Latest / The Paul Barron Crypto Show / $FLOW Enters Next Phase Peak Money!🚀CEO INTERVIEW🔥Dapper Labs

Transcript

$FLOW Enters Next Phase Peak Money!🚀CEO INTERVIEW🔥Dapper Labs · The Paul Barron Crypto Show

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Let's dive in to a project analysis today. You guys
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: are going to love it because it's going to break
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: down flow and give you some insights to where this
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: chain is going, and we'll get started. I just want
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: to thank our sponsor today and that is I Trust Capital.
• 0:11
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• 0:14
  Speaker 1: term strategies around your crypto and the way you do
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: it is a CRYPTOIRA. One thing you can do, of course,
• 0:20
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• 0:22
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• 0:25
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• 0:28
  Speaker 1: you over there.
• 0:28
  Speaker 2: Man.
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: They've got a lot of news too happening, so keep
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: an eye. They are getting ready to launch a lot
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: of new products. This is the place for you if
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: you're considering cryptoiras. I want to go over to a
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: couple of points we've hit on for a while. Flow
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: is one of those ancient topics that we have had
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: here on the show, and it's one we've done a
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: variety of videos on from a lot of different angles
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: because we kind of like where it has been going.
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: And of course there has been times I know many
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: of you will say, well, Paul this hasn't been moving
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: here recently. Look at some of the fundamentals. We're going
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: to bring on Roham in a minute to kind of
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: break down what those are. If you look at the
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: activity right now flow price, you can kind of see
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: where we're going. This is the ranking right now one
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: hundred ninety one in terms of the overall coin market
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: cap position, and if you look at marketcap in general,
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: it has in been a downward motion. But of course
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: this may change as we start to see things happening
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: on chain with the TVL continuing to grow so pretty
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: significantly as well, when a lot of other markets have
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: not necessarily moved. And of course, if you compare over
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: on doom Analytics to some of the competition that are
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: out there, you've got flow adera ton near but notice
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: flow upward trend. Some of these other major tokens not
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: necessarily in the same place in terms of TVL comparison.
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: So that's kind of the thing that we're looking at here.
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: One other thing I want to kind of hit on
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: right here, this is one of the fastest growing l ones.
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: Based on a thirty day chain, you've got flow holding
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: it over one thousand percent doses in the run here.
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: Polygon is in the run here, so definitely in good
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: company going forward. And if you look and compare to
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: another chain, Swie, and you look at where Swie is
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: holding right now to one point fifty four, this could
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: get interesting because sw of course has a market cap
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: of that's right, guys, five point six billion right there,
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: so very interesting. As we start to move in, I
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: want to go over to our guest today, and that
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: of course is Roham coming in from Dapper Labs and Flow.
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: How are you, Roha, I'm doing amazing. Thanks for having me.
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: Nice to see you back. You were on our show
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: a couple times. We've had you a lot of updates.
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: I want to go right into the enshrined protocols model
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: that you guys have gone and done. Explain that to
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: our audience first.
• 2:46
  Speaker 3: Well, first of all, the concept here is that Dapper Labs,
• 2:50
  Speaker 3: the for profit corporation that the company responsible for NBA,
• 2:53
  Speaker 3: top Shot and a whole bunch of other successful crypto products,
• 2:57
  Speaker 3: is building on top of technology that's being built by
• 3:00
  Speaker 3: the Flow Foundation. So my former co founder, Deter Shirley
• 3:03
  Speaker 3: runs the Flow Foundation. They're going to build the protocol.
• 3:05
  Speaker 3: We're going to build the application. But the key point
• 3:08
  Speaker 3: about what we're doing differently this time is a protocol
• 3:12
  Speaker 3: is available for use for everybody to build on top of.
• 3:14
  Speaker 3: So it's enshrined in the sense that it's a dedicated
• 3:17
  Speaker 3: protocol for it's given use case on top of the
• 3:21
  Speaker 3: l one and it drives value and revenue back into
• 3:23
  Speaker 3: the native token. But it is an open network that
• 3:26
  Speaker 3: anyone can build on, unlike let's say MBA top Shot
• 3:29
  Speaker 3: the first version, which was more of a application that
• 3:33
  Speaker 3: was difficult for outsiders to build on top of.
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: So you guys, of course, have launched peak money. This
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: is going to be a new multi chain product earning
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: fifteen percent or more on your USA saving.
