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Understanding Color Theory (with Melissa AuClair) · The Daily Writer

• 0:08
  SPEAKER_00: Hey friends, welcome to episode 99 of the Born to Create podcast.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_00: I'm your host, Kent Sanders, and this is the show where we explore the mindset, habits, and skills to help you make a bigger impact in your life and creative work.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_00: If you've listened to this show for any length of time, you know that we often look at common things in an uncommon way.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_00: I like to understand different perspectives and explore my curiosity, and this episode is no exception.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_00: When it comes to the creative arts, one of my favorite topics is color theory.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_00: Did you know that colors represent different ideas and themes?
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_00: Understanding even a little bit of color theory can help you unlock the riches of visual art and look at the world in a whole new way.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_00: Well, to help me explore these issues, I've invited my friend Melissa Auclair as a guest on the show today.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_00: Melissa is a talented author and artist, and I've admired her creative work for the last few years.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_00: Melissa helps busy women experience more creativity and beauty-filled lives with journaling and painting ideas, inspiration, and workshops.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_00: She loves the holidays, and many of her art collections celebrate the seasons, the holidays, and the special moments of life.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_00: Melissa's journaling technique called joy-filled journaling helps people capture their year on paper without being labored down by extensive technique or time.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_00: Joy-filled journaling focuses on collecting and celebrating the joys of life in a physical book that's a personal work of art.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_00: This is a really fun and informative episode, and I believe it's really critical because if you don't have an understanding of what colors represent in the world of art, which includes film, television, books, and really anything that's visual, you're always going to be hampered from understanding the true nature of what that art is all about.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: I'm a huge film nerd, I'm a huge film buff.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_00: You guys probably know that.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_00: So understanding a little bit of color theory has really helped me to be able to I think perceive at a deeper level what filmmakers and cinematographers are going for when they create their art.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_00: But it goes far beyond that.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_00: It's not just about movies, it's also about painting, and I mean this goes way back all throughout the history of art, really.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_00: So this is one of those episodes that I think is is kind of a bedrock or foundational episode because it helps us to understand one of the very basic concepts of art, which is that colors actually mean something.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_00: So I love this conversation, and I think you're gonna love it as well.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_00: After you've listened to it, you are welcome to check out the show notes at KentSanders.net slash zero nine nine, where of course you you will find more stuff as well as the links and the resources that we mentioned.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_00: All right, let's get right to the conversation with Melissa Auclair.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_00: Melissa, welcome to the podcast.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_00: I appreciate you making time to do the show today.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much for having me, Kent.
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_01: I'm thrilled to be on here.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_00: Well, we've been planning this for a while.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_00: In fact, when I looked at my back at some notes that I had made a little while back, I were I didn't realize that I had gotten in touch way back in it's been several months ago.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_00: And so we've been trying to plan this.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_00: So thanks for being patient with me as I sort of worked out my own schedule issues and and so forth.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, it's it's um, we've been friends, we've known each other for a long time now.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_01: I knew we were this was gonna happen, so I'm just I'm happy it did.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_01: It worked well for me this timing.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I'm really excited about the stuff that we're gonna talk about today, part of which is color theory, and then we'll dive into some other things as well.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_00: But before we dive into specifics, can you give us a little bit of background about your journey in art and maybe especially color theory and why that's a particular area of interest for you?
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_01: Sure.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I my grandfather was a fine artist.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_01: He was a watercolor artist, and his art was so detailed and um perfect.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_01: If I can say that people would come at uh come up to him in shows, look at his art and ask him if it was a photographer.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_01: Uh wow.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's incredible.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_01: I have several pieces.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um he probably reached the height of what we call financial success, early 2000s.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um he was painting until a few weeks before he passed away, um, about six years ago.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_01: But my idea of an artist was my grandfather.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_01: I would, as a little girl, I would, you know, come into um, they always had a room that was an art studio in his home, and I would come into that room and peek into it.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_01: It was almost sacred to me.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_01: I so looked up to him.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_01: But I grew up thinking that that's what an artist is: that perfection, that detail.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_01: So while I dabbled with art, um, I did not and I wanted to be an artist, it really um, I didn't think I could because the the definition, also, my grandparents, World War II, um, tail end of the Great Depression, and in their mind, being an artist was so hard.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_01: They practically pushed me toward what they called this stable career.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_01: And um, they were my biggest cheerleaders.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_01: They wanted me to get through college into my current um profession more than I wanted to even.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_01: And so it was really interesting as I look back and my art, I never let it go.
• 5:07
  SPEAKER_01: I always dabbled, dabbled, dabbled and had fun playing with it.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_01: It wasn't probably until a couple of years ago when I realized that I had some choices of things that um I could do.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_01: But I have had a really great uh day job and a very interesting profession.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_01: But if I wanted to pivot for the latter years of my life, that I could do that, and I really started to think, okay, what would that look like?
