Latest / Messy Minded Mama / Episode 23 - I See You: The Mother Behind the NICU Journey

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Episode 23 - I See You: The Mother Behind the NICU Journey · Messy Minded Mama

0:12
SPEAKER_01: Welcome to Messy Minded Mama, a podcast for moms who look managed but might feel a bit messy on the inside.
0:18
SPEAKER_01: I'm Kate.
0:19
SPEAKER_01: And I'm Jen.
0:20
SPEAKER_00: And we are here creating space for real talk about motherhood, mental health, and the invisible load so many women carry.
0:28
SPEAKER_00: Well, welcome back to Messy Minded Mama.
0:32
SPEAKER_00: This month is NICU Awareness Month, and we thought what a beautiful time to just shine the light a little bit more on families and their NICU experiences.
0:44
SPEAKER_00: I think when we think about the NICU, so much of it is understandably focused on the baby or babies.
0:51
SPEAKER_00: And today we really want to sit and talk a little bit more about the mother side of it.
0:56
SPEAKER_00: So, what are all the moms going through that are at the NICU?
1:00
SPEAKER_00: So that is why we brought Stephanie on today, who is the founder of Mama ICU.
1:07
SPEAKER_00: And Stephanie, your work immediately stood out to us when we thought about um having this conversation and being able to honor NICU Awareness Month in such a beautiful way.
1:17
SPEAKER_00: So welcome, Stephanie, to Messy Minded Mama.
1:20
SPEAKER_02: Thanks, guys.
1:20
SPEAKER_02: It's so awesome to be here.
1:22
SPEAKER_02: I love it.
1:22
SPEAKER_02: I love chatting about my life.
1:26
SPEAKER_01: We're really excited, and I know I'm really excited to learn from you today, too.
1:32
SPEAKER_01: I know Jen had her babies in the NICU as well, and I didn't.
1:38
SPEAKER_01: And so I'm really looking forward and interested in this conversation because I didn't personally experience it, but I want to learn about the support because I think it's really natural for us to say, Well, what about the baby?
1:51
SPEAKER_01: How's the baby?
1:53
SPEAKER_01: And we don't always slow down to think about what's all going on with mom at the same time.
1:57
SPEAKER_01: So welcome, welcome.
1:59
SPEAKER_01: And we're so excited.
2:01
SPEAKER_01: And I was wondering, would you tell us a little bit about yourself and your family?
2:05
SPEAKER_02: Yes, I would love to.
2:07
SPEAKER_02: Um I am a mama of five kiddos.
2:11
SPEAKER_02: I had um I got married and hit the ground running.
2:16
SPEAKER_02: And so I got we got married, me and my husband, I'm married to um a filmmaker and a podcast production guy, and um we just had babies really quick.
2:26
SPEAKER_02: And so I am again a mama of five.
2:30
SPEAKER_02: I had um my first two a year apart, gave myself a little three-year break, and then I had my last three within a year.
2:38
SPEAKER_02: And so um, if you're doing the math, that's five, five and under.
2:41
SPEAKER_02: I pretty much I almost had five, five under five.
2:45
SPEAKER_02: And um, I just didn't really enjoy being a mom.
2:48
SPEAKER_02: I love being a mom, I'm a stay-at-home mom, and have just started the mom ICU um this last year, and it's um been my second biggest joy next to being a mama and a wife.
2:59
SPEAKER_02: And so um, yeah, I it's been a journey.
3:03
SPEAKER_02: My last two ended up in the NICU, they were twins, and I had a great pregnancy and a great um delivery, but unfortunately we landed like many um in the NICU for a lot of different things that I'm sure I'll share later.
3:17
SPEAKER_02: But my biggest joy in life is motherhood.
3:22
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and can we pause for a minute and say you have five children?
3:26
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
3:28
SPEAKER_00: But here we are.
3:30
SPEAKER_00: You are one busy mama.
3:32
SPEAKER_00: So I think maybe just giving that a little time and attention, real quick.
3:35
SPEAKER_00: Like, tell us what motherhood looks like for you right now in this phase of life.
3:39
SPEAKER_02: Great.
3:39
SPEAKER_02: Um as we all know, motherhood changes through the season.
3:42
SPEAKER_02: So, like, right now is actually my favorite season of motherhood I've been in yet.
3:47
SPEAKER_02: Um, so my kids currently are um almost five and five, six, almost nine and ten.
3:56
SPEAKER_02: And so everyone can wipe themselves and get themselves cereal on a Saturday morning, and it's like actually bliss, and I'm just like loving it.
4:06
SPEAKER_02: Um, we homeschool our five kids, so I actually like to say like parent educate.
4:11
SPEAKER_02: So they have lots of things going on to the week.
4:13
SPEAKER_02: I'm not doing it all, I could never, um, but it is like truly the biggest blessing of my life.
4:19
SPEAKER_02: Our life is chaos, and my house is a constant mess, and I am constantly a messy mama.
4:28
SPEAKER_02: So I fit in, I feel like I fit in, and I just like truly I I love it.
4:33
SPEAKER_02: I love not every part of it, but most of most of the parts.
4:37
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, I think that rings so true, right?
4:39
SPEAKER_01: Of like we love so much of it, and I love that your kids are in that independence phase of desperately counting down to get there.
4:50
SPEAKER_01: Um, but I love that that that part for you feels so like a breath of fresh air, right?
4:57
SPEAKER_01: They have that independence, you're able to manage.
5:01
SPEAKER_01: It's always chaos, right?
5:03
SPEAKER_01: It's it's messy, it's magic, it's always chaos, but it sounds like right now feels like a great part of motherhood for you.
5:11
SPEAKER_01: And I love that.
