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Choosing the Path of Leadership with Shane Malcolm · Authentic Living

0:01
Welcome to authentic living with Roxanne, a place where we have as conversations about
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things that really matter in our lives.
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And now here's your host, Roxanne Derhodge.
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Everyone, it's, Roxanne Durgesh.
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I'm authenticating with Roxanne.
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Thanks for tuning in again.
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Today, I have a young man that I met not too long ago.
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He was, the MC at events that I spoke at, and I had the privilege of seeing him with his funky
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silver jacket and and, entertaining the crowd suits.
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Thank you, Shane, for coming on today.
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Shane Malcolm.
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How are you today?
0:58
Good.
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Thanks for having me.
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Okay.
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So Shane has, done a lot of pretty interesting things in leadership.
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So he is the executive director of leadership Niagra and has been, in in that leadership role
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since 2016.
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He does, he helps organizations through things like brand development, governance reform, And
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she's worked with nonprofits, just overall for, for about 10 years.
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You've worked in that capacity.
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And he's recognized as a community leader who's passionate about transportation, the youth
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voice, inclusion and diversity, with communities.
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He is presently part of, assist in the boards of the St.
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Catherine's Club, the Boys And Girls Club of Niagara, and the Paris board member of the
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Greater, Chamber of Commerce and the past chair of Next Niagara Council.
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He's also won several awards and, the Niagara College distinguished alumni award in 2018.
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The interior's premier award in 17 and the recipient of the 40 under 40 business
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achievement award and the 2018 Pride Niagara, ED Aldrin Award winner.
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He's from Montego Bay.
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So he's from the my part of the woods that I grew up with.
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And, he lives here, and we're fortunate to have him here in Niagara where I'm also from.
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So, Shane, is there anything that I missed that you'd like to highlight?
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Cause I know you've done so much in in a short period of time, I would say.
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Thank you.
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No, I've only been with not for profits.
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We're about 6 years altogether.
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The Initiative Niagara has been around since 2007.
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But I stepped in in an acting role in 2016, for a couple months, and then I became the ED later
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on in that year.
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So, very exciting, space to be in.
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But most of my background before from enough a profit side was with student governance.
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Where I was running the Niagara College Student Administrative Council for 2 years prior to my
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role here.
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So tell us about your path.
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I mean, you're obviously in a pretty senior position at a a very young age, and you've done
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a lot What kind of got you wanting to get involved in leadership?
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You know what?
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It's one of those things where think for me looking at my journey, whenever I talk about
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it, it really starts all the way back to a version of myself in grade 12, where I was on
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the path to sciences, like my entire, upbringing, my entire trajectory was, on the
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path of becoming a marine biologist of some sort, or I was thinking at the time, ecosystem
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restoration So I had no intention of one coming to Canada, and I ended up in grade 12.
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Just having what I consider my first conversation with myself about what is it that
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you would like to do, enjoy doing and versus what you have the attitude to do.
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Because I think for for many of us, whether it's our kids or people that we know, we're on
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a path because that's the what we're exposed to, and that so happens to kind of create its
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own set of you know, stop gaps as you kind of go through.
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And so for me, that was my first moment where I stopped this thing in a very nunch a lot way,
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or kind of silly way.
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I was like, what would I enjoy doing with my life?
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Like, I've done sciences.
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I don't see myself being in a lab looking through a microscope for the rest of my life.
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And it was a very somewhat cynical comment about, I think I'm too interesting of a person
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to be stuck in a lab.
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And so that led me on the journey of, you know, the things that I was involved in as a young
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individual that I could turn into a career.
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And funny enough, my career started out being in the culinary world.
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So I moved from Jamaica to be here in Canada to pursue culinary arts.
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I was gonna be a chef.
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I did that for a number of years.
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My my diplomas in culinary, my degrees in, hospitality operations.
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So I had zero interest in a, or I didn't have, a path directly to say I'm gonna work in an not
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for profit space, but it's interesting how my my path has evolved from, you know, wanting to
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be a chef to having my own food network show to get, yeah, getting involved with student
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government during my time at Niagara College And that really spurred a lot of the community
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work and, advocacy that I was doing both locally and, provincially.
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And I think that then led to its own set of by the time I graduated my degree, I was looking
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at oh, I've done a lot of this community work, civic minded stuff.
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And I was having a real, another one of those life moments of, like, forking the road, where
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do you go?
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You know, here I was moved here for a degree in a very specific field adding the pressure of
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also being an immigrant where, for me, something I always say, there's there's a
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different set of sensibilities and, pressure that one puts on himself when you're not
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necessarily from when you're an immigrant in a country.
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Right?
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You don't feel you necessarily have the freedoms to change your mind at a whim.
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So for me, there was a lot of pressure in imposing myself, nothing from my parents where
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I felt I came here to be one thing I need to be that.
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And so deviations from that path really took a while to happen because or to accept because I
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didn't really see those back then as an evolution of self you tend to see those things
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as failures, right?
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Like, I didn't become what I set out to be.
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So I failed at becoming a chef.
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I failed at becoming a hospitality professional that was going to, you know, work his way up to
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director of food and beverage at a large hotel.
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And so it took those maybe 3 different moments in my career, my life where I flipped the
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switch on seeing the things that I was getting involved in and what doors they were opening up
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for me and what path they were leading me down to to be okay with kind of following those path
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or opening those doors, even if it's not what the very linear, idea of where you should be,
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what's taking you.
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So my my role of leadership, Niagara, and even in the in in in the space has definitely been
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not something I was planning or was prepared for.
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But I think it's just one of those key lessons of you're kind of listening to the
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opportunities as they get presented life is kind of happening all around you.
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And I think many of us, we kind of miss those, calling, and you can have multiple callings, I
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do believe.
