Latest / Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar / 7/2/26: DSA Dem Party Takeover, Tucker MTG New Party, McConnell Found Unconscious

Transcript

7/2/26: DSA Dem Party Takeover, Tucker MTG New Party, McConnell Found Unconscious · Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar

0:00
Speaker 1: Hey, guys, Saga and Crystal here.
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0:33
Speaker 2: So, as you guys know, the left wing of the
0:36
Speaker 2: Democratic Party notch a few more victories, big ones in
0:39
Speaker 2: Colorado this week, including with Malat Kiros, political newcomer. She
0:44
Speaker 2: was inspired to run after she got fired from her
0:46
Speaker 2: job as a lawyer for speaking out with regards to Palestine.
0:50
Speaker 2: She unseated a thirty year incumbent in Diana to get
0:54
Speaker 2: truly astonishing someone who's been in Congress longer than malat
0:57
Speaker 2: Kiros has been alive. Let's take a look at a
0:59
Speaker 2: little bit of her victory speech.
1:01
Speaker 3: We are winning from post to post, from every level
1:07
Speaker 3: of office. We are taking back our party in our country.
1:16
Speaker 2: So who are the people behind these victories? Who are
1:19
Speaker 2: the voters that are making these big wins for the
1:22
Speaker 2: left hap and joining us now is Michael Lang. He
1:24
Speaker 2: is the author of the Narrative War's sub stack, and
1:28
Speaker 2: he digs deep into these coalitions, especially in New York
1:31
Speaker 2: City where the character of the coalitions has really been
1:35
Speaker 2: disputed and become a sort of a narrative War is
1:37
Speaker 2: a perfect title for what is going on with regard
1:40
Speaker 2: to is actually voting for these candidates.
1:41
Speaker 4: Michael, great to see you.
1:42
Speaker 5: Oh it's such a pleasure to be here.
1:44
Speaker 4: Thanks, Yeah, of course, of course.
1:46
Speaker 2: So I feel that the critique of the DSA has
1:49
Speaker 2: become a bit confused. Some feel that it is too
1:53
Speaker 2: white in college just college educated white gentrifiers. Some like
1:58
Speaker 2: Stephen Miller Jesse Waters feel that it is too many
2:01
Speaker 2: third worldist, as they put it, too many black and
2:04
Speaker 2: brown people, and we let into many immigrants, and that's
2:06
Speaker 2: what's going on here. You actually dug into the numbers
2:09
Speaker 2: so that we can deal with facts in realities. Put
2:11
Speaker 2: C three up on the screen. This was your headline
2:14
Speaker 2: when narratives meet facts about specifically the victories of Claire
2:19
Speaker 2: Valdez and Daria Liza.
2:21
Speaker 4: Chevalier in New York City.
2:23
Speaker 2: What did you find about these particular winning coalitions for
2:28
Speaker 2: two DSA candidates.
2:30
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean, I think there's plenty of variables that
2:34
Speaker 6: go into one support for socialism or progressive values, things
2:38
Speaker 6: like that. But when you kind of strip everything away,
2:41
Speaker 6: it's not necessarily race, it's not even college education, it's
2:45
Speaker 6: not even sometimes renters versus homeowners. It's just a kind
2:49
Speaker 6: of a proxy war for age. And this was kind
2:51
Speaker 6: of the story of the Mamdani coalition in New York
2:55
Speaker 6: City last year. You know, there was a lot that
2:57
Speaker 6: was made of his kind of lack of support voters
3:00
Speaker 6: in the Democratic primary last year, but that was just
3:02
Speaker 6: a function of kind of the age of that electorate.
3:06
Speaker 6: He did very well with white, Hispanic and South Asian voters,
3:08
Speaker 6: but those Democrats were much younger. And you see even
3:12
Speaker 6: you know, in the cases of claireval Des and Darry
3:14
Speaker 6: at least a Vila Chevaliere, you know, they're not just
3:17
Speaker 6: winning white voters or white voters under fifty, they're winning
3:21
Speaker 6: voters of all races under fifty. And again you to
3:26
Speaker 6: win an election in claireval Does's case by twenty points,
3:30
Speaker 6: you know, in that North Brooklyn Western Queens Commy corridor
3:34
Speaker 6: to win to defeat you know, a ten year incumbent
3:36
Speaker 6: in the thirteenth Congressional district, which is more renters than
3:39
Speaker 6: an other district in America, you can't really build the
3:45
Speaker 6: winning coalitions as they did if you're just again relying
3:49
Speaker 6: on like a very thin slice of you know, college educated,
3:53
Speaker 6: more white collar professionals, things like that.
3:56
Speaker 7: So yeah, part of your analysis was super interesting is
4:00
Speaker 7: all that even with Estelote, it was pretty close with
4:04
Speaker 7: Hispanic voters over fifty. So still I think that's still
4:07
Speaker 7: one but barely right, Like those numbers started to become
4:11
Speaker 7: really really close.
4:12
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean that was another kind of shocking piece
4:16
Speaker 6: of digging into it more because again, you know, he
4:18
Speaker 6: is the kind of the a Dominican political trailblazer here
4:23
Speaker 6: in Upper Manhattan in the Bronx, and I mean again
4:25
Speaker 6: in those communities he did did do quite well. You know,
4:29
Speaker 6: I would imagine again particularly with voters under fifty and
4:33
Speaker 6: voters over fifty, but there are also many Hispanic voters
4:36
Speaker 6: who live in that district who are not you know,
4:38
Speaker 6: who are not Dominican, they're Puerto Rican, they're Mexican. And
4:40
Speaker 6: I think that's where he really struggled, because you know,
4:44
Speaker 6: take a neighborhood like East Harlem for instance, which which
4:47
Speaker 6: again is is younger and is kind of outside of
4:49
Speaker 6: his base but still very Hispanic.
4:51
Speaker 5: That was a place where dar Eliza was able to
4:53
Speaker 5: do very well.
4:54
Speaker 6: But then again, you know Washington Heights, in the Bronx
4:56
Speaker 6: older places, you know, he kind of held on, but
5:00
Speaker 6: he still didn't really get the margins that he needed
5:04
Speaker 6: out of his core base of support. And again it
5:06
Speaker 6: points to this age polarization that we've discussed so much.
5:11
Speaker 2: You have a quote in your Pecca Claire Valdez won
5:14
Speaker 2: every age bracket and racial group. She won the young
5:19
Speaker 2: under fifty by landslide, and the old fifty plus by
5:22
Speaker 2: comfortable margin. So even as you find that the most
5:26
Speaker 2: dramatic divides are around age, and sure enough, if you
5:29
Speaker 2: look at the numbers, the younger you are, the more
5:31
Speaker 2: like you more likely you were to support a DSA candidate.
5:35
Speaker 2: But it seems that they're even making inroads with older voters,
5:38
Speaker 2: with voters that in previous cycles would have been very
5:41
Speaker 2: unlikely to vote for a DSA.
5:43
Speaker 5: Candidate, of course.
5:45
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean, I think that's kind of a testament
5:47
Speaker 6: to know the close the decade plus of political organizing
5:51
Speaker 6: that the Essay has been able to do in New
5:52
Speaker 6: York City, you know. And again, you know, this is
5:55
Speaker 6: something this is kind of a theme of my writing
5:57
Speaker 6: ideology I think matters a lot. But also the voters
6:00
Speaker 6: kind of relationships to the candidates, the institutions they represent,
6:04
Speaker 6: and just kind of DSA and Mamdani now becoming these
6:09
Speaker 6: widely viewed in the New York so sit he widely
6:13
Speaker 6: liked institutions.
6:15
Speaker 5: That does create a greater familiarity with older voters.
6:18
Speaker 6: And again also this, you know, when you're the Claire
6:20
Speaker 6: Valdez campaign and you knock over three hundred thousand doors,
6:23
Speaker 6: you basically do outreach to every real grassroots outreach to
6:27
Speaker 6: every Democrat in the seventh Congressional district. You know, that's
6:31
Speaker 6: kind of the margins that you manifest basically, and it's
6:36
Speaker 6: you know, for again, there was a lot of talk about,
6:39
Speaker 6: you know, oh, you know, the Rainoso campaign, things like that,
6:42
Speaker 6: they've been there for longer, they're the ones more rooted
6:45
Speaker 6: in the community, but they were essentially out organized. And
6:49
Speaker 6: again this is but you know, three hundred thousand doors
6:52
Speaker 6: is you know, a tremendous number of things like that.
