Latest / The MeatEater Podcast / Ep. 649: Muzzleloader Blues

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Ep. 649: Muzzleloader Blues · The MeatEater Podcast

• 0:08
  Speaker 1: This is the Meat Eater Podcast coming at you shirtless,
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: severely bug bitten, and in my case, underwear.
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: Listening to podcast, you can't predict anything.
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: The Meat Eater Podcast is brought to you by First Light.
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: Whether you're checking trail cams, hanging deer stands, or scouting
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: for elk. First Light has performance apparel to support every
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: hunter in every environment. Check it out at first light
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: dot com, f I R S T L I t
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: E dot com. This episode is gonna be called muzzle
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: order blues. I have, well, yeah, unless Seth's trying to
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: launch a new show called Tain't Talk but because he's
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: been listening to a lot of health and wellness podcasts.
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: But mussloader blues because once again I have failed to
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: uh get it done, as they say, with my muzzloader. Yeah,
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: I just don't have the skills man, Like you know
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: a tool. I'm a rifle man. Let me the kind
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: of center fire.
• 1:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's got to be similar to like archery, Like
• 1:25
  Speaker 3: you're not getting any further away than you would in archery,
• 1:27
  Speaker 3: and you got it, you got close.
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: But archery you get to you get to hunt before
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: the gun hunter. Archery you get first cracks and mussloader.
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: You get last cracks, meaning people been terrorizing these port animals,
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: and then you gotta you try to further antagonize them
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: when they're kind of tuned into the what's up?
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah archery, all your arrows work too, and yeah it's going.
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know that the boat's going off when I
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: let her go, she's going, she's going. Yeah. A lot
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: of stuff like I wrote in with a business idea
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: from a podcast, and I get a lot of these,
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: but this one I wanted to His name is Brian.
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: I just wanted to get you guys feeling on it
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: because I'm having a hard time understanding it.
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: I have.
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: I didn't invent this, but if you have a bill
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: cap on, I'm gonna put my bill cap on. A
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: demonstrator had my buyos too.
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: They're just in your truck, and we got a set
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: of vinyls. Same. You want to grab those?
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I canep grabb those set of binyls out of
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: the truck. So here I put my bill cap on
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: and I'm gonna demonstrate a strategy of knock a knocking
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: byo knocking binocular strategy. What I was talking about is
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: that you can use your bill again I didn't. I
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: didn't invent this. It's always then around. But these are
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: stabilizing pinoclars, so it's less relevant here I'm holding the parabindoctors.
• 3:05
  Speaker 1: Let's say these aren't stabilized binoculars. You forew people watching
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: at home not listening when you hold them up.
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: Have you ever? You know this trick? Every knows this trick.
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: You clamp, You clamp your uh fingers. You your ratchet
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: your binos. Where's that camera? You ratchet your bino's to
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: the bill of your hat, and if you want to
• 3:30
  Speaker 1: get mega stable, you pull slightly so I'm pinching them.
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: M hmm. I like to get the hands. I like
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: to uh, I like to get the hands a little
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: more on the side, like yes, that way, it's like
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: put it's like putting blinders up. That's not the right
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: way to do it.
• 3:53
  Speaker 3: No, that is that then you can get all you
• 3:56
  Speaker 3: basically grab it with the binos with your palms.
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and then you put all four fingers on your.
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: So you're like a dude from college in the nineties,
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: you know when you used to wrap your hat around
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: a beer can.
• 4:08
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, But that if you do that then,
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: especially when the sun's out. Yeah, put your blinders.
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: Up, because I run Backstreet boys when it's sunny out.
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: He did that.
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: Do you know what I'm saying? So the son's over here,
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: I run it like this, right.
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: But if you apply to our method, do you want to? Yeah?
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: And then I'm boned on this. So then you're see
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: what you're saying.
• 4:32
  Speaker 2: You're stable and you're not getting any leak or light
• 4:36
  Speaker 2: leaking inside. Yeah.
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: I don't know. Yeah, I can see it a little
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: bit either way. The what I have in BET, I
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: didn't invent that. But what I did in BET was this.
• 4:45
  Speaker 1: I invented the poll, just one. No one had done that.
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: There's not a soul in the world that has ever
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: done that.
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: Not not. When you put a slight pull for extra stability.
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: A guy heard me talking about this named Brian.
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: Okay, slight poll, huh yeah, locks in if you like,
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: I feel like a push would lock in.
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: No that it's hitting your eyes.
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, then you're stable against your face.
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: I can't explain it better. Later, this guy writes in Brian,
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: if you switch the letters in his name around, you
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: get brain. He says, I just had an idea. Well, first,
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: he says, hey, Steve. He says, I just had an idea.
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: I heard your podcast regarding the trick. Now listen carefully
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: because I get confused for this. I heard your podcast
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: regarding the trick to hang on to binoculars using the
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: bill of your bill, cap bill of your cap, and
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: he uppercases bill com I thought, why not come up
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: with a strap system. Now here's where you gotta start
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: paying attention. A strap system that goes around the binoculars. Comma,
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: so forget though, I thought, why not come up with
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: a strap system that goes around the binoculars. Comma, hold
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: him into the exact place you want, and a strap
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: then runs over the top of your head and attaches
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: underneath your shoulders. Wow, binoculars stay glued to your eyes.
• 6:44
  Speaker 3: Hard to them away, fail to see.
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't want you boys to get uncomfortable. By
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: I'm removing my belt, you're thinking you eat or did
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: something bad, or I'm gonna do something bad. Neither is true.
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: He's saying, Man, there's so many straps. He's saying something
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: to this effect, and then under the under back under
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: my armpits. At that point, I think that's it, You're like,
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: he just essentially would have been this is a business idea.
• 7:28
  Speaker 3: Well essentially what he'd piggybacked off of wash kevlar helmet.
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: No, he's right.
• 7:35
  Speaker 2: Look, yeah, it's almost like almost like a set of
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: nods on help.
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: What he's not thinking of is that you can't go
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: about your day.
• 7:45
  Speaker 2: You gotta be able to flip him up.
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because you can't find like, uh, you'd be tripping
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: over stuff. Yeah, you can't drive to your spot.
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: You can't be running around all day on twelve power.
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: So any feedback would be wonderful. Keep keep plugging away
• 8:06
  Speaker 1: at it. Yeah.
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: I think it's gotta be uh, you know, like your
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: fancy coon hunting hat, it's got the inner liner. Yeah,
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: I think, uh quick, it's got to be something on
• 8:16
  Speaker 2: there that you can flip them up and pop them down.
• 8:20
  Speaker 3: I'd pay good money to see Steve roll around the
• 8:22
  Speaker 3: planes and the kevlar with just some nods on it.
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah every time. Yeah yeah, and then if you fall,
• 8:29
  Speaker 2: you protect it. Yeah.
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: I was making a I was making an argument. Their day.
• 8:34
  Speaker 1: My boy is, my older boy is tangled up at
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: school and speech and debate class, m h I remember
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: being Yeah, speech and debate is what it's called I
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: went down to the to the orientation with my wife,
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: and when they asked for questions, I was dying to
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: ask a question, but I didn't. And then I told
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: my wife, I said, I'm gonna tell you something, and
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: you're not gonna like take it seriously. You're just gonna
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: you're gonna like be mildly offended, and you're not gonna
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: really listen to what I'm saying, Okay, And I was saying,
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: it doesn't without knowing the ethics of a child, I
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: don't think it makes sense to train them in speech
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: and debate. And I said to her, I had I
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: came up with this slogan, Today's children are tomorrow's enemies.
• 9:40
  Speaker 2: WHOA, it's great, so.
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: Picture it's great.
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's great.
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: This is a mildly and defensible position. But think about it.
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: What I was saying is like, here, you got a
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: whole class from your kids. I don't know what their
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: belief systems are, but but here we are like, like,
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: you donate your time, time or money to train them
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: to be persuasive without knowing what their belief system is.
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: How do you know you're not training someone who would
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: be adversarial to your position? Training them and making them
• 10:17
  Speaker 1: more convincing, thereby creating a future enemy.
• 10:22
  Speaker 2: I think that happens.
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: I think you would first vet you, you'd vet them
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: to find the ones that you kind of agree with,
• 10:29
  Speaker 1: and then train them one speech and debate.
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: How would you vet them?
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: And who's the questionnaire? I would do the questionnaire, but
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: that would.
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: Be that would be, that would be.
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: To you and your belief Yes, and you'd have to
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: try out for speech and debate. And I would accord
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: in and volunteer to come in and be like, yes no.
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: To speech and debate. According according to you're right, your
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: wife probably did.
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: I told her, and I've yet to have her come
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: back to me with any kind of a reply.
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: You'd have to have a board of people who like.
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: Then I'd have to be able to vet the board,
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: like uh, I'd have.
• 11:12
  Speaker 2: To pick the board.
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: Then you know what I'm saying.
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: Well, I'm just saying if you wanted to keep it fair,
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: or or you don't want to keep it fair, you
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: just want people to believe what you believe.
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: Can I give you a piece of Can I give
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: you some listener feedback about this?
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: This is all tee and up listener feedback. It's a
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: great subject line. Uh, it starts out my three favorite
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: four favorite words. Steve was one correct.
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: That's how it starts out.
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: Steve is, Steve is one correct about debate class and
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: here's a real life example why dying to know. Yep,
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: Steve is spot on when he says that teaching debate
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: separate from ethics is dangerous. That's not really what I said,
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: but sure my daughter did. It's a state champ debate
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: guy who is a class AA hole when their relationships hours,
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: he is expert at convincing her that the reason things
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: have gone bad is because of her. He never takes
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: responsibility for his actions and makes her feel like shit.
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: His ability to win either side of a debate has
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: given him the notion that he is never wrong because
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: he can always justify his position in his mind and
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: convinces her that she isnt the wrong because he is
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: able to twist the situation and deflect blame back on her.