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But miss those opportunities that are primed for you at the time instead of being very hard
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and fast about this is what I'm set out to do, and this is what I'm supposed to be based on,
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you know, whatever metric we decided on years ago.
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So even though I've been in my role for, you know, 4 years, I feel that it was a very slow
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burn into even really stepping fully into the opportunity that was provided at leadership in
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Niagara when accepting as an acting role because that that juncture in my career as well
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was one of many, another one of those kind of fork in the road moments.
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So I had a full, career and formal education in a, in a specific sector, in a specific field.
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And then I had 4 years, 3 to 4 years, 4 years of, postsecondary student government advocacy
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community work, experience, and I was yet then met, like, what do I do with this?
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Like, where do I go as a was budding hospitality professional to somebody that had
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really gotten gross with, local transit advocacy and provincial advocacy work for
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college students across the province.
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And I didn't feel like I was cuddled anymore to be that food and beverage director.
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Like, I just didn't see my self in a very, not cliched role, but just working up the normal
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ranks of a hospital, the, firm.
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And so I was then met with what do I do?
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Right.
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And and I knew part of my the challenge to you as a young professional was always navigating
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the space that we exist in right now, a boat credentialism.
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Right?
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So here I was looking at formal education and one thing that it experiences in a lot.
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And I think for you know, where the workforce is today and where or leaders of organizations
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and how we kind of recruit and find people, there is this humongous pressure placed on the
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credentials that one that we have.
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Right?
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You look at org generation wherein post secondary education, far longer than most
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generation previous generations had to be to get into entry level positions.
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Right?
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So it it would it definitely dawned on me as far as, okay, how do you articulate that lived
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experience to the next role that you should have and what does that mean as far as
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transferable skills.
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And I could tell you, I think even going through that transition, there's a lot I think
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that from a, from a leadership standpoint, I think a lot of people still just look for
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titles.
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Right?
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They look for the previous roles that you've had in their specific industry and not
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necessarily look at the transferable skills that really come from those different lived
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experiences.
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Right?
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I got a lot of nos earlier on, like, well, you've never you've never been a manager of a
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restaurant.
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I'm like, yes, but I Roxanne enough for profit student union with 9 senior staff and 8 board
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of 12 board of directors and the gambit.
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Right?
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So it was just a very interesting thing to see how people heckled, or how deep people went in
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terms of just trying to figure out what leadership skills or competencies somebody has
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to bring to the table regardless of whether the credentials itself speak to that or, the
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Libticks experiences that that individual has, allows them the ability and the capacity to
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thrive in a unique space.
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Right?
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So So with senior with with young people, right, and and I will hear it all the time.
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In my time when I graduated, back in 1987, you know, with an undergraduate degree.
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There was so many options.
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It seemed like there was so many options available to me back then, Shane, compared to
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what the young people coming out today, they'll you'll hear them.
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You'll hear people you know, like I live in a little town here in Niagara Falls and, you
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know, this lovely girl, she she, she's at the drive through.
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Lovely, lovely girl.
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Background in psychology has a psychology degree.
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You'll hear all these young people saying education today is not valued same way.
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And are with your to your point, technology is changing so much, and there's so many pressures
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that and people in my generation say compared to yours, you're right.
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We're kinda looking have the, you know, what what's the initial there?
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Mhmm.
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What have you done related to my fields?
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And I probably got, you know, this thick of, resumes that I may potentially have to look at
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to decide who's gonna be the person at the top of the pile.
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Right?
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So what's What do you find out with young people out there?
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What are you seeing when when you're talking about pivoting, which I I'll give you my pivot.
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I was gonna go to law school at Capehill.
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And didn't get accepted.
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Okay.
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I decided, okay.
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I'm going a lot.
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Okay.
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And then I pivoted, and then I went back to grad school and decided to, become the
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psychotherapist.
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It happens to all of us.
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Right?
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Well, yeah.
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Sure.
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You know, but go back to young people.
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What are you seeing out there?
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Because there's a lot of really highly educated people with a lot of transfer or little skills
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that I would think are experiencing a bit of disillusionment because there isn't as much out
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there or the perception is that they can't get jobs in a particular arena that they're looking
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at.
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Mhmm.
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Yeah.
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I I think the the context that we're in the entire generation 4540 under, is looking at is
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because the cookie cutter world of the previous generation where you know, jobs were as as
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described unique to the, you know, I can pluck you out of a post secondary experience and pop
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you right into a career or a pet, I think what we've had to do as an entire generation or
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learn to do as an entire generation is pivoting, I guess, becomes more of a thing that
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is required more than a a happenstance that just you know, comes from whether or not being
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accepted into a program to it's it's an intentionality behind, you know, and so I
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guess, to go back to that point quickly, I think there's a little bit of a understanding
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note that the path to a job secure, unsecured part time precarious.
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That's a whole different, discussion is it's a combination of educational experiences.
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You know, I think prior to the last 15 or so years, it was you go to university stream or
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you go to college and you kind of step directly into a job.
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No.
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The workforce is saying to us that, well, we need you to have the highest level of education
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possible to get in the door, but we also don't have the time to train or do any workforce
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development as the previous generation had to to do as they went into their jobs.
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So now you have this kind of triaging from college university and university to college,
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where it's the average student is is now navigating both spaces in or by the time they
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get out to, let's say, pursue a job, which I think compounds the cost of education that it
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is today And then it it's compounded by the the lack of readily available jobs that really meet
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those skill sets right away.
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To know you have these credentials and very few of the 100 and 1000 of students that graduate
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from similar programs have an ability to take up a space or a job in that space.
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And so it does require a little bit of entrepreneurship or entrepreneurship from from
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our standpoint as far as taking our careers into her own hands, because for many of us,
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it's not the 1+1 equals two equation that leads us to our career.
