Latest / Smart Business Growth with Nicky Miklós / Authenticity in Business: Embracing Your Weirdness with Kate Toon

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Authenticity in Business: Embracing Your Weirdness with Kate Toon · Smart Business Growth with Nicky Miklós

• 0:04
  Speaker 1: Welcome to Thrive in Business Together with Nikki and Ness.
• 0:11
  Speaker 2: We would like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of country, the Yagara and Bannerong people of Brisbane and Melbourne, respectively, where Nikki and I both work and live.
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: Today's guest on the podcast is Kate Toon.
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: Kate is an award-winning entrepreneur, author, speaker, educator, podcaster and a parent to one human and one fur baby.
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: From her humble backyard shed, she masterminds an ambitious business universe, helping thousands of other humans to build their own version of success through digital marketing business know-how.
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: Today, kate was so open and transparent and honest with us about her business journey and we covered off so many different topics authenticity in business, how to redefine success on your terms and staying true to your purpose.
• 1:04
  Speaker 2: We get to tap into Kate's 16 years in business, her knowledge, her experience and her really down to earth and quite vulnerable approach to how to step into who you really are, rather than trying to be a replica of other people.
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: It's been a great chat.
• 1:21
  Speaker 2: I know you're going to love it.
• 1:22
  Speaker 2: Let's get straight over to it.
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: So, kate, one of the amazing statements that I read that you said was about why the four hour work week is a big fat lie, and I would love to hear more about that, because I believe it's a big fat lie too, so tell me a little bit about where that statement comes from.
• 1:41
  Speaker 3: I think it's not a big fat lie.
• 1:43
  Speaker 3: If maybe you're 25 and you have no responsibilities, you can put all your energy into work and that's great and set yourself up.
• 1:52
  Speaker 3: I think you would need a couple of years maybe more than that to reach that point.
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: But I think for the majority of us we've got other responsibilities.
• 2:01
  Speaker 3: We've got families, we've got pets, we've got dental appointments and school runs and all that kind of stuff, and I think it's unrealistic to imagine that, even if we automate the crap out of everything we do, that we can just sit in a hammock and watch it all happen.
• 2:17
  Speaker 3: The truth about passive income is it's far from passive, or all passive income is passive, but some is more passive than others.
• 2:23
  Speaker 3: I think is another way of putting it, and I think this is a sweeping generalization.
• 2:27
  Speaker 3: The book is great and there's a lot to learn from it, but I think it's written from a male perspective and it's this kind of hustle culture where you get up at five, have an ice bath, have your green smoothie and start work, whereas a lot of us were up till three with the kids foot in our armpit, or the dog was sick this morning or the washing machine broke.
• 2:45
  Speaker 3: Life just doesn't work that way.
• 2:46
  Speaker 3: All circumstances being perfect, maybe after two or three years you can have a four hour work week, but in reality I just don't think it's doable and I think it sets a lot of us up for failure and to feel like we're not successful because we never reach this nirvana.
• 2:59
  Speaker 2: I think that's a really great relate.
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, sorry, I'm so passionate about this already, I'll let you go first.
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: I was just saying I can so relate.
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: And when I started my business it's the I felt like it was the expectation around.
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: You should be able to do it in less amount of time and make a million bucks.
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: And it's like what are they doing that I haven't figured out yet and that comparison artist starts to kick in and I don't think that helps anyone along the way.
• 3:28
  Speaker 2: But it really takes time to build your business, to even work out what it is you want to do and why you have a business, and how does it impact your actual life and what purpose does it hold for you.
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: I agree.
• 3:41
  Speaker 3: I agree, and I think there's a culture and we'll probably talk about this in the coaching community to push messages like earn a million dollars, work four weeks, and then you think I am missing something, I am not getting this, I must be stupid.
• 3:54
  Speaker 3: And if you're sitting in that place and feeling stupid, you're so much more likely to buy that course, to pay for that mastermind, to book that coach.
• 4:01
  Speaker 3: So it's creating this environment of doubt, which therefore makes us buy stuff we don't need, which doesn't give us the answer anyway.
• 4:09
  Speaker 3: But then we go.
• 4:09
  Speaker 3: Maybe that wasn't the answer, maybe this is the answer.
