Latest / Sasquatch & Sourdough / Ep. 38 | Haunted New England: Ghosts, Legends & Lost Places with Joe from Trails, Tales, and Taverns

Transcript

Ep. 38 | Haunted New England: Ghosts, Legends & Lost Places with Joe from Trails, Tales, and Taverns · Sasquatch & Sourdough

• 0:19
  SPEAKER_00: New England is a region steeped in history where every hill, forest, and crumbling building seems to carry whispers of the past.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_00: From shadowy figures on moonlit trails to ghostly ships flickering on the horizon.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_00: These lands are rich with tales of the strange and unexplained.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_00: I've spent years exploring these forgotten corners, not just reading the legends, but walking in the trails, touching the walls, and standing where history and mystery collide.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_00: This book is my journey into the places that haunt our imagination, where the line between fact and folklore blurs.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_00: Lace up your boots, grab a flashlight, and join me as we delve into the heart of New England's haunted, historic, and hidden places.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_00: From Tales, Trails, and Taverns.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_01: Awesome.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_01: You got it right the first time.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_00: I've got it right.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_00: I actually wrote it down phonetically because I did not want to like redo that.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_00: So welcome.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome, Joe.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_00: I'm so happy to have you on here.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_00: I have stalked you on Instagram for about a year now, and we've talked about a collab.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_01: We have for a while now.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks for having me on.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_01: This is awesome.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_00: And it's I know I'm so excited.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_00: And it's happening.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_00: And that intro, well, forward rather, is from your book, Haunted New England.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_00: Guys, I'm honing it up.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_00: Go buy this book because not only is it filled with all kinds of awesome history and kind of like a narrative of Joe's experiences, but also if you buy one, um, I think he'll do a bunch of push-ups on Instagram, which is fun.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_01: That's what I've been doing.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_00: So um, yeah, it's uh I I absolutely, well, that kind of made me like that was a catalyst of like, yeah, all right, it should just buy the book.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_00: But I also love like, I don't know, New England to me just I don't know.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_00: I just think of Cape Cod because I know you're from Cape Cape Cod.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_01: From Cape Cod, yep.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_00: So I think of that automatically, but I also think of like, especially around this time of year, like I feel like fall and all the spooky stuff happens in New England first and then like trickles down.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_01: Do you find that I mean we've got the most beautiful fall season here in New England.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_01: Everywhere from Maine to Connecticut, everything looks absolutely gorgeous.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_01: When the leaves start turning and the crisp bear starts blowing it off the ocean, it's it's amazing.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's it's a great place to spend fall if you have it at some point.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_00: That's just like what I think of.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_00: And then I just think of like, of course, now I'm in like pumpkin spice mode.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_00: So I just think of all that sort of stuff.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_01: Never mind that.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_01: The entirety of New England is mostly haunted, the whole place.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_00: Like not Yeah, exactly.
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just gonna talk about fall foli foliage and like pumpkin spice.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_00: That's where I go.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_00: But it is basically haunted, yeah.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_00: I know.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_01: And I was I was telling my son that you know, we start getting pumped up for fall season.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, oh, you know, BF Clyde's gonna be open again.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_01: That's the the the cider mill that's over in um in Mystic, Connecticut.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_01: And he's like, Oh, that's a place the the cider, right?
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_01: The cider donuts, yeah, the cider donuts, the cider cups, the you know, all the different apple cider, my jugs of hard cider that I buy there every year.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we have places like that around here, but it's not, I feel like I don't know, it's not as cool as you guys have it in New England for some reason.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know what it is.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_00: I just think of like cozy New England sweater towns, but I might just be watching way too much like Lifetime.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_01: I just think of crabs when I think of Maryland, but the I mean the ocean.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_01: You guys are right out there.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm in so I'm in Baltimore, and we do have I mean, we have all the fun, like Baltimore sort of legends and stuff like that.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, crabs, definitely.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_00: And you guys have lobster, right?
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, lobster's big in New England, yeah.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_00: And I don't like lobster.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_00: My son does.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_00: My 10-year-old just discovered lobster.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_01: Oh yeah.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_00: And he just he thinks it's like the cool, he's like, this is so much better than crabs.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, oh well.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_00: Don't excuse me.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, my kid loves my kid loves shrimp now, all of a sudden the last few months.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_01: He he'll be uh he'll be 10 in November.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, okay.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, nice.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, oh my son is a November baby too.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: So nice.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I know 10's fun.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_00: These crazy gen alphas, they're gonna like rule the world.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_00: It's gonna be amazing.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_00: I can't wait.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_00: So I told you when um when we were like in pre-roll that I have kind of a little surprise.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_00: I like I love when this happens naturally.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_00: It kind of it's really cool because sometimes I try to just do like a fun like icebreaker.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but this is so cool.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_00: So I stalked to you on Instagram a little bit earlier today, and I saw that you just like you did an episode with um Shell from Shell Spooky Stories, who we love over here.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_00: She is just totally crushing it.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um I like just I love her.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_00: She's just doing amazing.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_01: She gave me a huge boom.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_01: She gave me a huge bump in my uh my download numbers on my podcast, even though we haven't recorded anything all summer.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_01: We got a huge spike after she put her episode out.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_01: So thank you.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_01: But that's you're great.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_00: I know.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_00: Shell, we love you.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_00: She'll come back.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_00: I know.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_00: She's so great.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_00: But so one of her, like one of your guys' like reels or whatever, it said, um, you were talking about that you have um a relative that was in um like had electroshock therapy.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_00: I do too.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_01: Really?
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_00: We have that in common.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_00: And I thought that's the weirdest thing to ever have in common with someone you've never met.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_01: That is kind of weird, yeah.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_00: What?
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I've only I only learned about that within the last year or two, too.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_01: I had no idea about that.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_00: It's crazy.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_00: And it was your grandmother?
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_01: It was my grandmother, yeah.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_01: And this was after she passed that I even found out about it.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_01: My aunts finally started to open up about the stuff that she went through when she was younger, you know, when they were young.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_00: That's crazy.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it takes a while for family to kind of open up about stuff that, you know, is a little hush-hush when they're alive, but Well, especially in that time.
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_00: Like how so like when what year was she born?
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_00: Do you know?
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_01: She was 95, would you pass?
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_01: Or I wanna say like teens or twenties, something like that.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_00: Back in those days, they didn't do, I mean, you didn't talk about anything.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_00: And especially like, you know, the kind of I guess I don't want to say like boomer generation, but like like my parents, like they didn't talk about stuff.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_00: You don't talk about like those things.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_00: So my my relative, so we live in, so we're like in Baltimore and every year we go to the Renaissance festival, like the Maryland Renaissance Festival is in a place called Crownsville.
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_00: And so to get there, like you go, you just it's just this little town, um, kind of right off of it's like right outside of like kind of an like Annapolis, I guess you'd say.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and so to get there, you have to go past, it's like called the Crownsville, I don't know if it's like sanitarium, but it was a it was a hospital.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_00: And it's so crazy because the first year that we went, I told my mom like where the Renaissance festival was.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_00: And you have to imagine, like, I'm all dressed up, like ready to go, like drink tankards and like you know, be all jolly and like a fairy.
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_00: And my mom's like, oh yeah, well, that Crownsville Hospital, we had um, I had an aunt that uh was there and they used to do like electroshock therapy on her.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_00: Like they shaved her head, and like she's like painting this terrible picture of like this place.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_00: And when you drive by there now, it's totally abandoned.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_00: So it's like not in operation or anything like that.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_00: But I was like, okay, that's kind of freaky.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_00: Like, because my mom was, you know, you had a figure, she was visiting her in like the 60s, so it's not, you know.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_01: Because a lot of these places, a lot of these sanatoriums and and asylums, especially in New England, they didn't close till the 90s or the early 2000s.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_01: Like these places are still in operation when I was a kid, you know, when I was when I was young.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_01: And there's even some places.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um, there's one I want to say in Connecticut where a bunch of the buildings are abandoned, but it's still an active hospital.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_01: There's still a bunch of buildings that are being used and function as you know, as a hospital today.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_00: That's just uh, I don't know.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_00: That's actually one place when I drive by, I'm like, oh, this is creepy.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if it's because of the relational aspect of it or if it's just like it's probably just knowing, you know, that terrible stuff happened there.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I I don't know.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's just a terrible way of treating somebody for a mental illness, but that's just that's just me.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_01: One of the um one of the places I went to, I went to um Brattleboro, Vermont, and there's a place called the Retreat Hospital, and there's a tower up on the hill that I want to say in the 1860s, they actually had the patients, they decided that hard work was good for mental health.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_01: And so they had the patients build a tower, and it's it's this massive hundred-something foot tower up on top of this hill.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_01: And apparently what happened was they built the tower, they worked, you know, months and months, built a tower, and then a bunch of them just started going up the top of the tower and throwing themselves off afterwards.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh, that's the way that's a good thing.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_01: And so this tower is still sitting the hospital is still used there.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_01: I I went to the campus and was walking around.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't realize I was going to an active hospital.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_01: I went, you know, I saw the tower, which is very cool.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_01: It's super neat to see.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's got a weird vibe to it.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_01: It's way up on the hill and it's locked, you can't get into it.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_01: But then I went down to where the hospital was down by the river, and there's people all over the place and signs that say, you know, no pictures, don't, you know, no phone picture, no nothing.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_01: Don't do this, do that, and walk here, walk there, all that stuff.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_00: Ugh.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_00: That's what an awful history that is.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_01: Here, do some work.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, great.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_01: Now we have some ways to you know end our suffering.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_00: Just like free labor.
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_00: That's awful.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_00: That's so terrible.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_00: We when I was in high school, we went to um so it was when oh what was the movie?
