Latest / Networking Unleashed: Building Profitable Connections / Networking Unleashed: S1E44 An Interview with Frank King and Michael A Forman, Public Speaker

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Networking Unleashed: S1E44 An Interview with Frank King and Michael A Forman, Public Speaker · Networking Unleashed: Building Profitable Connections

0:17
and welcome to Networking Unleashed, Building
0:20
Profitable Connections. Welcome back to the show,
0:24
folks. I'm your host, Michael Foreman, and you're
0:27
listening to the podcast where networking is
0:30
more than just awkward handshakes and bad coffee.
0:33
It's an art and a talent. But here's the twist.
0:36
It's an art and talent you can actually learn.
0:40
Yes, even if you're the person hiding in a corner
0:43
at every event pretending to check emails. Networking
0:47
isn't just a nice skill to have, it's a game
0:50
changer. And when you get good at it, you'll
0:52
wonder why you didn't start sooner. More connections,
0:56
more opportunities, more profits. It's like unlocking
1:00
a cheat code for life. So whether you're the
1:03
life of the party or just the let me stay at
1:05
home and text type, I've got something for you.
1:08
So stick around and let's turn those awkward
1:11
small talk moments into big wins. I've got an
1:16
incredible guest today. His name is Frank King.
1:19
Let's say he's been around the horn a little
1:21
bit, and he has quite an extensive background.
1:26
But let me just tell you that Frank King is a
1:29
corporate comedian, TEDx speaker, and a suicide
1:33
prevention advocate with over 20 years of experience
1:36
as a writer for The Tonight Show. So before I
1:40
butcher his background, I really just want to
1:44
introduce Frank and let him tell you a little
1:46
bit more about it. Frank, how are you today?
1:48
Enjoying a wonderful cup of coffee. I'm good.
1:51
And I've been around the Horn twice, actually.
1:53
The Horn. First time around, the weather was
1:57
gorgeous. The sea was flat like a pool table.
2:00
I came up, I do stand -up comedy on cruise ships.
2:02
I've been to all seven continents, including
2:04
Antarctica, twice. And we were on our way to
2:07
Antarctica. And I come up on deck, I look, and
2:11
I... It's just a gorgeous day. And I said, what's
2:14
that big rock? To one of the pastors, he goes,
2:17
Frank, that's the horn. I go, it can't be. I've
2:21
seen pictures of this area when I was a kid.
2:24
Giant waves, sea serpents, ships flipping over,
2:27
guys falling out. It's going to be. But it was.
2:32
The second I went around, it was like that. The
2:34
ship didn't turn over, but it was ugly. I started
2:38
comedy in the fourth grade, nine years old. Actually,
2:41
people often ask me, were you born funny? Yes,
2:43
as a matter of fact. An amusing thing happened
2:46
on the way down the birth canal. But I was born
2:49
funny. Ninth grade, I told a joke. Kids laughed.
2:52
Teacher was hysterical. So hysterical, she had
2:54
to excuse herself to go to the teacher's lounge.
2:56
She was laughing so hard. I realized at that
3:00
moment I was going to be a comedian. Twelfth
3:02
grade, I'd been taking drama for three years,
3:04
never got a speaking part. Spring, they had a
3:08
talent show. And I thought, you know what? If
3:10
I do stand -up, I can write, direct, produce,
3:12
star my own little show every night. I'm going
3:14
to do stand -up. Nobody's ever done stand -up
3:16
at the talent show. And there's a picture of
3:18
me in the annual in a really ugly three -piece
3:21
suit holding the microphone and doing my stand
3:25
-up. And I won. Of course, I beat the accordion
3:27
player and the folk dancer, so not a huge victory,
3:29
but still a victory. Went home, told my mama,
3:32
I'm going to L .A. She goes, no, son, you're
3:35
not. You are going to college first. I don't
3:39
care what you do when you get done. You can be
3:41
a goat herder for all I care. You're going to
3:43
be a goat herder with a college degree. So UNC
3:47
Chapel Hill picked up a couple of college degrees,
3:49
neither of which I've ever used. But I graduated
3:52
and then bolted for the West Coast. And 40 years
3:56
ago, this coming April 1st, I was doing my first
4:00
open mic night. And inside my head about halfway
4:03
through, I heard a voice. You're home. Decided
4:08
that moment. I would do it for a living. Had
4:10
no idea how. Matter of fact, Michael, I've threatened
4:14
for years to write a keynote called, What Could
4:16
You Do If You Didn't Know No Better? Because
4:20
had I known how hard it was to make a living
4:22
doing stand -up, I might not have tried. 18 months
4:25
later, said to my girlfriend, now my wife of
4:27
37 years, I'm going on the road to be a comic,
4:30
full -time. You want to come along for the ride?
4:32
Figuring she'd go, oh, hell no. She goes, yeah.
4:35
So we gave up the apartment. and our jobs. Jumped
4:38
into my tiny Dodge Colt and we were on the road
4:41
for 2 ,629 nights in a row non -stop. Club to
4:46
club, beer bar to beer bar, pool hall to pool
4:49
hall, drunk idiot screaming, tell us some jokes
4:51
we can dance to. Here comes the slow one. You
4:55
can slow dance. And seven years and change. And
4:59
then came off the road to do radio in my old
5:01
hometown of Raleigh, North Carolina. Got a job
5:03
on The Morning Show, the number one morning show
5:04
in Raleigh, North Carolina. And in 18 months,
5:07
I drove it to number six. A friend of mine said,
5:11
you didn't drive that into the ground. You drove
5:12
it into Middle Earth. I did. And then I made
5:15
the jump to corporate comedy because the clubs
5:18
are closing faster than they were opening. People
5:20
ask me, what's the difference between a club
5:22
comic and a corporate comic? About $5 ,000 a
5:25
night plus travel. Yeah, I'm no math major, Michael,
5:28
but that made sense. Some of my really pure comic
5:32
purists friends, you sold out. You went corporate.
