Latest / Collectors MD Features / #13: Gatekeepers, Break Culture, & The Cost of Silence | Professor Sports Cards

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#13: Gatekeepers, Break Culture, & The Cost of Silence | Professor Sports Cards · Collectors MD Features

0:00
And now, Frank's gone. Frank's gone. What do
0:04
we got here? All right. So, CollectorMD, if you
0:06
have any questions for CollectorMD, throw them
0:09
in here. I'm going to show you my questions,
0:11
what I feel like I want to ask. Where are we?
0:14
Hey, Macy's Thanksgiving. Da -da -da. Here we
0:16
go. All right. CollectorMD, I want to know his
0:18
credentials in the field. What exactly? What
0:24
is his background? Number one. Number two, mission
0:27
statement. What exactly is he hoping to do with
0:30
Collectors MD? Number three. And Frank, thank
0:35
you for calling in. Always a pleasure. You're
0:37
welcome anytime. I love how he comes in. He gives
0:39
the knowledge. He came prepared. He had a slide.
0:41
He had a video. And then he got right out. What
0:46
is his inspiration? Where does the passion come
0:48
from for doing this? His biggest problems he
0:50
sees in the hobby or what he sees at his front
0:53
door? And finally, my biggest thought about this
0:57
is, you know, how does he compete with already
1:00
established medical community and avenues? There's
1:03
outlets for this already. So how is he just going
1:07
to focus on the niche and feels that's going
1:09
to be? So speaking of which. I think he should
1:13
be calling in any moment. Let's see. How do I
1:16
make this happen? Say his name and he appears.
1:21
I believe in Joe Hendry. I believe in Joe Hendry.
1:28
All right. Collectors MD, what is your first name?
1:32
Well, thanks for having me. Can you hear me okay?
1:35
Yes, sir. My name is Alyx. Alyx, good to meet
1:41
you. We heard you a little better and now you're
1:42
a little frozen. Let's see if that frozen goes
1:44
away. Oh, there he is. And we heard you a little
1:50
better in the beginning. I don't know if your
1:52
mic was closer. Now you're a little lower. Can
1:56
you hear me now? Yeah, I can hear you pretty
1:59
good. So collector and Petty's here as well.
2:01
You want to hop on Petty? No, not yet. Petty,
2:05
maybe later. Okay. My first question to you is
2:09
Alyx, correct? Yeah, it's Alyx. Yeah, that's
2:12
right. Alyx, so you can see my questions on the
2:15
screen. So my first question is kind of like,
2:16
what's the background? What's your background?
2:18
What qualifications do you have for Collectors MD?
2:23
Yeah, so first of all, I just wanted to thank
2:26
you for having me and just say hello to everybody
2:29
in the chat. I see a few folks that are in our
2:34
community. Collect Charles, Brandon, awesome
2:38
guy. Appreciate the support. Yeah, so Collectors
2:42
MD is a support first movement for people who
2:46
love the hobby but are tired of feeling controlled
2:50
by it. At its core, we help collectors step back
2:54
from all of the chaos, the compulsion, the pressure
2:57
-driven behavior that we're seeing everywhere
2:59
and move toward what we call intentional collecting.
3:03
So what intentional collecting is, it's where
3:07
choices are rooted in clarity, boundaries, and
3:09
purpose instead of dopamine, urgency, and FOMO.
3:13
We recognize that collecting isn't inherently
3:17
harmful, but the modern hobby has increasingly
3:20
borrowed a lot of what we see within casinos
3:23
and across sports books and the entire gambling
3:26
world that sort of drive these hype cycles. and
3:31
uh predatory mechanics right that blur the line
3:34
between passion and addiction and so that's the
3:38
space we exist just wanted to sort of uh set
3:41
the table there give everybody a high level overview
3:44
of who we are that was my third that was my second
3:47
question your mission statement so it sounds
3:50
like there's some of that in there i'd like to
3:52
expand a little more but again what are i think
3:54
it's important to to highlight you know at the
3:57
very beginning what are the credentials that
3:59
you have And I don't know. I'm honestly just
4:02
curious. Yeah, of course. I am not a licensed
4:05
therapist or a doctor or anything like that.
4:08
I am simply a lifelong collector who has experienced
4:12
the highs and lows of both gambling addiction
4:16
as well as compulsive collecting. Have you thought
4:18
about partnering with or reached out or has it
4:22
crossed your mind to partner with someone that
4:25
is accredited? So we have a full -fledged referral
4:28
network of five. I think we're up to five individuals
4:34
now that are licensed therapists, doctors, clinicians
4:37
that we can provide service from as part of this
4:43
extra layer of support for our community. We've
4:46
also partnered with three facilities that help
4:52
folks that have gambling addiction, behavioral
4:55
issues, substance abuse, things like that. And
4:58
those three facilities are Birches Health, Right
5:01
Choice Recovery, and one we actually just announced
5:04
today, Better Way of Miami. So if you have a
5:07
difficult time with sports cards, you can enlist
5:10
into these programs? Absolutely. Sorry, that's
5:15
so funny. I don't know why that's funny. Okay,
5:19
let's take the silliness away from it. How many
5:21
are people signing up for these things? Because
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I think it's hard to admit yourself you have
5:26
any problem, let alone saying, oh, yeah, I have
5:29
a sports card problem. Yeah, I mean, from the
5:33
outside looking in, it can absolutely seem comical.
5:39
you know, confusing as to how something like
5:42
a childhood nostalgia or childhood hobby rooted
5:45
in nostalgia can have the same sort of. Well,
5:49
that's not what it is anymore. Right. But that's
5:51
what it was. And so it's it's hard for people
5:54
to wrap their heads around. But are you finding
5:56
anybody admitting out there that, yeah, I do
5:59
have this problem? Oh, absolutely. Our community
6:02
is growing by the dozens on a weekly basis. how
6:06
where is your community at a facebook group discord
6:09
how do they what is the how does they join that
6:12
community so we host weekly meetings every wednesday
6:15
night at 8 p .m eastern we it's a real subject
6:20
i know it's 100 real and it's 100 serious and
6:24
good for you in being out there doing this I
6:28
know that it's come to this fucking thing, man.
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I'm not laughing. I just it's unreal that that's
6:35
where we're at. Yeah, I'm not I won't I'm not
6:38
taking offense to you laughing or anything like
6:40
that. But it is a very serious subject. And there
6:42
are people out there whose lives are getting
6:45
absolutely destroyed by the hobby. And we see
6:50
that firsthand on social media. We see it in
6:53
Reddit. We see it on Facebook groups, people
6:57
coming out and talking about the outrageous amount
7:00
of money that they've lost by getting sucked
7:04
into these breaks and break culture in general.
7:09
How does someone find your community? If I wanted
7:14
to join those meetings or be a part of the community,
7:18
which I don't have the problem, but how would
7:20
you do that? Can I share my screen? I can't,
7:24
I don't know. Can you, I'm not quite sure if
7:26
you can. Okay. I just, yeah, you did here. Let's
7:31
add to stage. I think this is, Oh, you might
7:33
have to do it. I don't know if I can, I, it won't
7:36
let me click add to stage. Hmm. Okay. Well, uh,
7:39
it's not letting me click either, but all you
7:41
have to do is go to collectors, md .com. Oh,
7:43
here I can remove that. Add to stage. Yeah, there
7:46
it is. There we go. Is there an echo? Do we have
7:50
an echo? Hopefully there's no echo. Sorry, Alyx.
7:52
Go ahead. You're good. And by the way, what's
7:54
your first name again? My first name is Jason.
7:56
Jason. Jason. It's great to meet you, man. Master's
7:59
degree, no doctorate. So, you know, you could
8:01
assume you couldn't get at me. But yeah, anyways.
8:04
The Real Mike Petty asks, is it a disease or
8:07
a weakness? Gambling addiction is a disease.
8:10
We absolutely. like see the parallels between
8:16
gambling addiction and compulsive collecting
8:19
overspending retail therapy. And by the way,
8:22
it's this, do you want to hop on right now or
8:24
no? This isn't just sports cards. This encompasses
8:28
a lot of different verticals across the collecting
8:32
world, right? There are sneakers, TCG. I'll put
8:36
you back when we stop sharing the screen. That
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way you're not covered. Sorry about that. So
8:43
when you go to this website, again, I'm trying
8:48
to plug how exactly does somebody get into the
8:52
community? So all they have to do is go to our
8:56
website and click on this link that says sign
8:59
up for our weekly peer support meetings. It takes
9:02
you to a Google form that you fill out, answer
9:05
a few high -level questions, and we add you to
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the calendar invite. It's very simple. We are
9:11
seeing anywhere from 30 to 40 plus people joining
9:14
on a weekly basis. Oh, that's great. Goating,
9:19
you're right. Stop interrupting. Sorry, there's
9:20
17 things going on. Sharing screens, adding this.
9:23
Petty's down there. He wants to ask questions.
9:25
Chat's going. I'm trying to get to know Alyx.
9:29
Okay, so they just go to the site and they can
9:31
join from there. Do you see more clients or more
9:35
people signing up from the TCG world or from
9:38
the sports card world? More from the sports card
9:42
world at the moment, but we do have a handful
9:43
of folks in our community that are addicted to
9:46
other things outside of just sports cards. I
9:48
was naming a few of them. Obviously, TCG with
9:51
Pokemon being the number one sort of culprit
9:54
there. Sneakers, memorabilia, watches, handbags,
10:00
luxury goods, NFTs, gaming, you name it. If it's
10:06
something that... will drive people to overextend
10:09
themselves or spend outside of their means, outside
10:12
of their budget, it's potentially, you know,
10:17
harmful. And, you know, there are... No, you're
10:20
not wrong. I agree with a lot. I mean, I don't,
10:22
I think a lot of what you're saying has some
10:25
truth. I think it's hard for people to admit
10:27
to themselves they have any sort of addiction,
10:29
any sort of problem. Let alone when it, so that's,
10:32
that's the barrier I think. And it sounds like
10:34
you're still getting people and Petty. Hey, how
10:37
about some support for Petty in the chat? Petty,
10:39
a random Petty. Hey, happy Thanksgiving. How
10:42
you doing? Happy Thanksgiving guys. Alyx, a pleasure
10:45
to meet you, my handsome friend. I really appreciate
10:47
what you've been doing. And I was, I was one
10:50
of your first subscribers. Thank you. I just
10:54
cannot believe what a slow ride it's been. to
10:59
get like a hundred subscribers for you. Yeah.
11:03
You're talking about YouTube. I mean, yeah. I
11:05
mean, do you have, do you have other impact in
11:07
other areas that are okay? Because I mean, the
11:10
people that should, you should have a hundred
11:12
thousand subscribers. I know. It's only been
11:14
eight months. So the amount of work. Shit, I
11:17
have that many subscribers in five minutes and
11:19
I don't have a channel. Mike, you gotta, you
11:22
gotta come work with me then. I gotta figure
11:23
out a way to blow this up. In all seriousness,
11:27
it's all about getting the message out there,
11:31
spreading awareness, educating people on the
11:34
insidious nature of collecting and the hobby.
11:37
And the first thing that I want to put out there
11:40
is that we are not anti -hobby. We love collecting.