• 4:12
  Speaker 3: So these messages that people put out there are deliberately put out there to make us buy their stuff.
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: I feel like you were standing at the window watching me in my first two years of business, because that's exactly what I was like.
• 4:27
  Speaker 3: And I think you're not alone and I think it's for most people.
• 4:29
  Speaker 3: It's not the first two years.
• 4:30
  Speaker 3: I know very successful entrepreneurs who are still relentlessly joining people's memberships and masterminds looking for the secret.
• 4:36
  Speaker 3: And the secret is there is no secret.
• 4:38
  Speaker 3: You probably already know what you need to do.
• 4:41
  Speaker 3: You just need to do a little bit less learning and more implementation.
• 4:45
  Speaker 3: You would get there.
• 4:46
  Speaker 3: My challenge to everybody listening to this podcast and maybe this should have been my thing for the end of the pod is to buy nothing for an entire year.
• 4:53
  Speaker 3: I don't buy a single book, a single course, a single template and instead implement everything you know.
• 4:59
  Speaker 3: Empty your brain of every idea you've had, that list that you've had in your asana, or a slack of things you could do.
• 5:05
  Speaker 3: Do all of them and by the end of the year, I guarantee you'll be in a better spot than if you bought another course and I'm saying this is someone who sells courses, so you can see what I mean.
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: Yes, that's really interesting because one of the things I was thinking about giving my I love books and I buy so many books and I have so many books I haven't read.
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: Can you relate, oh my gosh.
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: And I'm like you know what.
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: There's so many books I have read that were so incredible and inspiring.
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: What if I went back and read them again and I usually never do that, but I actually want to give myself a bit of a challenge for the first six months of this year to not buy any new books, either the ones that I bought and I haven't read, or go back to some of my faves.
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: And what else can I take from that?
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: And I guess the theme in that is this whole pausing, is this whole stopping and actually thinking for what purpose am I stepping into that course or that new learning space as opposed to taking action?
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: And I think the other thing that's really important to mention here is that it can be really easy to actually fall into becoming a part of the problem as well.
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: So we talk about comparison artists, we talk about saying hang on, what's wrong with me?
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: I'm not getting it right, but then what did we portray as well on our socials and in conversations that we're having, and this feeling of having to put the mask on or having to be perfect.
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: I think this is something that, to generalize, a lot of people we go through and that certainly it's been a lot of themes of our podcast episodes around and personal development.
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: I can only speak for myself.
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: But, wow, taking that mask off or that perfection.
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: When I do that, my results in all areas of my life definitely improve, and yet it is so easy to stay safe, which becomes uncomfortable eventually in trying to have that mask of perfection.
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: One of the things I love about you and your brand, kate, because, although this we haven't met in person till recently, I have known of your work for many years and actually shout out to Ali Henshin, one of my besties, who's also in business, who's obsessed with your work, who's part of your courses One of the things that has always stood out to me about your brand and even you talk about the misfit you are just.
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: You just think so authentically.
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: You and awesome and down to earth, even despite your exceptionally long list of business awards and business success, like you're very impressive and you just seem so real.
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: Tell us about that.
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: How do you do that in this world that seems, society that seems to support and reward on the outside anyway, definitely not real results, but that perfectionism?
• 7:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah, believe me, like you said, I did it for a while.
• 7:39
  Speaker 3: I thought, especially when I was a copywriter, I was like copywriters wear roll neck jumpers and have a picture of them at their desk with their hands over a keyboard.
• 7:46
  Speaker 3: I will do that, but it's so exhausting trying to be something you're not.
• 7:51
  Speaker 3: I always tell the story.
• 7:52
  Speaker 3: I was a big admirer of Denise Duffield Thomas and still I'm a very impressive woman, but she's glamorous in a way I could never be.
• 7:58
  Speaker 3: I just can't.
• 7:59
  Speaker 3: But I do remember I went online and I bought a piece of fake hair and I set up my lights in my office, put this fake hair it's probably cat hair and put it on, tried to make these videos.
• 8:08
  Speaker 3: I was sweating and getting swearing and I made this video which I should share on social media, and it's so awkward and hideous.
• 8:14
  Speaker 3: I even had my perfectly placed succulent and my color coded bookshelves, all the coutrements, and then I could never replicate that.