5:12
SPEAKER_01: And like Jen said, Whoo, five kids, like I am sending you all the vibes.
5:18
SPEAKER_02: Yes, I need them.
5:20
SPEAKER_02: All the things because that is work.
5:22
SPEAKER_02: Yes, it is so much work.
5:24
SPEAKER_02: Somebody like posted today on Facebook, like, when did you feel like a real adult?
5:28
SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, this year.
5:31
SPEAKER_02: That's it.
5:32
SPEAKER_02: Like, I finally felt like when my son turned 10, I was like, okay, I've got some like like life under my belt a little bit.
5:39
SPEAKER_02: And like I was telling them today, like, I didn't feel allowed to have like I'm like, who gave me permission to have these tiny babies?
5:46
SPEAKER_02: And like, I don't know, I'm just a type C mom over here trying to survive.
5:51
SPEAKER_02: So I appreciate the vibes.
5:53
SPEAKER_02: They're yes, I'm loving the independent life.
5:56
SPEAKER_02: I and I haven't missed a single beat, and I'm really grateful for that.
6:00
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, oh, that's amazing.
6:01
SPEAKER_00: And yes, you're in good company with all the messiness that we bring to the table in our lives as well.
6:06
SPEAKER_00: So it's good.
6:08
SPEAKER_00: Okay, take us back a little bit to the NICU journey with your twins.
6:13
SPEAKER_02: Um, so my NICU journey started um a lot like a lot of mom's NICU journeys, um, mine just happened to be twin pregnancy and everything kind of went great, actually.
6:25
SPEAKER_02: Like my other than being huge and giant and feeling like a whale, um, my pregnancy went so well, and I was not prepared to land in the NICU.
6:37
SPEAKER_02: Um, ironically, even though everyone like tried to be like, hey, just so you know, this could happen with twins, and you know, because my labor and delivery went so well, it didn't even clock to like register, like that may be something I need to prepare for a little more mentally, and um no, really mentally, physically postpartum.
6:56
SPEAKER_02: You can't really do much about that.
6:58
SPEAKER_02: Um, but like mentally, I just wasn't prepared.
7:01
SPEAKER_02: So when my boys um were born, they were born seven minutes apart, totally happy, crying, healthy babies.
7:09
SPEAKER_02: And about two hours into like that magic hour um of like holding them or magic period, um, one of my twins just had a little blood sugar situation that they um just were like concerned, they were like, we're gonna take him for a couple hours and it'll be fine.
7:27
SPEAKER_02: And so, you know, postpartum's hard, and you're just kind of in like a daze.
7:32
SPEAKER_02: Um, I was lucky enough to be offered a vaginal delivery.
7:35
SPEAKER_02: So I was just in regular postpartum room, but I had lost a lot of blood, so I was kind of like they were on the cusp but like, do we need a transfusion?
7:44
SPEAKER_02: Do we not?
7:45
SPEAKER_02: Anyway, all this stuff is happening.
7:47
SPEAKER_02: My little baby got rushed away, my husband went with um him, and it just seemed like he was gonna land there for um maybe a few hours.
7:56
SPEAKER_02: And I got a call um about two hours after he'd been there that he had like aspirated on some of something in his lungs, and he was revived, but we were gonna be there for a while.
8:08
SPEAKER_02: And so um that's kind of where my NICU journey started.
8:12
SPEAKER_02: It landed us 11 days, which is actually um such a blessing because a lot of moms are left in there for much longer.
8:20
SPEAKER_02: And um it just came with a lot of shocked loneliness.
8:25
SPEAKER_02: And um that was my biggest feeling of the NICU in that season was just like what am I supposed to do here with two babies?
8:36
SPEAKER_02: Um and there was just like a lot of questions and a just a lot, a lot of feeling like alone, even though I had my husband there.
8:44
SPEAKER_02: But honestly, he was useless in that in that like yeah, in that like postpartum space.
8:49
SPEAKER_02: He helped a lot in like holding the baby and doing the things, but as far as like my heart and where my brain was, like I he was not helpful.
8:57
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, kind of that torn feeling, right?
9:00
SPEAKER_01: Like your heart and your brain are like you're logically trying to figure out like what do I have to do next.
9:05
SPEAKER_01: And like your heart's like, but I'm trying to process what's happened.
9:09
SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes.
9:11
SPEAKER_02: A lot of um things I was used to, like survival mode, kind of kicked in because I was like, I know how to do this postpartum, but the NICU just puts like a whole nother blanket over um that postpartum journey, and it just felt like really heavy.
9:27
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
9:29
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I'm just my heart is like beating fast when you talk about just like the heaviness, right?
9:35
SPEAKER_00: When you talk about what that does, and you know, not to anyone's fault, but you're right, like nobody knows what to say, do how to like heal in those moments and how to show up.
9:47
SPEAKER_00: So I think there's things that can be done to help feel more supported, but when you're in this state of fear, right?
9:56
SPEAKER_00: Like it's terrifying when you don't know exactly what's going on and know all the answers and know necessarily like the outcome and how quickly everything will kind of get back to maybe what feels like a state of normal.
10:06
SPEAKER_00: Um, but that all just feels like so heavy.
10:08
SPEAKER_00: So I I see that when you're talking about it, and I feel that for you too, and anyone that's kind of going through that journey.
10:14
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think postpartum is talked about more now, which is awesome.
10:19
SPEAKER_02: I think that I'm like a total advocate of that.
10:22
SPEAKER_02: I think the thing that I learned through that season is like again, like the blanket of NICU life on top of postpartum is not talked about very often as far as like the mother.
10:33
SPEAKER_02: I think we have a lot of like baby did this, baby did that.
