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355: Why Starting Over Is a Parenting Superpower, with Wendy Snyder · Beautifully Complex

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Speaker 1: Someone might see that as like looser boundaries, but then
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Speaker 1: we also really have dove deep into actual research and
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Speaker 1: education around what is going to keep our kids safe.
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Speaker 1: You know you're going to put your quotes foot down
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Speaker 1: on some things, but you do it with relationship is
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Speaker 1: the big thing, and that's just what most parents aren't
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Speaker 1: used to. You put your foot down, but then you
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Speaker 1: do it with fear and intimidation or threats that if
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Speaker 1: they don't listen, something bad it's going to happen, versus
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Speaker 1: education on why the boundary exists.
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Speaker 2: Welcome to Beautifully Complex, where we unpack what it really
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Speaker 2: means to parent neurodivergent kids with dignity and clarity. I'm
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Speaker 2: Penny Williams, and I know firsthand how tough and transformative
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Speaker 2: this journey can be. Let's dive in and discover how
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Speaker 2: to raise regulated, resilient, beautifully complex kids together. Oh and
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Speaker 2: if you want more support, join our free community at
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Speaker 2: hub dot beautifully complex dot life. Welcome back, everybody. I'm
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Speaker 2: so glad to have you here and listening. I have
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Speaker 2: with me today Wendy Snyder of Fresh Start Parenting, and
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Speaker 2: we're going to talk about starting over what that looks
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Speaker 2: like in parenting, when we might do that, when we
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Speaker 2: might not do that, if there's ever a time not
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Speaker 2: to do that, and what that means for us as
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Speaker 2: parents of neurodivergent kids, kids who are walking through the
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Speaker 2: world a little bit differently, experiencing the world a little
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Speaker 2: bit differently. So, Wendy, will you start by telling everybody
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Speaker 2: who you are and what you do.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, thanks for having me, Penny. It's so good to
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Speaker 1: be here and to connect and I'm really grateful for
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Speaker 1: this conversation today. So hello listeners. I'm Wendy Snyder. I
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Speaker 1: am a powerful parenting educator, family life coach, and author
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Speaker 1: of the new book Frustrate Your Family. And to me,
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Speaker 1: a fresh start is really about having the humility, which
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Speaker 1: we really do believe is a superpower. Here at Freshdirt Family,
2:01
Speaker 1: mother Teresa talked about how humility can change the world,
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Speaker 1: and I agree with her, But having the humility to say, hmm,
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Speaker 1: there might have been some things that I inherited from
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Speaker 1: my own upbringing that I can see I'm now maybe
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Speaker 1: repeating with my own kids, and I want to change that,
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Speaker 1: Like it doesn't feel good. Maybe the ability or the
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Speaker 1: courage to raise your hand and say man, yesterday was
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Speaker 1: really a shit show. And I don't know if for
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Speaker 1: all to curse here petty, sorry, but go for it, okay,
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Speaker 1: good or like. I find that sometimes the lowest moments
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Speaker 1: as a parent or really as a human, actually, some
2:41
Speaker 1: of those lowest moments where it just feels dark and
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Speaker 1: heavy and it feels like what you're doing is air
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Speaker 1: quotes not working, those are often the most fertile ground
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Speaker 1: to be able to actually step into a next season
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Speaker 1: of support and get the help that you need to
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Speaker 1: do things differently. And here at for short family, we
3:01
Speaker 1: really focus on four main pillars. They're the same pillars
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Speaker 1: that I teach about in the book, but some of
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Speaker 1: the biggest ones are the ability to raise your hand
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Speaker 1: and get humble about wow, I've got some reactive tendencies.
3:14
Speaker 1: That was my story. I found this work when my
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Speaker 1: daughter was three. She's now eighteen, which is just wild
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Speaker 1: to have an adult child and that same strong will
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Speaker 1: that she was blessed with that I thought I was
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Speaker 1: going to lose my mind over and I really did
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Speaker 1: think something was air quotes wrong with her. That's before
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Speaker 1: I learned that uniqueness is a freaking gift. But she's
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Speaker 1: now eighteen, She's accomplished her dream of becoming a Division
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Speaker 1: one beach volleyball athlete at a top ten school in
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Speaker 1: the nation. She'll be headed to college this next fall,
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Speaker 1: and that is an accomplishment that I attest to this work.
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Speaker 1: So yes, she's amazing, But she was an undersized defender,
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Speaker 1: meaning that just means you're short and volleyball, and she
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Speaker 1: had a fight for that recruitment and that strong will
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Speaker 1: that we learn how to nurture and build up instead
4:03
Speaker 1: of break through the years.
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Speaker 2: That is one of.
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Speaker 1: The reasons why she was able to persevere and believe
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Speaker 1: in herself and really get this very hard to reach goal.
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Speaker 1: Less than one percent of high school athletes will become
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Speaker 1: Division IE athletes in college. But back then, and really
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Speaker 1: for a long time after I even got into this work,
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Speaker 1: reactive parenting was where I struggled. That's what I inherited,
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Speaker 1: So it took me eight years to stop yelling. I
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Speaker 1: was a not so gentle risk grabber and I always
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Speaker 1: have taught through story and taught through vulnerability because one
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Speaker 1: of my core values is that humility is a gift.
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Speaker 1: And I do tell the story in the book, but
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Speaker 1: I've also written an article called I Left Bruises and
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Speaker 1: I was a reactive parent and still actually to this day, Penny,
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Speaker 1: fifteen years in to this work, I still have moments
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Speaker 1: where I'm like, damn, I still have not you know,
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Speaker 1: air Quotes perfectly cured that reactivity, and that is okay
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Speaker 1: because we believe that there is no perfection in life
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Speaker 1: or parenting, but reactive to response to parenting is one
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Speaker 1: of our key pillars. Another area that we believe is
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Speaker 1: a gift when parents can raise their hand and say, hmmm,
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Speaker 1: pretty much doing the same thing that was done to
5:18
Speaker 1: me was in the realm of teaching kids how to
5:21
Speaker 1: do things differently tomorrow. So a lot of parents lean
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Speaker 1: on punishment versus discipline. So we teach a compassionate discipline
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Speaker 1: model here in pillar four the book, and that is
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Speaker 1: really different than nine out of ten of us what
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Speaker 1: we inherited as far as the punishment model time out
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Speaker 1: yanking technology. You know, a lot of parents still practice
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Speaker 1: corporal punishment, especially if they're in the higher control religious world.
