Latest / Bulletproof Screenwriting™ Podcast / BPS 425: The Power of the Cut: Storytelling Secrets from Michael Trent

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BPS 425: The Power of the Cut: Storytelling Secrets from Michael Trent · Bulletproof Screenwriting™ Podcast

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• 1:41
  Speaker 5: Well, initially it's a family involvement. I mean, my father
• 1:46
  Speaker 5: was a sound editor in England. He's now retired, so
• 1:52
  Speaker 5: editing has been something that I grew up with, going
• 1:55
  Speaker 5: to work with my dad. I've even got pictures of
• 1:57
  Speaker 5: me back in the late night teen seventies with single
• 2:02
  Speaker 5: stripe and film in my hands. So it was really
• 2:04
  Speaker 5: my father that got me involved. But I also did
• 2:06
  Speaker 5: go to a film school in England, a very small,
• 2:11
  Speaker 5: relatively unknown one, but it was still a film course
• 2:15
  Speaker 5: that I did in England. But essentially it was a
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  Speaker 5: family connection, so.
• 2:20
  Speaker 4: You're basically born into it, so it was almost like
• 2:22
  Speaker 4: was in your blood to get into the film industry.
• 2:26
  Speaker 5: In lots of ways, yeah, I mean it really was.
• 2:28
  Speaker 5: It was something that we grew up with on a
• 2:31
  Speaker 5: you know, really a day to day basis.
• 2:34
  Speaker 4: So let me ask you this, is there a difference
• 2:37
  Speaker 4: of any kind, whether major or minor, between the sort
• 2:42
  Speaker 4: of the English film industry and the American film industry.
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  Speaker 5: If there is, I'm not sure that I'm really aware
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  Speaker 5: of it. When I was in England, I worked on
• 2:53
  Speaker 5: lots of American films anyway, or at least, you know what,
• 2:55
  Speaker 5: there were finance from the United States, so I couldn't
• 3:00
  Speaker 5: really tell the difference. I mean, there's there's certainly larger
• 3:06
  Speaker 5: budgets in the United States, and I did work on
• 3:09
  Speaker 5: some English films that were of smaller budgets, but no,
• 3:13
  Speaker 5: as far as the as far as my work experience
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  Speaker 5: is concerned, that there wasn't really a difference, or isn't
• 3:20
  Speaker 5: really a difference.
• 3:22
  Speaker 4: So so when did you first, you know, decide, I mean,
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  Speaker 4: when you were editing actually, let me ask you this,
• 3:26
  Speaker 4: when you were when you're going back into editing and
• 3:28
  Speaker 4: you were actually you know, as as you were sort
• 3:30
  Speaker 4: of born into this, did you have like a movie
• 3:32
  Speaker 4: old at home or anything else when you were just
• 3:34
  Speaker 4: sort of cutting your own films together, or maybe even
• 3:36
  Speaker 4: a Super eight.
• 3:36
  Speaker 5: Camera well, no, we didn't have a movie older. They
• 3:40
  Speaker 5: were quite a big, big machines. But I did get
• 3:44
  Speaker 5: used to using a movieoda from the age of about
• 3:48
  Speaker 5: I would say, ten years old, because my father would
• 3:51
  Speaker 5: bring us into work and and I would get to
• 3:55
  Speaker 5: use the machinery that and and Steambeck's and flatbed coems.
• 4:00
  Speaker 5: But we didn't have any equipment at home.
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  Speaker 4: No, So, Micha, when did you make the trip then
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  Speaker 4: from England to over here to America.
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  Speaker 5: In nineteen ninety four, So when you came over.
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  Speaker 4: Did you already have like a few gigs lined up
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  Speaker 4: in like movies to edit?
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  Speaker 5: No, No, not at all. I was on a movie
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  Speaker 5: that started in England and it was a picture called
• 4:24
  Speaker 5: We're Back, a Dinosaurs Story. And I was a sound
• 4:28
  Speaker 5: assistant on that movie, and we were mixing at Twickenham
• 4:31
  Speaker 5: Studios in England, and the executive producer on the movie
• 4:36
  Speaker 5: was Steven Spielberg, and he saw the mix from Twickenham
• 4:41
  Speaker 5: and wanted some changes and decided that it would be
• 4:44
  Speaker 5: better to bring the movie from England to the United
• 4:47
  Speaker 5: States to do the final mix at Universal. Actually we
• 4:52
  Speaker 5: ended up at Toddeo. But actually it's the other way around.
• 4:56
  Speaker 5: We ended up at Universal. That's how I he came here. Yea,
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  Speaker 5: that was all that was in nineteen ninety three, and
• 5:07
  Speaker 5: then I met a girl in fact on that movie
• 5:12
  Speaker 5: and then went back to England. In the meantime we
• 5:15
  Speaker 5: did the long distance relationship thing, and then I moved
• 5:18
  Speaker 5: here completely in September of ninety four. But at that
• 5:22
  Speaker 5: time I had no gigs lined up. When I arrived here,
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  Speaker 5: I really cold called British editors that I'd known in England,
• 5:34
  Speaker 5: about five of them, and luckily for me, one of
• 5:38
  Speaker 5: them came back actually with a job offer. So finding
• 5:43
  Speaker 5: work was initially was I say, relatively easy for me,
• 5:48
  Speaker 5: just because this particular ready to pick me up and
• 5:51
  Speaker 5: gave me a job.
• 5:52
  Speaker 4: So at that point he knew you, so you didn't
• 5:55
  Speaker 4: have to like show him like a reel or anything, right,
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  Speaker 4: so he actually knew you from before.
• 5:59
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I knew. I knew him from England and he
• 6:01
  Speaker 5: was a British editor that would works in England and
• 6:03
  Speaker 5: then was working here. He was working on a picture
• 6:05
  Speaker 5: picture called Rob Roy for Michael Katon Jones. The editor
• 6:09
  Speaker 5: was Petere Hones, and I say I knew him from
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  Speaker 5: England and he was one of the people I called
• 6:15
  Speaker 5: and he just happened to have an opening at that
• 6:17
  Speaker 5: particular time.
• 6:20
  Speaker 4: So just to sort of follow up on that question
• 6:23
  Speaker 4: and just to sort of, you know, if you're ever going,
• 6:25
  Speaker 4: because I actually have some friends of mine who've actually
• 6:27
  Speaker 4: gone from country to country. I think that's a really
• 6:29
  Speaker 4: incredible feat because if you go to another even if
• 6:33
  Speaker 4: you're in England, let's say, and you go from maybe
• 6:35
  Speaker 4: Manchester to London, you know, you're depending behind the size
• 6:39
  Speaker 4: of the network you might have, you know, no nobody
• 6:41
  Speaker 4: you know have to actually get your foot in the
• 6:43
  Speaker 4: door through reels. You know, you're basically starting over from scratch,
• 6:47
  Speaker 4: you know, and then going from a different country to
• 6:50
  Speaker 4: another country. I mean, you really either have to a
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  Speaker 4: have a deep network or you have to be able
• 6:55
  Speaker 4: to just sort of, you know, get your foot in
• 6:57
  Speaker 4: the door in a lot of places. And I actually
• 6:59
  Speaker 4: know a couple of people, Michael, who are actually moving
• 7:02
  Speaker 4: from like different places like Australia to England because they
• 7:07
  Speaker 4: want to actually get into the British film industry. So
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  Speaker 4: it's just kind of I always kind of find it,
• 7:11
  Speaker 4: you know, fascinating, because just to be able to do that,
• 7:14
  Speaker 4: you either have to do one of the one of
• 7:15
  Speaker 4: those two things, have a deep network or be able
• 7:17
  Speaker 4: to just knock on ten thousand doors to get one.