5:36
Yes, I did. I'm a prostitute, but I'm a high
5:39
paid prostitute. That's right. Did that till
5:42
2008 when the bottom dropped out of the speaking
5:44
slash comedy market with the recession. Lost
5:48
everything in a chapter seven bankruptcy. That's
5:51
when I learned what the barrel of my gun tasted
5:52
like. Spoiler alert, I did not pull the trigger.
5:57
When speaking came back, meeting planner said
6:00
to me, Frank, we love you. Can't pay you five
6:02
grand anymore just to be funny. You have got
6:04
to teach the audience something. I had no idea
6:06
what to teach. But a friend of mine, Judy Carter,
6:08
wrote a book called The Message of You, Turn
6:10
Your Life into a Money -Making Speaking Career.
6:12
She gave me a copy. She goes, Frankie, you read
6:14
this, you'll figure it out. And she takes you
6:16
by the hand and walks you through the process.
6:18
Halfway through, I thought, I do have something
6:20
to talk about. Given my near suicide, two mental
6:22
illnesses, the fact, Michael, there are more
6:24
nuts in my family than in a squirrel turd, I
6:27
could keynote on suicide prevention if I got
6:29
some training, which I did. Then I thought, now
6:32
wait a minute. I've been doing comedy for two
6:35
and a half decades. Who's going to take me serious
6:37
about anything? So my wife said famously, do
6:40
a TEDx. And I said famously, what's a TEDx? As
6:44
I get ready to do my 13th TEDx, I got an application
6:47
that week from a TEDx in Vancouver, BC. And so
6:50
I applied, I auditioned, I got it. And then two
6:53
more events called and said, do you have any
6:55
more mental health topics? Yes, I do. Those are
6:59
my first three. So I proved to people that I
7:02
could do something deadly serious, literally
7:03
deadly serious, with humor, funny personal anecdotes,
7:07
not jokes, but anecdotes. And by the way, there's
7:09
a rule in comedy, Michael. You can make fun of
7:12
any group to which you belong. And having two
7:16
mental illnesses and coming close to killing
7:18
myself, I am doubly qualified. So that's the
7:23
long and the short, and I've been doing that.
7:25
I had other speeches. I had a networking speech,
7:27
as a matter of fact. I have a networking speech
7:29
that will make you cry. It's a story about networking.
7:33
It's about how I network to help someone out.
7:36
And at the end, I said, look, if I don't ever
7:39
do anything good for anybody else in my lifetime,
7:41
that story right there should get me into heaven.
7:44
But I decided January 1st, 2018, I'm just going
7:48
to be a suicide prevention speaker. Because Jane
7:51
Atkinson, the wealthy speaker coach, said, pick
7:52
a lane. Be the expert or thought leader. Just
7:55
do one thing. and figure out who needs that thing
7:58
and is willing to pay for it. So I thought, okay,
8:00
I'm a suicide prevention speaker. And I've been
8:03
doing that since 2018. I'll tell you, from my
8:10
experience as a speaker, that was always the
8:13
case. Pick a lane. Pick a lane, go to it, and
8:16
you'll do wonders. It's worked so far. And hearing
8:20
it from you with your vast experience tells me
8:23
that I was given the right advice. Okay, so I'm
8:26
going to go right into the questions. Yeah. How
8:29
has networking played a role in your mission
8:32
to raise awareness about suicide prevention?
8:36
I'm a big believer in giving value first without
8:41
expectation of return. My mother taught me that.
8:45
I didn't know she was teaching me that. She loved
8:48
to network, although we didn't call it that at
8:50
the time. People would call her all hours, day
8:52
and night. and ask if they could get some help
8:54
from her. And if she could help, she would do
8:56
her best to help them. And I'm watching this
8:59
as a child, to no benefit of her own, just because
9:02
she knew somebody who could probably get it done,
9:05
and she took great pleasure in getting it done.
9:10
And so I have networked with other entertainers,
9:14
other speakers in my career, and I think that's
9:17
the key, a key to success. is the network. It's
9:22
a lonely business as a speaker, as a comedian.
9:25
You're doing it by yourself. So I believe you
9:27
have to build a network. And I believe when you
9:31
network, it's like a garden. You have to tend
9:34
it. You have to nurture it. I'm still in touch
9:38
with my eighth grade history teacher. Was Miss
9:42
Hill, now Mrs. Goody. And I needed something.
9:46
I needed, oh, I needed, somebody called me, a
9:49
fraternity brother of mine. had a daughter who
9:51
graduated from college, and she wanted to work
9:53
in a school where they worked with autistic kids.
9:56
And I said to him what my mother would say, I'll
9:59
see what I can do. So I called Ms. Godey, who
10:01
had been a teacher in Raleigh, North Carolina,
10:04
and on the Wake County School Board, and said,
10:07
listen, here's the deal. She graduated college,
10:10
she's really bright, she wants to work, and so
10:12
we helped to network her into a job in Cary,
10:15
North Carolina, at one of the top schools for
10:18
autistic kids in the South. So that's eighth
10:22
grade teacher. Your network goes way, way back.