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Speaker 1: And so that's one of the other places we see
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Speaker 1: parents have the courage to start fresh, wipe the slate clean,
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Speaker 1: and that's usually after like a really hard moment where
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Speaker 1: they realize I can't keep doing this. And then the
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Speaker 1: last main pillar that I talk about often is the
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Speaker 1: ability to see your children as a blessing exactly as
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Speaker 1: they are, not as you wish they were. So for me,
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Speaker 1: that was around my strong willed daughter and thinking that
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Speaker 1: if she just change, then my life would be easier,
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Speaker 1: and really it was the opposite. She has always been
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Speaker 1: like an angel to me. She is the person who
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Speaker 1: has called me into healing. She is the reason why
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Speaker 1: I'm here today. Her button pushing ability was what allowed
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Speaker 1: me to see the triggers that lie deep down inside
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Speaker 1: of me way before I had children and that just
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Speaker 1: never got healed. And going through those very triggering moments
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Speaker 1: with her allowed me to get the healing that I
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Speaker 1: needed to then be able to operate and see the
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Speaker 1: world in a different way. So that's kind of what
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Speaker 1: I think of when I think of a fresh start,
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Speaker 1: and that's what I write about a lot in the book.
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Speaker 1: Is there's all these strategies that we teach, and then
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Speaker 1: there's the deeper layers of limiting beliefs, triggers and behaviors
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Speaker 1: that a lot of us inherited, and you just you
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Speaker 1: just don't have to keep doing them. We call them
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Speaker 1: inherited hand me down parenting tactics and finding the courage
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Speaker 1: to say like, I'm so over this, I don't want
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Speaker 1: to do this anymore is actually really quite a fun adventure.
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Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's just the starting point. Right. Then you
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Speaker 2: have to do the work to actually be able to
7:22
Speaker 2: shift things for yourself, which is so hard. But I
7:25
Speaker 2: want to first get clear on timing. Is there a
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Speaker 2: like ideal time to make a fresh start? Is it
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Speaker 2: ever too late to make a fresh start?
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Speaker 1: Yeah?
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Speaker 2: What do you want parents to know about that?
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Speaker 1: Well, we'll start off by saying, heck, no, it is
7:43
Speaker 1: never too late, right, It's never too late to start
7:45
Speaker 1: a fresh I even we talk about this in our
7:47
Speaker 1: membership quite often, the freshwowt experience of how if you
7:50
Speaker 1: are somebody who were raised in a home, so say
7:54
Speaker 1: as an adult, if you were someone who was raised
7:56
Speaker 1: in a home where you know you did get grounded
7:59
Speaker 1: and shamed, that's wrong with you? Name called like you're
8:03
Speaker 1: being lazy, you're being entitled. Whatever your parents did in
8:06
Speaker 1: those triggered moments where they were just really trying to
8:09
Speaker 1: get you to behave differently, or maybe you grew up
8:12
Speaker 1: in a very reactive home where there was a lot
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Speaker 1: of fighting or maybe even corporal punishment, and your parents
8:19
Speaker 1: came to you at like the ripe old age of
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Speaker 1: seventy years old and said, you know what, I started
8:25
Speaker 1: reading a few books, and I'm now seeing a therapist
8:28
Speaker 1: every week, and I realized that I did some things
8:32
Speaker 1: that I wish I would have done differently, and now
8:35
Speaker 1: I'm learning a new way, and I want you to
8:38
Speaker 1: know that I'm stepping into a new season of education
8:41
Speaker 1: so I can do it differently with my grandkids. We
8:44
Speaker 1: would all be like, yes, we might have a little
8:47
Speaker 1: part of us, depending on the level of autocratic parenting
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Speaker 1: you were raised with a little part of it to
8:52
Speaker 1: be like, why couldn't you come to me thirty years
8:54
Speaker 1: or you know, seventy years earlier, or whatever, fifty years earlier,
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Speaker 1: But most of us would be like, thank you, thank you. Yes,
9:02
Speaker 1: I would love. I love that you're in therapy. I
9:04
Speaker 1: love that you're reading books. I love that you're opening
9:07
Speaker 1: your mind to understand how that isn't the way what
9:11
Speaker 1: actually happens is the opposite. For most of parents, most
9:15
Speaker 1: people in our community, you know, especially again if they're
9:18
Speaker 1: in the high control religious world, they have parents who
9:21
Speaker 1: like dig their feet in the mud and are like
9:24
Speaker 1: judging them for having compassion and you know doing they're
9:27
Speaker 1: like you. They'll watch from watch from Afar and say,
9:31
Speaker 1: you know, you really should be harder on your kids,
9:33
Speaker 1: or you really should punish them. Right, They'll kind of
9:35
Speaker 1: be the fishbowl. And then of course we have we
9:37
Speaker 1: do have parents that are incredibly supportive. But point being,
9:42
Speaker 1: you can imagine that scenario. Right, So if you have
9:44
Speaker 1: a teenager and you all have some patterns that are
9:48
Speaker 1: pretty ingrained and you step into this work, sure is
9:52
Speaker 1: it going to be a higher degree of difficulty to
9:55
Speaker 1: start changing those patterns Versus if you do it like
9:59
Speaker 1: the girl scenario is you learn, you read a book
10:02
Speaker 1: like this and you learn this work before then you
10:05
Speaker 1: have kids, you have a baby. Yeah, right, Like all
10:08
Speaker 1: my years, thousands and thousands of students, I've felt I've
10:12
Speaker 1: had one couple, one couple when I first started teaching
10:15
Speaker 1: and I would teach out of my house. One couple
10:17
Speaker 1: that did it when they were pregnant, right like maybe two.
10:20
Speaker 1: I can think of someone who messaged me online. But
10:23
Speaker 1: I mean it's just not the norm. That is my
10:25
Speaker 1: vision for the future that this kind of work is
10:28
Speaker 1: required in high school and college like.
10:30
Speaker 2: One oh one human ing.
10:32
Speaker 1: But it's just not the case, right. So many of
10:34
Speaker 1: us get it once we're in crisis. So for me,
10:36
Speaker 1: that looked like my kid was three. I had her
10:39
Speaker 1: in time out seventeen times a day. I was starting
10:42
Speaker 1: to spank her because everyone and their mother told me
10:45
Speaker 1: that's just what you do, that'll fix it fast. And
10:48
Speaker 1: I was miserable. I was blaming her for all my stress.