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It's a combination of different things, and really taking a step back to figure out how you
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can chart almost your own path or creating your own space in order for those unique combination
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of skillsets and gifts that you have to be, a contributing factor to where you go.
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So people have to work, like, to my point, I went to, you know, U of T.
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I I graduated 21.
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I tried to go to Mona didn't get accepted.
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I thought, okay.
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Well, go to grad school.
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And then I went to grad school, and I didn't so but things kinda lined up in a way.
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It didn't feel simple back then.
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Yeah.
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But what you're what you're saying today is take someone like me in this day and age.
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They go out to get, you know, do the traditional thing.
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They still would have to be, work extra hard to be able to have people recognize their skills.
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Mhmm.
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And they you'd almost have to build a brand in a way.
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You're building a brand.
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So You're Shane Malcolm the brand.
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I'm Roxanne Derhodge, the brand.
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Mhmm.
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And that's a lot of pressure, I would say compared to when I was gonna, you know, school
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24.
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I was just thinking, get me a job.
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Get me a job.
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Right?
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Now you're saying you're finished.
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You're 24, 25, whatever years old.
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And on top of that, not only have you gone through, you have to still pay your bills,
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maybe do do a job just to be able to get by.
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You have student loan debt, those types of things.
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And by the way, you gotta brand yourself because
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Yeah.
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You're one of you're one of those and other people.
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Not that that's uniquely different than in previous generations, but I think, it it's
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slightly different in the sense of the volume people that are accessing post secondary
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education know compared to previous generation.
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So it is somewhat more competitive because the laws of a land now, so to speak, is that you
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need to go through that channel in order to be successful, very few people are doing it
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straight from a high school to success.
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Right?
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So everybody is being filtered in some way, shape, or form through a post secondary
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institution.
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Or a combination thereof.
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So it is more difficult because where institutions are churning out thousands of
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people within specific fields and and careers.
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And I think what is also, something that as a society, we're adjusting to is that we're all
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living healthier better lives.
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And so people aren't clearly retiring in the same speed that, previous generations have.
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And so now you're having 2 generations kinda meet up in the workforce.
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And how do you how do you earn the big, I guess it takes back that back to that conversation of
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how do you earn your key in a space now where you'll okay.
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Well, I thought before I had the credentials, and I can't have all the credentials and the
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lived experiences at the same time.
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I'm either a master student or a PhD candidate, with very little, work experience, So how do
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you how do you navigate that?
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And I think that's just a quandary that we're all, trying to wrestle with as you figure out
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the best way to kinda hustle your way through your your your chosen career or field.
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So I gotta I gotta just say it.
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You know, I listen to you and I I I think, wow, how you've thought this through because you've
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lived through it and you pivoted accordingly to get where you are.
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Mhmm.
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So there's a lot of young people that are gonna say, okay, Mister Malcolm.
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How do I do it?
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I'm educated.
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I've done things.
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I I'm doing the part time jobs, and I'm trying to get into my field?
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Like, what what directions would you give, you know, young adults that are getting out there
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in trying and they're knocking on the doors and they're sending the emails and they're
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networking and they're doing all those things.
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What have you found that's kinda worked for people that are wanting to get into young
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leadership roles because you you all are the next generation that's gonna take over the the
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helm.
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Maybe we're holding on a little bit too long.
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But at the end of the day, you're gonna take it over, and there's a lot of people out there
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that are ready, but maybe they don't know how to kind of maneuver.
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Yeah.
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You know what?
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One of those things is, it's it's an interesting thing because I believe this, and I
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I heard it echoed by Adele of all people once.
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It was in reference to, you know, I think one of her many Grammy winning albums and you for
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her, she attributed her sex success, whether it is her, what was her first album nineteen, she
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really said it.
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It was, yes, I have talent.
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I am a great singer, but it was also just luck.
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Like, right time, right place, kind of combination.
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And I do think there is a little bit of or a whole lot of that to play in terms of how many
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of us are able to really tap into it because what what I look at is every Most people that I
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know are doing what you're saying.
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Right?
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You're networking.
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You're trying yes.
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You could probably say tips and tricks on networking better or shortening those things,
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but they're trying to put themselves in those in those spaces.
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We're saying to it's no longer just the a student that are have this mindset of, oh, I
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need to be a volunteer.
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I need to have straight a's.
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I need to be on all these different things, because it's in those organic non, specific
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things that you're doing, that the opportunities themselves might present.
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So it's weird to kinda say it's a little bit of, I think, luck and timing has a lot to do
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with you know, what doors, get open.
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And I think part of that as well is just being open to the things that may not suit what you
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think your path is.
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Right?
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So I think the way we're kind of conditioned and we've always been conditioned is success is
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a straight path.
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I think that sets us up everybody.
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It sets it sets us up for the unrealistic expectations of what life is.
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Right?
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Life is more of you know, going upstream, you have your, you know, periods of rapids and and
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and so forth.
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And I think when we paint this, picture that it is all a linear approach.
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You do this.
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You do this.
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You do this.
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It really sets you up for a larger downfall or at least the sense of failure because all
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you've been told is if you go to school, if you do this thing, you do this thing, and you
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graduate with this grade or this distinction, you should get a job.
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No.
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You've done all those things that your parents or teachers have required of you, and then
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you're at this juncture of okay, where where are these opportunities?
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Why can't I seem to get in?
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And I don't know beyond what you've already said, and I think beyond what we we all try to
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do is to say you do need to I think it's that knowledge that you can't be just a book smart
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person anymore.
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It does require you to build a brand and what that brand is is in part about you getting out
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there and being in the spaces beyond what your whether it's volunteering or, you know, doing
23:59
projects in the community, I think those things get you in front of more people that allow for
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maybe organic conversations of, oh, Roxanne, what's your background, or what do you do?