10:26
Yes, and the greatest thing I've ever done, networking
10:31
-wise, was I was taking a martial arts class
10:35
on Whidbey Island, Washington, and I had a fellow
10:39
student, Elise. And Elise came in crying one
10:44
day. And I said, what's wrong? She said, we're
10:47
trying to adopt a child from Nepal. My husband's
10:50
there now. It's the last visa he will have because
10:52
we can't afford to send him back again. And I
10:56
said, what's holding up the audition? She said,
10:58
well, the birth mother signed off, the birth
11:00
father signed off, the Nepalese government signed
11:01
off. What's the catch? Homeland security. I said,
11:07
look, I've never had a three -year -old, but
11:08
I can't believe he's that big a terrorist. So
11:11
before I could stop myself, Michael, I said exactly
11:15
what my mother would say. I'll see what I can
11:17
do. And I believe there's power in giving voice
11:21
to that. Because as I'm driving home, I'm thinking,
11:24
I'm a comic on Whidbey Island. How do I impact
11:28
international relations or politics? And then
11:31
it occurred to me. There was a guy in Raleigh
11:34
that went to junior high school a year or two
11:35
ahead of me named Tom Fetzer. And then he became
11:37
mayor of Raleigh. He was mayor of Raleigh when
11:39
I was there working for the radio station. So
11:41
he got reacquainted to the YMCA. And so Tom...
11:44
is a Republican operative. He worked for Bill
11:47
Good, Strom Thurmond, and Jesse Helms. But the
11:53
thing was that this is during the George W. Bush
11:57
administration. So pretty much everybody in town
12:00
is a Republican. And this woman, Elise, was connected
12:03
with the two senators and the governor in Washington
12:06
State, but they're Democrats. So that was where
12:09
she's getting jammed up. So I called Tom. I said,
12:14
Tom, I told him a story. He said, just as my
12:17
mother would say, I'll see what I can do. Now,
12:19
Tom and I agree on nothing political, nothing.
12:23
But we agree on humans and kids. So Tom said,
12:29
I'll see what I can do. So that was Tuesday.
12:31
On Thursday, I got a call back from him. I said,
12:34
how'd it go? He said, Frank, I called Elizabeth
12:37
Dole, who was a senator in North Carolina at
12:40
that time, Liddy Dole. And I told her the situation.
12:44
And she called Homeland Security. And what happened
12:48
at Homeland Security? And he said, Frank, and
12:51
I'm quoting, I tore him a new asshole, end quote.
12:56
And so the word went out from Washington, D .C.
12:59
in a diplomatic pouch to Nepal to say, cut the
13:02
kid loose. But I don't know. I go back to class
13:06
on Monday morning and Elise is not there. And
13:09
I'm thinking, oh, man, it didn't work. Tuesday,
13:12
no, Elise. I can't believe we got so close. Tuesday,
13:17
I go to the grocery store after class. I'm pushing
13:19
my little buggy. I come around the corner. There
13:21
stands Elise holding the hand of a darling little
13:24
three -year -old child. I'm crying. She's crying.
13:29
His name is Avi. Avi looks me in the eye and
13:32
goes, Avi, go pee. I said, yes, and on American
13:38
soil, I might add. So I don't know if it's possible
13:44
to have that kind of impact on three people's
13:46
lives very often in a lifetime. So if I never
13:49
do anything good again, the fact that I helped
13:52
to bring them together to pull that off across
13:55
the international date line and Tom Fetzer, who
13:59
we agree on nothing politically, but he did it
14:02
because he could do it. I did it because I thought
14:04
I could do it. And Lady Dole apparently likes
14:07
kids and likes Tom. And there we go. You're at
14:12
the right place at the right time. You knew the
14:14
right people. And you never even knew it. And
14:17
I couldn't stop myself from saying, I'll see
14:19
what I can do. Oh, dear God, did I say that out
14:21
loud? Yeah. You know what? It's ingrained in
14:23
your system. Because your first thought is to
14:26
help somebody. Yeah. And so what comes out is
14:30
what your mother said. So it goes a long way.
14:34
It really does. And you can never be faulted
14:37
for doing the right thing. You can be, but. That's
14:39
beside the point. But at least you tried. Except
14:43
this time you tried and something came out of
14:45
it. It's a beautiful thing. It really is. What
14:49
advice do you have for professionals who want
14:52
to build meaningful connections that foster mental
14:56
well -being in their networks? A, what I learned
15:00
from my mom was when you meet someone, don't
15:02
think about what they can do for you. Focus on
15:04
what you can do for them. Because a lot of people
15:07
make that mistake networking. They're passing
15:09
out business cards, they're hustling, they're
15:11
trying to figure out what the person they're
15:12
talking to can do for them. Again, I believe
15:15
you figure out what you can do for them without
15:18
expectation of return. And Zig Ziglar famously
15:21
said something on the order of, help enough people
15:23
get what they want, and there's a good chance
15:25
you'll get what you want. Absolutely. That's
15:29
one of the main things that I talk about when
15:32
I go, when I speak. So you have to go into that
15:37
situation. What can you give? Don't think about
15:41
receiving. When you're meeting with somebody,
15:43
you say, how can I make you more successful?
