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Episode 409: A Cookbook Korean Night Out with Irene Yoo · Cookbook Love Podcast

• 0:02
  Speaker: You are listening to the cookbook Love Podcast with
• 0:04
  Speaker: Maggie Greene episode number four oh nine.
• 0:11
  Speaker: Welcome to the cookbook Love
• 0:12
  Speaker: Podcast, a podcast that
• 0:14
  Speaker: celebrates cookbook readers,
• 0:16
  Speaker: buyers, collectors, writers, and
• 0:18
  Speaker: clubs.
• 0:19
  Speaker: And now your host, cookbook
• 0:21
  Speaker: author, culinary dietitian, and
• 0:23
  Speaker: cookbook writing coach, Maggie
• 0:25
  Speaker: Greene.
• 0:31
  Speaker: Hi, everybody.
• 0:32
  Speaker: Welcome back to another episode of the cookbook Love Podcast.
• 0:35
  Speaker: How's everybody doing today?
• 0:37
  Speaker: Hope you are all doing well.
• 0:38
  Speaker: We're having our first really
• 0:40
  Speaker: hot days here in Kentucky, as
• 0:42
  Speaker: many of you are across the
• 0:43
  Speaker: country.
• 0:44
  Speaker: Of course, it is summertime.
• 0:46
  Speaker: So here in Kentucky, ninety degree weather is not unusual.
• 0:51
  Speaker: This is the perfect time of
• 0:52
  Speaker: year, though, to be in my
• 0:53
  Speaker: cookbook bunker, because it's in
• 0:54
  Speaker: the lower level of the building
• 0:56
  Speaker: and it's always nice and cool
• 0:58
  Speaker: down here.
• 0:59
  Speaker: I look forward to finishing up
• 1:02
  Speaker: here with my podcast episodes,
• 1:04
  Speaker: getting them processed, and then
• 1:06
  Speaker: heading out to my container
• 1:08
  Speaker: gardens and patio to water and
• 1:11
  Speaker: feed my plants, and just have
• 1:13
  Speaker: been really enjoying that this
• 1:15
  Speaker: summer.
• 1:15
  Speaker: Tons of blooms on our geraniums, our window boxes, our tomatoes
• 1:19
  Speaker: have lots of green fruit.
• 1:21
  Speaker: Not quite ripe yet, and we got a lot of basil.
• 1:24
  Speaker: And maybe I'll have some of that
• 1:26
  Speaker: on some pasta for dinner
• 1:27
  Speaker: tonight.
• 1:29
  Speaker: Also, out in the front of the
• 1:30
  Speaker: house, I have three really nice
• 1:32
  Speaker: hydrangea bushes.
• 1:33
  Speaker: And I don't know if you know anything about hydrangeas, but
• 1:35
  Speaker: there's different types of hydrangeas that bloom off of old
• 1:40
  Speaker: wood or new growth.
• 1:42
  Speaker: And it's always kind of a tricky thing to figure out when to
• 1:45
  Speaker: prune hydrangeas, but the type that we have in the front grow
• 1:49
  Speaker: off of brand new growth.
• 1:51
  Speaker: So the blooms form from things that are shooting up out of the
• 1:54
  Speaker: ground brand new.
• 1:55
  Speaker: So every spring before anything sprouts.
• 1:58
  Speaker: We prune them back and we have got the most gorgeous blooms on
• 2:02
  Speaker: those hydrangeas this year.
• 2:04
  Speaker: I even did the hydrangea food,
• 2:06
  Speaker: sprinkle it around the base of
• 2:08
  Speaker: the plant, and it makes the soil
• 2:10
  Speaker: more acidic.
• 2:11
  Speaker: So some of the blooms turn a blue color.
• 2:15
  Speaker: Just like our chemistry classes in high school, where we did the
• 2:18
  Speaker: acid and base testing with the little test strips.
• 2:22
  Speaker: Kind of a similar thing happens to hydrangea blooms going from
• 2:26
  Speaker: pink to blue.
• 2:27
  Speaker: So it's been interesting to do that.
• 2:29
  Speaker: And I think I'm going to clip some of those so that I have
• 2:32
  Speaker: some flowers in my kitchen before they wilt.
• 2:36
  Speaker: But I do try to water those in
• 2:37
  Speaker: the morning, and they usually
• 2:39
  Speaker: held up pretty well or hold up
• 2:40
  Speaker: pretty well, even in the summer
• 2:42
  Speaker: heat.
• 2:43
  Speaker: So that's a little bit of an
• 2:45
  Speaker: update from me here in Kentucky
• 2:47
  Speaker: with my warm weather and plants
• 2:50
  Speaker: and garden.
• 2:51
  Speaker: And I'm excited today to have an interview for you.
• 2:55
  Speaker: With Irene, you.
• 2:57
  Speaker: Irene is a food writer, recipe developer, chef and co-owner of
• 3:02
  Speaker: Orion Bar in Bushwick, Brooklyn.
• 3:05
  Speaker: She is the author of the brand
• 3:07
  Speaker: new book Soju Party How to Drink
• 3:10
  Speaker: and Eat Like a Korean A Guide to
• 3:12
  Speaker: Korean Style Drinking and
• 3:14
  Speaker: Eating.
• 3:15
  Speaker: This book is structured as a progressive night out and is
• 3:21
  Speaker: recently awarded a James Beard Award in the beverage with
• 3:25
  Speaker: recipes book category, competing against other cocktail books.
• 3:31
  Speaker: So it's an honor to have Irene
• 3:33
  Speaker: on the show today to discuss her
• 3:35
  Speaker: book.
• 3:36
  Speaker: And we cover the cultural
• 3:38
  Speaker: rituals of Korean style
• 3:40
  Speaker: drinking.
• 3:42
  Speaker: We follow the structure of the book in our conversation, which
• 3:45
  Speaker: mirrors a full night out all the way through hangover recovery
• 3:49
  Speaker: the next day.
• 3:50
  Speaker: We talk about recipes.
• 3:52
  Speaker: We talk about infusions, as well as the role of her family in
• 3:57
  Speaker: helping her shape the book.
• 3:59
  Speaker: Her sister helped with the illustrations.
• 4:02
  Speaker: Her mother played a role in the recipes in the book, and this
• 4:07
  Speaker: parallels her experience of also writing a cookbook alongside
• 4:13
  Speaker: running a bar.
• 4:15
  Speaker: So it was really a great conversation with Irene.
• 4:19
  Speaker: We talk about so many things
• 4:20
  Speaker: related to the pillars of Korean
• 4:22
  Speaker: drinking all the way through
• 4:25
  Speaker: everything from games that
• 4:26
  Speaker: people play to karaoke and the
• 4:29
  Speaker: whole section on food and bar
• 4:32
  Speaker: snacks.
• 4:33
  Speaker: So I think you're really going to enjoy this episode.
• 4:35
  Speaker: And without further delay, let's
• 4:37
  Speaker: dive into the interview with
• 4:39
  Speaker: Irene.
• 4:40
  Speaker: You.
• 4:41
  Speaker: Hi, Irene.
• 4:42
  Speaker: Welcome to the cookbook Love podcast.
• 4:45
  Speaker: Hello.
• 4:46
  Speaker: It's so nice to be on.
• 4:47
  Speaker: Yes.
• 4:48
  Speaker: Welcome.
• 4:49
  Speaker: So excited to have you here.
• 4:51
  Speaker: Can't wait to talk all about
• 4:52
  Speaker: your beautiful new book and many
• 4:54
  Speaker: more things.
• 4:54
  Speaker: But before we get started, why don't you tell everybody a
• 4:57
  Speaker: little bit about who you are and what you do?
• 5:00
  Speaker: My name is Irene Yu.
• 5:02
  Speaker: I am a food writer and recipe developer.
• 5:06
  Speaker: I'm also chef and co-owner of Orion Bar in Bushwick, Brooklyn.
• 5:12
  Speaker: And I'm also the author of Soju
• 5:14
  Speaker: Party, which is a cookbook about
• 5:16
  Speaker: how to drink and eat like a
• 5:18
  Speaker: Korean.
• 5:18
  Speaker: Yes.
• 5:19
  Speaker: Amazing.
• 5:20
  Speaker: And before we dive into talking specifically about the book, um,
• 5:25
  Speaker: we do offer you our congratulations on the winning
• 5:29
  Speaker: of your James Beard award.
• 5:31
  Speaker: Thank you so much.
• 5:32
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 5:33
  Speaker: So tell us a little bit about your experience with the awards.
• 5:37
  Speaker: And when you found out you were nominated and what it was like
• 5:41
  Speaker: to go through that process?
• 5:43
  Speaker: It's, I would say like getting a
• 5:45
  Speaker: James Beard Award nomination is
• 5:47
  Speaker: something that has always been a
• 5:50
  Speaker: goal, but also felt like
• 5:52
  Speaker: something that would never
• 5:53
  Speaker: happen.
• 5:54
  Speaker: I was just like, oh, wouldn't it be nice to be nominated?
• 5:57
  Speaker: And so, yeah, we submitted this
• 6:00
  Speaker: book to the awards, and I was
• 6:02
  Speaker: actually in Korea when I got
• 6:04
  Speaker: news of the nomination, which I
• 6:06
  Speaker: again knew, like I knew the
• 6:08
  Speaker: schedule.
• 6:09
  Speaker: I knew it was happening when I was in Korea.
• 6:10
  Speaker: But like with the time
• 6:11
  Speaker: difference, because it's like
• 6:12
  Speaker: night in Korea when it's day
• 6:14
  Speaker: here.
• 6:15
  Speaker: Um, I like just went to sleep and I figured I would find out
• 6:18
  Speaker: in the morning.
• 6:19
  Speaker: And I had a dream in the middle
• 6:21
  Speaker: of the night that I had gotten a
• 6:23
  Speaker: nomination.
• 6:24
  Speaker: And so when I woke up, I was
• 6:26
  Speaker: like, oh, well, that wasn't
• 6:27
  Speaker: real.
• 6:28
  Speaker: Surely that is a disappointment.
• 6:30
  Speaker: And then I looked at my phone and it was real.
• 6:33
  Speaker: And so all these people had texted me and had gotten like
• 6:35
  Speaker: emails, um, and like posts being like, I got nominated.
• 6:40
  Speaker: So that was really wild, especially to learn about it in
• 6:42
  Speaker: Korea, especially since this book is about like drinking and
• 6:47
  Speaker: eating in Korea.
• 6:48
  Speaker: So it felt very apropos.
• 6:50
  Speaker: And again, that was like my goal.
• 6:52
  Speaker: I don't it wasn't winning.
• 6:53
  Speaker: It was just to be nominated.
• 6:55
  Speaker: And I was really excited about that.
• 6:57
  Speaker: Yes.
• 6:58
  Speaker: So the awards was really crazy
• 7:01
  Speaker: because we flew in the day of
• 7:06
  Speaker: like a couple hours before, and
• 7:09
  Speaker: then we were running late to the
• 7:11
  Speaker: ceremony.
• 7:11
  Speaker: I thought for sure I wouldn't make it.
• 7:13
  Speaker: I also didn't realize I was the very first award.
• 7:16
  Speaker: So it was just like such a
• 7:18
  Speaker: crazy, like high, low
• 7:19
  Speaker: experience.
• 7:20
  Speaker: And then suddenly we got there,
• 7:21
  Speaker: the award ceremony started and
• 7:22
  Speaker: then, um, and then I was the
• 7:24
  Speaker: first award.
• 7:25
  Speaker: So it was like really amazing, like such a high.
• 7:29
  Speaker: And then it was great because
• 7:30
  Speaker: then I could go give my speech
• 7:32
  Speaker: and then I didn't have anything
• 7:33
  Speaker: else to worry about for the rest
• 7:34
  Speaker: of the ceremony or the rest of
• 7:36
  Speaker: the weekend.
• 7:36
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 7:36
  Speaker: And you can just enjoy the other
• 7:38
  Speaker: people getting their awards in
• 7:40
  Speaker: the festivities.
• 7:41
  Speaker: What category were you in for the awards?
• 7:43
  Speaker: So this was up for the beverage with recipes.
• 7:47
  Speaker: So there's a beverage without recipes, beverage with recipes.
• 7:50
  Speaker: And since mine is a cookbook
• 7:51
  Speaker: with recipes for both drinks and
• 7:52
  Speaker: food.
• 7:53
  Speaker: Um, yeah, it was, it was up
• 7:55
  Speaker: against some amazing other
• 7:57
  Speaker: cocktail books.
• 7:58
  Speaker: So I feel really honored to have one.
• 8:00
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 8:00
  Speaker: It's wonderful.
• 8:01
  Speaker: And I would love to know you said before that we talked about
• 8:05
  Speaker: the awards, that you were a food writer and you own a bar.
• 8:08
  Speaker: Let's talk about what it's like to not only be a food writer,
• 8:11
  Speaker: but own a physical space where people can come and drink.
• 8:15
  Speaker: I think that so the two ended up happening hand in hand.
• 8:19
  Speaker: Um, us building this bar and me writing this cookbook.
• 8:22
  Speaker: So a lot of the recipes were developed in tandem.
• 8:25
  Speaker: Um, and yeah, I think it really helps to cement sort of the
• 8:30
  Speaker: concept as a whole.
• 8:32
  Speaker: Like I really wanted to have a
• 8:33
  Speaker: space that people could come and
• 8:34
  Speaker: experience Korean style
• 8:36
  Speaker: drinking.
• 8:37
  Speaker: Um, but then also have a way for
• 8:39
  Speaker: people who might maybe don't
• 8:40
  Speaker: have access to these spaces or
• 8:42
  Speaker: soju or things like that, like
• 8:44
  Speaker: to be able to recreate it at
• 8:45
  Speaker: home.
• 8:46
  Speaker: So the cookbook is very much like how to have a soju party at
• 8:49
  Speaker: home, but also sort of demystifying what it's like to
• 8:52
  Speaker: go and order soju or have the entire, like, Korean drinking
• 8:57
  Speaker: experience, whether you're going to like Korean barbecue or going
• 9:01
  Speaker: to Korea, it sort of explains the whole concept.