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: One need this is the letter. I'm still reading the letter.
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: One need to only be convincing in a debate, not ethical, moral,
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: or write, and therein lies the issue. Signed a piste off, Dad,
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: Did you write that letter and No, that wasn't what
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: I was getting at. I was more getting at I
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: don't want to train up by my like these other
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: you know I've worried about, like the whole classroom of kids,
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: like some of them are gonna have viewpoints different than mine,
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: and then they become convincing, And what if they come
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: convince me is something that I don't want to be convinced.
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: So you're just you're you're ultimately scared of change. M
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: h m. That's right, Seth.
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: Can you can you share your reporting about bear spray?
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: Oh?
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah, this is probably your first piece of original reporting.
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: Probably it ain't it's not gonna be I mean, it's
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: not crazy, but well let me tee you up. Okay.
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: The other day on a podcast, we had a podcast
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: with a guest who spent their career, much of their
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: career working with grizzly bears and catching problem bears and
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: dealing with catching bears and trying to get people to
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: not have problems with bears stuff like that, and then
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: there we got to do a conversation about bear spray
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: and this guy's long time hunter worked a zwning guide
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: and I laid out to him. Okay, the perennial debate pistol,
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: bear spray?
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: What do you like?
• 14:14
  Speaker 1: He said, bear spray, and he went on to say,
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: you know, very few people are actually proficient with a pistol,
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: despite how much they might think they're proficient with a pistol.
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: But with bear sprays, you're creating a cloud of spray.
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: I see you, Chili did a little face.
• 14:31
  Speaker 3: I just I mean, I would agree with the fact
• 14:34
  Speaker 3: that a lot of people aren't proficient with a pistol,
• 14:37
  Speaker 3: But like, I think a lot of things like one year,
• 14:41
  Speaker 3: what if the wind's blowing in your face and like
• 14:44
  Speaker 3: you blind the bear, but you also blind yourself, or
• 14:45
  Speaker 3: what if you don't.
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: Get the bear, because then the bear that's fine.
• 14:49
  Speaker 3: But like, I just think that a lot more things
• 14:50
  Speaker 3: can go wrong with bear spray. And personally, I just
• 14:54
  Speaker 3: feel more comfortable with a gun because I mean, I've
• 14:56
  Speaker 3: never had to shoot out a bear, but I've seen
• 14:59
  Speaker 3: videos and I've like read reports like a lot of
• 15:02
  Speaker 3: the bears just bugger off at the sound of a gun.
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: I've had him go towards the sound of a gun. Well,
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: I've shot in front of him and then had him
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: go look at where I shot because they saw something move.
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: I think it depends on the person either way. I've
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: shot my pistol thousands more times than I have my
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: bear spray. Okay, you're ready for your reporting though.
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, then someone didn someone write in about assault
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: bear spray for assault. Greg Fonce, who's been on the
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: podcast Greg. Yeah.
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: Well Greg Fonce, he's a he's a firefighter, yeah in Sacramento,
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: and he said his experiences with bear spray are not
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: from people carry him around for bears, but it's kind
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: of a thing commonly used for assault and robbery. He says,
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: I bet more people get sprayed by bear spray then
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: bears get sprayed by bear spray. Absolutely true.
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: Yep.
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: I've had two incidents of getting sprayed by bear spray,
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: not bears. I've yet to see a bear get shot
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: with bear spray. I've seen bears get fired at with guns,
• 16:14
  Speaker 1: but not fired at by bear spray. And I have
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: a couple of times that okaysion to shoot in front
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: of them to try to deter them.
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: So, yeah, by Greg writing in about that, that brought
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: up this story that I was telling these guys of there.
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: I live in three Forks, Montana, and there was a
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: bar that back in the summer got robbed during like
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: the evening when it was full of people, and the
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: guy came in and just sprayed everyone with bear spray,
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: took the money and ran out. So while everyone's like
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: blinded and coffin and whatnot, he's pulling money out of
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: the you know, the cash still at large, still the
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: largest when caught them. I don't think they did.
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: You know that how they made that Ocean's eleven movie.
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: You could make a really short like Oceans one. They're
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: really short, one of those heist movies where that guy
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: just comes in that bear spray and grabs the stuff
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: and runs out. It would be a short. Yeah, just
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: get it, be like a YouTube short called Oceans one.
• 17:20
  Speaker 2: Hopefully you could turn into a full length movie. And
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: that happens in the beginning, and then the rest of the.
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: Movie is, oh, just make a part of a movie.
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: Trying to trying to figure out who did it.
• 17:29
  Speaker 4: Did he recoup the cost of a bear spray because
• 17:31
  Speaker 4: those are kind of expensive.
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know how much money was stolen he stole, Like.
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: Did they get the bar cleaned out and back in business?
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: Yes they did, But I still hear every once in
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: a while, like someone will be like I was in
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: the plaza and my skin got irritated when I was
• 17:47
  Speaker 2: playing the the gambling machines or whatever.
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: Really because they're still like, yeah, I can't believe they
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: never caught him.
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: I didn't. I didn't hear that they that they caught him.
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: Maybe they did, but I don't think so.
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: When I was a little kid, my dad was my
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: mom and dad were out to dinner with some of
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: their friends and the other woman besides my mom, right,
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: she had a little thing of mace, and my dad
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: was curious about her some kind of spray and the
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: key chain and he was curious about its range and
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: shot it in the restaurant into a vent Oh, not realizing.
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: It's like, uh, you know, it's real strong.
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: It's strength, and the whole place got evacuated.
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: Wow, did they nose him?
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah. It became a often told story in my family. Yeah,
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: that's probably not a good thing, this guy says this
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: bear spray accidents. Listen to episode three sixty five, and
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: the part of bear spray going off randomly reminded me
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: of being on a caribou hunt in Alaska. My friend
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: Lewis and I come out of the tent and there's
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: caribou on top of the hill outside camp. We grab
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: our guns and packs and head off. That sounds like
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: caribou hunting. Louis is supposed to shoot first. He drops
• 19:11
  Speaker 1: his bag on a tussock. It lands on his bear spray,
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: causing it to go off. It shoots a stream of
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: spray across Lewis's chest, causing him to drop like a rock.
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: Between gas was air. He was yelling for me to
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: shoot the bull, which I happily did.
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: Hmmm, nice, at least they got the bowl.
• 19:33
  Speaker 1: Another time, I left canna spray in my eighty three
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: GMC pick up after a day hiking in July. Come
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: back out the next morning and the canister had exploded
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: in my truck. That's common.
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I've heard that.
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: Eventually got him clean by stripping all the interior parts
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: out in pressure washing them. I've heard of cars getting totaled.
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: From you know I have. I have bear spray in
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: my bag right now because we're in a bury area.
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: What are you gonna do get it out of your
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: bag when he comes for you?
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: Well, no, I just listen to my story. Okay, it's
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: in my just my Duffel bag. I was gonna I
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: don't know if I thought I needed. I was gonna
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: put it in my little hearts thing. But I have
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: I think at Walmart, I got you know, like pub
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: mix stuff comes into like a plastic cylinder. I have
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: it in that thing kind of wrapped up so it's
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: not just bouncing around in there with the lid on.
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: And that's how I transport it.
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: I keep mine in a mini animal can because you
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: can put two or three of them in a mini
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: animal can and it's got a little foam in there
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: to keep it from rattling around. But that way you
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: can cut loose and nothing's coming out of there.
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: So if you're gonna have in your car, put it
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: in something like that.
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: There are a couple instances where pepper sprays have taken
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: down aircraft, small aircraft.
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: I believe that Alaska.
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, well I'm sure probably, I'm sure it's having a
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: Canada as well. But yeah, I want to cut cut
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: loose in the in the cockpit. So German, you fly
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: with bush planes, they take your spray and they tape it.
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: They duct tape it to the struts on the wings.
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: But there's ben cases like that. And there was an
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: air wreck not long ago where they weren't able to
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: determine the cause. Inside the cockpit everything was orange, but
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: they could never determine. It was inconclusive whether the can
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: erupted upon impact. Oh there's the can erupted and caused
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: the plane to crash.
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: Yep, we've been flying in Alaska before where you look
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: out the window and that can start shaking it.
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: Shit, that's like that movie Gods must be crazy, remember
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: that movie. All of a sudden, here you are and
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: then here's a temper spray. It comes down. We've been
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: having some discussions. This is more listener feedback. We've been
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: having some discussions about, Well, there's another thing I was
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: gonna talk about, but it's so talked about now everyone
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: I know of sense to me a tragedy. Were in Virginia,
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: a bear hunter. Everybody's seen this. Everybody's seen its near mind.
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: A bear hunter was killed. They shot a bear in
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: a bear fellow ovatry and landed on a guy and
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: killed him. But it's so heavily commented on and reported
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: on and misconstrued. We've been discussing lately when when states
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: he's recip a thing called reciprocity for management purposes around
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: hunting and fishing regulations. An example of what we're talking
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: about would be this, Uh, in North Dakota, you can
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: spear pike through the ice only if a North Dakotan
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: would be allowed to spear pike through the ice in
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: your state or province. You tracking all, let me give
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: you this one. Let me give you an example. This
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: just changed, but let me give you an example. Montana,
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I know where you're going with this one.
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: Prohibit non residents from trapping fur bearing animals and not
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: non game.
• 23:07
  Speaker 2: Unless their state allows unless.
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: No, no, they just forbid non residents. Oh yeah, they're
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: the ones that started it, Montana. They just changed it.
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: But Montana will not sell a fur harvester license to
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: a non resident.
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: Oh well, before that, it wasn't me out. Okay, you
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: tell everybody. No. I thought at one point in time
• 23:32
  Speaker 2: it was a non resident could trap in Montana if
• 23:37
  Speaker 2: their state allows non residents to trap there.
