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The Chestnut Tree From Mathew Tekusky Getting To Know Gladys McKinley · Arroe Collins Like It's Live

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  Speaker 1: It's not just a podcast. It's a podcast network. That
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  Speaker 1: was my vision in 2010, to create a network where
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  Speaker 1: you had the power of choice and owned it like
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  Speaker 1: you live it every day. Arrow.net, A-R-R-O-E.net. One of the
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  Speaker 1: top shows, Street Speak with Alexa and Clarence. It really
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  Speaker 1: is Alexa from Amazon. You're having the conversations, but do
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  Speaker 1: they go as deep as these two? Only on Arrow.net, A-R-R-O-E.net.
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  Speaker 1: Enjoy your exploration.
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  Speaker 2: Hello, Arrow.
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  Speaker 1: Hey, how are you doing today, Matthew?
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  Speaker 2: I'm doing great. I love your energy. I heard your
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  Speaker 2: interview with Joby. I'm definitely keyed in on that, man.
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  Speaker 1: I tell you, it's because the fact that you guys
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  Speaker 1: trust and believe in your skills with using words, it's
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  Speaker 1: so inspiring because we got to get back into this
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  Speaker 1: generation of using words. And I don't want to take
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  Speaker 1: away from what your book is doing, but we are
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  Speaker 1: in this generation right now where I can hold up
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  Speaker 1: a flashcard in front of a senior in high school.
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  Speaker 1: And they can't read it. And that's why I've got
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  Speaker 1: to get more authors involved in sharing their words so
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  Speaker 1: they can inspire the new word of a new generation. Because,
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  Speaker 1: I mean, the authors are in trouble. If we don't
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  Speaker 1: get this generation to start reading your books. Yes.
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  Speaker 2: Very interesting point. Well, maybe I should be going and
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  Speaker 2: making some... pro bono appearances at some schools you've inspired me.
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  Speaker 1: Wake them up wake them up now but but see
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  Speaker 1: what i love about you matthew is the fact that
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  Speaker 1: you totally understand that there are several different layers when
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  Speaker 1: it comes to writing because i mean to write a
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  Speaker 1: screenplay and for the chestnut tree i mean literally i
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  Speaker 1: want to say it's a book and it's also a
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  Speaker 1: play but i don't want listeners to go what is
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  Speaker 1: it i want them to understand you are using the
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  Speaker 1: right energy in the correct way when it comes to writing.
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  Speaker 2: Oh, thanks. Well, it started as a book and then
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  Speaker 2: I was asked to write it as a screenplay. And
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  Speaker 2: so I had to go back to the book line
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  Speaker 2: by line and take the elements of the book that
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  Speaker 2: I thought would work in a movie and then dramatize it,
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  Speaker 2: of course. So you show and not tell in a screenplay.
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  Speaker 2: I do a little more telling than showing in the book.
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  Speaker 2: Even a couple of reviewers, I shouldn't criticize myself, but
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  Speaker 2: a couple of them tell us a little bit here,
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  Speaker 2: but it's OK. but you're telling it through the point
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  Speaker 2: of view of a child and his mind. So in
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  Speaker 2: the movie, you let you use a voiceover, which is
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  Speaker 2: kind of a crutch. I try to resist using voiceover,
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  Speaker 2: although I've used them, you know, the narrator telling the story,
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  Speaker 2: like in the middle grade or young adult movies, it's always,
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  Speaker 2: I remember when mom took me out to the baseball
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  Speaker 2: game and then, you know, and then, then they sort
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  Speaker 2: of dissolve into the real drama and all that. So, um,
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  Speaker 2: I recall I did not use a voiceover for a
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  Speaker 2: chess entry, but I did use it for saving Annie
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  Speaker 2: about the college kids.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah.
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  Speaker 2: Oh, that is a different art form, but it still works.
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  Speaker 1: But I, but I love that because you're, you're using
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  Speaker 1: the imagination because to me, that's where you plant the seeds.
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  Speaker 1: And sometimes when somebody is reading the story for me,
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  Speaker 1: then it's like, okay, I'm going to let them design
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  Speaker 1: the picture for me. Or what Julia Cameron says, as
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  Speaker 1: the author, you paint the picture. Therefore, you know, so
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  Speaker 1: when you take it to a screenplay, now you've got
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  Speaker 1: to relinquish that control, don't you?
