Latest / Rugby Direct / Rugby Direct - Episode 128

Transcript

Rugby Direct - Episode 128 · Rugby Direct

• 0:09
  Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from news Talks EDB. Follow
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• 0:17
  Speaker 1: Yet inside the game from every angle.
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: It's Rugby Direct with Elliott Smith, powered by news Talks EDB.
• 0:24
  Speaker 3: Welcome into Rugby Direct powered by habit Health, tackling all
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  Speaker 3: your aches and pains from sport and work. Get online
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  Speaker 3: at habit dot health to get back in the game faster.
• 0:34
  Speaker 3: We are back in the game. We are back in
• 0:35
  Speaker 3: the people city of christ. Your joys a special treat
• 0:38
  Speaker 3: when we record Rugby Direct in the Garden City. And Liam,
• 0:42
  Speaker 3: I know you're excited to be here. I certainly am
• 0:45
  Speaker 3: because it's my hometown. But Liam, I know you've always
• 0:47
  Speaker 3: had a special affinity with the Garden City. So welcome
• 0:50
  Speaker 3: back and good to have you here.
• 0:52
  Speaker 4: Yeah, welcome home, Elliott. It is good to be here.
• 0:55
  Speaker 4: It almost didn't make it with the rain and the fog.
• 0:58
  Speaker 4: And I did notice something though, just wandering around town,
• 1:02
  Speaker 4: through the airports, around the shops. The kebinet just s
• 1:07
  Speaker 4: looking Bear.
• 1:10
  Speaker 3: That's all right, you know you can't win them all.
• 1:13
  Speaker 3: We'll get onto the super Rugby final bit later in
• 1:16
  Speaker 3: the podcast. The reason, of course that we are here?
• 1:18
  Speaker 3: Is the is the All Blacks squad announced last night
• 1:22
  Speaker 3: as it was as we record this thirty two man
• 1:24
  Speaker 3: squad and look awards a special occasion when the All
• 1:28
  Speaker 3: Black to name but leam perhaps a bit more special
• 1:30
  Speaker 3: this time, Gaven. We have a new coach, new management
• 1:32
  Speaker 3: and also there's always new players, but also a new captain.
• 1:35
  Speaker 3: It all felt very new, very fresh, and we've ended
• 1:39
  Speaker 3: with a thirty two man squad that I'm sure our
• 1:41
  Speaker 3: listeners have heard by now, but some surprises, some new faces.
• 1:44
  Speaker 3: So what was your initial top line reaction to the
• 1:46
  Speaker 3: All Black squad.
• 1:47
  Speaker 4: There's a lot of buzz and anticipation for this wasn't
• 1:50
  Speaker 4: there because of the new regime. What was Razor and
• 1:55
  Speaker 4: his assistant's going to bring, what was going to be different?
• 1:58
  Speaker 4: And to be honest that there's not a lot that
• 2:01
  Speaker 4: that is different. When you skim off the top layer
• 2:06
  Speaker 4: of five rookies. There is a high degree of continuity
• 2:11
  Speaker 4: coming back from last year's World Cup squad and a
• 2:14
  Speaker 4: core of experience. But we have a new All Blacks
• 2:17
  Speaker 4: captain that was widely predicted in Scott Barrett's and there
• 2:22
  Speaker 4: were a couple of big surprises, one in Hurricanes prop Tossi,
• 2:28
  Speaker 4: who I don't think anyone saw coming. And there is
• 2:31
  Speaker 4: always one bolter. It's just the way of an all
• 2:35
  Speaker 4: black squad. They have their time to assess, to sit
• 2:40
  Speaker 4: back and whether it's Dallas McLeod's this time last year
• 2:45
  Speaker 4: or Tossy this time around. So he was the big bolter.
• 2:49
  Speaker 4: And a number of fine line decisions that polarize opinions,
• 2:54
  Speaker 4: don't they from Hoskins stitut to missing out the hookers
• 2:58
  Speaker 4: first five fallback. So there's plenty to get stuck into.
• 3:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah, there is, indeed, First and foremost, let's touch on
• 3:04
  Speaker 3: the captaincy Scott Barrett, as you mentioned, not a surprise necessarily.
• 3:07
  Speaker 3: I know the drums beating for Ardie Savia, but this
• 3:11
  Speaker 3: wasn't a surprise to me that Scott Barrett has been
• 3:13
  Speaker 3: named captain. He's been Scott Robertson's captain at the Crusaders
• 3:17
  Speaker 3: for a number of seasons now since twenty twenty, won
• 3:20
  Speaker 3: a number of titles, so one Scott Robinson can trust.
• 3:23
  Speaker 3: And I think you know, we've also seen the Artie
• 3:26
  Speaker 3: Sava and Jordi Barrett have been implemented as vice captains.
• 3:29
  Speaker 3: But to me, I think the right decision. I think
• 3:32
  Speaker 3: tat the traits that Scott Robertson's pointed out around game
• 3:38
  Speaker 3: management and his ability, and there Scott Barrett has that
• 3:42
  Speaker 3: in spade, so I think that's the reason he's gone
• 3:45
  Speaker 3: with him. I know there's the Artie Savier camp, but
• 3:47
  Speaker 3: to be honest, not a huge surprise to me your
• 3:49
  Speaker 3: reaction to Scott Barrett being captain.
• 3:51
  Speaker 4: It's not a surprise Scott Barrett. As you say, They've
• 3:55
  Speaker 4: has that long standing relationship with Razor, four years, four
• 3:59
  Speaker 4: titles that they won together. But it is a big
• 4:03
  Speaker 4: step up for Scott from Super Rugby to the All Blacks.
• 4:07
  Speaker 4: He's played sixteen nine tests. He's never kept in the
• 4:09
  Speaker 4: All Blacks before, and he is aware of the enormity
• 4:16
  Speaker 4: of the role of the all encompassing responsibility, having played
• 4:20
  Speaker 4: under Sam Cain and lived through the depths of the
• 4:23
  Speaker 4: Ian Foster Sam Kaine regime and those coaching changes through
• 4:27
  Speaker 4: the struggles of mid twenty twenty two. He took a
• 4:32
  Speaker 4: couple of weeks to decide when Razor first asked him,
• 4:35
  Speaker 4: consulted Richie mccare and Karen Reid's to bounce ideas and
• 4:41
  Speaker 4: sort of understand the pressures and the expectations that he's
• 4:44
  Speaker 4: walking into, so it will be interesting to see how
• 4:48
  Speaker 4: he handles all of that. He's a quiet person. He's
• 4:51
  Speaker 4: somebody who leads from the front. He's a deep thinker.
• 4:55
  Speaker 4: He's not spontaneous, but he very much does lead through actions.
• 5:01
  Speaker 4: For me, I could have gone either way with the
• 5:04
  Speaker 4: captain c. I can see Ardie severe. He's a wild
• 5:06
  Speaker 4: player of the year. He's extremely popular in the All
• 5:09
  Speaker 4: Blacks environment. We had Dalton Popoali come out in support
• 5:13
  Speaker 4: of him, and I think that shows that there is
• 5:16
  Speaker 4: a lot of support for him within the All Blacks.
• 5:18
  Speaker 4: Aaron Smith was another guy spoke on the podcast glowingly
• 5:22
  Speaker 4: about Ardie's abilities and his emotional intellect. So I think
• 5:28
  Speaker 4: it is interesting as well that that Razer allowed Scott
• 5:30
  Speaker 4: to pick his vice captains. Artie not a surprise, but
• 5:33
  Speaker 4: Jordy twenty seven year old probably more of a surprise.
• 5:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think definitely a surprise, like he's done done
• 5:39
  Speaker 3: it with the Hurricanes, and when you say you can
• 5:41
  Speaker 3: pick a vice captain, you probably usually go with one,
• 5:43
  Speaker 3: but he's gone with two and obviously his brother or
• 5:46
  Speaker 3: he trusts implicitly younger brother, younger brother as well. Yeah,
• 5:50
  Speaker 3: he must have seen something on there for Boden, that's right. Well,
• 5:53
  Speaker 3: I think you're a smart move as well, because he's
• 5:56
  Speaker 3: surrounded himself with people that he trusts. You know, Scott
• 6:00
  Speaker 3: Barrett probably hasn't played any provincial rugby or anything above
• 6:05
  Speaker 3: with Ardi, but he's worked alongside him the All Blacks
• 6:07
  Speaker 3: for a number of seasons down and knows them well.
• 6:09
  Speaker 3: Jordi obviously knows very very well as well. So I
• 6:12
  Speaker 3: think that's a good mix of leaders in that team.
• 6:15
  Speaker 3: It's a new era, you're stamping your fresh mark on
• 6:18
  Speaker 3: the team. I think all three pretty good selections that
• 6:22
  Speaker 3: are going to lead this team Forarder. I think it's
• 6:24
  Speaker 3: really fascinating to see how the workers are dynamic on
• 6:27
  Speaker 3: the field. Obviously Scott Barrett's going to make all the calls,
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: but how often he goes to Artie Savilla and asks
• 6:33
  Speaker 3: for his advice, whether that's an on field decision where
• 6:36
  Speaker 3: it's more off the field sort of thing that he does.
• 6:38
  Speaker 3: Same with Jordy. But I think you've stamped there, stamping
• 6:41
  Speaker 3: mark on the team with that new leadership group.
• 6:44
  Speaker 4: I think i'd make the case that Scott Barrett probably
• 6:46
  Speaker 4: has a harder job to start with than Sam Caine
• 6:50
  Speaker 4: did because if you look at the makeup of that
• 6:52
  Speaker 4: leadership group, you've lost Brady Rettallic, Sam White, Locke, Sam Kaine,
• 6:57
  Speaker 4: right now Aaron Smith. That's a huge amount of leadership
• 7:01
  Speaker 4: that's left the team. And if you think about the
• 7:03
  Speaker 4: leaders that Scott will have around him, it's Artie Severe,
• 7:05
  Speaker 4: Jordi Barrett, Boden, Barrett, Cody Taylor, Patrick Twopolotu. So there
• 7:10
  Speaker 4: is experience there, but not quite to the same degree.
• 7:13
  Speaker 4: So that will be a challenge for him to mold
• 7:16
  Speaker 4: that new leadership group, get what he needs from different people,
• 7:19
  Speaker 4: hand over different responsibilities at different times. He's also going
• 7:23
  Speaker 4: to have to work with referees. One big question around
• 7:26
  Speaker 4: Scott is his discipline. Yeah, two red cards previously. That's
• 7:30
  Speaker 4: going to be a major focus, isn't it.
• 7:31
  Speaker 3: It is And Scott Robertson was asked about that at
• 7:33
  Speaker 3: the media conference last night, and I don't know if
• 7:36
  Speaker 3: he'd say cagey or didn't want to give too much away,
• 7:39
  Speaker 3: but said that certainly had formed part of the conversations
• 7:41
  Speaker 3: with Scott Barrett and Scott Barrett as well, saying that
• 7:44
  Speaker 3: you know, it's part of the ing captains that you
• 7:46
  Speaker 3: do have to be on the park and I can't
• 7:48
  Speaker 3: get away with that. And so that's something that he's
• 7:51
  Speaker 3: going to have to have in the back of his
• 7:52
  Speaker 3: mind every time he tackles someone. He's got to be
• 7:56
  Speaker 3: one hundred percent on with his technique and everything like that.
• 7:58
  Speaker 3: And we've seen those margins are so fine. Now he
• 8:02
  Speaker 3: says he's got to get Laura and Laura and Laura
• 8:04
  Speaker 3: and that's what he's got to do to remain on
• 8:06
  Speaker 3: the park, is the All Blacks captain. That's the challenge
• 8:08
  Speaker 3: for him, but also for the majority of the team.
• 8:10
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and it's about managing your emotions as well, because
• 8:13
  Speaker 4: Scott I think I think it was this quarter finals,
• 8:17
  Speaker 4: so the semi final against Argentina, what's that him? Maybe
• 8:21
  Speaker 4: I'm blacklisting him? Hit the ball down at the ruck
• 8:25
  Speaker 4: And there was also against the spring Box prior to
• 8:28
  Speaker 4: the World Cup he got two yellow cards. So it
• 8:30
  Speaker 4: wasn't just one instance. There are multiple incidents where he
• 8:35
  Speaker 4: hasn't kept his call in the heat of battle. So
• 8:39
  Speaker 4: as All Black captain, you've got to lead from the front.
• 8:41
  Speaker 4: You've got to be on the park as you say,
• 8:43
  Speaker 4: so that is going to be a big challenge.
