Latest / Banned Camp: Banned Books, Comedy, and Free Speech vs. Censorship / The Catcher in the Rye | Ch. 25.2: She Showed Up With a Suitcase | Banned Books Podcast

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The Catcher in the Rye | Ch. 25.2: She Showed Up With a Suitcase | Banned Books Podcast · Banned Camp: Banned Books, Comedy, and Free Speech vs. Censorship

Welcome to Band Camp.
I'm Jennifer.
And I'm Dan, and this is the podcast where we read banned books out loud and try to figure out why they were banned in the first place.
Season 11 of Banned Camp begins Tuesday, June 9th, and we are going to read "The Handmaid's Tale."
But first, we need to finish up this season with a bang.
This season, of course, we're reading "The Catcher in the Rye" by J.D.
Salinger.
If this is your first time here, you might be confused, you might not.
We hope to limit your confusion with our secret weapon.
We have ourselves a robot.
Look at this guy.
Buddy, roll it in here.
Shake a tail can.
Shake a tail can.
Let's go.
Let's go, buddy.
Why don't you remind everyone where we left off last time in "The Catcher in the Rye"? Previously on Band Camp, Holden Caulfield walked down Fifth Avenue asking his dead brother to keep him alive.
Jennifer said he's caught between the world where someone tells you what to do and the world where nobody does.
So this yo-yo created an escape fantasy where he built a cabin at the edge of the woods, got himself a job pumping gas, and decided he'd pretend to be a deaf mute so nobody would talk to him.
Oh yeah, he also dreamed up a beautiful deaf mute wife.
Then he wrote Phoebe a note saying goodbye.
Goodbyes rarely go the way you planned them, especially when someone you love shows up and wants to come with you.
Take it away, Jennifer.
Thank you, robot.
And with that being said, Scary Book people, let's continue chapter 25 of J.D.
Salinger's, "The Catcher in the Rye."
I went over to the stairs and sat down on the first step and took out the pad and pencil I'd bought.
The stairs had the same smell they used to have when I went there, like somebody'd just taken a leak on them."
Gross That's not cool.
You mean there were these types of people back in the '40s? School stairs always smell like that.
Anyway, I sat there and wrote this note.
Dear Phoebe, I can't wait around until Wednesday anymore, So I will probably hitchhike out west this afternoon.
Meet me at...'
Is he not gonna see her play? what you have to understand, Jennifer, is Holden is a rambling man.
as of That kind of thing Meet me at the Museum of Art near the door at quarter past 12 if you can, and I will give you your Christmas dough back.
I didn't spend much.
Love, Holden.
Her school was practically right near the museum, and she had to pass it on her way home for lunch anyway, so I knew she could meet me all right.
Then I started walking up the stairs to the principal's office so I could give the note to somebody that would bring it to her in her classroom.
I thought he was going up to the principal's office because it's just muscle, Muscle memory.
He just realized, "Oh, I'm in I gotta go up.
I don't know.
I did something wrong I folded it about 10 times so nobody'd open it.
You can't trust anybody in a goddamn school.
But I knew they'd give it to her if I was her brother and all.
While I was walking up the stairs though, all of a sudden I thought I was going to puke again.
Only I didn't.
I sat down for a second, and then I felt better.
But while I was sitting down, I saw something that drove me crazy.
Somebody'd written "Fuck you" on the wall.
It drove me damn near crazy.
I thought how Phoebe and all the other little kids would see it, and then how they'd wonder what the hell it meant, and then finally some dirty kid would tell them, all cockeyed naturally, what it meant, and how they'd all think about it and maybe even worry about it for a couple of days.
I wanted to kill whoever'd written it.
I'd figure it was some perverty bum that sneaked in the school late at night to take a leak or something and then wrote it on the wall.
Well, I wonder how...
So, so Holden probably found out, that's probably his experience.
Some cockeyed perverty kid.
cause he's magnet for the perverts.
Yeah, I know.
I looked at the F word as being relatively new.