• 8:21
  Speaker 3: So if I actually want to show up, I have to show up, like today you've just told me this is on YouTube.
• 8:26
  Speaker 3: Not even brush my hair.
• 8:27
  Speaker 3: Do you know what I mean?
• 8:28
  Speaker 3: It just means I can show up all the time.
• 8:30
  Speaker 3: Everything I do is on brand.
• 8:31
  Speaker 3: Everything I say is on brand because I am my brand and it just makes life easier.
• 8:35
  Speaker 3: But I do know that it comes at a cost, because I'm not everyone's cup of tea.
• 8:41
  Speaker 3: Do you know what I mean?
• 8:42
  Speaker 3: And if I was a bit more vanilla no one's offended by vanilla, it's not anyone's favorite flavor, but no one's offended I could have a much bigger following of slightly uninvolved, unengaged followers.
• 8:53
  Speaker 3: Instead, I have a smaller following of more raving fans.
• 8:57
  Speaker 3: And that's the choice you make.
• 8:59
  Speaker 3: If you are more you and you're more weird and you show your quirks, it puts a lot of people off, but it makes the people who like you a lot more.
• 9:06
  Speaker 3: So you swap popularity for genuine connection.
• 9:10
  Speaker 3: And I think that's really hard in social media because we all look at the follow account and we see these follow accounts of 50,000.
• 9:16
  Speaker 3: We go well, they've made it, but they haven't made it because often those people aren't making any money, they're just popular on paper.
• 9:22
  Speaker 3: So it comes at a cost, but it's a cost I'm prepared to pay.
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: And do you think that's?
• 9:27
  Speaker 2: You mentioned that it was something that perhaps you didn't do earlier on in business.
• 9:31
  Speaker 2: Do you think it's an age thing, a maturity thing, or just you get to a point in your business where you go oh, for God's sake, it's just.
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: This is who I am.
• 9:40
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's literally, it's age, it's time.
• 9:42
  Speaker 3: So I think you could get to this point at 25 if you were just putting in the hours.
• 9:46
  Speaker 3: You just get sick of yourself.
• 9:48
  Speaker 3: Do you know what I mean?
• 9:48
  Speaker 3: You get sick of all the game and the plava, and all of us suffer imposter syndrome and comparisonitis.
• 9:54
  Speaker 3: But once you've felt that feeling 72 times, you're like, honestly, kate, shut up.
• 10:00
  Speaker 3: Really, is this the person we're picking to hate online at the moment and be jealous of?
• 10:06
  Speaker 3: And then we forget about them.
• 10:07
  Speaker 3: And then we find someone else.
• 10:08
  Speaker 3: Oh, look at them.
• 10:09
  Speaker 3: And then we obsess over them for the next six months.
• 10:11
  Speaker 3: It's so boring, it's such a waste of time, the hours I have lost going down the rabbit hole on someone else's website going, oh, their videos are better and all they're speaking at this conference and I'm not.
• 10:22
  Speaker 3: Oh, what a waste.
• 10:23
  Speaker 3: It's so boring, I just got sick of myself.
• 10:25
  Speaker 3: I just got bored of myself.
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's like what you were saying as well around the learning to implementation.
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: It's just imagine what we could do with that time going down.
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: I know I've definitely done.
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: I have got some better boundaries around it these days, thank goodness, because we create this.
• 10:40
  Speaker 1: I'll say suffering in light of First Lord, suffering for ourselves, and we can control that and we can stop that.
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: We have a choice in that.
• 10:49
  Speaker 3: We do.
• 10:49
  Speaker 3: Suffering is a human condition not to get too Buddhist on us and it's all relative.
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: As you said, first World suffering, it's the top of the pyramid.
• 10:57
  Speaker 3: Right Once we've actualized our food and our comfort and whatever, we get to this point where it's all about our id and our ego and we're just at war with this aversion of ourselves that we want to put out there and how we're perceived and the really freeing thing is to realize no one cares.
• 11:11
  Speaker 3: We're so worried that everyone's looking at us and looking at our jumper and saying, oh, I want that jumper, I hate that jumper, or whatever.
• 11:18
  Speaker 2: No one cares.
• 11:19
  Speaker 3: Everyone's self obsessed and worrying about their own stuff.