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And you know, I went to school first so and so, and I'm currently, and those things might
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organically lead to that because I think the the other part of maybe the what we maybe need
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to say differently about getting out there, it's not about the volunteering perspective.
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It's more about the building relationships.
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Right?
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Which I think which I think is the constant here because I can tell you, you know, Shane, I
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lived in Niagara Falls and have been an executive in Toronto.
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I have taught grad school.
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I have taught at Niagara College.
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I have worked at the hospital.
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And and I never left Niagara I mean, once I moved hear from Trinidad.
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I never left Niagara.
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And to your point, I think it is really truly at the end of the day relationship.
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If you think about how I met you, I'm I I did some work with the Yvonne, and then you were
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the MC at HR disrupt.
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It's, you're you're so right when because I think the one thing that I think is very, very
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important to from what I heard you say is, Success is not a linear line.
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However, every position that you take, there is skills associated.
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Thank you.
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That you are gleaning and taking with you.
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Right?
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Like, you're like,
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you're building you're building yourself up.
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This is something I said when I so I recently had the the honor of being a convocation
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speaker at Nairo College for their, 2019 fall convocation.
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Wow.
25:40
Nice.
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And one of the things I said to them is as much as education right now, and we talk about, you
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know, having to go to university and college and and all that stuff and you might start out
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in history and end up in, you know, a different field altogether is yes, there is an expense
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that goes to it with that.
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But at the same time, we're all taking pieces of those, lived experiences or educational
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experiences that we have into the next role that you have.
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So when we think about you know, the term hustling or putting in the time to get better,
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it's really not about the job that you have at hand I always say it's a boat bettering
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yourself for the your future role.
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Right?
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So the there are things when and if we ever stop to really think fully, and I challenge
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people to do an exercise of kind of reflecting on who you are right now as an individual maybe
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the traits and, things that are not necessarily whether unique about you or that you find are
26:48
your cornerstone qualities.
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And just try to do a a a road map backwards of where those where those skill sets would have
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come from or be honed or and what elements of your life would contribute to you having this
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persona right now?
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And it's very interesting because I I've, you know, people who describe me as very method.
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I'm very meticulous and mythological in terms of how I approach things, and it there's a
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rhyme or reason in order to how I tend to operate.
27:23
And you take that back to you know, my time as a budding scientist, right, the scientific
27:29
method and your steps and your methodology and you're breaking things down, to, you know,
27:35
being a chef where your me zone plus having all your ingredients before you start doing and
27:40
cooking your meals.
27:41
Like, all those things lead to the version of me right now as an AD that approaches a lot of
27:48
things in, but we never stopped to think you know, oh, my time as a chef or my time as,
27:56
within this field, for you, your time being a potential lost student, what those unique
28:03
insights or, the the attitude that is required to thrive in that space, what what is that how
28:10
does that play into the roles that you have?
28:13
No.
28:13
Or or eve or even, you know, and I always say that my I I wanted to help people.
28:18
I thought, you know, I was trying to figure out different.
28:20
And, you know, I grew up in the Caribbean till I was sixteen.
28:22
Back then, it was doctor, a lawyer engineer, owner, And I'm like, okay.
28:26
I don't fit any of those in my I'm like, okay.
28:28
Well, I like to talk to people.
28:29
And I think sometimes it's even I remember my father, and he was, you know, a senior director
28:35
quite young in my life.
28:37
And he was so good with people that when my father spoke to anyone.
28:42
It was like nobody else was in the room.
28:45
So I even think back now, and I know I have that quality, and I've been told that And I
28:49
think here I am.
28:50
I probably was a little toddler flying around looking at that interaction and learning.
28:55
Mhmm.
28:56
You're picking
28:56
up things.
28:57
Yeah.
28:57
Right.
28:58
Absolutely.
28:58
And I was thinking, well, that wasn't the skill I learned in school.
29:01
Oh, I
29:01
looked at learned it from my trinidadian culture.
29:04
I'd and the connection and what I saw my dad do.
29:07
So we're always picking up things.
29:09
Right?
29:09
And, you know, I think that young leaders today, and you I wanna pivot back to this
29:14
because I think of when I became a leader, What you're talking about is I didn't have those
29:19
skills back then.
29:21
Back, you know, I learned that, you know, when I was in a senior position, because I had some,
29:27
but I I I was like, oh, boy.
29:28
Here, you know, I've taken this position.
29:30
What am I doing?
29:31
And then I learned it.
29:33
I think young leaders today are coming a lot more equipped to to the workforce than say
29:38
someone like me that was in my mid twenties to like late twenties.
29:41
I you know, it was like taking the positions, and it's kinda like, oh, boy.
29:45
I better be able to fish in this pond.
29:47
And then,
29:48
you know, I stumbled up, whereas it sounds like the younger generation is coming They're coming
29:53
with a whole lot of experiences to the workforce.
29:58
Right.
29:59
Right?
29:59
And so they could hit the the ground running.
30:01
So I wanna talk about management and, hiring young leaders because I think that's important
30:09
Like you said, people, you know, the the older generations kinda not we're staying a little
30:13
bit too low, maybe further along.
30:15
So you're getting that that cross section of young leadership with a senior leadership
30:20
that's a bit older.
30:21
Right?
30:21
So when you're hiring new leaders now, what do what do senior executives?
30:27
And CEOs need to think about with with, younger leaders today when they're thinking about
30:33
prospective hires.
30:36
You know what?
30:36
I think one of I think one of the things that I always find that, you know, it's like, oh,
30:47
well, as to your point earlier, when we started off, you're saying, well, maybe you know, some
30:51
people are thinking, well, we don't understand the this generation or we we don't fully
30:57
understand, what they might be looking for.
31:00
And that might be true in in some ways, but I often find that and I've said this to people
31:08
before.