6:55
Speaker 6: But it was kind of the culmination that I would say,
6:57
Speaker 6: a decade of work kind of going into that.
7:01
Speaker 7: Yeah, that makes sense. Well, let's go into the racial
7:04
Speaker 7: dynamics because they're getting a lot of attention from places
7:08
Speaker 7: like Fox News. So we'll roll here C two. Here's
7:13
Speaker 7: a rabbi complaining about the whiteness of the crowd at
7:16
Speaker 7: the Melakkiros victory celebration. This is a vo, folks, we
7:20
Speaker 7: can play C two so you can see what Rabbi
7:24
Speaker 7: Pupko is responding to. And then let's actually go ahead
7:28
Speaker 7: and flip to see one. This is a sot. This
7:32
Speaker 7: is Malakios talking about the victory after winning, so you
7:37
Speaker 7: can compare videos.
7:39
Speaker 3: We are winning from coast to coast, from every level
7:44
Speaker 3: of office. We are taking back our party in our contry.
7:53
Speaker 7: Lots of enthusiasm in that video, so tell us. I mean,
7:57
Speaker 7: here's also Jesse Waters. Let's roll Jesse Waters here. See four.
8:02
Speaker 7: Jesse Waters is complaining. These two things are existing at
8:05
Speaker 7: the same time and they don't totally make sense. So
8:07
Speaker 7: jesse Water is complaining about the racial.
8:09
Speaker 8: Composition crazy communists to right wing tough guys.
8:13
Speaker 4: Is that how America is.
8:14
Speaker 8: Supposed to be? Because that's the way it looks. These
8:17
Speaker 8: people don't believe in borders, capitalism, our founding fathers. They're
8:22
Speaker 8: here to steal, punish us, and then throw around welfare.
8:28
Speaker 8: This is a Third World takeover. This is what happens
8:31
Speaker 8: when you import the Third World. Did you know that
8:34
Speaker 8: New York City is seventy percent non white, forty percent
8:39
Speaker 8: foreign born, fifty percent of the apartments.
8:42
Speaker 7: They don't even speak English, not even their first language.
8:45
Speaker 8: These three women who Mandani endorsed weren't even born in
8:48
Speaker 8: New York City, weren't raised in New York City. They're
8:51
Speaker 8: carpet baggers, carpet baggers, Jessica.
8:55
Speaker 4: And everyone's talking about like.
8:57
Speaker 8: Oh Mandami, Oh you got all this juice? Like he's
9:01
Speaker 8: this like harmless novice politician on a hot streak.
9:05
Speaker 4: This guy is trouble.
9:07
Speaker 8: This guy is a trojan horse, and communism is going
9:12
Speaker 8: to take over the Democratic Party and then we're going
9:15
Speaker 8: to have to beat it because you can't can't do
9:18
Speaker 8: anything else besides beat it to a Pulp.
9:21
Speaker 7: So, Michael, what we see there is the right not
9:23
Speaker 7: knowing whether they should say DSA voters are too white
9:27
Speaker 7: or not white enough. So help us parse what the
9:31
Speaker 7: actual composition of the DSA coalition looks like from you know,
9:34
Speaker 7: Colorado to New York City.
9:36
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean, I think you've seen in kind of
9:38
Speaker 6: how people have responded to this, that they're responding in
9:41
Speaker 6: a way in which it's like, I don't really know
9:44
Speaker 6: what I'm up against. I mean, I think again, first
9:47
Speaker 6: and foremost, the DSA and the Democratic Socialist Coalition, it
9:51
Speaker 6: is it is very young.
9:52
Speaker 5: It's very millennial heavy.
9:54
Speaker 6: Shout out to you guys, right, best generation probably right.
10:01
Speaker 6: But it's also you know again heavily indexed towards renters.
10:05
Speaker 6: You know again, it's it's very difficult for younger people again,
10:08
Speaker 6: particularly in these urban areas to own an apartment, much
10:12
Speaker 6: less a home. I mean again, very college educated. That
10:15
Speaker 6: was another big thread kind of between Colorado on and
10:19
Speaker 6: New York seven. It's like lots of millennials, very high
10:22
Speaker 6: percentage of renters and very college educated, like ninetieth percent
10:26
Speaker 6: style and above. So it's kind of you know that
10:29
Speaker 6: those three things kind of mixing together, and I think
10:35
Speaker 6: that you put you put those ingredients together, it's like
10:40
Speaker 6: very potent you know, ponent factors to kind of organize politically.
10:45
Speaker 6: And again you're seeing also, as you know, kind of
10:49
Speaker 6: civic institutions in the civic bonds that I think for again,
10:52
Speaker 6: most of the twentieth century kind of held society get together.
10:55
Speaker 6: As those are fraying, you see organizations like dsa kind
10:59
Speaker 6: of fill the void, not just in terms of you know,
11:01
Speaker 6: providing people an organizing home, but also like you know,
11:05
Speaker 6: real social bonds, you know, friendship. It's you know, it's
11:09
Speaker 6: like a kind of a you know, a collective, you know,
11:13
Speaker 6: like a share you know, shared principles and interests and
11:16
Speaker 6: things like that. And again, and as these organizations have grown,
11:21
Speaker 6: as they've won more campaigns, they're also more embedded in
11:25
Speaker 6: not just community, but in government too, and you know
11:27
Speaker 6: that also builds trust and grows. And then you have
11:30
Speaker 6: an avatar like Surround Mamdani that can kind of take
11:33
Speaker 6: that vision to a grander scale and introduce even more
11:36
Speaker 6: people to kind of what it means.
11:38
Speaker 2: I think it's very unique that Zoron was able to
11:40
Speaker 2: transfer his coalition and Obama wasn't able to do that.
11:43
Speaker 2: Trump has not been able to do that. So it
11:46
Speaker 2: speaks to that level of organizing. And I think also
11:48
Speaker 2: a very like cohesive vision that Zoron has that that
11:52
Speaker 2: people can and also his orientation is very communal, you know,
11:55
Speaker 2: that's something he talks about a lot where he's not
11:58
Speaker 2: even though he is this in charismatic leader, it's not
12:02
Speaker 2: just all about him. It's about the ideas about what
12:04
Speaker 2: he's doing for New York. So when people see, oh,
12:07
Speaker 2: darny Lisa, she's Zorn's candidate, that means something to them.
12:11
Speaker 2: But the other thing that I wanted to ask you about, Michael,
12:14
Speaker 2: is to project this ount a bit into the future.
12:17
Speaker 2: You know, Bernie Sanders ran into the buzzsaw of like
12:21
Speaker 2: older black voters in the South in both of his
12:24
Speaker 2: presential campaigns, and I think part of the freak out
12:27
Speaker 2: from the dumb establishment right now is realization that their
12:31
Speaker 2: assumption that these left wing values and candidates would only
12:36
Speaker 2: ever appeal to first young white voters and then all
12:41
Speaker 2: multiracial young voters, and then now, okay, the older white
12:44
Speaker 2: voters are also voting for them, and now they're making
12:46
Speaker 2: inroads with older you know, multiracial coalition, like their assumption
12:50
Speaker 2: that the coalition would permanently stay stuck in a way
12:53
Speaker 2: that it was not a winning one. I think those
12:56
Speaker 2: are proving pretty faulty. So what does that look like
12:59
Speaker 2: going forward for the possibilities within the Democratic Party?
13:04
Speaker 6: I mean, again, you know, late Tuesday night, early Wednesday morning,
13:08
Speaker 6: that was the question everyone was asking, is like, how
13:10
Speaker 6: do how do you how can you really take this
13:12
Speaker 6: national And I think, I mean, certainly it seems like,
13:16
Speaker 6: you know, the macro political conditions of Trump two point
13:19
Speaker 6: zero have lined up very well in twenty twenty five,
13:22
Speaker 6: twenty twenty six, and.
13:23
Speaker 5: I would suspect twenty twenty eight.
13:24
Speaker 6: I mean it's just also like, look, is the Democratic
13:27
Speaker 6: Party New York City?
13:28
Speaker 5: Not necessarily? Is it Denver?
13:30
Speaker 6: Not exactly either, But the party is getting younger, more diverse,
13:35
Speaker 6: more college educated.
13:36
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's well is it Michigan where Abdula sayat
13:41
Speaker 2: is winning.
13:42
Speaker 6: The truth is that it's probably all of these things
13:45
Speaker 6: combined right literally and figuratively, but it's also the Democratic
13:48
Speaker 6: primary elector. It's also getting a little more urbanized. Things
13:51
Speaker 6: like that, And I think that does it mean that
13:54
Speaker 6: as you know that Zerumam Donny copycat wins in twenty eight.
