Latest / The Speak Life Podcast / Workplace Evangelism - Table Talk Podcast With Jack Timpany and Graeme Johnstone || SLP434

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Workplace Evangelism - Table Talk Podcast With Jack Timpany and Graeme Johnstone || SLP434 · The Speak Life Podcast

• 0:06
  SPEAKER_00: Hello and thank you so much for downloading episode 434 of the Speak Life Podcast.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_00: My name is Thomas Thorogood, media producer at Speak Life.
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_00: And for this episode of the Speak Life Podcast, we bring you a bit of a cheeky collab or collaboration, it's fine to say collaboration.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_00: Table Talk is a podcast hosted by Jack Timpany and Graham Johnston, and they do interviews on a whole range of subjects with a whole range of people, effectively making discussions about Christianity very accessible to primarily to their friends and people beyond as well.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_00: So it sounds like a really great podcast.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_00: Glenn was interviewed on their podcast recently talking about the air we breathe.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_00: And so it's been really nice to be able to reciprocate and have Jack and Graham on our own Speak Life podcast.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_00: So I hope you enjoy this conversation.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_00: It flows into lots of interesting areas, workplace evangelism, cultural issues, challenges when talking about Jesus, and joys in talking about Jesus in all sorts of places and in all sorts of ways.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_04: Thanks, guys.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_01: Brilliant to be here.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, pleasure.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_04: Well, I had the pleasure of being on your podcast, I guess it was a month or two ago, talking about uh the air that we breathe.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_04: Um now that's a podcast that you guys have been running for for a little while, is it?
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_04: Um tell tell us a little bit about that.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, that's um that's our lockdown project, really, um Glenn.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_05: I think a lot of people started things in lockdown, didn't they?
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_05: But um yeah, we're still going.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_05: We just did our 50th episode.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_05: We're really grateful for you guys coming on, but uh it's uh yeah, it's a shared passion of uh Graeme and and mine.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_04: What's the what's the gap in the market?
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_04: Because as you note, lots of people started things in lockdown.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_04: It's uh it is what you might call a saturated market.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_03: What's it called for a stop?
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, what's the name?
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_02: It's called Table Talk, and our strap line is connecting current culture with Christianity.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_02: So um I guess Glenn, like what's the gap we're trying to fill?
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_02: So a little bit of history.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_02: Like Jack used to run table talks in person, so he would do them at sort of pubs and and things like that.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_02: And I guess his theme was always what's going on in the world today?
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_02: Like, what's what's current, what's happening in the world?
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_02: And then how do we have a conversation about that and discuss what does Christianity have to say here?
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_02: Is it relevant?
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_02: Is something from 2,000 years ago meaningful in today's world in in modern culture?
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_02: And I guess Jack and I like started chatting about that, and yeah, I think our first episode when we decided to make it a podcast, we recorded it, I think like a week before COVID broke out and everything went into lockdown.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_02: So it was actually like a slightly pre-COVID project that very quickly turned into like a COVID project that grew arms and legs.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and so I guess the gap that we're trying to address, like I love listening to podcasts, I love listening to Christian podcasts, but I think they're you know I would feel a little bit unsure about sharing them with my non-Christian friends, not because I don't believe what they're saying or think it's great stuff, it's just I think it would maybe be a little bit too I don't know, intense or or pointed, or I don't know if it's that accessible, you know.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_02: And so what I personally felt really excited about in doing this podcast, especially with Jack, is how do we get people on who yeah are expert or knowledgeable in an area and just chat about that area and get their perspective on it and then say, but you're also a Christian, and how does that affect how you think about this?
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_02: And I guess if I wanted people to walk away from every episode thinking a few things, it would be okay, that person was like normal, um, credible, interesting, and Christian.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_02: And that's it, basically.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_02: Like, what's going on here?
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_02: You know, we view the world through that lens, so what is that what is that like?
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_04: So what you're saying is that most Christian podcasts involve weirdos incredible, incredible and speak inaccessible.
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_04: No, I think that's not a million miles from the truth, I think that accessibility is key for me.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_05: I don't actually mind if people find our guests a bit weird or or but it's ex- it's just clearly understanding the words they use.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, that is the basic for McGraham and I, and we always get guests on and we just say, guys, like no Christianese, try just imagine you're in a pub right now with your best mates out there.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_05: How would you speak to them in a way that they just understand the words that you're saying?
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, for me, that's what I'm most uh passionate about.
• 5:07
  SPEAKER_05: I don't even mind if people are like, wow, they're a bit weird.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_05: Um sometimes, I mean, we had Claire Luther on, she runs a Daxon hotel, you know, a hotel for dogs.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, that's weird, you know?
