Latest / Straumann® ProTalk / Dentistry is more than teeth: Dr. Marlene Teo on holistic and emotional care

Transcript

Dentistry is more than teeth: Dr. Marlene Teo on holistic and emotional care · Straumann® ProTalk

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  Illness comes in from the mouth so they can look inside and look at your
• 0:03
  tongue and say, oh, you're anemic.
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  Or they look at your gums and they say, oh, you're depressed.
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  You are specialized in perio, as you said you do a lot of complex
• 0:11
  implant work, bone regeneration, where did this passion come from?
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  When I came out of dental school, I really wanted to be an orthodontist.
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  All my exams are ready.
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  I'm like I did all my internships, like my half my foot was in the residency course.
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  Then I would call this like a butterfly effect, but what happened
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  was that I went for this talk.
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  Welcome to ProTalk.
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  Welcome to the Pulse of Dentistry and today welcome to Villa Moura in Portugal,
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  where we record this episode from the International Aesthetic Days, which
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  for us Straumann is one of the most important events in a year, speaking
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  about excellence in aesthetic dentistry.
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  Today, we have a very special guest that is not only special because of her
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  special clinical skills and clinical excellence, but also very special in
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  the way she's engaging with patients.
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  And you will learn throughout the episode about this.
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  So welcome, very warm welcome, Dr. Marlene Teo from Singapore.
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  Welcome, Marlene, great to have you.
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  Thank you Andreas, for inviting me.
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  And thanks for coming over to Portugal.
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  This was a long trip for you.
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  I know.
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  And it's a pleasure to have you in the ProTalk, but also later to have you
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  on stage here at the aesthetic there.
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  So really looking forward to this.
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  So in this episode, what will be very special is we will speak a lot about
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  patient engagement, patient communication, building connection to patients.
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  So if you think that this is just any soft skill or doesn't matter at all.
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  I think this podcast, this episode will make you rethink and you will
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  just realize it's a superpower that you want to build for your practice.
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  And I think Marlene, you're just a great person to, to learn from this topic.
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  So Marlene, to introduce Who's Dr. Marlene Teo in one minute.
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  Okay.
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  I am a periodontist from Singapore, and I think by accident I found out that
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  I'm really engaged in holistic wellness.
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  Okay, I think in society, there's a little bit of misconception how like
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  holistic wellness is a little bit like woo, crystals, blah, blah, blah, blah.
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  But to me, holistic wellness is about integrating holistically
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  through health, spirit, body and mind to enhance the immune system so
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  that you can have absolute health.
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  And this includes the mouth.
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  So I would say that me as a periodontist, I would say that what defines me
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  currently is how I would like to integrate holistic wellness into my practice at An
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  Dental in Singapore, and also Le by An Dental in Singapore as a periodontist.
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  So this is me in a nutshell.
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  Cool.
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  So welcome Marlene, and happy to dive into this topic more.
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  To start with, today you are a dentist, how was your journey actually to enter
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  this field from the very beginning
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  ? I, okay, so I come from like a family of doctors and I did it for two reasons.
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  Okay.
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  One was a pure act of rebellion.
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  So my parents, it's like Asian parent thing.
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  They were like, they just assumed I was going to be a medical doctor,
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  but I was at that stage in life where if you told me to do something, so
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  if my parents said you can't dive, I would be like taking a diver's course
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  and diving the next day in secret.
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  So I did dentistry partly as an act of rebellion.
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  Plus I also saw that all like the smart kids were actually going
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  into the medical field, and I saw a blue ocean in dentistry.
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  I was like, wow, for once, I don't wanna be in the rat race.
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  This is something.
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  So I wasn't passionate about dentistry itself.
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  I was just like, wow.
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  But dentistry is exactly like medicine.
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  Why?
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  Why is everyone going this route?
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  So I was like, oh, since no one's going there, I'm going to go ace it.
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  So I did.
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  So that was my reason why I chose dentistry in the first place.
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  Part rebellion, part bullshit.
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  Okay.
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  I never regretted it.
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  Oh no.
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  It was like the best rebellion I've done ever.
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  And the dentistry is a broad field.
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  And you focus on some of the most complex treatments that you can focus on.
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  You are specialized in perio, as you said you do a lot of complex
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  implant work, bone regeneration, where did this patient come from?
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  Because you could have also taken another route within the dentistry.
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  So it's interesting because I think there was a misunderstanding
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  somehow that I was an orthodontist.
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  And the very interesting thing is when I came out of dental school, I really
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  wanted to be an orthodontist, so I had done all my applications, so I took
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  my exams, so all my exams are ready.
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  I'm all like I did all my internships, like my half my
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  foot was in the residency course.
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  Then I would call this like a butterfly effect.
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  But what happened was that I went for this talk and at that point in time,
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  Ray Williams was in Singapore and I had the lecture which was actually
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  on periodontitis and systemic health.
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  Okay.
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  So initially just to backtrack a little bit, initially, they, the school, national
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  University of Singapore had unwanted me to go overseas to do periodontology,
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  and I said, no, there's no way.
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  It's so dirty.
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  I'm not gonna be a periodontist.
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  So that was an option.
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  But when I saw Ray giving his talk on systemic health, I turned to the
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  guy who happened to be beside me.
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  One of the most powerful figures in dentistry in Singapore, his
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  name is Prof Patrick Tseng.
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  So I turned to him and I said, haha, maybe I should be a periodontist after
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  all, like half sarcastic, half joke.