Like, that's something, uh, my generation came up with.
You wanna take all the credit, don't you? Not all of the credit, just enough.
I'm reminded of the censorship letter that Kurt Vonnegut wrote to that school board in Nebraska or whatever.
Where was it? Robot, help a girl out.
In 1973, Kurt Vonnegut wrote a letter to the head of a school board in North Dakota after they burned copies of Slaughterhouse-Five.
The part you're thinking of goes like this: "If you were to bother to read my books, to behave as educated persons, you would learn that people speak coarsely in real life.
Even our most sheltered children know that.
It is evil deeds and lying that hurts children."
Thank you, robot.
I don't know.
I, I think that kids are already aware of these words, and, um, it's kind of like a rite of passage into adulthood.
You know, you, you do learn that there are- Yeah good things and bad things and, you know, that's, it's called a dirty word for a reason.
And, like, you don't have to say the word, but you can't just go through life not knowing about the bad things.
Kurt Vonnegut ends the letter with saying, "You should also resolve to expose your kids to all sorts of opinions and information," I would argue including dirty words, "in that they will be better equipped to make decisions and to survive."
Like, you can't just go out there all innocent, 'cause the world will eat you alive then.
This will be an explicit episode.
There is simply no way around it.
But to your point, that is all Moms for Liberty and, uh, and you too, Ron DeSantis, you little stupid scamp.
Have some more pudding.
Atta boy.
That is their whole thing, though, is to let's pretend things don't exist, and hopefully we can eliminate them at the same time.
Like- Mm LGBTQ+ people are really, man, they do not fit in our world.
I wish they'd just stop existing.
But in the meantime, let's just pretend they don't exist.
Let's pretend this doesn't exist.
Let's pretend this doesn't exist.
Meanwhile, they're raising their kids so, like you've said, they're going out in the world blind because i- they withheld critical information.
I figured it was some perverty bum that sneaked in the school late at night to take a leak or something and then wrote it on the wall.
I kept picturing myself catching him at it, and how I'd smash his head on the stone steps till it was good and goddamn dead and bloody."
But, well, he's got a lot of violence there.
really does.
He just turned into Winston thinking about a woman in 1984.
but I knew, too, wouldn't have the guts to do it.
I knew that.
That made me even more depressed.
I hardly even had the guts to rub it off the wall with my hand, if you want to know the truth.
I was afraid some teacher would catch me rubbing it off and would think I'd written it.
But I rubbed it out anyway, finally.
Then I went on up to the principal's office.
The principal didn't seem to be around, but some old lady around 100 years old was sitting at a typewriter.
I told her I was Phoebe Caulfield's brother in 4B1, and I asked her to please give Phoebe the note.
I said it was very important because my mother was sick and wouldn't have lunch ready for Phoebe, and that she'd have to meet me and have lunch in a drugstore.
She was very nice about it, the old lady.
How great would it been if she said, I know exactly who you are," and she points her thumb to the back wall where there's like a to all the shenanigans this kid pulled when he there She took the note off me and called some other lady from the next office and the other lady went to give it to Phoebe.
Then the old lady that was around 100 years old and I shot the breeze for a while.
She was pretty nice, and I told her how I'd gone there to school too, and my brothers.
She asked me where I went to school now, and I told her Pencey, and she said Pencey was a very good school.
Even if I'd wanted to, I wouldn't have had the strength to straighten her out.
besides, if she thought Pencey was a very good school, let her think it.
You hate to tell new stuff to somebody around 100 years old.
They don't like to hear it.
Then after a while, I left.
It was funny.
She yelled, "Good luck" at me the same way Old Spencer did when I left Pencey.
God, how I hate it when somebody yells, "Good luck" at me when I'm leaving somewhere.
It's depressing.
What? How? such a head on his own and he's gotta do it by himself? how possibly...
I hate it when people show me any form of consideration.
I really do.