10:52
Speaker 1: So that was my crisis moment right where I was like,
10:54
Speaker 1: can I write about that in the book? Really in
10:56
Speaker 1: the intro of the moment, I set on the hardwood
10:59
Speaker 1: floor at five o'clock at night and left a six
11:02
Speaker 1: minute message from my sister in law saying I'm miserable
11:05
Speaker 1: as Stella was screaming. The baby was screaming, and I
11:08
Speaker 1: was like, I'm miserable. This is not what I signed
11:10
Speaker 1: up for. How did I get here? But other people
11:13
Speaker 1: might hit that rock bottom moment and finally step into
11:16
Speaker 1: a new way when their kids are like eight and thirteen,
11:19
Speaker 1: right or whatever. It doesn't matter, But of course it
11:22
Speaker 1: is a higher degree of difficulty as your kids get older.
11:25
Speaker 1: Because of the ingrained patterns. Right, Like we talk a
11:28
Speaker 1: lot about the nervous system here, and the nervous system.
11:31
Speaker 1: The more years you've been doing something, you know it's
11:34
Speaker 1: going to be a little bit more effort and intention
11:37
Speaker 1: to unwind those patterns, for example, yelling exactly. But it's
11:42
Speaker 1: always it's like it's part of adulting. It's like, yeah,
11:45
Speaker 1: what else are we going to do in life? Right? Like,
11:47
Speaker 1: I know we all have a million things to do,
11:49
Speaker 1: but I really see this work as a fun adventure
11:51
Speaker 1: to challenge yourself of Like, if you have an intention
11:55
Speaker 1: and a calling put on your heart and you are
11:58
Speaker 1: willing to see, like, wow, I've got some things I
12:02
Speaker 1: want to change, dive in. Dive in because it will
12:06
Speaker 1: be something that you never regret. Like if you dive
12:09
Speaker 1: in and you decide to make a fresh start and
12:12
Speaker 1: for example, replace punishment with discipline and your kids are
12:14
Speaker 1: like eight years old or thirteen and fifteen, you will
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Speaker 1: look back one day and thank yourself even though it
12:21
Speaker 1: took a lot of effort.
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Speaker 2: Mm hmm. There's always things that we don't know yet.
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Speaker 2: You know. One of the big reliefs for me and
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Speaker 2: my own self blame and shame as a parent was
12:34
Speaker 2: my Angelou's quote. You know, when you know better, you
12:37
Speaker 2: do better. And I'm like, okay, I really didn't know then.
12:41
Speaker 2: I did do these things that I really wish I
12:43
Speaker 2: hadn't as a parent. But now I know better, so
12:48
Speaker 2: going for it. I'm going to do better. And that
12:50
Speaker 2: really came as a relief for me, and in a mantra.
12:54
Speaker 2: There were so many days where I was like, I'm
12:56
Speaker 2: not going to get stuck in that, even though I'm
12:59
Speaker 2: feeling bad about it, because I know I didn't know
13:02
Speaker 2: any different. I was doing what people were telling me
13:04
Speaker 2: to do. Like I was told that I had to
13:07
Speaker 2: take all of his toys out of his room and
13:09
Speaker 2: he could earn them back one at a time. He
13:11
Speaker 2: was like four or five. It was horrific. Like I
13:15
Speaker 2: still he's twenty three now, and I still beat myself
13:19
Speaker 2: up about that thing because it was just it's not
13:22
Speaker 2: at all who I am. But I was listening to
13:26
Speaker 2: therapists and you know, doing the things that people were
13:29
Speaker 2: telling me to do. Now I know better, I would never,
13:32
Speaker 2: you know, advise anybody to do that. I would never
13:35
Speaker 2: do anything like that now. But I think our kids
13:38
Speaker 2: are like this opportunity if we let it be to
13:43
Speaker 2: help us grow and help us be the person that
13:46
Speaker 2: we actually want to be. Like if I hadn't had
13:49
Speaker 2: a neurodiversent kid, would I be nearly as compassionate and
13:53
Speaker 2: empathetic about somebody some stranger's kids screaming in the grocery store?
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Speaker 1: You know?
13:58
Speaker 2: I don't think like, oh my gosh, I wish they
14:00
Speaker 2: would get their kid to shut up. I think I
14:03
Speaker 2: wonder why that kid is struggling right now, right, and
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Speaker 2: it breaks my heart instead of getting irritated by it.
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Speaker 2: I wouldn't be that person if it weren't for my kid, right, So, and.
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Speaker 1: You wouldn't have gone on to help thousands and thousands
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Speaker 1: of other parents learn the same skill.
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Speaker 2: Yeah, if I hadn't learned it, I couldn't share it,
14:21
Speaker 2: right So?
14:22
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah I agree. And also I will add two
14:25
Speaker 1: penny that in our world, I don't know about yours too,
14:28
Speaker 1: but I assume in our world it's like I love
14:30
Speaker 1: that maya angela quote right, no better do better? And
14:34
Speaker 1: we also have a lot of students and this was
14:37
Speaker 1: my story too, where even once we knew better, we
14:40
Speaker 1: weren't able to do better because of the nervous system
14:43
Speaker 1: setting right, So that's that's like an important thing is
14:48
Speaker 1: like the do better part is once you are, you will,
14:53
Speaker 1: but until you really heal the nervous system, you'll keep
14:57
Speaker 1: doing that other stuff. And they important part is is
15:01
Speaker 1: to get out of the shame pattern of beating yourself up,
15:04
Speaker 1: because as Brene Brown teaches us right and her social
15:07
Speaker 1: research has proven to us, which I do cite and
15:09
Speaker 1: talk about in the book, is it will keep us
15:12
Speaker 1: stuck in repeating and in our community, we have a
15:14
Speaker 1: lot of repetitive stuff, and then people will beat themselves
15:18
Speaker 1: up because they know they know better, right logically, they're like,
15:23
Speaker 1: I know I shouldn't yell. I don't want to yell
15:26
Speaker 1: it's not effective, or punishing right, or grabbing risks too tight,
15:30
Speaker 1: and then damn it, I did it.
15:33
Speaker 2: I did it.