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: No, because Montana is the one that said you can't. Gotcha,
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: they they they're them Minnesota. Okay, there are certain states
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: that do not let non residence trap fur bearing animals.
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: Gotcha.
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: Now you could come to Montana trap fox. You'd come
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: to Montana trap kyote because they're non game. But you
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: couldn't trap bid page, you couldn't trap beaver, odd muskrat. Gotcha,
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: fur bearing animals. So a case of reciprocity would be
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: like Wyoming. For instance, Wyoming says, okay, you we will
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: sell a non resident a fur harvester license if that
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: if our residence can buy in their state.
• 24:18
  Speaker 2: Gotcha.
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: And so it would be that if you lived in Montana,
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: you could not trap in Wyoming. Why because Montana had
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: banned Wyoming people from trapping. Minnesota has another situation like that.
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: That's a case of reciprocity. There's a reciprocity, Like I said,
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: with pike spearing, if you don't allow if your state
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: doesn't allow pike spearing Wisconsin, you can't come spear northeast
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: in North Dakota.
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: Gotcha.
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: I was a while ago I was musing about whether
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: you would start to use reciprocity against states that are
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: doing bans on certain hunting activities. So meaning California bands
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: bobcat hunting, bobcat trapping, mountain lion hunting, should a Californian
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: be allowed to go like should a Californian be allowed
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: to go to another state and participate in those activities
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: when their state has banned the right. I was just
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: musing about asking this question just to like, you know,
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: get intellectual. You know, the intellectual juice is flowing.
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: Fee that was the case. I hope they banned deer
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: hunt in Washington.
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: Well, that's where it becomes interesting because if you have,
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: like because you have a lot of states that are
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: becoming increasingly adversarial, you have you have like states that
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: are coming adversarial to hunters and hunters, trappers, fishermen, right yep.
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: And then you know, like Washington when they during the pandemic,
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: they banned fishing by yourself. Like if you had a
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: pond in your yard, you could go out there and
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: shoot golf balls into that pond during COVID, but there
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: was a period of time when you couldn't go there
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: and cast into that pond.
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, just you know, keeping everyone safe.
• 26:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah. So as you have states Colorado, well Colorado has
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: beat one of these things, but Colorado, Washington, California, other
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: states in the East. As you have these states that
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: are becoming like super restrictive, you create kind of like
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: a hunting and fishing refugees that then carry on all
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: their activities elsewhere, meaning Washington State. They like, they're very
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: sting they don't they don't want to manage predators. They're
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: very stingy with big game tags. And so you create
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: a lot of hunting refugees who move into neighboring states
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: and Montana, right, So should you like, would a state
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: ever say, like, listen, if you're gonna if like, let's
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: say Colorado had passed the Mountain Lane, but no, let's
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: stay with California, California bands trapping the band hunting cats,
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: hunting lines. Would Montana ever be like, Okay, if that's
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: how you guys are about this, then your people cannot
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: come here and do that here.
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: They won't do that because it drives too much revenue.
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: Well, Yanni says, you're punishing the wrong people. Yeah, Yanni says,
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: like if Colorado had passed their Mountain Lion ban, so
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: then you want to further punish those people in Colorado
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: in saying they can't go elsewhere to do it.
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: People who agree with the Mountain Lion Band Colorado just
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: can't even come to Montana at all. They just have
• 27:49
  Speaker 2: to stay there, but we'll take the hunters.
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: That'd be fine with me. I feel like gloating all
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: over again about that not passing, But.
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: You can if you want.
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: You know what I came up with that I haven't
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: had a chance to use yet is a high know
• 28:10
  Speaker 1: you know the rhino is Yes, what hunter? Namely, that'd
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: be like the hunters that were for the Mountain Lion
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: Band in Colorado.
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: High knows like I'm a hunter.
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: I hunt pheasants once a decade, and I support the
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: ban on mountain lions. That was a thing.
• 28:30
  Speaker 2: That was a high Yeah, that was the thing. That's crazy.
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: Anyways, this guy writes in about reciprocty right for this,
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: the state of Ohio does not require resident landowners to
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: purchase a hunting license or deer tag to hunt their property.
• 28:46
  Speaker 2: Wow.
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: Really a minimum of five acres? I had no idea.
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: Is that true? The state of Ohio does not require
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: resident landowner to purchase a hunting license or deer tag
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: to hunt their own property if they have a minimum
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: of five acres.
• 29:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's true in multiple states. I think
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: it was like that in New Jersey.
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: This privilege extends to the landowner's spouse and children. Resident
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: landowners still have to tag their deer, report them and
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: are subject to bag limits and all the other wrecks.
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: I had no idea.
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: I want to say, I could be wrong on this,
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: but I want to say New Jersey was like that,
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: and you just go pick up your tags. But if
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: you're hunting your own place, you're on your own place,
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: and it's a above a certain acres, you just go
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: get your tags.
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: I can't say I have a problem with that. I
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: don't know. I didn't know. That surprises me.
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: That's fine. Whatever. Well, it's like, do you know.
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: That in Wisconsin, if you're on your own land, you're
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: exempt from small game regulations or something like that. I
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: think you can hunt squirrels year around. Really, I think
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: so Doug's probably having a heart attack on skits deer
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: right now. They you see Doug free Doug. He goes on,
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: are you ready for this? Okay, so we've established this
• 30:08
  Speaker 1: resident landowner Ohio. Okay, all that a non resident you're
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: tracking A non resident Ohio landowner and spouse and children
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: may hunt their property without a license or deer tags
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: if the non resident state of residence.
• 30:30
  Speaker 2: My god, oh, I feel like we need to draw
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: this out.
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, I get it, but I'm just okay, we've
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: established that more than eight times. We've established if you're
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: in Ohio, you're a resident, you're hunting your own pad,
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: you got more than five acres, you still got to
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: abide by the hunting lawsby don't need a tag. Now,
• 30:53
  Speaker 1: the state of Ohio does not require resident landowners to
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: purchase the hunting license or deer tag to hunt their property.
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: Okay, mm hmm, I've already read that. Oh my god,
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: just screwing itself so bad, the non resident part.
• 31:13
  Speaker 1: Screwing it up bad? Do you think about running for
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: political office? But I'd have a bad time in the debate.
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: You'd be like I lost seconds.
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: I'd be like, that's not gonna work for me. Okay, writing, Okay,
• 31:33
  Speaker 1: we've established that. Now, going on, a non resident Ohio
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: land owner, an spouse, some children may hunt their property okay,
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: without a license or deer tags if the non resident
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: state of residence allows non resident landowners to hunt their
• 31:52
  Speaker 1: land without a license or deer tags.
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: Okay. So if I lived in Pennsylvania and they allow
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: that same thing, which they don't.
• 32:02
  Speaker 1: But they'd have to allow a dude in Ohio.
• 32:06
  Speaker 2: But I own property Inhio. Ohio, I would be allowed
• 32:11
  Speaker 2: to do the same thing in Ohio because Ohio has
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: that same rule.
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: Does Pennsylvania charge a non resident a deer license if
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: the non resident owns land in Pennsylvania, that's.
• 32:24
  Speaker 2: What he's saying. Well, I mean Pennsylvania doesn't do that anyway.
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: Okay, so then they're out.
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, God, that's confusing. Well he goes on. Oh jeez,
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: to the best of my knowledge, Oh nope, back up.
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: As a Michigan resident, he's going to is everybody.
• 32:48
  Speaker 2: Tracking, He's a Michigan residence.
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: Is like a tongue.
• 32:50
  Speaker 2: This is intellectually, he's a Michigan resident who owns property
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: in Ohio.
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: I don't know that yet. Yes he is. Okay, everybody tracking, Yeah,
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: everybody track, Ye listen to this kind of stuff keeps
• 33:02
  Speaker 1: you from getting dementialator in life or yeah no, just
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: little brain twisters. Okay, as a Michigan resident where residents going,
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: he goes on as a Michigan resident where residents, non residents,
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: landowners and non landowners must have a hunting license and
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: deer tag. And an Ohio landowner, let me cut the
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: parenthetical off.
• 33:27
  Speaker 2: You read that too fast.
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: As a Michigan resident and an Ohio landowner, my family
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: and I do not benefit from this reciprocity.
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: Because Michigan doesn't allow it.
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: Because Michigan doesn't let non residents who happen to own
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: a place in Michigan hunt in Michigan without their Michigan
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: Deer license. This is chapped. This guy's asked enough that
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: he's done some research. To the best of my knowledge,
• 33:55
  Speaker 1: the only state's residents that benefit from this reciprocity arrangement
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: are Ohio. In no other state they've created a reciprocity
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: rule that doesn't apply to anyone. If you can prove
• 34:20
  Speaker 1: this man wrong, that's my kind of reciprocity law makes
• 34:24
  Speaker 1: you seem super lenient, But in fact, when you get
• 34:27
  Speaker 1: into the details, no one applies.
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: It's not catered to anyone. Yeah, huh, maybe it was.
• 34:35
  Speaker 3: Well, I'd also be curious to know, as this Michigan resident,
• 34:38
  Speaker 3: how hard is it for him, as a landowner in
• 34:40
  Speaker 3: Ohio to get a tag in Ohio, Like if it's
• 34:43
  Speaker 3: still like over the counter.
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he's got pay cup hundred bucks.
• 34:46
  Speaker 2: Well yeah, but like why is he complaining because.
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: You watch your pennies and dollars take care of themselves.
• 34:54
  Speaker 2: Fair fine, Yeah.