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_05: Wow.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_03: That took me so long to realise what you just said.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_03: Exactly, exactly.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_02: So um she was great.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_02: Um But I think what I would say, like Glenn, totally, I hear you.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_02: Uh the flip side of what I just said definitely comes across like that.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_02: Wasn't quite what I was I was intending.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_02: As in a caffeine union, sorry.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, as in like, you know, there's there's tiny things as Jack said, like the language we use.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, I'm a follower of Christ, right?
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_02: And if I'm listening to a Christian podcast as a Christian, like that's a normal thing to say.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_02: But if I'm a non if I'm not a Christian and someone says I'm a follower of Christ, like that's just an objectively kind of weird thing to say.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_04: And so it's like, how do we, you know, how do we sort of frame this in a slightly less kind of way Just two Two days ago somebody said to me, I don't like to call myself a Christian because that's weird, and so I call myself a follower of Jesus.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_04: Really?
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I I I had the same reaction as you, Graham.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_04: I was like, yeah, follower.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_04: I'm a follower of the word.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_03: I mean social media.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, you can Twitter and we'd say you know, have your followers and I suppose it's just a bit yeah.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_03: But it does suggest that I'm being a good idea.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_05: Um Jesus is better than Christ, I would say.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_05: I d I don't mind following Jesus Christ, even then, it's like a bit jargonistic.
• 6:33
  SPEAKER_05: But I uh I think for me uh it's also the format.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_05: So I think we're all used to this, right?
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_05: Of um inviting uh Christians to events or courses like Christianity Explored or Alpha or Oh, I've got this thing in a pub.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_05: Like I used to literally, from where I'm sat, I'm talking a hundred metres, right?
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_05: Used to arrange lunchtime talks for my colleagues.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_05: I go around at midday, I'll be like, right, guys, who wants to come to lunch and I'm gonna pay for it?
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_05: And then I just invited someone to speak on an interesting topic, and I'll be like, uh, um I'm actually gonna get a sandwich from Pret, you know, or whatever.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_05: Um, but the reaction I've had to hey, would you listen to this on your um commute on the way home?
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_05: They're like, Yeah, sure, it's dead time, I've got nothing to lose.
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_05: And so I think accessibility, not just in language, but like podcasts in terms of the format, they're literally coming people in people's ears, they're fed it like on their obviously on their Apple or Spotify, like, here's an episode you haven't heard yet, you know.
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_05: And for me, I think that's dynamite, you know, and it's it's it's just not I'm still up for events, don't get me wrong, and I absolutely love them.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_05: But in terms of actually being able to get someone who's totally disinterested and disengaged, just to be like, Would you listen to this?
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_05: It's not a huge barrier, is it?
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_03: Um so I want to get into that whole like workplace evangelism, you know, that sort of stuff.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_03: We but I actually want to I want to hear the story of the two of you.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_03: So here's the question If there was a uh a romantic comedy being made, we're making a movie about the the the origins of Table Talk, the podcast, right?
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_03: What are the three essential scenes that need to be in that film?
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_03: What what would you say?
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_03: How do how do we get, you know, take us into the rooms?
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_03: What's going on?
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_02: So I definitely know how it starts.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_02: And uh Jack and I were chatting about this uh a little bit earlier, and it was like, what's your first memory of of meeting me?
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, I I don't I'm not sure I really was it like we just met eyes across the room, but as in I think we so basically I am married to Jack's sister.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_02: So uh I am Antonia's husband, Antonia is Jack's uh older sister, and so when I first met Jack, I was like the new boyfriend, you know.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_02: Jack was the sort of playing the role of the protective brother and all this kind of thing.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_02: And um, what year is this?
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_03: What year is this happening?
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_03: Just give us a 2011.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, 2013.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_02: 2013.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, because we got married in 2014 and we moved fairly uh Okay, cool.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah so 2013.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_02: And um so basically, so this was this is my first memory of of properly engaged, like spending time with Jack.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_02: So we went to church in the morning.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_02: Uh so I went along with Antonia and and the rest of her family.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_02: Jack was there as the church in in the village that um that their their family are from.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_02: And on the way out of church, Jack said, Hey, should we uh should we just walk back to the house?
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, uh sure.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_02: And so Jack kind of was like, let's go this way.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_02: And uh and basically then proceeded to sort of have the talk with me about you through your paces, all right.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, pretty much.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_02: Like I want to know I want to know who you are, like what are your intentions with my sister, like you know, um I want you to honour her, protect her heart, all that kind of stuff.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_02: Which in the moment I was like, Whoa, this is pretty intense.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_02: But looking back, I have massive respect for Jack for doing that.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_03: Um, this is a country, a little country lanes we're talking about walking out through the field forest.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_05: Exactly that.