15:33
Speaker 1: And so then we get to do the compassion work
15:35
Speaker 1: of like there's a whole part in the book about
15:38
Speaker 1: that of like how do you actually work through that?
15:41
Speaker 1: And that is going to be in a way where
15:44
Speaker 1: it effectively reduces the chances that you're going to do
15:47
Speaker 1: it again tomorrow, because ninety nine percent of what kids learn.
15:51
Speaker 2: Is caught, not taught.
15:52
Speaker 1: YEP, So we are the most important vessel for their
15:57
Speaker 1: behavior change.
15:59
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, and that you know, knowing something and being
16:04
Speaker 2: able to implement it or integrate it in your real
16:06
Speaker 2: life for two different things. And like we know the
16:10
Speaker 2: nervous system is wired for protection and we are literally
16:14
Speaker 2: wired to give back whatever we are receiving. So if
16:18
Speaker 2: your kid is yelling at you, your body is wired
16:22
Speaker 2: to yell back. Like it's science that makes you do it.
16:27
Speaker 2: And I think that was a relief point for me
16:30
Speaker 2: where I could be more compassionate with myself about it
16:32
Speaker 2: when I learned that this is actually what we're built
16:35
Speaker 2: to do, and what we're asking of ourselves and other
16:38
Speaker 2: parents is to override that instinct and be able to
16:43
Speaker 2: do it differently. That takes a lot of work, It
16:46
Speaker 2: takes a lot of practice, and it takes a lot
16:47
Speaker 2: of time. Like I've had so many parents over the
16:50
Speaker 2: years go well, it's just not that easy. I can't
16:52
Speaker 2: just like snap my fingers and not be reactive anymore.
16:55
Speaker 2: And I'm like, that's you're right, that's not what I'm
16:57
Speaker 2: telling you at all. Like, yeah, it took me years
17:00
Speaker 2: to undo as you're talking about, undo the learned patterns,
17:05
Speaker 2: undo the belief that what our society and culture tells
17:09
Speaker 2: us about parenting is true or true for us and
17:13
Speaker 2: our kids right and the way that we were parented.
17:20
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17:23
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17:31
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17:34
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17:39
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17:47
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18:11
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Speaker 2: a lot of families come to me and say, a
18:58
Speaker 2: grandparent or an aunt or an uncle or a sibling
19:02
Speaker 2: of theirs saying, well, if you would just you know,
19:06
Speaker 2: punish them more, if you would just do this or that,
19:08
Speaker 2: And it's so defeating for them, and it's just because
19:13
Speaker 2: they don't get it.
19:14
Speaker 1: Infuriating.
19:15
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, they don't get it in the way that
19:18
Speaker 2: you do. Now. They don't have the understanding yet and
19:21
Speaker 2: they may never they may not be willing.
19:23
Speaker 1: Even the air quotes experts.
19:24
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
19:26
Speaker 1: I had a woman last week who I think she
19:29
Speaker 1: was in our membership for a little bit, but she
19:31
Speaker 1: was an example of a student that like didn't stay
19:34
Speaker 1: consistent and didn't stay in the work right. And so
19:37
Speaker 1: we all know that, like, you can hop in and
19:39
Speaker 1: learn a few things, but this work as we're talking about,
19:41
Speaker 1: like it really it really you got to find a
19:44
Speaker 1: community that you like and stay in there and see
19:47
Speaker 1: it through and bless your heart, but she was like,
19:50
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, tell me what to do. I'm not
19:52
Speaker 1: in the membership anymore. And she was asking for coaching
19:55
Speaker 1: an email, which was not going to happen, right, And
19:56
Speaker 1: we just got to compassionately invite her back into the membership.
20:00
Speaker 1: But it's like, I got this thirteen year old. Now
20:02
Speaker 1: you know, I try to do this. But now the
20:04
Speaker 1: in home she called it an in home therapist or counselor.
20:07
Speaker 1: We have an in home therapist That felt like it
20:10
Speaker 1: was assigned by the doctor or something for this thirteen
20:14
Speaker 1: year old who has ADHD, And this in home counselor
20:17
Speaker 1: therapist kept saying, you need to take away the xbox
20:21
Speaker 1: and she was like, I thought, I'm not supposed to
20:23
Speaker 1: do that because what we teach is literally the polar opposite.
20:27
Speaker 1: And I'm just like, how are there still experts air
20:30
Speaker 1: quote experts being hired or written the referrals by pediatricians
20:36
Speaker 1: or I don't know. Sometimes in our world it can
20:40
Speaker 1: be like really twisted, high control circles that assign these
20:43
Speaker 1: type of counselors. But in this sure felt like it
20:46
Speaker 1: was actually through the medical system that this person had
20:49
Speaker 1: been assigned this counselor so yes, it's the grandparents, but
20:52
Speaker 1: it's also these so called experts, and it is it's
20:56
Speaker 1: so defeating because we know people like you, know, teachers
20:59
Speaker 1: like you, and I know that it is so ineffective.
21:02
Speaker 1: It does not work long term. And what you're describing
21:05
Speaker 1: about the nervous system that like innate, perfect design of
21:08
Speaker 1: our human bodies to protect ourselves, to fight, back, to flight,
21:14
Speaker 1: to freeze, whatever it may be. It is so important
21:17
Speaker 1: that we honor the body and say thank you. Like
21:20
Speaker 1: that and that fight you're talking about when a kid
21:22
Speaker 1: is in your face and you're like, your nervous system
21:25
Speaker 1: is like fight back, yell back. A. Yes, it's often
21:29
Speaker 1: because we watch somebody do that when we were young, right,
21:32
Speaker 1: But b it's this trained feeling of like a bear
21:36
Speaker 1: is chasing you, there is a four alarm fire, the
21:39
Speaker 1: house is burning down, do something fast, and as you
21:43
Speaker 1: were saying, to override that without shaming ourselves, like the
21:48
Speaker 1: body is perfect. The body is not doing anything wrong.
21:51
Speaker 1: It is the nervous system is doing exactly what it should.
