Latest / Pod Save America / Why Is Trump Scared of the Media?

Transcript

Why Is Trump Scared of the Media? · Pod Save America

• 0:20
  Speaker 1: Welcome to Pod Save America. I'm Jon Favreau.
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: And I'm Jen Psaki.
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: On today's show, Kamala Harris and Donald Trump open up
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: a new front in the campaign, the all-out media blitz.
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: We're going to get into all the highs and lows
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: of the candidates' interviews, what their strategy is, and whether
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: it's working. And later, I'm going to be talking with
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: Joyce Craig, the Democratic candidate for governor in New Hampshire,
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: a state near and dear to both of us about
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: a race we really, really need to win. But first, Jen,
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: it's so awesome to have you.
• 0:46
  Speaker 3: It's great to see you and be here with you. Now,
• 0:49
  Speaker 3: I have not talked to you in person or over
• 0:52
  Speaker 3: Zoom yet. since you were on with Jesse Watters. So
• 0:55
  Speaker 3: congrats on that performance.
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: That was fun.
• 0:58
  Speaker 3: And the bond that was clearly made there. It was
• 1:00
  Speaker 3: almost awkward to listen to, but I loved it.
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: In fact, I talked to you the night before because
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: I was on your show at the convention, and then
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: the next night I did Jesse Watters.
• 1:09
  Speaker 4: See?
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: Look at that.
• 1:10
  Speaker 4: Look at that.
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: Quite a bookend.
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: So everyone knows who you are. Former White House press secretary,
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: host of MSNBC's Inside with Jen Psaki, but most importantly,
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: a good friend who spent... Many anxious Octobers with me
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: for the last 20 years now.
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: So many. So many polar coasters together.
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: Some ended up better than others.
• 1:30
  Speaker 2: That's true.
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: Our first not so good. Later on, much better.
• 1:34
  Speaker 3: The Carrie campaign days when we thought we were winning
• 1:37
  Speaker 3: the day of the election because of the polls that day.
• 1:42
  Speaker 3: Because of the exit polls. That was incorrect. A lesson
• 1:45
  Speaker 3: learned by all.
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: Quick vibe check. How are you feeling? Um.
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: optimistic and nervous.
• 1:54
  Speaker 5: Both.
• 1:55
  Speaker 2: All of the feelings.
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: I get asked this question a lot. I was just
• 1:59
  Speaker 3: down getting coffee and somebody asked me, what do you
• 2:02
  Speaker 3: think is going to happen? And how do you think
• 2:04
  Speaker 3: the race is? And he said, don't tell me it's close. Well,
• 2:10
  Speaker 3: that's kind of where we are this many days out.
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: Do you want me to go state by state with you?
• 2:15
  Speaker 4: I can, but yes.
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: I'm sure you get lots of those too.
• 2:18
  Speaker 1: I was just at a dinner last night, which... was
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: basically everyone at the dinner, just like I ended up
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: doing a live Pod Save America for people because they
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: were like, tell us what's going to happen and why
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: it's going to be okay. And I was like, I
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: can't do either of those things, unfortunately.
• 2:36
  Speaker 3: It's the time of year we've all lived through. I
• 2:39
  Speaker 3: was at my neighborhood block party a couple of weeks
• 2:41
  Speaker 3: ago and more than one person stopped me and said,
• 2:45
  Speaker 3: how big is this Georgia hand counting situation? I was like,
• 2:48
  Speaker 3: it's a level of specificity, but that's, That is what
• 2:51
  Speaker 3: everybody's paying attention to for good reason. And we've all
• 2:54
  Speaker 3: been through not only losing like you and I were
• 2:57
  Speaker 3: a part of in 2004. We've been through winning in
• 2:59
  Speaker 3: the elation of that. And we've been through the trauma
• 3:02
  Speaker 3: that was 2016 and 2020 in different ways. So no
• 3:05
  Speaker 3: wonder everybody feels traumatized.
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: I know it does. That's a good point. It makes sense. OK,
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: let's get into it. The other week, Dan suggested an
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: everything everywhere all at once media strategy for Kamala Harris.
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: And boy, has she delivered. In the last 72 hours,
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: the vice president has done Call Her Daddy, 60 Minutes,
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: The View, Howard Stern, Stephen Colbert, and Coach Walls was
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: on Jimmy Kimmel Live. Harris also has a Univision Town
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: Hall Thursday. Those appearances will reach combined tens of millions
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: of viewers, many of them voters who aren't political junkies
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: like you and I, some who haven't decided whether to
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: vote or who to vote for. Let's take a listen
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: to some of the highlights from Harris and Walz's appearance.
• 3:50
  Speaker 6: Please welcome back the next president of the United States.
• 3:57
  Speaker 6: There are so many people in our country who are
• 3:59
  Speaker 6: right in the middle. They're taking care of their kids
• 4:02
  Speaker 6: and they're taking care of their aging parents. And it's
• 4:05
  Speaker 6: just almost impossible to do it all. So what I
• 4:10
  Speaker 6: am proposing is that basically what we will do is
• 4:13
  Speaker 6: allow Medicare to cover In-home health care.
• 4:20
  Speaker 7: They try to paint you like you're some leftist who,
• 4:24
  Speaker 7: I don't know, who wants to have people running through
• 4:26
  Speaker 7: the streets committing crimes.
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  Speaker 4: You were a prosecutor. I have put a lot of
• 4:31
  Speaker 4: people in jail.
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  Speaker 6: I have personally prosecuted everything from child sexual assault to homicides.
• 4:36
  Speaker 7: You all remember when we grew up, this idea that
• 4:40
  Speaker 7: we could have different ideas, but we have unity, love
• 4:42
  Speaker 7: the democracy, have an election, and then shake hands, and
• 4:46
  Speaker 7: admit the person who won won.
• 4:47
  Speaker 8: One of the old saws is, they just want somebody
• 4:50
  Speaker 8: they can have a beer with. So would you like
• 4:52
  Speaker 8: to have a beer with me so I can tell
• 4:53
  Speaker 8: people what that's like? Okay, this was, now we asked
• 4:58
  Speaker 8: ahead of time, because I can't just be giving a
• 5:00
  Speaker 8: drink to the Vice President of the United States, but
• 5:02
  Speaker 8: I'd ask him, you asked for Miller High Life.
• 5:04
  Speaker 1: You asked for.
• 5:05
  Speaker 3: Miller High Life.
• 5:07
  Speaker 6: So cheers.
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: Okay, cheers.
• 5:08
  Speaker 3: There you go.
• 5:11
  Speaker 6: You know, when you've lost You lost millions of jobs.
• 5:16
  Speaker 6: You lost manufacturing. You lost automotive plants. You lost the election.
• 5:21
  Speaker 6: What does that make you?
• 5:22
  Speaker 3: A loser.
• 5:25
  Speaker 4: This is what happens when I drink beer.
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: Miller High Life. It's a choice. That is a commitment
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: to winning Wisconsin right there.
• 5:35
  Speaker 3: It is a commitment to winning Wisconsin. She's like, I
• 5:38
  Speaker 3: will just roll in floating jello and punch and have
• 5:43
  Speaker 3: Miller High Life every.
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: Day until the election.
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: Whatever it takes.
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: Whatever needs to happen.
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: I know you've been talking about this on your show, too.
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: But what do you think of Harris's media strategy in
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: this last week?
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: I love it.
• 5:56
  Speaker 3: You know, and I remember and I know I heard
• 5:58
  Speaker 3: Dan's description and that hearkened me back to working for
• 6:01
  Speaker 3: Dan many, many years ago.
• 6:03
  Speaker 9: Yeah.
• 6:03
  Speaker 3: I mean, the thing for everybody to remember is that
• 6:06
  Speaker 3: most people are not putting politics in their veins every day,
• 6:10
  Speaker 3: like you and I and everybody listening to your show
• 6:13
  Speaker 3: every week and everybody who watches me every week in
• 6:15
  Speaker 3: that same way. And the majority of people who Kamala
• 6:19
  Speaker 3: Harris needs to vote are.
• 6:21
  Speaker 2: Not doing that.
• 6:22
  Speaker 3: And so what she's doing is so smart because she
• 6:25
  Speaker 3: is getting outside of the bubble of of people who
• 6:29
  Speaker 3: are talking to themselves about the election and what matters
• 6:34
  Speaker 3: and what doesn't and what has an impact and what doesn't.
• 6:36
  Speaker 3: The other piece, and I talked about this a little
• 6:38
  Speaker 3: bit on my show the other night, but just to
• 6:39
  Speaker 3: get some things off my chest, is it drives me
• 6:42
  Speaker 3: absolutely insane.
• 6:44
  Speaker 2: And I say this having.
• 6:45
  Speaker 3: Spent 10 years working in the White House, briefing the
• 6:48
  Speaker 3: press every day. I value the press. I understand and
• 6:51
  Speaker 3: value the role of the media. But the notion that
• 6:54
  Speaker 3: you can only ask a question of a presidential candidate
• 6:57
  Speaker 3: or a president if you have a White House press credential,
• 7:01
  Speaker 3: is absurd.
• 7:03
  Speaker 4: Absurd.
• 7:04
  Speaker 3: And all you have to do is listen to, and
• 7:06
  Speaker 3: I listened to the Howard Stern interview this morning. He
• 7:09
  Speaker 3: is an excellent interviewer. Better than anyone else I have
• 7:13
  Speaker 3: heard interview a presidential candidate in my many years of
• 7:16
  Speaker 3: doing this. And he got to all of the core questions.
• 7:20
  Speaker 3: I mean, they talked about Putin. They talked about her
• 7:23
  Speaker 3: plans for the economy. They talked about her career as
• 7:26
  Speaker 3: a prosecutor. And the thing that is so appealing about
• 7:29
  Speaker 3: how he asks the questions is there's an element of
• 7:32
  Speaker 3: performative stuff.
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: That happens, I think.
• 7:35
  Speaker 3: I don't think you and I do it as much,
• 7:37
  Speaker 3: but I think it happens, of course, in the media
• 7:40
  Speaker 3: where it's like people think they have to do something
• 7:42
  Speaker 3: like this. Hello, Vice President Harris. Are you concerned that
• 7:47
  Speaker 3: Vladimir Putin was receiving COVID tests from Donald Trump? It's like,
• 7:52
  Speaker 3: are you fucking kidding me? Of course I'm concerned.
• 7:54
  Speaker 2: Who isn't concerned? I mean, so he asked the question, like,
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: isn't that insane?
• 8:00
  Speaker 3: And it's like, yes, it's insane.
• 8:01
  Speaker 2: And what does it mean?
• 8:03
  Speaker 3: And I think that is how people digest things. But
• 8:09
  Speaker 3: I love the strategy because it is way outside of
• 8:10
  Speaker 3: the bubble. I mean, call her mother, call her daddy,
• 8:13
  Speaker 3: call her daddy. I'm like, call your.