• 11:21
  Speaker 3: So once you realize that if you literally disappeared from social media tomorrow, no one would notice, I think that's incredibly freeing and allows you to turn up and be yourself.
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: That's so true.
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: That's so true.
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: It reminds me, nikki, of the conversation we've had before on the podcast about the ripped jeans and that whole thing.
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: We did a photo shoot.
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: Kate Nikki had ripped jeans and when they came back, when the photos came back, she had a little bit of a oh, we can't put that on our website.
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: And then 24 hours was like no, yes, we can this is symbolic.
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's crazy isn't it?
• 11:53
  Speaker 3: We think we need to sit around in pencil skirts, with perfectly quaffed hair and beautiful white kitchens, and we all know that if you move the camera a foot to the left, as a pile of dirty washers.
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: And if there isn't?
• 12:07
  Speaker 3: and if you are somebody that lives this immaculate life, good on you If it's genuine and true.
• 12:12
  Speaker 3: There are people like that who have really clean kitchens, you know, but for most of us, we get that it's not real, and as soon as you get a whiff of fakeness, oh my God, I'm off.
• 12:21
  Speaker 3: I'm not going to invest in you, because if you're going to put fake stuff up on Instagram, you're probably going to be faking your membership, you're going to be faking your course, and I'm not going to connect with you.
• 12:31
  Speaker 3: It's, it's, it's for all, so relatable.
• 12:33
  Speaker 3: You don't relate to someone succeeding.
• 12:35
  Speaker 3: You relate to people failing, and it's unfortunately.
• 12:38
  Speaker 3: You've got to share a bit of that.
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, a great, and in an authentic way.
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: I know there was a phase I don't know, maybe a couple of years ago of all of a sudden there was this wave of people showing themselves crying on camera and then that even feels really forced.
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: Are you stuck in the busy trap on Juggle Street being all things to all people despite having a team?
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: Or perhaps your business is feeling chaotic?
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: Do the mini business health check to get 10 strategies in under 10 minutes so you can get time freedom back, experience peak performance and finally leverage smart growth in your business.
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: Head over to b2businesstogethercomau forward slash health check and, if you're ready for us to help in a more hands on way, email us at hello at business togethercomau and we'll set up a time to chat.
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: In line with this maybe a bit of a digression, but really I think in line with this is also I was.
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: I woke up this morning thinking about the likes of Pamela Anderson, jamie Lee Curtis kind of bit odd, thinking about the fact that they're on this match, not mantra, but on the way of no makeup, mission of no makeup.
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: And Pamela Anderson I think she even said something along the lines of she.
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: I think she's had a bit of work done and she regrets it.
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: And this natural like showing up as we are, who we are, not having to put makeup on.
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: Even that's a huge shift.
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: I notice in my life or the gray hair, or people want authenticity, or the realness.
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: But yeah, don't fall into the trap of actually setting it up, allowing it to be the real thing.
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: Don't go dye your hair gray just so you can have gray hair.
• 14:20
  Speaker 3: This is it especially for Pamela Anderson, who was known for being a beauty.
• 14:23
  Speaker 3: It must be a lot harder to go from being a beauty to not being a beauty, whereas you've never been known as beauty.
• 14:28
  Speaker 3: It's a bit easier right, yes.
• 14:31
  Speaker 3: There's nothing wrong with dyeing your hair, getting Botox, putting makeup on and using filters and whatever.
• 14:35
  Speaker 3: It's not, as you're honest about it.
• 14:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I dye my hair.
• 14:38
  Speaker 3: Yes, I have a bit of cheeky Botox.
• 14:40
  Speaker 3: I do to feel good about myself and I've got no shame of that, but I wouldn't be going out there pretending this was natural.
• 14:48
  Speaker 3: So be you with your super clean kitchen, if that is you.
• 14:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 14:53
  Speaker 3: There's nothing wrong with that and don't apologize for that, but yeah, I think a bit more kind of showing up as a scruffy beast makes you a bit more relatable.
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: There's more scruffy based out there.
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: Here we are.
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: By the way, he looks great.
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: I also think it comes back to what we started the conversation with.
• 15:08
  Speaker 2: It's where, when we're not sure about who we are, what our business, what do we stand for?
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: We want to be vanilla because we don't want to rock the boat.
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: We've heard that people who get on their soapboxes get that's right.