• 8:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Sometimes the leadership responsibility sort of makes a man
• 8:48
  Speaker 3: makes you you know, you go, actually, I'm captain. I've
• 8:50
  Speaker 3: can have a little bit of responsibility here, not just
• 8:52
  Speaker 3: one of the troops. So that might well be the
• 8:54
  Speaker 3: case with him. Let's dig into some of these selections
• 8:56
  Speaker 3: around the squad, work our way through some of the
• 8:59
  Speaker 3: new Caps as well. I suppose good place to start
• 9:02
  Speaker 3: as any as the props and the surprise selection of
• 9:05
  Speaker 3: Pasili or Tossi out of the Hurricanes and bay of
• 9:08
  Speaker 3: place number eight until twenty twenty switched to tight head
• 9:12
  Speaker 3: prop put on about fifteen twenty kgs he says, and lockdown.
• 9:17
  Speaker 3: We'll hear some of the interviewee bit later on the podcast.
• 9:19
  Speaker 3: But converted himself into a tight hair prop and has
• 9:22
  Speaker 3: been a very good player for the Hurricanes this year,
• 9:25
  Speaker 3: but certainly wouldn't have made many thirty two's around the
• 9:28
  Speaker 3: rugby clubs or pubs or whatever of New Zealanders they're
• 9:31
  Speaker 3: putting together their teams over the course of the weekend.
• 9:33
  Speaker 4: No a bolt from the blue, wasn't it. And I
• 9:36
  Speaker 4: guess when you think about this deeply, it's the all
• 9:39
  Speaker 4: Blacks needed another tight head prop because nipole La Lala
• 9:43
  Speaker 4: has departed offer doing a fuss. He has the ability
• 9:46
  Speaker 4: to play both sides to Mighty Williams to a degree
• 9:48
  Speaker 4: can play both sides, so they have flexibility within their ranks.
• 9:53
  Speaker 4: But they clearly wanted to bring through another tight head.
• 9:58
  Speaker 4: Tossi is twenty five years old. He's only been a
• 10:01
  Speaker 4: tight head prop for four years. He was converted in
• 10:04
  Speaker 4: SOUTHLM and he did that because he was basically told, look,
• 10:08
  Speaker 4: there's not too many one hundred and forty kg number
• 10:10
  Speaker 4: eights running around the games.
• 10:13
  Speaker 3: It's quite incredible, isn't it that that story to go right?
• 10:16
  Speaker 3: The okay need to switch to a different position and
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: then go from being an NPC footballer in one position
• 10:21
  Speaker 3: and number eight to converting yourself into a front rower
• 10:23
  Speaker 3: and playing like that. But a wonderful story and out
• 10:27
  Speaker 3: of the blue. I guess some players that were in
• 10:29
  Speaker 3: the mix, the likes of Marcel ridden at Asavia Numia
• 10:33
  Speaker 3: was in the mix as well for All Black selection
• 10:36
  Speaker 3: but not picked. And Numia potentially maybe an injury, but
• 10:41
  Speaker 3: you know, always a tight call in the props.
• 10:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and I think they've gone with specialists on both
• 10:47
  Speaker 4: sides of the scrum to a degree and that's why
• 10:50
  Speaker 4: toss He's been selected. And also I spoke to Jason
• 10:54
  Speaker 4: Ryan about him and it was pretty classic to hear
• 10:56
  Speaker 4: Raisor Robinson say that Jason Rohan fell in love with him.
• 11:01
  Speaker 4: He talked about.
• 11:02
  Speaker 3: Married at First Sight, one of the first All Blacks
• 11:04
  Speaker 3: coach to reference Married at First Sight and media interview.
• 11:06
  Speaker 4: Clearly big mathsco but Jason Ryan said that Tossy is
• 11:14
  Speaker 4: the strongest prop in New Zealand. He said that he
• 11:17
  Speaker 4: can squat over three hundred kg and that he's got
• 11:20
  Speaker 4: a massive future and that he will learn a lot
• 11:22
  Speaker 4: scrummaging off Tyreel Lomax as he has all year. He
• 11:25
  Speaker 4: gave a big shout out to Jamie McIntosh at the
• 11:28
  Speaker 4: Hurricanes and the work that he's done to get him
• 11:30
  Speaker 4: up to speeds. I think it's fair to say at
• 11:33
  Speaker 4: this point Tossy is not at the level you would
• 11:36
  Speaker 4: want for a test scrummager and tight hair prop. You know,
• 11:41
  Speaker 4: the intricacies of propping are foreign to to most of us,
• 11:45
  Speaker 4: but tight hair prop is one of the most important
• 11:47
  Speaker 4: positions on the field. It is your anchor. You lock
• 11:50
  Speaker 4: down the scrum. I'd put it right up there with
• 11:52
  Speaker 4: the first five, and so getting him up to speed's important.
• 11:55
  Speaker 4: The All Blacks have Tyrol Lomax and Fletcher Newel, two
• 11:59
  Speaker 4: genuine world class tight head props, and they're hoping to
• 12:03
  Speaker 4: mold another one.
• 12:04
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and it was interesting Tossi is saying that it
• 12:06
  Speaker 3: was only sort of last year that he felt like
• 12:08
  Speaker 3: he was able to scrummage properly. So I think the
• 12:12
  Speaker 3: phrase Jordi Barrett Hues when I spoke to him was
• 12:15
  Speaker 3: incredibly high ceiling. So he's got the raw talent. Now
• 12:19
  Speaker 3: it's time for Jace Ryan to work with them, but
• 12:22
  Speaker 3: also to Rol Lomax and there's All Black teammates to
• 12:24
  Speaker 3: work with him and get him to where he needs
• 12:26
  Speaker 3: to be. In terms of the All Blacks, it was a.
• 12:28
  Speaker 4: Couple of things. When you look at the makeup of
• 12:31
  Speaker 4: those All Black props and Tossy being a former number eights,
• 12:34
  Speaker 4: they all have their ability to ball play, to have
• 12:37
  Speaker 4: quick feet at the line, to be mobile, and that's
• 12:41
  Speaker 4: what you need as well as being great scrummages. Ethan
• 12:45
  Speaker 4: de Groetz come on a lot in that regard. The
• 12:47
  Speaker 4: other thing about them is they're all massive units. Yeah,
• 12:50
  Speaker 4: they are huge humans. Offer toing, I Fuss is one
• 12:52
  Speaker 4: of the smaller props. You know, let that sink in
• 12:55
  Speaker 4: from and these are big humans and they will compete
• 13:00
  Speaker 4: on a size like for light basis with the Box
• 13:04
  Speaker 4: and the English. So they clearly want size and they
• 13:08
  Speaker 4: want skill and mobility from their props. And that's Tossy
• 13:11
  Speaker 4: does fit that mold.
• 13:12
  Speaker 3: It does. Indeed, let's continue to move our way up
• 13:14
  Speaker 3: the team and the hook is selected there now I
• 13:18
  Speaker 3: think two of them out of three week could have
• 13:20
  Speaker 3: both picked Tolfer sorry Cody Taylor and I suffer on
• 13:24
  Speaker 3: mooor the third one George Bell out of the Crusaders,
• 13:27
  Speaker 3: one of the five new faces in the squad. Of
• 13:29
  Speaker 3: the un capped players first and foremost, I think fair
• 13:33
  Speaker 3: to say Samasonic Takeyahoa is fit. George Bell is not there.
• 13:35
  Speaker 3: The three fit pretty clear. As it happens, they do
• 13:39
  Speaker 3: need a third player to play hooker in this team,
• 13:42
  Speaker 3: and with Samosoni Art there was a decision to be
• 13:45
  Speaker 3: made there for Scott Robertson and Deal Black's coaches selectors.
• 13:50
  Speaker 3: Ricky Rica Telli form player probably for the Blues as
• 13:52
  Speaker 3: they closed the season. One of the form players. He's
• 13:55
  Speaker 3: been very, very good. But George Bell is in there
• 13:58
  Speaker 3: with an eye to the future. Twenty two years of age,
• 14:01
  Speaker 3: and Scott Robertson said as much when he was asked
• 14:04
  Speaker 3: about it. It's an eye to the future. They really
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: really rate him. I don't think George Bell had a
• 14:08
  Speaker 3: great Super Rugby season with the Crusaders. Some of his
• 14:11
  Speaker 3: line out throwing was errant. He's a good ball player,
• 14:14
  Speaker 3: but I think if you're going on the form call
• 14:16
  Speaker 3: Ricky Ricottelli deserved to be there. But they've gone with
• 14:19
  Speaker 3: the long term vision because they've had this spot open
• 14:22
  Speaker 3: up through Samasoni Dokey I was injury and they've gone, well,
• 14:25
  Speaker 3: it's a better to give a third spot to a
• 14:28
  Speaker 3: player that is they're going to be there in the future,
• 14:30
  Speaker 3: or maybe someone who's a bit older. They've gone with
• 14:31
  Speaker 3: the future.
• 14:33
  Speaker 4: I'm going to read your tweet here from Simon raul
• 14:35
  Speaker 4: Looni from a Fiji coach is always good for a
• 14:38
  Speaker 4: hot take. Bell was a great player and open player,
• 14:41
  Speaker 4: but couldn't hurt an elephant's ass with a handful of eminem's.
• 14:45
  Speaker 4: Ricky Ricttelli has to be dirty.
• 14:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, well that's on the throw coach of the All Blacks.
• 14:50
  Speaker 3: Isn't it Corey Flynn to get him up to speed
• 14:52
  Speaker 3: and get him there? They're clearly similar to Tossy see him?
• 14:55
  Speaker 3: Is that the raw product that they can get up
• 14:58
  Speaker 3: to international caliber? Now you look at the first two tests,
• 15:03
  Speaker 3: unlikely that Bell or Tossi for that matter, is going
• 15:05
  Speaker 3: to play against England Fiji maybe where both of them
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: could potentially debut if they're up to speed by then,
• 15:11
  Speaker 3: but they're not going to get much game time. And
• 15:13
  Speaker 3: I guess if you're airing on that side, you go
• 15:16
  Speaker 3: with the guy that might be there in two or
• 15:18
  Speaker 3: three years time rather than the guy that you don't
• 15:20
  Speaker 3: know about and maybe isn't going to crack that top
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: three in the years to come.
• 15:25
  Speaker 4: Yeah, look, I think if you're poking on form and
• 15:27
  Speaker 4: for the now, it's a non selection, non choice. Rickittelli
• 15:31
  Speaker 4: has been outstanding for a dominant Blues pack, low center
• 15:35
  Speaker 4: of gravity, great and the clean out. The Blues lineup
• 15:39
  Speaker 4: was the best in the comp this year. The Crusaders
• 15:42
  Speaker 4: was the third worst and George Bell did not have
• 15:44
  Speaker 4: a good season. So you look at it on that
• 15:46
  Speaker 4: basis and you say, look, this has been viewed through
• 15:50
  Speaker 4: red and black tinted glasses, not only with Razor, but
• 15:53
  Speaker 4: Jason Ryan, who knows George Berll well. From a development
• 15:58
  Speaker 4: point of view and the age dynamic that you've mentioned,
• 16:02
  Speaker 4: you can understand bringing George Belle wanting to develop him
• 16:05
  Speaker 4: for the future and they believe he's a real athlete
• 16:09
  Speaker 4: and has a lot of potential. But look, I feel
• 16:12
  Speaker 4: for Rickettelly because on mirror on form he one hundred
• 16:16
  Speaker 4: percent deserves to be there.
• 16:18
  Speaker 3: He does, and that's a tough one for Ricky Rickttelly
• 16:21
  Speaker 3: not to be in the mix. He was in training squad.
• 16:25
  Speaker 3: I'm thinking about six seven years ago. He got in
• 16:28
  Speaker 3: the mix to cover some injuries. That was as close
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: as he's got and this time doesn't make the thirty two.
• 16:33
  Speaker 3: Let's continue moving. And this is one of the other surprises,
• 16:36
  Speaker 3: not so much in personnel, but the lack of personnel
• 16:38
  Speaker 3: and lock that they've only taken three now. When we
• 16:41
  Speaker 3: put together our squads last week, we had four locks.
• 16:44
  Speaker 3: Every squad that I've seen on Sky and various other
• 16:47
  Speaker 3: picks has had four locks. The all Blacks have gone
• 16:49
  Speaker 3: with three, which don't think many expected they would do. Yes,
• 16:52
  Speaker 3: Sama Penni Feina can cover lock. But this is a
• 16:55
  Speaker 3: huge risk to take only three locks in your squad
• 16:59
  Speaker 3: of thirty two.
• 16:59
  Speaker 4: It's a massive risk, particularly when one of them and
• 17:02
  Speaker 4: Patrick two Polot who's carrying a knee injury.