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: Mother, whatever.
• 8:16
  Speaker 3: You know what I'm talking about? I've been mixing up
• 8:18
  Speaker 3: the things. Call Her Daddy has 10 million listeners.
• 8:23
  Speaker 8: I know.
• 8:24
  Speaker 9: It's wild.
• 8:24
  Speaker 3: And most of them are under 35. It's really, really smart.
• 8:28
  Speaker 3: I will say as a sidebar, I was like, oh,
• 8:30
  Speaker 3: I'm an Alex Cooper fan.
• 8:31
  Speaker 4: I love her.
• 8:31
  Speaker 3: I'm going to listen to her now, right? So I'm
• 8:33
  Speaker 3: in the car with my 9-year-old daughter yesterday.
• 8:35
  Speaker 2: And I'm like, I'll just find a past episode.
• 8:37
  Speaker 5: No. No.
• 8:39
  Speaker 6: Yep.
• 8:39
  Speaker 2: I put it on and I was like, whoa.
• 8:43
  Speaker 3: Yeah, no. I mean, I'll listen to.
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: It not with my 9-year-old in the car.
• 8:47
  Speaker 3: But yes, I think it's outside of the people who
• 8:50
  Speaker 3: Google refresh on whitehouse.gov, outside of the people who are
• 8:54
  Speaker 3: listening to your excellent podcast every week. It needs to
• 8:57
  Speaker 3: be way outside of that. And I think the last
• 9:00
  Speaker 3: thing I'll say is this polling that everybody overly focuses
• 9:03
  Speaker 3: on and then describes in their own way, which is
• 9:05
  Speaker 3: another thing that drives me insane. Like the 28% who
• 9:09
  Speaker 3: want to know more about her. We don't know exactly
• 9:11
  Speaker 3: what that means. My gut here is that 28%. is
• 9:15
  Speaker 3: not looking for a 200-page economic plan dropped on each
• 9:19
  Speaker 3: of their doorsteps, though she does have a plan that's, what,
• 9:21
  Speaker 3: 85 pages or something. They want to know what makes
• 9:25
  Speaker 3: her tick and how she thinks about things. What is
• 9:29
  Speaker 3: driving her to think about home health care? What is
• 9:31
  Speaker 3: driving her to think about the child tax credit you
• 9:34
  Speaker 3: talked about? That's what these interviews help achieve.
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: Well, it's exactly right. And at the end of the day,
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: a lot of voters who haven't figured out what they're
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: going to do yet, again, these are people who are
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: not even listening to Pod Save America or your show,
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: they're barely paying attention to the news at all because
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: they're just living their lives, doing other stuff, and they're
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: going to vote, some of them, and they're tuning in
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: at the last minute. And so you kind of just,
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: it's a volume game. You have to be everywhere because
• 10:03
  Speaker 1: you want, like, by chance, if they just happen to
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: be watching The View or they happen to be in
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: their car listening to Sirius Satellite Radio and there's Howard Stern, right? Like,
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: you just have to catch people at times where they're
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: tuning in, which is infrequently for a And they're going
• 10:20
  Speaker 1: to end up making their mind via an impression of
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: the candidate, right?
• 10:25
  Speaker 5: Totally.
• 10:26
  Speaker 3: I mean, I will say one thing I may disagree
• 10:28
  Speaker 3: with Dan on, maybe he wouldn't disagree with me, but
• 10:31
  Speaker 3: is I do think that interviews like Call Her Daddy
• 10:36
  Speaker 3: and Howard Stern are more important in this moment when
• 10:41
  Speaker 3: voter registration deadlines are coming up. People are actually voting.
• 10:45
  Speaker 3: And it's like, what's going to give you a kick
• 10:47
  Speaker 3: in the butt to get out the door? then 60
• 10:51
  Speaker 3: minutes is always good to do, right? It's very powerful reach.
• 10:54
  Speaker 3: Then a lengthy interview with the New York Times. Like
• 10:57
  Speaker 3: I read the New York Times every day, but it's just,
• 10:59
  Speaker 3: that's not.
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: No one ever needs to do it. Honestly, you know,
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: I love the New York Times. I am not a
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: New York Times hater.
• 11:07
  Speaker 10: Same.
• 11:07
  Speaker 11: I read it at first.
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: But the idea of a sit down with the New
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: York Times, talk about, like communicating with the same fucking
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: people who have already made up their minds.
• 11:18
  Speaker 3: It just makes no sense.
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: It just makes no sense. And that's no disrespect to
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: the New York times. It's just, if you're a campaign strategist,
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: that's not where you want to go. Um, and I
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: also think, you know, so there was first, there was
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: the news cycle. She's avoiding the press. She's avoiding type.
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: But it's always a, you know, this, it's always a
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: trap because then she does 60 minutes. And of course,
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: because it's 60 fucking minutes, they asked her really tough questions.
• 11:40
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: And, You know, and I think they asked her one
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: on immigration and they were like, well, wasn't it too
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: late what you did? Wasn't it too late when you
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: did it? And they asked her like three separate times.
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: And of course, now that the Trump campaign, everyone like
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: jumps all over it once you do the tough interview.
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: And now they're like, you know, complaining. We want the
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: full unedited transcript out there, which is just completely ridiculous.
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: Because like the reason we all know that she had
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: a couple different answers is because 60 Minutes put out
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: the whole interview. But you can't win is the problem.
• 12:09
  Speaker 3: It's a real I also love this talking or I
• 12:12
  Speaker 3: love hate it. I mean, that you hear coming from
• 12:15
  Speaker 3: Trump's Trump's people. That's like or people who are like
• 12:18
  Speaker 3: trying to be, you know, I'm not on any side.
• 12:21
  Speaker 2: I'm just giving analysis.
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: People just need to.
• 12:24
  Speaker 3: Know more about her plans and her policies.
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: And it's like, are you kidding me right now? She's
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: not running against Mitt Romney. What are you talking about?
• 12:33
  Speaker 3: Like he can't.
• 12:34
  Speaker 2: Do you know what any of his plans are?
• 12:36
  Speaker 3: People who even love him, could they articulate a five-point
• 12:40
  Speaker 3: plan of his?
• 12:41
  Speaker 8: No.
• 12:41
  Speaker 2: No, of course not. That's not why they're for him.
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: No, he's going to close the border. That's it. One
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: thing I wanted to ask you, it's obviously hard to
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: drive a single message with so many interviews and questions over, what,
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: 72 hours.
• 12:55
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: But could you detect any themes, or do you think
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: the intended message was the media strategy itself?
• 13:04
  Speaker 3: Some of it was I think they had to get
• 13:06
  Speaker 3: over the hurdle of the media strategy. Like, I'm not afraid.
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: Get out of here.
• 13:10
  Speaker 3: I'm doing 100 interviews in four days. Some of the themes,
• 13:14
  Speaker 3: and I was listening for exactly this, and as you
• 13:16
  Speaker 3: well know, you can't control what the people ask you about, right?
• 13:19
  Speaker 3: And Alex Cooper wanted to ask about women's rights, abortion rights,
• 13:23
  Speaker 3: and specifics there.
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: So there were obvious themes that were coming through in that.
• 13:29
  Speaker 3: One of the things I did hear over and over again,
• 13:30
  Speaker 3: which was in her convention speech, you hear her do
• 13:32
  Speaker 3: this in the stump, is like, He is not a
• 13:36
  Speaker 3: serious person about Trump. That's one of her lines. He's
• 13:41
  Speaker 3: thinking about himself, not about you. There were some lines
• 13:46
  Speaker 3: and messages that you did hear over and over again,
• 13:49
  Speaker 3: but they covered the gambit a little bit. But I
• 13:52
  Speaker 3: think what she is kind of good at, and I
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: thought this was the case especially in the Howard Stern interview,
• 13:57
  Speaker 3: was kind of bringing it back to.
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: You know, he asked her.
• 14:01
  Speaker 3: About working at McDonald's and kind of things along those lines.
• 14:05
  Speaker 3: And she would bring it back to, well, that's why
• 14:07
  Speaker 3: I care so much about an opportunity agenda, right? And
• 14:09
  Speaker 3: people may be like, what's an opportunity agenda? But she's
• 14:12
  Speaker 3: getting better at bringing it back to what the core
• 14:15
  Speaker 3: message is.
• 14:15
  Speaker 5: So.
• 14:17
  Speaker 3: A little bit of it's about I'm about you.
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: I'm going to fight for you.
• 14:21
  Speaker 3: And he's fighting for himself, which I have always thought
• 14:24
  Speaker 3: is a core message.
• 14:25
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 14:25
  Speaker 3: And that was a core message in 2012 when you
• 14:27
  Speaker 3: and I were working for Obama and he ran.
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: What do you think?
• 14:29
  Speaker 3: What did you what did you did you hear thematics?
• 14:31
  Speaker 3: Did you hear more like a rat all over the place?
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: No, I heard that. I heard she it's interesting. I
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: think she did this with Stern, but she talked about that.
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: She sees this election as strength versus weakness and trying
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: to redefine what strength is and basically trying to define
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: Trump as weak just because he doesn't care about people,
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: which is interesting. You could tell in some of these interviews,
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: Howard Stern, a few others, that she's like, they know
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: that they're having issues with young men. And so she
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: wanted to appear strong. tough, which I think she is right. Like,
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: and she talked about talking about locking people up.
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: Have you shot it?
• 15:12
  Speaker 3: Of course I have.
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: She's firing Glocks. She's locking people up. Like, you know, she's, she's, uh,
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: she's not going to be defined as weak. That's for sure.
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: So I could detect that a little bit. Um, and
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: I don't know, it's interesting with her, like having watched
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: all this, I think she is, she's excellent talking about
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: personal stuff. and her life and like just being a
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: normal human being.
• 15:37
  Speaker 2: And abortion.
• 15:38
  Speaker 3: I mean, she talks about it in a way that
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: is like better than most people who talk about it,
• 15:43
  Speaker 3: including people who lead organizations around it.
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: And like has a real passion, you know?
• 15:48
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: And I think that she's also really good when she
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: goes after Trump. Like she's, I think that she's at
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: her sharpest there. You made the point about everyone being like,
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: I need your plans. I need your plans. when she
• 15:58
  Speaker 1: feels like forced to talk about her plans, like the
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: details of the plans are good when she tries to
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: put like language and values around it. That's when she,
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: I think gets into the, you know, she's sort of
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: just talking about, it's like a little more cliche. Um,
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: but I think like if I, if I, you know,
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: small things at this point, but like making it more
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: of a contrast with Trump, even on the policies. So
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: it's like, like, what do you want to do? And
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: I think at 60 minutes she did the, they asked
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: how you pay for it. And she's like, well, I
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: want to make the middle class strong and he wants
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: to make it weak, which is, directionally the right message
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: but it's more like big tax cut he wants to
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: give big tax cut to rich people i want to
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: give tax cut to the middle class done no other
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: language like that's it that's all you need to do.
