Latest / Unicorn Football Talk / NFL Rivalries
Transcript
- Emily: Hi, this is Emily from Unicorn Football Talk. Hillary and I recorded an episode on rivalries, but it ran a little long. So I'm gonna give you just part one this week. We'll be talking about NFL rivalries. Next week you'll get part two where we talk all about our favorite college rivalries. I hope you enjoy. Hi Hillary, we are back for another episode of Unicorn Football Talk. This week is all about rivalries and we are dressed for the occasion. I see you're wearing a husky jersey. Hilary: I am I am so excited about this episode. I've got a lot to say. Emily: Rivalries are a fun thing to talk about. I'm wearing a Tennessee t-shirt. I decided to save you and not wear Tennessee orange. That might be a little bit jarring. so it's just a gray Tennessee shirt, but I am dressed, dressed for rivalry day. we picked a list of eight rivalries to break down, four in the NFL and four in college. that are either known as the biggest ones or ones that we have a personal connection to. So let's start. I'm really interested to hear your thoughts on what you think makes a good rivalry. Hilary: Well, you know, s I thought about this a lot. And some of the things for a good rivalry don't apply only to the NFL. I think they're across all sports. And one of them is history. If two teams or franchises have had repeated meetings over time, I think that enhances a rivalry. I also think a great rivalry, the teams are of similar caliber, so that you kind of never know who's gonna win. I know over maybe periods During their history, they have, you know, high years or low years or whatever. But in the end, it comes out that they're pretty close in their standings. And I think it's even better if they're in the same conference or the same division. So those games have real meaning, especially if they come kind of late in the season. And, you know, some good controversy and trash talk helps. I I gotta say it it heightens it for me. What about you? Emily: Yeah, I agree with everything you say. I would add, when you talk about trash talk, I'm also thinking like on the field and off the field. And a lot of players give interviews or do social media and they create this bulletin board material for the other team and also big moments. So I think a lot of the rivalries we're talking about today. There's some really big moments that stand out in their history. So we are Seahawks fans, So we have to do a Seahawks or two rivalry. we picked the 49ers and Rams. I'm gonna start with talking about the 49ers. We hate the 49ers, don't we? Hilary: Yeah, we do. Emily: Some people call them the Fortine Whiners, but I don't personally like doing the name calling stuff, this rivalry is not a long, does not have a long history as compared to some of the other rivalries we'll be talking about, but it's a really good one that's developed in the last twenty-five years. The Seahawks joined the NFC West in 2002. So again, they weren't in the same division for very long. There have been periods of time where these two are the main contenders for the division and they've played some really high-stakes games. So I think those are key elements for a rivalry. last season specifically, I absolutely love that we clinched the number one seed in. Their stadium on the last game of the year. And there was a lot of celebration in the 49ers locker room. Well, you know, obviously the visitors' locker room. They broke out cigars and were dancing, the Seahawks players and a bunch of the 49ers were really annoyed. But I have to give props to George Kittle of the 49ers, who's a pretty cool guy. He said, like, cool. Hilary: He is a cool guy. Emily: I would do the same stuff and he didn't say stuff. They've got the number one seed. They want it in a rival stadium. Good for them. And then one other thing I'll call out from last year. we won the Super Bowl in their stadium, and I know that they hate that. I like I know they hate it. There were all these social media posts the week leading up to the game of Sam Darnold's face on Levi Stadium and how pissed off the local fans were. So I thought that was really fun for the rivalry. And I was there. Hilary: Yeah, and you were there at the Super Bowl, right? Y you got that first hand. Emily: Yeah, it was great. it was yes, great game, great win. It made it a little sweeter to win it in their stadium, I feel like. there were a bunch of key moments to call out from the rivalry, but I picked three. Hilary: Okay. Emily: The one that first just jumps out to me is the tip. Does that do you know what we're talking about when I say the tip? Okay. Hilary: I think every Seahawks and Forty Niner fan knows what you're talking about there. Emily: Okay. if you don't know, the tip was in the 2013 NFC Championship game. I was in the stadium, And I will say it was in my top five moments of all time being at a game. It was high stakes NFC championship game, 30 seconds left in the game, and we were ahead. But Kaepernick was moving the ball down the field like crazy. Like you could just feel it. We all felt that they were going to score, that the 49ers were going to score. And then Richard Sherman, I think it was on the like it was a first and 10 at the 18 yard line, passed to the end zone. Richard Sherman reaches up, he tips the ball to another Seahawks player. Can't believe I don't remember the name, intercepted. that was gonna be a touchdown. That I mean, that would have been a very, very different result if that pass was caught. But what punctuated that moment was right after the game, Richard Sherman being interviewed by Aaron Andrews and he just went off on Crabtree, the receiver from the forty nineers, calling him a sorry receiver. He was just so intense. It was hilarious. Hilary: Yeah, that was a that was a controversial moment, right? Like he really did lay down some smack there in that interview for sure. Emily: He did. And I think it's one of those moments where if you're a fan of the Seahawks, you love it. And if you're anybody else, you're like, I don't like him talking like that. But we loved it. Or I did. I did. Hilary: Right. Emily: the next moment another one of my favorites, the turkey feast in 2014. I was actually at your house having Thanksgiving dinner and we watched the game. So I'm hoping you remember this. Hilary: I do remember this and hey Emily, we have a history, ten plus years of watching football on Thanksgiving together. Emily: That's true. This is a great game. It was we played it at Levi Stadium, which was why I was not at the game. And we beat him, I think, by a lot. And after the game, the production crew I'm not sure what network was hosting it, had Turkey available for the players and they're Sitting at the stadium on the San Francisco 49ers logo, eating turkey, who's great. It's just great. okay, last one. another part of what makes rivalries great are these personalities that have come and gone during these rivalry periods. So Pete Carroll, Jim Harbaugh, the two coaches at the time, they hated each other. Like they hated each other. They've admitted they they do not like each other. Hilary: Yeah, they had a thing. Emily: And they had a rivalry that went back to when they were coaches in college. And Pete Carroll was the coach of USC, a very dominant, as you know, program. And Harbaugh was the coach at Stanford. And there was a game called the Handshake Game. It was two thousand nine and Stanford pulled ahead of USC by twenty-seven points with six forty-seven left on the clock and decided to go for two. They ended up tacking on another touchdown to end the game at fifty-five to twenty-one, a score of fifty-five to twenty-one. And after the game, as you know, all coaches handshake, Carol goes out. And he's like, What's your deal? You all right? Harbaugh's like, I'm good, what's your deal? And once they Hilary: Okay. Emily: were playing against each other in the NFL, we always really anticipated those postgame handshakes. Hilary: So they brought that forward, that rivalry from the college to NFL. Interesting. I had forgotten that. Emily: They did. Yeah. Before I hand off to you, any other thoughts you want to add on your hatred of the forty niners? Hilary: You know, my hatred, dislike of the Forty Niners kind of wavers more than some other rivalries the Seahawks have. you know, there have been periods where the Seahawks are great or the 49ers are great, and there have been a few years where they've overlapped. But recently I feel like the 49ers have dropped off in their competitiveness. And I'm not sure why. They have a great coach, they've got great, Players and stuff, they've had a lot of injuries. They haven't quite been able to put it together the last couple of seasons. And so I just now that they've dropped off the radar, but the feelings just aren't as intense. And I don't want to go so far as to say they're a little bit irrelevant, but you know, I I just not feeling the passion towards that rivalry as much right now. Emily: they would hate to hear you say that. Hilary: I know they would. I know they would. And I as I said, they do have great players and I'm not sure what is the root of the struggles the last couple of seasons, but I feel like they have not reached their potential. Emily: Yeah, I would say they're dangerous. though. right, let's move on to the Rams. Tell me about the rivalry, Hillary. Hilary: Okay, so after dissing the San Francisco 49ers a bit in that last segment, I am all over the Rams Seahawks rivalry. It is really heated right now, but going back a little bit, this is another new rivalry only since 2002 when the NFC West had the realignment. And at the beginning, we played the Rams. They were in St. Louis at the time. Some of the games were consequential, some weren't, but the rival really heated up when the Rams moved back to LA in 2016. the series right now sits at 30 wins for the Seahawks, 28 for the Rams, and the Hawks took the lead in that series, obviously, just with the last two wins in last season. And I went digging through the highlights too, and I came up with a couple, and I'll let you chime in on a few of these. most of them are more recent, but October 2013, Golden Tate took an 80-yard T D 50-yard pass from Russell Wilson, caught the pass, and for the Blast 30 yards as he's running it into the end zone. He's waving his fingers and pointing at the safety for the full 30 yards. He was fined and called for taunting, but you know, that was kind of a like a one of the starter moments of this the intensity increasing, I think. I don't know if you remember that or not. I Emily: I do, I do. Hilary: yeah. December 2016 is when the Seahawks debuted their action green uniforms on a Thursday night game. and in that game, Jared Goff was actually the starting rookie quarterback for the Rams. And for some unknown reason, on an insignificant play, he kept the ball. He was running down the sidelines, and Richard Sherman just laid him out, actually took him out of the game. And I guess the only saving grace to that is that if Richard Sherman hadn't done that, a couple steps behind was Cam Chancellor. So I think Jared learned a valuable rookie lesson in that game. Seahawks went on to win that. October 2019, Tyler Lockett again in action green, does the double toe tap end zone touchdown catch, which is in a lot of the NFL best catch moment. videos and that kind of stuff. He's in the corner of the end zone, both toes in, the rest of his body full extension, outside of the end zone. January 2023, the Seahawks beat the Rams in overtime with a field goal from Jason Myers and with a little help from the Lions. They went to the playoffs that year for the tenth time in 13 seasons. January 2025, we're getting recent here. week 18, the Seahawks made a trip to LA and they won and they made Mike McDonald the winningest first year coach in Seahawks history. But even with that, the Seahawks missed the playoffs to the Rams based on strength of schedule, and they went to the fifth level tiebreaker to make that decision. So I think that kind of heated up what came next last season, which is three games. The Rams won the first one, the Seahawks won in overtime in the second game, and that was a super controversial game. Do you want to talk about the Zachwards pass? Emily: that game. That game was great. I mean, it was, it was basically for the number one seed, even though the season wasn't over. So it was like a huge Hilary: Yeah. Emily: deal win. the Zachwards pass was a two point conversion attempt that looked like it was an incomplete pass, but it lay it wasn't, ended up being like a A lateral slash backward pass, but no one really realized it. The ball ends up in the end zone, and Zach Charbonnet picks up the ball to be nice and hand it to the ref, which turns out to be a two point conversion. And I think what was really controversial about it was they didn't make that call right away. I think they were even lining up for almost for the Hilary: For the next play. Yeah, Emily: To the kickoff, right? Hilary: yeah. Emily: So then they come on and they say it was actually a conversion. The crowd goes crazy. And what I love about this play is it lives rent-free in Sean McVeigh's head. He cannot let it go. He is so angry about this. he won't let it die. And the thing that gets me kind of worked up. Is if they hadn't given the touchdown or the two-point conversion to us, we would have had cause to be really angry. they're just angry that the play was called correctly. Like, or they're just Hilary: Right. Emily: angry that we didn't know it was a backward path. Like, get over it. Just get over it. Rivalries, they get you fired up, Hillary. Hilary: Rivalry. Yeah. Okay. And so then, of course, the season ends last year with the Seahawks beating the Rams at home in the game that takes them to the Super Bowl. So this is a close rivalry. I looked up some stats here. Out of