Latest / Tiger Territory: A Detroit Tigers Podcast / The Tigers are clawing back into the picture. Should we believe?

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The Tigers are clawing back into the picture. Should we believe? · Tiger Territory: A Detroit Tigers Podcast

0:08
Speaker 1: And welcome into another episode of Tiger's Territory, part of
0:11
Speaker 1: the Foul Territory Network, the Toy Tiger's Podcast. I am
0:14
Speaker 1: here seclely with me as always as a man who
0:16
Speaker 1: prefers his banners star spangled.
0:20
Speaker 2: He is Cody Stavenagan. How we doing doing all right?
0:23
Speaker 3: Hope everyone had a happy Fourth of July and a
0:25
Speaker 3: holiday weekend coming at you a little bit later than
0:28
Speaker 3: we normally do as a result of that, but we
0:30
Speaker 3: got some good stuff to talk about, Kieran. The Tigers
0:33
Speaker 3: are are they officially good again? Five and one road trip,
0:38
Speaker 3: five games back in the wild Card, making things interesting
0:41
Speaker 3: as we had kind of predicted, and we got some
0:44
Speaker 3: All Star game news. We kind of have a lot
0:46
Speaker 3: going on here.
0:49
Speaker 1: Well, look, the bottom line is it was. It was
0:51
Speaker 1: a pleasant holiday weekend for the Tigers and the Tigers
0:54
Speaker 1: fans and and we'll rope in Thursday's game as we didn't.
0:57
Speaker 1: We didn't talk about that in our last episode, and
1:01
Speaker 1: because I was there.
1:04
Speaker 2: Here's the thing.
1:04
Speaker 1: Okay, so ten to four loss, all right, whatever, you
1:07
Speaker 1: can't win them all. Three to zero, win six three
1:09
Speaker 1: win over there in Texas, and like the wins and
1:16
Speaker 1: the way they're doing them, Cody, I just like the
1:18
Speaker 1: question always becomes in my mind, like are we witnessing
1:21
Speaker 1: especially like all these stats that are being put out
1:24
Speaker 1: there about you know, the rank one, two three in
1:28
Speaker 1: this category and they have this many wins which is
1:31
Speaker 1: the most or whatever. Here we go since June June one,
1:35
Speaker 1: first in the AL and win percentage, first in Major
1:38
Speaker 1: League Baseball in uh with in tem e r A,
1:41
Speaker 1: and second in the AL and team ops seven seven eight.
1:45
Speaker 2: Like, what do you want me to say? Bro?
1:48
Speaker 1: This this looks like a team that is at worst
1:52
Speaker 1: capable of being a winner. Like that's that, that's where
1:56
Speaker 1: that is what is currently being observed with these Tigers, Okay.
2:00
Speaker 1: And so then the second question is are we just
2:03
Speaker 1: seeing some variants or what I tend to think it
2:08
Speaker 1: is something closer to a trend, because now the team
2:12
Speaker 1: is operating in a more consistent manner, in a more
2:16
Speaker 1: not just more consistent manner, but in a manner more
2:19
Speaker 1: consistent with how we knew they were going to play. Right,
2:23
Speaker 1: So is this variance or a trend? And that's the
2:26
Speaker 1: million dollar question, and it's going to determine everything potentially potentially, Cody,
2:30
Speaker 1: real talk it's going to determine the next five to
2:34
Speaker 1: seven years of this franchise.
2:35
Speaker 2: What is the answer to this question.
2:39
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know if I want to put that
2:41
Speaker 3: level of stakes on it, but I certainly see where
2:43
Speaker 3: you're coming from. Right The decisions they have to make
2:45
Speaker 3: certainly are big, they are heavy, and still there's so
2:50
Speaker 3: much riding on each game. This conversation has not really changed.
2:54
Speaker 3: The Tigers have now played well enough. Like we talked about,
2:57
Speaker 3: can they make a case that this team has it
3:01
Speaker 3: in them to make a run to give the front
3:04
Speaker 3: off as a case to not sell Like right now
3:06
Speaker 3: they are doing that. Whether it's real, I don't even know.
3:10
Speaker 3: I like, if I want to guess, I mean, you
3:12
Speaker 3: can go back to the fact we always thought this
3:14
Speaker 3: was gonna be a pretty good team, and that's what
3:16
Speaker 3: made May and even some of their losses in June
3:19
Speaker 3: so frustrating that it felt like they were better than
3:21
Speaker 3: that and they weren't. And now here they are. They've
3:24
Speaker 3: been the best team in baseball since June first. They're
3:27
Speaker 3: still pretty far back in the standings, but it's starting
3:30
Speaker 3: to feel a little bit more manageable. But they can't
3:33
Speaker 3: let off the gas. You go lose a series at home,
3:35
Speaker 3: like suddenly you're not feeling so hot anymore. It's just
3:39
Speaker 3: such a weird situation. You said this before we started recording,
3:43
Speaker 3: like a weird team, a weird season. That's where we're at.
3:45
Speaker 3: But they've played good baseball lately. The pitching has been incredible,
3:49
Speaker 3: and we can't deny that. I don't know exactly what
3:54
Speaker 3: it means other than there is a semblance of life here.
3:58
Speaker 3: The team that we thought these guys were supposed to
4:01
Speaker 3: be it does still exist. Can they sustain it enough
4:05
Speaker 3: around the decision point that is the trade deadline. That's
4:08
Speaker 3: what everything revolves around, And there's just no way to
4:11
Speaker 3: know until you play the games.
4:15
Speaker 1: We can't deny that that that that is actually really
4:17
Speaker 1: good phrasing, Like, we cannot deny all these elements here
4:21
Speaker 1: and all these What we have now is a decent,
4:25
Speaker 1: little bit more than a month sample size of like
4:28
Speaker 1: playing damn good, damn near the best baseball.
4:32
Speaker 2: We cannot that. That cannot be denied.