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_03: What time of year is it?
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_03: I'm just thinking we need Yeah for our film.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_02: It felt probably like spring, springtime actually.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_02: Springtime.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_02: I think we started going out this is what happens.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_02: We started going out in February.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_02: So uh I guess it would have been like April time.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_02: It's springtime war.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_02: Spring or May.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_03: I like it.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_03: I like it.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_03: I can I can see it, I can see it.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_03: I can see it.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, scene two.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_03: What's what's the second scene in this in this movie?
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_03: Essential scene.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_02: I picked the open o Jack.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_02: What do you think?
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_05: I think the second one, and by the way, Graham, like you you you did pass with Flying Colours, and I think I yeah, I'd seen my sister's heart, you know, be not well treated.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_05: So I think maybe I came at you a bit hard, but fair play, you stuck at it.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_05: Scene two, scene two would be the wedding.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_05: So Graham got oh I was a groomsman, and the coolest thing was Graham's Scottish, so I got to wear a kilt for the first time.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_05: Um and I just think you look good in a kilt.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_05: I think anyone looks good in a kilt.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_05: So we'd want that in we'd want that in the film, definitely.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_03: Now we know what time of year that was, don't we?
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_03: We in fact we know the date is probably written somewhere in your living room, I imagine.
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_03: So what date is this?
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_03: Let's give a precise date on this.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_02: 14th of August 2014.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_03: So glorious, blazing summer.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_03: Is it okay?
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_04: That's that is the the day of summer in Scotland, I believe.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_04: I believe that yeah.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_04: That's the day set aside for some.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_05: But it's and it's in Scotland, the way it's in Scotland, or it's in Oh, okay.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_05: It's a away match for Graham down Scotland.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_05: So it's but it is in that village church.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_05: Oh that'll that'll cut down so much.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_03: I know locations, location fees.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_03: Alright, so scene three.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_03: What's scene three?
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_05: So I think scene I think scene three, we we're now heading into Table Talk, okay?
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_05: And Graham and us like we were like, we need some good video content, right?
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_05: Because we we we won a we wanted a promo video for Table Talk to kind of launch it at a podcast.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_05: And then I was like, Graham, I've got it, let's do it on my roof in Fulham because there's a cut it's kind of cool background drop and everything.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_05: So we basically and we but like we need a table, so we basically get a rope, tie it to our dining room table, and pull it from the top of the roof, like from the garden up onto the roof, and then get all our kit up there and um and shoot it up on uh up on the roof, and it was it was a great day, wasn't it?
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_02: It was a fun day, it was a fun day, and I think we're sort of starting to get an insight into why I think the the podcast has a good dynamic because Jack and I like I you could have said, give me a list of a thousand places to do that, and I uh Jack's roof in Fulham with his dining table having been wrenched up there, would not have been one of them.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_02: And I think like Jack just you know, but that was that was Jack's creativity coming through there.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_03: So I feel like I've got the final scene of this.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_03: Go on, go on.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_03: We return after many years to the roof.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, being there.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_03: Table's still there.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, table is still there, that's what I like.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, fine.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_03: And there's no one sitting in it because they both they both passed.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_03: What's happened to them?
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_03: Alright, let's leave it at that.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_03: But that's great, thank you.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_03: I'm always interested to know the the how did you meet.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, that gimmick is brilliant though.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, you should do every episode on the roof.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_05: I know, apart from Heathrow Airport, which we didn't really think through.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, so every two minutes you're basically stopping to let you know the A380 land.
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_02: Um so and also like sirens and kids in the street and we got heckled we very quickly realized, I think.
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_02: We did, we did.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_02: So doing it outside on a roof in like in like in Fulham is not actually the best place to do something.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_02: Um but yeah, I mean it was a fun, it was definitely a fun day.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_02: It'll be a great scene, be magical.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, okay.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_04: I wanna I wanna press into um obviously what you did in the pub, Jack, with Table Talk.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_04: That sounds interesting.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_04: I'd love to hear um what workplace evangelism looks like as well.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_04: But let's just finish off on the podcast.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_04: Like what what tell me some good stories about okay, people aren't gonna come to the lunchtime talk, they're gonna go to Pret instead, but they put the earbuds in, they listen to you guys, and so they get in touch.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, yeah.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_05: I I I would say, well, Graeme, you go on to some of your mates.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_05: Our most exciting stories are our own mates listening.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_05: And uh even Graham and I always say this even if we just did this for our mates, we're satisfied.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_05: Um if that makes sense, we're not after some grand audience.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_05: We literally want to do this for our friends and and and colleagues.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_05: My favourite is when I'm chatting to someone at lunch, and then I go, Oh, you should really listen to this episode, you like it, and they're like, Oh, yeah.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_05: I've literally had this where they're sat next to me working, listening to the episode, and then we chat about it in the afternoon.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_05: And for me, that's dynamite, it's just so cool to have uh that level of kind of flow and interaction that uh feels very natural.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_05: Um so Glenn, why don't you share a few of your mates?
