing before the mom passed away. So before we
14:38
Speaker 1: start saying little orphan Annie, let's look at the facts. Okay,
14:42
Speaker 1: let's look at the facts. And this is what I
14:45
Speaker 1: would tell juries. The truth doesn't always taste good going down,
14:49
Speaker 1: But it is our duty not to turn away from
14:51
Speaker 1: the truth, to look at it and analyze it and
14:55
Speaker 1: come up with a solution. So what do you make
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Speaker 1: of it, Karen Start, you're the shrink. Well, not that
15:02
Speaker 1: there is a particular profile for this, Nancy, because school
15:05
Speaker 1: shooters are not from the same kind of backgrounds and
15:09
Speaker 1: they're not all the same, But there are things about
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Speaker 1: school shooters that he fits completely. He has a history
15:18
Speaker 1: of violence, and neighbors all talk about it. Other students
15:24
Speaker 1: talk about the fact that his favorite thing to talk
15:26
Speaker 1: about with guns knives. He would post pictures of animals
15:32
Speaker 1: that he had killed. He liked to shoot rats. And
15:35
Speaker 1: so when you bring up the fact that his mother
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Speaker 1: died in November, all I can say about that is
15:41
Speaker 1: the trauma of his mother dying just exacerbated what was
15:46
Speaker 1: already there. If he it was a planned attack, which
15:51
Speaker 1: is not unusual, there was nothing impulsive about it, and
15:56
Speaker 1: he let people know that this was going to happen.
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Speaker 1: The defense attorney is arguing, Joe Scott, I know you're
16:04
Speaker 1: tramping at the bit hold on, ladies for to Jesse
16:07
Speaker 1: As Scott Morgan Ashley Rollcott, people are already climbing and
16:11
Speaker 1: referring to his defense attorney quote, the child he's nineteen,
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Speaker 1: is deeply troubled and he is endured significant trauma that
16:19
Speaker 1: stems from the loss of his mother. Okay, I I
16:23
Speaker 1: hear that, because I just lost my dad. I hear
16:26
Speaker 1: about I understand that. But that is not a defense, Ashley,
16:30
Speaker 1: that is not a defense. You go tell that to
16:32
Speaker 1: the families of these seventeen your children, that are dead.
16:36
Speaker 1: That's it. It is not a defense and it does
16:38
Speaker 1: not excuse the behavior. So here's the thing. Repeated trauma
16:42
Speaker 1: scientifically now shows changes the varying chemistry and children, So
16:46
Speaker 1: doesn't affect children a d. Does it excuse these crimes, murders,
16:53
Speaker 1: killing spree. Absolutely not, and so it cannot be posed
16:57
Speaker 1: as a defense or an excuse, and it's not a
17:00
Speaker 1: egle defense. Now to forensics expert, Professor Forensics SIT, Jackson
17:07
Speaker 1: State University, Joseph Scott Morgan, Joe Scott, I know you
17:11
Speaker 1: have very carefully gone over what we have learned regarding
17:16
Speaker 1: to physical evidence. I know that you cannot date what
17:22
Speaker 1: injury was first but from the traffic pattern, from the
17:27
Speaker 1: entry the exit. But we know about the way this
17:30
Speaker 1: went down. We can determine what happened chronologically. In your mind,
17:36
Speaker 1: Joe Scott, I want to hear your analysis. I've been
17:39
Speaker 1: waiting on this. I was I was reflecting on this, Nancy,
17:46
Speaker 1: and one of the things that that kind of struck
17:49
Speaker 1: me was actually, it will be twenty years ago next
17:53
Speaker 1: month was the Jonesboro, Arkansas shooting where the two kids
17:58
Speaker 1: came to school and initiated a fire alarm and those
18:02
Speaker 1: those little kids came out at that middle school and
18:05
Speaker 1: these two guys were two kids were up on a
18:08
Speaker 1: hillside and they began to open up and I saw
18:10
Speaker 1: some connectivity. I've described this uh environment that that he
18:19
Speaker 1: created as utter chaos, and that's what we're going to see.
18:24
Speaker 1: That's what the police are currently seeing as they're working
18:28
Speaker 1: this scene. And UH, Briber County is tops when it
18:34
Speaker 1: comes to crimsing processing. They they're also being eighted by
18:37
Speaker 1: that a t F as well as the FBI teams. UH.
18:42
Speaker 1: And it is a gigantic juke saw puzzle. And if
18:45
Speaker 1: I could just paint this picture very very quickly for you, UM.
18:49
Speaker 1: One of the most striking things that that they're seeing
18:52
Speaker 1: in the scene right now is a tremendous amount of
18:55
Speaker 1: blood evidence. And it's not just individual puddles. Uh. You
19:00
Speaker 1: have people that are bleeding out. You had mentioned earlier
19:03
Speaker 1: that there was an image of a young, uh, motionless
19:06
Speaker 1: child on the floor. UM. You will have people that
19:09
Speaker 1: have stepped over her in a frenzy to get out.