21:54
Speaker 1: And it's a whole process we write about in the
21:57
Speaker 1: book to come beside the nervous system and say thank
22:00
Speaker 1: you for keeping me safe, and I am a fully
22:03
Speaker 1: grown human. I am not the same as my mother
22:07
Speaker 1: or my father, and I can see my child not
22:10
Speaker 1: as the enemy and not as the bear, but just
22:14
Speaker 1: as a human soul child who is unique, who has
22:19
Speaker 1: special whatever, Like I am going to see him in
22:23
Speaker 1: a way that is going to allow me to step
22:25
Speaker 1: to the side, do the stop side or the pause button,
22:28
Speaker 1: create that stimulus space between the stimulus and the response.
22:31
Speaker 1: But yeah, what a journey it is to like be
22:34
Speaker 1: the system interrupt for your own nervous system.
22:36
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm so glad you brought it up to you
22:38
Speaker 2: about thanking your nervous system because it's something that I
22:42
Speaker 2: have started trying to do for anxiety, Like, Okay, thank
22:46
Speaker 2: you for trying to keep me safe, but I have
22:50
Speaker 2: considered the situation and I actually am safe right now,
22:54
Speaker 2: and something to help you know that anxiety reactivity to
22:58
Speaker 2: sort of calm itself. And it's not a fix, Like
23:01
Speaker 2: you're not going to say that to yourself and the
23:03
Speaker 2: your nervous system is going to go huh okay, right,
23:05
Speaker 2: Like it's a process, but it helps. It's a piece
23:09
Speaker 2: of it. And I think too that when we can
23:12
Speaker 2: model that for our kids, like we're not teaching kids
23:16
Speaker 2: about their nervous system, about regulation, about emotional intelligence, and
23:24
Speaker 2: why not. I don't understand why not? Right Like I
23:27
Speaker 2: was in my forties, My kids were teenagers when I
23:31
Speaker 2: learned this, And I think that speaks too to the
23:34
Speaker 2: to the reason that there's a lot of experts out
23:36
Speaker 2: there who are still teaching more traditional, antiquated ways because
23:41
Speaker 2: that's what they were taught to do. Only in the
23:43
Speaker 2: last decade, I think, are we teaching people in psychology
23:48
Speaker 2: and stuff like that that the nervous system is a
23:51
Speaker 2: big part of this, you know, and that to me,
23:54
Speaker 2: it's crucial to me. Without understanding your body and your
23:58
Speaker 2: nervous system, you're not going to be able to really
24:02
Speaker 2: work through very much. It's true because it's such a
24:05
Speaker 2: core piece of it. It is so you know, modeling
24:09
Speaker 2: that for our kids is huge.
24:12
Speaker 1: Modeling is the hardest, damn it. It's also the most powerful.
24:18
Speaker 2: Yeah, it is so powerful, And what a.
24:21
Speaker 1: Journey to be able to see I am responsible for
24:25
Speaker 1: so much the co creation of my life and at
24:28
Speaker 1: the very same time not live in shame of like
24:33
Speaker 1: self blame right like of like, oh there's something wrong
24:36
Speaker 1: with me because my kids reacted because I'm reactive. It's like, no,
24:40
Speaker 1: there's nothing wrong with me. This was the literally for
24:42
Speaker 1: so many of us. It is the family lineage, and
24:46
Speaker 1: it is one of the most powerful feelings on the
24:48
Speaker 1: planet when you become a system interrupter and you become
24:53
Speaker 1: the one who has broke the chain. But man, it
24:57
Speaker 1: is quite a journey.
24:58
Speaker 2: It's difficult and.
25:00
Speaker 1: And I think also that when it comes to modeling
25:02
Speaker 1: and having compassion for yourself to take the blinders off,
25:06
Speaker 1: because a lot of parents will never be willing to
25:08
Speaker 1: take the blinders off. They will go to their grave
25:11
Speaker 1: justifying their behavior and will never come to that point
25:14
Speaker 1: where they're like, oh, I see the contribution to the dance.
25:19
Speaker 1: And it really just puts you into the true power
25:22
Speaker 1: seat because you're able to change so much of your
25:25
Speaker 1: environment and your children too when you change yourself versus
25:30
Speaker 1: thinking that you're going to change your kids. I really
25:33
Speaker 1: believe we were not designed to control other human beings.
25:37
Speaker 1: And that's why all those old school things fall flat,
25:40
Speaker 1: is because they are based in power over or control
25:44
Speaker 1: and it just doesn't work, especially for neurodivergent or strong
25:48
Speaker 1: woled kids. It just kind of blows up in your
25:51
Speaker 1: face quite often because they are so good at raising
25:54
Speaker 1: the red flag on ineffective systems.
25:58
Speaker 2: I love that you use the word dance because immediately
26:01
Speaker 2: I thought, as parents, we set the tempo, we set
26:05
Speaker 2: the rhythm. We you know, we determine if it's going
26:09
Speaker 2: to be a fast, angry song or if it's going
26:11
Speaker 2: to be you know, peaceful or whatever, right like, and
26:15
Speaker 2: that impacts their nervous system. Like what we haven't said
26:19
Speaker 2: yet is coregulation. We haven't talked about that, but the
26:22
Speaker 2: way that we show up also is information to their
26:26
Speaker 2: nervous system and whether or not it feels that they
26:28
Speaker 2: are safe. And so the impact is greater than just
26:33
Speaker 2: our experience or the way we parent. It's also the
26:38
Speaker 2: anchor the safety that we provide to our kids.
26:42
Speaker 1: I agree. And that's that temperature so to speak. You
26:46
Speaker 1: said tempo. I often will talk about, like the temperature
26:50
Speaker 1: in our home, and like, especially when it comes to
26:52
Speaker 1: the nervous system. Our nervous system's really soaked up the
26:56
Speaker 1: temperature of our home the first decade or two, definitely
27:00
Speaker 1: first decade, also the second decade of like what happened
27:04
Speaker 1: when there was imperfection? What happened when there was mistakes
27:07
Speaker 1: made what happened when there was a disagreement or one
27:12
Speaker 1: person wouldn't didn't want to do what another person did
27:15
Speaker 1: like that temperature. Was it safe to actually have conflict
27:20
Speaker 1: in your home? Like? Did people handle it with grace
27:23
Speaker 1: and dignity and self regulation and effective peaceful conflict resolution?