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_01: And also to let go of my premonitions of this box is what an artist is.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_01: There's actually, I'm pretty, I'm not as detailed as my grandfather, not by half of it.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's the long answer to your short question of where I am now, of creating my own artist niche and and um in a way that's probably a lot more um simplistic than my grandfather's.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_01: Um, he did kind of give me his his blessing towards the end.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_01: It was so funny he had was not was a man, I'm sure probably your grandparents too.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_01: That generation were just not really big on the affection and love and like you're awesome.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_01: Just wasn't right?
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_01: And he had said we were watching this cooking show together.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_01: We used to go and and cook together.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_01: He would cook for me and talk about art.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_01: I'd bring my sketchbook and sketches.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_01: We watched cooking shows, and and he looked at me and said, Um, you would have wanted to do something more creative, didn't you?
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_01: And I think the emotion came up in my voice, and I just said, Yeah, I just nodded and smiled.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_01: And he he didn't say go for it.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_01: He just said, Yeah, you should.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it was it was very much his response.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_01: So, anyways, that kind of allowed me that freedom to to start thinking of other options and to really start digging into the artist's journey of more seriousness instead of being a hobby of like, what does this look like to be a professional?
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_01: So that's that's kind of and that happened probably about five, six years ago.
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_00: Have you ever struggled with um, you know, and I mentioned that before we hit record on this, I mentioned that none of these questions are sacred.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm going off the rails like right really fast.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um, as far as like I didn't have this question planned, but uh something that I have wrestled with, and and I think that you have wrestled with this too, is kind of the tension between, I guess, art and commerce.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_00: In other words, you know, we we have a lot of mutual friends in the online creative space, the creative entrepreneur space, if you will, who, you know, some of them are doing really well and some are not doing so well.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_00: And have you ever felt that tension with your art of, you know, I want to be creative and I just want to fulfill this impulse to make stuff, but at the same time, I do want to have a functional business.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_00: And how have you thought through that tension in your own creative life?
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_01: That's yeah, I used to wrestle with that a lot.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_01: And um, part of it, I think, is when I listen to um really um business-minded people and entrepreneurs, part of I hear a lot of uh find a problem in the world and fill that need.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_01: Well, art per se isn't like a problem to be filled necessarily.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_01: Now I can make the argument for it, but it's sometimes it's it's it's a hard for me to go, hmm, okay, how does my creativity fill a need in the world when there really is a lot of actual needs that uh that people need problems to be solved per se.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_01: Art is not the lack of beauty, it is not necessarily a problem that people feel the need to be solved.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_01: Us don't say, unless you're an artist, right, unless you're creative, I need more beauty in my life.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_01: If you're not a creative per se, you may not recognize how important beauty is.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_01: I think you and I can make that argument, whether it's beauty visually or beauty in words or beauty in music, it adds so much.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_01: The other thing I think that creatives struggle with is um asking people for um money, whether in re in re in exchange for art, I think a lot of us love the idea of just sharing our art with the world and releasing us from the tension of asking for money back.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_01: I've I've always had a hard time with that.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and it's it's hard to meet put a value.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_01: I don't have a problem buying other people's art.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_01: I love to support other artists, but I have a harder time putting value on my own art.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_01: I sometimes find it easier to give it away.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_00: You know, that is so funny because I've had conversations with other authors before, and and I think most authors deal with that exact issue of you know, we all just kind of want to give our stuff away.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_00: And sometimes you feel bad charging for things, and you know, I I pretty freely give away my time to people just for to help coaching them through a particular thing or or whatever it is.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, that is definitely a tension that uh I think goes unresolved for most of us.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I had a mentor who I look up to, and and uh she's an artist and she's a wonderful businesswoman, and she's kind of opened up her life to other artists and creatives to kind of pull back the curtains a bit in these very intimate workshops, and that's been really a blessing because I consider her to be a very genuine, true artist who's also been able to blend artist and business.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_01: And it does seem like there's two different hats that you have to put on.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_01: And so I'm learning how to put on my my business hat.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's difficult.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: It's really difficult, I think, for people who are primarily driven by a need to create something.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_01: I agree with that.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_01: That's a good way of putting it.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_00: As opposed to in I'm thinking of somebody in particular that I I don't know them well, but somebody, I have a picture of somebody in my mind, kind of an online business person who they're primarily coming at it from a business standpoint, and then they they figure out ways to create stuff or to hire people to help them create stuff.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_00: So and neither one is right or wrong.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_00: It's just a matter of I think what is your primary impulse in life.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_00: People who are entrepreneurs sometimes they want to start businesses and so forth, and then the creative stuff comes second.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_00: Whereas for many of us, the the opposite is true where we want to create stuff and then we've got to figure out how to make money at it.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_01: Or where the audience is, and you're like, well, goodness, maybe no one actually wants this really Paris pink thing that I've created, you know.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's or you know, so it's yeah, no, there's definitely a tension there.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_00: I had that exact experience a few years ago.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_00: I are you familiar with Evernote Productivity App?