• 3:45
  Speaker 4: So explain this. What does this do for Flow?
• 3:47
  Speaker 3: Well, so here's the unique thing. So the first enshrine
• 3:50
  Speaker 3: protocol we're developing, it's called Flow Credit Markets. It's a
• 3:53
  Speaker 3: new kind of a lending protocol which has automation built
• 3:58
  Speaker 3: into the smart contract from the ground up. And so
• 4:00
  Speaker 3: what that means is borrowers can go much higher in
• 4:05
  Speaker 3: LTV while minimizing.
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: The risk of liquidation.
• 4:08
  Speaker 3: And we're going to be publishing all these papers that
• 4:10
  Speaker 3: show every single one of the crypto crashes over the
• 4:13
  Speaker 3: last ten years, this system would have ridden them out
• 4:16
  Speaker 3: with zero liquidation, which of course matters a lot.
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: To normal people.
• 4:20
  Speaker 3: If you stick your bitcoin or your stable coin somewhere
• 4:23
  Speaker 3: where you're trying to earn ten fifteen percent yield, you
• 4:25
  Speaker 3: don't want to end up with a liquidation if there's
• 4:27
  Speaker 3: a price drop or some sort of oracle exploit or
• 4:30
  Speaker 3: whatever it might be. So that's the fundamental core of
• 4:33
  Speaker 3: it is a lending protocol that lets us get higher
• 4:35
  Speaker 3: LTV while minimizing liquidation risks, and peak Money is a
• 4:39
  Speaker 3: wrapper around.
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: It that lets users bring whether it's stable.
• 4:42
  Speaker 3: Coins connecting their bank accounts, they can buy bitcoin, they
• 4:45
  Speaker 3: can buy ethereum.
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: Of course, they can also buy flow and.
• 4:48
  Speaker 3: Then they can put that into the lending protocol, borrow
• 4:51
  Speaker 3: out stable coins, put it into those yield sources delta neutral,
• 4:54
  Speaker 3: and that's where the yield is driven from. And it's
• 4:57
  Speaker 3: all transparent, all on chain, all nine because studial and
• 5:01
  Speaker 3: fully audited and auditable by any individual.
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: And that's just the start.
• 5:06
  Speaker 3: And so basically it's the model that shows what the
• 5:09
  Speaker 3: future of finance is going to be, which is, instead
• 5:11
  Speaker 3: of these complicated intermediaries and structures where you have to
• 5:15
  Speaker 3: negotiate individually. You just have autonomous tokens to sit in
• 5:19
  Speaker 3: user wallets and take actions that they're programmed to take
• 5:23
  Speaker 3: with assets all across the world. And so it's going
• 5:25
  Speaker 3: to start with cryptocurrencies obviously, whether it's bigcoin of theory inflow,
• 5:30
  Speaker 3: but it'll the same system applies equally well to any
• 5:33
  Speaker 3: tokenized asset. And as you know, trillions of dollars of
• 5:37
  Speaker 3: real world assets are going to be tokenized in the
• 5:39
  Speaker 3: coming years, and so that's the reason we are moving
• 5:43
  Speaker 3: into this direction. That's the reason we're so passionate about
• 5:46
  Speaker 3: making Flow fully interoperable with the Ethereum ecosystem, so liquidit
• 5:50
  Speaker 3: you can bridge in and now super easily. And the
• 5:53
  Speaker 3: applications that we're building are designed to let anybody take
• 5:57
  Speaker 3: advantage of the.
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: Power of tokenization and.
• 5:59
  Speaker 3: Defil whether they want to invest in sable coins or
• 6:02
  Speaker 3: sort invest in crypto, or just benefit from the increased
• 6:07
  Speaker 3: yield and the more complicated, more accessible investment products that
• 6:12
  Speaker 3: are going to be developed.
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: Okay, so explain to me how you protect against that,
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: especially liquidation issues or events that I've seen some products
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: out there that have kind of built this in, But
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: how does yours work?
