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Why ASIO spies are furious with the ABC · The Front

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: From The Australian. Here's what's on the front. I'm Claire Harvey.
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: It's Monday, February nine, twenty twenty six. They broke up,
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: made up, split again, and now they're back together. The
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: federal opposition parties are once again a coalition after weekend
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: talks between Liberal leader Susan Lee and National's leader David
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: Little Proud. Lee has back down on her threat to
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: banish three rebel National MPs to the backbench for six months.
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: They'll serve a much shorter sentence, and Little Proud says
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: he's confident they can stand together against the Labor government
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: when Parliament resumes this week. For all our reporting and
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: analysis of that, check out Beaustralian dot com dot AU
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: spy agency AZO says it's not responsible for the Bondai
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: Beach anti Semitic massacre. The spooks have come out ahead
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: of an ABC four Corners report shared for Monday Night
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: with a forceful defense of their twenty nineteen conclusion that
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: shooter Navid Akram was not a violent extremist. AZIO says
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: the source for the ABC's yarn is a disgruntled, unreliable
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: former informant. It's awkward timing for the ABC, with editor
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: in chief and Managing director Hugh Marks due to appear
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: at a Senate estimates hearing this week, which will focus
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: on the broadcasters impartiality. Steve Jackson is The Australian's Media
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: Diary editor and is here to discuss how the grilling
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: will go. Plus, Jacko has a red hot scoop today
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: about an on assignment blow up between a star reporter
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: and a cameraman. Steve Jackson edits The Australian's Media Diary. Steve,
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: we've both been in the position where a government organization
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: denies our story, but it's rare for that to happen
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  Speaker 1: before the story's published.
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: What's going on with Four Corners? You're right, Claire.
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  Speaker 3: Usually the denials come to you alone, not to the
• 2:05
  Speaker 3: whole public. It's come from ASIO, which we all know
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  Speaker 3: is the chief spying agency in Australia, and they think
• 2:11
  Speaker 3: they've got an inkling about what's going to be in
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  Speaker 3: Four Corners on Monday Night. Now they are a spying agency,
• 2:18
  Speaker 3: you'd think their mail could possibly be correct. They tend
• 2:21
  Speaker 3: to this is what they do for their trade, and
• 2:22
  Speaker 3: they reckon that what is coming is unfair, and it's
• 2:26
  Speaker 3: been served up by a disgruntled former insider, and they're
• 2:30
  Speaker 3: so alarmed by it that they've actually gone to the
• 2:32
  Speaker 3: unprecedented step. And I don't know if you'll remember clear
• 2:35
  Speaker 3: any time in history where ASIO has come out and
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  Speaker 3: categorically said we're going to go on the record and
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  Speaker 3: say this isn't true. I can't recall that ever happening.
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: They try to remain in the shadows obviously. In fact,
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: a few times I've rung ASIO because they do have
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: a landline and someone picks up and just says hello,
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: which leads to an awkward conversation where it's like, oh,
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: hang on, is this Asio?
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  Speaker 2: And they say how can I help you? Could they
• 2:58
  Speaker 2: help you? No?
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  Speaker 1: In fact, they generally say no comment, So for them
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: to make a preemptive denial is very interesting. Now this
• 3:05
  Speaker 1: is part of a welter of Bondi stories that television
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: Current affairs shows are doing. Of course, everyone's already been
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: scooped on the big interview with the hero, haven't they.
• 3:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
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  Speaker 3: Well, Anna Koran flew in from Hong Kong for she
• 3:19
  Speaker 3: works for American cable television and she flew into Australia
• 3:22
  Speaker 3: in December and she scooped everyone. Nobody even knew she
• 3:25
  Speaker 3: was doing it. Next thing we know the interviews on air.
• 3:28
  Speaker 3: It's been broadcast around the world and everyone's going on,
• 3:31
  Speaker 3: did you know that nobody had any idea to happen?
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  Speaker 3: Now sixty minutes is going to be interviewing Ahmed al
• 3:36
  Speaker 3: ah Met. They won't comment interestingly whether or not he's
• 3:39
  Speaker 3: been paid. Obviously, that's one of the questions that always
• 3:41
  Speaker 3: slopes around how much you know, has he been paid?
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  Speaker 3: But I think in this circumstance, given he's a hero
• 3:47
  Speaker 3: and what he's done, let's remember this is a guy
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  Speaker 3: ran towards a terrorist firing a shotgun at people and
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  Speaker 3: disarmed them and saved countless lives. I think no matter
• 3:56
  Speaker 3: what they've given him, whether it be a free lunch
• 3:58
  Speaker 3: or you know, another night down at the Crown Towers,
• 4:01
  Speaker 3: then we're probably all okay with that one.
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: BABC is going to be under more scrutiny this week
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: when Hugh Marx appears at Senate estimates what will be
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: the tone of the grilling he'll get.