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yeah.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: So I created a whole course.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I spent, I don't know how many untolds, hundreds of hours creating this course, you know, just to find out that nobody really was interested in it.
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't know what I was doing with marketing, but it was a good learning experience.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_00: So I guess I took that away from it.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I'm sure it's something like a course.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_01: You can take all the technical and the learning.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_01: I'm sure you you came around, thought, okay, well, maybe not the subject matter, but you have this whole skill set now for another course.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I think that's a good way of looking at it.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_00: And you've, I'm sure, have had this experience as well in different arenas of your life where you consider something basically a failure, but then you learn things through that.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_00: And and sometimes learning what not to do is just as valuable as learning what to do.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_01: Agree a hundred percent.
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_00: So let's dive into this uh topic specifically of color theory.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_00: I'm kind of a geek when it comes to this sort of stuff.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_00: In fact, there's a video I watched not too long ago that was analyzed.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_00: We were talking about the Avengers before I hit record on this.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_00: And it was a video that went through all the posters of the of the Marvel movies, the of the MCE movies, and talking about colors and the design of them and so forth.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_00: So I geek out about this sort of stuff.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_00: Take us through your journey a little bit of how you became interested in color theory and why that is such an important thing for us.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, I love color theory.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_01: I think I came across it, I didn't even know it was a thing, until it was um, it was maybe seven, eight years ago, maybe a little bit less.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_01: And I just dipped my toe in the water.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_01: Um, a gal was talking about seasonal archetypes and uh and in relation to really branding and marketing your website.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_01: And uh it sounds like we are the same in that once you find a subject, you just dive in.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_01: And you I started looking up books, and uh, there's not a ton on color theory.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_01: It's fairly new as far as uh the the psychology of color theory.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe um I think it's been talked about on and off, but people like looking at it more seriously.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_01: So there wasn't a ton of books, but I found a couple and I found some people who are studying it.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_01: Color theory is basically looking, understanding um how we respond to colors uh emotionally, psychologically.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_01: And um there's a quote in um The Road Back to You, it's a book on it in the Enneagram, but yeah, it's a great one.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_01: It's it isn't that fun, that's a totally fun book.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_01: And there's a quote in it that I thought was so applicable to color theory, and that is it was by the mathematician George Box of I think it was all, oh, I pulled it out.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_01: All models are wrong, but some are useful.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's why I look at seasonal archetypes, which is I'm a part of color theory.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_01: So I'll explain in a way that I think all of us can relate to in um color theory, it's the emotions behind the colors and and what those mean, how to respond to them, how we can use them in our day-to-day lives.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_01: So, what um what was done with the seasonal archetypes is that someone recognized that nature um has a way of basically creating the most beautiful color palettes in four different seasons for those of us in the Western Hemisphere.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_01: And that each of those seasons has sort of a personality to it and an emotional uh personality to it.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_01: So um, what really got me interested in this is I was really um struggling a little bit in my colors in my artwork.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_01: And um, it would just be off.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_01: It would just be like, hmm, you know, there is something really off here, and I don't know what it is.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_01: When I learned about seasonal archetypes, I started realizing I could use these um seasonal archetypes and create more appealing color palettes, not only for the people I was creating for, but also for myself, because I think we always want to know that we are liking too what we're creating.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_01: So we have spring, summer, fall, and winter.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_01: So if you're thinking about this, uh we've got four main color groups.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_01: And as you listen to this and then you start going out for a walk, start picking up on the nature around you, and because there is a very succinct color palette that's out there, depending on what the season is.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_01: So in spring, all the colors um right after the coldness of winter, we have more sunshine, it's warm out, and so you have colors that are primarily primary colors, lots of energy.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm imagining with the Avengers uh posters, those are gonna be red and blue and yellow and all those bold, energetic, in your face, lots of energy, lots of fun, lots of primary colors.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yep, happy, right?
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_01: Very happy, bouncy children's uh palettes will also often be the um spring colors.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_01: It's really um it's a very lively time of year.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_01: It's very warm.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_01: So the colors are going to be primary, clear, warm, and it's very happy, very upbeat.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_01: So the spring personality, all those colors, and that'll include stuff like pink, which is not in the Avengers palette, of course.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_01: Is that true?
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_01: Not too much that I am aware of, but again, it's that energy um that goes along with springtime.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_01: A friend was pointing out to me the other day, she goes, Do you recognize that most of the restaurants we go to, they all have like red and yellow and warm oranges?
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_01: Those colors make us feel more hungry.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_01: And advertisers, of course, have cute into this.