4:34
Speaker 1: And I do think if you're overly cynical about this,
4:38
Speaker 1: that is a level of denial about what you're watching. Okay,
4:42
Speaker 1: and in fairness to everybody's point, of view, given how
4:46
Speaker 1: we got here in the month of May and in
4:49
Speaker 1: the month of June, it's hard to deny anybody's feelings
4:52
Speaker 1: about how they actually feel about this team. But I
4:55
Speaker 1: just totally I just told I just tend to think
4:58
Speaker 1: like maybe it's like confirmation bias, where like all these
5:03
Speaker 1: things that we thought this team was capable of they're
5:05
Speaker 1: now doing. So it's like it has it feels more
5:08
Speaker 1: real because it was anticipated as opposed to what we
5:11
Speaker 1: experienced in May. And and look, I'll even go a
5:13
Speaker 1: little bit further, Cody, like I said, I was at
5:16
Speaker 1: the game on Thursday, Nathan Evaldi was first of all, Yeah,
5:20
Speaker 1: you never feel good in going into an Ebaldi game, right,
5:23
Speaker 1: He was dealing like, you know, like I don't see
5:26
Speaker 1: very many games in person, but I could you could
5:28
Speaker 1: just tell like they had no answer for what he
5:31
Speaker 1: was throwing out there, and then you know it's five nothing.
5:35
Speaker 1: This is a game that you know, I would honestly say,
5:38
Speaker 1: like the majority of the past calendar year of watching
5:41
Speaker 1: Tigers baseball, this is a game that you just kind
5:44
Speaker 1: of chalk up and you're just trying to, you know,
5:46
Speaker 1: get out of there, like that's what we've kind of
5:48
Speaker 1: seen from the team once. Once that level of lifelessness
5:51
Speaker 1: goes the more than half a baseball game, they don't
5:55
Speaker 1: tend to come back in this way, but they put
5:59
Speaker 1: the screw to ev all the back score three runs
6:02
Speaker 1: that look the game, bullpen blow. It ends up being,
6:04
Speaker 1: like I said, at ten to four loss. But you know,
6:07
Speaker 1: Cole Keith breaking up a perfect game with his home run,
6:10
Speaker 1: hy Lee.
6:11
Speaker 2: Continues to do things, you know what I mean.
6:13
Speaker 1: Hits the home run, which that was on my section.
6:15
Speaker 1: I thought it was caught, but uh so that was
6:18
Speaker 1: a chaok situation there.
6:19
Speaker 2: But like it's hard this.
6:22
Speaker 1: I don't want to say this about a ten to
6:25
Speaker 1: four loss in which you need all the wins you
6:28
Speaker 1: can get. But I actually kind of came away in
6:31
Speaker 1: for us with the Tigers in that game, you know,
6:33
Speaker 1: like like weirdly enough, I'll probably get killed for that.
6:36
Speaker 1: But to come back in the way that they did,
6:38
Speaker 1: and look it, the wheels came off, I understand that.
6:41
Speaker 1: But the comeback in the way that they did actually
6:43
Speaker 1: did impress me because again Luke at the guys who
6:46
Speaker 1: it was cold Keith, hy Lee, dudes that have been
6:50
Speaker 1: frustrating in some instances obviously Lee very short, so sample
6:54
Speaker 1: size not necessarily the most trustworthy of hitters and that
6:57
Speaker 1: and that was like part of the charge here, you know, mckins.
7:00
Speaker 1: We had a couple of hits, so like it. Actually,
7:03
Speaker 1: I came away impressed with that game. And I, you know,
7:06
Speaker 1: even though it was a frustrating loss and frustrating the
7:08
Speaker 1: sea and you're, you know, in the sea of opposition fans,
7:11
Speaker 1: Like I was like, it's still in there, and then
7:13
Speaker 1: they win the next two games. So I don't know
7:16
Speaker 1: if that's a that's just me being dumb, but I
7:18
Speaker 1: thought that was actually like a sign of a mature team,
7:21
Speaker 1: which we don't and so you get all that often
7:23
Speaker 1: because we you know, have to remind ourselves, like we
7:25
Speaker 1: thought of them as the young upstart for several years.
7:28
Speaker 3: Now. Yeah, that's an interesting way to look at it.
7:31
Speaker 3: Like you might not be totally wrong. Unfortunately, teams are
7:34
Speaker 3: going to lose games in Major League Baseball, So do
7:37
Speaker 3: you feel good after Like I didn't feel good after
7:40
Speaker 3: that game because they gave up ten runs, the bullpen
7:43
Speaker 3: was bad like things, you know, and they were getting
7:45
Speaker 3: perfect game for a little while. What I was impressed
7:48
Speaker 3: with because it felt like Okay, they swept the Yankees,
7:50
Speaker 3: and they kind of get their doors blown off in
7:52
Speaker 3: Game one. It's like, all right, here we go, here
7:54
Speaker 3: we go again, like a nice little run in Yankee
7:57
Speaker 3: Stadium whatever. But no, then they came back. The pitching
7:59
Speaker 3: was excellent. Riley Green played like what he is, a
8:03
Speaker 3: three time All Star. Like they had offensive production. We're
8:07
Speaker 3: gonna talk more about cater Montero in the bullpen, but
8:10
Speaker 3: like they played good baseball two days in a row.
8:13
Speaker 3: They controlled the game. The pitching is you talk about undeniable,
8:16
Speaker 3: like this is undeniably when healthy and at its best,
8:20
Speaker 3: a really good rotation. Jack Flaherty, again, this is the
8:22
Speaker 3: guy who deserves a lot of credit for looking like
8:26
Speaker 3: he was on the brink of maybe the Tigers just
8:28
Speaker 3: having to pull the plug on this thing, to now
8:30
Speaker 3: pitching some really good ball, look looking like himself, looking
8:34
Speaker 3: like the better version of Jack Flaherty. He deserves a
8:37
Speaker 3: ton of credit for that, because it's not easy, and
8:39
Speaker 3: it hasn't been easy on any of these guys who
8:41
Speaker 3: have struggled this year. There were times I've said, like
8:44
Speaker 3: something felt off, is something more fundamentally broken here, and
8:48
Speaker 3: rather than just kind of thrown in the towel. Some
8:50
Speaker 3: of these guys have made progress and turning their season around,
8:53
Speaker 3: or at least at least keeping us talking about these
8:56
Speaker 3: things into July. There was a time where it didn't
8:59
Speaker 3: necessarily feel like we gonna get here.
