Latest / Show, don't Tell Writing with Suzy Vadori / 52. Show don't Tell Page Review: Action Scenes with Michael

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52. Show don't Tell Page Review: Action Scenes with Michael · Show, don't Tell Writing with Suzy Vadori

• 0:07
  Welcome to Show.
• 0:07
  Don't Tell Writing with me, Suzy Vadori, where I teach you the tried and true secrets to writing fiction nonfiction that are gonna wow your readers broken down step by step.
• 0:18
  We're gonna explore writing techniques.
• 0:21
  I'm gonna show you a glimpse behind the scenes of successful writers' careers that you wouldn't have access to otherwise.
• 0:27
  And I'm also gonna coach writers live on their pages so that you can learn and transform your own storytelling.
• 0:33
  Whether you're just starting out, you're drafting your first book, you're editing, or you're currently rewriting that book, or maybe even your 10th book, this show's gonna help you unlock the writing skills that you didn't even know you needed, but you definitely do.
• 0:48
  I'm so looking forward to helping you get your amazing ideas from your mind onto your pages in an exciting way for both you and your readers, so that you can achieve your wildest writing dreams, and you're gonna also have some fun doing it.
• 1:02
  Let's dive in.
• 1:04
  On today's podcast, I have a special treat because Michael Dunn is coming on and he is also a fellow editor.
• 1:12
  And so he's being super brave because he knows that you can't always see what's going on in your own pages.
• 1:18
  So I love, love, love that.
• 1:19
  Michael submitted a page for a one page review.
• 1:21
  We're gonna do show Don't Tell on his one page.
• 1:25
  So Michael is a creative writer and an editor stuck for now in a corporate body.
• 1:30
  Oh boy.
• 1:31
  Do I know how that feels, Michael?
• 1:33
  His love affair with books was kindled by the original Alfred Hitchcock presents the three investigator series written by Robert Arthur.
• 1:41
  Shortly afterward, Michael began attending school in England where his father had a large personal library of hardcover novels ranging from Anne Rand's, the Fountainhead, to Daffy ER's, Jamaica Inn, and everything in between.
• 1:54
  Later while living in the Middle East, Michael's wife tired of string and grouse about poorly written books, and uttered a life changing challenge.
• 2:03
  It's kind of a dare, right?
• 2:04
  Well, if you can do better.
• 2:06
  And thus began a long journey of learning and eventually hanging out his shingle as an editor.
• 2:12
  More recently.
• 2:14
  In addition to regular fiction and nonfiction editing, Michael is also the author of the Scooter, the Bravest Bear Children's book series with each book written and published for the Isaiah 41 10 Foundation, which raises funds for pediatric cancer research.
• 2:30
  Michael has also published fantasy and science fiction short stories with a gothic adventure novella, and three volume fantasy series in progress.
• 2:39
  Michael currently lives in northern Alabama with his beautiful wife who still challenges him and their opinionated German Shepherd Teeka.
• 2:48
  Michael understood the assignment and he sent in a one pager for the podcast, which is an action scene, which I think was a really, really smart choice.
• 2:56
  I'm gonna read it for you now, and then Michael and I are going to review it together.
• 3:02
  His right shoulder drooped down the body's natural attempt to separate itself from the pain and shock of the wound.
• 3:08
  Several other bolts hit near him, but thank the goddess they all missed.
• 3:13
  Casting a quick glance behind Attri.
• 3:15
  Saw the shadows for suing him.
• 3:17
  The initial shock and flight reflex began to wear off, and the pain of the arrow still lodged His shoulder threatened to bring him down as he ran.
• 3:26
  Atrias wondered briefly if they'd poisoned the arrowhead with the sum agent or other.
• 3:30
  He knew he couldn't go on much longer.
• 3:33
  A hiss had began to sound in his ears, and with every step that grew louder, unconsciousness called to him with a seductive voice.
• 3:41
  He began to yearn for it as the struggle to escape rendered him weaker and weaker.
• 3:47
  Why should he endure the pain?
• 3:49
  Why did he flee?
• 3:51
  What was he even running from that was so horrible?
• 3:54
  Another minute passed during which it felt like he ran through treacle.
• 3:58
  The ground itself conspiring to slow him down.
• 4:01
  He wheeled his legs to keep going, humping his left arm to add momentum while his right hung useless.
• 4:07
  The S Sibilant sound grew to an almost continuous thunder in his ears, and Atri knew the end was near.
• 4:13
  Above the roar in his ears, he heard a shout.
• 4:16
  He stumbled to a halt and looked over his left shoulder.
• 4:19
  Sir Adrian stood at the edge of the tree line, read in torch light with another next to him.
• 4:27
  Atri S whitted through the pain.
• 4:29
  The other person remained indistinct despite the blazing torch in the Baron's hand, and then he fell into darkness.
• 4:38
  Welcome Michael Dunn to the podcast show.
• 4:40
  Don't Tell Writing.
• 4:41
  I am so excited to meet you today.
• 4:44
  Well, thank you, Suzy.
• 4:45
  Thanks for having me.
• 4:47
  All right, so I love, love, love this page that I just read for the audience that we are going to take a look at together today.
• 4:55
  Michael hasn't seen these edits, although this is just gonna be fun and he will get all of this afterwards so that you don't have to take notes.
• 5:02
  We can just be in it right now, brainstorming on what's going on.
• 5:06
  So tell me this book, how long have you been writing it?