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_05: Because they're really enjoying it.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's been really incorrect, it's been really cool because I've got quite a few friends who listen to every episode and they'll like message me afterwards and be like, oh, you know, good one today, or not so good one this week.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_02: You know, like uh real-time feedback, which is very nice.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_02: Um and it's just interesting because I feel like you know, what one of my mates in particular who stands out, he he's been incredibly encouraging, he's such a good friend, but he's he's one of those guys that's like I couldn't go to church.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I you know, I just I'd burst into flames as soon as I walked through the door, you know.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_02: And and I'm like, you know, how do you how do you start a conversation around that then?
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_02: How do you how do you bring that up when you're with when you're together?
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_02: And actually, it's been such a nice way of just doing that really gently.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_02: Like he'll he'll listen to it, come back to me with his thoughts, and I'll say, Well, what did you think of this?
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_02: How did you feel on that?
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_02: Like, what could we have done more of or less of?
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_02: And it's just been a really fun way of kind of engaging with it, and I guess also helping them get a little bit of insight into like what's my mindset on stuff, you know, what's the Christian, what's the mindset of a Christian on stuff that's going on today?
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_02: Um, not in a sort of preachy or overbearing way, but just oh, you know, that was cool.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_02: It's like for you know, when when COP26 was on, we had a couple of climate scientists on, and we're just talking about climate science, you know, and it was just interesting.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_02: I learned a lot, I think a lot of people learned a lot, but then it was like, and as a Christian, how do you feel about this?
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it's just that dynamic is quite nice.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_02: It's a nice, easy way in, and it's led to some really cool conversations, so yeah, it's been it's been good fun.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_05: What one of my favourites we did a live episode on on dating because basically dating through COVID was an absolute nightmare, and I and I would have so many conversations about it uh with like friends and colleagues.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_05: Anyway, I persuaded she wasn't a Christian, but I persuaded one one of my friends to come on a panel, and I that was a really interesting one where you've got a panel of people, some of them Christians, some of them not, but all sharing their experiences, and by the end of it, she was like really persuaded by the people that sat next to her, and openly so.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_05: She was like, actually, I really think what they these guys said was was brilliant tonight, and that that was that was another one that I really enjoyed.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_05: Uh it felt a bit cra it felt a bit risky, I don't know why, but giving someone else the microphone, but actually that that was great, and I I found that a lot actually, the the research that goes into it, or the you thinking about the topics with your friends and asking the open questions before really helped me uh engage with them as well.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_05: Um it's always popular culture, I I feel like I d I just the days of uh it it's not it's not totally true, but the days of like science and God and those sort of big truth questions are not what I'm hearing from my mates.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_05: It's it's much it's much more about um identity and does it work and how do I feel and uh what about Love Island and um yeah and yeah, or like I said, the dating apps is a classic.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_05: Like, are these good?
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_05: Are these not?
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_05: How do we think about them?
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_05: So I think I've really enjoyed exploring that uh and getting back to Jesus, and just it's amazing how easy it is from any literally any topic to just take it back to Jesus.
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_05: You think it's gonna be hard to go from Love Island to Jesus, it's always much easier than you think, and I love that.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_05: Uh it builds my faith.
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_05: Um, definitely.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_05: Sorry, but yeah, I don't know what the question was.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_04: Jack, you have 30 seconds.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_04: Your your category is Love Island to Jesus.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_05: Go!
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_04: The timer starts now.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_04: Go.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_05: Well, imagine Jesus on Love Island, right?
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_05: And I just think genuinely, that's great.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_05: He walks into that with any tubbing.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_05: Exactly, that's the easiest way.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_05: He walks fire safety engine.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_05: Imagine Jesus does get fire safety.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_05: Oh, you caught me, you caught me.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_02: Um but it's actually like it but it but it is it is really uh it's kind of remarkably powerful actually when you go down that route with stuff that you wouldn't expect.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_02: And we had a really funny moment the other day, so we were interviewing um a guy called Graham Daniels, who is the head of Christians and Sport.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_02: Really cool guy, it was an awesome episode, really good fun chatting to him.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_02: And basically at one point it was like, could you imagine Jesus flying in for like a Roy Keane style tackle?
