Latest / The STA Clinician Podcast / STA190 'Transforming Your Healthcare Business Model' with special guest Frank Benedetto

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STA190 'Transforming Your Healthcare Business Model' with special guest Frank Benedetto · The STA Clinician Podcast

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You're listening to the Sports Therapy Association podcast, putting evidence
0:04
back into soft tissue therapy.
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Music.
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Hey people, how are you doing? Welcome to episode 190, what a lovely round number, we're nearly at 200.
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That means absolutely nothing of course, but it's kind of like doing a 5k,
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10k half marathon marathon, isn't it?
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So we're nearly there at 200 of the sports therapy association
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podcast my name is matt phillips creator of runchatlive.com and
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as always this episode is being recorded live on a
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tuesday at eight o'clock on the sports therapy association youtube channel on
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the facebook page and also the facebook page open group so if you are listening
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to the podcast and you do like the idea of joining us live so you can ask questions
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directly to our magnificent guests and also just hang out with with other like-minded
0:54
soft tissue therapists, then that's all you've got to do.
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Put aside Tuesday at eight o'clock and then join us on one of those streams.
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So in this episode coming up very shortly, episode 190 entitled Transforming
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Your Healthcare Business Model, my special guest is Frank Benedetto,
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a doctor of physical therapy with a degree in psychology.
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Frank is the founder of the Honey Badger Project and with it is on a mission
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to revolutionize healthcare by making better use of technology and psychology
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to improve patient care.
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If you are joining us live, then you're obviously, as always,
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welcome to ask questions already through the door, flying through. We've got Sarah Jones.
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Those who listen to the podcast, when I do bring up questions,
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then you get to see the person's logo. You get to see what they say,
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obviously, on the screen.
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So it's a lovely way of sharing your thoughts, sharing your logo,
1:40
if you like, and networking.
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Sarah Jones says, evening. Hey, Sarah, thanks very much for joining us.
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Amanda is here as well, saying hi, everyone.
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Cecily Hislop is here as well. Howdy, folks. It's Cecily. Glenn Murphy has come
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through the door. Hi, Glenn. How are you doing? Good to see you.
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Gary Benson, founder of the Sports Therapy Association, is here as well.
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So if you've got any technical questions in the chat, then the man is there ready to answer them.
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And other people are coming through now. So it's all great. And we're looking
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forward to spending the next hour with you.
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But first, he moved the microphone towards him to create a little bit of atmosphere.
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A moment to talk about facial hair.
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Specifically the return of what some have referred to as my glorious beard.
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Now, if you listen to the podcast, you've never seen me. This will make no sense
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to you at all. You might want to fast forward. You might want to go to YouTube.
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But yes, the beard is back.
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I'm thrilled to announce that once again, just like I was about between 10 and
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five years ago, I'm able to offer you, the listener of the Sports Therapy Association podcast,
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a discount code for beard products from the wonderful people at the Brighton
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Beard Company. company.
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Those of you who are fans of Run Chat Live podcast and went to the conference
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will know that I was working with these guys for a long time.
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They're a lovely bunch. It's not just because they're in Brighton, which is my hometown.
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It also really is. I'm going to try and say this because I know a lot of people
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talk about, oh, all of our products are 100% natural.
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But these guys really started off as a tiny outfit in 2013, if I remember rightly.
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And all of their products, the balms, the oils, the brushes, everything,
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they are all handmade in small batches with 100%
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natural natural ingredients and it's a matter of taste isn't
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it but i'm telling you that as far as i'm concerned they are impeccable in
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fragrance and i would encourage you to try them
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the one i just want to mention i'm gonna do this like once a month because what
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they're doing at the moment is they've got a seasonal collection remember if you
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haven't got a beard some of the ladies out there maybe then this
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is if you really want to treat your fellow i know you don't like his beard much but
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you have to understand men don't grow beards for women it's not that sort
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of thing they grow them for them and they have little nods at
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people as they walk past and going here nice ice beer brew it's that sort of
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thing so if you really want to give your man a great present then some of these
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products balms or oils will mean the world to him there's one that a blind beer
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company is selling now which is the seasonal collection they're basically a
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collection of different ingredients which are supposed to match the season and
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we're in spring there's a little shot there i'm not sure if it's going to go
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out of blur but there we go this is the spring collection,
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i'm going to give it a smell it makes me laugh when i watch this back because it's if you're.
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Right i'm just gonna try and swear last time
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i did it's amazing i'm not just saying that as a sales pitch
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it's just beautiful this this seasonal spring one i'm
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talking about the ingredients on it if
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i remember rightly it's got bergamot which is a kind of type of orange which
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you can't eat but it's just beautiful citrus smell and it's also got coriander
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thyme and lavender and it's it's sound like a qvc channel but it is amazing
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it's energizing like spring it's citrusy but also with with peppery notes is
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the best way I'd describe it. But anyway, collections are limited.
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So go and check that out now. Now, the important thing you can see on the screen,
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if you listen to the podcast and you fancy buying that for yourself or for a
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loved one or somebody you want to be a loved one, then you can get 15% off using
4:46
the discount code STA15.
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That's it. STA15 will get you a code and yeah, I'll definitely check them out.
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It will change your life or the life of the person you give it to. And that's guaranteed.
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There we go. Right. Back to tonight's episode.
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Enough talk of beards although our guest who i bring up shortly does is sporting
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a very nice beard which we'll try not to refer to it's gonna be difficult now
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because everyone's thinking about it but i'm really excited to bring up for
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this episode 190 of the sports therapy association podcast,
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transforming your health care business model some i've been kind of talking
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about this in little bits in in the last four or five episodes because it's
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something that's really close to my heart it's something because i believe it's
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what you soft tissue therapists need to work less and earn earn more.
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And once upon a time, I would have hated hearing that.
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All right, here we go. Another marketing pitch, work less and earn more.
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It sounds like half the sponsored as we see on Facebook.
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But I'm at the age now I understand. And I try and let you guys know that you
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do deserve more than you're earning, especially now as we're learning of the
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power of human touch and people are starting to appreciate thanks to the studies,
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how human touch does change lives, how it hits that nervous system.
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So the more the nervous system is involved in healthcare, well,
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hey, guess what the more massage and everything we say and speak and listen
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around that massage is going to help people in pain so very excited to bring
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up my special guest for tonight frank benedetto and i shall bring him up now.
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Music.
