Latest / Cait & Court's Cozy Corner: Romance Readers / Let's Talk About: The Wild Card by Stephanie Archer (with the author!)

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Let's Talk About: The Wild Card by Stephanie Archer (with the author!) · Cait & Court's Cozy Corner: Romance Readers

• Courtney Richter: Hi. Caitlin Stryker: Executive producers and hosts, Caitlin Stryker and Courtney Richter, producers, Kinesha Ngo and Holly Lebowski. Original music, Cassie De Silva. This is a podcast for lovers of romance and romantasy novels who want to go on a deep dive into their favorite genre. Honest discussions and salacious details giving romance books the respect they deserve. We are two friends, actors, moms and romance readers who like a bit of spice and everything nice in their books. Welcome back to Cait and Court's Cozy Corner Romance Reader. Today we have a very special guest with us and we're very excited. have Stephanie Archer, ⁓ the Vancouver Storm series writer, plus many more ⁓ joining us today to talk about her latest book Wild Card and as many of her other wonderful romance books that we can squeeze in because there are a lot of super fans out there. Stephanie. Courtney Richter: Bye! Stephanie: Hello? Caitlin Stryker: You know the drill. Be sure to like and subscribe wherever you listen to our podcast. Courtney: Thanks for tuning in to Cait and Court's Cozy Corner Romance Readers. Caitlin Stryker: I was telling one of my old neighbors that we were going to be talking with you today and she like freaked out. Stephanie: ⁓ my gosh, that's so nice. I mean, hopefully he's good freak out, not bad freak out. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Yes, no, in a very good way. She was like, ⁓ my gosh, please tell her that I'm a total super fan. I had Jatchi BT create characters that like looked like her characters, like based off of. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Yeah. Okay. Caitlin Stryker: Hi, I'm Cait Courtney: And I'm Court. Welcome to Cait and Court's Cozy Corner Romance Readers. Stephanie: Well, that's really, really, yeah, that's a super fan. So say hello to her, give her a big high five for me. Courtney Richter: Yeah Caitlin Stryker: I will, for sure. I actually also think that is one of the really fun elements, I think, of the romance reading community is that people do get so genuinely excited and the fan base is so engaged and having conversations with one another and everything. And that's kind of one of the reasons why we started this podcast, because court brought me into this world. And then I was like, it's so much fun in here. Let's chat with everybody. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Stephanie: Yes. Courtney: As we like to say, you don't need spice for a book to be good. Well, you don't need running shoes to run, but they sure do help. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Stephanie: It's so much fun in here. It's happy place to be. mean, before anything, I am a romance reader. I was always a romance reader. I just came off of a tour. so after I have a conversation at each event with another author, I do a Q &A and then people line up for a signing. And I'm a chatty lady. So I take my time with everyone. Courtney Richter: Yes, it's a happy place to live. Mm-hmm. Run! Yeah. Stephanie: ⁓ Which unfortunately means people are in the line for up to an hour and a half sometimes. ⁓ But so many people were like, I made friends in the lineup. And that makes me so happy. I love when I'm connecting author friends. I love when readers become friends. I love when I hear that readers carpool to my events together and make friends that way. I just love community. So I love the romance community. Courtney Richter: ⁓ love it. Yes! I agree. It's, it's my favorite thing in the bookstore when you just like catch the eye of someone both in romance section, you're looking and then you just like exchange like what you're reading recommendations you wrote on the same plane. It's like we both know we know what's happening here. We get to share the love and now you have a new book your newest one wild card which is why you're on this book tour book five of the Vancouver storm series. So tell us about wild card. It's been a while. How long has it been since the first one? Caitlin Stryker: Yeah, it's amazing. I love hearing that. Stephanie: You Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Stephanie: Yeah, that's awesome. Have a new book. Yes. Yup. Courtney Richter: This is Jamie and Pippa. Stephanie: Three and I guess it would be through almost three years because behind the net came out in summer 2023. So coming up on three years, maybe two and a half years. ⁓ Yeah. The one card it is coach Tate Ward's book. It's book five in the series, ⁓ Tate Ward and Jordan, the antisocial prickly bartender. it's ⁓ a single dad romance. It's, Courtney Richter: three years in the making. Wow. Caitlin Stryker: So. you Stephanie: What else? don't know. I should know how to pitch my own book. It's coach romance. It's mild enemies to lovers. I would not say. Yeah, let's call it dislike. Yeah. It's nothing. Yeah, it's nothing like gloves off. But it's also nothing like the wingman. So yeah, he likes everyone but her. He's like the patient wise coach that everyone absolutely loves. Courtney Richter: Yeah. Yeah, I was gonna say I have SMILED enemies to love. Like, HESITANT enemies to love. Yeah, just like, yes. Great. you. Stephanie: and a little bit unreadable at times, ⁓ which is why I chose to put him last in the series, because I knew everyone would want his book. So, yeah. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yes, yes. It's so you've even waiting for tape word. So Cait's coming into this just reading wild card. So she read it as a standalone because I've read the series. So we have both perspectives on it to dive into this one with which is so great. And all of I mean, I've been waiting for this book. And I even for I've read them all. And then when I went to read wild cards, I was doing it on my Kindle Unlimited because I read all the time on the fly with the kids at their different sporting events are going so I read everything on my phone. Caitlin Stryker: It's Stephanie: I don't know. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Stephanie: Okay. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Stephanie: Okay. Totally. Courtney Richter: And I ended up reading gloves off like I clicked gloves off not paying attention but I got so sucked in again with George. Okay, but I just read that again before. Because they're so good. then I've gone back and read it. I just read again behind the net and fake out. And I just love these characters. You've built so much. They're so fun. And then finally getting to tate. So for Cait, you've just been introduced to him as the basically like, perfect calm focus on his Stephanie: Wow, that's awesome. Courtney Richter: that on his daughter and hockey specimen of a man basically is like what he appears to you. Yeah. So what is what was it like for you to beat them? Caitlin Stryker: Yeah, that's it. Yeah. Now... this is one of the things that I also love about romance books is, know, they come in, a lot of them come in a long series, but you can just pick out as a standalone anywhere and you're fine. You don't feel like you're lost. You don't feel like, okay, now I have the homework. I've got to go back and read, you know, there's zero overwhelm in romance read, which I love. Yeah. And I'm reading along and I'm reading with all these other characters and I can tell I'm like, okay, they had a book. They had a book. Stephanie: That's good, yeah. Caitlin Stryker: day at a book and then I'm like picking up on their dynamic and like, I want to go back and find out what happened there. Courtney Richter: ⁓ huh. Stephanie: That's so good to hear because I'm writing a book, I'm trying to check a few boxes and one of them is like, satisfy readers like Court, who they've been reading throughout the series, but then also people like Cait, who are just picking up a book for the first time. I want to make sure you the world, you understand all the couples and maybe what happened, ⁓ what tropes were in their book and stuff like that. so ⁓ that's really good to hear that I did check that box. So ⁓ great. Caitlin Stryker: Hmm. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Courtney Richter: Yes. Caitlin Stryker: ⁓ totally. Like I was not lost at all. And it was very clear like who had gotten together. And then I was kind of trying to be like, I wonder who was first. know I mean? Like I think going along. And then I was wondering, was like, because Tate has such a history, right? And I was like, did we get a lot of that in some of these previous books? Or was that before? Because it feels like that'd be hard to have as an underlying lead story in previous books. A lot of what he was going through was quite a lot. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yeah, who's E.O.G.? Stephanie: Yes. Caitlin Stryker: versus where we meet him in this book. Stephanie: get hints like you you know yeah I never give too much time and I didn't want to give too much away ⁓ but yeah you kind of you know that he was a star player you know that he had to retire early from an injury you find out in gloves off that he's recovering alcoholic and that he had dealt with alcoholism you know ten years ago I can't remember which book you find out he has a daughter and maybe the wingman but you like you slowly I don't want to you know I've got other books ahead of him so I'm focusing on those ones too Courtney Richter: Yeah, I was gonna say you're tempted. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. bit. Courtney Richter: Yes. Stephanie: And I don't want to give you too much. want to kind of keep readers kind of curious about him until the very end. So yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Thank Courtney Richter: And how much of that is planned on your own, Stephanie? Like, did you have all of the five books kind of in your head when you started the first one? Like, these relationships will form? Okay. Caitlin Stryker: Okay. Yeah, so I was just gonna say. Stephanie: Yeah, for the most part, I can't really start a series until I have, know, and like talking on the road, I'm like to different conversation partners. I'm really like how realizing how weird that is. It does work. It works. It's also like, you know, I don't know, I'm like, this is, this is what I'm doing for the next three years. I'm not, I can't deviate. I've got to write this series. But yes, I start the series knowing. Courtney Richter: No, I mean it works. It's working out very well. Caitlin Stryker: ⁓ really? Yeah. Courtney Richter: Yes. Stephanie: all the couples, maybe I don't know their name, I didn't know Georgia's name at first, but I knew her personality, I knew their dynamic, I always know the character's dynamic and like the main tropes, I knew they would be enemies to lovers, marriage and convenience. I knew Tate and Jordan would be together, right? I knew she would be working for the team in some capacity, I knew her dad was the owner, but I was really saving the reveal of that and so that's revealed at the very Courtney Richter: Right. Yeah. Yeah. You did that was a slow reveal for sure. Like Jordan is introduced just as the bartender for the first few books gate, they go to the flamingo. And she's just like the one that you love and you want in the friend group, but you don't know anything else. And like little looks a little bit from tape, but it's very like just a slow bird into it. Just so great. Yeah. Stephanie: Yes. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: figured. Yeah. Stephanie: Yeah. Very much about her, Yeah. Okay. That's good. Yeah. Cause people were surprised, right? Yeah. So, ⁓ yeah, so I have like the, this, the most of the series, have the couples and like their dynamics and the tropes planned out before I start. And then I've got like a bit of an arc to the series. know like with every book, you know, the hockey player becomes who he needs to be to like serve the team better. ⁓ and then by the end, you know, we're dealing with the coach. So, and how he needs, you know, what the Caitlin Stryker: in this book. It did. It came across that hand revealed. Nice. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Stephanie: the team needs to change to finally win the Stanley Cup. ⁓ yeah, that's kind of how I do a series. I know. Courtney Richter: Yes. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Courtney Richter: Only that could happen for Vancouver. You could fix you could fix our team. If you could just go in get them all settled. Caitlin Stryker: Right? Stephanie: So we need a new owner. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yes, we do. We need to bring in Jordan and get her to bump us. Stephanie: Yeah, Bel Cabra said that she was like, I think only in your fictional world Stephanie would the Vancouver Connects ever win the Stanley Cup. I said, yeah, that's that's correct. I agree with that. Courtney Richter: It's currently true, unfortunately. Stephanie: jersey are you wearing? Cait's got a- Who's- Who's jersey? Caitlin Stryker: so rough. I know I had to go for the jersey. You know what? I pulled it out from like the depths of my closet, right? Because it's it's been a rough run for the cats for a while now. Nobody is not funny. There's no one on the back. Yeah, it's just a generic one. Which I actually I have to say. Courtney Richter: Yes. Stephanie: I know. We're in the times. Who's on the back? Who's the player? ⁓ OK. OK. Courtney Richter: Yeah, yeah, who's on the back? It's open and ready. It's open and ready. Stephanie: Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: I do love when you just have like a jersey with no one on the back because the problem that can happen sometimes you get someone's name, right? They're having a great season or whatever. And then a few years down the line, they've got a scandal or they become a total jerk or like something has happened. Yeah, because your jersey lasts forever. So if you it's very I don't know, it's it's a marriage to put someone's name on the back, which I love how you kind of play that in the book as a row as the thing. Stephanie: ⁓ yeah, I know. Courtney Richter: It's true. You have to go classic almost now. Stephanie: I Courtney Richter: Yes. Stephanie: Yeah, that's fun. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: I thought that was really cool because I was reading, was like, well, she could just have her own jersey. She could just have it. was like, ⁓ no, I know what's happening here. But I'd like to have a little kicky feet moment. Stephanie: know. Courtney Richter: Well, and it's like that extra level because he's retired. So like to go and get it into the award jersey is like it's every book has like the moment the girls wear the guy's jersey on the team and like that one for them was like such a like sweet like, see what made it for like kind of moment that I love so much. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Stephanie: Yeah, and I feel like the war jersey would be such a hot commodity, right? Like it's a collector's item, you know, so it's like a Sedeen jersey or something like that. yeah, Trevor Linden or something. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Wait. Courtney Richter: Yeah! Yeah, exactly. Yes. Caitlin Stryker: Exactly. Which is the case like if you win the jersey lottery, like if you pick the right player, they don't go off the deep end on you at all. Then you're like, then every time you wear it, people are like, whoa, you know. Yeah, it's risky. Stephanie: I know. I know. Courtney Richter: Yeah. Stephanie: I know. know Courtney Richter: It's true. It's almost like you can get away with it though from the 90s because there's less internet so there was less scandals happening. So like even I grew up as a Leafs fan originally and I've tried to convert myself to being a Kinect Spanish just they're making it hard. They've made it really hard. I mean, it's not leaves. It's fine. But they but that you when I was a kid like the Gilmore and Clark and sitting like all those jerseys just live on because there wasn't as much scandal being announced to everyone. I'm sure there's lots happening. You just don't know about it like you do now and then you're like, Oh, I'm Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Stephanie: True. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Stephanie: Don't, it's okay. Caitlin Stryker: You can think of. Mm-hmm. Courtney Richter: Jersey. Yeah. But I love what the jerseys represent in these books. And I'm it's fun because take got to be such a steady, like main male character for you to write, like had everything kind of going and everything's under the surface for him. And then when you talk about writing your other ones, like your Jamie and Hayden and Rory, like I what I was reading, because I was just rereading again, and I want to make sure I'm safe the right one at the fake out with Rory and I love like, Caitlin Stryker: Yeah, yeah, you're not overexposed. Courtney Richter: how big and lively is, but I'm like, ⁓ wait, but Hayden needs to be the like, not Hayden, ⁓ Owens needs to be the next, he's got to be the like Labradoodle, Labrador one. So he's got the extra like edge in the, and then you see it all come together in this book so well, like Jamie's the more serious one. then we've got, we're all right then, we've got Owens and like, it's so fun. Yeah. Stephanie: Hazel. ⁓ yeah. Yeah, it's fun to have like a cast of characters that way, right? And so when I'm planning the series, like a group of different personality types. I I think that like not just in sports, but you know, in workplaces and stuff like that, like a team with variety does better because you have, yeah, a different set of skills and stuff like that. So like, that's what I really wanted in this book series. And also it's for me as a writer, as an author, it's like, I don't want to write Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Stephanie: five grumpy guys. I don't want to write five golden retrievers in a row. like kind of alternating and kind of, yeah, living in that space for a bit. yeah. Courtney Richter: Yes, yes. Caitlin Stryker: this. Okay, I'm doing a quick term timeout here. So Stephanie, because I am new to the romance world, I am like, I'm the I'm the reader who's like learning along the way all the tropes, which I love so much. We've we've said Golden Retriever and we've said Labradoodle. Are they not one in the same? Courtney Richter: Yes. Stephanie: Sure. Sure, yeah. You Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. They are, no I'm just picking random dog names. No, no, they're the same. Stephanie: I've never heard of last-part-doodles before, but I knew exactly what you meant in this context. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: I'm listening. like, I feel like those are two like comfy, cozy family dogs. Like they sound very similar. Stephanie: You're kinda right! ⁓ Courtney Richter: labradoodle to me in the in this one in the fake out because he's like, when it's him and Darcy in the pre like he's just like so cute and like I feel like it's just like the curly like soft sweet place. And then he's more so it just makes your labradoodle Caitlin Stryker: Or is it that like the Labradoodle is like the new like the 2020s version of the Golden Retriever? Courtney Richter: No, it's not. It's just me making up a name. Stephanie: We'll see if it might catch on after this. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Now it's a thing. Caitlin Stryker: Okay, but golden retriever is a term like is a type of guy What is a golden retriever versus a cinnamon roll or cinnamon? Stephanie: Yes. Yeah. ⁓ God. I don't really understand the cinnamon roll term. Maybe court knows better. I golden retriever to me is just like, are you go for it? Courtney Richter: Remember. Yeah, so cinnamon bun. I think Rory would be like a cinnamon bun. And then roll cinnamon roll is it rolls? ⁓ Stephanie: cinnamon roll, not cinnamon bun. Which doesn't make any difference, but it just makes me laugh the call of a cinnamon bun. don't know why. Courtney Richter: Is it cinnamon roll? I kept saying cinnamon roll and I'm like no it's a cinnamon bun that you buy so it must be the bun. ⁓ my gosh. Caitlin Stryker: Like, buns. You say bun, I just think of buns. I'm like, it's gotta be buns. Stephanie: don't know. Yeah, I'm thinking like he's just like a little fun, yeah. Courtney Richter: Maybe that's why I think of buns. I just think of like hockey buns. So in hockey there's some buns Stephanie: Yeah, Cinnamon Buttons, got a great butt. That's the, you know, the character archetype. Caitlin Stryker: Bye. Courtney Richter: Yes, that's the cinnamon bun, which is the guy. The guy that has a nice butt and is also a good guy like a sweetheart or anything that doesn't hide that from the girl. And even though he's worried he's an asshole like his dad, we we never think that as the reader we can see from the get go. He's a good guy. He's got like hazel's best interests at heart. And we trust in that. We're like Jamie is more the dark who like holding back like it's because he likes pippa but Caitlin Stryker: You Yeah. Stephanie: Absolutely. Yeah. Courtney Richter: He's not upfront just like the sweet nice guy to her. He hides it. So and then the Labrador golden retriever, good golden Labrador. Caitlin Stryker: Right. OK. You Courtney Richter: is just it's that it's what you picture is that energy. It's the energy of the golden tree. But there's that happy go lucky, happy to see everyone makes everyone feel good that excited energy, but beautiful and like, well, that you want to play with and hang out with. And just needs like, yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah, eager. Stephanie: It's like the opposite of a grumpy guy, right? Is like the golden retriever is like, he's outgoing. You know, with Hayden, it's like, Hayden wants every, Hayden's the life of the party. Hayden wants to make sure everyone feels included. It's like a golden, it's literally like a golden retriever. You know, the golden retriever is running from person to person to person and just wants to give like love and affection, right? Yeah. Very eager. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Courtney Richter: Where's it on his sleeve? Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Courtney Richter: Yes. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah, just like eager, eagerly giving love and if I could and in a way though that is like wonderful, not in a way that's like too much. Yeah. Stephanie: Yes, not annoying. Yeah. Courtney Richter: like, like a Jonathan Grohl off like Johnson grow off is like a real life golden retriever energy. What do you see? Yes, yes, yes, the Broadway the Broadway actor. But if you hear like he's on with Amy Poehler on good hang like he's just this energy of positivity and happiness and like picks everyone up when he hugs them and just loves everyone is always such a happy guy. That's my like, thing that I'm picturing with a golden retriever. Yeah. Stephanie: Was he in Glee? Is that the guy I'm thinking of? Okay, okay. Okay. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Yeah. Stephanie: Yeah. Yeah. Positive and outgoing, yeah, super fun, yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Versus like a cinnamon bun is like sweet, but like a little bit sticky. You know what I mean? Like not like, right? Like that's... Cause they're not the same. I'm gonna roll. Stephanie: I never understood it. I never understood it because people always call my heroes or my MMCs, cinnamon buns or cinnamon rolls, whatever. And I never really understood it. I think my understanding until today was like that they're like, now I don't know. It's okay. I just try not to think about it because all my is it was like, you're, you know, deep down he's really sweet. That's what it was supposed to mean. But it's like, Courtney Richter: It's a sim and roll. Caitlin Stryker: I'm going to roll, I think it's the top. Okay. Courtney Richter: Fair. Caitlin Stryker: Until we confused you like crazy. Courtney Richter: Yeah, like I can't. Caitlin Stryker: Yes. That's it. Yeah. Stephanie: All of my guys are really sweet deep down, right? So. Courtney Richter: it's how it's you know what it's funny you're not the first romance writer that is not liked the idea that kind of like goes like this to people calling their guys cinnamon rolls you're not just also felt like that about hers like there's something because then it feels like it's I don't know if as a writer it feels like it's not ⁓ grounded or real because you've written this full character when they're called the sin but it might feel like it's just like making it more surface but it's not it's just that we feel sick cinnamon buns Stephanie: Yeah. Okay. Courtney Richter: we feel safe from the get-go with them as the reader. The girl doesn't, but the reader does. And that the difference to between like that and like Jamie, where like, you do know, obviously we're reading a romance, he's going to be, but like, we know there's gonna be a little bit of bristling. There's gonna be where with Cinnamon Buns, the bristling tends to come from the female main character, not believe it or care enough. That's kind of the difference. And then with the next, ⁓ he's just that like. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm Stephanie: Hmm. Yeah. Okay. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Stephanie: Yeah. Okay. Courtney Richter: He's exactly the guy that would end up fake dating his best friend that he's in love with to like help her learn how to date. Like that's what happens with the golden retrievers. Cause they're just, they're, have a people pleasing complex on top of their sweetness. Yeah. And then grumpy sunshine is the guy that's like grumpy, but really sweet, happy to like the one person, but kind of carries it underneath. Yeah. Stephanie: Totally. Yeah. He's a big people pleaser. Yes, absolutely. Done. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Okay. Yeah. That is so interesting to me with the authors not loving the cinema, because I get it. And on the flip side, I'm like, they're also always my favorite. I love this cinnamon roll. Cinnamon button press. But like, yeah. Courtney Richter: ⁓ yeah, because they're great guys. Stephanie: It's not that I don't like it. It's more that I was like, but yeah, of course all my heroes are secretly sweet. Like, but that's my style of writing. Like I don't write dark romance, of course, you know, and I really read dark romance. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. I get it. Not really. No, I'm a scaredy cat. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, you're not doing morally gray. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Wait, did you say you read? Do you read Dark Romance or no? No, Erin, it's just not your phone. Okay. Yeah, that's fair. Courtney Richter: No. Yeah. Haven't dived into Elk-o-mize. That's like the ultimate dark romance. Stephanie: No, I had friends tell me about it and I'm like, I don't think I can. I don't think I can. It's not for me, but you know, good for you, not so much for me. That's OK. Yeah. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: You're like, that's not for me. Courtney Richter: Yeah, that's fair. That's fair. Caitlin Stryker: Totally. There's plenty of books. There's plenty of books out there. Courtney Richter: That's how we get these guys. Yes. Although I don't know what Tate would be to be honest, I don't feel like he really falls into any of those because he presents as that's total like he presents I guess like a cinnamon roll bun but there's not there's something else underneath it to him or maybe it's because he's a bit older but he doesn't have that I guess he's got the dad vibe maybe hot dad. He's got hot dad. That's what he is the hot dad vibe. Caitlin Stryker: Hmm. I feel a more grit. Stephanie: Yeah, he's a DILF. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: He's a delf. Yeah. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Which how, I'm assuming you wrote this, did you write this before ⁓ Showgirl, Taylor Swift, Elton came out? Stephanie: Yes, pretty sure I did. Courtney Richter: Cause how on point with the honey song and having with the tape character. Like I feel like that could be his song now. Stephanie: I don't know the lyrics to that one. I'm not a huge Swifty. Like, I listen to her music, I listen to the album, but I don't know all the lyrics like you obviously do. Courtney Richter: Fair. Okay. So there's a song honey and it's about how like honey can be a condescending term and rub you the wrong way. Like, ⁓ nice try honey and going, but then when it's the right person, it becomes really hot and sexy basically, which is Tate with Jordan and the use of honey. Yeah, it turns into a different thing. And so I thought that I'm like, ⁓ this is so perfect for this song honey. Cause it's literally like, yeah, you have to check it out. It goes well for them and the slow burn Stephanie, you are. Caitlin Stryker: Hehehehe Stephanie: ⁓ yeah. Yeah. ⁓ that's nice. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Caitlin Stryker: And he says it a lot. Yes. Yep. Stephanie: ⁓ that's awesome. Yeah, I'll have to keep that in mind. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Totally! ⁓ it's so true. I love a good song book match. Courtney Richter: Queen of a slow burn. You love to make us work for it. And I love it. And rereading through the slow. And I feel like it was extra slow with these two and wild card compared to the other ones. I feel like you really took your time with them to get us there. Caitlin Stryker: Ha! Stephanie: Yeah. Yes. Yeah, mean, they're both like very reticent people ⁓ in like in that arena. So ⁓ and there was a lot of things I, you know, I talk about checking boxes, right? Like the brand new reader to this series, picking up the wild card, like I've got to make sure that they understand the world, you know, ⁓ there were a lot of things as the last book in the series that I needed to check the box on, such as like Caitlin Stryker: Yeah, what? Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Right. Stephanie: I've got to give a couple other characters some happily ever afters that feel satisfying in this series. I write this series as a collection with my ideal reader reads from start to finish. So they kind of ⁓ see these characters growing in future books ⁓ and they see the setup of characters and stuff like that. so, ⁓ yeah, it just took, there was a lot of other stuff in this book. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Stephanie: that I really deliberated on of like, do I really need this? Do I really need this? Like, and a lot of stuff came out of this book because the draft was way too long. ⁓ And it ultimately is Cait and Jordan's book. So yeah, like all of the younger players joining the team, there was a lot more it's in it's in my bonus scenes. ⁓ So if you sign up for my newsletter, you can like you'll get a little email and you can click the free bonus scenes. Courtney Richter: ⁓ interesting. Mm-hmm. Great. Caitlin Stryker: Nice. Courtney Richter: Uuuhhh Stephanie: ⁓ And I kind of explain why I cut things at the beginning of the bonus scene. And there's some Tate and Jordan stuff in there too. But yeah, there was a lot more in this book and ultimately it was their book. So I had to trim it down. Courtney Richter: Yeah, that makes sense where you had to go on it. But it can't Yeah, we got to go along for the ride with them. And I felt it when I was reading. I'm like, I feel like this is really slow burn. And then I read back the other one together. I'm like, ⁓ yes, it is slower burn than the other two. But I loved it. Like, it made sense, like you said, for those characters. And because the power dynamic in the relationship that it would take that extra time to cross over. I think you found a nice balance. I have to say usually like Stephanie: Yass. Totally. Courtney Richter: age gap romance tropes aren't my thing. I'm not a huge fan of big ones, but this one was like 40 and 30, which I don't feel like is a big age gap. Like it is, but it's not like the 22 year olds. They're adults. You can, they're working. She's a business owner. It's, it's an easier, and I love even be reading it. I'll be like, ⁓ this old guy, 40 I'm 41. Like he's not old, but like in it, you're like, yeah, he's this old guy at the end of it. Stephanie: Yeah, they're both adults. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Yeah. Stephanie: I'm so excited. Yeah. Yeah. I know. Caitlin Stryker: Not all of us. Stephanie: No. And he's also so hot, right? Like no one looks at him like he's his grandpa. Like, no, he's really good looking, right? I am also not a big age gap person, but that was just how the character showed up. ⁓ And it's like, well, yeah, he used to play, he's retired. Hucky players often retire pretty young. so, yeah, I'm also, I didn't really put a lot of attention on the age gap because it's not, I don't like, yeah. Courtney Richter: So hot ⁓ my gosh, yes. Totally. Yeah. Yeah, which I liked. I liked that about it. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Stephanie: big fan of the like 22 year old and 40 year old. don't know. Yeah. I think it's cause I remember what I was like at 22 and it was insufferable. like, I so yeah, wouldn't have worked in my life, but yeah. Courtney Richter: Yeah, I don't like it. Caitlin Stryker: Either are we, I know, we're all aligned on that. Yeah, that's not our favorite thing. Courtney Richter: Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yes, same. Courtney Richter: Right? ⁓ my gosh. And it's hard to do without having to write some kind of gaslighting it like it's a weird dynamic to try to do some people do it well. But this one didn't feel like that. And it didn't feel because when you read like, you know, the coach and then the owner's daughter, I think there's like an assumption could be made that it's going to be an age gap romance, but it's really not it's two adults that happen to be in the same position. He's a young coach. And she's an older owner's daughter, basically. Like, yeah, that gets set up. Caitlin Stryker: No, no, I was... Stephanie: It is a strange dynamic, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Courtney Richter: But I do love I have to say I love that you ended with Rory stepping up as the next coach. Especially after rereading fake out again, I like how far that character got to come in the full circle. I love that so much. Some of those read it like did you knew that's where it was gonna go. It's so great. It's he's you'll love him skate when you got a chance to read the big out for Rory and like his path to getting to that to the coach is like so good. Yeah. Stephanie: Yeah. That was planned from the beginning. Caitlin Stryker: Bye-bye! ⁓ Stephanie: Yeah, so, yeah, it was really fun. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Ugh. I can't wait. I know I was telling court as like my gosh I love this book. It's like such a good you know it's February and Olympics are on and it's comfy and like cozy and it's so I love also I love reading all the Vancouver settings you know I just Stephanie: Yeah. Courtney Richter: Yes! Oh my gosh, yes, you write Vancouver so well, obviously, because you live here, but you do it in such a great way that like makes me want to go explore the city again. Yeah. Stephanie: Yes, yeah. ⁓ thank you. Yes! Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Stephanie: Yeah, I love living here, right? Like it's, yeah, our city has its problems. Like it's not a perfect city at all, but I really love, I mean, it was born and raised in Vancouver. Like I love it here. ⁓ my husband was born and raised here too. So like, yeah, we have so much, we have so much, ⁓ so many memories in this city. Right. And so, yeah, I love, the scavenger hunt scene is. Yeah, that was like a love letter to our city and all the like beautiful things here. So. Courtney Richter: Of course. ⁓ nice! Caitlin Stryker: music. Mm-hmm. Courtney Richter: Yes! Caitlin Stryker: I love that. Courtney Richter: Yes. Stephanie: Yeah, I'm so happy to hear that. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah, and it's fun getting to read it in a romance novel setting, I feel like, you know, a lot of Canadian literature when you're outside of this genre, ⁓ I don't know, it can be down, a bit of a downer and a bit dry and stuff like that a lot of the time, not always, but that's my memory of my like Canadian lit courses and just being like. Why don't we ever get to be like, they don't. And I'm like, why can't we like have like this like wonderful representation? Like New York is always written as this romantic place. like Vancouver is gorgeous. You know what I mean? Like Canada is a beautiful country. Can't it just sometimes be like up? nice? It's not all bleak. Stephanie: pick the most interesting books. Yeah. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Yeah. And you did that. You're hitting it. That's true. That's what you did. You made Vancouver feel like a character like how New York often is in books. It really is part of this series in a really great way that makes it feel alive and beautiful and celebrating the good parts of our city. And the, if we had a hockey team that was winning, it would be Coach Ward. Stephanie: Yeah, yeah, totally. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Stephanie: ⁓ I'm sorry. Yeah, I know. Caitlin Stryker: That's fantasy element of them all. Courtney Richter: Yeah, that's the part you have to... ⁓ Stephanie: Yeah, it's fiction, yeah. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Cool. Courtney Richter: the any extra attention on it from like the heated rivalry ⁓ craze that's happening now being Canadian author as well running hockey romance. Stephanie: Definitely. Yeah. think like, I mean, it kind of makes me laugh because I'm like, he did like gay romance is very different than straight romance and heated rivalry. I mean, it deserves all of the attention it's getting. Rachel Reed, I haven't met her. She seems like a lovely person. I read the book the week before the show came out and I was like, ⁓ yeah, that's why she got a TV show. Cause this is a good book. I watched the show twice. Yeah. So like I'm getting, I'm getting like a spillover of people being like, Caitlin Stryker: Thanks. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Yes, yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, right? Yes. We do. Caitlin Stryker: ⁓ Hey, yeah! Yeah! Stephanie: what's this thing called hockey romance? And it kind of makes me laugh. had it. So I did an interview with the Wall Street Journal. It was, you know, just like a fun piece about hockey romance. And I started this reporter had never, she's not a romance reader, very new to the romance world. And I, I, you know, I was explaining to her the typical, like, of the hockey romance niche. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Caitlin Stryker: Right. You can tell right away. Courtney Richter: you Stephanie: You know, these things are very popular. This is why readers like it. And for some reason it came up. I mentioned monster romance to her and she goes, I'm sorry, what I said? Yeah. Monster romance. And I was like, yeah, there's so many niches in the romance world. You know, there's something for everyone. There's so much diversity in the romance world. Anyways, I think I like terrified this poor reporter. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. You definitely did. If she hasn't read any romance at all, she heard monster romance and was like... Courtney Richter: You got it to start with a Shrek romance. I've seen it. I've what arrived at my bookstore and I was like, what is this? I was like, oh my it's literally truck It's crazy Stephanie: I've googled it! Caitlin Stryker: Yes, I know. Stephanie: I should have comments. Yeah. That's so funny. so there's, I, and that's what I was trying to explain to her was like anything you can dream, a romance exists for it. ⁓ Maybe it has, you know, 12 reviews online, but like, you know, maybe, you know, it's not as popular as other things, but like anything you can dream. I don't know why I started this ramble, but yeah, sorry. All right. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Yes, every fantasy. It's there. Yeah. ⁓ Caitlin Stryker: Well, because we went down to Hita Bradbury and you were like a little more notice on that and then you were like, oh, this this journalist I'm talking to and she doesn't know anything about romance is clear. And so. Stephanie: ⁓ yeah, yeah. So yes, I did get some spillover from like new to hockey romance, ⁓ people like interested in reading hockey romance. ⁓ But yeah, I usually try to say like, there's a lot of really great queer hockey romance out there. ⁓ So like, I usually try to like gently move the spotlight back to queer hockey romance because it is, I don't know, deserves its time in the sun. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Well. Mm-hmm. Yes. Caitlin Stryker: It's getting absolutely now I have a question for you as well then about you were saying okay the hockey romance has its sort of its own little niche corner it within this genre. What are some of the I've read a couple I've read three now different hockey romances by different authors so I think I have an idea but what would you say are like the sort of like the pillars of the hockey romance? Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Stephanie: I think that seeing him be amazing on the ice is really important. Or seeing his physical prowess. There are some of the best athletes. Yeah, stamina, sure. There's some of the best athletes in the world. And so seeing that and getting to appreciate that is really fun. She wears his jersey is a big trope. She cheers for him during a game is a big trope. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Courtney Richter: stamina Mm-hmm. Caitlin Stryker: and Stephanie: There's like different ones, like, you know, he gets injured, which I've used in our, in the series. ⁓ what else? I use them on the road a lot for my own convenience. Courtney Richter: Yes. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah, but they are on the road a lot, so... Courtney Richter: The FaceTime, sexting, sexting, video sex, all of that is always a big, yep, yep. Stephanie: Yeah, on the plane. Yeah, I just like and time away from each other, you know, so that they just to kind of give me time in the book to do other things. So there are way a lot on the road. That's not really I wouldn't say like a convention of the niche. yeah, like rich, famous, because, you know, in Canada, they are celebrities here. That's what I had to explain to a lot of our American friends is like hockey players are celebrities in Canada, like. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Courtney Richter: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Right. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Stephanie: Sidney Crosby walks down the street, he is going to get mobbed with people asking for his autograph. The Sedines probably can't go many places without getting, they're so unique looking, right? ⁓ So yeah, the celebrity aspect of it, they're very well paid, they're in fiction, they are very attractive. ⁓ Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yep. Caitlin Stryker: Yup. In real life, they're missing all their teeth. Stephanie: Yeah, sometimes, you know, that's my type is, know, they're missing a few teeth. um, I don't know if you either of you have seen Shorzy, the show Shorzy. Um, yeah, so many people say from my personal life, so many people say that the main character, like my husband looks like the main character, like, and, know, also has like an unbearable Canadian accent. Courtney Richter: Yeah. You like them a little rough looking. A little rough and tough. Yes, yes, yes, I have. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yes. Stephanie: And like backwards baseball hat, he is missing his, he has fake teeth in the front now, but he did knock his front two teeth out at one point in his life. So I know you can't, you know, I'm a simple, simple girl, but yeah. ⁓ so those are like some of the main conventions. think in my series, I really like to have the FMC working for the team in some respect to just like, I love, I love. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Caitlin Stryker: Amazing. And look at you right... Yeah. Courtney Richter: Yeah, I know it's a type Yes, they're all connected. Caitlin Stryker: Okay. So they're close. Stephanie: Yeah, they're kind of forced to interact and maybe work together or see each other, run into each other at work. I love them living together or near each other. I've been called on that by others. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Caitlin Stryker: Yes. I fixed that up at the end of this book. Everyone was buying a house next to everybody. You're like, they're so happy and they're always going to hang out. And I was like, I love this. Stephanie: Yes! Exactly. It's weird little Pleasantville, know, Steffi Archer Pleasantville. ⁓ What else do I like? I love a pet. Yeah. It's fun. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Courtney Richter: Yeah, but it's great. You've had well, yes. Yes, the cat and the dog Daisy, which I love Daisy and the bunnies and the first one like Jamie is so opposed to W just like he's accepting it the whole book. He's like, he's like sitting outside the shelter and then like, okay, you're coming up like, okay, just finding this. Obsessed, obsessed, like the sweetest. Caitlin Stryker: A pet? Yes, the cat! The cat in this was such a fun place. Stephanie: Hi the bunnies. ⁓ Caitlin Stryker: Yes. ⁓ Stephanie: And then by the end of the book, he's like, that's my dog. That's my dog. know, yeah, so. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Well, yeah, I thought the cat was such a fun device in this one. A, that it kind of was showing us her prickly character, right? Like they're mirroring one another. And then ⁓ I really enjoyed the cat's underwear treats being delivered to me. That was fun. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. ⁓ Stephanie: Yes. Yeah, fan favorite. Courtney Richter: It was such a good way to get her underwear into his hands. Stephanie: Yeah, that was like shout out my arc readers. Like, you know, I have a big community of arc readers and we have a Facebook group and sometimes I go to them for help. Like I'm not a cat person. I've never had a cat. I don't really understand cats. They all said no one understands cats. That's normal. but I asked them for help. said, like, what do, what are some weird things that cats do? And someone said my cat would, you know, she can get into cupboards and she can get doors open and stuff. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah So, yeah. Courtney Richter: Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah Mm-hmm. ⁓ Stephanie: and she'll bring things to people. And that's in my mind. She didn't say she brings underwear to people. No, no, no. That's me being like, how can I make this cat cause problems and make, you know, kind of get things going between these two. So yeah, that was a shout out my art readers. They're awesome. Caitlin Stryker: Didn't say anywhere, okay? I was like, no way! ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yes, but it's a thing. ⁓ Mm-hmm. Caitlin Stryker: Yes. Courtney Richter: Yeah, I do appreciate your female characters always have really nice lingerie or really nice lingerie bought for them from the maid. Everyone's efforts very on point. Yes. Yeah, which I love it. And I do feel like because I've read all of your Queens Cove as well. Your other series that I love very much. But I do feel like your your spices in there too. But I feel like it's stepped up a notch and this series too, like you went a bit spicier and a bit. This is my near honor, which I love. Caitlin Stryker: So fun, I love that. Stephanie: Yes. Yes. Another trope I love. Yeah. Yes. Mmm. Yeah, I think so. kind of, I try, you know, with each series, I'm like, okay, let's level up. Let's, let's kind of, you know, and I'm always changing as a person too. And, ⁓ I just got a bit braver with things in this series. And so, yeah, that was really fun to play with. And that's kind of a convention of hockey romance too, is like, typically it is like a quite spicy. ⁓ of course there's like closed door and fade to black, ⁓ hockey romance out there, but like, as I would say, Courtney Richter: Yeah. Nice. Yes. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Stephanie: an average, it's like spicier than your typical contemporary. Courtney Richter: Yeah, we don't read it for the closed door. We read it for the open door hockey. That's not why I'm reading it. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Yeah, no. I was gonna say every, every hockey romance, yeah, every hockey romance, Kord's been like, we're gonna read this one, read this one, read this one. I'm like, so they're spicy. But that tracks as well with like athletes, know what I mean? I'm like, yeah, maybe. Stephanie: I know, yeah, I agree. Courtney Richter: Yes. Well, it should be. Stephanie: Yes. the books themselves, like the tone is like very exhilarating and like it's there's an intensity with hockey, right? And there's competition and stuff like that. And so all of those things kind of thread together to yeah, it's a it's a fun niche of romance for sure. Caitlin Stryker: Mmm. Courtney Richter: Do you have a as writing because you did write in these five books and so you do have five different male bodies to describe and five different Cocks to describe and their appearance on it Does it like do you have to map it out so that you're not like making them the exact same each like they're all obviously big They're all great and going but like do you have to make sure there's like subtle? Differences or is it kind of like a good one is a good one and you can Stephanie: Yes. Caitlin Stryker: you Stephanie: No, might have to. Honestly, feel like I less is more like less description is more like I feel like I don't really say that much because I kind of let you the reader use your mind and your imagination. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yeah, you tend to talk about fit more than like the description of how it actually goes. Like, yeah. Stephanie: Yeah. Yeah, because it sounds kind of hokey if you're gonna like describe it too much, like, you know, and Courtney Richter: I mean that's being in general like they're nice. We like them. They're very useful But like they're not like the thing people talk about in art is like beautiful Caitlin Stryker: You You Stephanie: do have a document. I've got a document right in front of me where I have like a bunch of words, just like different words to use during these scenes because sometimes I'm just like, how do I describe this? And so, yeah, I've got like, I'm just like scrolling through right now. Like I've just got like a bunch of words of like, ⁓ yeah, I'll use that word. Okay. Okay. Like just the way you describe different body parts and different sensations. ⁓ Yeah. Sometimes you need to like a bit of assistance with that. And there's like books for romance writers out there that are like, I there's one called like Courtney Richter: Yeah. Yep. Stephanie: naughty words for nice writers or something like that. ⁓ So there's, yeah, sometimes we need a bit of help there. Courtney Richter: ⁓ nice! That can help. Yeah, I can go. Caitlin Stryker: Hey, yeah You know, I love this I love that this is leading into a bit of like how do you write the sex scene thing because inevitably like as a reader It's so much fun. You know, I mean, it's like kick your feet to the lady. Like we love it Love love love love love but then also as a reader Oh my gosh, like how would you write that? Like how would you you know, so it's interesting to know that you have like a list of words and maybe Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Stephanie: you kind of like, you you think about what your characters need and like what is like novel and interesting to them, you know, like Pippa needed patience, right? She needed someone to be very patient with her and like security. Hazel needed like total adoration, right? She needed someone to just like make her the queen of the universe, right? And, you know, Darcy needed ⁓ like fun. She needed to have fun and just like, and who better to do that with than like her best friend, right? Courtney Richter: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yes! Yeah, it's just being fun. Stephanie: Georgia needed to give up control and have fun with that and learn to trust and stuff like that. And same with Jordan. Jordan needs to ⁓ provide that to someone else. I think seeing Tate have a good time and finally indulge in himself is very rewarding to her. So that's always what I'm thinking about. That's how I craft the scenes ⁓ is what did these characters need? What makes them tick? And it all comes down to who they are as a person. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yes. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Yes. Stephanie: I've had to like cut scenes before and people say like, can you just use that in a different book? And I'm like, no, it doesn't work like that. Like there's no copy paste. Like, cause you'd read the book and be like, why is this person acting like this all of sudden? doesn't make any sense. Exactly. So yeah, it's like, it's, it's always got to like go to the, like go down to character. And that's when, whenever I get stuck in a book, not just spicy scenes, I'm like, what would this person do? Would they be freaking out? Would they? Courtney Richter: Yeah, like all of a sudden, that's what they want. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Stephanie: be like pretending they're fine, but they're not. Like I always kind of have to go back to the root of like, what would this person do? So yeah. Courtney Richter: Yeah. And I do like you stay true a lot to women that I think a lot of women do experience at least personally of the like, not being able to get there with previous partners and then assuming it's something wrong with them. And then the right person and kind of breaking through that which I really like because I do think that happens a lot especially with younger women and having partners that convince them it's a them thing and just like faking it going through. Stephanie: Sure, yes. Totally. ⁓ Or, know, it's, yeah, it's so easy to kind of think that you're the problem or whatever, but it's so complicated. It's not that easy for women. yeah. And, you know, romance novels, there's not a lot of like female gaze, sex education out there. I kind of talk about this in the Wrong Mr. acknowledgements, because that was like the first time I really started writing like, ⁓ this is, this is kind of like, he is kind of teaching her a little bit because she's very inexperienced. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yes, exactly. It's not like, yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm Stephanie: Again, I'm pretty fictional. I don't think a man would be teaching a woman in real life, but ⁓ fun to write. ⁓ But yeah, it's like, there's not a lot of like sex education from that perspective out there. And so that's kind of how I learned about a lot of that stuff is romance novels, right? And so, yeah, so I feel like that's part of my duty, you know, as an author, you're sharing information, right? And so I just, yeah, I really liked that aspect of it too. Courtney Richter: Right. Caitlin Stryker: Right. Courtney Richter: It's good. Caitlin Stryker: No. Courtney Richter: Right? Totally. Caitlin Stryker: Yes! Yeah! Courtney Richter: there's this scene with Jamie and Pippa you haven't got to react when you do and he helps her with a toy. But the way like that Stephanie wrote it and they're like embed and he's basically like cocooning her and using his hand with her and like helping her get over her mental blocks but it is so hot and it's literally him using a toy on her that like Caitlin Stryker: Let's, yeah. Hmm, yeah. Stephanie: Yeah, because she, I think in that book she stops and she's like, I'm cold. I can't do this. I'm cold. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Yeah, she's like, I'm cold. I'm out of my head. Yeah. And it is like, once that switch changes, you're like, Okay, I'm out and done like tried, but he like coaxes her back and it's done so well. And it's so it's like, they have that scene. And then in the next book, Hazel and Rory have like, the bathroom where they're faking getting each other off their faking phone sex for the guy in the room. That's her ex. But then it becomes very real to them both even though and it's just like those are the most that stay in my head with it. I'm like those were the like Caitlin Stryker: You Yeah. Yeah. Stephanie: Yeah Hmm. Caitlin Stryker: anything. Yeah. Love. Courtney Richter: That's where you see the relationships change. Like those are the moments that you're like with the slogan, the pivot. Yes. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah, like this X is part of the plot. Stephanie: Yeah! Absolutely. Like there's no like insert sex scene here. Like it really needs to be part of like the characters arc, like their relationship arc. I really liked doing that. You you mentioned like, it kind of comes up in a few of my books where like she has difficulty kind of getting to the finish line. And like, that is a really fun arc to play with. I love kind of characters. They're working on a problem together throughout the book. They're working on multiple problems and that like, that's one of them. And so yeah, I always, it's fun for me as a writer. It's fun for me as a reader too. So yeah. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Yes. Caitlin Stryker: Absolutely, I love that as a reader. Also as a reader, one of my favorite things that I've been enjoying so much about this whole genre is the sex positive aspect, you know, and just that especially as a woman where, like you said, we just didn't have that education necessarily growing up and I don't know, it's really fun. And then all of a sudden you're like, oh, maybe we can try that, ooh. Stephanie: that I always put it into my book. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Caitlin Stryker: Hey, that's a good idea. You know what I mean? And in a way that just makes it all like really nice and palatable and fun, not scary or intimidating or gross or like shameful, you know? Yeah, which I think is really cool. Stephanie: Yeah. Good, yeah. Yeah. That's awesome. Yeah, I know that I love that about the romance genres. Like people are, you know, like pretty open and like, yeah, it's just really wonderful. It's a wonderful space, like non-judgmental. So yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Good night. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. And this one's kind of the reverse of that, like you said, because it's Jordan taking care of Tate and kind of allowing him to have that hand. So it's kind of the opposite of what we see in a lot of books. And then that one that is so fun about this book, because you still know deep down, it's still him giving something to her. And it's her enjoying that power of helping him to let go and taking care of him, which we also know that power, there's something there isn't an eight power that you feel when you've got literally someone by the balls and you're like in control of that, knowing what you can do for them. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Right? Courtney Richter: that I think you got really well for Jordan and I loved that for her and it made sense to her character and her coming into that ownership. That was super fun in this one. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yes. Mm-hmm. It was like she Yeah, cuz it was like she was afraid of like caring for someone else in any way, you know And you watch her grow and be like, okay I'm gonna care for you and like you see it in the sex scenes and you see in the way She sets up a hockey game for him, you know to play with his buddies so that he can play again ⁓ which was like so incredibly thoughtful and amazing and Stephanie: Yeah, I had really fun. I had a fun time writing it. Hmm. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Caitlin Stryker: And it's this book was so interesting, like we have said a few times with the age gap, but the work to play scenario situation going on, just how they were going to get through those barriers that were very real. And the daughter. And I loved the press conference at the end where I was just like, you know what? by that point in the book, you were like, come on, ⁓ they have to be together. Courtney Richter: and the daughter like Jess Stephanie: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Courtney Richter: you Yeah. Stephanie: Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: on earth are we gonna get over this hurdle now? And it was just a really cool way of watching like a teammate stand up and then them each stand up for themselves and it was like, you know, it was all a community kind of being like, no, there's nothing wrong happening here. Stephanie: Yeah. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Stephanie: Yeah, that's kind of what I wanted to show was like, ⁓ this is a family, you know, found family is a big, ⁓ recurring theme in all my books. And, know, I worked in a male dominated industry. was an engineer before I was a romance author. And so I experienced, you know, there's the scene where, ⁓ Gary, fricking Gary, Gary said, you know, good morning gentlemen, and Darcy and Jordan are on the call. And that absolutely happened to me. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Mmm, I hated Gary so much. Caitlin Stryker: Ugh! Yeah. Stephanie: And, you know, it was hard working in a male dominated environment and men don't always stand up for you. They just let it go. Right. And so to me, that was a big fantasy of, of like, these people care about you, not just the coach, like Tate Ward. mean, one beautiful thing about him is he believes like everyone in his organization is important and valuable and critical, right? Everyone has value, not just the players. ⁓ but you know, I want the teammates to believe that too. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Stephanie: I want them to be good guys. so, yeah, to me, the mark of a good guy, you know, I'm raising ⁓ a little boy. It's like, you stand up for people who have less power than you. So, ⁓ yeah, that was like, to me that I always try to write something that makes you feel better about the world. So that, yeah, that's what I was kind of aiming for there is like, what would I want to see if I were Jordan? What would be like, what would make me feel like everything is okay? And it would be, yeah, Rory standing up for them and the entire organization standing up for her. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Yeah Caitlin Stryker: Yes! Courtney Richter: And they were standing up to the kids on the playground too, which was such a true moment as well that I felt I loved it so much like calling him the rat face fucked. We've all had those moments that we're like trying to swallow it down. We were doing pick up. like. Stephanie: So yeah. Caitlin Stryker: I love that. Yeah. Stephanie: So yeah. So the original scene, she broke his skateboard and it's in the bonus scene. I think it's in the bonus scenes. can't remember. But, um, and I said to my beta readers, like too far. Did I go to, and they said, yeah. So she just, I can't remember what she did in the final, but she didn't break it. I don't think she's called him around the face. Yeah. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Okay. Caitlin Stryker: Mmm. HAHA Courtney Richter: Yeah. She didn't break, I don't think she broke it, she just called me on Facebook, yeah. But I loved it, but he did break her guitar. Yeah, it's so hard. I'd be tempted to break a skateboard too. It would definitely, but I loved that. Caitlin Stryker: No. Stephanie: I know. I know. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah, she gets the upper hand in the end. Courtney Richter: And her perception, she's like, I see her sneaking out in the ring light. Like we always think we're getting so much over on our kids and like they're watching everything. They know everything. And I really liked the healthy co-parenting relationship that you wrote to like, and that it was just women supporting women. And it wasn't like the, you know, there was no, there was none of that that could happen between the mom and the new girlfriend. going like, it was, it was nice. Caitlin Stryker: Yes. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Stephanie: Yeah, feel like I've just I've seen that before and I don't really enjoy reading it and I didn't want to write it and that's just not who Tateward is. Like he wouldn't he wouldn't have a bad relationship because he would do everything in his power to make sure it's a good relationship. ⁓ and I just yeah, I wanted to write a positive, you know, again, it's like Jordan coming like they have a very unusual looking family, but. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Stephanie: that's their family. They have Holly and Jeff and Tate and now Jordan and Bia. And so that's what I wanted to show is she's getting accepted into their family too, not just the team family. Yeah, and I just liked Holly as a character. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Me too. I liked her. Caitlin Stryker: love her. She's great. She's so great. And yes, it's I don't know, it's, it actually feels fresher and more interesting to read a positive approach than you know, the other because I think we just get so much negativity and so much of that everywhere. That it feels overdone. You're like, yeah, we know. But what if, you know, and sometimes actually it does work out great. And everybody's not at one another's throats. Like that's not the only way that people pay. Exactly. Exactly. Stephanie: That was good. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Stephanie: Mm-hmm. Yeah. You do your best, right? So yeah, yeah, that's the hope. Caitlin Stryker: I really loved Tate's house, obviously, in this. This is a thing for me. Stephanie: All the players in the series have beautiful homes, yes. That's my fantasy, yes. Like they have gorgeous homes, yeah. Courtney Richter: Yes. Amazing homes, Caitlin Stryker: ⁓ I'm like when they were had the date and they were out kayaking and I was just like, ⁓ yes I love like I just love that so much ⁓ But wait, so like where kind of is his house miss it? Like is he up? That's what I thought. Stephanie: Yeah. Deep Cove. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like way up, way up Deep Cove. Like up, I'm picturing Gravel Road, like to get there, yeah, way up there, like up the Indian Arm. ⁓ When I was, yes. Courtney Richter: Yes. Caitlin Stryker: Yes! Yes! Courtney Richter: Okay. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Courtney Richter: Bye. Caitlin Stryker: Yep, that's what I was gonna say, is an up Indian arm, because when you describe the kayaking, that's what I was seeing. I was like, I know where they are. Oh, it's so gorgeous. Courtney Richter: Yeah. Stephanie: Exactly. So at my event with Perfect Match, the romance books are in Vancouver, we did an event last week and a reader said, you know, in behind the net, Pippa and Hazel, and sometimes Jamie and Pippa, think they go walking in the forest. They take Daisy, the dog, out to the forest. And the reader said, is it in this neighborhood? And I said, yes. She didn't just identify the city, identified the actual forest. And I was like, Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Amazing. Courtney Richter: Wow. Stephanie: ⁓ I was, my mind was blown. Like I was like, good job. Like, yes, that's what Forrest I was writing about. Cause I used to walk my dog there all the time. So. Caitlin Stryker: I mean, there you go, it's gonna stay. Good job you for accurately describing that part. Courtney Richter: Mmmhmm. Good. Stephanie: mean, come on, trees are trees. think that's like, you know, west coast trees. Caitlin Stryker: But they're mean, they are, but like each little forest area that you can go walk in in Vancouver has a slightly different feel. know, like the endowment lands feel different than Stanley Park and like, you know, all the other parks around and stuff. So that's really cool though that you wrote it. You could think trees are trees. So if you wrote it in such a way that the reader was like, I know exactly which park you're at. Do I have it? That's so cool. ⁓ Courtney Richter: you Stephanie: That's true. Totally. Courtney Richter: Yeah, that's awesome. Stephanie: Yeah, that was wild. That was yeah, pretty mind blowing. But yeah, I'm pretty impressed. Yeah, you got deep cove. So yeah, I'm always picturing something right? Like, yeah, I'm kind of like where they're where they're living and stuff like that. And so yeah, I think like Alexia and Georgia, their their original house was like somewhere in North Vancouver, maybe West Van. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yeah. Yeah, it had a less fans like vibe to it for that one. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Nice. Stephanie: Yeah, Jamie and Pitbull were downtown. Rory, Hazel's crappy old apartment was in the West End. You know, one of those three story. Courtney Richter: Okay, I felt like that, yes. Caitlin Stryker: ⁓ I gotta tell you I felt I totally knew Jordan's apartment and I totally knew the filthy flamingo as well like in Vancouver I was like ⁓ I know where these stuff where these places are I know exactly it was like so clear ⁓ Courtney Richter: you Stephanie: Nice! Courtney Richter: Yeah. Stephanie: Yes! good at Yeah, Gastown. I'm thinking like Blood Alley. Someone had recommended, ⁓ my gosh, there's ⁓ a Mexican restaurant in Gastown. It's not Taco Fino, but it's like down the street from Taco Fino and it's in a hidden alley. And they had said, ⁓ I'm picturing like Jordan's bar is somewhere. Like it's, and I'm like, yeah, it's totally like, it's down an alley. She does not want you to find the bar. Not a very good business strategy, but she's like, she has enough business. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Caitlin Stryker: Yes. Courtney Richter: Yeah. Stephanie: She wants her cool regulars only, but she's not doing a ton of advertising. It's like, if you find the bar, okay, you can come in. ⁓ Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. That's what was clear was that it was like in that sort of like down towards Gastown, but like maybe not all the way in. But those weird streets where it's like all one way, there's nowhere to park ever. And like, there's a couple of like gnarly alleyways. That's where it is. Yeah. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Yeah. Stephanie: Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Never. Courtney Richter: Yeah, you can't bark. Stephanie: YAH YAH Absolutely. Yes, exactly. Yeah, so that's fun for me, right? I kind of have a picture in my mind. I always like kind of change it a little bit, right? Like, ⁓ like how I kind of want it for the book, but especially like their home or whatever. But yeah, I really enjoy kind of grounding myself somewhere in our city. ⁓ Courtney Richter: you Mm-hmm. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Okay, so I have a question. You mentioned that you were an engineer before. You were a romance writer. When did you make this switch? what kind of like, why did you change? Career? Courtney Richter: That's so good. Stephanie: Why did I change? Well, I just like wasn't happy. It wasn't my purpose in life. ⁓ I figured that out pretty, pretty soon when I started working. I'm like, ⁓ this is it. it's no shade to engineering. Like engineering is a great profession. You can work pretty much anywhere in the world as an engineer. ⁓ you don't need an advanced degree. have a, like I had a bachelor's right. Whereas a lot of my friends were going to do, they're going to law school or medical school. I was already working. So engineering is fantastic. Like. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Courtney Richter: Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: you ⁓ Mm-hmm. Stephanie: There's a lot of women going into engineering. So it is, and you know, there's some really cool, there's some cool stuff out there. It's not, yeah, there's an amazing variety of work. So, and I met some really cool friends. I met lifelong friends. Most of my friends are engineers, engineers or romance authors. So, it's a really good mix. Yeah. So yeah, I, you know, it was just kind of unhappy. I, I, in my late twenties, I read a book. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Courtney Richter: Great. Caitlin Stryker: So cool. Love it. Courtney Richter: That's a good mix. Yeah. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Stephanie: that I just I was always a big reader, but I read a book I loved so much. And I was like, this is what I want to write. This is kind this is the kind of book I want to write. It's called A Girl Like You by Gemma Burgess. It's like a reddit. No, it's so good. No, Courtney Richter: Yes, it's I've read that I've read that it's so good. It's so good. Yes. One of my romance women at when I was lived in Ontario and that store she gave it to me was like you have to read this book. We love romance. She's like you have to read this book. It's so good. Yeah, I could Caitlin Stryker: Read it now. Stephanie: My god! No one's ever read it, so I'm just so happy you read it. That's great. Courtney Richter: Yes, if they had they had a whole book club on it. Yeah, you haven't read it yet Caitlin Stryker: was right after you. Stephanie: ⁓ my god, it's because it's the best book ever. Yeah. ⁓ She's so funny. She's so witty. Also, like I was I think I was in my like 27 or 26 when I read it and that's like how the age range of the main character and so it you know, I was single and broke and living in a crappy apartment and having fun and getting my heart broken and stuff. Right. And so ⁓ it felt yeah, it was just like on multiple levels. I was like, this is the kind of book I want to write. So I started Caitlin Stryker: to the character. Courtney Richter: Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Stephanie: writing. And I would write on the weekends and before work when I really got intense into it kind of near the end of when I was working, I would get up at five every morning and write before work and I'd write on my lunch hour in a meeting room at work. My coworkers wouldn't know what I was doing. ⁓ Yeah. And so I just, decided I wanted to be a romance author. I tried to get traditionally published for like seven years. ⁓ The books I wrote were not good and I'm not surprised I didn't get published. Caitlin Stryker: Amazing. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yeah. Okay. Stephanie: Much better books out there. It happened the way it was supposed to happen. ⁓ cause yeah, you know, as every book you write, you learn more and more and more. So, and then I got fed up with the traditionally published system. I think I was writing books that I thought I should write and not the ones I actually love. So then I started, I said, you know what? I really want to do this. I'm going to try and indie publish like independent publishing. So you're your own publisher. So that's when I wrote the Queens Cove series. ⁓ Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Courtney Richter: Right. Caitlin Stryker: Mmmmm Stephanie: And yeah, my life kind of changed. Like every book, my readership grew after the wrong Mr. Right. quit my engineering job. and I was a full-time writer and yeah, it has been hard work, but it's like a labor of love. absolutely, this is what I meant to do. This is what I'm here for. And I just absolutely loved it. So yeah. Courtney Richter: awesome. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. I love that. I'm so glad I asked you. was like, I hope she doesn't mind answering this, like, that's really cool. That's really cool and very inspiring and everything as well. That's amazing. Yeah. Courtney Richter: So great. Uh-huh. Stephanie: No, not at all, not at all. thank you. I'm yeah, it turned out a lot better than I expected. I was like perfectly happy to just write quietly in my spare time for the rest of my career if I had to, but thank God I didn't have to. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: ⁓ Yeah, thank goodness and thank goodness for us too because like these you know Now we have like such a wonderful stack of books by you to read and I'm excited for more if this is the last in the wild card like in this series Do we have do you have another series like planned out coming or are you like? ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yes, now we get them all. Stephanie: ⁓ thank you. Yeah. So I have, there is another Vancouver storm series coming. It's probably not a huge surprise to you if you read the book, you know, I left a couple pretty big cliffhangers in there. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Courtney Richter: Okay. Caitlin Stryker: She keeps saying this is the last one, but Stephanie: doing? Yeah, people are like, what about Luca? I'm like, I got plans for Luca. Luca's 20, Luca's 23 years old, right? So I'm just like, I don't want to read a 23 year old guy. So we're gonna give Luca a bit of time to grow up. So yeah, the next series starts five years later. I find like the late 20s Courtney Richter: Yes, Lucas you made him ⁓ yes, I'm gonna marry her Caitlin Stryker: Exactly! Courtney Richter: Yeah. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Nice. Courtney Richter: Ugh. Caitlin Stryker: Okay, that explains the epilogue as well. I was like, how is she gonna she just gave us a lot. I'm confused. By the end because I was like, what's the next one? Okay, cool. Stephanie: Yeah. Yes. So that's coming, but not yet. ⁓ there's going to be like two, I guess it's a, it's a series of two books, two contemporary standalones. Like those are coming next. I'm almost finished the first one. Those are completely unrelated. Cause I just, I wanted, you know, you've kind of learned from me that I need to plan the whole series in my head before I start. I have the entire Vancouver storm series planned. know the characters and the tropes. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Amazing. Yeah. Stephanie: But I want it to be like a little different. want it to be, I don't want it to be like a regurgitated Vancouver Storm series. I want it to be like a little fresh. want to level up, right? You kind of said, your spice changed from one series to the next. like, want to level up as a writer. So I'm still thinking about like, how is this going to look? What's the arc going to look like? So I'm thinking about it a little bit. So that's why I need a little break before I start Luca's book. Luca would be book number one. ⁓ Caitlin Stryker: Mmm. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Mm. Courtney Richter: Nice. Caitlin Stryker: fun. Courtney Richter: Yay, that's awesome. I can't wait to read it. Caitlin Stryker: Hey. ⁓ exciting. Very exciting. Good, good. I'm so excited to read more. Stephanie: Yeah, yeah, so but I have two books coming in between. So yeah. Courtney Richter: I can't wait. It's fun to even as a reader when you get the standalones in between just to like reset to and then come back fresh into them. Stephanie: Yeah. It's fun for me to write something a little bit different. I mean, it's still contemporary. ⁓ The two books are kind of like my homage to Grey's Anatomy because I love, I used to watch a lot of Grey's Anatomy. So yeah, they're medical romances. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Me too. my gosh. ⁓ I medical I don't think I've read medical romance. Romance very often. No, but I think it's amazing. That's because I also love Grey's Anatomy. So did Cait when it came like that was everything when that came out. ⁓ Yeah, that's awesome. Stephanie: I know, they're not that popular. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Stephanie: Yeah. So it started as like a fun project for me in October. was, you know, I was finished the wild card and I was like, I'm going to write something for fun for one month. And then at the end of the month, I figure out what I want to do. And I didn't want to stop writing. I wanted to finish the book. yeah, it's, ⁓ it's going to be fun. Yeah. Courtney Richter: That's so great. Caitlin Stryker: That's cool. ⁓ I love that. ⁓ Stephanie, thank you so much for coming on and chatting with us. I know you're incredibly busy. I'm so grateful that you made time to chat with us because this has been so much fun and so insightful. And just also, yes, ⁓ our pleasure. And we're also always about like pumping up like our Canadian writers and especially like local Vancouver writers too. So was really great to have you on. Thank you so much for joining us and Courtney Richter: Yes. Stephanie: Thank you. Courtney Richter: you you Stephanie: So fun. Thank you for having me. Courtney Richter: Yes. Stephanie: Thank you. Caitlin Stryker: That is it for today's episode of Cait and Court's Cozy Corner. We'll talk again with you soon. Bye! Courtney Richter: Yeah, bye!