Latest / Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families / #1249 - Supporting Autonomy Without Losing Authority

Transcript

#1249 - Supporting Autonomy Without Losing Authority · Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families

• 0:06
  Speaker 1: Date night for the kids. Is it a good idea,
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: is it a bad idea? Does it work or does
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: it just indulge them? And the importance of setting limits.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: That's where we're going today on the Happy Families podcast
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: Real Parenting Solutions every Day. This is Australia's most downloaded
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: parenting podcasts where Justin and Kylie Courson. Every Friday we
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: share news from our week, good, I'll do about it tomorrow,
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: what's working, what's not working in our home and our
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: family with our kids, in the hope that us being
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: intentional about our parenting will help you to be intentional
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  Speaker 1: about your parenting and raise happier kids, make your family happier.
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  Speaker 2: Kylie, I'm going to go.
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: First because my one is about getting heavy, coming in
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: and setting limits. Increasingly, I'm seeing parents that really struggle
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: with this, Like we just want our kids to feel
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: good all the time, We want them to have good
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  Speaker 1: things in their lives, and I'm susceptible to that like
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  Speaker 1: anybody else, Like, we try not to have too many
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  Speaker 1: rules for our kids.
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  Speaker 2: Would that be fair?
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  Speaker 3: Yep? Yep, that would be.
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  Speaker 1: And sometimes they do take advantage of that. So for
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: those of you who have missed the memo Emily is
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: our youngest. Two stories about Emily today, actually one from you,
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  Speaker 1: one from me.
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  Speaker 3: But oh, we're not going to be very popular with
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  Speaker 3: the other kids today, are we o.
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: Kids get angry when we don't share stories about them.
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  Speaker 1: I'm sorry, kids, today is all about Emily. So Emily's eleven,
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: she's been homeschooled. She's technically in grade five, and she's
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: keeping up with the curriculum. But just recently she has
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: been unenthusiastic since the school holidays, because we do school holidays,
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: she's been unenthusiastic about homeschool. Yeah, really just doesn't want
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: to be doing it. And the other day you said
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: to her, until you've done your writing, that there was
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: a specific writing assignment that she had to do. Until
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: you've done the writing, no, you can't watch TV. And
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  Speaker 1: she's like, but I want to play a game, or
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  Speaker 1: I want to watch YouTube, or I want to all this.
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  Speaker 1: She just wanted to be on the screen and you
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: said no, and as a result of that, she refused
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  Speaker 1: to do her writing. But then she also refused to
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  Speaker 1: do any other lessons as well, which that the morning
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: was completely unproductive. And then you had to go out.
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: So I'm in the office, Emily comes into me and says, Dad,
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  Speaker 1: can I watch the TV? I give you a quick
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  Speaker 1: call to check in and find out what she's up
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  Speaker 1: to with schoolwork, and you reaffirmed to me that she
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  Speaker 1: hadn't done her writing and that there's no TV intil
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: the writing's done. And sometimes she's got a lot of
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: energy for this, and she wins because you've got other
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: things to do, and we just sort of shrug our
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  Speaker 1: shoulders and go, you know what, it's too hard, and
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: we're just going to give her the remote because we
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: need twenty minutes to record a podcast or whatever. But
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: you were out, I had work to do, and I
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  Speaker 1: just looked at her and said, I'm so sorry, kiddo.
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  Speaker 1: I love you so much, and I wish that you
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  Speaker 1: could have twenty or thirty minutes watching an episode on Telly,
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  Speaker 1: but you've not done your writing assignment for homeschool today,
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  Speaker 1: and so therefore I can't let you watch TV.
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  Speaker 2: And she lost it. I mean, a total screaming banshie.
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  Speaker 1: If I was a neighbor, I would have thought that
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  Speaker 1: this was a call to the police, right, And I
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  Speaker 1: wasn't near her.
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  Speaker 2: I didn't make any threats.
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  Speaker 1: I was extremely loving, gentle, and kind, but she and
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  Speaker 1: she wailed as she ran through the house and cried
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: that I was the worst pairing.
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  Speaker 2: In the world and did all the stuff, and.
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  Speaker 1: Then she came back to me about an hour later
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  Speaker 1: and said, Dad, I've done five lessons now. I don't
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  Speaker 1: know how she did five homeschool lessons in one hour,
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  Speaker 1: but she showed me the evidence and she actually had
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  Speaker 1: They were pretty easy lessons, but she'd done five lessons
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  Speaker 1: and she was like, can I watch TV now because
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  Speaker 1: I've done all the lessons that I had to do today?