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Hey frank how you doing matt what's going on man thanks for having me nice beard
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man nice beard bro i mean i i i hope i'm gonna be able to concentrate,
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jealousy well this is wow that's looked
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after man that's really nice i like it and you've got that kind
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of like just great age which only
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a man of your experience and wisdom can have i mean that is the beard it's beautiful
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man but anyway well we won't talk about beers anymore and thanks for joining
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us you're in florida aren't you which is what time there well what time of day
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you're in it is 4 p.m eastern time here in florida but you've got more light
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than we've had for the last five
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months by the look of it so i hope you're appreciating that so yeah uh.
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So we're going to talk about the honey badger project which is something you've
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founded to start off we mentioned this off air i think it might be a uk states
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thing but all day or all week while i've been preparing this and lining up some
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notes i've been transforming honey badger into honey bear because we're more
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familiar with characters like winnie the pooh than the honey Badger.
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So I'm wondering if our UK listeners, you could explain what is symbolic and
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important about the Honey Badger with regards to soft tissue therapists and business in general.
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Yeah. So I'm a doctor of physical therapy by trade.
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Manual therapist was my identity for the first eight years of my career and has since evolved.
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And I believe that business is a vehicle to deliver amazing healthcare,
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innovative healthcare.
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And I believe that sports therapists are the front lines.
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We are the front lines reaching the consumers that are either coming to us first
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or coming to us when they have given up hope on the rest of healthcare.
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So I think the two extremes represents a lot of what I've seen in the people
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that I've worked with. And I believe that healthcare at large in the U.S.,
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in the U.K., we have a large presence in the U.K., we have tons of clients in the U.K., it's broken.
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It's broken in different ways in the U.S. and the U.K., but it is broken indeed. indeed.
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And I know that fear is the number one gatekeeper to having healthcare professionals.
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Reimagine their careers.
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It is fear that is in the way. It's fear of standing out, fear of breaking out
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of the mold, fear of all sorts of this laundry list of things.
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And when I started the Honey Badger Project, which is a business incubator,
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what that means is that we exist to create more creativity in the marketplace of healthcare. care.
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I am not a get more clients business coach.
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I am not a marketing expert that just, you know, does marketing.
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My mission and my purpose in that aspect of my career is to help inspire innovation
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in the healthcare space.
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And I knew that since fear is the number one gatekeeper to actually seeing innovation,
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we needed a spirit animal.
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And there's this viral YouTube video in 2012.
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It's ridiculous. It's absurd. You got to look it up.
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And it basically talks about how the honey badger is the most fearless animal in the world.
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And to my surprise, it was confirmed by National Geographic and some other resources
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where you watch some documentaries and docu-series on the honey badger.
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These are bad animals, man. They do not back down.
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They are fearless. They have thick skin. And there's layers of symbolism that
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we build into the messaging of our platform that allows the honey badger to
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be sort of this, bring some levity to the situation, but also serve as a spirit animal.
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What I'm here to do is to deliver a mindset shift.
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So this is not about me. This is about your audience.
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And the mindset shift that I want to help all of you see is that you are more than just your hands.
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And that doesn't mean we have to not take pride in the craft of what you can
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do, because because what you can do with your hands is extremely powerful,
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but you are even more powerful than that.
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And when you tap into that, you do a couple of different things.
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One, you prolong your career because let's just face it, my hands are not the
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same from the eight years that I did a very manual centric approach.
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But more importantly, I believe that we make the impact that you thought you
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would have when you first chose this career path.
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And the way I I believe in doing that is just matching you with readily available technology.
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It's not my technology. It's not proprietary. There are dozens of options out
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there. I have no affiliate with any of them.
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I'm not even going to talk about any specific ones unless you really want me
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to, to give some more texture or context to what I'm talking about.
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But how many of you are dealing with a client who is coming in for,
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let's say, lower back pain or neck pain or hip pain, who is also overweight,
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who is also sitting for eight hours a day, who is also eating processed foods,
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who is also not sleeping enough, who is also addicted to their screen.
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And the incredible gift that you can give them with your hands,
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whether you're intervening on pain or something else, swap in the context.
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Don't take the easy road out and be like, oh, this doesn't relate to me.
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I don't work with people with pain. Think about the problems your Your people come to help you solve.
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And now think about all of the things that are actually leading to that problem.
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If we don't address that, I would argue that we are more towards a bandaid than a long-lasting cure.
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Cure, I get it, is a loaded word here. What I'm advocating for is addition,
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not subtraction, adding to
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your services and potentially repackaging the way you sell your services.
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A little bit bigger of an ass, though, is that if somebody's coming in for low
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back pain, if somebody's coming in for hip pain or neck pain,
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this statistically we know represents the majority of the reasons why people come in for treatment.
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Barring any traumatic incidents and surgeries, post-op or all that other stuff. of.
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Chances are they need some very basic health habits that all of us and the rest
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of healthcare have overlooked.
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And I'm like, ah, that's too basic.
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That's too low level. And many of us, especially the sports therapists that
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we've worked with, they're like, well, I don't have an exercise credential.
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I'm not asking you to do exercise prescription.
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Well, I don't have a nutrition degree. I'm not asking you to do nutrition prescribed,
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not asking you to prescribe meal plan.
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But what I am advocating for is that you build in accountability to basic health
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habits as an adjunct to your core treatment and watch the results people get.
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And now again, we could go into deeper, like all the different ways we can do
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this, but what I'm advocating for, I'm going to shortcut to the takeaway.
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Pick one, two, or three patients, clients, and say, hey, I got,
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But this crazy guy from America is talking about this concept of me using an
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app to help implement some basic health habits.
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Would you be down to be a beta tester, a founding member of this to help me
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explore if it's something I even want to try?
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Go into the marketplace, pick an app that has a communication area.
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So place a message that's not your cell phone, that's not a DM in WhatsApp.
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Place the message, a method of habit tracking.
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And ideally a calendar so that you could place things to do on the calendar.
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And then from there, what I want you to do is just think about what habits your
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people might need help with. Pick one habit for two weeks.
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So if you were to take, let's say you want to say sleep, it could be as simple
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as what's your baseline sleep? Matt, what are you averaging?
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What's your average sleep?
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Trying to get seven and a half, eight. Yeah. What's the real number though, Matt?
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Come on. Oh, no, I've done it. I did a six week sleep study with a connect.
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I had like a potty somnogram tied up and I realized, you know,
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I've got the, I've got the eye mask. I've got the ear.
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Yeah. But yeah, I know a lot of people are not. Yeah. What was it before?