• 9:05
  Speaker: And then with Orion Bar, really wanted it to be a place that
• 9:09
  Speaker: would both meld the Korean drinking experience with the
• 9:12
  Speaker: American drinking experience.
• 9:14
  Speaker: So we call it a Korean and American bar.
• 9:16
  Speaker: Um, it has a lot of like classic
• 9:18
  Speaker: cocktails with Korean
• 9:19
  Speaker: influences.
• 9:20
  Speaker: Um, you can get like beer shots and natural wine, which are
• 9:23
  Speaker: American style drinks that I really love in addition to soju
• 9:27
  Speaker: and makkoli and Korean beers.
• 9:29
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 9:30
  Speaker: Wonderful.
• 9:31
  Speaker: And I think that one of the things that makes the writing of
• 9:34
  Speaker: a cookbook such an experiential thing is when you're actually
• 9:37
  Speaker: kind of living what you're doing, because you had lived
• 9:41
  Speaker: these types of evenings when you were in Korea, but then being
• 9:44
  Speaker: able to recreate them for people and then write about them, I
• 9:48
  Speaker: always think it makes it a lot easier when you're in the middle
• 9:51
  Speaker: of doing it yourself.
• 9:52
  Speaker: Exactly.
• 9:53
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 9:54
  Speaker: Because, you know, if you think, okay, I got to remember what I
• 9:56
  Speaker: did in Korea and how this went.
• 9:57
  Speaker: I mean, you certainly can remember, but there's certain
• 10:00
  Speaker: things that just happen in the moment that you can, uh, pick up
• 10:03
  Speaker: the details of or the story of.
• 10:06
  Speaker: That's so much easier when we're
• 10:08
  Speaker: actually living what we're
• 10:09
  Speaker: writing.
• 10:11
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 10:11
  Speaker: And I think that's something
• 10:12
  Speaker: that's really enjoyable for, um,
• 10:14
  Speaker: like patrons of the bar too, is
• 10:16
  Speaker: it's a lot of people who've
• 10:18
  Speaker: maybe gone to visit or travel in
• 10:20
  Speaker: Korea and had that experience
• 10:22
  Speaker: and wanting to sort of recreate
• 10:23
  Speaker: that or revisit that back home
• 10:26
  Speaker: in America.
• 10:27
  Speaker: So I was really hoping that both the bar and the book would be a
• 10:31
  Speaker: space and a way to do that.
• 10:32
  Speaker: Yes, yes, that's a great way to capture the memories.
• 10:35
  Speaker: And like you said, recreate it at home.
• 10:37
  Speaker: I find that people that, you
• 10:39
  Speaker: know, they go to a restaurant,
• 10:40
  Speaker: they go to a bar, they go to a
• 10:42
  Speaker: bakery.
• 10:43
  Speaker: A book is such a great way to
• 10:44
  Speaker: help people remember that
• 10:46
  Speaker: experience.
• 10:47
  Speaker: And for you, this experience is not necessarily about a place,
• 10:51
  Speaker: although you have a place, but about this whole concept of
• 10:56
  Speaker: drinking like you do in Korea.
• 10:59
  Speaker: So I would like to pretend that none of us that you are talking
• 11:02
  Speaker: to know what this is all about.
• 11:05
  Speaker: And, uh, that's the purpose of the book.
• 11:08
  Speaker: But I think I'd love for you to walk us through the evening and
• 11:12
  Speaker: the journey from, uh, arriving.
• 11:15
  Speaker: And you know what we might
• 11:16
  Speaker: experience so that we can hear
• 11:18
  Speaker: about this on the podcast and
• 11:20
  Speaker: then, of course, enjoy it in
• 11:21
  Speaker: your book.
• 11:23
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 11:23
  Speaker: So Korean style drinking is very much usually is very structured
• 11:30
  Speaker: in the beginning.
• 11:31
  Speaker: Um, and the idea is that there is sort of these rules and
• 11:34
  Speaker: rituals that within our culture, like we're expected to follow.
• 11:39
  Speaker: Um, and so I really wanted the book to just be like an
• 11:42
  Speaker: introduction to that.
• 11:44
  Speaker: For example, um, you might order a few bottles of soju or
• 11:49
  Speaker: makkoli, which is a Korean rice wine or a beer or whatever
• 11:53
  Speaker: you're drinking that night and you always pour for each other.
• 11:57
  Speaker: There's a bit of a general like
• 11:59
  Speaker: age based or, um, like society
• 12:02
  Speaker: based hierarchy that you follow
• 12:03
  Speaker: in terms of the order that you
• 12:05
  Speaker: pour in.
• 12:06
  Speaker: Um, you always have to have food when you're drinking.
• 12:10
  Speaker: You don't usually just go to a bar and have like a drink each.
• 12:13
  Speaker: There always has to be like food.
• 12:15
  Speaker: You're sitting at a table you're sharing.
• 12:17
  Speaker: Um, and I feel like that's
• 12:18
  Speaker: really the nature and purpose of
• 12:20
  Speaker: it too.
• 12:21
  Speaker: Again, as you're drinking,
• 12:22
  Speaker: you're sort of breaking down
• 12:23
  Speaker: these boundaries, um, and these
• 12:26
  Speaker: barriers.
• 12:27
  Speaker: So maybe in the beginning you're
• 12:28
  Speaker: being really formal about
• 12:29
  Speaker: pouring for each other, but as
• 12:30
  Speaker: the night goes on and you're
• 12:31
  Speaker: bonding and getting closer, um,
• 12:34
  Speaker: you can be a lot more lax about
• 12:36
  Speaker: that because now we're drinking
• 12:37
  Speaker: more as friends rather than,
• 12:38
  Speaker: let's say, colleagues or
• 12:40
  Speaker: strangers.
• 12:41
  Speaker: Um, and so a lot of Korean nights out are, um, structured
• 12:47
  Speaker: in what's called or like first round, second round.
• 12:50
  Speaker: And the purpose of that is sort of, um, give a change in
• 12:55
  Speaker: scenery, go to a different spot, try something else.
• 12:58
  Speaker: Um, so it's a great way to go to like three or four different
• 13:01
  Speaker: spots in one night.
• 13:03
  Speaker: And I kind of structured the
• 13:04
  Speaker: book in a similar way to is like
• 13:07
  Speaker: the first round kind of eases
• 13:08
  Speaker: you into what is Korean style
• 13:10
  Speaker: drinking, and then you kind of
• 13:11
  Speaker: level up.
• 13:12
  Speaker: Um, there's recipes for more complex cocktails.
• 13:16
  Speaker: There's lots of recipes again for food or Anju, which is
• 13:20
  Speaker: Korean for drinking food.
• 13:22
  Speaker: And then most key, I feel like
• 13:24
  Speaker: it is not a complete drinking
• 13:25
  Speaker: night out if you do not resolve
• 13:27
  Speaker: your hangover.
• 13:28
  Speaker: So there's a whole hangover section.
• 13:30
  Speaker: And that's also the crucial part
• 13:32
  Speaker: of why we're eating in general,
• 13:34
  Speaker: um, is to stave off her
• 13:35
  Speaker: hangover.
• 13:35
  Speaker: And then at the end, you're definitely feeding your
• 13:37
  Speaker: hangover, whether it's the night of or the next morning.
• 13:40
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 13:41
  Speaker: It's fascinating.
• 13:41
  Speaker: You said that just this past
• 13:43
  Speaker: weekend, I was with my family
• 13:44
  Speaker: and we were going to go to a
• 13:46
  Speaker: brewery.
• 13:46
  Speaker: It was in Louisville, Kentucky,
• 13:48
  Speaker: and, um, they didn't have any
• 13:50
  Speaker: food.
• 13:51
  Speaker: And I so common in US breweries
• 13:54
  Speaker: and I'm thinking they should
• 13:55
  Speaker: have.
• 13:55
  Speaker: Now sometimes they'll have like bags of chips on the wall, maybe
• 13:59
  Speaker: a popcorn machine, something like that, maybe give me a
• 14:03
  Speaker: pretzel at least.
• 14:03
  Speaker: Exactly, exactly.
• 14:05
  Speaker: And I think that it must be because and you might know this
• 14:09
  Speaker: better as a bar owner in the US, if it has to do with food
• 14:13
  Speaker: preparation areas, food preparation, you know, the
• 14:17
  Speaker: health department inspection, I'm not really sure but why a
• 14:19
  Speaker: bar wouldn't choose to do it.
• 14:21
  Speaker: What would the reason for that be in the US?
• 14:24
  Speaker: I think it's a bit more about margins.
• 14:27
  Speaker: Um as like a bar and restaurant owner, your margins are much
• 14:30
  Speaker: higher, um, selling alcohol than it is food because food requires
• 14:34
  Speaker: a lot more people.
• 14:35
  Speaker: Yeah, food costs are expensive.
• 14:37
  Speaker: Um, whereas alcohol, it's not.
• 14:39
  Speaker: Um, in Korea too, I think Korea
• 14:43
  Speaker: is not the only country that is
• 14:44
  Speaker: like this.
• 14:44
  Speaker: I think like, for example,
• 14:45
  Speaker: whenever I go to England, um,
• 14:48
  Speaker: like the drinking culture is so
• 14:50
  Speaker: different than American drinking
• 14:51
  Speaker: culture.
• 14:51
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 14:52
  Speaker: So I think similarly, it's a lot
• 14:54
  Speaker: more, um, accepted and casual to
• 14:58
  Speaker: drink, let's say with your
• 14:59
  Speaker: family, um, or out at a
• 15:00
  Speaker: restaurant or at eleven in the
• 15:02
  Speaker: morning.
• 15:03
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 15:03
  Speaker: Um, so it's sort of, um,
• 15:06
  Speaker: restaurants are a natural entry
• 15:08
  Speaker: point to be able to drink and a
• 15:12
  Speaker: lot of places have more of like
• 15:13
  Speaker: a food minimum than a drink
• 15:15
  Speaker: minimum.
• 15:15
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 15:16
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 15:16
  Speaker: So what's the drinking age in Korea?
• 15:19
  Speaker: It's a bit younger.
• 15:21
  Speaker: It is.
• 15:22
  Speaker: Um, well Korean age is a weird thing.
• 15:25
  Speaker: They, it used to be like when
• 15:26
  Speaker: you were born, you're like one
• 15:27
  Speaker: years old instead of zero years
• 15:29
  Speaker: old.
• 15:29
  Speaker: So it's nineteen, which is technically eighteen.
• 15:33
  Speaker: But then they recently changed
• 15:34
  Speaker: the law, but they're sticking to
• 15:35
  Speaker: nineteen.
• 15:36
  Speaker: So now it's like the true international age of nineteen.
• 15:39
  Speaker: Yeah, it used to be.
• 15:40
  Speaker: I live in Kentucky, used to be
• 15:42
  Speaker: eighteen here back until the
• 15:44
  Speaker: eighties.
• 15:44
  Speaker: At some point.
• 15:45
  Speaker: We were talking about this this weekend.
• 15:46
  Speaker: Also, I was with a bunch of my
• 15:48
  Speaker: sisters and we were at a family
• 15:50
  Speaker: wedding, and one of them
• 15:51
  Speaker: distinctly remembered when it
• 15:52
  Speaker: switched from eighteen to twenty
• 15:54
  Speaker: one.
• 15:55
  Speaker: You know, my mom always felt
• 15:56
  Speaker: though, if they if we were with
• 15:58
  Speaker: the family.
• 15:58
  Speaker: She also said, people enter the army at eighteen.
• 16:01
  Speaker: There's so many things that
• 16:02
  Speaker: people are already doing that,
• 16:04
  Speaker: uh, have entered them into
• 16:06
  Speaker: adulthood and actually were
• 16:07
  Speaker: legally adults at the age of
• 16:09
  Speaker: eighteen.
• 16:10
  Speaker: So she never really understood
• 16:11
  Speaker: why they raised it to twenty
• 16:12
  Speaker: one.
• 16:12
  Speaker: But anyway, uh, that's what they, that's what they did.
• 16:15
  Speaker: I feel the same way about like renting cars.
• 16:17
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 16:17
  Speaker: Like, why is it twenty five?
• 16:19
  Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
• 16:20
  Speaker: Like what has unlocked in our
• 16:21
  Speaker: brain between eighteen and
• 16:23
  Speaker: twenty five and twenty one and
• 16:24
  Speaker: twenty five.
• 16:24
  Speaker: That's actually, I think, can I take ownership of a car?
• 16:27
  Speaker: Exactly.
• 16:28
  Speaker: It should probably be more locked at twenty five, then the
• 16:30
  Speaker: people that are younger probably are a little safer with them.
• 16:33
  Speaker: So yeah, I don't know.
• 16:34
  Speaker: It is kind of interesting to think about now.
• 16:37
  Speaker: You went through the four
• 16:38
  Speaker: different, uh, the pillars of
• 16:40
  Speaker: Korean drinking.
• 16:41
  Speaker: You mentioned the soju.
• 16:43
  Speaker: Uh, what's the base of soju for?
• 16:46
  Speaker: Uh, the, is it a grain or is it a fruit?
• 16:49
  Speaker: Traditionally, it's distilled
• 16:52
  Speaker: with rice and noodle, which is a
• 16:54
  Speaker: wild Korean fermentation
• 16:56
  Speaker: starter, kind of like similar to
• 16:57
  Speaker: Koji, I would say, um, in
• 16:59
  Speaker: Japanese culture.
• 17:00
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 17:01
  Speaker: Um, however, a lot of the green
• 17:02
  Speaker: bottle soju that you see out in
• 17:04
  Speaker: the market is much more like
• 17:06
  Speaker: commercially manufactured.
• 17:08
  Speaker: Um, it's more of like ethanol that's mixed with sweeteners.