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_02: You know, like would he be that competitive?
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_02: And it was just it was slightly bizarre, but then also like, oh, it's an interesting question, right?
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_02: And it was like, how do you kind of bring it back to that and sort of think through that?
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_02: It was quite interesting.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_04: What is okay, so you can do anything.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_04: Is there anything that stumps you?
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_04: So your your friends kind of uh engaging with you on Christian faith, what what gives you real pause for thought?
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_05: Oh, great question.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_05: Um for me for me personally, it's it's always and I and I I do think my friends open up quite a lot, but it's it's always around death or suffering.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_05: It doesn't always stump me, but it it's just really it's often it's raw and it's sad, and uh I just try and be much slower to speak and uh quicker to listen in those situations.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_05: And um yeah, and I and yeah, I think uh the other topics we've said are fun, right?
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_05: And um yeah, and it's it's much easier to bounce off, but I think there's loads of topics for me when I get into them with colleagues or friends that oh, I just really feel sad for them and I don't want to I don't yeah, I just wanna ask questions actually and and not and and not be too quick to speak.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_02: I also find it quite challenging sometimes because we we try and talk about a broad spectrum of things, and I often find myself talking about stuff where I'm like I'm a white, middle class, straight, privately educated guy.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_02: Like, you know, I and and I think I often feel like people are probably looking at me going like of course you're a Christian, like you know, no doubt, like you've had a comfortable life, like why wouldn't you be?
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_02: You know, there's there's and so I I sometimes feel a little bit stumped when people are like, you know, can you really engage with that?
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_02: Like does does your does your Christian faith really like uh you know, is it really relevant to that scenario?
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_02: And and are you you talking about it?
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_02: Is that really helpful?
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_02: Because how can you possibly engage with that?
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, we had a lady on who had you know she was living in in Kharkiv in Ukraine when the the Russians invaded and she was talking about essentially you know fleeing for her life with her husband and young family and there and and you know I think I personally was stumped on that because I'm like I just I I I have nothing I have no point of reference but then I think it was awesome because you know she clearly did and her Christian faith had really you know helped her through that but she was also so authentic about it and said you know what there were times where I was just angry with God.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't get it.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_02: It wasn't like I opened the Bible to a particular verse and it gave me this moment of enlightenment.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_02: Like no I actually didn't have that at times.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_02: And so I you know I I sometimes feel a bit stumped by that but I do think that um you know it's kind of addressable in in in the experiences of the other folks that we get on so I I sometimes find that a bit challenging and stuff like prayer as well you know unanswered prayer why does God answer some and not like I sometimes find that quite quite challenging and it's a it's a tough one to unpack.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah so there's definitely things that that stump me for sure.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_04: So then Jack tell us tell us about the pub thing and the and the table talk that you got going there.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_04: I mean how how do you get conversations going in in that environment?
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah I love I absolutely love it.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_05: We still do it maybe six times a year upstairs in a pub uh there's usually I don't know 40 or 50 of us and we just pick a p pick a topic or get an interesting story.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_05: Our last one was a guy called Tobias Brown who was a gangster who grew up in Chicago and we try and keep it really fun.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_05: So Graham and I host the evening we'll start with like a quiz or something stupid and uh have some music going you know and it's fun like um we usually pick a like pretty central London location like Covent Garden or something like that just to keep it accessible.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_05: And um what I found is then the my favourite bit so we'll do an interview or uh usually for 20 25 minutes or something like that.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_05: And then my favourite bit is using Slido just an app that anyone can ask a question anonymously back to the questions that we've just heard.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_05: And that's the bit you don't get on a podcast unless you're doing it live and you've got some good tech.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_05: But it's so cool to just see how it's landed and the questions genuinely and then you can upvote which questions you like even the upvoted questions are usually super good and so for example like even Tobias amazing conversion story in prison got out managed to get out his gang da da da da and then the first question was have you gone and reconciled with all the people that you hurt before and he's like oh guys that's actually a hard question for me and uh and he talked through that with them um I don't know just to give you an example but the the I don't know Graham if you'd agree but that that is so exciting to have the conversations with your mate to sat there but also for them to see how other people are taking it really seriously and engaging with this works really well.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_02: I also think it's a nice dynamic of like let's go to the pub and have a pint and talk about this right as opposed to like you have to come down to my church on a Sunday and like be there for an hour and a half and listen to it.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it's just like again it's this it's this sense of like is it relevant to my life?