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_00: House on Haunted Hill.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: I think it was when House on Haunted Hill Yeah, the remake came out.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_00: And we went to like and I which I loved.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_00: I actually haven't watched that in a long time, but that's a really good movie.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we went to there's this place called Rosewood, like sanitarium in Maryland.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_00: And we were in high school and it was like a bunch of us.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_00: And of course, I was like, you know, not impressed goth girl that was like, You guys are lame.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_00: And when we went, it was like perfect, like this is a like classic stormy night.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_00: We drove, like, you know, we weren't supposed to be there, we're trespassing.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_00: There's all kinds of signs that say like no trespassing.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_00: And we finally like break in, and everyone's got flashlights.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm just like, okay, we're gonna get in trouble.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_00: Like at first, I was like, this is like stupid, but then I was like, this is kind of like we're really gonna get in trouble here.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_00: And there's also like asbestos signs.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I'm being rational.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_00: Dude, we get in there, and it's like all of this old hospital, like really like the really high chairs and stuff like that.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_00: Like, it looked like it was from the 40s.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_00: And my this guy who was like the ringleader, this guy, Steve, was like, look under the bed.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_00: That's the ball they played with.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_00: Like, look, you know, like it was so ultra blind.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_00: Come on, come on, right.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, guys, meanwhile, don't touch anything or bring it home with you.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_00: Like, cause there were broken records and stuff.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_00: Like, so that was like kind of creepy.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_00: But then when I looked at the paperwork that was everywhere, it's like it's like kids with special needs.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_00: And like, you know, at that time you would say, like, probably, you know, that they had whatever.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not gonna say the R word, but like, you know, they had special needs and they were like handicapped.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, this is awful.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_00: Why are we here?
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_00: We're this is I was like, I want to leave.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_00: Like, this is this is not the spooky thing that you promised us, but yeah, I feel like I don't know.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_00: Do you do you ever get that sensation?
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_00: Because I know you do a lot of, I wouldn't say like it's not really like urban exploring, but you do a lot of abandoned places.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_00: Do you kind of like do a process with that?
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_00: Like, do you read the history first or you just kind of hear about it and wing it?
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_01: So with the with the abandoned places with the urban exploration stuff, that's more raw than it is me.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um he usually likes to go there, explore it, then look up the history and get to, you know, kind of understand, like, oh, I went here, I went there.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_01: And um, his daughter is also um, she can she's sensitive in that.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_01: So she sees things, she she'll see spirits and she'll have things come up to her and talk to her.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_01: And and there's been a couple of times where she's seen something and he's gone back and started doing the research on it and found stories about it and like actually connected you know the the research and the history and the ghost stories to what she's seen while she was there.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_01: Oh that's so it's been there's been a couple really creepy things that that have happened as far as that's concerned.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_01: Um, yeah, so so his thing is usually like go there first, check it out, um, do the research, and then go back because usually what happens is he'll do the research and find out I only saw like a third of the place, or I only saw you know so many buildings and there's this many more.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_01: And if I checked it out, if I'd stayed a little longer, I would have been you know, found more stuff.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_01: So he usually a lot of the places he'll go two or three times and kind of figure that stuff out as as he goes.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_01: And he also he gets together with a bunch of other urban explorers as well.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_01: So he's he's met people who do this, you know, other urban explorers.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_01: And uh just kind of learned from them and they'll tell him where to go, they'll tell him, you know, they'll they talk to each other about how to get into places.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, that's cool.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's easier to get into, it's not easier to get into, you know, stuff like that.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_01: I've gone on a couple of them with him, but um, I'm really anxious about going into places where it's like no trespassing.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_01: I'm so I'm so anxious about him.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_01: Like it just drives me nuts.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_01: I I I don't like doing I won't I pretty much won't do it by myself.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_01: Like I just can't bring myself to do it alone.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_00: There's a lot of I mean, there's kind of a I think a mix, like kind of like a split feelings about it.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_00: Like some, I think I don't know necessarily like in paranormal circles, circles, but like in just in comment sections that I've read, you know, where people are urban exploring, there's like kind of I guess they have their own sort of like set rules where it's like you really don't go to like certain places.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_00: Like I just I would feel weird in general, I think in in that vein of like, not so much I don't want to get in trouble, but it's just like, I don't know, like leave it alone, you know?
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_00: Because people vandalize, I think it's like that intention of like if you're gonna vandalize or stuff like that, at least in Baltimore City, and some of the pages I've gone through where it's just like, okay, everyone found this hot spot and then people went and trashed it.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_00: It's not even like you went and took pictures, it's just like now it looks trashy.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_01: So and there's a lot of them that gatekeep just for that reason, like to keep other people from going in there and trashing it, like kids going in there trash, you know.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_01: They always say teenagers, you know, to go in there and mess everything up.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um definitely, but then there's also been the times where we gone into places.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, we went into one of the buildings that was at uh Norwich State Hospital, and we got up to the second floor, and then walked into this back room, and it was clear that there was somebody had been living there for a while.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_01: I don't have no idea if he had been there 10 minutes before or if he'd been there several months before, but like it was clear somebody was living there, and so it was like, all right, let's not go in there.
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, Rob brings his daughter, and her daughter had a friend of hers with us, so we got a couple teenage, you know, young, preteen, teenage girls, and it's like I understand you want to touch their stuff, like you want to go and see what this is, but just leave this shit alone, you know?
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_01: Don't mess with their stuff, and then the same thing happened at safe, yeah.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, be safe, you know, and then the same thing, something similar happened at Fort Tabor.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_01: We went uh to New Bedford, there's Fort Tabor Fort Rodman, and one of the old one of the old batteries is still there, and you can go in it, and there's a bunch of different rooms.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_01: It's very cool to see.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_01: And we went in there with a bunch of people.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_01: Uh it was like a couple other urban explorers, and then their kids.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_01: And um, we walk around the corner in this one room and there's a tent there.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like all the kids want us, all the kids want to see the tent.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: They want to walk up to the tent.
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, what if this if there's somebody sleeping?
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like, leave the tent alone.
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_01: Just don't go near the tent.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_01: That's somebody's stuff.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_01: It it doesn't matter if he's homeless or well, what his thing is, just leave him the hell alone.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_01: We don't want we don't want alterations with people, we don't want somebody who's uh you know, offers medication or something.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_01: You know, we don't want somebody who's like trying to protect their stuff.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_01: Um stuff happens, weird stuff happens, especially with uh people who are down to luck and and living in places like this.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like they're probably uh not going to be friendly if you walk in and you start messing with their stuff, you know what I mean?
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_00: No, that makes total sense.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_01: That's the most that's what really gets me anxious about going to places like this.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_00: I just want to I want to go places that safety.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_01: I like to go I like to go places that people go to all the time, you know, like parks or you know, woods or trails, stuff that people go to all the time, but don't realize that there's a dark history.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_01: Don't realize that there's ghost stories and don't realize that it's got a tragic past and kind of dig into that and find out, you know.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_00: I like that better.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_00: I'm I'm with you.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_00: I'm with you.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_01: Like, oh, this is what I experienced, and this is how you can go there.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_01: This is what you could see while you're there.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_00: Like, that's exactly what we're saying.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_01: We kind of we kind of can't when we're talking about you know, urban exploration and going into places that are no trespassing, like we gotta do the whole hey, do as I say and not as I do.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_01: So do not go into this place, but here's what you'll find if you do go into this place, right?
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, I totally get that.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so okay, tell me, I wanna I want to hear, I think I have a I have a suspicion, but I want to hear like your favorite like kind of woods story from your book.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like, tell me one of the best ones that's in there.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, um probably one of the good ones is one of the first times, probably the first time that I went deliberately hiking in the Bridgewater Triangles when we went to Freetown St.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_01: Forest.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_00: I knew that was gonna be it.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_01: This is this is when um this is when me and Rob like first started hiking together.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_01: Like because I was down in North Carolina for 10 years.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_01: Me and Rob served in the Marine Corps back in 2007.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_01: We served in Iraq, and then you know, I moved in North Carolina.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_00: Well, thank you for your service.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_01: And so I moved uh I moved to North Carolina for 10 years and then came back, and you know, I I got back and I got into hiking back up in New England.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I hiked all the time in North Carolina too, but um, I got back into a new New England, was going all over Connecticut and Rhode Island, and Rob was like, oh hey, I uh you know, I I hike all the time.
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_01: We should we should meet up and hike.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, I was like, Yeah, you know, you live near Bridgewater, you know, near Freetown.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I want to go hiking in that area.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_01: Like I I want to see that stuff.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_01: You know, that's obviously everybody knows everybody who's in the paranormal field knows that Bridgewater triangle is kind when it comes to uh to haunted places.
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_01: So he goes, Oh yeah, I gotta I got a place to show you.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, come on up.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_01: We get up there and we go off on this trail, and it's just like it's not a parking lot, it's like a gate on the side of the road, and it's just like a small little pull-off.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_01: So we get off there, we hike about a mile down the trail, and we jump off the side of the trail, and he's like, he's like, All right, we're here, and I see like a little gravestone.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, what the hell is this?
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_01: And he's like, This is the pet cemetery, this is the old Fall Runner Pet Cemetery.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_01: And I started looking around, I see one of the graves looks like it's empty, like there's like there was something in it, but now it's gone.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_01: So I I made a joke.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, ah, it looks like this one got up, like got away, you know.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_01: And he's like, he goes, Yeah, he goes, look around, man.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_01: He's like, This that's why, uh, that's why they shut the pet cemetery down, is back in the 80s during the satanic panic, people were burying their pets here, and Satanists and people who want to do weird stuff with them started digging up all the pets and doing rituals and stuff with them.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_01: So as I'm walking around, like the place is massive.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_01: Like it at first it just looked like one little spot, but as you start to look around, you realize that the woods are just full of grave sites, like full of gravestone spreading out all over the place.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_01: Uh and about 90% of them are all dug up.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like there's a there's a stone, there's a headstone, and there's a hole almost every single one of them.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_01: So disturbing.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_01: And it's disturbing.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_01: And of course, now I'm mad.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, what the hell is wrong with people?