10:36
SPEAKER_02: Doctors could do better at explaining this, that, and the other.
10:38
SPEAKER_02: But like, as far as emotional and mental support, like postpartum's already lacking, and then again, like adding the NICU on top of that is just like too much.
10:51
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'm wondering, like, talk a little more about this like NICU blanket.
10:55
SPEAKER_01: Like, what do you remember most about like those first few days?
10:59
SPEAKER_01: Like describe that.
11:00
SPEAKER_01: I mean, because there are people who have been in NICU and they understand that, and then there's people on the outside that are like, tell us, tell us what it's like and how we can support, right?
11:11
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, oh, that's such a great question.
11:13
SPEAKER_02: Um, so from someone who did have like a lot of um like food support and I had family to take care of my babies, that's not always granted.
11:24
SPEAKER_02: The mental load of like the unknown, I think was the blanket.
11:29
SPEAKER_02: I was learning a whole new language in the NICU, I was learning all new rules.
11:33
SPEAKER_02: Um, I didn't have control over anything really.
11:37
SPEAKER_02: I was like, I sure tried.
11:39
SPEAKER_02: Like, I'm gonna nurse, I'm gonna do that.
11:41
SPEAKER_02: So, like the lack of control and the sadness in that, like the heaviness of like, I just have to go along with whatever anybody's saying, I don't know anything.
11:51
SPEAKER_02: And as I went on through my days, you know, that got a little better, but like that first bit of like having to literally crawl down the hallway to get to my baby, and like um that was like, does anyone see that I'm like doing this by myself?
12:08
SPEAKER_02: And there are reasons, and I think there's really good reasons that I didn't have a wheelchair or like somebody to help me walk down the hallway.
12:17
SPEAKER_02: Um, my husband again was with our other twin, like we were going back and forth, um, but like that sadness of like feeling like everyone's here for baby, no one's here for me.
12:28
SPEAKER_02: Um, although I think correct in a lot of ways, um, I think that was the blanket, like, oh literally no one's here for me.
12:35
SPEAKER_02: Like, I'm here for my baby, they're here for my baby, it's all baby, and that was the hardest part.
12:42
SPEAKER_02: Isolating, yes, exactly.
12:45
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, um I did not feel seen.
12:48
SPEAKER_02: Um, again, I'm not trying to say that anybody had like an ill will of that, like everyone was seeing who they should have seen, but I was not the recipient of that care.
13:00
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I can imagine when you're sharing your experience and this thought of I don't have any control, right?
13:07
SPEAKER_00: And it's like not only is it control over the baby's health, right?
13:11
SPEAKER_00: And wanting them to be okay and and navigate that, but it's also, I imagine, from your experience with your other kiddos, I I don't know this to be true, but you probably went home pretty quickly from the hospital and you were able to like feed when you wanted to and pick up on the cues and do the things that felt more natural.
13:28
SPEAKER_00: Whereas when you're in the NICU, tell me a little bit more about that.
13:31
SPEAKER_00: Like, what was the loss of control or difference, I guess, in the control from previous experiences to that?
13:38
SPEAKER_02: Um, yeah, that's a great question.
13:40
SPEAKER_02: I think the biggest thing for me is like I just um my story is that I was able to stay in the hospital in just a room they gave me, a boarding room.
13:50
SPEAKER_02: Um, so like I didn't have any of my like normal things, right?
13:53
SPEAKER_02: I didn't have my normal shampoo, my normal, like down to like a sits bath.
13:58
SPEAKER_02: Like I couldn't take a bath when I usually would take do something.
14:02
SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, I was a little more seasoned, so I could like know, like, oh, I maybe need this, that, or the other.
14:07
SPEAKER_02: But like, I didn't have my favorite blanket.
14:09
SPEAKER_02: I didn't have slipper shoes.
14:11
SPEAKER_02: Oh my gosh.
14:12
SPEAKER_02: I know this sounds like small things, but like in the larger scale, like I had nothing.
14:17
SPEAKER_02: I was not prepared for 11 days.
14:19
SPEAKER_02: Um, I couldn't eat the food I wanted.
14:22
SPEAKER_02: That was a big one.
14:23
SPEAKER_02: Like, I did have food.
14:25
SPEAKER_02: People brought food or I got food at the cafeteria, but like I couldn't choose.
14:29
SPEAKER_02: Like, what do I want postpartum?
14:31
SPEAKER_02: What's my next meal?
14:33
SPEAKER_02: Um some people are really um lucky to have set aside a budget for like DoorDash or whatever.
14:41
SPEAKER_02: Um, we did not have that, so we were um we could do it here and there, but definitely not every meal for 11 days.
14:48
SPEAKER_02: So it was like a lot of this, just those comforts that we were able to like in a really healthy way, like self-soothe and take care of yourself.
14:55
SPEAKER_02: I didn't have like even the bathroom, like y'all, like in a hospital bathroom.
15:00
SPEAKER_02: That's like not it.
15:01
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and you're like changing your like pad and your diaper, and you're like, okay.
15:06
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, those little comforts go so far.
15:10
SPEAKER_01: Like when you're at home and you've got your favorite blanket and you can cozy up on the couch, and you're not in like this stiff hospital bed or like the couch or the chair that they give you that's really not that comfortable, right?
15:22
SPEAKER_01: Like, you're already hurting.
15:24
SPEAKER_01: Postpartum is physically challenging, and you can't have your own comforts.
15:29
SPEAKER_02: Like, that's a real like even down to like the show.
15:33
SPEAKER_02: Like, I had a postpartum show, like Gilmar Girls and Anatomy was like my my postpartum show.
15:39
SPEAKER_02: Like, I wanted to be like in my bed with my TV.