• 17:04
  Speaker 3: Scott Barret's had a back injury.
• 17:05
  Speaker 4: That's right, and Scott said he was fifty fifty to
• 17:08
  Speaker 4: play Club rugby last weekend declared for the first test.
• 17:12
  Speaker 4: But yeah, there are injury clouds hanging over your two
• 17:16
  Speaker 4: of your three established locks. In terms of the balance
• 17:20
  Speaker 4: of the squads, I always felt that if they went
• 17:22
  Speaker 4: six props that have to lose a loose forward or
• 17:25
  Speaker 4: a lock, I thought it might be a loose forward. Yes,
• 17:28
  Speaker 4: some of Penny Female gives you a degree of flexibility there,
• 17:31
  Speaker 4: and they have brought in Sam Derry, one of four
• 17:35
  Speaker 4: injury cover guys for Patrick two Polo two. But it's
• 17:40
  Speaker 4: a massive risk and it speaks to the thread beer
• 17:43
  Speaker 4: nature of the depth in New Zealand rugby locks. And
• 17:46
  Speaker 4: we went through six or seven different candidates and none
• 17:51
  Speaker 4: of them were really compelling to step into the breach
• 17:54
  Speaker 4: that's been left by Sam Whitelock and Brody Rettallic and
• 17:57
  Speaker 4: clearly the All Blacks have felt that way as well,
• 17:59
  Speaker 4: because they've only gone with three of them. I think
• 18:02
  Speaker 4: the other aspect of this is Josh Lord will make
• 18:05
  Speaker 4: his comeback bare He played for the Chiefs this year
• 18:08
  Speaker 4: with Tartanuki in their preseason. He's the guy that they
• 18:11
  Speaker 4: will fast track. He's stepped up to the international level.
• 18:15
  Speaker 4: I think he's the clear fourth choice lock. But for now,
• 18:19
  Speaker 4: let's say Patrick two Poloto is injured in the first
• 18:23
  Speaker 4: couple of minutes against England, then you're left with two
• 18:26
  Speaker 4: established locks. It is a risk, it.
• 18:29
  Speaker 3: Is a huge risk. I think from the All Blacks,
• 18:31
  Speaker 3: Sam Dowry is going to be in there is cover
• 18:33
  Speaker 3: for both of those injured players and may well get
• 18:36
  Speaker 3: a call up at some point in there. But I
• 18:38
  Speaker 3: think potentially if they were at home so I weren't
• 18:42
  Speaker 3: at home, they wouldn't have taken this risk. But the
• 18:45
  Speaker 3: fact that they can get well Darry's going to be
• 18:47
  Speaker 3: covering with them in squad, but they can fly in
• 18:50
  Speaker 3: players pretty quickly into camp allows them to make a
• 18:54
  Speaker 3: decision that they wouldn't have made and they wouldn't have
• 18:56
  Speaker 3: probably sleeped at thirty two if they're going abroad anyway,
• 18:58
  Speaker 3: but made a decision that they can bring in someone
• 19:01
  Speaker 3: at short notice if required.
• 19:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I think it's a big It's a flashing red light,
• 19:06
  Speaker 4: isn't it. If there's one person in New Zealand rugby
• 19:09
  Speaker 4: that you're concerned about right now, it's lock and selecting
• 19:12
  Speaker 4: three of them just highlights that even more.
• 19:15
  Speaker 5: Yeah, it does.
• 19:15
  Speaker 3: And look, there's players on the horizon. As we've mentioned
• 19:17
  Speaker 3: on this podcast before, Fabian holand eligible late late part
• 19:21
  Speaker 3: of next year. Jamie Hannah looks like a real up
• 19:23
  Speaker 3: and comer, but they're not ready yet. And this is
• 19:26
  Speaker 3: twenty twenty four and at the moment there's three locks
• 19:29
  Speaker 3: in an All Black squad and that speaks to the
• 19:31
  Speaker 3: thread being nature of things, isn't it, doesn't it?
• 19:33
  Speaker 6: Yeah?
• 19:33
  Speaker 4: And it's a big year. The All Blacks play fifteen
• 19:37
  Speaker 4: tests this year, a lot of them away from home,
• 19:40
  Speaker 4: and they're going to need more than three locks, So
• 19:43
  Speaker 4: it's going to be really interesting to see where they
• 19:45
  Speaker 4: turn and how affected that position is because it is
• 19:50
  Speaker 4: very attritional and Scott Barrett will play a lot of
• 19:53
  Speaker 4: rugby as captain, but the other two are going to
• 19:57
  Speaker 4: need to be rotated, so it's going to be fascinating
• 20:00
  Speaker 4: to see how that position plays out.
• 20:02
  Speaker 3: Let's get into the loose forwards. They've selected six of them,
• 20:05
  Speaker 3: so that was always going to be the balance as
• 20:06
  Speaker 3: to how many they took in. So I had a
• 20:08
  Speaker 3: female Jacobson, papala Via and Satiti getting the nod there.
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: I guess we went through it last week and we're
• 20:16
  Speaker 3: trying to match, you know, who can cover what position there.
• 20:20
  Speaker 3: But the one that stands out obviously is Wallace Atiti
• 20:24
  Speaker 3: being named over Hoskins Stutu sa Titi having a great
• 20:27
  Speaker 3: finish to the season. I thought it was I thought
• 20:29
  Speaker 3: it was probably the Chief's best in the final, even
• 20:31
  Speaker 3: though they didn't get a lot of ball. We'll get
• 20:32
  Speaker 3: into the final little bit later on. Obviously Superb and
• 20:34
  Speaker 3: the Hurricanes and they've weighted up and gone we're taking
• 20:37
  Speaker 3: the promising player in Satiti.
• 20:40
  Speaker 4: Yeah. It's fascinating, isn't it? And it's certainly the lightning
• 20:43
  Speaker 4: rod that sparked debate, discussion around pub laners and social media.
• 20:52
  Speaker 4: Hoskin Stitutu scored twelve trials for the Blues this year.
• 20:56
  Speaker 4: He played a lot of minutes, He carried for a
• 21:00
  Speaker 4: lot of meters. I think he set up another eight tries.
• 21:03
  Speaker 4: So when he had the ball in his hands. He
• 21:06
  Speaker 4: was hugely influential for an extremely dominant Blues pack. Hoss
• 21:11
  Speaker 4: Wallace Tatiti came on a little bit later in the year,
• 21:15
  Speaker 4: but there's one performance from him that earned him selection
• 21:20
  Speaker 4: and that's the semi final against the Hurricanes, and Jason
• 21:22
  Speaker 4: Rhand said that to me as plain and simple, that
• 21:26
  Speaker 4: performance in a semi final turned heads, and it turned
• 21:31
  Speaker 4: everyone's heads and it turned the All Blacks heads as well.
• 21:34
  Speaker 4: Now you've got a feel for Hoskins to Tuto because
• 21:37
  Speaker 4: he's got to sit back and think I couldn't be
• 21:39
  Speaker 4: doing anything more right now. He was cast asides in
• 21:42
  Speaker 4: late twenty twenty two, not only from the All Blacks,
• 21:44
  Speaker 4: but the All Blacks fifteen came into this year with
• 21:47
  Speaker 4: a massive chip on her shoulder and played like it.
• 21:50
  Speaker 4: I think there was a couple of talent comments in
• 21:53
  Speaker 4: the announcement last night. It was on both sides of
• 21:56
  Speaker 4: the ball that the All Blacks want their loose forwards
• 21:59
  Speaker 4: to make an impact and speaking to it a couple
• 22:01
  Speaker 4: of the coaches off the record last night. Another aspect
• 22:05
  Speaker 4: is what you do away from the ball and this
• 22:08
  Speaker 4: is something that the Queensland Maroons. Billy Slater values very
• 22:13
  Speaker 4: highly and it's something that Raised Robinson values very highly.
• 22:16
  Speaker 4: And I think it's been a feedback for Hoskins throughout
• 22:18
  Speaker 4: the year because Jason Ryan's been into the Blues and
• 22:21
  Speaker 4: with vern and that's one aspect of his game where
• 22:25
  Speaker 4: the All Blacks feel like when he's on the ball,
• 22:27
  Speaker 4: he's on and otherwise he can drift and not be involved.
• 22:32
  Speaker 4: So hugely polarizing selection, isn't it. Do you think they
• 22:37
  Speaker 4: got it right?
• 22:39
  Speaker 3: I probably don't. I think I would have kept Satisi
• 22:42
  Speaker 3: just a nice a little bit more and allowed him
• 22:44
  Speaker 3: to have a bit more of an NBC campaign and
• 22:47
  Speaker 3: picked Satusu and rewarded him for the season because he
• 22:51
  Speaker 3: has played well. And trust yourself to bring those standards
• 22:55
  Speaker 3: up to where they need to be in All Blacks camp.
• 22:58
  Speaker 3: And we've seen, you know, with Tossy and George Bell
• 23:01
  Speaker 3: that those players aren't the finished product. Well has Intituta. Yes,
• 23:04
  Speaker 3: he's been the All Blacks before, but if you want
• 23:05
  Speaker 3: to see that from him, surely he's shown you on
• 23:09
  Speaker 3: that side of the ball where he can do a
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: ball in hand. We'll get him up to speed with
• 23:12
  Speaker 3: what he's doing off the ball and what he's doing
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: in those moments that he maybe is a little bit idle.
• 23:17
  Speaker 3: That's what I think. You've got to back yourself as
• 23:19
  Speaker 3: coaches to get the best out of him. I don't
• 23:21
  Speaker 3: mind what the tea being slick at all. I think
• 23:23
  Speaker 3: he's an immense prospect for the All Blacks over the
• 23:27
  Speaker 3: coming years. But I think if you're Hoskins a Tutu,
• 23:30
  Speaker 3: you're probably feeling a bit hard done by and looking
• 23:32
  Speaker 3: at perhaps on a social media posts, he does feel
• 23:35
  Speaker 3: a little bit hard done by by missing out. But
• 23:38
  Speaker 3: there's two ways this can go with Hostintituji and similar
• 23:41
  Speaker 3: to last year, we saw him absolutely rise back with
• 23:44
  Speaker 3: the Blues this year and have have a great season
• 23:46
  Speaker 3: and put himself back in the conversation. It can now
• 23:49
  Speaker 3: go one of two ways. He can continue to work
• 23:51
  Speaker 3: at it and fix those things that the All Blacks
• 23:53
  Speaker 3: want to see and get there in time for the
• 23:55
  Speaker 3: Rugby Championship if there is time or injuries or whatever
• 23:58
  Speaker 3: all the end of year tour, or he can drop
• 24:00
  Speaker 3: his lip and he can go back of this. I'm
• 24:02
  Speaker 3: going to go map. Is Solf eligible for Fiji in
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: twelve months or eighteen months time, whatever it is, or England,
• 24:06
  Speaker 3: which is also eligible for So that's in Hoskins court.
• 24:11
  Speaker 3: It's going to be interesting to see what happens. But
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: you know, I think there's an element there that you've
• 24:17
  Speaker 3: got to back yourself as all about coaches to bring
• 24:19
  Speaker 3: him up to standard.
• 24:20
  Speaker 4: Yeah, Look, if I was Hoskins, I would be looking
• 24:24
  Speaker 4: off shore right now. I think there's been a pretty
• 24:27
  Speaker 4: clear directive that he's not in favor here, and you know,
• 24:31
  Speaker 4: Ford's coach Jason Ryan was there last year and he's
• 24:35
  Speaker 4: going to be there for the next four years. Clearly
• 24:38
  Speaker 4: others are preferred, and it's not just who's in this
• 24:41
  Speaker 4: All Black squad as well. There's depth elsewhere with Bradon
• 24:44
  Speaker 4: Yosse and Peter Luckey, who is actually in the All
• 24:49
  Speaker 4: Black squad is an emerging player, but the depth at
• 24:52
  Speaker 4: Loose Ford, in the loose forwards is incredible. So I
• 24:56
  Speaker 4: think if I were him, I would be looking off
• 24:58
  Speaker 4: shore because it is that opinion of him going to change.
• 25:02
  Speaker 4: What more can he do? Really? I think from an
• 25:06
  Speaker 4: international eligibility perspective, it's five years, isn't it three now?
• 25:10
  Speaker 3: Three now with so into twenty twenty two is his
• 25:12
  Speaker 3: last All Blacks tests so he could be eligible into
• 25:14
  Speaker 3: twenty twenty five with the he's got English, links, got
• 25:17
  Speaker 3: Fiji and links could play there into twenty twenty five.