19:12
Speaker 1: You have people tracking blood everywhere. There will be a
19:16
Speaker 1: tremendous amount of blood spatter in the immediate areas, not
19:18
Speaker 1: just on the floor. But on the walls. Um. And
19:21
Speaker 1: then we have to think about the firearms evidence relative
19:24
Speaker 1: to the expended brass, which are the little casings that
19:28
Speaker 1: come out of this weapon. Not to mention the projectiles
19:34
Speaker 1: that have passed through the bodies that have struck walls,
19:39
Speaker 1: lodged in things, and they will literally find projectiles laying
19:42
Speaker 1: on the floor. This takes us to a bigger picture
19:45
Speaker 1: here because all of those people that have undergone surgery, uh,
19:49
Speaker 1: you will have fragmented projectiles as well as intact projectiles
19:53
Speaker 1: that they're recovering. I'm sure that the police are on
19:55
Speaker 1: top of this. This is multi layered because these people
19:57
Speaker 1: went to multi multiple hospitals, and then that brings us
20:01
Speaker 1: course to the door the medical examiner. Uh, their day yesterday.
20:06
Speaker 1: I've been involved in mass fatalities. You you might remember
20:10
Speaker 1: the day Trader shooting in Atlanta, Nancy. It is utterly chaos.
20:14
Speaker 1: Uh is. Sometimes you don't feel like that you're prepared
20:16
Speaker 1: to deal with it, but somehow you muddle through and
20:18
Speaker 1: you have to remain focused. And that's that's the case.
20:21
Speaker 1: We don't have a guy that's gone out and has
20:23
Speaker 1: essentially ended his life in this case where there's nothing
20:27
Speaker 1: to prosecute. This is, as you well know, prosecutable, and
20:31
Speaker 1: I can tell you they're going over the scene with
20:33
Speaker 1: a fine tooth calm, and it is an absolute nightmare
20:37
Speaker 1: to piece together. Take a listen to Brower County Sheriff
20:40
Speaker 1: Scott Israel as he remembers the names of seventeen dead children,
20:52
Speaker 1: Carmen Metal Pollock, Peter Wayne, Nicholas Warrette, Christopher Hickson, my
21:06
Speaker 1: very very very special friend who all miss Aaron Fice,
21:11
Speaker 1: Luke Hoyer, Allana Petty, Jamie Guttenberg, Martin Duquet and Guiano,
21:20
Speaker 1: Melissa Alla Deaf, Helena Ramsey, Scott Bagel, Joaquin Oliver, Carol Offran,
21:30
Speaker 1: Gina montal Too and Alexander Schapter. May they rest in
21:36
Speaker 1: peace and may God comfort their families. I went to
21:40
Speaker 1: pause right now and thank our sponsor making our investigation
21:45
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Speaker 1: zoom dot com Thank you. As I traveled down one
23:10
Speaker 1: of the back roads, it's a heavily residential area I
23:14
Speaker 1: happened to come across. It was just just myself. There
23:17
Speaker 1: was not a lot of people out, A couple of
23:19
Speaker 1: people walking their dogs in the area. As I continued
23:23
Speaker 1: down this roadway, uh I discovered an individual walking on
23:28
Speaker 1: the sidewalk that was wearing the clothing description that had
23:33
Speaker 1: been given over the radio. Uh. He looked like a
23:39
Speaker 1: typical high school student. UH. And for a quick moment,
23:46
Speaker 1: I thought, could this be the person? Is this who
23:50
Speaker 1: I need to stop? Uh? Training kicked in. I pulled
23:56
Speaker 1: my vehicle over, immediately engage the sub subspect. He complied
24:04
Speaker 1: with my commands and UH was taken into custody without
24:11
Speaker 1: any any issues. You just heard the officer who actually
24:16
Speaker 1: apprehends Cruz describing how he found him and how he
24:19
Speaker 1: did not resist. But take a listen now to a
24:23
Speaker 1: high school football coach telling CNN about the assistant coach
24:29
Speaker 1: and athletic director gunned down. The first part of my day,
24:35
Speaker 1: He's gonna be terrible. And I don't see my buddy
24:37
Speaker 1: at the gate. That's gonna be the hard part. And
24:41
Speaker 1: then I'm gonna walk in my office and not see Chris,
24:43
Speaker 1: who always said good morning to me. And that's gonna
24:47
Speaker 1: be hard. Um. And I'm sure it's gonna be hard
24:50
Speaker 1: for all of us, you know. Um, they don't know.
24:57
Speaker 1: But do the best we can to ask you will.
25:00
Speaker 1: Caught child advocate and lawyer Ashley. I can already see
25:07
Speaker 1: the defense shaping up and this is where a mental
25:11
Speaker 1: defense comes from. In my experience from the courtroom. If
25:14
Speaker 1: you're not caught red handed, you'll say I didn't do it.
25:18
Speaker 1: If you're caught with DNA, for instance, you'll say, okay, uh,
25:22
Speaker 1: I was there, but I didn't do it. You don't
25:25
Speaker 1: have a video. If you have DNA and a video
25:30
Speaker 1: and witnesses, you say I was insane. I did it,
25:35
Speaker 1: but I didn't know what I was doing. That's how
25:37
Speaker 1: that shakes out. Look, I know this guy has problems,
25:41
Speaker 1: I know that, but that is not insanity under the
25:45
Speaker 1: legal sense of the word. This was pre meditated. I mean, Ashley,
25:50
Speaker 1: did you know he specifically went to multiple floors, multiple levels,
25:55
Speaker 1: as if you were targeting specific people. That's not crazy,
25:59
Speaker 1: that's easy, like a fox. That's right. And the way
26:03
Speaker 1: that you can prove that it was premeditated in this
26:05
Speaker 1: specific case is look at all of his social media
26:09
Speaker 1: posts and the um specific details about him planning this
26:15
Speaker 1: crime and telling everybody this is what I'm gonna do.