• 6:26
  Speaker 3: So it's very simple. So basically, the on chain automation
• 6:29
  Speaker 3: looks at your position every single second, every single block,
• 6:32
  Speaker 3: which is actually faster than a second, and rebalances it
• 6:35
  Speaker 3: to make sure you don't get liquidated. And the way
• 6:37
  Speaker 3: it rebalances it because all we've done is we've taken
• 6:40
  Speaker 3: your bitcoin, we've put it into a lending protocol, we've
• 6:43
  Speaker 3: taken out stable coins, and those stable coins are sitting
• 6:46
  Speaker 3: somewhere earning yield. And so instead of selling your bitcoin
• 6:50
  Speaker 3: when the bitcoin price drops, we just unwind your USD
• 6:53
  Speaker 3: position here, pay back the USD debt so you don't
• 6:57
  Speaker 3: get liquidated, and when bitcoin pops back up, we take
• 7:00
  Speaker 3: out more USD put it into the yield source again.
• 7:03
  Speaker 3: And so effectively, as long as the yield source is
• 7:06
  Speaker 3: picked is chosen to be something that's built to usual
• 7:09
  Speaker 3: and denominated in the same currency as the as the borrow,
• 7:13
  Speaker 3: then that you're not liable to know, you're not exposed
• 7:16
  Speaker 3: to currency risk, and we're picking yield sources that are safe.
• 7:20
  Speaker 3: And again you can combine Trap five as well as
• 7:24
  Speaker 3: crypto hield sources.
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: I'm going to be interested in taking a look at this.
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: When does this thing launch? Is it available now?
• 7:31
  Speaker 3: So Flow Credit March this is on main net right now,
• 7:33
  Speaker 3: we haven't there's no like dev docs or anything. It's
• 7:36
  Speaker 3: still going through sort of final audits. Peak Money we're
• 7:39
  Speaker 3: opening the wait list December second. So by the time
• 7:41
  Speaker 3: this air is all right, the ways.
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: We get so perfect, so we'll have the launch of
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: Peak Money, you guys will be able to jump into this.
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: Because that's the problem I think a lot of people
• 7:50
  Speaker 1: have run into in a lot of these yield markets
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: is it's very complex getting into a moving your assets
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: in and out. You know, the problem that's been out
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: there for some time. What happens to like more Markets,
• 8:01
  Speaker 1: Kiddy Punch, you know some of these other platforms, what
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: happens to.
• 8:05
  Speaker 3: Those so more markets is the first lending protocol on
• 8:09
  Speaker 3: flow is a sort of a a and that's implementation.
• 8:14
  Speaker 3: We're working with that team really closely to make sure
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: everything that we're building on Flow Credit Markets is fully
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: EVM compatible. So I believe they're going to be the
• 8:22
  Speaker 3: EVM front end. So you can come with your metomass,
• 8:25
  Speaker 3: you can come with your Trust wallet, whatever EVM and
• 8:28
  Speaker 3: wallet that you have, and interact with the flow credit markets.
• 8:33
  Speaker 3: Smart contract that sits on the cadence side benefits from
• 8:36
  Speaker 3: you know, you know the higher safety and security and
• 8:38
  Speaker 3: lower cost etc. There, but but more markets basically becomes
• 8:42
  Speaker 3: the interoperability layer. Kitty Punch is the is the decks
• 8:46
  Speaker 3: that the sort of UNISWAP implementation that sits on Flow
• 8:50
  Speaker 3: and that's being used for all of the trading and
• 8:52
  Speaker 3: so this product will drive.
• 8:55
  Speaker 2: More and more volume into their application.
• 8:58
  Speaker 3: So for example, on peak money and you on ramp,
• 9:00
  Speaker 3: you're actually buying PayPal USC and you're swapping that for
• 9:05
  Speaker 3: rap BTC that's also natively deployed on Flow, So all
• 9:07
  Speaker 3: of that volume helps.
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: We've shown that, you know, in terms of the yield
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: numbers on Kiddie Punch. So that's what about the liquidity side,
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: it is similar to Deep Book, like what Deep Book
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: nds we have done in terms of liquidity depth.
• 9:19
  Speaker 3: Well, the liquidity depth is also something that's going to
• 9:22
  Speaker 3: be benefiting at the whole ecosystem because a big part
• 9:26
  Speaker 3: of this effort working is bridging in yield sources from
• 9:30
  Speaker 3: different currencies, working very closely with Larry Zero on there
• 9:33
  Speaker 3: okay LFT implementation as well, and making sure there's really
• 9:37
  Speaker 3: deep depth for currency swaps, whether it's between stable coins
• 9:41
  Speaker 3: as well as Bitcoin ethereum flow and stable coins.