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_01: They're gonna dig up somebody's pet, like and then you know, the other thought is like, what kind of demon are you gonna summon with fluffy?
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like, what you're you're not gonna get, you're not gonna get a powerful demon with a little white cat.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_01: That somebody loved dearly.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_01: I don't really know what you were trying to do, but it's probably more like I don't know, using like bones for things.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I would imagine.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_00: Probably the witchcraft type stuff.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_00: Right, exactly.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_00: Like, or whatever, let me make a necklace.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes it's probably like more like Dares 2.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: I would imagine, but it's still absolutely awful.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, they were like they stopped, they stopped using it in 1989.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_01: I think they closed it down and stopped burying pets there.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_01: You know, and I'd seen one gravesite gravestone day at like 1977 and then didn't have a burial date.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, are they still alive?
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_01: And he was like, no, no, no, they should they shut the place down after.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_01: Oh man, after somebody like bought the somebody bought a very elaborate headstone and bought a plot for their poor dog or cat and uh and never got they had to bury them somewhere else, you know.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_01: Because of selfish, selfish Satanists or witches.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_01: Whatever was doing it.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_00: That's insane.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I thought that would be one of like I read that and I was like, this is gross.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_00: Like, but it I wouldn't put it past something that I would find.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_00: Like there's a trail around here that where there's people now, it's it does neighbor a cemetery, but I went completely back in the back and like off trail away from the cemetery and found an actual grave with like a grave marker, but no actual like indentations on it.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_00: So that's kind of something that I just can't.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_00: It's one of those things that I'd have to go to like a historical society or something.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_01: And I I found stuff like that in North Carolina too.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_01: I'll I'll talk about that after it finishes up with the hike in in Freetow.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh, yeah.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_01: So after after we went to the pet cemetery, after we did our whole thing with that, we kept hiking, and he took me God, it was I think we did like seven miles that day.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_01: And so, like a few miles, a few miles later, we come to this kind of crossroads, like there's two just paths that cross in the middle of across in the middle of the woods, and there's a tree right in the middle of this intersection.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_01: And uh we walk up and he stops, so I stop, and I I put my hand on the tree, not knowing what the hell it is, and he goes, This is it.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, this is this is what?
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_01: And he goes, This is where they found uh Mary Lua Ruder's body in 1978 tied to the tree with her head off and surrounded by all our stuff and like a cultish type thing.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, oh my god.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my gosh.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_01: And so it sort of was this this 15-year-old girl went missing in September and it wasn't found for a month, I think.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_01: And then a couple of dirt bikers found her at this tree tied up, and it the guy who did it, they caught him pretty quick.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_01: But the guy who did it like put all her stuff in sort of a um makeshift, he wanted to do like a ritual type thing because he wanted to he kind of wanted he wanted to blame it on the Satanists and kind of take the heat off of him, I guess, is what he was trying to do.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_01: So it wasn't it wasn't actual satanic ritual, which that did happen out there, but yeah, that was something totally different.
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_01: And so while we were there, I got a couple pictures of the tree.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like I I got a couple pictures as we were walking around.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_01: We just kind of he was telling me the story, and I was just stapping pictures here and there.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_01: And um later on I had taken those pictures, and there was this app on TikTok that was somebody was using to like see ghosts essentially.
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_01: And it was like a uh AI app and it would take your pictures and it would change it to like sort of an AI drawing.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_01: But if there was what they were saying was if there's a ghost in a room, then the AI would put a ghost in the picture, would put a person in the picture.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, okay, I see.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_01: And so later on, I didn't have service while I was out there, so later on I took that picture, those pictures of the tree, and I I kept putting them through this AI app thing on TikTok.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_01: Every single time I put this picture in that app, it developed a woman at the base of the tree.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_00: That's crazy.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_01: It never did not put a woman at the base of this tree.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, okay, well, that's uh that's weird, but maybe it's the app, you know?
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_01: And so I decided like maybe it just it took that tree and it just kind of looked like a, you know, just decided to put a woman there.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe it always does that.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_01: So the next time I was out hiking it, I found a tree that looked really similar to it on the trail, like a bear tree open in the middle of the trail.
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_01: I took a couple pictures of that one, and I started running through the app later on, didn't do it every single time.
• 26:39
  SPEAKER_01: Did it like half the time, you know?
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_00: Was it like the same figure or no?
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_01: No, it was it was always different.
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, like okay, I got you.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_01: It wasn't like the same figure or whatever, but it was just with that tree with the Mary Learuda tree, every single time there was a woman at the base of that tree, every time I developed it through that app.
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_01: Weird as shit.
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, is there a lot of lore?
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_00: So where so that part of the forest, is that like where is that, I guess, connected to like can you paint a picture of like the actual like tri is it like in the triangle?
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_00: Like, how does that work like where it is?
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_01: Freetown state forest is on the southern edge of the tribe, the Bridgewater Triangle.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_01: I think it goes from like it goes from Lakeville to Fall River and then north towards Bridgewater.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_01: And then Taunton, the city of Taunton is kind of right in the middle of it.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_01: And so Freetown State Forest is sort of like the the bottom end of the triangle, and then the Hawke Mock swamp is the northern point of the triangle, essentially.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_01: And so Freetown State Forest is like a Yeah, and uh Freetown State Forest is like a 5,000, 6,000 acre forest, and it's the old they they the locals call it the reservation or the res because it's the Wampanoag reservation area.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_01: It's all Native American land.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_01: So they've got a bunch of they've got a bunch of stuff out there.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um yeah.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_00: Are there any um I don't I don't even know if I like saying it?
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_00: Uh like any like weird Native American things like SWs out there.
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_01: So um yeah, one of the uh one of the hikes we did was outside the top of the Asonic Ledge.
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_01: And there's there's a legend about a wampanoag princess or something that was waiting on her lover who died during a war, and she so she went to the top of the Asonnet ledge and jumped off and killed herself when he died in the battle or whatever.
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_01: And now people find they claim to see the a woman in white standing atop the Sonic ledge, and then the overwhelming urge to throw yourself off sometimes happens.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_01: People who have up on the ledge.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, geez.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_01: When you get up on top of the ledge, yeah.
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_01: Apparently, there's sometimes people are people who have no ill will towards themselves who don't want to harm themselves at all, will get up to the top of the ledge and have the the overwhelming urge, like the the depression and the the urge to throw themselves off of the off of the cliff, yeah.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_00: So that's that that's that phenomenon.
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_00: I I yeah, I I don't think I wouldn't get too close to the cliff because I'm like super afraid of heights, but like that whole like phenomenon that people have, like that experiencing that is linked to like a demonic sort of like yeah, whispering or oppression.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_00: So I mean, that probably makes sense in that area.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_00: If there was a lot of I mean, you know how it goes.
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_00: If there's a lot of bloodshed, iniquity, like all that stuff on the land, it's just gonna resonate in the atmosphere.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and there was a lot of bloodshed in that.
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_01: That's where the majority of the King Phillips war happened was in the Freetown St.
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_01: Forest, the Hakamuk swamp in that area.
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I remember hearing somebody say, like, you know, it might have been the battle, it might have been all the name where all the negative energy comes from and all the paranormal stuff happens because that, but they're like, but what if there's something darker that's been there longer, and that's why the battle happened there?
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_01: Let's why more bloodshed happened there.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_01: Like, is that is that an area that's because even the natives before before the colonial call uh showed up, Hakamack swamp was it's the spirit swamp or something, or the the swamp of the spirits or something like that.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_01: I I don't remember exactly what it is.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_00: I'm probably fucking it up, but it's no, it's I mean that that like complete tracks in general.
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I have a theory.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_00: We talk about this like all the time in like this like fringe space.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I really believe that the Native Americans were fighting something before anybody came over here.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, because I mean that they've been here, I mean 10,000.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_00: Not themselves, like an actual spiritual battle, like something there was stuff here that they just totally had to deal with.
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I mean, obviously, I don't have any proof of that, and it's just this is all for entertainment purposes, but you know, like I mean, it kind of the more you dig into history, which I'm sure you know, like that's just kind of what happens.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_00: You're just like, wait a second, they weren't just killing each other over like land and tribal stuff.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_00: There's actual and there's stuff that when you talk to Indians, they won't talk about, which is why I said S.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_00: There's places, which is why I said SW.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_00: Like, yeah, I don't I don't like saying that word, but we don't have to bring any of that stuff into it.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_00: But because I feel like that caused a lot of attention to those kind of spirits.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I definitely believe that, but yeah, and and I mean that's that happens in other places in New England.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, Bennington Triangle is a good example of it involved in the the Ponchac State Forest is another good example of this all kinds of things.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_00: You cover all this stuff in your book, and like what I love about the way that you've like mapped your.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I've like kind of gone through a lot of like supernatural kind of historical books.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_00: And what I like the way that you kind of you lay it out really easily so that I could easily sit and like read it at a campfire, but it's not just tell me a spooky story.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_00: It's I'm actually hearing your firsthand account, but then I'm also getting some history, and I love that.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_00: Like you did it very, very well.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_00: I know it's not your first book, but it's the first book of yours that I've purchased.
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_01: It's the first book about haunted places.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_01: The the first book I wrote was uh fiction.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 32:07
  SPEAKER_01: It's a sci-fi horror fiction.
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_01: So that was just me being like, okay, I want to create something.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_01: That that was a bucket list, you know, check off a bucket list.
• 32:17
  SPEAKER_01: I want to be a published author.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_00: Check for sure, yeah.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_01: You know, yeah, right.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_01: Everybody says, I want to write a book.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that check the box.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_01: I wrote I did it.
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_00: I do too.
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_00: That's what I went to college.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_00: I majored in poetry, so I could write a poetry book.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_00: There you go.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_00: Never actually did it, but um, so okay, what else?
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I don't want you to like take us through the whole book.
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_00: Is there anything that's like not in the book that you could share?
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_00: Because I want people to buy it.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_01: Like, so I don't want you to like read the whole thing, but okay, so yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna um we're talking about finding the grave site at random.