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_01: They want a lot of springtime in their palettes.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_01: Moving into summertime, the sub the cut the heat comes, no matter whether you're in California, Texas, Paris, it you know, it's it gets warm, it gets hot, our energy goes down.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_01: Likewise, all the colors get muted too.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_01: So instead of the bright colors, everything just goes down a notch.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_01: It goes springtime is warm, summer is mostly cool.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_01: So you have cool, delicate, more muted colors.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_01: So if you think of um the ocean scene, and you think of we've got this, we have the sandy beaches, we have um everything is the greens are more muted, the lavenders and the flowers are more muted, the blue is periwinkle, it's not the bright blue.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, if you go to the we have um peach, pink, so everything's more muted, more delicate.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_01: For those who are planning a wedding, you might recognize that the many traditional wedding colors are summer themes.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_01: So everything's more delicate, more calm, more organized.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we move into the fall.
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_01: Those colors get more energized, it's more harvest, it's more school time, and it's muted and warm.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_01: So the colors are going to be lots of depth.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_01: There's going to be everything from your school colors, but it's not the bright spring of primary, it's more of muted.
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_01: So think of your bird orange, yellow, purple, and green and brown that the all the trees are leaves are falling.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_01: This is a time where it's more energetic and robust.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_01: So if I am creating a um a fall series, I'm gonna use even my pinks and plums, they are all gonna be muted and warm shades of pinks and plums, not the bright warm of spring.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_01: And then finally, color therapy go into winter, and winter is fewer colors, but they're very bold and they're pretty um authoritarian.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_01: So you have everything from pure white and pure black.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_01: And just side note, if you were gonna go strictly on seasonal archetypes, you're only gonna have pure white and pure black in the winter time.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_01: Most of us, if you're getting dressed in the morning, we do not look our best in pure white or pure black.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_01: Most of us are not winter personalities in our coloring or even in our personalities.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_01: There's a strong, um, you're gonna have bright reds and everything's cold.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_01: So cold green, um, if it's gonna be bright, this sounds funny, but the hot pink, which is really a cold pink or cold tangerine, bright, bright yellow, those are all winter.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_01: So, does that kind of give a brief overview of how to look at color theory in the in the view in the re the lens of the seasons?
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, absolutely.
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I I think it's helpful.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_00: Well, uh as you were talking, I'm thinking of kind of questions and response on a variety of levels.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_00: So let me let me dig into a really specific thing that you mentioned about fast food places.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: That probably tells you like the level of depth that I have.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_00: And as a person because I'm immediately thinking, fast food, what's for lunch?
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_00: Why why is that?
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, aside from the fact that yellow is gonna be the brightest color when it's lit up at neon, or well, I guess most restaurants don't use neon signs anymore, but you know, McDonald's, Taco Bell, whatever they are, they're gonna use yellow.
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_00: What is it about those colors that makes us hungry or makes us respond emotionally?
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_01: So that goes back to the psychology part of color theory.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_01: And why exactly we respond that way, I'm not, I'm not sure.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_01: But I know that generally for most of us, we do respond to the those that yellow, red, orange, those are all the anger or the fire or the energy passion colors.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_01: And so again, not everyone, but most of us are going to respond to yellows, oranges, reds with a certain um a connection of energy.
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_01: Versus if you head over to the fine restaurant, which is not gonna be right, the fine restaurant is gonna be McDonald's.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_01: It's not McDonald's.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_01: It's gonna be the maybe if you go to, I don't know, let's say Italian restaurant and the lights are dimmed, and maybe it's a burgundy, like that kind of it's a moody or purple.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_01: It's they are not necessarily wanting you to come or leave like stuffed, right?
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_01: They're not, that's not their their viewpoint.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_01: They're wanting you to have that experience of romance, perhaps, or maybe a professional dinner, of connection, of an experience of um ambiance, maybe a bit of mystery.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_01: And so those colors are going to be more muted.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_01: You're not gonna see brights there.
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_01: It's not that they don't want you to eat, it's that their motivation is for you to maybe um spend more money on the experience of something that's mysterious, mysterious and moody versus McDonald's, which is fast, fast, fast, eat, be full.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_01: We'll see you next time.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_00: And please get out.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly, exactly.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_01: They they keep the energy up.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_00: I wonder if there's some kind of connection to the fact that, you know, back in I sound like an old man when I say this, but back in ancient times or back in the old days, when people would have to go hunting for their food a lot more, you know, we associate red with meat, with and even today, yes, you know, we associate that with grilling stuff.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_00: And so I wonder if there's some sort of really primal connection with the color red, because we just associate that with life and blood and survival and you know, and so forth.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_01: And I when you dig into the psychology of it, there's a lot of theories about that, um, especially Around the primary colors of yellow, blue, um, green, and red.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_01: And there is a lot of focus of definitely those that does go back.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's I'm gonna say his name wrong, goth, G-O-E-T-H-E.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_01: And he was doing a study of colors and was pulling up on some of those things.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_01: I do not know his material well enough to speak on it, but if anyone's interested, he has an interesting theory of colors, and there's information you can look up.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_01: But um, yeah, no, it's well, even the color purple, right?