15:47
Or how can I be a good referral source for you
15:50
without even thinking what I can do for me? So
15:54
that's a very good. So we're right on line with
15:56
the same thing. How did you leverage networking
15:59
to land your TED Talk, and what tips do you have
16:04
for others looking to do the same? I can't swear
16:08
that I used my networking as a leverage to get
16:12
the TEDx. Okay. It's a very simple process. You
16:16
apply, you audition, you get it. And there was
16:19
no one, I didn't have anybody in the TED world
16:23
that I could use, that I could contact and say,
16:25
hey, listen, can you help me? Although I coach
16:29
TEDx. We have a program called the TEDx Launchpad.
16:33
And the first half an hour is always free. Now,
16:36
obviously, I want to sell them the program. But
16:40
oftentimes, we realize very quickly that they
16:43
don't have the money, even to finance it. We
16:46
have financing. But I don't cut the call short
16:49
because they don't have the money. What I do
16:52
is I say, look, here's the deal. You want to
16:54
be a speaker? Yes. You want to do a TEDx? Yes.
16:55
Okay. Here's how you get started very inexpensively.
16:59
Buy Judy Carter's book, The Message of You. Figures
17:02
under 20 bucks. Buy Talk Like Ted by Carmine
17:06
Gallo. It's a great TEDx 101. Again, under 20
17:09
bucks. I can get you started down the path to
17:11
be a professional speaker and have a TEDx talk
17:13
if you just buy those two books. Now, that said,
17:19
when you start putting yourself out as a speaker,
17:21
I would recommend you... If they ask your fee,
17:24
$5 ,000 plus travel. That's a starting point
17:26
nowadays. B, when you're filling out TEDx application,
17:29
pro tip. Some of them say, who do you want to
17:32
nominate? It's a way, I believe, of them cutting
17:36
down the number of people who fill them out because
17:37
you're thinking, who's going to nominate me?
17:40
Here's what they don't tell you. You can nominate
17:42
yourself, which they don't tell you. So I try
17:46
to give them tips and tricks and things for free.
17:50
that will ease, that will speed their journey,
17:52
even though they can't afford. It's obvious they
17:56
can't afford. And I have some other pro tips
17:58
on when you go to audition, make sure you have,
18:00
they're going to go, great idea. Now, what are
18:03
you going to teach the audience? Make sure you
18:04
have learning objectives, you know, figured out.
18:07
And then they're going to ask you, great, what's
18:09
the takeaway? So make sure you have takeaways
18:10
figured out. Because I had a speaker call me
18:13
one day. He'd gotten an audition and got blown
18:15
out. I said, how'd you get blown out? He goes.
18:18
Frank, they asked me for my learning objectives.
18:20
What's a learning objective? I'm thinking, how
18:22
long have you been speaking? So yeah, so I give
18:25
them tips that they, for 40 bucks, they can do
18:28
all that on their own and not use me. And it's
18:32
to no benefit of mine. Maybe they might, if somebody
18:37
else, they asked me what they can do for me.
18:39
If somebody says, I want to do a TEDx or I want
18:41
to make money speaking or I want to do both,
18:43
just say, I know a guy. Absolutely. And which
18:48
I happen to have you in my little knapsack also,
18:52
because you're the first name that comes off
18:55
my lips if somebody asks me that question. OK,
18:58
so you're right there. OK, so what's the most
19:03
impactful connection you've made through public
19:06
speaking and how did it change your career? The
19:11
most impactful was personally was the one I told
19:15
you. Oh, I know. I took a class, an eight hour
19:20
class on mental health, no, suicide prevention
19:23
in the workplace from Dr. Sally Spencer Thomas.
19:27
And she lost her brother to suicide. And she's
19:31
a psychologist. And she is big deal. She's a
19:35
big deal in the world of suicide prevention.
19:38
And she has a friend named Sarah Gare, who's
19:41
a therapist who teaches suicide prevention to
19:43
first responders. So they're friends. I didn't
19:46
know Sarah, but I met Sally. I did the class.
19:50
She had a fundraiser. I'm an auctioneer as well.
19:53
So I just charged her for my travel and I went
19:56
and did the auction. It was in an airplane hangar
19:59
in Colorado in the summer. I was sweating like
20:02
George Bush at a spelling bee. It was horrible.
20:05
I did it for travel. So Sarah teaches first responders
20:11
about suicide prevention. Most of them are men.
20:16
She wanted to buy a book on men's mental health
20:19
for one of her students. She went to Barnes &
20:22
Noble, brick -and -mortar store, nothing. Amazon,
20:26
nothing. She thought, there's a vacuum. So she
20:30
contacted Sally, said, I've got an idea. So Sally
20:34
thought it was a great idea. They contacted me,
20:38
because Sally knew me. She said, Frank, listen,
20:40
here's your idea. And we want to make it funny.
20:43
Would you make the book funny? I said, wait a
20:47
minute. You two ladies are writing a book on
20:49
men's mental health. Don't you think you might
20:51
need a co -author who is, I don't know, a man?
20:54
I said, here's the deal. I'll make it funny.
20:58
If I can be a co -author and I can record the
21:03
books for Audible, narrate them. So no money
21:06
for me besides a third of whatever profit we...
21:10
make on the books. And I haven't seen a dime
21:13
yet. And that was years ago, but that was the
21:16
best connection because Sally and Sarah are,
21:18
and I helped Sarah get a TEDx talk. Two of them,
21:21
as a matter of fact, didn't charge her a dime.
21:25
So it's, and Sally already had a TEDx. So I wasn't
21:28
able to, but that, that probably right there.
