Latest / The Christian Reeve Podcast / David Maloney | The Christian Reeve Podcast | #113 |

Transcript

David Maloney | The Christian Reeve Podcast | #113 | · The Christian Reeve Podcast

0:02
Hello and welcome to another episode of the Christian.
0:05
We've podcast. Today's guest is a games
0:08
developer, hailing, all the way from New York in the u.s.a., his
0:11
name is David Maloney. Welcome to the show David, how
0:13
you doing? Thank you.
0:15
I'm doing well. And how are you doing today?
0:18
Not bad. It's been a bit crazy today.
0:21
We've been having trouble with, I don't normally talk about
0:24
personal things in the podcast, but I just had to say this
0:27
because it's just ridiculous. So, we're having a bit of a
0:30
battle at the moment with my landlord Over the heating, which
0:33
happens everyone. And it literally like, we're so
0:37
cold and we've said to this person was so cold and they're
0:41
just like, for whatever reason telling us that, you know, this
0:48
is how it is. And but basically we're not,
0:51
we're not getting exactly what we want right now.
0:53
And just before I came here, it was just me and my housemate
0:56
next to the oven. Because it's so cold.
1:07
It is what it is. It is what it is.
1:08
But yeah, other than others terrible.
1:12
That's all right. I've been in worse situations.
1:15
It's part of what makes what makes life funny and
1:18
interesting. And you get all these different
1:20
stories. Don't you know?
1:22
Definitely, yeah. Let's let's jump straight into
1:27
the main thing. I want to talk about to you with
1:29
you today is obviously your games developer.
1:33
Before we get into, you know, the main game that you're that
1:36
you've released. I just want to sort of
1:38
understand a bit about your journey, sort of becoming a
1:41
games developer. So, where did that begin and to
1:45
talk us through. Fuck that, where that began up
1:47
to your where you are now? Okay, that's a good question.
1:53
Um, I would say it started about a year ago.
1:56
Now I've always been a fan of video games in.
2:03
Condo with a pandemic, end up having a little bit more free
2:07
time than usual. And actually, I'm a father of
2:12
two children and I'm married. I have a wife, so with all of us
2:16
being home, it was actually my song that kind of got into it
2:20
with school learning how to code and oh wow things of that
2:25
nature. Yeah.
2:26
And so he asked, you know, if we could create her own video game
2:33
And so I said let's give it a try.
2:36
Wow that's such a wholesome reason to get into gay strip and
2:41
I really think that okay well, so this is interesting.
2:45
I kind of assumed, I guess. Based on the research I did
2:48
that, you've been a games Developers for some time but you
2:50
know, hey, you get into it whenever you get into it, you
2:53
know it is what it is, but So what's your line of work outside
3:00
of this? Are you now like a full-time
3:02
games developer or you sort of doing both same time and looking
3:07
to get into full-time games development?
3:09
Like what's the situation there? Yes, that's kind of a.
3:13
So in on the outside my full-time job, I'm in the Auto
3:17
industry. Cool.
3:19
Cool. And thank you.
3:21
Yeah. I do team leader work, they're
3:24
kind of like the logistics and of keeping track of things and
3:27
running it to you. And I have some experience with
3:32
like, I've done tech support jobs and things of that nature.
3:35
So it's always kind of been in my wheelhouse and then, as far
3:39
as Just growing up on video games with my friends, we've
3:44
always been huge Gamers and then with with my family, my son's
3:49
getting into it. So we decided to start our first
3:52
project Trevor sale and we kind of went through created that on
3:59
mostly using like a software called RPG Maker, okay?
4:04
And it's really interesting for anyone that wants to get into it
4:08
on it kind of Takes a lot of the hard work out of it, and it's a
4:14
lot more plug-and-play, there is a bit of sequencing and coding
4:18
and stuff on the back end, but honestly, a bunch of YouTube
4:22
tutorials. And just a lot of ours said, you
4:25
know, kind of trial and error that got us into it.
4:29
It's amazing how the world has changed to this point where you
4:32
know, pretty much anything you want to learn how to do
4:35
obviously, there are exceptions but for the most part there's so
4:37
many things that you can actually just go onto YouTube
4:40
that Be a video or a series of videos or courses or whatever
4:44
and you can, you know, pretty much to start straight away.
4:47
Getting into that field and learning all about it.
4:49
It's incredible. Definitely, it's a, it's a huge
4:53
tool and it's, yeah, for anything, I mean, if you want to
4:56
learn to, you know, do a home project like how to hang a
5:00
picture frame, you can, you know, pretty much YouTube and
5:04
yeah. So so we did a lot of that.
5:06
And the first game again, We didn't really know what's too
5:11
much about marketing or running a company or publishing.
5:15
So I got with each tie. Oh, that's, that's what we ended
5:20
up. Releasing our game on, and
5:22
they're super receptive for Indie, Gamers and then, from
5:27
there, I actually, like I said, my friends, we've always been
5:30
into gaming. So my friend, Cory Walsh him and
5:33
I partnered up on her second project, called mystery of block
5:38
of a' and we actually did release that as well.
5:41
It's gotten some really cool feedback, some reviews, and we
5:47
actually had a couple of streamers player games with some
5:51
critiques. Yeah, so interesting.
5:53
Okay, so it's positive but, you know, it's kind of all the
6:01
unexpected sometimes. Nice.