• 4:15
  Speaker 3: Well, it's going to be tough for Hugh Marx. He
• 4:17
  Speaker 3: is now coming up to a year in that top job,
• 4:20
  Speaker 3: and he's got a lot of news breaking just on
• 4:22
  Speaker 3: the eve of his Senate estimates. And we know that
• 4:25
  Speaker 3: Sarah Henderson, herself, a former ABC journalist who won a
• 4:28
  Speaker 3: Walkley for her coverage while she's with the public broadcaster,
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  Speaker 3: is a strong believer in holding the organization to account.
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  Speaker 3: So she's going to be doing that again. I've spoken
• 4:37
  Speaker 3: to her in the past week about what she'll be
• 4:39
  Speaker 3: grilling mister Marks on, So one topic she'll definitely be
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  Speaker 3: asking about is this how she had with the host
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  Speaker 3: of seven thirty in the Halls of Canberra last November.
• 4:48
  Speaker 3: She says that Sarah Ferguson took umbrage with the Senator
• 4:51
  Speaker 3: critiquing her journalism, particularly a show she had done for
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  Speaker 3: four Corners. On top of that, we can expect four
• 4:56
  Speaker 3: Corners to be getting a few mentions given the latest
• 4:58
  Speaker 3: developments with ASIO, and I think we're also going to
• 5:01
  Speaker 3: hear questions about Gavin Fang's insistence that no ABC journalists.
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: Pulled out of the Adelaide Writers.
• 5:06
  Speaker 3: Week because they supported the pro Palestinian author Randa Abdelfhatar.
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so that's a scoop you broke in Diary where
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: two very senior ABC journalists Laura Tingle and Louise Milligan
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  Speaker 1: pulled out of Adelaide Writer's Week at the same time
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  Speaker 1: as two hundred authors pulled out in support of director
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: Louise Adler. That was after the board of the Writer's
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: Week canceled in appearance by pro Palestinian academic Randa Abdelfhatar.
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: Editorial director Gavin Fang said that that wasn't in any
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: way an endorsement of Randa Abdelfhatar. That's an interesting interpretation,
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: isn't it. Do you think Sarah Henderson bought that?
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  Speaker 3: Senator Henderson, very very intelligent lady. I don't think she's
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  Speaker 3: bought that for a minute, and I don't think anyone's
• 5:50
  Speaker 3: bought it. Gavin Fang shouldn't be trying to sell it.
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: Obviously.
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  Speaker 3: Hundreds of authors also pulled out. I think if you
• 5:56
  Speaker 3: asked them, they'd say, yeah, we'll support in it. That's
• 5:58
  Speaker 3: what we were doing. So it just seems like very
• 6:00
  Speaker 3: weird argument to suggest No, no, everyone else was supporting
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  Speaker 3: our guys. We just decided not to turn up to Adelaide.
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: Hugh Mars has been in the chair at the ABC
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  Speaker 1: for a year and he came into the job at
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: a time when one of the big controversies was top
• 6:15
  Speaker 1: tier talent of the ABC expressing personal opinions on social media. Now,
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: this is a tough one for media organizations because many
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: of them actively encourage journalists to be on social media
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: promoting their yarns being part of the conversation. ABC journal
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: has found a very receptive audience for their opinions, particularly
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: on X and have continued just expressing themselves very frankly,
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: what's your understanding of what Hugh Marks actually thinks about
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  Speaker 1: that issue and do you think he's made any inroads
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: in getting them to stick to the party line, which
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: is don't have an opinion.
• 6:50
  Speaker 3: Well, he has made some inroads. We've seen it be
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  Speaker 3: wound back already to some extent, and he's reinforcing the
• 6:56
  Speaker 3: strict guidelines around that. But it's different for the ABC
• 6:59
  Speaker 3: than most media organizations. So for us, you know, if
• 7:03
  Speaker 3: we want to share an opinion, that's a matter for
• 7:04
  Speaker 3: our employers and us to discuss. You know, i'd like
• 7:06
  Speaker 3: to say this or this is what my stance is
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  Speaker 3: when it comes to the ABC. Their employers are all
• 7:11
  Speaker 3: of us, so they can't have that conversation. You know,
• 7:14
  Speaker 3: I think this. I want to be actively supporting this
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  Speaker 3: matter in my role as an ABC journalist. So they're
• 7:21
  Speaker 3: not going to get a consensus sign off from the
• 7:23
  Speaker 3: Australian public. That's why there are strict rules. It's all
• 7:26
  Speaker 3: going to be impartial, no bias, no opinion. You're there
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  Speaker 3: to do a job. You're effectively a public servant and
• 7:32
  Speaker 3: it's an important role that they've got. But they've got
• 7:34
  Speaker 3: to remove that activism.
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: Another story you're breaking in the media diary today, Jacko,
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  Speaker 1: is about an on the road staush between a reporter
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  Speaker 1: and a cameraman. Now you and I have both spent
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: a lot of time on the road reporting.
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  Speaker 2: It gets tense. There's confined quarters.
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  Speaker 1: Sometimes you might be sharing a hotel room or at
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  Speaker 1: least eating every single meal together from dawn till dusk.
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  Speaker 2: It's natural for tempers to fray.