• 16:38
  Speaker 3: It's also yes that's so true because yeah there's something
• 16:41
  Speaker 3: about it that's like it's not quite there it still
• 16:43
  Speaker 3: feels like you're reading from the talking points off of
• 16:45
  Speaker 3: your speech yeah i think she'll get there but it
• 16:49
  Speaker 3: is the contrast piece is like the child care one
• 16:51
  Speaker 3: is such a good one too because remember when he
• 16:53
  Speaker 3: was asked about child care and it was like Oh, yeah.
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: Clearly, since you and I are going to play for
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: child care.
• 16:59
  Speaker 3: Of child rearing right now, I can tell you that
• 17:02
  Speaker 3: man has never had a conversation about child care in
• 17:05
  Speaker 3: his life.
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: But she can make that point.
• 17:07
  Speaker 9: Right.
• 17:08
  Speaker 5: Yep.
• 17:08
  Speaker 3: Look, that guy's never had a conversation about child care.
• 17:10
  Speaker 3: He never dealt with that ever.
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a good idea.
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: And some of.
• 17:14
  Speaker 3: That is making him seem, which he is, disconnected from
• 17:18
  Speaker 3: what people are actually going through.
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: Which I think is if she can drive that home
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: and sort of like she's done a great job sort
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: of chipping away at his advantage on the economy. And she's,
• 17:30
  Speaker 1: you know, leading when the question is cares about people
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: like you and fighting for people like you. If she
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: can make that the big issue in the homestretch and
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: really paint him as out of touch and her as
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: connected to people, I think that like that's her best
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: chance of putting this away. Yes, for sure. On that note,
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: there were a few bits of news to come out
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: of the interviews. On The View, and we heard this
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: in the clip, the vice president announced that she wants
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: Medicare to cover home health care, vision, and hearing. So
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: right now, if you're caring for an aging parent or
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: a relative, basically they have to qualify for Medicaid to
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: get care that allows them to stay at home and
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: to get someone to come to their home and care
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: for them. And we had that experience with my grandmother.
• 18:12
  Speaker 1: You basically have to spend your life savings in order
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: to qualify for Medicaid. And the waiting list is very,
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: very long. And so it's really, really hard for a
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: lot of seniors to be able to like stay in
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: their home and then they have to go somewhere else.
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: Or you have to, if you're the son or daughter
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: or the grandkids, then you have to care for them while,
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: and Kamala Harris pointed this out, while you're also caring
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: for your own children. She talked about the sandwich generation.
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: What did you think about the policy? Do you think
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: that was smart?
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: I think that's great. I also love that she is
• 18:47
  Speaker 3: thinking about very specific nuggets. I mean, you and I
• 18:51
  Speaker 3: lived through the Affordable Care Act unpopularity for many years, right?
• 18:57
  Speaker 3: And it felt so overwhelming to people. And it became
• 19:01
  Speaker 3: this thing that was tied to Barack Obama. So if
• 19:05
  Speaker 3: you liked him, you liked it. If you didn't like him,
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: you didn't like it. Even when it was the program
• 19:09
  Speaker 3: you were on in your state. And there was tons
• 19:11
  Speaker 3: of research that showed that. People would say, do you
• 19:13
  Speaker 3: like the healthcare you're on?
• 19:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I love it. And it was Obamacare. Do you
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: like Obamacare? I do not, right?
• 19:19
  Speaker 8: Right.
• 19:20
  Speaker 3: And I think the problem with big, huge plans and
• 19:23
  Speaker 3: talking about it as the big, huge plan is that
• 19:26
  Speaker 3: people politicize it in their minds and they don't understand
• 19:30
  Speaker 3: the nugget. And the nuggets, the Affordable Care Act became
• 19:33
  Speaker 3: more popular in part because people didn't like having something
• 19:36
  Speaker 3: taken away from them, right?
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: But also in part because- the president, Obama.
• 19:42
  Speaker 3: When we were working for him, and the team started
• 19:45
  Speaker 3: breaking down the pieces of it, right? It's like, hey,
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: your kids can be covered if they're under 25. It's like, oh,
• 19:52
  Speaker 3: they can? They don't even care what else is in
• 19:54
  Speaker 3: the Affordable Care Act. That's great if you have a
• 19:56
  Speaker 3: pre-existing condition. And so elements of this remind me of that.
• 20:00
  Speaker 3: And to your earlier point, she's better in talking about
• 20:04
  Speaker 3: the economic pieces when she's talking about the $ 6, 000 tax
• 20:08
  Speaker 3: credit if you have a new baby, right? This particular
• 20:11
  Speaker 3: piece you just explained on home healthcare, which so many
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: people deal with and navigate because it becomes real to
• 20:18
  Speaker 3: people and it doesn't make them feel like they are
• 20:20
  Speaker 3: being spat.
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: Out a pamphlet, right?
• 20:25
  Speaker 3: It's like a thing that could help me and I'm
• 20:26
  Speaker 3: for that thing.
• 20:27
  Speaker 8: Yeah.
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: And she had some, you know, she had personal experience
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: too that she talked about because she took care of
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: her mother when her mother had cancer.
• 20:33
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: Um, So she also made news on The View in
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: a way she probably didn't intend to when the hosts
• 20:40
  Speaker 1: asked this question.
• 20:41
  Speaker 6: Would you have done something differently than President Biden during
• 20:45
  Speaker 6: the past four years? There is not a thing that
• 20:49
  Speaker 6: comes to mind in terms of, and I've been a
• 20:51
  Speaker 6: part of most of the decisions that have had impact. Listen,
• 20:56
  Speaker 6: I plan on having a Republican in my cabinet.
• 20:58
  Speaker 3: Well, I got a list.
• 20:59
  Speaker 6: You asked me what's the difference between Joe Biden and me.
• 21:03
  Speaker 11: Well, that will be one of the differences.
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: So Trump and Vance unsurprisingly pounced on this. I think
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: they had an ad out this morning. There's like at
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: least one Republican House candidate has an ad on this. Obviously,
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: reporters jumped on it. She got the question again on Colbert,
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: basically punted again, saying she's not Joe Biden, but she's
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: also not Donald Trump. That got a lot of applause.
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: We talked last show about the reports that the Harris
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: folks are contemplating putting more daylight between her and Biden.
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: And there's certainly a case to be made that a
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: lot of voters want to see how she'd be different.
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: But obviously, that's a tricky balance for a number of reasons.
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: How do you think she should answer this question?
• 21:42
  Speaker 3: Um, didn't we love it when people kind of, um,
• 21:45
  Speaker 3: backseat drove when we were sitting in the White House?
• 21:49
  Speaker 3: We were like burning them an effigy in the office,
• 21:51
  Speaker 3: but let's do it anyway. Um, because I, I literally,
• 21:55
  Speaker 3: I listened to that part and I was texting with
• 21:58
  Speaker 3: the executive producer of my show about exactly this answer, right?
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 22:02
  Speaker 3: Um, because it's an obvious question you would get, which
• 22:04
  Speaker 3: is again, easy for us to say. I think to me,
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: it can be something like this. Um, I love Joe Biden,
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: and I'm so proud of what we've built together. But
• 22:14
  Speaker 3: nobody expects us to be carbon copies of each other because...
• 22:18
  Speaker 3: Challenges change. The world change. I'm going to be proud
• 22:21
  Speaker 3: to build on what we accomplished, but I am different.
• 22:24
  Speaker 3: I'm coming at it from a different perspective. And that
• 22:27
  Speaker 3: is going to be part of my guide. Well, what
• 22:29
  Speaker 3: specifically will be different? Well, I will tell you this,
• 22:32
  Speaker 3: you know, I'm somebody who went to visit an abortion clinic.
• 22:35
  Speaker 3: That's important to me. I have dealt with dealing with
• 22:37
  Speaker 3: home health care because of my mother, you know, in
• 22:40
  Speaker 3: terms of what how the policies, you know, my point
• 22:43
  Speaker 3: is like her who she is and her background is different.
• 22:47
  Speaker 3: It's like having different people and a different table to
• 22:50
  Speaker 3: make decisions. But I think there's a way to say
• 22:53
  Speaker 3: a different kind of pivot, which is like, I love him.
• 22:56
  Speaker 3: I'm going to build on that. But we're not carbon copies.
• 22:59
  Speaker 3: Don't expect it. And I come at things from a
• 23:01
  Speaker 3: different perspective. What is that gonna look like? Well, there's
• 23:03
  Speaker 3: time to figure that out. I mean, I'm not sure
• 23:06
  Speaker 3: she has to give a list of 10 things or
• 23:08
  Speaker 3: that's my take.
• 23:09
  Speaker 2: It's just sending an indication.
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: And the reason this is so important and why the
• 23:12
  Speaker 3: Trump people pounced on it is because she is more
• 23:16
  Speaker 3: of the change candidate right now when you look at
• 23:18
  Speaker 3: polling than Trump, which is a very, because the change
• 23:22
  Speaker 3: candidate is often and typically the winning candidate. And the
• 23:26
  Speaker 3: fact that she is the sitting vice president and is
• 23:28
  Speaker 3: seen as more of the change candidate is, is a
• 23:31
  Speaker 3: huge plus for her. And the Trump team wants to
• 23:35
  Speaker 3: change that. But so anyway, I don't think it needs
• 23:37
  Speaker 3: to be a list of 10 things. She's already done
• 23:39
  Speaker 3: like one slightly thing, different thing on taxes. But she
• 23:43
  Speaker 3: can just emphasize how she will build, but she's coming
• 23:47
  Speaker 3: at it from a different perspective. And she's going to
• 23:49
  Speaker 3: approach problems slightly differently.
• 23:51
  Speaker 2: And he knows that. She loves Joe. He gets that.
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I totally agree with that. I think that's a
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: great answer. I get why it's tricky because... Joe Biden's
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: unpopularity is not tied to specific decisions and policies that
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: he pushed or made, right? And that's what's so hard
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: about this. The unpopularity is tied to the broader discontent
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: with the effects of pandemic-induced inflation, right? Which he did
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: not have anything to do with. And we've been through
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: this for the last several years. So it's really hard
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: to go back and be like, And she was also,
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: as she said in one of the appearances, she's like,
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: I was part of most of the decisions. So she
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: can't go back and be like, I actually secretly disagreed
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: with him on X, Y, and Z, but I just
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: didn't say anything, right? So you're limited in what you
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: can do on that, just to be honest. I do
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: think she can say like, she can sort of like
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: break the fourth wall here and just be like, hey,
• 24:49
  Speaker 1: I realize that everyone wants me to just like, put
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: some distance between us or say something different. The truth
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: is like, we all wish we could do different things
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: if we look back at the last four years. And
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: I was in the administration too. Everyone looks back at that.
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: She's like, I'm not looking back though. I'm looking forward.