21:31
And by the way, I have never seen a psychologist,
21:34
psychiatrist or therapist. I'd never been officially
21:36
diagnosed until. We were working on book one
21:40
and I described my symptoms to Sally and Sarah.
21:43
And they said, you have major depressive disorder
21:45
and chronic suicidal ideation. So they diagnosed
21:48
me and they were absolutely right. But again,
21:51
I took Sally's class. I did the auctioneering
21:54
for travel with no expectation of anything else.
21:57
And lo and behold, they called me. And now it
21:58
was going to be one book, an anthology, 12 guys.
22:02
Each one has a problem. Life's good. Life's bad.
22:04
Here's how I'm coping. And we figured if we get
22:07
12 guys to be honest about their issues, we'd
22:10
be lucky. We got 60 guys. So it became four books.
22:14
So I am a best -selling author on Amazon four
22:17
times over. Now, I was the best -selling author
22:19
on the day they went up. It didn't last very
22:23
long. Somebody said to me, how long are you going
22:25
to call yourself a best -selling author? Until
22:27
the day I die. That's right. Because I am. I
22:33
have four best -selling. books on Amazon, thanks
22:36
to networking with Sally with Sarah. And that's
22:40
probably the most impactful. Outstanding. Outstanding.
22:44
Okay, let's move the needle a little bit. How
22:47
does humor help break down barriers and create
22:50
stronger connections in professional? It's not
22:55
just professional events. Pretty much anywhere.
22:59
It's disarming. And it's To make people laugh,
23:06
you have to make a connection. They have to be
23:10
seeing the world the way you see it to make them
23:15
laugh. And it brings down barriers. Laughing
23:23
is an unguarded moment. And so whether it's in
23:29
a social situation or a business situation or
23:31
a comedy club. if you can make them laugh and
23:35
it's a gift. I believe I was born funny and funny
23:41
thing happened all the way down the birth canal.
23:43
And so it's, it greases the wheels of interaction
23:48
with other humans. They automatically see you
23:52
differently than they did the moment before.
23:56
I'm in the airport. There's a mechanical problem,
23:59
a delay. Everybody at the gate is cranky. They're
24:02
upset. They're going to miss the wedding or whatever.
24:06
And so, grumble, I'm standing under television.
24:09
And on the television above me is CNN. And pretty
24:13
much everybody can hear the broadcaster. And
24:16
the guy standing next to me goes, hey, how do
24:19
we get this TV turned to Fox News? And I said,
24:23
you kill me first. Everybody in the gate is laughing.
24:28
They're still upset the play's not leaving, but
24:30
it changed the mood of the gate like that. And
24:33
now, oh, and when I came to Eugene, I knew one
24:37
person. It was the woman I bought insurance from
24:41
on the rental house we owned in Eugene. So I
24:45
called her and she goes, Frank, you need to go
24:46
to this, they call it greeters. It's a sub, it's
24:49
a committee of the chamber, greeters. You need
24:53
to go to greet. My husband's big in greeters.
24:55
He'll hold your hand. And so they meet in the
24:58
morning for breakfast. And her husband introduced
25:01
me around and we're all sitting there. And just
25:04
by chance, the person who was supposed to speak,
25:06
because they always have a speaker at the meeting,
25:08
didn't show up. So I said, how about some comedy?
25:13
And Kelly, who was the co -chair of the committee
25:16
at the time, told me later, I'm thinking to myself,
25:20
okay, it's Springfield, Oregon. How funny can
25:23
he be? So they let me get up on a chair. So I
25:29
did a theater round. And I've been doing comedy
25:31
by this point for, I don't know, 25 years. And
25:36
when I've been listening, which I think is important
25:39
in networking, I've been listening to, as people,
25:42
you go around the room and introduce themselves.
25:44
They give their name, the name of the business,
25:45
their tagline. So I knew there was a mortician
25:48
there, a travel agent there, and several other
25:50
occupations. And I had jokes for each one in
25:53
my repertoire. So I stood up and I did 15 minutes,
25:57
20 minutes of just, and they're going nuts. So
26:04
from not knowing anyone, all of a sudden, every
26:08
one of those 60 people at the meeting knows who
26:10
I am and that I'm funny. Well, get this, the
26:14
next week, the same thing happened. The speaker
26:17
didn't show. So I said, how about some comedy?
26:19
And Kelly said, we could do comedy or give 10
26:22
people members two minutes each to talk about
26:24
their business. What do you guys want to do?
26:26
And they all screamed comedy. I got up again.
26:33
And that's how I became known in Springfield
26:37
with all those business people instantly. Comedy
26:42
always seems to work the best. I, too, believe
26:46
in comedy. I sprinkle it into whatever talks
26:50
that I have because it keeps everybody involved.
26:54
You have everybody's attention. That's just one
26:56
of the ways. But I truly believe it's very important.
27:00
What business professionals learn from comedians
27:03
about building rapport and engaging in the audience
27:07
and audience? In comedy. A, you have to read
27:12
the room. Absolutely. During the recession, all
27:17
my bucket list was being a police officer. I
27:20
was 52 years old. And I thought I was too old.
27:23
But I met somebody in one of the departments
27:25
who said, Frank, there's no age limit. They can't
27:28
do that. You pass the law enforcement physical
27:31
fitness test, they have to at least consider
27:33
you for hire. So I started training. And I applied
27:38
with 12 different departments. And I passed the
27:41
physical fitness test four times. Oldest person
27:42
in the state of Washington ever passed. And at
27:45
one of the oral boards, they said, look, what's
27:49
the connection between comedy and being a police
27:51
officer? And I said, we're both paid observers.