9:02
Speaker 1: You know, it's funny, like I just I kept going
9:04
Speaker 1: back to the Andy Dirks Wednesday game broadcast, Just keep
9:11
Speaker 1: playing baseball, Just keep playing baseball and that, and you know,
9:14
Speaker 1: flirty epitomizes that and look often criticized, almost always puzzling.
9:21
Speaker 2: I think, is a good way to put it. For
9:22
Speaker 2: old friend Jack.
9:25
Speaker 1: You know, he was excellent obviously in the start, and
9:28
Speaker 1: then Montero comes in and more or less gets you know,
9:31
Speaker 1: except for one, right, gets at every out the rest
9:33
Speaker 1: of the rest of the game, three innings in relief.
9:35
Speaker 1: And it's funny that this happens, and it's a shutout, right,
9:38
Speaker 1: It's funny that this happens when people are calling for
9:43
Speaker 1: Montero to stay in the in the starting rotation, and
9:48
Speaker 1: or at least saying Jack should probably be the bulk
9:52
Speaker 1: reliever because he's not that good as a star anymore.
9:55
Speaker 1: And then they gotta they could more or less combined
9:57
Speaker 1: for a complete game shutout felt pretty fit. On a
10:00
Speaker 1: on a holiday too, it felt pretty fitting to see that.
10:03
Speaker 1: And in Montero, it's funny, but he he is.
10:08
Speaker 2: He is a six man.
10:09
Speaker 1: It just it's one of those things that's obvious and
10:11
Speaker 1: then you like, but then you say it out loud
10:13
Speaker 1: and it just like occupies your brain.
10:14
Speaker 2: He is a six man. Like he is.
10:16
Speaker 1: He literally fills in for starters and he comes you know,
10:20
Speaker 1: off the bench, you know, as a regular role.
10:22
Speaker 2: At this current moment, he is the Tiger six man.
10:25
Speaker 1: And that's another example right there, Like that's a game
10:28
Speaker 1: you kind of have to win on Saturday because, like
10:31
Speaker 1: like you said, like you drop the get get the
10:33
Speaker 1: doors blown off. After winning three games in the Yankee Stadium,
10:36
Speaker 1: you get the day off. You kind of have to
10:39
Speaker 1: wreck right the ship a little bit. And obviously it
10:42
Speaker 1: doesn't happen if Montero is not is not mowing down
10:46
Speaker 1: hitters the last three innings. And that's an example of
10:48
Speaker 1: his value as somebody who can come in on a
10:52
Speaker 1: obviously more daily basis than every fifth or sixth day.
10:56
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean to me, it's players like Cater Montero
10:58
Speaker 3: who can to make or break team. So you can
11:01
Speaker 3: have all the stars you want in the world, you're
11:04
Speaker 3: still gonna have some role players and are you getting
11:06
Speaker 3: production from them, whether that's a guy off the bench,
11:09
Speaker 3: whether that's a fill in starter, whether that's a bullpen guy.
11:12
Speaker 3: Cater Montero came up as an interesting but not really
11:16
Speaker 3: that hyped, far from a sure thing prospect, and he's
11:18
Speaker 3: made himself into a real asset for this organization. We've
11:21
Speaker 3: seen it at various points in time, and now he's
11:24
Speaker 3: a more consistent, more mature pitcher than ever. We said
11:28
Speaker 3: it on here a million times, like it kind of sucks,
11:30
Speaker 3: it's not really fair he has to go to the bullpen,
11:33
Speaker 3: But what you have just witnessed over the past week
11:36
Speaker 3: is one big reason why the Tigers kind of wanted
11:40
Speaker 3: him to the pin, or wanted him to be in
11:41
Speaker 3: the pin rather than go with a six man rotation.
11:46
Speaker 3: One thing I'm not like, like, my biggest concern about
11:48
Speaker 3: this team remains the bullpen. And one thing I don't
11:50
Speaker 3: love right now is seeing, oh, well, they're actually twelfth
11:52
Speaker 3: or whatever it is in bullpen era, and that is true,
11:55
Speaker 3: but like there is still an element of Okay, watch
11:59
Speaker 3: the game. How often do you feel confident. When a
12:03
Speaker 3: reliever is entering the game, how often are you actually
12:05
Speaker 3: feeling good? It's not that often for me, you know.
12:10
Speaker 3: Now when they're calling Kater Montero though I'm feeling pretty good,
12:13
Speaker 3: his stuff is ticked up in the bullpen, his composure,
12:16
Speaker 3: his compete button is there. It kind of changes the
12:19
Speaker 3: complexion of the game when Cater Montero is now coming
12:22
Speaker 3: in the late innings. And that's the benefit of competition,
12:25
Speaker 3: that's the benefit of having a healthy staff where you
12:27
Speaker 3: can take a talented player and put them in a
12:30
Speaker 3: different role. And of course a huge testament for Cater
12:32
Speaker 3: for being adaptable, flexible. The teams kind of have asked
12:36
Speaker 3: a lot of him and he just continues to answer.
12:38
Speaker 3: And I don't know one thing that does make me
12:41
Speaker 3: feel better about the bullpen right now. It's Cater Montero.
12:46
Speaker 1: If I had a son or daughter playing sports, I
12:50
Speaker 1: would want them to have the attitude of Cater like
12:54
Speaker 1: that is the perfect consummate pro team first, do whatever
13:01
Speaker 1: it takes, you know, and just perfect attitude everything. So
13:04
Speaker 1: credit to him for handling this and again being a
13:06
Speaker 1: real asset for the Tigers. All Right, we are going
13:09
Speaker 1: to take a quick break and then afterward we're gonna
13:12
Speaker 1: get to an all star selection of three for the
13:17
Speaker 1: Tigers this summer. What do we think about that? But
13:19
Speaker 1: first I were from our sponsors.