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: And that is the whole reason I'm here in the future.
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: And you know what? Joe Biden has been trying to,
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: and I have been trying to lower costs And a
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: lot of times, Republicans blocked our attempts to lower costs.
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: And so what I'm hoping to do as president is
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: to keep fighting and to keep lowering costs. And Donald
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: Trump doesn't want to do that. He wants to give
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: tax cuts to rich people. You've got to be like,
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: punch it a little bit more.
• 25:25
  Speaker 8: Yes.
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: And back to the Trump contrast. I mean, totally. The
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: Trump contrast is so key to it.
• 25:29
  Speaker 3: The other two things I think that are tricky for her,
• 25:33
  Speaker 3: in my view, is one, Joe Biden is.
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: Still the president, right?
• 25:39
  Speaker 3: And like, The whole question of where she is on
• 25:42
  Speaker 3: Israel and where she is on Gaza, he is the
• 25:45
  Speaker 3: president while there is a team trying to negotiate a
• 25:47
  Speaker 3: ceasefire deal, which doesn't look likely at this moment. But
• 25:51
  Speaker 3: you can't have the sitting vice president of the United States,
• 25:54
  Speaker 3: and I don't know what her position is on this,
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: but if she has a different one, you can't have
• 25:58
  Speaker 3: her come out with a different position than the sitting
• 26:01
  Speaker 3: president while there's a team overseas. So that's one challenging thing.
• 26:06
  Speaker 3: The other challenging thing is Obviously, there is still a
• 26:10
  Speaker 3: great deal of heartache and heartburn from a swath of
• 26:14
  Speaker 3: the party that feels deeply upset on behalf of Joe Biden, right?
• 26:18
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 26:18
  Speaker 3: Many of them are attacking you and I on Twitter currently,
• 26:21
  Speaker 3: I'm certain. And that's fine, even though I love Joe Biden.
• 26:25
  Speaker 3: We're just here to state what was happening in the
• 26:28
  Speaker 3: political discussion at the moment.
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: But that aside, she has managed this perfectly.
• 26:36
  Speaker 3: She did not push him out in any way, shape
• 26:38
  Speaker 3: or form.
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 26:39
  Speaker 3: He made the decision. She acted immediately. She does not
• 26:43
  Speaker 3: want to appear like she is pushing him and his
• 26:46
  Speaker 3: policies over the ledge.
• 26:48
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 26:48
  Speaker 2: Because she's managed that piece very well.
• 26:51
  Speaker 3: And that's another tricky piece, I think.
• 26:55
  Speaker 5: For her.
• 26:56
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: I mean, the truth of it is how she's going
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: to be different is. we're in a different time than
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: when he took office and she was vice president. And
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: where we are now is, you know, the economy has
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: bounced back, but prices are still too high and costs
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: are still too high. So her focus is going to
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: be on costs. That's what's going to be different, you know?
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: And it's not for anything that he did poorly. It's
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: just that we're in a different time period now. Yes.
• 27:16
  Speaker 3: And it's like, look back when Barack Obama was elected,
• 27:19
  Speaker 3: he was not openly for gay marriage.
• 27:20
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 27:21
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: I mean, times change, things evolve. She's going to be
• 27:25
  Speaker 3: dealing with different types of challenges as well. And that's,
• 27:28
  Speaker 3: an important thing to remember, but she's also coming at
• 27:30
  Speaker 3: things with an entirely different background, which will impact things
• 27:33
  Speaker 3: for sure.
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: Well, I just, uh, she's got that Univision town hall
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: Thursday night. Uh, I'm, I'm betting that they'll practice, uh,
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: practice another answer.
• 27:44
  Speaker 2: I hope so.
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: Fingers crossed.
• 27:47
  Speaker 2: That is one where you're like, that.
• 27:49
  Speaker 3: Is one that can be fine tuned from the first
• 27:52
  Speaker 3: time she answered the question. I think when she was
• 27:53
  Speaker 3: asked by Dana Bash about, um, changing positions, she did
• 27:58
  Speaker 3: have a different answer in 60 minutes. That was better,
• 28:01
  Speaker 3: I think, than in her CNN interview. And you figure
• 28:05
  Speaker 3: out how to answer things in a better way. It
• 28:07
  Speaker 3: doesn't mean your position changed. It just means how you
• 28:11
  Speaker 3: articulate it. That's a natural part of doing more interviews.
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: I was going to say, and that is why you
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: do so many interviews, too, because it's reps, right? It's
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: just you just keep doing it and you get better.
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: We've all been there. Yeah. Yeah.
• 28:24
  Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah.
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: I do wish they were doing more local TV. That's one.
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah. I saw she did like a Pittsburgh local
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: affiliate like a week ago, but I haven't seen much
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: since then. But I'm sure they'll do more. On her
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: Howard Stern interview, he asked about a report that emerged
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: yesterday from Bob Woodward's forthcoming book, as if we needed
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: a Woodward book.
• 28:50
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: We don't have enough content out there. It's like, I know.
• 28:55
  Speaker 6: I know.
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: I saw that yesterday.
• 28:56
  Speaker 3: I was like, where are all the podcasts?
• 28:57
  Speaker 2: How do I find them all?
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: Fuck, we have to talk about this now? So Trump's personal,
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: it's about Trump's personal relationship with Vladimir Putin, including sending
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: him COVID tests for his own use at the beginning
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: of the pandemic when it was extremely hard to get
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: COVID tests. The Trump campaign denied this. Kremlin confirmed it today.
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: Let's listen to her answer on this.
• 29:18
  Speaker 4: So I actually said it even in the debate.
• 29:21
  Speaker 6: I believe that Donald Trump has this desire to be
• 29:28
  Speaker 6: a dictator.
• 29:29
  Speaker 4: He admires strongmen.
• 29:32
  Speaker 6: And he gets played by them because he thinks that
• 29:35
  Speaker 6: they're his friends.
• 29:37
  Speaker 4: Yeah. And they are manipulated.
• 29:40
  Speaker 6: Him full-time and manipulating him by flattery yeah and with
• 29:46
  Speaker 6: favor and so in the midst to your point as
• 29:51
  Speaker 6: reported by bob woodward in the height of the pandemic
• 29:54
  Speaker 6: and remember and your listeners will remember people were dying
• 29:57
  Speaker 6: by the hundreds yeah Everybody was scrambling to get these kits,
• 30:03
  Speaker 6: the tests, the COVID test kits.
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: Couldn't get them.
• 30:07
  Speaker 4: Couldn't get them.
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 30:07
  Speaker 4: Couldn't get them anywhere.
• 30:08
  Speaker 8: Right.
• 30:09
  Speaker 6: And this guy who is president of the United States
• 30:12
  Speaker 6: is sending them to Russia to a murderous dictator for
• 30:15
  Speaker 6: his personal use? When he was talking about Americans should
• 30:19
  Speaker 6: be putting bleach in their blood. That is just the
• 30:22
  Speaker 6: most recent stark example of who Donald Trump is.
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: She seemed genuinely... offended and upset by that, which I liked.
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: Oh, first of all, can.
• 30:33
  Speaker 3: Also, that is the question anyone would have asked her
• 30:38
  Speaker 3: from any major outlet. Can we just, I mean, and
• 30:42
  Speaker 3: that answer is a great answer. She would have given
• 30:45
  Speaker 3: no matter who asked the question, but actually he asked
• 30:48
  Speaker 3: it in a way that teeter up maybe in a
• 30:51
  Speaker 3: way to be even more impassioned about it.
• 30:53
  Speaker 1: Um, yes.
• 30:55
  Speaker 3: I mean, her point is, The manipulation point is such
• 30:59
  Speaker 3: an interesting one. And it made me think like, I mean,
• 31:02
  Speaker 3: SNL has been doing so many good things about this
• 31:04
  Speaker 3: presidential campaign right now. They have the best people playing them.
• 31:08
  Speaker 3: An amazing skit would be Vladimir Putin, Netanyahu, the head
• 31:13
  Speaker 3: of the Heritage Foundation, the people who pick Supreme Court
• 31:17
  Speaker 3: justices just sitting around licking their traps about how they
• 31:21
  Speaker 3: can manipulate Donald Trump.
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: If he is elected.
• 31:24
  Speaker 3: Because that's how they all look at it, right? This
• 31:27
  Speaker 3: is a person who's the vehicle for me getting my
• 31:30
  Speaker 3: thing done.
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: And it's a great response to the people who are like, well,
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: Trump's kind of crazy, but maybe it's good that he's
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: crazy because everyone's going to be afraid of him. And,
• 31:39
  Speaker 1: you know, like I talked to a friend who actually
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: said that to me, who is voting for Harris, but
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: was like, you know, you do have to admit, you know,
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: Trump's a little crazy and on the world stage, maybe
• 31:49
  Speaker 1: that helps. And I was like, no, it doesn't help.
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: Because all these other fuckers are smarter than him. These
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: other dictators. And they are playing him all the time.
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: And it's going to be more dangerous because they're getting
• 32:00
  Speaker 1: exactly what they want because he's dumb. When you have
• 32:02
  Speaker 1: a dumb, unfit person as your president, it doesn't matter
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: if he's crazy. If he's dumb, they're going to be
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: able to take advantage of him.
• 32:08
  Speaker 3: It is so I mean, the others, we're just going
• 32:10
  Speaker 3: to I'm just we're just going to keep offering talking
• 32:12
  Speaker 3: points to the Harris team and they're.
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: Going to be so.
• 32:16
  Speaker 3: Thrilled and delighted by that. But the other thing and
• 32:18
  Speaker 3: I've talked about this a little bit on my show
• 32:20
  Speaker 3: is like dictators are not strong.
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: They are weak.
• 32:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah, they cannot be democratically elected. They need to control
• 32:28
  Speaker 3: the media. They need to control anybody who is their opponent.
• 32:31
  Speaker 3: That is why Donald Trump likes them, because they control
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: things and you only have to control things if you're weak.
• 32:39
  Speaker 3: And that's a sign of his own weakness, not.
• 32:41
  Speaker 4: Strength, actually.
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: I think she really nailed that point. All right, let's
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: talk about Trump, the candidate who's clearly hiding from tough
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: questions and real journalists. His media appearances the last few
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: days have been with Trump supporters and right-wing networks. Ben Shapiro,
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: who's hosted a fundraiser for Trump. Hugh Hewitt, who ended
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: his interview by telling him to come back after he's
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: president again. Laura Ingraham, who shills for him every night.
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: And Newsmax, which just settled a defamation lawsuit for spreading
• 33:06
  Speaker 1: Trump's election lies. One interview Trump was too scared to do,
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: 60 Minutes, which he backed out of last minute. The broadcast,
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: which was a special episode that was supposed to feature
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: both candidates, started with Scott Pelley reading texts and emails
• 33:19
  Speaker 1: from the Trump campaign that confirmed his appearance, followed by
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: an explanation for why he canceled. Let's listen.