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: And then there's the haters and all that kind of stuff, and so there'd be a bit of fear around.
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: I can't shine too brightly, because what will other people do or say If you're at this phase in your business or your career?
• 15:34
  Speaker 2: I want you to hear that you'll see you, because people ahead of you have been there most likely, and that permission to say it's okay early on would have been something that I would love to have perhaps lived for myself when I wasn't in that.
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: What's wrong with me?
• 15:49
  Speaker 2: Yes, why can I do?
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: Why have I spent $60,000 on courses and I still don't get it, whatever it is?
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: Because there isn't an it.
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: There isn't.
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right.
• 16:00
  Speaker 3: That's the thing we're all searching for, like El Dorado, and it doesn't exist.
• 16:04
  Speaker 3: You're like new level, new devil.
• 16:06
  Speaker 3: I've been doing this now for 15 years and from the outside, looking in, people would be like boo ya, with your books and your conferences and your overseas travel.
• 16:14
  Speaker 3: I still sit here 90% of the time in my pants in a shed fiddling with Excel.
• 16:19
  Speaker 3: It's not that sexy.
• 16:21
  Speaker 3: Do you know what I mean?
• 16:21
  Speaker 3: A good business is essentially a very dull, predictable business.
• 16:26
  Speaker 3: And again, obviously we know the highlight reel.
• 16:29
  Speaker 3: You see these pictures on Instagram of people going off to retreats in Malibu and everyone wearing matching kraft hands.
• 16:33
  Speaker 3: You're like I want to do that.
• 16:34
  Speaker 3: It's like why?
• 16:35
  Speaker 3: Why do you want to spend 20 grand on this so-called guru On earth?
• 16:40
  Speaker 3: Do you think they're going to say to you that's going to make that much difference?
• 16:43
  Speaker 3: Nothing, it'd be better off just talking to your mate.
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: Do you know what I mean?
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: Stop giving these people your money because there's nothing they're going to say.
• 16:51
  Speaker 3: That's going to change your life.
• 16:52
  Speaker 3: You're going to change your life and as soon you realize that, the much better your bank balance will be.
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: Most definitely.
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: And I do.
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: Here you go, Nick.
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: I was just saving the awareness of again why I've asked ourselves that question.
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: That's really important.
• 17:06
  Speaker 3: Of course there's a place for courses and of course.
• 17:08
  Speaker 3: there's a place for courses If you've never been on Instagram and you want to do someone's course on how to do it, so I'm fantastic, but this might be controversial.
• 17:17
  Speaker 3: It's also like seeing maybe a psychiatrist or something.
• 17:20
  Speaker 3: There's a period where you need to do that, and then there's a period where maybe you need to do some stuff on your own.
• 17:25
  Speaker 3: You need to take a step back, try on your own, and then maybe you need to see someone else and keep going.
• 17:29
  Speaker 3: But constant coaching and needing to feed yourself, courses and memberships speaks to me as a lack of something within you rather than a need.
• 17:40
  Speaker 3: You're trying to fill a hole that will never actually be filled.
• 17:43
  Speaker 3: As you said, identify the hole, ask why.
• 17:45
  Speaker 3: Sometimes the reason is still legit.
• 17:47
  Speaker 3: Sometimes, they're not, and it's really hard to know.
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: Absolutely, because it is the intention behind that as well, and I think that this is a really important aspect for all of us to consider Is this action that I'm taking, this need to fulfill whatever the hole is, to fill that hole?
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: Is it coming from a place of fear?
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: Is it coming from a place of love?
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: We can even break it down to human behaviour.
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: We're coming from a place of fear, we're coming from a place of love, and if it's fear driven, chances are it's a superficial, vanity type, ego driven, something that you're looking to fill.
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: If there's an intention of love or I'm going to go practical return on investment, what's the ROI in this, then that's a different kind of story and I think that there is a.
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: I don't know if it's maturity, but maturity is in.
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: We've done it before.
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: Aha, I start to recognise this actually was fulfilling the hole that was unresourceful, versus this is something that is worth an investment of my time and money and absolutely identifying that pattern.
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: If you're just buying, buying, buying, going, but not actually taking action, that's a really big, big piece of feedback right there.
• 18:56
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think it depends as well what kind of mood you're in.