15:42
SPEAKER_02: Like, I know that just sounds wild.
15:44
SPEAKER_02: Maybe actually, I know it doesn't because I think all moms feel this way.
15:47
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, but it was like those things that I was like, I need, or to like have my mom.
15:53
SPEAKER_02: I was this was in 2021, so my mom wasn't allowed to come to the hospital, and so just like even my mom to take care of me or my best friend to come like sit with me for a bit, that was not the option.
16:04
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so yeah, but that like compounding on top of everything else you were going through the times when the rules totally look different in the hospital, and who you could actually have in there for a support, so yeah, one extra layer.
16:19
SPEAKER_02: Being sick at all is like a no-go.
16:21
SPEAKER_02: Like, I know moms that have like landed down the hall from their baby and like got a cold after delivery, and like we're like, Oh, sorry, like you're not allowed, not allowed in here, and like just that to imagine that was not my story, but to imagine that, and then also to have like none of your comforts from home, like just heart-wrenching.
16:40
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, Jen, I'm curious.
16:42
SPEAKER_01: Like, listening to Stephanie talk about her experiences.
16:46
SPEAKER_01: Is there anything that she's saying that's like taking you back to your experience in that?
16:52
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, oh, for sure.
16:54
SPEAKER_00: I think mine were way shorter, but I did find myself there with both my kiddos.
16:59
SPEAKER_00: And I think the first was when you're talking about your husband being with your other baby, right?
17:06
SPEAKER_00: The twin, and you being there for my experience.
17:09
SPEAKER_00: My son went to the NICU right away.
17:12
SPEAKER_00: I had a c-section, and I actually had to go back in for surgery after my c-section.
17:16
SPEAKER_00: And my husband was left in a room all by himself with my babe, the baby in the NICU, me going off to surgery, and him just being like, What is today turning into?
17:27
SPEAKER_00: And then I ended up having postpartum pre-eclampsia.
17:31
SPEAKER_00: So my son was in the NICU, and I couldn't even go see him for the first at least 12 hours after I was had him.
17:39
SPEAKER_00: So I didn't get a hold of him after he came out because he went to the NICU right away.
17:43
SPEAKER_00: And then I had to go in for my own thing.
17:45
SPEAKER_00: My husband was left alone, and I'm like, what is today actually turning into?
17:49
SPEAKER_00: It was just wild.
17:50
SPEAKER_00: And then five had nurses that were huge advocates for like, get let's get you down to your baby because my blood pressure was too high that they wouldn't let me go see him.
17:59
SPEAKER_00: They didn't want to move me.
18:00
SPEAKER_00: I was like, I'm pretty sure my blood pressure is high because I haven't seen my baby yet.
18:04
SPEAKER_00: I just not I had not even held him, and it was 12 hours in.
18:09
SPEAKER_00: So talk about like that.
18:11
SPEAKER_00: They advocated really hard and ended up getting me down there when I don't know if they should have, but it helped.
18:16
SPEAKER_00: It helped me.
18:17
SPEAKER_00: It helped the whole situation was much better after that.
18:20
SPEAKER_00: But I mean, talk about the the mental games my mind was playing.
18:24
SPEAKER_00: Like I was disassociating, I was like, I didn't know if he was okay, I didn't know if I was gonna be okay.
18:29
SPEAKER_00: Like, I was just kind of emotionally separating from the fact that I even had a baby because I didn't know what the outcome was gonna look like, and everyone was on my side and pulling for us in those moments, right?
18:41
SPEAKER_00: And it was such a small, he was there 24 hours, right?
18:44
SPEAKER_00: Such a small window of time, but terrifying in those moments, and just wanted every I wanted answers, right?
18:50
SPEAKER_00: I wanted everything to be okay.
18:52
SPEAKER_00: Um, so yeah, it definitely brings me back to just how terrifying the experience is because of the unknowns when you don't know exactly what the next move is, what the next step is, right?
19:03
SPEAKER_00: How long it's gonna last.
19:04
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
19:05
SPEAKER_02: I think that what something you said was like really important to know for specifically NICU moms or like trauma in birth, like that disassociation I think can come with a lot of shame.
19:18
SPEAKER_02: And I think that it's so important to talk, like, hey, it's normal, like that's your body survival.
19:25
SPEAKER_02: Like, I think there was like a couple times, even in that 11 days, where I just had to like honestly kind of pretend that he didn't exist, like to be like, he's not there.
19:36
SPEAKER_02: I have to sit here and be well.
19:38
SPEAKER_02: And I think that like, I don't know, I just want to normalize that for like moms who maybe have gone through this or will go through that.
19:45
SPEAKER_02: Like, that is a very normal and like honestly appropriate reaction to like a traumatic response when you have to like take care of yourself, take care of another baby, like help your husband take care of you, like help teach him.
20:00
SPEAKER_02: Like, there was a lot of like teaching my husband, like, I have to do this, and in my last one, you didn't have to do this for me.
20:08
SPEAKER_02: And so a lot of that is like, I just think it's so important to both stay in your body and be like, this is reality, and also be like, I have to shut it off for a minute to survive.
20:20
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
20:22
SPEAKER_00: And and thank you for normalizing that because I yeah, it's so important to like share that message and I was like, stream it, right?
20:28
SPEAKER_00: Shout it from the rooftop because I this was my first experience as a mom, but I knew I was disconnected from him right away.
20:36
SPEAKER_00: And it took me what I felt like was longer than normal to feel a connection to him, and it wasn't because he was doing anything wrong or I was doing things wrong, it was all the trauma that led to those moments of me knowing I'm gonna be okay, he's gonna be okay, like we are actually here together, and we're gonna leave in a healthy way, and everything will be fine.