• 33:26
  Speaker 12: Vice President Kamala Harris and former President Donald Trump accepted
• 33:31
  Speaker 12: our invitation. But unfortunately, last week, Trump canceled. The campaign
• 33:37
  Speaker 12: offered shifting explanations. First, it complained that we would fact-check
• 33:42
  Speaker 12: the interview. We fact-check every story. Later, Trump said he
• 33:47
  Speaker 12: needed an apology for his interview in 2020. Trump claims
• 33:53
  Speaker 12: correspondent Leslie Stahl said in that interview that Hunter Biden's
• 33:58
  Speaker 12: controversial laptop came from Russia. She never said that. Both
• 34:03
  Speaker 12: campaigns understood this special would go ahead if either candidate
• 34:08
  Speaker 12: backed out.
• 34:11
  Speaker 3: First of all, Scott Pelley's voice is so great.
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: So 60 Minutes.
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: It's so 60 Minutes. It's so awkward.
• 34:18
  Speaker 3: Those texts are just uncomfortable.
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: I mean, do you think this like, does this matter?
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: I mean, I do think it probably doesn't. I don't
• 34:27
  Speaker 1: know if it matters to voters, although I hope it does.
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: But at least the media, which has been like Harris
• 34:35
  Speaker 1: hiding from the press. I mean, like Donald Trump has
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: just ducked 60 minutes, backed out last minute, won't do
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: the next debate, and has just been like retreating to
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: his safe space of right wing interviewers.
• 34:50
  Speaker 3: I mean, first of all, I also hear the talking point,
• 34:53
  Speaker 3: which is another one I hate. Well, this is the
• 34:56
  Speaker 3: Donald Trump strategy, just doing interviews with people who reach
• 34:59
  Speaker 3: bigger audiences.
• 34:59
  Speaker 2: You're like, He's doing interviews with, like, white nationalists. And, like,
• 35:03
  Speaker 2: it's a little bit different, okay? So let's just start there.
• 35:07
  Speaker 2: I don't know that it matters.
• 35:09
  Speaker 3: I wish that it would be a point that would
• 35:13
  Speaker 3: make media or people who are analysts question this. Harris
• 35:18
  Speaker 3: isn't out there enough. She is out there a ton.
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Point.
• 35:23
  Speaker 3: I'm not sure entirely if it will. The other point
• 35:26
  Speaker 3: that I hear over and over again that, again, we're
• 35:28
  Speaker 3: just going to debunk here.
• 35:29
  Speaker 2: Is J.D.
• 35:30
  Speaker 3: Vance has answered hundreds of questions or whatever the point is.
• 35:33
  Speaker 3: You're like, have you listened to him answer the questions?
• 35:35
  Speaker 3: Because this is what he does. He says, oh, we're
• 35:37
  Speaker 3: going to hear out their question. And they may ask,
• 35:40
  Speaker 3: you know, what do you think of Donald Trump lying
• 35:43
  Speaker 3: about hurricane relief funds? And he'll say, that's a ridiculous
• 35:47
  Speaker 3: question or whatever. He's not answering the questions. He's using
• 35:50
  Speaker 3: them as a tool.
• 35:52
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: Oftentimes.
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: He's also he's also the least popular. candidate on either ticket.
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: So that's what his press strategy has done.
• 36:00
  Speaker 3: Yes, that is true, too. I don't know that it's
• 36:03
  Speaker 3: going to matter. I don't think it matters. I don't
• 36:06
  Speaker 3: know that the like number of media interviews anyone is
• 36:09
  Speaker 3: doing ever really matters to voters, just like nobody cares
• 36:12
  Speaker 3: if candidates or presidents do press conferences.
• 36:15
  Speaker 6: They should.
• 36:15
  Speaker 3: It is not a thing voters are moved by. I
• 36:18
  Speaker 3: think it's more the content of what's popping out of these.
• 36:22
  Speaker 3: And I listened when you guys talked about this the
• 36:24
  Speaker 3: other day. And the point that often people miss is
• 36:26
  Speaker 3: it's like it's not just the interview. It's the content
• 36:29
  Speaker 3: from the interview, right? Like what's on Instagram, what's on
• 36:33
  Speaker 3: Tik TOK, what videos are on YouTube that are being
• 36:36
  Speaker 3: pushed out. And that video of Harris answering the question about, uh, whether,
• 36:42
  Speaker 3: you know, Sarah, how could be Sanders question, right? Sarah
• 36:45
  Speaker 3: Sanders point about her not being humble. My girlfriends from college, uh,
• 36:51
  Speaker 3: were sending that around, they were like, I don't even
• 36:53
  Speaker 3: know what this podcast is. I'm going to listen to
• 36:55
  Speaker 3: the whole episode, right? I mean, that's the kind of thing, right?
• 37:00
  Speaker 3: Obviously you want people to just not listen, just listen
• 37:02
  Speaker 3: to the episode. You want them to also register and
• 37:03
  Speaker 3: then vote, but there, there has a, so that's why
• 37:06
  Speaker 3: it matters. But I don't, I don't, I don't actually
• 37:08
  Speaker 3: think people care if Donald Trump does 60 minutes or not.
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: Well, here's what he sounded like in all of the
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: interviews that he did do. We got some, we got
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: some highlights. Here we go.
• 37:17
  Speaker 5: Okay. This is not a presidential She's answering questions in
• 37:20
  Speaker 5: the most basic way and getting killed over it. And
• 37:25
  Speaker 5: every time she does an interview, she sounds like a child.
• 37:28
  Speaker 5: She sounds like a person with a very low IQ. Actually,
• 37:32
  Speaker 5: now that you're mentioning it, I think they should do
• 37:34
  Speaker 5: a double 25th Amendment. Get them both out. Who's third
• 37:38
  Speaker 5: on line? The name fake news, I was very proud
• 37:42
  Speaker 5: of it. But now it just isn't strong enough. It
• 37:46
  Speaker 5: is just so corrupt. And I call it corrupt news. Now,
• 37:50
  Speaker 5: a murderer, I believe this, it's in their genes. And
• 37:54
  Speaker 5: we got a lot of bad genes in our country
• 37:56
  Speaker 5: right now. They are illegal immigrants as far as I'm concerned.
• 38:00
  Speaker 5: But you don't tax the rich.
• 38:01
  Speaker 3: How will you restore faith in our justice system, a
• 38:05
  Speaker 3: lot of people will say, well, he's just going to
• 38:08
  Speaker 3: do to them what they did to him.
• 38:10
  Speaker 2: And get back at them.
• 38:12
  Speaker 8: A lot of people say that's what should happen. You
• 38:14
  Speaker 8: want to know the truth.
• 38:15
  Speaker 5: I have a hard time doing it to them because
• 38:18
  Speaker 5: I'm basically a truthful person.
• 38:22
  Speaker 9: But frankly.
• 38:29
  Speaker 3: The laughing when he says I'm basically a truthful person.
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: Basically, it's Donald Trump. He's basically a truthful person. Basically.
• 38:35
  Speaker 2: I mean, I love when Sean Hannity, was that Laura Ingraham?
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: Laura Ingraham, yeah.
• 38:41
  Speaker 2: And she was sort of.
• 38:42
  Speaker 3: Trying to like hand him a softball there. I mean,
• 38:44
  Speaker 3: it was a warped, messed up softball. Or when the
• 38:48
  Speaker 3: times when Sean Hannity tries to like help him out.
• 38:51
  Speaker 2: And it's like he just died. He just can't even
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: handle the.
• 38:55
  Speaker 3: The easy tee up.
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: That was one of three times. She went back twice
• 38:59
  Speaker 1: to like try to help him and be like, say
• 39:02
  Speaker 1: that he's not going to take revenge on his political opponents.
• 39:05
  Speaker 2: Some people are saying that's what should happen.
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: He refused to do it. He's going to do it.
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: That was like a serious, I mean, in there was
• 39:11
  Speaker 1: him saying like, oh, you don't want to tax the rich.
• 39:14
  Speaker 1: Like there were so many things in there in that
• 39:16
  Speaker 1: small compilation that would like sink a normal campaign and,
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: And I don't know. I mean, I'm still under the, like,
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: I still believe the more Trump we hear, the better
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: it is. I don't know what you think.
• 39:30
  Speaker 2: I agree. And this is a debate that's been going
• 39:35
  Speaker 2: on for years, right?
• 39:36
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 39:37
  Speaker 3: And I feel like maybe a year ago I hit
• 39:40
  Speaker 3: this point where I was like, you know what? When
• 39:42
  Speaker 3: you listen to him, it is so crazy bananas off
• 39:46
  Speaker 3: the wall with problematic positions.
• 39:49
  Speaker 8: Yep.
• 39:49
  Speaker 3: It's much more effective for people to listen to it themselves,
• 39:54
  Speaker 3: which is why I think, one, she keeps saying, watch
• 39:57
  Speaker 3: his rallies, watch his rallies. That was her answer in
• 39:59
  Speaker 3: 60 Minutes when it was like, what do you think
• 40:01
  Speaker 3: of him not doing it? She was like, well, I
• 40:02
  Speaker 3: guess people are going to have to watch his rallies, right?
• 40:04
  Speaker 3: Many people watch his rallies.
• 40:06
  Speaker 2: But also.
• 40:08
  Speaker 3: If you just play, and we do this a lot,
• 40:11
  Speaker 3: and you guys, it's like you just play what he
• 40:13
  Speaker 3: just said. It's like, I'm not going to saying wash.
• 40:15
  Speaker 2: It for you.
• 40:16
  Speaker 3: I'm not going to explain it.
• 40:17
  Speaker 2: That's what that was.
• 40:19
  Speaker 3: And beyond his hugely problematic positions on a range of
• 40:23
  Speaker 3: issues and xenophobia and racism, he sounds unhinged and also incoherent.
• 40:31
  Speaker 5: Yes.
• 40:31
  Speaker 1: And I think that's the most important takeaway for voters
• 40:34
  Speaker 1: who haven't decided because, you know, I think in 16
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: when he was first on the scene, it was like,
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: listen to what he says. Isn't that offensive? Isn't that
• 40:40
  Speaker 1: going to sink him? And then it wouldn't sink him
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: because people were like, eh, yeah, it was offensive, but whatever.
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: But when you hear him now, it's different because he
• 40:48
  Speaker 1: sounds so crazy. He just sounds crazy.
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: Well, crazy.
• 40:53
  Speaker 3: And also like, even if I were trying to follow you,
• 40:56
  Speaker 3: even if you were talking about things that I agreed with,
• 40:59
  Speaker 3: I'd be like, I'm a little concerned here because it's like,
• 41:05
  Speaker 3: Even if you were saying the child tax credit should
• 41:07
  Speaker 3: be extended, but then he went into sharks versus being electrocuted.