27:27
Speaker 1: Most of us would laugh at that. The answer is no, right,
27:30
Speaker 1: like like I grew up in a home where and
27:34
Speaker 1: this echoes a lot for my students. It was either
27:37
Speaker 1: like giant fight, screaming, yelling, shaming right like yeah, or
27:43
Speaker 1: it was just like suppression, like people would retreat and
27:48
Speaker 1: then just be bitter and resentful inside but never really
27:52
Speaker 1: like work through the challenge, right and then mistakes they
27:57
Speaker 1: were just dealt within the classic way. I actually my
28:00
Speaker 1: little my little guy, well he's fifteen and sixteen now,
28:04
Speaker 1: but he has a new girlfriend and she got grounded
28:07
Speaker 1: this last weekend because she snuck out. She actually she
28:11
Speaker 1: got grounded and then she got her phone taken away.
28:13
Speaker 1: Because that's the classic these days, right, Like so much
28:15
Speaker 1: compassion to those of you still doing that. Let us
28:17
Speaker 1: teach you a new way. I promise you it's not
28:20
Speaker 1: going to work to change the behavior and I remembered.
28:22
Speaker 1: I was laughing because I'm like, oh my gosh, Karen,
28:25
Speaker 1: that's my son's name. I go, I remember sneaking out
28:29
Speaker 1: at that exact same age, exact same thing happened to me.
28:32
Speaker 1: I got grounded. I didn't have a phone to get
28:34
Speaker 1: taken away. And guess what, I just got better at
28:38
Speaker 1: hiding nice, speaking out at hiding right. And he knows
28:43
Speaker 1: to this day. He goes, I don't know why they're
28:45
Speaker 1: doing it. He goes, he goes, it's not going to
28:47
Speaker 1: change anything, mom, And I'm like, it won't. And he said,
28:50
Speaker 1: I didn't tell her tell your mom to call my mom.
28:55
Speaker 2: I bet that was well received.
28:56
Speaker 1: This is the second girlfriend he's had.
28:59
Speaker 2: Oh, oh gosh.
29:00
Speaker 1: Yeah. The first one like I like was like, hey,
29:03
Speaker 1: here's a podcast episode. I can support you to tea
29:06
Speaker 1: to do it differently, and it was like crickets And
29:08
Speaker 1: this one, I'm sure she'll never reach out. But yeah,
29:11
Speaker 1: I don't know how we went on that rift.
29:13
Speaker 2: But yeah, doing it differently, Like oh.
29:16
Speaker 1: Yeah, the temperature of your home growing up, what was
29:19
Speaker 1: it like? Yeah, yeah, I remember the night I came
29:21
Speaker 1: home when I snuck out that night, Oh my god,
29:24
Speaker 1: all the lights were on in my house. We came
29:26
Speaker 1: home and we were like, uh, oh right. We were thirteen, twelve,
29:29
Speaker 1: thirteen years old, maybe fourteen, and it was like shame central, right,
29:34
Speaker 1: it was like, wal are you're thinking?
29:36
Speaker 2: Way? Was I worried?
29:37
Speaker 1: Whereas now, if I was teaching a family, and if
29:40
Speaker 1: that would have happened to me, I would have known
29:43
Speaker 1: that I could do it a different way. I could
29:46
Speaker 1: have just been like, hey, like if that happened to
29:48
Speaker 1: me as a parent, the way I would teach it
29:50
Speaker 1: is like everyone's going to go to sleep. I was
29:52
Speaker 1: so scared, I am definitely angry, and everyone's going to
29:57
Speaker 1: go to sleep. We're going to talk about this in
29:59
Speaker 1: the morning. But like I would speak emotional literacy, I
30:03
Speaker 1: would make it very clear, like how scared, hurt, and
30:06
Speaker 1: angry I was, and then we would go to bed,
30:08
Speaker 1: go to good night's rest now that everyone was home,
30:10
Speaker 1: and then we would work through the life skill the
30:13
Speaker 1: next day to like, tell me what happened, what were
30:16
Speaker 1: you thinking? This is the reason why we have such
30:19
Speaker 1: firm boundaries, And then we would do logical consequences to
30:21
Speaker 1: teach an important life skill versus just what's wrong with you?
30:25
Speaker 1: Shame on you. You're such a bad kid, and now
30:28
Speaker 1: you're grounded and you're going to have everything you love
30:30
Speaker 1: taken away from you for three days, and that's really
30:33
Speaker 1: going to do the trick, right, So.
30:35
Speaker 2: All that does is pushing them further away from us. Yeah, yeah,
30:38
Speaker 2: I was raised in a very ultra Christian household, and
30:43
Speaker 2: you oh yes, And you know I went and tried
30:47
Speaker 2: all the evil things as soon as I could, right
30:50
Speaker 2: as soon as somebody said come here, you know, try this,
30:55
Speaker 2: and I did. And then I you know, couldn't wait
30:57
Speaker 2: to move out of the house and imised myself. Once
31:02
Speaker 2: I matured and quit that ridiculous behavior that was not
31:07
Speaker 2: safe and was not helpful, I could look back and
31:11
Speaker 2: realize that forbidding things from people makes them want to
31:17
Speaker 2: do them more. Pretending to be perfect, like you know,
31:22
Speaker 2: religion gives us this perfect thing that we have to
31:25
Speaker 2: be right. And you know, my sister recently said to me,
31:30
Speaker 2: our parents never fought, and I'm like, yeah, they did,
31:34
Speaker 2: of course they did. They just didn't do it in
31:36
Speaker 2: front of us because they wanted this like perfect perception,
31:40
Speaker 2: you know, And it creates kids who think that they
31:44
Speaker 2: can never measure up right and we're so you know,
31:49
Speaker 2: I vowed very early on to be completely transparent and
31:53
Speaker 2: completely human with my kids. So you know, if you
31:58
Speaker 2: want to try alcohol, we're going to do it at home,
32:01
Speaker 2: and you're going to be safe when you do it,
32:04
Speaker 2: and we're going to talk about you know, the pros
32:07
Speaker 2: and the cons and all the things that you need
32:09
Speaker 2: to know. And neither of my kids went out partying.
32:14
Speaker 2: Not that that was the only reason, but you know,
32:16
Speaker 2: I was so much more like, yeah, this is an option,
32:20
Speaker 2: it's available. You know, let's be realistic and real about things.