• 5:10
  Now you're gonna ask me to reveal the big secrets.
• 5:13
  They, it's big secrets, right?
• 5:15
  This is something that we don't talk about.
• 5:17
  You know, the answer might be three weeks.
• 5:20
  Sometimes the answer is three weeks, and sometimes the answer is 10 years.
• 5:23
  And they're both valid and they're both so interesting to our listeners.
• 5:28
  Yeah.
• 5:28
  So the honest answer is Terrance 1990.
• 5:34
  I love that.
• 5:35
  Well, what's kept you going all these years?
• 5:38
  I mean.
• 5:38
  Obviously when we say this, it means probably that you were, it's not like you're writing it every day for that many years, 35 years, right?
• 5:46
  It's like you've probably had a rendition of it and now you're picking it up again.
• 5:51
  Is that my, I'm guessing here, you let us know.
• 5:53
  Yeah, it's, it's very organic.
• 5:56
  The word people use today.
• 5:58
  It all started with the dare.
• 6:00
  That I included in the bio.
• 6:02
  It's, you know, my, my wife would get tired of hearing me grouse about the quality of books that I was reading.
• 6:09
  Well, she's like, well, if you can do better, I'm like, well, all right, I will.
• 6:14
  And so, you know, in 1990, that's a long time ago, but we had a pc, so I got up and I banged out a chapter or two, and I'm like, okay, no, that's not bad.
• 6:26
  But it was, it was horrible.
• 6:28
  I've been in the corporate world my whole life, so it would get put down, you know, a year, two years, I'd go back to it, but it's always been in my head.
• 6:37
  And really the organic part is that I've learned so much about writing between then and now that, well, I've had this right, if you will.
• 6:47
  I've, I've gotten creative again, and next up I'm working on a, another novella right now.
• 6:54
  But as soon as that's done.
• 6:56
  I'm jumping back into this full time.
• 6:59
  Love it.
• 6:59
  Okay, so we're getting you at an opportune time to come on the podcast and to wanna dive back in.
• 7:06
  So when, when was the last time that you touched this page that you sent us?
• 7:10
  Like, are you working on the novel actively here, or is this something that's straight outta your PC from 1990?
• 7:16
  I, I'm super interested.
• 7:18
  I love, love, love this answer.
• 7:20
  Yeah, no, this, this is, this is fairly recent and by that I mean in the last five or six years, I'm also an editor, which I, that's one of the reasons I haven't been writing a lot because I've been editing other people's books.
• 7:37
  I steal, I steal you me, all the time.
• 7:40
  I work on about 50 full manuscripts a year right now.
• 7:44
  Wow.
• 7:44
  And I work with hundreds of people on the podcast and in my programs, so yeah.
• 7:49
  Okay.
• 7:49
  Right.
• 7:49
  Like, and, and sometimes they go to writer's events and writers will say to me, but are you writing?
• 7:54
  And I'm like, well, yes and no, and I don't, you know, like I feel like all of my writers are writing and all of these stories are getting out there.
• 8:02
  So however it gets out there, it's all.
• 8:04
  So amazing.
• 8:05
  And I'm sure that editing other people's manuscripts, you must learn a ton, right?
• 8:12
  You learn so much about how it works.
• 8:15
  That's right.
• 8:15
  Um, so I love that you're coming back to this book that's diverted 35 years ago.
• 8:20
  And I have a similar story.
• 8:21
  I worked in corporate and when I was a teenager in the eighties and nineties, I was working on books as well.
• 8:27
  Totally feel you.
• 8:28
  And I didn't write my first novel.
• 8:30
  I sat down and wrote my first novel in my late thirties, so yeah, and I just turned 50 last week, so there you go.
• 8:37
  Happy birthday.
• 8:38
  It is.
• 8:38
  Thank you.
• 8:39
  It's, it's, you know, it is, it's a journey.
• 8:42
  I can guarantee that this book will not be the same and it should not be the same as if you finished it 35 years ago because so much has changed and we'll go through that.
• 8:52
  Okay.
• 8:53
  And live, blah blah.
• 8:54
  This choice of your page to review.
• 8:57
  Thank you for sending it.
• 8:58
  I'll always ask you not to send something that you think is perfect 'cause then we have nothing to talk about, but something that you actually want to brainstorm.
• 9:04
  Mm-hmm.
• 9:05
  There's so much going on, like it's an action scene and there's so much going on in an action scene.
• 9:11
  And it's really difficult to balance what I call the five elements of writing, which is your dialogue, your action, your reactions, your setting, and your inner thoughts.
• 9:20
  Right?
• 9:20
  Those are your five tools that you can put on any given page, and so it's hard to balance all of those.
• 9:25
  I think you've done a pretty good job.
• 9:27
  We'll go through.
• 9:27
  There are some ways that we can actually add this scene because I, I mean, I'm jumping in here.
• 9:34
  Where is the scene in the book?
• 9:36
  Is it the opening?
• 9:38
  No.
• 9:39
  No, this is, this is a little bit, this is kind of leading up to the guy in this, in this scene is one of the two protagonists.
• 9:49
  That's one of the things that's changed a little bit about this book.
• 9:52
  It's always had a couple of protagonists, but the way I'm approaching it now is more, I guess, modern vernacular would be young adult fantasy, although I think it's gonna appeal to a wider audience as well.
• 10:06
  But.
• 10:07
  So there's two, two people from two completely different worlds that get put together for the sort of classic fantasy quest, right?
• 10:17
  Yep.