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_01: So there was um there was a place in Sanford, North Carolina.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_01: So I moved down to Sanford.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_01: This was I think I moved to North Carolina in 2009, I moved to Sanford in 2010, and I found this little spot, this little hiking spot that I love there.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_01: I I hike there all the time.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_01: It was this place called the White Pines Nature Preserve.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_01: And um, the thing that I loved about it the most is like white pines are not natural to North Carolina, they are they are natural up here, they're they're all over you find white pine forests in New England everywhere.
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_01: And um, so when I got down there, what happened is there's this spot in Sanford where Deep River and Rocky River come together, and the way the hills are formed, it's like it's a little bit cooler than the surrounding area, it's about 10 degrees cooler than everywhere else in the area.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_01: So when uh the ice age happened, and you know, it kind of moved all the fauna and it moved all the northern fauna a little farther south, and then when it receded, it had this little pocket of white pines in North Carolina.
• 33:51
  SPEAKER_01: So these these little guys are just there and they're just living happy, northern trees living happy in the south in this little commune, you know.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_01: And so I got down to the first time, and I I think the first time I hiked it, I smelled the white pines, and I was like, oh my god, this is this is home.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_01: Like this smells like home.
• 34:08
  SPEAKER_01: I love it here.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_01: And so I hiked, I hiked that trail, I hiked every inch in that forest so many times.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_01: But I was there one time and I just I walked off the trail to take a leak in the woods, like, and I just stepped off probably 10 feet from the trail.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_01: And as I'm standing now, I'm looking around, I see a stone kind of sticking up out of the ground.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, okay, that's not that's not normal.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I I'm looking around while I see another one, and I see another one, and then I realize it's it aligned, and then there's a row, and I'm like, oh, this is a cemetery, like this is an old cemetery out here.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_01: And then I realize I after I started to search around after that, I thought there was an old farmhouse up on the hill just off the property, you know, not too far away.
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_01: So I realized that this has been this had been settled.
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_01: This is this was somebody's home at one point, so it was like a family plot or something.
• 34:55
  SPEAKER_01: And um I'm not sensitive to spirits really, like I I don't notice anything.
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_01: Nothing really jumps out at me too often.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_01: Sometimes they do.
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_01: Um but this particular place I hiked there all the time.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_01: And then as I was going there, I I met and I got married, and she's I took her there all the time.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_01: I actually proposed to her down where the two rivers met.
• 35:17
  SPEAKER_01: And uh after a while, she started going, There's something weird with this place, right?
• 35:22
  SPEAKER_01: Because like there's something creepy about this, about this trail.
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_01: And um I don't remember exactly what it was.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_01: I started to feel it, and then one time I went down there and it was like it was drizzling a little bit, and nobody else was in the parking lot when I parked there.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_01: I started walking down the trail, and as soon as I started walking down the trail, I could hear voices, I could hear people talking to each other, and it sounded like I could almost make out what they were saying, but I couldn't quite make it out, and they always sounded like they were right around the next corner on the trail, like I was about to catch up with them.
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_01: The entire loop trail, probably three or four miles.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_01: I heard voices in the woods the whole time and got back to the car.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_01: Nobody else was down.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_01: There was nobody else there the entire time.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_01: After that, I was like, all right, just movie.
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, I tried like recreating that, like, okay, maybe it was the rain, maybe it was, you know, the way the leaves were, stuff like that.
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_01: I've never had that happen again.
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I've never heard voices like that.
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_01: Something was there in the woods, and it was just out of just out of range, just out of sight range or something, but I could hear it the whole time.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_01: I could hear people talking in the woods, and it was so distinct.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I there were times when it was so loud I could almost make out what they were saying, but I couldn't quite hear it.
• 36:38
  SPEAKER_00: That's like the worst when that happens.
• 36:40
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it doesn't happen to me often.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_00: I don't hear sounds like that.
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_00: Like, what is that?
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but never, I mean, just when it's just out of earshot, and then you think you're second guessing, like, am I crazy?
• 36:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I would probably start psyching myself out at that point if I heard it the entire hike.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_01: Well, because I kept thinking, like, when I there was a corner or something, I kept thinking, like, okay, I'm finally gonna catch up with this group of hikers that is clearly in the woods with me.
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_01: Like, these people are definitely here.
• 37:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, never caught up with it, nobody was there, you know.
• 37:09
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, even when the trail straightened out, even when the trailer was like, like you said it was two rivers, like it was a crossing.
• 37:16
  SPEAKER_00: Did it start there, or is that just part of it?
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, okay.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_01: That's just part of it.
• 37:20
  SPEAKER_01: Like you sort of start up on the top of the hill and you walk down towards one river along the banks and then come up the other side.
• 37:28
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, gotcha.
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, that's creepy.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_00: Hmm.
• 37:32
  SPEAKER_00: Did she did she did your um your fiance at that time, did she have like any other inklings, or was it just that like just a creepy feeling?
• 37:40
  SPEAKER_01: No, she was she's one of those people like, don't tell me about ghosts, I don't want to hear it, I don't want to see it.
• 37:45
  SPEAKER_01: I don't want to know about it.
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_01: You know, don't tell me stories.
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_00: I don't want to know that it's there.
• 37:50
  SPEAKER_01: I don't want to know that anything's there, yeah.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_00: Did you dig into the history?
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_00: Was did you find anything weird about like the history of that area?
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't find anything about it.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't find anything about the farm or about anything that happened there.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_01: No, but that's not the only place.
• 38:03
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, there's other places in North Carolina.
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_01: It's one of the reasons I got into like the whole hiking and spooky trails and haunted forests is because of uh Raven Rock State Park.
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_01: Um, there's a trail there that I think I was I was dating a girl who worked there, who actually worked at that park.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_01: She was like a maintenance tech or something.
• 38:23
  SPEAKER_01: And um she was like, Oh, if you ever notice that Northington Ferry Trail, nobody's ever on it.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, I mean, I've been down there, I've noticed that there's not a lot of people on it.
• 38:32
  SPEAKER_01: She's like, Yeah, that that trail is haunted.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_01: People don't go down there.
• 38:36
  SPEAKER_01: And she was she later on told me that she could see spirit, she was gifted, you know.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_01: She could she told me, you know, I could see dead people essentially at some point.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_01: And so she could see it, but she was like, Oh, yeah, you hear people hear voices in the woods, and you could I she's like, I've seen things down there, that trail is haunted, that's why you know you don't see a lot of traffic on that trail.
• 38:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and there were gravesites on the trail.
• 38:59
  SPEAKER_01: That was um so that was like it was Northington Ferry Trail, and it was James Northington, I think, was the guy who owned it, and there was a ferry at the end of the trail, and it was the main road between Raleigh and Fayeville.
• 39:14
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, in North Carolina, and it crossed the Cape Fear River down there, and um the guy had a general store, and apparently the the story was that he got drunk on New Year's Eve, rode his horse into the house, up the stairs, out onto the balcony, and then fell off the horse off the deck landed on the ground, and then a few weeks later died from his injuries.
• 39:37
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, that's awful.
• 39:38
  SPEAKER_01: And so his gravestone and his grave, his family grave plot is right there along the top of the trail that you're going down there.
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_01: And apparently you could find the general store, I think, or the house.
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_01: The foundation is still there.
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_00: Foundation?
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, that's neat.
• 39:51
  SPEAKER_01: She told me she told me it was there.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_01: She said she knew where it was.
• 39:54
  SPEAKER_01: She never took me there, and I tried to find it time and time again.
• 39:57
  SPEAKER_01: I never found it.
• 39:59
  SPEAKER_00: Hmm.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_00: That's kind of I like I kind of like that stuff when you're on trails.
• 40:03
  SPEAKER_00: There's a there's a couple um trails in kind of like north of where I am now where you can find like foundations of houses and stuff like that.
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_00: And it's really, I think that's just awesome.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I love that.
• 40:17
  SPEAKER_01: I I went um I went out hikes.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_01: There's a hike in Exeter Rhode Island here that goes out to a uh abandoned summer camp.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_01: So you go out there and there's like the story's in the book too.
• 40:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's in there.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_01: And there's um, and so I went down there and I was walking around Breakneck Hill, no breakneck, not breakneck, breakheart pond.
• 40:37
  SPEAKER_01: And so I started down this trail.
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_01: I I'd never walked that particular direction, but like no sooner as I got in the woods, I found this beautiful old foundation in the in the ground.
• 40:49
  SPEAKER_01: You know, old colonial layer of foundation just right there.
• 40:52
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, wow, this is awesome.
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_01: This is so cool.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_00: So cool.
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_00: I know, I love that stuff.
• 40:58
  SPEAKER_00: I always want to like the last time we we did a hike like that, and my my husband and my son and I found like the foundation of something.
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_00: My son and I are always the first ones that want to like go in the foundation and like which then I'm again, I'm like, well, no, maybe not.
• 41:14
  SPEAKER_00: Like, one, it might be dilapidated and we'll get hurt.
• 41:17
  SPEAKER_00: Or two, I don't know if it's like creepy or you know, I don't know.
• 41:21
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes you just don't know the vibe, you know.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_00: Right, yeah.
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_01: Sometimes, sometimes you don't want to disturb the spirits that are there.
• 41:26
  SPEAKER_01: Other times it's like, okay, I gotta check it out.
• 41:29
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_01: You know, a foundation.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, I'm gonna walk in your basement for a minute.
• 41:32
  SPEAKER_01: I don't mean any harm.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_01: Sorry, I'm here.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_01: Not trying to bother you, just I gotta see it.
• 41:37
  SPEAKER_01: I gotta walk down these little stairs.
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_01: The little stone staircase into the into the the the dirt, you know?
• 41:43
  SPEAKER_01: It's awesome.
• 41:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 41:45
  SPEAKER_00: Do you guys uh like that on the podcast, you guys talk about like how built like houses are built and stuff like that.
