Latest / Off The Shelf With Phil and Dave- A Movie Review Podcast / 1987's No Way Out

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1987's No Way Out · Off The Shelf With Phil and Dave- A Movie Review Podcast

• 0:01
  Hello and welcome to Off the Shelf with Phil and Dave, the
• 0:06
  movie talk show where each week one of us takes a movie off our
• 0:08
  shelf, presents it to the other and discusses it at length.
• 0:18
  This week we've got coming off of David's Shelf, 1987's No Way
• 0:24
  Out, directed by Roger Donaldson, Starring Kevin
• 0:27
  Costner, Gene Hackman, Sean Young, Will Patton, of course.
• 0:31
  Yep. Written by Robert Garland.
• 0:33
  Here we are, David, back on the couch.
• 0:35
  Been a while. It's been a little while.
• 0:37
  We've missed you. Who's?
• 0:38
  We. The Royal We the listeners.
• 0:40
  And I. Collectively all Missed hearing
• 0:44
  your dulcet tones. Yeah, I think one of those is
• 0:46
  not true. I don't know which one.
• 0:49
  Also, it doesn't matter because we've been consistent with
• 0:51
  episodes so no one would know. No one would know been this long
• 0:55
  since we've been on the couch. You outed.
• 0:56
  Us outed us from not seeing each other, and you are a sight.
• 0:59
  For eyes, not necessarily sore, No, just eyes.
• 1:03
  Just eyes. Just Ms. site, actually.
• 1:05
  Ears, maybe ears, not sure, but the eyes.
• 1:08
  The podcast format until we get to YouTube, Dave, then.
• 1:10
  Oh, it's a work in progress. Then we're going to see some
• 1:12
  magic. It's on my list.
• 1:14
  Yeah, the spreadsheet. Yeah, I got a lot on my plate
• 1:18
  right now. I got a lot on my plate.
• 1:19
  Sure, I'm happy to hear it. Yeah, keep busy.
• 1:22
  Looks like a lot on your plate, yeah?
• 1:24
  I have lost in the last month. 10 lbs.
• 1:27
  Yeah, no, 7 lbs. I work out four runs a week.
• 1:31
  Strength training today. Sweat it like a pig.
• 1:34
  Yeah, yeah, sweat like a pig. Yeah, it's like you're a foreign
• 1:38
  spy with the kind of level of sweat you're producing and
• 1:43
  paranoia. Yeah, that's just everyday.
• 1:45
  I don't need to be a spy to feel paranoia, let me tell you that.
• 1:49
  But yeah, no way out, buddy. Here it is.
• 1:51
  Why? Why this movie, and certainly
• 1:53
  why now? I wasn't ready for that
• 1:56
  question, despite the fact you've been asking it for five
• 1:59
  years, five years, 5 glorious years coming up on 6.
• 2:05
  Soon. Yeah, that's what happens. 5
• 2:07
  gets to six and onward. I hate that.
• 2:10
  You ever hear that? How old's your kid?
• 2:11
  Always 6 going on seven. Yeah.
• 2:14
  What else is going on anyways? We were just flipping through
• 2:17
  Prime, me and my wife. It's almost to the point where
• 2:20
  I'll scour through and if I don't find something within 510
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  minutes she'll grab the remote and it's her turn to find
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  something. OK, not a good position for me.
• 2:30
  To get inform your decisions you're alone looking through.
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  No, no, we're together, but our tastes, they don't always align.
• 2:38
  To get her to watch this movie from 1987.
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  She must have been wanting something that night, perhaps.
• 2:46
  I don't know, I didn't check the calendar.
• 2:48
  Sure, but. I said to myself, wow, this is
• 2:53
  in my wheelhouse. Yeah, it's a hackman.
• 2:55
  Yeah, it's a hackman, released around the same time as movies
• 2:58
  like The Package. Sure.
• 2:59
  Yeah. It's late 90s sure, just.
• 3:01
  A good old fashioned thriller and I so we stumbled across it,
• 3:07
  watched it. I'm like, I think this would be
• 3:09
  a fun movie to talk about the fact that it's.
• 3:12
  Almost. 40 years old. Yeah, 38.
• 3:15
  Yeah, there it is. And this was probably about 3
• 3:17
  weeks ago so I had to rewatch it obviously just to refresh my
• 3:23
  mind and make some notes. And by then it had.
• 3:27
  Left Prime. This is why I own movies, my
• 3:30
  man. I know.
• 3:31
  So now I'm on a 7 day free trial of MGM.
• 3:34
  Oh yes. Don't let me forget to cancel
• 3:36
  that. But that's my experience, I had
• 3:39
  not seen it. Before then though, interesting
• 3:40
  that's heard of it. Nothing.
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  Never even heard of it. Totally blank came.
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  Out of left field. That's great.
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  Surprised I hadn't heard of it. I usually find these things on
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  my excursions, but it's been a while since, you know, gone
• 3:52
  through the DVD rack to find things like narrow margin
• 3:54
  etcetera. I'm guessing, and please correct
• 3:57
  me if I'm wrong, it happens sometimes.
• 4:00
  You have heard of it, but you hadn't seen it.
• 4:03
  I had heard of it and I had seen it.
• 4:05
  Oh, yeah, I'd seen it. No, I'm just kidding.
• 4:06
  I'd never seen it. So I'm right.
• 4:08
  Yeah, I'd never seen it. I'd heard of it just having a
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  party somewhere. No, I probably heard of it on
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  Ebert, like, when I was eight or nine years old.
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  Like, I don't think this movie really made any real impact on
• 4:20
  me at a young age when it came out.
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  And to your point, it isn't really in the zeitgeist.
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  It's not a movie that even though I like Kevin Costner and
• 4:28
  I like Gene Hackman. Certainly nothing really would
• 4:32
  have led me to this movie, so. When you're like 9, right?
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  Like, that's not a movie, that's.
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  Going to go off the screen. And it wasn't something that as
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  I was getting more and more deeper into sort of film history
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  or whatever in general, it wasn't just on the list of the
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  classics, let's say. Should be on your list.
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  But as I watch it, I will say it's nearing classic territory
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  to me. Like I'm really surprised by how
• 4:53
  much I didn't know about this movie.
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  And I knew Roger Donaldson. We had talked about him before
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  in The Recruit. He's directed 13 Days, which is
• 5:03
  the movie I loved from the late 90s.
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  And yet I knew nothing about this movie.
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  I probably have seen because I was a teenager.
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  I may have seen a couple of moments from this movie thanks
• 5:15
  to the Internet that I did not know we're we're from this movie
• 5:19
  specifically. But John Young made an
• 5:21
  appearance to you. In my search history in the.
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  Really early. Early Internet it.
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  Was just sort of like, you know, famous.
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  Not that I googled it, but she's a crazy person by all accounts.
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  In the movie or in real life? OK, but I don't know.
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  Her it was, you know, she was in Batman cast as Vicki Vale, as
• 5:42
  Catwoman, as Vicki Vale the original Batman.
• 5:45
  OK, sorry. I thought Vicki Vale might have
• 5:47
  been Catwoman. Catwoman.
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  Catwoman. Catwoman, so she cast as Vicki
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  Vale falls off a horse during rehearsals.
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  That's too bad. Then it gets fired, effectively.
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  Then around the time of Batman Returns Part 2 comes.
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  She's vying for Catwoman. This I heard.
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  Puts on the suit, goes to Tim Burton.
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  Vanderbilt's like, I'm good. Yeah, completely in character,
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  apparently. And then goes on Joan Rivers
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  talk show in the suit again on national television.
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  Like a plea. Like a plea.
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  Let me be a cat. And it doesn't end well, so.
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  Cuz usually when a cat rubs up against your leg it's nice.
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  Yeah, this apparently. Not so much.
• 6:27
  Not so much. Yeah, OK.
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  So she was just a character and I didn't really know much of
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  her. And then I think from that point
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  you're like, she's Einhorn, Einhorn and Blade Runner is and
• 6:35
  Blade Runner and so. That's it for me, that's all.
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  I know she's in a movie called I think The Bump, which is a
• 6:39
  cocaine filled movie with the James Woods, which is really.
• 6:43
  Interesting he loves cocaine. Yeah, I think so.
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  I think so. I don't know if that's that's a
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  crazy movie that I happened to just sort of fall upon.
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  So anyway, I didn't know much about this movie at all.
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  I didn't know anything about the plot.
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  I didn't know anything about anything other than just this
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  was a movie that I thought I should have seen by now.
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  Mark this down. Mark this down your calendar
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  because I have brought off a movie off of by shelf and you
• 7:05
  have already used the term classic. 100%.
• 7:09
  Maybe a little bit loosely. Yeah, what I think is telling,
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  and this maybe should be why there's a little asterisk on the
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  calendar notation that I make, is that your shelf is littered
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  with shitty movies. Oh, yeah.
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  But you're scrolling through a digital platform.
• 7:29
  Sometimes you see a picture that is a classic movie.
• 7:32
  Yeah, OK. I.
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  Mean if you had bought this movie 20 years ago and said
• 7:36
  Phil, Phil, I got this. We need to see.
• 7:39
  Yeah, you're right. But your description of how you
• 7:41
  came upon this movie is not really.
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  And damn my honesty. Damn my honesty and I
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  transparency though, yeah you could probably get this movie on
• 7:51
  DVD for 7-8 bucks. Yeah, maybe, but I don't think
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  it's Blu-ray. I haven't seen it, No.
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  It's just not a thing. And that's OK.
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  And I would probably put it on my shelf and remove something
• 8:02
  that's currently on there to make space for.
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  Him so Mel Gibson action. Thriller wouldn't go that far
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  because he's such a great guy and my boy, he deserves to be on
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  my shelf right beside Kevin Spacey's movies.
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  OK. Yeah, Woody Allen, Kevin Spade,
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  these are the good, good, good people.
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  What happened to MGM, by the way?
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  Amazon bought it. Amazon, which, OK, so why?
• 8:26
  That's the question. Why are you paying that was
• 8:27
  gonna I'm. Paying for Amazon and then I had
• 8:29
  to pay for MGM. Yeah, yeah.
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  And it was originally bought by Sony.
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  Then MGM was UA. They merged with United Artists.
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  Sony bought them both. I went to tour the Sony lot,
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  which is the old MGM lot. So they had some of those
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  classic MGM movies that had won Yeah, Oscars.
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  And Sony doesn't really win Oscars.
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  And Amazon bought it from Sony. I can't keep up with all these.
• 8:52
  Mergers. It's too much.
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  And it's it's going. To kill the industry, it really.
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  Is we kind of touched on Donaldson, he did do the recruit
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  in 2003 and I remember you, you know, you warmed up to it a
• 9:06
  little bit, but wouldn't say I. Didn't want your favorite?
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  No, no. But again, not every movie a
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  director does is going to be great.
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  That's true. I mean, that's easy to say about
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  a guy like Roger Donaldson. However, Stanley Kubrick, every
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  movie that guy made was great, and most of them were shot by
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  John Alcott, cinematographer who happened to shoot this movie.
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  His final. OK, he died after the movie.
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  Was that the special thanks to the?
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  Memory of yes, OK, the owner of him at the end was to John
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  Alcott. That's nice, Who had shot 2001.
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  He'd shot Clockwork Orange. Barry Linden, The Shining, of
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  course. Yeah, I wouldn't say this movie
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  necessarily called for major shots, but I was do I want to
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  say in awe. I think you do.
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  I feel it coming. From there, just at the
• 9:50
  beginning of the movie, I'm like the helicopter.
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  Shots. Yeah, yeah.
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  Like now drone shots, but I'm like, this is a chopper shot,
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  chopper shot, chopper shot. Tough to say.
• 10:00
  Sure, it's a chop shot. And I loved how it just got
• 10:02
  further away from the White House.
• 10:05
  In the monuments, right, you're seeing a scene.
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  This is Washington, see the Washington Monument, Lincoln,
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  White House. This is the scope of the world
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  we're going to be playing in. The Pentagon obviously plays a
• 10:13
  strong role as well, so. Before we get any further away
• 10:17
  from the synopsis though. That's right, we will.
• 10:20
  Don't get too deep here. Yeah, 'cause I'm, you know what,
• 10:23
  champion? I'm excited for this one because
• 10:25
  it was, like you said, a pretty decent film.
• 10:27
  So please, Phil, I want you to share with everyone of the
• 10:30
  synopsis. Thanks to your best friend.
• 10:33
  Faithful. Oh, faithful.
• 10:35
  Well, we've got it here. It's it's nice and brief.
• 10:37
  We have the Secretary of Defense Forces, a Pentagon naval aid to
• 10:41
  lead a spy manhunt. That's it.
• 10:43
  It feels like it's a sentence. Short.
• 10:45
  Yeah, yeah. But I'm glad it doesn't reveal
• 10:47
  anything. After the murder of his
• 10:49
  mistress, the Secretary of State requires or, you know, enlists a
• 10:54
  naval, yeah, suspected of being a Russian agent to find, you
• 10:59
  know what I mean? Like, 'cause those, some of
• 11:01
  those synopsis, that's what they give you.
• 11:02
  There's the movie. It's not even.
• 11:04
  What's funny is when, like I mentioned, Blown Away came up
• 11:08
  afterwards and I was reading and I was reading sort of the
• 11:12
  synopsis on Prime. Yes, or sorry, MGM.
• 11:17
  And it pretty much told me, well, this guy is not good.
• 11:20
  Yeah, sure, you might find out 30 minutes in, but I don't want
• 11:23
  to know until 30 minutes in. I don't want to know it at
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  second one. Yeah, there's a reason things
• 11:28
  are paced right. That's why I stopped watching
• 11:29
  trailers. Better for it.
• 11:31
  I saw a trailer unwittingly for Roof Man, which is a movie I
• 11:36
  don't particularly know anything about.
• 11:38
  Jenny Tatum. Kirsten Dunst.
• 11:40
  You're people. Peter Dinklage.
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  So Peter Dinklage, this movie trailer, I'm watching it
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  thinking there is nothing about this movie that I don't know in
• 11:48
  this two and a half million trailer.
• 11:50
  If there is, I mean, more power to it, But I can't fathom that
• 11:53
  there's anything different or anything more happening than
• 11:56
  what I see in this trailer. He gets caught, he gets found
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  out, he hides, he finds love, he tries to save his love, wants to
• 12:01
  stay an extra day. That causes like, I'm like,
• 12:04
  you're mapping out the entirety of the movie in this trailer.
• 12:07
  Why do I want to watch this movie and this?
• 12:10
  I've never watched the trailer for this movie.
• 12:13
  Part of the beauty of it, part of maybe why I can call it
• 12:15
  nearing a classic, if not even a proper classic as it is, is
• 12:19
  because everywhere it went, I did not expect it to go.