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  So at lunch he goes to the dean of the dental school, prof. Keson
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  Tan goes to Ray whom he knows, and he said, take this girl.
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  I got into North Carolina, the University of North Carolina in Chapel Hill, the
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  Periodontology program, which was probably one of the best programs in the us.
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  At that point in time because I made a joke and when I interviewed with Ray,
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  I even told him, I'm not sure that I like blood and imagine there's so many
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  other people competing for this spot.
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  But he took me and to this day, I don't know why he took me.
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  And I remember his words to me when actually I call Prof. Williams
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  I don't think I like blood.
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  I'm not sure what I'm gonna do when I get into your program.
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  And he goes, Marlene, you just might change your mind.
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  And to this day, I can't sit through a lecture without seeing any blood.
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  So I became a periodontist by what I call a butterfly effect.
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  It's almost like destiny, it like switched overnight because I made that comment
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  too, maybe I should be a periodontist.
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  This, and it came one full circle.
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  So I, this passion comes maybe from destiny and also the fact that I
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  realized I really do like to see blood.
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  I love rehabilitating, dentitions, ripping out all the old teeth,
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  teeth that are really failing and putting them into a body that is
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  able to accept these new implants.
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  Because without health, if you teeth are already falling out,
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  if you put in the implants, your implants are gonna fall out as well.
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  So to me it's the passion comes from.
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  A few of these things.
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  Yeah.
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  So this guy in North Carolina has probably seen something in you that you
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  didn't, and maybe at one point, yeah.
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  You wanna ask him what it was, but he saw your talent probably for it.
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  And also, so I did ask him, I was like, why did you take me?
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  And you know what he said?
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  He said, I wanted to see people all over the world that was
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  treated in periodontal medicine.
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  In the University of North Carolina.
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  So that was his ebe and I just happened to be in the right place at the right
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  time, and I hope I will be able to grow this legacy in Singapore and maybe Asia.
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  So this is how you decided to become a periodontist, so Yes.
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  Let's say surgical specialist.
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  Yes.
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  Was there a specific defining moment where you then realized that you said, look,
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  we can do all of this in a more human and more connected way to the patient?
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  Yes, so I would say that.
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  The, I wanted to connect more closely even when I was in the dental school,
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  so it wasn't, when I was a periodontist, there were actually two defining moments.
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  The first moment was when I was in dental school and the patient said, I hate you.
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  You look so young, and as dentists, we get this all the time.
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  I hate you.
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  Excuse me, I, it's not nothing personal, but I hate dentistry and I
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  was thinking at that point in time, because I come from a family of
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  doctors, I don't see my dad who's a gynecologist, nobody says that to him.
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  You don't say that to your cardiologist.
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  Why do people say that to dentists?
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  So I realized perhaps it's true.
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  It's true, right?
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  So like it was the way we were communicating with patients.
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  Why do patients.
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  Hate dentists.
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  So that's number one.
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  So that was one defining moment.
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  And when I graduated from dental school because I was the valedictorian, they
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  interviewed me and they said, what do you wanna change in dentistry?
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  And I still have this record, like in the papers.
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  So I said.
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  I want to change people's perception of dentistry in the year 2000.
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  Okay?
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  But I forgot about it.
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  I need to let you know that I forgot about it.
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  I continued with my career as a periodontist, then as a periodontist,
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  what got me to switch again was I felt that I was doing all my surgical stuff.
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  I was putting in implants nicely in the correct position, but strangely enough.
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  When I became a yoga teacher and I started to find myself more in yoga, I think you
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  have to sit in wellness, like you sit in stillness actually, and then when you
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  come like more into yourself, you start realizing, oh, this is what I really want.
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  When I sat with myself, I realized, hey, what's lacking in myself is this ability
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  to connect with the patient so that they have a better experience with dentistry.
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  And then I remember what I said in the year 2000 and I said, oh,
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  I lost myself along the way and now it's time to come back to it.
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  So there were two defining moments, actually.
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  One, when I graduated from dental school because of what patients
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  said, and two, when I. Sat still and came in touch with myself.
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  So there were actually two defining moments.
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  Yeah.
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  Yeah.
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  These moments are very powerful.
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  We don't have them often enough, actually.
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  That's why yoga is is such a powerful exercise to do.
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  Yes.
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  So let's start diving into this.
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  How you do this.
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  Marlene I'm curious, and I would like to start actually with your practice.
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  You said your practice, that the name, the practice that you build is on dental.
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  What is the meaning behind this word on.
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  And why did you choose it the first place?
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  So I wanted a practice that could bring peace and safety to the patient, right?
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  So I wanted to work on that fear and why people hate us.
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  So the word on in Mandarin is actually, it means peace, right?
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  So peace means, so invention we say.
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  An means safety wan means stability.
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  So I wanted to give a place which provided peace, safety,
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  and stability to the patient.
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  Now, the very interesting thing about an is that the word an in mandarin,
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  the word is actually modular.
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  So the word an the top part is called a ba. That means roof, the bottom part.
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  Means new means woman.
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  So when you combine the top part with the bottom part, it actually means it, you
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  need, you can have peace and safety with a woman's touch because it feels like home.
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  So the whole word represented my Asian roots.
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  And what I wanted to give to the world.
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  The word on itself was because of that.
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  And my logo designer came up with a really interesting concept where he put
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  a circle around the word on, because you don't just want to be empathetic
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  to the patient and give them a sense of security, you also wanna give
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  them precision surgical accuracy.