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Disturbed four. Yeah. Disturbed four or five. I was bored. Many of your clients
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will answer similarly, like five or six.
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You know, I try to get seven, but I usually get six.
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Well, what is it? You know, I tend to watch TV a little too much at night or
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I'm on my phone scrolling at night. It's a universal human condition and simple
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habit tracking of saying, okay, let's make a new rule down to between our sessions.
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Let's imagine you sell something where you have a session every two weeks or maybe once a month.
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Between now and next session, we're going to either work on one or two habits.
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And those habits are going to be inside this app. And first habit is going to be sleep. sleep.
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So let's build a habit that you're going to set your Apple health or your Android
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health alarms and your focus modes to basically turn off and turn on at the right times.
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And every morning after you wake up, you're going to come to my app and click, did you do it or not?
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And you're like, Frank, are you really serious? You're going to ask me to hold
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people accountable to setting up their Apple health? Yes, no one does it.
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And if they do do it, they ignore it so quickly. It's incredible because they
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have a billion notifications on their from. They need human accountability.
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Human accountability for the absolute basic health habits of generalized healthcare
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is what's missing and is life-changing.
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And you as the front lines can build this in.
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So some of you are probably saying, well, am I doing this for free? How does this work?
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And I'll pause here, Matt. Where do you want to go? Do you want to go into more
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of the concept or do you want me to go more into business models?
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No, I love, I mean, what you're saying builds on things which we've kind of
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dripped through already in the sense that because a lot of our audience and
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listeners have got a great therapeutic alliance with their clients because of the touch,
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because of the subjective assessment that they're doing. They know stuff about their client.
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We've kind of stressed that you're in the perfect place, probably more so than
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any other health professional to actually get some decent behavior change because
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you've broken those barriers.
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So the stuff you're talking about is amazing.
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And it's just, I think the technology you're introducing is a way to put something
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we've talked about now into actual practice.
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It's just about the therapist having the confidence to do it.
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So going, continuing down that road would be amazing.
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Yeah. So there's a list of the most basic health habits that,
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oh, what's the resource I was looking for?
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I'll pull the link and give it to you. You can put it in the description of this.
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But it's the government-recommended basic health habits that requires,
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in my opinion, no specialized credential and has extremely limited, if not zero, risk.
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Because somebody checking a box saying, like, did I put my phone away at 9 so
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I could get to sleep at 10 is not going to sue you because you had them go to sleep a little earlier.
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Or their step count might be one of the goals. So whatever it is that's most
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important to your crew, your people that you serve, is really what you should revolve this around.
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Now, talking about the business model, how does this free you from so much demand
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on your hands? Because I don't necessarily...
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You opened with, how do you work less and make more? And you technically can do that.
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But my perception is, how do you shift the way you work to diversify it away from just your hands?
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And make more. So you might end up making, working the same amount,
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or you could choose to work slightly less.
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But the reality is, is that the scope and the scale of which you could,
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lives you can impact, climbs exponentially when you start leaning on technology.
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So what that means is people that you might discharge, you know,
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or say like, hey, you know, I'm ready to no longer come in for sessions.
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This can be an adjunct where you continue the relationship with them after their
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need of sessions naturally goes away, or you decide it's no longer needed,
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or they decide it's no longer needed. And a couple of things happen for that.
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It's recurring revenue.
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So you can charge a very reasonable amount for 100% asynchronous care.
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Asynchronous meaning they respond on their watch, you respond on your watch,
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you add new habits, they check those habits, you you evolve it,
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you check in via messenger.
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So this could be a stream of recurring revenue ongoing after people wrap up with their sessions.
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I'm not asking you, you don't need to change anything about your sessions.
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Do you know what happens after a year of accruing? Now, not everybody's going
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to want to do that, but let's just say five people a month, very reasonable number in my opinion,
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five people a month, every month, all year,
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the end of the year, We're going to have 60 people paying whatever dollar amount
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that you feel is fair for the service, which we have seen from anywhere between 100 to 250 pounds.
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So I tried to say pounds. I was going to say tons. I was impressed.
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That was great. I tried to be natural, as I said. I made you a mind.
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The reality is we do have people selling this for anywhere between $50 and $250,
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depending how loaded they make it.
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Some people create some really intricate programs, and it's got some pre-filmed
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education where you just film these two-minute segments of education,
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and you load it in their calendar.
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Because people need to learn. It's social media now. now. Social media has changed
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the way consumers learn.
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So rather than them having scroll social media, you'd have them check your app.
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Again, it was readily available. You just pay some app 50 to a hundred bucks a month to host this.
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You film a two minute little video about the importance of hydration.
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You know, here's why this is what it does to your cells. And you know,
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when you get, when you come in for a session, make sure you stay hydrated,
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but now we're going to build that into an app.
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Did you drink X liters of water the next day or whatever it is that we're going
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to to say, we could build this in.
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And now circling back to the one variation is this being a discharge mechanism.
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At the end of a year, the amount of money you can have recurring revenue then
20:14
gives you the power and flexibility to say, what is the right amount of in-person
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sessions I want for this phase of life?
20:20
Maybe you're preparing to have a kid. Maybe you just had a kid.
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Maybe you're coming to the end of your career. Maybe your hands are hurting.
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Maybe your back's hurting. Maybe you you want to travel a little bit more.
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When you build up in a long-term project, no quick fixes, monthly recurring
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revenue, it gives you optionality.
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It gives you now money to reinvest back into the business. You could hire someone.
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You could maybe get that bigger space that has a different treatment room.
20:42
You could bring someone else into this proprietary method because this is cutting edge.
20:46
The other way you could do this, and I'll pause for questions,
20:48
is selling a plan of care and that you could swap that name out for whatever
20:54
you feel comfortable with, but that's the placeholder that we start with.
20:57
And every clinician gets to rename their own stuff.
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But selling a plan of care where people are price shopping different sports therapists.
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So they're going, okay, what's your hourly rate? What's your hourly rate?
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With you though, you don't sell sessions, you sell a process.
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So once you live launch this, and now you have your one habit every two weeks,
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and now you have, let's say a 90 day or six month plan.
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Those are the two that we usually recommend to start with is like,
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let's say somebody comes in with some sort of chronic pain.
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You say, oh, I actually have a program that I've developed. That's a combination
21:33
of sessions and this whole host of asynchronous interventions.
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That's the, that's going to get really to the root of your chronic pain.
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We're going to do all this amazing stuff, not asking you to change any narrative
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with your hands at all, but I'm asking you to surround it with that,
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with everything else, some educational videos, some habit tracking,
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some basic guidance for food, nutrition and sleep and technology and all this other stuff.