20:57
SPEAKER_00: But in those moments, I did believe that, and again, I was terrified.
21:01
SPEAKER_00: So, yeah, it's definitely uh it messes with your mind in all the ways, and and it is okay to sit in that and feel and just acknowledge the fear I think that can exist.
21:14
SPEAKER_00: And then how do you start to overcome some of that and little by little start to build that connection and kind of get back into um the way that feels healthier and happier, right?
21:24
SPEAKER_00: More joyful.
21:26
SPEAKER_02: And I think that does come um with a lot of conversation.
21:30
SPEAKER_02: So if you're a mom that's in that stage still or was or to be, like conversation is the best.
21:37
SPEAKER_02: Like I think I have the best support team personally where I could could and still can five years later be like, this sucked.
21:49
SPEAKER_02: Like I'm still maybe dealing with this a little bit.
21:51
SPEAKER_02: Or I yeah, I think it's just important to talk about like what you're feeling and it's all on it's all okay to lay on the table.
22:00
SPEAKER_02: And it's totally normal.
22:02
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
22:03
SPEAKER_01: I think the fear piece too that I've heard both of you talk about, and I wasn't NICU.
22:08
SPEAKER_01: I had my own set of fear, right?
22:10
SPEAKER_01: And I think every mom does.
22:12
SPEAKER_01: Um, when you're pregnant, when you're in labor, when you're at the hospital those first few days, there's so much unknown and so much uncertainty that comes in there, and our brain fills it in, right?
22:27
SPEAKER_01: When you're like, Well, what if?
22:29
SPEAKER_01: And then your brain goes, Oh, fear.
22:31
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna answer that question with the worst case possible to prepare ourselves, which then goes right back to what you were talking about, that disassociation because we're trying to self-protect.
22:40
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but there's so much unknown and uncertainty, and Googling does not help.
22:46
SPEAKER_01: Googling is not your friend in those situations, but to to allow yourself some curiosity without fear shutting the door, I think is really important.
22:58
SPEAKER_01: Um, and to like you both just said, have a conversation about it because it's pregnancy can feel isolating in and of itself.
23:06
SPEAKER_01: It sounds like for both of you, going through NICU felt really isolating in its own set.
23:12
SPEAKER_01: And so having the conversations with other moms or people have gone through it, or talk to the nurse that's standing right there, right?
23:19
SPEAKER_01: Somebody to help process it out loud so it's not getting stuck, I think, is something that you both have highlighted.
23:28
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and one quick thing I'll share, and then I want to get back to you, Stephanie.
23:32
SPEAKER_00: But I remember these moments like when I'm tired, I get really slap happy in general, and I everything's just funny to me.
23:37
SPEAKER_00: And I think my husband and I, we've had times where things are going on and we just feel really uncomfortable, right, in the fear.
23:44
SPEAKER_00: And so we've leaned into like humor.
23:46
SPEAKER_00: And I remember being on the phone with people that were for the family that was further away or something, and we'd be giving them updates about our babies in both scenarios, most times we were there, and we would just start like laughing about something, and they're just like, Aren't like, aren't you guys supposed to be sad or worried or whatever?
24:05
SPEAKER_00: And I'm just like, Oh, we're we're terrified, but we like have to lean into humor and just like laugh through it.
24:12
SPEAKER_00: I think it confused so many people.
24:14
SPEAKER_00: But I'm like, it got us just being able, even like a nurse that was, you know, was annoying us to be honest or driving us crazy or something.
24:21
SPEAKER_00: It was something that we felt like we could lean into that really helped us.
24:25
SPEAKER_00: And I don't regret any of that.
24:27
SPEAKER_00: I think we didn't have control over it.
24:29
SPEAKER_00: It's just like naturally how we were, but it helps so much to try to find like little bright spots when we were in a sense of like the unknown and the fear.
24:37
SPEAKER_02: That's so good.
24:38
SPEAKER_02: I've got a dark sense of humor.
24:40
SPEAKER_02: So I joke about things that people are like, no, no, that's trauma.
24:44
SPEAKER_02: I'm like, yeah, we're working through it.
24:45
SPEAKER_02: It's fine.
24:46
SPEAKER_01: This is the part this is the part of it, right?
24:48
SPEAKER_01: It's how we cope and be okay, right?
24:51
SPEAKER_01: It's our yeah, absolutely.
24:53
SPEAKER_00: It's bringing like the normal side back to it, right?
24:56
SPEAKER_00: Like you need to you have to be able to lean into something that feels comfortable and normal in the moments when everything feels kind of out of your control.
25:02
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, totally.
25:03
SPEAKER_02: And like you can't cry the whole time, like physically, you just can't.
25:06
SPEAKER_02: I mean, there's a there's a there's a place for that for sure.
25:10
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I am like a crier everyday person, still, but it's like sometimes it's like we can't do that all the time, it's gonna burn us out.
25:19
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, totally.
25:20
SPEAKER_01: I'm curious from both of you.
25:23
SPEAKER_01: We like one, just thank you for sharing like the fears and the unknowns and and your experiences, because I'm sure like it still is there, right?
25:33
SPEAKER_01: You're still carrying it and it's still there and underneath, and I'm curious too of you know how can someone support, right?
25:42
SPEAKER_01: Of like you're not feeling supported, and so I know Stephanie, you have Mama ICU, and I'm I want to get into like the ideas of that and how it started, but I also want to hear before we dive into that, like what is support look like?
25:58
SPEAKER_01: What does support for mom look like?
26:02
SPEAKER_02: Oh, I love this question.
26:03
SPEAKER_02: We could talk about it all day.