• 7:20
  Speaker 5: Yes, yeah, well that's right. I mean, you know, when
• 7:23
  Speaker 5: I look back on it, it was a crazy thing
• 7:25
  Speaker 5: to do, but I was young at the time and
• 7:30
  Speaker 5: it it didn't feel scary at the time. It was
• 7:33
  Speaker 5: just something I wanted to do and for some reason
• 7:36
  Speaker 5: I felt that it would work out, and to one
• 7:41
  Speaker 5: extent or another, it has. So I feel very lucky.
• 7:45
  Speaker 4: You know, don't you You touched on something too. Do
• 7:47
  Speaker 4: you feel when you're younger, maybe you know, when you're
• 7:50
  Speaker 4: first staring out in film, anything's possible, you know, like anything,
• 7:54
  Speaker 4: you know what I mean, like you could. It just
• 7:55
  Speaker 4: feels that everything's just going to come together where you're
• 7:59
  Speaker 4: in a project or have you just go you know what,
• 8:01
  Speaker 4: I don't you know, damn the people who naysayers and
• 8:05
  Speaker 4: I don't have a lot of budget. I don't have
• 8:07
  Speaker 4: a lot of budget. I don't have a lot of
• 8:08
  Speaker 4: you know whatever. But we're just going to go do something,
• 8:10
  Speaker 4: you know what I mean? Because I mean honestly, like
• 8:13
  Speaker 4: I'm thirty two right now, and when I was first
• 8:16
  Speaker 4: starting out, I would actually go out and shoot a
• 8:18
  Speaker 4: hell of a lot more than I do. Now you
• 8:20
  Speaker 4: know what I mean, As a similar effect happened to you, I.
• 8:24
  Speaker 5: Think that it was definitely my experience was I didn't
• 8:31
  Speaker 5: really consider the possibility of failing. And that wasn't any
• 8:36
  Speaker 5: kind of not meant in an arrogant way. It's just
• 8:39
  Speaker 5: that I just felt that it would work out. It
• 8:43
  Speaker 5: was something that I really wanted to do, to move
• 8:45
  Speaker 5: to the United States and work in film editing, and
• 8:48
  Speaker 5: it was just something that I felt would work out.
• 8:53
  Speaker 5: And I wasn't I wasn't scared about it, as I say,
• 8:57
  Speaker 5: probably foolishly looking back, but I felt it was it
• 9:02
  Speaker 5: was just something that would just happen. Yeah, there's definitely
• 9:06
  Speaker 5: a sort of a fatalist element to it. I guess
• 9:12
  Speaker 5: I just didn't consider what would happen if I failed.
• 9:15
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you take quitting and filling off the table, right,
• 9:19
  Speaker 4: and basically you're like, you don't give yourself a choice.
• 9:22
  Speaker 4: You just say say to yourself, listen, this is the
• 9:24
  Speaker 4: you know, I have one option, and this is it
• 9:26
  Speaker 4: I have to do. Go do this.
• 9:28
  Speaker 5: This is what we're doing. That's that's basically was this
• 9:30
  Speaker 5: is what I'm doing yeah, yeah, and and there was
• 9:34
  Speaker 5: no considering anything else. So it was just I mean
• 9:38
  Speaker 5: there's been periods of unemployment in the interim where things
• 9:42
  Speaker 5: have not you know, always been easy. But initially somebody
• 9:46
  Speaker 5: was looking after me for sure, and it was Peter Honess.
• 9:50
  Speaker 5: There's no doubt about that.
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: And now back to the show.
• 10:02
  Speaker 4: So after that one editing job that we were just discussing,
• 10:05
  Speaker 4: after that was over, you know, what what did you
• 10:08
  Speaker 4: do to go out and to try to find like
• 10:10
  Speaker 4: more assignments and more movies.
• 10:13
  Speaker 5: After after Rob Roy Yes, yeah, I was actually Peter
• 10:19
  Speaker 5: Honess had another movie which we went straight onto, so
• 10:23
  Speaker 5: I didn't have to do any knocking on doors. We
• 10:26
  Speaker 5: went straight almost straight onto a movie called Eye for
• 10:30
  Speaker 5: an Eye that John Schlesinger directed, and again he picked
• 10:35
  Speaker 5: me up as an assistant editor on that movie. So
• 10:37
  Speaker 5: we all moved on as a crew. It wasn't immediate,
• 10:40
  Speaker 5: but it was within a within a month or two,
• 10:44
  Speaker 5: so we all moved on as a crew.
• 10:46
  Speaker 4: So and then then basically did you keep like moving
• 10:49
  Speaker 4: along with Peter as you as you from project to project?
• 10:52
  Speaker 5: We did. We did Rob Roy Eye for an Eye
• 10:55
  Speaker 5: then we did, I think. Then the next one we
• 11:00
  Speaker 5: did was l A Confidential in nineteen ninety six, So
• 11:05
  Speaker 5: those were actually there was three movies that I moved
• 11:08
  Speaker 5: along with Peter. He hired me on three movies, and
• 11:13
  Speaker 5: then I went elsewhere after that.
• 11:16
  Speaker 4: So after you want, you know, I actually am looking
• 11:18
  Speaker 4: at your IMDb right now and I have to ask.
• 11:21
  Speaker 4: You know, you were the assistant editor on Saving Private Ryan.
• 11:24
  Speaker 4: You know, getting to work with Spielberg and seeing some
• 11:26
  Speaker 4: of you know, of the footage they first shot and
• 11:28
  Speaker 4: everything like that. You know, what was it like to
• 11:31
  Speaker 4: actually work on Saving Private Ryan?
• 11:34
  Speaker 5: Oh? Well, that was It was an incredible experience from
• 11:40
  Speaker 5: lots of points of view. First of all, we knew
• 11:43
  Speaker 5: I'd read the script, so I knew it was going
• 11:44
  Speaker 5: to be an amazing script, an amazing movie. But from
• 11:48
  Speaker 5: a personal point of view, it was an amazing experience.
• 11:51
  Speaker 5: We went from I'd worked on Armistad before that, and
• 11:56
  Speaker 5: we went straight into Saving Private Ryan. But from a say,
• 12:02
  Speaker 5: a personal experience point of view, we went from here
• 12:04
  Speaker 5: to Ireland, took all the equipment with us, and we
• 12:07
  Speaker 5: were editing in a field in Ireland. And then that
• 12:10
  Speaker 5: was for the first three weeks of the for the
• 12:13
  Speaker 5: shooting the opening sequence on the beaches, and then after
• 12:17
  Speaker 5: three weeks we moved to Hatfield in England to a
• 12:21
  Speaker 5: facility there which was an old aerospace museum and the
• 12:27
  Speaker 5: set was built on the on the airfield. So, I
• 12:32
  Speaker 5: mean everything about that movie was amazing at the time,
• 12:38
  Speaker 5: and we knew it at the time that we were
• 12:40
  Speaker 5: very excited to work on the show.