• 10:17
  Love it.
• 10:18
  And so this is before this character meets the person that's going to join those two characters together and.
• 10:28
  Send them out.
• 10:29
  Right.
• 10:30
  So we've had sort of, so you've got, you're saying two protagonists.
• 10:34
  I wanna break that down just for a second.
• 10:36
  Okay.
• 10:36
  Um, so you've got two point of view characters.
• 10:39
  Yes.
• 10:39
  You've got, so you'll be sharing, sharing it from his point of view and then from her point of view That's correct.
• 10:45
  At and maybe your mother.
• 10:45
  Okay.
• 10:46
  Because when we say two protagonist, yes.
• 10:48
  And you can have two point of view characters.
• 10:51
  I wanna make sure that you know who we want readers to care about more.
• 10:57
  Do we want?
• 10:57
  Because it's never equal, right?
• 10:59
  Mm-hmm.
• 10:59
  And when you're mapping that story out, it's a lot cleaner.
• 11:03
  If you can choose one of those characters to map their journey and then have the other person's journey kind of mirror, contrast, push, pull, all those things along the way, like it's one of the characters has kind of this spine of the arc and the other character is, so if you do it, I, I don't wanna get too deep into that'cause that's beyond scope of this today.
• 11:22
  But if you've got two protagonists, when people say that, I wanna make sure that you understand that, because if you don't do that, you're gonna end up with two separate journeys and it misses those moments.
• 11:33
  Right.
• 11:34
  So if you can map them and see if you can put their moments together, that's a really fun way to do it.
• 11:40
  Yeah.
• 11:40
  And, and I won't, I won't dwell on that either, but I, I will say that this first book, which this is from the first, uh.
• 11:48
  Plan three book series.
• 11:50
  Yeah.
• 11:50
  This character is definitely the lead, as a matter of fact.
• 11:55
  The other, you know, and, and I refer to them as two protagonists because they end up being kind of a team.
• 12:02
  But in this book, she spends a great deal of time incarcerated.
• 12:07
  So he is trying to rescue her as well as.
• 12:12
  Move the quest forward.
• 12:13
  Absolutely.
• 12:14
  He's gonna be the spine, if you will, of the story.
• 12:18
  I love that.
• 12:18
  I love that.
• 12:19
  Thank you.
• 12:19
  Okay, so that helps the context.
• 12:22
  And how old are they?
• 12:23
  They're late teens, high school graduates, if you will.
• 12:26
  If you wanna learn it that way.
• 12:28
  Yeah.
• 12:28
  Because you said that it kind of morphed into a YA story and really we need our YA characters need to be under 18.
• 12:35
  If they're beyond that, then it becomes this new adult category, which is really hard to sell.
• 12:39
  I'm not saying it's bad, it's, it's really hard to sell.
• 12:42
  And so this was kind of no man's land from 18 to 25, but it's, it's kind of sits in there.
• 12:48
  So if you've bought them as teenagers, just make sure they're, you know, 17 or under and you're, mm-hmm.
• 12:53
  You're good.
• 12:54
  At least in book one.
• 12:55
  Awesome.
• 12:56
  You've got your research.
• 12:57
  You know what you're doing here, and you should, because you're an editor as well.
• 13:00
  I love that.
• 13:00
  Okay, so we've got here, and so I was diving into this page without all that context, and now I know a lot more.
• 13:07
  We'll go through my suggestions here for show don't tell writing, which is what the podcast is all about.
• 13:12
  We've got his right shoulder drooping down.
• 13:15
  His body's natural attempt to separate itself from the pain and shock of the wound.
• 13:18
  So here I had to question about the point of view.
• 13:21
  So I, I understand now that you've got a couple of point of view characters, but in genre fiction today, which this is right, like mm-hmm.
• 13:28
  Fantasy and why especially.
• 13:31
  It's changed a lot in 35 years.
• 13:34
  Right.
• 13:34
  And as I know as well, and I try to keep on top of it, but really we wanna be in third person close, which means that we're really inside your character's bodies.
• 13:43
  It's the most common point of view.
• 13:44
  And so it had a question here whether we were really close.
• 13:47
  The reason was because it seemed like he was really aware in the moment of why his body was reacting, which was interesting.
• 13:54
  If he has a medical background or he has a lot of experience with pain, but as this is happening, to be aware and say, oh, that's just my body's natural attempt to separate itself from the pain and shock of the wound, right?
• 14:06
  It didn't feel like his voice.
• 14:08
  Does that make sense?
• 14:09
  Mm-hmm.
• 14:09
  Yeah.
• 14:09
  So questioning.
• 14:11
  Otherwise, it sounds like a third party description.
• 14:13
  So I was gonna watch for this point of view, choice through the page to see if it's consistent, but maybe if he's wise beyond his ears.
• 14:20
  That makes sense.
• 14:21
  I don't know.
• 14:22
  What do you think about that?
• 14:23
  Yeah, I think that's a great observation and you know, if I think about the character he is just graduating from their version in his world of, of what would be considered kind of a, a forest ranger school, if you will.
• 14:39
  Cool.
• 14:40
  So he might know this.
• 14:41
  So his job, if you wanna call it that, is going to be within his barony, would be to look after the forest and the creatures and all of these kind of things.
• 14:51
  So it's possible that he's gonna have some medical background in there.
• 14:56
  And you know the perfect, the incident right before this is he takes a crossbo bolt.
• 15:02
  To the shoulder.