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_01: Purple has been throughout hundreds of years the um uh a sign of elegance and wealth.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_01: Even today, it's a color of um there is no fast food sign.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_01: Well, talkable, I guess, a little bit of purple there, but purple's usually more elegant and eloquent than some of the other colors.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_01: It's still a uh luxury color.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_00: When I was growing up, my dad was a funeral director part-time, so I spent a lot of time in funeral homes.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, I used to be a pastor, and I still occasionally will do funerals and weddings and that type of thing.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_00: So I've always been very comfortable in funeral homes.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_00: And it's interesting that when you go to a funeral home, most of the time you're not gonna go in and see a bright yellow color palette on walls or a great uh like a deep purple or any kind of a weird green color.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_00: It's almost always gonna be like these muted blues and grays, and I guess because those colors are calming and going back to the psychology of it, certain colors have an emotional impact on us.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_01: No, blue is an incredibly calming color, and it's very cerebral.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_01: So it said that if you want to think better or study, to be in a blue room.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_00: Wow, I haven't never heard that before.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, you won't get as hungry.
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_01: Blue will calm you down.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_01: So it can be very helpful and practical if you're thinking of decorating your home, like of colors for your rooms, especially if people have a tendency to go real bright.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_01: Remember when those big, like uh the walls, some people are like painting their walls red.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, do you do you really want a bright red wall?
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_01: You just think it's it's gonna be trendy, but you want to make sure that you're surrounding yourself with more uh with whatever atmosphere you want.
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_01: I have a friend who does color theory for fashion, and she would tell me if you're feeling stressed, go home and put something pink on, like if you have a pink robe or something, because pink is very nurturing.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_01: And um, I've always remember that I have these pink fluffy slippers, so I'll go home and stick my pink on.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_01: And it's kind of funny as you start looking at things from a color perspective, uh it actually can work, it can help you in if you have a big job interview, you don't want to wear red, it's too much power, it'll be intimidating to your interviewee or the interviewer.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you unless you're trying to, uh, most of us aren't.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_01: We want to want to be hired.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_01: Um so even and thinking about things like that, but you might want to wear something that has more of a little bit of yellow or orange or green if uh in your shade because that's giving more energy and it's gonna bring um uh some some sense of your team player too to the to the roof.
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_01: So if you're feeling nervous, wear a color that's gonna be wear blue.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_01: That's gonna be calm for you and calm for them.
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_01: So just thinking about those things in a practical way can is a way to use color theory um in your everyday life.
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_00: Now, when it comes to things like book covers, websites, you know, digital marketing kind of things, I think it is really interesting that there are certain industries that tend to use certain colors in their in their logos, their branding, and so forth.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_00: Can you share a little bit about about that as far as, okay, if somebody is maybe in this industry or that industry, here are some colors that might be helpful or considerations that you run across when it comes to branding and marketing.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_00: As it relates to color theory.
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, no, yeah, that's a great question.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_01: And that was how the angle that I came in on is I was being I was being uh taught by someone who was using this completely from that angle of websites.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_01: Businesses.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_01: And I can her name is Fiona Humberstone, and she actually has an entire book on branding with a pretty good section on seasonal archetypes for the small business owner.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_01: She speaks most to creatives, but it's helpful for everyone if there people are interested in a book about it.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but yeah, so for uh for businesses, you kind of think of go back to the your motivation of your business.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_01: Who are you trying to connect with, and what is the emotion that you want them to feel?
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_01: Not necessarily what you feel.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_01: I think especially if you're a creative business, we can put a lot of ourselves in it.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_01: But what is the emotion that you want people to feel?
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_01: So, for example, if you're a business such that is wanting to establish, you want people to feel like they can trust you, that you're reliable.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_01: Perhaps it's a business that you've had for some time and uh you have a lot of experience, you're gonna want to go into the fall colors.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_01: Fall has a lot of muted, a lot of browns to them, of cream colors, these are colors that people will trust, a navy blue, a warm blue, uh, some burgundy, and those are gonna be um colors that people feel a resonance of reliability.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_01: Uh if you're an elegant, uh, your elegant business, a high-end business, you're attracting more of a luxe clientele.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_01: It's gonna be more of a winter archetype, just those colors and using them sparingly.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_01: So for a winter business, you're not having a lot of stuff on the website.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_01: It's gonna be much more sparse, very few colors, lots of white and black, with maybe a couple of accent colors, whether it's turquoise or bright red, whatever that other color is.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_01: And that's gonna speak to a more um elegant high-end customer.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_01: You'll notice on travel websites, there's not too much of their pictures, they are big, there's lots of space.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, the other thing with the like Tiffany, Tiffany Jewel, she's got the Tiffany Jewelry house basically two colors, and um, they kind of reside in more of that high-end.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, so there's fall, there's winter.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_01: So spring, spring businesses are going to be businesses that want to give the sense of playfulness, of energy, of excitement, maybe youthfulness, or some sort of some sense of power.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_01: The Avengers hasn't sense of power, but it's kind of a fun power.