31:08
I'm like, the same things that you were looking for when you were my age or starting out in
31:14
your career or whatever stage you were, those are the same things that people are looking for
31:19
right now.
31:20
Those things haven't fundamentally changed.
31:23
There might be there is a difference in maybe how this generation is where there are more
31:30
people that are looking for works that are a career that is fulfilling rather than the
31:36
mindset and become from a Caribbean culture where the overall culture or or tone towards
31:44
work is not really one of enjoyment.
31:47
You know, really different talking about being fulfilled in what they're doing.
31:52
It's it's it's what you do.
31:54
This is what grown ups do.
31:55
You work.
31:56
You put food on the table.
31:57
It's sustenance.
31:59
So the the notion of, you know, this kind of fluffy feeling of fulfillment doesn't really
32:07
make its way into the conversation.
32:09
And I think sometimes too when we look when the current CEOs and industry leaders when you look
32:16
at what we're hiring, I think we tend to want to think that we're worlds apart.
32:22
From the next generation.
32:24
Right?
32:24
And given some of those slight changes, whether it's, you know, there are more people that want
32:28
to think I want to find purpose.
32:31
And that's not only an employee driven, mandate or requirement, that's from us as consumers
32:40
looking to companies that are more than their bottom line that are more than just what they
32:46
do.
32:47
Right?
32:47
So everybody's looking for purpose and deeper meaning beyond, you know, what is it that
32:53
you're manufacturing or you're producing?
32:55
So I think one is take getting rid of that mindset that, oh, well, you know, this
33:02
generation is looking to be fulfilled, not every role in your organization is going to
33:06
bring healing to you or tickle that that particular spot and instead see see those
33:15
future leaders or or people that you're looking to hire as a reflection of the consumer base or
33:21
the clientele that is there in the world that are also requiring, more value and purpose
33:27
driven and the things that aren't for, or authentic, leaders and organizations and
33:36
companies.
33:36
Right?
33:37
That's not just, that's not just a an employee thing.
33:43
And I think specifically for for, I guess, one thing to think about, is that I think more
33:51
people on in in the younger generation, maybe.
33:54
I don't know.
33:54
There are no stats on my on my side to confirm this.
33:58
May be equally looking at interviews.
34:01
I know I do this where an interview is at 2 a street I'm looking at as much as I want this
34:07
job, I'm looking for whether or not you're a good fit for me, whether or not your cult, your
34:14
value, your culture, your space, your ethos, like all those things are all things that I
34:19
assess as the other side, on the other side of the table saying, is this a supportive work
34:24
environment?
34:25
Do I think there's room to to grow.
34:29
Do I think there is, capacity to, or interest in that individual saying you know, even within
34:36
the very restrictive roles that we may have to have in organization that there's room for
34:41
individuality.
34:42
There's room for you to bring who you are.
34:45
And I think that's one of the greatest struggles of the transitioning industries is we
34:52
are in we're literally almost coming from a manufacturing assembly line industry from the
34:59
past.
35:00
Metaphorically speaking as well where, no, the workforce and the people force are demanding or
35:08
expecting that okay.
35:11
Well, we are and I think Bernie Brown says this perfectly.
35:14
We're here worrying about, you know, robots taking over or jobs and and cancelling people
35:20
out of, every single thing.
35:22
And yet, or current workplace culture is saying, Hey, Roxanne, you leave your
35:28
individuality at the door and come into our organizational box and just produce.
35:35
Don't think the don't just do.
35:38
And we're not allowing people to to show up as who they are.
35:44
And allow those unique skill sets to come through because I think that is where the true
35:49
spirit of entrepreneurship gets to thrive as these individuals say, Hey, here's a spin that
35:57
we can make because this is a passion of mine.
35:59
This is something I this is a unique perspective that I bring to the table.
36:05
So I think, leaders right now need to, when we're we're looking at hiring or replacing or
36:12
themselves, there's really a lot of hustling that's there.
36:16
And I do think each generation gets a bad wreck from the previous one.
36:21
Right?
36:22
Everybody has it harder than the the previous one.
36:25
And I think we need to maybe get away from that very black and wide conversation of who's had
36:31
it the worst and just understand the unique set of challenges that are plaguing this particular
36:38
generation.
36:39
You don't necessarily have to live it to understand it.
36:42
There's intersectionality that exists.
36:44
And I always say, I don't there's intersectionality between my lived experience
36:49
as a young black male to the intersectionality of any woman in the workforce.
36:55
The same things that I do as a mental calculation may be the same things that a young
37:01
leader, a young female, or woman of color, would have to do, in the same space, right?
37:08
And we don't necessarily have to all live those experiences but we can all find an area of
37:14
intersectionality that allows us to get a sense or to glean a little bit of perspective around,
37:23
where that individual may be coming from and what we could do to address that.
37:27
Does that
37:28
And I think, you know, to your point, and it it you know, nothing against my generation.
37:33
I think we just did I just kinda plotted a path.
37:37
Mhmm.
37:37
And I I think what's happening is the knowledge that a young leader, let's say, you know, I was
37:42
in a position to hire a young leader, you would be challenging me in a way that would have to I
37:48
would constantly have to think.
37:49
And I I would have to of course, what we know in the workplace is that, presentingism, short
37:57
term disability, all those things are rising.
37:59
Right?
38:00
So people want purpose.
38:02
Mhmm.
38:02
And like you're right, the men manufacturing mentality that we're coming out of, and we're
38:06
shifting thing.
38:06
That's that's reality.
38:08
Technology is driving our workplaces today.
38:12
It's forcing us to deal with what's in front of us.
38:15
Like, to your point, we're evolving, but there's gonna be better along the way.
38:19
Yes.
38:19
There's gonna be, deficits but there's also better.
38:23
So when I think of my, you know, young leaders and I, you know, when you talk to young people,
38:27
they they want meaning.