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_02: You know because that feels a bit sort of peripheral to a lot of people whereas if you're going down to the pub and you're having a pint with some friends and you're listening to someone share about their experience of something and then asking them some questions it's like the most natural thing in the world.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_02: And I find that to be really encouraging and I think the energy also in the room like recording it online like this is is great because it gives us access to people all over the world and it's super easy but I think there's nothing you know it's it's a special thing having like 50 people in a room and you know kind of that energy and doing it live is is great fun.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_03: So um yeah I'm glad we still do those and is that just the two of you arranging those or are you doing that with a bigger ministry or church or or whatever?
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_05: Well actually we sh we have to mention my wife at this point.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_05: So Sarah Timpany my wife is our editor and producer and she is the persistent widow.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_05: I mean she's not a widow because she's married to me but like on I'm not joking guys give her any name she will track them down and she will get them on the podcast and it's an amazing gift it's an amazing gift that she's got and I'm we're really grateful for it aren't we Graham So that that's just for the podcast though in terms of the if you're doing the table talk in the common card.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah yeah but then it's in she'll not she producing that as well yeah well is in she will get get the get the talent get the guest in and then Graham and I will just the talent get Graham and I will just push it push it out in our networks.
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_05: It's it's it's um and for the first time we're starting to get people who we don't know at all who are like oh I listen to the podcast and now they're coming they're they they're coming to the events as well which is cool.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_05: Whereas before it was more they already knew us and were supporting.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_05: So it's starting to but it's starting to gain a bit of traction that way.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_02: I suppose we we should probably say that Sarah is like 80% plus of Table Talks.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_02: I mean she like without honestly Jack and I literally like we'll we'll record an episode for an hour and and like you know that but that's what everyone hears but literally I mean basically all of the groundwork and all of the actual work of creating this show is essentially entirely down to Sarah.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah we would be massively remiss in not calling her out and saying that she is the heart and soul of this thing.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_04: You guys you seem um have have people identified you as or called you terrible names like evangelist before has anyone used that slur on you not really a bit I mean yeah churchy people um yeah yeah but I mean yeah with it within a church situation have have people have church leaders kind of said hey Graham and Jack um you you guys are freaks you're a bit weird this is not this is not what normal people do no they're incredible they are fantastical they're fantasists um you guys are evangelists would you would you own the label?
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_05: I'm happy to own it definitely and and and I do feel like my church set me aside for that like they give me I feel like they give they know I've got quite a lot on on my plate and they support me in that and um and that yeah I feel really supported in that way actually to just go deep on that I guess and I'm freed up to do that a bit uh they don't make me go on like the PCC or try and help with um the finances because they know it'd be a mess uh and or very creative anyway and so I think of my experience is quite positive of yeah as in I don't mind the label it's more just like go and do it and don't worry about this stuff we'll look after that which I really I'm sure I'm really grateful for yeah I would say I've I don't think I've ever been labeled on the receiving end of that particular label.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_02: Um if I'm honest I mean if I were to be would I push back particularly hard?
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_02: No probably not I mean I think yeah it's important to me it's something that uh is is central to my life so I mean for sure like I would want people that I love and care about to to hear about it and at least consider it and do a reasonable job of putting a case forward for it.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_02: And if that's what an evangelist is doing then yeah I guess I'm I'm okay with that.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah well that's cool because I I think the sort of churches that that we happen to go to are are very um they're very apt to tap sparky evangelists like you on the shoulder and take you out of the business world right take take you out of the jobs that you're doing and put you in a little conveyor belt towards becoming a vicar or something like that and sending you off to Vicar factory and um have have people tried to press you into those molds?
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_05: I've got a good story on that.
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_05: So I did a year out what was would I be like five years into work I approach my work here and I say I want to do a sabbatical and they're like okay and I was like I'm gonna work for my church and they were like cool uh go for it which was awesome I was really grateful for that and I worked for my local church and I just found it so weird because I was like when what do I do between nine and five because everyone's at work in that time so I was just like at my desk like cool what do I do what do I do what do I do and then I found this is part of the movie this is definitely part of the movie just in the three guardmates who'd just come out of prison who were like well we've got nothing to do and so I was like right I started what was it called bench Bibles and burgers and we used to like work out and read the Bibles together and um and have a burger and then like week three I work out two of them can't read so I was like doing these Bible studies and they're like they could they can't even read the Bible so that was and I I learned a lot in that year but the key thing is I was like by the end of it I was like get me back in there and my the uh my vicar um was like so supportive of that and that was a massive moment for me yeah he went get out you are done you are done here I'm very supportive of you leaving so do you know what I remember I remember the moment where so I heard that Jack was doing this and again like you know at the in the moment it's like wow that's a that's a big move but huge respect to Jack for doing it and then I remember the moment I realized that he was kind of struggling with it was when he sent a picture to our like family WhatsApp group and he was like hey guys um this is what I've been doing for the last hour and there were some flowers on his kitchen table and he'd been watching them like blossom and I was like wow Jack you need you are scraping the barrel there my friend that pretty much sums up my experience of church life that is church ministry target right isn't that important I think I think that was a couple of days before bench bible and burgers got kicked off and then he I think it was off to the races but I think it was there was some searching in that moment before yeah okay because again I I think part of part of the the way that so much ministry philosophy happens in our kinds of churches is that yes there's there's this sort of suck in towards you like anyone who is interested in Jesus and telling people about Jesus, we get them onto the the the vicar conveyor belt.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_04: And then there's there's something else that's been rattling around my head ever since Stephen McCalpine a a church leader in in Perth in Australia said it to me earlier this year.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_04: He he said pastors are usually quite good at preparing their congregations for the kind of Monday morning that the pastor is going to have and not particularly good at preparing Christians for the kinds of kinds of Monday mornings that they are going to have in in their secular workplaces.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_04: I I wonder if that resonates with you at all.