• 25:21
  Speaker 4: Yeah, so target the next World Cup, go and earn
• 25:24
  Speaker 4: some yen. You know, I could completely understand that rationale
• 25:27
  Speaker 4: or he digs in for a year, tries to change
• 25:30
  Speaker 4: an opinion. But I'm gonna throw something else at you here.
• 25:34
  Speaker 4: So Wallac the TT Hoskins, the two two head to
• 25:38
  Speaker 4: head raises like that's our most difficult selection. I know
• 25:42
  Speaker 4: that you're not a massive fan of Luke Jacobson, and
• 25:47
  Speaker 4: you know, would you have selected him and Hoskins two.
• 25:51
  Speaker 4: There's there's so many different ways you can skin the
• 25:53
  Speaker 4: balance of this loose forward mix. When you talk about versatility,
• 25:57
  Speaker 4: which is another thing that hurt Hoskins because Wallac TT
• 26:00
  Speaker 4: is a guy that they view can play all three positions.
• 26:03
  Speaker 3: Well to start with that, I think what we've seeing
• 26:05
  Speaker 3: there is that clearly Artie is still going to play
• 26:07
  Speaker 3: eight for the your black correct there. There's not going
• 26:09
  Speaker 3: to be no change there. There's been a bit of
• 26:10
  Speaker 3: chatbat movie I've inside from what the squad they've selected.
• 26:14
  Speaker 3: He's going to play eight and the wall of tit
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: is the backup number eight. So that's where the squeeze
• 26:19
  Speaker 3: came on Hoskins. Is that do they go with a
• 26:22
  Speaker 3: player that's probably not going to get much game time
• 26:24
  Speaker 3: but is a long term project for the All Blacks
• 26:27
  Speaker 3: they've added up Hoskins or Walla Wallace wins out in
• 26:30
  Speaker 3: that regard. Luke Jacobson I think has had a number
• 26:35
  Speaker 3: of cracks at Test level, but I would struggle to
• 26:38
  Speaker 3: think of a Test match where he's absolutely gone. This
• 26:41
  Speaker 3: is a Test match where I've staked my claim from
• 26:43
  Speaker 3: All Blacks Jersey. I'm not going to let it go.
• 26:45
  Speaker 3: He's been around for a number of seasons now. Yes
• 26:47
  Speaker 3: he's had a few injuries here and there which have
• 26:50
  Speaker 3: obviously set him back, but he's been around the All
• 26:51
  Speaker 3: Blacks camp for a number of years now and I
• 26:54
  Speaker 3: don't think has put his hand up completely to go
• 26:56
  Speaker 3: I'm here. But what he does do is cover a
• 26:58
  Speaker 3: number of positions and that's fairly Walks, So too does
• 27:00
  Speaker 3: Ethan Blackat and the All Blacks Max.
• 27:03
  Speaker 4: We know that who you could argue is fortunate to
• 27:05
  Speaker 4: be there. Bais of the this.
• 27:07
  Speaker 3: Year and look he could have been squeezed out and
• 27:10
  Speaker 3: as I was putting together a squad yesterday with my
• 27:13
  Speaker 3: old man, made a few tweaks to what we selected
• 27:15
  Speaker 3: last week, and I actually squeezed Ethan out A sorry, yeah,
• 27:18
  Speaker 3: squed Ethan out of the mix because I thought he
• 27:20
  Speaker 3: hasn't played a lot of rug be the best thing
• 27:22
  Speaker 3: is to get some rugby under his belt. But he's
• 27:23
  Speaker 3: a known quantity to these all Black selectors. So I
• 27:27
  Speaker 3: think the heat's really on Ethan Blackaded and Luke Jacobson
• 27:30
  Speaker 3: in the loose Ford trio when we go forward here,
• 27:33
  Speaker 3: because Ethan's had his injury issues and Luke, to be fair,
• 27:37
  Speaker 3: I don't think has taken his chances in the All Blacks.
• 27:39
  Speaker 3: So there's clearly they've seen plenty from them. They liked
• 27:43
  Speaker 3: those players. But I still think there's a bit of
• 27:45
  Speaker 3: work the too need to do at test level.
• 27:48
  Speaker 4: We'll have another pod before the first Test, but right
• 27:51
  Speaker 4: now I believe the all black starting loose Ford trio
• 27:54
  Speaker 4: for England will be Ardi at eight, Dalton at seven
• 27:57
  Speaker 4: and Ethan Blackheader at six.
• 27:58
  Speaker 3: I don't disagree. I think it will be.
• 28:00
  Speaker 4: Summer Penny Female at sex is the only.
• 28:02
  Speaker 3: Possible option, but I think they may want to use
• 28:05
  Speaker 3: him off the bench and have double lock cover patent,
• 28:10
  Speaker 3: or have the ability to change things up mid test.
• 28:12
  Speaker 3: So I think the way things are selected at the moment,
• 28:14
  Speaker 3: I think female off the bench alongside perhaps two per
• 28:17
  Speaker 3: I would be the likely mixed for that first test.
• 28:20
  Speaker 4: And that speaks to how highly the All Blacks regard
• 28:22
  Speaker 4: ethan blacket. It doesn't it because he has played bargaroll
• 28:25
  Speaker 4: this year.
• 28:25
  Speaker 3: He has played buggarull. He is indeed, all right, let's
• 28:27
  Speaker 3: get into the halfbacks.
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: T J.
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: Pettinara, Cortez Ratima included in Finlay Christie the three that
• 28:34
  Speaker 3: they've named No surprises really there. That was essentially what
• 28:37
  Speaker 3: everyone thought was going to happen, and indeed they have.
• 28:41
  Speaker 3: You'll read on the half backs. You know, a great
• 28:43
  Speaker 3: story for TJ. Pedanara, been through the wars the last
• 28:46
  Speaker 3: couple of years, wasn't selected in twenty twenty two until
• 28:49
  Speaker 3: right at the very end, then goes and does his
• 28:51
  Speaker 3: achilles at ticking him misses all of twenty twenty three,
• 28:54
  Speaker 3: can't get back in time for the World Cup. We'll
• 28:55
  Speaker 3: put himself in the frame for the World Cup. But
• 28:58
  Speaker 3: you know that's a redemption story for TJ.
• 29:00
  Speaker 4: It is and he spoke with Kimberly downs on Sky
• 29:04
  Speaker 4: about the fact that because it wasn't just one chilly surgio,
• 29:07
  Speaker 4: it was two and he's out of the game for
• 29:09
  Speaker 4: eighteen months, and he talked about the fact that he
• 29:12
  Speaker 4: may not play rugby again, that he had that thought
• 29:15
  Speaker 4: when he had a second rchilly surgery things went progressing.
• 29:18
  Speaker 4: So what a comeback story. And it does speak to
• 29:20
  Speaker 4: fate to a degree because cam Royguard isn't injured for
• 29:25
  Speaker 4: the until you know, the back end of this year.
• 29:28
  Speaker 4: Then TJ doesn't have the whole season starting for the Hurricanes,
• 29:31
  Speaker 4: and maybe he doesn't make the All Blacks because he
• 29:34
  Speaker 4: doesn't have that time to impress. So there's a bit
• 29:37
  Speaker 4: of divine intervention to a degree. But a great story
• 29:40
  Speaker 4: for a great servant, a great human. But no surprises.
• 29:46
  Speaker 4: Not Hotham was the guy that has been knocking on
• 29:48
  Speaker 4: the door. I think he's got a big future, but
• 29:51
  Speaker 4: he's still a young guy and his time will come.
• 29:54
  Speaker 3: Some bizarre things as well that not Hotham not in
• 29:56
  Speaker 3: the multi All Black squad that'll be out by the
• 29:58
  Speaker 3: time this podcast lands. Not sure if he's injured, but
• 30:03
  Speaker 3: he's missed the cut. There with Sam Knock and Titoy
• 30:07
  Speaker 3: making the cut there. Sure if he's unavailable for personal
• 30:09
  Speaker 3: reasons or whatever it is. But yeah, it was quite
• 30:12
  Speaker 3: odd not see No Hopme's name listed in that multiple
• 30:14
  Speaker 3: Black squad.
• 30:15
  Speaker 4: Yeah, very strange. Maybe they're holding them back for the
• 30:18
  Speaker 4: All Blacks fifteen later in the air.
• 30:19
  Speaker 3: Could be, could be let's get into the tens. No surprises,
• 30:22
  Speaker 3: he actually no, there is a slight surprise. Boden Barrett
• 30:25
  Speaker 3: and dam mckinzi are listed as the first five eights.
• 30:28
  Speaker 3: We'll get to sehim. Peter Feeder shortly, but he is
• 30:30
  Speaker 3: not listed in the first five eights. He's played fullback
• 30:32
  Speaker 3: for the Blues majority of the season, but just a
• 30:35
  Speaker 3: little week. Interesting thing in terms of how the All
• 30:38
  Speaker 3: Blacks have laid out the squad is that Petter Fetter
• 30:39
  Speaker 3: is listed in the outside backs rather than the first fives.
• 30:43
  Speaker 4: Well, let me put this to you. Do you have
• 30:44
  Speaker 4: to be a first five to play fullback for the
• 30:48
  Speaker 4: All Blacks?
• 30:48
  Speaker 2: Now?
• 30:48
  Speaker 3: It does seem like a prerequisite. When Richid Wong is gone,
• 30:52
  Speaker 3: he's the last ten specialist ten. It seems like it
• 30:57
  Speaker 3: is a pre requisite the way they play, or maybe
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: it's just the way that New Zealand teams like to play. Yeah,
• 31:06
  Speaker 3: I'm still a fan of having an out and out
• 31:08
  Speaker 3: specialist ten if he possibly can.
• 31:11
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it works the other way as well. Do you
• 31:12
  Speaker 4: have to be a ten to play fifteen? Look, the
• 31:15
  Speaker 4: positions are similar in terms of what the All Blacks
• 31:18
  Speaker 4: want from them. They want dual playmakers. They want the
• 31:21
  Speaker 4: ability to read the game, to chime into the line,
• 31:24
  Speaker 4: to alleviate the decision making on one person, to be
• 31:28
  Speaker 4: that backdoor receiver, and to plug the corners, and all
• 31:33
  Speaker 4: those sorts of elements are shared between fullback and first five.
• 31:37
  Speaker 4: But I really wanted Ruben Love in the squad and
• 31:41
  Speaker 4: he's a guy that lit up super rugby. He's one
• 31:44
  Speaker 4: of the most exciting prospects since Christian Cullen from a
• 31:49
  Speaker 4: pure attacking point of view, and I would love to
• 31:53
  Speaker 4: see his skill set be given a chance to shine
• 31:55
  Speaker 4: on the Test scene. So I'm disappointed that he's not there.
• 32:00
  Speaker 4: Stephen Peter Efecta didn't play a lot of rugby this year,
• 32:02
  Speaker 4: and when he did it it was almost exclusively from fullback.
• 32:07
  Speaker 4: His versatility as an upside if you select Ruben Love.
• 32:10
  Speaker 4: He can't play ten, but.
• 32:12
  Speaker 3: Hasn't for a long time.
• 32:13
  Speaker 4: He hasn't established himself at ten at super rugby level,
• 32:18
  Speaker 4: so clearly that working in Steven's favor. I think also
• 32:22
  Speaker 4: his relationship with Leo McDonald knows him well, so that's
• 32:28
  Speaker 4: a tick. But I guess first five is a position
• 32:33
  Speaker 4: where there's not a lot of depth. Harry Plumbers, a
• 32:35
  Speaker 4: guy that's been there, was a bit of a clamor
• 32:38
  Speaker 4: for him after the way he led the Blues this year.
• 32:40
  Speaker 3: It was interesting here Scott Hansen speak with Jason Pye
• 32:43
  Speaker 3: and he said it was asked whether Harry Plumber is
• 32:45
  Speaker 3: in the mix, and Scott Hansen said one hundred percent
• 32:47
  Speaker 3: deserved to be in the mix because he was playing
• 32:49
  Speaker 3: some superb rugby. But just the challenge of him now
• 32:52
  Speaker 3: is to keep backing it up at NPC level and
• 32:54
  Speaker 3: I think he's family now in the All Blacks radar.
• 32:57
  Speaker 3: Whether that converts into a call up is you know,
• 33:00
  Speaker 3: anyone's scarce, but he's certainly in the conversation for the
• 33:03
  Speaker 3: All Blacks.