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: He goes on, Okay, no, it's just he totally changes
• 35:01
  Speaker 1: the subject. But it's not a non sequitor because he
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: put down PS, which sort of announces it as you know,
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: you're announcing it's a non sequitur PS not relating. And
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: he also says, not related to the above, PS. Not
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: related to the above, but another Ohio reciprocal agreement. This
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: is different. This is interesting management. We'll talk about this
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: because I like this, but it's different. Ohio and West
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: Virginia allow residents of either state to hunt waterfowl and
• 35:33
  Speaker 1: fish on the Ohio River without having a license from
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: the other state. That's common. Yeah, that's common where for instance,
• 35:41
  Speaker 1: New York and Pennsylvania and the Delaware River, they make
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: a instead of creating Let's say you have one situation
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: where Pennsylvania says you're allowed six small mouth to day
• 35:52
  Speaker 1: and New York says you're allowed for a small mouth today,
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: and you got this river that's you know, shoot a
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: bowick cross. You create all kinds of problems. So what
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: states will often do in those situations is they'll come
• 36:07
  Speaker 1: and make the states will agree, they'll make a river
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: bag limit, a river set of regulations, and allow anyone
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: from the bordering states to fish the river.
• 36:20
  Speaker 2: YEP.
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: An interesting spot where this little bit of reciprocity does
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: not exist is the Saint Mary's River, which divides Michigan.
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: For there's probably many other places. The Saint Mary's which
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: divides Michigan with Canada with Ontario. You need to pay
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: attention where you are because there's a magical line running
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: out in the middle of that stuff, and you got
• 36:47
  Speaker 1: to know what side of that line you're on, even
• 36:49
  Speaker 1: in your boat.
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: I want to say. That's the thing on the Mississippi too.
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: You know there are some spots in the Mississippi like
• 36:56
  Speaker 1: that because remember a bass professional basque guy disqualified from
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: a tournament because he had strayed across some invisible line
• 37:04
  Speaker 1: and was actually fishing at different states waters and they
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: had a different bag limit in those states or something
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: like that.
• 37:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think.
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: It, but I like it when they come together and
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: do those little deals.
• 37:14
  Speaker 2: Right What about uh? Like people fish in Lake Michigan
• 37:22
  Speaker 2: from the Michigan side, but make a big run? Is
• 37:24
  Speaker 2: there is there? Say it again? Like if you're fishing Lake, Michigan,
• 37:29
  Speaker 2: and you launch in Michigan, but make a big run
• 37:33
  Speaker 2: and you're like closer to Wisconsin.
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: I don't know how that. I don't know how Michigan
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: Wisconsin do it. That's a great question. We never fished
• 37:41
  Speaker 1: that far out. That's a lot. That's the ways. Yeah,
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: I got buddies that do. I don't know what they.
• 37:46
  Speaker 1: I don't know if you got I'm guessing there on
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: that lake of that size, I'm guessing you need to
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: get a license when you cross the state line and
• 37:53
  Speaker 1: the state line runs out in the water. Here's a
• 37:58
  Speaker 1: guy on the same subject. Ready for this, yep. He
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: says he was listening to the podcast this morning in
• 38:08
  Speaker 1: his tree stand and killed the dough and he says,
• 38:12
  Speaker 1: take that for what it's worth. Then he goes out
• 38:15
  Speaker 1: to say, towards the end, they meaning we mentioned a
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: write in where a guy complained about being a landowner
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: and having to pay non resident fees. I remember this guy.
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: He's like, how in the hell can I have h
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: He's griping because he's like, I live in whatever, I
• 38:36
  Speaker 1: don't know whether this Michigan and I own a place
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: in Ohio. I shouldn't have to pay non resident fees
• 38:43
  Speaker 1: in Ohio. But think about the can of worms you're
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: opening up there, right, Like, Okay, do you want to
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: file taxes in both states? Do you wanna? You know
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: what I mean? There's like there's a thousand things right
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: that you would probably not like if that was true. Well,
• 39:02
  Speaker 1: he don't, you know, I'm I'm not giving him full credit.
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: He does pay taxes. He pays land taxes there. But
• 39:11
  Speaker 1: the way the whole country set up, you got to
• 39:13
  Speaker 1: be a resident of a state. It's just how It's
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: just it's hard to get around that. He goes on
• 39:19
  Speaker 1: to say this. Towards the end, they mentioned a writing
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: where a guy complained about being a landowner and having
• 39:23
  Speaker 1: to pay non resident fees. I do the same thing. However,
• 39:26
  Speaker 1: I live in Tennessee and hunt in Alabama. I wish
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: the roles were reversed. But if you're born in Tennessee,
• 39:34
  Speaker 1: you can apply every year for non resident native to
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: Tennessee licenses. Damn, Idaho has that thing the lifetime, Yeah,
• 39:48
  Speaker 1: Idaho had it for it's no longer the way, but
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: you could get grandfathered in on it at once upon
• 39:53
  Speaker 1: a time, and a lot of dudes took advantage of this.
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: They knew they weren't gonna stay in Idaho. I could
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: name names. And one of them likes to complain about
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: anyone getting any kind of benefit, like anytime someone draws
• 40:07
  Speaker 1: a tag, he's like down on them. But this individual,
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: you guys know and love, ran out and bought his
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: lifetime Idaho license before moving away from Idaho so that
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: he could continue to dodge fees and hunt as a
• 40:23
  Speaker 1: resident in Ohio. I thought you can still, and he
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: cries foul at any advantage that anybody gets when it
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: comes to getting a tag. He wishes he got.
• 40:36
  Speaker 2: I thought you can still do that in Idahoo.
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: I think they got rid of I don't think it
• 40:39
  Speaker 1: works that way anymore. But if you said, oh, I
• 40:43
  Speaker 1: drew a big horn tag in Idaho, he's gonna give
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: you a big ol' eye roll. Must be nice.
• 40:52
  Speaker 3: Is this Is this the same fella that's also not
• 40:55
  Speaker 3: very lucky when it comes to drawing, Yes, because.
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: Way way it's taking this gradually taking a toll on them. Yeah,
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: it's taking it. It's taking a psychological toll. But they
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: did that.
• 41:08
  Speaker 2: They did that.
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: Montana has a coming home to hunt. I can't remember
• 41:15
  Speaker 1: who was talking to you about this, it's like if
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: you like, it's meant to be that. Like, let's say
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: you have a family and you your you have kids,
• 41:21
  Speaker 1: and your your kids go away. It gives advantage to
• 41:25
  Speaker 1: your kids to get tags so you can come home
• 41:28
  Speaker 1: to hunt. The coming home to hunt hunt.
• 41:29
  Speaker 3: Is that still like an application process or is it
• 41:32
  Speaker 3: like kind of like an OTC.
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: I think it's in a different I don't know.
• 41:36
  Speaker 2: I think that's just different. Different got a different price,
• 41:40
  Speaker 2: I think so.
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: Uh, this gentleman says, uh, attached to this email's application.
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: It would be cool to see more states do this. Also,
• 41:54
  Speaker 1: y'all joked about voting in two different states. Oddly enough,
• 41:58
  Speaker 1: my former police chief wasn't indicted for doing that and
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: several other charges earlier this year. Was or wasn't It
• 42:07
  Speaker 1: was not? I think he must have meant was probably
• 42:16
  Speaker 1: when that came that came up, and when we did that,
• 42:18
  Speaker 1: I think we did the episode. Yeah, remember we interviewed
• 42:21
  Speaker 1: were you there when we interviewed the women that got
• 42:23
  Speaker 1: mauled by the otter? No, I was telling a story
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: on that one where I was in a restaurant overhearing
• 42:35
  Speaker 1: people next to me. There's a huge table full of
• 42:37
  Speaker 1: people and they were actually from an animal rights organization.
• 42:41
  Speaker 1: They're having a dinner of Bozeman based animal rights organization
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: and I'm overhearing them and there's a guy plotting. I
• 42:51
  Speaker 1: got caught by my wife because I wasn't paying attention,
• 42:53
  Speaker 1: but she was telling me because I was so engrossed
• 42:54
  Speaker 1: by what they were talking about. And he was plotting
• 43:00
  Speaker 1: than Illinois, but he wanted to be able to vote
• 43:03
  Speaker 1: in a swing state, so was switching all of his
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: stuff around to be able to go vote in Michigan. Wow,
• 43:13
  Speaker 1: because he wanted to vote in a swing state because
• 43:16
  Speaker 1: he wanted to vote against Trump. So then I said,
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: when Trump says the election was rigged, I was like,
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: well there's one.
• 43:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it ain't zero, ain't zero.
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: Uh Man. This guy, he even though we said we're
• 43:36
  Speaker 1: no longer going to talk about pre chewed food, he's
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: like asking if there could be one last little thing.
• 43:46
  Speaker 2: No, well that's an in depth.
• 43:55
  Speaker 1: Deal, man. He's got it's a lot in here.
• 43:58
  Speaker 2: He's got bullet points.
• 44:05
  Speaker 1: Okay, there's a guy that's a tough one. There's a
• 44:10
  Speaker 1: guy that wrote in and he had some things to
• 44:15
  Speaker 1: say about making babies eat solid food and the advantages
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: of breastfeeding. Then another guy wrote in and said, what
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: does he know? He's a he's a DDS.
• 44:27
  Speaker 2: Okay, what's dds?
• 44:29
  Speaker 1: Dennis? And he laid out all these credentials and talked
• 44:33
  Speaker 1: about how this guy doesn't know what he's talking about.
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: Now he's got a rebuttal.
• 44:41
  Speaker 2: Uh when people say, what is what? What do they know?
• 44:45
  Speaker 2: He's just a dentist. How do you know that guy
• 44:47
  Speaker 2: isn't a hobbyist just like research some other topic when
• 44:52
  Speaker 2: he goes home. Sorry, credibility. Yeah, when people say he
• 44:58
  Speaker 2: what did he know he's a dentist? What people don't
• 45:01
  Speaker 2: know that like maybe his hobby's going home and researching
• 45:03
  Speaker 2: that kind of Well here's where he came out. Swing.
• 45:05
  Speaker 2: I don't I don't have a degree in hunting whitetail bucks.