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And then when you do that, you could actually space the sessions out more than
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maybe you would have otherwise, because the value is no longer per session.
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Like, oh, cool. How much does that work out to session?
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Actually, it's just how it works.
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So the price is for working with me for three months is this amount.
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And you're now literally preventing the math from even happening of what is
22:18
that per session, because they're paying for the process that you have created
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for. and now this is where you have to identify who your people are.
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Maybe it's a chronic pain problem. Maybe it's postpartum. Maybe it's pre-partum.
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I can't think of the word. Pregnancy.
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Pregnancy-based. You can create signature programs or a catch-all that works with everybody.
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And then you can charge a premium for that, which then deleverages your time
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and your hands, which creates the same effect as the discharge. charge.
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Having all three, where you have your classic sessions for those people who
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just, at the end of the day, you can't get them to see the future of it,
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or you need your reps in learning how to sell this, that's fine.
23:00
Your discharge program and your signature process, that's what we call an evolving practice model.
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That's a model that is dynamic and that can shape shift and grow with you over
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time and is scalable, sustainable, and has an amazing impact.
23:15
That brilliant that's great people in the audience i
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can see you sitting there i want some questions coming out because already i know
23:22
by some of your names that you've said to me i'm just getting tired i'm having
23:26
to work too much my hands are hurting it's a common thing when you're overdoing
23:30
it with a with a manual therapy i have some questions coming in about how this
23:33
is going to work there must be some questions happening i'm really i'm interested
23:36
in hearing you and talk Talk about this idea,
23:41
which people will realize now, the only way to make money is one-to-one.
23:45
And if you want to make more money, then you have to see more people and how
23:48
this is an outdated principle.
23:50
And I was interested also, you mentioned on another podcast,
23:53
how it's tricky to get away from this model because a lot of traditional businesses,
23:58
I think the expression you used were you're paid when they check in.
24:02
And you're not actually getting paid for a result. It's every time they check
24:06
in, see this person eight times a month, and then that's fine.
24:08
You only see them five times a month.
24:10
And it's difficult for therapists to break out of that mold.
24:12
The idea of seeing less people and stuff.
24:14
But what you're providing, and it sounds so simple now, the way it comes so
24:18
masterfully out of your mouth, is a way to look after people in the background.
24:23
You're not having to see them.
24:24
Somebody could be filling in that spreadsheet, that app, whilst you're seeing another patient.
24:28
And it's just incredible. So, yeah, just why is it we've got this one-to-one
24:33
system and what suggestions have you got for therapists to get out of this mentality
24:39
of I need to see patient after patient?
24:41
It's a great question. I'll share a little bit of a story about who I am as
24:44
it relates to this. So I've been practicing since 2009.
24:49
I was an employee from 2009 to 2015.
24:52
In 2015, I finally had enough and I launched my own practice.
24:57
Thinking i had escaped the system i had quickly
24:59
basically sold all of my time and was
25:03
just up my schedule was
25:06
completely filled i wasn't seeing my kids i had two kids at the time now i have
25:09
three and i was like man is this it did i did i succeed at giving myself another
25:14
job you know is this really the pinnacle and then my solution was selling other
25:20
people's time and that meant the The profit margin is narrow, right?
25:23
So we did scale that business to 50 employees, five locations.
25:27
And I'm fortunate to have been able to sold that practice in 2019.
25:32
We were a very high quality, low volume practice, but that would not have survived
25:38
COVID at the end of the day. That was simply would not have survived it.
25:42
I, by a stroke of luck, was always obsessed with the Silicon Valley tech scene.
25:48
And in the United States, that's where all innovation comes from.
25:51
So Uber, Airbnb, anything that's disruptive and innovative typically comes out
25:57
of the US, comes out of Silicon Valley.
25:59
So I was just obsessed with studying them. And I wanted to go to Y Combinator,
26:03
which was an incubator that used principle-based learning to help anyone with
26:08
any idea, turn that idea to an innovative business in like 16 weeks.
26:11
I was like, healthcare needs that. And I thought, how could I create an incubator
26:16
someplace where it doesn't matter what your Your credential is who you serve,
26:19
but through these principles, you can reimagine the way you practice in a way
26:22
that mutually benefits the end user, the clients, you,
26:26
and the future team that you might build if you do choose to scale it that far.
26:30
And that's really what I started racking my brain around when I had sold that
26:32
practice. That's what I dedicated my life towards.
26:34
I am somebody, though, who would not be able to teach that unless I was doing it.
26:38
So I first, before I started teaching other clinicians, I launched a business
26:42
for combat athletes, fighters, literally UFC fighters, kickboxers, jujitsu wrestlers.
26:47
And that was the that was my favorite type of patient
26:49
and client to work with i just love them they're crazy they'd
26:52
come in with something dislocated and they're like i'm fighting
26:56
friday no matter what you know what can you do you know
26:58
so it was always just this fun group of people to work with and in 2019 i realized
27:03
that this group was far like they were very interspersed there's not a central
27:08
location for them they're fragmented the health care system usually usually
27:13
disregards them. They tell them, you're crazy for doing this, just stop.
27:17
They don't stop. And they basically just get tossed aside.
27:20
And I said, this isn't right. And I realized that an online platform,
27:23
a mostly remote platform, was actually what they needed.
27:27
So I launched what I called a hybrid practice at that time, where I went in
27:32
person twice a week to use my hands, to use my eyes, to assess the way people
27:36
move, to do manual therapy.
27:38
But I would sell them 90-day plans of care based off of what I saw that they
27:44
needed with everything I just described with a little bit more of an exercise
27:48
physiology component based off of my background and my degree.
27:52
But the reality is that most of them needed just basic health habits.
27:55
Most of them needed step counts and sleeps and better sleep and all this other stuff.
28:00
So in 2019, I had my hybrid location set up, and we had started getting significant
28:04
interest from the combat sports community. I had some people fully remotely
28:08
from outside my area who I never met just because I documented what I was doing on social media.
28:13
The lockdowns happened, and I realized, wow, I'm really uniquely positioned right now.
28:17
And my business just grew throughout it. So we grew up to 130 combat athletes
28:24
on caseload, fully remotely, where all we're doing is the basics of nutrition, movement, exercise,
28:30
mindset, meditation, everything that they need to prep for their fights as my niche.