• 18:59
  Speaker 3: I often tend to go spiralling down into this.
• 19:01
  Speaker 3: When I'm feeling a bit sad or depressed, I buy things.
• 19:04
  Speaker 3: When I'm feeling wobbly, then the next day I'm like why don't I buy that?
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: I think it's also about the brain chemistry of sometimes.
• 19:10
  Speaker 3: We live in a world that promotes dopamine, immediate reward.
• 19:13
  Speaker 3: You buy a course and you feel like you've done something.
• 19:16
  Speaker 3: You haven't done anything.
• 19:17
  Speaker 3: You haven't done anything.
• 19:18
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 19:18
  Speaker 3: But you get the immediate dopamine reward, whereas what we need to be rewarding is we need the serotonin, that slow release, feeling of contentment, not the highs and the lows, and therefore you have to.
• 19:30
  Speaker 3: If the reward for something is far away, that's serotonin, and you enjoy the process.
• 19:35
  Speaker 3: If you get an immediate kickback, that's the dopamine.
• 19:38
  Speaker 3: It's like when you do and I've done it before and I said I'm writing a book and everyone's well done, it's amazing I haven't written it.
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: I haven't written it.
• 19:45
  Speaker 3: But I get so much dopamine for the backpacking that then I probably don't write it because I got my big dopamine.
• 19:51
  Speaker 3: Now I'm in a low after I've had my dopamine and now I'm now sitting in this place of low where the dopamine's gone and now I have to write it.
• 19:57
  Speaker 3: Better to tell no one Slowly write it and get your dopamine when you publish the blamish thing we live in a dopamine culture.
• 20:06
  Speaker 3: Netflix, amazon Prime.
• 20:07
  Speaker 3: It's all about immediate reward and you have to be careful for that.
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: Absolutely.
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: I know you were saying that.
• 20:13
  Speaker 2: I think of the pressure perhaps that some business owners put themselves under, and we talk about thriving without burning out, because when you are time poor, when you're stuck in the busy trap and putting expectations on yourself about what you should be doing, I should be further along, I should be earning more money.
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: I should know this information especially.
• 20:34
  Speaker 2: I know that your book is all about school hours and parenting and, having gone through business when my kids was in late primary school right through high school, there's this element, I think, of just pushing and pushing in order to be able to have success whatever that some other person's version, really.
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: Until we got to a point where we were working together, I decided actually, we want to create a business based on our terms, we want to have a day off every second friday, we want to not work weekends, we want to earn good money, but we also don't need to earn millions of dollars.
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: What's good?
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: What's our vision for our business and how is that going to fuel the lifestyle that they, that we want?
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: And I think that what I've observed from watching you over the years that I've been in business as well, kate, is that you make decisions, you turn things off that are doing well in your business, and I wonder is there a driver in that, based on your whole perception of how is this impacting me and my life, or is there another driving force behind that?
• 21:35
  Speaker 3: Look, I'm gonna be perfectly frank and I and say that I was very financially driven.
• 21:39
  Speaker 3: So I think it's really important to define your metric of success from the outside.
• 21:42
  Speaker 3: Otherwise you'll be defined by everybody else's but it will evolve over the years.
• 21:46
  Speaker 3: So when I started, it was time.
• 21:48
  Speaker 3: I wanted time with my son, but I then I had my son and I'm like I need some time away from and then it became very financially driven.
• 21:56
  Speaker 3: I wanted to pay off debt, I wanted to have a secure future and I money became my absolute god, the cost of all else.
• 22:02
  Speaker 3: And it didn't work.
• 22:03
  Speaker 3: Yes, I hit my million dollar revenue let's be honest here revenue but it was highly profitable.
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: My profit always been about fifty two, fifty three percent, some passive income business.
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: So I hit my million dollars, and you get to that.
• 22:14
  Speaker 3: But because I hadn't attached it to anything in my life other than paying off debt, which is a cold and emotional thing, there was no joy.
• 22:22
  Speaker 3: Great look to my excel at the end of the year.
• 22:24
  Speaker 3: I've done it, brilliant.
• 22:25
  Speaker 3: What now?
• 22:26
  Speaker 3: Now I have to make two million.
• 22:28
  Speaker 3: Do I have to get eight figures?
• 22:29
  Speaker 3: Jeez.