11:43
I'm still a collector. I've been collecting my
11:46
entire life. I've collected sneakers, memorabilia,
11:49
obviously cards. And so, you know, this isn't
11:53
about canceling. sports cards canceling, break
11:57
culture, any of that. We don't want to remove
11:58
the fun. We just want people to know that they
12:01
can continue to collect as long as they're doing
12:04
so intentionally. And so when the... But you
12:09
know what? When you have an addiction like that,
12:11
you pretty much have to stop it all. And especially
12:17
when you're a young kid in your 20s to 30s and
12:20
you have a family. And there's just other things
12:23
that are just so much more important, like paying
12:25
your rent and buying groceries and things like
12:27
that, that I think, I mean, you literally have
12:29
to stop. And I think one of my professors in
12:33
college, and a lot of people that know me know
12:35
that I was in college for 10 years, so I've had
12:37
quite a lot of schooling. But one of the main
12:42
things I learned was, is the guy said, hey, stop
12:47
doing what isn't working. And it's pretty simple.
12:52
I mean, it's probably the best advice I ever
12:54
got in life. So no matter what it is, whether
12:57
it's gambling or something in your life that's
13:00
not going right or that's not working at that
13:03
time, stop it. And I don't know that it's a disease
13:06
or a weakness. I mean, I don't know. Like, I
13:10
think we all, in cards in general, I think we
13:12
all have a little bit of an addictive personality.
13:15
Yeah, so the first thing I want to say to that
13:18
is you're absolutely right, Mike. I mean, there's
13:22
definitely more at play here. We're talking about,
13:26
oh, that's my boy. So Brandon. I have a little
13:30
beef with your boy. He knows, he knows. Charles,
13:32
good to see you. One of our biggest supporters.
13:35
But yeah, I mean, there's a lot of things at
13:38
play, right? There's the psychological effect,
13:40
the dopamine loops. You know, it's a lot harder.
13:44
than you think to just stop a behavior especially
13:47
when you've been sucked into the point of you
13:51
know it's sort of embedded in your dna and it's
13:54
been a part of your life uh for years or for
13:56
decades and so um especially with something like
14:00
sports cards or TCG that again is is rooted in
14:04
our childhood it's something we've been doing
14:06
since we were kids and so because of that because
14:10
of the nature of it there is this gray area.
14:14
There are a lot of blurred lines. People don't
14:16
realize the gambling mechanics that have been
14:19
introduced. They don't understand. We realize
14:22
forms like Whatnot and Fanatics Live are engineered
14:25
to suck you in Arena Club, get you to spend money.
14:29
Arena Club is. Hey, so can I ask you a question?
14:31
I have a few more questions before Charles. Thank
14:33
you for calling. So did it bother you when you
14:36
were on Geoff show and he did the Arena Club ads
14:38
prior or it didn't cause it got some, it got
14:41
some. press. So did that bother you at all or
14:44
not so much? So I spent 13 years in advertising
14:48
sales. So I understand the nuances as far as
14:53
partnership agreements are concerned, advertising.
14:57
I mean, this is an advertiser that pays Geoff
15:01
and his company money on a monthly, quarterly
15:06
basis. He stands for nothing. Let me finish.
15:10
You just partnered. Respectfully. Well, some
15:13
of the chat is saying to move on. I want to make
15:15
sure it's very long -winded, but go ahead. Yes,
15:18
yes. Yeah, so with something like that, of course,
15:22
like Arena Club is doing what they're doing,
15:27
and they're a part of the problem. But at the
15:30
end of the day, and this kind of goes hand -in
15:33
-hand with any break group. card shop platform
15:35
that Collectors MD partners with. It's not about
15:39
endorsing the behavior. It's about reaching people
15:42
that are involved in said behavior. And so for
15:46
instance, if Arena Club is reaching hundreds
15:49
of thousands of individuals and a percentage
15:51
of those individuals have a gambling problem
15:53
and need help, then we're now able to reach those
15:57
people through these partnerships. So it's, it's
16:01
less so about, you know, from like a mission
16:08
standpoint and more so about making sure that
16:12
we're getting in front of these individuals that
16:14
actually - Oh, it didn't bother you. You don't
16:17
really answer my questions. It didn't bother
16:19
you. It's a loaded question, Jason. I mean, I
16:24
can't - Well, it's one way or the other. It either
16:26
bothered you or it didn't. It's not a loaded
16:28
question. It didn't bother me that - Arena Club
16:33
was a sponsor of the show. What bothered me was
16:37
that people don't look at the entire picture.
16:42
They look at everything from face value. And
16:45
everybody and their mom wants to be a keyboard
16:47
warrior and insert their opinion. comment and
16:50
say this that the other about well Geoff is doing
16:54
this is gonna be tough we just we just hate the
16:56
fucker that's all no no a previous question you
16:58
also i i'm having a tough tough time you i also
17:01
asked like this and maybe you did answer and
17:03
i missed it uh is the majority of people you
17:06
see coming in from TCG or from sports cards sports
17:10
cards okay all right thank you uh i have Charles
17:15
go ahead you thanks for calling Charles what's
17:17
up I'll work with Alyx. I'll vouch for him. We
17:21
don't take any kind of endorsements widely. And
17:26
Mike Petty, I totally understand you being dogmatic
17:29
about us partnering with Market Movers. No, I'm
17:31
not. I think it's probably a good partnership.
17:34
In what context do you work for? Because you
17:36
get a lot of morons over there that can really
17:38
use it. And I'm a big supporter of this. Let's
17:43
just get that straight. Oh, me too. I'm not trying,
17:45
I'm almost trying to get straight answers. What,
17:47
in what context, me too, in what context do you
17:51
work for the company or for Alyx? I just help
17:54
him out and contribute with our daily reflections
17:57
and whatever he needs as far as. That's nice
18:00
of you. It really is. As contributions are concerned.
18:03
You know, it's anything I can do to help the
18:04
hobby out. I joined this because as. I don't
18:08
even know how much that I've admitted of this.
18:10
You might have figured it out. I had a real tough
18:12
time with breaks, spending too much money. Don't
18:15
say. Well, that's how we met. That's how we met,
18:17
Charles, and how we tried to talk. And we're
18:20
trying to help. And I think it's awesome, dude.
18:23
And I'm like, I love you. Up to this point, you
18:26
know, going from being a loser and just being
18:29
a nightmare and having to listen to you. Being
18:32
just an awesome guy, I really appreciate you
18:35
and really, really like you. You've come a long
18:37
way on the show. You've come a long way in three
18:39
months, I heard you. That's all you've been in
18:41
the hobby. So I think it's great. Five months
18:43
now total since the summer. Five, yeah. So that's
18:46
great. No, I didn't start doing these until about
18:48
September. And we're just busting your balls
18:50
a lot too. Yeah, I know. You deserve it. It's
18:53
all in fun, but he still deserves it. He still
18:55
deserves it. So here's the thing. So here's what
18:59
I saw when I first came into this hobby. Arena
19:01
Club. Hey, chase a Grail card. Get a really awesome
19:04
card you've always wanted that's graded. You
19:06
have Geoff Wilson going, hey, graded cards rule.
19:08
This and that and the other. And then you have
19:09
breakers saying, hey, you can buy into this much
19:12
cheaper and not have to actually buy an actual
19:15
box of cards and stuff like that. So it's really
19:18
enticing. And I have an addictive personality.
19:21
I was a gambler. I was in the big poker boom
19:23
back in the mid -2000s. I won money. No, I lost
19:26
money. You know, cause that was the thing back
19:29
then you got on online. Yeah. So this, the whole
19:35
thing with Arena Club, that's what stands out
19:37
to me. They have that algorithm. They have that
19:40
method of doing things. And that's what really
19:42
got me wrapped into it a little bit. And plus
19:45
the breakers that act like they want to be your
19:48
friend. And they're really just kind of sort
19:50
of wanting your money. Cause you'll notice when
19:51
you don't go into their breaks anymore, you don't
19:53
hear from them. It's like when you are in their
19:58
breaks, they'll like send you emails or DMS or.
20:02
I mean, if you're Fanatics, I guess. Sure. But
20:04
like, if you're just a mom and pop shop, sometimes
20:06
they're just like, oh, well, anyway, we'll move
20:07
on to another. We call it. I'm curious. Like,
20:10
what's the difference? So you're saying once
20:11
you're not in their break. So if you're joining
20:13
somebody's break, are they hitting you up with
20:15
like, hey, buy this from us today or how? What's
20:20
the difference? How's it going? They try to include
20:22
you in. It's like a social circle. That kind
20:23
of thing. It's sort of like. They veiled like,
20:27
hey, you're in our club. Join us here and subscribe
20:29
for $5. Hey, hit the damn like button. Sorry.
20:32
There's 100 people in here, 17 likes. It's free.
20:35
It helps grow the channel. It helps spread this
20:37
message of Alyx and Collector Charles helping
20:40
out. We got Petty on. Hey, you know Petty. He
20:42
wants it to be. Hey, Petty, thanks for calling
20:44
in. Charles, has the addiction gotten better?
20:48
Oh yeah. I mean like I'm not buying into breaks
20:51
anymore. I think I bought into one like in the
20:53
last month and it was just for a box of cards,
20:54
you know, stuff like that. But you'll get into
20:57
the trap of like watching these breakers or watching
20:59
these people pull cards. You're like, I don't,
21:01
I'd go down to my shop and just buy a hobby box,
21:03
buy a jumbo box. That's what collectors in these
21:06
four, I can text Alyx and be like, Hey man, so
21:08
I got a problem. I want to start buying some
21:11
more boxes. He'll say, here's the checklist.
21:13
It's crap. Alyx, let me ask you a question. That's
21:15
great. I mean, run everything by Alyx. Exactly.
21:18
It's like, look, the checklist is crap. Or, you
21:20
know, this or that or the other. Just buy your
21:22
singles. If you want to pick your arms, it's
21:24
fine. Or a box every three months. Or, you know,
21:28
enjoy what you like. Budget your money, that
21:31
kind of stuff. Save your, you know, that kind
21:33
of thing. Go ahead, Jason. My question for you,
21:37
and I don't know if you had something to say,
21:38
but is it mainly in breaks? Is it mystery packages?
21:42
Buying too many singles? What's the biggest problem
21:44
that you see on your front door or that comes
21:46
to you? Yeah, it's people joining breaks. It's
21:50
people buying personals and chasing the next
21:53
big hit. It's just that constant dopamine cycle.
21:57
There's just so much oversaturation now with
22:00
product. And it's being forced down our throats
22:04
24 -7 by the manufacturers, platforms, and breakers.
22:08
And so because of that, there's this sort of
22:11
inherent reaction from the hobby where they're
22:16
just driving this relentless sense of FOMO. There's
22:21
so much urgency. A new product comes out, every
22:24
breaker on the planet is shouting from the mountaintops
22:27
that you got to join this break or you're missing
22:28
out. And so young... impressionable uneducated
22:32
adults and children are being sucked in and spending
22:37
money hand over fist not even realizing that
22:40
what they're doing is effectively gambling and
22:44
so it's across the board it's even people who
22:46
are just buying singles just to scratch an itch
22:49
we're seeing it everywhere it's becomes very
22:52
sensationalized and almost everything you just
22:54
said We have different ways of going, but that's
22:57
almost what inspired me to make a channel. I
23:00
mean, it's just absolutely every, all the overprinting,
23:03
it's shoved down your throat. Some of these content,
23:05
it's really kind of sensationalizing it in a
23:07
way that creates a bigger issue. And yeah, so
23:12
I can connect with all those. all those things
23:15
you just made. And then, so, okay. That leads
23:17
me to my next question is that's what inspires
23:18
me for content. What inspired, obviously you
23:21
doing this, there has to be a passion. There
23:23
has to be a reason. So where is it in your gut
23:25
or what, what inspires you to do this? My own
23:29
lived experience. Like I said earlier, I'm a
23:32
recovering gambling addict. I've experienced
23:37
the. the thrill of the chase I've experienced
23:40
the lowest of lows, that feeling of like I hit
23:43
rock bottom multiple times in my life. I'm 36
23:46
years old. And so I have fully dedicated my life
23:50
to helping people who need support. And so you
23:55
had a problem with the sports cards or have a
23:58
problem currently. I mean, I would hope not.