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah I my experience is um I they work hard at it so I get WhatsApps and maybe we like oh can you give examples of this or so my experience is they they work hard.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_05: I think where it's really hard for them is to imagine what is possible.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_05: So I think it's easy to come up with examples of oh this week um don't just kind of hide behind your screen and go and have a conversation about Jesus or don't lie or um think about how to be I don't know how how to try not to embezzle too much money this week.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_05: I think you get a lot of those examples but I think what you get less of is and and just because they don't maybe know what's possible is um have you thought about starting a business and uh you could like work for three days and then do this for a day and then you could um in your business you could have this sort of culture or um help these sort of people or have you thought about um how you could shape your senior management um HR and start a new um like Christian week for your business or so I th I feel like it's just like it it it's not bad the examples they give or it's not that I'm not prepped.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_05: It's just wow actually I think not always not always but I think there's some pretty exciting opportunities that maybe we're missing out on just because we're we're not encouraged to think in those avenues because they don't we don't know they're possible.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_05: I can speak to a few more of those examples that is so interesting.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_03: Just the fact that because I think the impression I get I mean I I've never really worked for a any kind of non-Christian organization but the impression I get is that they're constantly trying to re reimagine the workplace or reimagine how the week runs and thinking about the how do you get enough out of your employees and and for you guys working in in in pretty big companies I'm pretty sure that HR departments and and and workplace culture sort of stuff is is front and centre.
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_03: But such a shame that that ministers so regularly are are diminished in their vision for what the working life of their congregation involves.
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_05: And and so you're just saying yeah what if what are the what is the Christian imagination about about work um rather than just seeing it something to pay and I I think we come out of that from an angle though because great well graham's married to my sister who's an entrepreneur my dad's an entrepreneur and my brother's an entrepreneur.
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_05: So although Graham and I are a bit more corporate I think we see as well the kind of the tent making the how exciting kind of the tent making entrepreneurial life can be for a Christian when they also I mean I manage a lot of people in my work and so does Graham which is exciting and we've got a lot of impact but when you're just defining your business's purpose and and like what you can do with that money and it gets so exciting as a Christian how generous you could be or the impact you can have and I would just love to see more of that and hear more of that but it's quite hard I think for a pastor sometimes to imagine that although some are really entrepreneurial aren't they some pastors but um yeah would you sorry Graham I've spoken a lot would you agree with that I mean you're married to an entrepreneur yeah I think I think it's really interesting because I the experience of of being an entrepreneur and I'm I'm speaking you know for Antonia here but I get a reasonable insight as her husband I mean I think it's so intense and it's so kind of nuanced and detailed and it's so it's so broad like you you're you're ultimately responsible for every single aspect of quite a you know uh quite a large operation and I think that it's not really realistic to expect someone who has not had that experience to be able to you know share a message that is really like pointed to that thing.
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_02: And so I I tend to find that like the messages that I hear certainly at my church on a regular basis are a nice mix of like challenge and encouragement but they're generally sort of it it it feels like they're they're they're being delivered in the knowledge that there's a broad spectrum of people listening.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_02: And so I think that um it's sometimes a little bit hard to get really specific practical application from that in like a business context because it's just it's not really designed to do that and it would be too niche if you did go down that route because 98% of people in the room kind of wouldn't get much from it.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_02: And so I think it's a really hard balance to strike.
• 38:23
  SPEAKER_02: And I don't really know how you address that other than you know maybe encouraging people who are in that world to look take this and distill it down and maybe you know talk about this amongst amongst that community.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_02: But it's a it's a hard one for sure.