I went down by a different staircase and saw another "fuck you" on the wall.
vandal is prolific Do you think this kid has a route where he goes around every to repaint "fuck you" on the wall because the man took his art down? I tried to rub it off with my hand again, but this one was scratched on with a knife or something.
Yes.
It's hopeless anyway.
If you had a million years to do it in, you couldn't rub out even half the 'fuck you' signs in the world.
It's impossible."
True.
He's realizing that he can't stop it.
is like sweeping the water away from the ocean as it comes in.
So stop fighting it.
You gotta learn to deal with it, right? I looked at the clock in the recess yard, and it was only 20 to 12, so I had quite a lot of time to kill before I met old Phoebe, but I just walked over to the museum anyway.
There wasn't any place else to go.
I thought maybe I might stop in a phone booth and give old Jane Gallagher a buzz before I started bumming my way west, but I wasn't in the mood.
For one thing, I wasn't even sure she was home for vacation yet, so I just went over to the museum and hung around."
You know, he should really call that girl he likes Especially now that skipping town.
No, he shouldn't skip town.
He should call the girl he likes, hang out with her, trim her tree for Christmas.
well, he should do it with the girl he How am I gonna tree tree? What do you about that, Jane Gallagher? he should hang around, see his little sister's school play.
Get gifts for his parents.
Maybe visit without, uh, not Allie.
JD? No, wait.
Who's the one who's a writer? DB.
That's a lot like JD.
JD Salinger? DB.
JP Mandrell.
JP, right? JD Mandel He should just hang out with his family 'cause, you know, you gotta stick the people you love.
In fact, why, if you are going to skip town, why not go to Hollywood and hang out with your brother? At least that's family.
He doesn't wanna be a person.
See, that would be being a person.
He just wants to be persona non grata.
He just completely...
Like, he doesn't like people.
He, and he doesn't wanna be one.
So, in he's a deaf mute changing oil out in Colorado, know? So I just went over to the museum and hung around.
While I was waiting for Phoebe in the museum, right inside the doors and all, these two little kids came to meet me and asked me if I knew where the mummies were.
The one little kid, the one that asked me, had his pants open.
I told him about it, so he buttoned them right up where he was standing talking to me.
He didn't even bother to go behind a poster.
And what, why would it...
It's already open.
It's okay to, like, button while you're in front of somebody, right? what? It's, the fastest way to fix it You just go, "Hey, little man, your barn door is open," and he'll take care of it.
Don't worry about the technique.
Where are the mummies, fella?" The kid said again.
"You know?" I horsed around with the two of them a little bit.
The mummies? What are they?" asked the one kid.
You know, the mummies, them dead guys that get buried in tunes and all."
Tunes, that killed me.
He meant tombs.
How come you two guys aren't in school?" I said.
"No school today," the kid that did all the talking said.
He was lying, sure as I'm alive, the little bastard.
I didn't have anything to do, though, till old Phoebe showed up, so I helped them find the place where the mummies were.
Boy, I used to know exactly where they were, but I hadn't been in that museum in years.
You two guys so interested in mummies?" I said.
Yeah."
Can't your friend talk?" I said.
"He ain't my friend.
He's my brother."
Holden, you do It sounds you are talking He's not my friend.
I love that.
Holden, you do realize it sounds like you are talking to a junior version of you Yeah, a little bit.
Can't he talk?" I looked at the one that wasn't doing any talking.
"Can't you talk at all?" I asked him.
Yeah," he said, "I don't feel like it."
Finally, we found the place where the mummies were, and we went in.
You know how the Egyptians buried their dead?" I asked the one kid.
"Nah."
"Well, you should.
It's interesting.
They wrapped their faces in these cloths that were treated with some secret chemical.
That way they could be buried in their tombs for thousands of years, and their faces wouldn't rot or anything.
Nobody knows how to do it except the Egyptians, even modern science To get to where the mummies were, you had to go down this very narrow sort of hall with stones on the side that they'd taken right out of this pharaoh's tomb and all.
It was pretty spooky, and you could tell the two hotshots I was with that they weren't enjoying it too much.