• 15:03
  Okay.
• 15:04
  He is trying to, he's running away, he's trying to three somebody.
• 15:07
  So he is, he's trying to fight through all of that and, and get away.
• 15:12
  Excellent.
• 15:12
  So he's not your typical team, so that's perfect.
• 15:15
  So when we're in his point of view, everything should be colored with what he knows and what his view of the world is.
• 15:21
  So that's perfect If he knows that I just flagged it.
• 15:24
  'cause I was like, I'm dropping in without context.
• 15:26
  So that's great.
• 15:27
  And then again, several other bolts hit near him and I didn't have the context and so my note was okay, because I don't have context, I don't yet know what a bolt is.
• 15:35
  Mm-hmm.
• 15:36
  But if it's, you just said it, it's across all bolts.
• 15:39
  And if it's described earlier in the scene, then that's fine.
• 15:42
  I wasn't sure if this was, if this was your opening page, then you would need to give me some context there, right?
• 15:47
  Then you dive right into Thank the Goddess and I'm like, I just love that.
• 15:51
  So you've got this already.
• 15:52
  You're world building, you're doing it.
• 15:54
  You're showing us what's important in their world, what we do when we, you know, have a deity or we have swear words or whatever.
• 16:01
  We show what's important in society so that that's a really great showing detail and it's using that language, right.
• 16:07
  It's a great job there.
• 16:09
  When we get here, then we're in the middle here.
• 16:12
  Does he know who's chasing him?
• 16:14
  Do we know who's chasing him?
• 16:15
  The shadows.
• 16:16
  Do we know what those are yet?
• 16:17
  Yes.
• 16:18
  Yes.
• 16:18
  More or less.
• 16:19
  We know that there's shadow.
• 16:21
  We, we know that, and I don't wanna spoil anything for anybody that's listening that wants to buy my book later, but he's running away.
• 16:29
  That's what they know so far.
• 16:30
  Yeah, that's right.
• 16:31
  Yeah.
• 16:31
  He's running away because the baron, if you will, of the neighboring province or Barony, killed his father.
• 16:39
  And has blamed him for doing it.
• 16:42
  So a typical frame up murder scene, he used this character's weapon to kill his father.
• 16:49
  Put it on him.
• 16:50
  Why?
• 16:50
  He is all about tropes.
• 16:51
  Use him.
• 16:52
  Use him.
• 16:52
  Yeah.
• 16:53
  He was getting carried away, haired away.
• 16:55
  So he knows the bad guys.
• 16:58
  The ones that actually did kill his father are probably the ones chasing.
• 17:02
  Excellent.
• 17:02
  So here, there's an opportunity though to show us what's going on here.
• 17:06
  So here's a great one.
• 17:08
  So you've got casting a quick glance behind Atrias Saw the shadows pursuing him, right?
• 17:13
  So that's a tell.
• 17:14
  You're telling us here that the shadows are pursuing him.
• 17:16
  Is he running?
• 17:17
  I mean, later on we find out that he is running and maybe before he's running, so, but a show here would look more like the shadows.
• 17:24
  Black Mass was a mere stride behind him, right?
• 17:27
  So rather than seeing he saw the shadow behind him.
• 17:30
  See it.
• 17:31
  So the shadows, black mass was a mere stride behind him, or he held his shoulder as he sprinted forward.
• 17:36
  Only missing a moment.
• 17:37
  The shadow was on his tail.
• 17:39
  He dared a glance back to see its long gray fingers dancing across the pavement.
• 17:44
  Only a breath behind, right?
• 17:46
  Like see the shadow.
• 17:48
  So don't tell me about the shadow, but what does it look like?
• 17:51
  A lot of times when we're doing magic, a mistake that writers make is that we don't make our magic big enough.
• 17:56
  It's cool in your mind, and you wanna say it's a shadow, but it can be so many things.
• 18:00
  I mean, Peter Pan dances with his happy shadow, and then there's also shadows that are like dementors out there, evil horses.
• 18:08
  Which one are we?
• 18:09
  So when you are sewing magic, make it weird.
• 18:12
  Make it big.
• 18:13
  This is fantasy.
• 18:14
  Don't let it be that.
• 18:15
  It could just be a regular old earthbound shadow.
• 18:20
  Make it weird.
• 18:20
  Yeah.
• 18:21
  So another or something, nutter, right?
• 18:24
  Like, like if you love the, I always like to say this, if you love the suggestions that they come up with, by all means have them.
• 18:29
  They're yours.
• 18:30
  But if you don't love them, sometimes that's even better.
• 18:33
  You're like, Susie, that doesn't sound like the shadow at all.
• 18:36
  What does that shadow look like to you?
• 18:39
  In this case, the shadows, plural, are the people that are pursuing him, the soldiers of this other baron and and shadow what look like.
• 18:48
  They sound like, what does it feel like?
• 18:51
  Well, and I just called them shadows because it's nighttime and they're running through the forest, so there's not a whole lot of light.
• 18:58
  So absolute people.
• 19:00
  Yeah.
• 19:00
  So what little bit of light there would be from the mood or stars or whatever, you know, the people pursuing him are going to look like actual shadows running through the train.
• 19:10
  Oh, okay.
• 19:11
  So I thought that it was gonna be part of your magic system, that there was something called the shadow that was actually pursuing him, and I wanted it to be really exciting.
• 19:19
  Okay, so if they're just people, then we, we maybe need to say the shadows of the soldiers.