6:04
Good feedback is good feedback in my back and I've had some
6:08
some feedback on the podcast which I I've been very vocal
6:11
about for but, you know, he even no matter how it comes to you,
6:18
good or bad, it's always useful and something that you can use
6:21
to kind of run with and move forward with.
6:23
But I suppose that, you know, when it, when it comes to games,
6:26
I mean, who knows, better than Gamers right?
6:28
You know, it's, you're playing and everything and often, you
6:32
know, when it comes to games testers, especially, you know,
6:36
you're looking for things more to do with the The gameplay
6:41
itself as opposed to, you know, story and everything like that.
6:44
So are there any major bugs? Is there anything that's really
6:47
exploitable that crashes, the game easily, you know, so on
6:50
because of course, yeah, so great grammar has been the
6:55
biggest thing that ever been critiqued us an interesting last
7:01
poses feathers and rightfully, so, you know, it's all I've
7:06
never claimed to be an English major, you know, so any feedback
7:10
I'm like that's cool. And yeah, I mean The Gaming
7:14
Community is very, very flexible and they'll tell you if
7:17
something's wrong. And also so we've been patching
7:21
on updates and fixes as we go along there.
7:26
But yeah, I mean, it's it's cool.
7:28
So I would eventually like to transition into a full-time
7:33
career doing gaming, but I think that's not quite there yet.
7:38
But we got, we got a few projects in the works.
7:40
Just how far off the think you are realistically.
7:45
Hopefully. Hopefully another year or so.
7:49
Okay. We're at night are so yeah,
7:53
we're still on the marketing aspect, which on, you know, it's
7:59
been going very well. I know with the pandemic it's
8:01
harder to like get out there as far as putting up Fliers and
8:06
like I wanted to connect with some of the local community
8:09
colleges but there's a lot of covid regulations which is
8:13
rightfully. So you know I don't want to be
8:15
the responsible for getting anyone.
8:17
They occur in trouble or there's a lot of liability behind you
8:22
know, doing some of the promotional aspects.
8:25
That's understandable. Obviously, you mentioned that
8:28
your game is on Traders. Taylor was on each I/O, which I
8:32
know for those who are unaware. It's basically, as you mentioned
8:35
for indie game, as a sort of Indie gaming platform, where you
8:40
can basically download the games for free, I believe I do again,
8:45
I'm not an expert in this, but I know.
8:46
Yeah. That I have a friend who's been
8:49
on the podcast. Shout out to trial by fire.
8:51
And he, regularly releases games on the platform.
8:56
And, you know, you, I mean what you mentioned before you get
8:59
rated on these games, you get people leaving feedback
9:03
comments. People even videos as you
9:05
mentioned, like, people streaming and using your content
9:07
and so on. But we as you're moving into
9:11
trying to maybe make this into a career like What steps have you
9:16
taken to try to expose monetize their stuff?
9:19
Like a, you looking for sponsors, are you looking to
9:21
maybe make paid games as well? I was, where's your head out
9:25
with guys to that? Of course.
9:28
Yeah, I know it's that I owe all over against are free but we do
9:33
have the option for donations and that and that's been really
9:38
helpful. I think given the option to
9:43
donate as Opposed to putting like a monetized price.
9:46
I think that's been really cool because I know not everyone, you
9:50
know, has extra money available so sure.
9:54
You know it's kind of gives you a chance to play the game and if
9:58
you like it you know feel free to donate.
10:01
We are looking into doing a Kickstarter campaign and a few
10:06
options along that way as well as when we do kind of like a
10:11
finalized version of the game, we're going to launch on.
10:14
Mm-hmm. And what, we'll probably put a
10:16
price to it only because steam, I think it says a way to like
10:21
filter out on people who aren't necessarily as serious about
10:26
their games, they do have like, a publishing fee on and it's not
10:32
like a crazy amount of money. I think it's like $100 or
10:35
something, but it's good to try and make some of that back and
10:40
and done some, you know, it's is that per game.
10:45
Yes, that's pretty good. Yeah.
10:47
So yeah you definitely need to. Yeah yeah.
10:51
I mean from what I've seen on Steam, the games are never more
10:55
than much than what I get. It depends on what the game is.
10:59
If it's an indie game versus if it's a major title but yeah it
11:02
ranges anywhere from like safe 225 pounds all the way up to 40
11:06
pounds if it's a major game and so on.
11:08
But I like your ethos about how you know especially I like the
11:13
donations kind So idea in the sense that people can kind of
11:16
freely donate what they feel the game is worth or what they want
11:22
to contribute or whatever they have at the time and so on.
11:25
Yeah, that's one thing I like about patreon.
11:29
Especially I have a patreon as well and it's after find it on
11:33
there. It's like it's cool because it's
11:35
like, people can like I said, donate whatever they want.
11:41
But you know, sometimes people just want to, you know?
11:44
Show that they appreciate you and everything that you do and
11:47
it's a good way. Like when people become fans of
11:50
what you're doing, like one thing I think is interesting
11:53
about what you've told us so far is that this is a project with
11:56
you and your son and I think that how old is your son if you
12:00
don't mind me asking. So he just turned ten actually.
12:05
Yeah, on the fist. I yeah, we had a great time
12:10
doing this and my daughter helped out as well she's
12:12
summoned. So She's a little bit younger
12:15
but she was our first beta tester, as well as the couple of
12:19
my buddies. You know, it's crazy out
12:21
previously kids get into, it's a gaming.