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm just showing this was the deep book example
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: that was being used in terms of institutional grade liquidity.
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: This is a thing that I think will start to
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: take up because this, of course is Greyscale talking about
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: this right here, and it's going to be something that
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: we're probably going to see more sophisticated investors starting to
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: look at some of these kinds of platforms and utilize it.
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: Do you think we would see any kind of institutional
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: moves onto something like what you guys are doing with
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: Peak money the.
• 10:14
  Speaker 3: One hundred percent, I mean the both Peak money as
• 10:17
  Speaker 3: well as just deploying into the smart contract natively, because
• 10:20
  Speaker 3: a lot of the folks that are most interested right
• 10:23
  Speaker 3: now are folks that are already sitting on large amounts
• 10:27
  Speaker 3: of bitcoin stable coins. They're already in these yield farms,
• 10:31
  Speaker 3: and so this is a way for them to sort
• 10:33
  Speaker 3: of get more juice out of the.
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: Work that they're already doing.
• 10:38
  Speaker 3: And so those will be a big drivers of TVL
• 10:41
  Speaker 3: into flow credit markets to smart contract. But the Peak
• 10:44
  Speaker 3: Money product is aimed to be retail and it's going
• 10:48
  Speaker 3: to start with you know, millennial et cetera. But then
• 10:51
  Speaker 3: it's going to layer in more gamification, more opportunities for
• 10:56
  Speaker 3: sort of the asymmetric opportunities that exist in defive, make
• 10:59
  Speaker 3: those open and accessible without the complexity of the crypto side, right,
• 11:04
  Speaker 3: which is the key management, learning, the MeTV, the front running.
• 11:08
  Speaker 3: All of those kind of pieces We abstracted out completely.
• 11:12
  Speaker 3: Part of it because of just flowed natively has MeTV protection,
• 11:16
  Speaker 3: all of these things, but part of it because of
• 11:19
  Speaker 3: our application. So the on ramps are going to be
• 11:21
  Speaker 3: super simple credit card or bank account or just transferring
• 11:26
  Speaker 3: from you know, connect your coin based transferring from crypto.
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: So it's part user experience, part technology.
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: What about native vaults within the Flow wallet because we've
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: seen this in the slush wallet with Suite, we're starting
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: to see another wallet showing up vault control, vault management.
• 11:45
  Speaker 4: How are you guys going to do that?
• 11:47
  Speaker 3: So same concept. It will be an open, open system
• 11:51
  Speaker 3: where I think it's either earned off flow dot com
• 11:54
  Speaker 3: or vault stufflow dot com. That will be up in
• 11:56
  Speaker 3: the next week or so, and anybody can come in
• 11:59
  Speaker 3: and and create their own positions and eventually we'll be
• 12:03
  Speaker 3: able to design their own strategy, so it's a fully
• 12:05
  Speaker 3: EVM compatible as well.
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: We're using the same standard as Vada Vaults and UH and.
• 12:11
  Speaker 3: Others, and some of the strategy operators that are currently
• 12:14
  Speaker 3: most active on other chains are also coming in and
• 12:18
  Speaker 3: setting up their own strategy, so you can buy into
• 12:21
  Speaker 3: those vaults if you want access to different sort of
• 12:23
  Speaker 3: risk return profile. It's all transparent and auditible. But as
• 12:28
  Speaker 3: you mentioned earlier, part of the thing we're trying to
• 12:30
  Speaker 3: stay away from is just like black box DeFi thinking saying, hey,
• 12:34
  Speaker 3: there's just there's a percentage rate, and then you just
• 12:37
  Speaker 3: put it here and you've got to.
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: Trust and wish or hope yeah, yeah, hopetrate Dapper Labs
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: moving treasury on chain.
• 12:46
  Speaker 4: What stable coin are you guys going to use to
• 12:48
  Speaker 4: be p y ust.
• 12:50
  Speaker 3: We're the whole ecosystem is centered around PayPal USC right now.
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: There is obviously USDC as well and potentially telor downline.
• 12:58
  Speaker 3: But but you know, PayPal as represents kind of that
• 13:02
  Speaker 3: consumer vision as well, right and we want deep interoperability
• 13:05
  Speaker 3: with other consumer financial applications.
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: And the other thing to recognize is.