• 19:24
  You know, all you could say were, maybe it's more like silhouettes, right?
• 19:27
  Yeah.
• 19:28
  Silhouettes of the soldiers.
• 19:29
  If it's just their 'cause, the shadows would be what's on the ground.
• 19:32
  Okay, so perfect.
• 19:34
  So, but, but isn't it interesting when you, and you probably find this all the time when you're editing other people's, you can't see that yourself.
• 19:40
  'cause it, it plays like a movie in your own mind.
• 19:43
  And then you're like, Susie, why did you think that was a magical element?
• 19:46
  But hey, that's what happens when we write things down sometimes.
• 19:49
  So in the next part, you've got, you've done a really great job of making meaning for this, of this for us.
• 19:55
  So you've got the initial shock and fight reflex began to wear off.
• 19:59
  The pain of the arrow is still lodged in his shoulder, threatening to bring him down.
• 20:03
  So this is awesome.
• 20:04
  So this is making meaning he's roo, he's hurt and he's about to go down.
• 20:09
  So great job getting us up to speed and were in his thoughts now.
• 20:13
  That's the element that we're using is his inner thoughts.
• 20:15
  Right?
• 20:15
  So you've got, as he ran, ATRI, wandered briefly if they had poisoned the arrowhead with some agent or other.
• 20:21
  So I'm wondering why he's doing that.
• 20:23
  Is something happening that we could connect to the scene?
• 20:25
  Like is it burning?
• 20:27
  Does it feel, has he been shot before?
• 20:28
  Does it feel off?
• 20:30
  Like why is he wondering that?
• 20:33
  I think that was just my attempt at, bring in a random thought.
• 20:38
  That is he's running through the woods trying to escape.
• 20:41
  He's obviously aware of, of his weapon and his previous experience perhaps with, you know, this is probably the primary weapon and it's been used already previously in the book, the Crossbo.
• 20:55
  So it's used all the time, and it's used in various ways.
• 20:58
  So I thought, well, you know, one way it could be used, especially by bad guys, is they poison arrowhead.
• 21:05
  Right?
• 21:05
  Absolutely.
• 21:06
  And so is that what's making him woozy or is it just the pain, right?
• 21:09
  Like, like those things are, or if the arrow, you know, if it has been poisoned, what does that mean?
• 21:15
  I don't know as a reader, unless you've already described it.
• 21:18
  Mm-hmm.
• 21:18
  But if you haven't.
• 21:19
  Then does it mean he might only have mere minutes?
• 21:21
  And where's the safest place?
• 21:23
  Like gives more agency.
• 21:24
  So if he's thinking about that, what does it mean to him?
• 21:27
  Hey, if they've poisoned this arrow, I'm going down faster and then I might need to take cover, or I might need to, how do I get help?
• 21:35
  How do, how do I start yelling?
• 21:36
  I don't know.
• 21:37
  What would he do about it?
• 21:38
  Because we want, especially in ya, these heroic characters have all the guts in the world, right?
• 21:44
  And so what would he try to do?
• 21:47
  How would he try to help himself?
• 21:48
  He's gonna fail because I read to the bottom of the page, he's gonna fail.
• 21:52
  But what would he try to do?
• 21:53
  Would he try to pull it out?
• 21:55
  Would he try, I mean, that's not necessarily a good idea, and he may already know that training and he may not decide to do that.
• 22:02
  But what would he try to do?
• 22:04
  What does he know?
• 22:04
  So, yeah, I wanna see him trying to help himself.
• 22:07
  He's trying to run, but what else?
• 22:09
  Yeah.
• 22:09
  Stuff to do.
• 22:10
  Okay.
• 22:10
  Yeah.
• 22:11
  I mean, yeah.
• 22:11
  Right, right now, the, the whole scene.
• 22:14
  Is him just trying to get away, right?
• 22:16
  Yeah.
• 22:16
  He got multiple people chasing him.
• 22:20
  He knows if they catch him, he's either gonna be thrown in jail for murdering his father, which he didn't do, or they're just gonna kill him and say, sorry.
• 22:29
  Does the reader know that?
• 22:31
  Um, it's telling me what he thinks.
• 22:32
  If it's not there, it should be somewhere.
• 22:34
  Yeah.
• 22:34
  The reader knows that he, he will either be killed or thrown in jail.
• 22:38
  Right.
• 22:38
  If they connect the dots, they would know.
• 22:41
  At this point, we need to know the stakes, connect the dots for them.
• 22:45
  Yeah.
• 22:45
  You know these things, but we forget to put them on the page.
• 22:48
  Yeah.
• 22:48
  So then he starts to ask himself questions, right?
• 22:51
  Why should he in endure the pain?
• 22:53
  Why did he flee?
• 22:54
  What was he even running from?
• 22:55
  That was so horrible and, and I made the comment, I was like, yeah, I actually, as the reader, I have the same questions, but why does he have these questions?
• 23:03
  Is he actually, so what I was trying to get at was, is the poison confusing him now or was he always this confused?
• 23:10
  'cause he is confused, right?
• 23:12
  'cause he's saying, why did I do this?
• 23:13
  What's going on?
• 23:14
  Like, what, what are my options?
• 23:16
  And that's okay for a moment, but don't leave us confused for too long.
• 23:21
  'cause we are your protagonist, right?
• 23:22
  We are your point of view character in the scene.
• 23:25
  And if the reader's confused for too long, they don't like it.
• 23:28
  It's sort of the same point as before, is like, what are these stakes?