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  So he put a circle around the word UN to create a seal of trust.
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  So that's where the.
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  A name came out and also how the logo came out.
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  So that's where the whole a came to express what the vision that
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  we wanted to bring to the world.
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  It's a very thoughtful way of designing your name and I think it's pretty
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  much reflects also your philosophy.
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  And I read in the interview that you said, look let's say dental phobic patient,
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  if we can say and there are lot, lots of those, and I think everybody knows and I
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  wonder why this is, but they need to feel.
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  Welcome and safe to let go.
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  So how do you navigate through this with a patient, the patients that are coming
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  through you that they let go, there's this fear, this anxiety, this shame that they
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  have in a situation, in a dental practice.
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  How do you do patients experience this?
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  So I think.
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  Very importantly, we have to go through the five senses.
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  So what creates safety in someone, I would say comes through
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  sight, smell, touch, taste.
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  Hearing.
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  Yeah.
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  Sorry, wait.
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  Sight, touch, smell.
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  Taste.
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  And
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  hearing.
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  Yes.
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  And hearing.
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  Okay.
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  I think we created a very safe environment.
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  So like we use music colors that are calming and flowing.
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  That's one.
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  And then also like song, we play music and then we have a team.
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  And then we touch on all the senses so even when it comes to feel, we
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  give weighted blankets and also like little squishies to hold whenever
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  they hit it, feeling nervous.
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  But I think what's very important also, we hire a team that's very empathetic.
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  So it starts right from the front desk to the nurses, to the doctors.
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  So once we're able to bring them into the environment, there's some
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  people that freeze because of fear.
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  And when that happens as a doctor, I think the first thing you need to do is not to
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  try to approach, when someone's fearful, if you try to go in, the first thing
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  they do is to climb up a person who's stuck in fear, shame, or anxiety always
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  has walls, and I liken it to a them.
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  So you can't go in and say you can't bash that dam because
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  there's so much pressure inside.
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  That pressure is stronger than whatever you could poke.
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  Yeah.
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  But.
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  You have to be safe enough for them to open that door up a little bit so that
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  they can let the pressure flow out.
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  Now, once that pressure flows out and it goes away from their brain,
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  they're able to think properly and express what they want to feel.
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  And so how do you let them open the door?
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  I feel that.
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  That, emotional dentistry is something that's really important.
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  You don't just say, Hey, I'm gonna sort this out for you.
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  The first thing you do is to retreat and say, why are you here?
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  That's the number one question.
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  Okay.
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  Number two, why do you fear the dentist?
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  So usually when you say, why are you scared, the patient pauses because they
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  actually don't know why they're scared.
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  So when they're still be, then they will tell you a story.
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  Oh, when I was a kid.
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  I was traumatized, blah, blah, blah.
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  Oh, I really hate the sound of the drill.
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  So number one, you have a factual thing.
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  And I'll say, oh, the instruments here are very quiet.
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  But the first thing is to get them to open up and then you
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  start hearing their problems.
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  And then the next step is not to jump into solve the problem.
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  I think the most important thing is to remain in yourself so that they
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  can come to you and express what.
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  They're feeling.
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  And once that dam opens you are able to sort it out.
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  Because the funny thing about trust is that when you
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  don't trust has to be earned.
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  And you don't earn it by doing things or anchoring in that person.
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  If they're able to come to you and they feel safe in that space,
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  once you develop that trust.
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  Things just flow and then they're gonna be able to listen and hear,
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  and all that shame and anxiety actually gets let out like a dam.
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  And then you're able to come up with a treatment plan and say,
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  Hey, I can sort this out for you.
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  But that could take the next session.
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  So the first session is almost like therapy.
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  You open it up a little bit.
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  And it comes up.
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  And then you can build a connection.
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  Yeah.
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  And then you go in with the treatment
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  Is there like a specific methodology you use or like
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  psychological technique as well?
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  Because I, I imagine, the way you phrased it and you have a very mindful
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  way of asking question and then behaving, not jumping and solving the
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  problem, but still opening the patient.
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  Is that something that you learned from somewhere or that is a specific
• 16:59
  technique or you developed all of this by yourself based on your instinct?
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  I don't think I have a specific technique, but I think yoga and stillness.
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  And maybe divinity has kept me more centered nowadays.
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  So rather than an experience as well.
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  So if you keep pushing someone and you realize there's no entry, sometimes
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  the other way is just to retreat and be an observer and see what happens.
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  It's a technique that I've I would say I've developed, but
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  just by watching people, and even watching people whom I admire.
• 17:37
  Yeah.
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  You see how they approach people.
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  And even in life, it's not about dentistry.
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  Why do some people encourage people to open up to them?
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  Then I realized, oh, this is the technique.
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  You just don't go barge in.
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  You let them come to you and you do that by opening that door just a little bit.
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  So I wouldn't say there's like a specific technique, but it comes with
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  a lot of number one, groundedness and two, empathy and being able
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  to listen and understand and.
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  Three refraining from trying to solve the problem immediately.
• 18:11
  So you literally developed it by yourself?
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  Yeah.
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  Based on your background and learnings.
• 18:17
  Yes.
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  And I know you have a lot of let's say surrounding education
• 18:20
  as well on be nutrition, holistic medicine and much more.
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  But, can people learn from you?
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  Do you share your knowledge?
• 18:27
  Do.
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  Do you give courses or is there no time for doing that?
• 18:31
  No one's asked me.
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  So I don't know it's the first time I'm articulating what I do.