27:54
A comedian has to read the room. Police officers,
27:57
they pull up on a scene. Maybe it's like a gathering
27:59
at an intersection. They have to take the temperature
28:03
of the situation. And I said, as in comedy. In
28:09
police work, whatever you say first can either,
28:14
in police work especially, either escalate the
28:16
problem or de -escalate the problem. So a comic
28:19
will know, will read the room, read the intersection,
28:22
and probably figure out who's in charge of this,
28:25
who are the leaders of this thing, and then what
28:28
they need to say first to de -escalate. So in
28:34
comedy, you've got about, I don't know, 30 seconds,
28:38
a minute to get their attention and make them
28:42
comfortable with the fact that you're funny.
28:46
When I do ships, stand -up comedy on ships, the
28:49
first 10 minutes, I do my bullets, my A material.
28:53
I tell speakers in comics, open with a 10. Anything
28:56
that's a 10, open with it. Anything that's a
28:59
10, close with it. In between those, that's where
29:02
all the 6, 7, 8, 5, 6, 7, 8 pieces of business
29:05
go. You need to open strong and close strong.
29:08
So I do 10 minutes, and then I do what they call
29:10
audience work. I go to the audience. I've made
29:12
the audience comfortable. They know I'm funny.
29:14
They know I'm not talking to them just because
29:16
I got nothing else to say. So I think you need
29:20
to focus on that opening. And a friend of mine
29:23
wrote a book. It's called Finding the Funny Fast.
29:26
And it's not for comics. It's for people who
29:28
find themselves at a podium or rostrum, and they
29:31
have to speak. And her idea is that you need
29:35
to... take in the environment and say something
29:40
funny based on the environment. For example,
29:43
when I'm in Vegas, oftentimes it seems like the
29:47
conference room I'm working in is miles from
29:49
my, you know, my hotel room. So I get up there
29:53
and go, look, I'm sorry I'm a little late. I
29:55
don't know about you guys, but my room is long
29:58
way from here. I'll tell you how long it is.
30:00
I got rolling luggage. I had to stop and rotate
30:02
the tires. Now, they've all experienced that.
30:06
They're all probably far away from, or there's
30:09
a little bottle of water in the room, and it's
30:12
five bucks for 10 ounces. So I go, you guys have
30:16
a bottle of water in your room? It's five bucks.
30:19
You know what that means? Here in Las Vegas,
30:21
it's actually cheaper to drink the gasoline.
30:25
Again, what you're looking for is commonality,
30:28
relatability. You want to relate to the audience,
30:32
something that they can wrap their minds around,
30:34
something that hopefully they've experienced.
30:37
And again, it brings those barriers down. I guess
30:39
the bottom line is you got about 60 seconds as
30:41
a comic and as a speaker to get their attention.
30:45
And because they've invested their time, they
30:47
want you to be good, but they want to know that
30:49
right away. Good, good. And you're speaking right
30:53
along the same lines as when I talk. I'm thinking
30:56
about my... talks and the way that you're describing
31:00
it. And I'm just about there, but I'm already
31:04
thinking about how I'm going to rearrange things
31:06
because of what you just said. But that's for
31:09
a story for another day. What's the best networking
31:13
lesson you've learned from your journey in comedy,
31:17
the speaking, and suicide prevention? I think
31:22
it's a lesson that I already knew, that giving
31:24
value first without expectation of return. And
31:27
figuring out what you can do for somebody when
31:28
you meet them, not worry about what they can
31:30
do for you. And a friend of mine who sells radio
31:34
in this town, I sold radio one summer for a cumulus
31:37
cluster of stations. Somebody had asked her,
31:40
somebody new at their station in sales, asked
31:43
her about how to succeed in sales. And she said,
31:48
don't sell anything for the first three months.
31:52
Just show up. In other words, just go to the,
31:57
Springfield Chamber meeting, the Eugene Chamber
31:59
meeting, the Eugene Chamber after hours. Just
32:02
keep showing up, not selling a thing. Just have
32:05
a presence in the community for three months.
32:10
Don't sell a thing. Don't pitch anything. Just
32:13
show up. And I think that's good advice. I think
32:17
they're young. They're excited. They want to
32:19
make the sales and whatever. And listen. When
32:25
I sold radio, The average salesperson in the
32:31
company had a 20 % close rate. My close rate
32:35
when they fired me was 94%. Because what I did
32:42
was, which most radio people don't do, I took
32:45
what they call a spec spot out to every closing
32:48
appointment. In other words, I actually wrote,
32:50
produced, and voiced a commercial for that client.
32:56
And the way I did that was when I met the client,
33:00
I listened. Oftentimes they would tell me exactly
33:03
what should be in that ad. I went to another
33:06
repair shop. Guy's name is Bob. Still friends
33:09
to this day. I go, Bob, tell me about the repair
33:13
shop. They said, we're not the home of the 1999
33:15
oil change. Hold on. Which in radio, they call
33:20
a disqualifier. You want to disqualify the people
33:23
you don't want to come. You want to qualify the
33:24
people you want. I go, what are you the home
33:26
of? We're the home of the 24 ,000 mile, 24 month,
33:32
24 ,000 mile nationwide warranty. Hold on. So
33:37
that's how I wrote. They wrote the ads for me.
33:42
One of them was a construction company that did
33:44
remodels, kitchen and bath. And their thing was,
33:48
look, if you're looking for, hang on, there's
33:51
a cat down here. We have six cats and this one
33:53
wants to come up. Hold on. Honey, I'm working.