• 17:12
  Speaker: Um, so it's not really traditionally distilled.
• 17:14
  Speaker: It's a little bit more.
• 17:16
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 17:16
  Speaker: Commercially manufactured.
• 17:17
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 17:17
  Speaker: And then you have beer.
• 17:19
  Speaker: But the second pillar, yeah, beer is usually very light beer.
• 17:24
  Speaker: I would say it's like more akin to like a bud or a cause.
• 17:27
  Speaker: Um, very like light.
• 17:28
  Speaker: Good to drink while eating food.
• 17:31
  Speaker: And then you have the lightly filtered rice wine and then the
• 17:36
  Speaker: foods, the, the Anjou, right.
• 17:39
  Speaker: So those are the four pillars.
• 17:40
  Speaker: So, um, let's start with the first round.
• 17:45
  Speaker: Um, and if there's food along with that, or what people are
• 17:48
  Speaker: typically drinking during this first round or this first part
• 17:51
  Speaker: of the evening.
• 17:54
  Speaker: Um, yeah.
• 17:54
  Speaker: I mean the, the rounds are very casual.
• 17:57
  Speaker: Like, it's not like you have to actually follow, like you drink
• 18:00
  Speaker: this and this round and that in the next round.
• 18:03
  Speaker: Um, but let's say you are starting off, um, I personally
• 18:07
  Speaker: like to start off with soju because it gives you a little
• 18:11
  Speaker: bit of like an alcohol boost.
• 18:13
  Speaker: Um, maybe you're also pairing that with dinner.
• 18:16
  Speaker: Um, or alternatively, maybe
• 18:18
  Speaker: you're like going and having
• 18:19
  Speaker: like a glass of like a fancy
• 18:21
  Speaker: McCauley bar and having a little
• 18:23
  Speaker: bit of snacks while you wait
• 18:24
  Speaker: for, let's say your a table at a
• 18:27
  Speaker: dinner reservation.
• 18:29
  Speaker: And yeah, always there is food
• 18:32
  Speaker: that is paired with different
• 18:33
  Speaker: alcohols.
• 18:34
  Speaker: I would say that like soju really goes with everything
• 18:38
  Speaker: because it's a very neutral, um, tasting alcohol, but it's really
• 18:43
  Speaker: good with like spicy food, really good with grilled meats.
• 18:47
  Speaker: McCauley, which is the lightly
• 18:48
  Speaker: filtered rice wine that has a
• 18:50
  Speaker: lot more traditional pairings
• 18:51
  Speaker: because it's actually Korea's
• 18:53
  Speaker: oldest alcohol.
• 18:55
  Speaker: And it's also a little bit more of like a farmer's wine.
• 18:57
  Speaker: So I would say like a lot more traditional Korean foods are
• 19:01
  Speaker: often played with McCauley things like, um, like pan fried
• 19:04
  Speaker: chun, which is kind of like a pancake, um, or um, also
• 19:09
  Speaker: definitely things like pork belly, um, steamed pork belly.
• 19:12
  Speaker: It's really good with anything
• 19:14
  Speaker: where the sort of creaminess of
• 19:16
  Speaker: McCauley can be offset by like
• 19:18
  Speaker: something maybe a little bit
• 19:18
  Speaker: greasier.
• 19:19
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 19:20
  Speaker: Um, and then beer, like classically.
• 19:22
  Speaker: It's fried chicken lately.
• 19:25
  Speaker: Um, it's it's just something that like.
• 19:29
  Speaker: Yeah, I mean, I don't have to explain.
• 19:30
  Speaker: It's just like the, like
• 19:31
  Speaker: carbonation of beer goes so well
• 19:33
  Speaker: with that sort of like crispy
• 19:34
  Speaker: fried fattiness of fried
• 19:35
  Speaker: chicken.
• 19:36
  Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
• 19:36
  Speaker: There's a brewery here in I live
• 19:38
  Speaker: in northern Kentucky now outside
• 19:39
  Speaker: of Cincinnati.
• 19:40
  Speaker: There's a brewery in Cincinnati
• 19:42
  Speaker: that they have like a leased
• 19:44
  Speaker: space inside the brewery for
• 19:46
  Speaker: food.
• 19:46
  Speaker: And it's a Korean chicken place and you can get the beer with
• 19:50
  Speaker: the Korean fried chicken.
• 19:51
  Speaker: It is really tasty.
• 19:53
  Speaker: It's so good.
• 19:54
  Speaker: Yeah, it really tasty.
• 19:55
  Speaker: And then um, so that's the first, the first round.
• 19:58
  Speaker: How do people generally feel if they're new to this, about being
• 20:02
  Speaker: served and about sharing?
• 20:06
  Speaker: I feel like people feel maybe like a little bit scared to be
• 20:10
  Speaker: like, am I doing this right?
• 20:11
  Speaker: Um, but I think especially if you're drinking with other
• 20:14
  Speaker: Koreans, um, they're just so excited for you to be a part of
• 20:19
  Speaker: it and be interested in it and are so like, it's more about
• 20:23
  Speaker: like making sure you're taking care of each other rather than
• 20:27
  Speaker: being like, oh, I made a, you know, I messed up or this is
• 20:31
  Speaker: taboo or it's taboo.
• 20:32
  Speaker: If you do something like this,
• 20:34
  Speaker: and I think it's more like, we
• 20:36
  Speaker: just don't want you to drink by
• 20:38
  Speaker: yourself.
• 20:39
  Speaker: We want us to all drink together.
• 20:42
  Speaker: Um, which.
• 20:42
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 20:43
  Speaker: And, and I think it's a little
• 20:44
  Speaker: bit more of like acknowledging
• 20:46
  Speaker: like, I see you, I'm pouring
• 20:49
  Speaker: your drink.
• 20:50
  Speaker: I'm making sure you're having a good time.
• 20:52
  Speaker: I'm making sure you're fed.
• 20:53
  Speaker: Um, it's a little bit more from that perspective.
• 20:56
  Speaker: Um, but I think it's like, especially from a Korean
• 20:59
  Speaker: perspective, it's really fun to see people try different
• 21:03
  Speaker: alcohols, different foods.
• 21:05
  Speaker: Um, and we just get really excited when people like take
• 21:08
  Speaker: interest in our culture.
• 21:09
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 21:10
  Speaker: And I think that's a great rule for drinking alcohol is always
• 21:14
  Speaker: sharing it with people.
• 21:15
  Speaker: And it makes it a whole different experience than not.
• 21:19
  Speaker: And I think that, that's
• 21:20
  Speaker: something if people just keep it
• 21:22
  Speaker: in the back of their mind, you
• 21:23
  Speaker: know, one of the purposes of it,
• 21:24
  Speaker: and it just goes right along
• 21:26
  Speaker: with the food and people
• 21:27
  Speaker: together and celebrating even
• 21:29
  Speaker: just an evening out and being
• 21:30
  Speaker: together.
• 21:31
  Speaker: So you mentioned pouring though,
• 21:33
  Speaker: is does that mean that
• 21:34
  Speaker: everything arrives at the table
• 21:35
  Speaker: in a bottle and then it's poured
• 21:37
  Speaker: for other people into their
• 21:38
  Speaker: glass?
• 21:39
  Speaker: Yes.
• 21:40
  Speaker: So it's you always, almost always order by the bottle.
• 21:43
  Speaker: You don't really order individual drinks.
• 21:46
  Speaker: So soju will come like cold refrigerated.
• 21:50
  Speaker: Um and then come with soju glasses.
• 21:53
  Speaker: Soju glasses are two ounces.
• 21:55
  Speaker: So they're just a little bit bigger than your traditional one
• 21:57
  Speaker: and a half ounce shot glasses.
• 21:59
  Speaker: And then you pour for each other.
• 22:01
  Speaker: Even with beers, it's usually
• 22:03
  Speaker: comes in, you can still get in
• 22:05
  Speaker: the cans.
• 22:06
  Speaker: Um, and you would do the same thing even if you were to get it
• 22:08
  Speaker: in a individual can.
• 22:09
  Speaker: But usually it comes in larger share bottles.
• 22:12
  Speaker: And then beer glasses are, I think they're like two hundred
• 22:16
  Speaker: or two fifty milliliters.
• 22:18
  Speaker: So they're a little bit smaller.
• 22:19
  Speaker: I would say they're akin to like a small like orange juice glass.
• 22:22
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 22:22
  Speaker: Um, and then you would also pour in that.
• 22:24
  Speaker: And then the key and the reason why this is all served at the
• 22:27
  Speaker: table is because you can then make up your own drinks.
• 22:31
  Speaker: Um, they're called Somex.
• 22:33
  Speaker: I call it the Korean unofficial national cocktail, but you mix
• 22:37
  Speaker: soju and beer or mixed together into those glasses.
• 22:42
  Speaker: So then you're kind of either, um, like, you know, mixing
• 22:45
  Speaker: something less alcoholic with soju or vice versa, making beer
• 22:48
  Speaker: a little bit more alcoholic by mixing it with soju.
• 22:51
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 22:51
  Speaker: What's the percent alcohol of soju?
• 22:54
  Speaker: Soju ranges from twelve percent
• 22:57
  Speaker: to I mean, all the way up to
• 22:58
  Speaker: forty percent.
• 22:59
  Speaker: Oh, classic green bottles you
• 23:01
  Speaker: see are usually twelve to max
• 23:03
  Speaker: nineteen percent.
• 23:04
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 23:04
  Speaker: But the traditionally distilled soju, which is definitely like
• 23:08
  Speaker: coming back, especially through like the craft soju movement.
• 23:11
  Speaker: Um, yeah, that definitely can go up to forty percent.
• 23:13
  Speaker: I've even seen like sixty percent.
• 23:16
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 23:16
  Speaker: So that's a pretty wide range, I guess people would know is there
• 23:19
  Speaker: are different names for it.
• 23:20
  Speaker: It's just soju across the board.
• 23:23
  Speaker: Yeah, it's soju across the board.
• 23:25
  Speaker: But I would say you can
• 23:26
  Speaker: definitely differentiate by
• 23:27
  Speaker: green bottle soju, um, which all
• 23:29
  Speaker: looks like very similar to each
• 23:31
  Speaker: other.
• 23:31
  Speaker: And just the labels are different.
• 23:33
  Speaker: Those will all range between
• 23:34
  Speaker: like twelve and nineteen
• 23:35
  Speaker: percent.
• 23:36
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 23:36
  Speaker: So you can kind of think about that as being the same alcohol
• 23:39
  Speaker: percentage as wine.
• 23:41
  Speaker: And again, we pour it in shot glasses.
• 23:43
  Speaker: And the idea is you're supposed to take full or half, um, shots
• 23:47
  Speaker: at a time.
• 23:47
  Speaker: So it's not really like a sipping alcohol.
• 23:49
  Speaker: It's more of a shooting alcohol.
• 23:51
  Speaker: And then anything that's more traditionally distilled.
• 23:55
  Speaker: Um, you would also be served in
• 23:57
  Speaker: like a glass similarly, but I
• 23:59
  Speaker: think that is like a little bit
• 24:01
  Speaker: more.
• 24:01
  Speaker: You're meant to enjoy it.
• 24:03
  Speaker: It's a little bit more expensive price point.
• 24:05
  Speaker: And also, I think you would know immediately that it was strong.
• 24:08
  Speaker: You can definitely tell
• 24:09
  Speaker: difference between a distilled
• 24:10
  Speaker: spirit that's forty percent
• 24:12
  Speaker: versus a one that's more just
• 24:13
  Speaker: like a wine at twelve to
• 24:15
  Speaker: nineteen percent, and people
• 24:16
  Speaker: would mix either of those with
• 24:17
  Speaker: the beer then, um, you know,
• 24:19
  Speaker: putting out.
• 24:20
  Speaker: Yeah, putting a spirit and a beer is not uncommon here in the
• 24:23
  Speaker: US even, you know, things like my son went to Purdue
• 24:26
  Speaker: University, they have boilermakers, you know, was like
• 24:28
  Speaker: lager beer with a shot of whiskey in it.
• 24:31
  Speaker: Um, I'm sure the Irish have something.
• 24:32
  Speaker: I don't know what it's.
• 24:33
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 24:34
  Speaker: It's called an Irish car bomb.
• 24:35
  Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
• 24:36
  Speaker: So you know, they have like jagerbombs.
• 24:38
  Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
• 24:38
  Speaker: Bomb shots.
• 24:39
  Speaker: There's a whole chapter for that in the book too.
• 24:41
  Speaker: It's amazing how many different versions there are.
• 24:44
  Speaker: There's like elaborate like stacking of glasses inside of
• 24:47
  Speaker: glasses or a lot of like performative things you can do,
• 24:51
  Speaker: like lining up glasses and then lining up shot glasses on top of
• 24:55
  Speaker: them and knocking them all in, um, which I call a soul train.
• 24:58
  Speaker: Or you can also call like a soju domino.
• 25:01
  Speaker: Um, so yeah, there's, I think that's part of the fun of it
• 25:05
  Speaker: too, is, you know, once you sort of get past the ritual like
• 25:09
  Speaker: reporting for each other, then it's just like, let's go crazy.
• 25:11
  Speaker: Let's have a party.
• 25:13
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 25:13
  Speaker: And then what about the rice wine?
• 25:15
  Speaker: How is that served at the table?
• 25:18
  Speaker: That is usually classically served in a copper kettle, um,
• 25:23
  Speaker: with copper bowls that sort of reference rice bowls.
• 25:27
  Speaker: And that kind of ties back to the fact that McCully used to be
• 25:30
  Speaker: more of like a farmer's wine.
• 25:32
  Speaker: Its basis is also rice, and it's
• 25:34
  Speaker: just something you could ferment
• 25:37
  Speaker: and make just really quickly at
• 25:38
  Speaker: home in within like a week's
• 25:40
  Speaker: time.