12:23
But from such a young age, I mean, I have four siblings and
12:27
all of them, I would say started playing games from as early as
12:30
34 years old, which blow ya mind, you know, I mean, I don't
12:35
picked up a games console and least until I was seven or eight
12:39
years old. Like, yeah.
12:42
Amy here are being a back in the day.
12:44
Station or a Nintendo whatever you know it's like well but yeah
12:50
have you had any our favorite games growing up or even now
12:55
sure? Yeah, I mean and pretty much any
12:57
game made by Rockstar like, you know, Don was a good one Skyrim.
13:03
Prescribing is probably my favorite game of all time.
13:06
I think I just love definitely that whole RPG kind of Any kind
13:14
of RPG? I love Pokemon.
13:15
I'm a big fan of the Pokemon games.
13:17
The original ones. I don't do gaming as much these
13:20
days just because I just can't afford to, but no, no, yeah, no
13:25
II. See like everyone with knives
13:28
and I'm like, at the same time, you know, it's you know how it
13:34
is, you get older. You don't always necessarily
13:36
have the time for these things either, as well.
13:37
So that's a thing, you have to consider.
13:39
But one thing I wanted to just to comment on his offer You got
13:43
that this sort of partnership thing with your son and your
13:47
daughter. And I think that's really cool
13:48
that maybe that's something that you could work on in the future,
13:51
you know? Who knows?
13:52
Maybe you could stream games together in the future,
13:55
although, every farm and see there's yeah, because it's
13:58
different aspects to it, isn't it?
14:00
There's the spending quality time with your kids, you know,
14:03
bonding time, of course. And then there's working on
14:05
stuff together. And then there's also the appeal
14:07
of, I'm sure. Because I haven't seen that many
14:09
times that people streaming family, streaming live I've seen
14:13
it a few times but not like with gaming and I think that'd be
14:16
pretty interesting. So maybe there's an idea for you
14:18
definitely. Yeah, I'd almost on here.
14:21
Are he wants to be a YouTuber? Of course that's like his career
14:26
goals and I'm totally supportive, 100%, you know, I
14:31
think if you are passionate about something, you know, go
14:34
for it. And so we got him for his
14:38
birthday, the gaming computer and cherwell set up, you know,
14:42
it's not Top-of-the-line stuff of course, but it's something to
14:46
get started with. Hey the while was the I think
14:49
it's really cool to support your kids thought that I think that's
14:52
pretty good and I'm supporting their dreams and and what they
14:54
want to do, you know that's just gay.
14:55
I think for many people it is important to have your parents
14:59
kind of acknowledge what you're doing and and to support it and
15:04
you know even little things like that you know, couldn't can mean
15:07
a lot to them because it's like affirmation of like, hey, I
15:10
believe in you. I know you're going to succeed
15:12
in this go. Get it, you know, definitely
15:15
couldn't agree more of that. This took a little bit more
15:19
about the Traders tail, your first game.
15:22
So yeah, tell us about this game in the blurb.
15:26
It read that. It's very similar to The Legend
15:28
of Zelda games or early platformer games.
15:31
But what can you tell us about this game?
15:32
Why should people play this game?
15:35
Well, if you're a fan of RPGs, it should be right up your alley
15:39
on. Yeah, so, I mean, it's cool.
15:42
It's Trevor is the main character always trying to save
15:45
his kingdom in. Yeah, there's kind of a parallel
15:48
to, like, Legend of Zelda, where link would be on as class.
15:53
I think what differentiates it would be.
15:58
You know, we made a couple cool different levels where there's
16:01
like ice kingdom in a fire Kingdom.
16:04
And along the way, you get more members and your party, I
16:07
believe you get up to four characters total on.
16:12
And we made a couple hidden like side quests and stuff, so I
16:15
don't want to spoil everything, you know, but uh, yeah, it's on.
16:21
It's a pretty straightforward. Just like, you know, throw back
16:26
to like the Super Nintendo days. Kind of where you could just
16:30
pick up and play. We made the future.
16:32
So you can say that any point in the The game.
16:34
So, yeah, if you've ever watched The Angry Video Game Nerd on
16:43
YouTube before, by it's a YouTuber called James Rolfe, you
16:48
created this character, not the 2000s and he's reviewed like
16:51
hundreds of games. And the whole point of the
16:55
characters that he's like this guy, I guess having a sort of a
16:59
midlife crisis where he's like, reliving the games, he hated as
17:04
a Adam and not genuinely reviewing the games being in,
17:08
like, over the. Oh, that's fun.
17:10
And the best thing I remember or selling the sticks out, which
17:13
you reminded me of is that he remarks?
17:15
The in The Legend of Zelda, you could save your game at any
17:18
point which back then was pretty a pretty big deal and people
17:21
watching and listening now. Beloved, what?
17:23
That's no big deal. Like every game has that today,
17:26
you didn't have that you had to basically, like complete the
17:29
game in one go like what? Yes, you lose.
17:32
That's it. Start the game again.
17:34
When, you know, and some games like the Mega Man series allowed
17:36
you to choose each stage that you wanted to start with, or,
17:41
you know, maybe you had a passcode sometimes, but some
17:44
games just had nothing. So having a recalled, having
17:48
this like, save feature, is its invaluable, really?
17:51
I mean, it's absolutely definitely.
17:53
I mean, that's one of the most frustrating things is you put
17:56
all this time and effort into our proceeding forward.
17:59
And then you're just like, oh no back to square one.