• 18:37
  This is literally the first time no one's actually asked me.
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  So like, when, this podcast was really interesting because when you ask me
• 18:46
  these questions it forces me to sit down and say, what am I actually doing?
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  So yeah, I. No, no one's.
• 18:53
  I've never given a course, I've never actually thought about it, but I
• 18:57
  would say this is an actual technique to get people to open up first.
• 19:02
  Yeah.
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  You also, you are very mindful about I would say.
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  Mouth body connection or perio systemic link
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  As well.
• 19:12
  So we, beyond what you do with the patients and how you make them feel
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  in your practice, based on the five senses, what else are you looking
• 19:19
  into the treatments to optimize the treatments beyond just the, I would
• 19:23
  say the clinical dentistry treatment, it's just something on nutrition that
• 19:27
  you're doing on other holistic medicine.
• 19:30
  Approaches.
• 19:31
  So once we break that freer barrier, right?
• 19:34
  So the next thing our bottle at Al Dental is as within, so without, okay.
• 19:39
  So what It means that without inner health, you cannot have a sustainable
• 19:45
  outer appearance, and the outer appearance means the mouth as well.
• 19:50
  So what we do is really emphasize on like the medical issues.
• 19:53
  So when you come in, of course everybody takes a medical history.
• 19:56
  But once you're diagnosed with gum disease, we don't stop that.
• 20:00
  We wanna know why.
• 20:01
  All our patients have to go through additional medical testing if
• 20:05
  they have not done so already.
• 20:07
  And this medical testing includes pre-diabetes.
• 20:10
  We're not talking about diabetes here, we're talking about
• 20:13
  doing a glucose tolerance test.
• 20:15
  We are also doing a HbA1c test to see how much sugar there is.
• 20:19
  So sometimes you can pass your fasting glucose, but it doesn't
• 20:22
  mean that there's like sugar.
• 20:23
  You need to find out if sugar is like stuck in your collagen as well.
• 20:27
  We also do a lot of vitamin D testing.
• 20:30
  So vitamin D is shockingly underdiagnosed in Asia because especially in Singapore,
• 20:35
  you think it like, it's so hot everybody.
• 20:38
  It's so sunny.
• 20:39
  Yes, it's so sunny.
• 20:39
  Yes, but what a lot, and me included, I was diagnosed with low vitamin D
• 20:44
  because I don't wanna go to the sun.
• 20:46
  Don't wanna get freckles, right?
• 20:47
  So I'm like indoors all the time.
• 20:49
  I'm wearing sun block and I was, my vitamin D levels
• 20:53
  were like 18 or something.
• 20:54
  So I realized that if I was vitamin D deficient so many
• 20:58
  other people are as well.
• 20:59
  And when we do the vitamin D testing.
• 21:01
  In our clinic, we find a shocking number, maybe 90% of gum disease patients in our
• 21:07
  clinic are actually vitamin D deficient.
• 21:10
  So because of all those tests that we run, we support that body mouth
• 21:16
  connection from the inside out as well.
• 21:18
  So I would say that really helps maintain the stability of the gums.
• 21:22
  Because you can clean and clean, but if you are not sorting out your
• 21:25
  body your throat is still gonna fall out, your gum disease is gonna weak.
• 21:28
  Could relapse if there's something untreated, like high sugar levels
• 21:33
  thyroid, even thyroid illnesses or even hormone imbalances like
• 21:38
  polycystic ovarian syndrome.
• 21:40
  So all these things contribute.
• 21:41
  So I would say that in our clinic we really emphasize what's
• 21:45
  happening in the body as well.
• 21:47
  Yeah.
• 21:48
  And so you really go down to the root cause.
• 21:50
  We do,
• 21:50
  and I think what's very important is management of stress.
• 21:54
  Which is where my other sideline interests actually come in.
• 21:58
  So it seems like sometimes in my life I have all these like very interests.
• 22:02
  But in the end though, very weird thing is that it's all
• 22:06
  supportive of what I'm doing.
• 22:08
  Like I became a yoga teacher in 2016.
• 22:11
  I was just bored.
• 22:12
  I was like, started on yoga.
• 22:13
  I just found it.
• 22:14
  Intriguing.
• 22:16
  And then when I realized that I became a lot less stressed because
• 22:20
  of yoga, I said, Hey, this is a wonderful way to reduce stress.
• 22:23
  So during that period, there was.
• 22:26
  Not much educational literature on yoga and gum disease, but nowadays there
• 22:31
  are few reports coming out how yoga can specifically relate to gum disease.
• 22:35
  But very specifically, yoga has now been shown to reduce stress in so many ways.
• 22:41
  And by doing that, reducing stress as a risk factor for gum
• 22:45
  disease, you enhance the stability of treated gum disease as well.
• 22:50
  Yeah, that's how we
• 22:52
  help patients.
• 22:52
  So that's very interesting.
• 22:53
  Marlene is also you.
• 22:56
  Prepare the patient holistically based on the five sensors.
• 22:58
  Then, you look at them holistically from a systemic
• 23:02
  perspective, and you prepare them.
• 23:04
  You eliminate deficiencies like vitamin D deficiencies, so you prepare them.
• 23:10
  So if there's the day of surgery now.
• 23:12
  That because at one point there, there is the day of surgery how do
• 23:16
  you specifically prepare this day and the patients for that day so that they
• 23:20
  feel comfortable in these treatments?
• 23:22
  That can be scary for patients.
• 23:23
  I understand and you do some complex cases as well.