26:05
SPEAKER_02: Um, like so many things, which is so frustrating to my to me and my husband, because he's like, Good God, what's the wheel gonna spin today?
26:17
SPEAKER_02: Um let's make that normal too.
26:19
SPEAKER_02: We don't always need the same thing every day.
26:22
SPEAKER_02: Um, but okay, so I when I came home from the NICU, I realized there was like a list of comfort items that I would have loved to have had um in the NICU.
26:36
SPEAKER_02: And so I think support truly can start um very simply with a few comfort items like given.
26:45
SPEAKER_02: Um, there's lots of ways, there's lots of free ways to do it.
26:49
SPEAKER_02: Um I can tell you texting a postpartum mom, NICU mom specifically, what do you need?
26:55
SPEAKER_02: She does not know.
26:57
SPEAKER_02: She will not know, she will not respond.
26:59
SPEAKER_02: She'll be like, I don't know, I don't, I don't know.
27:02
SPEAKER_02: And so um there's lots of ways to give support.
27:06
SPEAKER_02: But one of the most tactical ways you can give support is um through just a little carry bag.
27:13
SPEAKER_02: Um, Mama ICU started out of that.
27:16
SPEAKER_02: It started when I got home from the NICU about five months postpartum out of the NICU.
27:21
SPEAKER_02: I thought I can actually just like gather some things at the store every time I go and have a bag that's ready for um a NICU mom that I know someone knows.
27:32
SPEAKER_02: I was in the postpartum doula space.
27:34
SPEAKER_02: So I had some like birth connections, birth space connections there.
27:38
SPEAKER_02: And I just kind of started with that.
27:41
SPEAKER_02: Um, I thought, again, like what did I not have that I would have liked?
27:45
SPEAKER_02: Um, slipper socks was a huge one.
27:49
SPEAKER_02: Um, so Mama ICU basically began then when I was like trying to figure out.
27:55
SPEAKER_02: Um, so slipper socks, shower steamers, a little DoorDash gift card, a journal, and some chocolate was how it started.
28:03
SPEAKER_02: Like so simple.
28:05
SPEAKER_02: Um, I did a hundred dollars DoorDash that gave the mom maybe three meals to depending on how big you're, you know, if you're buying for you and your husband.
28:14
SPEAKER_02: But um, and then I just like grabbed what I could.
28:18
SPEAKER_02: Um, I personally really valued the higher quality stuff.
28:22
SPEAKER_02: I didn't want like the goodie bag with a couple starburst in the bottom of the bag.
28:26
SPEAKER_02: Like that to me was just like the sentiment was wonderful, but the payoff was not it.
28:32
SPEAKER_02: So I started there and postpartum, five months postpartum, um that's kind of where I started.
28:40
SPEAKER_02: And I just gave them to moms I knew in town or a friend that would text me, like, can you send me um some a box or a bag of stuff?
28:51
SPEAKER_02: And um we kind of started from there.
28:54
SPEAKER_02: And um now it's grown into something a lot bigger, but um that's kind of the like the easiest fruit to grab, honestly, for support.
29:05
SPEAKER_02: I think just like small things without having to be asked or like having to ask them, just like drop it off.
29:12
SPEAKER_00: Very simple comforts that you're describing, like so easy to do and can go such a long way for someone that is finding themselves there.
29:21
SPEAKER_01: Was there a specific moment when you're like, I I want to do something?
29:25
SPEAKER_01: Like, can you recall like the moment that it clicked for you?
29:28
SPEAKER_02: Um, like as far as helping or actually like starting mommy's you?
29:34
SPEAKER_02: Either both yeah, immediately I knew I wanted to help Nikki moms.
29:37
SPEAKER_02: Um, my whole goal in life has been to support moms.
29:40
SPEAKER_02: Literally, since I became a mom, I was like, this is my now like um my like dream in life is to be like a mother of mothers.
29:49
SPEAKER_02: I like just love all the mamas, and so I knew that was gonna be a thing.
29:54
SPEAKER_02: Um, and so I took my boys were four.
29:58
SPEAKER_02: So I did the this like on my own for three years, self-funded the whole thing, and then I went on like um a woman's like kind of faith retreat, and I knew um like right away when I got to this retreat, like, oh, like this is why I'm here.
30:15
SPEAKER_02: I like want to like figure this out and do this full time and make it like a whole nonprofit.
30:22
SPEAKER_02: And so um when we were there, it was just like confirmed all the women were like, duh, like that's exactly what you should do.
30:30
SPEAKER_02: Um, so like literally the next week I was doing my like 51c3 stuff, and we've made it a thing, and um we've made the bags even better, which is awesome with high, high quality stuff.
30:44
SPEAKER_02: In fact, I'd love to make it higher quality.
30:47
SPEAKER_02: So um, but yeah, it's just been like so fun to meet moms.
30:53
SPEAKER_02: Um, in now we were living in California when my boys were born, so to meet moms here and to have it transfer here um has been so cool.
31:02
SPEAKER_02: And I'm friends with a lot of the people who have gotten our bags now, and a lot of people have um given to our mission, which is awesome, and just made it like go further.
31:15
SPEAKER_02: And um, I don't know, I think as from like a faith perspective, I think that it's God has just like given me exactly where I need to go and what I need when I need it, so it's been pretty fun.
31:30
SPEAKER_01: I have like uh chili bumps.
31:32
SPEAKER_01: There's a different name.
31:32
SPEAKER_01: I call them chili bumps, but I have chili bumps.
31:35
SPEAKER_01: Like yeah, uh, I love this.
31:39
SPEAKER_01: And I think what stands out so much to me is the name.
31:43
SPEAKER_01: Like, understandably, everyone's like, how's baby, how's baby, how's baby?