• 41:11
  Speaker 2: You're like, I don't know.
• 41:16
  Speaker 3: I like the child tax credit thing, but the sharks
• 41:18
  Speaker 3: and electrocution thing, that's real concerning.
• 41:20
  Speaker 2: Or Hannibal Lecter. I mean, whatever it may be, there's
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: a million examples.
• 41:23
  Speaker 6: I know.
• 41:24
  Speaker 1: In terms of his media strategy, to the extent that
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: there may be a media strategy, it does seem like
• 41:30
  Speaker 1: the difference is She's going on all these shows and
• 41:33
  Speaker 1: some of them are friendly. Some of them are, you know,
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: tough questions. Some of them are just really smart, substantive questions.
• 41:39
  Speaker 1: But she seems like she's at least going to end
• 41:41
  Speaker 1: up reaching a bunch of persuadable voters because she's not
• 41:45
  Speaker 1: going on just the just the lefty stuff. And she's
• 41:47
  Speaker 1: not doing just, you know, shows that high engaged voters
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: pay attention to. But with Trump, it seems like he's
• 41:54
  Speaker 1: doing like a pure turnout based strategy. With with these,
• 41:59
  Speaker 1: which which may work for him because he's had fantastic
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: turnout in 2016 and again and even higher in 2020
• 42:05
  Speaker 1: for his base. But it seems like, you know, they're
• 42:07
  Speaker 1: looking for low propensity young men. And so he's doing
• 42:10
  Speaker 1: some of those podcasts. But then other than that, it's
• 42:12
  Speaker 1: just like turn out the base kind of stuff.
• 42:14
  Speaker 8: Yeah.
• 42:15
  Speaker 3: I mean, I think part of it is also he
• 42:18
  Speaker 3: knows that his ceiling is low.
• 42:21
  Speaker 2: They know that.
• 42:22
  Speaker 12: Yeah.
• 42:23
  Speaker 9: And so.
• 42:25
  Speaker 3: And the potential for expanding that is, is low and
• 42:28
  Speaker 3: they're not running any strategy that seems like they have
• 42:30
  Speaker 3: any intention of trying to expand, at least not from him.
• 42:33
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 42:34
  Speaker 3: So part of it is destroy her, um, reduce voter turnout,
• 42:39
  Speaker 3: suppress voters so that I will have more, I think
• 42:44
  Speaker 3: is part of the strategy. The other thing I'm betting,
• 42:46
  Speaker 3: and I don't know, I'm not in the Trump preps for,
• 42:49
  Speaker 3: or the Harris preps, any of the preps, but I've
• 42:52
  Speaker 3: prepped a lot, or I've tried to convince a lot
• 42:54
  Speaker 3: of people running for office to do interviews.
• 42:56
  Speaker 2: And everybody, you approach it differently.
• 42:58
  Speaker 3: My bet is that, and do you remember that quote
• 43:02
  Speaker 3: that was on background? This also drove me crazy. I'm
• 43:04
  Speaker 3: getting a lot off my chest today.
• 43:05
  Speaker 1: I like that.
• 43:06
  Speaker 3: From somebody who once worked for her that was like,
• 43:08
  Speaker 3: you have to go in there prepared and have read
• 43:10
  Speaker 3: all the materials and give her a reason for doing something.
• 43:13
  Speaker 3: It's like, no shit. That is what you do for
• 43:16
  Speaker 3: anybody who is president or running for president.
• 43:19
  Speaker 2: I mean, what? That's the baseline. But but I.
• 43:22
  Speaker 3: Also it made me think that we used to go in,
• 43:25
  Speaker 3: especially the last couple of years when we when, you know,
• 43:28
  Speaker 3: post Dan Zach Galifianakis amazingness, we started to do more
• 43:32
  Speaker 3: and more things like that. We would go into the
• 43:34
  Speaker 3: Oval Office with one slide to President Obama and we'd say,
• 43:37
  Speaker 3: here are the things I think we think you should do.
• 43:40
  Speaker 3: And a lot of them would be off the wall things.
• 43:43
  Speaker 5: Right. Right.
• 43:43
  Speaker 3: And he'd say, why? And we'd say, because this reaches
• 43:48
  Speaker 3: this group of people who care deeply about criminal justice
• 43:50
  Speaker 3: reform and you're going to care. And it's like this
• 43:53
  Speaker 3: thing is, you know, and I think my bet is
• 43:55
  Speaker 3: that she requires and demands that as well, which forces
• 43:59
  Speaker 3: the system to really think about what they're proposing to
• 44:02
  Speaker 3: her and make sure it has a purpose. Whereas Trump, again,
• 44:06
  Speaker 3: I don't know. My bet is he might be like,
• 44:08
  Speaker 3: who's that guy who said I was good at the rally?
• 44:11
  Speaker 3: Let's go on his show.
• 44:12
  Speaker 2: Like, it might be like that. I don't know. It's
• 44:14
  Speaker 2: very possible.
• 44:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think some of it is like comfort food
• 44:17
  Speaker 1: for him, right? Like, let him go and make him
• 44:19
  Speaker 1: feel comfortable with whoever he wants. And some of it,
• 44:21
  Speaker 1: like that podcast, that last clip where they were all
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: laughing at him, it's called the Flagrant Podcast. It's just
• 44:27
  Speaker 1: like Andrew Schultz, he's a comedian. And so I'm guessing
• 44:30
  Speaker 1: it's like this... Someone in the campaign is thinking like
• 44:33
  Speaker 1: young male demographic go on those pods. But the Shapiro
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: Ingram stuff is just that is comfort food for him.
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: And it's just a combo.
• 44:41
  Speaker 3: I mean, this is the important thing, I think, also
• 44:44
  Speaker 3: for people to remember. You know, one, we're optimistic, but nervous.
• 44:48
  Speaker 3: Whatever we say, the combo of things is here because
• 44:50
  Speaker 3: it's all very close, which I know drives people crazy.
• 44:52
  Speaker 2: But it is true is that as.
• 44:54
  Speaker 3: Much as Trump is a loony tune who says scary,
• 44:58
  Speaker 3: crazy stuff and it's incoherent. His campaign is actually running
• 45:03
  Speaker 3: ads that are quite disciplined on the same topics of
• 45:07
  Speaker 3: crime and immigration online and on TV everywhere. And I'm
• 45:12
  Speaker 3: not saying that is going to win him the election,
• 45:15
  Speaker 3: but it is there is a level of discipline that
• 45:19
  Speaker 3: is below him that I think is important for people
• 45:22
  Speaker 3: to remember.
• 45:22
  Speaker 1: Yes, for sure. Because and that's and that's one reason
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: why it's so close, I think. One last clip I
• 45:27
  Speaker 1: want to get your reaction to did not tell you
• 45:29
  Speaker 1: about in advance.
• 45:31
  Speaker 5: That's all right.
• 45:31
  Speaker 1: It is from my now good friend, Jesse Waters, interviewing
• 45:37
  Speaker 1: one of my successors in the White House, Stephen Miller.
• 45:42
  Speaker 9: We're getting a lot of texts from women about Miller
• 45:46
  Speaker 9: and his appearances and his appearance. Our audience at Primetime
• 45:50
  Speaker 9: believes you're some sort of sexual matador.
• 45:53
  Speaker 1: What do you have to say for yourself?
• 45:55
  Speaker 9: Well, let me give advice to any young man that's
• 45:58
  Speaker 9: out there. I'm married now. I have children, but I
• 46:00
  Speaker 9: wasn't married that long ago.
• 46:01
  Speaker 1: I was single. I was in the market.
• 46:03
  Speaker 9: If you're a young man... It's very important in election season.
• 46:06
  Speaker 9: Who's looking to impress ladies, to be the alpha, to
• 46:09
  Speaker 9: be attractive. The best thing you can do is to
• 46:12
  Speaker 9: wear your Trump support on your sleeve. Show that you
• 46:15
  Speaker 9: are a real man. Show that you are not a beta, right?
• 46:19
  Speaker 9: Be a proud and loud Trump supporter and your dating
• 46:23
  Speaker 9: life will be fantastic. I cannot wait to see the text.
• 46:28
  Speaker 2: Tonight.
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: Jen, my question is, do you find it hard to
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: resist Stephen Miller's sexual energy?
• 46:37
  Speaker 3: First of all, I'm like breathing into a paper bag
• 46:40
  Speaker 3: over here because that was... First of all, he didn't
• 46:43
  Speaker 3: even say beta.
• 46:44
  Speaker 2: Beta?
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: Beta?
• 46:47
  Speaker 3: You know, I wouldn't say that somebody who seems to
• 46:51
  Speaker 3: wake up in the morning trying to kick immigrants out
• 46:55
  Speaker 3: of the United States is like the person.
• 46:57
  Speaker 2: Who I would be most drawn to. I don't know
• 47:00
  Speaker 2: who these texts are coming from. Are they Stephen Miller's mom?
• 47:03
  Speaker 2: Are they like... I mean, I have bots. I do
• 47:07
  Speaker 2: not know. I'm to each his own.
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: But I will say to like for a guy who's
• 47:13
  Speaker 1: into race science and genes and all that shit, you know,
• 47:18
  Speaker 1: he's not he's not he's not a good poster boy for.
• 47:21
  Speaker 6: No, no.
• 47:23
  Speaker 3: I would be hard pressed to find anyone who that
• 47:26
  Speaker 3: person is his type, even if he even if they
• 47:29
  Speaker 3: are a Trump supporter.
• 47:31
  Speaker 1: I mean, while while that he was while that he
• 47:33
  Speaker 1: was on the market for so long.
• 47:36
  Speaker 2: Listen, at least.
• 47:37
  Speaker 3: Jesse Waters has good hair, as you know, because you
• 47:39
  Speaker 3: guys bonded.
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: Because we're tight now. That was Stephen Miller. Terrible person,
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: terrible speechwriter.
• 47:47
  Speaker 2: But apparently a sexual matador.
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: But a sexual matador. That's it. When you think of
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: Stephen Miller, that's what you think of. Jen Psaki, thank
• 47:54
  Speaker 1: you so much for joining Positive America again.
• 47:57
  Speaker 5: Thank you.
• 47:57
  Speaker 2: It was great to be here.
• 47:58
  Speaker 1: This was so fun.
• 47:59
  Speaker 2: It was fun.
• 48:00
  Speaker 1: Come back again and hopefully all our nervous energy.
• 48:06
  Speaker 2: Optimistic and nervous.
• 48:08
  Speaker 1: I like that.
• 48:08
  Speaker 2: And matadors.