• 23:26
  So how do you.
• 23:29
  Support the patients at the day of surgery.
• 23:31
  Okay, so we, on the day that they come for the consultation, you
• 23:35
  usually get a feel about whether this patient needs sedation or not.
• 23:40
  So there are some patients that cannot sit on the dental chair, and those
• 23:44
  patients, sometimes we even let them.
• 23:47
  So we have these patients that burst into tears in the waiting
• 23:49
  area, so they won't even go.
• 23:51
  The phobia is so great that they can't even walk into a
• 23:54
  dental room without crying.
• 23:56
  So I have this flashlight.
• 23:58
  So sometimes I do my treatment planning in the waiting room just by looking
• 24:02
  at that and I'm not gonna hurt you.
• 24:04
  And then I have the flashlight and I look in and then I say,
• 24:06
  Hey, I'm just gonna touch you.
• 24:07
  And then I feel all the shaky teeth.
• 24:09
  And then we send them for x-rays, CT scans, and we do the workout.
• 24:14
  With photos.
• 24:14
  So basically, I'm not touching them.
• 24:16
  I just, all I do is use my fingers.
• 24:17
  I have no tools.
• 24:18
  So because they're in the waiting room, they feel safer.
• 24:21
  So these kind of patients there's no talk.
• 24:25
  Like they're either gonna be sedated or GA then we do the big surgeries
• 24:31
  on them because all these, all in four cases, sometimes all you need to
• 24:34
  do is to clear that one big hurdle.
• 24:36
  And once you do that.
• 24:37
  They feel so proud of themselves, they're able to come back for the reviews.
• 24:41
  So I'll say there's this first subset of patients where they just
• 24:45
  cannot sit in the dental chair.
• 24:48
  Then there's another subset where they scared, but you can work on them, right?
• 24:52
  So those kind of patients, you can go through the steps without sedation.
• 24:57
  You can do that with local anesthesia and all that.
• 25:00
  So with local anesthesia patients.
• 25:02
  What we do, again, we engage the five senses.
• 25:05
  They come in we have a aromatherapy.
• 25:08
  So I was like, what smell do you want?
• 25:10
  So we have a range of senses in our office.
• 25:13
  Okay.
• 25:13
  We can burn, like we have lavender, right?
• 25:15
  We have a mixture.
• 25:17
  We play a favorite music.
• 25:18
  So every room has a stereo.
• 25:20
  Like system, you can watch tv.
• 25:23
  So we treat them like kids.
• 25:24
  We, we have nitrous as well.
• 25:27
  Which I seldom use because I don't like it blocking my way.
• 25:30
  So again, then we have the weighted blankets, and then we have squishy balls.
• 25:34
  So when we are using the squishy balls, sometimes we ask the
• 25:38
  patients, can we tap your shoulder?
• 25:41
  And they're like, what?
• 25:42
  Then we're like, yeah, just tap your shoulder and then say, open your mouth.
• 25:45
  And then we'll, and we're giving the injection after
• 25:48
  putting top topical anesthesia.
• 25:50
  We get them to think.
• 25:52
  So I'll get them to think of the left shoulder.
• 25:54
  And when they're thinking of the left shoulder, I say, breathe
• 25:56
  in, and then the needle goes in.
• 25:58
  So they'll be like, oh, I didn't feel that.
• 25:59
  So it's a lot about distraction.
• 26:01
  If you're treating a patient Yep.
• 26:03
  With local anesthesia.
• 26:04
  So now if I can do that with local anesthesia, once they're
• 26:07
  numb, we can do everything.
• 26:08
  And we can do it fast as well, because I think our team.
• 26:12
  Is trained to manage like fearful patients and to go in and out as fast as possible.
• 26:17
  The other tip that I would say is really helpful to practitioners
• 26:21
  is that don't need the patient a hundred percent, like to 180 degrees.
• 26:25
  What people fear in dental chair, the loss of control.
• 26:27
  So if you put them at 45 degrees and they feel they can breathe,
• 26:32
  you can do so much more.
• 26:33
  So I would say these are the.
• 26:34
  Few tips that I could give if the patients are not knocked out, otherwise,
• 26:39
  knock them out or, all these tips to keep them safe in the chair.
• 26:44
  No,
• 26:44
  no thanks.
• 26:44
  It's very tangible.
• 26:46
  I would like to go to, back to one point that you mentioned earlier.
• 26:49
  Now making patients feel safe.
• 26:51
  It's not only about you and your practice, also about your team, right?
• 26:54
  It's a whole culture that you need to build in your practice.
• 26:57
  So how do you select the people that work for you and what would you say if you.
• 27:03
  Interview people.
• 27:04
  What skills, do you, first of all, do you hire for skill or potential?
• 27:10
  And the second one is, what behaviors is non-negotiable for us, for you, or
• 27:14
  what characteristics are non-negotiable?
• 27:17
  I would say when you, I'll talk about like this the nursing staff first, okay?
• 27:22
  To get nursing staff, you have to start with the A players and you have
• 27:26
  to be very clear about what you want.
• 27:28
  For example, for me, I hire based on integrity number one.
• 27:33
  Intelligence and initiative.
• 27:36
  Okay.
• 27:37
  This is from Warren Buffet.
• 27:39
  The this three eyes is actually attributed to Warren Buffet, but I
• 27:42
  think a lot of people have talked about it, but, and he says that without
• 27:47
  number one, which is integrity, the other two become dangerous qualities.
• 27:50
  And I totally agree with that.