26:18
Speaker 1: And there's a picture with multiple guns in it that
26:21
Speaker 1: he had. There's one of him holding in his hand
26:24
Speaker 1: a gun, and all the details that he dribbled along
26:26
Speaker 1: the way to say, this is exactly what I'm gonna do,
26:29
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna be a professional school shooter. The other
26:33
Speaker 1: thing I want to add, and it's what bothers me
26:35
Speaker 1: I have seen. I was appointed by the Governor's an
26:37
Speaker 1: Oversight Agency UM for abuse and neglect cases. And here's
26:41
Speaker 1: what I would see over and over and over again.
26:44
Speaker 1: When somebody rolls up to report or to investigate on
26:47
Speaker 1: a report and they see a nice house, as you've described,
26:52
Speaker 1: well manicured, socioeconomic doesn't appear to be an issue because
26:56
Speaker 1: the parents have worked their butts off to provide for children. Now,
27:00
Speaker 1: guess what, those reports are not taken as seriously because
27:05
Speaker 1: of that. And that's sad but true. And so in
27:08
Speaker 1: this case there have been what did you say, thirty
27:11
Speaker 1: nine responses responding to law enforcement having to go to
27:15
Speaker 1: that house. When they roll up on a house like that,
27:18
Speaker 1: I do not believe they're going to take it as
27:20
Speaker 1: seriously as they should. And I know it doesn't mean
27:24
Speaker 1: there's not a problem when you roll up to a
27:27
Speaker 1: house like that, as you're describing it, but it also
27:31
Speaker 1: means that you, I guess instinctively think, well, if they
27:34
Speaker 1: care enough about their home and their law and all that.
27:36
Speaker 1: Then I they should be caring about the children. But
27:39
Speaker 1: the thing is this was not internally generated such as
27:44
Speaker 1: attacks on the mom. These were him, him harassing neighbors,
27:49
Speaker 1: elderly neighbors, all sorts of neighbors. I don't know what
27:51
Speaker 1: Elsie did, but thirty nine reports actually will cut with
27:56
Speaker 1: me back to David Kat's CEO of Global Security Group
28:00
Speaker 1: and Active Shooter Response expert former d e A. David,
28:05
Speaker 1: you know, I know you don't always have somebody to blame.
28:10
Speaker 1: There's not always an answer, okay, but I'm looking for
28:14
Speaker 1: the answer. I'm searching for the answer as to why
28:18
Speaker 1: why am I doing that? I don't know. Maybe it's
28:20
Speaker 1: because if I know the answer, somehow it won't happen again.
28:25
Speaker 1: We can stop it from happening again if we understand why.
28:29
Speaker 1: But here there's so many things, David, thirty nine police reports,
28:34
Speaker 1: no arrest ever, kicked out of two schools, expelled from
28:39
Speaker 1: this school, starting fights at school online, threatening to be
28:43
Speaker 1: a school shooter, reported to the FBI. I mean this morning, David,
28:49
Speaker 1: I swear I would be out of my skin if
28:54
Speaker 1: I were one of those parents and my child is
28:57
Speaker 1: dead at cool in the floor in a pool of blood,
29:04
Speaker 1: and the FBI knew about it six months ago. There
29:10
Speaker 1: is there is no way to look at this case
29:14
Speaker 1: and say anything other than there there was laps at
29:18
Speaker 1: every single juncture. I mean, this is a kid where
29:22
Speaker 1: school officials said, okay, you can't bring a backpack onto
29:25
Speaker 1: school grounds because we think you're going to carry a
29:27
Speaker 1: firearms and there's there's no police follow up. My god,
29:33
Speaker 1: you can. That's gonna shake out as to what happened,
29:36
Speaker 1: what was not done, and what and what apparently was
29:39
Speaker 1: was the reason that he wasn't called and prosecuted. But
29:43
Speaker 1: on on the procedural level, to um one of your guests,
29:46
Speaker 1: to give me I missed the name mentioned the pulling
29:49
Speaker 1: of the fire alarm. One thing that that I mean
29:52
Speaker 1: New York for the last fifty years. Thing that that
29:55
Speaker 1: is that is written in stone. You do not evacuate
29:58
Speaker 1: upon alarm. The alarm is meant to alert somebody, some
30:01
Speaker 1: central person who's going to run the emergency. They're going
30:04
Speaker 1: to make a determination if it's if it isn't, maybe
30:06
Speaker 1: it's a false alarm, maybe it's found it alarm. But
30:08
Speaker 1: they're going to direct you the fact that that ever
30:12
Speaker 1: you see this all over the country. People are still trained.