all of the times they've played 58, 14 games have been decided by five points or less. Five have gone to overtime. So, you know, these are evenly matched teams across that rivalry. a little bit of trash talk, I guess, this year when the Seahawks released their season schedule. They did everything kind of on a cologne theme and what each team would smell like. And the Rams were described as Conversion number two, smelling of melancholy and what the hell just happened. So going back to the play we just talked about, a little dig there, and I kind of love it. Emily: I love it. I love it. it's hard to be on the other side of those digs. So I mean, we've had to take our own digs before. So we get to enjoy when we come out on top. Hilary: For sure. And over the years, these two teams have traded players and coaches, meaning that there are players who've played for both teams and you know, coaches who have coached for both teams, notably Bobby Wagner, when he was cut from here, went and went to the Rams for a year. Of course, he was smart and came back. and currently, this is another little dig, I guess. there are two players on the Hawks roster from the Rams. Cooper Cup and Ernest Jones, both who had fabulous seasons in 2026. So I'm thinking that's gotta burn a little bit, maybe. And Puna Ford is with the Rams on their roster now. And thoughts on the Rams? Why is it so easy to hate these guys? What why? Emily: Think it's Sean McVeigh. that's what I think it is. I think Matt Stafford is kind of easy to dislike too, but I guess it's just because he's playing for the Rams. I guess maybe I liked him when he played for Detroit. But McVeigh's got that real tough, gritty exterior. And he looks smug to me. So I yeah, it I it's easy. I feel like it's easy to to Hilary: Okay. Emily: hate them. Hilary: One reason I thought about too is that the way the matchups are scheduled, we usually play both of our games against the Rams in the back half of the season. And so there's high stakes for the playoffs and seeding and that kind of stuff. I think that makes a little bit different, but I definitely have those two games circled on my calendar for this upcoming season. And I'm going to leave you with a fun fact. Total scoring for this series. How close do you think it is? Emily: I'm gonna guess that it's a narrow margin. Hilary: It is one point. See Seattle has scored 1,223 points across the series, and the Rams have scored 1,222. So there's my fun fact. Emily: Wow, which is a key to a good rivalry is having close games. I think this one is gonna be a fun one to watch for years because people call McDonald the McVay of defense. So you have this offensive genius mind versus this defensive genius mind. So they're gonna keep it tight and fun to watch for sure. Hilary: Hey, and we can circle back. They come from the coaching trees we talked about, both head coaches. Emily: Yep, that's true. Okay, well, the Rams, the 49ers, we've talked about them. We each decided to pick one other NFL rivalry that we personally enjoy, So I picked Steelers Ravens. I didn't know much about the lore or history, but as an just a general NFL fan, this was the first rivalry game I thought of outside of the Seahawks. I know these games as some of the most physical, nasty, violent games. players hate the players and I look forward to these games every year. I guess I don't know what that says about me, that I look forward to the physical brutal games. But I know these players give it their all for these games and it's fun to watch. The Ravens I don't know if you remember this. They were formerly the Browns. The Browns moved to Baltimore in 1996. Hilary: Yes. Emily: And so obviously they're in the same division as the Steelers, the AFC North. And, you know, it's gonna be a natural rivalry being in the same division. Steelers were always good. and honestly, I feel like the Steelers are just easy to hate. I I don't know. Maybe it's maybe maybe it goes back to the 2005 Super Bowl for me and them beating the Seahawks. But I've always hated the Steelers. I feel like their fans are easy to hate. Don't know if we'll have any Steelers fans listening. I'm sorry. but in the earlier days of the rivalry, you had some really iconic players with big personalities that clash. like Ben, Big Ben Rothlisberger, Troy Kolamalu and Heinz Ward on the Ravens side, Ray Lewis, Ed Reed, Terrell Suggs, all defensive guys. So I feel like that is part of the formula of a good rivalry. And they had they had those player, clashes. some of the things I dug up on the history in 2010, Big Ben, quarterback, got his nose broken. in the game. He stayed Hilary: Wow. Emily: in and he scored a touchdown. And afterwards he called it just a standard AFC North game. this one is a little this one takes a more serious turn. The Steelers wide receiver Heinz Ward was universally despised in Baltimore for his devastating blind side blocking style. Terrell Suggs famously admitted that the Ravens defense kept a bounty out on him. He used that word, So he took some heat for that, obviously, because you you can't have a bounty on a player. He clarified Hilary: Yeah. Emily: after it was for no money and the NFL did an investigation, but it just kind of adds to the allure. And, you know, they obviously didn't like the player. So you're gonna it's good, you're gonna feel that when you're watching, you know, I feel like you really feel it when Hilary: sure. Emily: when two teams really hate each other. And then the other thing that adds to their rivalry is that they've been very good, you've talked about how it's better rivalry if they're If they're good. they're consistently elite and they've had opportunities to meet in the playoffs, they've met four times with Pittsburgh holding a three-one postseason advantage, including a legendary 2008 AFC championship game victory by the Steelers. Some say it's the most violent physical, hard-hitting game in modern history. There were a lot of injuries that came out of that game, a lot of sacks, a lot of QB hits. one more before I pass off to you. This to me was the one that I remembered when I was thinking about this rivalry. And I don't know if you remember it. the Mike Tomlin sideline incident. Do you know what I'm talking about? Hilary: Yeah, I don't. I don't. Emily: Okay. It was a while back, 2013. it was a night game. Ravens kick returner, Jacoby Jones broke free, running down the sideline for a kickoff return. And it looked like he could make it for a touchdown. Mike Tomlin, I encourage everybody to go look for this on YouTube. Mike Tomlin's like holding his back and kind of standing on the sideline to force Jacoby to cut into the field towards a blocker on the Steelers side. So Hilary: Okay, so so to be clear, Mike Tomlin's not in bounds, but he's bodily taking up space on the sideline. Okay. Emily: He's close to being inbounds, but he is not where Hilary: Okay. Emily: he should be. And it he claims, I, you know, I never met any. It was just an accident. And there's no way it was an accident. Tomlin was heavily fined for this. And the Ravens fans obviously still swear it was deliberate. I've never seen anything like that. Never seen anything like it. It adds to the lore for sure. I guess what will be interesting for me is to see what happens to the rivalry now that Tomlin and Harbaugh, their longtime coaches, which we've talked about on another podcast, are moving on. It will interesting to see how it evolves. Hilary: Yeah, see what the new coaches bring to the game, right? Or the rivalry, Emily: Yeah. Hilary: I should say. Emily: Okay, we Hilary: okay. Emily: have one more NFL rivalry. What rivalry did you pick? Hilary: I chose the Packers, Bears. I wanted to go way back and go really old school. And I didn't know a lot about the history of these two teams. I just knew the rivalry had existed for a long time. And what I found out is that these are two of the oldest teams in the NFL and that they both started before the football league was even a thing. They were company teams. The Bears started in 1919 as the Decatur Stalies for Staley Manufacturing. and they relocated in nineteen twenty to Chicago and became the Bears And the Packers also started in 1919 as a company team for the Indian Packing Company. And I just thought that was really interesting that these two teams actually predate what we would consider. I I think it was originally the American Football Conference, American Football League. they were just playing games against whoever they could find to play against. There was nothing structured. But Packers, Bears have paid played 213 times, which is the most in the NFL. because of that history and also because they're in the same division and they play each other at least twice a year, plus, you know, if they come together in the playoffs or something. Green Bay holds the lead on that. 109 wins to the Bears, ninety-eight. There's some ties in there. The longest win streak is held by Green Bay at 11 from 2019 to 2024. And so it's kind of like it's like, why the rivalry, right? I think part of it is location. These cities are only 200 miles apart. It's it's almost like a sibling rivalry a little bit. And both teams have had their ups and downs as far as winning seasons go, but across time. They're