• 13:10
  Speaker 3: The programmability of all of this means that any consumer
• 13:13
  Speaker 3: product can now very easily give their consumers a wallet,
• 13:18
  Speaker 3: give those wallets access to DeFi.
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: Whether you're a game.
• 13:21
  Speaker 3: Whether you're a social network, whether you're anyone that has
• 13:24
  Speaker 3: consumer eyeballs, can use this as an opportunity to deepen
• 13:28
  Speaker 3: the relationship they have with their customer and make extra
• 13:30
  Speaker 3: money and effectively sort of offer the whole world of
• 13:34
  Speaker 3: DeFi to their customers. So these kinds of like platform
• 13:38
  Speaker 3: integrations we get really excited about.
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, would this update mean that Flow is deflationary because
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: I'm looking here at your statement. Update creates a direct
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: link between network usage network value. In fact, this model
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: is designed to make Flow token net deflationary at a
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: sustain two hundred and fifty tps.
• 13:56
  Speaker 4: That's basically the goal here. Or is it done? Yeah, exactly,
• 13:59
  Speaker 4: that's available.
• 14:00
  Speaker 3: That No, it's still going through community reviews and so
• 14:03
  Speaker 3: it's in the late stage of this kind of comment
• 14:05
  Speaker 3: period until next week something like that, But it seems
• 14:08
  Speaker 3: pretty positive that that it will go through. It'll still
• 14:11
  Speaker 3: even after this change, Flow is going to be the
• 14:14
  Speaker 3: cheapest high throughput network compared to even compared to L
• 14:17
  Speaker 3: two's like Base et cetera, where by far more efficient,
• 14:22
  Speaker 3: not because we're compromising on decentralization, but because of the
• 14:26
  Speaker 3: architecture where we have different note types and we don't
• 14:29
  Speaker 3: do any more work than is necessary, whereas most legacy
• 14:33
  Speaker 3: blockchain architectures or sort of every note does all of
• 14:35
  Speaker 3: the transactions in the network, And so that we have
• 14:39
  Speaker 3: a fundamental advantage that like the protocol layer for cost,
• 14:45
  Speaker 3: but the cost has been kept artificially low, and so
• 14:48
  Speaker 3: correcting that and I think that's going to be very important.
• 14:51
  Speaker 3: You know, the inflation on the network has been a
• 14:54
  Speaker 3: source of the cell pressure on the token, and so
• 14:57
  Speaker 3: fixing that is going to be a very important part
• 15:01
  Speaker 3: of making sure that activity on the network drives value
• 15:05
  Speaker 3: to the token economy, which is what leads to a
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: healthy sort of flywheel.
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, well it definitely could trigger some movement on the
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: price too, when you Okay, So the couple of points
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: that I wanted to hit on here in terms of apps.
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: First of all, you look at top shot. This is
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: just a from your statement. Had they launched on an
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: open protocol from day one, massive amount of liquidity wouldn't
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: have stayed in the silo, which is something that we've
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: talked about here on the show. Before it would have
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: flowed outward bootstrapping, lending markets, false strategies, RWA innovations. You
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: can kind of see that era is over, the regulatory
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: tailwind supporting now what we're seeing a crypto regulation here
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: in the US. This uncertainty is removed on various Dapper
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: labs flow independently share a unified mission network economic alignment.
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: So this changes a lot within Dapper Labs where they
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: could have maybe launched a token. This is gonna are
• 15:58
  Speaker 1: you going to see Do you think how quickly do
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: you think we'll see these strategies shift for major companies.
• 16:03
  Speaker 3: Like this, Well, I think the strategies are shifting already.
• 16:07
  Speaker 3: It's been a process. And but for our partners, let's
• 16:10
  Speaker 3: say the world's leading companies most love brands, Disney, MBA,
• 16:14
  Speaker 3: et cetera. Everyone is looking at what's going on here.
• 16:18
  Speaker 3: But it's really important to have a sustainable model where
• 16:22
  Speaker 3: you're you're actually benefiting your real community members. You know,
• 16:25
  Speaker 3: every time someone's launched a meme coin, every time someone's
• 16:28
  Speaker 3: launched a sort of speculative endeavor, it's gone through a
• 16:33
  Speaker 3: cycle that has harmed some of the most core fans,
• 16:37
  Speaker 3: and so That's what we're trying to do sort of
• 16:39
  Speaker 3: differently here is give a model for the world's best
• 16:42
  Speaker 3: companies and leading brands, major institutions to kind of interact
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: both with DeFi and kind of offering yield and these
• 16:49
  Speaker 3: sort of financial opportunities to their customers as well as
• 16:53
  Speaker 3: with fungible tokens and having using crypto incentives in a
• 16:57
  Speaker 3: way that builds sustainable and sort of healthy co ownership,
• 17:02
  Speaker 3: not this this sort of short term, sort of pump
• 17:06
  Speaker 3: and dump type type mentality.