• 25:41
  Speaker: But it's also something
• 25:42
  Speaker: conversely, you have to drink
• 25:43
  Speaker: very quickly because it keeps
• 25:44
  Speaker: fermenting and then is no longer
• 25:47
  Speaker: good.
• 25:47
  Speaker: So yeah, it's usually poured out of a kettle, um, which I think
• 25:51
  Speaker: is a really nice vibe.
• 25:54
  Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
• 25:55
  Speaker: And it keeps fermenting.
• 25:56
  Speaker: You say it can.
• 25:57
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 25:58
  Speaker: I think it's like similar to kombucha.
• 26:01
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 26:01
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 26:02
  Speaker: Where it's like if you don't
• 26:03
  Speaker: pasteurize it, it'll keep
• 26:04
  Speaker: fermenting.
• 26:05
  Speaker: Um, especially if you're making it at home.
• 26:07
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 26:08
  Speaker: Um but yeah, so it's something you definitely want to drink as
• 26:12
  Speaker: soon as it's made in Korea, it's made a lot more easily.
• 26:17
  Speaker: You can get it.
• 26:18
  Speaker: You can get so many different types of makkoli, um, across the
• 26:21
  Speaker: country here it's a little bit harder to get imported makkoli
• 26:25
  Speaker: for this reason, it keeps fermenting or it's pasteurized,
• 26:28
  Speaker: which kind of alters the flavor.
• 26:29
  Speaker: Um, but there are a lot more
• 26:31
  Speaker: makers in America who have
• 26:33
  Speaker: started to brew their own
• 26:35
  Speaker: makkoli.
• 26:36
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 26:36
  Speaker: Very good.
• 26:37
  Speaker: So this is the first part of the evening.
• 26:39
  Speaker: Tell us what happens next.
• 26:41
  Speaker: So afterwards, um, you would
• 26:43
  Speaker: probably like, let's say, I
• 26:45
  Speaker: think it sort of follows the
• 26:47
  Speaker: natural progression of your
• 26:49
  Speaker: eating, like you've ordered some
• 26:50
  Speaker: dishes and then you finish
• 26:51
  Speaker: eating them.
• 26:52
  Speaker: So naturally you would be like,
• 26:53
  Speaker: okay, well, let's go to the next
• 26:54
  Speaker: spot.
• 26:55
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 26:55
  Speaker: And I think this is the part that really like baffles people.
• 26:58
  Speaker: And even me, whenever I go back
• 26:59
  Speaker: to Korea, I'm like, how on earth
• 27:01
  Speaker: could I still be eating more
• 27:03
  Speaker: food?
• 27:04
  Speaker: Um, but you go to the next spot and you order maybe more soju.
• 27:07
  Speaker: Maybe you go to a cocktail bar, even if you go to a cocktail
• 27:10
  Speaker: bar, which is something that's on the rise in Korea, there's
• 27:13
  Speaker: still at least giving you bar snacks, even if it's something
• 27:17
  Speaker: as simple as peanuts or even like these, like little like
• 27:20
  Speaker: stir fried fishes.
• 27:22
  Speaker: Um, there's always something.
• 27:23
  Speaker: They will never leave you empty handed.
• 27:26
  Speaker: And the more you drink, the more you'll realize, like how
• 27:29
  Speaker: imperative that is.
• 27:30
  Speaker: Sometimes it's just like a
• 27:31
  Speaker: little bit of like a fidget
• 27:33
  Speaker: thing.
• 27:33
  Speaker: You're just like, well, you're
• 27:34
  Speaker: chatting and it's like, you
• 27:36
  Speaker: know, peanuts.
• 27:36
  Speaker: Like you just pop them in your mouth.
• 27:38
  Speaker: And then all of a sudden the bowl is gone.
• 27:40
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 27:41
  Speaker: Um, so yeah, I think that would be kind of the next round.
• 27:44
  Speaker: Um, and then I think you would definitely maybe like go to, you
• 27:48
  Speaker: know, then you're feeling good and then you might go to like
• 27:51
  Speaker: karaoke and have another round.
• 27:53
  Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
• 27:54
  Speaker: And when you're at the second
• 27:55
  Speaker: round, is the pouring still the
• 27:57
  Speaker: same or are you serving just
• 27:58
  Speaker: individual drinks from the bar
• 28:00
  Speaker: or the pouring is always the
• 28:03
  Speaker: same.
• 28:03
  Speaker: Okay.
• 28:04
  Speaker: Um, especially if you're maintaining like so drinking
• 28:07
  Speaker: soju or makkoli.
• 28:09
  Speaker: Um, again, like maybe you're going to a cocktail bar.
• 28:12
  Speaker: And I think in Korea, a lot more
• 28:13
  Speaker: like Western style drinking has
• 28:15
  Speaker: become popular.
• 28:16
  Speaker: So if you went to a cocktail bar, you would be ordering your
• 28:20
  Speaker: own individual cocktails, um, not pouring cocktails for each
• 28:24
  Speaker: other in that way.
• 28:25
  Speaker: Um, but yeah, it's always the same, um, until you get to
• 28:30
  Speaker: inebriated to maintain it.
• 28:32
  Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
• 28:33
  Speaker: And then you're like, okay, pouring isn't part of part of
• 28:36
  Speaker: what we're going to be doing.
• 28:37
  Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
• 28:38
  Speaker: So it's not, it's not the priority here.
• 28:40
  Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
• 28:40
  Speaker: So you talk about in the easy
• 28:42
  Speaker: drinking part, you talk about
• 28:43
  Speaker: shots, you talk about drinks and
• 28:45
  Speaker: infusions.
• 28:47
  Speaker: I'd love for you to we kind of
• 28:48
  Speaker: talked a little bit about the
• 28:49
  Speaker: shots and the, the bomb shots,
• 28:52
  Speaker: but the easy drinks and the
• 28:53
  Speaker: infusions, what is what would be
• 28:55
  Speaker: the difference between those two
• 28:57
  Speaker: things?
• 28:58
  Speaker: So easy drinks.
• 28:59
  Speaker: Um, or what I also refer to as
• 29:01
  Speaker: one, one plus ones, um, is a
• 29:03
  Speaker: little bit more of a cocktail
• 29:05
  Speaker: Industry term.
• 29:06
  Speaker: So that's like in America, if you went somewhere and you order
• 29:09
  Speaker: like a gin and tonic or a vodka soda, it's like you your one
• 29:13
  Speaker: alcohol and your one mixer.
• 29:15
  Speaker: So I wanted to provide some recipes for that.
• 29:18
  Speaker: So most of those are recipes
• 29:20
  Speaker: that I developed for this book
• 29:23
  Speaker: and a little bit more American
• 29:24
  Speaker: style drinking applied to Korean
• 29:25
  Speaker: alcohol.
• 29:26
  Speaker: And then the infusions is one of
• 29:29
  Speaker: my favorite, kind of like secret
• 29:32
  Speaker: chapters of this book, infusing
• 29:36
  Speaker: soju.
• 29:36
  Speaker: What's also called is something
• 29:39
  Speaker: that's been around in Korean
• 29:41
  Speaker: culture since, like the Chosun
• 29:43
  Speaker: dynasty.
• 29:44
  Speaker: It's been around forever.
• 29:45
  Speaker: It was a way for people to make medicine.
• 29:48
  Speaker: Um, which again is how a lot of
• 29:49
  Speaker: alcohol was invented, was
• 29:51
  Speaker: infusing herbs into alcohol to
• 29:53
  Speaker: make tinctures to treat
• 29:55
  Speaker: different maladies.
• 29:57
  Speaker: Um, so that's how infusion infused soju started.
• 30:00
  Speaker: Uh, classic versions that you might find in Korea are like
• 30:03
  Speaker: ginseng infused soju or like jujube infused soju, these
• 30:07
  Speaker: things that are just really easy to make at home and like they
• 30:12
  Speaker: provide, you can just go to like the supermarket and buy all the
• 30:16
  Speaker: ingredients for it.
• 30:16
  Speaker: They make, um, infusion strength
• 30:19
  Speaker: soju, which is stronger, usually
• 30:21
  Speaker: about thirty percent alcohol, I
• 30:22
  Speaker: think.
• 30:23
  Speaker: And then you can get these like infusion jars, and then you buy
• 30:26
  Speaker: whatever fruit or herb that you want and infuse that.
• 30:30
  Speaker: So when I was developing recipes for this book, I was like, this
• 30:34
  Speaker: is such an easy thing to do.
• 30:35
  Speaker: Why is this not something that we are doing more often?
• 30:38
  Speaker: Um, so you can really like infuse your own flavors.
• 30:41
  Speaker: One of my favorite recipes is
• 30:44
  Speaker: something called Samgyetang
• 30:45
  Speaker: soju.
• 30:46
  Speaker: So Samgyetang is a Korean ginseng chicken soup.
• 30:50
  Speaker: The soju is not infused with chicken, but the chicken soup
• 30:54
  Speaker: recipe infuses these herbs, um, like these sort of like Korean
• 31:00
  Speaker: herbs and roots and bark.
• 31:02
  Speaker: And that gives the chicken this
• 31:04
  Speaker: like amazing, sort of like
• 31:06
  Speaker: restorative healing flavor and
• 31:09
  Speaker: quality.
• 31:09
  Speaker: But I was like, what if you were
• 31:11
  Speaker: to capture this and put this in
• 31:12
  Speaker: soju?
• 31:12
  Speaker: Like, I'm just curious what would happen?
• 31:14
  Speaker: And they sell these like, um,
• 31:16
  Speaker: just like individual packs of
• 31:19
  Speaker: things.
• 31:19
  Speaker: So normally you would just take
• 31:20
  Speaker: that pack and put it in the
• 31:21
  Speaker: chicken and make your chicken
• 31:22
  Speaker: soup.
• 31:23
  Speaker: Um, so if you just put that into
• 31:24
  Speaker: like a bottle of soju, what
• 31:25
  Speaker: would happen?
• 31:26
  Speaker: And it was delicious.
• 31:27
  Speaker: So it's something that, um, we've also been serving at Orion
• 31:31
  Speaker: Bar ever since we opened too.
• 31:33
  Speaker: So you can get the soju itself.
• 31:34
  Speaker: But then also we use that
• 31:36
  Speaker: infused soju as a base for our
• 31:38
  Speaker: cocktails.
• 31:39
  Speaker: And then you actually take the
• 31:41
  Speaker: infusion and make a drink with
• 31:43
  Speaker: it.
• 31:43
  Speaker: Or do people drink that in shots?
• 31:45
  Speaker: Also, you can do both.
• 31:47
  Speaker: So you can definitely just drink the infused soju.
• 31:49
  Speaker: It's also great because the
• 31:50
  Speaker: longer that sits, the better it
• 31:52
  Speaker: gets.
• 31:52
  Speaker: Um, it keeps extracting flavor even once you've drained the
• 31:56
  Speaker: soju, you can add more soju in and keep going.
• 31:59
  Speaker: But then also it's kind of like an amaro or an aperitif.
• 32:03
  Speaker: It makes a really good already
• 32:04
  Speaker: like infused, um, alcohol that
• 32:07
  Speaker: you can then layer into
• 32:08
  Speaker: cocktails.
• 32:09
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 32:09
  Speaker: And, you know, shots and
• 32:11
  Speaker: alcohols with herbs in it is not
• 32:13
  Speaker: unusual.
• 32:14
  Speaker: Um, your chicken one though
• 32:16
  Speaker: takes it to even a more like
• 32:17
  Speaker: savory level.
• 32:18
  Speaker: Do you know what I mean.
• 32:19
  Speaker: It's not just herbal.
• 32:20
  Speaker: It has a, uh, the, the meaty, the flavor of it.
• 32:25
  Speaker: And I guess it's a similar flavor profile to the, to the
• 32:28
  Speaker: soup that you have.
• 32:30
  Speaker: But, um, I think those kinds of savory infusions have always
• 32:34
  Speaker: fascinated me because it's easy to make the leap to sweet.
• 32:37
  Speaker: Do you know what I mean?
• 32:38
  Speaker: Maybe fruit or, uh, rose or something like that.
• 32:42
  Speaker: But when you actually take it to
• 32:44
  Speaker: the savory side, it's I think
• 32:45
  Speaker: it's a whole different
• 32:46
  Speaker: experience.
• 32:47
  Speaker: Yeah, definitely.
• 32:48
  Speaker: And I think it's something like I really gravitated towards.
• 32:51
  Speaker: I'm not a huge, like sweet person.
• 32:54
  Speaker: Um, so it's really fun to experiment with that.
• 32:58
  Speaker: And it's also wild from a Korean culture perspective, because
• 33:02
  Speaker: there's so many different flavors you can get from all
• 33:04
  Speaker: these different like woods and barks and herbs that like can't
• 33:09
  Speaker: even pronounce like the Latin names for them.
• 33:11
  Speaker: But, you know, they all do different things.
• 33:13
  Speaker: They all have different medicinal qualities and they all
• 33:15
  Speaker: impart really different flavors.
• 33:17
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 33:17
  Speaker: So those, those recipes look great.
• 33:19
  Speaker: I see green plums.
• 33:20
  Speaker: I see berries, uh, the one that
• 33:22
  Speaker: you mentioned, gosh, there were
• 33:23
  Speaker: so many different things that
• 33:24
  Speaker: you could pick to perhaps put in
• 33:26
  Speaker: it, um, including things like,
• 33:29
  Speaker: uh, licorice root, cinnamon, or
• 33:31
  Speaker: even.
• 33:31
  Speaker: Angelica.
• 33:33
  Speaker: Mhm.
• 33:33
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 33:33
  Speaker: Very good.
• 33:34
  Speaker: All right.
• 33:34
  Speaker: What's next?
• 33:37
  Speaker: Um. All right, so then we are going to karaoke or we're going
• 33:42
  Speaker: to play some games.
• 33:44
  Speaker: So in the book I've, you know,
• 33:47
  Speaker: you've gone through your easy
• 33:48
  Speaker: drinks.
• 33:49
  Speaker: Maybe you've leveled up with some cocktails.