• 22:29
  Speaker 3: So I feel like I did reach my summit and I do not deny anybody that as their goal.
• 22:34
  Speaker 3: If you want to make money, it's a brilliant thing.
• 22:36
  Speaker 3: Life is easier with money.
• 22:37
  Speaker 3: Let's not deny there's no glory in poverty.
• 22:39
  Speaker 3: I've been there but it does become soulless unless it's connected back to your life and your whatever, and also the accumulation of things becomes very pointless.
• 22:48
  Speaker 3: I see some entrepreneurs going I need to earn money because I like nice things, yeah, but do you need another cushion and you need a better cut, really, when it all comes down to it, do you?
• 22:57
  Speaker 3: So I think this is glorification of like fanciness as well, and I'd rather live a simpler life.
• 23:02
  Speaker 3: But that took.
• 23:03
  Speaker 3: I can't deny that I had to get to that point and then come down again.
• 23:07
  Speaker 3: So I don't want to be in sincere.
• 23:08
  Speaker 3: I've been a greedy bitch for many years.
• 23:10
  Speaker 3: Now I'm like my son's 14.
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: I've got four years of family life in this kind of vibe and then it will change.
• 23:17
  Speaker 3: Obviously still be there, but it won't be like this.
• 23:19
  Speaker 3: I'm getting old.
• 23:20
  Speaker 3: I'm 50 nearly this year.
• 23:22
  Speaker 3: I want to live a little.
• 23:23
  Speaker 3: I want to learn to roll a skate, I want to make pies.
• 23:26
  Speaker 3: I don't know, and my business denies me that pleasure sometimes because it's all consuming.
• 23:30
  Speaker 3: But I can again.
• 23:31
  Speaker 3: I can say this from a place of relative financial security and that's a smug place to be, do you know?
• 23:36
  Speaker 3: I mean because financial security gives you choice and that's all it really is money, finance, and money is freedom.
• 23:41
  Speaker 3: And then you get the freedom and you're like I don't know what to do with myself because I've spent the last 20 years working like a dog.
• 23:46
  Speaker 3: Might you know how to relax?
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: Wow, thank you for your honesty.
• 23:52
  Speaker 2: I think that is such a perfect example of why being in business is always about and it's so cliche, but it is about us growing as people and learning about ourselves.
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: Yeah, 100% personal development course in the world every day.
• 24:08
  Speaker 3: Your challenge, the very fact that we're even all sitting here doing a podcast.
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: That's taken three way coordination For the tech stuff.
• 24:16
  Speaker 3: The oomph to do a podcast when there's a million podcasts and you're worried like who's gonna listen to mine.
• 24:20
  Speaker 3: There's so many things that have led to just even us being here and we don't unfortunately, we don't credit ourselves with that like, yeah, we've got to do another podcast.
• 24:28
  Speaker 3: We don't realize that this is amazing, and we talked about authenticity and the fact that I think that I used to think it was humble.
• 24:35
  Speaker 3: I wanted to stay humble, but I don't think it's about being humble.
• 24:39
  Speaker 3: I think I'm still astonished that I get to do this every day and that astonishment, I think, comes through every day.
• 24:46
  Speaker 3: I'm like why I get to sit in an office in my back garden and talk to people like you and if you keep that vibe, that joy that keeps you going a bit of a bit of astonishment, if you start to get smug and complacent and take this all for granted, that's when you, I think you become one of those people we don't like on instagram.
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: And then it becomes that perpetual, like you said, achieving these meaningless goals.
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: So, oh, kate, I love talking to you and even what I love about what you just shared, then, is that the definition of success changes as you change, as you grow.
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: Also, as you and I'm talking to you, listeners as your environment changes, your age, your family situation, all of that, of course it changes.
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: We can't expect that.
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: Even potentially, the reason we first went into business might be different as to why we stay in business now, and it's okay to have the money, goals or be defined by whatever it is.
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: I think that's a big thing to take away from today.
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: Whatever that is for you we've said that a lot in a little bit of different contexts as well Just make sure that it's attached to something of meaning.
• 25:50
  Speaker 1: It's this whole.
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: One of our mentors and dear friends, joe Pane, talks about this transition from ambition to meaning.
• 25:57
  Speaker 1: I'm reading a book, strengths to Strength, by Arthur C Brooks, very relevant for our age group, and it is the same thing.