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  Speaker 1: What happened in the rural New South Wales town of
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  Speaker 1: Lake Carjelligo when a seven crew was there reporting on
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  Speaker 1: the disappearance of someone who's accused of murder.
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  Speaker 3: Seven News reporter Inga Nielsen and cameraman Finn Hawkins, who
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: are actually really good friends or at least they were
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: up until two weeks ago. Have turned up in town
• 8:21
  Speaker 3: to realize there's only one room for them because they've
• 8:24
  Speaker 3: come with the rest of the Sydney media pack. Obviously,
• 8:26
  Speaker 3: as you say, that's really close quarters. A lot of
• 8:29
  Speaker 3: pressure on the story, chasing down the best angles each day,
• 8:32
  Speaker 3: and tensions have grown and tempers have flared, and look,
• 8:35
  Speaker 3: they've shared more than a room. They've ended up sharing
• 8:37
  Speaker 3: some frank and very honest feedback with each other about
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  Speaker 3: what they think about certain things, and they're approached covering
• 8:43
  Speaker 3: the story, and unfortunately for them, it's been caught on
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  Speaker 3: hot mic and on camera, not just their own, but
• 8:49
  Speaker 3: everyone's as they were setting up for a press conference.
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  Speaker 3: Now you can imagine as this vision's being fed back.
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  Speaker 3: It's been sent around to all the networks and onto
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  Speaker 3: diaries in box, so everyone is seeing what that interaction
• 9:00
  Speaker 3: is like, and it's ugly.
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  Speaker 2: Listen, you still an Arseholewise, there are a lot of expletives.
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  Speaker 3: But that said, it's probably not in the top ten
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  Speaker 3: blow ups I've had on the road with reporters while
• 9:18
  Speaker 3: I was working in television this year at Stake. Here
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  Speaker 3: is quite often there's a rule what happens on the road,
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  Speaker 3: stays on the road. That's what happened here. They've come
• 9:25
  Speaker 3: back and it's ended up in the HR office. Now
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  Speaker 3: there's a whole heap of very serious allegations and accusations
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  Speaker 3: being flown around. HRS involved, Lawyers have become involved, and
• 9:36
  Speaker 3: all of a sudden, what was an embarrassing hot mike
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  Speaker 3: moment has become what I fear is going to be
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  Speaker 3: a legal battle.
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: It comes back again to social media, doesn't it. Apparently
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: the source of the dispute was that Finn Hawken's the cameraman,
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: shared an innocent, happy snap on Instagram, noting that he
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: and the reporter in gan Nielsen were going to have
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: to share a hotel room. That prompted, of course, because
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: it's social media, some discus in comments from people who
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: read a sexual allusion into that. You can sort of
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: see how it got hot quite quickly, can't you.
• 10:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah, And look, to be honest, they both post up
• 10:09
  Speaker 3: for that photo. They thought it was fun. They put
• 10:11
  Speaker 3: it up together. But you know, you can't always moderate what.
• 10:15
  Speaker 3: Let's face it, a bunch of idiots are sometimes going
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: to say on social media about what you put out there.
• 10:20
  Speaker 3: It's one of those problems where you know, you make
• 10:22
  Speaker 3: a joke and all of a sudden it gets out
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: of hand, it gets out of control, and unfortunately it
• 10:26
  Speaker 3: looks like it's cost these two people their friendship, and
• 10:29
  Speaker 3: let's just hope it doesn't cost them their jobs.
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: Coming up more of my conversation with Steve Jackson Jacko.
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: One of the things I love about the Media Diary
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: is that it's a bit of an equal opportunity tickle up.
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: You often have items about every single media organization in
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: a row, and then they're all left wondering who you're
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: really having a go out. They're all complaining to you
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: that you're unfairly targeting them. This week, you've got an
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: item about nine Radio, which has recently been bought by
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: the pub baron Arthur Lorndy and his son Craig. They're
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: going to come in with a new broom. I would
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: suspect to nine Radio and the current management who are
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: in there now have found themselves in a bit of
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: a hot mess over trying to organize a party to
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: celebrate a significant milestone.
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: What's gone wrong?
• 11:31
  Speaker 3: Look, The Continuous Call Team is one of the most
• 11:34
  Speaker 3: successful shows on nine Radio's Talkback Network, it's syndicated nationally.
• 11:38
  Speaker 3: It's a big deal and having a big bash to
• 11:40
  Speaker 3: celebrate it reaching a big milestone, it's fortieth anniversary. Unfortunately,
• 11:44
  Speaker 3: somehow they've accidentally forgotten on purpose to invite the guy
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: who started the show and led.
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: It for much of its time.
• 11:51
  Speaker 3: It hasn't gone down very well with many of the
• 11:53
  Speaker 3: people who work on that show, and suffice to say,
• 11:56
  Speaker 3: I don't think it'll go down well with him either.
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: Can't wait to read all about it, Jackson, Thank you
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: very much, Thank you for having me on. Steve Jackson
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: is The Australian's Media diary editor. You can check out
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: all his scoops right now at the Australian dot com
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: dot au