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14:27
Speaker 1: All right, coming back here, you guys have seen the
14:31
Speaker 1: news by now, and it was again it's good holiday
14:34
Speaker 1: to be to be a member of the organization or
14:36
Speaker 1: a Tigers fan. Dylandingler, Kevin McGonagall, and Riley Green all
14:41
Speaker 1: named to the All Star Game. And it's you know,
14:44
Speaker 1: it's easy to see why. Like Dingler, you know, best
14:47
Speaker 1: catcher in baseball in my humble opinion, Ken McGonagall one
14:51
Speaker 1: of the most impressive I don't know about best or
14:53
Speaker 1: you know whatever, but one of the most impressive rookie
14:56
Speaker 1: starts to a career rookie seasons that I've ever w
15:00
Speaker 1: And it's just in terms of old the little stuff,
15:01
Speaker 1: not even just the counting numbers, just all the little stuff,
15:04
Speaker 1: you know. I finally got to see him in person
15:06
Speaker 1: on Thursday, and that's what I was looking for, all
15:08
Speaker 1: these like little things. I was like, he's just not
15:11
Speaker 1: a rookie, He's just not you know what I mean.
15:14
Speaker 1: And so and then of course he throwing the Philly
15:16
Speaker 1: thing just so super cool. And then Riley Green just
15:20
Speaker 1: consummate steady old man Riley Green, even though he's like
15:23
Speaker 1: what twenty six, twenty five, you know, like it all
15:28
Speaker 1: makes sense. And I'll tell you, like, I was like
15:31
Speaker 1: excited obviously for all these guys to get this opportunity,
15:34
Speaker 1: obviously to first timers there in McGonagall and Dingler.
15:38
Speaker 2: I was excited for them.
15:40
Speaker 1: I felt validated myself because these are the things that
15:42
Speaker 1: I keep saying. It's like, this is a good team
15:44
Speaker 1: with good players. Why they keep losing? You have three
15:47
Speaker 1: all stars position players. But also like a little guilty
15:51
Speaker 1: because I was like, man three for a team that
15:53
Speaker 1: at the time was like, what twelve games under five hundred?
15:56
Speaker 2: It did?
15:57
Speaker 1: It did feel a little weird, you know what I mean.
16:00
Speaker 1: But obviously on an individual basis, this is super cool
16:03
Speaker 1: for all of them, and I think all very very
16:06
Speaker 1: very much deserving. More so that you thought you almost
16:09
Speaker 1: assumed that they'd be disappointed, but like all very deserving.
16:12
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, there's just absolutely no doubt. Dylan Dingler
16:16
Speaker 3: has been one of the ten most valuable players in baseball.
16:19
Speaker 3: He's been probably the best catcher in the game. He
16:22
Speaker 3: has been a folker room in a starboard in what
16:25
Speaker 3: has still been a difficult season. Dylan Dinger is the
16:28
Speaker 3: same dude every day and he impacts the game kind
16:32
Speaker 3: of in multiple ways. Almost every single nights he's behind
16:35
Speaker 3: the plate and he's maybe doing something that's bat or
16:38
Speaker 3: doing something with his arm. It's incredible what a good
16:43
Speaker 3: player he has become. I was talking to a scout recently,
16:46
Speaker 3: it was like, did you ever realize he was going
16:48
Speaker 3: to be this good? Like we the rap on him
16:50
Speaker 3: coming up as like, yeah, pretty good glove. We'll see
16:52
Speaker 3: like with the bat, there's a little pop in there,
16:54
Speaker 3: but who knows. That was kind of my perception. This
16:57
Speaker 3: guy told me like, yeah, no, I wrote him as
16:59
Speaker 3: like a backup, and he is now the best catcher
17:01
Speaker 3: in the sport. Like that's a testament to Dylan Dingler
17:06
Speaker 3: Riley Green. Like for all the back and forth we
17:08
Speaker 3: do in Riley Green, is important to zoom out and
17:10
Speaker 3: be like, this guy has been a rare player really
17:15
Speaker 3: in Tigers franchise history, especially posts nineteen eighty four, who
17:20
Speaker 3: has come through the system and developed and become something
17:24
Speaker 3: really dang close to what he was supposed to be
17:27
Speaker 3: what he was touted as. This is third All Star game.
17:31
Speaker 3: Can we use the word perennial All Star now? Like
17:34
Speaker 3: at three in a row guy's consistent, like even through
17:37
Speaker 3: the strikeouts whatever. He's made all the necessary improvements, He's
17:41
Speaker 3: answered all the right questions, the durability thing. He's missed
17:45
Speaker 3: one game this season, and he probably can have played
17:48
Speaker 3: them all. It's been really impressive and Riley deserves credit
17:51
Speaker 3: for that. And of course Kevin McGonagall maybe the most
17:55
Speaker 3: special player of them all. I think he's third in
17:57
Speaker 3: b war in the sport right now. I hope you
18:00
Speaker 3: guys will check out the story I did. I spent
18:02
Speaker 3: some of last week in Kevin's hometown or his home county,
18:05
Speaker 3: Delaware County. It was a wild time. You should see
18:08
Speaker 3: the things I wasn't able to put in that story.
18:11
Speaker 3: It was awesome. And he's from a unique part of
18:14
Speaker 3: the world, right, that is really tough, that is really
18:18
Speaker 3: hard nosed. You know, he's from a town Alden, Pennsylvania,
18:22
Speaker 3: that's not a not a glamorous place, you know, a
18:25
Speaker 3: real working class suburban Delco as it gets right. Not
18:31
Speaker 3: that many guys come out of there, like there have
18:32
Speaker 3: been some good basketball players, football players from that area.