• 41:50
  SPEAKER_00: Like I never take that into account with things, I guess.
• 41:54
  SPEAKER_00: But what were you?
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_00: I can't remember which one I was just listening to.
• 41:57
  SPEAKER_01: We did um we went to the SK Pierce mansion and uh SK Pierce haunted Victorian Mansion in Garger, and me and him, we recorded while we were in there.
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_01: Uh like they give you 30 minutes, they do the hour tour, and they give you 30 minutes to walk around the mansion afterwards.
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't think I don't know if they do it anymore because the mansion went up for sale uh a couple months ago.
• 42:19
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, and but so we went in there and we got our microphone, I got lapel mics on, and we're walking around.
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_01: We're just on the I'm in awe of like the hinges, the artwork on the hinges of the doors was gorgeous.
• 42:31
  SPEAKER_01: And then the marble and the on the fireplace, and wow, the place was it was amazing.
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_01: It took they said it took a hundred men three years to build this house.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my gosh.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_01: And then his wife died two weeks after they moved it.
• 42:45
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah, I love, I mean, I d I love thinking about like not so much architecture, but I appreciate how houses were built, you know.
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like, and just well built.
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, now it's like everywhere around here.
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_00: It's like Ryan homes, they're built in a day.
• 43:00
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_00: Like I think it's probably because my mom's a real estate agent and she like appreciates that stuff too.
• 43:05
  SPEAKER_00: Her father was a um a contractor who built up a lot of Fells Point in Baltimore.
• 43:11
  SPEAKER_00: So she kind of always like, you know, it's like kind of part of her her lineage to care about the way houses are built.
• 43:17
  SPEAKER_00: So I kind of guess I picked up on that too.
• 43:19
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, you guys were talking, that's what it was.
• 43:21
  SPEAKER_00: You were talking about the conjuring house.
• 43:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_00: And you guys, oh my gosh, that was a great episode.
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_00: Ugh.
• 43:28
  SPEAKER_00: I have so many problems with the Warrens every time I think about like all of that stuff.
• 43:33
  SPEAKER_01: Um Yeah, they're kind of like it's kind of hit and miss with them.
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, yeah, they probably did some good, but they probably also did a lot of stuff for money.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 43:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 43:45
  unknown: Yeah.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_00: But you guys were talking about that in that episode.
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_00: And I thought that that was I mean, you were just kind of talking about how it used to look versus like what they were doing, like did to it now, and that there's like now I guess you can rent it out.
• 43:58
  SPEAKER_01: You could.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 44:01
  SPEAKER_01: So last the end of last year, the beginning of this year, um, the woman who owns it, she got shut down by the town of Burleville.
• 44:09
  SPEAKER_01: She could no longer have anything.
• 44:11
  SPEAKER_01: She they took her business license away.
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_01: And she had had a bunch of problems.
• 44:14
  SPEAKER_01: Like, we went there and we stayed a year ago in June.
• 44:18
  SPEAKER_01: And this was right after she had fired everybody who worked there.
• 44:22
  SPEAKER_01: She fired everyone who worked there, and she claimed the spirits told her that some of the people there were stealing money from her.
• 44:30
  SPEAKER_01: So, like, she kind of threw everybody out.
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_01: This has been like this huge point of contention.
• 44:34
  SPEAKER_01: I'm always seeing um what is it, uh, Jason Haas and Satori Hawes, they're always on social.
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_01: They were on social media for a while talking about because she worked there.
• 44:43
  SPEAKER_01: Um, some of the other people that they knew would work there, and there was a bunch of stuff.
• 44:46
  SPEAKER_01: We were there right in June, right in the middle of it.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_01: Like it was right after she had kicked everybody out.
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_01: And uh, yeah, so we went there with uh with Scott Ryan from Beyond the Shadows and Kevin with where the weird ones are.
• 44:59
  SPEAKER_01: We all got to spend the night in the house together.
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it was I got to meet those guys.
• 45:03
  SPEAKER_01: That was the first the first time I met all them after going on for a while.
• 45:07
  SPEAKER_01: It was very cool.
• 45:08
  SPEAKER_01: It was it was a lot of fun.
• 45:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but the house it was the it must have been the hottest day of the summer, and there's no air conditioning in that house.
• 45:16
  SPEAKER_01: They hadn't set up, they didn't put in any of the window units, so the house was like 110 degrees inside.
• 45:21
  SPEAKER_01: Um, she told us there was no alcohol allowed, and I'm like, I'm just gonna go out and have beer my jeep then.
• 45:28
  SPEAKER_01: I'm I'm just about bringing it in the house.
• 45:30
  SPEAKER_01: I'll tell you, she made us sign form saying that like we wouldn't talk about the stuff without consent from her to make sure that what that you experienced?
• 45:40
  SPEAKER_01: No, it's just oh because you were podcasted, like, okay, well, anything you want to put out about the house, you need to run it by me first.
• 45:49
  SPEAKER_01: So we're like, no, I'm not doing it.
• 45:53
  SPEAKER_00: I don't yeah, I don't know.
• 45:54
  SPEAKER_00: Is that is that legal?
• 45:56
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if you can do can you do that?
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_00: It's not like an NDA.
• 45:59
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 45:59
  SPEAKER_01: It it's pretty much not, yeah.
• 46:01
  SPEAKER_01: But we um we actually recorded, we recorded a whole bunch of stuff with Scott, Ryan, and and Kevin in the basement while we were there, and uh Scott said he lost half the audio, so it didn't really knew they're never able to put it out because half of the stuff was gone, you know, half the audio was gone.
• 46:19
  SPEAKER_01: All he had was me and Kevin talking on one mic, him and Scott and Ryan were not in the episode at all.
• 46:26
  SPEAKER_01: So he's like, Can't put that out, can't put half an episode out, you know.
• 46:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, what was the vibe like in there?
• 46:32
  SPEAKER_01: Was it I mean most of the place was good, most of the place was fine.
• 46:36
  SPEAKER_01: The kitchen and dining room for me was I I kept having to go into the kitchen and dining room area to go to the the fridge or whatever and grab a drink.
• 46:44
  SPEAKER_01: And every time I walked in by myself, I didn't want to be in there.
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_01: It was like, no, there's something, there's something in this area, you know.
• 46:51
  SPEAKER_01: But like the library that they say is has a bunch of stuff.
• 46:55
  SPEAKER_01: Everybody talks about being in the library that's just this one little room off the side.
• 46:59
  SPEAKER_01: I fell asleep in there, you know.
• 47:02
  SPEAKER_01: Russ and down on the gas of the library, he passed out.
• 47:05
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know him, but from what I hear of him, like what I've heard of him on your show, that doesn't surprise me.
• 47:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, he just like fell asleep in the haunted library.
• 47:15
  SPEAKER_01: I think I I think I fell asleep for like an hour upstairs.
• 47:17
  SPEAKER_01: I was in one of the bedrooms upstairs and it laid on top of the bed, and I was like, all right, I'll I gotta get some sleep.
• 47:23
  unknown: Yeah.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_01: We've been here all night, we're gonna be here all night.
• 47:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like I gotta get at least a little shy.
• 47:28
  SPEAKER_01: See if I have any weird dreams.
• 47:29
  SPEAKER_01: Because usually if if something's gonna happen to me, it's gonna happen when I'm asleep.
• 47:33
  SPEAKER_01: It's gonna happen in a dream.
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna have some weird stuff to me.
• 47:36
  SPEAKER_01: But nothing happened.
• 47:36
  SPEAKER_01: I slept for an hour peacefully.
• 47:39
  SPEAKER_01: It was fine.
• 47:40
  SPEAKER_00: Crazy.
• 47:41
  SPEAKER_01: And there's a living room where supposedly when they were doing the uh the exorcism, the woman was picked up and thrown out of the room that was in a living room that nothing nothing really happened.
• 47:52
  SPEAKER_01: Nothing happened that I noticed in there.
• 47:54
  SPEAKER_01: Even with the they had a fake Annabelle doll.
• 47:57
  SPEAKER_01: They had like a recreation Annabelle doll in there in the box, you know, with the do not open, do not touch.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_01: You know.
• 48:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that whole thing is crazy.
• 48:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, Scott had a weird experience while we were there though.
• 48:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 48:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um we're all outside, and so when you go in there, they had like the first room you walk into that was right off of the living room, and then over towards the left, they she had like a room that had a bunch of swaggy, and then she had the room that she was staying in.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_01: The owner was there that night.
• 48:30
  SPEAKER_01: So she was staying in this room off to the left of there, over like the garage area, I guess, would have been.
• 48:36
  SPEAKER_01: Um and so Scott was walking, he said he was walking around the back of the house, and he saw the curtain where she was staying.
• 48:46
  SPEAKER_01: He saw the curtain open, and somebody looked out at him while he was walking by.
• 48:50
  SPEAKER_01: And he was like, Oh, she's just this woman's just being weird and just looking at her.
• 48:54
  SPEAKER_01: And then he started walking down to the backyard where the rest of us were.
• 48:57
  SPEAKER_01: I think like me and Kevin were down there, we were live streaming on Instagram.
• 49:00
  SPEAKER_01: I was live streaming on Instagram, and um that's when he saw that she was out walking her dog.
• 49:08
  SPEAKER_01: She was down the trail the other side of the yard walking her dog.
• 49:10
  SPEAKER_01: And so he asked her about it later.
• 49:12
  SPEAKER_01: He was like, Is someone staying here with you?
• 49:13
  SPEAKER_01: Or is it just you?
• 49:14
  SPEAKER_01: And she was like, Oh, it's just me.
• 49:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 49:17
  SPEAKER_00: So no, no, thank you.
• 49:19
  SPEAKER_01: That was the only really weird thing that happened.
• 49:21
  SPEAKER_01: Besides the way the the kitchen and dining room felt, the well was cool.
• 49:26
  SPEAKER_01: It's not the well was awesome.