38:28
They want purpose.
38:29
They want work life balance.
38:30
Things that I would be like, and when I was, you know, when I was, you know, you know, in
38:35
the workplace, it was like, oh, work like balance.
38:37
Okay.
38:38
Sure.
38:38
I'll figure that out later.
38:39
And now I realized that, you know, had I, at that time, it's timing too.
38:44
Right?
38:44
I'm talking, you know, 10, 15 years ago.
38:47
How it's different.
38:48
Right?
38:49
You know, you have policies in place.
38:50
You have, you know, digital kind of limitations with with, you know, texting, all that stuff.
38:56
So in a way, because we've had this massive shift into technology, it's also forced us to
39:01
start to look at what's in our best interest of keeping people a healthy and happy at work.
39:07
Right?
39:07
And the younger generations bringing that in, and they're saying, well, no.
39:10
No.
39:10
No.
39:10
I I don't wanna work the 60 hour week or I wanna be able to work on a project where I I
39:16
can leave my a bit of my footprints.
39:17
And I so I think it's challenging, the the workplace in a lots of good ways Yes.
39:23
At times, there's gonna be intersections like to your point where there's gonna be conflict
39:26
based on, different, you know, generations, but is that now where growth can come?
39:32
Yeah.
39:32
And and I think to, you know, I I think the I'm a passionate millennial.
39:38
Like, I I wear that word with pride because I feel I'm always defending my age range.
39:48
You know, we're constantly under attack as far as, you know, what people say about, oh,
39:53
millennials are entitled.
39:55
Millennials are you know, lazy and, you know, don't wanna work.
39:59
And I'm like, yes, but I don't know.
40:01
Yes.
40:01
And they're entitled to people in every generation.
40:04
They're entitled to people they're lazy people in every generation.
40:07
Like, it's not unique to to us, but at the same time, you say that and I can find you for every
40:16
person that you're you're entitled, I can find you 2 or 3 millennials that are doing 3, 4 jobs
40:21
that are, you know, also trying to find time to volunteer and do those kind of things.
40:27
So it's just a very weird thing if as industry leaders were in our corner saying, well, I know
40:33
what you guys lack and I know what you guys don't have.
40:38
And that challenge is seeing as, well, don't question don't question me.
40:44
I've been here long enough, and my It's not a question of your, history and no, it's just a
40:51
question that may come from a different perspective.
40:54
Because I'm an external body to what you've been probably consumed with your entire life.
41:02
And I look back to, a friend of mine who was partially raised in friends, And when he came
41:10
here, he's he's from St.
41:12
Lucia, then he wants friends to live for a couple years.
41:16
And we would always have this conversation about you know, how French people are, you
41:23
know, seen as very, to the point and blunt and There's all they're very inquisitive and always
41:29
asking.
41:30
And when he came here to study, he said, like, he had such a hard time because even basic
41:36
things that I don't even think we're paying attention to, the North American kind of
41:41
culture, especially in an education standpoint, is not really to question.
41:46
It's to I'm the I'm the institutional knowledge.
41:50
I pass this on to you.
41:51
You take it wholesome, and then you go.
41:54
Where in and I and we do this in the Caribbean too.
41:57
There's a lot of critical thinking that happens earlier on in high school.
42:01
Right?
42:01
I think critical thinking really becomes a thing here in college, university.
42:07
And so you have people that immigrate here from different, more stricter educational
42:13
backgrounds or, And anyway, but what he was saying is he noticed that the biggest
42:20
difference between him living in France and coming to school and work and working here is
42:27
we take what is so commonplace in the French culture as kids are expected to ask why at
42:35
every single turn, right, the the high school system is structured in that way.
42:40
If you're not, challenging your teacher in why are you saying this?
42:44
It's not re it's not taken as, well, I went to school for this.
42:47
Why are you asking me why?
42:48
It is what it is.
42:50
And we fail to try to sell the why we just say, hey, I'm the institutional knowledge, I'm the
42:56
industry leader, go, and do that.
42:59
And I think that's part whether that's a complete North American construct, where we
43:05
just want people to be informed and just kind of go with the flow and we see any stop and,
43:14
momentary question of, you know, why as a negative thing where it's a it's an insult to
43:23
to what I bring to the table.
43:25
Clearly, you don't need to ask me why because I clearly know what it is.
43:28
And I think our organizational leaders too will have to And I think some are definitely getting
43:35
that on where it's not the leadership versus management thing.
43:39
It's not just saying you need to jump.
43:41
It's a justification of why you're jumping.
43:44
And I think for some, it's unpacking that wire, to not be the, well, I don't owe you anything.
43:53
You're just the cog in the wheel.
43:55
Right.
43:56
If
43:56
you have that mentality, it's probably off to a wrong start.
43:59
So millennials really are disrupting us to become more creative and think systemically
44:04
different.
44:05
Yeah.
44:05
To some degree, which is what kinda your friend from, France was saying, you know, if you're if
44:11
you're spurting creativity, And that's where your brain is, and that's kinda what the
44:15
millennials have brought to us.
44:17
Not that we didn't have it too, but we had it more of in a traditional way.
44:21
And now and I think of my son who's 18, and I'm thinking, oh, boy, what what what what are they
44:25
gonna bring?
44:26
Right?
44:26
Right.
44:27
Yeah.
44:27
So I think it's about saying to your point, leadership that are looking at, like, young
44:33
leaders to say, you know what?
44:34
This is an opportunity.
44:36
Mhmm.
44:36
Because I have this young person that has had all this, like, to your point lived
44:39
experiences, and they're they're wanting different things.
44:42
They're gonna have a different way of thinking that could actually impact your leadership out
44:48
there in your sector, whatever sector you're in.
44:51
Yeah.
44:51
Yeah.
44:51
And it yeah.