18:02
I think I remember one of the Mario, There's games was like
18:06
that and I think I forget it was the first Nintendo or if it was
18:11
the Super Nintendo. But yeah I remember that it's
18:13
being super frustrating because you make it like halfway
18:16
through. And then the cartridge would
18:17
just freeze in your every everything was gone and made me
18:22
laugh as well. Like and how there was all these
18:25
different techniques to how you have a game working again.
18:28
So that most people, it's the blowing thing which are over
18:32
there. I think Nintendo themselves said
18:33
that She doesn't do anything but I kid you not that did do
18:36
something. But, yeah, some people that used
18:41
to just take their cartridges and, like, frail wall, and that
18:44
would apparently were also until it explodes at some point.
18:53
There's a, in the city I live in.
18:56
I live in a city called Manchester in the UK and there's
18:59
this. Okay.
19:00
There's this arcade bar, right? It's as awesome as it sounds.
19:04
Go downstairs. And there's a bar you can, you
19:07
know, by way of drinks you one and there's a bunch of free
19:11
games, you can play. So you're talking about
19:12
PlayStation, 1 Game Cube, whatever, right.
19:16
And a bunch of arcade systems as well.
19:19
And the one thing that I remember that I thought was
19:23
really cool other than all the the decor and all the games, and
19:26
everything that you see is that when you go to the bar, on the
19:29
right hand side, is just a wall that's literally incapable.
19:34
Taste in Super Nintendo games just just I don't know I guess
19:38
they've been glued to the wall or something.
19:40
This is the yeah. That is so cool.
19:45
That's why I love places like that.
19:46
Where you can go like doesn't matter how old you are.
19:48
You just go there? Any big kid again.
19:49
That's brilliant. Definitely, definitely, you
19:52
know, we have a place, I'd even Buster's.
19:55
I'm not sure if you've heard of that.
19:56
It's a it seemed think it's like a bar, but they have all these
20:00
arcades almost like like, like you can go there and get Tickets
20:04
and win prizes and stuff. But it's for everyone from kids
20:08
to adults and it's just super cool.
20:13
So, do you have plans to sort of release like a sequel to this
20:16
game? Or I don't know, what do they
20:18
call it now? DLC extra content.
20:20
Etc. Stuff like that.
20:22
Yeah. So we actually have developed a
20:25
sequel and it's coming sooner than we thought.
20:29
So we're actually looking for Halloween weekend at least.
20:34
Trevor tell you, that's coming out, we're really excited about
20:40
it. It kind of it.
20:41
Continues the story, however, its vast world.
20:49
It's a lot bigger. And as we've been developing
20:52
games on, we've actually got some new techniques and I
20:57
figured out how to make like new texture paths and new enemies.
21:02
So, it's going to be really fun. I'm actually looking forward to
21:06
that. And hopefully, it's as well
21:08
received his traveler's tale. He took just a little bit.
21:13
I know you mentioned a little bit about the feedback before,
21:15
but what's the kind of overall impression you're getting from
21:18
people, you know, good and bad. Like, what what's, what's the
21:21
kind of what people saying about the game that you've produced so
21:24
far are a lot of people love this story, they love the
21:29
gameplay are some of the, some of the feedback we've got on.
21:33
It's not necessarily Things we can control.
21:35
I mean, and you know, the internet can be fun for that.
21:39
So some things like it's mostly all been positive.
21:43
But we have had like one or two trolls where they're like your
21:46
game looks stupid. I'm like, oh, okay.
21:48
Like and then we'll have someone that's like, you know, I hate
21:52
RPGs like, okay, yeah. It's like literally.
22:02
So I post a bunch of stuff on Tick-Tock, I do like short
22:05
clips. I post them on YouTube as well,
22:08
Instagram, whatever. Like, you know, because like
22:10
short content is like the thing now, you know what I mean.
22:13
So, I still do but, of course. Yeah.
22:14
Goldie. You know, long videos all that
22:16
but you know, you got to appeal to the x + shift with the
22:19
time's, right? And I horse every now and again,
22:22
I get a lot of hate comments that we all do, but there was
22:25
one. Yeah, there's one the other day.
22:26
Where is literally like, I was Doing some silly videos making
22:31
faces. I don't know, Common, but the
22:33
context. But I remember the comment that
22:36
I received hate comment was something like, what the you
22:41
looking at me like that for. And I was like, I say, as far as
22:46
trolling is concerned, this is just bizarre.
22:49
Like, if he don't like like a lot of time when I, when I think
22:52
about trolls I'm like why do you waste your time if you hate what
22:54
I do so much just don't watch, I don't get it.
22:58
Yeah. Exactly.
23:01
It must just come from a place of jealousy and not necessarily
23:04
because of because obviously, you know, I've seen hate
23:07
comments on people that are successful General, I mean, that
23:09
they attack any of course. But if you're trying to build
23:12
something, I think people get jealous because they're not
23:15
building anything themselves and they're jealous that you're
23:17
trying. I think that's what it is.
23:19
You know what I mean. They try and break down other
23:20
people that are trying to achieve something and it's is
23:25
what it is. Definitely over.
23:26
I think it comes from like he said it Just they got something
23:30
going on in their lives, that's going wrong or not their way.
23:34
So in order to feel better, the last shall on whoever whatever
23:38
whether you're creating video games or music videos or
23:41
whatever, I mean. Yeah and you're right.
23:44
It's funny. You mentioned that I've seen
23:46
like I'm a huge fan of like UFC in boxing and you'll see like
23:50
world champions, like, Tyson Fury and people will comment on
23:54
his thing. Like you saw a cure terrible and
23:57
it's like I'm sure he feels so. So bad about it, you know, as
24:00
he's rolling around in his millions, the database, a world
24:03
champion, tell you suck, I could take you in a fight.