• 49:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that was you said that in the episode.
• 49:29
  SPEAKER_00: I was weirded out by that because I because you were right, like the water, I don't know, there's so much energy in water.
• 49:35
  SPEAKER_00: I do think having that energy kind of going through that house, but nothing, huh?
• 49:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, nothing.
• 49:41
  SPEAKER_01: Like I said, except for that, except for the weird feeling in the kitchen that uh I don't want to be in there, but or in the dining room next to the kitchen, yeah.
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_00: What if she just like because like because now she's like lost the business or whatever?
• 49:52
  SPEAKER_00: What if that was she just like set all that up?
• 49:54
  SPEAKER_00: Like like the creepy window thing.
• 49:56
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 49:57
  SPEAKER_01: Oh she might have.
• 49:58
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 49:59
  SPEAKER_00: She might have, but I don't want to ruin somebody's like haunted tail, but I get I'm sc I'm skeptical, I think, on the front end of things.
• 50:05
  SPEAKER_00: Unless I not so much like unless I experience it, like I don't know.
• 50:10
  SPEAKER_00: I always kind of want to rule things out before we over supernaturalize everything.
• 50:14
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 50:15
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I don't know.
• 50:17
  SPEAKER_01: But like I'm not I'm not a paranormal investigator, you know, so I don't have all the tools and stuff like that.
• 50:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like I don't I don't go there for that.
• 50:23
  SPEAKER_01: I go there to experience it to see what the place is like.
• 50:27
  SPEAKER_01: Like you know, these haunted places, they're cool to go to.
• 50:30
  SPEAKER_01: I think they're awesome.
• 50:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 50:32
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I respect that.
• 50:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 50:34
  SPEAKER_01: You know, we take pictures and stuff.
• 50:35
  SPEAKER_00: Mess around with anything, yeah.
• 50:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, I I don't like to uh I don't like to to do I I try not to touch it.
• 50:43
  SPEAKER_01: I don't take rocks, I will not take things from well, except for um I've got a piece of coal from uh uh Centralia.
• 50:52
  SPEAKER_01: It's part of the anthraxite coal from Central.
• 50:55
  SPEAKER_00: You've been to Centralia?
• 50:57
  SPEAKER_00: What?
• 50:58
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh.
• 51:00
  SPEAKER_00: Did you hear my episode on Centralia?
• 51:02
  SPEAKER_01: No, I didn't hear your episode.
• 51:04
  SPEAKER_00: Oh gosh, I did one.
• 51:05
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah, with um I'll listen to it.
• 51:08
  SPEAKER_00: My friend from Crime to Burn.
• 51:09
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh, it this it was really.
• 51:11
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yes, yeah.
• 51:12
  SPEAKER_01: I have heard because I heard I listened to her five episodes on Centralia.
• 51:17
  SPEAKER_01: That's why that's how I know it's it's anthracy colon, not difficult.
• 51:23
  SPEAKER_00: I know.
• 51:23
  SPEAKER_00: She oh my god, I love her too.
• 51:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um oh man.
• 51:27
  SPEAKER_01: I think I messaged her, I messaged her about that because I was like, yeah, I've been to Centralia, like it's and it's a weird place because like there's nothing there, but you can still smell the smoke.
• 51:35
  SPEAKER_01: You can smell it in the air there, yeah.
• 51:39
  SPEAKER_00: They don't go there because it's like it can't be that far away.
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_00: It's probably just laziness on my part, but it's like, and also I don't want to fall through a hellscape.
• 51:47
  SPEAKER_00: Like, let's not do that.
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I would be afraid of falling through the you know, but there were some spots that looked like you could fall into the earth in there, but I mean, for the most part, we just stayed on the roads and the trails, and everything was fine.
• 52:00
  SPEAKER_01: And it's it's it's cool to go to, like, absolutely 100%.
• 52:03
  SPEAKER_01: I would go if you haven't gone, but it's not like it's not the ghost town that it used to be back in the 90s, you know.
• 52:10
  SPEAKER_01: There's there's two houses there, and such people live in these two little houses.
• 52:14
  SPEAKER_01: And there's a road, the main road runs right through the middle of town.
• 52:16
  SPEAKER_01: Like people drive right through the middle of this town all the time.
• 52:19
  SPEAKER_01: What?
• 52:20
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah, like it's it's not off of anything.
• 52:23
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, the the paint the painted highway is covered in dirt mounds now.
• 52:27
  SPEAKER_01: You can't, you know, you can walk down it, but it's all covered in dirt.
• 52:30
  SPEAKER_01: You can't see the the the graffiti and the paint wow.
• 52:35
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, but but yeah, it's not feels ruined.
• 52:37
  SPEAKER_01: The main highway still drives right through there.
• 52:40
  SPEAKER_01: It's kind of like uh, okay, well, this it didn't really live up to the height, but still cool to go to, you know.
• 52:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but it doesn't seem like that's very safe because it's supposed to just like cave in at any moment.
• 52:52
  SPEAKER_00: Like that doesn't make any sense.
• 52:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 52:55
  SPEAKER_01: Oh there are some spots, there are some spots in the woods that have signs of like no hunting, do not enter, you know.
• 53:01
  SPEAKER_01: So there's probably some spots where they had dug out and they might be closer to the fire than other places.
• 53:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that makes sense because yeah, I I remember she was saying there's like still people that live there.
• 53:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's it.
• 53:15
  SPEAKER_01: But there is there is coal everywhere.
• 53:18
  SPEAKER_01: Even when you walk into the woods, you can see just it looks like just black rocks, you know.
• 53:24
  SPEAKER_01: The hillsides are just it's just coal.
• 53:26
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I picked this piece up just off the ground on a trail, you know.
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_01: It wasn't I didn't dig for it or anything, it's just the whole place is cold, you know.
• 53:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, I doubt that your your coal is haunted.
• 53:38
  SPEAKER_00: That's fine.
• 53:40
  SPEAKER_00: It'll be fine.
• 53:41
  SPEAKER_00: No, but I definitely wouldn't go like I wouldn't, I mean, I I personally wouldn't go to like Gettysburg and like take like a piece of nature back.
• 53:49
  SPEAKER_00: I wouldn't do that.
• 53:50
  SPEAKER_00: Um, yeah, I wouldn't go anywhere that's like supposedly haunted or whatever and just take stuff.
• 53:56
  SPEAKER_00: Like, no thanks.
• 53:57
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, no.
• 53:58
  SPEAKER_00: I'm kind of more and I agree, like I'm not really I also don't like the idea of making money off of these places.
• 54:03
  SPEAKER_00: Like sometimes that just really, really bothers me.
• 54:06
  SPEAKER_00: Like, as much as I love spooky stuff and I totally get the appeal, I'm just kind of like, if we know it's haunted, why don't we like get rid of the ghost and make it not haunted anymore?
• 54:17
  SPEAKER_00: Like, because then we wouldn't make money off of it.
• 54:20
  SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, some places are really touristy like that.
• 54:23
  SPEAKER_00: And I kind of just I don't know, it hurts my soul, I think, the older I get, you know.
• 54:27
  SPEAKER_01: Although on the on the other hand, it's like places like uh Pennhurst Asylum.
• 54:31
  SPEAKER_01: Like, yeah, we've gone out to the Paracon a couple years in a row.
• 54:34
  SPEAKER_01: That's why we went to Centralia, that's why we went to Gettysburg.
• 54:36
  SPEAKER_01: We're already in Pennsylvania, and so we're like, oh, this place is only a couple hours away.
• 54:41
  SPEAKER_01: We'll just add that to the trip, you know.
• 54:43
  SPEAKER_01: But that place is like they're making money off of their haunted tours and their ghost tours, and they they have like a uh haunted house type attraction that they do there during the Halloween, the spooky season.
• 54:57
  SPEAKER_01: But they're using that to fix the place back up and kind of bring the history back out into the light again, you know.
• 55:03
  SPEAKER_01: So they're they've got the museum in there now, and they've got all the all the buildings are getting cleaned up and they're getting new roofs and they're being you know restored and kept up.
• 55:13
  SPEAKER_01: You know, which is I feel like that's that's a great thing that you're gonna do.
• 55:16
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, if you're gonna if you're gonna make money off of it, like, you know, do good with it, you know.
• 55:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, I I totally I agree with that for sure.
• 55:25
  SPEAKER_00: That's just like the privately owned places where it's just kind of like so this is kind of funny, because you did an episode with the Lizzie Borden house.
• 55:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 55:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I coincidentally was just talking to people about like the anniversary and kind of the whole history of, you know, they didn't want that trial to get out because they didn't want the town to like suffer from you know, like the bad publicity.
• 55:51
  SPEAKER_00: And yet, ironically, now that's like all the town is is like this, like, and you guys are so close to there, it's crazy.
• 55:59
  SPEAKER_01: Like, yeah, we've been there.
• 56:00
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, because Rob's gone on the tour there.
• 56:02
  SPEAKER_01: I've not been in the Lizzie boardhouse, but I went to the little Lizzie coffee shop next door, you know, got a coffee there.
• 56:08
  unknown: Right.
• 56:09
  SPEAKER_01: The tip jar in the put the put my tip in the jar that said Lizzie is innocent.
• 56:14
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 56:14
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh.
• 56:16
  SPEAKER_00: I don't I think she's guilty.
• 56:17
  SPEAKER_00: I think she totally did it.
• 56:18
  SPEAKER_01: And so um, no, I got a funny story about that.
• 56:21
  SPEAKER_01: So probably like probably like 20 years ago or so, my aunt got married to a guy named Robert, and I I knew back then his name, it was Robert Borden, right?
• 56:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I knew back then it was Borden.
• 56:32
  SPEAKER_01: Every once in a while I thought about it, like, oh, maybe he's a Borden.
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I don't know.
• 56:36
  SPEAKER_01: It's it might be a popular name, and then I found out he was from New Bedford, and I was like, well, it's kind of close to Fall River, you know.