44:52
And I and I think the other thing too is, I think our industry leaders, we I think the
45:00
leadership of all our industries, no, we have to find a way for the workforce to go up to put
45:09
a little bit more slack in the waistband for development to happen.
45:15
Like, I think we've gone too far into the expectation of you need to be the exact model
45:22
of what I need by the time you end up or get out of postsecondary, and there's not any
45:28
wiggle room there for, that empowerment and development, right?
45:33
And I and I've heard this all the time.
45:36
Well, the workforce is very different or global economy is very different.
45:39
We don't have the time to stop and nurture anything.
45:44
So we need people to come in and go, go, go, go, go, and, and and, like, well, you can't
45:50
really have that because it's those things don't happen in in the same space, whether you
45:56
get the learn it experience from an educational standpoint, or you're getting the lived
46:01
experience from actually doing it.
46:03
But to say that you need that perfect combination from every single facet, I think is
46:09
doing or future leadership procurement more harm than good because we're expecting
46:15
everybody to be the best version of themselves when you get them.
46:19
And there's no patience, I think, in the system anymore.
46:25
Again, heartening back to the factory days where you're taking a high school student, into
46:31
a factory job, it the system was built and designed to teach you what you needed to know
46:37
in order to be a
46:39
thriving Right.
46:40
It says in that space, no, we've kind of taken that out of the equation and replaced that with
46:46
the need to be in post secondary a lot longer.
46:49
So I think we need to find a little bit more slack in that space to say, you know, how do we
46:57
then And I don't have the answer for this.
47:00
How do we create that slack in the workforce that allows us to to give the Roxanne sands and
47:05
machines and the the other up and comers room to
47:11
To thrive because they need to thrive.
47:13
So I think I think I'll give you an example.
47:15
This is funny, and I know we're probably overtime, but When I started my corporate job,
47:19
it was in Toronto.
47:20
And like I said, I was, like, twenty seven years old, and so I would you know, portfolio.
47:25
And I, you know, here I am at this portfolio I'm taking on, I'm thinking, oh my goodness.
47:29
How am I gonna do this?
47:30
Right?
47:30
I'm an account executive, blah blah blah.
47:32
And I remember my first renewal.
47:34
And I was like, oh my god.
47:35
What am I gonna do?
47:35
It's a huge company.
47:37
And I remember sitting across from my board, my my boss, who was lovely, love, like, mentoring,
47:43
I think, is important here.
47:44
Mhmm.
47:45
And he sat.
47:46
Right?
47:46
Like, here I am, I'm overwhelmed.
47:47
It's not that it wasn't over it was just the whole process of going through the the metrics
47:52
and what was happening in the company and pricing and all that.
47:55
And he sat with me because he knew it was it was my first renewal, right, can't screw the
47:59
first one
48:00
up.
48:00
Yeah.
48:00
And then he sat with me and at some as simple as going through CPI and all that stuff.
48:04
It was a multi level contract and all that.
48:07
And he taught me certain things that just, you know, I knew it, but it was the confidence to
48:13
get up and sit across from a board to renew a contract.
48:16
It was, you know, new you know, big company in Toronto.
48:19
And he basically, figuratively held my hand before I went into the meeting, and then it was
48:24
fine.
48:24
And I think that's what you're talking about.
48:27
Is like even though globalization is happening in digital technology, we need to figure out a
48:33
way to, effectively mentor young people because we won't be able to retain them.
48:39
Mhmm.
48:40
Yeah.
48:40
If we don't, if we don't and we don't bring them along with the proper mentorship.
48:45
And I can think of Richard, and I I to this day, I became a successful a leader and an
48:51
executive because of him because he took that time, me being so young with, you know, kinda,
48:57
you know, small fish, big pond kind of thing.
49:00
I was overwhelmed.
49:01
I was, you know, young and I had some education and some experience, but I didn't have a lot of
49:05
it.
49:05
And at the end of 10 years, guess what?
49:08
You know, I was I was seasoned.
49:09
I was, you know, one of the top in in the arena that I was working.
49:14
So I think we do have to change the practices even though globalization and the quickness of
49:20
turnaround is increasing, we have to go back to some of the basics to onboarding but using it
49:26
in a creative way so it doesn't take out from the bottom line.
49:29
Yeah.
49:29
Yeah.
49:31
I agree.
49:31
What it's gonna like, I don't know, but I think any any leaders listening, they really have to
49:36
think about it and think, you know, this person has done lots of things to your point before
49:42
you made step into core into leadership, there were certain things that you brought with them
49:46
for them to start to look at hiring new leaders from a different lens.
49:50
Yeah.
49:50
Yeah.
49:51
And I think that's that's where that's where it is because when you really think about it too,
49:56
we've said, the entire time we've talked, the cookie cutter, combination isn't there anymore.
50:04
Right?
50:04
So the the one shot, postsecondary education, to a job, etcetera, is isn't really there.
50:11
That formula doesn't really work as well as it used to.
50:15
So when you even think about the recruitment side as well.
50:20
I'm like, well, if we're saying the education combination doesn't work, then the mindset that
50:25
we have into looking at people also doesn't work, right, because that cookie cutter
50:29
expectation of you're gonna get these exact same credentials that you're looking for and
50:36
not necessarily pay attention to the transferable skills that may be tying these
50:41
things together.
50:44
That it it it goes hand in hand.
50:47
Like, both those things require everybody, every player to really to think outside of the
50:52
box.
50:53
Right?
50:53
And I I think that the success of any of our leaders right now is probably more so those
50:59
that are comfortable with that type of mindset, that are thriving, that are seeing the the
51:07
benefits of surrounding themselves or injecting that sense of, new generation mentality into
51:11
their workforce because it's from a nonthreatening, perspective.