• 12:23
  Generally, Yeah, a couple of parts.
• 12:25
  You're like, that is the way you do it.
• 12:27
  Yes, But none of it was like, oh, yeah, yeah, I know this.
• 12:30
  Yeah, Exactly. You know, And that is good
• 12:32
  filmmaking. It's good performance, it's good
• 12:34
  writing. It's all those things.
• 12:36
  And if I watch a trailer that sees Sean Young dying as she
• 12:39
  falls off or watching Hackman do it, I'm.
• 12:42
  Trying to think of it, I I did watch it.
• 12:43
  I don't remember it though, so I can't.
• 12:45
  Yeah, I mean, it could very well be.
• 12:46
  And certainly if it was made now, you would, right?
• 12:48
  And so you're like, oh, OK, well, Hackman kills her, she's
• 12:51
  dead. So now everything I see of her,
• 12:54
  is it ruining her character? Is it ruining that relationship?
• 12:57
  Does it? It takes the movie.
• 12:59
  It just, yeah, I think it takes the experience.
• 13:01
  Totally, absolutely. It's like I told you before,
• 13:03
  right when people are like, you'll love the 6th sense,
• 13:05
  you'll never guess the twist. Well, now I'm I'm not going to
• 13:09
  tell you what the twist is, but you're going to love it and
• 13:12
  you're like. Well, you did now you told me.
• 13:14
  Yeah, you've poisoned whatever that water is.
• 13:17
  And not that that happened with that particular movie, but just
• 13:19
  in general. It's a good example, Philip.
• 13:21
  Yeah, great movie too. Sure, better than I remembered.
• 13:24
  That's right. What part of the couch were you
• 13:26
  on for this movie though? Were you at the edge in?
• 13:29
  The middle. Were you on the floor?
• 13:31
  I don't know your. I watched it on the shitter
• 13:32
  actually. I really try and it's good
• 13:34
  acoustics in there. Maybe you have speakers in there
• 13:36
  because they're not in here. Now work in progress.
• 13:39
  Now for this movie, I'm not going to hold it against you.
• 13:42
  You don't really need like the 9.2 surround sound, but I have
• 13:46
  one that's on my shortlist. Let's just say you get that shit
• 13:49
  done. Yeah.
• 13:49
  All right, All right. We'll do it after this
• 13:51
  recording. Yeah, I doubt that.
• 13:52
  The movie makes a bold choice, David to open with a scene
• 14:01
  unrelated to anything we've seen before, right?
• 14:02
  We only had the chopper shot the.
• 14:04
  Chopper shot the. Chop shot.
• 14:06
  Let's just look at it from a narrative perspective, starting
• 14:09
  the movie after something has happened.
• 14:12
  Yeah, he's got a tattered uniform.
• 14:13
  We got costume. Tom Ferrell, he's clearly been
• 14:17
  through something, and he's sitting in what appears to be an
• 14:19
  interrogation room, and he's frustrated.
• 14:21
  Yeah. And then it cuts six months
• 14:23
  earlier. I wonder what your thoughts are
• 14:27
  with that as a narrative hook. I thought you might wonder that
• 14:30
  and it's not your business. How do I feel about?
• 14:32
  That I keep my business to myself.
• 14:34
  I thought about it. I've seen it in movie form, I've
• 14:37
  seen it in TV form, but it's been a long time.
• 14:41
  I find a lot of the time I end up forgetting about it and I
• 14:45
  think that is a sign that it's done well because then it
• 14:49
  circles around back to it like, Oh yeah, that to me is a check
• 14:54
  mark well done. Or at the very least, did not.
• 14:57
  Harm the film, OK, Because I think there's a risk to giving
• 15:01
  away too much. We just talked about it's a
• 15:02
  trailer. So you're.
• 15:03
  Yeah, it's either a guessing game you bring in the audience
• 15:06
  into the mix or, as you're saying, the best versions of it
• 15:10
  get forgotten. I did think about a couple of
• 15:11
  movies that this is the case of Usual Suspects.
• 15:14
  That's true, yeah. Opens with, if you remember
• 15:16
  Gabriel Byrne, the whole boat scene on the boat already fallen
• 15:20
  and he gets shot and then it goes and we come back to that at
• 15:23
  the end. Now that isn't forgotten because
• 15:25
  that is a linchpin to the rest of the movie, a movie where it
• 15:28
  actually literally says it, if you remember in the archives,
• 15:31
  has fallen. And he says, I'm going to tell
• 15:33
  you a story about the time I almost died.
• 15:34
  Very good example. And then he says, remember I
• 15:37
  said I almost died? And then we get the rest of the
• 15:40
  story. So those are two I think great
• 15:43
  examples. I think in this case
• 15:45
  specifically, I think it doesn't reveal much.
• 15:50
  No, I think you're right just a little bit.
• 15:52
  I think it's perfect. We have recently been to a ball
• 16:00
  we bowled. Well, your boy did.
• 16:03
  Roy Schreiber Schneider. Roy Schneider.
• 16:07
  Yeah. In Jaws 2, Jaws 2.
• 16:09
  And I like balls. Gonna say it.
• 16:12
  Your record is very. Clear on that.
• 16:15
  I have a A ball for my feet now call that running.
• 16:18
  I do. It's gonna roll it.
• 16:19
  Yeah, I got an Achilles issue. Yeah, anyways, Tom does not have
• 16:25
  an Achilles issue. His problem is being too damn
• 16:27
  good looking gorgeous. And we're introduced to him, his
• 16:32
  character, Tom Farrell and Sean Young's character, Susan Atwell.
• 16:37
  Very good movie names. And we see them together and she
• 16:41
  makes a great joke because they're in a room full of
• 16:43
  politician. Generally speaking, I think I
• 16:46
  can see that big Washington love fest.
• 16:48
  So obviously they have a metal detector and she makes a joke
• 16:52
  about luckily it's not a bullshit detector because we
• 16:56
  know how politicians have a tendency here and there once in
• 17:00
  a while, the bullshit. There's an occasional fibbing
• 17:03
  that will. Occur and I will have to tell
• 17:06
  you I felt instant chemistry between these two and I'm not a
• 17:11
  big fan. Of chemistry.
• 17:14
  Of well, I almost failed it in grade 12, that in biology I
• 17:17
  really struggled with. Yeah, really struggled with.
• 17:20
  I was good in gym and history actually, because it already
• 17:24
  happened. So, you know, I just got to look
• 17:28
  it up. I just got to look it up.
• 17:29
  It's there in a book somewhere. Encyclopedia.
• 17:31
  Not the Internet back then, no. No old.
• 17:34
  School. So this whole scene I I love
• 17:36
  when he goes up to her again and basically says you're into me.
• 17:39
  Yeah, And then he walks away and she's totally into him, right?
• 17:44
  And he plays that perfect and goes to the bar, orders a drink,
• 17:46
  and there she is. I just think the dialogue is
• 17:49
  pretty tight, generally. It's got some witty stuff.
• 17:53
  It's really written well for the actors, the characters in which
• 17:57
  it's intended for. And I was pretty impressed.
• 18:00
  I was surprised because I'm not a Sean Young guy.
• 18:03
  Really. Mr. Winky, too.
• 18:05
  I don't think it's that, and this movie didn't help that at
• 18:09
  all. Oh, you're thinking, Francis.
• 18:11
  I wondered if you would. It is written in my notes.
• 18:13
  I wondered if you might go that. Way.
• 18:15
  Not yet. I'll bring it up when it's
• 18:18
  secured her ballot. Sure, it's secured.
• 18:21
  For it. But aside from that, the
• 18:24
  chemistry, yeah, 100% her energy is very high throughout this
• 18:28
  entire movie. Yes, a very loud presence.
• 18:31
  I find it charming at times, certainly jarring, but generally
• 18:37
  speaking it feels completely gauging.
• 18:40
  Yeah, I mean, it's her character.
• 18:41
  That's the thing. So the she's coming on real hot
• 18:44
  and real strong and real loud. Even things like the bullshit
• 18:47
  detector line, that's an attention getter in a room full
• 18:52
  of people that don't give attention easily.
• 18:55
  And I don't love Sean Young. Like I think that she's terrible
• 18:57
  at times, but watching her in this, I just think that level of
• 19:03
  energy and charisma is perfect for the movie.
• 19:06
  And what it does to me is 100% adds credibility and credence to
• 19:11
  Costner. Looking across the room and
• 19:13
  seeing who this person is and just going like I want that.
• 19:16
  I'm going to have it. I would agree with you 100% from
• 19:19
  the Shongyang perspective. I think performance wise, I
• 19:22
  can't think of anyone else and I did of what actress would I have
• 19:26
  preferred? Who do I want?
• 19:27
  And I couldn't come up with anybody.
• 19:28
  Even if we look at the Batman example right, that energy in
• 19:31
  Batman is 180° from Kim Basinger as Vicki Vale so.
• 19:38
  I think Catwood might have been OK.
• 19:39
  Sure, Michelle Pfeiffer is incredible in that movie, so
• 19:42
  it's tough to see the other side of it.
• 19:44
  But anyway, I just think like her performance as Vicki Vale is
• 19:48
  an interesting paradox, and if this energy was brought to the
• 19:51
  Batman movie, it would be a completely different vibe.
• 19:53
  So it's perfect for me to see her in this and watch her in
• 19:56
  costume, immediately have the chemistry that obviously we get
• 20:00
  to see a plate stuff out over. Limousine action.
• 20:04
  Let's talk about that. The music's queued up.
• 20:07
  It's perfect 80s music, right? Yeah, we have the perv in the
• 20:12
  front seat. Yeah, not being subtle.
• 20:14
  He's just like, oh, this is great.
• 20:16
  Yeah. Now, putting up that dark window
• 20:18
  isn't a safety concern because you're supposed to be able to
• 20:20
  see out the back. Not in a limousine.
• 20:22
  That's the privacy. I know, but what makes it all of
• 20:25
  a sudden safe? Really good side windows.
• 20:28
  Really good side windows. The ultimate and side window
• 20:31
  technology is. Right there.
• 20:32
  OK, it is. A potential risk.
• 20:37
  So they start kissing and making out.
• 20:39
  And this is what my wife says. Is that Gene Hackman?
• 20:46
  Like in the front? No in the back.
• 20:48
  OK, she confused Kevin Costner with Gene Hackman.
• 20:52
  Nope. She taught Gene.
• 20:55
  Was Sean Young? Oh my God.
• 20:57
  I could not believe it. Wow.
• 21:00
  I I was out of the marriage. I was going to say divorce the
• 21:04
  paperwork. Untie the knot.
• 21:06
  The paperwork's been filed, she doesn't know it yet and luckily
• 21:09
  she doesn't listen to this so it'll still side blinder.
• 21:14
  Is that the right word? Blindsider.
• 21:15
  Blindsider. Man, I'm bad for that.
• 21:18
  Every time I listen to an episode editing it I'm like,
• 21:21
  what am I? What did I just say?
• 21:23
  That's not right. But then the side blinder is
• 21:26
  what you might get at the side of a limo instead of a pack.
• 21:29
  Oh. There we go, there it is.
• 21:32
  Anyways, we giggled, we laughed. I was very sad at the same time,
• 21:38
  but it was a nice scene. It was pleasant.
• 21:39
  It was a nice scene. Did we see your breast?
• 21:41
  We. Did No.
• 21:42
  No, didn't we? No, I don't believe so, but it's
• 21:45
  a very hot scene and seem to be sparing no expense in the.
• 21:49
  Yeah, we didn't need to see one. We just saw one last week and it
• 21:53
  was a week or two. It is.
• 21:55
  A scene. It makes so much sense to me.
• 21:57
  Again, these combustible, gorgeous people.
• 22:01
  Like this is it. We just want to fuck and we
• 22:02
  don't want to wait. Have you ever had that kind of
• 22:04
  experience? Not in the limo necessarily.
• 22:06
  Wow, that's a loaded question. Probably have to cut it out
• 22:09
  later. Curiosity, you know.
• 22:12
  Not recently, yeah. It's not the last five years, I
• 22:15
  can tell you that. Cuz you know what?
• 22:17
  I'm an honest guy. Yeah.
• 22:19
  And I'm also, what's the word? Noble.
• 22:21
  Noble. It's OK, I'm very noble.
• 22:23
  Sure. I think I yeah, yeah, there's.
• 22:25
  Those people and you're like I, this has got to happen.
• 22:28
  I've made eye contact with somebody.
• 22:30
  I worked at a call center and I was, you know, on the phones and
• 22:34
  stuff. But I was, I was good enough
• 22:36
  that I, I became part of a coaching team.
• 22:39
  So I got off the phones and I would help coach the new crew.
• 22:42
  And I locked eyes at that time. I exchanged my e-mail.
• 22:47
  Because you could do that. Do that.
• 22:48
  That's a thing. Yeah.
• 22:49
  And yeah. I walked into a New Year's Eve
• 22:53
  party and just grabbed a drink from the fridge, turned around,
• 22:56
  looked down in the living room. It was electric.
• 23:00
  Oh. She felt it, too.
• 23:02
  Oh yeah, we spent the rest of the night together basically,
• 23:04
  and then spent the night together and had a really fun
• 23:08
  time. I find that hard to believe
• 23:09
  because I thought you spent most of these parties crying all
• 23:11
  night. No, no, no, no, that was earlier
• 23:14
  and later. OK, There was a narrow window, 6
• 23:17
  minutes where I could walk into a party and have that happen and
• 23:20
  it was magical. But that was that feeling of
• 23:22
  just like what I would say, good looking people finding one
• 23:26
  another across the room and then just the whole rest of the night
• 23:29
  was like, we need to be together and alone and as you know, as
• 23:34
  much as possible. So like, yeah, I get it that
• 23:37
  none of that makes any difference or is not suspect.
• 23:41
  And the fact that continues over into Ninas apartment, we get to
• 23:44
  meet Nina and this is where we can see the breasts when she
• 23:48
  throws her throws the fur coat onto Iman's and you know, here
• 23:52
  you go. That's right.
• 23:53
  But we get the first sense that there's obviously this other
• 23:56
  thing happening because she doesn't go to her apartment.
• 23:58
  Yeah, I thought that was odd. Yeah, which is why.
• 24:00
  None of my business. That's right, None.
• 24:02
  Of my business. But we got a great scene.
• 24:04
  She's like, here, everything you need is in is in the apartment.
• 24:07
  Take my coat and go. Iman's a beauty, too.
• 24:10
  Gorgeous woman too. There is a.
• 24:12
  Lot of people in this movie. Three people from Star Trek in
• 24:16
  this movie. Oh gosh, yeah, all.
• 24:18
  Three of them are in Star Trek 6 specifically.