• 33:03
  Speaker 4: Well, if you're going down the rungs, he has to
• 33:05
  Speaker 4: be done. He outplayed Brett Cameron when it met and
• 33:08
  Speaker 4: it's look, I think there's an argument about playing behind
• 33:12
  Speaker 4: an extremely dominant full pack, which helps you, but you've
• 33:14
  Speaker 4: still got to make those decisions and execute them. And
• 33:17
  Speaker 4: Harry's goalkicking as well was superb, so ticked a lot
• 33:21
  Speaker 4: of boxes. Look, I do rate Stephen Peterfetter. He's a
• 33:24
  Speaker 4: classy operator, very skillful, great at the line, great at
• 33:27
  Speaker 4: creating for others and hasn't really had a crack for
• 33:30
  Speaker 4: the All Blacks, so he is deserving a being there.
• 33:33
  Speaker 4: But if it was up to me, I would have
• 33:35
  Speaker 4: selected Reuben Love because he's a point of difference and
• 33:37
  Speaker 4: he's an out and out genuine fullback.
• 33:39
  Speaker 3: Let's get back into the outside backs before we get
• 33:41
  Speaker 3: into the midfielder is then caterber Clark in morning at
• 33:44
  Speaker 3: our Stephen Peter Felder severy re smart Tala on the
• 33:48
  Speaker 3: basis of that, I mean, I know that also is
• 33:50
  Speaker 3: outside backs. You would think Boden Barrett's going to start
• 33:52
  Speaker 3: at fullback in the first Test, even though he's not
• 33:54
  Speaker 3: listed as being an outside back.
• 33:56
  Speaker 4: But he's bolted on ye I would argue they're not
• 34:01
  Speaker 4: going to start Stephen Petter Perefetter at fullback and there's
• 34:06
  Speaker 4: no other options. Narawa has played fullback, but probably not
• 34:11
  Speaker 4: what they're looking for at test level exactly. So yeah,
• 34:15
  Speaker 4: you could pretty much name the All Blacks back line now.
• 34:18
  Speaker 4: I think the wings are contestable, but midfields, I think
• 34:23
  Speaker 4: t J. Petinara starts at half back, Damian McKenzie's at ten,
• 34:27
  Speaker 4: Jeordie Barrett, Riquewani and Boden Barrack at fullback. So who's
• 34:32
  Speaker 4: just starting wings?
• 34:33
  Speaker 3: Well, I think Severa Reese on the left wing and
• 34:36
  Speaker 3: Mark Tilera on the right.
• 34:37
  Speaker 4: For me, yeah, not too many. I'm not totally sold
• 34:40
  Speaker 4: about sever Reese, but I think Mark t Lea for sure.
• 34:45
  Speaker 4: The way that England play high ball is going to
• 34:49
  Speaker 4: be important, so maybe that brings Caleb Clark into the equation.
• 34:54
  Speaker 4: The question with him is he's carrying a rib injury,
• 34:57
  Speaker 4: same of off towing a fussy so they have broaden
• 35:01
  Speaker 4: cover there. But look, sever Reese was the Crusader's best
• 35:06
  Speaker 4: performer in a dire season for the part, and it's
• 35:09
  Speaker 4: really hard to play well in a poor team, so
• 35:12
  Speaker 4: he thoroughly deserves to be in the squad and he's
• 35:16
  Speaker 4: certainly pushing for starting claims.
• 35:17
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and big moment for Southland as well, getting a
• 35:20
  Speaker 3: second to All Black. I spoke with the Southland radio
• 35:22
  Speaker 3: station this morning and they were absolutely delighted to have
• 35:24
  Speaker 3: too All Blacks in the mix. I guess the other
• 35:27
  Speaker 3: selection the player that's missed out there. I don't think
• 35:30
  Speaker 3: we had him in. But Shawn Stevenson, a player that's
• 35:33
  Speaker 3: performed well for the Chiefs, I do think obviously didn't
• 35:36
  Speaker 3: play the semi final against the Hurricanes. Maybe if he
• 35:38
  Speaker 3: played there might have been able to stake his claim
• 35:40
  Speaker 3: a bit more. Nothing went the way of the Chiefs
• 35:42
  Speaker 3: on Saturday night really, especially you know in terms of
• 35:46
  Speaker 3: back's getting quality ball. He couldn't do a life and
• 35:48
  Speaker 3: he had a knock on at one point or a
• 35:50
  Speaker 3: couple of eras, so he didn't get a chance to
• 35:52
  Speaker 3: stake his claim. But it feels like this is probably
• 35:55
  Speaker 3: destined to be Sean Stevenson's lot. Might get another test
• 35:59
  Speaker 3: here or there for injury cover, but when Ruben Love
• 36:01
  Speaker 3: has been picked ahead of him in terms of that
• 36:03
  Speaker 3: injury cover, it's looking a long way back now for
• 36:06
  Speaker 3: Shawn Stevenson making another All Blacks appearance.
• 36:08
  Speaker 4: It is in the Chiefs back three in general had
• 36:10
  Speaker 4: a really poor knight in that Super Abiy final. Stevenson.
• 36:13
  Speaker 4: You mentioned that the drop high ball which wasn't a
• 36:16
  Speaker 4: great kick from Finn Labor. That was as close to
• 36:19
  Speaker 4: Test match for the as you'll get. It was raining
• 36:22
  Speaker 4: as well, and you've got to be better than that
• 36:25
  Speaker 4: early doors he looked nervous as well. Throw a long
• 36:27
  Speaker 4: ball out on the fall, it's any Nina sturo kicked
• 36:32
  Speaker 4: another ball out on the fall Amoni Nawa even letter
• 36:36
  Speaker 4: kickoff go over his head and bounce out. So those
• 36:39
  Speaker 4: sort of instances in a final. When we talk about Hoskins,
• 36:44
  Speaker 4: Wallace a Titi performing in a semi, when you don't
• 36:47
  Speaker 4: perform in a final, it's the same sort of dynamics.
• 36:49
  Speaker 4: So I think that hurts Stevenson's chances. And you're right
• 36:52
  Speaker 4: that room in Love has moved ahead of him in
• 36:54
  Speaker 4: the picking order, so he needs some consistent footy as well.
• 36:59
  Speaker 4: He didn't play a lot this year in and out
• 37:01
  Speaker 4: of the Chiefs team, so that didn't help no.
• 37:03
  Speaker 3: And I guess he's always been the NRAL question around
• 37:05
  Speaker 3: Shawn Stevenson. That comes again, I don't know. I know
• 37:09
  Speaker 3: Wayne Bennett tried to get him at the Dolphins wayn
• 37:11
  Speaker 3: Bennett's now gone to going to South Sydney next year.
• 37:15
  Speaker 3: I'm not sure if Shawn Simonson is contracted as yet
• 37:18
  Speaker 3: for next year, trying to remember whether he resigned or not.
• 37:20
  Speaker 3: But regardless, this is an interesting decision coming up for
• 37:23
  Speaker 3: someone like Shawn Steminson.
• 37:24
  Speaker 4: It is and it will be for all the players
• 37:27
  Speaker 4: on the friends. If it's a bit different, you're and
• 37:30
  Speaker 4: Noah Hopham shoes and yeah, you're twenty years old. But
• 37:33
  Speaker 4: if you've been around, you've been knocking on the door,
• 37:35
  Speaker 4: You've played a couple of tests and then been pushed
• 37:37
  Speaker 4: back to the fringe. Others move ahead a year. Yeah,
• 37:40
  Speaker 4: you contemplate your future and potentially look to other options
• 37:44
  Speaker 4: to cash.
• 37:44
  Speaker 6: In you do.
• 37:45
  Speaker 3: Let's get into the midfield as our final selection. Jordi
• 37:48
  Speaker 3: Barrett the new vice captain alongside Rico, Joanni Anton that
• 37:51
  Speaker 3: at Brown and Billy Proctor. I mean this was picked
• 37:53
  Speaker 3: weeks ago. No change there, but great congratulations to Billy Proctor.
• 37:57
  Speaker 3: Great selection. He's been a great, great season for the
• 38:00
  Speaker 3: Hurricanes and well deserving of his chance. He's been a
• 38:03
  Speaker 3: player that's been on the radar of the All Blacks
• 38:04
  Speaker 3: and higher honors for a number of seasons.
• 38:07
  Speaker 6: Now.
• 38:07
  Speaker 3: I think he signed a five year contract just out
• 38:09
  Speaker 3: of high school with the Hurricanes now at twenty five
• 38:13
  Speaker 3: getting into his body, knows the skills, knows how to
• 38:16
  Speaker 3: read a game. Very very good player and well deserving
• 38:20
  Speaker 3: the chance. But as I say, no surprises in that
• 38:21
  Speaker 3: midfield pick No.
• 38:23
  Speaker 4: There's a few dynamics at play here though. Billy thoroughly
• 38:25
  Speaker 4: deserving of his chance, not just for his form this year,
• 38:28
  Speaker 4: but he has been knocking on the door since last year.
• 38:30
  Speaker 4: He's really starting to put some pressure on en Rique Oani.
• 38:35
  Speaker 4: Another question I would put to you is there's three
• 38:38
  Speaker 4: centers in that mix, East Antonlina Brown has the ability
• 38:41
  Speaker 4: to play both, but are the All Black short of
• 38:44
  Speaker 4: another physically dominant twelve.
• 38:47
  Speaker 3: I think they are, to be honest, and that probably
• 38:50
  Speaker 3: speaks to a lack of options, but also in fact
• 38:51
  Speaker 3: they only selected thirty two and perhaps couldn't go a
• 38:55
  Speaker 3: little bit wider. I mean, aj Lamb had superb back
• 38:59
  Speaker 3: into the season. I was doubtful that he was a
• 39:00
  Speaker 3: second five at all, but was probably arguably the player
• 39:03
  Speaker 3: of the semi final and maybe even the final for
• 39:05
  Speaker 3: the Blues. So he's a player that could well have
• 39:06
  Speaker 3: been in the mix for them. David Harveli missing out
• 39:10
  Speaker 3: and there is injury cover. He's played twelve for the
• 39:14
  Speaker 3: Crusaders for a number of seasons, played there for the
• 39:15
  Speaker 3: All Blacks as well, So I think they are missing
• 39:19
  Speaker 3: out on the second five. I mean someone like Harry
• 39:21
  Speaker 3: Plummett could potentially play second five. Maybe not that physically
• 39:23
  Speaker 3: dominant player you're looking for, but that's an area potentially
• 39:27
  Speaker 3: a weakness. If Jordi Barrett goes down, you're looking at
• 39:30
  Speaker 3: a midfield of Anton Lenett Brown, Enrico Yuani or Anton
• 39:33
  Speaker 3: Lenet Brown and Billy Proctor. So I think options are
• 39:36
  Speaker 3: a little bit thin at second five there.
• 39:38
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I think that's my point that Jordi. If you
• 39:41
  Speaker 4: lose Jordian, there's no light for light replacement in terms
• 39:44
  Speaker 4: of what he brings, his ability to bend and break
• 39:47
  Speaker 4: the line, be physically combative on defense. There is no
• 39:52
  Speaker 4: other replacement like that in his Zella rugby out there,
• 39:55
  Speaker 4: So they've sweating on his fitness all year.
• 39:59
  Speaker 3: They will be and I don't know who else is
• 40:01
  Speaker 3: on the Robin aj Lamb. Maybe they will be the
• 40:02
  Speaker 3: next option Bryce Heen the Blues. But there's a guy
• 40:06
  Speaker 3: Allis McLeod, maybe a.
• 40:08
  Speaker 4: Guy that lever More could potentially do that job, but
• 40:12
  Speaker 4: was extremely underwhelming for the Crusaders and looks a long
• 40:14
  Speaker 4: way off Test football, but that's the sort of physical composition.
• 40:19
  Speaker 3: McLoud was sort of mentioned as maybe the Jordy Barrett
• 40:21
  Speaker 3: prototype out of the Crusaders, and maybe that's someone they
• 40:24
  Speaker 3: go back to, but again he didn't have a year
• 40:27
  Speaker 3: of consistency for the Crusaders in terms of selection.
• 40:30
  Speaker 4: We were his pick, so it's not a position of
• 40:32
  Speaker 4: great depth.
• 40:33
  Speaker 3: No, it's not. Any final thoughts on the All Blacks
• 40:35
  Speaker 3: squad of thirty two.
• 40:37
  Speaker 4: I think, well, I don't know, were you expecting a
• 40:41
  Speaker 4: revolution a Razor River right that I.
• 40:44
  Speaker 3: Wasn't, but I think some people were, and I've seen
• 40:46
  Speaker 3: some comments online around well this is similar to what
• 40:49
  Speaker 3: Ian fosterpec last year, and it is to an extent,
• 40:53
  Speaker 3: but no one's really played their way out of selection
• 40:57
  Speaker 3: that are still available for the All Blacks. You think
• 40:59
  Speaker 3: a lot of those players they've stood up again in
• 41:01
  Speaker 3: Super Rugby, they've been there or thereabouts. I think maybe, yeah,
• 41:04
  Speaker 3: people were expecting that he was going to throw out
• 41:05
  Speaker 3: and pick a whole up, but you guys, but in
• 41:07
  Speaker 3: a squad of thirty two, you don't have room for that.