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_01: Right, right.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_01: Like, right?
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_01: It's so it's it's kind of a playful power.
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_01: So a lot of children's brands will resonate with the spring because not only does spring have the colors of that are warm and bright, but also the shapes of spring are round and bouncy.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_01: Um, other things might be a party planner, event planning is gonna go for a spring archetype.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_01: A lot of artists might use a spring arc archetype.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we might do a lot of, I know some direct sales, direct marketing, there's a lot of spring archetypes there.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_01: It's very community organized, uh, very gathering people, networking is gonna be a lot of spring because it's all about energy and getting people together.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_01: And does that make sense?
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, totally.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_01: And then summertime is gonna be more elegant, but it's not the power.
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, winter is like your power player.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_01: Summer is not so much.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_01: Summer doesn't feel the need to be at the center of attention.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_01: So summer businesses can be a lot.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I think I brought up wedding planners in the wedding industry.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_01: Wedding industry knows it's not about us, it's all about the bride, right?
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_01: It's all about the family.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_01: So they have a very sophisticated, elegant, almost understated websites.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_01: It is gonna be more script.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you can get away with more script uh fonts in there, uh, versus the fonts do change with the other um seasons as well.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_01: But um, the other thing, I'm trying to think of another good example with um with summertime magazines as well.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_01: A lot of magazines have more of the summer thing.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_01: Again, it's they want to be um it's all about the reader.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_01: Our as market network marketers, a lot of network marketers, if you look at books like on Amazon, you can look, um they're all gonna be in the spring or the winter, depending on if they're more of a power or they're more um uh energy and wanting to be uh community focused.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_01: Uh other books, a lot of romance books are, as you can imagine, gonna be either spring or summer, depending on um how maybe how romantic they are, versus uh adventure books are gonna be a totem sci-fi.
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_01: You're not gonna see any sci-fi covers for the most part with the summer palette.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_01: No pinks, lavenders, and beige colors for them.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_01: The sci-fi books are gonna have a different, uh probably gonna be more of a thaw thing.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's super interesting.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_00: I had never thought about that.
• 30:21
  SPEAKER_00: So literally in front of me, uh about a foot and a half in front of me, I've got a poster for The Empire Strikes Back.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_00: And the color palette for that is um, you know, the logo is white, but then you've got purples, you know, dark blues, Darth Vader's helmet, blacks, and so forth.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_00: That is super interesting.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_00: I never thought about that.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, movie posters are fun because I I imagine, I don't know, I don't know anyone in the movie business, but I I imagine that so much must go into creating those posters and those advertisers, and they they must have so many different cuts of different color cues.
• 30:56
  SPEAKER_01: With what everything we can do on computers these days, I imagine they they put those in front of a certain number of people to see what will get the most attention.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_00: Well, this is super fascinating.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_00: Man, I could talk about this stuff all day.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_00: But let me dive into a couple of questions, more related to you as an artist in general.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_00: And then we'll we'll dive into our lightning round.
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_00: Does that sound good?
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_00: That sounds good.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_00: I'm really curious, what has been one of your biggest creative disappointments and what did you learn from it as an artist?
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_01: So my biggest creative disappointment was probably something, it was definitely something I needed to learn, and I'm so glad I did.
• 31:33
  SPEAKER_01: But I always thought um that uh what I was going to do is because I couldn't quite figure out the way to get to art, I was gonna use a little bit of my uh creative skills.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_01: I can do um a good enough job at writing and kind of use that writing business to kind of launch my way to the art business, if that makes sense.
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_01: Like I was gonna use the writing business to fund my way to the art.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I I did that and it started going okay, actually.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_01: I was doing some, um I had learned how to do copywriting, so I was sticking in the and in a certain niche and getting clients, and so I made the decision to quit my day job at the same time that I was also traveling across the country to move to the East Coast.
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_01: Well, wouldn't you know that as soon as I did that, it was only a couple weeks that I lost all my clients.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_01: Like it was the most Oh wow.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_01: It was it was just one of those I jumped too soon.
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_01: If you've listened to Dave Ramsey and he talks about you shouldn't jump off the off your what is it, what the dock until the boat right?
• 32:36
  SPEAKER_01: I jumped way too soon.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_01: It wasn't a bad plan.