• 24:21
  Wow. Yeah, I missed 2.
• 24:22
  Yeah, well, that, you know, you're you.
• 24:25
  I'm me. This is true for better, for
• 24:26
  worse. We don't know.
• 24:28
  We're still left on that. But yeah, great scene, love.
• 24:31
  Iman. We get a an idea that there's
• 24:34
  something happening. In the back end, yeah, right.
• 24:36
  It'll it'll come as. We need it, right?
• 24:39
  That's right. Now, having said all of that,
• 24:42
  this chemistry and this galvanizing moment between the
• 24:44
  two, Yeah. In such a short time, do you
• 24:48
  think that it's reasonable because that is like, you can
• 24:51
  buy that as lusty, right? Like, you're gorgeous.
• 24:53
  I just. We just want to take care of
• 24:55
  business. The next time we see them,
• 24:57
  they're in a taxi going to the airport.
• 24:59
  He's been called away on a mission.
• 25:01
  Yeah. And she's crying.
• 25:04
  He's. They're making out that same
• 25:06
  kind of thing. But I wonder, do you buy this
• 25:08
  relationship at this point? If you buy Leslie Nielsen and
• 25:13
  Lisa Marie Presley A Naked Gun, if you can buy that, I don't see
• 25:17
  why you can't buy this. Yeah.
• 25:19
  Yeah. Because the example I gave you
• 25:22
  with that woman, we would have been at that stage within pretty
• 25:26
  quickly. Yeah.
• 25:27
  If you have that first sight and we don't know exactly how long
• 25:30
  it's been, that's true. It could have been two weeks for
• 25:32
  all we know. Could be we don't see a
• 25:34
  delineation now. What if they had, hypothetically
• 25:37
  speaking? Don't you?
• 25:38
  What if they'd come from their apartment to the airport in the
• 25:43
  trunk? In the trunk?
• 25:45
  Do you think that might add some credibility to that
• 25:46
  relationship? I would definitely say no, no,
• 25:49
  no trunk stuff is not admissible.
• 25:52
  OK, Yeah, in the in the court you.
• 25:54
  Don't know you, don't know her personality.
• 25:55
  She might be into the trunk stuff.
• 25:56
  She would. That would not surprise me.
• 25:58
  I was more upset about the cabbie calling the cop an
• 26:02
  asshole. That's right, you didn't have a
• 26:04
  problem. With that, I had a problem with
• 26:05
  that because there's no need for that.
• 26:08
  You're right. He's not supposed to be parked
• 26:09
  there. And after he calls him an
• 26:10
  asshole, he turns back to Costner.
• 26:13
  He's like, you guys really got to leave.
• 26:15
  He's right. I'm wrong.
• 26:16
  Yeah, he's right. So why, if you know the cop is
• 26:18
  right, don't call him names? That's the thing with cops that
• 26:21
  I really find hilarious is like people that are speeding and
• 26:23
  then they get pulled over and like you're this fucking
• 26:25
  asshole. Like you're the 'cause you did
• 26:28
  it. You can't be like, yeah, the
• 26:29
  parking. Oh, my God, I got a parking
• 26:31
  ticket. I've been here for seven hours.
• 26:33
  So like, yeah. Take some ownership.
• 26:34
  If you don't want a parking ticket, don't park where you
• 26:37
  can, yeah? Take ownership and also take the
• 26:39
  ownership out of your glove box because you're going to need it.
• 26:41
  You're going to need it. Exactly.
• 26:43
  So frustrating. But yeah, Tom is on a boat with
• 26:48
  Todd Gak. Yeah, it's a GAC moment.
• 26:51
  Do you know who Todd GAC is? No idea whatsoever.
• 26:54
  I didn't figure out Star Trek 6. No, no, no, no, no.
• 26:57
  I don't think so. Maybe Deep Space 9.
• 27:00
  Everyone's played an alien by now.
• 27:02
  He was in Seinfeld. Gotcha.
• 27:05
  Played a guy named Todd Gac. Who bet?
• 27:08
  Elaine. He plays himself.
• 27:09
  No, I don't know what the actor's name is, but he made a
• 27:13
  bet with Elaine saying that Dustin Hoffman was in Star Wars,
• 27:18
  that if I'm wrong, I owe you dinner.
• 27:21
  The whole premise of the episode was he got you to go on a date
• 27:25
  and Todd Gak the whole time. It's not a date kid, just two
• 27:27
  friends. And then he wants to introduce
• 27:29
  Elaine to his parents. He's like, whoa, whoa, whoa.
• 27:31
  Cannot someone just meet someone's parents and cigars?
• 27:34
  Anyway, great episode if you haven't seen it.
• 27:38
  But yeah, so he's on with him and things happen.
• 27:41
  Yeah, there's two scenes in this movie that I don't like or
• 27:44
  understand or care about. And which one is this?
• 27:46
  Or is it all three? I have.
• 27:48
  There's only two, yeah, but this is.
• 27:50
  This is I don't care, I don't understand and you.
• 27:53
  Know yeah, this is all three. I think the only reason this
• 27:56
  scene exists is so that Hackman can see him the article in the
• 28:00
  newspaper. That's like local hero or Navy
• 28:02
  hero, but otherwise. It's for you and Hackman.
• 28:05
  It's for you and. Hackman, you can get your
• 28:06
  newspaper. That's right, I got my new
• 28:08
  newspaper scene. Which again, folks, pause it.
• 28:10
  You'll see the same paragraph repeated twice.
• 28:13
  Oh God. It begins with a suggestion that
• 28:16
  possible hearings are upcoming and so forth. 3 Three times that
• 28:19
  paragraph. Three times.
• 28:20
  And none of it has anything to do with the headline.
• 28:22
  And you knew that. So this is an action sequence I
• 28:24
  suppose. I just I think this doesn't
• 28:26
  belong here. It's like you said, it's for
• 28:29
  that reason only but frustrates me is he's the hero but if he
• 28:35
  had just not done anything the result would have been the same.
• 28:39
  You think he would have survived the?
• 28:41
  He was fine. He was attached to the rope and
• 28:44
  the rescue team was only about 30 seconds behind.
• 28:48
  They had the proper gear, they had the rope.
• 28:50
  They would have reeled them in. Costner just basically put
• 28:54
  himself into harm's way for No, I mean, we don't.
• 28:57
  Know, I mean, that's your for you.
• 28:58
  I guess that's that's. Your he does it.
• 29:00
  He does those damn Russian. Spies.
• 29:02
  Yeah. I I just think it doesn't
• 29:03
  belong. Speaking of the boat, and I know
• 29:06
  you obviously have some reservations.
• 29:10
  I don't have a reservation. I wouldn't.
• 29:12
  I wouldn't even book it. Could you do the whole boat
• 29:15
  thing? Like be at sea for an extended
• 29:17
  period of time. I was out on a cruise for a
• 29:20
  week. You got a lot of amenities.
• 29:24
  Amenities. Yeah, sure.
• 29:26
  It's almost like you're on land at that point.
• 29:28
  OK, so there's a. Pool on the cruise?
• 29:32
  Sure. Come on.
• 29:33
  Yeah. So what do you mean by doing the
• 29:35
  boat thing? The.
• 29:36
  Boat thing, you know, being at sea.
• 29:38
  Pretend it's 1492 and you're with Chris Columbus.
• 29:42
  Like leaving your country to go to the new.
• 29:44
  World on a boat. Yeah, where you might get
• 29:47
  scurvy, yeah, like not enough. I was going to say not enough
• 29:49
  vitamin C, but yeah, that could lead to scurvy and the horrors
• 29:53
  and such. Yeah, well, if I mean the
• 29:54
  horrors are OK, if there's you didn't tell me, there would be
• 29:57
  horrors. Goes with that.
• 29:59
  Saying, I think, you know, I'm not a, I'm not a strong man, no.
• 30:04
  You're not going to make it. I just want to hear you say it.
• 30:06
  Just want to hear you say it buddy.
• 30:07
  So, I mean, if I was a captain of such a ship, you know, my
• 30:10
  captain's quarters, yeah, might be.
• 30:12
  OK. Give me a Nintendo Switch.
• 30:15
  You're fine. You're driving while he's gone.
• 30:19
  He does make a call and ends up ripping the pay phone off the
• 30:23
  thing. A little outer character for
• 30:25
  him, I think. Yeah, he's upset.
• 30:27
  I hate everything in the scene. It's the only part of the movie.
• 30:29
  I I really don't the whole everything.
• 30:32
  OK. Yeah, I question.
• 30:33
  All of it. Is it Todd Gack?
• 30:37
  Like it doesn't hurt the movie, I just think it's unnecessary.
• 30:40
  I I could have cut that and gotten and lost nothing.
• 30:42
  It's not this what you know. Come on.
• 30:45
  And nothing, just cut it. Well, you need something I don't
• 30:47
  think. You do.
• 30:48
  I think you need something. I don't think he needs to go
• 30:49
  away. At all.
• 30:50
  Oh, he wanted to go away. I'm saying is it from a
• 30:54
  filmmaking perspective, I don't think it's necessary and it's
• 30:57
  fine, but none of it really furthers the plot.
• 30:59
  I don't see that there's much point in it.
• 31:01
  It's not enough to ruin it. I just I way to help.
• 31:03
  It stuck out like a sore thump to me.
• 31:04
  It was like, oh, what are we doing now?
• 31:06
  And it's short though, so it. Was it was like it was half.
• 31:08
  An hour sojourn into Manila. But but we do see the reveal
• 31:15
  after the phone call that she's with Jean.
• 31:17
  Yes, David Bryce, yes, is Gene Hackman's character.
• 31:21
  He's the Secretary of Defense for those.
• 31:24
  Now Secretary of War, I guess. Yeah, I suppose so.
• 31:28
  So what they called? Now that's sad.
• 31:30
  Department of War. Anyways, and I thought that was
• 31:33
  odd, but hey, odd relationship. OK, well, not really, I guess.
• 31:38
  No, Hackman. Yeah, it's a politician.
• 31:40
  What am I talking about here? He's the hackman.
• 31:42
  He's the hackman, Of course. What are you going to do?
• 31:45
  Did you suspect that Hackman was going to be in this tryst?
• 31:49
  In this predicament, yeah. It's weird because when we were
• 31:52
  introduced to him a while back at the ball that we talked
• 31:55
  about, he was a little bit cold. A little cold.
• 31:58
  But you know, Gene Hackman has played both sides.
• 32:02
  Yeah, very well. I have a.
• 32:03
  Question about that for you, because I, I think you're right.
• 32:06
  We're watching this movie and for me, like you're introducing
• 32:08
  him, he's a little aloof and he's a little cold at the ball.
• 32:11
  And then he has a little more interest in Costner's character
• 32:17
  after he reads about him at the breakfast at the breakfast.
• 32:20
  And also he he's got some interest in trying to clearly
• 32:26
  like reform the department because it thinks this phantom
• 32:31
  sub, phantom sub is kind of a boondoggle and it's kind of like
• 32:34
  a sinkhole. Yeah, he seems to have like the
• 32:36
  interest of the American people like he.
• 32:39
  He seems to be one of the good guys.
• 32:40
  I kind of wondered, yeah, did you think he was the good or a
• 32:43
  good guy? I I was back and forth for a
• 32:46
  little while. It's a little bit ambiguous, you
• 32:48
  know. Almost for the whole movie,
• 32:49
  yeah, yeah, I agree. There's some obviously some
• 32:51
  major pivot points, some. Developments, yeah.
• 32:55
  Yeah. So it's interesting.
• 32:56
  But again, I've watched him on both sides of it.
• 32:58
  I prefer to him on the good side of things.
• 33:00
  I guess. Like my favorite role of him was
• 33:02
  in narrow margin. That's like prime gene, prime
• 33:05
  gene for me. But I can appreciate Lex Luthor.
• 33:09
  Like, come on. Who couldn't, really.
• 33:10
  Yeah, and looks like Susan is his kryptonite, ironically.
• 33:16
  That's the truth. I mean, either way, he has the
• 33:20
  sensibility to bring in a guy like Tom to work for him as a
• 33:26
  liaison to the CIA or to all agencies actually.
• 33:30
  But yeah, it's the main 1 though.
• 33:32
  It's the main 1. Marshall of Die Hard 2 fame, of
• 33:36
  course. Probably other stuff as well.
• 33:37
  Politician, I believe Congressman and congressman
• 33:41
  they're. So that's the trio.
• 33:42
  We see a lot of them on screen together, Prichard, Hackman and
• 33:46
  Costner. Yep.
• 33:48
  I messed that up. I did actor, character actor.
• 33:52
  You really switched it up for sure.
• 33:54
  I'll follow along. Yeah, Bryce Pitch, Pritchard
• 33:57
  and. Ferrell.
• 33:59
  Ferrell all together, All together.
• 34:01
  And yeah, this is ultimately the triumvirate.
• 34:03
  This is going to be our main guide throughout the rest of the
• 34:05
  movie and how these three relate to one another and interact and
• 34:09
  so forth. I think this particular trio is
• 34:13
  phenomenal. Again, we really get to see
• 34:15
  Hackman be kind of in a low grade.
• 34:20
  There's moments where he's the A guy and there's times where he's
• 34:23
  the B guy and Hackman playing the B guy.
• 34:26
  Not a good look. Is interesting to me.
• 34:28
  It's not a great look and it's not common.
• 34:30
  He's often the A guy so I'm watching him unravel with Susan
• 34:34
  later. Is odd just from a
• 34:37
  characterization, but also where he is seemingly at times on
• 34:42
  equal footing or even subservient to Tom and then also
• 34:46
  now very dominant and a very heavy-handed and almost I mean
• 34:50
  spirited a little bit to Pritchard.
• 34:52
  It's interesting to watch all three of those dynamics through
• 34:55
  the eyes of this actor that we know as being often the a guy,
• 34:59
  which I think is it's good casting.
• 35:00
  Jean can bring it down a bit. Like Jean can just be so chilled
• 35:03
  and relaxed and have the lines. His little laugh every every
• 35:08
  movie where giggle. Yeah.
• 35:09
  And he says things that are well, he just says things that
• 35:12
  are great. This is the biggest building in
• 35:20
  the world, apparently. Pentagon.
• 35:22
  Yeah, got a lot of rooms. Huge, Very, very big.
• 35:26
  I don't know how many bathrooms, but there's at least one because
• 35:28
  we saw it, but probably, probably a few more.
• 35:32
  And we meet a couple of characters, some I'm guessing
• 35:35
  you recognize, and there's one that I recognize, Hesselman.
• 35:39
  Yeah, I immediately recognized him from Basic Instinct of.