28:38
And I took that as the opportunity for me to launch my incubator,
28:42
which was essentially taking all the lessons learned from my direct experience
28:46
in business and bringing it back to other clinicians.
28:51
And since then, I've launched two more practices, one that's actually about to launch in a few weeks.
28:57
But another one we did last year, we've created a fully remote ecosystem for
29:01
truck drivers. Truck drivers are another one who's just cast aside by society,
29:06
meaning, you know, 70, 80% of everything in our rooms right now,
29:09
wherever you are, touch the truck.
29:11
And we just cast these humans aside as though they're not human anymore.
29:15
So we built a healthcare system for them. And now I'm releasing a hybrid practice for people with ADHD.
29:23
And you might be like, what, Frank, what are you talking? How are you a physical therapist doing ADHD?
29:29
I believe in expanding and pushing the limits of our practice models.
29:33
Again, within the legal boundaries, I am not going to, you know,
29:38
there will be no diagnosis of ADHD made.
29:40
We're actually really an attention improvement center, not an ADHD center.
29:46
Center basically kids and adults can come in use some
29:48
really cutting-edge technology like ipads with
29:51
infrared cameras that can track your eye movement to train
29:55
you how to read because people with adhd typically jump around a lot they get
29:58
distracted and there's exercises you could do with 3d glasses and there's all
30:03
sorts of really cool technology that can help with adhd but the reality is is
30:07
that health habits actually are what inter intervenes on adhd more than the of technology.
30:12
So what we're doing is basically the same thing I'm advocating for you.
30:15
Instead of my hands, we're talking about come in and use this technology.
30:19
Oh, and by the way, your ADHD is exponentially worse when you have no limits
30:23
on your technology, when you don't sleep enough, if you drink alcohol too frequently,
30:28
if you eat processed foods, especially high sugars.
30:31
So this concept, the principle can apply to any credential working with any
30:36
type of person in any setting anywhere in the country.
30:39
It's just about inspiring clinicians to start thinking outside the proverbial
30:44
box and giving them the tools to help reimagine their skill sets.
30:51
Excellent. Yeah, I think as you're talking about, I'm thinking of different,
30:54
like I work with runners.
30:55
I'm thinking of, I mean, I've done that as well. I was similar to you in the
30:58
sense that before COVID happened,
30:59
I was already providing a big brother service where they had to upload their
31:04
runs to this spreadsheet and how much they slept and whether I was trying to
31:09
keep the individual from doing too much or not doing enough.
31:11
And and it's basic human nature isn't it sometimes we all need a
31:14
big brother to feel accountable to and that helps behavior change so it's
31:18
something which all therapists need to be doing i love the
31:21
way you said i think it was something like if you're in 2024 you're
31:24
a therapist and you're not using an app just one app then
31:27
you're losing already you're going to be caught definitely with
31:30
your trousers down by the time ai starts getting more so i'm thinking
31:34
really i mean this is an amazing way to
31:37
help behavior change with clients which is something we've talked about a
31:40
lot with some amazing guests but now really we're focusing more on behavior
31:43
change for therapists who maybe have got barriers to changing the service they
31:48
offer so how in your experience because you work with therapists and you help
31:52
them to kind of launch this change and get a hybrid model together what do you
31:56
think of some of the barriers and how do people overcome them,
31:59
yeah mirror is number one but i'll give you a context of that it's usually imposter syndrome.
32:05
And, or this self-constructed belief that like almost like an identity crisis is the way I would put it.
32:16
And that's what I went through, you know, so if I could look back at 2013 to
32:21
15, Frank, where it's a tail end of when I was an employee, starting my own
32:25
business, I had gotten into the pain science world.
32:28
World and there's these extremes now man we
32:31
were talking about this off air like there's either these like rigid
32:34
loyalists almost like religious based thought
32:37
in clinical philosophy and there's just my opinion there's no place for that
32:42
and we've been around long enough we got a gray beard and you're a clinician
32:45
that means that you have seen the trends come and go so you're just less reactive
32:50
to the new trend and i don't dismiss them but i just take it as data and i always try I said, okay,
32:56
well, you know, the extremists are saying pain science is now,
32:59
it's all just in your mind. You know, pain is not real.
33:02
It is in a neurochemical reaction, nothing more.
33:05
And that's such a hard line extreme. Like, are there cases where that is true?
33:10
Absolutely. I'm sure we all can think of one person where that is the extreme example.
33:16
And then I can, we can also all agree that when you roll your ankle or break
33:20
a bone, there is the other extreme where this is now a a mechanical tissue issue.
33:25
And if the person has a great support system and all of the other variables
33:30
we know to help them succeed, it's kind of purely a mechanical issue.
33:34
We need to get them stronger. We need to get them more mobile.
33:36
We need to return to their activity at a dose-style pace.
33:39
So these are the two extremes, whereas most people are then going to be in the
33:43
middle, where if you do have such a bout with low back pain,
33:48
that it does induce fear-based changes.
33:53
We do need to understand that our words matter. We do need to carefully choose
33:57
the way we explain the mechanics to not use nocebic language to influence people
34:02
to come to our sessions or buy our products.
34:04
But that doesn't mean that we have to discredit the role of manual therapy or
34:08
the role that other interventions can play that still do have research support
34:13
behind it or that is aligned with your personal philosophy.
34:16
As long as we're not using nocebic language consciously to influence the sale
34:21
of a product, I believe now we need to be more open to the full cascade of research,
34:27
not allow ourselves to become religious about it, and then adopt what worldview
34:31
actually makes sense for our niche.
34:33
So back to your question of what's in the way here, this does not need to be an identity crisis.
34:41
This is adding a tool to your toolbox for you to experiment with in the tiniest
34:46
dose, even like a friends and family thing.
34:50
Go to your neighbor go to your buddy go to your in-laws and be
34:52
like i just want to test this thing like could you now for
34:55
granted when you give it away for free and you do it to family they're going
34:58
to not do it so like take that with a
35:01
grain that's a grain of salt like that's for you to
35:04
practice the mechanics don't judge based off of their results
35:07
because they're to you they're you're too close to them they're not going to
35:10
actually listen but ideally it's your
35:12
best clients ask them them to dabble
35:15
with it but just take the first step because like
35:18
the other part of this is and you know trying not to use
35:21
nocebic language myself here but technology
35:25
is like here technology is here it is not in the future anymore technology is
35:31
here and the reality is is that if you're not using any form of technology i
35:37
do view that as a risk and sometimes that's just like you know There are still
35:41
people taking physical note-keeping.
35:43
There are still people who don't have a scheduling link.