33:56
Come here. Pardon me. I've got to get a hold
34:01
of the table. Okay, there you go. Here we go.
34:04
Yep. So they did remodeling, and their thing
34:09
was, if you're looking for three bids like your
34:11
dad told you to do, that's not. Their thing was,
34:16
you bring us a budget and a dream, and we'll
34:18
make it work. So the spot I wrote was... They're
34:22
the one client that didn't buy from me. And I
34:26
wrote some Cracker Jack spots for them. One of
34:29
which was, bring whatever the name of the construction
34:33
company was. Yeah, what can I do for you? I'm
34:36
looking for three bids. Click. And you can hear
34:39
the click in the commercial. And then the phone
34:41
rings again. You can hear the guy pick it up
34:43
in the commercial. Yeah, hello, what can I do
34:45
for you? Oh, we got cut off. I'm looking for
34:47
three bids. We didn't get cut off. We don't do
34:49
that. Click. It was hysterical. And they didn't
34:55
buy it. But the point is, they wrote it for me.
34:59
All I had to do was take dictation. So I would
35:03
say in networking, listening is much more important
35:06
than talking. Absolutely. I couldn't agree more.
35:10
I couldn't agree more. How do you approach networking
35:13
in high stakes or emotionally challenging environments?
35:19
Comic. Here's your answer. I come in wearing
35:24
Kevlar and heavily armed. And again, it's like
35:28
that thing at the airport where I was just waiting
35:31
for an opening to break the tension. And the
35:34
guy couldn't have been better opening. It was
35:36
perfect. People say things, and if you're listening
35:39
carefully, again, listening. I thought for the
35:42
longest time, Michael, that everybody thought
35:44
the way I did. That they all, when something
35:47
happened, they saw the punchline and I was just
35:50
beating everybody to the punch. So one day at
35:53
the grocery store, I decided to give it a road
35:55
test, if that was true. I don't know if you ever
35:57
do this, but I like to look at the things that
35:59
people in front of me are buying and people behind
36:01
me are buying on the belt. It's a guilty pleasure.
36:04
And so the guy in front of me, he had a bag of
36:09
frozen shrimp. a quart of motor oil now it just
36:13
so happened it was back in the day when that
36:16
oil well blew up in the gulf of mexico remember
36:18
that hundreds of thousands oh yeah yeah the oil
36:20
so i'm looking at shrimp in that oil and i know
36:25
what the punch line is but i decided i'm just
36:27
gonna wait and see if anybody else the cashier
36:30
that guy the guy behind me i waited nothing so
36:35
i said dude that's an interesting purchase there
36:38
that's frozen shrimp and Motor oil. Are you going
36:41
to serve those Louisiana style? The cashier bends
36:45
over double. And when she gets back up, she goes,
36:49
you should be a comedian. I get that a lot. So
36:52
I realized, Michael, that not everybody thinks
36:55
that way. Comedy is a great, it's an icebreaker.
36:59
It levels the playing field. People all of a
37:03
sudden are taking you. You know, they see you.
37:07
Is there just a blur? Absolutely. Yeah. It's
37:13
the best icebreaker. It's the best tension breaker.
37:16
It's good in many different facets. But I am
37:21
a true believer in the comedian because you wear
37:25
all sorts of hats. You can diffuse many problems
37:28
without even diffusing the problem. You can just
37:31
be yourself. And you can find funny things in
37:35
just about everything. Just about everything.
37:38
And I think if you combine comedy and empathy,
37:41
I read a book called The Like Factor. The Like
37:46
Factor. And one of the things he said was, you
37:49
should always open an email, especially if you're
37:51
going to be turning somebody down or saying something
37:53
that they don't want to hear. Open it with an
37:56
empathetic statement. Listen, I understand how
38:00
busy you are. I get that. And then go into whatever
38:02
it is. Or I understand your point of view. You
38:06
can also do that in real life. And he said, here's
38:09
an example. And this has happened to me many
38:11
times. I'm standing at the rental car counter
38:14
behind somebody. And the guy in front of me is
38:16
just raking the poor rental agent over the coals.
38:21
And so... He said, in that case, what you do
38:24
is you need to let them know, the rental agent
38:26
know, you saw what happened, you understand what
38:30
happened, and you're sympathizing or empathizing.
38:33
So the way I do it is, the guy's screaming and
38:35
yelling at the poor agent behind the counter.
38:37
They stomp off. And I walk up and I go, hey,
38:42
listen up. I've got a car rental named Frank
38:43
King. Here's my driver's license. And I go, listen,
38:46
I just got one question for you. At what point
38:48
during this traction, this transaction, do I
38:51
get to yell at you? Now they're laughing. They
38:55
know I know what just happened. I took note of
38:57
it and I made them laugh. So if you combine empathy
39:02
and humor like that, where you're being empathetic,
39:07
but you're also being funny in the process, then
39:11
I think that's very powerful. Yeah, I still say
39:16
you can find funny things or comedic value in
39:20
just about everything. do or it happens or but
39:24
you have to make the decision whether you say
39:26
something about it or not because i always see
39:31
the comic the comedic value and so i find comedy
39:34
in just about everything my wife tells me to
39:37
shut up all the time okay so i know i know the
39:41
feeling i know the feeling but it's what you
39:44
have to put up and by the way what oftentimes
39:48
when i do that i get the upgrade on the automobile
39:51
Or the upgrade to the Economy Plus seat on the
39:55
plane. I remember I'd done that, and the woman
40:01
handed me keys, and it was a Spyder. I can't
40:05
remember what company makes the Spyder. It was
40:07
a Spyder convertible. Okay. It's sheet metal
40:11
and an eight -cylinder engine. It's dangerous.