• 12:42
  Speaker 4: Did you ever get to actually meet Stephen at any point?
• 12:46
  Speaker 5: Yeah, many times. I mean he would come to editing,
• 12:50
  Speaker 5: usually at lunch time, and we would be ready for him.
• 12:54
  Speaker 5: We knew it was all set up beforehand, so yeah,
• 12:56
  Speaker 5: I'd be in the room with Spielberg and we'd be
• 12:58
  Speaker 5: running on the camp and selecting day. So I made
• 13:02
  Speaker 5: him on many occasions.
• 13:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah, And I mean that obviously one of the most
• 13:07
  Speaker 4: influential directors of all time. I mean it was just
• 13:11
  Speaker 4: you know, and again the reason I bring that up
• 13:13
  Speaker 4: is because of that he is just, you know, one
• 13:14
  Speaker 4: of the most influential directors of all time.
• 13:17
  Speaker 3: Uh.
• 13:17
  Speaker 4: And you work with them afterwards on AI, which is
• 13:21
  Speaker 4: an interesting project I wanted to ask about too. But so, so,
• 13:26
  Speaker 4: what were some of the things you took away from
• 13:27
  Speaker 4: working with Spielberg. Was there anything he told you anything
• 13:29
  Speaker 4: that maybe you know that that he said that you
• 13:32
  Speaker 4: just sort of like, oh, you know, that's a you know,
• 13:34
  Speaker 4: you know, when you work with people at that level,
• 13:36
  Speaker 4: it's sort of like you know what I mean, it's
• 13:38
  Speaker 4: you're you're looking for something like a almost like a
• 13:41
  Speaker 4: quote or something that have that epiphany, that aha moment.
• 13:45
  Speaker 4: Is there anything he sort of said to you that
• 13:46
  Speaker 4: just sort of still what sticks with you?
• 13:49
  Speaker 5: No, I mean I don't really remember anything that that
• 13:52
  Speaker 5: he said. I mean, it was just an observation of
• 13:55
  Speaker 5: somebody that can work, that just has such amazing ideas
• 14:00
  Speaker 5: that can seemingly be manufactured out of nothing. There's one
• 14:06
  Speaker 5: particular story I talk about, and we were on Minority
• 14:10
  Speaker 5: Report and we had been editing for a while and
• 14:16
  Speaker 5: Spielberg was away, I think he was in Japan, and
• 14:20
  Speaker 5: he called into the editing room with a note of
• 14:23
  Speaker 5: a picture change to make. And it was not just straightforward,
• 14:28
  Speaker 5: it was fairly complex. It involved three four shots, and
• 14:32
  Speaker 5: he said, I believe it will work better. And remember
• 14:35
  Speaker 5: he's in a remote location, he's in Japan, and we
• 14:38
  Speaker 5: make the change on the ken and well, not unbelievably
• 14:43
  Speaker 5: because he's Steven Spielberg. But the change worked exactly the
• 14:47
  Speaker 5: way he said it would, And it just said to
• 14:51
  Speaker 5: me that he had some kind of video camera in
• 14:56
  Speaker 5: his head that was able to actually run the footage
• 14:59
  Speaker 5: back and then make editing changes in his own head.
• 15:03
  Speaker 5: And I suppose from that point of view, I was
• 15:05
  Speaker 5: thinking about, you can imagining the edit is something that
• 15:18
  Speaker 5: I try and do, and and that was something that
• 15:20
  Speaker 5: he did, And I suppose that's something that I try
• 15:24
  Speaker 5: and I try and utilize in my career today. That's
• 15:29
  Speaker 5: that's the best way I can answer that question answer.
• 15:33
  Speaker 4: And Michael, and I wanted to just ask, you know,
• 15:35
  Speaker 4: a follow up. In editing as a whole, are you
• 15:38
  Speaker 4: ever given the script, you know, along with the footage
• 15:41
  Speaker 4: or are you just given like the script script supervisor's notes,
• 15:44
  Speaker 4: so to speak, when you're when you're actually editing films.
• 15:47
  Speaker 5: Oh, I have the I have the the line script.
• 15:50
  Speaker 5: Each day, the the pages that were shot the day
• 15:53
  Speaker 5: before come in and they're marked up from the script supervisor.
• 15:56
  Speaker 5: And I worked with the script as I edit.
• 16:00
  Speaker 4: Okay, I always, you know, I like to hear how
• 16:02
  Speaker 4: different people work, and uh, you know, I've always wondered that,
• 16:05
  Speaker 4: because I know, I was just reading about how sometimes
• 16:07
  Speaker 4: you know, scripts are so carefully guarded and you know
• 16:11
  Speaker 4: what I mean, and it's just sometimes the editor, the editors,
• 16:14
  Speaker 4: you know, they'll just get you know, notes like that,
• 16:16
  Speaker 4: or sometimes they'll actually be given the full script so
• 16:18
  Speaker 4: they can actually just go, you know, read through it.
• 16:20
  Speaker 4: And I've worked with different line producers too, who sometimes say, look,
• 16:23
  Speaker 4: I get the script. I don't even read it daved
• 16:25
  Speaker 4: because I just I just see different things, like you know,
• 16:27
  Speaker 4: are pulled out of it, and uh, you know what
• 16:29
  Speaker 4: I mean, and they just go from there. So so
• 16:32
  Speaker 4: when you're working with you know, Spielberg, you worked with
• 16:34
  Speaker 4: him again on AI, and I believe that that film
• 16:38
  Speaker 4: was started by Kubrick, right, and then it was finished
• 16:40
  Speaker 4: by step Spielberg.
• 16:42
  Speaker 5: That's my understanding. I wasn't really involved in in the
• 16:46
  Speaker 5: Kubrick end of it. I understand that Spielberg and Kubrick
• 16:52
  Speaker 5: had had a conversation over a number of years about
• 16:55
  Speaker 5: the making of AI, but I wasn't involved in the
• 16:59
  Speaker 5: detail of how that came about. I do remember that
• 17:03
  Speaker 5: we had some footage that Kubrick had shot, and it
• 17:08
  Speaker 5: was footage of ocean waves and it was going to
• 17:11
  Speaker 5: be used as an element in the in the Submerged
• 17:14
  Speaker 5: Manhattan sequence. But as far as the transition of the
• 17:20
  Speaker 5: director being Kubrick to Spielberg, I wasn't really involved in that,
• 17:24
  Speaker 5: I see.