• 48:09
  Speaker 1: And matadors. All right. Thanks, Jen. When we come back
• 48:13
  Speaker 1: from the break, I'm going to be talking with New
• 48:14
  Speaker 1: Hampshire's Joyce Craig, the Democratic candidate in the closest and
• 48:17
  Speaker 1: most crucial governor's race in the country. But two quick
• 48:21
  Speaker 1: things before we get to that. The Supreme Court has
• 48:23
  Speaker 1: just started its new term, and if you want to
• 48:25
  Speaker 1: understand the madness, you need to be listening to Strict Scrutiny,
• 48:28
  Speaker 1: where our friends the brilliant and hilarious legal scholars Melissa Murray,
• 48:31
  Speaker 1: Kate Shaw, and Leah Lippman break down every case and
• 48:34
  Speaker 1: every decision. Listen to Strict every Monday wherever you get
• 48:36
  Speaker 1: your podcasts, and now you can watch on YouTube as well. Also,
• 48:40
  Speaker 1: last week, Stacey Abrams stopped by Pod Save America to
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: talk about all the new voting restrictions we need to
• 48:44
  Speaker 1: watch out for. But she's not just a guest. She's
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: now a Crooked host. So go check out the latest
• 48:49
  Speaker 1: episode of Assembly Required, where she and Ari Berman keep
• 48:52
  Speaker 1: the conversation going about voter access. New episodes of Assembly
• 48:55
  Speaker 1: Required drop every Thursday. You can listen wherever you get
• 48:58
  Speaker 1: your podcasts. And finally, we are recording this at 11 a.m.
• 49:02
  Speaker 1: Pacific time in Hurricane Milton. unfortunately looks like it's about
• 49:06
  Speaker 1: to wreak absolute havoc on Florida, hoping everyone in the
• 49:09
  Speaker 1: area is safe and that everyone else is doing what
• 49:12
  Speaker 1: you can to help. One easy way to do that,
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: head to votesaveamerica.com slash relief. We have already raised over $ 100, 000
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: so far for victims of Helene and Milton. So let's
• 49:22
  Speaker 1: keep that going. When we come back, Joyce Craig. Joining
• 49:37
  Speaker 1: us in studio today, the Democratic candidate in the nation's
• 49:40
  Speaker 1: closest race for governor, the former mayor of Manchester, New Hampshire,
• 49:44
  Speaker 1: Joyce Craig. Welcome to Pod Save America.
• 49:46
  Speaker 11: It's great to be here, John. Thank you.
• 49:49
  Speaker 1: Got my Dunkin' Donuts.
• 49:50
  Speaker 5: Nice.
• 49:51
  Speaker 1: Just for you. You are running in the country's most
• 49:54
  Speaker 1: competitive race for governor, basically Democrats' only chance to flip
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: a governorship. It still hasn't gotten much national attention with
• 50:01
  Speaker 1: everything else going on. For people who are just tuning
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: into this race... What should they know about why it's
• 50:07
  Speaker 1: so important for New Hampshire to have a Democratic governor again?
• 50:11
  Speaker 10: So, John, you said it. It is the number one
• 50:14
  Speaker 10: flip opportunity for a governor's race this cycle. And we
• 50:18
  Speaker 10: know that governors right now are making serious decisions when
• 50:21
  Speaker 10: it comes to, you know, freedoms and opportunities for residents
• 50:25
  Speaker 10: in our country. And in New Hampshire, there is so
• 50:28
  Speaker 10: much on the line. Reproductive freedom, housing crisis to address,
• 50:33
  Speaker 10: public education crisis.
• 50:35
  Speaker 11: And so much more.
• 50:36
  Speaker 10: And I'm running against someone who has a record of,
• 50:40
  Speaker 10: you know, basically doing everything they can to decrease reproductive
• 50:45
  Speaker 10: freedom in our country and so much more. And so
• 50:49
  Speaker 10: there's a lot on the line this election. Kelly Ayotte
• 50:52
  Speaker 10: has voted multiple times for a national abortion ban. She
• 50:55
  Speaker 10: has voted multiple times to defund Planned Parenthood. you probably
• 50:59
  Speaker 10: recall that she shepherded Neil Gorsuch through the Supreme Court
• 51:03
  Speaker 10: process and then celebrated when Roe v.
• 51:05
  Speaker 11: Wade was overturned.
• 51:06
  Speaker 10: So, you know, reproductive health care is on the ballot
• 51:09
  Speaker 10: in New Hampshire, and we need to do everything we
• 51:11
  Speaker 10: can to protect that.
• 51:12
  Speaker 1: So I want to get into all that. Even though
• 51:15
  Speaker 1: I'm from Massachusetts, I'm a big New Hampshire guy. We
• 51:18
  Speaker 1: talked about this earlier, but for folks who don't know,
• 51:20
  Speaker 1: my dad and his very large family are from Manchester,
• 51:23
  Speaker 1: where you were mayor. My uncle was the chief of
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: police there. A few of my cousins are still state
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: troopers there. And my grandfather was actually a Republican state
• 51:30
  Speaker 1: rep in the legislature way back before the Republican Party
• 51:34
  Speaker 1: became a cult of Trump. But I'm interested in like
• 51:36
  Speaker 1: how the politics of the state have changed over the
• 51:39
  Speaker 1: last several years. So New Hampshire has Democratic senators and
• 51:43
  Speaker 1: House members, has voted for the Democratic presidential candidate for
• 51:46
  Speaker 1: the last two decades now, but currently has a barely
• 51:49
  Speaker 1: Republican controlled legislature and one of the most popular Republican
• 51:53
  Speaker 1: governors in the country who you're running to replace. What's
• 51:57
  Speaker 1: your best guess as to why that is and how
• 52:00
  Speaker 1: has it shaped your campaign?
• 52:01
  Speaker 10: Yeah, I mean, New Hampshire is a purple state and
• 52:04
  Speaker 10: we take pride in making sure we are understanding who
• 52:07
  Speaker 10: is running for these elections. And you said it, you know,
• 52:10
  Speaker 10: we've had a popular governor, a Republican governor for the
• 52:13
  Speaker 10: last eight years. He's not running. So we have a
• 52:16
  Speaker 10: tremendous opportunity this cycle to flip that seat. And the
• 52:19
  Speaker 10: last time we had a Democratic governor was with Maggie Hassan.
• 52:24
  Speaker 10: You know, in terms of the House, very, very close
• 52:27
  Speaker 10: to your point. And so this race that we're running
• 52:29
  Speaker 10: right now is not only to win back the governor's seat,
• 52:32
  Speaker 10: but it is to bring back majorities in the statehouse
• 52:36
  Speaker 10: because things are so close and we have a tremendous
• 52:38
  Speaker 10: opportunity to do so. residents in New Hampshire have seen
• 52:43
  Speaker 10: the extreme threats that Republicans have, you know, shown in
• 52:47
  Speaker 10: the state of New Hampshire. And I feel like a
• 52:49
  Speaker 10: lot of these things have really, you know, flown under
• 52:52
  Speaker 10: the radar. You know, we talked a little bit about
• 52:54
  Speaker 10: reproductive freedom. Governor Sununu just signed a very restrictive bill
• 52:59
  Speaker 10: when it comes to voting that's going to be coming
• 53:02
  Speaker 10: into the, not my election, but the next election that
• 53:05
  Speaker 10: basically says you have to show a photo ID when
• 53:09
  Speaker 10: you vote. And you need proof of citizenship when you register.
• 53:13
  Speaker 10: So really, really restrictive. No one's talking about that, right?
• 53:17
  Speaker 10: Reproductive freedom is under attack. Gun violence prevention strategies. We
• 53:22
  Speaker 10: need common sense gun violence prevention strategies in New Hampshire.
• 53:26
  Speaker 10: You know, you can do concealed carry without registering. My opponent,
• 53:31
  Speaker 10: Kelly Ayotte, as a senator, voted against universal background checks
• 53:36
  Speaker 10: after 20 children were shot and murdered at Sandy Hook
• 53:40
  Speaker 10: Elementary School. And so, you know, this is what New
• 53:43
  Speaker 10: Hampshire has become. And it's why it's so important that
• 53:47
  Speaker 10: we elect a Democratic governor and Democrats in the statehouse
• 53:51
  Speaker 10: and the state Senate to make sure we are enacting
• 53:54
  Speaker 10: common sense laws to protect our freedoms.
• 53:57
  Speaker 1: I forgot that Ayotte voted against the background checks, which
• 54:01
  Speaker 1: was a bill that negotiated by Joe Manchin and conservative
• 54:06
  Speaker 1: Republican Senator Pat Toomey. And I remember it was one
• 54:09
  Speaker 1: of the most frustrating moments for Barack Obama in the
• 54:13
  Speaker 1: White House that that bill failed, especially after Sandy Hook.
• 54:16
  Speaker 1: And it was just outrageous.
• 54:17
  Speaker 11: It is absolutely outrageous.
• 54:19
  Speaker 1: So last time we heard from Kelly Ayotte, she was
• 54:24
  Speaker 1: announcing that she wouldn't be voting for Trump in the
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: 2016 election because of the Access Hollywood tape. She went
• 54:30
  Speaker 1: on to narrowly lose her Senate seat. Trump, of course,
• 54:33
  Speaker 1: went on to win the presidency and then fomented a
• 54:36
  Speaker 1: violent insurrection after he failed to overturn the 2020 election.
• 54:39
  Speaker 1: Now he's running again. And Kelly Ayotte says, quote, he's
• 54:42
  Speaker 1: the right choice for the White House. What do you
• 54:45
  Speaker 1: think happened there? And how much do you see her
• 54:49
  Speaker 1: support for Trump mattering in your race?
• 54:52
  Speaker 10: I think it matters a lot. It just shows her character, right?
• 54:56
  Speaker 10: I mean, 2016, she said he's unfit to be president.
• 55:01
  Speaker 10: And so right now, she is saying anything she can
• 55:04
  Speaker 10: to be elected. And we can't trust Kelly Ayotte, right?
• 55:07
  Speaker 10: She's just saying anything, doing anything. But it says a
• 55:11
  Speaker 10: lot about who she is. There's no way that Donald
• 55:15
  Speaker 10: Trump is fit to be our next president.
• 55:18
  Speaker 8: None.
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: I want to talk about your very popular current governor,
• 55:22
  Speaker 1: Chris Sununu, who has like, he's very popular, but he's
• 55:24
  Speaker 1: followed the same playbook. He has called Trump an asshole,
• 55:28
  Speaker 1: a coward, fucking crazy. And too old to form a
• 55:31
  Speaker 1: cogent thought without a teleprompter. All direct quotes. But he's
• 55:35
  Speaker 1: voting for him, he says, because of inflation. What do
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: you make of that?
• 55:38
  Speaker 11: You know, I wish I could. It's fucking crazy.
• 55:42
  Speaker 1: It is crazy.
• 55:43
  Speaker 11: So, you know, it doesn't make any sense.
• 55:46
  Speaker 10: He worked so hard for Nikki Haley. And then, like,
• 55:50
  Speaker 10: she lost. And two days later, he's fully supporting Donald Trump.
• 55:53
  Speaker 11: It makes no sense. It doesn't make sense.