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  Speaker 1: And I said, what about the writing assignment that you
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  Speaker 1: had to do?
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  Speaker 2: And she just lost it again. She said, I don't
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  Speaker 2: want to do it. It's the worst.
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  Speaker 1: And when I tried to ask her about it, it
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  Speaker 1: just came down to it. It was not about ability,
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  Speaker 1: and it wasn't even about the valid the usefulness of
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  Speaker 1: that particular assignment.
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  Speaker 2: She just had zero motivation for doing it.
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  Speaker 1: I was like, kid, I'm so sorry, I'm so glad
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  Speaker 1: you've done five lessons and you deserve a high five
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  Speaker 1: and a hug for that. But she hid so she
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  Speaker 1: wouldn't let me do that I said, no TV, and Kylie,
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  Speaker 1: you're the worst.
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  Speaker 2: This was worse.
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  Speaker 1: She responded worse the second time because now she felt
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  Speaker 1: like she'd earned it because she done lessons. And I'm
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: sitting there going, I'm just trying to get I'm trying
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  Speaker 1: to write a book here about earning and I'm being tested. Finally,
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  Speaker 1: she came to me about half an hour later, and
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  Speaker 1: she did the writing assignment. She showed it to me
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  Speaker 1: and she said, now can I watch TV?
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  Speaker 2: And I had to look at it, and she.
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  Speaker 1: Did a completely satisfactory job. She was able to do
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  Speaker 1: it all the way through. And I said, well, it's
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  Speaker 1: so funny you ask. Mum's going to be home in
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  Speaker 1: a couple of minutes, so we're going to show this
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  Speaker 1: to Mum and Mum will decide whether you've done it
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  Speaker 1: satisfactorily or not, and then we'll work out whether you
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  Speaker 1: can watch TV. But well done. You did the hard thing,
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  Speaker 1: and once you do the hard stuff, then you get
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  Speaker 1: to do the good stuff. And it was just I
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  Speaker 1: guess my I'd do better tomorrow. Is this setting limits
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  Speaker 1: matters and our children if they can just like a river,
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  Speaker 1: they will find the path of least resistance. Unless we
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  Speaker 1: provide the supports and the expectations that they will do
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  Speaker 1: the hard stuff before they get the good stuff.
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: And I don't know.
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  Speaker 1: It was just one of those moments where it crystallized
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  Speaker 1: for me our kids need limits, and when they have
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  Speaker 1: the limits, they do live up to the expectations we have.
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  Speaker 2: Of them, they can do it.
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  Speaker 1: I just felt like it was a great parenting moment
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  Speaker 1: and needed to be shared today in case any parent
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  Speaker 1: is starting to think I'm wavering.
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  Speaker 2: It's getting too hard. Maybe I should let go of
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: the limits.
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  Speaker 1: They matter, right, They matter with context, you want to
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  Speaker 1: make sure that you're understanding what's really going on.
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: But they matter. So what's your old about tomorrow?
• 5:35
  Speaker 3: Well, I've actually had a really good win. School in
• 5:37
  Speaker 3: general has been really tricky since we've got back, as
• 5:40
  Speaker 3: you've already mentioned, but we've been making some really intentional
• 5:44
  Speaker 3: decisions around food lately, and we had a couple of
• 5:48
  Speaker 3: brilliant days with Emily. I introduced her to radish and
• 5:51
  Speaker 3: snow peas and sugar bees and she did amazing And
• 5:56
  Speaker 3: then we found ourselves alone, just her and I night
• 6:01
  Speaker 3: or the girls were at youth that you were out,
• 6:03
  Speaker 3: and I looked at her, and I said, am, we've
• 6:06
  Speaker 3: got the house to ourselves. Do you think we should
• 6:08
  Speaker 3: have a little date night? And she said yes, and
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  Speaker 3: I said, maybe we could get a little treat. You
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  Speaker 3: know what she said to me, She literally looked at
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  Speaker 3: me and she said, Mum, I don't know if I
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  Speaker 3: want to put that bad food in my body after
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  Speaker 3: I've been eating so well witning. I was like, who
• 6:25
  Speaker 3: is this kid? But I thought, you've been doing so well,
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  Speaker 3: and I don't want her to think it's an all
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  Speaker 3: or nothing.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, so let's not be religiously fanatic about what our
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: kids are eating.