• 35:42
  Course you did on your show. One of the least interesting
• 35:46
  things about that movie I. Suppose if I think back, did he
• 35:48
  uncross? His legs, he's a good kid.
• 35:52
  But yeah, that's the only thing I really recognized him from.
• 35:54
  But I did. I was like immediately I knew
• 35:55
  that guy. OK, the guy that stood out for
• 35:58
  me, and this is a funny story actually, because his
• 36:01
  character's name, actually I don't even know his real name in
• 36:04
  this movie, is Kevin O'Brien. OK.
• 36:07
  Two things about him you're going to.
• 36:09
  Have to give me something, yeah. There was an actor whose real
• 36:12
  name was Kevin O'Brien in Friday part three last week.
• 36:16
  And you didn't mention. It I did not mention it.
• 36:18
  Wow. I was saving it for this.
• 36:19
  I was saving it, all right. And secondly, Star Trek 6, I
• 36:25
  don't recognize it, Iman. So he's on the planet?
• 36:28
  No, he's no, sorry, sorry, I did not say that properly.
• 36:32
  No, he's in the movie. Say movie is Iman a completely
• 36:36
  different planet. He was at the beginning when
• 36:38
  they had that little. Round 2 in the UN.
• 36:41
  And Kirk's like, you know, let them die.
• 36:43
  Yeah. I think that might have been the
• 36:45
  scene. He's just running the show
• 36:46
  there. OK.
• 36:47
  Yeah. So that's him.
• 36:48
  If you notice. Kevin O'Brien.
• 36:49
  Yeah. There's one more a little bit
• 36:50
  later from Star Trek 6, and I'll let you know when it comes up,
• 36:53
  buddy. Can't wait.
• 36:54
  And probably you probably. Can in the interim, listen to it
• 36:56
  in the archives? But yeah, so we just meet some
• 36:58
  some players, some players. He Kevin O'Brien is the he's
• 37:01
  also liaison. We have a couple of liaisons
• 37:04
  here, which I think is a fantastic position.
• 37:05
  I want to be a liaison. You want a liaise?
• 37:07
  I want a liaise, OK? And he's a liaison from the CIA
• 37:11
  to here. Yes.
• 37:12
  So him and Costner's character should work pretty.
• 37:15
  That's their Yeah, that's their main focus right there.
• 37:17
  And he seems like a really nice guy.
• 37:19
  OK, Just want you to know that. Put a pin in that.
• 37:22
  I think that this world is rife with.
• 37:27
  Nice people. Movie opportunities?
• 37:29
  Yeah. Political realm of Washington,
• 37:31
  but not the president. And like the movies.
• 37:33
  Been. Yeah, that's good.
• 37:34
  Yeah. These are all like the low
• 37:35
  levels and the. Mid tier, mid tier, mid tier.
• 37:38
  Exactly. And then those that work
• 37:39
  underneath. And one of the things when The
• 37:41
  West Wing, my favorite television show, came out, one
• 37:44
  of the ideas was it's not a president show.
• 37:45
  It's about the staffers. It's about.
• 37:47
  Just the wing. Just the wing.
• 37:49
  So watching this, you're sort of like, oh, yeah.
• 37:51
  So the liaisons between the FBI and the CIA and the Navy and
• 37:54
  the, you get it, Secretary of State and the department and all
• 37:58
  of these different places, you're like, there's a lot of
• 38:00
  story here. And I think this movie really
• 38:02
  kind of excites me as it starts to unfold and connect the dots
• 38:05
  here. Wonderful, wonderful.
• 38:07
  Would you mind, though, if we stepped away, went back to
• 38:11
  Susan's house? Sure.
• 38:13
  It also has its own seemingly a lot of lot of people coming and
• 38:15
  going. Potentially in her line of work,
• 38:19
  which don't. Know, she liaises.
• 38:21
  She liaises very well with the best of them.
• 38:24
  This is at the point where we find out as an audience that
• 38:29
  she's involved. I think if not, we find out who,
• 38:33
  that there's another guy in her life.
• 38:34
  That's not fair. Well, no, we already established
• 38:38
  that when she's on the phone and Hackman is in her room in a robe
• 38:41
  when she was on the phone, you're saying yes, not as an.
• 38:43
  Audience not as an audience as Ferrell yes, yes, he he seemed
• 38:47
  to know there was a guy sure, but now he finds out it's David,
• 38:51
  it's the. Guy.
• 38:52
  It's the guy he works for and he's like, do you realize I work
• 38:55
  for him? And she's like, well, that makes
• 38:57
  two of us. touché, am I right? Great line.
• 39:01
  He's bottling it up pretty good at this point.
• 39:03
  Sure. I'd be pretty upset though.
• 39:05
  You think? I mean I'll lend things to
• 39:08
  people, but sharing? I don't know.
• 39:11
  I think in this world everything is so transactional that it's
• 39:15
  like understood. I mean, I'm not suggesting that
• 39:18
  it's OK. I just.
• 39:19
  Make you work. But I think sharing is just
• 39:23
  come. It's comes to the territory.
• 39:25
  I know, but there's the I love yous come out OK anyways, I
• 39:28
  guess if he knew it going in, this is her job.
• 39:31
  To whatever extent it is, there's a thing going on.
• 39:34
  She had that going on 1st, so if it happened afterwards that's a
• 39:37
  different. Conversation.
• 39:39
  He's walking into a pre established situation.
• 39:42
  And apparently David Bryce bought her a nice ash tray of
• 39:46
  sorts. Didn't buy it.
• 39:48
  Gifted it to her. Yes, he was gifted it.
• 39:50
  Yes, and he gifted. It to her, I think it's
• 39:52
  Moroccan. Yes, yeah, but it's a key plot
• 39:55
  point that doesn't make a meal out of itself in the moment.
• 39:59
  No. Which again, this movie, I think
• 40:01
  plotting very subtle, is incredible.
• 40:03
  Yes, none of it tips its hand very good.
• 40:06
  It's a great foreshadowing moment.
• 40:08
  He looks at the jewelry box. That's unique.
• 40:10
  Oh, well, it came from the ambassador to Morocco.
• 40:13
  Oh, OK, not really noteworthy specifically beyond just, oh,
• 40:18
  that's interesting. And he reveals a little bit that
• 40:21
  because he says at that .0, this guy must be pretty high up then.
• 40:25
  So it's laying the groundwork to who Bryce is, and then that
• 40:28
  obviously leads to the reveal and so forth.
• 40:30
  So it's really well interconnected in this scene in
• 40:33
  particular. Yeah, and that's not easy to do.
• 40:35
  And I don't think writers and film makers necessarily want to
• 40:39
  take that on, because for a movie not to tip its hand too
• 40:42
  much, to weave it perfectly like a well woven item, that's a
• 40:48
  challenge from a writing perspective.
• 40:50
  Yeah, I agree 100%. You better it's.
• 40:53
  True, but I will say Tom is not upset, but to the point where
• 40:58
  he's going to join the party. Yeah, she's getting picked.
• 41:01
  Up for a party that he's frustrated that he's not going
• 41:04
  to. Yeah, well, he has an invite.
• 41:06
  Sure, but he's frustrated. He can.
• 41:08
  Tell he's hurt. Yeah, apparently this David
• 41:11
  Brice guy, even though he's hap married, likes to just see her
• 41:17
  there at these gathers. That's what he says, just as he
• 41:20
  says stranger like. And then later, you mean when he
• 41:23
  has the opportunity, obviously he.
• 41:26
  Well, I think, you know, sometimes you just, it's like
• 41:30
  you're sitting on a bus and you see a pretty person.
• 41:32
  You're like, yeah, I'm going to check him out, Yeah.
• 41:35
  But I mean that's that's it. You you can't touch.
• 41:38
  Well, not in that moment. That moment, yeah.
• 41:40
  But you open up some opportunities.
• 41:42
  OK, so you've done that. OK, moving on.
• 41:43
  Sure, absolutely. But it seemed in that moment
• 41:47
  when he shows up to the party, he gives the look like, let's
• 41:50
  get out of here. Yeah.
• 41:51
  And go because I think, yeah, she knows that he's just, she's
• 41:54
  just there as eye candy because the wife is there.
• 41:56
  Yeah. So they decide to take a little
• 41:59
  journey of sojourn for the second time.
• 42:03
  A little trip away, yeah. Nice car.
• 42:07
  Yeah, lovely car. How do you feel about the woman
• 42:09
  driving the car? Are you a modern man?
• 42:13
  Jeepers great car you've said. I don't I don't know cars you
• 42:17
  don't know. I mean, it's got 4.
• 42:18
  Wheels. It's a.
• 42:19
  Convertible. That's right.
• 42:20
  Yeah. Top down wind in the hair on the
• 42:25
  coast. He can wear a hat like George.
• 42:27
  You know you can wear the old indie hat.
• 42:28
  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. There you go.
• 42:30
  You. Can do that.
• 42:30
  You can do that. Yeah.
• 42:31
  A couple of notes I have about that weekend.
• 42:33
  Not a lot, Philip. OK, There's a couple of things I
• 42:35
  want to point out to you. Nope.
• 42:37
  Well, I wrote it down. Yeah.
• 42:39
  First of all, they're still in the car and he is eating bugs.
• 42:42
  Yeah. Don't understand.
• 42:43
  From the windshield. I don't get it.
• 42:45
  I don't. Am I missing something?
• 42:47
  I don't get it. He wasn't faking it.
• 42:48
  And he's being playful. Yeah.
• 42:50
  He's like, I'll get you another one.
• 42:51
  Like what? Does he have a protein
• 42:53
  deficiency because there's protein in there?
• 42:55
  When I think about it in hindsight, actually, I think
• 42:58
  that maybe it's like, because I've been in some crazy places
• 43:01
  doing some crazy things and underground, that this might be
• 43:04
  like the only thing I've got left, sort of like living off
• 43:06
  the land. So I'm like, is this the that he
• 43:10
  was stranded? And so like, you know, I'm
• 43:11
  filling in too many blanks. Yeah, you are.
• 43:13
  Just doesn't make any. Sense.
• 43:14
  Yeah, that's a stretch. Yeah, I'm not sure.
• 43:17
  But we we can move past it, though.
• 43:18
  I I still like Kevin. Sure.
• 43:20
  AKA Tom. Well, because he's bugs, that's
• 43:23
  why. The bugs is a deal breaker.
• 43:24
  It's if she's eating the bugs. I'm out.
• 43:27
  I'm rolling out of the cart 80 kilometers an hour, or in their
• 43:30
  case, 50 mph. There you go.
• 43:32
  There you go. Did the conversion Appreciate
• 43:33
  it? They stayed an inn.
• 43:35
  Let me tell you about that inn. That bed is not going to make
• 43:37
  it. Not for these two, no.
• 43:40
  She sat down on it and it starts squeaking on this.
• 43:42
  Doesn't have the legs. No pun intended.
• 43:44
  Does not have the legs. For their for their weekend
• 43:48
  plans. My other note is the rents a big
• 43:52
  boat which is a little foreshadowing to later.
• 43:57
  I guess, do you like big boats? Can you lie?
• 43:59
  I I can lie, no idea. I'm actually pretty honest, but
• 44:02
  he pays this guy to get a bigger boat, the boss's boat.
• 44:05
  My bigger concern is his shirt's too small.
• 44:08
  Whose shirt? Tom's, it's not a halter top,
• 44:12
  but it has a little bit of room there.
• 44:15
  OK, You know what I'm talking about.
• 44:17
  Like it doesn't go all the way down.
• 44:18
  Sure, I want to go all the way down.
• 44:21
  It's. A bad look.
• 44:22
  I think it's an 80s thing. Could be, but it has that, you
• 44:25
  know that some midriff stuff in the 80s when you go in the 80s
• 44:28
  when the guy's going to the gym and you had that Gray sort of
• 44:32
  three quarter top, it's like that, but it's a 4/5.
• 44:36
  Yeah. So it's like 3 fifths 3/4,
• 44:38
  You're OK. Oh no, I'm not OK with that
• 44:39
  either. Oh no, that's a terrible.
• 44:41
  Look, OK, I was thinking about when you said that Friday the
• 44:43
  13th Part 1, if you recall, like there's like all those campers
• 44:46
  they've got. There.
• 44:46
  Yeah, exactly. So this is in that category.
• 44:49
  OK. I'm out.
• 44:52
  I turned the movie off. But that's pretty much all from
• 44:55
  the weekend. It seemed like a nice break they
• 44:58
  think they needed. Yeah, I mean, certainly they
• 45:00
  they seemingly had a good time. Again, this feels a little like
• 45:02
  out of place, like Manila. None of it is enough to take you
• 45:05
  out of the movie. People got to live, Phil.
• 45:06
  Yeah. And I kind of respected they're
• 45:08
  getting away and they're sort of doing this thing.
• 45:10
  And obviously it comes back later, as we see with some
• 45:12
  witnesses. Yeah, and it also that purpose
• 45:15
  it has also Hackman wondering where are you?
• 45:18
  It allows us to get a window into his tendencies to be
• 45:22
  jealous. Yes.
• 45:24
  Because if she's gone for too long, he's got questions.
• 45:27
  Who you with? Do I know them?
• 45:29
  I know a lot of people. Yes, it's a great scene.
• 45:31
  Yeah, It, it, it is it. It starts out as a great scene
• 45:35
  with her and Costner where he just shows up.
• 45:37
  He just. Shows she panics because she
• 45:39
  knows the jealousy is coming. She knows that there's this
• 45:41
  cloak and dagger thing that she's got to do.
• 45:43
  Tom cannot be there and Tom can't be there and Tom's pissed
• 45:47
  and he's like, you know, I'm leaving at the front door the
• 45:48
  next time, blah blah blah. Knocked that coffee table
• 45:51
  pretty. Good.
• 45:52
  Yeah, it's pretty frustrating. But he obviously has a right to
• 45:54
  be, I think. Sure.
• 45:56
  I don't know after the weekend they had.
• 45:57
  Well come on, that bed busted. And then we really get Jean
• 46:02
  being perfectly deviant to love him in this thing, the way he
• 46:07
  manages the situation. We see the ugly side of his
• 46:11
  character. Yes.
• 46:12
  David Bryce, absolutely. He really wants to know who she
• 46:15
  was with. Yeah, we get that great shot as
• 46:18
  she's cuz he's coming into the house and costing.
• 46:20
  Her leaves. Oh yeah, yeah.
• 46:21
  Again, Alcott, we're talking. About come on here.
• 46:23
  Expect that the shadows. Bryce and the light, the way
• 46:26
  those two playoff one another and yeah, when he gets up there,
• 46:29
  you know things are about to kind of explode.
• 46:30
  Exactly. He roughs her up a little bit,
• 46:33
  yes, initially. And then he has this moment
• 46:35
  like, OK, I'm sorry I did that. Overcome.