• 41:11
  Speaker 3: Maybe when they get to the Rugby Championship and they're
• 41:13
  Speaker 3: looking at thirty six there there's some new faces that
• 41:15
  Speaker 3: may come in there end of your two. We don't
• 41:17
  Speaker 3: have a number on how many they're likely to take,
• 41:19
  Speaker 3: but there's a five test program abroad starts in Japan, England, Ireland,
• 41:24
  Speaker 3: France Big three weeks in a row, the Italy to
• 41:27
  Speaker 3: finished the season in Churin. That to me looks like
• 41:30
  Speaker 3: where you might see some of these players, especially the
• 41:33
  Speaker 3: night of twenty twenty seven, start to come at a
• 41:35
  Speaker 3: wee bit more if they take an expanded squad.
• 41:37
  Speaker 4: I think the other point to this is this is
• 41:39
  Speaker 4: Ray's's first squad. They have ten days to prepare the
• 41:44
  Speaker 4: All Blacks for a test against England, who are coming
• 41:47
  Speaker 4: off a head out against Japan. Traditionally this is the
• 41:52
  Speaker 4: All Blacks start rusty. You've got a new coaching team,
• 41:56
  Speaker 4: a whole new sort of vision culture. There's a danger
• 42:00
  Speaker 4: that you're going to overwhelm them in a short space
• 42:02
  Speaker 4: of time. So you're not going to throw the baby
• 42:05
  Speaker 4: out with the bath water. As you mentioned, there's still
• 42:07
  Speaker 4: a number of established, core experience All Blacks there, so
• 42:11
  Speaker 4: I wasn't expecting a massive revolution either. So I think
• 42:15
  Speaker 4: on the balance of things you can argue different selections.
• 42:18
  Speaker 4: But we are talking fringe largely as well, because when
• 42:23
  Speaker 4: you look at hooker Samasoni Takyaho is going to come back.
• 42:27
  Speaker 4: When you look at half back Cam Rougart is going
• 42:30
  Speaker 4: to come back, When you look at fallback Will Jordan
• 42:32
  Speaker 4: is going to come back. So there's all those other
• 42:35
  Speaker 4: dynamics at play as well. But it is going to
• 42:38
  Speaker 4: be fascinating to see how the All Blacks, how Razor
• 42:42
  Speaker 4: goes about getting this team ready for a first Test
• 42:44
  Speaker 4: against England, because that is a bloody tough start.
• 42:47
  Speaker 3: It is time is ticking. They're only going to gather
• 42:49
  Speaker 3: on the Wednesday of this week in Wellington. They play
• 42:51
  Speaker 3: a test the following Saturday in Duneed and Wright. So
• 42:55
  Speaker 3: before we leave the All Blacks discussion, let's hear your
• 42:57
  Speaker 3: chat with Ford's coach Jason.
• 42:59
  Speaker 7: Rans It called it the toughest call. What the balance,
• 43:05
  Speaker 7: I guess, yeah, I.
• 43:07
  Speaker 5: Mean tracking both of them.
• 43:09
  Speaker 8: Obviously, it's really important that we have both sides of
• 43:14
  Speaker 8: the ball, if for our loose forwards, and that's something
• 43:17
  Speaker 8: that Ray really wanted from was loosers, you know, thankfully,
• 43:20
  Speaker 8: And that's different than the selecting model that is this
• 43:23
  Speaker 8: year where we all get a little say in specious areas,
• 43:26
  Speaker 8: which is quite unique on its own. I think probably
• 43:29
  Speaker 8: what timpt was how dominant he was in a semi final.
• 43:34
  Speaker 8: To turn up and just put on an absolute clinic
• 43:36
  Speaker 8: like that, it was pretty impressive. Scotty Hanson and coaching
• 43:40
  Speaker 8: in the Twins. He's been around for a while, just
• 43:43
  Speaker 8: similar around the back background and did a little bit
• 43:46
  Speaker 8: of homework with Liam Missing, had a good chat to
• 43:49
  Speaker 8: Hunger about him. He sort of mentored him through and
• 43:52
  Speaker 8: just ask him a couple of questions on character.
• 43:54
  Speaker 5: And that sort of thing. So and he tucks and
• 43:57
  Speaker 5: tipped all the boxes and we believe we could get
• 43:59
  Speaker 5: him to test him were really really cockee side.
• 44:03
  Speaker 7: We'll glad you see that position.
• 44:05
  Speaker 4: Generally, Sad was the year last year as an eights
• 44:09
  Speaker 4: because they've got a lot of flexibility in those of
• 44:11
  Speaker 4: those thoughts. Even both had a look Jacobson, some female
• 44:18
  Speaker 4: we would be your next choice number eight.
• 44:20
  Speaker 8: Yes, I'm going to be a lot bit early to
• 44:22
  Speaker 8: call the next next choices. We've got a artists be
• 44:26
  Speaker 8: so will we know that? And he's you know he
• 44:29
  Speaker 8: can also play seven too, and Wallace gives us that
• 44:32
  Speaker 8: as well. You know he can he can actually play
• 44:34
  Speaker 8: the whole three as well, So there's a you know,
• 44:37
  Speaker 8: we'll get a good look at them training and I've
• 44:39
  Speaker 8: got a fair idea of what our top testing we
• 44:42
  Speaker 8: believe for the first game will be.
• 44:44
  Speaker 5: We need to be there where we're at.
• 44:45
  Speaker 8: So I just think that with Wallace Nester's durability around
• 44:50
  Speaker 8: both sides of the ball, and also there's being able
• 44:52
  Speaker 8: to play a couple of positions is quite important farming.
• 44:56
  Speaker 4: But how does it work with this solection. Obviously cool
• 44:59
  Speaker 4: guys that are in, but ye're cool guys that are
• 45:01
  Speaker 4: in the fringe. Obviously again Hoskins or the hopeful you
• 45:04
  Speaker 4: get them done general type thing.
• 45:06
  Speaker 5: Yep.
• 45:07
  Speaker 8: So Raises talked to whole Skins, He's given him their
• 45:09
  Speaker 8: heads up, and all the guys ever really close, and
• 45:12
  Speaker 8: I think he's touched on who's coming in as a
• 45:14
  Speaker 8: little bit of Andrew cover te conversations with.
• 45:17
  Speaker 5: Fostering a year as well with Blues and talked to
• 45:19
  Speaker 5: vernon that constant.
• 45:22
  Speaker 8: I think that's a good bit of a point of
• 45:24
  Speaker 8: difference that I think all the coaches got around the
• 45:25
  Speaker 8: super clubs this year too.
• 45:26
  Speaker 5: That they're in there all the time and that's where
• 45:29
  Speaker 5: you sort of do your homework and in.
• 45:30
  Speaker 7: The commerce.
• 45:33
  Speaker 6: And toss.
• 45:37
  Speaker 4: He came on late in the year, didn't head to
• 45:39
  Speaker 4: himself when the Tyrell got in Judies for a lot
• 45:43
  Speaker 4: of minutes. He think he's had a big factory three
• 45:45
  Speaker 4: of the same starting not just god enough to be.
• 45:48
  Speaker 5: Sort of it wasn't it wasn't. He's been simone away
• 45:50
  Speaker 5: in the background for Roland.
• 45:51
  Speaker 8: Should's he's the strongest prop of the country thinking squad
• 45:55
  Speaker 8: over friend of Killo.
• 45:56
  Speaker 5: He's amazing and he's young, but.
• 45:59
  Speaker 8: He's he's in a position that's the most demanding position
• 46:04
  Speaker 8: in the rugby field and tight hair prop but well
• 46:06
  Speaker 8: back herself to get him Potesta with you know pretty quickly,
• 46:10
  Speaker 8: and we'll need to and I've got no doubt that
• 46:12
  Speaker 8: we can.
• 46:12
  Speaker 5: And I think it's really.
• 46:17
  Speaker 8: I'll probably like to play a tribute to Jamie McIntosh
• 46:20
  Speaker 8: what was done a great job with with Pussy and
• 46:24
  Speaker 8: Lowie and that's you know in the Suffo.
• 46:27
  Speaker 5: So I think that you know where he's got into
• 46:28
  Speaker 5: it at the moment.
• 46:29
  Speaker 8: The conversations that I've had with with what during the
• 46:32
  Speaker 8: year constantly has been really good and he's played back
• 46:36
  Speaker 8: part and now we've we've.
• 46:36
  Speaker 5: Got to get him to the next level down and
• 46:38
  Speaker 5: all black and he's at a great age. You know,
• 46:40
  Speaker 5: he could disguise on them off for the young color.
• 46:43
  Speaker 4: Obviously your tight heads. Yeah, Yan creas scrumbling and you
• 46:45
  Speaker 4: know he called you just come first. But as a
• 46:47
  Speaker 4: former number eight, I think he only switched four years
• 46:51
  Speaker 4: ago in Southland to those skills, that skill set something
• 46:57
  Speaker 4: that you like as well.
• 46:58
  Speaker 5: Yeah, you've got to have a scrum first.
• 46:59
  Speaker 8: And he's there and you know the test level was
• 47:02
  Speaker 8: a little bit different and it's up quite a bit more.
• 47:04
  Speaker 5: But his agility around the park has Paul carry.
• 47:08
  Speaker 8: High, especially that twenty two attack stuff and his work
• 47:11
  Speaker 8: around them all both sides of the ball.
• 47:13
  Speaker 5: He's right on. So yeah, it's it's exciting with the
• 47:17
  Speaker 5: three tidies, we've got to the field.
• 47:20
  Speaker 7: What about agis just the style of plague?
• 47:22
  Speaker 4: How how much you said evolving from from last year,
• 47:26
  Speaker 4: were still caring for a number of guys that were
• 47:28
  Speaker 4: in that squad.
• 47:31
  Speaker 7: How how's this group going to play it without giving
• 47:33
  Speaker 7: too much?
• 47:34
  Speaker 5: We want to have a crack.
• 47:37
  Speaker 8: We were you know, we're being challenged as coaches to
• 47:39
  Speaker 8: make sure that we're having a real dug in our
• 47:42
  Speaker 8: own areas. And the one thing, one of the many
• 47:46
  Speaker 8: things I losed learned in the test arena is you've
• 47:49
  Speaker 8: got to have your four pack even more so, you know,
• 47:53
  Speaker 8: really leading and that sets up other parts of your
• 47:56
  Speaker 8: game really. But you know, under the roof, I want
• 47:59
  Speaker 8: to put on a good show and I've got no
• 48:02
  Speaker 8: different you know, I'm sure England are no different than
• 48:05
  Speaker 8: how they want to play a tough side.
• 48:07
  Speaker 7: What made him in a general gone up a few
• 48:11
  Speaker 7: notches in the Six Nations.
• 48:13
  Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, they have been. I think they're in a
• 48:16
  Speaker 5: think they're in a good spot.
• 48:17
  Speaker 8: They're Yeah, they've heard it because you know that game
• 48:20
  Speaker 8: against Island in the last game in the Six Nations
• 48:22
  Speaker 8: from They're upstanding. Saw a lot of that game and
• 48:25
  Speaker 8: done our homework on them as they will be on us.
• 48:28
  Speaker 8: And I think they're here in the country in a
• 48:30
  Speaker 8: few days. So we're looking forward to the series. Great
• 48:32
  Speaker 8: to come straight out of the blocks into England.
• 48:34
  Speaker 5: I know we're rectally quick.
• 48:35
  Speaker 3: It's some interesting thoughts there from Jace. Ryan and I
• 48:38
  Speaker 3: caught up with the new cap in the front row
• 48:41
  Speaker 3: the un cap player in the front row PASSAI or TOSSI, congratulations,
• 48:45
  Speaker 3: how did you find out?
• 48:46
  Speaker 2: Ray?
• 48:47
  Speaker 3: Ray called me this morning?
• 48:50
  Speaker 6: Oh teacher.
• 48:51
  Speaker 2: The story.
• 48:51
  Speaker 6: I was just trotting upstairs because it's just waking up,
• 48:55
  Speaker 6: and I was trotting upstairs and normally I'll put a
• 48:56
  Speaker 6: movie on just to mothered them out, and chucked on
• 48:59
  Speaker 6: a movie and normal normally they're they're all right, but
• 49:01
  Speaker 6: one decided to throw a tantrum. So I was holding
• 49:03
  Speaker 6: him my mom and a phone call came through and
• 49:05
  Speaker 6: it was a random number. Normally I'm not one to
• 49:08
  Speaker 6: answer them because you know, like I'm not one to answer.