30:15
Speaker 1: You hear that alarm, you go. That's why he was
30:17
Speaker 1: able to pull that alarm, even he knew the procedures
30:20
Speaker 1: in that school. He knew the kids would hear the alarm,
30:23
Speaker 1: empty the rooms, go into the hallway. And that's one
30:25
Speaker 1: reason why why he was able to engage and kill
30:27
Speaker 1: so many people. But you can go through every single aspect,
30:31
Speaker 1: whether whether it was the warning signs, the failure to
30:34
Speaker 1: WAW enforcement, the failure of the school to have to
30:36
Speaker 1: have access control, the failure of the school to properly
30:38
Speaker 1: train these students, and how to respond these incidents. This
30:42
Speaker 1: this is the textbook how to do every single thing
30:46
Speaker 1: wrong and we see the results. I mean, how could
30:49
Speaker 1: the FBI fix themselves? Rob Hessel, author of Safe City,
30:54
Speaker 1: From law Enforcement to neighborhood Watches. How could they say
30:59
Speaker 1: we couldn't identify him? What, there's his picture, his face
31:03
Speaker 1: and his real name. Hello, of course they could identify him. Yeah,
31:10
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't know how the FBI could say
31:12
Speaker 1: they couldn't identify him. And even further and kind of
31:15
Speaker 1: pigging backing off what David just said, there's been so
31:18
Speaker 1: many advances in technology UM and for for the schools,
31:22
Speaker 1: I think it brings up the conversation about open campuses
31:25
Speaker 1: and the security on the schools. There's so many different
31:28
Speaker 1: technologies that can be deployed to help recognize threats, facial
31:32
Speaker 1: recognition software UM, and then to the point of pulling
31:36
Speaker 1: a fire alarm and having people evacuated, there are systems
31:39
Speaker 1: out there that have been created to override a fire
31:42
Speaker 1: alarm system and communicate to the teachers and for students
31:45
Speaker 1: in real time the actions that they need to take
31:48
Speaker 1: to keep themselves safe. So I think we've got a
31:50
Speaker 1: lot of things that we need to look at from
31:52
Speaker 1: how we're responding to different threats inside of the school systems.
31:55
Speaker 1: And I think, as as you just said, there's gonna
31:58
Speaker 1: be some definite fall out of how this kid was
32:00
Speaker 1: able to go under the radar after he'd been reported
32:03
Speaker 1: so many different times. Take a listen to Drew Griffin
32:08
Speaker 1: CNN describing the warning signs about Nicholas Cruz. The warning
32:13
Speaker 1: signs were all there in person and on social media,
32:17
Speaker 1: photos of guns, knives, extremist comments posted under political videos.
32:22
Speaker 1: I want to shoot people with my a R fifteen.
32:25
Speaker 1: That quote attached to a YouTube video of a Donald
32:28
Speaker 1: Trump's supporter being pushed around at a rally. Under a
32:31
Speaker 1: video about Antifa, he posted, f Antifa, I wish to
32:35
Speaker 1: kill as many as I can, and I'm going to
32:38
Speaker 1: kill them in the future. And the comment that prompted
32:41
Speaker 1: a call to the FBI, he wrote, I'm going to
32:44
Speaker 1: be a professional school shooter. Ben Benight contacted the FBI
32:48
Speaker 1: when he saw that post. They came out from my
32:51
Speaker 1: office the very next morning in person and met with
32:54
Speaker 1: men and those who knew. The shooter said his life
32:56
Speaker 1: was filled with trouble. This video from a neighbor shows
33:00
Speaker 1: him brandishing what looks like a pellet gun. He was
33:03
Speaker 1: expelled from school, obsessed with guns, and when his adopted
33:06
Speaker 1: mother died in November, he ended up with no place
33:09
Speaker 1: to live. The family of a friend took him in.
33:12
Speaker 1: Their lawyer said he didn't get up as usual yesterday,
33:16
Speaker 1: but they had no idea what was about to happen
33:18
Speaker 1: to John Limley Crime Stories investigative reporter joining us John,
33:23
Speaker 1: I was watching the court proceeding for his first appearance.
33:28
Speaker 1: What exactly was the purpose of him being in court
33:31
Speaker 1: in the last hours and what did you observe John Limley.
33:34
Speaker 1: In his first court appearance yesterday, facing seventeen counts of
33:39
Speaker 1: premeditated murder, CRUs mostly looked down at his hands and
33:45
Speaker 1: just answered in a low voice to the questions that
33:48
Speaker 1: the judge asked him. His attorneys did not specifically say
33:54
Speaker 1: that he had confessed to the shooting, nor did they
33:57
Speaker 1: explicitly deny his involvement, describing him as a broken young man.
34:03
Speaker 1: Investigators already have interviewed more than two thousand people as
34:08
Speaker 1: a part of the probe and hope to speak to
34:11
Speaker 1: unnamed others who might enlighten them to exactly what happened.
34:16
Speaker 1: There are new details emerging about cruises movements on Wednesday, UH.
34:23
Speaker 1: These from court documents and even what we're hearing from
34:26
Speaker 1: police officials. Cruise took an Uber vehicle to the school.