13:57
Speaker 6: You know, I'm not sure, but it does mean that
13:59
Speaker 6: that certain parts of you know, the mass field organizing,
14:05
Speaker 6: you know, the kind of the.
14:10
Speaker 5: Media or sorry, I don't know.
14:13
Speaker 6: I say this like the visual articulation of like a
14:17
Speaker 6: narrative about affordability, about kind of your micro position in
14:23
Speaker 6: the economy, but also how it relates to these greater
14:26
Speaker 6: forces like oligarchy and corporatocracy, things like that.
14:29
Speaker 5: It's kind of blending all of that together.
14:31
Speaker 6: And I mean, I do think though that to your point,
14:34
Speaker 6: the greater establishment panic in reaction to Tuesday, it is
14:40
Speaker 6: it's like a soft acknowledgement that they have lost kind
14:43
Speaker 6: of the next generation, and that next generation is increasingly
14:47
Speaker 6: like asserting themselves far before they were ever like supposed to.
14:52
Speaker 5: Yeah, and that I think represents a real threat.
14:55
Speaker 4: Let me also float this.
14:56
Speaker 2: I'm just thinking this through in real time, but one
14:59
Speaker 2: of the ways that the establishment Democrats were able to
15:02
Speaker 2: beat back the Bernie Sanders insurgency was by a weaponization
15:06
Speaker 2: of identity politics. And you know, Hillary Clinton really is
15:09
Speaker 2: the person who sort of like introduces this particular strain
15:12
Speaker 2: of wokeism into the Democratic Party when she says, oh,
15:15
Speaker 2: breaking up the big banks isn't going to.
15:16
Speaker 4: End racism, and so it was pretty successful.
15:21
Speaker 2: And that type of politics has I think been fairly
15:24
Speaker 2: discredited and is certainly not as central in the Democratic
15:28
Speaker 2: Party now as it once was. So, for example, you
15:31
Speaker 2: have this very incredibly diverse group of candidates who are trailblazers,
15:36
Speaker 2: who are running and winning as DSA candidates, but that's
15:38
Speaker 2: not the center or the focus of why you should
15:42
Speaker 2: vote for them. And I think that that also is
15:45
Speaker 2: helping to create the possibility of a broader coalition because
15:51
Speaker 2: underneath it all, like, yeah, if you're renters, you have
15:53
Speaker 2: a series of similar concerns, whether you're like young in
15:56
Speaker 2: college educated and saddled with student debt and very limited
15:59
Speaker 2: job ross, or whether you are you know, someone who
16:02
Speaker 2: is older who is struggling as the economy in the
16:04
Speaker 2: way that most Americans are. There are a lot of
16:07
Speaker 2: universalist principles at stake here that bind these groups together
16:12
Speaker 2: much more than create differences between them.
16:15
Speaker 6: Yeah, and I think to kind of add to what
16:18
Speaker 6: you said, the electability narrative has also I think been
16:21
Speaker 6: used to really hurt progressive and left candidates. I especially
16:24
Speaker 6: felt that in twenty and twenty, but that narrative is complete,
16:27
Speaker 6: you know, kind of completely exploded with Kamala Harrison twenty
16:30
Speaker 6: twenty four and Hillary Clinton, and so I think that's
16:33
Speaker 6: also why, you know, it almost feels like every Tuesday
16:36
Speaker 6: we go to an even more higher stake selection. That's
16:39
Speaker 6: where if someone like embdul elsa ed or Grand Platner
16:42
Speaker 6: can win in Michigan or when in Maine, that would
16:44
Speaker 6: really again, I think, you know, strike a significant blow
16:49
Speaker 6: to that narrative because they do think that that. You know,
16:52
Speaker 6: there are a lot of more quote unquote conventional traditional
16:55
Speaker 6: Democrats who had you know, been very moved by electability,
17:01
Speaker 6: like we just want someone who could go win things
17:03
Speaker 6: like that, who are now kind of you know, seeing
17:05
Speaker 6: things far differently given the position that we're in.
17:09
Speaker 2: Michael, thank you so much for breaking down your analysis.
17:11
Speaker 2: Everybody should go subscribe to the substack. It is called
17:14
Speaker 2: Narrative Wars, and the level of detailed analysis that you
17:19
Speaker 2: do in New York City, I mean it.
17:20
Speaker 4: Really blog is really invaluable. Yeah, I agree to see
17:24
Speaker 4: those kind of numbers.
17:25
Speaker 2: It's really helped my understanding of what the dynamics there
17:28
Speaker 2: on the ground, and also your love of the city
17:30
Speaker 2: comes through in every post, which I appreciate you.
17:32
Speaker 5: That means a lot. Thank you, Thank you for having me.
17:34
Speaker 4: Yeah, our pleasure. We'll see again soon.
17:39
Speaker 7: Yesterday, both Marjorie Taylor Green and Tucker Carlson floated the
17:43
Speaker 7: idea of working on a third party. Let's take a
17:47
Speaker 7: listen here to Marjorie Taylor Green on with Pures Morgan
17:49
Speaker 7: discussing her plans for potentially launching something to compete with
17:53
Speaker 7: the Republican and Democratic parties.
17:56
Speaker 9: But is there a chance that Tucker maybe was supported
17:59
Speaker 9: of people like you, Well, could you see him making
18:02
Speaker 9: a run? I mean, is there a new splinter version
18:06
Speaker 9: of the Republicans that could take over the party?
18:10
Speaker 10: You know, I haven't had that direct conversation with Tucker.
18:14
Speaker 10: I know a lot of people are speculating that, and
18:16
Speaker 10: I can tell you right now, Tucker Carlson would be
18:18
Speaker 10: a great threat to both parties because there's many Americans
18:22
Speaker 10: that are very independent that would support him. But there's
18:26
Speaker 10: also Republican voters and Democrat voters that would support him.
18:30
Speaker 10: So I would say he's a He's a very credible threat.
18:34
Speaker 10: There is a group of us that have literally fought
18:38
Speaker 10: the system, and I think there's a group of us
18:41
Speaker 10: that if we decide to align, we could launch a
18:45
Speaker 10: true America focused party that doesn't fall into the traps
18:52
Speaker 10: of Democrats and Republicans, but could align some serious players
18:57
Speaker 10: from the right and the left and move forward. But Peers,
19:01
Speaker 10: I'm also very realistic because I was in the system.
19:04
Speaker 10: I've served in Congress, I've run campaigns, I know what
19:08
Speaker 10: it takes.
19:09
Speaker 4: It's difficult to launch a third party.
19:12
Speaker 10: So the reality is this isn't something that gets off
19:15
Speaker 10: the ground and just a couple of campaign cycles. This
19:18
Speaker 10: is a movement that has to be developed and would
19:21
Speaker 10: take time to develop. I'm not sure where that is
19:27
Speaker 10: right now, but I am in talks with people and
19:31
Speaker 10: where there are serious conversations happening.
19:34
Speaker 7: Okay, so she says she's in talks with people and
19:36
Speaker 7: there are serious conversations happening now. Meanwhile, separately, Tucker Carlson
19:40
Speaker 7: an interview he did with the Columbia Journalism Review posted
19:43
Speaker 7: yesterday where he talked about this as well. The reporter asked,
19:47
Speaker 7: are you interested in aligning yourself with other anti war voices?
19:51
Speaker 7: He says, I do know what really matters is war
19:53
Speaker 7: in finance, where does the money come from, where does
19:55
Speaker 7: it go? And who gets killed? And on those questions,
19:57
Speaker 7: the parties are in lockstep solidarity with each other. That's
20:00
Speaker 7: not a democracy. That's a one party state posing as
20:03
Speaker 7: a democracy, and it needs to be broken, and there's
20:05
Speaker 7: going to be a third party and I'm going to
20:07
Speaker 7: do everything i can to bring that about. He goes
20:11
Speaker 7: on to say, that's the less than the last two
20:13
Speaker 7: and a half months to me. If you vote for
20:14
Speaker 7: Trump and you still wind up in a regime change war,
20:17
Speaker 7: if Chuck Schumer is strongly behind Trump's foreign policy, which
20:19
Speaker 7: he is, then we need options or else let's just
20:22
Speaker 7: give up and be ruled by the most unscrupulous people.