51:20
So maybe leaders and senior teams need to think, how many disruptors do I have at the
51:26
level that I'm sitting?
51:27
Yeah.
51:28
Do I have people that go along and go, yeah.
51:30
Yeah, Shane.
51:30
That's good.
51:30
That's good.
51:31
That's good.
51:31
Or do I have the rock sands that might say, okay, Shane.
51:34
What about this?
51:35
You haven't you haven't looked at that.
51:37
Even if it may not be a solution, someone that is diametrically opposed in their thinking or
51:42
somebody, like you said, your micros your microscopic, I'm not.
51:45
I'm the opposite of you.
51:46
Right?
51:46
So those people challenge you really to get more of a, you know, well rounded kind of a
51:51
team.
51:52
Yeah.
51:52
This you and I could probably talk a very long night.
51:56
It's it's a Caribbean in us.
51:58
That's it for anybody listening.
52:00
Now, Shane, for just so I want you to wrap up and just really speak to any young people that
52:05
are listening that are, you know, out there in the they're out there in the trenches.
52:09
They're doing the things that we've talked about.
52:11
What kind of words of wisdom do you have for them before we let you go?
52:14
And if people wanting to get a of you in any way.
52:18
You can also tell them where they could reach you.
52:22
Sure.
52:23
Where's the wisdom, the pressure?
52:25
I mean, It is I think the the one thing we have to I I I, kind of live with no, is live with a
52:37
loose framework of where your life is going to go.
52:40
Right?
52:40
I think having that very hard and fast black and white approach of, you know, we talked
52:46
about this very hard line in the sand linear approach won't isn't what's gonna, isn't
52:52
cutting it for the majority of us.
52:54
Not saying people's lives don't add up the exact way they've seen it.
52:58
But for the rest of us, the other 98% out there, live adopt this mentality that you're
53:05
living with a loose framework of where you're gonna go in your life.
53:09
So it's a general path but you can bounce around the edges as much as you you need to.
53:16
And I think that cushions the the changes and the pivots and the turns that we need and maybe
53:21
u turns that we need to make at some point while we're in that lane without it being the
53:27
complete, disaster or feeling like it's a complete disaster or a failure, right, because
53:33
you've already given yourself permission that there's flexibility and slack within the path
53:39
that you're trying to go go down.
53:41
And and I think outside of that, We might hear, you know, hustle and put your head down and pay
53:49
your dues and all those things very overplayed because I know so many young professionals and
53:54
young people my age, that are doing those exact same things.
53:59
And it's really as I said, I think there's a little bit of luck involved.
54:03
There's it's a little bit of a right time, right place.
54:08
And just authentically presenting who you are with wherever and whenever wherever you you
54:13
are, because it's it's those things over letters and the the things asterisk and stuff
54:21
beside your name that are going to be your doorways into the relationship.
54:27
Not necessarily your credentials all the time.
54:30
So I think those maybe 2 or 3 things would be what I would say to people my age or younger
54:37
that are looking to navigate this, Claudie, you know, for force and life that we're living in,
54:45
as a starting point, but I'm sure there's way more performance.
54:50
So if if people are wanting to maybe connect and just learn about, about leadership,
54:57
Niagara, or anything else that you're doing out there, where where could people get a hold of
55:01
you if they wanted to connect?
55:03
Sure.
55:03
From a leadership and Niagara perspective, you can visit our website at leader Ship
55:08
Niagara.ca, just to learn more about what leadership Niagara is all about.
55:12
The program that we run, And for me personally, you can find me on linkedin connect with me
55:18
there, Shane Malcolm, and on Twitter, Shane__malka.
55:25
Strain underscore underscore Malcolm.
55:28
So I'm gonna say what I think I took away from today.
55:31
And you know, I I I think I love millennials because they always challenge me, and I'm more
55:38
of a, you know, kind of put your head down and what what I think I heard learned today was
55:45
millennials are already taking us into unknown ground, but we need to go there.
55:51
So we need to listen, observe.
55:53
We all want meaning and purpose.
55:55
We've always to change point.
55:57
They don't want any different than we do.
55:59
So but they're just doing it a different way.
56:01
And they're asking and they're challenging because they wanna stay, but they wanna stay
56:06
with meeting and purpose.
56:07
They just don't wanna do the 30 years kinda because I'm supposed to.
56:12
And that's something that I think, a lot of people in my generation would have loved to do
56:17
earlier.
56:18
But we had to we had to grow into it to be able to say, no.
56:21
I wanna challenge that.
56:22
I wanna challenge this.
56:24
So I think, you know, we have to look the gift of the young leaders on what they're bringing
56:28
to us.
56:28
And for senior leaders listening, we have to embrace that because we want to retain our top
56:34
talents If not, they're going elsewhere, and that's they're they're gonna be going to your
56:39
competitors, which is something that I know, most organizations want to circumvent so for
56:45
me, if you're needing any information, you know, I'm a mental health and wellness expert,
56:48
a Mckeynote, and a trainer, and a coach and, you can reach out to me at Roxanne.
56:54
So, Shane, thanks again for your time.
56:56
Merry Christmas.
56:57
It's Christmas Eve.
56:58
That we're doing this, and I'm sure we'll run into each other pretty soon in Saint
57:02
Catherine's.
57:03
Yes.
57:03
We will.
57:04
Thank you for having me.
57:05
And, good, look with all the wrapping that you have to
57:08
Okay.
57:08
I have lots.
57:09
Okay.
57:10
Take care.
57:11
Bye.
57:12
Bye.
57:13
Thanks for tuning in to authentic living with Roxanne, creating the space for positive,
57:19
healthy change.
57:20
Roxanne is a keynote speaker, psychotherapist, and coach to work with visit
57:26
roxannedurhaj.com/blueprint.
57:30
We'll see you next time.
57:32
An authentic living with Roxanne.