35:47
So this doesn't even need to be in the fulfillment of your service.
35:50
This could be like, where could you just say, okay, you know what?
35:53
This month, I'm going to add this piece of technology to swap out the old school way.
35:57
And if you just do that slowly but surely, you will have a practice that evolves with the times.
36:02
Because I do believe that we are going to see an exponential increase in the
36:07
use of technology in the coming years. And those who are dabbling now,
36:10
it's like a form of job security for yourself because that's where the world is heading.
36:14
And there's only so much longer the healthcare system can resist it.
36:18
We've been stifled in innovation for years for lots of reasons.
36:23
And just dabbling with this will reduce the fear associated and also help you
36:28
see that there's no identity change that needs to happen. It's an and, it's an addition.
36:35
Decision definitely great points in there i think cecily
36:38
here has summed it up nicely it's what we're talking about really it's how do we influence
36:41
ourselves and being happy to try and influence others it's nicely
36:44
put cecily but i like what you say frank is it's a
36:47
case of not fearing that we're going to have to change our
36:49
identity massively or reinvent ourselves because particularly i'm
36:53
always saying this i'm always commending soft tissue therapists and sports massage
36:56
therapists because you've already got the empathy you already genuinely
36:59
care for your clients who comes in otherwise you couldn't do half
37:02
the stuff you do with them so i think it's
37:05
accepting maybe that you're one your client
37:08
is going to be happy to do what
37:11
you advise and they're going to take it on much easier than
37:14
you suspect probably people thinking i'm going to charge them something else
37:16
and they're going to think it's just a gimmick but people especially people
37:20
in pain people who can't do their preferred sport especially with runners if
37:24
a run is not able to run or do what they want to do they're in a period of mourning
37:27
and they will do anything thing as long as they have confidence in you.
37:31
So I think it's just crossing that step, isn't it? Thinking people are going
37:35
to enjoy what I give them and it's going to help.
37:37
Once you think that, then suddenly you can go ahead and suggest these apps to
37:41
people without fear of it not working or anything.
37:43
So yeah, fear. I can understand why you focus on that.
37:47
Yeah, absolutely. And here's the link, and we can include this one too,
37:52
from the NHS on their Live Well.
37:55
NHS advice about living, healthy living, including eating a balanced diet,
37:59
healthy weight, exercise, quitting smoking, and drinking less alcohol.
38:02
And there's quite literally just dozens of tabs that you can click on one and
38:09
say sleep and tiredness and quite literally just take exactly what the NHS is
38:15
recommending and simply turn that into a habit.
38:18
And the accountability to actually doing that will be the most life-changing
38:24
thing for your client's health that they will have ever experienced.
38:28
I promise you that. Just try it.
38:31
Just try it with a few people and you will see excellent
38:35
it's probably worth mentioning here i'm just bringing these people up on
38:37
the screen who i'm sure you recall so a while back
38:40
it was episode 181 we are the pleasure of
38:43
spending some time with david barron simon teller sorry simon taylor of rehab
38:46
guru and they mentioned you because you've worked with them before and and i
38:51
mean there's other suppliers there of of apps and things out there but they
38:55
were in that episode talking about about how technology means that it's not
39:00
just a case of providing exercises anymore.
39:02
I mean, that once upon a time would be drawing down stick men.
39:05
And a lot of people have moved on now to actually sending a program with decent
39:09
videos and things you can amend.
39:10
But that particular episode, I recommend you listen to it, people,
39:13
181 end-to-end patient management and rehab guru.
39:16
They were touching on how their software and other software can now do so much more than that.
39:21
And they do provide programs and systems and spreadsheets to,
39:25
like Frank is saying, to provide a chance for the
39:28
client to actually take responsibility and be accountable and fill
39:31
things out so definitely check out that system sorry that
39:34
episode if you're listening to the podcast so let
39:38
me i'm interested also let me just keep you on the time quarter to yes quarters
39:43
nine that's fine 15 minutes talk to me how the honey badger project i've actually
39:48
said honey badger for the first time actually this today is always honey bear
39:51
the honey badger project helps What's the idea behind it and how can it help
39:54
our therapists embrace this hybrid model?
39:58
Yeah. So again, it's principle-based learning, which means that there is a structured curriculum.
40:04
However, the structure of that curriculum is agnostic to type of clinician,
40:10
credential, and clinical beliefs.
40:13
So it is really a series of prompts that elicits who is your ideal kind of client.
40:19
Most people are still in the category of too general and you don't always need
40:25
to like now just start saying no to people but instead you start attracting
40:29
people who you have built something for so when you build something remarkable
40:33
for a smaller group of people they tend to see it and go,
40:38
that was made for me. Like, wow, they took the time to make that for me.
40:43
And there's a couple of different ways you can introduce this.
40:45
You could add this as a signature offer in addition to your generalist offer.
40:49
Or if you're somebody already niched down, like some of you are,
40:52
then you simply just start to mold your offer into a more of a plan of care.
40:57
But essentially the steps are, number one, we take you through life design worksheet.
41:02
Life design worksheet is reverse engineering.
41:04
What do you actually want out of this for you?
41:08
And this is not some pine sky and getting margaritas on the beach, you know, 24 seven.
41:12
This is like, do you want to take your kids to school every morning?
41:15
Do you want to be home for dinner?
41:16
What's, what's the cadence that you want to travel? What days of the week do you want to work?
41:21
Like what, you know, it's just, it's very practical thing to then look into
41:25
the future and say, what would my ideal life look like in a very practical way?
41:29
And then that becomes this, this lens that all decisions are made through.
41:34
Because when you start doing this stuff and you get momentum and more and more
41:38
people want to work with you, it's easy to say yes to the point where you end
41:42
up like me, where you just sold all of your time and you're like,
41:44
yeah, I'm making more money than ever, but now I'm working more than ever.
41:48
Is that actually the point of this whole thing called business? No, it's not.
41:52
So the point of the business is to help people that you feel called to serve
41:56
and make a good living while doing it.
41:58
If we don't outline what we mean by a good living while doing it,
42:01
We're leaving up to random chance.
42:05
So the first step is outlining exactly what you want. You can all do this regardless
42:09
of, you know, I'm a give it away for free, come to us if you want the accountability
42:12
and the mentorship kind of guy.
42:13
So we have like 40, 50 hours of free trainings that start our free Facebook group.
42:18
If you follow my Instagram, it's education heavy. I give it all away.
42:22
So this is exactly the process. If there's any interest at all, you could come over.