24:00
I'm a recovering gambling addict and that encompasses
24:02
anything defined by the gamblers anonymous program
24:06
is gambling. And, yes, sports cards and breaking,
24:09
by definition, are gambling. How does breaking
24:12
suck people in? How does breaking get you? Because
24:15
I argue it's not sustainable. People get in,
24:17
they realize it's not the best ROI, and they
24:19
get out. But maybe, I guess I'm wrong. I don't
24:21
know. So what do they do to keep you and suck
24:24
you in? They do a lot of things. Are we talking
24:27
about the platforms, the breakers, the manufacturers?
24:30
Either anything. Let's start with the breakers.
24:31
Not manufacturer, because I understand that part
24:33
completely. Let's start with the breakers. So
24:37
everything that you're seeing on Whatnot and
24:39
Fanatics Live, all these gimmicks, the wheel
24:41
spins, choosing which team you want from a deck
24:44
of cards, the flashing lights, the breakers screaming
24:48
into the microphone to bid, the auctions aren't
24:53
going for what they should. Go get it. The trade
24:57
two teams for one. It's all a giant facade engineered
25:03
to suck you in the same way casinos do. The difference
25:06
between breaking and gambling, traditional gambling,
25:11
is that there's zero oversight, zero regulation,
25:14
zero rules, and breakers can do whatever they
25:18
want. So, for instance, if a breaker or a card
25:21
shop is selling singles, they can plop a slab
25:24
down on a card stand and say, this card lasts
25:26
for $20 ,000. You have 10 seconds on a sudden
25:29
death auction. Bid. On a card you can't see.
25:33
And people immediately just feel this sense of
25:36
urgency. Yeah. And mindless. And they'll have
25:41
people in there in the beginning, trying to pump
25:43
it. Cause what I understand about all the burgers
25:45
is momentum. You have to build more. So you'll
25:47
have someone in there, even hyping the first
25:48
few building those prices. That way it builds
25:50
some momentum. So now, Ooh, now, now we're going,
25:53
now there's a rush. If you don't believe that
25:56
this is a real issue. And I'm not saying that
25:58
you guys don't. I'm just saying for anybody listening,
26:00
if you don't believe that this is a real issue,
26:03
I highly encourage you to sign up for one of
26:06
our meetings, sit in, and listen to the real
26:09
stories from real people in the hobby. I'm glad
26:12
you have them. Are those recorded? No. Out of
26:17
the safety and privacy of our community, our
26:19
weekly peer support meetings are not recorded.
26:22
If I were to join, could I use some of those
26:25
as anonymous and just some of the stories that
26:29
I hear from there? I think it's important to
26:32
get them out. Whatever you want. I would just
26:34
encourage you to be respectful. Would you be
26:39
okay with me sharing some of what I heard? Yeah,
26:43
you could share whatever you'd like as long as
26:45
you're not, you know. calling anybody out or
26:47
naming anybody by name. There is a waiver that
26:50
you have to sign before joining the meetings
26:52
that sort of highlights all of those details.
26:54
I would be very interested to be on a fly in
26:58
a wall on one of those meetings. Yeah, I mean,
27:00
we've had people join from the hobby who, whether
27:03
it be somebody whose podcast I was on or vice
27:05
versa, people who are just genuinely intrigued
27:08
or interested in learning what's going on behind
27:12
the scenes, the people that are really struggling.
27:15
And you'd be floored at some of these stories,
27:17
truly. There are people, and I'll tell you a
27:20
story right now. There are people who have nearly
27:23
lost their lives. There are people who have had
27:28
to sell their homes, their cars, lose custody.
27:33
In what way nearly lost their lives? Lose custody
27:35
of their children. Oh, all sorts of things. I
27:38
mean, we're talking about people that end up.
27:41
because of what they're going through. I mean,
27:44
this is no joke. Absolutely. Brandon, no, or
27:48
sorry, Charles. I don't know. So Brandon, he
27:51
was my Brandon, but he's Charles on here, so.
27:53
I go by Collector Charles on YouTube and everything.
27:56
What a snake. I go by Brandon outside of my life.
27:58
It's fine. So Charles gets it. Yeah, I mean,
28:02
they're all walks of life. And you're talking
28:05
about people losing possibly their wife or their
28:07
husband or, you know. Losing your house? It's
28:11
men and women. Why do you think I speak out about
28:13
this bullshit? This is exactly the reason why
28:17
I've been speaking out for two years on YouTube.
28:20
It's because people don't see the damage. It's
28:23
all smoke and mirrors and all joy and a bunch
28:26
of fun and games. And I know that this shit is
28:29
happening because it happened to me. Not in sports
28:32
cards per se, but I was a big poker player before
28:35
I was 21 years old, okay? I had a $10 ,000 credit
28:41
limit at Caesars Palace for free rooms and all
28:46
I could eat and get a room anytime I wanted at
28:49
Caesars. This is before I was 21 years old. I
28:53
had a fake ID. I had worked my way up from when
28:56
I was 19 years old. I went to Las Vegas and played
29:00
poker. This was seven -card stud back then. Hold
29:04
'em had just kind of started. I won. 20 times
29:08
in a row. I'd go every two weeks. I lived three
29:12
hours from there. So I would drive up there.
29:14
Here I am. I'm sitting at a poker table playing
29:18
$30 and $60 limit with Pugsy fucking Pearson,
29:23
Doyle Brunson, and Amarillo Slim at the same
29:26
fucking table. And me. You can only imagine how
29:31
young I looked. It was ridiculous. I would get
29:35
my cigar, my 10X Beaver hat, Stetson, and I would
29:40
hit cards, hands I had no business being in,
29:42
and just dumbass luck. But then, what do you
29:46
think happened? The way I would do it is I'd
29:48
go there, I'd sign out for chips at the blackjack
29:52
table. So I'd get $5 ,000 at the blackjack table.
29:55
This was before they ever knew. Now they know
29:59
every quarter you spend there, they know. Back
30:03
then, they couldn't track you. So I would play
30:05
$100 hand. I'd win, lose, play two hands, win
30:08
or lose. I'd take all the cash, put it in my
30:11
pocket, and go straight to the poker room. I'd
30:14
play like in a 5 to 10 limit. Regenerate. I was
30:18
a degenerate pretty much. But I didn't lose.
30:20
But guess what? Your luck runs out. When you
30:23
start getting in debt, $10 ,000. Well, I would
30:27
come home after with $8 ,000. with $15 ,000 and
30:31
then I would pay my bill off and you would show
30:34
a $10 ,000 loss every month. And sky was the
30:37
limit for you. But when you lost, and I was just
30:40
working a regular job making $8 an hour, you
30:43
know, working at like a lumber city or a hardware
30:46
store out here as a kid going through college.
30:49
And then I got married. And yeah, it definitely
30:52
made an impact on my life. But also I had to
30:57
learn. To quit completely. And I was also collecting
31:01
sports cards. And I quit sports cards. And I
31:04
quit everything at once. To try to get out of
31:07
debt. It took me five years to get out of debt.
31:11
For $10 ,000 back then. It's hard. That was back
31:15
then. Now these guys are just spending money.
31:17
This is why I speak out about it. Because I feel
31:22
that I had a problem back then. But then I never
31:25
bet. or they didn't have all these apps. It wasn't
31:29
so easy. I had a friend that was spending 20,
31:31
he would bet $25 a game in football. You got
31:35
14, 15 games every week. He was down like $5
31:38
,000 in like three months. Oh, and the way the
31:41
books work now is if you prove to them, you're
31:43
a winning player. Well, guess what? They either
31:45
cut you off or they, they really limit your play.
31:49
They're not trying to, they know who's the losers
31:51
and winners and the winners are rare, especially
31:53
at the sports book. And if you do it, if I gamble,
31:56
if I gamble a hundred dollars. But I do have,
31:59
I do want to go some, I do want, go ahead, go
32:01
ahead. I have something. No, no, you run on the
32:03
show, but I just wanted people to know that story
32:04
about me because a lot of people haven't heard
32:06
it before. But I mean, and this is why I speak
32:09
passionately about it. The problem I have, the
32:13
bit, and I, you know, I'm going to, I'm going
32:15
to, Alyx, I don't know if you like this, but
32:16
I think the marketing is, is one is you said
32:21
you were in advertising. So the marketing on
32:23
some of this stuff is disgusting. I'm a PR journalism
32:26
major. Some of this is so gross. And that's what
32:30
the people see. That's how it's marketed. That's
32:33
what you're seeing. And to me, Arena Club is
32:35
one of the culprits and there's many others.
32:38
It's just push. As you mentioned, shove down
32:40
our throat. And that's through content. That's
32:42
through the marketing. And I despise it. And
32:45
that's a lot of what inspires me is I really
32:48
despise the marketing, which then leads to people
32:51
finding you. But it's the marketing that helps
32:54
push this whole problem. Yeah. The problem is
32:58
there's no regulation on any of it, including
33:00
the marketing and advertising. So Arena Club
33:02
can send out these predatory emails and nobody's
33:05
going to be accountable. So I really quickly
33:08
guys want to address something because the chat
33:10
is going, you know, running rampant, obviously
33:13
with Geoff and we just did partner with market
33:16
movers. And so I want to answer a question that
33:18
somebody had asked earlier. I don't know who
33:21
asked this question. I just copied and pasted
33:23
it. But he said, Alyx, how much influence does
33:26
Geoff have on young collectors, especially with
33:29
the gambling -like side of ripping packs? Could
33:32
his content be pushing some kids toward unhealthy
33:35
habits in the hobby? And so that is a great question.
33:39
And the honest answer is yes. Yes. All right.
33:42
You are truthful then. I'm glad you said that.
33:44
Geoff absolutely has influence. This isn't just
33:48
about Geoff. This isn't just the Geoff. He's not
33:50
helping. Geoff is one of the most visible faces
33:52
in the hobby and young collectors absolutely
33:55
model what they see. So when a creator has that
33:59
kind of reach, their tone, their pacing and framing,
34:01
especially when ripping is presented as nonstop
34:05
excitement, the big hits, the emotional highs,
34:07
right? So for young collectors who are still
34:09
forming these habits, that can blur the line
34:12
between entertainment and behavior. to emulate,
34:16
right? So the chase, the suspense, the celebration
34:18
of the big pull, all of that can condition the
34:21
idea that more ripping equals more fulfillment.
34:26
That said, and this is the important part, zooming
34:29
out, this is really about the ecosystem, not
34:32
one individual. Geoff is operating inside a structure
34:35
that, that rewards society right now. The high
34:38
energy. Yeah, it absolutely is. But to give Geoff
34:42
a pass, I think it's a reflection of society.