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: So let's keep checking in with why again, why are we doing?
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: What's the purpose and what's the meaning in that?
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: And I absolutely love oh, my dogs are saying hello, astonished.
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: What I'm hearing in that is all gratitude, but all for what we do and the fact that we have this opportunity to sit here as a three-way.
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: Thank you for sharing and reminding me of that actually Like it's really important.
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: So we like to finish with one actionable action that our listeners can take Now.
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: You already have shared one.
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: Maybe that's the one that we land on In light of this conversation, and in 25 minutes or so we've taken it to a few different places Authenticity in business, redefining success, staying true to your purpose, whatever that is, not allowing ourselves to get swept up in comparisonitis, being okay to not having brushed our hair in the morning before a podcast.
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: So many things that we have covered off.
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: If you were to pull out one key thing out of all of that to give our listeners to action, preferably within 24 hours what would that be?
• 27:03
  Speaker 3: I want to cheat, I want to give two.
• 27:04
  Speaker 3: I want to give an abs, a brain one and a practical one.
• 27:07
  Speaker 3: The practical one first is to spend an hour today going through your emails, your socials and removing anybody who gives you even a vague feeling of ick.
• 27:16
  Speaker 3: You do not need to follow the big names.
• 27:19
  Speaker 3: You do not need to follow your competitors.
• 27:20
  Speaker 3: You do not need to follow your friends.
• 27:22
  Speaker 3: No one will know, it doesn't matter.
• 27:24
  Speaker 3: You can follow as many people as you can and keep that creativity inside yourself rather than draining out by looking at other people's content.
• 27:31
  Speaker 3: The other one, I think, is a bit more of an abstract rule one I talk about this in the finish of my book is really think about whether you want to create a CV life or a eulogy life.
• 27:41
  Speaker 3: Your definition there was beautiful ambition to meaning.
• 27:43
  Speaker 3: Are you ticking off achievements I must have a membership, I must write a book, I must have this many followers or are you creating a eulogy life?
• 27:50
  Speaker 3: What will people say about you when you're gone?
• 27:54
  Speaker 3: They're not going to remember that you had 72 episodes of your podcast.
• 27:57
  Speaker 3: They're going to remember that you were made them laugh, you made them feel loved and that you were a nice person to be around.
• 28:02
  Speaker 3: I think that's something to take on board, wow.
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: I love that so much.
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: I would have to say that, from following you, what you put out into the world, that you live, that Thank you so much, I feel like I'm going to cry.
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: Yes, before we all grab tissues, tell us where can people find you, kate?
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: What's the best way for people to get in touch if they want to be in your world?
• 28:28
  Speaker 3: You want to join the Tunaverse, as I call it slightly ecotistically.
• 28:31
  Speaker 3: I started off as an SEO.
• 28:33
  Speaker 3: If you pop Kate Tune into Google, you'll find my 72 sites, my 900 social media channels.
• 28:38
  Speaker 3: I'm an overachiever.
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: I'm trying to come back from that, so you'll find ambition to meaning we will definitely pop some links, and especially a link to anybody who wants to buy your book.
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: I can see that in the background.
• 28:52
  Speaker 2: It's been a lot through my social media channels and I look forward to reading that one too.
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: So, kate, thank you so much for your time today.
• 28:59
  Speaker 2: We have loved chatting and, yeah, we'll say goodbye.
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: Thanks so much, thanks.
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: Kate, thanks for listening to today's app.
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: If you loved what you heard, find us on LinkedIn and let us know what you enjoyed.
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: Also, don't forget to rate and review and, of course, share this episode with your biz besties.
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: Ness and I are obsessed with helping you break through your business and life barriers to get you to your next frontier of growth.
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: We bring two business minds and two perspectives into your business.
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: As the magician, I help connect the dots, see the possibilities and the hidden potential, and as the architect, ness turns those possibilities into practice, implementing plans and frameworks.
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: Because, let's face it, every vision needs a practical pathway to success.
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: We offer business health checks, taking you from chaos to clarity in just 30 days.
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: Are you curious to find out more?
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: Send us an email or go old school and give us a call.
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: All our details are in the show notes and on our website.
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: Until next time, happy listening and here's to thriving in business and life.