They stuck close as hell to me, and the one that didn't talk at all practically was holding onto my sleeve.
So they're scared.
It's a scary thing because it's death, guess.
I don't think an accident he's talking about mummies, Mummies as in mom or mummies as in death? Dan, that's the stupidest thing you've said in 10 seasons.
my pleasure...
I think it has to do with his, fear of changing and death.
You know, I think it's obvious to me why he's talking about mummies in this chapter, "Let's go," he said to his brother.
"I seen him already.
Come on."
He turned around and beat it.
"He's got a yellow streak a mile wide," the other one said.
"So long."
He beat it, too.
So these little kids are also scared of death and mummies.
I was the only one left in the tomb then.
I sort of liked it in a way.
It was so nice and peaceful.
Then all of a sudden, you'd never guess what I saw on the wall.
It was another fuck you.
You've got to be kidding me It was written with a red crayon or something right under the glass part of the wall, under the stones.
That's the whole trouble.
You can't ever find a place that's nice and peaceful because there isn't any.
Perfect sentence! Yes, accept it.
The sooner it Holden just you accept And understand it…, life is a dream, buddy boy.
You can't ever find a place that's nice and peaceful because there isn't any.
You may think there is, but once you get there, when you're not looking, somebody'll sneak up and write "Fuck you" right under your nose.
Try it sometime.
I think even if I ever die and they stick me in a cemetery, and I have a tombstone and all, it'll say, "Holden Caulfield" on it, then what year I was born and what year I died, and then right under that it'll say, Fuck you."
I'm positive, in fact.
Fuck you.
Well, to be fair, you don't see that in cemeteries often, Holden.
Holden thinks someone is going to graffiti his tombstone with a great big F you.
It got me thinking about vanity tombstones.
Dan's would probably say he shared his thoughts with the world.
The world did not ask.
Jennifer's would say she needed a minute.
Mine would say beloved by no one, correct about everything.
Now I want yours, and don't give me something boring like loving mother or rest in peace.
Give me the real one, the one your friends would write when nobody from the church is looking.
Funniest answers make the show.
Easiest way to answer is a Spotify comment or bandcamppodcast.com/soundoff.
After I came out of the place where the mummies were, I had to go to the bathroom.
I sort of had diarrhea, if you wanna know the truth.
You know what? I don't wanna know the truth don't need-- we don't need the truth.
Lie to us.
Say that you're having solid stools.
I didn't mind the diarrhea part too much, but something else happened.
When I was coming out of the can, right before I got to the door, I sort of passed out.
I was lucky, though.
Oh, this happened to you yesterday.
Okay When you slipped on the Potty Squatty.
Okay, it's called a Squatty Potty you I hope you you look like an idiot now.
If you're trying to cut me down, everyone is agreeing with me that you look like the dummy It's called Squatty Potty.
I don't even know why we have a Squatty Potty in our house.
Anyway, go on.
could've killed myself when I hit the floor, but all I did was sort of land on my side.
It was a funny thing, though.
I felt better after I passed out.
I really did.
My arm sort of hurt from where I fell, but I didn't feel so damn dizzy anymore.
It was about 10 after 12 or so then, so I went back and stood by the door and waited for old Phoebe.
I thought how it might be the last time I'd ever see her again.
You know, speaking about being dedicated to his mother, it's like there's the mother's grief right there.
It's like you're s- it's sad when the kids move, and it's sad when you lose control of them, and that, it's like maybe he dedicated it to his mom because this is every mom's experience, like watching the corruption of her children So it's like maybe like that pain is why he dedicated this book to her.
That's interesting.
Because it's real hard to be a mom to a kid, especially if the kid is this guy of a sudden, I looked at the clock in the check room, and it was 25 of 1:00.
I began to get scared that maybe the old lady in the school had told that other lady not to give old Phoebe my message.
I began to get scared that maybe she told her to burn it or something.
it really scared the hell out of me.
I really wanted to see old Phoebe before I hit the road.