34:46
So let me just finish. Geoff is operating in this,
34:49
in this system that rewards high energy, ripping
34:53
content, dramatic reactions, and constant openings.
34:58
Platforms, algorithms, breakers, the sponsors,
35:01
the marketplaces, they all benefit from making
35:05
ripping feel like the heartbeat of the hobby.
35:07
So while creators like Geoff do shape perception,
35:10
they also are a part of a much larger machine.
35:13
No, they are the machine. They are the fucking
35:16
machine. And emotional hooks. Geoff started it
35:19
five years ago. The real concern isn't, is Geoff
35:22
corrupting kids? It's what happens when the most
35:25
visible version of the hobby becomes. non -stop
35:28
high stakes ripping instead of intentional collecting.
35:31
Well, that's what it is now. That's what we're
35:33
looking at right now. We're in the thick of it.
35:35
Right. So that's where Collectors MD steps in.
35:38
We're not here to. I don't think Geoff does. I
35:41
mean, I think it's a great thing. I mean, if
35:43
you can get them to gear it back a little, like
35:45
you're down big shifter. Right. I mean, like,
35:48
at least like, look at what you're doing. Make
35:51
a plan. Does that provide extra money for you
35:53
to operate the business? Hopefully there's a
35:56
reason you did partner with them in order to
35:58
spread this bigger. Exactly. The biggest thing
36:02
here is that we're not here to... endorse or
36:05
villainize anyone especially creators or influencers
36:09
we're here to broaden the narrative to remind
36:12
people that collecting isn't just about the rip
36:14
it's about things like purpose connection pacing
36:17
sustainability and that's especially important
36:20
for these young impressionable people you don't
36:23
think all that content that's opposite of that
36:25
is a huge problem i mean let's not just say Geoff
36:28
there's a dozen other 50 other people doing this
36:31
to me that is press media content is very very
36:36
it's bigger than people understand it has a big
36:39
influence and so to me a lot of the problem is
36:42
how it's pushed because people have businesses
36:45
that they want those businesses to work and so
36:48
how do they do that at least Alyx has his foot
36:50
in the door and he has some eyeballs on it and
36:54
he what he is doing a great job and he is the
36:56
uh the warning sign on the side of cigarettes
36:59
instead make may cause cancer so Geoff is also
37:03
the first individual that I've spoken with in
37:07
the hobby as an industry leader who has said,
37:09
you know what? You're right. Everything you're
37:12
doing makes sense. Let's endorse this message
37:14
and layer it into our ecosystem. So if you can
37:17
bring me another car group influencer breaker
37:20
who is willing to put Rip responsibly on as a
37:24
disclaimer on their content. Is that what he's
37:27
actually going to do? Is that really going to
37:29
happen? Give me one sec. Well, you have it there.
37:32
I want to see it on everything. I don't buy it.
37:35
Maybe get in with Gio. Gio's a friend of the
37:38
show. Today, actually, these are samples, but
37:41
they're basically, I don't think you can see
37:43
it. Rip responsibly. So these are going to be
37:46
brake mats that are rolling out across the hobby
37:49
in the coming months. And they will be co -branded
37:52
with Cards HQ, amongst a few other shops that
37:55
we're rolling out this campaign with. But the
37:56
idea here is that you see 1 -800 -GAMBLER on
37:59
a gambling ad, right? They're not endorsing that
38:02
message. They're just acknowledging that there's
38:04
a problem and that they're there for people who
38:06
need the support. That's what Collectors MD is
38:08
to the hobby. So for those of you who are asking,
38:10
oh, is there a Collectors Anonymous or some sort
38:15
of recovery program or group for the hobby? Yes,
38:20
there is. It's called Collectors MD and we're
38:22
here to help you. Are you a doctor or do you
38:26
have doctors? No, we said he didn't have. Actually,
38:29
they partner with, I think there's like three
38:34
or four accredited doctors that are therapists
38:37
and that specialize in this kind of behavior.
38:40
Facilities as well. In the beginning of the conversation
38:43
before you guys join. Yeah. They're used as references
38:47
because, like Alyx said, he's not a registered
38:49
doctor. Neither am I, obviously. But there are
38:51
those. It just seems like on YouTube, everybody's
38:54
a doctor. Dr. Beckett, Dr. Carlos. Everyone's
38:57
an expert. Dr. that guy. So I don't know. Yeah,
39:00
I was hoping you'd have credentials, but it sounds
39:02
like you've done the right thing with partners
39:04
and some options for people to go to that can
39:07
help. I like the fact that you do have meetings.
39:10
Don't love that you partnered with SportsCard
39:12
HQ, but it'll get your brand out there, hopefully.
39:15
more well the hobby really needs you and you
39:18
know so i think that like me i'm always cynical
39:22
before i buy into anything but i mean the hobby
39:25
is really your boy Orlando you know Orlando he's
39:28
partnering with the car drug dealers it's it's
39:30
kind of the dirty business it's it's he's not
39:34
wrong but it helps endorse draft kings and fan
39:41
duel and the behavior that goes on mine i think
39:44
i like that though i mean everybody is doing
39:46
that everybody from the not everybody's um well
39:49
you go to like like watch dodger content and
39:52
you've got like five or six different yeah you
39:54
know uh People that are doing that and everybody
39:57
sponsored by Arena Club. I got to listen to all
40:00
their bullshit and, and a fan duel and the other
40:03
draft Kings. And then, I mean, you've got the
40:06
NBA. Look what's going on with gambling and the
40:11
sports clubs right now. There are class action
40:15
lawsuits that exist at the moment against the
40:18
hobby. We don't have anything to do with those
40:19
things. That's out of our jurisdiction. But there
40:22
are folks that if you wanted to, you could go
40:24
to your local legislator and file a complaint
40:27
about what Mike's talking about. Alyx, do you
40:29
think it could ever come? Because it took a long
40:31
time with cigarette companies, alcohol companies,
40:33
but there's no. Excuse me. We used to see those
40:36
advertisements all the time. Now, now we don't
40:38
gambling legally is somewhat new. I mean, six,
40:42
seven, eight years. So could we become to a point
40:44
at some point where, and I know sports cards
40:46
is not technically gambling, but let's just talk
40:48
gambling ads where maybe it gets banned. Maybe
40:50
they say, Hey, this isn't good for society. We'll
40:52
keep the legal gambling, but you can no longer
40:54
have all these gambling billboards ads on everything.
40:58
I've been talking to any and everybody in this
41:01
space for the last eight months about this. Yes,
41:04
those sort of things are absolutely at play.
41:08
And the hobby is in danger of major changes,
41:15
major adjustments from an outside governing body,
41:19
whether that be a gaming commission or an SEC
41:21
-like organization. What do you know? What do
41:23
you know? But we could change that. We can prevent
41:28
that. If we all collectively, proactively...
41:32
make this hobby a safer and more sustainable
41:34
place. But in order to do that, people have to
41:36
get on board. Enough with the trolling and the
41:39
keyboard warriors who just want their name to
41:41
be flashed on a live stream. That's all I want.
41:46
Someone else had a question I wanted to get to.
41:48
I apologize if I'm coming across as defensive
41:54
or abrasive. You've come across great, not informative,
41:56
nothing. We like to have a little fun. You're
41:59
more serious. It's not even a matter of being
42:01
serious. It's just a matter of fans. I'm very
42:04
passionate about this. I wouldn't have you on
42:06
if I didn't appreciate what you were doing. Yeah.
42:09
Like I said, I wouldn't be one of your first
42:11
subscribers, but, but also to like, I go on your
42:14
live streams. I put in chat in there. I mean,
42:17
I do it during my work day or whatever. I never,
42:19
I appreciate that. Here's the question. Isn't
42:22
the entire modern hobby design. Oh, sorry, Rhonda.
42:25
Hold on. Isn't the entire modern hobby designed.
42:27
hey now come on isn't the entire modern hobby
42:30
designed to create new addicts holy shit i'm
42:33
just gonna read it to you uh it doesn't help
42:35
when so many guys are feeling hopeless uh when
42:38
uh when upper upward mobility i don't know let
42:40
me just ask that isn't the entire modern hobby
42:43
design modern mind you designed to create new
42:46
addicts yeah it's engineered that way so that
42:49
the powers that be the the folks at the helm
42:52
can uh exploit and monetize in every which way
42:57
possible, which includes your wallet. So yeah,
43:01
that's exactly what it's designed to do. How
43:06
do you advise people that do want to be in sports
43:08
cards to stay in sports cards and not have it
43:10
be up? Do you advise against breaking? Do you
43:12
advise buying singles? We have two distinct lanes,
43:15
Jason. Collecting with intention, somebody like
43:17
Charles, who embodies that mantra. Somebody who...
43:21
Well, that's new to Charles. And then we have
43:24
another lane for abstinence, folks that just
43:26
can't have a healthy relationship with collecting
43:28
anymore, and they're just making an effort to
43:31
abstain completely. And we honor and respect
43:34
those names. Seriously, I think they need to
43:36
stop completely. But I understand this intentional
43:40
collecting first, and then if that doesn't work,
43:44
I mean... You got to just stop doing what isn't
43:47
working. I mean, it's really that simple. Whether
43:49
you say it's a disease or not. Now, my wife worked
43:52
for Malibu Passages. I'm sure you guys have all
43:55
heard of that. Don't know it. I don't know it.
43:57
Well, it was the biggest drug rehab facility
44:00
in California. And she worked there for 10 years.
44:04
She's, you know, it was a celebrity type place
44:07
here, 30 miles away from me here. The people,
44:11
they were just fucked in the head, those people.
44:13
But really, that's pretty much what he said is
44:15
like, you know, you have underlying conditions.
44:18
That's what it is. It's not so much a disease
44:21
or a, you know, an addiction. There's underlying
44:27
conditions for doing what you're doing. And I
44:31
think what's happening is this get -rich -quick
44:34
society is there's so many people. Young, younger
44:38
people, I think that just haven't hit their stride
44:42
yet. And they're almost hopeless. Yeah. They
44:45
see people, they see all this going on there
44:48
and they, they, they think I need to get that
44:51
big hit. I need to hit that million. It's not
44:53
a collection society for young men. It's a lottery.
44:57
It's a lottery ticket for them. I don't necessarily
45:00
blame them at their age, but us older people
45:03
have to talk. I mean, I don't know if they don't
45:05
have parents or what. They're lost at that age.
45:09
Or they don't listen. I think it's a listening
45:12
problem. The thing is, a lot of compulsive behavior
45:15
is being exacerbated by companies like Arena
45:18
Club that advertise and they focus on that kind
45:21
of stuff. And I admit, I'm compulsive about things.
45:24
Like you mentioned your poker boom in the 80s.
45:26
I played online poker. I played online poker
45:29
because you're getting scammed on that. I was
45:32
in there with Phil Hellman. Yes, you were. You
45:34
know, those guys, you know, poker stars, Full
45:37
Tilt. I actually got money from Full Tilt because
45:39
I was actually being cheated. Took a while. Yeah.