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  Speaker 2: Like that's exactly right.
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  Speaker 3: And so I said to I just thought maybe we
• 6:38
  Speaker 3: could go get a scoop of gelato, or we could
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  Speaker 3: just go home and have a hot chocolate with some marshmallows.
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  Speaker 3: And she looked at me and she said, oh, I
• 6:45
  Speaker 3: could probably do a hot chocolate. She said, we probably
• 6:48
  Speaker 3: shouldn't get Tim Tam, should we? And I looked at
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  Speaker 3: her and I said, you know what, if we're only
• 6:53
  Speaker 3: having it on once even once a week, we're doing
• 6:57
  Speaker 3: one hundred times better than we've been doing in a
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  Speaker 3: very long time. I think we could get a packet
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  Speaker 3: of tim tams.
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  Speaker 1: Right, so you're undermining the very thing that you're trying
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  Speaker 1: to encourage that you bought the tim tams.
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  Speaker 3: I brought the tim tams.
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  Speaker 2: I didn't see those tim tams. Are they still? They're gone?
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  Speaker 1: On?
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  Speaker 3: No, someone else found there.
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  Speaker 1: One of the people who are less conscious about Okay,
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: all right, go on.
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  Speaker 2: So you bought the.
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: Tim tams and we came home. We made hot chocolate.
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  Speaker 3: I only gave her half a cup. I have quite
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  Speaker 3: big mugs, to be honest. So I gave her half
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  Speaker 3: a cup of that, and I put a couple of
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  Speaker 3: marshmallows in it. And she had two Tim tams. So
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  Speaker 3: it's a pretty big sugar rush after having not had
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  Speaker 3: it for a couple of days. But she sat down
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  Speaker 3: and we were playing a game together, and at the
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  Speaker 3: end of her second Tim Tam, she looked at me
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  Speaker 3: and she said, I don't think I should have done that. Mum.
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  Speaker 3: I really don't feel well.
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  Speaker 2: It's so good.
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  Speaker 3: I just I'm struggling to find the words because this
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  Speaker 3: is so massive. This is massive.
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  Speaker 1: This is that whole thing though, the conversation that I've
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  Speaker 1: been trying to have with them, and that is that
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  Speaker 1: your brain tells you lies. If you listen to your body,
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  Speaker 1: not your brain, you make different choices.
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  Speaker 3: If I had have told her she wasn't allowed a
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  Speaker 3: hot chocolate and she definitely wasn't allowed Tim TAM's number one,
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  Speaker 3: she would have missed out on the learning right and
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  Speaker 3: number two she would have thought I was the worst
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  Speaker 3: parent in the world. Sure, second point is not so important,
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  Speaker 3: but the first one is she would have missed out
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  Speaker 3: on the learning by me allowing her to have it.
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  Speaker 3: She has now had an experience where she recognizes how
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  Speaker 3: her body feels.
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  Speaker 1: Trusting in our children's the technical term in psychological speak
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  Speaker 1: is their organismic growth. Trusting in their organismic developmental capacity
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  Speaker 1: to grow in healthy ways towards flourishing. That's fundamentally what
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  Speaker 1: this is about. Rather than making the decision for them,
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: saying to them, let's give you a chance to do
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  Speaker 1: this and you can listen to what your body says.
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  Speaker 1: You get the sugar rush, Oh that's really good, But
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: five minutes later, where are you now?
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  Speaker 3: Two days later, she'd had a really good day with
• 9:02
  Speaker 3: food again, and it was mid afternoon. She was a
• 9:04
  Speaker 3: bit packaged, and I said, why don't you go on
• 9:05
  Speaker 3: to the school treats bucket and get yourself out some
• 9:10
  Speaker 3: grain waves.
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: I feel like, I feel like I need to interrupt
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: this story halfway with the going to get the grain waves.
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: And the reason I want to interrupt it is to
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: emphasize just how into prepackaged non healthy food this kid
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: has always been like yellow and white foods only, and
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: now you're having this experience anyway. So she goes to
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: get the grain waves.
• 9:30
  Speaker 3: I guess she goes and gets the grain waves.
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  Speaker 2: Which are a food product, not a food.