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  Speaker 2: Absolutely. A screenplay is the blueprint for the actors and
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  Speaker 2: the director to come in. I try to make it
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  Speaker 2: as camera-ready as possible. But the whole idea is to,
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  Speaker 2: as I say, show and tell. And by the way,
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  Speaker 2: Like on the latest screenplay I wrote called Bernie, The Spring,
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  Speaker 2: which is a story that's like Stand By Me meets
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  Speaker 2: The Great Santini. It's a crusty old gym teacher that
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  Speaker 2: takes these four boys, 15-year-olds, across the country in a
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  Speaker 2: state bed truck. And I was thinking along the way,
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  Speaker 2: you know, should I tell more about the character? Like
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  Speaker 2: in Stand By Me, they have the characters, you know,
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  Speaker 2: one's abused and one's brother died and another one's kind
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  Speaker 2: of a juvenile delinquent, you know. And then they go
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  Speaker 2: on and on with flashbacks about their backstory and all that.
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  Speaker 2: And I thought, you know what? Less is more. You
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  Speaker 2: give a little brush, in my case, one's a socialist
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  Speaker 2: and one's the son of a rich hedge fund guy, right?
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  Speaker 2: So they have a conflict, sort of like a political-social
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  Speaker 2: conflict in the truck, right? But you don't have to
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  Speaker 2: go into the fact that his father tried to drown
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  Speaker 2: him when he was three and all that stuff. So
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  Speaker 2: just let the audience fill it in and let the
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  Speaker 2: actor bring in the elements, the dynamics of that character.
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  Speaker 2: That's in a screenplay I'm talking about. Now, in a novel,
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  Speaker 2: maybe I would flesh that out a little bit more.
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  Speaker 1: Now, speaking of novels, I've got to know who Gladys
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  Speaker 1: McKinley is, because the way that you write about Gladys
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  Speaker 1: is that I feel like that you personally know her,
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  Speaker 1: that she's not just a character in a book. How
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  Speaker 1: wrong am I?
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  Speaker 2: You are right on the money, my friend. I can't
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  Speaker 2: believe how perceptive you are. This is quite revealing to me, even.
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  Speaker 2: When I was a child on 20 Hazel Lane, Larchmont,
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  Speaker 2: New York, right across my backyard, the famous author Gladys,
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  Speaker 2: I'm sorry, Dulles McGinley lived. She won a Pulitzer Prize
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  Speaker 2: for poetry in 2016. She'd actually lived at 12 Hazel
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  Speaker 2: Lane too, two doors down at various times too. But
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  Speaker 2: I remember her from Beach Avenue. And so I had
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  Speaker 2: my characters basically go up her Beach Avenue entrance on
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  Speaker 2: her long driveway and meet her there as Gladys McKinley. But...
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  Speaker 2: Later in life, out here in Los Angeles, I actually
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  Speaker 2: met a woman, and she's not with us anymore, but
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  Speaker 2: her name was Eleanor Basinski, and she was the wife
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  Speaker 2: and then widow of a great artist named Robert Basinski,
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  Speaker 2: and I have one of his paintings in my house here.
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  Speaker 2: And we piled around, and she took me under her wing,
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  Speaker 2: and she was, you know, like in her 70s or 80s,
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  Speaker 2: so it seemed. And I channeled Eleanor into that character work.
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  Speaker 2: Because I never knew Phyllis McGinley. So you're right on
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  Speaker 2: the money. I took a real person and morphed it
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  Speaker 2: into that character that had been inspired by some famous
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  Speaker 2: person that I never met. How do you like that?
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  Speaker 1: See, I do like that because.
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  Speaker 2: First person I've ever told that.
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  Speaker 1: I love that because I mean, and then when the
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  Speaker 1: other thing that you really do put in there and
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  Speaker 1: to me, it's almost like you're giving your reader an
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  Speaker 1: identity because a lot of readers nowadays don't feel like
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  Speaker 1: they belong. They belong inside your stories because I mean,
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  Speaker 1: you add religious, you have racial tensions, you have so
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  Speaker 1: many real things. And then you've got somebody like a
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  Speaker 1: Miss McKinley. And all of a sudden now I'm seeing
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  Speaker 1: myself inside your story. That is an art form, dude,
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  Speaker 1: that you have mastered.