45:43
So I get that. I get that whole perspective,
45:46
too. So that's why I lean on Collectors MD and
45:50
the message I get across. you know it's yeah
45:54
i knew Market Movers would be one of those it's
45:56
like okay and Charles what's part of the problem
45:58
is not everyone's our age so if you imagine you're
46:00
18 20 21 it's harder to you found out you know
46:04
in five three six months whatever it's been you
46:07
saw through it pretty quickly but yeah that younger
46:10
generation is not seeing through it they're watching
46:13
because they they might have money like from
46:16
crypto or whatever so they got or no money at
46:19
all come on well they might have credit but they
46:21
might have a lot of different ways of obtaining
46:23
money and that kind of thing a lot easier than
46:25
it used to be like even 20 years ago when i was
46:27
in college or when Petty was in the 80s you know
46:30
cash was king in the 80s plastic started being
46:33
king back in 2005 and 6 when i was when i was
46:36
in the chat has a few more questions for Alyx
46:38
Charles where did you want to go because you've
46:40
been quiet for a minute where did you want to
46:42
go with it i was just going to say like i see
46:44
a lot of the People like Dan, you know, big boomer
46:47
energy, like, come on, man. You know, we don't,
46:49
I don't think we're even with Arena Club. We're
46:51
with Market Movers. We have a Card Ladders, one
46:54
of our partners too. So it's not just, you know,
46:57
singling them out. We're trying to work with
46:59
any of the people that a lot of folks use card
47:02
ladder to comp their prices out. You know, why
47:04
not help? Like, hey, so if you're collecting,
47:06
you're trying. It's also it's also who knows
47:09
what the right way to do here. Just a couple
47:12
of questions they had for. Where's another one?
47:15
Let's see. Alyx, do you think sports card companies
47:17
should put Gamp Gamp? Ronda Ronda. She's the
47:22
best. Let's see. Let me see. I have it. I could
47:26
read it if you want. Do you think sports car
47:27
companies should be put gambling -style warning
47:29
labels on their packs? Should breakers have gambling
47:32
warnings on their live breaks? Yeah, so this
47:37
is a really important question, and I think the
47:39
answer lives in the gray area. So do sports cards
47:45
equal gambling in the legal sense? No. Do modern
47:50
ripping and live breaking function like gambling?
47:54
like do so psychologically? Yes. So when you
47:58
look at what's happening on, on Whatnot and Fanatics
48:02
Live and social media breaker, live streams,
48:05
the, the countdown timers, the bid, bid, bid,
48:08
the sudden death spins, the mystery boxes. It's
48:12
just, it's hard to ignore the similarity to these
48:16
casino mechanics. Right. And so, well, because
48:20
it is. Yeah, because it is. So, yes, the gambling
48:24
style warning labels need to be somewhere. If
48:29
that means on packs, I don't know, because that,
48:34
you know, Fanatics and Panini and these other
48:38
companies that produce the product have the most
48:42
fleshed out legal teams you could possibly imagine.
48:47
They've gone through the ringer for decades now
48:49
over this, and they do put some sort of disclaimer
48:52
about odds on the packs. So that is definitely
48:55
an area that opposing parties have tried to fight
49:02
against for a long time. Again, that's out of
49:05
my jurisdiction. What we can do is put that responsible
49:08
messaging, the disclaimers, the warning signs
49:11
in strategic places that can reach the individuals
49:15
who are firsthand consuming the content or they
49:19
won't keep going. And that includes, yeah, that,
49:24
that includes breakers. So his other question
49:26
was, should breakers have gambling warnings on
49:27
their live breaks? And yes, that's exactly what
49:29
I just showed you with the rip responsibly a
49:32
card mat. We're also going to be doing card stands
49:34
and backdrops. At least they have somewhere to
49:40
turn or they can see a, or, you know, where it
49:43
drives the thought in their brain head. that,
49:47
hey, maybe I have a problem when it comes time
49:50
to pay in their next credit card bill. Another
49:53
question from, and I don't know if there's any
49:55
truth, is Dan Vintage Baseball. Did Collector
49:57
MB talk about his bankruptcy and giving his debtors
50:01
penny on the dollars? I don't know anything about
50:03
that story. I don't know if you want to go into
50:05
that story. Is there truth to that story? I have
50:06
no clue about any of that. Yeah, so this is something
50:09
I talk about on my podcast in our weekly meetings.
50:14
I, again, am a recovering gambling addict. I
50:17
just like I wear my heart on my sleeve. I talk
50:20
about this stuff. The reason why I'm doing what
50:22
I'm doing is because of my own lived experience,
50:25
my transgressions, my mistakes, the fallout that
50:29
was created from my actions. And so I'm paying
50:33
it forward now through what I'm doing. So anything
50:36
that I've experienced. What exactly happened?
50:41
What what what happened with that? I was in a
50:44
boatload of debt. Oh, you, your purse. Oh, so
50:47
you shared that story. This is a personal. Yeah.
50:49
I don't know how that person, you know, obviously
50:52
this is all public information. If somebody files
50:54
for bankruptcy, you can pull that up on Google,
50:57
but I had a gambling problem. It led to me having
51:00
to file for bankruptcy. I am 100 % that isn't
51:07
news to anybody in our community. Like, so again,
51:10
like there's nothing. about me or my past that
51:14
i don't already talk about is it a 12 -step program
51:17
yes we have a full -fledged recovery guide with
51:22
12 steps uh what are the first few steps can
51:27
i share my screen again yeah it'll be funny with
51:31
four of us let's see how that works all right
51:33
share this tab instead i have to let's see add
51:36
to stage okay This is our recovery guide, which
51:41
is adapted from the GA yellow book. And so the
51:46
12 steps are right here. Again, these are 12
51:50
steps rewritten for Collectors MD through this
51:53
recovery guide during every single weekly peer
51:56
support meeting. It's intended to be used as
51:59
a foundation for our recovery. And so number
52:02
one is we admitted that our spending or collecting
52:04
and taking control of our lives in ways we couldn't
52:06
ignore. We began to believe that with real support,
52:09
we could find peace again. We committed to asking
52:12
for help and opening ourselves up to community
52:14
-based recovery. I don't know if you want me
52:16
to read all 12, but... No, it's fucking hilarious.
52:19
I'm sorry. It's not a big 12 -step guy, but that
52:21
is that, hey, however you got to do it, man.
52:24
I hope you're doing good. You know, it seems
52:26
like you're doing good work. Is this kind of
52:28
stuff for you? Why don't you just tell these
52:29
fucking idiots, stop doing what isn't working.
52:32
I'm not even paying attention to the chat. I'm
52:34
sure everybody has an opinion. I've tried to
52:36
ask some of the questions. Doesn't it make sense?
52:39
Stop doing what isn't working? It's worked for
52:42
me. Stop buying brakes. Like I said, every time
52:47
things are not working for me, I look back to
52:51
that. I learned that in 1980. You know, my life
52:57
has been a roller coaster and I was bankrupt
53:00
myself in 1994 after a divorce. So I and I sold
53:04
I had baseball cards. My wife supported that.
53:07
I had sets from the 60s. And, you know, and I
53:11
was lucky enough to keep those. And it helped
53:14
me through my bankruptcy, actually. And, you
53:18
know, and. I never had never seeked any treatment
53:22
for my gambling addiction, but I stopped going
53:24
to Vegas. I paid my debt off. And then, then
53:28
once I have to stop, I mean, you have to stop.
53:31
Once you're divorced, you know, shit hits the
53:34
fan and a lot of people go bankrupt during it.
53:37
You know, anybody, anybody who is, you know,
53:40
thrown shade or making light of this serious
53:43
topic. Like, Oh yeah. I mean, it's all good.
53:46
More power to you. Like it's completely fine.
53:50
The fact of the matter is we are helping people.
53:52
And the other thing, you know, Alyx is that 10
53:55
years ago, prices weren't the same. So people
53:58
are losing bit, you know, it's rates. We're talking
54:00
about real money. You're not buying $150 box.
54:03
You're not buying a $20 break spot. People are
54:05
spending. The money aspect of it has gotten out
54:08
of control. It's a different beast today than
54:11
it was a decade ago. The prices of this stuff.
54:14
Gio asked the question, so is Geoff going to be
54:17
changing his messaging and including warnings
54:19
now also? My skeptical brain, Alyx, is I want
54:23
to see those mats actually being used. I'll believe
54:27
it when I see it. We're officially rolling out,
54:30
we're formally rolling out the campaign with
54:32
Cards HQ in December. It'll be used at the World
54:35
Series of Breaking next year. I mean, again,
54:41
like, it's not about clout. It's not about popularity.
54:44
No, I want to see them being used. That's all.
54:46
If you can get them to be used, that's great.
54:48
Blowing up my name or anything like that. It's
54:50
about, again, reaching the people that need the
54:52
help, reaching the masses. Yeah, if people see
54:56
it, I just want people to see it. I just want
54:59
people to see it. Do you guys want a quick preview
55:03
of the Cards HQ mat? Yeah, why not? Didn't we
55:06
already have it? That was just the Collectors
55:09
MD. That was with no logo. Not really. I don't
55:12
give a shit what they're doing. That'll take
55:13
two seconds. The thing is, the reason why it
55:16
works is because Cards HQ uses that. We'll see.
55:19
We'll see if it works. That's the thing. We'll
55:23
see. I also want to see it be used. And I also
55:26
think it's a great message. You're not doing
55:29
what you're doing. And it starts with someone
55:32
like Geoff and we need to get to others, you know,
55:34
like, you know, run good life and his breaks.
55:37
You know, if he gets a lot of people, he has
55:39
a lot of reach. So Gio, Gio, Gio's on board.
55:44
I already know because you know what, because
55:47
Gio is, you know, he's at least pragmatic and
55:50
practical about the whole situation. Sometimes
55:54
when it fits his narrative. Sometimes. He makes
55:57
a good living off it. Sports card nonsense. We're
56:01
going to be working with them, too. All right.
56:03
Well, there you go. You're going to go with all
56:08
as he's joining the Gio. Chris and I have been
56:11
in touch and we're talking about doing some great
56:13
things together. Gio's in touch with everybody.
56:17
Gio's going to sell it as soon as he gets another
56:19
million. um yeah we're we're gonna they i didn't
56:24
know this until recently but sports card nonsense
56:26
has the uh licensing for si collectibles and
56:30
so we're talking about a potential partnership
56:32
there to just continue to roll out more content
56:34
it's the right man it's a better message than
56:38
what they're pushing out now so that's good that's
56:40
good is there anything you want you know you've
56:42
been going we'll be almost an hour here uh i
56:45
can stay stay on as long as you want Jason uh
56:48
So you tell me, you know, my last question here
56:51
is how do you compete with already established
56:53
medical community avenues? I mean, there's your
56:56
competition and I know you're focused on just
56:58
cards, but there's Gamblers Anonymous. There's
57:01
there's other things, you know, there's psychiatrists,
57:03
there's therapists. We exist in a completely
57:05
white space. There's nobody else doing what Collectors
57:08
MD is doing to support this gray area of. compulsive
57:12
collecting and overspending and again it's bigger
57:15
than just cards yeah what do you get outside
57:18
of cards what do you yeah so boo boo Charles
57:21
knows we have people that are addicted to art
57:23
we have people that are addicted to sneakers
57:25
we have people that are addicted to nfts and
57:28
gaming and gotcha games and loot boxes and crap
57:31
like that it okay so are you reaching out to
57:35
other audiences besides cards yeah it's a it's
57:38
a corner it's a cacophony of different people
57:40
that come out you know, when different avenues,
57:42
like, like he said, sneaker, you know, collecting
57:45
sneakers is a big thing. Like, how do they find
57:47
you? Are you on? I was immersed in the sneaker
57:50
community for 12 years, 12 plus years at one
57:55
point had over 500 pairs of sneakers. I mean,
57:57
it was out of control. I had a problem back then.