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  Speaker 3: She comes back to me, I'm not sure, maybe three
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  Speaker 3: or four minutes later, and she has half a packet
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  Speaker 3: of grain Waves in her hand, and she said, Mum,
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  Speaker 3: I don't think I can eat these anymore. That's the punchline.
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  Speaker 3: She said.
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  Speaker 1: I just realized I'm looking at you slack jawed because
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: I didn't know this, and I forgot we're doing a
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: podcast and people can't see my face, you like.
• 9:56
  Speaker 2: She didn't even finish the package.
• 9:57
  Speaker 3: She did not finish the packet. Now, I could give
• 9:59
  Speaker 3: her a full size packet and she.
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: Would have deled that total.
• 10:03
  Speaker 3: This is just one of those little individual packets with
• 10:06
  Speaker 3: what six chips in it? Wow, And she literally said
• 10:09
  Speaker 3: I can't finish this. Do you want them?
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: Take home message?
• 10:11
  Speaker 3: The takeo message is our kids just need I think
• 10:17
  Speaker 3: this is a boundary conversation.
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: Again, really I do.
• 10:21
  Speaker 3: I think that it's so we fall into these traps
• 10:23
  Speaker 3: of providing our kids with the things that provide us
• 10:28
  Speaker 3: with the less the.
• 10:30
  Speaker 2: Least friction, like the easiest possible way forward.
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  Speaker 3: Yes, yes, without giving them the opportunity to learn and grow.
• 10:39
  Speaker 3: We've gone through this with her multiple times.
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, this is not the first rodeo.
• 10:43
  Speaker 3: No, We've gone through this multiple times with her. But again,
• 10:47
  Speaker 3: scaffolding and maturity and ongoing initiation in this area is
• 10:54
  Speaker 3: making the reinforcement is making all the difference. But what
• 10:58
  Speaker 3: I'm loving is that she is experienced in the learning.
• 11:01
  Speaker 3: Instead of me having to dictate and educate and you know,
• 11:05
  Speaker 3: kind of give her all of the reasons why she
• 11:09
  Speaker 3: should be eating healthy, she's actually experiencing it. We're now
• 11:12
  Speaker 3: nearly two weeks past this experience and she actually hasn't
• 11:17
  Speaker 3: asked for a single sugar item.
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: You well, So to take our message for me, there
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: are a couple. First of all, boundaries matter, and secondly,
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: supporting kids autonomy by helping them to understand reasons why,
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: giving them the experiences that they need, and then trusting
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: in their ability to make those decisions to be in
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: the driver's seat of their lives. For me, they're the
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: two things that are really standing out here.
• 11:40
  Speaker 3: I think it's very easy as parents, we kind of
• 11:42
  Speaker 3: keep hitting a brick wall with our kids in whatever
• 11:45
  Speaker 3: area they're specifically struggling in, and we often lose sting.
• 11:50
  Speaker 3: It's really easy to just kind of give up and
• 11:53
  Speaker 3: take the path of least resistance to create peace in
• 11:57
  Speaker 3: the home. What we're experiencing with Emily, this is eleven
• 12:00
  Speaker 3: years of really hard work. It is very, very hard work.
• 12:04
  Speaker 3: We have never had a child so resistant to food
• 12:08
  Speaker 3: like Emily has been. But as we have continued to
• 12:13
  Speaker 3: just reintroduce things to educate her and to provide her
• 12:19
  Speaker 3: with the support she needs to make good choices, we're starting.
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: I'm not saying, yeah, we'll see how we're going.
• 12:25
  Speaker 3: I'm not saying that we're reached reached the pinnacle by
• 12:30
  Speaker 3: any straight This is a massive win and I am
• 12:35
  Speaker 3: just so grateful that, in spite of the fact I've
• 12:38
  Speaker 3: wanted to throw the talent so many times, that we've
• 12:41
  Speaker 3: just kept plodding along and working with her.
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: But that's the thing as a parent, you never throw
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: the talent. That's that's the great, the great challenge and
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: the great reward.
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: We really hope that there's some inspiration for you if
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: you're having struggles in your family. Thank you so much
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: for listening to I'll Do Better Tomorrow and The Happy
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: Family's Podcast.
• 12:58
  Speaker 2: The Happy Family's Podcast is produced by Justice.
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: And Rule on from Bridge Media and More information and
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: resources to make your family happier can be found at
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: happy families dot com, dot a u