20:24
Speaker 7: And I'm just too young to accept that we need
20:27
Speaker 7: a third party. He then later says, I'm going to
20:30
Speaker 7: help build a third party. There should be a good
20:32
Speaker 7: faith effort to figure out what benefits the country. He's
20:35
Speaker 7: asked would he be a candidate for the third party,
20:37
Speaker 7: He said, I don't want to be a candidate. Before
20:39
Speaker 7: I did the New York Times interview he's referring to
20:41
Speaker 7: with lu lu Garcia Navarro. Someone said to me, quote,
20:43
Speaker 7: they're going to ask you if you're running for president.
20:45
Speaker 7: I was very tempted to say I'm running on the
20:47
Speaker 7: pro patriarchy ticket just to make sure I gain no
20:50
Speaker 7: new fans and make Crystal ball as much of the
20:55
Speaker 7: twenty sixteen meme of the lady screaming into the void,
21:00
Speaker 7: of course, but that both happened separately yesterday. Neither of
21:03
Speaker 7: them referenced one another, so I don't know if they
21:05
Speaker 7: are coordinating on this together. Let's put up one more element,
21:08
Speaker 7: this media headline of Tucker Carlson making a lot of headlines,
21:12
Speaker 7: not just in mediaite for saying not long ago that
21:16
Speaker 7: he was out of the Republican Party. He's been a Republican,
21:19
Speaker 7: he said, his whole life. But he is out now,
21:22
Speaker 7: he's done. How could I or any American voter support
21:25
Speaker 7: a political party that's not loyal to the US, that
21:26
Speaker 7: puts the interest of a foreign country above those of
21:28
Speaker 7: its own citizens, he said on June twenty second. It's
21:31
Speaker 7: not possible to vote for people like that, And I'm
21:33
Speaker 7: not going to so Crystal a lot to unpack here,
21:37
Speaker 7: or maybe really not that much to unpack here, because frankly,
21:40
Speaker 7: I don't think this is happening. I think the reason
21:42
Speaker 7: historically we get caught in or historically you've had their
21:45
Speaker 7: parties be more successful than they've ever been in recent history.
21:48
Speaker 7: Is just that money has fundamentally bolstered augmented the two
21:53
Speaker 7: party system in ways that it hadn't always in the past.
21:57
Speaker 7: But maybe I'm wrong about that. It's my theory. I
21:59
Speaker 7: just don't see how it's possible to break the two
22:01
Speaker 7: party infrastructure at all.
22:03
Speaker 2: I mean, if you play this out and think about, Okay,
22:08
Speaker 2: what would happen if Marjorie Taylor Green and Tucker Carlson
22:12
Speaker 2: and Thomas Massey let's say start this third party, Like,
22:16
Speaker 2: what would what would proceed and what would happen is
22:19
Speaker 2: they would peel off I don't know, ten percent, twenty
22:23
Speaker 2: percent maybe maybe of the Republican Party, which makes you
22:26
Speaker 2: a spoiler basically, and then the Republican Party would be
22:28
Speaker 2: guaranteed to lose by a wide margin. And that's what
22:32
Speaker 2: the result would be. So I encourage them to go.
22:37
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, as someone on the left, you
22:39
Speaker 2: like as always thinking about you know, we've got been
22:42
Speaker 2: having this third party conversation to left for a very
22:44
Speaker 2: long time, and should you do that or should you
22:46
Speaker 2: like work within the Democratic Party and are they going
22:48
Speaker 2: to co opt you and then you never end up really,
22:51
Speaker 2: you know, being any different than them. And this is
22:53
Speaker 2: an ongoing debate. Both paths are very difficult, but we
22:56
Speaker 2: could see what DSA what actually works. Look at the
22:59
Speaker 2: DSA versus the Green Party, you know, and I don't
23:02
Speaker 2: think it's fair. I don't think the Green Party where
23:03
Speaker 2: the spoilers in twenty sixteen. If you look at the numbers,
23:06
Speaker 2: it doesn't really work out because you're assuming all of
23:09
Speaker 2: those voters would show up and would vote for the
23:11
Speaker 2: Democrats if they didn't work vote for the Greens.
23:12
Speaker 4: I don't think that really, you.
23:14
Speaker 2: Know, I don't think that math totally mass. I also
23:16
Speaker 2: don't think that blaming voters for deciding that they prefer
23:20
Speaker 2: this other alternative is really the way to go either.
23:22
Speaker 2: But in any case, you could see the Green Party
23:25
Speaker 2: has had very limited impact on American politics trying to
23:29
Speaker 2: pursue the third party path and DSA and before the
23:32
Speaker 2: Working Families Party, and you know, even if you look
23:35
Speaker 2: on the Republican side, the Tea Party or Trump taking
23:38
Speaker 2: over the Republican Party, you can look further back at
23:41
Speaker 2: the DLC taking over the Democratic Party in the nineties,
23:44
Speaker 2: which not a direction I would wanted them to go in,
23:46
Speaker 2: would want them to go in, But in any case,
23:48
Speaker 2: it was a successful sort of take over the party.
23:50
Speaker 2: That is the much more likely path of success if
23:54
Speaker 2: you want to change the political system. So without these
23:59
Speaker 2: more fundamentals, which I support, by the way, we should
24:02
Speaker 2: have ranked choice voting. We should make it so that
24:04
Speaker 2: there could be a broader array of political parties and
24:10
Speaker 2: views represented in our politics versus just Democrat and Republican.
24:13
Speaker 2: You have to start there. If you're starting just with
24:16
Speaker 2: the we're going to have the third party, it's going
24:17
Speaker 2: to work out.
24:18
Speaker 4: It's not. And I think to your point about why.
24:22
Speaker 2: That is, somebody's part of it, But I think it's
24:25
Speaker 2: more there's just such hardened partisan loyalties that if you
24:30
Speaker 2: if you put an R by your name or you
24:32
Speaker 2: put a D by your name, you're like guaranteed the
24:34
Speaker 2: certain chunk and then you're just you're building from there,
24:37
Speaker 2: Whereas if you come up, if you create something new,
24:41
Speaker 2: you really are starting from vote number one, and you're
24:44
Speaker 2: at a tremendous, tremendous disadvantage.
24:47
Speaker 4: So I think it's.
24:49
Speaker 2: Better to look at these established parties as the hollow
24:52
Speaker 2: husks that they really are, and especially on the Democratic
24:55
Speaker 2: Party side, I mean truly just a hollow husk. In fact,
24:58
Speaker 2: if you get endorsed by the establishment figures in the
25:00
Speaker 2: Democratic Party, it's a bit of a box.
25:02
Speaker 4: On you in a drag in an election.
25:04
Speaker 2: They have no real organizing capability, you know, they've just
25:07
Speaker 2: been completely Yeah, they just that's a great example. They
25:10
Speaker 2: even completely hollow down. So just look at them as
25:13
Speaker 2: like hollow shells that can be taken over and molded to,
25:18
Speaker 2: you know, a new conception and taken in a different direction.
25:21
Speaker 2: So well, but I think for Tucker and Marjorie Taylor Green,
25:25
Speaker 2: there's a lot of wish casting about what the Republican
25:27
Speaker 2: base wants would be and wants. But when you actually
25:31
Speaker 2: look at the polling of do they like Tucker Carlson
25:34
Speaker 2: or do they like Trump, like, it's not even close.
25:37
Speaker 4: So I maybe that changes.
25:39
Speaker 2: But I think if Tucker were to run, or some
25:42
Speaker 2: Tucker ish figure Thomas Mazi or whoever, were to run
25:45
Speaker 2: in a Republican Party primary, I think they would get destroyed.
25:48
Speaker 7: It's interesting because right now polls are finding historic levels
25:51
Speaker 7: of people identifying as independents, as opposed to Democrats or Republicans.