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_01: I just wasn't patient, and I um I should have had a lot more clients to at least give me room for if the couple that I did have, which were good clients, all dumped me at the same time.
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, I've never made that mistake again.
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_01: I've um and uh but it was it was painful.
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_01: It was a big disappointment that I didn't quite launch out like I thought I would.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_00: Gotcha.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_00: Well, there's definitely some lessons we all can learn from those kinds of things.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um, what would you say are uh any lessons that you're learning right now as an artist?
• 33:11
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I tend to be task-oriented.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_01: Um and this was a good question.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so one of the things that I'm learning right now is uh is people over projects because I can get so consumed with my projects and um looking at my the people in my life as getting in the way of completing my projects, just that selfish attitude based.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_01: And we do, we need to prioritize time, but as a creative, I can also push people aside is not as important.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_01: I've I've noticed that about myself in the past, and that's not what I um the I don't want people to ever feel like that.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_01: So I just really that's something I'm learning right now.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_01: I do not need to say yes to everyone, but people over projects, there's always people in my life of every season, and I kind of um they may not know this, but I'm like, this is an important person to me.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_01: I'm going to um uh open my life up to them, what whether that is is calling them or having them over for dinner, but I just recognize I was spending so much time in my projects, I had let go of people, and that that wasn't good.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_00: It's easy to do when you're a task-oriented person.
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_01: It is.
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_01: It and and um yeah, I can be very task-oriented.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_01: So I love it sometimes, right?
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_01: I just get inundated.
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_01: So that's one thing I'm learning.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then probably the other thing is patience.
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, we talked just be a little bit before we jumped on the recording about um about the path that we that we're both on.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_01: And I know for me the path that I wanted to be on is not the path I uh I ended up being on, if that makes sense.
• 34:41
  SPEAKER_01: So just be patient with myself, being patient that there is there's a plan, there's a path, I'm getting there.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_01: I am more of the um slow and steady turtle than the fast and speedy hare, and that is okay.
• 34:54
  SPEAKER_00: So let's dive into our lightning round.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_00: This is just a series of kind of rapid-fire questions just to dive into you as an artist and a creative.
• 35:02
  SPEAKER_00: These are always a lot of fun.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_00: They may not be as much fun for the guests, but I always have a lot of fun with them.
• 35:07
  SPEAKER_00: So hopefully everybody's having fun.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, number one is if you were stuck on a desert island with only one movie to watch, what would it be?
• 35:15
  SPEAKER_01: I think it would have to be either the Anna Green Gables miniseries or Lord of the Rings.
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_01: And I want to ask, can I bring them all?
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_01: Can I bring the whole triple Lord of the Rings?
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_01: That's probably what I would bring.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_00: Now, the the true question is, are you gonna bring the theatrical versions or the extended editions?
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_01: The extended editions, of course.
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_00: So that's like going hardcore with the 68-hour marathon.
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you know, I've I'm I'm stuck on that island.
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_01: I've got some time.
• 35:42
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, uh next question.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_00: If you could meet anyone in history, dead or alive, who would you meet and why?
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_01: This is such a good question.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_01: And what I really want to do is have a dinner party and invite six.
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_01: But since I'm only allowed to pick one for this interview, um, I really um Corey Tinboom was someone I read several of her biography, um, her autobiography.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_01: I've always been fascinated with her, how she went through so much pain in um her family hiding uh the Jews during the Holocaust, well, they and then being pulled into the um concentration camp, losing her family, and then her books are so joy-filled.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_01: How do you go through that much pain and come out with not only your faith intact, but a joy, and then she forgave her enemies?
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um I just never get tired of her story, and I definitely want to sit down with her one day and have a few cups of coffee with her.
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, next question.
• 36:38
  SPEAKER_00: What is one of the books that helped change the way that you think or see the world?
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_01: Um, okay, that, you know, I have to say I I really enjoyed getting to learn the Enneagram, um, if I'm saying that right, Enneagram, Enneagram, and The Road Back to You was my first dive into it.
• 36:52
  SPEAKER_01: I've read several others since, but I just thought, I think because I always think people think, see the ways, see the world the way I do, and realizing that not only do they not see it the way I do, but they're motivated.
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, it's just been an eye-opening book for me.
• 37:06
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah, that's a great book.
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, the Enneagram is such a powerful tool, for sure.
• 37:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, very much so.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, next question.
• 37:15
  SPEAKER_00: What does a perfect day look like for you?
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, a perfect day for me.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I love to get up.
• 37:20
  SPEAKER_01: It would be several hours of creating, uh, whether that would be working on uh the next book project or um painting, and then I would want to do some cooking.
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_01: I love to cook and I'd have people over for a dinner party and finish the day with a bunch of people.
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_00: Nice, nice.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, next one.
• 37:36
  SPEAKER_00: What is a tool or a creative resource that you can't live without?