• 49:10
  Speaker 6: I'll just let it ring. But on on Friday, I
• 49:14
  Speaker 6: remember mosst and Ray saying that, like, you'll get a
• 49:15
  Speaker 6: phone call farm from either one of us to let
• 49:18
  Speaker 6: you know if you're in the team. So all weekend
• 49:20
  Speaker 6: I was I was real anxious about getting their phone
• 49:23
  Speaker 6: call or not. And then when I came through the
• 49:25
  Speaker 6: random umber, I was like, I have to pick it up,
• 49:26
  Speaker 6: you know, like you never know who it is. Yeah,
• 49:28
  Speaker 6: and then I picked it up. I picked it up
• 49:31
  Speaker 6: and it was m Ray and he said he made
• 49:32
  Speaker 6: the team. And you know, I was just overwhelmed and
• 49:35
  Speaker 6: just you know, feel with joy, you know, like especially
• 49:37
  Speaker 6: when it's something that you've been that you that you
• 49:39
  Speaker 6: work towards throughout the season and you know, now now
• 49:43
  Speaker 6: I'm here, and you know, all I can do now
• 49:45
  Speaker 6: is just learn and and try to be a better
• 49:47
  Speaker 6: Raguy player and be able to earn that jersey.
• 49:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah, did the kids finish the movie or did you?
• 49:52
  Speaker 3: Did you celebrate with him or how did that plan?
• 49:54
  Speaker 6: Actually, I actually don't remember because as soon as as
• 49:56
  Speaker 6: soon as you told me that I made the team.
• 49:57
  Speaker 3: Like everything was just out the winters.
• 49:59
  Speaker 6: I just wanted to celebrate with my family, you know,
• 50:01
  Speaker 6: So went downstairs, wake up moms. He brought her up
• 50:03
  Speaker 6: and I was hugging the kids, hugging her, and I
• 50:06
  Speaker 6: was saying like, you know, we're here now, you know,
• 50:07
  Speaker 6: but hard work starts now, you know, Like, Yeah.
• 50:10
  Speaker 3: What kind of road has it been to be in
• 50:11
  Speaker 3: this all black Tuesday? You take us through your rugby Jouney. Oh,
• 50:14
  Speaker 3: it's been pretty rocky, you know. Like I started at
• 50:16
  Speaker 3: eight first.
• 50:17
  Speaker 6: I was eight when I when I moved down to Southland,
• 50:19
  Speaker 6: and I think it was I was down there for
• 50:21
  Speaker 6: four years. I was playing at number eight, and then
• 50:23
  Speaker 6: I think my last year there in twenty twenty, we
• 50:25
  Speaker 6: had lockdown and I packed on like fifteen to twenty gigs. Yeah,
• 50:29
  Speaker 6: and but it was I could have easily switched the
• 50:32
  Speaker 6: prop way before, but it was just getting my ego
• 50:34
  Speaker 6: and check telling myself that, you know, like no number
• 50:37
  Speaker 6: is jumping on line out a one hundred and forty
• 50:38
  Speaker 6: clicks or running around and being able to.
• 50:40
  Speaker 3: Lasted that weight. So I would have said the easiest, but.
• 50:44
  Speaker 6: It was I just had to switch, you know, like,
• 50:48
  Speaker 6: you know, like I had a big gut on me,
• 50:50
  Speaker 6: you know, like and so once I once I made that,
• 50:53
  Speaker 6: that switched the number to number three, it's I hit,
• 50:56
  Speaker 6: you know, like it was. It was a it was
• 50:58
  Speaker 6: a long road learning it, but big thanks I got
• 51:01
  Speaker 6: big thanks to Whopper, Whopper taking taking time and you know,
• 51:07
  Speaker 6: helping me perfect my craft. You know, obviously I'm not
• 51:09
  Speaker 6: the perfect scrummager, but I feel like I've got way.
• 51:12
  Speaker 6: I've learned heaps from him, and I've saw what heaps
• 51:15
  Speaker 6: heaps way to go and off Lowey as well, try
• 51:17
  Speaker 6: lone Max, because in my eyes, he's he's probably the
• 51:20
  Speaker 6: best tight hit in the world at the moment. And
• 51:22
  Speaker 6: learning firsthand off of mare trainings and and all. That's
• 51:25
  Speaker 6: been pretty cool.
• 51:26
  Speaker 3: What's it been like being being a super rugby player?
• 51:28
  Speaker 3: I mean, you scored the winner against the Reds earlier
• 51:31
  Speaker 3: in the season. Do you feel like you've grown over
• 51:32
  Speaker 3: the last week while just sort of as a player
• 51:35
  Speaker 3: and confidence everything like that.
• 51:36
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I feel like that's what it was.
• 51:38
  Speaker 3: Confidence.
• 51:39
  Speaker 6: You know, Like the last couple of years, I just
• 51:41
  Speaker 6: felt like I didn't get much game time, you know,
• 51:43
  Speaker 6: like and like we had we had great TI hits,
• 51:45
  Speaker 6: we had Tarau and we had Owie as well, so
• 51:47
  Speaker 6: understandably that. But when my opportunity came this year, I
• 51:51
  Speaker 6: just had to I had to take it of two hands,
• 51:54
  Speaker 6: you know what I mean, Like, yeah, I was just
• 51:57
  Speaker 6: I don't know, I wouldn't old Sales. I was pretty
• 51:59
  Speaker 6: lucky to be able to get an opportunity to be
• 52:01
  Speaker 6: able to jam. And you know, obviously with I wouldn't
• 52:05
  Speaker 6: say it helped nothing towards Lowe, but when he got
• 52:07
  Speaker 6: injured and I was starting those games, I felt like
• 52:09
  Speaker 6: it helped me grow my confidence as well in starting
• 52:12
  Speaker 6: because I've never I've never started for the Canes or
• 52:16
  Speaker 6: or there so I was always coming off the bench.
• 52:18
  Speaker 6: So once I was once I was comfortable and startying,
• 52:20
  Speaker 6: you know, like being able to start and come off the.
• 52:22
  Speaker 3: Bench and and just try and play good, you know.
• 52:24
  Speaker 6: So it was good.
• 52:25
  Speaker 3: Yeah, then we'll do us for our All Blacks chat.
• 52:27
  Speaker 3: We'll take a quick break, come back and talk the
• 52:28
  Speaker 3: Super Rugby Final after this. So on Rugby Direct.
• 52:31
  Speaker 2: This is Rugby Direct, a podcast for real rugby fans.
• 52:39
  Speaker 2: Every try, don't.
• 52:40
  Speaker 3: Try and sixty six every tackle tackle get up again.
• 52:47
  Speaker 4: Before time.
• 52:48
  Speaker 2: It's Rugby Direct powered Buddies Talks to Me.
• 52:51
  Speaker 3: Welcome back into Rugby Direct, powered by Habit Health. Second
• 52:53
  Speaker 3: half of our podcast. Now let's talk the Super Rugby Final.
• 52:57
  Speaker 3: We're gonna do things a little differently than we do
• 52:59
  Speaker 3: in the back half of our podcast usually we'll dig
• 53:01
  Speaker 3: into the Super Rugby Final. The Blues winning comfortably forty
• 53:05
  Speaker 3: one ten for a tipping combine. I think we put
• 53:09
  Speaker 3: a twenty five dollars point on the points on the
• 53:11
  Speaker 3: line when it and so that's had another twenty five
• 53:14
  Speaker 3: points for advantage. So I thought, you bet you fifty
• 53:16
  Speaker 3: in the end. But it was a comprehensive win by
• 53:18
  Speaker 3: the Blues. Not much you can say about the Chiefs.
• 53:21
  Speaker 3: Other than the fact that they were in it for
• 53:22
  Speaker 3: the first four or five minutes and then went in
• 53:24
  Speaker 3: it for the remaining seventy five or at least most
• 53:27
  Speaker 3: of them. That was a very, very good finals performance
• 53:30
  Speaker 3: from the Blues.
• 53:31
  Speaker 4: It was I guess you could say from a contest
• 53:35
  Speaker 4: point of view, it was a flop yep. And I
• 53:37
  Speaker 4: really felt for the hordes of Chiefs fans. Matt Cooper
• 53:41
  Speaker 4: was suggesting there was going to be twenty thousand Chiefs
• 53:44
  Speaker 4: fans and walking around pre match when the rain was
• 53:47
  Speaker 4: falling the concourse it was packed with Chiefs fans. I
• 53:50
  Speaker 4: know they had a Kingsland bar, a supporter's bar there
• 53:54
  Speaker 4: that Sam Caine was at. And look, they came in
• 53:57
  Speaker 4: their droves and they sat through the rain and witnessed
• 54:03
  Speaker 4: a very underwhelming performance and a lot of credit to
• 54:06
  Speaker 4: that has to go for the Blues. There's the weight
• 54:10
  Speaker 4: of expectation would be massive, the pressure twenty one years
• 54:13
  Speaker 4: without a title. There are people in Eden Park that
• 54:16
  Speaker 4: wouldn't have witnessed a title in their lifetime. You know,
• 54:20
  Speaker 4: it's been such a long time. But that was so
• 54:23
  Speaker 4: clinical from the Blues and everything they did. They never
• 54:26
  Speaker 4: really look threatened. They were up I think twenty points
• 54:29
  Speaker 4: to three. The Chiefs didn't score any points for eighteen minutes.
• 54:33
  Speaker 4: They stuck to their blueprint all year. Patrick Tuopolotu was
• 54:37
  Speaker 4: huge coming back five weeks early from a nee ligament injury.
• 54:42
  Speaker 4: And what can you say about Verne Cotter? He has
• 54:46
  Speaker 4: gone where so many Blues coaches haven't you think about
• 54:50
  Speaker 4: the Blues. You compare that performance to the Blues performance
• 54:54
  Speaker 4: and the final two years ago against the Crusaders, Yes,
• 54:56
  Speaker 4: different opposition. You compare that performance to their semi final
• 55:01
  Speaker 4: flop in christ Church last year and just the mentality
• 55:05
  Speaker 4: that the difference in the way they turned up and
• 55:08
  Speaker 4: the way they executed. A lot of that credit has
• 55:11
  Speaker 4: to go to Verne.
• 55:12
  Speaker 3: Oh, it's got so And speaking to Offatonga Fasi last week,
• 55:15
  Speaker 3: he said that it's probably the simplest game plan that
• 55:17
  Speaker 3: he's had at the Blues. But simple work sometimes, and
• 55:20
  Speaker 3: it's worked for the Blues this season. It's a very
• 55:24
  Speaker 3: not necessarily spring box style I've sent compared to them,
• 55:26
  Speaker 3: but it's just, you know, it's just using the Fords
• 55:29
  Speaker 3: and the way that they want. They get themselves into position,
• 55:31
  Speaker 3: then they just bang, bang bang. The line and trust
• 55:33
  Speaker 3: that they're going to break it eventually. There's a lot
• 55:36
  Speaker 3: of trust in that game plan that they're built up.
• 55:38
  Speaker 3: And when was the last time the Blues scored a
• 55:41
  Speaker 3: try from forty out fifty meters out? Just simply hasn't
• 55:44
  Speaker 3: happened in recent time. Maybe some of the games against
• 55:46
  Speaker 3: Australian position they might have squnceded long ranges. But they
• 55:49
  Speaker 3: know their blueprint. It's another matter stopping it and they've
• 55:53
  Speaker 3: used it as as a weapon this year off of Tonga.
• 55:57
  Speaker 3: Fassi's playing some of the best rugby in his career.
• 55:59
  Speaker 3: The Keta Yuani in his final season with the Blues
• 56:01
  Speaker 3: has stepped up immensely, and Houstin's a two too. We
• 56:04
  Speaker 3: saw the best come out of him this season as well.
• 56:07
  Speaker 3: And you add An Patrick twy but lot too missed
• 56:10
  Speaker 3: a lot of the season with the daw injury. Comes
• 56:11
  Speaker 3: back and you know this is the semi final with
• 56:16
  Speaker 3: the knee injury, comes back and plays the final in
• 56:18
  Speaker 3: an inspirational man of the match performance. As I say,
• 56:21
  Speaker 3: sometimes simple works and that's what the Blues have drawn
• 56:24
  Speaker 3: their blueprint around this season. One thing I think the
• 56:26
  Speaker 3: Chiefs knew exactly how the Blues are going to play.
• 56:28
  Speaker 3: It's one thing knowing about it, it's another thing stopping it.
• 56:31
  Speaker 3: And the Chiefs just didn't have any answer in the night.
• 56:33
  Speaker 4: Well, everyone knew how the Blues were going to play.