42:26
It doesn't matter to me. I would love to have you in the following to just follow
42:30
along. on Instagram is the best way to reach me. It's Frank underscore Benedetto.
42:34
But here's the process. It is life design.
42:37
Find and study your niche. Within that, you're identifying their key problems.
42:42
So you list out their problems exhaustively and then list the problems that
42:47
are in your wheelhouse that you are feeling confident to be able to solve.
42:52
You order them in order of the biggest domino. So a lot of times what we help
42:57
people do is set up technology rules.
42:59
You will not believe how much people's lives can be changed by having an adult
43:03
needs you to tell them how to have a relationship with their phone.
43:08
And I truly believe that pain and cell phone usage is somewhat correlated.
43:14
Chronic pain and screen time, somewhat correlated.
43:19
So again, not causative. I'm not saying this is it.
43:21
I'm looking at the full picture of like, if I'm picking two habits a month,
43:26
So it means I get to pick 12 habits, 12 interventions.
43:31
Unpicking things that revolve around technology so your
43:35
screen time immediate stress levels decrease we know
43:37
stress is correlated with pain that one's proven stress and screen time are
43:43
also proven therefore we can indirectly make the assumption that screen time
43:47
and pain has likelihood of strength behind it so long story short i go off in
43:53
these two tangents that's all good man just Life design,
43:57
study your niche, decide what problems you're going to intervene upon.
44:01
What is the outcome of solving that problem look like? Are they happier?
44:04
Are they more fulfilled? Are they more active?
44:06
Then you're going to identify what is the delivery mechanisms that you can solve that.
44:11
I think that many of you can film two to three minute pieces of information
44:15
that you can preload into any one of these readily available apps like the Rehab Guru.
44:20
And you don't realize that people, information overload is a massive issue for consumers right now.
44:28
And they will pay to have less information to get the right information.
44:33
They will pay you to say, you are now my trusted source of generalized health
44:39
information. and lean on you for whatever it is in your wheel so you feel passionate about.
44:45
Again, you could pull from the NHS, so it's not even you making it up.
44:48
You're just pulling from the recommendations.
44:51
Then we're going to package all this into a 90-day or six-month plan of care to assign a price point.
44:57
Now, don't make a mistake of giving this away for free. It's okay in the beginning
45:01
if you all pick your two or three beta tests so that you're learning the app
45:05
and give some of your top clients some little value add.
45:08
Tell them that it's a 60 day trial or a 30 day trial or something like that
45:11
for free. And then it will be a paid service, but they'll get a discount.
45:15
They'll love you for it. Keep it as a term.
45:18
What you want to do is what we call the hybrid coefficient. It's actually what's
45:21
on the board behind me for those of you who can see it, is that you do the frequency
45:24
of in-person sessions, that's your normal rate, times multiplied by the hybrid coefficient.
45:30
Let's say it's 1.1, 1.2, 1.5, depending on how much you load it.
45:34
So if you're going to say, I'm going to do the bare bones, I'm going to load
45:36
and I'm literally going to copy and paste one sentence into a habit tracker once every two weeks.
45:43
That comes with a premium telling you. So, but maybe it's like 1.2,
45:46
you charge 1.2 times, whatever the total package price is.
45:50
And now you get, let's just take easy math just to, just to,
45:53
cause I'm terrible math.
45:54
So if you normally charge a thousand dollars for 10 pack of sessions,
45:58
you might now charge 1200 bucks for that same 10 pack, but you're not selling
46:05
it as a pack of sessions anymore.
46:06
You're selling it as your 90 day process, which includes habit tracking and
46:12
these sessions. and you're breaking down the time for money ratio.
46:16
So that when they ask like, what is that per session? Like that's really like
46:19
you quite literally come up with the narrative and we have tons of sales and
46:23
marketing training, but it's not really the core purpose of what we do.
46:25
But we support people because they have to learn how to resell this stuff because
46:28
most of you are so well-groomed and just selling the thing that you're used to.
46:32
So you need a little bit of support to just fine tune. But you will get to the
46:36
point where you could sell this and it's disconnected from your time.
46:40
People are happy to pay for it. Now, if you add some educational videos,
46:43
maybe you have a little bit of a community aspect.
46:46
You have some 24-hour support so they could ask you health questions or talk to you during work week.
46:52
Now you're at 1.5. Now you're at 1,500 for those 10 sessions,
46:58
but really the 10 sessions inside of PlanetCare.
47:00
Now let's say you really loaded up and maybe you do have some exercise knowledge
47:03
or you go out and get a credential or you have a credential in nutrition or
47:06
you partner with a nutritionist or a personal trainer. You hire them.
47:10
Now you're charging 2x. Now you're charging 2k for this 90-day or six-month
47:16
process where the sessions are even more spread out because the value is coming
47:20
from all these different locations.
47:22
Once you then build your product, sign, seal, deliver it, we believe in the
47:26
Silicon Valley of launching businesses where you study your people as they go through it.
47:31
So your first five to 10 people, you're literally watching them like a science experiment.
47:35
And you're going to be wrong about some stuff. They're going to be like,
47:37
I don't understand what you mean by this.
47:38
Great. That's great data. as long as you
47:41
have an intention to take care of them no matter what it takes yeah
47:44
in the beginning phase you gotta do a little bit more work to be like oh let me
47:47
hop on a quick five minute call and explain to you
47:49
and then based off of that call you then go update the
47:52
way you phrase it inside the app and i guarantee the next time the next people
47:55
come through they then don't have that question you're now
47:58
on the path to being able to streamline and scale this offer
48:01
where you're working maybe the same or less but seeing
48:05
a lot more people with less energy less
48:08
hands less time in the clinic you could be doing
48:11
that from a laptop from your house from vacation i remember
48:14
the first vacation i took with my family to florida when
48:17
i lived in new jersey and i just brought out my laptop
48:19
from like 9 a.m till noon and i
48:22
closed it i was like done with i
48:26
like walked back to the room and i was like yeah i
48:29
wrote some programs and i messaged some people and i
48:32
like here i am thinking my entire life had been spent inside
48:35
of a clinic 40 hours 50 hours a week i was was like i i didn't lose any money
48:40
by going away you know in fact i made like slightly more because i was i was
48:45
selling people into these remote products so yeah that's that's the process
48:49
and then support with marketing and sales and there's a mastermind component on the back end amazing.