32:26
Speaker 2: Or you know, when I'm frustrated and I'm having a
32:29
Speaker 2: hard time with something, not hiding that away so that
32:33
Speaker 2: they realize. Oh, like even my parents struggles with their
32:37
Speaker 2: emotions sometimes and this is how they handle it, right,
32:41
Speaker 2: Like that sort of modeling, like just lean into being
32:45
Speaker 2: human and letting your kids see it, and that alone
32:48
Speaker 2: will make a lot of difference, I think. But yeah,
32:52
Speaker 2: I was in a very restrictive household. All the short
32:56
Speaker 2: skirts in the world had to go back to the
32:58
Speaker 2: mall man. I mean, my dad was like, it has
33:02
Speaker 2: to cover your knees. And let me tell you, in
33:05
Speaker 2: the late eighties early nineties, they were not covering your knees.
33:10
Speaker 1: Many were probably dropped right into the youth group, which
33:12
Speaker 1: was the highest likelihood of sexual assault. Oh, I know,
33:17
Speaker 1: I'm not laughing at that.
33:18
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm not laughing at that.
33:20
Speaker 1: But it's just it's so I work with so many
33:23
Speaker 1: beautiful families who are coming out of high control religion
33:26
Speaker 1: or choosing to find a healthier, faith filled circle, and
33:29
Speaker 1: it is infuriating the hypocrisy and the beliefs that certain
33:34
Speaker 1: things will keep your kids safe when the data and
33:37
Speaker 1: the research really shows that the actual harmful you know,
33:42
Speaker 1: exposure is happening. So, yeah, that's that's wild. You mentioned
33:46
Speaker 1: that alcohol thing. Yeah, we've had the same experience. And
33:49
Speaker 1: I will add that the reason why I think our
33:51
Speaker 1: kids didn't have this big rebellion thing is because of
33:55
Speaker 1: the relationship. We talk a lot about how rules plus
33:57
Speaker 1: relationship equals respect, and so the relationship you had with
34:01
Speaker 1: your son, the relationship I had with my daughter, how
34:04
Speaker 1: we did make mistakes and then make amends, right, Like,
34:07
Speaker 1: that's an important part of it. Like we're not just
34:08
Speaker 1: saying let your kids see you be in perfect and whatever.
34:11
Speaker 1: It's like be imperfect, right, Like, let them see you
34:14
Speaker 1: fight with your husband and then or whoever, and then
34:18
Speaker 1: make amends. Let them watch you clean things up, right.
34:21
Speaker 1: But with the alcohol thing, we took the same approach.
34:23
Speaker 1: And we went to Mexico for my husband's fiftieth last
34:26
Speaker 1: summer and Stella was like, she's eight. She well, no,
34:29
Speaker 1: she was seventeen at the time, but she was like,
34:31
Speaker 1: can my best friend and I can we get some tequila?
34:33
Speaker 1: And we were like, yeah, sure, you just well obviously
34:35
Speaker 1: we'll be at home together. Terry and I quit drinking
34:38
Speaker 1: three years ago when Stella started experimenting with drinking, and
34:41
Speaker 1: we were a little freaked out. She was a high
34:43
Speaker 1: level athlete, and we looked at ourselves and we were like, okay, hypocrisy,
34:48
Speaker 1: Like we have been literal fish for three decades. I
34:51
Speaker 1: think it's time. Let's model to Stella what it looks
34:55
Speaker 1: like to not need to have a substance, right, and
34:58
Speaker 1: it's time. It's time. So I said, let's quit. So
35:01
Speaker 1: it's been three and a half years. We've never felt better.
35:03
Speaker 1: But we said to her, sure, like you can spend
35:05
Speaker 1: your own money. I'm not going to buy it. You
35:07
Speaker 1: can spend your own money. So they bought this beautiful
35:09
Speaker 1: tequila bottle in Mexico, and I swear it was like
35:13
Speaker 1: nighte seven and we were like, are you guys gonna
35:15
Speaker 1: drink that? And they were like, yeah, I don't even
35:18
Speaker 1: know if we open it, we won't need like we might.
35:21
Speaker 1: I don't know if we can take it home. So
35:23
Speaker 1: then they brought it home and it's set on our counter.
35:26
Speaker 1: Penny and still is in a party group, like I've
35:29
Speaker 1: taken the angle of a lot, like micromanaging her friends.
35:32
Speaker 1: I love that she has diversified friends. She's got stoner friends,
35:36
Speaker 1: she's got friends at party's, she doesn't really have that
35:38
Speaker 1: many athlete friends that live the same life. It's set
35:41
Speaker 1: on the counter for so long that we were like,
35:44
Speaker 1: what is happening. We're like if we were if we
35:47
Speaker 1: were seventeen, we were keg parties every weekend. We weren't
35:51
Speaker 1: doing anything to get out of the house. The way
35:54
Speaker 1: I see it now is we were so desperate for
35:57
Speaker 1: belonging in power because we didn't have it with our pans.
36:00
Speaker 1: It's like on the surface level air quotes, it was
36:02
Speaker 1: airques fine, but really I didn't have the connection that
36:05
Speaker 1: I wanted with my parents. I didn't have relationship. I
36:07
Speaker 1: didn't feel safe. I didn't feel like I belong. There
36:10
Speaker 1: was still this type of punishment and shame going on.
36:13
Speaker 1: So anytime I got out of the house, I was
36:14
Speaker 1: like later. And so just the real life efficacy of
36:19
Speaker 1: what we're talking about, I just want to let the
36:21
Speaker 1: listeners know we're not just like, oh, it's a cool
36:24
Speaker 1: idea to like really have safety in your house and
36:27
Speaker 1: teach your kids' life skills. No, it actually works like
36:31
Speaker 1: that tequila set on the counter, I want to say,
36:34
Speaker 1: for at least six months before finally she took some
36:37
Speaker 1: party and they were going she was going to contribute
36:39
Speaker 1: or something, and I think she probably was even eighteen
36:41
Speaker 1: by that time, which I think is a big win
36:44
Speaker 1: for teenagers to like have tequila sit on the counter
36:47
Speaker 1: for it's huge six to eight months and not even.
36:50
Speaker 2: It's huge, huge, right you had said it's pretty well, no,
36:53
Speaker 2: absolutely not. You cannot taste any alcohol until you were
36:56
Speaker 2: twenty one. What would have happened She and her friend
37:00
Speaker 2: would have immediately went and got something somehow and drink
37:04
Speaker 2: some of it, like exactly.
37:06
Speaker 1: We Yeah, it's interesting.