• 46:38
  He's fine. He's OK.
• 46:39
  Half. Us are the best of.
• 46:40
  Us. But then he loses it again, He
• 46:42
  loses it again. And then we have, I would argue,
• 46:45
  the slap of the century, the. Century.
• 46:47
  You're going century. And there's a whole sport with
• 46:50
  slapping. I don't know if you've seen it
• 46:52
  where they slap each other. Yeah.
• 46:54
  Yeah, it's sickening. It's OK, people watch.
• 46:56
  I don't know. I mean, the writer of this movie
• 46:58
  wrote a movie, The Sale of the Century by William Friedkin,
• 47:02
  Chevy Chase, Sigourney Weaver and Gregory Hines.
• 47:03
  So there you go. Slap of the century.
• 47:05
  Feels. Feels.
• 47:06
  Feels right and knocks her right over the ledge.
• 47:10
  Yeah, the railing, the stairs, the whole railing.
• 47:13
  That would be it. And not so much a ledge in your.
• 47:15
  Ex No, as soon as I said it, I'm like he's going to correct.
• 47:17
  Me, I got, I let something slide.
• 47:19
  I cannot not that not a ledge. It is a railing and she goes
• 47:24
  through a glass table. Yeah.
• 47:26
  Do you think that does it? Well, it doesn't matter.
• 47:29
  I think for the purposes of the movie, yes, but I think in real
• 47:32
  life, yeah, scrapes and probably maybe a.
• 47:36
  Dislocation, it would be a touch and go at least for a little
• 47:38
  bit. Yeah, they might lose her on the
• 47:40
  way, that's right. But.
• 47:41
  But she looked fine. Yeah, I think she's faking it.
• 47:44
  Yeah, I. Think she just twisted an ankle
• 47:45
  and I know it's not what he intended.
• 47:47
  So he's not the bad bad bad bad guy.
• 47:53
  Sure, but obviously he allowed. He didn't murder.
• 47:56
  I wouldn't say it's first degree.
• 47:58
  This is definitely a second degree.
• 48:00
  Not premeditated, not premeditated.
• 48:01
  Possibly the third degree if there is one.
• 48:04
  Yeah, Is there? I don't know.
• 48:05
  I don't know the third degree burn.
• 48:07
  That's true. I think it's manslaughter would
• 48:08
  be the next tear down or. As one joke in the Naked Gun
• 48:12
  remake is you serve time for man's laughter.
• 48:16
  That must have been one. Oh yeah.
• 48:19
  That's in the trailer. Yeah, is it that's.
• 48:21
  One of the reasons why I didn't watch it.
• 48:23
  Yeah, yeah, I went to see that. Did you see?
• 48:25
  Did you watch it? Yeah, we'll talk about that
• 48:26
  later. So she's dead and his first
• 48:31
  thought is to go to Prichard. Go to the fixer.
• 48:33
  We sort of know that that's kind of his.
• 48:35
  Character, yeah, we've established that relationship is
• 48:37
  very close. He's clearly obsessed with him a
• 48:39
  little and I would say in love with him even.
• 48:42
  Obviously only we find that out later a little more deeply.
• 48:44
  But watching Patton, we haven't talked much about him.
• 48:47
  His performance in the movie. I love because it's it's odd,
• 48:51
  but it's odd in like the right ways, and it's odd in a
• 48:53
  compelling way, and it's odd in an interesting way.
• 48:55
  It's really good. But watching him say things
• 48:57
  like, you know, Bright, this is the most magnificent man I've
• 48:59
  ever known. This was in the first minute of
• 49:01
  the movie where he's saying he's.
• 49:04
  The greatest, he's the greatest. So when we're getting to points.
• 49:07
  Don't play to him. Exactly.
• 49:08
  So we're getting to points where you need somebody to help you
• 49:11
  out of a jam. Prichard seemingly has
• 49:14
  established himself as being that guy.
• 49:15
  He is the guy, and at this point Gene is like, I should go to the
• 49:20
  cops. So that's why I'm saying he's
• 49:22
  not all in bad guy like he's been in some movies, like, you
• 49:26
  know, Lex Luthor. He's pretty all in on that, I
• 49:28
  would say. So I like that about his
• 49:30
  character because usually it's one or the other with Jean, but
• 49:33
  he is in this sort of Gray area. But ultimately he has committed
• 49:36
  a pretty terrible crime and Pritchard convinces him that
• 49:41
  it's best that we cover it up. Yes, absolutely.
• 49:45
  What was that tail, Phil? You've covered stuff up for
• 49:47
  people before. You've been the complicated,
• 49:49
  trust me. I can't get into it right now A.
• 49:52
  Lot of gloves. But one of the things that that
• 49:54
  means to Pritchard is Yuri. Yeah, right.
• 49:57
  That just pops out. And I don't know anything about
• 49:59
  Yuri. Yuri.
• 50:00
  It hasn't been mentioned at all in the rest of this movie up
• 50:02
  until this point. And Pritchard's just like we
• 50:05
  know that there's a guy that we and, and he basically just
• 50:08
  immediately starts to fabricate this story to bring Yuri out.
• 50:14
  Yeah, Yuri has been a rumor. Yeah, he's sort of a spook
• 50:16
  story. As I say, yeah, Mole.
• 50:19
  Really. Exactly.
• 50:20
  And I like how it's existed and they're able to explain it to us
• 50:24
  as an audience to who it is, what it is.
• 50:27
  OK. This is actually, it's not a bad
• 50:29
  idea. That's right.
• 50:30
  If you're going to do it, yeah, this is your way.
• 50:32
  So I I think it's great. I think it's a great scapegoat
• 50:34
  for the characters. And as an audience member,
• 50:37
  you're like, oh, you're introducing this new layer of
• 50:39
  intrigue. And I found that very
• 50:42
  compelling. And watching them and watching
• 50:44
  Pritchard in particular, cuz at this point, Hackman is a write
• 50:47
  off, right? He's distracted.
• 50:49
  He's zoned out. Yeah, and so Pritchard comes in
• 50:51
  to take care of business and watching his brain and him
• 50:55
  selling Hackman on don't go to the cops.
• 50:58
  We can use this and we'll use Yuri and we'll use it to
• 51:01
  negotiate with the CIA like he's got it mapped.
• 51:04
  Out. He's smart guy.
• 51:05
  Yeah, he's smart guy. And I think it's really
• 51:08
  fantastic. Again, great performances for
• 51:10
  that and Hackman playing as you're saying he killed her,
• 51:14
  it's arguable if he intended to or not.
• 51:16
  I don't think he did. But the performances in this I
• 51:19
  think are fantastic. In this scene in particular, I
• 51:21
  think really good. I wouldn't expect any less from
• 51:23
  from Gene and Kevin, even though it's young in his career.
• 51:26
  But a patent is a guy I only know from Armageddon.
• 51:30
  I loved him in that and I know he's been in a lot more than
• 51:33
  just that, but this is a movie that I really get a sense of.
• 51:36
  He's got some acting. Yeah, some real chops.
• 51:39
  Yeah, some chops. He's in the remade Halloween
• 51:41
  movies too. Oh, that's too bad, that'll ruin
• 51:44
  your career. Hundreds of millions of dollars
• 51:47
  in the box office. Doesn't make it.
• 51:48
  Right. Really ruined it.
• 51:51
  And I think, Phil, if you are going to go through this plan,
• 51:55
  you need to go to the apartment. Yeah, of course.
• 51:58
  And get rid of any evidence that Bryce was ever there.
• 52:01
  All the fingerprints off. Everything.
• 52:03
  He's a good scrubber. He scrubbed.
• 52:04
  Well, he scrubbed the phone and he's thorough, so he went under
• 52:07
  the bed. Yeah, where all the secrets are.
• 52:10
  And he finds that photo that was taken earlier, if you recall.
• 52:13
  Yep. When they're being really
• 52:15
  playful. This is where she was a
• 52:17
  candidate officially for Francis.
• 52:20
  I'm like, you're so annoying right now.
• 52:22
  I don't care how good looking you are, how you know sick.
• 52:26
  You're driving me nuts here. But he takes a photo of himself,
• 52:29
  or she takes, she takes, she takes the photo.
• 52:31
  And he tries to break it 'cause he doesn't want his photo, which
• 52:34
  we find out. Later.
• 52:34
  Yeah. Well, you just.
• 52:35
  Yeah, Did it too soon again. You can't do this today.
• 52:37
  Yeah, and you can barely see. It's not exposed properly.
• 52:41
  I don't know all the terminologies and Kodaks of the
• 52:45
  world, but he finds it nonetheless.
• 52:47
  Yes, but obviously he can't see what it is.
• 52:49
  But it will play later for sure. Oh, absolutely.
• 52:53
  It's the linchpin of the whole thing.
• 52:54
  Oh, I wouldn't. Go that far.
• 52:56
  OK, but pretty close. And what he and Bryce decide is
• 53:00
  we're going to put Tom in charge?
• 53:02
  Yeah. Why?
• 53:02
  Not. He's their new kind of Guinea
• 53:04
  pig around the office. And this is a moment where I
• 53:07
  think Costner really delivers. This is the year before, or the
• 53:12
  same year maybe of The Untouchables.
• 53:15
  So like he's at his ascent and then following up with full
• 53:18
  Durham in 89. Robin Hood in 90 ish. 92 we got
• 53:23
  91 with Dances with Wolves. We got 90 I think with JFK like
• 53:26
  he is in a stretch. Yeah, this is the beginning of
• 53:29
  his. It feels like it's an ascent and
• 53:30
  watching him and he's not an actor that I particularly give a
• 53:32
  lot of credit to generally. I think we both well, I know I
• 53:35
  did say well, he's just really good looking and he just is fun
• 53:39
  to watch. Charisma.
• 53:40
  Yeah, he has a charisma, but I even think I said that I don't
• 53:43
  really think he's necessarily an amazing actor.
• 53:46
  I think it was Robin Hood. In the movie for sure,
• 53:48
  Untouchables too, where he's kind of.
• 53:49
  Yeah, he's. The straight guy, right?
• 53:51
  So, Costner. Character, yeah, but here is OK,
• 53:55
  yeah, he can do stuff. Yeah, so they reveal who was
• 53:59
  murdered. I suspect Yuri is the cause of
• 54:02
  and then watching him react to the evidence, as it were, that
• 54:06
  that. Great couch acting.
• 54:08
  I think he's really good and you can't even see straight.
• 54:10
  He's got to go to the washroom even I thought.
• 54:12
  He was going to puke. He had that like I'm sick to my
• 54:15
  stomach. Look, Yeah.
• 54:16
  Was it too obvious? That's my question.
• 54:19
  No, it's my question, I I said to myself.
• 54:21
  I asked at first. Anytime in a movie where I see
• 54:24
  that, I feel like, well, that's obvious.
• 54:27
  And some of that is the camera work.
• 54:28
  It's slips to the eyes you, it tells you the story.
• 54:32
  Now, maybe in real life it's not quite so obvious.
• 54:34
  Or Gene's not looking in that direction.
• 54:36
  But watching the look, the hyperventilation and the I'm
• 54:39
  going to go, the brain would assume something triggering you
• 54:42
  here that isn't obvious. So I would poke a little bit
• 54:47
  more on that. As a filmmaker, this is, and I'm
• 54:49
  not one of those, is having a quick cut to the other
• 54:57
  characters, Hackman and Patton, kind of busy, like not looking
• 55:01
  at him, sure. We're they're trying to have
• 55:02
  their conversation, right? Yeah.
• 55:04
  Where that it would allow him to have that moment and not have
• 55:06
  us. Fair question it, but that's
• 55:08
  pretty nitpicky. Totally.
• 55:09
  I think again, it works in the movie.
• 55:10
  I don't have any questions throughout the movie.
• 55:13
  Generally, I think everything plotted is really well laid out
• 55:16
  and effective, and performances I think are generally very
• 55:19
  solid, and this scene is another example of that.
• 55:30
  We have O'Brien, which I I really like.
• 55:33
  They don't do a lot with. Him, they don't.
• 55:34
  It's very small, but he is such a genuine nice guy and you
• 55:39
  wouldn't expect that from a character who works for the CIA
• 55:42
  or is a politician just in that world.
• 55:44
  Liaison. I think liaison is the exception
• 55:47
  to the rule because you also kind of like Tom and they're
• 55:50
  both liaisons, but Scott really doesn't have time for that.
• 55:55
  Yeah, because they're dealing with the sub, right?
• 55:58
  Like all the stuff the CIA cares about.
• 56:00
  It generally is the sub. What sub exactly?
• 56:04
  Exactly. But they are establishing that
• 56:08
  this guy O'Brien is curious and they're trying to throw him out.
• 56:14
  Or, you know, particularly Pritchard.
• 56:15
  Just Pritchard. Cause.
• 56:17
  Costner's giving him. He's like, I want to talk to
• 56:19
  you. Yeah.
• 56:20
  And Scott twice, I think. Yeah.
• 56:21
  And I love the fact that he does want to talk to him.
• 56:24
  I don't know. There's something about those
• 56:25
  two guys. Yeah.
• 56:26
  Again, I think it's just liaison on liaison.
• 56:28
  I want to see some of that action.
• 56:30
  Yeah. Some hot liaison action.
• 56:35
  This is parts of the movie that I don't fully grasp on the 1st
• 56:38
  watch about Tom's relationship to the sub itself.
• 56:42
  Does Tom as Yuri want the sub to be funded?
• 56:47
  I think so. Well, I think as we'll get
• 56:50
  through to the rest of the movie, there are some questions
• 56:52
  around watching it a second time and have him.
• 56:55
  OK, you're Yuri. Now for my second viewing.
• 56:58
  Does this all make sense? Yeah, there's some question
• 57:00
  marks around. That's fair.
• 57:01
  I think ultimately in this moment he does want the sub to
• 57:04
  be funded because ultimately it's a terrible sub and the
• 57:08
  Americans are going to put billions of dollars into it and
• 57:10
  so. I guess we don't get the time to
• 57:12
  really flush. That out.
• 57:13
  So I think when he's trying to liaise with the CIA guy.
• 57:16
  That's when he was. Dropping these things to try and
• 57:20
  set up a situation where they continue to fund the sub.
• 57:23
  By the time it's over, they're getting the funding right.
• 57:25
  So I think that that's ultimately the play, which is
• 57:28
  why that relationship continues to happen there.
• 57:30
  You go and it's. That relationship that goes
• 57:32
  brings us back to Langley. You love Langley?
• 57:35
  It's my favorite. Did I say that right, Langley?
• 57:37
  Langley, Yeah, I think you're saying with the Langley.