• 33:51
  Speaker: Um, you've definitely had lots of rounds of food.
• 33:54
  Speaker: Um, so then I feel like it's time to have fun.
• 33:57
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 33:57
  Speaker: So, um, maybe if you're going out in Korea or Koreatown, you'd
• 34:02
  Speaker: be going to karaoke, which I think is very classically, the
• 34:05
  Speaker: two are linked.
• 34:06
  Speaker: And in my book, I'm like, I want
• 34:09
  Speaker: to share drinking games, which
• 34:10
  Speaker: again is in Korean culture, very
• 34:13
  Speaker: popular, more so than, um, you
• 34:16
  Speaker: would think or more so than you
• 34:17
  Speaker: find here.
• 34:18
  Speaker: I feel like in America, drinking
• 34:19
  Speaker: games are really associated with
• 34:21
  Speaker: like college.
• 34:22
  Speaker: Oh, sure.
• 34:23
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 34:23
  Speaker: Drinking.
• 34:23
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 34:24
  Speaker: Um, which I've definitely had my fair share.
• 34:26
  Speaker: I love a good, uh, round of beer pong.
• 34:29
  Speaker: Um, but drinking games here, it's some there's so I mean,
• 34:32
  Speaker: drinking games, Korean drinking games are made to be so simple
• 34:38
  Speaker: that like a child can do them.
• 34:39
  Speaker: And I think that's on purpose because then that means a drunk
• 34:42
  Speaker: person can do them.
• 34:44
  Speaker: Um, so actually my sister, who's
• 34:46
  Speaker: an illustrator, she illustrated
• 34:48
  Speaker: all the drinking games in the
• 34:49
  Speaker: book.
• 34:50
  Speaker: And there's, I mean, it's just a few of so many.
• 34:54
  Speaker: One of them that a lot of
• 34:56
  Speaker: American audiences are now very
• 34:58
  Speaker: familiar with is, um, The
• 35:00
  Speaker: Apartment Game or Aperto, which
• 35:02
  Speaker: is a song that was popularized
• 35:04
  Speaker: by rosé from Blackpink and Bruno
• 35:06
  Speaker: Mars.
• 35:07
  Speaker: Um, that was a, it's such an old, old game.
• 35:11
  Speaker: So I think it's really funny
• 35:12
  Speaker: that it's like become into vogue
• 35:14
  Speaker: again.
• 35:15
  Speaker: But, um, like, for example, that
• 35:17
  Speaker: drinking game is just like you
• 35:19
  Speaker: put all your hands in the
• 35:20
  Speaker: middle, you stack them like an
• 35:21
  Speaker: apartment tower and then someone
• 35:23
  Speaker: calls it a number, and then you
• 35:24
  Speaker: alternate until you get to that
• 35:26
  Speaker: number.
• 35:26
  Speaker: And then whomever number that
• 35:28
  Speaker: is, is the person who has to
• 35:29
  Speaker: drink.
• 35:30
  Speaker: Or alternatively, everyone who isn't that person has to drink.
• 35:33
  Speaker: Whatever the rules you want to
• 35:34
  Speaker: make are the very like simple
• 35:36
  Speaker: counting games.
• 35:37
  Speaker: Um, and I think it just, again,
• 35:38
  Speaker: is like the goal is to help you
• 35:40
  Speaker: have fun, break down barriers,
• 35:42
  Speaker: get drunk.
• 35:43
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 35:43
  Speaker: And also it keeps people
• 35:45
  Speaker: together, doing something
• 35:46
  Speaker: together.
• 35:47
  Speaker: Um, I think it's a fascinating how that's kind of a common
• 35:50
  Speaker: thread through this whole thing.
• 35:52
  Speaker: again.
• 35:53
  Speaker: Nobody's alone when you're doing these drinking games or when
• 35:56
  Speaker: you're doing karaoke.
• 35:57
  Speaker: I assume you could do karaoke
• 35:59
  Speaker: alone, but you probably have an
• 36:01
  Speaker: audience.
• 36:01
  Speaker: People are watching you do it.
• 36:03
  Speaker: Yeah, exactly.
• 36:04
  Speaker: Very fun.
• 36:05
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 36:05
  Speaker: All right.
• 36:05
  Speaker: So let's talk a little bit about
• 36:07
  Speaker: some of the chapters in the for
• 36:08
  Speaker: the food.
• 36:09
  Speaker: Then tell us a little bit about the, the food section.
• 36:12
  Speaker: Um, it says no party without an Anju party.
• 36:15
  Speaker: And then there's several different types of food that you
• 36:18
  Speaker: would serve for that evening.
• 36:21
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 36:21
  Speaker: The recipes for the Anju really
• 36:23
  Speaker: range from very simple bar
• 36:25
  Speaker: snacks, kind of like I
• 36:26
  Speaker: mentioned, peanuts, um, or
• 36:28
  Speaker: little, little fishes, um, or
• 36:30
  Speaker: anchovies.
• 36:31
  Speaker: Um, so those are just like stir
• 36:33
  Speaker: fried, um, anchovies that are
• 36:35
  Speaker: served with peanuts actually in
• 36:37
  Speaker: this case.
• 36:38
  Speaker: Um, and then kind of range from, uh, like noodle dishes to sort
• 36:45
  Speaker: of shareable dips.
• 36:46
  Speaker: Like I have a corn cheese queso.
• 36:49
  Speaker: Um, so it's a little bit that's
• 36:51
  Speaker: a little bit of a fusion recipe,
• 36:53
  Speaker: um, that I came up with that's
• 36:55
  Speaker: inspired by corn cheese, which
• 36:57
  Speaker: is sort of a newer Korean
• 36:59
  Speaker: barbecue side dish with queso,
• 37:01
  Speaker: which is the classic classic
• 37:03
  Speaker: Texas.
• 37:04
  Speaker: Yes.
• 37:04
  Speaker: Um, cheese dip.
• 37:06
  Speaker: And then yeah, there's also
• 37:08
  Speaker: like, you know, there's a bit of
• 37:09
  Speaker: an ode to samgyeopsal or grilled
• 37:11
  Speaker: pork belly because that I think
• 37:13
  Speaker: is a very classic way to be
• 37:15
  Speaker: eating and drinking Korean
• 37:16
  Speaker: style, um, as well as maybe a
• 37:18
  Speaker: little bit more complicated
• 37:19
  Speaker: recipes.
• 37:19
  Speaker: Like there's like a Korean pizza that I love.
• 37:23
  Speaker: Um, and that's like, you know, that's a bit of a project
• 37:25
  Speaker: recipe, but I think cookbooks benefit from that.
• 37:28
  Speaker: Um, having something where
• 37:29
  Speaker: you're like, all right, I'm
• 37:30
  Speaker: going to get all the
• 37:30
  Speaker: ingredients.
• 37:31
  Speaker: I'm going to make a day out of it and make a weekend out of it
• 37:33
  Speaker: and invite my friends over.
• 37:35
  Speaker: Um, so I kind of wanted to have a range of just something you're
• 37:38
  Speaker: either making in bulk, maybe you're keeping in your pantry or
• 37:41
  Speaker: your fridge to have whenever, um, to party, sort of like
• 37:46
  Speaker: signature feature party foods.
• 37:48
  Speaker: Um, But also like in the same way that any food that you drink
• 37:53
  Speaker: with is a drinking food, any drinking food is just dinner.
• 37:57
  Speaker: So, um, it's not like, oh, you can only make this one.
• 38:01
  Speaker: You have to drink.
• 38:02
  Speaker: Um, you know, a lot of them are very classic Korean dishes that
• 38:08
  Speaker: just happen to be a thing people love to eat while drinking.
• 38:12
  Speaker: And then also some of them are just things that I've, um,
• 38:15
  Speaker: created and developed over my tenure as a first pop up chef
• 38:19
  Speaker: and then as a food developer and now as a bar owner.
• 38:22
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 38:23
  Speaker: And as a pop up chef, you ran a restaurant that served.
• 38:26
  Speaker: It was for food, correct.
• 38:27
  Speaker: It wasn't a, I guess you can't
• 38:29
  Speaker: have maybe you could have a pop
• 38:30
  Speaker: up bar, but this was a, um, a
• 38:32
  Speaker: food space that people could
• 38:34
  Speaker: eat.
• 38:34
  Speaker: What kinds of recipes and things did you find that people were
• 38:37
  Speaker: really attracted to when you had the pop up?
• 38:40
  Speaker: Yeah, I, I had a food pop up that was called You Eating,
• 38:44
  Speaker: which is still lives on as my Instagram and social media
• 38:48
  Speaker: handle for probably like eight or nine years.
• 38:53
  Speaker: And my goal with that was to
• 38:55
  Speaker: really explore the Korean like
• 38:58
  Speaker: food that I grew up with through
• 39:00
  Speaker: the lens of other like cultural
• 39:02
  Speaker: cuisines that I was encountering
• 39:03
  Speaker: as I was, um, living in New York
• 39:06
  Speaker: or traveling around or just like
• 39:08
  Speaker: I grew up only eating Korean
• 39:10
  Speaker: food.
• 39:10
  Speaker: So it was such a joy and a
• 39:12
  Speaker: wonder to discover all these
• 39:13
  Speaker: other types of food, but then
• 39:14
  Speaker: also connect it back to my
• 39:16
  Speaker: heritage.
• 39:17
  Speaker: It's crazy.
• 39:18
  Speaker: Like the more you eat, how something you've never tried
• 39:21
  Speaker: before can really resonate with, um, like a taste, memory, and
• 39:25
  Speaker: nostalgia that you didn't know that you had.
• 39:27
  Speaker: Um, so that's something I really wanted to explore.
• 39:30
  Speaker: I also happened to pop up mostly in bars, so maybe this was
• 39:34
  Speaker: always, um, something that was meant to be.
• 39:37
  Speaker: Um, so I definitely try to make these foods that were like easy
• 39:42
  Speaker: to eat as finger foods, easy to eat, like something you would
• 39:46
  Speaker: kind of crave if you've maybe had a few drinks in, um, that
• 39:50
  Speaker: sort of thing.
• 39:51
  Speaker: So some of the, every pop up was a different theme.
• 39:53
  Speaker: Like for example, it was like Korean and Vietnamese or Korean
• 39:58
  Speaker: and Cuban or I was, um, sort of diving into a specific part of
• 40:03
  Speaker: Korean food culture, like cold noodles or school food or school
• 40:09
  Speaker: snacks is like a huge, um, subsection of Korean food
• 40:13
  Speaker: culture, things like that.
• 40:15
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 40:15
  Speaker: And a couple of the recipes use spam.
• 40:18
  Speaker: Tell us about that.
• 40:20
  Speaker: Oh, a lot of the recipes use spam.
• 40:22
  Speaker: Um, spam is definitely one of my comfort foods.
• 40:26
  Speaker: It's something that my mom used to make for me.
• 40:28
  Speaker: When I would get home from
• 40:30
  Speaker: school, she would fry it up
• 40:33
  Speaker: with, um, a little bit of like
• 40:34
  Speaker: flour and egg and pan fry that
• 40:36
  Speaker: and just serve that, um, with
• 40:38
  Speaker: rice and a little bit of like
• 40:39
  Speaker: furikake.
• 40:40
  Speaker: And that was one of my favorite after school, um, lunch meals.
• 40:45
  Speaker: So in the book I have a recipe for that spam Chon, which is
• 40:49
  Speaker: like a spam pancake basically.
• 40:52
  Speaker: And then also convert that into a spam musubi.
• 40:57
  Speaker: So if you love spam, then you know, like musubi is sort of the
• 40:59
  Speaker: next logical step.
• 41:01
  Speaker: And that's actually a dish that I've been serving at the bar
• 41:04
  Speaker: since we opened as well.
• 41:05
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 41:05
  Speaker: It seems like it'd be something for people.
• 41:07
  Speaker: It's easy to buy and, you know,
• 41:08
  Speaker: pick up and eat and have along
• 41:10
  Speaker: with their, their, uh, one of
• 41:12
  Speaker: their drinks.
• 41:13
  Speaker: So you also have a whole section where you actually have Korean
• 41:17
  Speaker: meets American cocktails.
• 41:20
  Speaker: Uh, tell us a little bit about that part of the book that's
• 41:24
  Speaker: very driven by the cocktails that we serve at Orion Bar.
• 41:28
  Speaker: And that's something that I developed in hand with my
• 41:31
  Speaker: husband, Nick, who is the beverage director at our bar and
• 41:35
  Speaker: the co-owner, and he's been a bartender and, you know, drink
• 41:40
  Speaker: maker his whole life.
• 41:41
  Speaker: Um, so his concept going into Orion is that we really wanted
• 41:46
  Speaker: to do classic cocktails, like classic American cocktails
• 41:49
  Speaker: infused with Korean flavors.
• 41:51
  Speaker: So you'll see things like a jujube ginseng Negroni.
• 41:56
  Speaker: So the classic cocktail is the Negroni.
• 41:57
  Speaker: One of my absolute favorite signature cocktails.
• 42:00
  Speaker: And that's made with jujube infused soju.
• 42:04
  Speaker: Um, a little bit of ginseng powder.
• 42:06
  Speaker: It's like a thing you can buy at the Korean store.
• 42:09
  Speaker: A little bit of like rice that it's shaken with to give it a
• 42:14
  Speaker: really nice, like silky texture.
• 42:16
  Speaker: And then I would say like
• 42:18
  Speaker: another favorite of mine is the
• 42:20
  Speaker: Tajima Martini.
• 42:21
  Speaker: So I really wanted to make like a savory martini.
• 42:25
  Speaker: So the soju here is infused with Kashima or um, kombu in
• 42:32
  Speaker: Japanese, which is a dried seaweed, which imparts a lot of
• 42:36
  Speaker: umami flavor as well as a little bit of shiitake.
• 42:38
  Speaker: And then that's the base for a very savory, as I mentioned,
• 42:41
  Speaker: love a savory drink.