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  Speaker 2: Thank you so much. Well, if I may, can I
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  Speaker 2: indulge you? Because I've been preparing, because I know you're
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  Speaker 2: a spiritual, religious man. In his Bar Mitzvah, he actually
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  Speaker 2: quotes Martin Luther King Jr., the three dimensions of a
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  Speaker 2: complete life, which are length, breadth, and height. May I
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  Speaker 2: go on briefly?
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  Speaker 1: Yes, please.
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  Speaker 2: Okay. This is quoting my character, Adam. He's telling them
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  Speaker 2: during our mitzvah, the length of life means that you
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  Speaker 2: must love yourself, accept yourself, and not try to be
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  Speaker 2: somebody else, and to figure out what in life you
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  Speaker 2: are called to do, and be the best of whatever
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  Speaker 2: you are. Breath of life is a concern with the
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  Speaker 2: welfare of others, to be a good Samaritan, and not
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  Speaker 2: to worry about what will happen to you if you
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  Speaker 2: do a good deed. But what would happen to the
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  Speaker 2: other person if you didn't do that good deed? Pite
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  Speaker 2: is concerned with the spiritual, and knowing that when you
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  Speaker 2: are right... God will fight your battle, but Martin is
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  Speaker 2: also a preacher, and he says that Jesus will never
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  Speaker 2: leave him alone. Isn't that neat? Oh, my God. That's
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  Speaker 2: the spiritual side of.
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  Speaker 1: You know I'm going to go back, and I'm going
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  Speaker 1: to write out every single word you said, and I'm
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  Speaker 1: going to put it inside this studio so that every
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  Speaker 1: day I come in here, I'm going to have that
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  Speaker 1: expression inside this room.
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  Speaker 2: I'm going to try, too, to remind myself of that
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  Speaker 2: now that you mention it. Martin Luther King is, I think,
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  Speaker 2: one of the... Five great Americans, I would say. I
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  Speaker 2: grew up with his era. And sadly, we've kind of
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  Speaker 2: forgotten him these days. You know what I mean? On
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  Speaker 2: the Martin Luther King Day, nothing but's happened. I think
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  Speaker 2: there's many more celebrations.
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  Speaker 1: Please do not move. There's more with Matthew Tucholsky coming
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  Speaker 1: up next. The Chestnut Tree. It's a book and it's
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  Speaker 1: a screenplay. We are back with Matthew Tucholsky. Once again,
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  Speaker 1: it goes all the way back to the thing that
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  Speaker 1: I said in the beginning. If we don't get this
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  Speaker 1: next generation to start reading books like your books and
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  Speaker 1: to understand what you're doing or to even watch your
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  Speaker 1: movies and to understand wordplay and that it doesn't just
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  Speaker 1: happen and it's not coming from my thumbs, that we're
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  Speaker 1: going to be missing out on something in the future.
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  Speaker 1: And that's why that we created View from the Writing
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  Speaker 1: Instrument on iHeart. It is the author. And I want
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  Speaker 1: the attention on the author. You are the star.
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  Speaker 2: Well, thanks. And funnily enough, in Hollywood, as you know,
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  Speaker 2: they sort of belittle the author as soon as they
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  Speaker 2: get the screenplay, even though nobody would be doing anything
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  Speaker 2: if they hadn't gotten the screenplay in the first place.
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  Speaker 2: But they immediately try to, not in my life, because
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  Speaker 2: what I'm doing is I'm working with a producer named
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  Speaker 2: Kelly Price of Price Productions, and we're developing these movies,
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  Speaker 2: which simply means trying to hire the most famous actors
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  Speaker 2: you possibly can and then get the money. That's what
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  Speaker 2: development really means. It's not rewriting my screenplay. Screenplay seems
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  Speaker 2: to be just fine. And so you try to do
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  Speaker 2: that that way. But the other way is to sell
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  Speaker 2: a screenplay to some studio where they just take the
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  Speaker 2: work and then you never see them again, right? In
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  Speaker 2: that scenario, they kind of belittle you. In my case,
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  Speaker 2: Kelly has been a big advocate of my writing and
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  Speaker 2: a big supporter. So I'm glad to be going in
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  Speaker 2: this direction, having control over my work, even if it
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  Speaker 2: takes a little longer to get to the screen.