• 27:52
  And when we hire for intelligence, I'm not talking about iq.
• 27:55
  We're hiring for emotional intelligence as well.
• 27:58
  The person that can read the room.
• 28:00
  So the first few people that you hire must embody this in an A standard.
• 28:09
  'cause the minute you start with A B, this B is going to set the
• 28:13
  tone for the rest of the company.
• 28:15
  Which means that I have to be an A as well.
• 28:17
  So if I'm hiring, I better make sure.
• 28:19
  All the other players are of a certain level, so the first step
• 28:23
  is to hire that a player that exhibits these three qualities.
• 28:27
  Then from then on, everybody has to match the standard.
• 28:31
  And one of the things that I say, and this sounds almost cruel, is to fire fast.
• 28:37
  And I think it's a great strategy because if they come in and
• 28:41
  they don't fit, you have to.
• 28:42
  You have to have that difficult conversation.
• 28:44
  Hey, I don't think you're like a great fit for the team.
• 28:47
  You might be better off elsewhere.
• 28:48
  And it's like dating.
• 28:50
  You don't waste anybody's time, so you switch it up.
• 28:52
  And there's and the one that sticks, they really stick.
• 28:55
  So a long time, for a long time, the minute they join.
• 28:58
  It fits.
• 28:59
  They're in there forever because now they've joined the locker room.
• 29:01
  It's like a soccer team.
• 29:03
  If they are, if they get along in the soccer, in the locker room, they're also
• 29:07
  going to be like a really tight team.
• 29:09
  So right now, even when I'm here, they're hiring people.
• 29:13
  The team is hiring people, the nurses.
• 29:15
  So they meet the team first and I say, does this person fit?
• 29:19
  So they'll say, oh, I think her vibe matches.
• 29:22
  Then.
• 29:23
  They'll say, okay, they call me love band, by the way, which means boss.
• 29:26
  So should we hire her?
• 29:27
  I'll say, go ahead, sign her on.
• 29:29
  But I will have that conversation with this person, say, Hey, it right
• 29:34
  at the start, so nobody gets hurt.
• 29:35
  We're hiring based on whether you fit the team.
• 29:38
  I don't say, oh, are you an A player or not?
• 29:39
  We're hire.
• 29:40
  And if it's not a good match, we may ask you to leave, or if you
• 29:44
  feel that you don't match, you need to let us know and we let you go.
• 29:47
  So it's like a three month testing period.
• 29:50
  And usually after the first two weeks, we can tell.
• 29:53
  So the ones that stick forever and the ones that don't just leave.
• 29:57
  Yeah.
• 29:58
  So that's how we hire our nurses.
• 29:59
  I can tell you Marlene, it's very similar with us.
• 30:02
  It's I can only agree, you shouldn't compromise.
• 30:04
  And often people you let go, you know that they find a better home elsewhere as well.
• 30:09
  We have to clearly see this.
• 30:10
  It's not only about us, it's also about them.
• 30:12
  So we
• 30:12
  Agree.
• 30:13
  They find a better home elsewhere and they're so happy somewhere else.
• 30:16
  Exactly.
• 30:16
  Yeah.
• 30:16
  That's true.
• 30:17
  Yeah.
• 30:18
  It's a lot about emotional connection what you're speaking about.
• 30:22
  Is it too deep emotional connection at times an issue for your people?
• 30:25
  Is it important that sometimes you teach them also to have a distance
• 30:28
  between the patients and themselves?
• 30:30
  Because you try to emotionally connect deep, but sometimes you don't
• 30:33
  want the people to take this home.
• 30:35
  Probably the your staff is that.
• 30:38
  Becoming an issue or that, did this become an issue for you at one point?
• 30:41
  So I think the thing about emotional connection on a dentist
• 30:47
  level is to not let it affect you.
• 30:50
  Because if you feel too involved in that story, you get thrown
• 30:54
  off center and you are off.
• 30:55
  Don't use to anyone.
• 30:56
  So I think everyone in our office detach us the minute.
• 31:00
  We go home.
• 31:02
  The other thing that we do is that we try not to engage with
• 31:07
  people that don't match our vibe.
• 31:08
  And this includes patients as well.
• 31:10
  So we select our patients as well, not in a so what I'm what I mean about
• 31:15
  selecting patients is that sometimes if they come in and they're rude to
• 31:18
  the staff, sometimes we let them go.
• 31:21
  At the counter, or when we do the consultation and this person
• 31:24
  just, this is not a good fit.
• 31:26
  We actually say, Hey, we might not be able to help you in this area.
• 31:28
  And we send them off of their x-rays.
• 31:30
  So by not engaging with someone who's going to drain your energy,
• 31:34
  I think it protects us as well.
• 31:36
  So like our family.
• 31:38
  Of dentists and nurses we mean intact.
• 31:42
  So we have that high energy and empathy to go on to the next person that like
• 31:46
  matches our vibe and once no, and once this kind of treatment from us,
• 31:50
  so let's move a bit on to another topic.
• 31:52
  That was very insightful by the way, Marlene.
• 31:55
  You are also into mentoring.
• 31:57
  You are leading also the women in Implantology network in Southeast
• 32:00
  Asia, which we are very grateful for.
• 32:03
  Where is this, let's say this passion for sharing and helping other
• 32:08
  young female talents flourishing?
• 32:10
  Where is this patient coming from and why do you do it?
• 32:12
  Okay, so first I need to qualify something.
• 32:15
  I've actually stepped down from the leadership and win.