• 23:31
  Like let him think a little bit more clearly than he might in real life because it's a about what are the stakes and what is he worried about?
• 23:38
  Make that really clear.
• 23:39
  I know when we're writing drafts then we can ask ourselves all these questions, but let's answer a few of them as well.
• 23:45
  Yeah.
• 23:46
  And I, I think that just built off, you know, the previous couple of sentences there where, you know, he started to hear what I described as a hiss in his ears and, you know, he's getting weaker and, and so the natural, what I considered a natural extension of that was, you know, now he's like, why am I running, why am I running right?
• 24:07
  Why don't I just give up kind of thing.
• 24:09
  Why doesn't he give up?
• 24:10
  One of the core things that we need to answer right is like, why would your protagonist go above and beyond what any normal human would do to accomplish their mission?
• 24:20
  What?
• 24:20
  What is his deeply personal reason?
• 24:22
  Right?
• 24:22
  And I'm sure you've answered that elsewhere.
• 24:24
  I won't put you on the spot here.
• 24:25
  Okay, so I'm blah, blah, blah.
• 24:28
  Your hissing sound like introducing a sound is really smart.
• 24:31
  So showing we often just rely on the visual, but you've made it 3D because he catch here now, but he's got this hissing sound, right?
• 24:38
  So it, it felt like he ran through treacle the ground itself, conspiring to slow him down.
• 24:44
  Beautiful.
• 24:45
  He wheeled his legs to keep going, pumping his left arm to add momentum while his right.
• 24:49
  I useless.
• 24:50
  Excellent, excellent.
• 24:52
  Very good.
• 24:52
  Showing the Sid sound grew to an almost continuous thunder in his ears, and Adrias knew the end was near above the roar.
• 25:00
  In his ears, he heard a shout.
• 25:02
  He stumbled to a halt and looked over his left shoulder.
• 25:05
  Okay, so again, I'm looking for the stakes and it's kind of the same comment as before.
• 25:10
  What does he think is about to happen?
• 25:11
  Have him guess because that that's gonna make you reader really stressed if we have no idea what's gonna happen or if we're just waiting or if he's just waiting.
• 25:19
  It's not as, actually, that's exciting as if we're anticipating it.
• 25:24
  It's weird, right?
• 25:25
  Like this, it's the way that suspense novels are built.
• 25:27
  When we know in the very beginning, we know right away what the suspense is.
• 25:32
  You know, there's a murder, we just don't know how it happened, that type of thing.
• 25:35
  So it's, it's that sort of thing is if we know what's coming, sometimes that's even more suspenseful, especially in a, in a chase scene like this.
• 25:43
  I've got a few suggestions here.
• 25:45
  Again, take him or leave him, but maybe it will push you to see what I'm getting at Soon the shadow would overcome him and swallow his body again.
• 25:52
  I thought it was a fantasy shadow.
• 25:54
  I was really excited to walk up.
• 25:56
  Or it could drag him to the depths.
• 25:58
  Right, but you're saying that he might be killed or he might be thrown in jail.
• 26:02
  Right.
• 26:03
  Yeah, so name the danger here in his own words for ma Maxim income impact.
• 26:08
  What I mean by that is, again, color it with his point of view.
• 26:11
  What does he think the danger is?
• 26:13
  Right?
• 26:14
  Like color it with his personality.
• 26:17
  It doesn't have to be like he could go to jail or he could die.
• 26:20
  It's like he could, he closed off from his family for the rest of his life in jail, or he could.
• 26:27
  You know, what does he, what does it mean to him?
• 26:29
  Put it in his words.
• 26:30
  I don't know enough about your characters to keep guessing, but I can brainstorm all day.
• 26:34
  Yeah, no, and, and, and that's good.
• 26:36
  I, and it's, it's tricky, number one, because his mother died before this, which weighs on him, and he thinks about that in, in quiet moments.
• 26:47
  And that made his relationship with his father difficult.
• 26:50
  Yeah.
• 26:51
  Which is also discussed previously in the narrative.
• 26:54
  And so well, so she's, yeah, I, I was just gonna say it.
• 26:58
  The only real family that we know of, that the reader will know of that he has is his grandfather, who is the headmaster at school that he went to.
• 27:08
  And as we, we can see in a particular scene where he comes to the house, finds his son, which is this character's father dead.
• 27:17
  You can see in his reaction that he's maybe not buying the fact that his grandson killed his father.
• 27:25
  Right?
• 27:25
  But his hands are kind of tied because this guy is a ruler of province.
• 27:31
  There's polls involved, you know, but Atrius doesn't know that.
• 27:34
  He doesn't know that his grandfather is necessarily sympathetic.
• 27:39
  He just knows that his grandfather had him taken off to jail.
• 27:42
  Right.
• 27:43
  So, and that's what he escaped from.
• 27:45
  And so, and so would he be disappointing his grandfather or, you know, like, what, what does this mean to him?
• 27:50
  Exactly.
• 27:51
  So am I disappointing them?
• 27:53
  Am I gonna meet, you know, my loved ones who I don't know what their religious, you know, they believe in this goddess, right?
• 27:59
  There's a goddess.
• 27:59
  Do they believe in an afterlife?
• 28:00
  There's so many things here.
• 28:02
  I mean, not to go off on three pages of what he believes, but.
• 28:06
  What he could comment on, even in one sentence, could do a lot of work.