• 42:42
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 42:43
  Speaker: Um, cocktail.
• 42:44
  Speaker: Yeah, I see a michelada also.
• 42:47
  Speaker: Oh, that one is so good.
• 42:49
  Speaker: So I love this recipe.
• 42:51
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 42:51
  Speaker: It's so like all of it's so many
• 42:54
  Speaker: umami flavors in it, like
• 42:56
  Speaker: pomegranate molasses.
• 42:58
  Speaker: Sounds really sweet, but it's actually very umami and savory.
• 43:01
  Speaker: Um, and then yeah, just like the tomato and the kimchi, it has
• 43:05
  Speaker: just like all these things that just make your like that, like
• 43:07
  Speaker: part the back part of your mouth, like salivate.
• 43:11
  Speaker: It does that.
• 43:12
  Speaker: It's that very well, very good.
• 43:15
  Speaker: Now we mentioned, um, heading into is a school party.
• 43:19
  Speaker: Mhm.
• 43:20
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 43:20
  Speaker: Tell us a little bit about that's a whole chapter on that.
• 43:23
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 43:24
  Speaker: So third party is just an alcohol party.
• 43:26
  Speaker: I think it's more the concept of like, here's how you can have a
• 43:30
  Speaker: Korean party at home.
• 43:33
  Speaker: Um, I think classically it's really, um, structured or the
• 43:37
  Speaker: feature would be like, you're doing Korean barbecue, and then
• 43:40
  Speaker: you also have alcohol and a little bit of a primer on like,
• 43:45
  Speaker: how you might accomplish that and all the different things
• 43:48
  Speaker: that you need for it.
• 43:49
  Speaker: And I also wanted to feature
• 43:50
  Speaker: some other like party foods or
• 43:53
  Speaker: party drinks.
• 43:54
  Speaker: Like there's a watermelon soju, which is a Korean fruit punch.
• 44:00
  Speaker: It has like a little bit of milk or like condensed milk, and it
• 44:04
  Speaker: has a little bit of sprite in addition to soju in this case,
• 44:08
  Speaker: as well as lots of fruit.
• 44:09
  Speaker: And it's usually served in a hollowed out watermelon.
• 44:12
  Speaker: It just like, doesn't it sound so refreshing?
• 44:15
  Speaker: As we're entering a heat wave here in New York.
• 44:18
  Speaker: Um, so yeah, it's just like
• 44:20
  Speaker: things that you'll definitely
• 44:21
  Speaker: want to like invite your friends
• 44:22
  Speaker: over for.
• 44:23
  Speaker: Nice.
• 44:24
  Speaker: So it's really sweet that people
• 44:25
  Speaker: then could recreate that at home
• 44:27
  Speaker: includes things like, uh, Korean
• 44:29
  Speaker: pizza and then some nachos,
• 44:32
  Speaker: things that people could
• 44:34
  Speaker: probably pretty easily make at
• 44:35
  Speaker: home and throw the party on
• 44:38
  Speaker: their own.
• 44:39
  Speaker: Then I see did see the whole chapter on the drinking games.
• 44:41
  Speaker: I think it's.
• 44:42
  Speaker: The illustrations are beautiful.
• 44:43
  Speaker: I think it's so neat how cookbooks are combining
• 44:46
  Speaker: photography and illustrations, uh, fonts and, you know, um,
• 44:52
  Speaker: languages, different languages.
• 44:53
  Speaker: I think it's fascinating how cookbooks, even just within the
• 44:56
  Speaker: past couple of years, have kind of taken a leap to this
• 44:59
  Speaker: combination of visual appeal.
• 45:02
  Speaker: Uh, what was it like for your sister to do the illustrations
• 45:05
  Speaker: for the book?
• 45:07
  Speaker: I totally agree that I feel like
• 45:08
  Speaker: cookbooks, cookbooks have become
• 45:10
  Speaker: so much more than just a, um, a
• 45:13
  Speaker: method to teach you how to make
• 45:15
  Speaker: something and more of a visual
• 45:17
  Speaker: like referendum or a visual way
• 45:19
  Speaker: to communicate something,
• 45:20
  Speaker: whether it's a cultural cuisine
• 45:24
  Speaker: or someone's personal identity
• 45:26
  Speaker: or a restaurant or a vibe,
• 45:29
  Speaker: whatever it is, or just like
• 45:30
  Speaker: cakes.
• 45:31
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 45:31
  Speaker: Um, I think that's what gives me so much joy in making cookbooks.
• 45:36
  Speaker: So when I was concepting this
• 45:39
  Speaker: book, I really wanted to find a
• 45:43
  Speaker: way to like, incorporate my
• 45:45
  Speaker: sister and she's an amazing
• 45:46
  Speaker: illustrator.
• 45:47
  Speaker: So I had in mind, like, I knew I wanted illustrations because
• 45:50
  Speaker: there are some things that are just really hard to photograph.
• 45:53
  Speaker: Um, and I reached out to her and I was like, oh, what would you
• 45:58
  Speaker: think about doing this?
• 46:00
  Speaker: Um, my, but also she's my sister and she's, um, she's a tough
• 46:06
  Speaker: cookie to work with.
• 46:07
  Speaker: So my, um, she drives a hard bargain.
• 46:11
  Speaker: My agent suggested like, well,
• 46:13
  Speaker: what if you guys did sort of
• 46:15
  Speaker: like, just like a test, um, a
• 46:16
  Speaker: paid test.
• 46:17
  Speaker: So I did a paid test with my sister to do a couple
• 46:21
  Speaker: illustrations with her, um, just to make sure that like, she was
• 46:24
  Speaker: cool with working with my vision, um, and vice versa.
• 46:28
  Speaker: And fortunately it worked out great.
• 46:29
  Speaker: She, I think ended up doing, I
• 46:32
  Speaker: don't remember somewhere between
• 46:33
  Speaker: thirty five and fifty
• 46:34
  Speaker: illustrations.
• 46:35
  Speaker: The drinking games when we did them, we realized, were such a
• 46:40
  Speaker: visual, like wow factor.
• 46:41
  Speaker: We were like, this has to be its own chapter.
• 46:44
  Speaker: Originally, I think I concepted them as sidebars.
• 46:48
  Speaker: Um, and then she also illustrated a lot of the front
• 46:52
  Speaker: matter of the book.
• 46:53
  Speaker: So things like illustrating how
• 46:55
  Speaker: to pour for people instead of
• 46:57
  Speaker: doing like a stock photo shoot,
• 47:00
  Speaker: kind of, of someone pouring for
• 47:01
  Speaker: someone else.
• 47:02
  Speaker: Um, I think that helps to
• 47:04
  Speaker: really, um, establish the visual
• 47:06
  Speaker: identity and, um, of the book by
• 47:10
  Speaker: like having these fun
• 47:11
  Speaker: illustrations of like college
• 47:13
  Speaker: kids pouring for each other with
• 47:15
  Speaker: like their, um, graduating years
• 47:17
  Speaker: on their, um, like varsity
• 47:19
  Speaker: jacket.
• 47:19
  Speaker: So you knew like who was older than I thought she did some
• 47:22
  Speaker: really like fun, um, smart things to convey that.
• 47:27
  Speaker: And then actually her
• 47:28
  Speaker: illustrations, since they were
• 47:29
  Speaker: the first visual element of the
• 47:32
  Speaker: book became the thoroughfare for
• 47:35
  Speaker: the book.
• 47:35
  Speaker: It's really what ended up
• 47:36
  Speaker: driving all the colors, the
• 47:38
  Speaker: design.
• 47:39
  Speaker: Um, when the publisher put it together, um, they used her like
• 47:43
  Speaker: color scheme and I think it really like, um, inspired them
• 47:48
  Speaker: and pushed them to make the whole book be a really fun,
• 47:52
  Speaker: exciting, engaging book.
• 47:54
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 47:54
  Speaker: That's neat.
• 47:54
  Speaker: I think it's neat when something
• 47:56
  Speaker: like that becomes the thread
• 47:58
  Speaker: that, you know, holds it all
• 47:59
  Speaker: together.
• 48:00
  Speaker: And it was the game that wasn't, you know, anything else about
• 48:03
  Speaker: the, I mean, the, the idea for the book, but revolving around
• 48:06
  Speaker: the illustrations that she made.
• 48:07
  Speaker: So she obviously got the job.
• 48:09
  Speaker: Uh, she passed the test.
• 48:11
  Speaker: Uh, she was hired to do the work.
• 48:14
  Speaker: And, um, that's a beautiful section on not only the
• 48:16
  Speaker: illustrations for the games, but, you know, explanations for
• 48:19
  Speaker: people who want to play them, how to do it.
• 48:21
  Speaker: And again, um, have your own party.
• 48:24
  Speaker: Or if you go out, you can know
• 48:26
  Speaker: how to play them when you get
• 48:27
  Speaker: there.
• 48:28
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 48:28
  Speaker: All right.
• 48:29
  Speaker: And the final thing that we
• 48:30
  Speaker: always have to think about when
• 48:31
  Speaker: we are drinking is the last
• 48:33
  Speaker: chapter.
• 48:34
  Speaker: Why don't you tell us a little bit about that?
• 48:36
  Speaker: Yes.
• 48:36
  Speaker: So again, a night out drinking is not complete until you've
• 48:40
  Speaker: resolved your hangover.
• 48:42
  Speaker: And in Korean culture the hangover industry is huge.
• 48:48
  Speaker: You go to a Korean convenience
• 48:49
  Speaker: store, there's a whole rack of
• 48:51
  Speaker: hangover cures there, glass
• 48:54
  Speaker: bottles in the fridge, or these
• 48:56
  Speaker: little like jelly pouches at the
• 48:58
  Speaker: counter.
• 49:00
  Speaker: All sorts of things that you're
• 49:01
  Speaker: supposed to eat or take or drink
• 49:03
  Speaker: before you start drinking, when
• 49:04
  Speaker: you're drinking, after you're
• 49:05
  Speaker: drinking.
• 49:06
  Speaker: Um, but I think even more interestingly, there's a whole
• 49:10
  Speaker: culture of hangover food.
• 49:12
  Speaker: So there's something called hangover soup or haejangguk, and
• 49:16
  Speaker: that there's tons of restaurants devoted just to making that.
• 49:20
  Speaker: And I think the reason I have such a strong personal
• 49:23
  Speaker: relationship with it is because my mom, who does not drink,
• 49:26
  Speaker: loves his uncle.
• 49:28
  Speaker: It is one of her top foods.
• 49:30
  Speaker: As kids we would go with her to have haejangguk at like eleven
• 49:34
  Speaker: in the morning.
• 49:34
  Speaker: I always thought it was so funny
• 49:35
  Speaker: because it would be surrounded
• 49:36
  Speaker: by like old men, old men nursing
• 49:38
  Speaker: their hangovers.
• 49:39
  Speaker: They're eating hangover soup and having more soju.
• 49:42
  Speaker: And I was like, that's awesome.
• 49:45
  Speaker: Um, and hair of the dog, as they say, right?
• 49:49
  Speaker: Having their soju with their hangover soup.
• 49:52
  Speaker: Exactly.
• 49:53
  Speaker: They, they know how it's done.
• 49:54
  Speaker: Um, so yeah, I think like there's a whole culture of
• 49:57
  Speaker: feeding your hangover.
• 49:58
  Speaker: Um, to give a little more
• 49:59
  Speaker: context, hangover soup in Korea
• 50:02
  Speaker: is not just one specific type of
• 50:05
  Speaker: soup.
• 50:05
  Speaker: It's again, a whole genre.
• 50:07
  Speaker: Um, but usually it's something
• 50:10
  Speaker: that is meat based, meat broth
• 50:13
  Speaker: based, um, so very savory and
• 50:16
  Speaker: deep and something that's been
• 50:18
  Speaker: like boiled for many, many hours
• 50:20
  Speaker: to give you all of that, like
• 50:21
  Speaker: minerals and nutrition, you
• 50:23
  Speaker: might have a loss while you were
• 50:24
  Speaker: drinking.
• 50:25
  Speaker: Um, it's often packed with
• 50:27
  Speaker: things like soybean sprouts,
• 50:28
  Speaker: which are really good for, um,
• 50:30
  Speaker: curing hangovers.
• 50:32
  Speaker: Um, and then even things like dried napa cabbage.
• 50:37
  Speaker: And it is like the one like not all hangover cures are proven to
• 50:43
  Speaker: be effective, but hangover soup is one hundred percent proven,
• 50:46
  Speaker: proven to be effective because at the very least, your body
• 50:48
  Speaker: needs hydration and nutrition to get back on track.
• 50:51
  Speaker: Um, so the hangover soup I highly recommend.
• 50:54
  Speaker: The chapter itself has a lot of
• 50:56
  Speaker: recipes for other types of
• 50:58
  Speaker: hangover cures.
• 50:59
  Speaker: Um, because sometimes like, for
• 51:00
  Speaker: example, you want something
• 51:01
  Speaker: greasy, so like a kimchi grilled
• 51:03
  Speaker: cheese will really set you
• 51:05
  Speaker: right.
• 51:05
  Speaker: Um, or maybe you want hair of the dog.
• 51:08
  Speaker: So I do love a bloody Mary the next morning.
• 51:10
  Speaker: So there's a recipe for that.
• 51:12
  Speaker: Um, as well as just like instant ramen.
• 51:15
  Speaker: Maybe you don't have any of these ingredients or time or
• 51:19
  Speaker: honestly energy to make that.
• 51:21
  Speaker: So there's even a recipe for like a hangover.
• 51:23
  Speaker: Instant ramen you can make at home.
• 51:25
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 51:25
  Speaker: Can't go wrong with that.
• 51:26
  Speaker: Now, you've mentioned your mom a couple times.
• 51:28
  Speaker: Your mom and I think one of the James Beard, uh, winners was
• 51:33
  Speaker: also, uh, Sarah on who wrote the book called Umma.