24:08
All right, that dude was nozzle. But yeah, I mean and you gotta
24:20
I'm sure as well, you know, I've seen all, you know, you have I
24:25
think something like 800 sobs and you 100,000 viewers just on
24:31
your page. And so you're obviously doing
24:33
something very successful and I think along the way you probably
24:37
had to develop a thick skin for all the trolls out there, you
24:41
know? Well, I will say this, I'm not
24:43
doing as well as you think I'm doing.
24:45
I'd say it's, I will say, well, I'll take a second to just
24:49
address this. So like the content gay is
24:51
funny. Actually, I did a video today,
24:54
which commented on the good and the bad of being a Content
24:57
creators, just kind of Funny how the universe aligns sometimes
25:00
with these things. Anyway, so the first couple of
25:04
things was I was focused was a tick tock video so I was like oh
25:06
I got a video to 2.9 million views.
25:09
Yay! I got 27 thousand followers.
25:13
Yay, built a small community, most important thing.
25:15
Yay, and then it's like, I got banned from Tick-Tock lives.
25:19
And then the next thing is can barely get 200 views per video
25:24
despite having 27,000. And then the third one was like,
25:27
oh, people don't see my Videos anymore because there's this
25:30
thing on Tick-Tock called Shadow Banning where sometimes they'll
25:34
ban. I don't know if it exists but do
25:37
you know what it is weird? When you're going from like
25:41
getting thousands of used to suddenly just getting shy of 100
25:45
per video because it seemingly because everything is based on
25:49
an algorithm YouTube, you know, of course, right.
25:52
So whether or not your stuff gets pushed is Is Random.
25:55
So, like right now, I have I have three YouTube channels.
26:00
I got all these platforms everywhere.
26:02
But anyway on my second channel it's a short Channel and it used
26:06
to just be an extra Channel and then I made the switch to do in
26:09
shorts, just upload them. I didn't really give it much
26:12
thought. I was like, well look, I'm
26:13
uploading this stuff on Tick. Tock putting it on Instagram,
26:16
makes sense to put it on YouTube as well.
26:18
Just get out of the way, right? Of course and The first time I
26:24
did it it was like magic me and my friends were testing it out
26:27
and it's like there's this a magic thing where you put your
26:30
videos online. They get no views and then
26:33
overnight. They get thousands of views and
26:36
it's this YouTube shortening it just randomly pushes you and I
26:39
theorized that RK based on the timing it's getting pushed to
26:44
the American audience at like midnight UK time.
26:48
So that's like the morning on the west coast, right?
26:52
So Make sense but then it just died for like three, four
26:58
months, just nothing and then resells.
27:01
Yeah. In the last month, I've been
27:03
getting like thousands of views per video and I'm like, there's
27:07
no way of tracking this or understanding this or knowing
27:09
this, you know, and it's Rose. That's the thing.
27:12
It's like a constant battle. Like, on my YouTube, the
27:17
subscribers on the mainland account.
27:18
Goes up and down up and down. I lose more than I gained and
27:21
the same with Instagram. So, Like when you're talking
27:24
about growth and and stuff, it's like it is a gradual thing over
27:29
long time over a year, six months to years, whatever.
27:32
But it's something you just have to keep pushing and keep going.
27:36
Keep going. And you get more failures than
27:39
you do successes, but when you do get those successes, they're
27:41
normally pretty big. And that's, you know, my
27:44
community always says that to me, they're always like, look,
27:47
you might not have 1000 10000, you deserve it but you know,
27:51
focusing the 10 to 15 people that do.
27:53
Care. And that is the most important
27:55
thing. You got to focus on is, who were
27:57
the people that care focus on them.
27:59
Create for them, and for you as well, most important fully self.
28:03
You know, so this makes a lot of sense.
28:07
Yeah, I know. Thats quiet.
28:11
I learned a lot about that. Yeah.
28:14
I mean, the analytics and algorithms.
28:16
That's all I've heard a lot about that on Facebook to.
28:21
It seems like, um, They've got some kind of crazy algorithms, I
28:26
haven't done too much with Facebook.
28:28
I found a credit has a really good Community.
28:33
Like you said, it's about engagement and show, you know, I
28:36
think there's a lot less trolls to an extent.
28:39
Because if you're on a sub reddit reddit on, for example,
28:42
about video games, for the most part, you want to be there for
28:45
video games. Of course, you'll get one or two
28:47
random trolls or whatever, but no, that's cool.
28:51
And yeah, as far as I agree, 100%.
28:55
I mean you got to keep at it to see any kind of growth and it's
28:59
super rewarding when you do get like, oh hey look, there's 10
29:02
more downloads or whatever views you know.
29:06
Now I mean it's impossible not to think about the numbers and
29:09
I've had countless people friends of mine, shout-out, to
29:12
Charles Jaco who've told me, you know, stop focusing on the
29:16
numbers. It's not all about the numbers
29:18
and it's like you're right. But also it is because that's
29:21
the only Benchmark from which to kind of look a progression.
29:24
Like if you're just staying the same or worsening then you're
29:28
not growing are you? But obviously if you do grow,
29:31
even if it is by just five people, that's five more yeah
29:34
than before. So there is something to latch
29:37
onto and no, okay, what I'm doing this right?