• 28:10
  If I meet the maker, if the goddess takes me to the maker, then I'm gonna see my mother, who's past the four or whatever.
• 28:17
  Like, like maybe some of these choices aren't so bad, right?
• 28:20
  Like that's what he's grappling with.
• 28:22
  Am I at the end?
• 28:22
  And what does that mean to him?
• 28:25
  So any of those things.
• 28:26
  Then we've got Sir Adrian standing at the edge of the tree line Wreathed in torch light.
• 28:31
  Beautiful.
• 28:31
  Thank you for the showing detail.
• 28:33
  Lots of those.
• 28:34
  And then we've got another next to him, which doesn't get a showing detail, right?
• 28:37
  So I'm like, okay, I want a detail or two so that if I am attentive reader, I can anticipate again.
• 28:43
  We're trying to figure out what's happening.
• 28:45
  Let us guess.
• 28:45
  Let us anticipate.
• 28:46
  So if there's another man next to Sir Adrian slight or a frame, but his face fierce, maybe.
• 28:52
  I'm trying to guess in all the characters that I've met so far, who is that?
• 28:56
  Or maybe I'll remember it later when that other figure comes up.
• 29:00
  I'm assuming then it's somebody important or we wouldn't be so Yeah.
• 29:03
  Careful with it, right?
• 29:04
  Yeah.
• 29:04
  It's gonna be somebody important.
• 29:05
  So he, this is your fantasy shadow.
• 29:08
  This character golf paint is a shadow.
• 29:10
  I love it.
• 29:11
  This.
• 29:12
  So how is he different?
• 29:14
  Well, number one, he doesn't want to be seen.
• 29:17
  Number two, he, if I just blurted it out right here.
• 29:23
  He would be recognized as the leader of the official church in my world.
• 29:30
  Right, right, right.
• 29:30
  So, so he would be like the Pope only, but if, but if Atria doesn't know, then we don't have to know.
• 29:38
  Right.
• 29:38
  But he could see a detail that we could be like, that's weird.
• 29:42
  You know?
• 29:42
  If it were the Pope, it's not the Pope.
• 29:44
  If it were the Pope, maybe he is wearing a hat like or something.
• 29:49
  Right.
• 29:49
  Yeah.
• 29:50
  He doesn't know that word.
• 29:52
  And so he says, you know, it's a silhouette.
• 29:55
  Yes.
• 29:55
  So, yeah, like, like what?
• 29:57
  What?
• 29:57
  Is there something that is gonna give it away, but still is more interesting than there's another next to him?
• 30:04
  Right.
• 30:04
  It's so obvious that you're trying to couch something or hide something from us that the reader will be like, what is that?
• 30:10
  And they'll be more interested in it, but it's frustrating.
• 30:14
  So give us those details as you like, dole them out, but don't give it away.
• 30:18
  It's tricky.
• 30:18
  Right.
• 30:18
  And then at the end of the scene, he falls into darkness.
• 30:23
  And all I would say about that, I mean, you can do it, I would say that.
• 30:28
  One of the easiest ways that writers come up with to start scenes and to end scenes are I woke up, I opened my eyes as a way that we often come to, it's the easiest way to start a scene, and falling into darkness is the easiest way to end a scene, which means that some readers, agents, publishers feel that it's cliche and won't, they'll reject it just based on that, which is fair, and there's no way to know that unless somebody tells you.
• 30:55
  But now you're gonna see it.
• 30:56
  You don't see it much in writing, so it doesn't feel cliche because most editors will edit that out for you, right?
• 31:02
  Mm-hmm.
• 31:02
  So there's a few options you can use it.
• 31:05
  I, I was just reading a New York Times Bestselling Fantasy and you know, I was, I actually know the author very well.
• 31:11
  I texted, I said, you let her fall into darkness at the end of a scene.
• 31:15
  She laughed and said, yeah, I can get away with that.
• 31:17
  Right?
• 31:17
  But the thing is, is that when a scene ends with losing consciousness, we also lose that point of view.
• 31:23
  So be careful with it because it's, it's overused.
• 31:26
  But before he goes black, I need to know what he thinks.
• 31:29
  End the scene with his forward looking thoughts.
• 31:32
  Like, if I die, nobody's gonna feed my dog.
• 31:35
  Like I, obviously that's not, you know, what he's thinking about.
• 31:38
  What is he thinking about?
• 31:40
  That's what's what we keep us turning the page.
• 31:43
  I will tell you number one, as an editor today, ah, I would look, I would look at that and say, I would just cut into darkness.
• 31:51
  I would just say yes.
• 31:52
  So as a writer, I was going through some of my old files and partial scenes and things sort of ahead of our call, and I actually have this same age that I sent you probably in two different ways.
• 32:09
  I've written it at least three times.
• 32:11
  I love that there, there is a version of this where he's thinking while he's following.
• 32:19
  Yeah, yeah.
• 32:19
  And now, so I'm like, wow, I wonder if I should include, pull it back in.
• 32:23
  Well, because what you are looking for, like I assume, is this the end of a chapter or the end of a sea?
• 32:27
  It is the end of a chapter and he's actually falling off a cliff into a river, and the river is going to spit him up onto this little rock shell where the wizard binds him.
• 32:39
  Okay, Michael, I'm gonna stop you for a moment.
• 32:42
  He's falling off a cliff into a river.
• 32:44
  Where is that on the page?
• 32:46
  Okay, well you only, no, I can only send one page.
• 32:50
  Right?
• 32:50
  Yeah.