18:36
Speaker 3: It's pretty rare for a baseball player of his caliber
18:39
Speaker 3: to emerge from a place like that. And obviously we
18:42
Speaker 3: see it every day. Like the personality, the character, the
18:45
Speaker 3: toughness he plays with is impressive. The consistency is incredibly impressive,
18:50
Speaker 3: and we shouldn't lose sight to the past. I don't
18:53
Speaker 3: know what four ish months of his life have to
18:57
Speaker 3: be the craziest four months of his entire life of
19:00
Speaker 3: most people's lives. Like the pressure he's been under, the
19:03
Speaker 3: attention he's gotten, and the way he's handled it, navigated
19:06
Speaker 3: the rookie ups and downs. The Yeah, these these three
19:09
Speaker 3: guys are all totally deserving, and as we have talked
19:12
Speaker 3: about before, like when you have three players of this caliber,
19:14
Speaker 3: it's kind of ridiculous that you're twelve games under five hundred.
19:17
Speaker 3: And that does speak to the lack of production we've
19:20
Speaker 3: seen from other almost every other spot on the team
19:23
Speaker 3: up until recently.
19:26
Speaker 1: Yeah, some of some some people need to pull their
19:28
Speaker 1: That's what that means. It's like some other guys either
19:30
Speaker 1: start pulling their way.
19:31
Speaker 2: A little bit.
19:31
Speaker 1: You got three position player all stars, so yeah, so
19:36
Speaker 1: here here's the fun little exercise. You just kind of
19:38
Speaker 1: laid out the criteria, not the criteria, but the reasons why.
19:42
Speaker 1: I think a fun exercise is like who's the most
19:44
Speaker 1: deserving of these three? Because there was a very real
19:47
Speaker 1: world where like, you know, like there's like an either
19:50
Speaker 1: or piece of this. For some of these guys had
19:53
Speaker 1: the you know, the rosters that shaped down in a
19:55
Speaker 1: slightly different way. And when I ask myself this question,
20:01
Speaker 1: it almost seems like I got to like criticize to
20:03
Speaker 1: others if I say the other one's most deserving. It's
20:06
Speaker 1: hard for me not to just kind of go back
20:08
Speaker 1: to Riley Green, who, like, who has had who has
20:14
Speaker 1: been through the ringer more than these guys, because he
20:16
Speaker 1: was there for some you know, for some down seasons, uh,
20:20
Speaker 1: and has had like I would probably say a bullseye
20:25
Speaker 1: on his back from a scouting report perspective longer than
20:29
Speaker 1: either of these two.
20:30
Speaker 2: And so there's no.
20:33
Speaker 1: Like, there's more data on Riley Green than Dylan Dingler
20:36
Speaker 1: or Kevin McGonagall for a pitching staff to come up
20:38
Speaker 1: with a game plan, right, And you throw in the
20:41
Speaker 1: fact that like all the questions about him and like
20:44
Speaker 1: his ability to stay healthy, which again everything is to
20:47
Speaker 1: this point, he has been able to do what you've
20:50
Speaker 1: written about it, and like, you know, all these things
20:53
Speaker 1: that he is done, they kind of take the craft
20:55
Speaker 1: more seriously, Like he has an eight fifty four ps
21:00
Speaker 1: cody right.
21:02
Speaker 3: Over to his career for anyone who says he's not
21:04
Speaker 3: hitting for enough power is the best o ps of
21:06
Speaker 3: his career.
21:07
Speaker 1: So that's another thing he you talked about, like how
21:10
Speaker 1: long has it been since the Tigers player was drafted
21:14
Speaker 1: and then you know, went through the ranks and then
21:16
Speaker 1: became a player that he was you know, kind of
21:18
Speaker 1: drafted or required to.
21:20
Speaker 2: Be part of.
21:21
Speaker 1: That is also dealing with the noise about Riley Green
21:25
Speaker 1: his entire pro career, whether it's you know, whether it's
21:29
Speaker 1: you know, questions about like his running or whatever, or
21:32
Speaker 1: questions about like, hey, how come he doesn't have enough power?
21:34
Speaker 1: And then it's like, hey, the power's here, and now
21:37
Speaker 1: he's striking out too much. And so like he's kind
21:39
Speaker 1: of gone through every single little piece of this and
21:42
Speaker 1: he still comes out here and is having the you know,
21:45
Speaker 1: obviously the most I would say, esthetically pleasing season at
21:49
Speaker 1: the plate of his career. And then of course we
21:51
Speaker 1: saw it on on Sunday with you know, the home
21:53
Speaker 1: run and then you know near home run triple and
21:56
Speaker 1: and and you know, making that play and left field
21:58
Speaker 1: like the elements of a star in a baseball player
22:04
Speaker 1: are in Riley Green's game and the day to day
22:06
Speaker 1: and you know in this in the chase sometimes they're
22:09
Speaker 1: all the all those you know, just kind of watching
22:11
Speaker 1: him run sometimes it makes you lose sight of that,
22:13
Speaker 1: but you can't much.
22:14
Speaker 3: Situations rub people wrong sometimes whatever, pretty good player. R
22:20
Speaker 3: Green's pretty good player, man.
22:21
Speaker 1: So that's that's my pick. I don't know, I'm not
22:24
Speaker 1: going to even add. You know, you don't have to
22:25
Speaker 1: make a pick if you don't want to, But that's
22:26
Speaker 1: my pick.
22:27
Speaker 3: Those Yeah, I mean again, all three of these guys
22:30
Speaker 3: are incredibly deserving. So yeah, it is. It almost feels
22:33
Speaker 3: like weird ask who's most deserving, Like McDonald's been incredible,
22:37
Speaker 3: but I'd say Dingler just because, like the the level
22:39
Speaker 3: of demands on the catching position are so unlike any other,
22:43
Speaker 3: the workload he has handled both catching and d H
22:46
Speaker 3: and and I mean the fact he's quite literally been
22:49
Speaker 3: the most valuable player at his position in in baseball,
22:52
Speaker 3: at the most valuable player at the most difficult position
22:56
Speaker 3: in the sport. It's incredible. Angler did not get in
23:01
Speaker 3: on the fan vote. I believe he led the player
23:04
Speaker 3: vote or It certainly was very high up there on
23:07
Speaker 3: the player ballot, which I do think says something except
23:10
Speaker 3: you can go look at the player ballot and like
23:12
Speaker 3: players do weird things voting too, So it's not It's
23:15
Speaker 3: not the end all bl solution A lot of players
23:17
Speaker 3: make it out to be, but I think it says
23:20
Speaker 3: something that the rest of the league clearly has a
23:22
Speaker 3: lot of respect for what Dylan Dingler is doing behind them.