29:40
It's leading to something. It means I should actually what
29:43
I'm doing and, you know, obviously if you do something
29:46
that people don't like and it puts people off you or you lose
29:49
followers than you think. Hmm.
29:50
Maybe I shouldn't do that again. Right, right?
29:55
It's the hard balance I think you're smart was on, like you
29:58
said, just keeping up with the times whether it's Tick-Tock or
30:02
YouTube shorts or whatever the growing Trends are on just
30:06
keeping your content out there because, you know, just my
30:10
limited experience, checking out your videos, I think you got
30:14
really good potential to be. You know, I've seen your
30:18
paperwork's a short film there. That was really cool.
30:22
Thank you, sir. It was really a neat.
30:25
I think you definitely got the multi talented
30:28
singer-songwriter, actor, podcaster thing going.
30:32
And really it's just cool, you know, send to my ego through the
30:36
roof, but it's not about me. It's about you.
30:38
So that's for the questions back at you.
30:40
So, you mentioned analytics, have you learned anything from
30:45
the analytics or indeed? I don't know related to your
30:48
game. Have you learned anything from
30:49
the numbers? I what of the numbers so far
30:51
taught you? It's been interesting on with
30:56
our first release on. I just, we just kind of threw it
31:00
out there. Well, let's see what happens,
31:02
you know, the games complete, we're happy with it.
31:06
You know, I had a couple friends tester autumn-like, hopefully
31:08
the world likes it and so we just launched it.
31:11
We didn't pick like any release date or anything, and I think it
31:16
was like in the middle of a week, we put it up there and
31:19
there was like five downloads, okay.
31:22
And it just kind of sat there and then I'm like, you know
31:27
what, maybe I should let the world know that this exists.
31:31
Yeah, so then I went on YouTube and I'm like, what are some of
31:35
the best ways to Market if Indie video game.
31:39
Hmm. And that led me down a rabbit
31:41
hole of watching a tutorial on marketing on.
31:47
And so I ended up putting out like an ad together and it looks
31:51
on Reddit. There's Subreddit for free video
31:56
games. So, if your game is for free,
31:58
you can post it up there, so we advertise that way on.
32:03
And then we watch the numbers grow from 5 to the rest of all
32:06
like 10 more that following day. And I was like cool.
32:09
This is working and then you know, we started going and we
32:14
see it in upward Trends and then it kind of fell flat for a while
32:18
and on. So I reached out to a couple
32:22
YouTubers A couple streamers and I just kind of private message.
32:26
Hey, this is our company that Sarah Cain, would you like to
32:30
review it and what's kind of interesting before any of those
32:35
individuals stop that to me streamer?
32:38
See 757 gaming, he actually picked up play the game and just
32:42
left it on a comment on her on her page and he likes it.
32:47
He was very positive supercool guys without him.
32:51
But he also went through and was Like you needed to crack this.
32:54
You didn't correct that. So, even even though it was kind
32:59
of like a, it was the first impression that was the name of
33:03
his video on Trevor sale and just just with him picking you
33:08
up and maybe his followers or viewers, they must have liked it
33:12
because all of a sudden it started upward trending again.
33:15
So I'm like, okay this works and then we did an edit and I found
33:20
blogging helps to on because f We released a Blog about the
33:24
game saying, this is our patch update, we corrected a few
33:27
things, the views then kind of followed upward to.
33:31
So I think a lot of it has to do with the more you put into it,
33:35
the more you receive, you know, if you just throw it out there,
33:39
you might only have five downloads or whatever, but the
33:43
more you kind of let the world know it's ready.
33:47
So the more views and likes and downloads and followers you gain
33:51
show. Took us to his food like you'll
33:55
process of creating a game. Like, I know you said, you've
33:58
only been doing this for years and stuff so you're relatively
34:00
new to it, but like everyone has their style and obviously this
34:03
will continue to grow over time. But what's your current process
34:07
for creating a game? And so are the second game we're
34:12
releasing on? Well, it's actually out now
34:15
mystery of block, that was actually for the most part, it's
34:19
just fun. I know, it's kind, it's very
34:21
loose leaf on me and my body, a quarry wall.
34:24
She actually partnered with me for that game and we were just
34:29
throwing ideas back and forth. Like what have you be cool?
34:31
If you know you're walking on a bridge in this troll attacks you
34:35
or something along those lines. So then we figured out how to
34:38
incorporate that. Into the game.
34:41
And so yeah, it's very loose leaf on.
34:44
You know, we just throw some ideas together and then you know
34:47
we have like this list of like let's try to incorporate this
34:51
and then the logistically as we're coating if I'm like you
34:54
know we wanted one of the things was we wanted to have like where
34:57
you jump on this train and it goes across the train and takes
35:02
you to another place. Okay?
35:04
And the amount of coding that we did it to make at work, it
35:10
glitched like four or five times so it's a lot of trial and
35:15
error. So then we scratch that idea in
35:17
me like a secret tunnel that you walk through for now and I'm one
35:21
of our patches when we update it will hopefully have that
35:25
corrected a little bit better. But, you know, it's just that's
35:29
mostly I just got to spitballing ideas back and forth for
35:32
Traverse. Hell, same thing was with my
35:34
kids. You know, they're like, let's
35:36
see if we can make a fire dragon.
35:37
Okay, let's see if we can. So but yeah, I mean, it's just a
35:43
huge learning process. In the main thing is family,
35:46
friends and fun, you know? And hopefully that's what
35:48
translates into the game. And of course, we want it to be
35:51
a little challenging so as you progress through the game's the
35:55
levels, get a little bit harder. As they should awesome.