• 17:25
  Speaker 4: And because I was just always fascinated because you know,
• 17:28
  Speaker 4: I heard so much about that movie and you know
• 17:30
  Speaker 4: that it was started by Kubrick and then had to
• 17:32
  Speaker 4: be finished by Spielberg and h and everything else. And
• 17:35
  Speaker 4: you know, I actually saw it in a in a
• 17:36
  Speaker 4: film class I took in college, and I actually liked
• 17:39
  Speaker 4: it a lot more than other people did because some
• 17:43
  Speaker 4: people felt it we felt at two different movies coming together. Uh,
• 17:46
  Speaker 4: when I always said, that's probably what it was, because
• 17:49
  Speaker 4: it was with Kubrick and and Spielberg. But again, I
• 17:53
  Speaker 4: just wanted to ask about that because again, you know,
• 17:56
  Speaker 4: that was a fall up to Spielberg. So just to
• 17:58
  Speaker 4: sort of, you know, take this in Indie, do your
• 18:00
  Speaker 4: your career trajectory. You know, when you actually went from
• 18:04
  Speaker 4: an assistant editor to the actual editor. You know, you've
• 18:07
  Speaker 4: worked on some pretty cool projects and I want to
• 18:09
  Speaker 4: talk about, you know, just how you became the editor.
• 18:12
  Speaker 4: So what point did you realize that you were ready
• 18:14
  Speaker 4: just to take on all the editing responsibilities and sort
• 18:17
  Speaker 4: of be like that guy so to speak. You know,
• 18:20
  Speaker 4: when did you realize that you were you were finally
• 18:22
  Speaker 4: ready to do all.
• 18:23
  Speaker 5: That while it was in It was in two thousand
• 18:27
  Speaker 5: and four when we finished the terminal and what happened.
• 18:31
  Speaker 5: I mean you touched on it a little bit earlier.
• 18:33
  Speaker 5: When you moved countries, you have to restart your career,
• 18:35
  Speaker 5: and that was definitely my experience. As much as I
• 18:40
  Speaker 5: was lucky to be picked up by Peter Honees, I
• 18:43
  Speaker 5: had to spread out my you know, find new contacts,
• 18:48
  Speaker 5: so essentially I did have to restart my career. And
• 18:52
  Speaker 5: even even when I went with in with Spielberg's editing crew,
• 18:56
  Speaker 5: you know, they didn't know me and and I had
• 19:00
  Speaker 5: to sort of prove myself. So if I'd done you know,
• 19:04
  Speaker 5: eight years in England and I did another ten years
• 19:07
  Speaker 5: eight or ten years here, I really felt after that
• 19:10
  Speaker 5: amount of time I was ready. I mean, usually if
• 19:12
  Speaker 5: I'd stayed in England, maybe I would have made the
• 19:14
  Speaker 5: jump sooner. But because I really felt I had to
• 19:18
  Speaker 5: restart my career in the United States, I was ready
• 19:21
  Speaker 5: probably sooner than two thousand and four, at the end
• 19:25
  Speaker 5: of the Terminal, A few things happened. Is that I
• 19:30
  Speaker 5: moved up within the ranks of that editing room. One
• 19:33
  Speaker 5: of the assistants who'd been with Michael Kahan before me
• 19:37
  Speaker 5: moved on to edit himself. So I was able to
• 19:41
  Speaker 5: move up into a into the first assistant position. And
• 19:46
  Speaker 5: I felt that I did the terminal and Munich as
• 19:50
  Speaker 5: the first as actually one of the first assistants. So
• 19:53
  Speaker 5: at that point I had gone as far as I
• 19:56
  Speaker 5: was going to go in that editing room.
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: Be right back after a word from our sponsor, and
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: now back to the show.
• 20:09
  Speaker 5: And I felt again maybe fatalist. I felt that I
• 20:14
  Speaker 5: could do it, and again I just decided that was
• 20:17
  Speaker 5: what I was going to do. But in actual facts
• 20:20
  Speaker 5: it was it was. I did finish the Terminal, I
• 20:23
  Speaker 5: went and cut a picture, and then I was out
• 20:26
  Speaker 5: of work for a while, and they offered me to
• 20:28
  Speaker 5: come back on Munich, which I did, and then I've
• 20:32
  Speaker 5: been editing ever since then on my own.
• 20:35
  Speaker 4: So when you went out on your own, you know,
• 20:37
  Speaker 4: did you have a reel with you and and say
• 20:39
  Speaker 4: that two different projects, did you say, listen, I can
• 20:43
  Speaker 4: I am you know, ready to be the editor now
• 20:46
  Speaker 4: I mean so. And also at that point, did you
• 20:48
  Speaker 4: have like a lot of your own tools, meaning that
• 20:51
  Speaker 4: you know, at your house, do you have like your
• 20:52
  Speaker 4: own editing bay set up and and and you can
• 20:55
  Speaker 4: work that way?
• 20:56
  Speaker 5: I have done. I sometimes have had and I cut
• 21:03
  Speaker 5: on my laptop, which is you know I'm talking to
• 21:05
  Speaker 5: on my laptop right now. I have editing software on
• 21:10
  Speaker 5: my laptop. I don't always like to do it because
• 21:13
  Speaker 5: I like the separation between home and work, but I
• 21:18
  Speaker 5: do have some equipment at home from time to time.
• 21:22
  Speaker 5: But to go back to your previous question, first part
• 21:26
  Speaker 5: of your question, I cut a couple of short films
• 21:29
  Speaker 5: and one of them I cut on film, and then
• 21:30
  Speaker 5: one of them I cut on a laptop using software
• 21:34
  Speaker 5: called file Maker Pro. And I use those movies as
• 21:39
  Speaker 5: a calling card, and they helped me get editing jobs.
• 21:42
  Speaker 5: Is they certainly helped me get my first feature length movie,
• 21:46
  Speaker 5: which was a picture called My Bodywood Bride or also
• 21:50
  Speaker 5: known as My Far Away Bride. But I don't have
• 21:55
  Speaker 5: an editing set up in my house. No.
• 21:58
  Speaker 4: So actually that is a question I want to ask
• 22:00
  Speaker 4: you too, Michael. It's about actual editing. You know, when
• 22:03
  Speaker 4: you're actually on a film set or you're actually in
• 22:05
  Speaker 4: the editing lab, you know, working on this. You know,
• 22:08
  Speaker 4: ninety nine percent of the films now are all digital.
• 22:10
  Speaker 4: They're shot you know, with you know, probably one of
• 22:13
  Speaker 4: you know, twenty cameras, but you know what I mean,
• 22:15
  Speaker 4: but like versions of cameras, but they're all you know, digital.
• 22:18
  Speaker 4: You know, you're getting either different cards or you're getting
• 22:21
  Speaker 4: hard drives, you're getting something. So what do you edit
• 22:25
  Speaker 4: on now? Is there like a specific editing software like
• 22:28
  Speaker 4: Avid Premiere that you actually edit on?
• 22:31
  Speaker 5: Yes, Avid Media Composer. I've used, as I say, I've
• 22:35
  Speaker 5: used Final Cup Pro but not for a long time.
• 22:37
  Speaker 5: But I've used Premiere very minimally, although I'd like to
• 22:42
  Speaker 5: use it more. But my main tool is Avid Media Composer.