• 37:40
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I I this is so basic, but probably just my laptop.
• 37:44
  SPEAKER_01: I just spend so much time writing, and if not that, my journal, because I do spend a lot of time writing.
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_01: I have tons of brainstorms, ideas, and sessions.
• 37:53
  SPEAKER_01: And that ends up being my um, there's so much that comes out of my journal or the laptop, but mostly, yeah, most of that journal that turns into projects and ideas for down the road.
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_00: Nice, nice.
• 38:06
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, uh two more in our lightning round here.
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_00: If you could say thank you to one person who's made a big difference in your life, who would it be?
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_01: Uh my grandfather, the artist that I talked to at the beginning of the interview, um, he really emphasized the importance of practice and um that so he he would be.
• 38:23
  SPEAKER_01: He was someone who just went the long haul.
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_01: And you I I sometimes often think I wish I could go back now and have more conversations with him.
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_01: But he taught me a lot when I was younger.
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_01: He actually gave me my first sketchbook and my first drawing lesson.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_01: So I I would say thank you to him.
• 38:36
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 38:37
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, final one.
• 38:39
  SPEAKER_00: What are you working on this year that you're really excited about?
• 38:42
  SPEAKER_01: So I am working on a new um a new book.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_01: And it's a book we didn't touch on joyful journaling, but it's my other big passion that goes with the art.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_01: And um, I really love teaching people how to what I call capture their year on paper.
• 38:55
  SPEAKER_01: And uh it's not scrapbooking because I think we're too in and that's too perfectionistic, and other so many of us are so intimidated by scrapbooking or junk journaling, which is again very technique driven.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_01: So I just teach people to um gather all of their memories in a physical book that they can share with others, and I am writing a book about that.
• 39:15
  SPEAKER_01: It's gonna have lots of pictures.
• 39:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I'm so excited about it.
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_01: It's gonna be a beautiful book, a coffee table book, as well as an instructional book.
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_01: So that would hopefully it's gonna be working on it this year.
• 39:26
  SPEAKER_01: It may come out at the end of the year.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_01: That's my goal.
• 39:29
  SPEAKER_00: Very cool.
• 39:30
  SPEAKER_00: Well, this interview will come out before your book does, but but I hope that you'll um remind me when your book comes out because I would love to help promote it and just see it because you always create really cool stuff.
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_00: Well, thank you.
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_00: Like you have such a creative mindset, and gosh, how how would I explain this?
• 39:46
  SPEAKER_00: Um I love to see to see people who are so creative and you're producing a variety of things.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you have your your fiction that you have, you have your your blog and your website where you have a lot of great articles, particularly about you know, seasons and color theory and so forth, then you have um your courses and you know, you just have all kinds of cool stuff that you're working on.
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_00: So I d I love that whenever one person is creating such a wide variety of things.
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_01: Well, thank you.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_01: It's been um, yeah, I kind of do like you and I both, we're that we're creatives at heart.
• 40:21
  SPEAKER_01: That's so that it's um it's just a lot of fun.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_01: And I like to bring people into that fun whenever I can.
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_00: So if our listeners want to connect with you, which I'm sure that they will after hearing your awesome interview, uh, what's the best way for them to find out more about your work and to connect?
• 40:36
  SPEAKER_01: So the website is going to be the best way.
• 40:38
  SPEAKER_01: It's the creative season.com.
• 40:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I am also on a couple of the social media, but really I live on Instagram.
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_01: So and it's at MelissaOclair.
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_01: Um yeah, at Melissa O'Clair, and you can find me there.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_00: Very cool.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_00: I'll have links to all that stuff in the show notes.
• 40:52
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much for having me, Kent.
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's been fun.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, thanks so much, Melissa.
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_00: This has been great.
• 40:57
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, I hope you enjoyed this conversation with Melissa.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_00: I know it's really motivated me to look at the world in a new way through the lens of color theory.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_00: And in fact, it's motivated me even more to do some more learning about it because it's one of those areas of art that you can really never learn too much about.
• 41:14
  SPEAKER_00: There's always going to be new avenues and roads to explore when it comes to understanding how color impacts the themes and the subjects and the topics of the world of art, but also the world in general.
• 41:26
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, we see color in everything, so it's one of those topics that's definitely worth exploring more.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_00: Also, be sure to check out Melissa's website at thecreative season.com.
• 41:36
  SPEAKER_00: It's really good.
• 41:37
  SPEAKER_00: She's brilliant with this stuff, so make sure and check it out.
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_00: Today's quote comes from Brene Brown, who said, Vulnerability is the birthplace of innovation, creativity, and change.
• 41:49
  SPEAKER_00: And I hope that encourages you on your creative journey.
• 41:51
  SPEAKER_00: Until next time, remember that you were born to create and design to make a difference.