both very good. And a lot of times their matchups determine if they make the playoffs or not. between the two teams they've got twenty-two NFL championships and five Super Bowls. history, they're loaded with memorable coaches and players. Vince Lombardi, Bart Starr, Charles Woodson, Mike Ditka, Dick Butkus, Walter Payton. I mean, those are names that almost every even casual fan knows. The two teams have 77 players in the Hall of Fame, 36 for Green Bay and 41 for the Bears. And, you know, a lot of their games have ended just weird plays, crazy weather, things that just kind of add to the allure of the rivalry. one that I Couldn't find a video clip for, but that I found a lot of write-up about was in 1980, and the Green Bay kicker attempted a field goal and it ricocheted off the defender's helmet back into his arms and he ran it in for a touchdown in the win. So Emily: Wow. Hilary: right. There's an infamous game in 1989 that's called the instant replay game. The Packers won on the final drive, but initially there was a call by the ref on the field that the quarterback was on the line of scrimmage, which negated the touchdown. And then there was an almost six-minute delay on TV. I don't know how they filled that six minutes while they reviewed the instant replay and that kind of thing by the booth officials and finally It was ruled that the touchdown was a good touchdown and Green Bay went on to win the game. And that stoked the rivalry for sure. in 1994, on Monday night football, it was Halloween. The weather was 35 degrees with wind at 60 miles per hour, and the rain was sideways. They couldn't keep the TV cameras clear to show a clear game. And the Packers won that one. December 2008. It's the coldest game in Bears history, two degrees with a wind chill of minus 13, and the Bears won it 2017 in overtime. So bringing it more current, I think there's definitely what I'm going to call the Aaron Rodgers here. He is a notorious trash talker. And there are there are multiple clips of him of saying things that are not kind. About the Bears, but he's most famous for in 2021, he said, I own the Bears. And he kind of gave a hand gesture on the field at the end of a game. And then there was a big media frenzy. And the next day he doubled down, said he did not regret saying it. He would say it every day. I mean, he just really dug in on that. And Emily: That's amazing. Hilary: yeah, yeah. Okay. And so this brings us to like really recent. And the rivalry had died down a little bit. In January 2025, the Bears new head coach, Ben Johnson, had an introductory head coach press conference. And in that presser He acknowledged the strength of the division and praised Dan Campbell of the Lions and Kevin O'Connell of the Vikings for what he considered coach of the year caliber coaching. And then he went on to say, quote, and to be quite frank with you, I kinda enjoyed beating Matt LaFleur twice a year, end quote. You're head coach presser and you're gonna call out the rivalry with the Packers? Okay, dude. Emily: I love it. I love it. He's trying to stoke up the rivalries, trying to get some excitement in Chicago. Hilary: Right? Okay. He totally, totally. Yep. And then when the Bears did beat the Packers in the wild card game, I don't know if you remember that, but there was a super awkward sort of handshake at midfield. And then Johnson goes into the locker room and gives this massive, fiery postgame speech where he says, F the Packers. And both video clips went viral. He expressed zero regrets when asked about it the next day by the media. I mean, he is lighting the fire. And I'm just gonna leave you with this last thought. Caleb Williams, quarterback for the Bears, is the cover of Madden NFL 27. And I I don't know if you've seen that photo. Have you seen that photo they used on the cover? Emily: Haven't no. Hilary: Okay, well, I think it's a Green Bay troll because it sure looks like the clenched jaw photo when he did the jump throw to Rome Odinze in the fourth quarter on fourth down that led to their come behind win over the Packers in the wildcard game. Take a look at that photo and tell me what you think. But rivalries, man, bring it. I love it. Emily: that was great. That was really fun. Hilary: love the Ben Johnson stuff. I'm like, really, dude? I do Emily: it too. I think I I think he wants to stoke the rivalry and I think that's that's good for Chicago. Okay, as I mentioned at the beginning of this episode, I split this into two. So we're ending it here. And I hope you enjoyed the conversation about NFL rivalries. See you next week where we focus on college football. Thanks for listening.