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  Speaker 1: You bring up something that I've got to ask you
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  Speaker 1: because if I don't, I'm going to spend the rest
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  Speaker 1: of my life saying that you should have asked Matthew.
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  Speaker 1: And that is because you're talking about the actors and things.
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  Speaker 1: And I always thought that Hollywood has it wrong when
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  Speaker 1: it comes to the actors. And here's why. The authors
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  Speaker 1: and those that bring stories together, they are the greatest
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  Speaker 1: actors we will ever meet. Ever meet. And yet we
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  Speaker 1: don't get to see them on the screen. I think
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  Speaker 1: Hollywood's got it wrong. We need the authors to be
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  Speaker 1: the greatest actors. we'll ever meet.
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  Speaker 2: Well I like to think of myself as kind of
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  Speaker 2: a clown I'm a pretty good mimic and sometimes I
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  Speaker 2: tell a good story in private you know with my
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  Speaker 2: friends and things if you put me on screen I
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  Speaker 2: could probably pull something off but a great actor that
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  Speaker 2: you know has has all the chops and is kind
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  Speaker 2: of a wonder to behold so maybe a combination you
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  Speaker 2: mean put the author in as one of the actors
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  Speaker 2: i think so have them as the real author on
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  Speaker 2: the screen.
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  Speaker 1: Even on a murder mystery book i want the author
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  Speaker 1: up on that stand i want to hear their story
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  Speaker 1: because they lived it they they they've gone through the
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  Speaker 1: emotional exchange of everything that's taking place and it's like
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  Speaker 1: that's that's who i want to be i want to
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  Speaker 1: be that person that brought that book forward.
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  Speaker 2: That's a great idea. I'll tell Kelly. That's a great idea. Well,
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  Speaker 2: I've heard Hitchcock was a little bit like that when
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  Speaker 2: he introduced his TV shows. He didn't really write them,
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  Speaker 2: but he was sort of the front man. And imagine
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  Speaker 2: those shows without Hitchcock introducing them. He became the face
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  Speaker 2: of that. So I agree. That's a really... Great way
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  Speaker 2: of looking at things.
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  Speaker 1: Well, I mean, even Jordan Peele, I think, took that
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  Speaker 1: from Hitchcock with the way that he does the Twilight
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  Speaker 1: Zone and stuff like that. I expect to see Jordan
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  Speaker 1: Peele on there, not as the actor, but as somebody
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  Speaker 1: who's setting up that story.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, well, you could actually do, I think, I can't
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  Speaker 2: remember what it's called now, the fourth something or other,
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  Speaker 2: where you face the camera and you talk to it.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah.
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  Speaker 2: You break the.
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  Speaker 1: The fourth wall, the fourth wall. Yeah.
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  Speaker 2: Well, yeah, that would be interesting to have the author
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  Speaker 2: guide you through the story. That would be an interesting technique.
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  Speaker 2: It's a wonderful life where you watch Jimmy Stewart, this
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  Speaker 2: character with Clarence the Angel, and he goes back over
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  Speaker 2: his life. And that's like, you know what I mean?
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  Speaker 2: That's like looking at yourself from the distance. You could
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  Speaker 2: do that as the author.
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  Speaker 1: That'd be kind.
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  Speaker 2: Of tricky, but.
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  Speaker 1: Oh, but you've got the skills. You've got the skills.
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  Speaker 1: Where can people go to find out more about you, Matthew?
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  Speaker 2: My website is Matthew with one T. So it's M-A-T-H-E-W-E-E-K-U-L-S-A-Y.com.
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  Speaker 1: I was going to ask you about that with that
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  Speaker 1: one T and then thank God you brought that up.
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  Speaker 1: Thank you so much for your time today, Matthew. You
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  Speaker 1: got to come back and do this show again sometime.
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  Speaker 2: I would love to. Anytime.
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  Speaker 1: Well, you'd be brilliant today, okay?
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  Speaker 2: Okay. You already are, but thank you.
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  Speaker 1: You too.
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  Speaker 2: Keep it up.