• 45:09
  Speaker 1: But you know, but it's like it's it's sort of
• 45:13
  Speaker 1: like a little bit generally be like generally accepted. Like
• 45:16
  Speaker 1: if we're having an argument about George Washington, okay, and
• 45:19
  Speaker 1: you're like, oh, he chopped down that cherry tree, you know,
• 45:21
  Speaker 1: and lied about it. And then a guy's like, well,
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: I have a PhD in American history and I did
• 45:30
  Speaker 1: my dissertation on the my You know, my thesis was
• 45:35
  Speaker 1: on the veracity of the claim that George Washington chopped
• 45:39
  Speaker 1: down a cherry tree and lied about it. Now, if
• 45:42
  Speaker 1: I'm hearing this conversation, I'm probably gonna be looking to
• 45:46
  Speaker 1: the PhD cherry chopper guy, Yeah, to maybe have a
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: little more intel about that occurrence.
• 45:53
  Speaker 2: I understand that, but I I think sometimes people get
• 45:59
  Speaker 2: a little carried away with sometimes.
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: Yes, but in some areas, this guy was saying, hey, man,
• 46:04
  Speaker 1: it's better to breastfeed babies, and it's better to pre
• 46:08
  Speaker 1: chew food and give them meat and give them tough
• 46:11
  Speaker 1: stuff to chew on, chewy steaks and whatnot, and that
• 46:14
  Speaker 1: we're creating muscular problems by giving babies all this soft food.
• 46:19
  Speaker 1: And he has little squeeze bottles. This other guy writes
• 46:23
  Speaker 1: in being like, you know, here's the deal. I'm the
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: real expert, and that's all bs is what he says.
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: M Okay, the dentist said that this other dentist gotcha. Now,
• 46:34
  Speaker 1: this first denist comes back swinging because this other guy
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: said his kid wants to fight that guy's kid.
• 46:43
  Speaker 2: All right, let's hear it, dang, I'll tell you what
• 46:47
  Speaker 2: dentist that thinks right.
• 46:52
  Speaker 1: It's so it's so complicated, we really do, I really want.
• 46:55
  Speaker 2: To get into this. I probably agree with the dentist
• 46:58
  Speaker 2: who's all about eating deer meat and drinking milk.
• 47:02
  Speaker 1: He starts out with a little dig because this guy
• 47:05
  Speaker 1: was saying in the end of it, he made a
• 47:06
  Speaker 1: joke like, hey, my kid'll fight your kid anytime. Okay,
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: now that so the first Dennis now writes in, and
• 47:14
  Speaker 1: he dresses his letter to the guy, so it's Max
• 47:18
  Speaker 1: on one side and Matthew on the other side. Max
• 47:21
  Speaker 1: wrote in saying, you should give your babies tough deer
• 47:24
  Speaker 1: meat to help their jaws develop. And when their jaws
• 47:27
  Speaker 1: develop and their musculature develops, it helps them in all
• 47:30
  Speaker 1: kinds of ways throughout life. Yeah, this other guy's saying
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: that's horseshit. That guy's name is Matthew. The first guy's
• 47:35
  Speaker 1: Max Max Max. So now Matthew writes, Dear, honorable, honorable
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: and distinguished colleague, Matthew, it's no shock that your baby
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: wants to fight mine. Kids are wild. But here's the kicker.
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: There's a connection between sleep disordered breathing and ADHD in children.
• 47:58
  Speaker 1: ADHD's hallmark. Hyperactivity and emotional chaos can make kiddos more
• 48:04
  Speaker 1: prone to throw hands in the playpen. A little slight
• 48:10
  Speaker 1: sticks the knife right in the ribs before he even
• 48:13
  Speaker 1: gets started.
• 48:17
  Speaker 2: He goes on.
• 48:17
  Speaker 1: Now, you might be asking, what does sleep breathing have
• 48:20
  Speaker 1: to do with my kid's weak jaw? Excellent question. Research
• 48:26
  Speaker 1: shows a high prevalence of mallow clusion, underdeveloped jaws, and
• 48:31
  Speaker 1: children with obstructive sleep avenue compared to the control group.
• 48:37
  Speaker 1: Simply put, your kid's jaw might be slacking in their sleep,
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: and mood might be paying the price. And he goes next.
• 48:48
  Speaker 1: I imagine you saying you still haven't proven that my
• 48:50
  Speaker 1: baby's diet of squeeze bag peas and rubber nipples is
• 48:53
  Speaker 1: ruining their jaw, And you're right. Every kid responds differently.
• 48:57
  Speaker 1: But here's what research tells us. Breastfeeding is a positive
• 49:01
  Speaker 1: factor that seems to reduce the incidents of posterior crossbite,
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: skeletal class two and distal occlusion, and primary mixed dentician.
• 49:11
  Speaker 2: I knew that. I didn't know.
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: That animals raised on soft foods show more rotated and
• 49:22
  Speaker 1: displaced teeth, crowded premolars, and absolutely and relatively narrower dental arches.
• 49:32
  Speaker 1: Get this, middle aged adults in rural Kentucky had better
• 49:38
  Speaker 1: occlusion than younger folks. The younger generation grew up eating
• 49:43
  Speaker 1: commercially processed foods while their elders chomped on coarse, homemade fair.
• 49:57
  Speaker 1: Then he goes out with a bunch of disclaimers. Breastfeeding
• 50:00
  Speaker 1: is noise easy, feeding kids course or foods feels like
• 50:03
  Speaker 1: a battle. We're all doing the best we can. But
• 50:07
  Speaker 1: he ends with this, here's my advice. Cheer up some venison,
• 50:11
  Speaker 1: spit it into your baby's bowl, and let the kid
• 50:13
  Speaker 1: take a nap.
• 50:17
  Speaker 2: That sounds like great advice.
• 50:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And then he has all the citations, Dirt, if
• 50:21
  Speaker 1: you want me to afford them to you.
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that'd be nice.
• 50:23
  Speaker 4: Is this Is this a side of Stirring the Pot?
• 50:26
  Speaker 4: Is this an intro onto that that series?
• 50:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Stirring the Pot. That's my next show, TV show,
• 50:35
  Speaker 1: stir in the Pot. You know what this?
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: Then I said, yeah.
• 50:39
  Speaker 1: I'll be like, hey, you know what's I'll call Dirt's girlfriend,
• 50:44
  Speaker 1: you know, hands checking in.
• 50:47
  Speaker 4: This is stirring the pot.
• 50:51
  Speaker 1: That's kind of weird thing there. And Scott just can't
• 50:53
  Speaker 1: stay thinking about the same dirt said there.
• 50:59
  Speaker 2: Anyway, how let you go.
• 51:01
  Speaker 4: I want to say, Hill, I.
• 51:06
  Speaker 2: Have a great night.
• 51:08
  Speaker 1: He has dirt been field. Okay, you just said something
• 51:12
  Speaker 1: kind of strange about you there to night. Everything good.
• 51:17
  Speaker 2: I wouldn't worry.
• 51:17
  Speaker 1: I know if everything's fine, I don't know. Don't you know?
• 51:19
  Speaker 1: I don't want to portray his trust.
• 51:21
  Speaker 2: Gotta go another call, come there, do me a favorite.
• 51:24
  Speaker 2: Don't tell my.
• 51:24
  Speaker 4: Called Stephen reneul Is is signing off for stirring the pot.
• 51:36
  Speaker 1: You know, I don't know. I mean, I want to
• 51:38
  Speaker 1: talk about the mussloader, but mussloader hunt, but I don't.
• 51:41
  Speaker 1: I don't have to talk about musslier hunt. Seth. You're
• 51:43
  Speaker 1: an expert. How many do you kill the mussloader?
• 51:45
  Speaker 2: Seth? Well, at one point in time I killed more
• 51:48
  Speaker 2: white tails with the mussloader than a rifle al lock. Yeah,
• 51:53
  Speaker 2: but I surpassed that now. I don't know, six, seven, eight, ten,
• 52:01
  Speaker 2: I don't know. A handful, handful? Yeah, all bucks, Nope,
• 52:05
  Speaker 2: not all bucks, some bucks, some bucks mostly does.
• 52:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah. How many times have you dropped the hammer on
• 52:11
  Speaker 1: a buck and the gun didn't go off or you
• 52:13
  Speaker 1: messed up something several?
• 52:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, no, go ahead. Well, how often was it
• 52:19
  Speaker 2: a drive versus a like still hundred most most drives, yeah,
• 52:23
  Speaker 2: most drives, maybe all drives. Yeah, I think all the
• 52:27
  Speaker 2: deer I've ever killed with a flint lock has been
• 52:29
  Speaker 2: from a deer drive. And a lot of times it's
• 52:33
  Speaker 2: me doing the driving with rather than watching and you
• 52:37
  Speaker 2: double bump, you just well a lot of times you yeah, yeah,
• 52:42
  Speaker 2: so you jump them up and they go down, get
• 52:45
  Speaker 2: shot at and come back, so they're on the move
• 52:50
  Speaker 2: by that point. Yeah. Well sometimes yeah, uh, you.
• 52:55
  Speaker 1: Know, I don't think i've even I have one time,
• 52:58
  Speaker 1: I haven't tracked much with a round ball.
• 53:02
  Speaker 2: What do you mean like blood tracks?
• 53:03
  Speaker 1: By having blood track stuff that has hit by a
• 53:05
  Speaker 1: round ball. When we say a round ball, like we're
• 53:08
  Speaker 1: talking about there's there's muzzleloaders, and there's flint locks and
• 53:11
  Speaker 1: flint locks. It's a whole different ball game, you know,
• 53:14
  Speaker 1: because Muslims now, they're they're pretty sophisticated. You got inline
• 53:16
  Speaker 1: musloaders with special primers and everything's kind of sealed and
• 53:20
  Speaker 1: doesn't get wet. But a flint lock's hard to hunt,
• 53:22
  Speaker 1: hard to learn, you know. Yeah, And one thing about
• 53:25
  Speaker 1: when you when you loading a flint lock, you're taking
• 53:28
  Speaker 1: like a lead sphere, you know, like a musketball and
• 53:31
  Speaker 1: putting it down there. It's not conical.