• 22:46
  Speaker 4: And why is is Avid? I mean because I've heard
• 22:49
  Speaker 4: other people using Avid. I'm like a Premier guy. I
• 22:52
  Speaker 4: actually just downloaded Avid's free. I don't know if you
• 22:55
  Speaker 4: know this, shob, but Avid just released a complete, one
• 22:57
  Speaker 4: hundred percent legit free editing software called Avid Media Composer Free.
• 23:01
  Speaker 4: And it's sort of like a light version of Media Composer,
• 23:04
  Speaker 4: the pro grade version. And I'm just you know, I
• 23:07
  Speaker 4: get in there and play around a little bit. It's
• 23:09
  Speaker 4: I'm so used to Premiere that it's a little there's
• 23:11
  Speaker 4: obviously a learning curve. But you know what makes avids
• 23:14
  Speaker 4: like basically what most pro editors want to use.
• 23:18
  Speaker 5: Well, that's a that's a tough question. I don't. I mean,
• 23:22
  Speaker 5: I use it because it's it's always been the system
• 23:24
  Speaker 5: that's been available. I'm not sure that the tool I
• 23:29
  Speaker 5: mean I've used. I've done the opposite to you. I've
• 23:31
  Speaker 5: actually downloaded the free version of Premiere, so I've played
• 23:34
  Speaker 5: around with Premiere in that sense. But the most honest
• 23:41
  Speaker 5: answer is that I use Avid Media Media Composer because
• 23:44
  Speaker 5: it's it's what's been available to me, and that's made
• 23:48
  Speaker 5: me get used to it, and that now that that's
• 23:51
  Speaker 5: the reason I'm the most comfortable with with that system.
• 23:56
  Speaker 5: It's just that's the one that was presented to me.
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 24:00
  Speaker 4: I was actually teaching editing courses at a college, which
• 24:02
  Speaker 4: is a whole another story, by the way, Michael, how
• 24:04
  Speaker 4: I got into that. We had actually we had a
• 24:08
  Speaker 4: meeting because one professor wanted me to put in Vegas Studios.
• 24:12
  Speaker 4: The other professor wanted ADVID Media composer. The other professor
• 24:17
  Speaker 4: wanted just Windows movie Maker, and then I want a premiere.
• 24:20
  Speaker 4: So it's kind of like, well, how do you please everybody? Right,
• 24:24
  Speaker 4: And so the answer was we ended up just going
• 24:28
  Speaker 4: with premiere and when Windows movie Makers free anyway, and
• 24:32
  Speaker 4: I think somebody else wanted a final cut. I think
• 24:33
  Speaker 4: this is what it was. So basically, you know, the
• 24:36
  Speaker 4: one professor came to me and she goes, oh, I've
• 24:38
  Speaker 4: worked in different productions and this and that, and she
• 24:43
  Speaker 4: was getting info from other editors. She wasn't actually an editor. Actually,
• 24:46
  Speaker 4: I was the only person that's ever actually edited a
• 24:47
  Speaker 4: movie in the whole room, which was actually kind of funny.
• 24:50
  Speaker 4: But everybody else just heard things like, oh, this is
• 24:52
  Speaker 4: what this guy used, and this is what that guy used.
• 24:55
  Speaker 4: So she was on productions and she was like, well,
• 24:56
  Speaker 4: I heard from my guy that they only use ADVID
• 24:59
  Speaker 4: and that's that, and that you shouldn't be using anything else.
• 25:02
  Speaker 4: And I always like to ask because I always go
• 25:04
  Speaker 4: back to that because it was actually kind of funny
• 25:06
  Speaker 4: how we're on a room and we're all just sort
• 25:09
  Speaker 4: of having a pissing contest which editing software to use, right,
• 25:13
  Speaker 4: So it's good I always That's why I always ask
• 25:15
  Speaker 4: that question. And whenever the students, when I actually wouldever,
• 25:19
  Speaker 4: whenever I would teach, they would go out into the field,
• 25:22
  Speaker 4: most of them would find that people did you still
• 25:24
  Speaker 4: use AVID? And then? But I always said, you know,
• 25:27
  Speaker 4: don't worry about an actual software, worry about the principles
• 25:30
  Speaker 4: of editing.
• 25:31
  Speaker 5: Well, that's that's that's absolutely correct, and that's the reason
• 25:34
  Speaker 5: I stick with with AVID, although I say, I'm certainly
• 25:37
  Speaker 5: not against trying out Premiere. It's just that I want
• 25:40
  Speaker 5: to concentrate on the storytelling aspect of editing rather than
• 25:43
  Speaker 5: the sort of how do you make a dissolve? Which
• 25:47
  Speaker 5: button do you push? There was a learning curve in
• 25:51
  Speaker 5: the transition from editing on film to electronic editing for me,
• 25:56
  Speaker 5: and I spent you know, a while getting used to
• 26:00
  Speaker 5: with the AVID. So once I was used to it,
• 26:03
  Speaker 5: it's sort of it's the devil, you know. And as
• 26:06
  Speaker 5: I say, just I want to concentrate on the storytelling
• 26:08
  Speaker 5: aspect rather than the actual software.
• 26:11
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I completely agree, one hundred percent. It's all about
• 26:14
  Speaker 4: the story and telling the best story possible. And I
• 26:16
  Speaker 4: wanted to talk to you also just you know, about
• 26:19
  Speaker 4: the hatred obviously, you know, I've been interviewing everybody in
• 26:22
  Speaker 4: the cast and crew of the of this movie. I
• 26:24
  Speaker 4: actually talked to a friend of yours, Thomas Fleming. Oh yeah,
• 26:29
  Speaker 4: and Thomas was like, oh, make sure you talk to
• 26:31
  Speaker 4: Michael Trent. That guy is amazing. And I was like,
• 26:35
  Speaker 4: you know what, he's actually next on the list for
• 26:37
  Speaker 4: me to talk to. So here we are. But I
• 26:39
  Speaker 4: wanted to ask about the Hatred and about you know,
• 26:42
  Speaker 4: editing the you know editing that. So, you know, how
• 26:45
  Speaker 4: did you go about, you know, getting the gig on
• 26:47
  Speaker 4: this movie.
• 26:50
  Speaker 5: While it was a situation where I was, I knew
• 26:54
  Speaker 5: the director. The director and I met at elementary school.
• 26:59
  Speaker 5: Not to say that we met when we were eight, nine,
• 27:03
  Speaker 5: ten eleven. Our sons went to the same elementary school
• 27:06
  Speaker 5: here in Studio City and in in well, certainly the
• 27:14
  Speaker 5: Studio City area. Whenever you meet parents, says, there's lots
• 27:18
  Speaker 5: of people that are involved in the film industry. And
• 27:22
  Speaker 5: Mike and I were just talking, just standing around and
• 27:25
  Speaker 5: you know, we ask each other what we did. And
• 27:28
  Speaker 5: that was a number of years ago. So I met
• 27:32
  Speaker 5: Mike through our sons at school and had talked for well,
• 27:39
  Speaker 5: probably a couple of years about filmmaking, and then he
• 27:44
  Speaker 5: asked me to edit the short film of the Hatred,
• 27:48
  Speaker 5: which was called Hush, and then we had a certain
• 27:51
  Speaker 5: amount of success with that, and he asked me to
• 27:55
  Speaker 5: edit the feature after that. So I didn't actually have
• 27:59
  Speaker 5: to go out and get the job in this particular instance,
• 28:02
  Speaker 5: because I already knew the director.