• 57:41
  Yeah. But Langley, Yeah, I visited in
• 57:44
  Van Vancouver. There's a suburb, Langley.
• 57:46
  I just met us watching The Recruit.
• 57:48
  Donaldson, Phil. So in Langley.
• 57:49
  Goes to Langley in every movie he does.
• 57:51
  Spy game Langley, Yeah, 13 days, probably a little bit of time in
• 57:57
  line. Probably, and nothing better
• 57:59
  than that with a guy named. Well, I'm going to go with
• 58:02
  Marshall. What's his real name?
• 58:03
  Do you know Fred Thompson? There you go.
• 58:05
  There's no question mark of that.
• 58:07
  That's. That's correct.
• 58:07
  Yeah. He's great.
• 58:08
  He's amazing. And Die Hard, too.
• 58:10
  Yeah, he's great. He's great in this, too.
• 58:11
  He's plays power very well. Yeah.
• 58:13
  And O'Brien, they're having their nice little conversation
• 58:16
  just. Yeah, they're kind of revealing
• 58:17
  a little bit. Yeah.
• 58:18
  Yeah. He.
• 58:19
  Wants to talk and but I've figured it out.
• 58:21
  He's like one of these two people, or the mistress that she
• 58:24
  was the mistress of, yes. Makes more sense, and it's not
• 58:27
  Scott. It's certainly not Scott
• 58:28
  Pritchard who's revealed at this point to be a homosexual.
• 58:31
  Yeah. Which is not good if you read
• 58:32
  the Old or New Testament, because you'd be damned, I
• 58:35
  think. Both don't really treat them
• 58:36
  very. Well, no, Delivered well, but
• 58:40
  nonetheless, Marshall is a powerful character on screen.
• 58:44
  Or the actor, not the, yeah, an actor.
• 58:46
  Thompson. Yeah.
• 58:47
  As we head back to the regular office, the Pentagon, Yes,
• 58:50
  biggest in the world, what are your thoughts around the
• 58:53
  technology being used It's. Fantastic.
• 58:56
  It's really nice. It's a nice change of pace and
• 58:59
  it's one of those things that, yes, it's very dated, but it's
• 59:03
  still entertaining. It's fun to visit.
• 59:06
  Yeah, I think you nailed it. It's compelling in a way that
• 59:10
  modern technology isn't exactly We talked about this with the
• 59:13
  clear and present danger sequence, waiting for the data
• 59:16
  to adapt or to transfer from one computer to another from the
• 59:21
  screen. The bar going across.
• 59:23
  All of that I think is really interesting and exciting.
• 59:26
  And watching it implemented in this movie where they talk about
• 59:29
  how the photo is inconclusive because the emulsion is down,
• 59:32
  but we have computers now, we can input the information and
• 59:36
  we're just going to basically create a ticking clock for the
• 59:39
  rest of the movie and a pressure is going to amp up.
• 59:41
  And to me, I'm like, if that's genius.
• 59:43
  And in modern technology, that scene couldn't happen A.
• 59:46
  Lot of this movie couldn't happen.
• 59:47
  That's the thing. And you're talking about
• 59:48
  dropping the jewelry box into the State Department's database,
• 59:52
  and it's got to find a place to put it and all of this slow
• 59:55
  stuff. The credit card statements,
• 59:59
  Yeah, the banks don't submit those until midday.
• 1:00:01
  They won't get those for two days.
• 1:00:03
  Just in the modern age that none of that happens.
• 1:00:05
  And this scene sucks. Without it, yeah.
• 1:00:07
  And the fun thing for us, being the age that we are, we can
• 1:00:10
  appreciate those, we recognize them, we live through them.
• 1:00:14
  And I think one series of movies that's interesting is Mission
• 1:00:16
  Impossible. Now I know we haven't really
• 1:00:18
  seen any of them, No. The first one I believe was in
• 1:00:20
  93 ish. No.
• 1:00:23
  OK, 9096 David. OK, OK.
• 1:00:26
  So even in 96 the technology of then is is it's much different
• 1:00:30
  than it is now. Holy.
• 1:00:31
  And the last installment which I have not seen just came out last
• 1:00:34
  year. So you have a a good chunk of
• 1:00:36
  time where you can. See sure in 20 years, basically
• 1:00:39
  when you're watching that progression for.
• 1:00:40
  Sure, exactly. So it's cool.
• 1:00:41
  It's cool, yeah. It's nice to revisit something
• 1:00:43
  like this for that sort of old school technologies.
• 1:00:47
  Yeah, I worked at the airport, if you recall, and we had a dot,
• 1:00:49
  dot matrix printer. This is like in 2020.
• 1:00:53
  We're still on the dot matrix printer, so hearing that kick,
• 1:00:57
  kick, kick, kick, kick kick. Kick.
• 1:00:58
  It's really fun. It's that's when printing.
• 1:01:00
  Peak The movie is kind of peaking at this point.
• 1:01:02
  I would suggest because we're going to have one of my favorite
• 1:01:04
  scenes in the movie. That doesn't surprise me.
• 1:01:06
  Oh, OK. I'm pretty good at you.
• 1:01:08
  Are you are. Yeah, I know I'm inside your
• 1:01:10
  head and it's a little scary sometimes after last week.
• 1:01:16
  But yeah, so Pritchard and Tom, yeah, are on route to visit
• 1:01:21
  Nina. Yeah, because that was the last
• 1:01:23
  phone call. Last phone call.
• 1:01:25
  Which they found out four days after they started.
• 1:01:26
  Looking Oh, come on in. The modern age, which I love.
• 1:01:30
  So this is a scene where all the elements that play in this scene
• 1:01:33
  are are perfection to me. And I'm not sure if you feel the
• 1:01:37
  same, but for me watching Costner kind of take control of
• 1:01:40
  the situation, Susie walks in the.
• 1:01:41
  Room instantly and watching. I've never met you before.
• 1:01:44
  That's it you need and that's communicated so perfectly.
• 1:01:47
  Yeah, that Iman Nina picks up on it.
• 1:01:52
  Yeah, clicks and plays it that way.
• 1:01:54
  Not as actors. Like I see this scene, obviously
• 1:01:56
  they're actors, but watching this scene feels very real.
• 1:01:59
  And watching that, that dynamic between the two makes perfect
• 1:02:02
  sense to me. His eye acting which I went to
• 1:02:06
  acting classes once and this guy, my teacher did not like eye
• 1:02:08
  acting. This scene does not happen
• 1:02:11
  without. You need it there?
• 1:02:12
  Yeah, it has to. It's appropriate.
• 1:02:13
  This is perfect. And I think every subtle detail
• 1:02:16
  with her, him and Pritchard, who's just so focused on getting
• 1:02:21
  information, Yeah, yeah, looking at her passport.
• 1:02:24
  Yeah, South African. Ironically, she's an illegal
• 1:02:28
  alien and she played an alien in Star Trek 6.
• 1:02:34
  But luckily, Nina is able to really give Pritchard just
• 1:02:37
  enough information. She gives up Bryce, and then
• 1:02:40
  she's like, there's also another guy, but I don't know his name.
• 1:02:43
  That's it. And pictures, like, I'm
• 1:02:45
  confident we got everything. Yeah.
• 1:02:46
  When he delivers that, I I just like that character.
• 1:02:49
  It's just. That's perfection.
• 1:02:50
  Like this whole scene I think is great.
• 1:02:51
  It's showcase, It really is. It's a showcase in subtlety
• 1:02:54
  because there's no big moment in this.
• 1:02:56
  At all showcase without being showy.
• 1:02:58
  Yeah, that's how it's done. That's how it's done.
• 1:03:00
  That's how it's done exactly. I will say Philip, though, the
• 1:03:03
  next scene is a little weak coming off such a a strong
• 1:03:07
  moment. I don't know if you know what
• 1:03:08
  I'm alluding to here. I think I do.
• 1:03:10
  Yeah. It's a knock.
• 1:03:12
  Yeah, it's a knock on the movie. It's a knock on the movie, but
• 1:03:15
  you're allowed three knocks. That's.
• 1:03:17
  Right knocked three times. But the jewelry box, yeah, I
• 1:03:20
  think it's an ashtray, actually. Yeah, it looks like a jewelry
• 1:03:22
  box to me, but it could. Have been the gift, yes.
• 1:03:24
  Was found later. And they give it directly to
• 1:03:28
  Tom. Yeah, that's the exact person
• 1:03:30
  for this movie to work to give it to.
• 1:03:32
  Yeah, because that's his one proof that she's involved with
• 1:03:36
  David Brice. That's right.
• 1:03:37
  So a little contrived. Yes, it's a knock on the movie
• 1:03:39
  because it is a contrivance. Yeah, but I mean, if a grand
• 1:03:43
  scheme of things, it could happen.
• 1:03:44
  We've talked about this before, right?
• 1:03:46
  When a movie is bad, those contrivances, it's eye rolling,
• 1:03:50
  Take Me Out of the game, I'm done.
• 1:03:52
  When a movie is delivering in particularly coming off of a
• 1:03:55
  really great scene, it's easy to forgive that because it's not
• 1:03:58
  like, oh, here's another example of something.
• 1:04:00
  Here we go. And the way that this is
• 1:04:03
  utilized later sort of almost justifies what happens now,
• 1:04:08
  right? Because I think it's having that
• 1:04:09
  element. As part of the plot.
• 1:04:12
  Moving forward is important. We have to introduce the thugs.
• 1:04:16
  The Goons special forces? Not that special as far as I'm
• 1:04:20
  concerned. Guys don't appear to be elite.
• 1:04:23
  If you remember, Narrow Margin with Gene, Hackman and Archer
• 1:04:27
  all happened on a train. The bad guys were out of ATV
• 1:04:31
  show. Now I accepted in a show like
• 1:04:33
  MacGyver, even even that I don't like it because you can't take
• 1:04:37
  any of them serious. Like they're not bad enough.
• 1:04:39
  They don't have that aura. You don't see evil in them,
• 1:04:42
  right? Exactly.
• 1:04:43
  But I accepted that 80s TV, if I'm less willing to accept it
• 1:04:47
  out of a feature film, OK, Feature film of any era, all
• 1:04:50
  right. Did it bother me that much?
• 1:04:53
  Not too much. It's just noteworthy when you
• 1:04:55
  deliver such quality casting right previous.
• 1:05:00
  Yeah, why stop now? And quality.
• 1:05:01
  Writing and quality performance and like all these other
• 1:05:03
  elements, budget. And then you come in with these
• 1:05:06
  two guys that are supposed to be the bad of the bad, presumably.
• 1:05:09
  Oh, they were in the death squads and they overthrew a
• 1:05:11
  government and whatever. These two dudes do not strike me
• 1:05:15
  as that. I don't feel the threat.
• 1:05:17
  And maybe we're not supposed to ultimately, because it's too
• 1:05:19
  late in the movie to really kind of try and introduce that to a
• 1:05:22
  certain. Extent but they they are ill
• 1:05:24
  tempered and they do keep an eye on pretty close.
• 1:05:28
  They're supposed to do their job.
• 1:05:30
  I guess it's just too sluggy. Yeah, they're, they're just too
• 1:05:33
  slubby. Slubby.
• 1:05:35
  I said sluggy. I meant sluggy and I figured you
• 1:05:37
  meant sluggy. That's why I would correct you.
• 1:05:38
  Snoopy double snoopies. Yeah, like they're supposed to
• 1:05:44
  be the big tension for the last act of the movie, and I just
• 1:05:46
  don't buy it. I do buy the fact that their job
• 1:05:49
  is to eliminate any potential holes.
• 1:05:53
  Absolutely. Nina is a hole in this instance.
• 1:05:57
  And they're going to try to take care of that.
• 1:05:58
  Yeah, and Costner sees it coming right a mile away, knows exactly
• 1:06:02
  what's going to happen. And he would.
• 1:06:03
  I would. Yeah.
• 1:06:03
  You're in the center of all the intelligence happening around
• 1:06:06
  you. And right at the beginning of
• 1:06:07
  the introduction of these thugs, he's like, these guys are bad.
• 1:06:11
  I know this world. This is going to be a problem.
• 1:06:13
  That's right. Why are they here in the 1st?
• 1:06:15
  Place, that's right. And Pritchard hired them
• 1:06:16
  obviously to cover up for Bryce. So everything is going to be
• 1:06:18
  about covering up for Bryce. I will protect Bryce at all
• 1:06:22
  costs. To the ends of the of the earth.
• 1:06:25
  Yeah. 1 issue I do have though. Please.
• 1:06:27
  Is because he finds out so quickly that they're going to
• 1:06:31
  need us. Place of work, not her home.
• 1:06:34
  You think she'd take a day off to mourn Anyways, you got to
• 1:06:37
  keep yourself busy. That's right.
• 1:06:39
  He's so fast and getting out to the parking lot, into the car
• 1:06:43
  and out. I figured he'd be ahead.
• 1:06:45
  He's still catching up to them who are slowly walking.
• 1:06:48
  No rush, we'll kill her. No big deal.
• 1:06:50
  On shift till 5. Exactly.
• 1:06:52
  Kill her now, We'll kill her in two hours.
• 1:06:54
  What's the difference? But nonetheless, it does lead to
• 1:06:55
  our first real chase sequence. Yep.
• 1:06:59
  Yeah, and it's a pretty good one.
• 1:07:00
  I generally like it. It's a little long, but
• 1:07:02
  generally speaking I like the subway trick you love.
• 1:07:05
  That deep in the archives. Buddy, Yeah, French Connection,
• 1:07:08
  kind of some hints of. That scene in that movie.
• 1:07:11
  But yeah, I think generally I think it's a solid chase scene.
• 1:07:14
  I think a rooftop was involved, which is always nice.
• 1:07:17
  Briefly. And he gets to her and saves the
• 1:07:20
  day and everything is wonderful. I don't.
• 1:07:22
  I think that's kind of pushing it.
• 1:07:23
  Wonderful. But that part of the story is
• 1:07:26
  closed. He does protect her.
• 1:07:27
  Ultimately, you could tell that Nina is now out of this movie.
• 1:07:29
  That's right, and that's fine. That's fine.
• 1:07:31
  And Prichard is tired of weakness, which is a great line
• 1:07:34
  that is one of the best. Of it is great, yeah.
• 1:07:37
  We get Costner back with Hesselman and he's kind of
• 1:07:43
  asking a little too many favors of Hesselman, I think at this
• 1:07:45
  point, so he's got to give him a little.
• 1:07:47
  Something. Yeah, exactly.
• 1:07:48
  I like this scene a lot. Yeah, Hesselman seems to have a
• 1:07:50
  respect for Tom. I don't really know exactly
• 1:07:53
  where it comes from. I kind of addressed it earlier
• 1:07:55
  that there's some relationship. With history there.