• 53:33
  Speaker 2: Shaped, Nope, it's just a ball lead.
• 53:36
  Speaker 1: So when you're hitting a deer with that thing, when
• 53:39
  Speaker 1: you recover that ball, what's to end up looking like?
• 53:43
  Speaker 2: Trying to think if I ever recovered one, I don't
• 53:49
  Speaker 2: remember every recovering one.
• 53:50
  Speaker 1: Does it mushroom out or does it just punch a hole?
• 53:55
  Speaker 2: I remember one time I shot a deer like right
• 53:59
  Speaker 2: behind the sho shoulder, you know, double lunged, and it
• 54:02
  Speaker 2: was like it was the biggest blood trail I've ever
• 54:07
  Speaker 2: with that realm with the round ball. Yeah, yeah, I'd
• 54:10
  Speaker 2: love to see. I've never seen one like shot in
• 54:12
  Speaker 2: the Ballistic Jael or anything, so I honestly don't know
• 54:15
  Speaker 2: what it does in there. But yeah, I don't think
• 54:18
  Speaker 2: I've ever recovered one. Just punch out and go go
• 54:22
  Speaker 2: about their business.
• 54:24
  Speaker 1: It'd be interesting to check out.
• 54:27
  Speaker 2: The blistic jail that it does in Blistic Jael. We
• 54:30
  Speaker 2: should do that.
• 54:31
  Speaker 1: We should shoot a bunch of flint locks and and
• 54:33
  Speaker 1: uh shoot flint locks and the I mean the blissic
• 54:36
  Speaker 1: Jel doesn't know that it was a flint lock. But
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying, shoot a bunch of black
• 54:40
  Speaker 1: powder flint locks in the ballistic gel.
• 54:42
  Speaker 2: Ye, see what it actually does. I was surprised, how soft.
• 54:46
  Speaker 2: What's the non round ball one we were using?
• 54:49
  Speaker 1: This is a conical or a prelude MAXI ball.
• 54:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, the conical.
• 54:53
  Speaker 4: How soft it was when you guys were round rodding it.
• 54:58
  Speaker 2: That's lead for you man. Yeah, yeah, it gets misshaping.
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, it is not a hell oft say. It's
• 55:07
  Speaker 1: kind of got my ass handed to me on the
• 55:08
  Speaker 1: most loader hunting A lot of close calls.
• 55:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's tough.
• 55:12
  Speaker 1: If I hadn't, like I announced a family moratorium on
• 55:16
  Speaker 1: killing milder dose, I had a lot of opportunities to
• 55:17
  Speaker 1: shoot me.
• 55:18
  Speaker 2: You could kill a lot of those.
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: But o, nap man, just tough hunting a spot. I'm
• 55:24
  Speaker 1: not hunting the spot. I haven't hunted deer on hard before.
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: I kind of would go about it different now now
• 55:29
  Speaker 1: that I kind of understand how they do what they
• 55:30
  Speaker 1: do and what their tolerances are.
• 55:33
  Speaker 2: The thing about about muzzlerter like flint lock musslater hunting
• 55:37
  Speaker 2: is there's a set of challenges to get close to
• 55:41
  Speaker 2: a deer with get to get within range. And then
• 55:45
  Speaker 2: once you get in range and it comes time to shoot,
• 55:48
  Speaker 2: there's like a another You open up the door and
• 55:51
  Speaker 2: there's another set of challenges there.
• 55:54
  Speaker 1: We the the hammer cocking on those things. We are
• 56:00
  Speaker 1: they crept up on one, uh, crept up on a
• 56:03
  Speaker 1: mule deer and couldn't really determine, but it seems like
• 56:06
  Speaker 1: the hammer cocking, Yeah, spooked it. It's loud. What I
• 56:11
  Speaker 1: started doing now is our cock it ahead of time,
• 56:14
  Speaker 1: but pulling the set triggers loud.
• 56:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, the cocks. The pulling the hammerbags loud. The
• 56:21
  Speaker 2: set triggers loud. And then just like these evenings, the
• 56:25
  Speaker 2: few evenings we've been sitting out here, it's just so quiet,
• 56:29
  Speaker 2: like the wind dies down. Yeah, and you could hear
• 56:32
  Speaker 2: a pin drop. Would muzzleloaders hunt with the set trigger,
• 56:36
  Speaker 2: everything's just like down to the hair trigger.
• 56:39
  Speaker 1: I don't know. I've never in all the reading I've
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: done about hunt with flint locks, I have no idea
• 56:43
  Speaker 1: what you must have because even when you're like bushwhacking
• 56:46
  Speaker 1: another person, there's no way you were cocking that yeah
• 56:49
  Speaker 1: thing bag.
• 56:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. I wonder what they did back in the day.
• 56:57
  Speaker 4: I kept thinking of that lasting mole can scene.
• 56:59
  Speaker 2: This old trip. Oh yeah, he's he cuts off the
• 57:04
  Speaker 2: helk a couple.
• 57:06
  Speaker 1: There's a thing that that about those flint locks like
• 57:09
  Speaker 1: to give you a sense of how stealthy people were.
• 57:11
  Speaker 1: There's a thing we talked about this in the We
• 57:13
  Speaker 1: talked about this in our Long Hunters audiobook that they
• 57:20
  Speaker 1: would you would more be looking when you're trying to
• 57:22
  Speaker 1: find someone or check for people going through the woods.
• 57:25
  Speaker 1: You'd be more looking for the barrel, looking for that big, long,
• 57:30
  Speaker 1: straight barrel. You're more likely to see the barrel than
• 57:33
  Speaker 1: the dude holding it, and you look for that.
• 57:36
  Speaker 2: Straight straight lines. You'd look for the.
• 57:38
  Speaker 1: Straight line, try to in order to try to find somebody.
• 57:42
  Speaker 1: Is your soose. There's no way someone's taking stealth that seriously.
• 57:45
  Speaker 1: And then it's going to click click. He's probably laying
• 57:50
  Speaker 1: there at that set trigger engaged.
• 57:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, just breathe on that, you know, and.
• 57:55
  Speaker 1: Just protecting it so it does nothing. Breathes on it.
• 57:58
  Speaker 1: I've two times muffed up messing with the set trigger. Yeah,
• 58:03
  Speaker 1: once something with you and once here muffed up like
• 58:07
  Speaker 1: hitting the set trigger and then getting your finger around
• 58:09
  Speaker 1: because once that, once you do the set trigger. That
• 58:12
  Speaker 1: thing is on. I don't know what it is. Ounces Yeah,
• 58:15
  Speaker 1: so getting your finger it definitely can't be doing with
• 58:19
  Speaker 1: a glove, getting the set trigger and then bringing your
• 58:22
  Speaker 1: finger up and it's a weird little space and just
• 58:25
  Speaker 1: you just and also two times into the air yep,
• 58:30
  Speaker 1: or I even got the because you're just trying to
• 58:33
  Speaker 1: find the trigger, you know, and it's got that little
• 58:35
  Speaker 1: that little teeny because there's a trigger guard and it's
• 58:38
  Speaker 1: got two triggers in it. So picture your trigger guard
• 58:40
  Speaker 1: as two triggers, one big, one little, and you do
• 58:43
  Speaker 1: the one. There's not a lot of room in there,
• 58:45
  Speaker 1: for there's not a lot of room in front of
• 58:47
  Speaker 1: the regular trigger.
• 58:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 58:49
  Speaker 1: So even just trying to get your finger up in
• 58:50
  Speaker 1: the right neighborhood shoots the damn gun off for me
• 58:53
  Speaker 1: because I don't do it enough.
• 58:54
  Speaker 2: Well, we need to get you is uh like a
• 58:58
  Speaker 2: the I forget what the Thompsons used to make one
• 59:01
  Speaker 2: called a Pennsylvania Hunter and it was just one trigger.
• 59:04
  Speaker 1: Well here's what I'm getting. I'm broadcasting this out into
• 59:08
  Speaker 1: the world because then I'm willing to pay for it.
• 59:11
  Speaker 1: Let me know if you're my man, if you're a
• 59:15
  Speaker 1: gun maker, I'm getting a here's what I want because
• 59:20
  Speaker 1: because the rules where I'm at, I need an exposed
• 59:24
  Speaker 1: hammer percussion cap, not an inline exposed hammer percussion cap.
• 59:31
  Speaker 1: Single trigger muzzleoader.
• 59:33
  Speaker 2: Yep, there's some good muzzle I want to shoot.
• 59:36
  Speaker 1: I want to shoot Pirate X or Triple seven and
• 59:41
  Speaker 1: I would I'd like to shoot conicals out of it,
• 59:45
  Speaker 1: which is one less thing because like normally, when you load,
• 59:49
  Speaker 1: like in the old oldie days, when you load a
• 59:51
  Speaker 1: flint lock, you pour your powder charge down the barrel
• 59:54
  Speaker 1: and then you got to take a piece of what's
• 59:56
  Speaker 1: called the patch, so the ball doesn't grab the ball
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 1: doesn't grab the lands and the barrel that well, So
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 1: what you do is you wrap the ball in a
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 1: greased patch, and that grease patch is kind of like
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 1: you're wadding or like it. Yeah, yeah, and that is
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 1: what helps throw a spiral on it when it comes
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 1: out that patch. So if you shoot there, they make
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 1: these bullets that you don't need the patch. I want
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 1: a gun and I don't want any bullshit someone saying like, oh,
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 1: it's you know, subma whatever, like peep site, single trigger
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 1: shoots conicles. The barrels spiraled for kind of twisted for conicles,
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 1: percussion cap.
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 2: There you go, that's what I want.
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 4: How far are they shooting? I'm going you mentioned it.