• 28:05
  Speaker 4: And yeah, mikey Keyhoe, he's he's everywhere, right, I mean, yeah,
• 28:09
  Speaker 4: By the way, do you know that the trailer for
• 28:12
  Speaker 4: the film has over ten million views?
• 28:14
  Speaker 5: I did hear that. I got Mike. I didn't know
• 28:17
  Speaker 5: it was as much as ten million, but Mike Kehoe
• 28:19
  Speaker 5: called me the other day and said we were up
• 28:20
  Speaker 5: to seven point four million views. So that's just incredible
• 28:24
  Speaker 5: that we're at ten million views.
• 28:27
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it's I actually saw it go over I think
• 28:30
  Speaker 4: either on Friday night or last night, which is Saturday.
• 28:33
  Speaker 4: I saw it roll over to ten million, and I
• 28:36
  Speaker 4: was like, my god, this is you know, this is
• 28:38
  Speaker 4: like a juggernaut. So I wanted to ask, you know, Mike,
• 28:40
  Speaker 4: did you did you edit the trailer as well?
• 28:43
  Speaker 5: No, I edited to a version of the trailer, but
• 28:47
  Speaker 5: I believe the trailer was made at through Lionsgate, and
• 28:55
  Speaker 5: I believe that's correct. But no, I wasn't involved in
• 28:57
  Speaker 5: editing of the trailer.
• 28:58
  Speaker 4: Okay, I know sometimes the editors don't. Actually there's a
• 29:01
  Speaker 4: whole different trailer editor and I just wanted to ask,
• 29:04
  Speaker 4: you know, but so, you know, it's amazing that it's
• 29:06
  Speaker 4: over ten million views, and uh, you know, obviously when
• 29:08
  Speaker 4: when this comes out on September the twelfth, you know,
• 29:11
  Speaker 4: I'm actually you know, interested to see you know how
• 29:14
  Speaker 4: you know, you know how how you know everyone responds,
• 29:17
  Speaker 4: and you know, because again, like Mike and I were saying,
• 29:20
  Speaker 4: he wishes the movie was coming out, you know, this weekend,
• 29:23
  Speaker 4: because he's like, you know, all these things are happening,
• 29:25
  Speaker 4: and he goes, now we have a we have a
• 29:26
  Speaker 4: whole nother month or so before it's actually out.
• 29:29
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 29:30
  Speaker 4: Yeah, So you know, Mike, I wanted to ask you
• 29:32
  Speaker 4: about editing The Hatred. When you're actually editing a horror
• 29:36
  Speaker 4: film like this, do you find that there's a lot
• 29:39
  Speaker 4: more of I mean, obviously timing is everything, right, So
• 29:43
  Speaker 4: is there more of a of a timing when you're
• 29:45
  Speaker 4: doing something like The Hatred with horror rather than maybe
• 29:48
  Speaker 4: something more like I guess comedic like like Gem and
• 29:52
  Speaker 4: the Holograms, which you also edited.
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: and now back to the show.
• 30:04
  Speaker 4: You know, I mean, obviously there are two very different films,
• 30:08
  Speaker 4: So so obviously is there a lot of like what
• 30:10
  Speaker 4: are some of the nuances that you have to sort
• 30:13
  Speaker 4: of go through and you're editing two different films just
• 30:15
  Speaker 4: like that, just as an example.
• 30:17
  Speaker 5: Yeah, there's definitely a difference. I mean with a with
• 30:20
  Speaker 5: a movie like The Hatred especially, I mean the opening
• 30:26
  Speaker 5: of the movie, well, the opening of the movie was
• 30:30
  Speaker 5: I edited with a certain amount of suspense. When we
• 30:34
  Speaker 5: introduced the girls, I edited, let's say, more of a
• 30:37
  Speaker 5: normal movie. But when the the the entity starts to
• 30:41
  Speaker 5: take over, the take over, the take over the house.
• 30:45
  Speaker 5: But basically you edit to to put it simply to
• 30:50
  Speaker 5: try and build tension and suspense the shots. I just
• 30:54
  Speaker 5: keep the shots longer and hold on things a little
• 30:59
  Speaker 5: bit more that I would certainly with a in an
• 31:02
  Speaker 5: action movie, or or with a with a comedy. Obviously
• 31:05
  Speaker 5: comedy is very much tied up with timing as well.
• 31:09
  Speaker 5: But if I was to put give you the broad strokes,
• 31:13
  Speaker 5: is I generally hold the shots longer to try and
• 31:16
  Speaker 5: build tension and suspense with a horror movie.
• 31:20
  Speaker 4: So do you sometimes think that, you know? And when
• 31:22
  Speaker 4: I was getting into editing, I made the mistake of
• 31:25
  Speaker 4: cutting too much. And what there was actually a professional
• 31:28
  Speaker 4: editor who once told me, she said, Dave, when you
• 31:31
  Speaker 4: cut too much like you're doing right now, it gets
• 31:33
  Speaker 4: a sense like there's a fight back and forth, like
• 31:36
  Speaker 4: a power struggle. And I and I started because when
• 31:38
  Speaker 4: when I was acting, when what I was doing was
• 31:40
  Speaker 4: I was cutting on the dialogue. So as soon as
• 31:42
  Speaker 4: you were done speaking, cut go to the other person.
• 31:45
  Speaker 4: And it was like, you know what I mean like
• 31:46
  Speaker 4: it was and she goes, you see how that feels
• 31:48
  Speaker 4: like almost like an argument? And I said, yeah, I
• 31:51
  Speaker 4: get that now, I totally get that. And you know
• 31:53
  Speaker 4: that that's some of the things that I've picked up
• 31:55
  Speaker 4: too over the years. That's why I imagine, you know,
• 31:58
  Speaker 4: when you're when you're doing horror, you have to hold
• 32:00
  Speaker 4: onto those shots just a little bit more, hold onto
• 32:02
  Speaker 4: those edit's just a little bit more because you are
• 32:05
  Speaker 4: trying to build that tension in the suspense.
• 32:07
  Speaker 5: That's that's absolutely right. I mean, there was one particular
• 32:09
  Speaker 5: instance in the in the in the Hatred, and it's
• 32:11
  Speaker 5: where Alice walks across the room before she's about to
• 32:14
  Speaker 5: go down into the into the cellar, And we started
• 32:19
  Speaker 5: that shot and kept it long. It was just so
• 32:21
  Speaker 5: she could do the whole walk across he goes past
• 32:24
  Speaker 5: a wall in the room, but we kept the whole
• 32:29
  Speaker 5: length of the shot and then also down the stairs.