34:31
Speaker 1: Police have said that he was wearing a black backpack
34:36
Speaker 1: and carrying a black Duffel bag. A staffer at the
34:40
Speaker 1: school actually recognized Cruise and radioed a co worker to
34:45
Speaker 1: say that Cruise was walking towards what is known as
34:49
Speaker 1: the Freshman Building on the campus. Within a minute, UH,
34:53
Speaker 1: gunshots were heard and a code read was announced as
34:58
Speaker 1: an emergency. Police say Cruise began firing into a series
35:02
Speaker 1: of rooms on the second floor, returning actually going back
35:06
Speaker 1: to two of those two pump more rounds at these
35:12
Speaker 1: huddle terrified teachers and students. Crews then went up the stairs,
35:16
Speaker 1: allegedly firing at another room as he traveled through the
35:19
Speaker 1: school building. Then, as students began to flee, police say
35:24
Speaker 1: Cruiz dumped his rifle and a bag of extra ammunition
35:29
Speaker 1: and joined the others trying to blend in as everyone
35:34
Speaker 1: ran from this building on campus. Back to David Kat,
35:38
Speaker 1: CEO Global Security Group, what does that mean to you, David, Well,
35:43
Speaker 1: you know, there's there's a lot of things that we
35:45
Speaker 1: just mentioned too that one of the things going back
35:46
Speaker 1: to the same room multiple times that happened to Vision
35:49
Speaker 1: to Tech, so that's not uncommon. The bunch of things
35:53
Speaker 1: that that stand out. Number one, as a former student,
35:57
Speaker 1: he knew how to gain access to the building. Number two,
36:00
Speaker 1: he knew that by pulling the fire along, he he
36:02
Speaker 1: knew exactly the response. Number Three, he knew that there
36:06
Speaker 1: there is a protocol in place that probably he was
36:11
Speaker 1: able to exploit because of his knowledge of the procedures
36:14
Speaker 1: enabled to and able to gain access to potential victims
36:18
Speaker 1: before they could react. You know, there's a there's a
36:20
Speaker 1: bunch of things that that I mean here in New
36:23
Speaker 1: York City, for example, the NYPD, the Fire Apartment, they've
36:27
Speaker 1: mandated actor shooter response and high rise buildings in in UH,
36:32
Speaker 1: public assembly venues and hotels. In addition, their school mandates
36:36
Speaker 1: and everything that we teach, every bit of the curriculum
36:41
Speaker 1: is exactly diametrically opposed to what was done in this case.
36:45
Speaker 1: So I mean, I mean, if you look at all
36:48
Speaker 1: the details as they emerged, you're going to find for
36:52
Speaker 1: for some inexplicable reason, none of the recommended protocols are
36:56
Speaker 1: being followed. And I just I just this second, I
36:59
Speaker 1: saw an up date that Scott Israel, the sheriff down there,
37:02
Speaker 1: is calling the topper tepper gun control laws. My god,
37:05
Speaker 1: the guy had at thirty nine encounters with the police
37:08
Speaker 1: that we know of, probably farm more than that, and
37:10
Speaker 1: all the history at the school and more topper gun
37:13
Speaker 1: control laws. Do your job, make a case locked the
37:16
Speaker 1: kid up. If he had a felony conviction, he doesn't
37:18
Speaker 1: buy the gun, this doesn't happen, or at least if
37:20
Speaker 1: he does buy a gun, it's much more difficult and
37:22
Speaker 1: simply walking through the store and plugging down, sucking down
37:25
Speaker 1: his credit card. I want you to take a listen
37:29
Speaker 1: to what a neighbor, Rhonda Roxboro tell seeing in about
37:35
Speaker 1: cruises behavior. Listen. The first time I had any run
37:40
Speaker 1: ins with him was in about and he actually slammed
37:47
Speaker 1: his backpack into my car door, which you know. I
37:50
Speaker 1: got out and approached him and asked him, you know,
37:52
Speaker 1: why did you do that? Why did he, you know,
37:54
Speaker 1: try to damage the car. He wouldn't look at me.
37:57
Speaker 1: He was giggling and so, you know, mischievous boy. So
38:02
Speaker 1: I confronted him directly. You confronted him on the street, Yes, yes,
38:08
Speaker 1: I did, and I'll tell you the He didn't want
38:13
Speaker 1: to answer anything. He had a very cold stare. He
38:18
Speaker 1: couldn't care less. Did he have other interactions like this
38:21
Speaker 1: with with with other neighbors, other kids in the in
38:24
Speaker 1: the neighborhood. He did, He did. Um, he gotten in
38:30
Speaker 1: several fights with kids throughout the neighborhood. One he bit
38:33
Speaker 1: his ear and injured him his ear. Other kids also, Yes, yes,
38:41
Speaker 1: he got in a fight with several kids in the neighborhood.
38:44
Speaker 1: And I didn't physically see that, but um, I heard
38:47
Speaker 1: about it. But also I did see him with a
38:50
Speaker 1: pellet gun and there was you know, there were squirrels
38:54
Speaker 1: that he was shooting killing. There was cats that were missing,
38:58
Speaker 1: um in the name hood as well. There was that
39:02
Speaker 1: he had killed the cats of these animals. Yeah, this
39:08
Speaker 1: is what you know, This was floating around the neighborhood.