25:55
Speaker 7: But to your point about that hardened core, what that
25:58
Speaker 7: does in our primary system is, or I should say,
26:01
Speaker 7: what that does in the general election system is make
26:04
Speaker 7: it so that there is this huge baked in benefit,
26:07
Speaker 7: because that's really hard to overcome when you have roughly
26:11
Speaker 7: thirty percent thirty percent of the country in either of
26:13
Speaker 7: those directions, and so you're fighting over the scraps of
26:16
Speaker 7: remaining independence. But that's also about voter turnout, so like
26:20
Speaker 7: if you're in a mid term election cycle, the independence
26:22
Speaker 7: aren't turning out as much as the partisans, So it's
26:25
Speaker 7: it's really really hard to overcome that for the reasons
26:27
Speaker 7: that actually get into how we conduct elections here. So
26:31
Speaker 7: I think the theme of today's show is how elites
26:33
Speaker 7: are pushing to the brink, and I'm very curious we
26:36
Speaker 7: talked about this in the last block, the comparisons when
26:39
Speaker 7: the dust is settled between the DSA and the Tea
26:41
Speaker 7: Party movement, because the trajectory of the Tea Party movement
26:43
Speaker 7: is utterly depressing, obviously because Trump comes along co ops it,
26:49
Speaker 7: a lot of the establishment Republicans co opted it, and
26:51
Speaker 7: now the DSA is talking about term limits. I mean right,
26:54
Speaker 7: like that's the Tea Party movement changed the Republican Party
26:58
Speaker 7: in some ways, Like I'm glad that we have a
27:00
Speaker 7: more protectionist Republican Party right now, slightly more protectionists. Not really,
27:04
Speaker 7: it's now. That's another part we didn't even get to
27:07
Speaker 7: in the first block about Trump corruption, is how the
27:10
Speaker 7: tariffs have been applied in such a grifty way. So
27:13
Speaker 7: I'm glad that the Overton window has been shifted on
27:16
Speaker 7: some of these issues. But I wonder if the DSA
27:19
Speaker 7: can learn lessons from the Tea Party and actually change
27:21
Speaker 7: the Democratic Party in ways the Tea Party was not
27:24
Speaker 7: able to change the Republican Party, And I wonder if
27:27
Speaker 7: actually that's what MTG and Tucker Carlson are really thinking about,
27:31
Speaker 7: is shaping the Republican Party in a different direction and
27:35
Speaker 7: building on maybe some of the scraps that are remaining
27:38
Speaker 7: from the Tea Party era. That might be the better
27:41
Speaker 7: shot than actually assuming you could have a successful third
27:45
Speaker 7: party Republican or a third party independent right of center
27:49
Speaker 7: person rise in a presidential election and become the commander
27:52
Speaker 7: in chief. If that's what they're getting at, it's much
27:55
Speaker 7: more possible, But there are a lot of ways I mean,
27:57
Speaker 7: the Tea Party was a very powerful political movement and
28:00
Speaker 7: it didn't end up. I mean I ended up with
28:02
Speaker 7: Trump basically, yeah.
28:04
Speaker 2: And I think there's there's a lot to get in
28:06
Speaker 2: dig into there. I mean, I think partly. And I
28:08
Speaker 2: ran during the Tea Party, like peak of Tea Party
28:11
Speaker 2: twenty ten, and went to Tea Party meetings and like
28:13
Speaker 2: took their questions and did the whole thing.
28:16
Speaker 4: So I'm very familiar with.
28:18
Speaker 7: Were you for term liaments when you ran?
28:20
Speaker 4: No interesting And I think I'm still.
28:22
Speaker 7: Not a defensible position. It's a defensable position.
28:25
Speaker 2: I mean my thing is just I, if anything, think
28:28
Speaker 2: there should be more democracy, more choice.
28:30
Speaker 4: I'm more in the direction we should force.
28:31
Speaker 2: Things like debates so that there is more of a
28:35
Speaker 2: democratic choice. People know what they're getting, they're able to evaluate, okay,
28:38
Speaker 2: as my you know, future member of Congress, able to
28:40
Speaker 2: string three sentences together or not.
28:42
Speaker 4: That's more the.
28:43
Speaker 2: Direction I would rather go in, even versus you know,
28:46
Speaker 2: becoming more inclined towards age limits. But even you know,
28:48
Speaker 2: and I sort of oppose it anyway. So that's a
28:51
Speaker 2: different subject for a different day. But the Tea Party
28:54
Speaker 2: was always very in co eight. What they actually wanted.
28:56
Speaker 2: They're just mad, right, And there was not a lot
28:59
Speaker 2: of ideological cohesion. So the closest thing you could come
29:02
Speaker 2: to is like, we want to cut the deficit, you know,
29:05
Speaker 2: we want to spend less money. But even that, you know,
29:08
Speaker 2: ultimately Trump takes it over. Trump spends more money than anybody.
29:11
Speaker 11: Yep.
29:11
Speaker 4: So it's even that.
29:13
Speaker 2: I remember there was always this famous sign that was
29:15
Speaker 2: like get your government hands off my Medicare, and it
29:18
Speaker 2: was like, yeah, you know, that was kind of the
29:20
Speaker 2: vibe was just like we feel like the country is
29:23
Speaker 2: changing and we're mad about it.
29:25
Speaker 7: And the bailouts were big.
29:27
Speaker 2: The bailiance may I mean, I don't know were they
29:30
Speaker 2: because I don't know that that was really core to
29:32
Speaker 2: the Tea Party concerns. I think it was much more.
29:36
Speaker 2: I think there was certainly a racial element to it
29:38
Speaker 2: with Barack Obama there, that was definitely part of it,
29:40
Speaker 2: But I think it was more this sense of the
29:42
Speaker 2: country is changing ways that we are uncomfortable with and
29:45
Speaker 2: we just want to hit the brakes. So in any case,
29:48
Speaker 2: there wasn't a cohesive ideological strain that was consistent from
29:55
Speaker 2: the Tea Party to Trump other than just rage and
29:57
Speaker 2: then Trump becomes this truly, I mean, you have to
30:00
Speaker 2: culture personality, it genuinely is, and so that it just
30:02
Speaker 2: becomes about Trump and whatever Trump wants.
30:05
Speaker 4: So I think one of the learnings for.
30:07
Speaker 2: The DSA has to be that there has to be
30:10
Speaker 2: some more consistent ideological content, which the DSA is more
30:13
Speaker 2: equipped for because they're certainly ideological.
30:16
Speaker 4: You have to give them that.
30:17
Speaker 2: They do a lot of thinking about what the ideological
30:20
Speaker 2: content is and what sort of programs they would like
30:23
Speaker 2: to see. So I think that's one of the things
30:25
Speaker 2: the pitfalls to avoid, is it not just collapsing down
30:29
Speaker 2: into this like cult of personality of a person who
30:33
Speaker 2: can then you know, and then you can justify whatever
30:35
Speaker 2: it is you want to do, whether it's complete, you know,
30:38
Speaker 2: graph for your your family, or you know, whether it's
30:41
Speaker 2: a giant tax cut and deregulation for the tech oligarchs,
30:44
Speaker 2: or whether it's doing tariffs in a way that is
30:46
Speaker 2: so insane that it just completely discredits the entire program
30:49
Speaker 2: of tariff's right.
30:50
Speaker 7: Yeah, And in this media environment, I think it actually
30:52
Speaker 7: is hard for political movements not to get subliminated to personality.
30:57
Speaker 7: Just that's the way that we've mediated our powers exported
31:01
Speaker 7: them onto algorithmic platforms. It's really really hard to avoid
31:04
Speaker 7: that happening. I don't know what that would look like
31:07
Speaker 7: from the DSA, but well, Zauren is.
31:08
Speaker 2: Kind of an interesting example because it certainly his personal
31:12
Speaker 2: charisma is like off the charts and extremely extremely, extremely talented,
31:18
Speaker 2: but also has immediately used that personal political capital to
31:23
Speaker 2: build out his movement. He is a DSA guy. Like
31:27
Speaker 2: that was when he was getting one percent in the polls,
31:30
Speaker 2: he was a DSA guy, and the idea was, We're
31:32
Speaker 2: going to do this totally long shot, insane thing just
31:35
Speaker 2: to push forward the movement and the ideas and the ideology.
31:39
Speaker 2: And so he immediately turns around and takes some big
31:41
Speaker 2: political risks that right now are paying off for him,
31:45
Speaker 2: that are in the direction of it can't just be me.
31:49
Speaker 2: There has to be this broader movement. And you know,
31:53
Speaker 2: it actually dovetails with the conversation that we're having with
31:57
Speaker 2: Michael lang about how he was able to transfer his
32:00
Speaker 2: coalition to other candidates in a way that Barack Obama
32:05
Speaker 2: isn't able to do, in a way that Trump is not.
32:06
Speaker 7: Able to exactly. That's a good point.
32:08
Speaker 2: So that makes it you know, you can tell that
32:11
Speaker 2: it's different because of the nature of that where people say, okay, well,
32:14
Speaker 2: these people are on board with Zoron's program, and so
32:18
Speaker 2: he has made it, even though he is very important
32:21
Speaker 2: as a leader, he has also made it much more
32:24
Speaker 2: about how do we build this movement in New York
32:27
Speaker 2: City to start with, but across the country.