23:24
Speaker 1: Plate any snubs for the Tigers obviously obviously no pictures,
23:32
Speaker 1: but for the first time and and I and I
23:34
Speaker 1: forget what the year is, but since the two thousand teams, uh,
23:39
Speaker 1: no no picture of representing the Tigers in the All
23:41
Speaker 1: Star Game. So of course that means no Tech Skouble.
23:44
Speaker 1: That means no Casey Mies. You know that, you know,
23:49
Speaker 1: not that he would have gotten it, but like, you know,
23:50
Speaker 1: like no Troy Melon, any of these guys, like no
23:52
Speaker 1: no pitching representative for the Tigers this year.
23:55
Speaker 2: How's that feel?
23:57
Speaker 3: It feels strange. I will be interested to see if
24:00
Speaker 3: any of these guys get in as replacements. Right now,
24:04
Speaker 3: I can't don't. I can't really call any of them
24:06
Speaker 3: snubs just because Schoogle was hurt he's only pitched in
24:10
Speaker 3: eleven games. Now, his profile alone, maybe he could get
24:14
Speaker 3: him an invite. We'll see in case he mis has
24:17
Speaker 3: been phenomenal, but he's had two separate il stints, only
24:20
Speaker 3: thrown seventy one innings. He's been good enough. I think
24:23
Speaker 3: he certainly has a case to get in as a reserve.
24:26
Speaker 3: But like if I were making selections guys who have
24:29
Speaker 3: been hurt, it's just kind of hard to talk yourself into.
24:33
Speaker 3: You know, he's theron more than innings than both of them.
24:35
Speaker 3: Cater Montero, who's down to a three point two to
24:37
Speaker 3: one er. He could be making a case here. I
24:40
Speaker 3: don't think that's been talked about a lot. Melton's only
24:42
Speaker 3: made seven starts. I just don't think that's enough. It's
24:45
Speaker 3: kind of funny, imagine if the Tigers were like terrible
24:48
Speaker 3: and they had to do the thing where you just
24:49
Speaker 3: like pick a reliever with a good er. Cal Fin
24:52
Speaker 3: again has a two point two to three er. A
24:55
Speaker 3: lot of years, that might get you in the All
24:56
Speaker 3: Star Game. Now, we've talked about that, his underlying stats
24:59
Speaker 3: aren't that good the way like it's a it's not
25:02
Speaker 3: been a pleasant two point two three era but like
25:06
Speaker 3: there are a lot of years in Tiger's history where
25:08
Speaker 3: like he might have just gone to the All Star
25:10
Speaker 3: Game as a result of that. So there are guys
25:12
Speaker 3: who certainly have cases, but I think given the injuries,
25:18
Speaker 3: it's hard to feel like emotional for me than any
25:21
Speaker 3: of them were snobbed. Do you do you think that's fair?
25:24
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm not outraged by it, a little surprised, just
25:27
Speaker 1: because sometimes the name just carries over and it's like,
25:30
Speaker 1: you know, like Mike, the Mike Trouts of the world.
25:33
Speaker 3: I know is yeah, well, Jacob Mizerowski can be an
25:36
Speaker 3: All Star last year, like Terrek Schouoble should probably be
25:39
Speaker 3: an All Star this year.
25:40
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, so so.
25:41
Speaker 3: And then it's also like in Schoobl's best interest to
25:44
Speaker 3: go to this game, and Pitch I would kind of
25:47
Speaker 3: say no at this point.
25:49
Speaker 1: There's a marketing element to this that like, if there's
25:51
Speaker 1: a way for schoobl to be named an All Star,
25:55
Speaker 1: he probably will be. And and look, this is somebody
25:58
Speaker 1: who's building up a great resume that we could be
26:00
Speaker 1: talking about indefinitely. So like these kinds of things ultimately matters.
26:05
Speaker 3: It's on the back of your baseball card or the
26:07
Speaker 3: modern that that's on your Baseball reference page forever. The
26:10
Speaker 3: difference between two All Star Games and three All Star games.
26:13
Speaker 3: That matters for these guys, and for someone like Trek
26:16
Speaker 3: Scoogle that that certainly matters.
26:17
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, so we'll see.
26:20
Speaker 1: But either way, just a great sign for the three
26:25
Speaker 1: drafted and developed position players name to name to an
26:29
Speaker 1: All Star Game when they are ten plus games.
26:32
Speaker 2: Blow five hundred?
26:33
Speaker 1: How about that?
26:35
Speaker 2: All right? Cody?
26:36
Speaker 1: I wanted to remind you and remind everybody that Tiger
26:40
Speaker 1: Territory is brought to you by FanDuel, so it is
26:49
Speaker 1: our fandual Daily Dinger segment.
26:53
Speaker 2: And I gotta tell you this one was a pretty
26:58
Speaker 2: easy one.
26:59
Speaker 6: You know.
26:59
Speaker 2: I do like a little bit, but I do a
27:01
Speaker 2: little bit of research on this.
27:03
Speaker 1: Cody and the Tigers play the Athletics of Sacramento slash
27:08
Speaker 1: Las Vegas, slash wherever on on Tuesday, and they are
27:13
Speaker 1: scheduled that J. T Jin on the mound, who throws
27:17
Speaker 1: fifty three percent sinkers to right handed hitters. It's most
27:20
Speaker 1: popular pitch to right handed hitters. You know who destroys sinkers?
27:24
Speaker 2: Cody, I I have a good idea.