58:01
And then it manifested itself and became gambling.
58:04
And then it became, you know, the hobby and breaking.
58:08
I had an addictive personality. I'm, like I said,
58:11
a lifelong recovering addict. I think a lot of
58:13
us do. I've embraced that it's a lifelong commitment.
58:16
And so I've devoted my life to this space. And
58:19
it's not just Collectors MD. I also work at a
58:22
local facility called Right Choice Recovery where
58:24
I lead group meetings for gambling addiction
58:26
on Monday and Tuesday nights. Is this all your
58:29
full -time job or do you also have a job? This
58:32
is my full -time. Hey, good for you. Well, you
58:35
need to smile a little more. Ryan mentioned,
58:37
is there any real data? Any reason why these
58:41
prices are so high? Is that why the hobby's inflated?
58:43
And Ryan, we're not going to answer that now,
58:45
but I think it's the right questions. Rhonda,
58:47
I'm going to try to throw it up for just 30 seconds
58:49
or 20 seconds, but I do think it's the right
58:51
question to ask. Ryan, try one more time. If
58:53
not, so be it. But anyways, I've kind of asked
58:58
all my questions, Alyx. Is there any? avenue
59:01
we didn't go down or we didn't hit that you you
59:04
think's important or you want to share well i
59:07
mean i can answer the question regarding the
59:08
data real quick if he wants well that's it's
59:11
all it's not i don't think there's one answer
59:14
every i've done enough that we talk about this
59:16
every day there isn't there isn't one answer
59:18
you can give us your take you want to stick around
59:20
while i tell you a little bit about showbiz Yeah,
59:23
I just did a piece. So we publish these daily
59:27
reflections every single day, which is basically
59:29
a journal about what's going on in the hobby
59:32
and what we're what we're experiencing. Charles
59:35
has contributed to a handful of them. And so
59:38
we did a piece this week about what's going on
59:42
with the whole shill bidding scandal and saga.
59:46
I think yesterday or the day before. So, yeah,
59:49
it's that's not that's not kosher. So, Petty,
59:52
where did you want to go with that? I wanted
59:55
to talk. The reason I called in an hour ago is
59:58
because I wanted to kind of teach the room a
1:00:00
little bit about how the shill bidding. Dan and
1:00:03
Charles, do you want to stay here for this? Okay.
1:00:07
I have two videos about the shill bidding. Charles
1:00:10
wants to stay here. Charles wants to push. He
1:00:12
wants that exposure for his channel. I know.
1:00:14
I'm going. That's fine. We'll leave it at that.
1:00:17
You called me. So, yes, let me go check out his
1:00:21
channel. Go ahead, Mike. Stick around, Alyx.
1:00:25
I'm going to tell you a little bit about how
1:00:26
just this show. I'm not going anywhere, Mike.
1:00:28
Don't worry. All right, man. We love you. All
1:00:30
right. So July of last year. Real quick, real
1:00:33
quick, real quick before you start. Goading365
1:00:36
just said something, and this is something I
1:00:38
wanted to address. He said Alyx is going to try
1:00:40
to charge $9 .99 a month for his health. No,
1:00:43
we are never, ever, ever going to charge any
1:00:46
of our members for our service. It is 100 percent,
1:00:50
no strings attached, completely free. You have
1:00:53
access to our meetings, our support, our tools
1:00:56
and resources, our educational content. Everything
1:00:59
is free and it will always stay that way. You
1:01:02
have my word. We will never exploit people who
1:01:05
are going through the thick of it from a financial,
1:01:07
mental and emotional standpoint for their money.
1:01:10
You have my word. From the bottom of my heart,
1:01:12
that will never happen. Good. I'll put it to
1:01:16
you this way. I want Petty's rant. I want Petty's
1:01:19
rant. Go ahead, Charles. I'll give you one better.
1:01:21
If that ever happens, you'll never see me in
1:01:25
Collectors MD again, and I will come out and
1:01:26
have a video of that live. I love what you guys
1:01:30
are doing, and you're passionate about it, and
1:01:32
you've already lived it. I feel like I could
1:01:37
do the same thing if I had a passion for that.
1:01:40
I've tried to help people by just being a complete
1:01:42
dick, pretty much, of this hobby and being a
1:01:46
lightning rod, you know, for a lot of people.
1:01:49
And I only do this to support other people's
1:01:52
channels, to be honest with you. I don't have
1:01:54
my own channel. I don't care to monetize. I don't
1:01:57
give a shit. No, Penny, I want to get to that
1:01:58
rant. Okay, here's the rant. Thank you, KK, for
1:02:02
saying that. Do you get any grant money? Do you
1:02:04
get any sort of help money? No, we're not set
1:02:06
up as a nonprofit to answer that question. All
1:02:08
right. Petty, let's hear this rant. Here we go.
1:02:11
So everybody knows about Shillstein. For 20 years,
1:02:16
he's been doing this. It's much the same way
1:02:20
as what PWCC did, okay? And you have a group
1:02:24
of card doctors that work around the clock buying
1:02:28
cards and shilling them on these third -party
1:02:32
sites. So you had PWCC, which was an eBay company.
1:02:37
or selling on eBay. You had Probstein on eBay.
1:02:41
And that's the way it worked originally. The
1:02:45
card doctors, 10, 15 of these assholes, you're
1:02:49
starting to see a lot of them now. The Kuntzes,
1:02:51
the Craigs, the Scissorhands Mosiers. The best
1:02:56
friends. The list goes on and on. The original
1:02:58
of all this. Well, the originator was... of shill
1:03:03
bidding was Mastro, but shill bidding was a fraction
1:03:07
of what you would see. It was the, it was the
1:03:10
trimming and then the shilling. And then they
1:03:14
send it to PSA after the trimming, get a higher
1:03:17
grade from a three to a seven. They'd increase
1:03:20
a $50 card to a, to a $3 ,000 card. And that
1:03:25
was just commonplace for these guys. They all,
1:03:28
and Shillstein was in on this. Okay. So. I knew
1:03:32
about Shillstein and basically just wrote him
1:03:35
off. I tried to block him on eBay as far as like
1:03:38
a seller, but at some point I couldn't figure
1:03:42
out how to do it. It was just too difficult.
1:03:43
They make it really hard on eBay to try to do
1:03:46
that. So in July of last year, 2024, these Home
1:03:53
Run Derby cards come up. There's 10 of them on
1:03:55
Probe Scene. They look like this. and these cards
1:04:00
were very hard to find, okay? They're really
1:04:03
pretty rare. Shillstein happens to have 10 of them.
1:04:08
Maze, the Mantle, you know, all the Hall of Famers,
1:04:12
the cards I wanted. Everybody's at the National.
1:04:15
I think, I'm going to win these cards. I go in
1:04:17
there, and I know, Charles, you don't really
1:04:19
understand the way these snipe bids work, but
1:04:21
there's programs like Gixxin and... And another
1:04:26
one I use. Carlstein actually said this on Sports
1:04:30
Car Dad interview that he used a software to
1:04:33
snipe bids. Well, he shouldn't be using it. That
1:04:37
is for collectors like us to use, all right?
1:04:40
So we use those to put the last 10 -second bid
1:04:43
in. You put your highest bid, 10 seconds. That's
1:04:45
why it goes up from 1 ,000 to 3 ,000 at the end
1:04:49
or whatever happens. You have five guys that
1:04:51
are, you know, bidding. But my point is, is this
1:04:56
Willie Mays card that I showed you here, right?
1:04:58
There was a comp, a PSA 5 for $4 ,750 in 2022.
1:05:07
There was a comp for $4 ,050 in 2023. So that
1:05:13
went down $700. So now I'm putting my snipe bid
1:05:18
in and my highest bid in. On that day, on July
1:05:22
15th, I see, it was like $58 .50 was my highest
1:05:27
bid. Now, why should I have to bid $58 .50? Now,
1:05:31
keep in mind, there's a PSA 5 for a buy it now
1:05:34
for $7 ,000, okay? So I could click in and buy
1:05:39
that for $7 ,000 anytime. And I know the guy.
1:05:42
And I know he wanted $6 ,000 for it. But I wasn't
1:05:45
going to pay that, even off of eBay. So I put
1:05:48
this number in. This is just on this particular
1:05:51
one card. Keep in mind, there's 10 other cards.
1:05:53
Ernie Banks, Tommy Killebrew, all these cards
1:05:56
haven't been up for years. You see these once
1:06:00
a year at that. So now, it's the shit hits the
1:06:04
fan. This particular card went for $58 .90, okay?
1:06:10
And I'm second place bidder. I go and I look
1:06:13
at all the other bids that I placed. Every other
1:06:17
card except for one I lost, I was the second
1:06:20
place bidder. You go and look at the guy who
1:06:23
won, he had 47 feedback. Okay? So now, keep in
1:06:30
mind, that 47 feedback, he won everything except
1:06:34
for this. I won this one for $3 ,200, the Mickey
1:06:38
Mantle. This was the prize, but I also got, you
1:06:42
know. Ripped off on this one. Explain to me real
1:06:47
quick just basically exactly he was just outbidding
1:06:50
you up? I got outbid at the end for $5 ,800 on
1:06:55
this card, okay? Now, two weeks later, so I get
1:07:01
the mantle. I win the mantle. Two weeks later,
1:07:05
every one of these fucking cards come up for
1:07:07
auction again, including this one. So now I know
1:07:11
that this shit is shill bid. And I've known for
1:07:14
years that Probstein is a shill bidder. But as
1:07:16
a collector, I'm a fucking idiot. You know, here
1:07:20
it is. They always say, cards trump all. I wanted
1:07:23
the goddamn cards. It's simple as that. I blame
1:07:26
myself mostly. So the next auction comes up.
1:07:31
This goes off. I put my same bid in there. And
1:07:35
would you believe that guy with the 47 feedback?
1:07:37
You would think after he reneged on all those
1:07:40
fucking cards, Probstein would cut him off, right?
1:07:44
He's right in there bidding again. All day, every
1:07:48
day. This is what Schillstein does. This is the
1:07:51
fucking Schillstein guy. That's how he got his
1:07:54
name Schillstein. By me. Because I love nicknames.
1:07:57
So I win the card. for $5 ,000. The third bid
1:08:05
is $3 ,500. I got fucked for $1 ,500 on this
1:08:11
card. Now, that other card, that PSA 5 that was
1:08:15
$7 ,000, in three days, that card was sold for
1:08:19
$6 ,000. That was up for a fucking year on eBay.
1:08:26
What happened is that increased the price of
1:08:29
these home run derby cards immensely. So as they
1:08:32
were trending down, all of a sudden, Probstein
1:08:35
caused this card and all these cards to go up.
1:08:40
And then after that, this guy, the guy that bought
1:08:46
the card for six grand. Before he got the fucking
1:08:49
card, the guy is called Sports and Comics or
1:08:52
something. He loves doing that. Shows a picture
1:08:54
of the card with his kitchen table. I don't know
1:08:57
what kind of background he has, but before he
1:08:59
even has the card, he puts it up for $8 ,000.
1:09:05
And finally, after the next sale goes up and
1:09:09
this card goes up, he sells it a year later for
1:09:12
$7 ,000. So it increased. The price of this Mickey
1:09:16
Mantle card for a PSA from what should have been
1:09:22
like a $4 ,000 card to $7 ,000. And these cards
1:09:26
have never seen bottom since. I sold a PSA 2
1:09:30
or a PSA 2 sold for $4 ,000 on the next sale.