37:09
Speaker 2: We need to let kids find their path, like you know,
37:12
Speaker 2: part of that control asppearance is also it comes from
37:17
Speaker 2: the best of intentions, It comes from wanting the best
37:20
Speaker 2: for them, but we end up trying to guide what
37:24
Speaker 2: they become, and we can't actually do that. They are
37:28
Speaker 2: their own person. So when we try to do that,
37:31
Speaker 2: we end up forcing the kinds of things that we
37:33
Speaker 2: don't want, a rift in the relationship, them not coming
37:36
Speaker 2: and talking to us about things. You know, self medicating
37:39
Speaker 2: is a thing. I have social anxiety and so for me,
37:44
Speaker 2: substances really helped with that. And also it was like, no,
37:50
Speaker 2: you can't do this, this and this, It's terrible, it's evil.
37:55
Speaker 2: So I went and did this, this and this right
37:57
Speaker 2: as soon as I could. And yeah, doing it differently?
38:01
Speaker 1: Why not?
38:02
Speaker 2: Why not?
38:03
Speaker 1: I know, I know it's such a journey, but it
38:07
Speaker 1: is really so interesting to see how effective it is
38:12
Speaker 1: to have the relationship where you're not living in this
38:15
Speaker 1: hypocritical better than thou place, but also standing very firm
38:20
Speaker 1: in your wisdom. Right, Like, there's also like we're talking
38:24
Speaker 1: about kind of these like someone might see that as
38:26
Speaker 1: like looser boundaries, but then we also really have dove
38:31
Speaker 1: deep into actual research and education around what is going
38:34
Speaker 1: to keep our kids safe and what are the strong
38:37
Speaker 1: boundaries that are. You know, you're going to put your
38:40
Speaker 1: quotes foot down on some things, but you do it
38:42
Speaker 1: with relationship is the big thing, and that's just what
38:45
Speaker 1: most parents aren't used to. You put your foot down
38:49
Speaker 1: around a boundary, but then you do it with fear
38:51
Speaker 1: and intimidation or threats that if they don't listen, something
38:54
Speaker 1: bad it's going to happen, versus education on why the
38:59
Speaker 1: boundary exists in our world these days, it's a lot
39:02
Speaker 1: around technology, it's around safety, it's around telling the truth,
39:06
Speaker 1: it's around peer pressure. You know, the earlier you can
39:10
Speaker 1: start it is better, right, Like if you can, if
39:14
Speaker 1: you hear this information and you got little ones, you know,
39:17
Speaker 1: just just dive in as early as you can. I
39:19
Speaker 1: really do teach all of this stuff inside the book,
39:22
Speaker 1: and I tell so many stories. We're not just giving
39:25
Speaker 1: the how to, but we are really I really tried
39:27
Speaker 1: to give as many stories as possible to show you
39:30
Speaker 1: here's what it looks like in real life.
39:33
Speaker 2: I love that we've had such a real conversation together
39:36
Speaker 2: today and that we're sharing it with people, like, that's
39:39
Speaker 2: what you know matters, that's what is relatable and that's memorable.
39:45
Speaker 2: So you know, I think it makes a greater impact
39:48
Speaker 2: sometimes when do you tell everybody where they can find
39:51
Speaker 2: the book. I know it's in pre order right now.
39:53
Speaker 2: Let them know when it's going to come out and
39:55
Speaker 2: where they can find you online.
39:57
Speaker 1: Thank you, Penny. Yes, pre order help authors so much,
40:02
Speaker 1: so much so you can order anywhere books are sold.
40:06
Speaker 1: But then we have a pre order page a fresh
40:09
Speaker 1: Start Family online dot com forward slash pre order. Once
40:12
Speaker 1: you place your order, come and give us your order
40:15
Speaker 1: number because we have some really great bonuses for you.
40:17
Speaker 1: We have a really beautiful journal and implementation guide that
40:23
Speaker 1: has a value of forty five dollars. We will be
40:25
Speaker 1: selling that for forty five dollars once the book has published,
40:28
Speaker 1: and so you get to get it for free for
40:30
Speaker 1: now when you pre order, and you still won't be
40:32
Speaker 1: charged till May twenty six. So this I think is
40:35
Speaker 1: the most perfect Mother's Day gift and thank you, just
40:40
Speaker 1: thank you. In advance pre orders really help authors. You know,
40:42
Speaker 1: places like Amazon, Target, Brens, and Noble they place orders
40:47
Speaker 1: based on our pre order numbers as authors. So that's
40:50
Speaker 1: a great place to come find us. Instagram, I'm Freshhirt Wendy.
40:53
Speaker 1: Our podcast is the fresh Start Family show, and then
40:55
Speaker 1: the last thing I will say. I know, Penny, you
40:58
Speaker 1: and I have talked so much about how neurodiverse kids.
41:02
Speaker 1: You know, most of them are like strong wild kids.
41:05
Speaker 1: And really we specialize in strong wild kids here, seeing
41:08
Speaker 1: the beauty in them, seeing them as blessings not curses,
41:11
Speaker 1: and really helping families understand how they can work with
41:15
Speaker 1: a strong wild kid in a way that actually causes
41:18
Speaker 1: them to want to listen and cooperate instead of being
41:22
Speaker 1: forced to listen at cooperate. So we have a really
41:24
Speaker 1: great learning bundle they can download at Frshhratfamily Online dot
41:27
Speaker 1: com Forward Slash Secrets, where we teach three secrets to
41:31
Speaker 1: thriving with strong wold kids.
41:33
Speaker 2: Awesome. I will link everything up in the show notes
41:35
Speaker 2: too at PARENTINGADHD and USO dot com. Thank you, Wendy,
41:39
Speaker 2: It's always so much fun to chat with you, and
41:43
Speaker 2: I will see everybody next time. Take good care, Thanks Benny,
41:48
Speaker 2: I see you. You're doing hard and meaningful work and
41:52
Speaker 2: you don't have to do it alone. If you found
41:54
Speaker 2: this episode helpful, share it with someone who needs it
41:57
Speaker 2: and leave a quick review so others can find this
42:00
Speaker 2: support too. When you're ready for next steps. The Regulated
42:04
Speaker 2: Kid's Project is here with the tools, coaching, and community
42:09
Speaker 2: to help you raise a more regulated, resilient child. Get
42:13
Speaker 2: more info at regulated kids dot com.