• 1:07:57
  But we get kind of moments where he's asking too often, favors
• 1:08:02
  and ultimately in order to convince Hesselman he comes
• 1:08:05
  clean. Well, he comes clean twice.
• 1:08:07
  It's the first one where he says he was her lover.
• 1:08:09
  That's right. Yeah.
• 1:08:10
  OK. Yeah, I just think to play that
• 1:08:13
  scene as confidently as he does, and competently as well, is I
• 1:08:18
  don't know what's happening in the best ways.
• 1:08:21
  So I'm like, he's revealing something to ask someone.
• 1:08:23
  I'm like, is that going to screw him over?
• 1:08:24
  Like, it's this a moment of vulnerability?
• 1:08:26
  Like, what is the end game with Costner's character?
• 1:08:29
  Because I don't yet know anything about him other than
• 1:08:32
  he's our protagonist and I like him.
• 1:08:34
  But he didn't kill her. Yeah.
• 1:08:35
  That's all I know. And in the title of the movie,
• 1:08:37
  eventually the walls are coming in.
• 1:08:39
  That's it. To the point where there's no
• 1:08:40
  way out. Yeah.
• 1:08:41
  Exactly. And we don't want him to be on
• 1:08:44
  the hook for her killing. No, because we know that he
• 1:08:47
  didn't do it. So watching him and have to kind
• 1:08:49
  of confess, if you will, to being the other man and that's
• 1:08:52
  why he needs some help to kind of.
• 1:08:54
  He's stressing, too. Yeah, I look at this moment as a
• 1:08:57
  surface level problem. And then obviously as the movie
• 1:09:01
  continues, we're like, oh, it's like 10 feet deeper.
• 1:09:04
  Oh yeah, That if I'm very exciting to.
• 1:09:06
  Watch. Absolutely.
• 1:09:07
  And the things he's going to do is to alter the picture so it
• 1:09:11
  doesn't come back to him so quickly.
• 1:09:14
  Like buying time. That's it.
• 1:09:15
  It's all about buying time. Exactly.
• 1:09:17
  Hesselman's good at his job, too.
• 1:09:18
  Like, he's smart. He's always chewing gum or
• 1:09:21
  eating Chinese food or something.
• 1:09:23
  He's always got something going on there.
• 1:09:24
  I don't know if you noticed the business.
• 1:09:26
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:09:28
  And then he talks to Pamer, David Pamer, a nice little cameo
• 1:09:31
  in this movie. I'm.
• 1:09:32
  Only assuming you're talking about the guy from Max Payne.
• 1:09:39
  Only you in the entire world would say David Pamer.
• 1:09:42
  Yeah, that's right. Max Payne guy, the big party
• 1:09:45
  house. He's in quiz show.
• 1:09:47
  Let's just available in the archive.
• 1:09:48
  Yeah, that's true. Yeah, he's been a lot.
• 1:09:50
  He's been a lot. He's great in that he's got,
• 1:09:52
  he's nominated for an Oscar for Mr. Saturday Night.
• 1:09:54
  He's great in Max Payne as well. Let's not forget Donovan or TV
• 1:10:05
  specialist. Yes, yes.
• 1:10:08
  Damn, what is his real name? I don't remember, but he's been
• 1:10:11
  in a lot. Noteworthy, really for V.
• 1:10:13
  He's fantastic in V. OK if we ever did ATV movie
• 1:10:16
  again. It would.
• 1:10:17
  Oh, it's ATV movie. Well, that's off limits.
• 1:10:19
  I know I said it. Yeah, you said it.
• 1:10:21
  Not me, but. But we're talking Cosby Show,
• 1:10:24
  Empty Nest, murder, She Wrote. Probably he doesn't have a huge,
• 1:10:29
  huge role in this, but he fits the bill.
• 1:10:32
  Jason Bernard. That's the name that's.
• 1:10:33
  Right. Jason Bernard again, you want to
• 1:10:35
  see him do great work, Check out VB, the miniseries.
• 1:10:38
  You know what, when anyone tells me to check something out,
• 1:10:41
  you're out. I don't, but it works both ways.
• 1:10:44
  I was hanging out with the fellas the other day and I
• 1:10:47
  watched this great British series called Capture.
• 1:10:50
  You'd like it cuz she's a redhead.
• 1:10:51
  Like a young Gillian Anderson, but good acting skills.
• 1:10:54
  And like, you got to watch this. And everyone just shrugs it off
• 1:10:57
  like, no, I'm not watching. It doesn't matter how good it
• 1:10:59
  was. And it was really good.
• 1:11:01
  Sure. No one's going to watch what you
• 1:11:02
  tell them to watch. I agree it cuts both ways.
• 1:11:04
  I've worked at a video store, I would just tell people all the
• 1:11:06
  time what to watch and they wouldn't listen to me.
• 1:11:08
  And you're like, what? But you have to listen to the
• 1:11:11
  blood type results. O neg is that what is that the
• 1:11:15
  slang for O negative? Because they found that in the
• 1:11:19
  sperm, which well, you know where that is found.
• 1:11:24
  Well, you know, a lot of places actually have got a blue light.
• 1:11:27
  It's all over the place, but that's just.
• 1:11:29
  Another thing that points the finger potentially at Yeah, Tom,
• 1:11:34
  it's one more layer of paranoia that he gets to ratchet up.
• 1:11:38
  Yeah. And then they're bringing in the
• 1:11:39
  boat guy. They're bringing in the hotel
• 1:11:41
  guy. Yeah.
• 1:11:42
  They're all going to be able to pinpoint.
• 1:11:43
  And we've got the picture, eyewitnesses materializing on
• 1:11:46
  the computer. Credit cards waiting to come.
• 1:11:49
  Right, so again I. Can't say it enough earlier.
• 1:11:51
  At the edge of the seat. But I was so riveted by what was
• 1:11:54
  happening in this last half an hour that I was like, oh gosh,
• 1:11:57
  absolutely. I cannot wait to get get to
• 1:11:59
  whatever this is going to happen and unfortunately he's got
• 1:12:04
  Hasselman a little too deep. Yeah, he has him entering false
• 1:12:10
  information into a database now. It's real like it, But the fact
• 1:12:16
  that it's not in the database is what's not Like you're putting
• 1:12:19
  that into that. That's the crime.
• 1:12:21
  Yeah. Like, let's be clear about that.
• 1:12:24
  And I don't think Hasselman, as much as he respects Tom, there's
• 1:12:29
  obviously a limit to their friendship.
• 1:12:31
  Well, at this point, yeah, because he's telling them, look,
• 1:12:33
  here's the whole story, Bryce Kilder.
• 1:12:36
  It brings Hesselman deeper into the story, into the plot, let's
• 1:12:39
  say. Beyond his comfort level, we'll
• 1:12:42
  say that and. That's not going to end well for
• 1:12:45
  him. Hackman's also a little
• 1:12:46
  uncomfortable right now. A great line I want to share
• 1:12:49
  that, he said. Is he?
• 1:12:53
  He's a little concerned with the way things are going.
• 1:12:56
  And Prichard says, I think you're just tired.
• 1:12:59
  Hackman kind of goes off on him a little bit, a little bit
• 1:13:01
  harsh. And he says, forgive me, I'm
• 1:13:04
  just a little tired. I thought the same thing.
• 1:13:07
  Yeah, it's just a great line. And it's the same way he does it
• 1:13:10
  earlier with the order breakfast than he used with, right?
• 1:13:12
  He just doesn't have any real like Pritchard is right next to
• 1:13:15
  him all the time, but it doesn't really have a bunch of respect
• 1:13:17
  for him, I don't think, no. I don't think so.
• 1:13:19
  I don't want to forget because you, you mentioned the
• 1:13:21
  eyewitnesses. I have to do this because like,
• 1:13:26
  well and like Tom, we're in deep with Star Trek 6 characters and
• 1:13:30
  we have the 3rd and final one. Who's that?
• 1:13:33
  Romulan ambassador in Star Trek 6.
• 1:13:36
  He's the guy that brings in the boat guy.
• 1:13:39
  He's just with him on on the rounds.
• 1:13:41
  He he's not a very attractive man.
• 1:13:43
  He looks like he looks like a Romulan, to be honest with you.
• 1:13:45
  In real life, that's probably why he got cast.
• 1:13:48
  Can't act. I cast him.
• 1:13:49
  Yeah, absolutely. You're my Romulan guy now.
• 1:13:50
  Yeah, we get Coster being hilarious with the funny movie.
• 1:13:55
  Make sure that nobody leaves, but I have to go.
• 1:13:59
  Yeah, great scene and I buy them.
• 1:14:01
  Of course, if I'm the guy, he's saying that to you.
• 1:14:04
  Do what you. Got right here when you get
• 1:14:05
  back, yeah. No problem, I'll.
• 1:14:06
  Lock it down, don't worry. Yeah, I got it.
• 1:14:08
  Yeah. And one of the times he does
• 1:14:10
  sneak out, he went to the bathroom.
• 1:14:12
  If you recall, that one bathroom that I know exists in the
• 1:14:14
  Pentagon, he makes a call on a payphone.
• 1:14:17
  Yes. Did you think anything of that
• 1:14:19
  phone call? Nothing at.
• 1:14:20
  All nothing of. It.
• 1:14:22
  Damn, this movie does that incredibly well.
• 1:14:24
  Yeah. All this time, that gift list
• 1:14:27
  just keeps printing and prints and he keeps checking it, keeps
• 1:14:32
  checking it. So frustrated.
• 1:14:34
  Yeah. And I was getting a little
• 1:14:35
  frustrated, too. Like, just show up already.
• 1:14:37
  But we know that it's coming up though, because it's been
• 1:14:40
  planted. It adds more tension to what's
• 1:14:43
  happening. Again, we've got all these other
• 1:14:45
  elements, and now we've also got the damn print out.
• 1:14:49
  Everything is ratcheting up to such pitch perfectness that it
• 1:14:52
  gets me very excited. And then when he finally does
• 1:14:55
  see the thing show up on the printer, there's like a relief,
• 1:14:57
  almost like a release. Valve's been pressed for
• 1:15:00
  Costner. Like yes.
• 1:15:01
  OK, good. Finally all In the meanwhile,
• 1:15:03
  Yuri is in the building. They've decided to let people
• 1:15:07
  leave and ID them as they leave. Costner is saying get them out
• 1:15:12
  via the front door, and then Prichard is saying the
• 1:15:15
  television cameras won't let us do that.
• 1:15:16
  So then yeah, they have to pivot and go whatever into every
• 1:15:19
  single room. Which is the only major mistake
• 1:15:23
  when doing some research that the movie got wrong, they
• 1:15:26
  calculated the time it would actually take to do that, and it
• 1:15:31
  would take days. Yeah, literally it would take
• 1:15:34
  days. It is that big.
• 1:15:36
  But I mean, again, you don't, doesn't matter.
• 1:15:38
  Who cares, right? If it's not glaring to me, then
• 1:15:40
  it's not important. That's nitpicking totally, and
• 1:15:43
  I'm not going to do that. I'm not here to do that.
• 1:15:46
  I agree. But it does again create this
• 1:15:48
  tension where they're all kind of zoning in on this one area.
• 1:15:51
  They're going to start in the sit room and kind of make their
• 1:15:53
  way through it, but. They never check the ceiling
• 1:15:55
  vents. No, they don't check the
• 1:15:57
  gymnasium either. Yeah, so we someone made a call
• 1:16:01
  because you made a phone call. That's right.
• 1:16:04
  Reggie Hackman movie. Yeah, another great one.
• 1:16:07
  That's the issue, yeah. So we got Hesselman.
• 1:16:09
  He wants to meet up with Pritchard because Tom is acting
• 1:16:11
  weird and pushed him a little too.
• 1:16:13
  Far. How do you feel about that?
• 1:16:15
  That the phone call happened. Yeah, like the Hesselman has
• 1:16:18
  enough reason. I think there's enough reason.
• 1:16:20
  OK, I questioned it. Oh really?
• 1:16:22
  OK, but I understand why they did it in the movie.
• 1:16:24
  Pritcher needs to know, of course, that it's Tom.
• 1:16:27
  Yes, and the best way to do it is for Hesselman to reveal it.
• 1:16:30
  Yes, but if Pritcher doesn't need to know, I don't think
• 1:16:33
  Hesselman does this. I think Hesselman, if you're
• 1:16:35
  getting told to do all of these things and you're being now told
• 1:16:39
  that Bryce killed somebody, Tom has all the evidence.
• 1:16:43
  Right, I'm I'm Team Tom. Hesselman doesn't have the
• 1:16:46
  evidence, so he's just hearing this and taking everything that
• 1:16:49
  Tom says on face value, and at some point you're going to go,
• 1:16:52
  this is starting to feel weird for me.
• 1:16:53
  And Pritchard is the guy to talk to if that is the Yeah.
• 1:16:56
  The right hand man of the murderer.
• 1:16:58
  He's the guy to tell because he would know.
• 1:17:01
  Oh, Bryce. Oh, was it Bryce?
• 1:17:03
  I didn't know that. Of course Pritchard would know.
• 1:17:06
  Maybe he doesn't believe that Bryce did it.
• 1:17:09
  He's team Tom, he's Team TomTom team.
• 1:17:13
  Anyway, it's not a big deal. Just not a big deal to you, but
• 1:17:16
  as someone took three bullets in the chest for it.
• 1:17:17
  Well, in terms of a horror movie, he deserved it.
• 1:17:21
  Yeah, that's fair, because he made a bad decision.
• 1:17:22
  Because he made a phone call. Because he made a phone call.
• 1:17:24
  Exactly. Then we get this sort of chase
• 1:17:27
  through the Pentagon, which is a scene that I think goes on a
• 1:17:31
  little too long for me, but you really get a sense like Tom's
• 1:17:34
  got to get the hell out of. Here.
• 1:17:35
  This is where the movie title comes into play.
• 1:17:38
  No way out. That's right.
• 1:17:39
  Except just like we saw on Friday the 13th last week.
• 1:17:43
  Yeah, you got yourself in a corner.
• 1:17:45
  You pick up a chair and knock out a window.
• 1:17:48
  No more corners, you've solved it.
• 1:17:49
  It's identical scene, Yeah. Have you ever taken a fire
• 1:17:52
  extinguisher to the face, by the way?
• 1:17:54
  Negative. OK, come over to my place.
• 1:17:56
  I have one. OK, Yeah.
• 1:17:57
  Just to just give you a taste, might knock out a few chiclets.
• 1:18:03
  Though. All right, Well, yeah, I got
• 1:18:05
  perfect teeth, buddy. I don't want to lose these
• 1:18:06
  shoppers. But we get a good stairwell
• 1:18:09
  scene which we haven't seen since Casino Royale.