35:59
Awesome. Okay, you mentioned that you'd
36:03
set up a company. I do actually have the name
36:04
here. Yeah, I'd completely forgotten
36:06
about. I said, apologize, your company
36:08
is Mega gorilla gaming. Is that correct?
36:12
Yes, so okay. This might sound like a silly
36:15
question, but I'll try and phrase it in the best way.
36:19
Why did you decide to create a company as opposed to just
36:24
initially sticking to just creating the games?
36:27
You know, with your son and just kind of seeing where it goes
36:30
like to me. That's a very forward move in
36:33
the sense that you're kind of going.
36:34
Okay. I want to actually make a
36:36
business out of it and obviously as we mentioned as we spoke to
36:39
each other about before you No, you do have big plans for this,
36:43
you do want to make this your career.
36:44
So I understand that. But like, what was what, why set
36:47
up a company now, why not set up later that what's the of the
36:52
goals I guess with that company? Or why'd you set up?
36:55
Okay, yeah, that's a fair question.
36:57
Um, so the neat in our, the company actually came from, they
37:01
formulate gamertag. And which my son then took over,
37:08
he took over my account like, son.
37:13
So, that's, that's where the name came from.
37:15
And the idea of the company was actually when we were going to
37:20
probably, you know, they're like, you need to come up with a
37:24
company name. For on, I'm trying to think of
37:28
the way to call it, but it's like for filling out tax
37:30
purposes for any Revenue, you gain, you have to pay in file
37:35
taxes on it on. So that's kind of where that
37:38
came into play for it. Sort of quickly interject on the
37:41
so in America, Do you stand to keep more of your revenue and
37:49
pay less taxes? If you set it up under a
37:51
business as opposed to setting up under yourself.
37:55
If you sort of mean basically I do you losers are that's a good
38:04
question on. We're still new to it but I
38:07
think it's almost as if it is taxing is if it's yourself but
38:13
on being like a sole proprietor of the company on, but it's just
38:18
for the paperwork, it's easier to kind of have it.
38:23
Organized. Like this is the business, this
38:25
is where this money came from. This is what we paid out.
38:28
This is what we've created on. I do Americans tax laws,
38:32
probably super crazy but yeah I just want to make sure we do the
38:36
right thing to pay up. Pay all the right people
38:40
essentially and make sure everything's on the up-and-up.
38:44
Anyways, that's kind of big gun. Oh yeah.
38:47
So that's that's kind of the reasoning behind.
38:49
It is just to make sure everything's done in the correct
38:52
manner. Any reason I mention days?
38:55
Just because, like, what I've seen over the years with
38:58
businesses in taxes as a lot of the time, especially when it's a
39:02
small company. What the business owners will do
39:07
is, you know, obviously put everything under the company
39:11
name and, you know, Revenue goes through the company Etc, and
39:14
they just pay themselves a kind of a small wage and not that
39:18
much or you know even if it is a lot, you know, nothing compared
39:22
to what the company is earning and then they receive less taxes
39:26
on that the company, incurs the majority of the taxes Etc.
39:31
His kind of if you do it, right, if you have creative enough
39:34
account in, you can Kind of find loopholes and shortcuts.
39:39
It's and it's not, it's not like not paying tax pays a way of,
39:42
you know, retaining more of your money as opposed to of course.
39:47
And that's why is what you're looking for?
39:48
Isn't it sort of navigating within the confines of the law
39:52
to get the most out of your business or project or whatever
39:55
you're doing with their families?
39:57
Definitely, with regards to this company liable, what are your
40:00
goals then? Like you mentioned, obviously,
40:02
you want to make this your career but do you have any wider
40:05
go? Is for this company for gaming
40:07
in general at what? Where do you want to take this?
40:10
Um, that's a good question. Yes, I think I think the biggest
40:14
thing is on this is something we found.
40:17
We really enjoy and so we want to bring more content to the
40:21
world. So whether that's creating a
40:23
couple more games or, you know, potentially doing like streaming
40:29
like I said, maybe some streaming video games reviews
40:33
things of that nature. So, yeah, we're definitely
40:36
looking to grow expand partner up on, you know, any any one
40:42
that's kind of into the Gaming Community, if they want to get
40:46
involved, we love partnering up, you know, whether it's giving a
40:49
shout-out on our blog to other indie game developers, or
40:53
YouTubers or podcasters on because I found that's the
40:57
biggest thing is when you not work, what you give out kind of
41:01
helps come back. Yeah, you know, and I've seen
41:04
the biggest growth On some times where I might not even have
41:08
anything to gain from it. But I just helping another
41:11
gamer, kind of come up in into the world as it were, and that's
41:17
super rewarding. And sometimes their followers
41:19
may be like, oh well, I like, you know, this game.
41:22
So maybe I'll give yours a shot to.
41:23
So that's kind of the business model is just continuing to grow
41:29
and build content in the network.
41:31
Keep growing the network. That's huge.
41:34
That's a big thing like that at all cost.
41:35
And actually, and also just in general creating because many of
41:39
the guests I've had on the show. Not all of them, but quite a few
41:43
have been, you know, people I've met online, other content
41:47
creators, are the podcasters, whatever.
41:49
And, you know, every time you do a new podcast, or a new
41:54
collaboration, or something like that, you inevitably, put your
41:58
products in front of fresh eyes, you know, people that have never
42:02
seen worse and like, you know, it doesn't always work, you
42:05
know, I I've had, I've had people on my show before that
42:09
have like hundreds of thousands of followers and, you know, not
42:13
even five of them checked it out.