• 56:42
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe it's yeah, maybe he's part of the family.
• 56:44
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 56:44
  SPEAKER_01: And then last year I was up at their house in New Hampshire, and uh I go in to use the the bathroom downstairs, and I see this thing on the wall, and it's got like a bunch of like hand-drawn pictures of axes, and it's like this is a carpenter's axe, this is a woodcutter's axe, and then it's got one that says this is a kitchen axe as used by Aunt Lizzie.
• 57:02
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, shut the fuck up.
• 57:05
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, no way.
• 57:07
  SPEAKER_01: And I look back out, I look back out of the living room and I was like, So Robert, Aunt Lizzie?
• 57:13
  SPEAKER_01: Like, what?
• 57:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, he's like, Yeah, my son made that in you know, in college, one of his classes, he did a project.
• 57:20
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, So you're you're actually aboard, and he's like, Yeah, she's like an eighth cousin or something, like you know, cousin eight times removed, or something like that.
• 57:28
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, Oh, that's awesome.
• 57:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, So at one point during the night, I'm like, so Robert, listen, what is the who what does the family think?
• 57:36
  SPEAKER_00: What is exactly what's the family consent?
• 57:39
  SPEAKER_00: What's the family tea here?
• 57:41
  SPEAKER_00: He goes, What did Auntie Lizzie do?
• 57:42
  SPEAKER_01: He goes, the Irish maid did it.
• 57:47
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, oh man, and this is this is this is where it gets even weirder, right?
• 57:51
  SPEAKER_01: So you mentioned that, you know, I put that post out, I put a post on Instagram about the anniversary, right?
• 57:58
  SPEAKER_01: So I put that out, and then my aunt comments, she goes, she goes, you know, Nene used to say Nene was her mom.
• 58:06
  SPEAKER_01: I used to call her, I used to call my grandmother Nene.
• 58:09
  SPEAKER_01: Um, she goes, Nene used to say that her mother was cousins with Bridget Sullivan, the Irish maid from the Lizzie Borden thing.
• 58:18
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, wait a minute.
• 58:20
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, stop the presses here.
• 58:22
  SPEAKER_01: Are you telling me that we're related to Bridget Sullivan from the Lizzie?
• 58:27
  SPEAKER_01: I not only so you're telling me not only do I have a Borden in my family, but I'm related to the Irish maid from this.
• 58:34
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, okay, this this can't be, this has got to be BS.
• 58:37
  SPEAKER_01: Like, this has got to be just you know fantasy.
• 58:40
  SPEAKER_01: And so I jumped on ancestry.com and I started digging, and I realized, okay, so my great-grandmother is a Sullivan, her maiden name was Sullivan, she is from Fall River.
• 58:53
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, okay, I gotta I gotta find this even, I gotta keep digging.
• 58:58
  SPEAKER_01: And I have yet, I haven't made a definitive connection, but I have found um Bridget Sullivan's father's name.
• 59:06
  SPEAKER_01: I found somebody in my family tree who matches that name and is this about the same age and has a daughter that was born about the same time that Bridget Sullivan would have been born.
• 59:16
  SPEAKER_01: So I haven't been able to a hundred percent connect the two, but there's a pretty fair chance that my family is related to Bridget Sullivan from the Lizzie Borden murders.
• 59:29
  SPEAKER_01: So now I'm like, now I gotta go back to Robert and be like, it was probably Lizzie and not the maid, because right, exactly.
• 59:37
  SPEAKER_01: Right now I'm about to defend the Irish maid because I realize Irish maid is cousins with my great grandmother.
• 59:44
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh.
• 59:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, okay, that's insane, dude.
• 59:48
  SPEAKER_01: It's so it's so weird.
• 59:49
  SPEAKER_00: I'm I'm because it's both of like the suspects, like they didn't suspect her sister.
• 59:55
  SPEAKER_00: Like she wasn't a suspect, it was Lizzie, and then it was it was the maid.
• 1:00:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and like one of yeah, well, there was also the brother, right?
• 1:00:03
  SPEAKER_01: There was Andrew's brother, the uncle, or whatever.
• 1:00:06
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, from what Rob was like, Rob did the episode on Lizzie board because he went to the house and did the tour, and from what he was saying, like everybody who was there who had who was in proximity, everybody benefited from Andrew's death.
• 1:00:21
  SPEAKER_02: Everybody did.
• 1:00:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, the uncle did, the maid did, Lizzie did, um her sister did.
• 1:00:27
  SPEAKER_01: Everybody who was there benefited from that.
• 1:00:30
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, was it just one person acting, you know, was it Lizzie acting one way?
• 1:00:34
  SPEAKER_01: Did they all collaborate to do something?
• 1:00:36
  SPEAKER_01: You know, because they knew$7 million was a lot of money back then in 1870.
• 1:00:42
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah, that's right.
• 1:00:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:00:43
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh.
• 1:00:44
  SPEAKER_01: They got his whole inheritance, yeah.
• 1:00:47
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna have to go, I would have to go see that.
• 1:00:50
  SPEAKER_00: That would be one that I would think I would probably want to visit is the Lizzie Borden house.
• 1:00:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:00:54
  SPEAKER_00: Just for the hit, like the museum and the history.
• 1:00:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:00:57
  SPEAKER_00: Like not to buy the swag, like see like the actual like history of it.
• 1:01:04
  SPEAKER_01: Because I'm sure there's stuff that you're not gonna find on the internet, you know, like that's another one that's like, you know, is it okay to make money on this stuff?
• 1:01:10
  SPEAKER_01: Because like that house, Rob was telling me when he was a kid, that house was abandoned in Fall River.
• 1:01:16
  SPEAKER_01: Nobody was living there.
• 1:01:17
  SPEAKER_01: His him and his dad went in that house when it was when nobody was living there.
• 1:01:20
  SPEAKER_01: And he was like, you know, oh, this is the Lizzie Borden house.
• 1:01:23
  SPEAKER_01: And they they just he's like, I remember walking around that house as a kid because it was just nothing was on there.
• 1:01:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it was crazy.
• 1:01:32
  SPEAKER_00: And now you can like stay in it as a bad boy.
• 1:01:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you can stay in, and now it's 300, 300, 400 for a night for your stepmother's room, yeah, or whatever room you want to be in.
• 1:01:42
  SPEAKER_00: No.
• 1:01:42
  SPEAKER_01: And apparently they have like cut-out figures, they have like fake axes and something you can play with and you can pretend that you're murdering that's I mean it's a little too much.
• 1:01:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's it's much.
• 1:01:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like just keep keep it respectful, man.
• 1:01:56
  SPEAKER_01: Come on.
• 1:01:57
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 1:01:57
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I mean, these people were hacked to death.
• 1:02:00
  SPEAKER_01: Like isn't it horrific enough already?
• 1:02:02
  SPEAKER_00: It's awful.
• 1:02:03
  SPEAKER_00: Like, oh but that's dude, that's so crazy.
• 1:02:07
  SPEAKER_00: Cause like you have, yeah, either side is either a Borden or a Sullivan.
• 1:02:12
  unknown: Yeah.
• 1:02:13
  SPEAKER_00: I want to hear more about this.
• 1:02:14
  SPEAKER_00: You have to inform us when you find this out.
• 1:02:16
  SPEAKER_01: And if I if I can, if I could find because I don't think there's there's nothing about Bridget.
• 1:02:21
  SPEAKER_01: Like, there's some places that say her name and her or I mean her parents' name, but other than that, it's very much like what did she do after the merge?
• 1:02:30
  SPEAKER_01: What was her life before that?
• 1:02:31
  SPEAKER_01: Like nobody really knows, you know.
• 1:02:33
  SPEAKER_01: There was a lot of moving back and forth between Ireland and the Americas back then.
• 1:02:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:02:39
  SPEAKER_00: You know, but I don't know.
• 1:02:40
  SPEAKER_00: I feel like an Irish maid is not gonna she's got enough to lose just being an Irish maid in America at that time.
• 1:02:46
  SPEAKER_00: Like, come on, she's not gonna hack her employer to death.
• 1:02:50
  SPEAKER_00: Like, oh my gosh.
• 1:02:52
  SPEAKER_00: So, uh, that's crazy.
• 1:02:54
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, Joe, that's amazing.
• 1:02:56
  SPEAKER_00: Do you have any other um like any other tales you want to tell us while you're here?
• 1:03:02
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, because this has been a lot of fun.
• 1:03:04
  SPEAKER_00: I know you have a lot, but say kick off spooky season.
• 1:03:09
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, kick on spooky season.
• 1:03:12
  SPEAKER_00: Or you can tell us like if you're gonna like you have any plans coming up, like places you're gonna go and places that people should go.
• 1:03:19
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so stuff coming up.
• 1:03:21
  SPEAKER_01: I I don't think I've got um a whole lot of stuff.
• 1:03:25
  SPEAKER_01: So I started this um one of the things I did was I I decided to start a hiking group.
• 1:03:29
  SPEAKER_01: So I don't know if you ever heard of meetup.coms it's one of those places where people can get together.
• 1:03:33
  SPEAKER_01: So I started a group on there and I did a couple hikes back last fall and last winter time frame.
• 1:03:40
  SPEAKER_01: I haven't done anything in the summer because it's just too hot to go hiking in the summer.
• 1:03:44
  SPEAKER_01: The bugs are crazy.
• 1:03:45
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm starting that back up again.
• 1:03:47
  SPEAKER_01: I'm taking out uh I'm doing a hike.
• 1:03:50
  SPEAKER_01: Again, I'm going out to the abandoned summer camp this weekend.
• 1:03:53
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think anybody, I don't think anybody signed up for it yet.
• 1:03:56
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe maybe it'll just be me again, but yeah.
• 1:04:00
  SPEAKER_00: That's kind of cool.
• 1:04:01
  SPEAKER_00: So you just take are you taking people on like tours or are you just like kind of like let's go hang?