• 32:18
  Yeah.
• 32:18
  I'm actually just, I'm still part of the core team, but I'm not
• 32:21
  but it's still a core player.
• 32:22
  I hope so.
• 32:23
  But the passion, I would say it's a passion, but, and sometimes I'm
• 32:28
  almost embarrassed to talk about it.
• 32:29
  I'm not sure if people want to hear from me, but what I would like I'd
• 32:34
  just like to share my experience and.
• 32:38
  Oh, hopefully they can learn from my mistakes as well.
• 32:41
  So I think what a lot of female females ask me is, should I have kids?
• 32:49
  Okay.
• 32:50
  So that's another thing that I've get, I get asked a lot on a
• 32:53
  casual basis, should I have kids?
• 32:55
  Like how does it affect your career?
• 32:57
  And my answer to them was.
• 33:01
  If you wanna have kids, but know that it may affect your
• 33:04
  career and it very likely will.
• 33:07
  Even if you have a supportive partner or if you have supportive family,
• 33:13
  just taking on an additional basket is going to mean that you're gonna.
• 33:17
  Have to take some time out from whatever you've carved out, right?
• 33:21
  So expect to have a dip.
• 33:24
  So you must know that you're gonna have a dip.
• 33:26
  It is not possible to do it without a dip, but you must also understand that
• 33:31
  like kids grow up and leave the nest.
• 33:33
  So if you are able to accept the fact that you're not gonna be able to give
• 33:36
  a hundred percent, for example, to writing a hundred research papers.
• 33:41
  And you are okay with writing 70 research papers per year,
• 33:45
  and you're okay with that.
• 33:46
  By all means, have a kid because this is going to take up your energy again.
• 33:49
  But then, once the kid grows up, you can grow up to go for that writing 200
• 33:54
  research papers because now they're big.
• 33:55
  So it, if you wanna have kids, please do and.
• 33:59
  It's, how much that dips depends on how much support you're
• 34:02
  getting from the outside.
• 34:04
  And you can have it at any point in your life.
• 34:06
  Just for me, for example I gave up lecturing in 2012.
• 34:11
  I thought I was done for good.
• 34:14
  I was only working three to four days a week.
• 34:16
  When I, when my kids were small.
• 34:18
  And I thought I would never, ever be on the lecture circuit again, but
• 34:23
  again, through a twist of it, and I'm not sure why I am back doing it.
• 34:27
  So I don't even have pictures because I just stopped lecturing.
• 34:31
  So I stopped taking pictures.
• 34:32
  I take pictures from to, to assess my own surgical skills, but now
• 34:36
  suddenly I'm back on the podium.
• 34:38
  Speaking about emotional dentistry in the world circuit.
• 34:43
  So it's like a really strange twist of faith and i'm back, so that's good.
• 34:46
  Yeah.
• 34:47
  But I think that's the beauty of it, Marlene, that, this is exactly
• 34:50
  what, the young next generation of, female clinical leaders can
• 34:55
  learn, from careers like yours.
• 34:57
  And I think that's very encouraging, to see this, if you look into the
• 35:00
  future of dentist dentistry what would be your wish, where dentistry
• 35:03
  and especially implant dentistry is developing tool based on, let's say.
• 35:08
  Your ecosystem that you built.
• 35:11
  So I think number one, I would like dentistry to be unified in itself.
• 35:17
  So right now I, you can say we're working in multidisciplinary teams, but how
• 35:23
  much do you know about orthodontics?
• 35:26
  How much do we know about sleep apnea?
• 35:28
  How much do we know about even like the prosthetic part?
• 35:33
  If you're putting an all on next treatment, you can't say, oh, I'm
• 35:36
  just gonna slam in the implants and someone's gonna put in the resta like
• 35:39
  the restorative, but what if the patient crashed out his teeth bef because he
• 35:44
  had sleep apnea in the first place?
• 35:45
  So I would say in dentistry, we need to learn all that right down to the base.
• 35:50
  And I think Anura Imp Empower is doing a fantastic job with
• 35:54
  this term, unified dentistry.
• 35:56
  They're going to hold a three mask that like they.
• 35:59
  They call it the three masters and the theme, it's unified dentistry.
• 36:03
  So we already see this in Asia.
• 36:04
  People are trying to, Dr. Jean, who's been a guest here, she's really a
• 36:08
  huge proponent of a fan girl of us.
• 36:11
  She's she's put it all together in dentistry and I think the quality
• 36:16
  of education that she started
• 36:19
  For dentists is just phenomenal.
• 36:21
  Exceptional.
• 36:21
  It's exceptional.
• 36:22
  So that's Jeanette and Unified Dentistry and.
• 36:26
  What I would love on my part is for dentistry to be considered a body part.
• 36:32
  So in medicine you have the gynecologist, you have the cardiologist
• 36:36
  but where are the dentists?
• 36:38
  So my dream is for the medical specialty to understand that.
• 36:44
  Okay, so in Mandarin we call, we have this phrase that means the
• 36:49
  illness comes in from the mouth.
• 36:51
  And I'm sure they meant you, you food okay, food, right?
• 36:54
  But.
• 36:55
  The Chinese practi traditional TCM the tradit, they actually look into
• 36:59
  the mouth to diagnose your problems.
• 37:01
  So they can look inside and look at your tongue and say, oh, you're anemic.
• 37:04
  Or they look at your gums and they say, oh, you're depressed.
• 37:08
  So a lot of these things actually connected to the mouth.
