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Strictly Come Hamster - Season Thirteen (featuring David Gillespie-Pratt & Dan Pinn) · A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast

• 0:00
  I have won my freedom, Horus. Your curse is lifted.
• 0:07
  Now begins the reign of Sotek the Destroyer.
• 0:12
  I shall crush this miserable world and hurl it into the
• 0:17
  ultimate depths of space. My vengeance starts here.
• 0:48
  The. This will be no crude butchery.
• 0:59
  A podcast such as this, a podcast that will soon command
• 1:02
  the universe, must be undertaken with care and skill.
• 1:06
  Every instalment must be planned.
• 1:08
  Every guest, every winner has to be perfect.
• 1:12
  This will be my greatest triumph. 1000 years from now
• 1:16
  people will remember Strictly Come Hamsters every episode.
• 1:22
  Welcome back to Strictly Calm Hamster, the Doctor Who
• 1:28
  Championship podcast. Oh my God, he's done it twice in
• 1:33
  25 episodes. Yeah.
• 1:34
  Well done, Joe. Congratulation every now and
• 1:37
  again to keep your perks up, you know.
• 1:40
  Thank you. Pardon, Rod.
• 1:41
  Hello, Joe. How are you doing?
• 1:42
  We're being rude already. Yes.
• 1:45
  Hello. My name is Joe Ford.
• 1:47
  I'm here to talk about a delirious season of Doctor Who.
• 1:50
  But as ever, I'm going to handle the admin over to my good friend
• 1:54
  Rod Brown. Hello, Rod.
• 1:56
  Hi, Joe. How's it going?
• 1:58
  I'm fine, thank you very much. Yes, I've just left a
• 2:00
  particularly explicit gay film to come and record this.
• 2:03
  Well, you're obviously you're going to leave that behind for
• 2:05
  Doctor Who, aren't you? I'm in no hurry to get back,
• 2:07
  sweetheart. Thank you.
• 2:08
  Very much. Well, let's go on to season 13
• 2:10
  then. In that case, then that's.
• 2:12
  Pretty explicit season 13 actually.
• 2:14
  But maybe not in the same way as the film you were watching.
• 2:17
  So there are mostly Max Cole. May get there.
• 2:19
  Like don't, don't, don't count your chickens yet, all right?
• 2:24
  So we are doing season 13 midpoint for Hinchcliffe and
• 2:27
  Holmes. Arguably, Doctor Who has never
• 2:30
  been so successful with ratings peaking during ironically, the
• 2:33
  Android invasion and it's a collection of stories that have
• 2:36
  continued to resonate down the years.
• 2:38
  So obviously we start with Zygons and they go to meet
• 2:40
  multiple doctors in Day of the Doctor before meeting Peter
• 2:43
  Cabalde in Joe. Here's a mine favorite story of
• 2:46
  that era. Saigon invasion, Saigon
• 2:48
  inversion. Then Suitek obviously made a
• 2:52
  triumphant return to the most recent series.
• 2:54
  Sisterhood of Khan appear here for the first time, go to appear
• 2:57
  in a few all the episodes, and obviously who can forget the
• 3:01
  multiple past doctors in Morbius also play a role in The Timeless
• 3:05
  Children. What else have we got?
• 3:07
  Well, we've got the plot of 42 that gets recycled, probably in
• 3:10
  Harrison Chase's compost machine.
• 3:12
  When Chris Chibnall brings it back for 42 General Chidaki from
• 3:16
  the Android Invasion, he gets slightly remodified, and then he
• 3:20
  plays Zippy for the rest of his career in Rainbow.
• 3:23
  And in the most disappointing sequel of all, the lush,
• 3:26
  aggressive vegetation of Seeds of Doom go limp and withered and
• 3:31
  end up in In the Forest of the Night.
• 3:34
  I've only got 1 issue of everything you've just said
• 3:36
  there. Which one Zipping?
• 3:38
  Say the word triumphant return of.
• 3:40
  I did. I did that purposefully.
• 3:42
  I was. I was waiting for a response.
• 3:44
  OK, all right. I can see like a pain on our
• 3:46
  guests faces. I was just prodding the bear,
• 3:49
  but let's get into it, right? I'll need to take a deep breath
• 3:52
  for this one and to help us sort out our Scottish country.
• 3:57
  In where mysterious alien eyes are watching proceedings from
• 4:00
  their dark organic spaceship through a camera hidden in an
• 4:03
  animal bust whilst waiting to launch their duplicates which
• 4:06
  will enable them to take control of the Earth.
• 4:09
  From our English village inn, Where mysterious alien eyes are
• 4:13
  watching proceedings from their dark organic spaceship through a
• 4:16
  camera hidden in a dartboard before launching their
• 4:19
  duplicates which will enable them to take control of the
• 4:22
  Earth. You might notice the bit of plot
• 4:24
  similarities. There's no recycling going on in
• 4:26
  this this season at all. But to help us sort those things
• 4:30
  out, we are joined by two chicken brained biological
• 4:33
  disasters. Sorry, I mean two special
• 4:36
  guests. Because guests do come in pairs,
• 4:38
  like chronoid pods and policemen.