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 2: How far are they shooting modern muzzle lators that would
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 2: be under regulation in Montana like the.
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 1: Bes knees the way the right spelled here, Yeah, you know,
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 1: one hundred yards because you can use the optic.
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that can't use like the fancy in lines here.
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 2: So that's the limited states stay. Also, an optic is
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 2: real helpful.
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, an optic helps you out a lot. When we
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 1: did when we did long in our Long Hunters audiobook
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 1: about the Daniel Boone and the Hide Hunters, Like I'd
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 1: always had this question about how good were guys, Like
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 1: how good really were guys with with flintlocks? You know,
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 1: because in the mythology there's like, you know, old tick liquor,
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 1: like it could shoot a tick off a deer shooting
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 1: balls and hitting a hatchet blade and splitting the ball
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 1: and killing two guys, you know, like whatever, all these
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 1: accounts lasting Mohicans, these like three hundred yard running shots
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 1: through the woods, you know, hitting guys, Like how good
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 1: they were? So when we were working on that, me
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 1: and Randall got into the question of like trying to
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 1: find accounts of like what really could be done with
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 1: the flint lock. Yeah, you know. And similarly, now that
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 1: we're coming out with our Mountain Man one, we're kind
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 1: of like, how really were they catching bab Like like
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 1: what were the set Like how did they catch beaver
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 1: in the mountain beyond the lower kind of yeah, like
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 1: beyond the like oh they did this, that and the
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 1: other thing. And you're reading like, I don't think that's
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 1: what they did, you know, it doesn't make sense. And
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 1: I don't think they were splitting shots against hatchets and
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 1: killing two guys like waiting for like the Indian to
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 1: hold his hatchet up and then he hit his blade
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 1: and he killed.
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 1: So there's these shooting contests that we talked about in
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 1: that long hundred piece. You can just go by it
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 1: in the you know, it's a it's an audio books,
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 1: you can purchase it. There's these guys called Uh, there's
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 1: these real bad bad dudes Brady's Rangers, and like these
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 1: are bad dudes.
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 2: Like bad like badass or yeah bad like they're both
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 2: doing outlaw.
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 1: There were some bad dude they were like he had
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 1: some so they were like along the Ohio River in
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 1: the mid seventeen hundreds when tribes would cross like the
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 1: Shawnee and people would come from the north across the
• 1:02:59
  Speaker 1: river and raidss in West Virginia, yep, raid settlements in Kentucky.
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 1: These he had this collection of he had this collection
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 1: of woodsmen and hunters that he formed into this like
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 1: kind of almost like this little bit of a It
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 1: was almost like a paramilitary special forces unite. And they
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: would get on their trail and track them and they'd
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 1: track them back across the Ohio or they'd ambush them,
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 1: like they'd find canoes part hidden they like the Shawne
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 1: would sink canoes now and then like they'd cross the
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 1: Ohio and sink their canoes and then go raid. So
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 1: these rangers would wait at river crossings and stuff, and
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 1: they raised some help, but they oftentimes like they oftentimes
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 1: like got their man, but then they got some other
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 1: guys too. They were they had a reputation for being
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 1: somewhat indiscriminate in their pursuits and if they were tracking
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 1: someone ran to somebody else. Anyways, there's some bad dudes
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 1: and they were considered like crack shooters, and there's some
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 1: accounts of them competing against regular soldiers in shooting contests,
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 1: and they would clean their clock, but they would make
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 1: a mark on a tree. They would make a mark
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 1: on a tree the size of a dollar bill, which
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 1: was the we have the dimensions on it. It's not
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 1: quite like our dollar bill today. But you're basically making
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 1: a hatchet slash in a tree like a bill, and
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 1: then at sixty paces and they could put most but
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 1: not all of those balls into that mark. Regular soldiers
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 1: could not. So that gives you an idea of like
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 1: what really was what they were really doing.
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and that's the same the soldiers and the the
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 4: bad boys are using the same.
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 1: No, so the soldiers have way better just wait because
• 1:04:52
  Speaker 1: they're hunting with the hunting rifles. There was at that
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 1: time people weren't the backwoodsman. It's kind of funny. The
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 1: backwoodsmen were getting into rifled barrels, and they were getting
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 1: into lighter calibers, smaller balls and rifling, and soldiers were
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 1: oftentimes given these smooth bares, and like the rifling kind
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 1: of came from a different direction of how guys caught
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 1: on it. So these guys were shooting like pretty sophisticated
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 1: but oftentimes home like handmade guns.
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 4: Yeah, customized customer out.
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 1: Wow, where you're actually taking a bar in, rolling that
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 1: bar to make the barrel, like hammering it out, rolling it,
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 1: smoothing it out, cutting the lands and grooves and cutting
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 1: the grooves into it. Whole thing all made by.
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 2: Hand, understanding their tool.
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 1: But like, how good could you be, because like they were,
• 1:05:49
  Speaker 1: I think of how inconsistent gunpowder is. You're pouring shot
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 1: by hand, right, it's you know, it's just a lot
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 1: of inconsistencies. But there's the mythology is how good these
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 1: guys were these flint locks. But and it's still impressive,
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 1: but they weren't like you know, in our reachar. It's
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 1: just like for someone to hit to hit a deer
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 1: at two hundred yards was really something that was really
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 1: something with a flint lock, but shooting at shooting at
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 1: sixty paces was like pretty what you were after, which
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 1: is very similar, Like it's like not too terribly far
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 1: off from what you're looking for now. Yeah, a flint lock,
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 1: and that's putting them into ah, you know, and that's
• 1:06:30
  Speaker 1: putting them into a something about the size of a bill.
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 1: They would shoot further distances at the head of a
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 1: shooting at the head the top of a keg, which
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 1: is so it's about an eight inch circle. They would
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 1: set up and you would They would set up and
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 1: go a little farther and try to put it into
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 1: an eight inch circle. So they weren't miracle workers with
• 1:06:53
  Speaker 1: those things.
• 1:06:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, just knew the tool, knew the rifle very well.
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 1: I could definitely see like I was telling myself, I'm
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 1: going to do this but now, but recognizing I'm probably
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 1: lying to myself, I was like, man, I should just
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 1: do it where for like a bunch of years going forward,
• 1:07:06
  Speaker 1: I only hunt with that freaking flint lock.
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 2: That's all I touch. Tough guys to do it.
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 1: Just be like, yeah, Jim Becktel yep, just be like
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna humpt if I like, I'm only like like
• 1:07:19
  Speaker 1: same way like certain dudes like cam Agnes, he just
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 1: huntsed a bow, he don't hunt the gun. Doesn't do it,
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 1: and be like I only hunt with the flint lock
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 1: until I get that thing mastered.
• 1:07:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you'd always have to be in that one twenty
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 2: hundred yards zone.
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 1: No, sure, I don't give a shit. Yeah, just get
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 1: where I'm like Joe flint Lock Man or Steve flint Lock.
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 1: I'm not gonna actually do that. But if I was
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 1: cooler than I am, that's what I would do.
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 2: He had more time, That's what I would do. See
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 2: this book, Old Grizzly. This book is phenomenal.
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 1: I'm only pointing this book out because this guy just
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 1: put together it was like, it's like a journal. Did
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 1: you put together? It's self published.
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 2: Journals.
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 1: Yep, Old Grizzly to a better understanding of life on
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 1: the frontier?
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 2: Is that him?
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 1: That's Old Grizzly. So this guy's later and he's a
• 1:08:19
  Speaker 1: grizz He was hunting grizzlies in the cell kirks.
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 2: Oh nice, and.
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 1: Uh, it's phenomenal man. You know, we do Steve Reid's books,
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 1: so you ain't got to We even have a little
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 1: I don't have it with me, but there's a thing
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 1: that goes it's time.
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 2: Oh you have it.
• 1:08:40
  Speaker 1: You play it into my Endo SAT's headphones. It's time
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 1: for Steve Lee's books.
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 2: So you ain't got to.
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 1: See what I'm saying.
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 2: Old.
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 1: So it's a series we do where I read a
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 1: book and I just find the good parts can tell
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 1: you about them. Yeah, and then you ain't got to
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 1: read it. You ain't got it because I already read it,
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 1: and I told you all the good parts.
• 1:09:15
  Speaker 2: Got more time to shoot your flint lock.
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 1: Yep, you ready for a couple of these?
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 2: Yep.
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 1: In the winter, we often hunted muskrats with long spear
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 1: we had made from a quarter inch round iron rod.
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 1: It had a sharp barb on the spear end and
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 1: a round wood handle fastened on the other end. When
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 1: the ice would bear our weight, we would go out
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 1: to their houses and shove the spear through the center
• 1:09:41
  Speaker 1: of each house. The houses were made of grass and
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 1: mud from the edge of the lake and were easily penetrated.
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 1: We seldom missed getting at least one from each place
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 1: we tried. The spear was sharp and it made a
• 1:09:56
  Speaker 1: clean cut in the pelt, which did not depreciate its value.
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 2: Dang, that's cool. What year was this?
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 1: I'll get you arrested. Don't do that now, So I'm trying.
• 1:10:10
  Speaker 1: So he was running around in uh old grizzly here
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 1: one second, Old Grizzly killed fifty six grizzly bears in
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 1: Western Canada, all the Selkirks between eighteen ninety five and
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 1: nineteen twenty four. Then he went back in nineteen thirty
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 1: five and killed another one. So most of this action
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 1: is occurring in the mid like like well, most of
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 1: the action is occurring in the early nineteen hundreds.
• 1:10:42
  Speaker 2: Okay, you can't do that now, you can't.
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 1: Go can't gig muskrats anymore through the roof of their house.
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 2: Ready for this?
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 1: Yes, directly he's talking about and pike, spear and fish
• 1:11:05
  Speaker 1: if no, Okay, directly he's talking about they go out.