32:29
Speaker 7: He really proves the AOC the infamous or famous really
32:33
Speaker 7: AOC quote where she said, in a European system, Nancy
32:36
Speaker 7: Pelosi and I would not be in the same political
32:38
Speaker 7: party and totally true. And actually we're seeing that in
32:40
Speaker 7: the UK right now, the rise of the Greens, the
32:42
Speaker 7: rise of Reform, totally undermining the institutional power of the
32:46
Speaker 7: two major parties there, and they have a totally different
32:49
Speaker 7: system of course as well. But what's interesting about that
32:52
Speaker 7: is it's about the coalition too. So Zora mom Donnie
32:55
Speaker 7: brings in a coalition that is not just the Democratic
32:58
Speaker 7: Party coalition. Trump does thing similar. He brought in a
33:01
Speaker 7: lot of Obama voters in the Rust Belt, and that
33:04
Speaker 7: doesn't translate to any other Republican so far. So the
33:07
Speaker 7: Zoron experiment then is to go to places like Colorado,
33:10
Speaker 7: California and take that same coalition and build it up
33:13
Speaker 7: around him a lot Kiros or someone else. And if
33:16
Speaker 7: that's successful, that is a total transformation and a takeover
33:20
Speaker 7: of the Democratic Party in a way that if Trump
33:23
Speaker 7: has gone, we still don't know what happens to the
33:25
Speaker 7: Republican coalition. The proof so far is that it doesn't
33:29
Speaker 7: remain the Trump coalition. Where in the Rio Grande Valley
33:32
Speaker 7: you're having Hispanic men vote in big numbers for Donald Trump,
33:36
Speaker 7: that doesn't seem to be translating to literally anybody else.
33:39
Speaker 2: Yeah, my last question for you is Tucker in the
33:41
Speaker 2: same in the same moment when he said that thing
33:45
Speaker 2: about like I'm out, I'm done with the Republican Party.
33:48
Speaker 2: He then was like, yeah, but I like jd Vance.
33:50
Speaker 2: You know, we remained and I think they talk. I
33:52
Speaker 2: think they're friendly. He remained open to supporting JD.
33:56
Speaker 4: Vance.
33:57
Speaker 2: So I also wonder how serious he is about like
33:59
Speaker 2: on with the Republican Party, or you know, whether ultimately
34:03
Speaker 2: is like does this calculation is like yeah, but I
34:05
Speaker 2: really hate the Democrats, so I got to stick with
34:07
Speaker 2: the Republicans.
34:08
Speaker 7: I have to say I'm not often surprised by Tucker.
34:10
Speaker 7: I was surprised to see.
34:11
Speaker 4: Him talking about party third party.
34:13
Speaker 7: Yeah, because he's pessimistic, and I think reasonably pessimistic, and
34:18
Speaker 7: that you know, the third party talk is naive generally,
34:21
Speaker 7: and you heard Marjorie Taylor Green try to frame it as,
34:24
Speaker 7: you know, consciously kind of naive, right, Like, we're aware
34:28
Speaker 7: this is really difficult, and that's what lends me to
34:30
Speaker 7: the position, or brings me to the position that they're
34:33
Speaker 7: trying to really just influence the Republican Party. It's true
34:36
Speaker 7: there are a lot of independent, dependent voters up for grabs,
34:38
Speaker 7: and yes, that's on the table right now. That was
34:41
Speaker 7: true during the Tea Party era as well. But I
34:44
Speaker 7: just think it's I don't know. I was surprised to
34:47
Speaker 7: see that. I don't think he has any interest in
34:49
Speaker 7: running for anything. I think there are a lot of
34:50
Speaker 7: people who are chirping in his ear about running for things.
34:53
Speaker 7: I don't think he's interested in that at all. I
34:55
Speaker 7: think he's like less interested in politics, and so the
34:58
Speaker 7: idea that he would be working on a third party
34:59
Speaker 7: was genuinely surprising to me. I don't know what's going
35:02
Speaker 7: to happen with this. I'm sure Margery Taillergreen is in
35:04
Speaker 7: talks with people that might be something we should ask
35:06
Speaker 7: Row to see if she's brought it up to him,
35:09
Speaker 7: or if Massie's brought it up to him, because Massie's
35:11
Speaker 7: going to be out of a job in a few months.
35:13
Speaker 7: So we'll see what they're actually working on. But I
35:17
Speaker 7: think our audience is as skeptical as we are that
35:20
Speaker 7: something significant would come of this.
35:22
Speaker 4: We will see.
35:23
Speaker 2: All right, let's talk about our declining empire here and
35:26
Speaker 2: the health struggles of several of our representatives.
35:32
Speaker 7: New reporting about the state of Mitch McConnell's health. Lest
35:35
Speaker 7: do you think mister McConnell, Oh, he's no longer Senate
35:38
Speaker 7: Majority leader, he's no longer important. He actually is. He's
35:41
Speaker 7: appointed himself to be on ahead of big committees. But
35:45
Speaker 7: new reporting he was we can put this up on
35:47
Speaker 7: the screen found quote unconscious and may have suffered a
35:50
Speaker 7: heart attack at his DC residents before being rushed to
35:53
Speaker 7: a local hospital last month, according to a district Fire
35:56
Speaker 7: and EMS dispatch call made public Wednesday. Post reports the
36:01
Speaker 7: June fourteenth called reference medical personnel in an ALS or
36:04
Speaker 7: advanced life support ambulance being sent to the home shortly
36:07
Speaker 7: before nine am, and mentioned there was quote CPR in
36:11
Speaker 7: progress for a cardiac arrest. Now, to be clear, right
36:17
Speaker 7: now we don't have a comment from Mitch McConnell, who
36:20
Speaker 7: is the sitting US Senator for the state of Kentucky.
36:24
Speaker 7: He does helm important congressional committees. He's put himself in
36:28
Speaker 7: that position very intentionally, and we basically have no idea
36:32
Speaker 7: what is going on with his health. It actually reminded
36:35
Speaker 7: us of this report we did here exclusively at breaking
36:37
Speaker 7: Points not long ago. But this next element up on
36:40
Speaker 7: the screen. Ryan and I reported back in December that
36:45
Speaker 7: we got a picture from Reagan Airport, Reagan National Airport
36:49
Speaker 7: not long after the election, and Mitch McConnell was being
36:53
Speaker 7: pushed around in a wheelchair by his staffer. Basically, this
36:57
Speaker 7: was not getting reported on by anybody in the press.
36:59
Speaker 7: People and the press had seen this happening and had
37:02
Speaker 7: not reported on it was our understanding at the time. Again,
37:06
Speaker 7: not a huge bombshell exactly. It's obvious that Mitch McConnell
37:10
Speaker 7: is enfeebled, to say the very least. He struggled to
37:13
Speaker 7: even make it through multiple press conferences. He stumbled physically
37:17
Speaker 7: literally in public. But just come on, the people of
37:20
Speaker 7: Kentucky deserve better. No question about it. He is clinging
37:23
Speaker 7: to his power to wield it against the ascendant Trump movement,
37:27
Speaker 7: but particularly against anti interventionalist strains in the Republican Party.
37:33
Speaker 7: He's deeply concerned about them, and you can bet he's
37:36
Speaker 7: staying in the Senate to tamp them down. That's basically
37:39
Speaker 7: everybody's understanding on Capitol Hill. He's come out and said
37:42
Speaker 7: as much multiple times. Now it gets weirder because Republican
37:47
Speaker 7: Tom Kean announced, do you all remember the mystery that
37:52
Speaker 7: was happening with Tom Keen, this congressman, Republican congressman who
37:55
Speaker 7: was just nowhere. He just disappeared, and his office was
37:58
Speaker 7: giving totally cryptic responses about where he was. They were
38:02
Speaker 7: saying things like, well, there are no cameras where Tom is. Again. Insane,
38:06
Speaker 7: completely insane. Well, he announced in a floor speech yesterday
38:10
Speaker 7: that he was gone for months because of depression treatment.
38:13
Speaker 7: Let's roll the clip.
38:15
Speaker 12: Several months ago, due to health concerns, I entered the
38:18
Speaker 12: hospital for some testing. I did not believe that this
38:22
Speaker 12: would result in a long term stay. I was given
38:25
Speaker 12: the diagnosis of depression. Now, when people hear the word depression,
38:30
Speaker 12: many people think simply means feeling sad. But depression is
38:35
Speaker 12: so much more than that. It is physical, it is emotional.