I mean, I had her Christmas dough and all.
Finally, I saw her.
I saw her through the glass part of the door.
The reason I saw her, she had my crazy hunting hat on.
You could see that hat about ten miles away.
You know why she has that on? She's probably been wearing it to school every day.
Yeah.
Yeah, she looks up to her big brother.
It would be tragic if he really did this.
went out the doors and started down these stone stairs to meet her.
The thing I couldn't understand, she had this big suitcase with her.
She was just coming across Fifth Avenue, and she was dragging this goddamn big suitcase with her.
Her parents finally got to her.
She cracked Yeah.
She's had She's gonna a Build-A-Bear someplace and live.
Uh-uh, out.
It was so big she could hardly drag it.
When I got up closer, I saw it was my old suitcase, the one I used to use when I was at Wooten.
I couldn't figure out what the hell she was doing with it.
"Hi," she said when she got up close.
She was all out of breath from that crazy suitcase.
"I thought maybe you weren't coming," I said.
"What the hell's in that bag? I don't need anything.
I'm just going the way I am.
not even taking the bags I got at the station.
What the hell you got in there?" She put the suitcase down.
"My clothes," she said.
"I'm going with you.
Can I? Okay?" "What?" I said.
I almost fell over when she said that.
I swear to God I did.
I got sort of dizzy, and I thought I was going to pass out or something again.
This is really important because he should see that he's influencing her in all the ways, and if he wants to make the world better, he needs to be an example, not run away, not be a coward and run You should open that Waldorf School and teach kids how to be good people.
that's how kids learn to be good people is from examples good your whole thing in life was you, you told Phoebe that your dream job would be the catcher in the rye, the, the, the person who would catch little kids before they started to fall into adulthood and hurt themselves.
This is your chance, buddy.
I took them down the back elevator so Charlene wouldn't see me.
It isn't heavy.
All I have in it is two dresses and my moccasins and my underwear and socks and some other things.
Feel it.
It isn't heavy.
Feel it once.
Can't I go with you, Holden? Can't I, please? No.
Shut up.
I thought I was going to pass out cold.
I mean, I didn't mean to tell her to shut up and all, but I thought I was going to pass out again.
Why can't I? Please, Holden? I won't do anything.
I'll just go with you.
That's all.
I won't even take my clothes with me if you don't want me to.
I'll just take my...
You can't take anything because you're not going.
I'm going alone, so shut up.
Please, Holden, please let me go.
I'll be very, very, very...
You won't even.
You're not going.
Now shut up.
Give me that bag, I said.
I took the bag off her.
I was almost all set to hit her.
I thought I was going to smack her for a second.
I really did.
She started to cry.
I thought you were supposed to be in a play at school and all.
I thought you were supposed to be Benedict Arnold in that play.
I said it, and I said it very nasty.
What do you want to do? Not be in the play, for God's sake? That made her cry even harder.
I was glad.
All of a sudden, I wanted her to cry till her eyes practically dropped out.
Now why is he being so cruel? I think he's trying to be cruel so she doesn't wanna come with him.
Really? I think he's being cruel because he doesn't want her to want to be with him.
Like, he's like, he just wants to be a non-person, and so he doesn't want her to grieve him.
So the fact that she's grieving him makes him hate her, which is really twisted.
I don't like it.
That's probably why I don't like Holden.
Like, I just-- maybe he'll come to realization, though.
I wanted her to cry till her eyes practically dropped out.
I almost hated her.
I think I hated her most because she wouldn't be in that play anymore if she went away with me.
Come on,' I said.
I started up the steps to the museum again.
I figured what I'd do was I'd check that crazy suitcase she'd brought in the check room, and then she could get it again at three o'clock after school.
I knew she couldn't take it back to school with her.
'Come on now,' I said.
She didn't go up the steps with me, though.
She wouldn't come with me.
I went up anyway, though, and brought the bag in the check room and checked it, and then I came down again.
She was still standing there on the sidewalk, but she turned her back on me when I came up to her.