1:09:35
So this is the way that this fucking asshole
1:09:39
has had his stupid yarmulke. in the hobby. What
1:09:43
pisses me off is this motherfucker wears that
1:09:46
yarmulke. I'm Jewish. My mother was Jewish. I'm
1:09:50
Jewish, too. The only time I ever wore a yarmulke
1:09:56
was at my grandparents' and my mother's funeral.
1:09:58
I take it responsibly. That guy goes everywhere
1:10:04
he goes. He wears that fucking yarmulke. He's
1:10:07
a goddamn disgrace to the Jews. Because he steals
1:10:12
all day and prays all fucking night. That's why.
1:10:15
So you think it's a PR move? You think that he
1:10:19
wears it to look like an honorable person? Absolutely.
1:10:23
And I'm sure he prays and I'm sure he eats kosher
1:10:27
and he's whatever the hell, he's acidic or whatever
1:10:30
the fuck. But my dealings with that guy have
1:10:32
been nothing but shady. $925 million. $925 million
1:10:38
over 21 years. And again, I told people on Net54
1:10:45
seven, eight years ago that this hobby was a
1:10:48
billion -dollar fraud, and they fucking laughed
1:10:51
me off the fucking network. I had to come up.
1:10:54
And now you can see that just this one guy is
1:10:57
a fucking billion dollar. If you don't think
1:10:59
this is multi -fucking billions, you're out of
1:11:02
your mind. And that's the reason that I'm here
1:11:04
on sports cards, Professor Sports Cards. That's
1:11:08
the reason I'm on eBay. Do I love the hobby?
1:11:11
Hell yeah. I love the cards. But again, people
1:11:17
need to know that this shit is happening. And
1:11:21
you've got kids like this Pokemon guy that came
1:11:24
out. He's got 50, he did 500 grand worth of business
1:11:27
with Shillstein last year. And then he goes on
1:11:30
to, then the Shillstein guy, he goes and makes
1:11:33
his own site. What did you expect to happen?
1:11:38
You knew he was going to show that shit up. I
1:11:41
didn't think it would come out that he would
1:11:43
fail that miserably, but he is just a stupid
1:11:45
idiot. He's an arrogant fuck. And I, I, he should
1:11:49
go straight to fucking hell. He went on sports
1:11:52
car dad, at least four or five times and just
1:11:54
flat out. You have to remember Dustin doesn't
1:11:58
know shit. Okay. He came out. I love the guy,
1:12:01
but I can't watch his shit anymore. And I didn't
1:12:04
even see Shillstein call himself Shillstein. which
1:12:07
I thought was pretty funny because it was a compliment
1:12:11
that he at least has seen me, but, but Dustin
1:12:14
bless his heart. He just wants to be like Geoff
1:12:17
Wilson. He, you know, he really, he's take sponsorships
1:12:22
and he does a lot of shady shit. He hasn't gotten
1:12:26
to bed with too many bad people, but he doesn't
1:12:28
know any different. And then you want to talk
1:12:33
about Beckett for a moment. Let's just take a
1:12:35
look at these hobby friends and the blockchain
1:12:38
that goes across with these assholes, okay? So
1:12:41
you have Beckett comes out and just flips. He's
1:12:45
not a shill bitter, so let's just get that straight.
1:12:48
Oh, I don't know. He was way overbidding. He's
1:12:51
bidding on his own cards. It sounds like he's
1:12:54
okay with bidding on his own cards. And something
1:12:57
like that you're talking about is just like a
1:13:00
little speck, you know? He was too open with
1:13:03
it. Well, the way he was talking to P. Ryan,
1:13:07
okay, was just offensive because they're talking
1:13:11
like it's a good old boy network. How do you
1:13:14
even know that fucking loser? Because P. Ryan's
1:13:18
got more money than God. I give $500 to charity.
1:13:22
I pay the fucking money. He gives $50 ,000. So
1:13:26
that's his economic level compared to mine. He
1:13:31
doesn't pay his $50 ,000. I give my time to charity.
1:13:34
That's my economic level. That's better than
1:13:36
nothing because everybody's got to start somewhere.
1:13:39
But again, I just find that that blockchain from
1:13:44
Beckett is trying to like sell his story. My
1:13:49
friend Mastro. Mastro was the fucking beginning
1:13:53
of this shit. My friend Shillstein. He's, again,
1:13:57
another fucking asshole. My friend Patrick. If
1:14:01
you think that's the first time that guy shilled
1:14:03
that shit. I think you said his friend was Mastro.
1:14:06
Because this is what the hobby does. They use
1:14:08
these fourth -party companies to, you know, to
1:14:14
shill their shit up. They have them shill their
1:14:16
shit up. This is the way it's been working. They
1:14:19
let... People either bid their own stuff or they
1:14:23
had their employees do it. Mastro had an FBI
1:14:27
knock on his door and served 20 months in club
1:14:29
bed. That's how bad Mastro was. You know what?
1:14:33
The thing is, he had so many fucking charges
1:14:35
on him. He only pleaded to show bidding, which
1:14:37
was the easiest out for him. And so whether that
1:14:43
was the worst thing that he did, no. Probably
1:14:45
not. To catch somebody in the showbiz scheme
1:14:49
these days, it's not going to happen. He apparently
1:14:52
got a 2306 card and sold it to Wayne Gretzky,
1:14:55
and then it got resold for $2 .8 million. Yeah,
1:14:58
but you know what? But the owner of that card,
1:15:00
he doesn't care. That's part of the charm of
1:15:03
the company. And that was PSA's first card. It
1:15:06
was sold on a, you know, as a PSA 8. It's a trimmed
1:15:11
card. So it doesn't say trimmed. It didn't say
1:15:16
authentic. And here you go. This was the beginning
1:15:20
of PSA. And Bruce McNall, shortly after that,
1:15:23
found himself in jail because he was a fucking
1:15:25
scammer too. So all these guys are just into
1:15:29
it. And then you get this P. Ryan, and he leads
1:15:32
to Geoff Wilson. And who does Beckett go on with?
1:15:35
Geoff fucking Wilson. These guys are just fucking
1:15:39
idiots from the word go. And I'm just so sick
1:15:42
of these guys. You can't even believe it, how
1:15:45
they are fucking up the hobby. Amen! Other than
1:15:49
that, I love the cards. I love the hobby. I'm
1:15:53
not going to allow myself to get shill bid anymore.
1:15:56
Good. But, you know, I know it's part of the
1:16:00
deal. We all know it's part of the deal. It's
1:16:02
not going to stop. It's going to continue. And
1:16:05
all this price manipulation, you have all these
1:16:08
companies like Card Ladder, VCP, and bowel movement
1:16:12
movers that are basically, you know, it's just
1:16:16
fake data. Okay. So real good. Not to pivot,
1:16:22
but Dan's on a mission right now. Dan's vintage.
1:16:24
So he mentioned, you know, he really wanted to
1:16:28
show this and that in this statement, it says,
1:16:30
I'm sure you'll have a good answer, Alyx, if
1:16:32
you're able to donating help fund out our research
1:16:34
infrastructure, blah, blah, blah. So what would
1:16:36
you answer back to Dan? Cause you seem to, to
1:16:38
yeah, go ahead. You seem to be transparent. Yeah,
1:16:41
of course. 100 % transparent from day one. We
1:16:44
have never taken a single donation at Collectors MD.
1:16:48
If we did, you would know it. This was on the
1:16:51
website for the first couple months before we
1:16:56
filed as an LLC. We were exploring going in multiple
1:17:01
directions, whether it be nonprofit or the LLC
1:17:05
route. it was just to are you comfortable sharing
1:17:11
why you went LLC i'm not no judge there's reasons
1:17:14
why you pick one or the other are you comfortable
1:17:16
sharing why you didn't end up going that way
1:17:18
versus uh the other way yeah i i could definitely
1:17:23
expand on that um but i just really want to quickly
1:17:27
finish my thought on yeah sorry about that go
1:17:30
ahead yeah so uh Dan was insist i mean he was
1:17:34
just on a mission like you said uh claiming that
1:17:37
we had a donation button of some sort or like
1:17:40
maybe like a patreon or something of that nature
1:17:43
and that never existed and he said it it was
1:17:46
on the site for um at least a year our website
1:17:49
didn't launch until march of this year so i mean
1:17:52
people look at the end of the day people want
1:17:54
to throw shade they want to prove themselves
1:17:56
right they want to well the other you know it's
1:17:59
it's a it's a shady business people are doing
1:18:01
shady stuff so it you know you really have to
1:18:04
work hard to make sure you stay a good name yeah
1:18:07
so real quick on the uh LLC topic so we structured
1:18:12
Collectors MD as an LLC because it reflects the
1:18:14
reality of what this is becoming You know, it's
1:18:18
not just a passion project or an awareness movement
1:18:21
where it's like, you know, a part time gig of
1:18:24
some sort. We're building a sustainable organization
1:18:27
built to operate, partner, protect people and
1:18:31
grow responsibly. And so going LLC gives us that
1:18:34
sense of legitimacy and infrastructure. it allows
1:18:37
us to form formal partnerships with treatment
1:18:40
centers and coalitions and platforms and brands
1:18:43
and it allows us to do a lot of a lot of other
1:18:46
things you know we can develop programs we can
1:18:48
license educational content we can secure funding
1:18:52
if needed and create long -term support systems
1:18:55
without being limited by informal structure right
1:18:58
and it also protects the mission legally and
1:19:01
operationally so this work isn't dependent on
1:19:04
just one person or treated like a side project
1:19:06
so um another thing that comes up a lot is like
1:19:10
god forbid i make any money you know doing what
1:19:14
i do as a full -time job right Do doctors make
1:19:19
money? Do therapists make money? Does any sort
1:19:22
of service that offers. No, but just being transparent,
1:19:25
you know, people don't want to think you're taking.
1:19:26
I don't think you got to. I mean, the most important
1:19:29
thing that people need to understand is that
1:19:34
we're not taking donations. We've never taken
1:19:36
a donation. We're never going to charge our members
1:19:38
for the service. Any revenue would come through
1:19:41
partnerships, potential advertising, merchandising,
1:19:46
like the RIP responsibly, Matt, I showed you,
1:19:49
things like that. We will never be in a position
1:19:52
where we're exploiting people for their mental
1:19:56
health and financial shortcomings. It's just
1:19:59
not going to happen. I'm more than happy to continue
1:20:03
this conversation. Dan seems to be a really vocal
1:20:06
guy. He's saying he's dealt with guys like this
1:20:08
his entire career. So he's clearly putting me
1:20:11
in a bucket with other people. Like, look, you
1:20:15
could talk all you want. It's not going to change
1:20:18
what we're doing. We're going to continue to
1:20:20
power forward and we're going to help as many
1:20:24
people as humanly possible. If you have a problem
1:20:27
with this helping people, then God help you.
1:20:32
Alyx, personally, between me and you, I really
1:20:35
don't care what you're doing, but if you can
1:20:37
help one person. Dan's skeptical it's a money
1:20:41
grab. Yes, it's not a money grab. And I'm putting
1:20:46
words in Dan's mouth. I don't know that for sure,
1:20:48
but that's my take. That would be what I guess.