38:41
Speaker 12: Until you experience it yourself, is difficult to fully understand
38:45
Speaker 12: how powerful this illness can be. The doctors recommended that
38:51
Speaker 12: I remain in the hospital to address my illness. They
38:54
Speaker 12: explained to me that this would be the fastest way
38:57
Speaker 12: to recovery, and, to be honest, hesitant, I didn't think
39:01
Speaker 12: that I had time for it. I had responsibility to
39:04
Speaker 12: my family, I had responsibilities to my constituents, I had
39:09
Speaker 12: responsibilities to this institution, and like many people, I believed
39:14
Speaker 12: that I could simply push through. But I agreed to
39:18
Speaker 12: follow my doctor's recommendations, again not believing that would result
39:24
Speaker 12: in a long term stay.
39:26
Speaker 7: This guy was going for one hundred and sixteen days
39:29
Speaker 7: and again with no transparency, with his staff giving ridiculous excuses,
39:33
Speaker 7: cryptic excuses, and Chrystal, you pointed out this lever News article.
39:38
Speaker 7: We can pop it up on the screen. It's headline
39:40
Speaker 7: sick leave for me, not for the and criticize as
39:43
Speaker 7: Keen for quote taking a taxpayer funded four month absence
39:46
Speaker 7: from Congress to treat clinical depression, despite repeatedly voting against
39:50
Speaker 7: paid sacredly for workers while serving as a state senator
39:54
Speaker 7: in New Jersey. So again, he's in Congress now. But
39:57
Speaker 7: this is when in twenty eighteen, a New Jersey law
39:59
Speaker 7: requiring employer to provide up to forty hours of paid
40:01
Speaker 7: time off for workers dealing with an illness or medical
40:03
Speaker 7: condition came up and he was opposed to it. So
40:08
Speaker 7: just a wonderful insight into our our mighty dignified elected
40:14
Speaker 7: officials here in Washington, DC, who insist on clinging to
40:16
Speaker 7: their power even though they clearly I mean, listen, I
40:19
Speaker 7: think he is totally correct about the severity of depression,
40:22
Speaker 7: physical consequences of something that looks like a purely psychological condition.
40:27
Speaker 7: But he's totally right about that it's real. Then get
40:29
Speaker 7: the hell out of Congress. Yeah, the hell out of Congress.
40:32
Speaker 2: He won his primary while he was apparently being hospitalized
40:37
Speaker 2: for depression, and by the way, to your point about
40:39
Speaker 2: his candor, he's still not being candid because the story
40:41
Speaker 2: doesn't make any sense. You don't show up for TESS
40:43
Speaker 2: and then they admit you four months for depression. Typically
40:47
Speaker 2: you're admitted for you are hospitalized for depression if you
40:50
Speaker 2: are danger to yourself for others. So it seems to me,
40:53
Speaker 2: you know, he was either suicidal, there was something else
40:55
Speaker 2: going on here that he's still not being candid about.
40:58
Speaker 2: And so look, it's it's a sign of you know,
41:02
Speaker 2: the declining empire. With him, it's not an age thing,
41:05
Speaker 2: but with McConnell certainly is. It's also a sign of
41:08
Speaker 2: democracy failure, like how is this guy getting re elected
41:12
Speaker 2: at a time when we don't even know when he's
41:15
Speaker 2: like just vanished and we don't know where he is
41:18
Speaker 2: or what he's doing or why he's gone or anything.
41:21
Speaker 2: And he still gets the nod for the Republican Party
41:24
Speaker 2: to go on and continue in Congress. It also shows
41:27
Speaker 2: you how little most of these people do.
41:30
Speaker 4: I mean, you know, did his constituents.
41:32
Speaker 2: Or the nation suffer because he wasn't there doing his
41:35
Speaker 2: job for four months? No no one noticed other than
41:38
Speaker 2: you know, to be like, well, that's weird that he's
41:41
Speaker 2: gone and isn't taking any of these votes. So, you know,
41:44
Speaker 2: some members are more consequential than others. The ones who
41:47
Speaker 2: just sort of check the boxes and do whatever the
41:50
Speaker 2: party leader tells him to do on the votes, they
41:52
Speaker 2: basically don't matter at all.
41:54
Speaker 4: It's their staff they're.
41:55
Speaker 2: Running the offices and doing anything that's like useful or
41:58
Speaker 2: consequential whatsoever. One person who was really not impressed with
42:02
Speaker 2: what Tom King had to say is Lauren Bobert, who
42:05
Speaker 2: really pulled no punches in her response. You know, a
42:07
Speaker 2: fellow Republican in her response to his announcement that he
42:09
Speaker 2: was out for four months with depression.
42:12
Speaker 4: Let's take a listen.
42:13
Speaker 11: I don't even think he used the word severe. He
42:15
Speaker 11: just said he was diagnosed with depression. I for one,
42:17
Speaker 11: have been marked safe from depression today.
42:20
Speaker 7: And what do you mean by that?
42:22
Speaker 13: What does that mean? I'm here, you haven't seen those memes?
42:25
Speaker 13: Come on now? Younger than me? I guess it's a
42:29
Speaker 13: Facebook thing. Huh faical?
42:31
Speaker 14: Okay, So what's your take on it?
42:34
Speaker 13: I think it's embarrassing still even more so.
42:37
Speaker 11: I mean, sure, like take care of yourself, get healthy,
42:41
Speaker 11: But who gets to take four months off of work
42:43
Speaker 11: because they're sad?
42:45
Speaker 7: Like that?
42:45
Speaker 14: That's not might not be sad. I mean it's it's impressed.
42:49
Speaker 13: He's depressed.
42:50
Speaker 11: He's sad, and I okay, whatever the reasons may be,
42:54
Speaker 11: it's embarrassing.
42:54
Speaker 13: I don't care what party you're a part of. It's
42:56
Speaker 13: not okay.
42:57
Speaker 11: I mean I think there's a dose of depression and
43:00
Speaker 11: that comes with these pins that were given. And so
43:02
Speaker 11: I mean if you can't build up a tolerance to it,
43:05
Speaker 11: then maybe don't be here.
43:07
Speaker 14: Yeah, but it's if his doctor saying, hey, it's safe,
43:11
Speaker 14: it's not safe for you to go to work. I
43:13
Speaker 14: mean doesn't that come before this job?
43:17
Speaker 13: Did his doctor say that? I heard his doctor say
43:19
Speaker 13: that it is safe for him to return to work.
43:22
Speaker 14: Yeah, I mean I assumed if he was there for
43:24
Speaker 14: that long, he was there under doctor's orders.
43:26
Speaker 11: Maybe he should have been institutionalized, like if it was
43:29
Speaker 11: if it were that bad, I mean, I don't know,
43:32
Speaker 11: Like I it's embarrassing. Do you think he should not
43:34
Speaker 11: just sit here and just dunk on Tom Keen or Kane?
43:37
Speaker 13: I think the speaker pronounced it Kane.
43:39
Speaker 7: I don't know.
43:40
Speaker 13: I'm not going to sit here and just dunk on
43:41
Speaker 13: him and his in his issue.
43:43
Speaker 11: I do think it is an absolute disrespect to his
43:47
Speaker 11: voters that he has not shown up and had a
43:49
Speaker 11: reason like that. If you're depressed, okay, come in the
43:52
Speaker 11: back door, put your card in, vote and leave. Like
43:56
Speaker 11: you don't have to talk to anybody. You can keep
43:58
Speaker 11: your head down low and vote and go home.
44:02
Speaker 2: I like that m part too, where she's basically like,
44:04
Speaker 2: we don't really do that much like you could just
44:06
Speaker 2: come and vote and leave. It will take you ten seconds,
44:09
Speaker 2: just dip the card and just dip the card in,
44:10
Speaker 2: do your thing and go and your staff will handle
44:12
Speaker 2: everything else, because they probably do that all the time anyway.
44:14
Speaker 7: By the way, this is why these ideas about remote
44:16
Speaker 7: voting for Congress are so stupid, because you could have
44:19
Speaker 7: somebody literally lying about where they are or not saying
44:22
Speaker 7: where they are. They're in clinical depression treatment, maybe because
44:26
Speaker 7: they are suicidal, and they're voting because their staff members
44:30
Speaker 7: are just keeping up the act for them and like
44:32
Speaker 7: finding ways to just vote whether they're there or not.