39:11
Speaker 1: I can't confirm that I did not see that, you know, um,
39:14
Speaker 1: but I know that I saw him with a pellet
39:17
Speaker 1: gun and um, you know, there were animals that were
39:21
Speaker 1: dead throughout the neighborhood. To Brian Levin, director of the
39:27
Speaker 1: Center for the Study of Hate and Extremism in San Bernardino, Brian,
39:32
Speaker 1: we are hearing about the way many neighbors called police
39:38
Speaker 1: about animal cruelty, about he would attack neighbors, harass neighbors.
39:44
Speaker 1: Yet never has David Kats and John Linelee pointed out,
39:49
Speaker 1: was there and arrest. I know you deal with specific
39:52
Speaker 1: groups regarding hate and extremism, but this really, these repeated
39:57
Speaker 1: acts of hatred. Are you surprised at what you were
40:02
Speaker 1: hearing from the neighbors. You just heard a neighbor speaking
40:05
Speaker 1: out and that a hate group would claim him as
40:08
Speaker 1: their own. Well, let's let's let's UH bifurcate this and
40:16
Speaker 1: approach the first one. UM, there are many instances where
40:22
Speaker 1: young people UH get into fights and also harass animals.
40:30
Speaker 1: But to get to this level of this number of
40:33
Speaker 1: times and the fact that animals have been killed, even
40:38
Speaker 1: though UH in many instances UH children either get treatment
40:45
Speaker 1: or the outgrow some of these things, clearly this is
40:50
Speaker 1: someone who had some profound type of behavioral disorder, possibly
40:58
Speaker 1: going into something worse. I'm not a diagnostician, but bottom
41:02
Speaker 1: line is you don't have thought that they were just
41:05
Speaker 1: playing out main and evil. I mean every time UH
41:09
Speaker 1: that someone does an evil act, that does not mean
41:12
Speaker 1: that they have a mental defect or they are mentally ill.
41:15
Speaker 1: If you look at serial and spree killers throughout history,
41:19
Speaker 1: you will see that many of them started as youth torturing,
41:24
Speaker 1: dismembering and killing animals just like this guy. Absolutely. The
41:30
Speaker 1: only thing is a dear friend of mine, Jack Levin
41:34
Speaker 1: no relation, one time told me when I said the
41:37
Speaker 1: same thing. This is many years ago when we both
41:40
Speaker 1: were younger, But I look older, you don't, which is
41:45
Speaker 1: a will will do that for another time, but in
41:48
Speaker 1: any event, yes, many of these types of killers have
41:52
Speaker 1: had those kind of precursors. The only thing is um,
41:57
Speaker 1: many more people have done similar things and have not
42:00
Speaker 1: advanced with their uh, their their violent behavior. So it's
42:06
Speaker 1: one of those things where it's both over inclusive and
42:09
Speaker 1: under inclusive. In other words, we see this kind of
42:12
Speaker 1: behavior with respect to men who go into violence, but
42:16
Speaker 1: we also see for many uh, particularly when it's not
42:20
Speaker 1: as egregious as we've seen in this case. UH. I
42:24
Speaker 1: know you're making a point. What would it be? The
42:28
Speaker 1: point would be that there should have been follow up.
42:32
Speaker 1: Well said to John Limley, I'm reading about all the
42:36
Speaker 1: acts of heroism. One coach dies trying to save other people,
42:43
Speaker 1: one math teacher, and Miss Shanty this one ofthon known
42:47
Speaker 1: as Miss V to her students. When she heard a
42:51
Speaker 1: second fire alarm that day, she knew something was wrong.
42:56
Speaker 1: They had had a fire drill earlier that morning. Instead
43:00
Speaker 1: of letting her students out of algebra, she made them
43:02
Speaker 1: all get down on the floor in the corner of
43:04
Speaker 1: the room, put paper over the windows so nobody could
43:07
Speaker 1: see in and see the students siding, And she wouldn't
43:12
Speaker 1: even let the swat team in. John. They had to
43:16
Speaker 1: come in through the windows because she would not let
43:19
Speaker 1: them in. She didn't note for sure it was a
43:21
Speaker 1: swat team for real, John exactly and another teacher, Scott Bigel,
43:27
Speaker 1: a geography teacher, was killed as he was trying to
43:31
Speaker 1: usher students back into his classroom when the shooting broke out.
43:35
Speaker 1: One of the students told CNN that he was shot
43:39
Speaker 1: outside the classroom door right after he locked all of
43:43
Speaker 1: the students in um. It's stories like this that make
43:48
Speaker 1: all of this all the more heartbreaking. One detailed that
43:53
Speaker 1: has emerged in just the past several hours is one
43:58
Speaker 1: about Mr Crewe's at home that morning Wednesday morning. On
44:04
Speaker 1: most average weekday mornings, UH, he had been going back
44:08
Speaker 1: to classes since he had been expelled, uh to maybe
44:12
Speaker 1: get his g e D. And he usually got up
44:15
Speaker 1: to catch a ride to the adult education courses that
44:18
Speaker 1: the family he had stayed with after his mother's death
44:21
Speaker 1: last year had encouraged him to attend. Mr Lewis Uh
44:26
Speaker 1: this is the family's lawyer, Jim Lewis, said that Mr
44:30
Speaker 1: Cruz explained his reluctance that morning to get up by
44:35
Speaker 1: saying something to the effect of it's Valentine's Day, I
44:39
Speaker 1: don't go to school on Valentine's Day. He had been
44:43
Speaker 1: staying with the Sneed family since November, the month of
44:47
Speaker 1: his mother's death. Mr Lewis, the attorney, said that the
44:51
Speaker 1: family had seen signs of depression in Mr Cruz, but
44:55
Speaker 1: nothing indicated that he was capable of this kind of violence.