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: Which has been the issue that we've seen with a
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: lot of tokens. You mentioned Disney. Do you think they
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: will embrace an open ecosystem like this, I mean, because
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: Disney's fairly locked up a lot of times in terms
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: of their IP.
• 17:22
  Speaker 3: Well, yeah, of course. I mean, the use of the
• 17:24
  Speaker 3: IP is really critically important. But that's also where blockchain
• 17:26
  Speaker 3: technology shines. And in a way, blockchain technology is digital
• 17:31
  Speaker 3: rights management on the Internet the way it always should
• 17:34
  Speaker 3: have been implemented, and you can bacon rules into every asset,
• 17:38
  Speaker 3: rules that can't be broken, and so that that mindset
• 17:41
  Speaker 3: shift from saying, hey, look, anything we put on digital
• 17:44
  Speaker 3: is basically kind of giving it away versus No, these
• 17:47
  Speaker 3: fans are our highest value fans. And even today within
• 17:51
  Speaker 3: Disney Pinnacle, within NBA Top Shot, we have a sustained
• 17:54
  Speaker 3: you know, one hundred plus dollars a user average revenue producer,
• 17:59
  Speaker 3: and the numbers are off the charts compared to let's
• 18:01
  Speaker 3: say subscription revenue or advertising revenue, which is fractions of that.
• 18:06
  Speaker 3: And so crypto is a whole new business model for
• 18:09
  Speaker 3: these brands. It's a business, new business model, new way
• 18:12
  Speaker 3: to engage with fans in a way that you know,
• 18:15
  Speaker 3: makes them not just consumers but co participants, co owners,
• 18:19
  Speaker 3: co promoters and everything that you're you're doing. And they're
• 18:23
  Speaker 3: they're one hundred percent seeing that.
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: Now.
• 18:24
  Speaker 3: The reality is, though, they've got billions of fans, and
• 18:27
  Speaker 3: so the technology has to work for not just the
• 18:31
  Speaker 3: you know, most tech savvy one to two million, It
• 18:33
  Speaker 3: has to be for everybody, and it has to be
• 18:36
  Speaker 3: rock solid and has to be proven for years and years.
• 18:39
  Speaker 3: And so I have no doubt that every major company
• 18:42
  Speaker 3: will adopt crypto rails as their economics sort of backbone,
• 18:46
  Speaker 3: and it's just a question of timeline.
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we're getting into a new era for sure. Obviously,
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: the regulation front has done that. But back to Disney first,
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: an why do you think? Okay, so the clarity here
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: is that this has not launched, you know still see Pinnacle.
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: That gets into a scenario where your NFTs are locked
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: up within the platform. What why do you think that
• 19:07
  Speaker 1: has been the case? I mean when is when are
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: we going to see a twenty four to seven marketplace here?
• 19:12
  Speaker 3: So so obviously you can look at kind of MBA
• 19:15
  Speaker 3: and NFL as models for those assets are fully able
• 19:18
  Speaker 3: to get pulled in and out of the custodial and
• 19:20
  Speaker 3: a consola environment. They can get listed on open See,
• 19:23
  Speaker 3: they can be collabteralized for loans, all of these things.
• 19:26
  Speaker 3: And as I mentioned, some companies are just more conservative
• 19:29
  Speaker 3: than others in the sense of needing more time for
• 19:33
  Speaker 3: something to age in the market before they can they
• 19:37
  Speaker 3: can adopt. You know, some things are like cheese to
• 19:39
  Speaker 3: some people. You need to let them age. And I
• 19:42
  Speaker 3: would say that's that's the approach here. But you might
• 19:44
  Speaker 3: have seen this year we announced with NBA top Shot
• 19:47
  Speaker 3: that all of the metadata, all of the videos, the
• 19:51
  Speaker 3: kind of the core pieces that make the NFT valuable
• 19:54
  Speaker 3: to the fans is going to be on chain and
• 19:56
  Speaker 3: that's the first in a IP and a major IP
• 19:59
  Speaker 3: back project and kind of means that it is actually
• 20:03
  Speaker 3: fully a decentralized digital object and that's powerful because it's
• 20:08
  Speaker 3: it's the precedent I think for all major IPS to follow,
• 20:13
  Speaker 3: and so it's kind of one step at.