44:36
Speaker 7: So I think this is a good lesson as Congress
44:38
Speaker 7: moves closer and closer to that, there's a big push
44:40
Speaker 7: for that right now. By the way, worth noting also,
44:43
Speaker 7: just as I was saying, Mitch McConnell is trying to
44:45
Speaker 7: retain his power. He is at the top of the
44:48
Speaker 7: Rules Committee. Wow, he is in charge of the Senate
44:52
Speaker 7: Appropriation Committee Subcommittee for Defense, the sub Committee for Defense.
44:57
Speaker 7: Right now. He said it himself in an interview with
44:59
Speaker 7: the Financial Times that's where the real money is, and
45:02
Speaker 7: he's really referencing Ukraine, but also probably Israel as well.
45:05
Speaker 7: So here he is clinging to power despite and not
45:09
Speaker 7: being transparent about it. Again, that's another part of this.
45:11
Speaker 7: His office hasn't said if any of this happened. This
45:14
Speaker 7: is the New York Post gleaning it from and I
45:16
Speaker 7: think Punchable got it from medical report from EMS records
45:20
Speaker 7: released in Washington, DC because people suspected something was going on.
45:24
Speaker 2: I mean, he's fallen on camera multiple times, broke his
45:27
Speaker 2: ribs right, had a concussion because of a fall, froze
45:30
Speaker 2: on camera multiple times, and now at this time, that's
45:33
Speaker 2: years ago that that happened, and this man is still
45:36
Speaker 2: serving as a United States Senator and then on the
45:38
Speaker 2: top keen point. I think Lauren Bobert when she's like,
45:43
Speaker 2: who gets to take four months off from their job?
45:45
Speaker 2: I think that's exactly the question that many Americans are
45:48
Speaker 2: going to be asking themselves, especially since he's.
45:50
Speaker 4: A hypocrite on the issue.
45:51
Speaker 2: It'd be one thing if he's a champion of universal
45:53
Speaker 2: healthcare and mental health wellness and paid time up, but
45:57
Speaker 2: he is none of those things.
45:59
Speaker 9: He is the.
45:59
Speaker 2: Opposite of that, and so it's it is hard for
46:02
Speaker 2: me to think of any other job where you could
46:05
Speaker 2: just casually disappear.
46:07
Speaker 7: Well, Sager does it.
46:08
Speaker 4: For four months outside of soccer.
46:11
Speaker 2: I mean, I guess if you're yeah, if you own
46:12
Speaker 2: the business, I guess you get to do.
46:13
Speaker 4: What you want. But we don't know where Soger is.
46:15
Speaker 7: He could be better.
46:16
Speaker 4: Many there are no cameras where Saga is.
46:18
Speaker 7: Emily, That's actually probably true. We do know where Saga
46:23
Speaker 7: is to an extent. I could probably guess.
46:28
Speaker 2: I love your consistent like desire to dunk on Sager
46:31
Speaker 2: when he's not here. I mean, it's the only one
46:33
Speaker 2: of the best things about you.
46:35
Speaker 7: I've known Sager for long enough that I get I
46:38
Speaker 7: get a pass. Oh yeah, I've known him since he
46:42
Speaker 7: was a different Saga, A younger, more naive Saga.
46:46
Speaker 2: Okay vice versa less jaded, hardened by the world. In
46:51
Speaker 2: any case, I think most people be looking in this
46:53
Speaker 2: and be like, if I took four months off, I
46:55
Speaker 2: would be fired.
46:55
Speaker 4: That's the way that would work.
46:58
Speaker 2: And then I'd be more depressed, you know, I would
47:01
Speaker 2: be more to brass than Mike Johns.
47:03
Speaker 4: This isn't the job for you. There are other jobs
47:06
Speaker 4: go do.
47:06
Speaker 2: Like you're longing, miserable and you are not doing the job,
47:09
Speaker 2: so go do something else. It's I don't know. The
47:13
Speaker 2: whole thing is just too wild.
47:16
Speaker 7: Mike Johnson has like tepidly criticized him.
47:18
Speaker 4: Oh diddy, ye oh yeah.
47:19
Speaker 7: He was like, well, I would have been more transparent
47:21
Speaker 7: about it, and it's like all right, so we can
47:22
Speaker 7: all come together and tepidly criticize it, and it just
47:25
Speaker 7: keeps happening. This, the former set up majority leader is
47:28
Speaker 7: doing it right now, and is anybody, yeah, trying to
47:31
Speaker 7: push him.
47:32
Speaker 2: Out, but and I do, really I want to come
47:33
Speaker 2: back to the point about it says something about our
47:36
Speaker 2: system that this can happen and there's no political electoral consequences.
47:42
Speaker 7: Kane might lose his seat, is it a close Yeah,
47:45
Speaker 7: This Republicans are partially I bet it's partially why Johnson
47:47
Speaker 7: feels comfortable criticizing him because I think it was one
47:50
Speaker 7: of those things where people didn't know if he was
47:51
Speaker 7: going to come back in time for the primary to
47:53
Speaker 7: be okay, So it was hard to like feeld a
47:55
Speaker 7: replacement because people didn't know if he was going to
47:57
Speaker 7: step back in or whatever, and uh, this time around
48:00
Speaker 7: it's a swing district, so he might actually lose the
48:03
Speaker 7: seat for Republicans obviously, when they're clinging to every single
48:05
Speaker 7: seat they possibly can.
48:07
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I'm just thinking of like Diane Feinstein, you know,
48:10
Speaker 2: where there was a progressive challenge to her and it
48:12
Speaker 2: was beat back by Obama and Nancy Pelosi. And you know,
48:16
Speaker 2: they don't have to do town halls. They don't have
48:19
Speaker 2: they like, it's much easier now than ever, I think,
48:22
Speaker 2: even as cameras are everywhere for them to hide their
48:26
Speaker 2: true condition from the public, and so it you know,
48:30
Speaker 2: falls to people like Ken Clippenstein to be like a
48:32
Speaker 2: total asshole and be like, why is there's a college
48:34
Speaker 2: shaking like that? You know, because people deserve to know
48:37
Speaker 2: because so much has.
48:38
Speaker 4: Been hidden in the past.
48:39
Speaker 7: So yeah, you know, I think that shout.
48:41
Speaker 2: Out to Ken for being the asshole for the people,
48:44
Speaker 2: an asshole for the people.
48:46
Speaker 7: If Ken runs, that's his slogan.
48:50
Speaker 4: For the people.
48:51
Speaker 2: I mean that was kind of the central problems of Trump, right, Yes, yes,
48:54
Speaker 2: that's being an asshole for his own sake.
48:58
Speaker 7: But Chris, like you have just brought the sh so
49:00
Speaker 7: full circle in such a beautiful, poetic way. I was
49:03
Speaker 7: very well done.
49:04
Speaker 4: Glad you enjoyed that.
49:04
Speaker 7: Oh that's perfect. It's been such a pleasure to be
49:07
Speaker 7: here this week. And we have a Friday show. Some
49:10
Speaker 7: people might be taking the Friday before the two fiftieth
49:13
Speaker 7: off us.
49:14
Speaker 4: Not us.
49:15
Speaker 2: We have to cover all of all of the news
49:17
Speaker 2: for the patriots that people need to know. We will
49:19
Speaker 2: be there and Emily doing every single show this week.
49:23
Speaker 4: So thank you, my friend.
49:24
Speaker 7: I'm going to steal the iheartradiotrophy and it's it's off
49:28
Speaker 7: camera right now. I'm gonna steal it. I'm you know,
49:30
Speaker 7: put it behind me.
49:31
Speaker 2: You deserve it. And only are you doing that, you're
49:33
Speaker 2: doing your own show too. Like hardest working women in
49:36
Speaker 2: show business here.
49:37
Speaker 7: You gotta do what you gotta do. You know, you
49:38
Speaker 7: can't be caning, you can't be doing, you can't be
49:40
Speaker 7: pulling to Tom Kane.
49:41
Speaker 4: There are all looking. There are always cameras where Emily is.
49:46
Speaker 7: Honestly, it's true about all of us shout up to flock.
49:49
Speaker 7: We're always all on camera. I bet they've got some
49:51
Speaker 7: footage of Tom game that.
49:52
Speaker 2: We shout out to Palenteer. There are always cameras where
49:55
Speaker 2: all of us are.
49:55
Speaker 7: Oh goodness.
49:57
Speaker 4: Anyway, thank you guys for watching.
49:59
Speaker 2: Sign up for the new letter, breakingboards dot com, Driving
50:02
Speaker 2: trouble support at supercast dot com, and we'll see you tomorrow.
50:05
Speaker 15: It should be a good one.
50:08
Speaker 7: H