• 51:37
  Speaker: And I think that your
• 51:39
  Speaker: conversation here with me today
• 51:40
  Speaker: has really reinforced, again,
• 51:42
  Speaker: the role of food preparation in
• 51:45
  Speaker: the home typically done by your
• 51:47
  Speaker: umma.
• 51:48
  Speaker: And it's sweet how you mentioned
• 51:49
  Speaker: her just in our conversation and
• 51:52
  Speaker: then in the head notes of these
• 51:53
  Speaker: recipes and doing things with
• 51:56
  Speaker: her when you went out to eat,
• 51:57
  Speaker: um, like eating this hangover
• 52:00
  Speaker: soup even though she didn't
• 52:01
  Speaker: drink.
• 52:01
  Speaker: So, um, tell me a little bit about your, your mom's role in
• 52:06
  Speaker: all of this, my mom or my Umma, she has a lot she, like my
• 52:12
  Speaker: almost role is huge in just like the food career I've taken on.
• 52:18
  Speaker: Um, she made three full Korean meals a day for us growing up,
• 52:24
  Speaker: which is an insane feat.
• 52:27
  Speaker: And a Korean meal is not just like you've made one dish and
• 52:32
  Speaker: called it a day.
• 52:33
  Speaker: It's not like, you know, you made like a pot roast and then
• 52:36
  Speaker: you fed your family of four, which, I mean, pot roast are
• 52:39
  Speaker: hard too, but, um, but in Korean culture, it's like you have to
• 52:43
  Speaker: have a full spread of Pancha, which are all individual dishes.
• 52:46
  Speaker: And then you also have to have
• 52:47
  Speaker: rice and soup and a main and,
• 52:50
  Speaker: you know, peel and cut fruit for
• 52:53
  Speaker: your whole family at the end of
• 52:54
  Speaker: it.
• 52:54
  Speaker: And just like the management of
• 52:57
  Speaker: like all the punch she would do,
• 52:59
  Speaker: she used to make her own kimchi,
• 53:00
  Speaker: like she was someone who was
• 53:03
  Speaker: always chasing her own taste
• 53:05
  Speaker: memories.
• 53:05
  Speaker: Um, which I think is something
• 53:06
  Speaker: that's always really, really
• 53:07
  Speaker: inspired me.
• 53:09
  Speaker: And when I left home and I
• 53:11
  Speaker: realized I could no longer take
• 53:13
  Speaker: that for granted, that was the
• 53:14
  Speaker: food that I like really missed
• 53:16
  Speaker: the most.
• 53:16
  Speaker: Um, and that's actually what was the impetus for what started my
• 53:20
  Speaker: whole food journey is I wanted to revisit and recreate and
• 53:26
  Speaker: evolve the food that I grew up with that she used to make.
• 53:30
  Speaker: And also, I kind of was looking at the industry and seeing that
• 53:34
  Speaker: at the time, especially a lot of Korean food was being, um, made
• 53:40
  Speaker: by and or sort of, uh, a lot of like Korean food portrayal in
• 53:45
  Speaker: food media was by men.
• 53:47
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 53:48
  Speaker: And I agree that I think so much
• 53:50
  Speaker: of Korean food, um, culture and
• 53:54
  Speaker: history is communicated through
• 53:56
  Speaker: women.
• 53:57
  Speaker: Um, it's like your mom making you something and, but it was
• 54:01
  Speaker: something her mom taught her and she was an immigrant to America.
• 54:06
  Speaker: So she had to do so much legwork during a time when Korean food
• 54:11
  Speaker: and Korean food ingredients were really not easily accessible.
• 54:14
  Speaker: Um, so I always just really
• 54:16
  Speaker: wanted to You preserve her
• 54:18
  Speaker: recipes, iterate on them,
• 54:20
  Speaker: especially as sort of like a
• 54:21
  Speaker: third culture, second generation
• 54:23
  Speaker: person.
• 54:23
  Speaker: You know, I think like I see a lot of people like who are my
• 54:27
  Speaker: peers or colleagues or like my age and generation doing this
• 54:31
  Speaker: sort of thing around me too, where we're just like, we grew
• 54:34
  Speaker: up with our mom's home cooking, but we also grew up with, um,
• 54:37
  Speaker: really American style food.
• 54:39
  Speaker: So like, what is food to us?
• 54:41
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 54:42
  Speaker: Um, so I really, again, that's
• 54:43
  Speaker: feel like that's what this book
• 54:45
  Speaker: is about.
• 54:45
  Speaker: And that's what I feel like I'm
• 54:46
  Speaker: always kind of chasing on my
• 54:48
  Speaker: end.
• 54:48
  Speaker: Both.
• 54:48
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 54:49
  Speaker: Recreating my mom's taste memories, but also, you know,
• 54:52
  Speaker: making my own.
• 54:53
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 54:53
  Speaker: And then you have a family now of your own.
• 54:55
  Speaker: And I think also the decision about what you're going to
• 54:58
  Speaker: decide to feed and pass on to them, it's really made me
• 55:03
  Speaker: realize how incredible it is that she did any of that.
• 55:06
  Speaker: I'm like, yeah, it's hard enough
• 55:08
  Speaker: to feed a toddler anything much
• 55:10
  Speaker: or even myself, honestly, when
• 55:12
  Speaker: you're busy.
• 55:13
  Speaker: Um, and you just don't want to cook.
• 55:15
  Speaker: Um, so.
• 55:16
  Speaker: Don't you think I'm feeding toddlers is a fact?
• 55:19
  Speaker: We probably do a whole podcast on this.
• 55:21
  Speaker: My three my three children have all graduated from college.
• 55:24
  Speaker: They're adults on their own.
• 55:26
  Speaker: And, um, I kind of took a hard line with feeding them.
• 55:31
  Speaker: And I learned it from a woman who was, uh, not my own mom, but
• 55:35
  Speaker: I kind of modeled what she did.
• 55:37
  Speaker: And the point of it was, is that
• 55:40
  Speaker: children are inherently smart
• 55:41
  Speaker: about their hunger cues and
• 55:44
  Speaker: they're not going to, they're
• 55:45
  Speaker: not going to not eat when
• 55:47
  Speaker: they're hungry.
• 55:48
  Speaker: And she always said, just serve them what you're having.
• 55:51
  Speaker: If they don't eat, you know, our responsibility as parents was to
• 55:55
  Speaker: offer them regular times where they could engage with food.
• 56:00
  Speaker: And if they don't eat, it's no problem because you have a snack
• 56:03
  Speaker: coming up in a little while or, you know, before they go to bed,
• 56:06
  Speaker: they can eat then.
• 56:07
  Speaker: And their their inherent hunger cues can lead the way.
• 56:11
  Speaker: And I guess I always kind of did that.
• 56:13
  Speaker: I think her thought was she
• 56:14
  Speaker: didn't want parents to feel like
• 56:16
  Speaker: they had to turn into short
• 56:17
  Speaker: order cooks.
• 56:18
  Speaker: Mhm.
• 56:18
  Speaker: You can cook for the family.
• 56:20
  Speaker: You could maybe cook things that are component dishes.
• 56:22
  Speaker: You could give them bits and pieces of it.
• 56:25
  Speaker: But what do you remember, if anything, from watching your mom
• 56:29
  Speaker: feed your three full Korean meals with maybe some toddlers
• 56:33
  Speaker: that you remember at the table?
• 56:34
  Speaker: What was her approach with toddlers?
• 56:38
  Speaker: I remember she always used to just make the things that she
• 56:44
  Speaker: wanted to make.
• 56:45
  Speaker: I did ask her this because I, I think I'd seen some like, um
• 56:49
  Speaker: niece and nephews, um, eating and yeah, they're very much
• 56:53
  Speaker: like, we're only eating buttered pasta and nothing else.
• 56:56
  Speaker: And then also had interviewed her for, um, a piece I wrote for
• 57:00
  Speaker: Food Network about like how to maintain pancan or how to just
• 57:04
  Speaker: have the regular cycle of it.
• 57:07
  Speaker: And she did say that like me and
• 57:09
  Speaker: my sister were not very picky
• 57:11
  Speaker: eaters.
• 57:12
  Speaker: Um, which I'm sure is just something she's saying in
• 57:14
  Speaker: retrospect and probably was not actually true at the time,
• 57:17
  Speaker: because I remember being very picky about a lot of things.
• 57:20
  Speaker: Um, like I didn't like kimchi at all as a kid.
• 57:24
  Speaker: Um, which I'm sure makes me a bad Korean, but like I remember
• 57:27
  Speaker: she was very, in my opinion, fearless about making the food
• 57:33
  Speaker: she wanted to make.
• 57:34
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 57:35
  Speaker: Um, for example, she would buy whole fish, she would butcher it
• 57:40
  Speaker: herself, um, clean the fish herself and cook it herself like
• 57:44
  Speaker: in our home.
• 57:46
  Speaker: And that is something like I've even realized with other Korean
• 57:49
  Speaker: parents was not very common.
• 57:52
  Speaker: Um, so I think for me that like really demystified and took sort
• 57:57
  Speaker: of the fear out of cooking.
• 57:59
  Speaker: Like if there's something you
• 58:00
  Speaker: want to make, you can achieve
• 58:01
  Speaker: that.
• 58:02
  Speaker: And that's something I also realized recently I must be
• 58:05
  Speaker: modeling for my own child because like I recently made
• 58:08
  Speaker: Kandang, which is a soy marinated crabs, but which
• 58:11
  Speaker: requires you to have live crabs.
• 58:13
  Speaker: So it's like had a box of crabs
• 58:15
  Speaker: that he, like came over and was
• 58:17
  Speaker: so fascinating.
• 58:18
  Speaker: I'm sure it's great.
• 58:19
  Speaker: And then they start moving and he like, started screaming and
• 58:22
  Speaker: like running away.
• 58:22
  Speaker: And I was like, well, this will be a fun core memory.
• 58:25
  Speaker: Yes, exactly, exactly.
• 58:27
  Speaker: We used to have in Kentucky when
• 58:29
  Speaker: all the tobacco farms were kind
• 58:31
  Speaker: of like going on the decline,
• 58:33
  Speaker: they started to use and try to
• 58:36
  Speaker: install fresh water, fish farms
• 58:39
  Speaker: and shrimp.
• 58:40
  Speaker: So we would go to this place locally that sold, uh, farm
• 58:44
  Speaker: raised freshwater shrimp.
• 58:45
  Speaker: But of course, when you get it,
• 58:46
  Speaker: you know, the head's on and
• 58:46
  Speaker: everything.
• 58:47
  Speaker: And, um, talk about core memories.
• 58:49
  Speaker: I mean, it's so fascinating watching my kids usually shrimp,
• 58:52
  Speaker: you know, you see this little curled up thing, maybe with a
• 58:54
  Speaker: tail, you might peel it, you might take the legs off.
• 58:56
  Speaker: But the whole thing was just like totally fascinating to them
• 59:00
  Speaker: and very, um, I think it's great to expose them to that.
• 59:03
  Speaker: To me, that's one of the risks of only letting them eat butter
• 59:06
  Speaker: noodles all the time is that they miss all these things.
• 59:09
  Speaker: Exactly.
• 59:10
  Speaker: So I think it's really cool for them to see where food comes
• 59:12
  Speaker: from one hundred percent.
• 59:14
  Speaker: So if anyone's listening that
• 59:16
  Speaker: you think, am I taking this too
• 59:17
  Speaker: far with my kids and the food
• 59:19
  Speaker: and the, I think the depth and
• 59:21
  Speaker: the breadth of it, we owe it to
• 59:23
  Speaker: them to expose them to things
• 59:24
  Speaker: like that.
• 59:25
  Speaker: Because if we don't, who will?
• 59:26
  Speaker: I just don't, I don't know, I, I feel very strongly about that.
• 59:30
  Speaker: So I think it's wonderful that
• 59:32
  Speaker: your mom, of course, did it for
• 59:33
  Speaker: you.
• 59:34
  Speaker: But it is fascinating once you become a parent to think, oh my
• 59:37
  Speaker: gosh, how did she do that?
• 59:40
  Speaker: Three full Korean meals, you know, and like, it's just all
• 59:43
  Speaker: these little curiosity.
• 59:44
  Speaker: Things start opening up once we have mouths in our house that we
• 59:48
  Speaker: need to feed.
• 59:49
  Speaker: Um, definitely.
• 59:51
  Speaker: I think also for my mom, there
• 59:53
  Speaker: were, there were eight children,
• 59:54
  Speaker: you know, she fed us every day,
• 59:56
  Speaker: but there weren't the options
• 59:57
  Speaker: for getting food that there are
• 59:59
  Speaker: now.
• 1:00:01
  Speaker: Yeah, I agree, we could
• 1:00:02
  Speaker: literally sit here right now and
• 1:00:04
  Speaker: order DoorDash to the podcast if
• 1:00:06
  Speaker: we wanted to have a tasting of
• 1:00:08
  Speaker: Korean food, probably like, you
• 1:00:10
  Speaker: know, as a Korean restaurant
• 1:00:11
  Speaker: down in Covington, we could
• 1:00:12
  Speaker: order things.
• 1:00:13
  Speaker: You could tell me what they are and.
• 1:00:14
  Speaker: Mhm.
• 1:00:15
  Speaker: So it's just so different having availability.
• 1:00:17
  Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:00:18
  Speaker: It's a very different culture than what we grew up with.
• 1:00:21
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 1:00:21
  Speaker: So one other question.
• 1:00:23
  Speaker: Being from Kentucky, I'm curious about bourbon in Korea.
• 1:00:26
  Speaker: Tell me a little bit about that.
• 1:00:29
  Speaker: Western alcohol is so
• 1:00:30
  Speaker: interesting in Korea because
• 1:00:33
  Speaker: there is a lot very high tax on
• 1:00:37
  Speaker: it.
• 1:00:37
  Speaker: So it's extremely expensive to get whiskey.
• 1:00:40
  Speaker: Koreans love whiskey.