40:15
But it was not a midsize basic. I go. This spider
40:21
is a midsize. She goes, it is today. Yep. Yep.
40:29
Always. I would say almost always works out in
40:34
your favor. Yeah. Almost always. All right. Can
40:37
you share a story where a simple conversation
40:39
or connection led to an unexpected opportunity?
40:47
I think the key there. networking key is again
40:51
is it make it about them ask leading questions
40:54
because it may appear at first that there's nothing
40:58
you can do for them but if you ask leading questions
41:00
i'll give you an example when i'm on a plane
41:03
and i'm sitting next to somebody and we're going
41:05
to have a conversation i ask leading questions
41:08
through the flight never talk about myself what
41:12
i do why i'm there and oftentimes at the end
41:15
as we're coming in for a landing They go, you
41:18
never said what you did. I said, I'm a comedian.
41:21
You're not that funny. I said, I'm off the clock.
41:24
Get your checkbook out. We'll yuck it up. One
41:28
of the leading questions I ask is, and this surprise
41:31
comes at the end. The leading questions I ask
41:35
is, if you ask a question about how somebody
41:38
feels about something, I believe is a powerful
41:41
question. If you ask about their emotional. or
41:45
whatever it is you're asking about. And one of
41:47
the questions, I've got to grab the cat again.
41:49
It's like she forgot she was up here. I ask,
41:52
what do you do for a living? And I'm an attorney.
41:57
And I go, do you enjoy that? And if there's a
42:00
pause, Michael, yeah, then I know they don't.
42:04
So the woman sitting next to me, I said, what
42:06
do you do for a living? She goes, I set up booths
42:09
at exhibit halls for conferences. I said, do
42:12
you like that? Pause. Yeah, it's not a bad job.
42:17
I go, here's the deal. What if I could wave a
42:20
magic wand and you could do anything you wanted?
42:23
I said, did your husband have a job? Good pay?
42:26
Yeah. If you quit tomorrow, would you guys survive?
42:30
Yeah. So if I could wave a magic wand, you could
42:32
make money doing anything you want to do. What
42:35
would it be? And I can't remember what she said.
42:37
However, a year later, I got an email. Frank,
42:41
I sat next to you on a flight to wherever it
42:43
was. And you ask me, what would I do if I could
42:45
do anything for a living? And she goes, I'm doing
42:49
it. So by just asking leading questions and especially
42:57
ones that evoke an emotion, how do you feel about
43:00
that? Do you enjoy that? And that was a surprise.
43:04
I flew next to a pilot once. He was the head
43:07
pilot for United Airlines or one of those. There
43:09
were two airlines merging. So they had two head
43:11
pilots. So somebody's going to lose a job. He's
43:15
on his way to Dallas to find out whether he was
43:16
going to take the job or not. Gets a job. I go,
43:19
man, what if the worst happens? And they blow
43:21
you out and they pick the other guy. If you could
43:24
do anything in the world you wanted, rather than
43:26
being the head pilot for United, what would it
43:28
be? Sous -chef. What? He'd been a sous -chef
43:34
in college and he'd... That was a surprise. And
43:41
by the way, Michael, I just realized I've got
43:43
a Zoom starting two minutes ago. Do you have
43:45
another question before we go? You know what?
43:47
I do. But you know what? Let me just close it
43:50
up by saying I can talk to you for another two
43:52
hours. OK, that goes without saying. But if somebody
43:57
wants to get hold of you, Frank, what's the best
44:00
way that they can do it? Oh, that's easy. MentalHealthComedian
44:04
.com. MentalHealthComedian .com. That's my brand.
44:07
That's my website. All the information is there,
44:10
email, phone number, calendar link. Beautiful,
44:14
Frank. Frank, I don't want to keep you from your
44:16
next Zoom meeting, but I had a great time talking
44:19
to you, and I'm going to keep you in mind in
44:22
case anybody needs that kind of help. I'm telling
44:25
you, I'm going to send them your way. Well, and
44:28
may I close out the podcast the way a comic would
44:30
do it? Absolutely. Okay. If you enjoyed this
44:34
podcast, please rate, review, and subscribe,
44:36
and tell your friends. If you did not enjoy this
44:39
podcast, we hope you have no friends. Thank you,
44:48
Frank. I'll talk to you soon. Well, hold on,
44:52
folks. Don't go anywhere. Let me just read a
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-U -P -K -I -D -S .org. Well, that's a wrap,
46:11
folks. A huge thank you to our special guests
46:14
for sharing such incredible insights today. And
46:17
of course, a big shout out to you, our amazing
46:21
listeners, for tuning in and spending your time
46:24
with us. Remember, networking isn't about being
46:27
perfect. It's about being present. So take what
46:31
you've learned today, get out there and make
46:33
some meaningful connections. If you enjoyed this
46:36
episode, don't forget to subscribe, leave us
46:39
a review and share it with someone who could
46:42
use a little networking inspiration. Let's keep
46:45
the conversation going. You can find me on Apple,
46:49
Spotify, YouTube or my website, Michael. Remember.
46:54
Until next time, keep practicing, keep connecting,
46:57
and keep building those relationships. This is
47:00
Michael signing off. Take care and happy networking.