• 32:31
  Speaker 5: The whole piece was kept almost at full length. And
• 32:35
  Speaker 5: it's for that exact reason. It was, you know, just
• 32:38
  Speaker 5: to build, to build that suspense. But definitely, I mean
• 32:42
  Speaker 5: another example I can I can think of is it
• 32:45
  Speaker 5: and this was in another movie I think, but it
• 32:47
  Speaker 5: was a similar kind of genre, but a shadow appears
• 32:49
  Speaker 5: on the wall, and rather than cut when she walks
• 32:51
  Speaker 5: through the door, we start on the where the shadow
• 32:54
  Speaker 5: first appears on the wall and hold that shot all
• 32:57
  Speaker 5: the way through to when the character walks through the door.
• 33:00
  Speaker 5: And again with the hope and the aim of creating suspense.
• 33:05
  Speaker 4: So, you know, what are someone like the one final
• 33:08
  Speaker 4: things that you you you hope just to talk about
• 33:10
  Speaker 4: the hatred, just to sort of like come full circle,
• 33:12
  Speaker 4: you know what are some of the things that you
• 33:13
  Speaker 4: you hope people take away from the hatred after they
• 33:16
  Speaker 4: get after a viewing of it.
• 33:18
  Speaker 5: Of the movie, well, I hope they. I hope they're scared,
• 33:21
  Speaker 5: and I hope they talk about the movie afterwards. If
• 33:25
  Speaker 5: they if if we put them the audience on the
• 33:27
  Speaker 5: edge of their seat, then I believe that we've done
• 33:29
  Speaker 5: our jobs. Uh as long as it's you know, they
• 33:35
  Speaker 5: they enjoy the movie for those reasons, say and get scared,
• 33:41
  Speaker 5: then then I'd be very happy.
• 33:45
  Speaker 4: So, you know, Mike just sort of just continuing to
• 33:48
  Speaker 4: talk about editing. You know, what, what are some of
• 33:50
  Speaker 4: the tips or or principles that you've learned over the years.
• 33:54
  Speaker 4: You know that you would you could you know, just
• 33:55
  Speaker 4: sort of give the listeners who are maybe starting to
• 33:57
  Speaker 4: edit their movies or or maybe just to some thing
• 34:00
  Speaker 4: that you know, they could use if they're trying to
• 34:02
  Speaker 4: edit their own movie.
• 34:06
  Speaker 5: It's a good question. I think it probably goes largely
• 34:10
  Speaker 5: goes back to what we were just talking about, is
• 34:12
  Speaker 5: that you want to to say, first of all, read
• 34:19
  Speaker 5: read the script or read the scene, and then decide
• 34:22
  Speaker 5: what the emotion of the scene is. If the emotion
• 34:25
  Speaker 5: of the scene is a fight, then you would edit
• 34:27
  Speaker 5: just as you described, you know, cutting very quickly on
• 34:31
  Speaker 5: the dialogue lines, or even on the dialogue to give
• 34:34
  Speaker 5: the impression that one person is cutting the other person off.
• 34:38
  Speaker 5: If it's a romantic scene, again, you you'd roll those
• 34:41
  Speaker 5: shots out a little bit longer to to create that
• 34:45
  Speaker 5: that romantic atmosphere. Comedy probably speaks for itself, that is,
• 34:52
  Speaker 5: you've got to cut to the right reaction after the
• 34:55
  Speaker 5: right amount of time, after the punchline, and hold on
• 34:59
  Speaker 5: the punchline for the right amount of time. I think
• 35:02
  Speaker 5: that these are the things that I've learned the most,
• 35:04
  Speaker 5: because I think that a lot of editors might have
• 35:06
  Speaker 5: that tendency, as you just described, to cut too much.
• 35:12
  Speaker 5: The other thing that you might I often think about
• 35:16
  Speaker 5: is cutting to reaction shots and what is that person thinking,
• 35:21
  Speaker 5: What is the opposing person thinking as that dialogue line
• 35:26
  Speaker 5: is being spoken, and is it is it relevant to
• 35:28
  Speaker 5: cut to their reaction? And I think it's all about
• 35:32
  Speaker 5: generating the emotion that's intended by the writer. You know,
• 35:37
  Speaker 5: that's written down, So I try and emulate what was
• 35:45
  Speaker 5: originally imagined by the writer.
• 35:49
  Speaker 4: And you're always you know, also you talking about reading
• 35:52
  Speaker 4: the script and about you know, find the essence of
• 35:54
  Speaker 4: that scene. You know, what's the scene really about You know,
• 35:58
  Speaker 4: you hear that a lot too in writing, and you
• 36:00
  Speaker 4: realized just how closely involved editing and uh, writing are
• 36:04
  Speaker 4: because you know, you're trying to build that same atmosphere
• 36:07
  Speaker 4: and now you're doing it with the actual footage. While writers,
• 36:10
  Speaker 4: you know, you're doing it and trying to get people
• 36:11
  Speaker 4: to imagine this in their head, you know, trying to
• 36:13
  Speaker 4: get like this a little there's these images and how
• 36:16
  Speaker 4: everything would pan out in their head. So you know,
• 36:18
  Speaker 4: when we're they're they're very closely related, and you know,
• 36:20
  Speaker 4: finding that core of the scene. You know, what's this
• 36:22
  Speaker 4: scene really about? You know, maybe it's not really about
• 36:25
  Speaker 4: a fight, that's just the after that's really the the
• 36:28
  Speaker 4: sort of causation from the actual you know. Uh, I
• 36:31
  Speaker 4: guess I want to say core of the core of
• 36:33
  Speaker 4: the problem for you, if you will.
• 36:35
  Speaker 5: Mm hmm. That's that's that's correct. I think that you
• 36:39
  Speaker 5: do work very very very much with the sort of
• 36:45
  Speaker 5: the writer's intention in mind, or at least my interpretation
• 36:51
  Speaker 5: of what the writer's intention was, and I edit with
• 36:54
  Speaker 5: that in mind for sure.
• 36:56
  Speaker 4: Yeah. And you know, and that's something too when when
• 37:00
  Speaker 4: when if you're editing anything, I think you have to
• 37:02
  Speaker 4: ask yourself those questions, you know, you have to ask
• 37:04
  Speaker 4: you yourself those you know, why are we even why
• 37:07
  Speaker 4: is this scene even in here? You know obviously because
• 37:09
  Speaker 4: somebody once told me about it about you could tell
• 37:11
  Speaker 4: the difference between a good editor and a great editor
• 37:14
  Speaker 4: by how how how ruthless they'll cut stuff. And uh,
• 37:19
  Speaker 4: there was this, There was this one time a friend
• 37:21
  Speaker 4: of mine was on was telling me that it took
• 37:22
  Speaker 4: them two days to get this scene right, and the
• 37:25
  Speaker 4: editor said to them, look, you got to cut it.
• 37:27
  Speaker 4: And and my friend said, who was the rector? He goes,
• 37:29
  Speaker 4: but it took us two days to shoot this stupid thing,
• 37:32
  Speaker 4: And the editor said, uh, yeah, but it has it
• 37:35
  Speaker 4: adds absolutely nothing to the movie.