42:15
But then I've had other instances, where, you know,
42:17
maybe they didn't have a big audience but I still gained some
42:20
new followers from that or, you know, just more views or
42:24
lessons, or whatever. And, and, but I think that like
42:27
you said, the most valuable thing is Working with new people
42:31
learning from new people. Absolutely.
42:33
And it's the biggest probably reason.
42:36
Why do the podcast other than my other sort of reasons for doing
42:40
it? Is that I get to sit and have
42:42
fun conversations with people from around the world and learn
42:45
about different things. You know, it's obviously, you
42:48
know, At the end of the day, it's a reciprocal relationship
42:52
in that, you know, for instance, you come on the show, you got
42:54
sent to promote Etc, its content for me, but like, I don't see it
43:00
quite like that in. Like, even though it is that I
43:04
drove it, right? I actually truly enjoy just
43:07
having the conversations and I think I owe the podcast a lot
43:11
for helping me to be able to be about conversationalist, you
43:14
know. And I think that it's fun, bring
43:18
it back to the conversation. They're like the main point.
43:21
What? What you raised is that you
43:22
know, just collaborating, in general, can only bring Either
43:28
positive things or lessons. It's one or the other.
43:32
Definitely. Yeah, or hopefully, both.
43:35
Yeah. Sometimes Absolutely.
43:41
Absolutely, you mentioned that your father and I didn't
43:46
actually know that ahead of this so fair enough, but I guess what
43:51
I wanted to ask you is that what tip, why?
43:54
Two questions firstly, how has Being a father changed.
44:04
I suppose your life and the way you do things, the way you
44:07
approach things. And then also, what would you
44:09
say about the biggest lessons you've learned from being a
44:11
father? That's a good question.
44:16
I definitely, I think it's changed my life for the
44:18
positive. Of course on.
44:21
You know, I love my kids and my wife, we've been married for
44:24
eight years now. Congrat on.
44:27
Thank you. And, yeah, I think the biggest
44:29
thing is, Whether it's my career as far as like going to I got
44:38
like online business degree and that my main inspiration was to
44:44
provide for my family. Um it kind of with my career
44:48
path and everything that nature. Uh, so the biggest thing is I
44:52
transport my children, you know, both financially but also to be
44:56
there for them because I've learned so much from them just
45:01
as much as It wasn't for me. I'm sure you know, such as like
45:04
patients, you know, just being there, being creative, trying to
45:10
have fun, keeping them out of trouble.
45:13
That's always the biggest one. And I think the best way to do
45:17
that is to support them. And whether it's soccer or we do
45:23
like boy scouts or girl scouts any after-school activities?
45:28
I think that's the biggest thing but with that comes patients
45:31
because there's Some days, they just don't want to do anything,
45:33
except go home and play video games.
45:37
But yeah, I think patience is the biggest thing and then I'm
45:40
definitely more cautious is trying to be a better role model
45:45
and a better person, you know, I don't want the them to see me
45:49
cursing all the time, for example, or things of that
45:52
nature, you know. It's like, you know, how can I
45:57
tell them to be the best if I'm not being the best person, I
46:00
could be. I think that's The biggest
46:02
thing. That's a really cool way of
46:04
looking at it, but I do expect that awesome.
46:06
Thank you. I know, that's kind of kind of a
46:10
lot. No, it's good.
46:12
It's good. I like asking these questions
46:14
that come from the heart, which sets up my next question,
46:17
actually, what's the biggest life lesson that you've learned
46:20
so far? Well, that's a good one.
46:25
Um, I think the biggest one is, you know, like like I said, this
46:30
kind of all comes full circle but you know, family's the most
46:33
important thing in front friendship to of course you know
46:38
on the that's another thing like my best friend.
46:41
We've been friends since elementary school.
46:43
Oh cool. And you know it doesn't always
46:46
work out where it's like we hang out every day life happens but
46:50
you know I always try and When I make friends, keep in contact
46:53
because Anything could happen, I've lost a lot of friends over
46:56
the years from, you know, whether it's car accidents.
46:59
Or unfortunately, in some cases, like drug overdose.
47:03
That was a huge problem. A couple years back was like,
47:06
opioids, some people kind of went out on that row and so, you
47:11
know, you never know. But yeah, the biggest thing is
47:13
just family. That's the family and friends
47:15
are the most important things we got.
47:17
So trying to take care of them. And as we draw things to a close
47:23
for today, do you have any kind of upcoming projects, or maybe
47:25
some final thoughts that you'd like to share about this?
47:30
Definitely, so upcoming projects, we have Trevor cell to
47:34
coming out very soon on and on each Tayo we actually do have
47:39
our blog where we will post updates on.
47:43
So yeah, if you want to give it a check out of you like
47:47
whatever, you know, that's their biggest thing.
47:50
And I just want to thank you for giving me the opportunity to
47:53
come on here. We had a great conversation, I
47:55
feel. And like I said, Awesome
47:59
musician. So I'm going to check out some
48:01
more of your videos. Well, thank you so much David.
48:03
I sincerely appreciate you. Putting aside the time to appear
48:06
on the show. Thank you very much.
48:09
Thank you. And to everyone listening to the
48:12
Christian right podcast. I hope you enjoyed it.
48:14
Be safe, be well, and I'll see you in the next one.