• 56:35
  Speaker 4: That They started that blueprint in the preseason when they
• 56:38
  Speaker 4: went to Japan and carried it into their opening match
• 56:42
  Speaker 4: against the Fijian dru In funga Ay and played that
• 56:46
  Speaker 4: way through the whole year. They didn't deviate from the script.
• 56:49
  Speaker 4: They actually used the ball more in that final, I
• 56:52
  Speaker 4: felt than at other times and did it really well.
• 56:55
  Speaker 4: Caleb Clark made various breaks a hat trick in the final.
• 56:59
  Speaker 4: He probably needs some new spriggs because he's always fallen over,
• 57:01
  Speaker 4: but what a moment for him has In nineteen ninety six,
• 57:05
  Speaker 4: I think it was Ronnie Clark, his father scored a
• 57:08
  Speaker 4: try when the Blues won the title. And here he
• 57:10
  Speaker 4: is twenty eight years on, scoring a hat trick and
• 57:13
  Speaker 4: winning a title. So there are some great stories when
• 57:15
  Speaker 4: you look at a kid to Iwani as you mentioned
• 57:19
  Speaker 4: Vooon coming in in his first year and it is
• 57:22
  Speaker 4: nice for Auckland as a region to get that monkey
• 57:26
  Speaker 4: off their back and it is going to be fascinating
• 57:29
  Speaker 4: to see whether others can rise to the challenge. I
• 57:32
  Speaker 4: don't think the Blues will deviate much from that blueprint.
• 57:35
  Speaker 4: Next year. Can the Hurricanes, Crusaders, Chiefs come again and
• 57:40
  Speaker 4: challenge them? Maybe the Reds from Australia. Looking at the Chiefs,
• 57:45
  Speaker 4: they very much did feel and looked like they played
• 57:47
  Speaker 4: their final the previous week against the Hurricanes and Wellington.
• 57:51
  Speaker 4: I think it speaks to rugby and general tournament rugby
• 57:55
  Speaker 4: about how hard it is to get up three weeks
• 57:57
  Speaker 4: in a row. They smashed the Reds, they were a
• 58:01
  Speaker 4: lot better than the Hurricanes and Wellington, and then they
• 58:03
  Speaker 4: were miles off against the Blues. And they've now lost
• 58:06
  Speaker 4: two finals in a row three in the past four years.
• 58:10
  Speaker 3: They lost the Super Rugby alter had Off final in
• 58:12
  Speaker 3: two each and won to the Crusaders as well.
• 58:14
  Speaker 4: So in some respects they are where the Blues were
• 58:18
  Speaker 4: prior to UN's arrival. So Clayton McMillon has to find
• 58:21
  Speaker 4: that missing ingredient to get them over the line in
• 58:24
  Speaker 4: a final. Can he do it?
• 58:25
  Speaker 2: Well?
• 58:26
  Speaker 3: The jury's out on that, isn't it. I thought the
• 58:30
  Speaker 3: final because I still thought the Blues wuld win, But
• 58:32
  Speaker 3: I thought the final be closed, and I felt like
• 58:33
  Speaker 3: the Chiefs had learned some of the lessons of last year,
• 58:35
  Speaker 3: where they were the best team in the regular season
• 58:38
  Speaker 3: then ran out of puff at the end, and it
• 58:40
  Speaker 3: felt like they just peaked at the right time, potentially
• 58:43
  Speaker 3: perhaps the form team of Super Rugby going against the
• 58:45
  Speaker 3: most consistent team this year in Super Rugby. But as
• 58:48
  Speaker 3: it happened all the night, they just didn't have anything.
• 58:49
  Speaker 3: They didn't seem to have that finals mentality. The Blues
• 58:52
  Speaker 3: forwards pack out muscled the Chiefs. I thought it wasn't
• 58:56
  Speaker 3: really much of a contest up front, you know, whilst
• 59:00
  Speaker 3: it was a standout for the Chiefs again, but other
• 59:02
  Speaker 3: than that, you try and think of standout performances from
• 59:04
  Speaker 3: the Chiefs and there really weren't many. Damian McKenzie didn't
• 59:07
  Speaker 3: have great border work with We've touched on Sean Stevenson
• 59:10
  Speaker 3: in the first half of podcast. The back three didn't
• 59:12
  Speaker 3: have a lot calling the game. I mean barely called
• 59:15
  Speaker 3: Antonina Brown's name in commentary, didn't. They just didn't have
• 59:18
  Speaker 3: the ball and the Blues just spallowed it up and
• 59:23
  Speaker 3: knew their game plan and got their way to the
• 59:25
  Speaker 3: finish line. And that was as good a Final as
• 59:28
  Speaker 3: performance in a Grand Final that you could possibly want
• 59:30
  Speaker 3: to see from a team.
• 59:31
  Speaker 4: It was a Chiefs. The Blues forced the Chiefs to
• 59:34
  Speaker 4: make something like one hundred and fifty more tackles, and
• 59:38
  Speaker 4: you're not in the fight. When you're defending for that long,
• 59:40
  Speaker 4: you simply can't impose any scoreboard pressure, any territorial pressure.
• 59:47
  Speaker 4: You you're a battering ram. And the Blues were just
• 59:51
  Speaker 4: hitting it up, one off the ruck, one off the ruck,
• 59:53
  Speaker 4: pushing the Chiefs back, and that's resulted in defending for
• 59:58
  Speaker 4: that long, you get frustrated, and that translated into penalties.
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 4: They're on the wrong side of I think it was
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 4: a twelve five penalty count Nickberry ping them off the park.
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 4: They got a a yellow card in the second half.
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 4: So all those things compounded frustrations, mistakes, discipline that they
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 4: were never in the fight.
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 3: They weren't the first four or five minutes they were
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 3: in the fight. They forced a couple of hasty excepts
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 3: from the Blues, and then they got a penalty and
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 3: took the shot at goal from memory when.
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 4: It was about fifty odd meters out.
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and it missed, But maybe the percentage play was
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 3: getting to the twenty two and trying to make a
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 3: real early statement. Easier to say that in hindsight. Isn't
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 3: it just that those kind of moments, you know, you
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 3: get up to a five lead early, seven lead early,
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 3: you put some pressure on the opposition three nil, Yes,
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 3: it's a final yessu. You want points on the board.
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 3: And as I said, easy to say this in hindsight,
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 3: but maybe getting that scoreboard pressure, taking the crowd out
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 3: of it early may have been the option.
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 4: Yeah, to a degree, I do feel like it was
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 4: written the Stars and the Blues had a composure and
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 4: a clinical nature about them that they were always going
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 4: to win that. But you're right at the chief score early,
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 4: maybe there's a bit of anxiety builds. Things can change quickly,
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 4: but it just didn't happen for them, And you're right,
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 4: Damien McKenzie, Yes, off a poor platform, but even there's
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 4: little things like crossfield kicks didn't go to hands. Accuracy
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 4: was not there for the Chiefs on the biggest stage,
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 4: and that's something that he's going to need to bring
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 4: and improve on when he's the starting All Blacks ten
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 4: that those are big shoes to fill for Damien in
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 4: the next week.
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 3: Or so they are. Let me ask you, we touched
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 3: on the Blues and they're probably not going to deviate
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 3: from this too much next year. A kidder Joannie is going,
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 3: Ricco Yuanni from my understanding, is on sabbatical next year.
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 3: So there are a couple of players that have gone,
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 3: but otherwise you look through that team and the majority
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 3: at this point from our understanding, going to be back
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 3: for season twenty twenty five. I mean, do they have
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 3: the makings of a bit of a dynasty starting here?
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 3: I mean it's easy to say after one title, but
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 3: do you feel like that the platforms there that they
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 3: can build on this get some more silver aware.
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 4: It wouldn't go as far to say at dynasty because
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 4: I think what the Crusaders have built, and you know,
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 4: it's really tough to see that come crumbling down.
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 3: Special for you to say that here in christ Chips
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 3: that they've built their dynasty.
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 4: That I don't know if that will ever be repeated,
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 4: you know, but look, the makings for the Blues are there.
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 4: Cameras sorry for steps into a Kiddawana's shoes, very similar
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 4: physical composition type player, and they've also got Anton Signa
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 4: and Adrian Choates so some real depth and the loose forwards.
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 4: They've got Bryce Heim who came off the bench. He
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 4: was injured at the back end of the year. I
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 4: suspect you'll go one more, so you know there's cover
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 4: there for Rico Iwani. They've got depth right across the
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 4: park so that they're not losing any big pieces. Vern Stain.
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 4: That coaching team's remaining intact and it is a very
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 4: high powered coaching team outside of her, and we've talked
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 4: about all Paul Tito, grig Feak, Jason o'haller and Dan
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 4: Helen Gahu, so all the pieces are there and they
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 4: are let's not let's be real as well. From a
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 4: recruitment and financial perspective, the Blues are better off than
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 4: anyone else in this competition, so they are very well
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 4: set up to sustain success well.
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 3: For a number of seasons, that wasn't the case though,
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 3: wasn't it. There was all sorts of excuses about how
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 3: no one wanted to live in Auckland because you can't
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 3: buy a house there. It's too hard to commuse. It's
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 3: da da da da da. The team can't win. Funny
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 3: how winning sort of fixes everything in that regard and
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 3: this is going to make a more attractive proposition. I mean,
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 3: you know, they don't necessarily need to recruit, but if
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 3: they do, you know, they're right back at the top
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 3: of the table in terms of, you know, making those
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 3: pictures to players coming through. You know, they've lost a
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 3: lot of players through the years from the one A
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 3: program that have gone elsewhere and found success. So that's
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 3: the you know, winning winning a title can sort of
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 3: paper over some of those things. Zaran Sullivan's an interesting one.
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 3: Hasn't re signed with the Blues for next year. I
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 3: imagine all four potentially other franchises are having a look
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 3: and maybe trying to get him down. They're so interesting
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 3: to see where that he stays on board. But look,
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 3: they're well set up, aren't they for future success?
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 4: They are, and that's probably the only players that they
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 4: do lose, guys that are established and aren't getting the
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 4: game time they're looking for. Enzan's one of those guys.
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 4: Boden Barratt coming back into the mix next year is
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 4: very interesting dynamic in terms of where he slots and
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 4: how that affects the dynamic. And for a guy like Zan,
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 4: he is probably better off going elsewhere, So does he
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 4: take the leap of faith like Jacob Ratamvuki Nipkins and others.
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 4: You know, Swani vakna at hooker hasn't been cited in
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 4: recent times, and there are a litany of examples on
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 4: the fringe of that Blue squads who may be looking
• 1:05:06
  Speaker 4: at the Highlanders or the Crusaders or any other team
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 4: to go and push their claims because ultimately, if you
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 4: want to be pushing for Horror honors or any rugging player.
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 3: Wants to play, Yeah, they do and they want those opportunities.
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 3: So it's going to be fascinating to see where he
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 3: ends up and what other transfers there might be around.
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 3: The few whispers around. I think suwadi Va Kenna leaving
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 3: to potentially go the Highlanders kle Tank Tower on the
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 3: way as well, So there will be some change, but
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 3: those are players that are in the background, deepen the
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 3: squad rather than being the first choice players. So yeah,
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 3: been a fascinating Super Rugby season and roll on twenty
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 3: twenty five.
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 4: That's right, and I guess changes in the works with
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 4: the drawer and the finals format and a new champion
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 4: for the first time in eight years, and I think
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 4: you know it's fair to say New Zealand's pretty happy
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 4: about it.
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Australia less. So they'll figure it out. They'll figure
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 3: it out eventually. We'll have an Australian champion again one
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 3: day and Super Rugby wont me before this all winds up?
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 4: Maybe? Maybe what about the kebnets here? Are they any chance.
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 3: They've still they've still got the Super Rugby or one
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 3: that's still got that count?
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 3: Yes, the other Super still got I think they won
• 1:06:17
  Speaker 3: the last Super fourteen. Mate, we'll find out some big
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 3: holes there. You can't win it for a year. They'll
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 3: get back the Hurricanes one of the places. How's the
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 3: Hurricanes one?
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 4: Oh? Look, you know Clark lade Laer. We trust it's
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 4: been an above expectations year and there's a lot of young,
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 4: dynamic talent artists coming back and Title town's on the
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 4: way to Wellington.
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 3: If you say so right? That'll do us for rugby
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 3: direct from our Christ will be back next week ahead
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 3: the first teast against England. Have yourself, it's a good week.
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 3: I thanks to Last and Bars English and also to
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 3: Habit Health.
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 1: For more from News Talks b listen live on air
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 1: or online and keep our shows with you wherever you
• 1:07:00
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