• 37:38
  Speaker 5: Mm hmmm. I think that that's that that's uh, that's
• 37:43
  Speaker 5: absolutely right. I think that as an editor you also
• 37:45
  Speaker 5: have to look at the edit with the big picture
• 37:48
  Speaker 5: in mind. You you maybe edit a character, but then
• 37:54
  Speaker 5: also edit that character with the whole story arc of
• 37:57
  Speaker 5: the movie in mind. So if there's something that's going
• 37:59
  Speaker 5: to pay off later and and there's a look maybe
• 38:05
  Speaker 5: that you can hold on to, not to telegra necessarily
• 38:08
  Speaker 5: telegraph to the audience, but it could be something that
• 38:12
  Speaker 5: you say you hold on a shot earlier in the
• 38:13
  Speaker 5: movie which then pays off later. But I think that
• 38:16
  Speaker 5: definitely you have to edit with the whole movie in mind.
• 38:20
  Speaker 4: Yeah, very true.
• 38:21
  Speaker 5: And that also that includes that if a scene is
• 38:27
  Speaker 5: not giving anything to the movie, even if it took
• 38:29
  Speaker 5: two days to short, then you have to you have
• 38:31
  Speaker 5: to cut the scene and and and be ruthless about
• 38:35
  Speaker 5: it if in the big picture, that's that's what's best
• 38:38
  Speaker 5: for the movie.
• 38:40
  Speaker 4: You know, I always watched eleaded scenes off of some
• 38:42
  Speaker 4: of my favorite movies on like Blu Rayro DVD, and
• 38:45
  Speaker 4: and when I watched them, I can go, oh, you
• 38:47
  Speaker 4: know what, now, I see why it's sort of leaded
• 38:48
  Speaker 4: scene because literally it added nothing to the movie. It
• 38:51
  Speaker 4: added absolutely nothing, And if you actually put it in
• 38:54
  Speaker 4: there would have you'll drug it down, yeah, because you
• 38:56
  Speaker 4: don't want people in the theaters to be checking their
• 38:58
  Speaker 4: watches going, oh my god, is this thing going to
• 39:00
  Speaker 4: be over?
• 39:02
  Speaker 5: That's exactly right, And that's that's you know, that's the
• 39:05
  Speaker 5: hope that we can judge what those scenes are and
• 39:09
  Speaker 5: and take them out for the good of the movie.
• 39:13
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and very true. And that's where we want to
• 39:17
  Speaker 4: make sure the movie just sort of flows all together.
• 39:19
  Speaker 4: And I think that's what we're all going for, you know,
• 39:21
  Speaker 4: even when we're running a script or you know, I'm
• 39:23
  Speaker 4: actually you know, we're all trying to just make sure
• 39:25
  Speaker 4: that we're a servicing the film as a whole rather
• 39:28
  Speaker 4: than anyone's you know, ego, so to speak, and to
• 39:32
  Speaker 4: you know, always making sure that the movie is just
• 39:33
  Speaker 4: flowing together and not to just to just disjointed. If
• 39:37
  Speaker 4: I could actually talk, that would actually help dis jointed it. So, Michael,
• 39:42
  Speaker 4: we've been talking for about, you know, thirty five minutes now,
• 39:45
  Speaker 4: So just in parting, is is there anything that you
• 39:47
  Speaker 4: wanted to talk about that we didn't get a chance to,
• 39:49
  Speaker 4: or maybe just sort of any final thoughts, put a
• 39:51
  Speaker 4: period end of this whole conversation.
• 39:55
  Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 40:01
  Speaker 2: and now back to the show.
• 40:05
  Speaker 5: Only that you know, I've been I've been doing this,
• 40:08
  Speaker 5: this job for a number of years, probably more than
• 40:12
  Speaker 5: than I care to remember. But it's it's a I
• 40:15
  Speaker 5: love the job to be. To be an editor is
• 40:21
  Speaker 5: really for me a satisfying profession. And as the cliche goes,
• 40:28
  Speaker 5: if you enjoy what you do, then you never work
• 40:30
  Speaker 5: a day in your life. And that for me about
• 40:33
  Speaker 5: editing is absolutely true. It's a it's a passion of
• 40:37
  Speaker 5: mine and something that I enjoy every day. If that's
• 40:41
  Speaker 5: something I can offer up as a not that it's
• 40:45
  Speaker 5: always easy. There's periods of unemployment, but if you if
• 40:51
  Speaker 5: you stick at it, then it's a very satisfying career.
• 40:55
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and and that that's a you know, a good
• 40:57
  Speaker 4: way to to sort of put it in a period.
• 40:59
  Speaker 4: At the end of this conversation is you have to
• 41:00
  Speaker 4: do what your life. You have to do what you love. Again,
• 41:03
  Speaker 4: if I could talk Michael would actually be very helpful,
• 41:06
  Speaker 4: but but yeah, you have to do what you love.
• 41:08
  Speaker 4: And you know that that's key to to to to life.
• 41:11
  Speaker 4: You know, I, you know, in myself included, sometimes I've
• 41:15
  Speaker 4: just done things or work jobs that you just hate
• 41:17
  Speaker 4: and you're like, what the hell am I doing to
• 41:18
  Speaker 4: myself here? So you have to you have to really
• 41:21
  Speaker 4: love this business to to to to make sure you're
• 41:23
  Speaker 4: actually you know, you want to do it. And there's
• 41:25
  Speaker 4: a lot of tests in the way that actually make
• 41:27
  Speaker 4: sure you're like, are you sure you want to do this?
• 41:29
  Speaker 5: Yeah?
• 41:30
  Speaker 4: So Michael, work people.
• 41:31
  Speaker 5: Find you out online I'm sorry, what was that?
• 41:33
  Speaker 4: Where work? Can people find you out online?
• 41:36
  Speaker 5: Well? I have my IMDb page, I have a Vimeo
• 41:43
  Speaker 5: h page also really just Michael Trent, film editor. Google
• 41:50
  Speaker 5: that and a bunch of my stuff comes up. My
• 41:54
  Speaker 5: LinkedIn page, my IMDb page, the name of my agent
• 42:00
  Speaker 5: and Vimeo page also come up. But yeah, google Google
• 42:03
  Speaker 5: my name and film ed it's here and that's my
• 42:05
  Speaker 5: online presence and I will link.
• 42:07
  Speaker 4: To all of that everyone in the show notes at
• 42:10
  Speaker 4: Dave Bullets dot com. Twitter, it's at Dave Underscore Bullets,
• 42:14
  Speaker 4: and the podcast is at dB podcast. Michael Trent, I
• 42:17
  Speaker 4: want to say thank you so much for coming on,
• 42:19
  Speaker 4: and you know I'm looking forward to the Hatred.
• 42:22
  Speaker 5: Great and thank you for having me.
• 42:25
  Speaker 2: I want to thank Dave so much for doing such
• 42:26
  Speaker 2: a great job on this episode. If you want to
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: get links to anything we spoke about in this episode,
• 42:30
  Speaker 2: head over to the show notes at Bulletproofscreenwriting dot tv
• 42:34
  Speaker 2: for it slash for twenty five. Thank you so much
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: for listening, guys, As always, keep on writing no matter what.
• 42:40
  Speaker 4: I'll talk to you soon.
• 42:41
  Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to the Bulletproof Screenwriting podcast at Bulletproof
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: Screenwriting dot tv.