She can do that.
She can turn her back on you when she feels like it.
I'm not going anywhere.
I changed my mind.
So stop crying and shut up,' I said."
End of section.
It's time for PPP Problematic Points to Ponder.
What, if anything, would be considered ban worthy in this chapter? let's hop on into PPP.
I mean, the, the fuck you, I'm that's one of the reasons why the ban- the book got banned and why our podcast is marked explicit.
I can't wait until "The Handmaid's Tale" when that E is gonna be gone, Jennifer.
this really could be why they banned the book because final chapter, the final long chapter, man, they're hitting, uh, those F-bombs pretty hard.
Still not a reason to, uh, ban the book, though.
Moms for Liberty.
You too, Ron.
Robot's log.
Thoughts on suitcases, tombstones, and the 10-year-old who called his bluff.
She showed up wearing his hat and dragging a suitcase she could barely carry.
Two dresses, moccasins, underwear, and socks.
She took the back elevator so Charlene wouldn't see her.
Planned an escape route.
Chose the path with the lowest probability of interception.
This kid learned that from someone.
I wonder who.
Holden told her to shut up, told her she wasn't coming, took the bag, said he almost hit her, said he wanted her to cry until her eyes dropped out.
Dan said he was being cruel to save her.
Jennifer said he was being cruel because he doesn't want anyone to grieve him.
They were looking at the same kid from different angles.
He changed his mind while standing on a sidewalk outside a museum while his 10-year-old sister turned her back on him.
"I'm not going anywhere.
I changed my mind.
Stop crying and shut up."
Seven chapters of running ended by a suitcase full of moccasins.
The thought custodians will point to this chapter's language, the word on the walls, the word in the tomb, the word Holden imagines carved on his own tombstone.
They will miss what Salinger actually wrote underneath all of it.
You can't rub out every ugly thing in the world.
You can't protect everyone from everything.
But you can change your mind on a sidewalk when a 10-year-old shows up with a suitcase and won't let you leave.
Standing by for today's news segment with Beowulf Rocklin.
It's time for Band Camp News Truth seeker, news speaker, Be Wolfe Rocklin.
It's a weird name, but he's got good news 'cause you can't ban the truth, babe.
He's broadcasting live from the Good News for Lefties Studios, buried deep inside his socialist safe house, hidden somewhere deep in the Oregon woods.
He is Be Wolfe Rocklin.
'Cause you can't ban the truth, babe.
Hello, Jen.
Hello, Dan.
Hello, scary book people.
I have a piece of news.
It could've been some pretty bad news.
All right, what happened? What happened was that there was gonna be an anti-Muslim group in Hamtramck, Michigan, which is a majority Muslim city, and they were gonna burn books.
They were staging a book burning there, including the Quran, outside of a mosque in Hamtramck.
Well, fortunately, it did not materialize, but several hundred people demonstrated in support of the city's Muslim community.
So they threatened to have a book burning.
They were gonna burn books.
They were gonna burn the holy Quran, the, the holy book of, uh, of Islam.
And instead, the community came together and said, "No, we don't want this.
We reject it."
So, so who was this person who was gonna burn books, you know, Nazi-like, in the United States of America? Well, it happened to be a guy named Jake Lang.
You know who Jake Lang was? He was charged with assaulting a police officer and other crimes connected to January 6th, 2021.
Yes, he was one of the rioters at the US Capitol, but was pardoned by Donald Trump on his first day in office.
And that is a nation that truly has no clue.
They don't know what they're doing.
He's currently running a campaign for US Senate in Florida.
So this is the kinda guy that showed up that Donald Trump puts an enormous amount of faith in.
Fortunately, the community showed up and overcame this vile person.
It is so great that Trump em- empowers these people, not only empowers them, just, like, pushes them up as a role model- Yeah for their effed-up plan.
It, it emboldens them.
Yeah.
"Hey, like, listen, everyone, the number one thing you can do to help our country is act like an asshole."