44:59
Speaker 1: An interest note, a chilling note. The family had allowed
45:04
Speaker 1: Nicholas Cruz to bring his gun with him to their house,
45:08
Speaker 1: insisting that he keep it in a lockbox. We also
45:11
Speaker 1: are hearing from a mom who reveals her daughter, a
45:15
Speaker 1: basketball player, is one of the two survivors in critical
45:18
Speaker 1: condition right now. She says gunshots went through her back,
45:22
Speaker 1: crushing her ribs and exiting her stomach. It's Maddie Wilford
45:27
Speaker 1: High School Jr. She was hit multiple times in the attack.
45:32
Speaker 1: Her mom, Missy, posted a status of her daughter's condition,
45:38
Speaker 1: urging people to pray for Maddie and God knows. We
45:45
Speaker 1: are praying for the Lord to comfort these families and
45:51
Speaker 1: heal the children that are sick and in the hospital
45:55
Speaker 1: and hurting now both their bodies, their minds, and their
46:00
Speaker 1: old Karen Stark, New York psychologists joining us. I keep
46:05
Speaker 1: thinking about the bodies are their friends lying in the floor, dead,
46:11
Speaker 1: impulse of blood, and the children running out and stepping
46:16
Speaker 1: over and around the bodies. You know they're going to
46:20
Speaker 1: remember that the rest of their life, just like you are, Nancy,
46:25
Speaker 1: just like I am, and all of us here today.
46:28
Speaker 1: Those images never leave, and they will need a lot
46:31
Speaker 1: of help to be able to cope with the fact
46:34
Speaker 1: that that trauma has been so violent and vivid. Everyone
46:42
Speaker 1: will need a lot of counseling and support with this,
46:46
Speaker 1: particularly since it was so apparent that this was a
46:51
Speaker 1: boy who wanted violence, who he sought it. He let
46:57
Speaker 1: people know that he wanted to bring it done to school.
47:01
Speaker 1: It was nothing mysterious about what was on his mind.
47:05
Speaker 1: This one girl that that lived, Maddie, is right now
47:10
Speaker 1: in her third surgery getting a permanent titanium plate put
47:13
Speaker 1: in her body to hold her ribs together. This young
47:16
Speaker 1: basketball star had a bullet run down the full length
47:20
Speaker 1: of her right arm. As horrible as it sounds, she's alive.
47:26
Speaker 1: Joseph Scott Morgan, Do you believe, Joe Scott that these
47:30
Speaker 1: students were killed instantly or were they conscious as they
47:36
Speaker 1: bled out on the floor as all of their friends, classmates,
47:40
Speaker 1: people that didn't know jumped over and around them to
47:44
Speaker 1: get out. No, they were not killed instantly. I'm sure
47:48
Speaker 1: that some of them probably were, but not every single
47:51
Speaker 1: one of them. That's that's this. This is not TV.
47:55
Speaker 1: It doesn't happen like that. This is a a long
47:59
Speaker 1: languishing death. In many cases, particularly people are shot in
48:04
Speaker 1: the abdmin they do bleed out, you have a long
48:07
Speaker 1: period of time trying to clear the building. People are terrified.
48:10
Speaker 1: That goes back to the the chaos in this circumstance.
48:13
Speaker 1: But I want to take you back somewhere else, Nancy.
48:16
Speaker 1: I was just thinking about the Broward County Medical Examiner's
48:19
Speaker 1: Office and when those people walked in that worked there
48:23
Speaker 1: that day there yesterday, there was there would be a
48:27
Speaker 1: long line of body bags containing bodies, and each one
48:31
Speaker 1: of those people have a name, and each one of
48:33
Speaker 1: those people have been traumatized um And one of the
48:37
Speaker 1: things that's done at the Medical Examiner's office is that
48:40
Speaker 1: toxicology has taken on each and every person when an
48:44
Speaker 1: autopsy is performed. And every one of these people were
48:47
Speaker 1: autopsy there homicide victims. You know who I want to
48:51
Speaker 1: see toxicology on. I want to see toxicology on Cruis.
48:54
Speaker 1: That's what I want to see. I want to know
48:57
Speaker 1: what poisons were in his system, because there is a
49:01
Speaker 1: consistent thread that is running through all of these shootings
49:06
Speaker 1: going back to Clee Bolton Harris. Things that I won't
49:10
Speaker 1: mention brand names, but medications that these people are on,
49:14
Speaker 1: and they're not being maintained when they take these medications.
49:18
Speaker 1: They're just kind of handed out like candy, and they're
49:22
Speaker 1: ripping a lot of these people's brains to shreds. Uh.