• 37:12
  And so I hope one day the medical people will say, Hey, why is there high CRP?
• 37:18
  How come there's so much inflammation and you don't go looking for.
• 37:22
  All the other body parts, maybe start looking in the mouth as well.
• 37:25
  If there's this integration of medicine and dentistry, it would be absolutely
• 37:30
  beneficial to, that would very powerful.
• 37:33
  Yeah.
• 37:33
  That's a very beautiful dream to have,
• 37:36
  man.
• 37:36
  That is my dream.
• 37:37
  Yeah.
• 37:37
  Thanks for sharing all these insights, Marlene.
• 37:39
  That was very interesting.
• 37:40
  Also wanted to give you the opportunity to ask a question to me or to Straumann
• 37:44
  that you always wanted to ask.
• 37:46
  Okay.
• 37:47
  So for Straumann, where you're known for like surgical accuracy skills.
• 37:52
  Basically hard skills.
• 37:54
  Are you guys doing anything in like the holistic wellness space?
• 37:58
  Is there room for improvement in your company?
• 38:01
  Oh, that's that's, the question that suits very well, our conversation
• 38:05
  for us, a very challenging one.
• 38:07
  And yes, we are known for, everything starts with titanium parts, as you said.
• 38:11
  It's hardware that we do.
• 38:13
  But we have some instances where we start to look a bit more holistic.
• 38:17
  Like we have we have a company called BOT that we are partnering with and, I
• 38:22
  think that's one very little example.
• 38:24
  It's about vitamin D where we start to to distribute also vitamin D.
• 38:29
  This is not only the vitamin D but the testing before.
• 38:32
  Clinicians can test the vitamin D levels before they do surgery.
• 38:36
  It is quite similar what you do.
• 38:37
  You do it much more holistic, but here you can test the vitamin D level
• 38:41
  and in case there is a deficiency, there is also then a vitamin D.
• 38:46
  A dosage that, that you can give and you can build this back up
• 38:49
  again before you do the surgery.
• 38:50
  Amazing.
• 38:51
  Because this is what we find that there's there is more and more evidence coming
• 38:55
  and showing that it will, it, it does do a difference in terms of let's say
• 39:00
  bone healing, but also tissue healing.
• 39:02
  There's more and more evidence coming today.
• 39:04
  Many people would say the evidence is maybe not yet strong enough, but we see
• 39:07
  also that actually that it's a trend that a lot of clinicians are starting
• 39:11
  supplementing the patients, which I think is a. Is a, is an excellent trend to do.
• 39:15
  So we start slowly but surely, but I have to say we can
• 39:18
  learn a lot from you Marlene.
• 39:19
  Thank you.
• 39:19
  Str this is great.
• 39:20
  That test kit right?
• 39:21
  Before the surgery is going to be so helpful for everyone.
• 39:24
  Exactly.
• 39:25
  Yeah.
• 39:25
  It's a blood test that you can do.
• 39:26
  I did it myself as well.
• 39:28
  Started supplementing after as well.
• 39:30
  You are vitamin D deficient.
• 39:31
  Yes.
• 39:32
  Not anymore, probably.
• 39:33
  Okay.
• 39:33
  But yes and that, that's I think a little pa piece that we can we can do.
• 39:38
  So thanks a lot, Marlene.
• 39:39
  That was a very interesting conversation.
• 39:42
  Thanks for sharing.
• 39:42
  And, taking us into this very different world, yet very important world
• 39:46
  because we know, it's the patients.
• 39:48
  It's not a functional visit that they wanna do that, they wanna feel well and.
• 39:52
  That there are a lot of people that have anxiety going to dentists.
• 39:55
  We know it.
• 39:56
  And I think the way you approach it, there are a lot of learnings for clinicians
• 40:00
  out there that they can take from this.
• 40:01
  So the first learning for me, I think is.
• 40:04
  To have a holistic, balanced approach.
• 40:06
  It needs a holistic and balanced person leading it, which,
• 40:09
  which is you in this case.
• 40:10
  You are really balanced in yourself, right?
• 40:12
  And you do a lot for this yourself.
• 40:14
  And I think if you would not be balanced and is mindful, it would be
• 40:17
  very difficult for you or impossible to implement this in your practice.
• 40:20
  And then I'm very impressed how you built this, them systematic with the, looking on
• 40:25
  the five senses, how you select your team.
• 40:27
  I think again, we come back to the team and how important the team is to make
• 40:31
  this a success because you are just a very small experience for the Yes, I
• 40:36
  agree.
• 40:36
  In the journey of of a patient.
• 40:38
  I agree.
• 40:39
  I think this was very insightful.
• 40:40
  So thanks a lot Marlene.
• 40:41
  Thank
• 40:41
  you for inviting me.
• 40:42
  I'm very appreciate.
• 40:43
  Our pleasure and looking forward to your lecture now here at Aesthetic Days.
• 40:47
  And to all the listeners thanks for listening in.
• 40:50
  I hope you felt also this was a very special episode.
• 40:52
  And please watch out for new episodes to come for Straumann ProTalk.
• 40:57
  You can always interact with us.
• 40:59
  We are very interested in.
• 41:01
  Your comments, your thoughts, your ideas your questions as well.
• 41:05
  And best be done on our Instagram account, which is Straumann Global.
• 41:08
  We are always happy to receive your direct matches, so thanks a lot for listening in.
• 41:12
  See you next time.
• 41:13
  Thanks a lot, Marlene.
• 41:14
  Thank you so much, Andreas.