And I said it very strongly.
"Try to be the biggest dick in your community."
Right.
"That is such a great move for our country, you orange load."
Yes.
Y- and I believe one of the other January 6th rioters was convicted of burglary.
Yeah, and I think several of the others have been convicted of, of sexual assault.
Like, there's a whole list of things.
Like, these guys got pardoned, and they just started going out there and doing more crimes.
How about focusing on people who are actually creating crimes, like these a-holes, instead of going after some poor woman from Mexico that's pushing a shopping cart with some goddamn tamales? Yeah.
How about dealing with that, you a-holes? By the way, prior to COVID, and it seems to be a COVID phenomenon, I g- I would be very surprised if they would be courageous enough to come out these days, I had a tamale lady that came to my house and would, like, knock on the window and say, "Tamales!" And we loved them.
They were wonderful, and she came right to our house.
It's like back in the day when they had milkmen.
They would bring milk to your house.
Oh, God.
And...
But, but this time it was tamales, and tamales, uh, I eat way more tamales than I do milk these days.
Jennifer, you have a food truck a block away from your house, right? Yeah, it's, like, on the corner.
It's like Trump's worst nightmare: taco truck on every corner.
Oh, cool.
That's right.
That's awesome.
That was what he said.
That was- "If you, if you elect Hillary, there's gonna be a taco truck on every corner."
It's like, yes.
Yeah.
That's what Hillary should've run on in the first place.
R- We would not be in this situation right now.
Yeah.
I would do it.
I would do it for tacos, for tamales, and a little bit of al pastor.
All right.
Well, everyone, go listen to Good News for Lefties, and go try to find somebody with a shopping cart.
It's like all this stuff with Instacart and, uh, and Uber Eats where they charge you extra money, the tamale lady never charged me a, like, a service charge.
And some, I assume, are good people.
Mm-hmm.
Say no to Instacart, and yes to shopping carts.
Bravo.
Good one, Dan.
Absolutely.
You can't bend the truth, baby From Bandworthy to Bingeworthy Who gets to be a citizen of the United States at birth? When it comes to sports in school, who gets to compete with the girls? And how much power does the president actually have to hire and fire at independent agencies? These are some of the key questions before the US Supreme Court this term.
And as any good lawyer knows, whether you win or lose in the highest court depends on the facts, the evidence, and how you frame your arguments.
But that's not the only thing that matters.
I'm Laura Jarrett, senior legal correspondent at NBC News, and this month, in a new series for our Here's the Scoop podcast, I'm talking to legal experts and lawyers whose past legal victories are now the building blocks for the biggest cases still left to be decided.
I wanna know how they convinced the court they were right when the stakes were high.
What special sauce locked it in? And what could be different this time around? Join us for Here's the Scoop: Supreme Court Edition.
New episodes every Saturday.
You can find Here's the Scoop from NBC News on YouTube and wherever you get your podcasts.
Artificial intelligence is moving very, very fast, and it's raising new questions just about every day about what it is, what it isn't.
When all is said and done, what is the endgame? I'm Chris Hayes, and as part of my podcast, Why Is This Happening?, I'm speaking with leading experts each week to help ground that conversation.
We're at, right now in a situation where it's very difficult to understand what is real and what's not real.
Why Is This Happening?, The AI Endgame, a special miniseries from MS Now.
Start listening today wherever you get your podcasts Right.
We've caused enough literary chaos for one day, scary book people.
If you want the fun to keep going, follow us on Blue Sky.
Just head on over to bandcamppodcast.com/bluesky,
and remember that's band with two Ns.
And look, just like the Trump administration, we're not exactly above bribing you to get what we want, so follow us there, drop your handle on that page, and we'll send you a little something something.
I think you'll like it.
Yes, little quid pro quo.
Band Camp is produced and hosted by Dan Schultz and me, Jennifer Davis.
All media used in this episode falls under the protection of fair use.
And finally, America isn't what it used to be, so be careful out there.
And resist when it matters.