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 1: They'd go out to spear northerns Okay for commercial uh
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 1: for commercial sale. But here's an interesting bit. The highest
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 1: price we got for our fish was around four cents
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 1: a pound, and that was for black bass, large mouths.
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 1: So in those days they were spearing large mouths through
• 1:11:35
  Speaker 1: the ice and sell them for four bucks for selling
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 1: them for four cents a pound on the commercial market.
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 1: So you would go into a fish market in those
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 1: years and you could buy large mouth bass. You could
• 1:11:49
  Speaker 1: buy speared large mouth bass and bring it home to eat.
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 2: At the table.
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 1: In the fall of the year, we would make a
• 1:11:56
  Speaker 1: few dollars by what we called pulling trees. Settlers living
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 1: on the prairie would come to town and hire boys
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 1: to pull up small cottonwood seedlings, which grew on the
• 1:12:07
  Speaker 1: sand bars along the river. The settlers planted the seedlings
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 1: around their homes to start a windbreak. Some settlers had
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 1: extra land given to them by the government provided they
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 1: planted it with trees, and we also supplied seedling trees
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 1: for such planting. The seedlings were usually about ten inches
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 1: long and grew in clean sand from seeds washed there
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 1: from the previous season. It was easy for even a
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 1: small boy to pull up a dozen or more at
• 1:12:35
  Speaker 1: a time. We tied them in bunches of a thousand,
• 1:12:39
  Speaker 1: for which we received twenty cents. We considered this an
• 1:12:45
  Speaker 1: easy way to make money.
• 1:12:48
  Speaker 4: Wonder what's in flat like what would the math beyond that?
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 4: Like what's twenty cents nowadays? And from nineteen twenty like
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 4: a hundred bucks?
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 2: You want to know what else he would do for money? Yep.
• 1:13:02
  Speaker 1: Sometimes the settler wanted maple seeds to plant, We supplied them. No,
• 1:13:07
  Speaker 1: he did all his hunting in Western Canada, but grew
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 1: up in the Midwest Okay. Sometimes the settler wanted maple
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 1: seeds to plant. We supplied them, but it was hard
• 1:13:17
  Speaker 1: work to get them. We first had to chop down
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 1: a tree and then strip the seeds from the limbs,
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 1: and they usually were so firmly attached that it was
• 1:13:26
  Speaker 1: a case of pulling off one seed at a time.
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 1: The settlers paid us one dollar for a gunny sack
• 1:13:34
  Speaker 1: full of these maple seeds. We noticed that some of
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 1: the sacks were larger than others, but soon got over
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 1: that difficulty by filling up the bottom of the big
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 1: sacks with leaves.
• 1:13:47
  Speaker 2: That's called cheating, dirty or just opportunistic. You get seven
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 2: dollars fifty cents. Oh, Zoey got under ten bucks for
• 1:14:01
  Speaker 2: a thousand cottonwoods.
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 1: My kid went to a turkey shoot at the bow range,
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 1: and I was trying to explain to him that when
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 1: I was a kid, a turkey shoot, Like now you'll
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 1: shoot targets to win a frozen turkey.
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I used to do that.
• 1:14:16
  Speaker 1: Well, when I was a boy, you could go down
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 1: to our gun range and there was an actual turkey shot.
• 1:14:22
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, behind a sand They put a turkey behind
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 1: a sandbar, and well you just shoot. You had to
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 1: have twenty two and hit it head its head.
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 2: Whoever got it got the turn.
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 1: That's dodging around back there with just his head sticking
• 1:14:37
  Speaker 1: up out of a sandbar. I was so little, I
• 1:14:40
  Speaker 1: didn't do it, but it was the thing, huh, he said.
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 1: He's talking about these guys going to a turkey shoot.
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 1: It was always an interesting sight to watch these old
• 1:14:51
  Speaker 1: timers load their rifles at the turkey shoot, which was
• 1:14:54
  Speaker 1: an annual affair at home. They were all good shots too,
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 1: and never never failed to get a turkey. The men
• 1:14:59
  Speaker 1: would lie up along the river bank and shoot at
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 1: a turkey place with its feet tied together on the
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 1: shore some distance away. The shots were ten cents and
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 1: the bird was yours if you hit it anywhere.
• 1:15:14
  Speaker 2: Sounds like a good deal.
• 1:15:19
  Speaker 1: I'm trying to think if I'm gonna tell you about
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 1: any more of these, you know what he gets into.
• 1:15:24
  Speaker 1: He winds up having exposure. This is the last thing
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna tell you. I'm run on the show. He
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 1: winds up having exposure to you know, the guy that
• 1:15:32
  Speaker 1: killed Jesse James.
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 2: Oh, kind of backstabby Robert Ford.
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he has some details about when the killing of
• 1:15:41
  Speaker 1: Robert Ford. Mister Ford was standing at the bar talking
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 1: to a man about contributing some money to a fund.
• 1:15:52
  Speaker 1: He was raising to bury one of the dance hall
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 1: girls who had just died. As four turned from the bar,
• 1:16:02
  Speaker 1: he called a greeting to O'Kelly, that's who killed Robert Ford.
• 1:16:10
  Speaker 1: He called a greeting to O'Kelly, who was only about
• 1:16:12
  Speaker 1: five feet away, without saying a word. O'Kelly pulled up
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 1: the gun and fired a blast the buckshot from both barrels,
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 1: which blew away half of Bob Ford's head.
• 1:16:26
  Speaker 2: Oh, what's called a greeting? Mean?
• 1:16:30
  Speaker 1: Just to listen, I'm only on page twenty seven. I've
• 1:16:34
  Speaker 1: read the whole thing.
• 1:16:36
  Speaker 2: It's a heavy hitting the whole way.
• 1:16:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, look at these Look at all these highlights I
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 1: got in mind.
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 2: Wow, I don't got to read it anymore.
• 1:16:42
  Speaker 1: Though, you don't need to read it because now you
• 1:16:44
  Speaker 1: know the main good parts.
• 1:16:47
  Speaker 2: What's called a greeting? Mean?
• 1:16:49
  Speaker 1: Well, he wanted to make it so, he wanted to
• 1:16:52
  Speaker 1: make so Jesse James gets killed by Robert Ford. It's
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 1: kind of a trader, yeah, and in this guy around town,
• 1:16:57
  Speaker 1: it's kind of local bad guy around town wants to
• 1:16:59
  Speaker 1: make a name for himself. He wants to kill Robert
• 1:17:02
  Speaker 1: Ford to make a name for himself. He doesn't get
• 1:17:04
  Speaker 1: any trouble for it. Yeah, Robert Ford has a bar
• 1:17:07
  Speaker 1: and I've heard other accounts that he took a bunch
• 1:17:09
  Speaker 1: of h He took a bunch of pipe iron pipe,
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 1: and cut it into little rings, and then chiseled those
• 1:17:20
  Speaker 1: rings in the little slivers and actually funneled that down
• 1:17:23
  Speaker 1: the barrel of a double barrel and shot Robert.
• 1:17:27
  Speaker 2: Ford with that bunch of shrapnel. Wow.
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 1: Some accounts have him cutting Robert Ford in half down
• 1:17:32
  Speaker 1: at the waist, and some accounts his account has him
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 1: cutting Robert Ford and half along the head.
• 1:17:39
  Speaker 2: Jeez.
• 1:17:41
  Speaker 1: He wound up dying a violent death.
• 1:17:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah, oh the other guy.
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 1: He died of violent death. Yikes.
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 4: It's all for today. Do you still think this was
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 4: the worst trip you've ever been on?
• 1:17:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah? Absolutely, Yeah.
• 1:18:02
  Speaker 1: This is a low point in my life.
• 1:18:04
  Speaker 2: Really, That's what I try to think of other bad
• 1:18:07
  Speaker 2: ones we've had fifty years.
• 1:18:08
  Speaker 1: Is the lowest point in my life. Nothing to do
• 1:18:13
  Speaker 1: with that up from here March. Yeah, nothing to do
• 1:18:15
  Speaker 1: with that, Maggie. There's the lowest point in my life.
• 1:18:17
  Speaker 1: There's it's just like, yeah, it's like I don't know
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 1: what to do. I don't know how I can go
• 1:18:21
  Speaker 1: home and be a father to my children. You know,
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 1: I feel like he'll be like, you know, yeah, they'll
• 1:18:29
  Speaker 1: be like I was raised by They'll they'll they'll grow
• 1:18:31
  Speaker 1: up later in life, they'll they'll go to a therapist
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 1: and they'll say, I was raised by a broken man.
• 1:18:37
  Speaker 1: Were fine, I'd be like, he was fine until like
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 1: December twenty fourth. After that he was.
• 1:18:42
  Speaker 2: A broken make the shell of a man. He'll be like,
• 1:18:46
  Speaker 2: what broke your old man? He'd be like the flint
• 1:18:48
  Speaker 2: lock muscle.
• 1:18:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he got, he went down, he got knowing my
• 1:18:52
  Speaker 1: mom didn't want him to do it, but he got
• 1:18:54
  Speaker 1: that God damn flint lock.
• 1:18:59
  Speaker 2: The first time there broken, second time, definitely broken.
• 1:19:04
  Speaker 1: And he was never the same. He just took to
• 1:19:06
  Speaker 1: the bottle, you know, Coca Cola with all next flip
• 1:19:17
  Speaker 1: season when I'm flir like Joe, you know, I'm not
• 1:19:22
  Speaker 1: hunting next year's flint lock season because I have already
• 1:19:25
  Speaker 1: killed a buck during regular season with my flint lock.
• 1:19:29
  Speaker 1: Because that's all you well, you don't know flint lock.
• 1:19:32
  Speaker 1: But but that said, I am in the market for
• 1:19:33
  Speaker 1: that that gun, that single trigger, percussion cap, long barreled,
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 1: straight shooting Maxi ball gun and your gun makers out
• 1:19:42
  Speaker 1: there all right. Thanks y'all get