31:47
SPEAKER_01: But there's a woman sitting right beside that baby that just went something that just went through something so enormous, and like the name in and of itself stands out so much to me of like sometimes we just need that.
32:00
SPEAKER_01: Like, I see you.
32:03
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think that was like the my biggest hope behind it is that even though I can't be in a NICU all the time, that is the goal, eventually.
32:15
SPEAKER_02: Um hello, hear me.
32:17
SPEAKER_02: Any NICU out there, just let me in there.
32:20
SPEAKER_02: Um, but that is the goal.
32:22
SPEAKER_02: But like if I can tell a mom, like if I was told that, right?
32:26
SPEAKER_02: If I had been told, like, hey, you are seen, you are not alone, like you have you're not the first to do this, you're not the last, like you're gonna be okay.
32:36
SPEAKER_02: Um, that doesn't mean the outcome's always great.
32:39
SPEAKER_02: That doesn't mean like I see you and your baby's gonna be totally fine.
32:43
SPEAKER_02: No, no, it just like, yeah, like my hope is just like, hey, you are seen, and your pain is seen and your joy is seen.
32:52
SPEAKER_02: There are really sweet things about NICU life too.
32:56
SPEAKER_02: I think that's something also not talked about enough.
32:58
SPEAKER_02: Like, there's really sweet connections you make in the NICU or can make in the NICU.
33:04
SPEAKER_02: And so if I can see all of that in like a little bag that maybe lasts a week or two or three, um, that's the mission complete.
33:18
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and you I we can hear the passion, right, that you carry for this, and what a heartwarming story of how you got here, how you created it, how it's already evolving, right?
33:29
SPEAKER_00: You said a year ago, right?
33:30
SPEAKER_00: Just last year you started this.
33:32
SPEAKER_00: How just a little bit a little bit less, yeah, November of last year.
33:36
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
33:36
SPEAKER_01: Amazing.
33:37
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's yeah, it's so amazing and like the evolution.
33:40
SPEAKER_00: I'm curious.
33:41
SPEAKER_00: Tell me more about the bags today.
33:44
SPEAKER_00: Like, what are some of the items that people can would find in it, and then how are they being delivered, and then maybe we can go into next steps of how people can help out and get involved.
33:54
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I'd love to.
33:55
SPEAKER_02: So, our mama bags that started with like four or five items now have almost um 10 to 12, depending on our donation season.
34:04
SPEAKER_02: So um you could find um a DoorDash gift card is something we try to really put on the forefront of that because again, the control of getting the food you want and like nourish your body the way you want to is huge.
34:21
SPEAKER_02: Um, every bag comes with a toiletry bag with like some higher quality shampoo conditioner, um a nice deodorant.
34:30
SPEAKER_02: Some some of them come with dry shampoo, some of them don't, but some of them have dry shampoo, like eye patches, just like stuff that you would have maybe at home, or that you it's just that extra little, like I'm maybe not doing an eye patch thing every day, but when I'm sad, girl, I've got the eye patches on.
34:46
SPEAKER_02: They're all there, and the shower steamer, like the whole thing.
34:49
SPEAKER_02: So we put a whole thing of shower steamers in there, um, slipper socks or actual slippers.
34:54
SPEAKER_02: Um, we just were able to source some actual slippers that are really cool and high quality.
35:00
SPEAKER_02: Um, and then a journal, I think that was for me.
35:04
SPEAKER_02: I wish someone would have handed me a journal and said, write even if you don't want to.
35:09
SPEAKER_02: Um, so a journal, a pen.
35:12
SPEAKER_02: Um, I'm sure I'm missing something.
35:15
SPEAKER_02: Lip gloss, chapstick, whatever higher quality items we can fit in there, we do.
35:21
SPEAKER_02: And then um, every bag gets a note from me.
35:24
SPEAKER_02: And um, everyone is a little different, but it just basically says, like, hey, I see you.
35:30
SPEAKER_02: Like, I want every mama to know like they are the best mom, even if they haven't touched their kid yet.
35:37
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and so the bravery and um strength that we um give as an example to our baby, like that happens the minute they're put in the NICU.
35:49
SPEAKER_02: Like, so I just like to tell all the moms that they are just so brave and I'm so proud of them.
35:54
SPEAKER_02: And I wish, gosh darn, I'm gonna be in there one day sitting next to these moms telling them my story and telling them they're they're gonna be alright.
36:02
SPEAKER_02: Um, again, the outcome isn't always favorable or the way we wish.
36:09
SPEAKER_02: I mean, every mom wishes they don't have to go through the NICU, but there are some really sweet moms that do understand where they're at.
36:19
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I think holding space for what you just said, the outcome isn't always, you know, what we hope for.
36:26
SPEAKER_00: And I think regardless of that, what you're doing and what you're providing, and the thought of a mama being the best one that they can be in the time that they are if the outcome isn't there, and the bravery that you're sharing right with them, of being able to be there side by side next to their babies the whole time.
36:47
SPEAKER_00: I think all of that, no matter what the outcome looks like for the moms and the NICU, it it speaks volumes to allow them to feel seen in those moments and help carry them through.
36:58
SPEAKER_00: So um appreciate you and just all everything, the heart behind it again, and everything that you're doing and sharing with them.
37:06
SPEAKER_00: Like it is so valuable.
37:08
SPEAKER_02: Um, you guys, like, thank you for letting me share.
37:11
SPEAKER_02: I think um, again, like NICU life isn't shared a whole lot about um in a common space, but like reality is like one in ten babies are premi and end up in the NICU.
37:23
SPEAKER_02: And so that is 10% of these mamas out here living life feeling, some of them feeling, I would say most feeling unseen.