• 1:00:43
  Speaker: It is like the best.
• 1:00:44
  Speaker: If you're ever visiting someone
• 1:00:45
  Speaker: in Korea, bring them a bottle of
• 1:00:47
  Speaker: whiskey.
• 1:00:47
  Speaker: They love it.
• 1:00:48
  Speaker: They would love it.
• 1:00:49
  Speaker: Um, and it's like three times more expensive for them than it
• 1:00:52
  Speaker: is for, uh, for you.
• 1:00:54
  Speaker: And there's lots of even like tasting, um, like rooms in Korea
• 1:00:59
  Speaker: where you can, they have bottle many, many different types of
• 1:01:02
  Speaker: bottle and you can try, um, different, you know.
• 1:01:06
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 1:01:06
  Speaker: Shots or um, glasses of things, but like, yeah, I'm like, I
• 1:01:11
  Speaker: could never go to Korea and like experience that because I'm
• 1:01:13
  Speaker: like, it's so expensive.
• 1:01:15
  Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:01:15
  Speaker: I think it's really fun to do here in the US.
• 1:01:18
  Speaker: And if people want to do, uh,
• 1:01:20
  Speaker: good bourbon tastings, I mean,
• 1:01:22
  Speaker: there's a whole bourbon trail in
• 1:01:23
  Speaker: Kentucky and you literally can
• 1:01:24
  Speaker: go into the distilleries and do
• 1:01:27
  Speaker: the little it's usually for
• 1:01:28
  Speaker: pours.
• 1:01:29
  Speaker: You sometimes can pick them.
• 1:01:30
  Speaker: It's usually about a third of an ounce for each pour.
• 1:01:33
  Speaker: You can put a little ice if you need to.
• 1:01:35
  Speaker: You can drink it neat.
• 1:01:36
  Speaker: You can add a little water if
• 1:01:37
  Speaker: you want to, but tasting them
• 1:01:38
  Speaker: side by side really does give
• 1:01:40
  Speaker: you an opportunity to taste the
• 1:01:42
  Speaker: difference in the barrel, the
• 1:01:43
  Speaker: difference in the aging, the
• 1:01:44
  Speaker: difference in the rye
• 1:01:46
  Speaker: combinations with the corn and
• 1:01:48
  Speaker: the wheat.
• 1:01:49
  Speaker: And it's really a fun thing to do.
• 1:01:51
  Speaker: So I highly recommend it.
• 1:01:52
  Speaker: If you've never been to Kentucky, you've got to come and
• 1:01:55
  Speaker: go on a bourbon tasting.
• 1:01:56
  Speaker: It's a terrific I love Kentucky,
• 1:01:58
  Speaker: I've done a lot of Bourbon
• 1:02:00
  Speaker: Trail.
• 1:02:00
  Speaker: It's great.
• 1:02:01
  Speaker: It's so amazing to see the different types of distilleries.
• 1:02:06
  Speaker: And yeah, I'm a big whisky fan.
• 1:02:08
  Speaker: Amazing.
• 1:02:08
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 1:02:09
  Speaker: Very good.
• 1:02:09
  Speaker: Well, I'm glad you've been able to visit and enjoy that.
• 1:02:11
  Speaker: And I think as a bar owner, I think it's probably fun too,
• 1:02:13
  Speaker: because then you can maybe have a connection or experience with
• 1:02:17
  Speaker: something that you might be serving at your own bar.
• 1:02:19
  Speaker: Definitely.
• 1:02:20
  Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:02:20
  Speaker: All right.
• 1:02:21
  Speaker: So one last question as we're wrapping up, I'd love to ask is
• 1:02:24
  Speaker: about cookbooks since we are cookbook love podcast.
• 1:02:27
  Speaker: Um, if there is growing up, even with your mom or when you
• 1:02:31
  Speaker: started out on your own, if there is a cookbook in your
• 1:02:34
  Speaker: history that meant a lot to you that you would like to share?
• 1:02:39
  Speaker: Um, I was also really hoping that this podcast would just be
• 1:02:42
  Speaker: about us talking about all the, all the cookbooks that I love,
• 1:02:45
  Speaker: which we could have a separate episode just about.
• 1:02:48
  Speaker: Let's talk about all the cookbooks I own.
• 1:02:49
  Speaker: Um, here's behind me is, um, many of them I have, it's, it
• 1:02:54
  Speaker: goes on to another shelf.
• 1:02:55
  Speaker: I see you have so many.
• 1:02:56
  Speaker: Yes.
• 1:02:57
  Speaker: Um, but growing up, we didn't have a lot of cookbooks.
• 1:03:00
  Speaker: My mom had a few that she had brought over from Korea.
• 1:03:04
  Speaker: Um, but there's two that stand out to me.
• 1:03:07
  Speaker: One is a cookbook that my grandma gave me, which a lot of
• 1:03:12
  Speaker: cookbooks in Korea are very functional, and they're very
• 1:03:15
  Speaker: different than American style cookbooks, which is that they
• 1:03:18
  Speaker: give you amounts.
• 1:03:20
  Speaker: Um, and then the steps are very like cook this until it's done.
• 1:03:23
  Speaker: You're like, well, what does that mean?
• 1:03:25
  Speaker: Um, but the cookbook she gave me was a how like it's called like
• 1:03:31
  Speaker: meals or four thousand one meals, which usually translate
• 1:03:34
  Speaker: to like meals.
• 1:03:35
  Speaker: You can make for two dollars and fifty cents.
• 1:03:37
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 1:03:38
  Speaker: Just amazing.
• 1:03:40
  Speaker: Um, so that was one of the books.
• 1:03:42
  Speaker: Um, which I still have.
• 1:03:43
  Speaker: And another one that I got from
• 1:03:44
  Speaker: my mom that she used to use
• 1:03:47
  Speaker: growing up was a very eighties
• 1:03:49
  Speaker: cookbook.
• 1:03:50
  Speaker: Like it has aspects.
• 1:03:52
  Speaker: Um, and yeah, lots of like meat jellies and things that were
• 1:03:56
  Speaker: like popular in the eighties, but it's like it was called
• 1:03:59
  Speaker: three hundred and sixty five Days of Cooking, and it had more
• 1:04:03
  Speaker: than three hundred and sixty five recipes, and it had
• 1:04:06
  Speaker: instructions to make three hundred and sixty five meals.
• 1:04:10
  Speaker: So a lot of recipes, right?
• 1:04:12
  Speaker: Meals for three hundred eighty
• 1:04:13
  Speaker: five days, breakfast, lunch and
• 1:04:14
  Speaker: dinner, and then, you know,
• 1:04:15
  Speaker: Korean food.
• 1:04:16
  Speaker: It's like you have all the different things.
• 1:04:18
  Speaker: So it's like, so it's like probably like nine dishes a day.
• 1:04:21
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 1:04:22
  Speaker: Um, and then the photos are so
• 1:04:23
  Speaker: like amazingly eighties and I'm
• 1:04:27
  Speaker: like, again, who is making all
• 1:04:28
  Speaker: of this?
• 1:04:29
  Speaker: Um, who like how?
• 1:04:31
  Speaker: And then there's also like, okay, well, it's Chuseok, which
• 1:04:33
  Speaker: is Korean Thanksgiving.
• 1:04:34
  Speaker: So now here are the twenty dishes you have to make.
• 1:04:36
  Speaker: And I was like, wow.
• 1:04:37
  Speaker: Yeah, the pressure on a Korean housewife is so intense.
• 1:04:41
  Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:04:42
  Speaker: And I do you think they felt it as that?
• 1:04:46
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 1:04:48
  Speaker: That's like especially Chuseok
• 1:04:49
  Speaker: is a great example of that
• 1:04:50
  Speaker: because it's a time when you
• 1:04:52
  Speaker: have to make these really labor
• 1:04:53
  Speaker: intensive dishes.
• 1:04:54
  Speaker: And I think it's really dreaded by like all of the daughters in
• 1:04:57
  Speaker: laws out there because they have to like go to their mother in
• 1:05:01
  Speaker: law's house, get really judged, just toil away in the kitchen
• 1:05:04
  Speaker: for like ten hours just to like sit in the back of the kitchen
• 1:05:06
  Speaker: and be like, oh my God, like I was a short order cook all day.
• 1:05:09
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 1:05:10
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 1:05:10
  Speaker: I wonder what, um, it feels like to be living with that dread all
• 1:05:15
  Speaker: the time though.
• 1:05:17
  Speaker: That's why you need to drink.
• 1:05:21
  Speaker: That's true.
• 1:05:22
  Speaker: It's true.
• 1:05:23
  Speaker: I guess I always felt like if
• 1:05:24
  Speaker: it's something that I really had
• 1:05:26
  Speaker: to do and I couldn't get out of
• 1:05:27
  Speaker: it, I tried to change the way I
• 1:05:29
  Speaker: thought about it because I hated
• 1:05:30
  Speaker: walking around feeling like I
• 1:05:32
  Speaker: dreaded everything.
• 1:05:33
  Speaker: Mhm.
• 1:05:34
  Speaker: So anyway, that's just, um, I, you know, and feeding children
• 1:05:39
  Speaker: is something that you.
• 1:05:40
  Speaker: Well, you have a choice again, but I decided I was going to try
• 1:05:43
  Speaker: to enjoy it and I, and I really tried to go into it with that.
• 1:05:48
  Speaker: But those are two great books.
• 1:05:49
  Speaker: I will see if I can scrounge up any links on the internet, link
• 1:05:54
  Speaker: to those in the show notes, and I'd love to also link to how
• 1:05:58
  Speaker: it's been so fun to talk to you hear all about your book.
• 1:06:01
  Speaker: We should do a separate podcast
• 1:06:03
  Speaker: about cookbooks that cookbook
• 1:06:05
  Speaker: authors love.
• 1:06:06
  Speaker: Not just about your book, but other books.
• 1:06:09
  Speaker: Um, but tell me a little bit about how people can connect
• 1:06:11
  Speaker: with you online.
• 1:06:13
  Speaker: Um, you can find me on Instagram or TikTok at you eating.
• 1:06:18
  Speaker: Um, that's my last name y o o eating.
• 1:06:21
  Speaker: Um, I'm also on YouTube.
• 1:06:23
  Speaker: I share a channel with my friend James Park who's James world.
• 1:06:27
  Speaker: Um, and that is called Kaka studio K a dot k dot studio.
• 1:06:31
  Speaker: Um, you can find me at Orion Bar in Bushwick, Brooklyn.
• 1:06:36
  Speaker: And later this month, um of July, um, I'll actually be be at
• 1:06:42
  Speaker: tales of the cocktail.
• 1:06:42
  Speaker: I'm going to be doing a Korean
• 1:06:45
  Speaker: cocktail pop up with a few
• 1:06:46
  Speaker: friends.
• 1:06:47
  Speaker: Um, Hashim who's coming out with a Korean cocktails cookbook
• 1:06:51
  Speaker: later this year, as well as our friend, um JB, who makes
• 1:06:55
  Speaker: beautiful, amazingly innovative cocktails on Instagram.
• 1:06:58
  Speaker: Um, yeah.
• 1:07:00
  Speaker: Wonderful.
• 1:07:00
  Speaker: And I know there's a link on
• 1:07:01
  Speaker: your website with all the
• 1:07:02
  Speaker: events, so if anyone's
• 1:07:04
  Speaker: interested in meeting Irene and
• 1:07:07
  Speaker: learning a little bit more about
• 1:07:08
  Speaker: what she does in person, you can
• 1:07:09
  Speaker: check out that section of her
• 1:07:11
  Speaker: website.
• 1:07:13
  Speaker: Well, it's been terrific to have you on the show.
• 1:07:15
  Speaker: I thank you so much for your time and your beautiful new
• 1:07:19
  Speaker: book, Soju Party How to Drink and Eat Like a Korean.
• 1:07:24
  Speaker: Thank you so much, Maggie.
• 1:07:25
  Speaker: It was so fun to talk to you.
• 1:07:27
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 1:07:27
  Speaker: Great to talk to you too.
• 1:07:28
  Speaker: And I wish you nothing but the best with your book.
• 1:07:31
  Speaker: Again, congratulations on your
• 1:07:32
  Speaker: award and enjoy meeting all the
• 1:07:35
  Speaker: people.
• 1:07:36
  Speaker: You know, it's different meeting people who buy the cookbooks
• 1:07:39
  Speaker: versus like coming into a bar or maybe even restaurants.
• 1:07:42
  Speaker: So for sure, enjoy those, those people as well.
• 1:07:45
  Speaker: Thank you so much.
• 1:07:47
  Speaker: Thank you so much for joining us today for this episode of the
• 1:07:50
  Speaker: Cookbook Love Podcast.
• 1:07:51
  Speaker: again.
• 1:07:52
  Speaker: All the links can be found in the show notes at w w w dot
• 1:07:55
  Speaker: cookbook dot co.
• 1:07:57
  Speaker: And if you are interested in
• 1:07:59
  Speaker: writing a cookbook of your own,
• 1:08:00
  Speaker: please check out the free
• 1:08:02
  Speaker: Cookbook Writing Masterclass
• 1:08:04
  Speaker: called How to Get Paid to Write
• 1:08:06
  Speaker: a Cookbook.
• 1:08:07
  Speaker: It is designed specifically for food or nutrition experts, and
• 1:08:11
  Speaker: you can check that out at w w w dot cookbook writers dot com.
• 1:08:18
  Speaker: So that's it for today's episode of the Cookbook Love Podcast.
• 1:08:21
  Speaker: This is your host, Maggie Green.
• 1:08:23
  Speaker: And until next time, have a
• 1:08:25
  Speaker: great day and keep loving your
• 1:08:27
  Speaker: cookbooks.
• 1:08:32
  Speaker: Thanks for listening to the Cookbook Love podcast.
• 1:08:35
  Speaker: You can find out more
• 1:08:36
  Speaker: information at w w w dot
• 1:08:38
  Speaker: cookbook.