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: A time, is how I would look at it.
• 20:16
  Speaker 3: Disney Pinnacle just formally launched a couple months ago. It's
• 20:19
  Speaker 3: been growing, it's been doing well, and you know the
• 20:22
  Speaker 3: other pieces, we're trying to really integrate it deeply into
• 20:24
  Speaker 3: the fan ecosystem. So whether it's Disney Plus, whether it's
• 20:28
  Speaker 3: you know, Anaheim Hotels in near Disneyland, whatever it might be,
• 20:33
  Speaker 3: We're trying to go where the fan is and we
• 20:34
  Speaker 3: want the digital product to be something that the partner
• 20:38
  Speaker 3: is comfortable enough sort of continuing to grow and putting
• 20:42
  Speaker 3: it out there instead.
• 20:43
  Speaker 2: Of you know, maybe financializing it too early.
• 20:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I mean we've been talking to this for
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: a while. I was looking back on our own channel.
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: This was nine months ago we were talking about getting
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: this done and you know, maybe now with regulation obviously
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: this plays into how companies are.
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: Taking well, so that yeah, I mean, look, the unlocking
• 21:02
  Speaker 3: ethereremce potential like that.
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: That happened, right.
• 21:04
  Speaker 3: We shipped that upgrade late last year, and since then
• 21:07
  Speaker 3: Flow has been number one or number two fastest growing
• 21:09
  Speaker 3: in terms of number of developers. As you showed the
• 21:12
  Speaker 3: DeFi chart, it's kind of the shape we like to see,
• 21:16
  Speaker 3: and I think the thesis kind of worked positively there.
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: Here's a question I have for you. I'm looking at
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: ESPN bet all right sportsbook. Why wouldn't this be automatically
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: on Flow? I mean, come on, this is like a
• 21:30
  Speaker 1: slam done, no pun intended.
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: I agree.
• 21:34
  Speaker 3: Look, I think the for one thing, the lines between
• 21:38
  Speaker 3: entertainment and finance are blurring, right like the new generations that.
• 21:43
  Speaker 4: ESPN is foking outside your door there. I think that's ESPN.
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: I think so they brought a helicopter.
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: I love it all right, Well, maybe Pin Entertainment could
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: do something here, because this would be a big one
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: for sure.
• 21:55
  Speaker 4: Bezy on the move right now?
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: What do you think is holding Busy from kind of
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: flipping courtyard right now? Courtyard kind of the king in
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: terms of where we're seeing a lot of these NFT
• 22:04
  Speaker 1: movements go.
• 22:05
  Speaker 3: I think they're they're doing really good work. The coolest
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: thing about BZ is they're not saying, hey, let's replace
• 22:11
  Speaker 3: every layer of the stack. They're not saying let's replace
• 22:14
  Speaker 3: their reseller, let's replace these partners. They're saying, let's build
• 22:18
  Speaker 3: software for them. It's almost like Shopify, let's empower all
• 22:21
  Speaker 3: of these everyone from card shops to folks like tach
• 22:24
  Speaker 3: grating to offer these and an open see the Open
• 22:28
  Speaker 3: Sea recently did a claw with z where they offered real.
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: World looking at right now, which is a good example
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: of that to your point.
• 22:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Yeah, So any any brand and and and anyone
• 22:44
  Speaker 3: with sort of distribution can go to them, grab their
• 22:47
  Speaker 3: full sort of stack and be able to put their
• 22:49
  Speaker 3: own user experience around it in.
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: Order to kind of create their own claw.
• 22:53
  Speaker 3: And I think that's how they catch up and and
• 22:55
  Speaker 3: then blow past sort of the impact the Courtyard has
• 22:58
  Speaker 3: had on market.
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: Okay, so gaming has been one of those things. I'll
• 23:03
  Speaker 1: just to kind of show here. We're just looking at
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: revenue general in terms of flow kind of being in
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: that top position right there. You see Courtyard kind of
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: controlling it right there. So the market is clearly ready
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: for something like this, for sure. You look at gaming
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: in general now in over the last I know, web
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: three gaming people will argue Web three gaming definitely not growing,
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: even though we saw Avalanche winning all kinds of award
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: just last week.