37:32
SPEAKER_02: So I'm grateful to be able to share because the more we talk about it and postpartum in general, like the more we talk and have community and don't stay quiet and don't stay isolated is the best.
37:45
SPEAKER_01: So community's huge.
37:48
SPEAKER_01: I want to know how we, Jen and I, messy-minded mama, but also our our listeners, our community can support Mama ICU.
37:57
SPEAKER_01: What are things that we can do to support?
38:00
SPEAKER_02: Okay, thank you for asking.
38:02
SPEAKER_02: Um, as a nonprofit, we're always looking for donations.
38:05
SPEAKER_02: Um, there's two big ways to do that.
38:08
SPEAKER_02: Um, monetarily, you can go to our website, mamaicu.com, and just donate through that um donate on that donate button.
38:16
SPEAKER_02: That's um an easy way.
38:18
SPEAKER_02: I like to break things down into smaller chunks because our bags are$300, which is a higher ticket item.
38:25
SPEAKER_02: But if you were to donate$25 a month, that actually equals$300 in the year.
38:30
SPEAKER_02: And so just$25 a month guarantees that one mom will get one of these bags, and it's super easy and simple, and you can set it and forget it, and we um benefit from that all year long.
38:42
SPEAKER_02: Um, another really easy way monetarily is we always have like a running Amazon list, and so you can again, I don't know if that button's live yet.
38:51
SPEAKER_02: It will be live by the time this is out.
38:53
SPEAKER_02: So um you can just go click on that Amazon wish list, and there's things from like$10 to the highest$100 for a DoorDash gift card, and you just use it like you would any Amazon purchase.
39:05
SPEAKER_02: You just go through and then it sends it right to me, which is so helpful.
39:09
SPEAKER_02: Um, those are wildly helpful because it takes the work off me too.
39:14
SPEAKER_02: And so um the only thing I ask when people Amazon like gift wish list us is just let me know that you did it so I can say thank you, because I don't get a note or anything.
39:25
SPEAKER_02: Um, and then another way you can support is just follow Mama ICU on socials um and share when you see it.
39:31
SPEAKER_02: That's so helpful.
39:32
SPEAKER_02: Again, um money is in our highest value community and like making others feel seen.
39:39
SPEAKER_02: And so I love it when everything gets shared and we just get to be a community and love on other people.
39:46
SPEAKER_02: And um also you can do this on your own.
39:50
SPEAKER_02: I like people in other states are like, you're not in my state, I can't do it.
39:53
SPEAKER_02: I'm like, no, no, go do it yourself.
39:55
SPEAKER_02: Like, look at our Amazon wish list, just buy everything on there and then give it to a mama and just take credit for it.
40:01
SPEAKER_02: I love it.
40:02
SPEAKER_02: Our whole goal is to make sure moms feel seen.
40:04
SPEAKER_02: So we can do that, whether it's mom I see you or just like personally, that's it.
40:11
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I love that.
40:12
SPEAKER_00: Putting the good vibes out there of anyone can take this on, and even if it's just one time to one mom, it's making a difference, right?
40:20
SPEAKER_00: So I love that.
40:21
SPEAKER_00: But it doesn't have to be.
40:23
SPEAKER_00: Um, I think sometimes we tend to make things bigger than they need to be, and it doesn't have to be that.
40:28
SPEAKER_00: So any effort to get out there and be able to help mamas in any area um would be so perfect.
40:35
SPEAKER_00: We just appreciate what you're doing, we appreciate you sharing.
40:38
SPEAKER_00: We will make sure that we update um everything that you shared.
40:43
SPEAKER_00: We'll make sure that we put that and make that available to all of our listeners as well.
40:48
SPEAKER_00: Kate, do you have anything else for today?
40:52
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I just thank you, Stephanie, for like coming on and sharing your story with us and and taking such a challenging but beautiful again, two things true.
41:05
SPEAKER_01: Part of your own story and and taking that to help another mom feel less invisible.
41:10
SPEAKER_01: Like it just hits me right right in my heart.
41:13
SPEAKER_01: And I think one of my biggest takeaways, especially as someone who didn't experience it, is that I don't have to completely understand what someone is going through in order to show up.
41:22
SPEAKER_01: That's right.
41:22
SPEAKER_01: I have other ways that I can show up.
41:24
SPEAKER_01: It doesn't need perfect words or me to fix it, it's just to find a way through connection and some comfort.
41:31
SPEAKER_01: And so I really just like thank you for for sharing all of that.
41:38
SPEAKER_01: And I think like during NICU Awareness Month, like, let's celebrate these moms and babies and let's recognize the people that are caring for them, and and we want to support organizations like yours, and you know, I think everyone needs to walk away with mama.
41:55
SPEAKER_01: We see you.
41:56
SPEAKER_01: You are not alone, we see you.
41:58
SPEAKER_01: Jen and I are here, Stephanie's here, and you're not alone in this.
42:03
SPEAKER_01: So we'll see you next time on Messy Minded Mama, and please, please go support Mama ICU.
42:10
SPEAKER_00: All right, thanks Stephanie for being here today, and we'll see you next time.
42:16
SPEAKER_00: Thank you for being here with us today.
42:18
SPEAKER_00: If something in this episode resonated, we're really glad you listened.
42:22
SPEAKER_00: Messy minded or not, you're not alone in this, and you don't have to have it all figured out.
42:26
SPEAKER_01: If you'd like to stay connected, you can follow Messy Minded Mama wherever you listen to podcasts.
42:32
SPEAKER_01: And follow us on Instagram at messy.minded.mama.
42:36
SPEAKER_01: We'll be back to connect again soon.
42:38
SPEAKER_01: Thanks for being here.