27:28
Speaker 1: Spencer Torkalsen, Spencer Torklesen on if you go to his
27:31
Speaker 1: baseball savant page has a five run value against sinkers,
27:34
Speaker 1: a three forty five average, and a six fifty five
27:38
Speaker 1: slugging percentage. Pretty good, that's uh, it seems pretty good
27:43
Speaker 1: for old Torque there, and and then the larger question
27:47
Speaker 1: here with Torque, as we still like have to find
27:52
Speaker 1: ways to talk about him in a way that is refreshed,
27:57
Speaker 1: is fresh, and it really it's not because he's just
28:01
Speaker 1: like this team.
28:02
Speaker 2: He can be very.
28:03
Speaker 1: Fun and exciting at times. He has certainly the ability
28:07
Speaker 1: to get the job done. There are just some areas
28:10
Speaker 1: that are lacking. But then you look at the stats
28:13
Speaker 1: or underlying metrics or you know whatever, and you're like, huh,
28:17
Speaker 1: seems pretty good.
28:19
Speaker 2: Like especially Torklsen.
28:20
Speaker 1: If you look at his savant page as I have
28:23
Speaker 1: it pulled up here is in the one hundred percentile,
28:27
Speaker 1: one hundred percentile cody and launch angle sweet spot. He's
28:32
Speaker 1: not chasing ninety two percentile chase percentage with a seventy
28:36
Speaker 1: six percentile based on ball percentage barreling balls in the
28:40
Speaker 1: eighty eight percent tile Like, this is a lot more
28:44
Speaker 1: red than I was anticipating, And I'm a Torque guy.
28:46
Speaker 1: I like Torque. I root for Torque. All right, Uh,
28:50
Speaker 1: but like man, like what a guy? What a guy
28:54
Speaker 1: to figure out?
28:55
Speaker 3: You know? Yeah, you want to talk about a player
28:58
Speaker 3: who's pretty emblematic of this team, it might be Spencer
29:01
Speaker 3: torkalsin because he's done some things well and every time
29:04
Speaker 3: you want to write him off, he there he is
29:07
Speaker 3: blasting a few balls out of the park. It's also
29:10
Speaker 3: just kind of a weird stack cast page, like doesn't
29:13
Speaker 3: chase at all but bottom three percent island k rate.
29:18
Speaker 3: He whiffs on balls he should hit sometimes, like it's
29:21
Speaker 3: very strange, but he generally has a pretty good played approach.
29:25
Speaker 3: I like this pick against sinkers. Oddly enough, Tork struggled
29:30
Speaker 3: really bad against sinkers early in his career twenty twenty
29:32
Speaker 3: four especially, I think he had like one ninety four
29:34
Speaker 3: against sinkers. He's absolutely demolished them this year. I asked
29:37
Speaker 3: him about that at one point after one of his
29:39
Speaker 3: homers against the sinker, like is there a difference? And
29:41
Speaker 3: he kind of shrugs said yeah, I don't know. I'm
29:46
Speaker 3: kind of stunned. He still sees as many sinkers as
29:49
Speaker 3: he does. If I were to write a scouting report,
29:52
Speaker 3: like against Spencer Torklesin, I think I would say, like,
29:55
Speaker 3: don't throw anything that breaks into this guy's batpath, like
30:00
Speaker 3: sinker from right handed pitcher does. We've talked going way
30:03
Speaker 3: back to his rookie year, like sometimes that swing gets
30:05
Speaker 3: a little grooved, it's kind of going in the same spot.
30:08
Speaker 3: He's not adjustable in the zone. He can still struggle
30:11
Speaker 3: with that when he's cold. So you throw something that's
30:13
Speaker 3: moving boom into the barrel of the bat well. We
30:17
Speaker 3: know this guy has power, all right, That's one thing
30:19
Speaker 3: that has never been doubted. So you throw something that's
30:22
Speaker 3: just into his barrel, that thing might get whacked out
30:25
Speaker 3: of the park. And indeed it has four times this season.
30:30
Speaker 3: And yeah, the slug is it's six fifty five against sinkers.
30:35
Speaker 3: I wouldn't throw this guy's sinker. I don't care how
30:37
Speaker 3: often you throw things. You throw sinkers. I'm gonna do
30:40
Speaker 3: maybe get in on his hands with some four scenes
30:43
Speaker 3: and then slider or whatever I want it going away
30:46
Speaker 3: from him. Yep.
30:50
Speaker 1: Yeah, and again it's one hundred percent and there he's
30:53
Speaker 1: like the Envision player. You can envision all like the
30:58
Speaker 1: ways that things can go right, but it just doesn't,
31:02
Speaker 1: you know, often enough, and that's why we continue to
31:05
Speaker 1: have the conversation of what the Tigers do with torque
31:08
Speaker 1: or you know, at first base in general. And we'll
31:11
Speaker 1: have plenty of time to talk about this moving forward.
31:13
Speaker 1: But my opinion on that generally is show me some
31:17
Speaker 1: feasible upgrade and then we'll have a conversation.
31:21
Speaker 2: And that upgrade with upside.
31:24
Speaker 1: I would add a lot of times that you know
31:28
Speaker 1: that that kind of ends the conversation. So Baseball fans,
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32:25
Speaker 1: All right, coming back here, Cody, you know, like just
32:27
Speaker 1: to kind of throw in some of the stuff that
32:30
Speaker 1: that happened in the Yankee series. You know, you look
32:33
Speaker 1: at the uh, you know, you look at the road
32:35
Speaker 1: trip as a whole.
32:37
Speaker 2: You know, you sweep the you sweet, you sweep the Yankees.