49:25
Speaker 1: It's not an excuse for what he did, because he's
49:28
Speaker 1: obviously planned this out. But I guarantee you UM people
49:33
Speaker 1: want to pass out blame for these events. I see. Uh.
49:38
Speaker 1: I see a lot of blood on the hands of
49:41
Speaker 1: people in UM, in the medical community that are passing
49:46
Speaker 1: this up. Another thing I want to figure out. Two. Uh,
49:50
Speaker 1: we have such a great panel of experts. Rob Hessel,
49:55
Speaker 1: you talk, you specialized in hardening targets. This school didn't
49:58
Speaker 1: have the doors locked. It was a quote open campus
50:01
Speaker 1: to my understanding. If I'm wrong, John Linely jump in,
50:04
Speaker 1: but I mean much locked down school where they locked
50:10
Speaker 1: the doors. And that's the way I like it. It's
50:13
Speaker 1: locked this any any idiot can walk in that all
50:17
Speaker 1: the teachers saw the guy walking in. Rob Hessel, Yeah,
50:23
Speaker 1: I think it definitely raises the conversation about an open
50:25
Speaker 1: campus environment. I mean, um, in my office, which is
50:29
Speaker 1: a commercial business twenty four hours a day, you cannot
50:33
Speaker 1: just walk into my office during business hours. It's a
50:36
Speaker 1: locked office environment so that we can identify who's trying
50:39
Speaker 1: to enter our building to keep our employees safe. So
50:42
Speaker 1: for a campus to be an open environment, I think
50:44
Speaker 1: we really need to take a look at that. I
50:46
Speaker 1: think our campuses need to be locked down. Kids and
50:49
Speaker 1: the faculty. We lock our homes at night. If we've
50:52
Speaker 1: got half a brain, why don't you lock your children
50:54
Speaker 1: in during the day? To Rob Hessel, Brian Levin and
50:58
Speaker 1: David Kats another issue to you, uh, David Katz? Why
51:04
Speaker 1: is everyone now making a big deal about the hat?
51:08
Speaker 1: He was wearing a Make America Great? Hat? Did am
51:11
Speaker 1: I missing something? What is the significance of him wearing
51:15
Speaker 1: that hat when he was target practicing in the backyard.
51:19
Speaker 1: That's something that's just another you know that. Remember, I
51:22
Speaker 1: think there was a knee jerk political response on both
51:24
Speaker 1: sides initially the reports that he was a dreamer because
51:27
Speaker 1: of the last name Cruise and they kicked and other
51:29
Speaker 1: people kicked back. He was a white supremacist. I hear you.
51:32
Speaker 1: Everybody's looking for somebody to lash out at. In my mind,
51:38
Speaker 1: there's so many red flags. The school knew, the teacher
51:43
Speaker 1: saw him walk in, the FBI knew, there were thirty
51:48
Speaker 1: nine arrest reports. I mean, what more could he do
51:51
Speaker 1: besides take out a billboard on Park Ave and he's saying,
51:54
Speaker 1: I'm going to shoot up my school? Well, I mean,
51:57
Speaker 1: what else could he do? You're exactly right, and we
52:02
Speaker 1: we always I mean, how many times do you here
52:04
Speaker 1: see something, say something, report to get involved what they did,
52:08
Speaker 1: and no action was taken. I mean, you can't. It
52:11
Speaker 1: is incomprehensible to me that with all these signs, this guy,
52:15
Speaker 1: this guy was not was not in the system. And
52:19
Speaker 1: you know, and now looking back, you know, I think
52:21
Speaker 1: I think if I had a guess, no one, no
52:24
Speaker 1: one in the FBI wrote a report on it. And
52:26
Speaker 1: that's why later on now they're kind of trying to
52:28
Speaker 1: backtrack and they make the phone call to the the
52:31
Speaker 1: person who initially made that made that uh complaining call
52:34
Speaker 1: to the the FBI and talked to that person because
52:38
Speaker 1: I think there was no action, and that's and that's
52:40
Speaker 1: going to be a problem for them. This is not
52:42
Speaker 1: just a story. This is not just fuel for the
52:47
Speaker 1: four hour cable shows and the radio and the print.
52:52
Speaker 1: This is real. Listen to this. Mother, Lori l hadus
52:59
Speaker 1: My daughter, Lissa ald was a beautiful young lady. Yesterday
53:03
Speaker 1: on Valentine's Day, I dropped her off at school and
53:06
Speaker 1: I said I love you. And then a few hours later,
53:09
Speaker 1: I get a call that there's a shooter at Stoneman
53:11
Speaker 1: Douglas High School. And I ran as fast as I
53:15
Speaker 1: could to get there, and I knew at that point
53:19
Speaker 1: she was gone. I felt it in my heart. How
53:22
Speaker 1: how do we allow a gunman to come into our
53:25
Speaker 1: children's school? How did they get through security? What security
53:29
Speaker 1: is there? There's no metal detectors, the gunmen. A crazy
53:34
Speaker 1: person just walks right into the school, knocks down the
53:38
Speaker 1: window of my child's door and starts shooting, shooting her
53:42
Speaker 1: and killing her. Nancy Chris christ Joys signing enough did
53:49
Speaker 1: that happen?