48:54
Right well look it's five two i want to
48:57
i'm trying to get into a habit after these
49:00
chats with which i'm calling very um not
49:03
very originally putting theory into practice but with that
49:06
idea do you mind putting theory into practice some people out there
49:09
are going to listen to this and go right i've been looking for some form of mentorship i've
49:12
got some money put aside i need to talk to these guys and i'm
49:15
willing to pay a certain amount i want to find out how much it is and i want
49:18
to look after me and guide me through this process in that case i'm going to
49:21
bring up your website do they go through your website and contact you through
49:24
that if they're willing to cut if they want to have you actually guiding them
49:27
and giving you giving them service yeah the best place is actually to reach
49:31
me on instagram dm me i'll personally answer just mention that you're from this
49:35
podcast, we take it slow.
49:37
So if you're interested, and this is the first time you heard about me,
49:41
I'm not going to ask you to enroll.
49:42
I am not going to set you up with a sales call. What I'm going to do is hook
49:45
you up with longer form free trainings to really get an idea of what we're talking
49:51
about so that you can self-select, does this concept make sense?
49:54
And then if it does, you'll see multiple ways to be able to book a call and
49:59
hop on with my team and see if it makes sense. but we take a much longer nurture
50:04
trust building based approach.
50:06
So you are welcome to follow along with any of our free trainings for as long as you'd like.
50:10
We'll put you in the Facebook group where you can get tons of free trainings
50:13
on an ongoing basis that go live most weeks, similar to you,
50:18
four years straight with some breaks here and there.
50:21
But we're just constantly trying to deliver more value into the free community.
50:26
And if the time is ever right, you'll know how to reach us.
50:29
Right. First of all, that's amazingly generous. That's great. It's lovely.
50:33
It's so refreshing to hear that. So, people, if you are interested,
50:35
then take advantage of that. at Instagram, Frank underscore Benedetto,
50:39
which is B-E-N-E-D-E-T-O.
50:42
I made a typo on the original advert, but it is B-E-N-E, Benedetto.
50:48
So yeah, Instagram. And then, yeah, like Frank has said, Facebook group.
50:52
Loads of free stuff to get to know. It sounds really healthy,
50:54
a gentle kind of learning. And then you may decide, yeah, I'm up for this and take it further.
50:59
And I suppose that's the same is going to go for people who aren't quite ready,
51:02
thinking, thinking, oh, I'm not ready to pay for anything yet.
51:04
As Frank has said, a whole load of free information there for you.
51:08
The Facebook group sounds really cool.
51:10
I did put up a little screenshot here of the Facebook group.
51:13
Let's see. I think it's going to be, there we go.
51:17
There's legitimately enough information in the Facebook group where you can
51:20
implement this completely on your own.
51:22
There are people who don't want it. Some people want the more finer-tuned,
51:29
tight-touched experience. experience.
51:31
But if you get inside this Facebook group and actually take the time to work
51:36
through the materials, you'll have a host of resources. This is actually the Facebook page.
51:42
The Facebook group is called the Time Leveraged Clinician.
51:46
So we can drop that. Okay. Yeah, yeah. I'll make sure that goes in the link.
51:49
I was going to say, yeah, we'll put all of these into the links.
51:51
But if you listen to the podcast, then yeah, it sounds like Instagram is going
51:54
to be a great port of call for you.
51:56
But if you're not using Instagram, then yeah, check out the show notes here and
51:58
we'll put the links in for you there very exciting it's
52:02
almost like it's one of those moments where
52:05
we kind of know this is where everyone needs to be heading i mean it's so
52:07
obvious the way you put it and and and but people
52:11
need help and guidance to do it's like when we tell our patients to do
52:14
these exercises then we're surprised when they don't do them when we
52:16
blame them i think it's the same thing here we can tell
52:19
you on this podcast or whether you can tell people that you need to
52:22
be doing this but if you don't do it we get it we
52:25
get that it's easy for you or it's hard for you to actually make that change
52:28
it's real sort of barriers so it sounds like frank you put all those
52:31
steps into place to gently show people how to get into
52:34
2025 with some success to actually everything
52:37
which our audience need yes make a little bit more money use
52:40
your hands less and also just the main thing which people in this business for
52:43
is to get more success with clients to get more thank yous to actually help
52:47
more people um which is going to make you feel better and make you glad that
52:51
you chose this lifestyle instead of being a lawyer on account of someone earning
52:55
fortune but but not getting said not getting thank yous as much so yeah really appreciate it frank.
53:01
Fantastic. Right. Thank you, people, for joining us live. It is that time again.
53:06
If you listen to the podcast and really appreciate it, to help get the word
53:09
of our great guests out there, we always say it. Please, please,
53:12
please do leave a rating and a review, particularly on Apple podcasts.
53:16
If you've got an iPhone, it takes literally 30 seconds. Just go to your innate
53:20
app and just I'll make it easy for you.
53:22
Just click the fifth star, the fifth little gold one, and then just say excellent in the review.
53:26
That'd be fine. or it just helps our guests who
53:29
get nothing for this just to get their good word out there and
53:32
it helps more therapists see it and also if you do like
53:35
the idea of joining us live then just come on
53:38
a Tuesday at eight o'clock either YouTube or Facebook to
53:42
let you know if you are listening and you like the idea of it
53:44
next Tuesday which is going to be March 26th if
53:47
you're listening to this before then at eight o'clock the topic is going to
53:50
be manual therapy a new way of learning so we've got a little theme
53:53
going on here this is going to be with everybody knows it Mike James james endurance physio
53:56
which a lot of people will be familiar with he's been working
53:59
working on different ways to deliver manual therapies there
54:02
will be a lot of crossovers here and he's gonna be with us
54:05
in the studio next week so really much looking forward to that so for the last
54:10
time tonight thank you so much frank for giving up your time and you still got
54:13
what a whole afternoon to enjoy in florida now have you got things planned or
54:16
is that your briefcase shut now your metaphor got one more meeting after this
54:19
the second day before meeting up next and then we are i really Really appreciate it.
54:25
It's the golf practice. So you are sharing.
54:28
No, a pleasure. You're sharing some amazing information. I'm really,
54:31
I'm really want to do what I can.
54:32
And the sports therapy association wants to do what it can to help you get,
54:36
get your good word out there. There's so much you're giving away.
54:38
We just need to get it out to the people that need to hear it.
54:40
So we will do everything we can to do that. So thank you very much.
54:43
Right. Thanks people for joining us. Like I say, if you want to join us next
54:46
week, then join us Tuesday at o'clock, but until then, make sure you look after each other.
54:51
Music.