• 1:04:05
  SPEAKER_01: Just like, hey, let's go, let's go hiking.
• 1:04:07
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm taking a couple people out to uh the Hell Hollow Loop loop trails out in Potchog State Forest.
• 1:04:13
  SPEAKER_01: That's where like there's the witch of hell hollow.
• 1:04:17
  SPEAKER_01: There's the the girl that stands on the uh side of the road, and there's a colonial soldier that haunts one of the roads, and there's supposedly uh um one of the stories is there's a dark mist that follows hikers through the woods in that area.
• 1:04:32
  SPEAKER_01: Hotchog is full of ghost stories, yeah, and it's not that far away.
• 1:04:35
  SPEAKER_01: I I didn't find this too long ago.
• 1:04:37
  SPEAKER_01: It's like 30 30 minutes to an hour drive from here, and it's just super haunted.
• 1:04:43
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 1:04:44
  SPEAKER_01: So we took a few people there, and it was just like a very simple, like, oh, we're gonna go, you know, four-mile hike, we're gonna check out there's a place called Devil's Den.
• 1:04:53
  SPEAKER_01: So one of the hikes, I took a couple couple women out there, and we just walked around and found the found the because I'd never seen it before.
• 1:04:59
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, I want to find this den.
• 1:05:01
  SPEAKER_01: Don't mind me.
• 1:05:02
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna be I'm gonna walk off the trail here for a minute, just start looking around, see if this rock formation is actually Devil's Den or not, you know.
• 1:05:10
  SPEAKER_00: But um Did you find it?
• 1:05:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I found it.
• 1:05:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:05:14
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, cool.
• 1:05:14
  SPEAKER_00: It's very cool.
• 1:05:15
  SPEAKER_01: It's just like this rock formation that sticks out and it's got like a cave kind of just like overhanging, and there's like this little cave on the side of a hill.
• 1:05:22
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, don't go into any caves and hills.
• 1:05:24
  SPEAKER_00: No, no.
• 1:05:24
  SPEAKER_00: That's a portal.
• 1:05:25
  SPEAKER_00: Please don't.
• 1:05:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, all right.
• 1:05:28
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah, that that was another thing I wanted to say.
• 1:05:30
  SPEAKER_01: So one of the times I went out there, I wanted to find Maud's grave.
• 1:05:34
  SPEAKER_01: So there's a tale about the Maud named witch that lives out there, and so I found how to get there and I figured it out.
• 1:05:42
  SPEAKER_01: And so on the way there, I'm walking down the trail and I see like this little offshoot trail, and I'm like, what the hell?
• 1:05:49
  SPEAKER_01: What is this?
• 1:05:50
  SPEAKER_01: I I gotta, I gotta see what this is.
• 1:05:51
  SPEAKER_01: And I walk, I walk like maybe 20 feet into the woods, and I turn on my left, and there's these two massive pine trees, and it just looks like a gate, right?
• 1:06:00
  SPEAKER_01: In the woods, and it's just these massive pine trees, and there's no branches in between them.
• 1:06:04
  SPEAKER_01: So it just looks like this great big, like Lord of the Ring style gate in the woods.
• 1:06:08
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, I'm like, okay, this is this is a fairy portal or something.
• 1:06:12
  SPEAKER_01: Like I'm walking into something, and then just through them, I can see like this little clearing, this big rock sitting in the middle of it.
• 1:06:18
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, well, obviously, I'm going in there.
• 1:06:20
  SPEAKER_01: I walk in there and I'll walk up to this rock, and there's like the rock has this formation in it, and I'll like wipe all the stuff off the top of the rock, and there's a seat in this rock.
• 1:06:31
  SPEAKER_01: What right?
• 1:06:35
  SPEAKER_01: Well I'm sitting on this checking this out.
• 1:06:38
  SPEAKER_01: I sat up on a rock and I'm like, this is kicking my feet, kind of looking around, go, this is this is a like something's either something's gonna happen to me or it's not, but this is awesome.
• 1:06:47
  SPEAKER_01: Like something is definitely common.
• 1:06:50
  SPEAKER_00: It was Rivendale, yeah.
• 1:06:52
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 1:06:52
  SPEAKER_01: And then and then I walked further on down the trail and I I crossed the little river and you get to where her grave is and her the family's uh old farmhouse foundation, you know, and it was it was very creepy when you when you walk over the river, you walk over the little stream there, it's like the mood the the feeling changes in the area, and it was like all right, something's out there.
• 1:07:13
  SPEAKER_01: And I just you know like on her like on her side, like past like on her side, because she was the one the girl was the one who was buried close to the farm, uh you know, so that her mother could see her, you know, instead of being in the family plot that was on the other hill or whatever.
• 1:07:29
  SPEAKER_01: And so you get up there and there's there's a weird change in the air.
• 1:07:32
  SPEAKER_01: It's very cool though.
• 1:07:33
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm you know, I go up there, just kind of pay my respects and just no, I'm not here to bother anybody, please leave.
• 1:07:38
  SPEAKER_01: Don't follow me out of here, but I just wanted to see.
• 1:07:41
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks for having me.
• 1:07:42
  SPEAKER_01: Alright.
• 1:07:44
  SPEAKER_01: I wanted to take a quick video.
• 1:07:50
  SPEAKER_01: I'm getting out of here now.
• 1:07:51
  SPEAKER_01: Don't come home with me.
• 1:07:52
  SPEAKER_01: Stay here.
• 1:07:53
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 1:07:54
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, that sounds awesome though.
• 1:07:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, fairy portals.
• 1:07:58
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh.
• 1:07:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it was super, it was super cool.
• 1:08:01
  SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
• 1:08:03
  SPEAKER_00: Joe, this has been a lot of fun.
• 1:08:05
  SPEAKER_01: This has been awesome.
• 1:08:06
  SPEAKER_00: I really appreciate you coming on, and I can't wait to go on your show and talk about spooky things and possibly Gettysburg.
• 1:08:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I want to hear about time there.
• 1:08:14
  SPEAKER_01: No, you have to spend a lot.
• 1:08:16
  SPEAKER_00: You have to told you it's gotta be like two days.
• 1:08:18
  SPEAKER_00: You can't.
• 1:08:20
  SPEAKER_00: You can there's so much to do.
• 1:08:21
  SPEAKER_00: It's amazing.
• 1:08:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:08:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:08:24
  SPEAKER_00: I would love to have you come on again, for sure.
• 1:08:27
  unknown: Okay.
• 1:08:28
  SPEAKER_01: Well, thanks for having me.
• 1:08:29
  SPEAKER_01: This has been a blast.
• 1:08:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, definitely.
• 1:08:31
  SPEAKER_00: Do you want to tell everybody, first of all, everybody, go buy this book for spooky season, do it now.
• 1:08:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, see, do it, do it now.
• 1:08:40
  SPEAKER_00: Look, there he is.
• 1:08:41
  SPEAKER_00: He's gonna do so many push-ups.
• 1:08:44
  SPEAKER_00: It's gonna be incredible.
• 1:08:45
  SPEAKER_01: I hope so.
• 1:08:46
  SPEAKER_01: All the push-ups.
• 1:08:48
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, why don't you tell everybody where they can find you?
• 1:08:51
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so you can find Tails, Trails, and Taverns anywhere you get your podcast, Apple, IR, Spotify.
• 1:08:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you can find us on all the social medias.
• 1:09:00
  SPEAKER_01: I've got a page anywhere you look.
• 1:09:02
  SPEAKER_01: You can find us online at tails, trails, and taverns.com.
• 1:09:06
  SPEAKER_01: And if you want to contact me, you can either DM me through Instagram.
• 1:09:09
  SPEAKER_01: That's the best way.
• 1:09:11
  SPEAKER_01: I have the most people in there.
• 1:09:12
  SPEAKER_01: I'm most active on that one.
• 1:09:14
  SPEAKER_01: You can also email us at tailstrailsandower at yahoo.com.
• 1:09:18
  SPEAKER_01: If you have any stories, you want to talk about something, you want to point me in the direction of checking something out because part of the niche of the uh of our podcast and our website and our our our stuff is that we go to all the places that we do the podcast for.
• 1:09:32
  SPEAKER_01: We get eyes on it, you know, we like to see these places, we like to experience firsthand.
• 1:09:37
  SPEAKER_01: I tell you about it afterwards.
• 1:09:38
  SPEAKER_01: It's the adventure for us.
• 1:09:40
  SPEAKER_01: So that's what it's all about.
• 1:09:43
  SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
• 1:09:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, adventure.
• 1:09:45
  SPEAKER_00: I love it.
• 1:09:45
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much, Joe.
• 1:09:47
  SPEAKER_00: All right, thank you for having me.
• 1:09:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, and thank you guys for listening.
• 1:09:50
  SPEAKER_00: Remember, the truth is out there.
• 1:09:53
  SPEAKER_00: God is with you, and everyone always ends up in the kitchen.
• 1:10:15
  SPEAKER_00: You have been listening to Sasquatch and Sourdough.
• 1:10:18
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Christina, and thank you so much for tuning in.
• 1:10:22
  SPEAKER_00: Sasquatch and Sourdough is so much more than just a podcast.
• 1:10:25
  SPEAKER_00: We are a community of kindred spirits, united by our curiosity and fascination with the extraordinary.
• 1:10:32
  SPEAKER_00: And we want to bring you into the conversation.
• 1:10:34
  SPEAKER_00: So whether you've had a brush with the unexplainable, seen something that you can't quite wrap your head around, this is your space.
• 1:10:43
  SPEAKER_00: We invite you to join us as we break bread and break down the barriers between the known and the unknown.
• 1:10:50
  SPEAKER_00: If you want to share your story, you can email us at sasquatch and sourdough at gmail.com or send us a DM on Instagram.
• 1:10:57
  SPEAKER_00: Until next time, remember, the truth is out there.
• 1:11:01
  SPEAKER_00: God is with you, and everyone always ends up in the kitchen.