• 23:29
  Speaker 4: You know, at the Web.
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: Three gaming scenario, and then you look at what you
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: know Sue has been able to do with locking up
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: being Gordon. I mean, these are big moves for Web
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: three companies to be able to really kind of get
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: into the gaming cycle. Do you guys need possibly maybe
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: a gaming advisor, someone big who can we.
• 23:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah, look, I mean I know Bing well, he's actually
• 23:50
  Speaker 3: been an advisor to that for for many years now,
• 23:53
  Speaker 3: and he's recently kind of leaned back in on a
• 23:55
  Speaker 3: couple of the newer products we're building.
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: He's absolute genius.
• 24:00
  Speaker 3: And obviously we have other geniuses on our around the table,
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: like Mark Pinkus, founder of ZINGA, founder of v A.
• 24:10
  Speaker 3: We have, we have some amazing folks around the table.
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: And then the other thing to remember is every market shift,
• 24:17
  Speaker 3: every platform shift, new things emerge that make the new
• 24:21
  Speaker 3: realities of gaming different. And so in this one, you know,
• 24:24
  Speaker 3: it's it's it's open economies is a very important dynamics.
• 24:29
  Speaker 3: So we went after the co creators of Magic Gathering,
• 24:34
  Speaker 3: Richard Profils, Cafelius. They were part of our early advisory group.
• 24:38
  Speaker 3: They have some amazing folks around the table. I mean,
• 24:40
  Speaker 3: the reality is that the we're scratching the surface, and
• 24:44
  Speaker 3: we're scratching the surface on what crypto, what what crypto
• 24:47
  Speaker 3: can do inside games, What jen a I can do
• 24:49
  Speaker 3: inside games? What Crypto and jen a I combined can
• 24:52
  Speaker 3: enable inside games, like actual economic experiences that that are
• 24:58
  Speaker 3: impactful to daily life. Those products just take a little
• 25:01
  Speaker 3: bit longer to build. We're not that far away from
• 25:04
  Speaker 3: someone walking into a roadblocks bank and doing real banking
• 25:08
  Speaker 3: with their stalle coin wallet and accessing yield and all
• 25:11
  Speaker 3: of these all of these things that takes there.
• 25:14
  Speaker 1: What I'm hearing, which I like what I'm hearing. Everybody's
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: been kind of pointing to this for quite a while.
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: I mean, we've been gone back probably three years in
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: terms of our excitement around this, and of course then
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: we saw, you know, the market slow down. Obviously we
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: didn't have regulatory alignment, which is now a big factor.
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: I think that we'll move a lot of these big
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: companies and if the money comes in, then yeah, I
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: think we're going to see it. Let's talk flow rewards
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: real quick. Before I let you go flow rewards season
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: one over. When will we see season two? What is
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: that going to look like? Any new updates?
• 25:47
  Speaker 3: I think team is working on it, I'm not. I
• 25:50
  Speaker 3: think the main theme of it is that season one
• 25:53
  Speaker 3: was a great success. It was very focused on kind
• 25:55
  Speaker 3: of the consumer products, getting people to try different applications.
• 25:58
  Speaker 3: Season two will be very defive focused. The snapshow for
• 26:02
  Speaker 3: season was just taking a lot of goal Some people
• 26:04
  Speaker 3: who still have boxes and keys will be getting all
• 26:07
  Speaker 3: floy Air tropp and then the next season is going
• 26:10
  Speaker 3: to be the big one.
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: So stay tuned.
• 26:12
  Speaker 4: Yeah, very cool.
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: All right, listen, this has been a good one. Rohan,
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: thank you so much for coming into I love catching
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: up with you because you always get me excited about
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: stuff again. But it's fun to and maybe now we're
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: going to see some movement in the market. I think
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: this is one of those times where maybe there's a
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: window here that we start seeing things happen. Thanks for
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: coming in though, we appreciate it.
• 26:32
  Speaker 2: Thanks for having me was fun.
• 26:33
  Speaker 4: You bet all right.
• 26:35
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• 26:36
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• 26:38
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• 26:42
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• 26:50
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• 26:54
  Speaker 1: here on the Paul Baron showing