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: You talked about reproductive freedom. So under current New Hampshire law,
• 55:58
  Speaker 1: abortion is legal through the first six months of pregnancy.
• 56:01
  Speaker 1: And in the last three months, if there are fetal
• 56:04
  Speaker 1: anomalies or medical emergencies, Kelly Ayotte says she supports that
• 56:07
  Speaker 1: law and wouldn't change it. Why shouldn't New Hampshire voters
• 56:10
  Speaker 1: believe her?
• 56:11
  Speaker 10: Because she has spent her entire career attacking reproductive freedom,
• 56:16
  Speaker 10: voted for a national abortion ban, voted to defund Planned Parenthood.
• 56:20
  Speaker 10: You know, in New Hampshire right now, Republicans have defunded
• 56:23
  Speaker 10: our reproductive health centers, including Planned Parenthood. And she has
• 56:26
  Speaker 10: said already, if she's elected, she would continue to defund them.
• 56:31
  Speaker 10: The Neil Gorsuch thing, she's celebrated Roe v. Wade being overturned.
• 56:37
  Speaker 10: We can't trust what she is saying. Her record shows otherwise.
• 56:41
  Speaker 10: My mom growing up, she always used to tell me,
• 56:43
  Speaker 10: your actions speak louder than your words. And in this case,
• 56:48
  Speaker 10: Kelly Ayotte's actions absolutely speak louder than her words, and
• 56:51
  Speaker 10: we cannot trust her.
• 56:53
  Speaker 1: This is obviously a personal issue for you, as it
• 56:56
  Speaker 1: is for so many women and families around the country.
• 56:58
  Speaker 1: You wrote an op-ed about having to get a DNC
• 57:01
  Speaker 1: after you miscarried. What would you do as governor to
• 57:05
  Speaker 1: protect reproductive freedom? Anything different than current law or policies?
• 57:09
  Speaker 6: Absolutely.
• 57:09
  Speaker 10: New Hampshire is the only state in New England that
• 57:12
  Speaker 10: hasn't codified access to abortion. And so what we saw
• 57:15
  Speaker 10: this session was that Republicans actually put forward a very
• 57:20
  Speaker 10: restrictive bill, a 15-week abortion ban. Thankfully, they didn't pass.
• 57:26
  Speaker 10: But until we codify access to abortion into law, we
• 57:30
  Speaker 10: will continue to see this attack on reproductive freedom. And
• 57:33
  Speaker 10: so I am committed to working with our House to
• 57:36
  Speaker 10: codify access to abortion and to you know, increase access
• 57:40
  Speaker 10: to reproductive health care. Because again, New Hampshire has fallen
• 57:43
  Speaker 10: far behind other states around us in terms of providing
• 57:47
  Speaker 10: the medical services that are needed.
• 57:50
  Speaker 1: Cost of living, huge issue in this race, like it
• 57:52
  Speaker 1: is in most races, especially the cost of housing, which
• 57:54
  Speaker 1: has reached record highs in New Hampshire. Ayotte has described
• 57:58
  Speaker 1: her approach as build, baby, build. How would you describe
• 58:01
  Speaker 1: your approach and how is it different than hers?
• 58:04
  Speaker 10: So I have put forward a very comprehensive plan to
• 58:06
  Speaker 10: address the housing crisis in New Hampshire. And as mayor,
• 58:09
  Speaker 10: it's actually something that I tackled as well. And in Manchester,
• 58:12
  Speaker 10: we now have over 2,000 housing units in development. I
• 58:15
  Speaker 10: had allocated over $ 30 million toward affordable housing initiatives. And
• 58:20
  Speaker 10: we broke ground this past December on one of the
• 58:22
  Speaker 10: largest affordable housing developments in the entire state. So I've
• 58:26
  Speaker 10: negotiated with developers, incentivized housing, and understand the challenges that
• 58:30
  Speaker 10: that our local communities are facing. I've been on the
• 58:33
  Speaker 10: front line of this and made progress. All while Kelly
• 58:37
  Speaker 10: Ayotte has made millions of dollars sitting on the corporate
• 58:40
  Speaker 10: board of Blackstone. That is like literally, you know, jacking
• 58:43
  Speaker 10: up rents and pushing people out of their homes.
• 58:46
  Speaker 1: Buying up housing.
• 58:47
  Speaker 11: Exactly.
• 58:48
  Speaker 10: It is like the total opposite of what we need
• 58:51
  Speaker 10: in leadership in the state of New Hampshire.
• 58:54
  Speaker 11: And it is a joke. We do need to build.
• 58:57
  Speaker 10: We need to build now the projection statewide or that
• 58:59
  Speaker 10: we need 60,000 housing units by 2030, but I'm the
• 59:03
  Speaker 10: only person in this race who knows how to get
• 59:05
  Speaker 10: it done and I'm committed to doing it.
• 59:07
  Speaker 1: You recently said that you would legalize the use of
• 59:10
  Speaker 1: recreational marijuana in order to help make housing more affordable,
• 59:13
  Speaker 1: improve education, avoid a broad sales or income tax in
• 59:16
  Speaker 1: New Hampshire. In response to your plan, Ayotte said, quote,
• 59:20
  Speaker 1: Joyce Craig can smoke her way to a balanced budget,
• 59:23
  Speaker 1: but I'm going to do it the old-fashioned way. My
• 59:24
  Speaker 1: question is, how does one smoke their way to a
• 59:27
  Speaker 1: balanced budget?
• 59:28
  Speaker 4: Who knows?
• 59:29
  Speaker 10: And I'll add, she has never done a budget. When
• 59:33
  Speaker 10: she was at the Senate, they didn't pass a budget.
• 59:36
  Speaker 10: As mayor, I had to build budgets, $ 400 million for
• 59:39
  Speaker 10: the city of Manchester. I understand what it takes. And
• 59:42
  Speaker 10: to your point, I would veto a sales or an
• 59:44
  Speaker 10: income tax. We are seeing a decrease in revenues in
• 59:47
  Speaker 10: the state of New Hampshire. This is going to be
• 59:49
  Speaker 10: a challenging budget. And she wants to give tax breaks
• 59:53
  Speaker 10: to millionaires like herself in the state of New Hampshire.
• 59:57
  Speaker 10: She's not focused on what's right and decreasing costs for
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 10: hardworking families in.
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 11: The state of New Hampshire.
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 1: So even though my dad's side of the family is
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 1: from New Hampshire, I was born and raised in Massachusetts,
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 1: which is why the most personally offensive part of Kelly
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 1: Ayotte's campaign has been her adoption of the slogan, Don't
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 1: Mass Up New Hampshire. She's also accused you of wanting
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 1: to make New Hampshire more like Massachusetts and Do the
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 1: good people of New Hampshire have something against your southern
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 1: neighbors or.
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 11: What's going on there?
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 10: They do not.
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 11: They do not. It is, again, it's really one of
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 11: these crazy things.
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 10: You know, I'll just add, though, I'm a fourth generation
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 10: resident of New Hampshire and running for governor of New
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 10: Hampshire to make the lives of people in New Hampshire better.
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 9: Right.
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 11: And we know there's a lot we can do. We
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 11: talked about it.
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 10: And, you know, I look forward to working with governors
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 10: in New England to make sure we are focusing on
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 10: things that we can do together to help residents and
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 10: businesses in New Hampshire. And, you know, we're hearing from
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 10: businesses in our state now, you know, pushing back on
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 10: Kelly Ayotte because tourism is a huge thing in New Hampshire. And,
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 10: you know, you've got people from Massachusetts saying, well, I'm
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 10: not welcome there. I'm going to go somewhere else.
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 11: And that's that's wrong.
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 1: And I've had a lot of family and friends move
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 1: up to southern New Hampshire. I spent my summers at
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 1: Hampton Beach up in North Conway in the White Mountains.
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 1: So yeah, no, New Hampshire is great for tourism.
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 10: Yeah, I used to work in Massachusetts, took the bus
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 10: there from Manchester. And a lot of people do that.
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 10: And we've got to be welcoming.
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 11: This is not, it's baloney.
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 1: It's very Trump era Republican Party. Finally, very important question.
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 1: Puritan backroom. What is your chicken tender order?
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 10: I do traditional, but I do like the coconut. I
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 10: do want to mention, though, while I was mayor, I
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 10: signed a proclamation that identified Manchester as the chicken tender
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 10: capital of the world.
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 11: I hope you know that.
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 1: For people who don't know, I did not know that.
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 1: For people who don't know, the chicken tenders at the
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 1: Puritan Back Room are maybe the best I've ever had anywhere.
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 1: What is in that duck sauce? And like, why can't
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 1: I find it anywhere?
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 11: You can order it.
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 1: Okay. I might order some of that duck sauce now.
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 1: That's a good idea. Joyce Craig, thank you so much
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 1: for coming on Pod Save America. Good luck in your
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 1: race for governor. Where can people go if they want
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 1: to help out?
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 11: Joycecraig.org.
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 10: I really appreciate the opportunity to be here. This is
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 10: a critical race. And if you can help out with fundraising,
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 10: it would be tremendously helpful.
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 1: All right. Thanks, Mayor Craig. Good luck.
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 11: Thank you.
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 1: That's our show for today. Thanks so much to Mayor
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 1: Joyce Craig for joining and thanks to Jen for guest hosting.
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 1: Dan and I will be back in your feed on
• 1:02:39
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  Speaker 1: Madeline Herringer is our head of news and programming. Matt
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 1: DeGroat is our head of production. Andy Taft is our
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  Speaker 1: executive assistant. Thanks to our digital team, Elijah Cohn, Haley Jones,
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  Speaker 1: Phoebe Bradford, Joseph Dutra, Ben Hefcote, Mia Kelman, Molly Lobel,
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  Speaker 1: Kirill Pelleviv, and David Toles. Hey, listeners, it's Jon Favre.
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  Speaker 1: I want to make sure you know that Slate's award-winning podcast,
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  Speaker 1: Slow Burn, is back with a new season today. titled
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  Speaker 1: The Rise of Fox News, hosted by Josh Levin. This
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  Speaker 1: season looks at the early years of the Fox News
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  Speaker 1: channel when it went from bumbling to seemingly invincible, the
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  Speaker 1: moment Fox really became Fox. During the 2000 election, Fox
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  Speaker 1: News would captivate the nation and change the fate of
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  Speaker 1: American democracy forever. And it's a perfect listen leading up
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  Speaker 1: to this year's election. You'll hear from Fox insiders who
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  Speaker 1: have never spoken out before, sharing some shocking details about
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  Speaker 1: their time at Fox News, And you'll hear from the
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  Speaker 1: activists and comedians like those at The Daily Show who
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  Speaker 1: tried to stop it. Trust me, you do not want
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  Speaker 1: to miss this season. That's Slow Burn, The Rise of
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  Speaker 1: Fox News. Follow and listen now wherever you get your podcasts.