• 1:18:12
  Yeah, I agree. Well, you mentioned the chase
• 1:18:14
  scene has gone long. Yeah, I don't like it.
• 1:18:16
  Yeah, OK. You don't like it at all?
• 1:18:17
  I mean, I think it's fine when chases happened even with the
• 1:18:19
  Iman chase to get I just don't care.
• 1:18:22
  Yeah, bores me generally. OK.
• 1:18:23
  So you're ready to kind of let this all culminate?
• 1:18:27
  And he does. He runs and basically comes and
• 1:18:29
  meets up Hackman with the proof that he's got the jewelry box,
• 1:18:32
  that he knows that Bryce is the guy and and all this.
• 1:18:35
  That's all he's got. And that's enough because
• 1:18:37
  Pritchard comes in and sort of tips his hand and then our guy
• 1:18:41
  Jason Bernard pops in and says Hesselman was killed, Yuri's in
• 1:18:45
  the building. We've got all this lockdown
• 1:18:47
  happening, things are breaking up and watching Pritchard
• 1:18:53
  basically lose his mind here I find very compelling.
• 1:18:57
  It's not good. It's a tough situation to be in.
• 1:19:02
  It's funny because now the walls are kind of closing in on him.
• 1:19:05
  He's trying to protect Bryce. Bryce has been exposed.
• 1:19:08
  He doesn't know what to do. He's trying to fight his way
• 1:19:10
  through it. Costner's kind of got the heavy
• 1:19:12
  hand here. What'd he do?
• 1:19:13
  What do you do in a situation like that?
• 1:19:15
  If you're Pritchard, he picks up that gun.
• 1:19:18
  Did you think for a moment, a second, a millisecond, 3 seconds
• 1:19:22
  that he was going to shoot Hackman?
• 1:19:23
  No, I actually thought he was going to kill himself.
• 1:19:26
  Really. Yeah, that is the one.
• 1:19:27
  Like I knew that was coming. So you feel that was the way to
• 1:19:31
  go? I felt like a movie person.
• 1:19:33
  He felt like he was in a corner and all the signs I could see
• 1:19:36
  and killing Hackman wasn't gonna work.
• 1:19:39
  And he also loves them. I think he's obsessed with them.
• 1:19:41
  Like I think that was the gay overtone was there and he so I
• 1:19:45
  think he would have killed himself before he would kill.
• 1:19:47
  Hackman I always struggle with that type of scene because it's
• 1:19:50
  not the first time it's happened where someone's made a decision
• 1:19:53
  to end their own life. That's kind of like on the spot.
• 1:19:55
  And I find it a tough sell for me, OK, Because I'm thinking
• 1:19:58
  there's got to be another way out, to fight another day to
• 1:20:02
  just to end it all so abruptly. I just find it hard to believe.
• 1:20:07
  I think what ends up happening is Hackman catches the wind,
• 1:20:11
  right? So he and Costa are now plotting
• 1:20:13
  that Preacher's going to be the fall guy.
• 1:20:14
  I get that. Preacher jury, right.
• 1:20:16
  And so if he thinks he's going to spend the rest of his life in
• 1:20:19
  a prison and he sees it right in front of him that he doesn't
• 1:20:21
  have the power, preacher's at the low end of the totem.
• 1:20:23
  So I think it's. I suppose so.
• 1:20:25
  If he doesn't kill Hesselman, I think he should have his day in
• 1:20:29
  court. Oh, interesting.
• 1:20:30
  Yeah, I think you you can live to see the light of day, but
• 1:20:33
  because you've killed Hesselman, you're not going to no
• 1:20:36
  manslaughter. You're.
• 1:20:36
  Done man's laughter right there. That's one ain't laughing, but
• 1:20:41
  it's quite the culmination, which is exactly what you
• 1:20:43
  wanted. It's a great shot to the slow
• 1:20:45
  MO, the brain coming out of the side of the head.
• 1:20:47
  I really thought that was good. Well.
• 1:20:49
  Effective. Better than anything we saw last
• 1:20:50
  week. I'm just kidding, You know that.
• 1:20:55
  But yeah. And you think it's sort of the
• 1:20:58
  end. That's the end of.
• 1:20:59
  It right, you would think, OK, well Pritchard, it took the rap.
• 1:21:02
  Bryce was saved the embarrassment.
• 1:21:04
  Here's a loophole though. The eyewitness does he look
• 1:21:07
  enough like Tom for the boat guy to say, yeah, that's the guy?
• 1:21:11
  I don't think it matters if Bryce comes out as saying as
• 1:21:15
  being the guy that had the affair, he's going to have some
• 1:21:18
  personal problems. If Costner comes out of having
• 1:21:21
  the affair, he may have some personal problems, but I don't
• 1:21:24
  think it matters that Costner was having an affair with this
• 1:21:26
  woman. So I don't think the boat guy or
• 1:21:29
  anyone through identifying Costner, I don't think that puts
• 1:21:32
  him in the Yuri category. I think it just means though he
• 1:21:34
  was stripping Susan. Like I think it's maybe
• 1:21:37
  embarrassing. At most so he can be the guy
• 1:21:39
  having the affair, having the relationship with the deceased,
• 1:21:44
  but Pritcher can still be Yuri. Yeah, OK.
• 1:21:46
  Because I think they were only trying to establish this as Yuri
• 1:21:49
  to protect and prevent the FBI and the CIA being involved.
• 1:21:52
  But at this point, they're kind of going to be involved if they
• 1:21:55
  want to be, or they establish Yuri as him.
• 1:21:58
  I don't think it's going to get far enough that no one's going
• 1:22:01
  to care about a hotel clerk. I think they want to button it
• 1:22:03
  up. They want to move on because
• 1:22:04
  they're going to get the sub. Money is going to be given out.
• 1:22:06
  Hack was going to stay in his position.
• 1:22:08
  Everyone's going to be like, perfectly fine.
• 1:22:10
  Except Costner. Yeah, Tom hands this little note
• 1:22:14
  to his little runner. Yes.
• 1:22:17
  Nice looking guy, basically showing the gift receipt.
• 1:22:21
  That's whatever to expose. To give to the CIA.
• 1:22:23
  To give the CIA, yeah, that will be a problem for.
• 1:22:26
  That's right, but not for Costner.
• 1:22:27
  Not for. No, no, no.
• 1:22:28
  He's fine. So flourishing.
• 1:22:30
  That's even though he is revealed in the photo.
• 1:22:33
  In the photo, Yeah, but that's just, again, he's had an affair.
• 1:22:36
  Yeah, whoop to do. That's not illegal.
• 1:22:38
  That's right. It's not even an affair.
• 1:22:39
  They were in a relationship. That's right.
• 1:22:40
  That's it. So yeah, by that logic,
• 1:22:42
  Pritchard is Yuri. For all intents and purposes,
• 1:22:46
  Bryce was having the affair with Susan because the jewelry box
• 1:22:50
  convinces that, which made Pritchard slash Yuri upset,
• 1:22:53
  jealous, whatever else. Because of reasons, we now.
• 1:22:56
  Know that, and because Hackman is so willing to give whatever
• 1:22:59
  he wants to get out of the jam, the sub is going to get funded,
• 1:23:02
  which is ultimately what the Russians seem to have wanted.
• 1:23:04
  And therefore, Costner walks away, even if he's spotted as
• 1:23:08
  being like, hey, you're that guy from Chesapeake Bay.
• 1:23:10
  Don't worry about it. Don't.
• 1:23:11
  Worry about it. Don't worry about it.
• 1:23:12
  Yeah, wasn't me. Wasn't he Used the Shaggy
• 1:23:14
  defense? OK, that that actually kind of.
• 1:23:17
  Clarifies. I think that's the breakdown.
• 1:23:18
  OK, cool. But that's something you only
• 1:23:19
  get really when we're watching it, because what we get next is
• 1:23:22
  a quiet moment where Tom is at the grave site.
• 1:23:26
  Yeah, he was in love. And I think seemingly that would
• 1:23:29
  indicate that maybe he was. Yeah.
• 1:23:31
  But he said later, you asked me to be in this relationship
• 1:23:35
  because who he's talking to is not an interrogation entirely.
• 1:23:38
  Or it is an interrogation, but it's not with who you think it
• 1:23:40
  is, no. They're all on the same team.
• 1:23:42
  That's it technically. And so his landlord, this guy
• 1:23:45
  that's. Yeah, I didn't get that the
• 1:23:46
  first time. Around.
• 1:23:46
  No, it's a face. You're like, I do.
• 1:23:48
  I know. Yes, I do.
• 1:23:49
  Know not a very good painter by the.
• 1:23:52
  Way. No, well, it's wasn't working.
• 1:23:54
  Progress. It was working.
• 1:23:54
  Progress. Yeah.
• 1:23:56
  Yeah, the big reveal that Costner actually is Yuri.
• 1:24:00
  Yeah, and you don't say that painting is a work in progress
• 1:24:02
  unless you know the guy. That was a bit of a tip off,
• 1:24:05
  Sure. You would just say, Oh yeah, it
• 1:24:06
  looks great, no problem. Well they did have that
• 1:24:07
  relationship because they established I got your mail
• 1:24:09
  here. Right?
• 1:24:10
  Like this seems to be the place he was living before too.
• 1:24:12
  But I agree there's a connective tissue.
• 1:24:14
  There is a comfort between the two.
• 1:24:16
  I loved it. That twist, I completely did not
• 1:24:18
  anticipate it. You didn't anticipate it, which
• 1:24:20
  is amazing. Neither did I, which I think is
• 1:24:22
  a win, totally. But do you buy?
• 1:24:25
  100%. Even watching it a second time,
• 1:24:27
  you don't see any sort of. What I see is mismatches.
• 1:24:30
  I don't see mismatches. Generally, I can't think of a
• 1:24:33
  scene or performance or a beat or a note that was untrue to
• 1:24:38
  what the final payoff was. If you can accept the fact that
• 1:24:41
  Kevin Costner, Tom Farrell is Russian, then yeah, no.
• 1:24:47
  I don't think he is Russian, I think he's an American that.
• 1:24:51
  That he can just speak Russian. Yeah, like he's a counter spy.
• 1:24:54
  He worked in Russia as a as an American.
• 1:24:56
  Spy. See, I thought he was.
• 1:24:58
  He was. Born in Russia, I don't think
• 1:24:59
  he's that. Look into it.
• 1:25:01
  It's possible, but I I interpreted more of his double
• 1:25:04
  age. He's an American working as a
• 1:25:06
  spy in Russia for Russia. That, that makes more sense.
• 1:25:10
  Yeah. Thank you for that.
• 1:25:11
  Yeah, That really puts a bow on it.
• 1:25:13
  Yeah. Where I'm completely.
• 1:25:14
  I'm in. I loved it.
• 1:25:16
  I was. I was staggered by how good it
• 1:25:18
  was executed and said the second watch, I felt like it was like
• 1:25:21
  seamless. There was no plot holes.
• 1:25:23
  I felt like I needed to fix. So you're watching this in
• 1:25:25
  theater. There's none of you going to
• 1:25:26
  Larry saying I know he's no. Russian.
• 1:25:30
  That's right, this twist was more impactful than The Sixth
• 1:25:33
  Sense. Good.
• 1:25:34
  Good to hear. Well, I'm glad to hear it.
• 1:25:36
  For me, it's a it's an easy, it's an easy win.
• 1:25:38
  I would and happily see this again if they had come out with
• 1:25:41
  a quality 4K special features, so forth, I would be into that.
• 1:25:46
  I I think this movie is really well executed in a movie that I
• 1:25:49
  love because it's a movie that when I worked at the video
• 1:25:52
  store, I would have loved to have known because people will
• 1:25:55
  come in and they'll say, like, I like this, give me something,
• 1:25:57
  give me a thriller, right? And you have your go TOS, right
• 1:26:00
  and eventually kind of run out of go TOS or it's somebody that
• 1:26:03
  if they're movie people, they're like, I've seen it, I've seen
• 1:26:05
  it, I've seen it, I've seen it. This would have been one that I
• 1:26:08
  think would be under that radar and would over deliver on the
• 1:26:11
  expectation, which is ultimately what it is comes off your shelf.
• 1:26:14
  I'm like, OK, it's a gene, OK. It's a gene.
• 1:26:18
  Pic. And then I'm watching it just
• 1:26:19
  thinking like shit, this is fantastic.
• 1:26:21
  So that's where I'm at. What are your final thoughts on
• 1:26:23
  it? After watching the first time I
• 1:26:25
  enjoyed it. That's exactly what I was hoping
• 1:26:29
  it would be and beyond because of the twist at the end.
• 1:26:32
  But I also said to myself, I think it's a one and done, OK,
• 1:26:35
  you know, with A twist like that.
• 1:26:36
  But then I watched it again. I'm like, this is a good movie.
• 1:26:40
  And I'm like, I think I could probably even watch this another
• 1:26:42
  time because I think. You got a week, buddy?
• 1:26:45
  Yeah, exactly. I do.
• 1:26:46
  I do. I think the pacing of it is
• 1:26:49
  really good. And beyond what your thoughts
• 1:26:53
  were about the where did they go again, Manila.
• 1:26:56
  Manila Million Manila. I thought that was perfectly
• 1:26:59
  fine. So I have literally no issues
• 1:27:01
  with anywhere they went and how long it took to do anything.
• 1:27:06
  So I thought this was a pleasant surprise and I was surprised
• 1:27:11
  that I had not heard of them before.
• 1:27:14
  And a film that if you like this genre thriller.
• 1:27:20
  Political intrigue? A little.
• 1:27:21
  Bit too a good 80s piece I mean. Yeah, that's how some people
• 1:27:25
  describe Sean Young. Yeah, good 80s piece.
• 1:27:29
  Yeah, again. Didn't love her in it, sure, but
• 1:27:32
  she wasn't in the whole thing. It's true, actually.
• 1:27:34
  Thanks to David Brace. Thanks to our good friend Gene
• 1:27:38
  Hackman. Yeah, fantastic.
• 1:27:40
  I couldn't have said it better. Well done, David.
• 1:27:42
  Finally, thank you. Something good off your shelf?
• 1:27:44
  Glad. I'm glad you enjoyed.
• 1:27:45
  It thanks for listening folks who do appreciate it.
• 1:27:47
  As always, please rate the podcast 5 stars on your pod
• 1:27:49
  catcher of choice. Subscribe so you never miss an
• 1:27:51
  episode and join us on the Facebook page and more
• 1:27:53
  importantly, share the podcast with any Russian agents or spies
• 1:27:57
  you know, some thugs, some thugs, assassins.
• 1:28:00
  Special Forces. Anybody.
• 1:28:01
  Yeah, goodnight.