• 38:36
  SPEAKER_04: You can't do it you can't do it from the pulpit but you could say look we're gonna have a church lunch and over lunch all the entrepreneurs you get together all those in teaching you get together all those working at NHS you work you work together and get together.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah but what what if and just just bear with me on this what if it's not about preachers preparing their congregation for Monday morning?
• 38:56
  SPEAKER_03: What if it's about preparing Monday morning for them okay Yeah Oh I love that reimagining this is overnight you Monday morning call me back there is a there is a it's almost like we're just going well the the world sets the rules.
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah yeah there's there's a culture out there's a workplace culture and it is established and you need to be prepared to go off into that's what I'm talking about.
• 39:26
  SPEAKER_03: Somehow fit in break the mould and and work within that system and to say in one sense if you're you know especially if you've got guys as with as much sort of energy and enthusiasm as these two clearly have like it's about it's about saying what is possible for you to do as a Christian that's interesting in this kind of place.
• 39:47
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_04: Which is less the question what what are you going to do about Pride Month and more the question that Jack says well how do you start Christian week in your workplace.
• 39:55
  SPEAKER_05: And yeah like have you have you seen that work before?
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_05: Um I I'm really challenged by someone in my church who's done it for a huge a huge business it wasn't Christian week it was the it was Faith Week but what was really interesting and I I I'm I'm kind of up for trying this but I don't know how it would go but so it was Faith week and every day you get you're kind of you're Muslim or you're Buddhist but what was so cool was like for for the for the Christian day for like the speaker really uh it was different to the rest and notably so because I actually believed it and uh in the sense of it went transcended through everything they did at work and life and and so actually you think oh it's a bit risky because everyone gets their turn but actually that was brilliant and it turned out really well um and people uh responded really well so I I'm I'm quite up for that Faith Week um I don't know uh I'll give it a go anyway.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_04: It's a good it's a good note to finish in I think risky we can we can call it Christmas or something.
• 41:03
  SPEAKER_03: We already have Christmas you already have Christmas and Easter and all the rest but no guys honestly thank you so much for your um your insights and yeah I'm in one sense the the question is not why did Jack and Graham start podcast is how could these two men have not started a podcast when clearly you've got such sort of energy enthusiasm and and passion for your friends and and work colleagues to to hear the gospel so can I give some credit back to you guys because what you're doing which is so important is we just listen I just listen to you and cream all your best ideas and and but there's such a role for that because I need to listen to the world as you guys do it and you help sharpen me in that all the time to keep doing what you're doing and all I'm thinking is how do I make that as accessible possible for my for for for my target mm kind of market who the people we're thinking of if that makes sense so thank you.
• 42:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah wow well it's I mean it's it's your gifts and it's your situation right and you've got it just well what can you do with those two things and I think there's absolutely a place for loads of it and I think we've found an interesting gap that seems to have been a lot of fun so far but um but yeah it's um it's been a journey hopefully we'll we're looking forward to getting to a hundred now I think that's the next goal we've got 50 let's get to a hundred and see uh see how we get on so 50's good for the average but you've got to push on for the century all right guys uh Graham Johnson Jack Timpany thank you so much easy for you to Well there we go I hope you enjoyed that if you like what you heard from these guys do go and check out their podcast Table Talk I'll put the links in in the show notes.
• 42:53
  SPEAKER_00: Just a reminder that all these podcast episodes are also available as YouTube videos on our channel youtube.com forward slash speaklifemedia and so I realise that people often listen to podcasts while they're cooking and driving and stuff which is great but sometimes it's nice to be able to see these conversations as well as hear them.
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_00: So uh do go and check that out and we've got lots of other shorter videos uh and some longer videos on our channel um with a whole range of of people so why not uh check out uh the Speak Life YouTube channel today and uh give us a subscribe we're able to do what we do at Speak Life because of the generosity of people like you who listen to our content.
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_00: So we th we're so thankful for your support.
• 43:41
  SPEAKER_00: Uh people supported us through prayer, through financial means through other means we're so thankful to God uh for you and if you would like to support us financially either as a a one-off or a regular uh giver um just go to speaklife.org.uk forward slash give.
• 44:02
  SPEAKER_00: But that's all from me.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_00: We've got lots of interesting conversations and topics coming your way.
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_00: Just a reminder that Nate Morganlock's series on franchise storytelling exclusively on YouTube is reaching its conclusion this week with Narnia so be sure to check that out I imagine Narnia has a special place in the hearts of a lot of uh the listeners for the Speak Life podcast and it's certainly um got a special place in Nate's heart as well.
• 44:33
  SPEAKER_00: Well that's all from me see you next time God bless