1:20:50
Yeah, I mean, look, people can think what they
1:20:52
want. You're never going to make everybody happy
1:20:55
no matter what you do. Of course not. You're
1:20:57
never going to have... fans everywhere you go.
1:21:00
But at the end of the day, we can't make a change.
1:21:03
We can't shift culture. We can't help people
1:21:05
by standing on the sidelines. So we will be at
1:21:08
the center of the conversation any opportunity
1:21:10
we have to continue spreading the message. If
1:21:13
that means Professor Sports Cards invites me
1:21:16
to be on his podcast and there's going to be
1:21:17
haters in the chat throwing shade, I welcome
1:21:21
it. It's a little different than Jeremy Lee,
1:21:23
right? It's a little different than Jeremy Lee.
1:21:27
But whatever. I mean, just keep doing what you're
1:21:30
doing and see. And just to throw something at
1:21:33
Alyx, you know, Orlando's a respected guy. Dan's
1:21:36
a respected guy. Orlando's the mayor. Collector's
1:21:43
dream. You know, and these two guys, they're
1:21:47
older than us. They have more experience than
1:21:49
us. They've been in the hobby for 50 years or
1:21:51
more. It's at least good to take their both heads.
1:21:54
They both say, you know, maybe stay away from
1:21:57
some of those taking the drug dealer money or
1:21:59
the car dealer money. But that's just something
1:22:02
I'm only throwing at what they're saying. And
1:22:04
I respect both those guys a lot. I see the young
1:22:07
people struggling, seeing people losing their
1:22:10
lives or losing their livelihoods, I should say.
1:22:14
Like Charles said earlier, looking at divorce,
1:22:16
looking at potentially losing custody of their
1:22:18
children. Well, my friend Jamie gives advice
1:22:21
to me. My advice is just don't ever change your
1:22:23
message. Don't ever change what you're doing.
1:22:25
If you want to partner with those, okay. But
1:22:28
you really have to be adamant, transparent. And
1:22:30
the biggest takeaway I got from tonight, and
1:22:32
we'll go another minute or two. I want to finish
1:22:34
with voicemails. I think the 12 -step program
1:22:38
is okay, but I think your actual meetings where
1:22:41
people can go and hear others and be open and
1:22:44
be vulnerable, that's priceless. That's a very
1:22:48
good thing. I would like to join one just to
1:22:52
be a fly on the wall, just to hear what actually
1:22:54
gets said in those meetings. Absolutely. I was
1:22:59
a three -bird -a -day pussycat until I found
1:23:02
GA or BA to help you. Rick, I'm not immersed
1:23:07
in this space. I don't join live streams or spend
1:23:11
my Thanksgiving eves on... I'm just kidding.
1:23:14
But in all seriousness, I respect everybody.
1:23:18
Good opinion, bad opinion. Gentlemen, let's give
1:23:21
closing thoughts for the three of you. We went
1:23:24
through a lot. This was nice. This was good.
1:23:26
Let's have Charles go first, and then we'll Gio
1:23:29
and Alyx, and we'll sum it up. I wouldn't hitch
1:23:33
my wagon to somebody like Alyx or Collectors
1:23:36
MD if I thought there was anything shady going
1:23:38
on. That's the last thing I want to be a part
1:23:40
of is something. One more thing is shady in the
1:23:42
hobby. I don't get that. Well said. Charles,
1:23:46
thank you for calling in tonight. Petty, what
1:23:48
do you got? I just want to say I wish you all
1:23:50
the best. You're fighting a tough battle, and
1:23:53
you've got a really tough battle ahead of you.
1:23:56
And if you could just help one person, I'm sure
1:23:58
you'd consider yourself successful. And that's
1:24:01
all I've tried to do by talking the shit I do
1:24:04
about people. I don't care who likes me, who
1:24:07
hates me. I simply love the cards. I've met some
1:24:11
great people along the way in the last couple
1:24:13
of years, and that's what I'm going to take away
1:24:16
from it. Am I going to slow down? I've got my,
1:24:19
you know, I love my collection. It is with a
1:24:22
purpose. It's not the same way I collected when
1:24:24
I was addicted, maybe, or when I was a younger
1:24:29
man, when I maybe didn't have the money, you
1:24:32
know? So I didn't, I quit until. I started making
1:24:36
a little bit more money. I had my house paid
1:24:38
off. I was a little bit more mature in my collecting,
1:24:41
you know? And I, and I think that's why somehow
1:24:44
it's, I do respect a lot of you younger guys
1:24:47
or guys in your forties or, or even in the thirties
1:24:50
or, you know, that are pulling this off because
1:24:54
you're a much better man than I was because I
1:24:57
never could do that. You know, I really didn't
1:24:59
find, I didn't really find my success or my wheels.
1:25:03
until my forties, you know, and I wouldn't even
1:25:06
think of cards until, you know, I was in my fifties
1:25:09
and established. It's an established and I had
1:25:12
all my, and I had all my debt paid off and, you
1:25:15
know, that's really, that's really where it was
1:25:17
at. I, you know, I paid my house off in 14 years,
1:25:20
credit cards, bought cars for cash. And then
1:25:24
they, you know, my retirement was funded my asset
1:25:30
my you know all this shit goes what Alyx was
1:25:33
trying to do is there's so many people not in
1:25:35
that situation playing these games Alyx how did
1:25:39
you want to to finish up yeah i have a few thoughts
1:25:43
the first is to your point Jason if i could save
1:25:49
just one person i would combat i would go against
1:25:54
a hundred Dan's and Orlando's a night if I had
1:25:59
to and I truly mean that I will I respect those
1:26:03
two guys a lot I respect those two guys like
1:26:08
you have no like there are others I'm sure they're
1:26:10
I'm sure they're great people and they are probably
1:26:13
have you know, wonderful content, put out wonderful
1:26:17
content. And it's good to listen to, you know,
1:26:19
guys have more good men. I get it. People are
1:26:26
going to be jaded. They're going to be skeptical.
1:26:29
They're going to think we live in a society.
1:26:31
We live in a world now where every, any and everything
1:26:33
needs to be sort of put through a filter or a
1:26:38
strainer, if you will, because there's so much.
1:26:43
malicious intent and bad actors that are going
1:26:48
around. So we have to be careful. Well, I hate
1:26:51
every new company that comes out. I hate them.
1:26:54
So this hobby in particular, especially if a
1:26:57
new voice or a new brand comes into the fold
1:27:01
and starts making noise and partnering with the
1:27:03
Geoff Wilsons of the world, there's going to be
1:27:05
some sort of... some version of an upheaval or
1:27:09
people just expressing their frustration. But
1:27:12
you have no, in the long run, you'll prove it
1:27:15
wrong. It's all good. Like it comes with the
1:27:18
territory and I totally get and respect that.
1:27:20
And you just continue doing what makes you happy.
1:27:22
To people like Dan and Orlando and Cartel and
1:27:26
all of these naysayers that just are throwing
1:27:28
shade. I love it. Keep bringing it. We're here
1:27:32
to stay. We're not going anywhere. So we can
1:27:35
continue to. have these conversations. I'm not
1:27:38
speaking for those guys, but I can tell you that
1:27:40
I know that they want what's best for the hobby
1:27:45
in general. And if you can help, and let's see
1:27:50
what happens in a year or two, just keep doing
1:27:51
what you're doing. Most importantly, work on
1:27:54
yourself. And that's a lifelong struggle, what
1:27:56
you're going through. And you can help others.
1:27:59
It makes a big impact on you as well. And you
1:28:03
need to make a living. I've always said that
1:28:05
profit is not a dirty word. I've made profit
1:28:09
on, you know. Yeah, but it depends how you're
1:28:11
making the profit. That's all. And I'm not accusing
1:28:14
Alyx of anything, but some of the guys are. No,
1:28:16
no, no, it doesn't. Absolutely. But you know
1:28:19
what? I mean, it's not a dirty word. Mike, if
1:28:23
electors MD went away today and we cease to exist,
1:28:26
there are so many people that we already reach.
1:28:30
That's great. When is your next meeting? When's
1:28:38
your next meeting? Our next meeting will be next
1:28:40
Wednesday, December 3rd at 8 PM. Eastern. All
1:28:43
right. Well, Oh shit. We actually, we actually
1:28:45
have two meetings. Now we partnered with a coalition
1:28:49
in Colorado called PGCC, the problem gambling
1:28:52
coalition of Colorado. They've rolled out the
1:28:54
first official franchised version of collectors
1:28:56
MD called. Oh, It's called Unbox Powered by Collectors MD.
1:29:01
They've been hosting those meetings now for almost
1:29:04
two months. They're every Thursday at 7 p .m.
1:29:07
Eastern, and they're just as effective. I joined
1:29:09
them myself. So the reason you are partnering
1:29:14
with some of these companies is because you're
1:29:15
not taking in any money from the people calling
1:29:17
in or doing the program, so you have to support
1:29:19
the business somehow. Right. We're partnering
1:29:22
with state coalitions. We're offering consulting
1:29:25
and advising to... these organizations that really
1:29:29
only know traditional gambling, all of the nuances
1:29:33
within the hobby and how there's so many gambling
1:29:35
like mechanics and overlap. And so, you know,
1:29:39
we're basically franchising collectors, MD offering
1:29:42
the branding, the IP, but most more importantly,
1:29:45
the curriculum, the modules, the recovery guide,
1:29:48
the entire program so that more people, cause
1:29:52
I I'm one person. I can't reach everybody. We
1:29:54
need to, there are hundreds of thousands of people
1:29:56
struggling. Last question. We're going two hours
1:29:59
here. Our meeting, and Phil, we can do this again.
1:30:01
I have no problem. Our meeting's over Zoom. Yeah,
1:30:04
so we're going to shift from Google Hangout to
1:30:07
Zoom, but the Unbox meetings are already on Zoom.
1:30:11
So yes, the answer to that is yes. Gentlemen,
1:30:13
dude, thank you guys for calling in. I think
1:30:15
we should have done this show. Can I say one
1:30:19
last thing real quick? Yeah, we can do it again.
1:30:21
I just want to end on one note real quick, Jason,
1:30:24
if you don't mind. As long as it's somewhat short.
1:30:27
It's short. It's short. So if there's one thing
1:30:30
to take away from this conversation, it's that
1:30:32
the hobby isn't broken, but the way we've been
1:30:35
taught to engage with it is, right? So we can
1:30:38
love collecting and still question the systems
1:30:40
that profit from our impulse. We can enjoy ripping
1:30:44
and still recognize when the chase starts to
1:30:46
replace intention. And we can care deeply about
1:30:48
this space while asking it to evolve. And that's
1:30:52
what Collectors MD is about. We're not here to
1:30:54
shame. We're not here to blame. And I also think
1:30:57
you got that message across throughout the whole
1:30:59
night. Alyx, Petty, Charles, have a great Thanksgiving.
1:31:03
Thank you for calling in, and I hope to stay
1:31:04
in touch with all three of you. Love you, boys.
1:31:07
Alyx, good luck. Stop doing what isn't working.
1:31:10
Hey, now. Up. He gave us a happy Thanksgiving.
1:31:14
I kind of cut him off. Hey, it was a good conversation.
1:31:17
I want to end with voicemails. Wish you all a
1:31:19
happy Thanksgiving. That was awesome. That was
1:31:21
a lot of insight we had on Wednesday before Thanksgiving.
1:31:24
I think the peak was 133 in here. So I like the
1:31:27
slow growth. It's very healthy.