32:39
Speaker 1: And that's obviously we talked about with Austin that can
32:42
Speaker 1: be daunting sometimes playing a Yankee stadium all that stuff,
32:45
Speaker 1: and you know, you sweep, you steal one in there,
32:48
Speaker 1: and then against Texas, I just wanted to say this, like,
32:51
Speaker 1: we know the Rangers can be like so so, but
32:54
Speaker 1: I'll tell you what that you know, Dallas quote unquote
32:58
Speaker 1: is a World Cup right now. So there's a lot
33:02
Speaker 1: of energy, energy in sports, energy like going on in
33:06
Speaker 1: the area. And I was, like I said, on Thursday,
33:08
Speaker 1: it was packed with Australians who you know, obviously they
33:11
Speaker 1: don't know what's going on in this game, but they
33:13
Speaker 1: are like bringing a lot of energy and a lot
33:15
Speaker 1: of noise, and you know, and that's bringing everybody else's up.
33:18
Speaker 1: That was a very energetic atmosphere. And then Saturday, obviously
33:24
Speaker 1: it's fourth of July, and then Sunday with you know,
33:27
Speaker 1: to close out the holiday weekend. These were not like
33:30
Speaker 1: no offense, but these were not like, you know, minor
33:32
Speaker 1: league environments that the Tigers were excelling in this week
33:36
Speaker 1: in addition to just kind.
33:38
Speaker 2: Of beating teams that are in the playoff picture as well.
33:42
Speaker 1: And I think it was set on the broadcast Sunday,
33:45
Speaker 1: it's like, you know, the crowd was excited, it's fourth
33:47
Speaker 1: of July, it's America two fifty, and you know they're
33:49
Speaker 1: just waiting on some of the cheer on and Jack Flaherty,
33:53
Speaker 1: Tyler Holten and Cater Montero said, sorry, you ain't got
33:58
Speaker 1: squat the cheer for today because we're gonna shut them down.
34:01
Speaker 1: And so like those kind of those were I just
34:03
Speaker 1: wanted to kind of emphasize like these were not like
34:05
Speaker 1: easy places to win, and they did it over the
34:09
Speaker 1: course of a week in a variety of ways that
34:11
Speaker 1: if you just take a step back, I think it's
34:14
Speaker 1: more impressive than what we're giving it credit for.
34:19
Speaker 3: I'm gonna I'm gonna spin that around a little bit, Keren.
34:22
Speaker 3: When you think about this weird season, the weird past
34:25
Speaker 3: two or three years, one thing we've learned about the
34:27
Speaker 3: Tigers is that they do play well when their backs
34:30
Speaker 3: are completely against the wall, which is a great and
34:35
Speaker 3: admirable trait. I'd like to see them play well when
34:38
Speaker 3: their backs aren't against the wall. I'd like to see
34:40
Speaker 3: them just take care of business when there's not, for
34:44
Speaker 3: lack of a better analogy, like a gun pointed to
34:46
Speaker 3: their head. It does seem like they respond maybe the
34:50
Speaker 3: big environment in the Yankee Stadium, the energy that they
34:53
Speaker 3: might have experienced in Arlington, the pressure of the postseason,
34:58
Speaker 3: or a Pennant race, like they they have mostly responded
35:01
Speaker 3: to those sorts of settings. I mean, I know they
35:04
Speaker 3: really faltered in a playoff race last year, but they
35:06
Speaker 3: did what it took to get it done, won a
35:08
Speaker 3: wildcard series. Those are good things. I would like it
35:11
Speaker 3: to not always have to be like we say, like
35:14
Speaker 3: so dramatic and I wonder if there's something about that
35:18
Speaker 3: with this group that like it almost takes that to
35:21
Speaker 3: get them amped up. Think about like, I know, Hobvey
35:23
Speaker 3: Bias is injured right now. That's been hovey'sm his entire career. Like,
35:27
Speaker 3: he responds when the lights are bright and the energy's
35:30
Speaker 3: there and it kind of gets the focus and engaged.
35:32
Speaker 3: And then there are other times he's he's hobby air,
35:35
Speaker 3: He's the bad version of hobby like. And if you
35:38
Speaker 3: really think about it, this team kind of as a whole,
35:40
Speaker 3: I'm not saying every player you have guys Schoogle. Certainly
35:44
Speaker 3: McGonagall and Dingler have brought another level of consistency, but
35:47
Speaker 3: this team as a whole has oddly struggled and somewhat
35:53
Speaker 3: almost responded when they're in situations like that. And I'm
35:56
Speaker 3: not sure that's completely a good thing.
36:01
Speaker 1: Well look, it's uh, you know, there's part of what
36:06
Speaker 1: is the story of the season is the pieces haven't
36:09
Speaker 1: all been present at the same time. So then you're
36:12
Speaker 1: trying to mix and match what you think this is,
36:14
Speaker 1: what you think is gonna kind of get you through
36:16
Speaker 1: you know, a game, a series and at bat or
36:18
Speaker 1: you know whatever, and so like the the adjustment has
36:23
Speaker 1: been to that as much as just like the regular
36:26
Speaker 1: adjustments that go into the games. Right, when's the last
36:28
Speaker 1: time we saw Jamia I wasn't in Texas? Uh So,
36:32
Speaker 1: So like you know, it's it's and it's also an
36:36
Speaker 1: old and a young team at the same time. And
36:39
Speaker 1: and we still, I think, are trying to figure out
36:42
Speaker 1: who is really the core here. We obviously know a
36:45
Speaker 1: couple of names that definitely are, but like the guy
36:47
Speaker 1: we just talked about, you know, there's there's you know,
36:50
Speaker 1: there's long term considerations here that are being decided like
36:54
Speaker 1: right now, and and just like the you know, the
36:57
Speaker 1: School Bowl and the trade deadline and all that stuff.
36:59
Speaker 1: So it's gonna be interesting and we're gonna be here
37:03
Speaker 1: to cover the entire the entire way. Cody and you
37:06
Speaker 1: guys can follow us on x formally known on Twitter
37:08
Speaker 1: at Cody stavenh Haagen. I'm at Kieran Underscore Steckley pod
37:11
Speaker 1: pages at Tiger Territory Underscore, YouTube, Apple, Spotify. You guys
37:15
Speaker 1: do know what to do. We appreciate all of you.
37:17
Speaker 1: So for Cody Stavenhagen, I'm Kieren Steckley. Everybody, have a
37:20
Speaker 1: great day.