• 32:51
  Yeah.
• 32:52
  So, but, but as he's drawing, that's so interesting.
• 32:55
  'cause if he fell into darkness, I just pictured him falling into the dirt.
• 32:59
  Right.
• 33:00
  So just show him falling.
• 33:01
  These are amazing.
• 33:02
  Think about, especially for teens reading.
• 33:06
  How many times do people talk about these dreams where you're falling or dreams where you're flying?
• 33:11
  Let us feel what that feels like before you know, if he blacks out at the top, that's no fun.
• 33:16
  Actually, I actually say that in one of these other versions.
• 33:20
  He, he does?
• 33:21
  Yeah.
• 33:21
  And feels like he's flying.
• 33:23
  Yeah.
• 33:23
  So, so pay, so pay attention to those moments that we can be in your character's body, because especially in today's, ya, like really that third person close is really important to bring us on that journey and to let us feel that he can still, I mean.
• 33:40
  It is a bit cliche, but you can still end it with him being unconscious as long as we have sort of this forward looking thought, and then I wanna flip the page because he is like, who's gonna feed my dog?
• 33:50
  That's not what you're gonna say, but whatever that thing is that he's thinking about as he's falling.
• 33:56
  We need to know, did that come true?
• 33:58
  Oh my gosh.
• 33:59
  You know, rovers, you know, Rover needs me.
• 34:01
  I need to keep reading or rovers.
• 34:03
  'cause what we don't want is to just think that he died or think that he's gone.
• 34:07
  We need to sort of have that forward looking connection.
• 34:10
  Yeah.
• 34:10
  So it's a little trick at the end of, at the end of your scenes rather than to sort of end it.
• 34:16
  We always wanna be dramatic and ende, but actually it's more interesting if you've got this sort of open-ended connection to what happens next.
• 34:25
  Even if you've got, if you've got two point of view characters, which you do at least right, then we might be flipping to her point of view next.
• 34:32
  Then when we come back, we wanna keep reading so that when we come back to Adria's point of view, we can find out if he's okay.
• 34:39
  But yeah, I, I would highly recommend also ending it just before he falls, uh, into darkness.
• 34:45
  Just from a technical standpoint.
• 34:47
  Alright.
• 34:48
  How are you feeling?
• 34:49
  Are you excited to dive back into this project?
• 34:52
  No, I am, I, you know, and, and this is, I was trying to come up with a page that I would get the most out of.
• 34:58
  Yeah.
• 34:58
  And, and I'm, I'm like, where I really, really need the help is here.
• 35:02
  So let me find a scene where there's a fair amount going on.
• 35:07
  But it can be encapsulated in that one page where there's enough there to work with.
• 35:14
  I always find it amazing, especially if we're careful about which page we send, which thank you so much for trusting us with your work.
• 35:21
  For ha being open to this conversation, but, but it also can show you that in one page.
• 35:27
  Yeah.
• 35:27
  You know what, you don't have to do everything that's recommended by an editor as you know.
• 35:32
  Right.
• 35:32
  Um, you can, but when we take it in that context and we just look at one page, it's like, woo, there's a lot of work that could be done in this scene.
• 35:42
  The biggest feedback I think I have is that I didn't feel like I knew what the stakes were.
• 35:48
  Right.
• 35:48
  Like, and we've said this a few times, I think.
• 35:50
  If nothing else that you take from it, if you could resolve that piece, even if you've set it up for now, he's about to die or be captured.
• 36:01
  I thinks he is Some, yeah.
• 36:03
  And some things.
• 36:04
  Oh, okay.
• 36:04
  Yeah.
• 36:05
  Leave it open-ended and some things, or just fall into the bottom of a river.
• 36:09
  But some things we need to know what he's thinking and some things are gonna become very clear and so.
• 36:15
  Rather than have him be really confused and option choices, maybe something becomes crystal clear.
• 36:22
  That's important.
• 36:23
  I think that, you know, that would really make us feel like, what if I were about to be captured or die?
• 36:29
  What becomes important?
• 36:30
  It shows a lot about your character development and your character strength.
• 36:34
  So you've got this one sentence where you described your book, and it gives us really excited about bigger context just to get people excited about where this book is headed.
• 36:43
  A young man accused of murdering his father, finds himself joined with a young woman from another land, and together they are commissioned by an enigmatic wizard to find an ancient and holy artifact.
• 36:54
  I just absolutely can't wait to hear what happens.
• 36:57
  So I wish you all the success on your publishing journey.
• 37:01
  Thank you so much for joining us today.
• 37:03
  I hope this was super helpful, Susie, it was awesome.
• 37:07
  I really appreciate you.
• 37:15
  Thanks for tuning in to show, to Tell Writing with me, Susie Vidori I'll me continue to bring you the straight goods for that book you're writing or planning to write.
• 37:23
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• 37:30
  Also, visit susie vidori.com/newsletter to hop on my weekly inspired writing newsletter list where you'll stay inspired and be the first to know about upcoming training events and writing courses that happen in my community.
• 37:45
  If you're feeling brave, check the show notes and send us a page of your writing that isn't quite where you want it to be yet for our show notes, tell page review episodes.
• 37:54
  Remember that book and your writing is going to open doors that you haven't even thought of yet, and I can't wait to help you make it the absolute best.
• 38:04
  Best you're feeling called to write that book.
• 38:07
  Keep going, and I'm gonna be right here cheering you on.
• 38:10
  See you again next week.