• 4:41
  Both of them are returnees for Strictly Dance Floor, but
• 4:43
  hopefully neither of them have underestimated the power of
• 4:46
  organic crystallography. Between us, we're going to sort
• 4:50
  out which story is going to be lifting the location glitter
• 4:52
  ball and which will be made Chieftain of the Antlers
• 4:55
  Association or Trustee of the Golden, I guess.
• 4:57
  Lucky day. So let's meet today's guests.
• 5:00
  I've got to say, Rod, right? Yeah.
• 5:02
  Our, our listeners are in a disadvantageous position that
• 5:06
  they can only hear our guests. I can see how beautiful these
• 5:09
  two men are right in front of me right now before you introduce
• 5:12
  them. I just had to say that.
• 5:13
  Please continue. Thank you very much.
• 5:16
  And our first guest has collapsed into fits of laughter.
• 5:19
  Damn. As as Joe's latest podcast
• 5:22
  husband. Hi, guys.
• 5:25
  Yeah. I'm back, yeah.
• 5:29
  Really looking forward to it. You still told us the best story
• 5:32
  ever on Strictly Come Hamster, which was you relaying?
• 5:35
  If everyone wants to hear this, go listen to our Season 17
• 5:38
  edition of Was It Creature from the Pier?
• 5:41
  Wasn't It? It was creature from the pier
• 5:43
  for your for. Your new girlfriend and family
• 5:47
  and Erato's enormous phallus came onto the screen and
• 5:52
  amazingly, you're still married. Yeah, yeah, just about.
• 5:58
  But no, no, yeah, I haven't got any cracking stories like that
• 6:03
  tonight, I'm afraid. But yeah.
• 6:06
  I bet you got some cracking opinions so.
• 6:09
  One or two, one or two up the up the sleeve.
• 6:12
  Yeah. Excellent.
• 6:14
  And also David. David, welcome back to Strictly.
• 6:17
  Thank you very much. Thank you for having me back and
• 6:19
  giving me a season that when because last time we did series
• 6:23
  12, which wasn't a favorite, changed some opinions.
• 6:28
  This is one which was much more kind of.
• 6:30
  I could get my teeth into this one a lot more.
• 6:33
  Can I ask you a question, David? You can try.
• 6:36
  You know, we are forced you to watch series 12 last time.
• 6:39
  Well, technically it was Rod, but me via Rod.
• 6:41
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 6:42
  Did you make me watch Babylon 5 in revenge for that?
• 6:46
  I not revenge per SE, but I would point out you, you
• 6:52
  approached me about that. You came to me in.
• 6:54
  Fact. We're great fun talking about it
• 6:56
  as well. We've still got more to talk
• 6:57
  about, too. We do.
• 6:59
  And you know, it's quite every now and again, you know,
• 7:02
  watching Babylon 5, there's some wonderfully atrocious pieces of
• 7:05
  acting which either you sent to me or I sent to you because it's
• 7:08
  like, is this as bad as it gets? The answer is no, it's not.
• 7:12
  There's always a a much worse performance coming up and trust
• 7:16
  me, you've got some great ones to come.
• 7:19
  Quite different from Season 13. You know, I'm not sure there's a
• 7:21
  dud performance this year. Well, come on to that.
• 7:29
  Brentis Hancock, maybe? Maybe the odd?
• 7:33
  10 chicken chest himself. Right, but before we get into
• 7:39
  the stories, what do we think of the season overall?
• 7:42
  David, give us your overall thoughts on Season 13.
• 7:47
  So is this the golden age of Doctor Who?
• 7:51
  Because I think that that has come up when people talk about
• 7:54
  Season 13, it's the best, the pinnacle and watching it back
• 7:58
  there is just, there's so much good stuff going on.
• 8:04
  So it's not my favorite. And that's partly because I'm
• 8:08
  slightly contrary. But so I did notice in a lot of
• 8:13
  the comments and a lot of reviews, people compare this
• 8:15
  season a lot to The Avengers. And I'm going to go off on a
• 8:19
  slight tangent, but trust me, it's going to make sense because
• 8:21
  personally, I don't actually see The Avengers parallels as much
• 8:24
  as other people do. And to the point, you know, the
• 8:27
  seeds of Dooms is like Seeds of Doom is like an Avengers story.
• 8:30
  It's like, well, have you ever watched that series at all?
• 8:31
  Because no, it isn't apart from on the surface, but I'm an
• 8:36
  Avengers fan. But one of my least favorite
• 8:38
  periods of The Avengers is the appeal episodes, which everybody
• 8:41
  else absolutely loves. And they say it's the pinnacle
• 8:45
  of the series. And I don't, I don't think
• 8:46
  they're bad. I think they're really
• 8:47
  enjoyable. I think they're really well
• 8:49
  made, but I just don't get the same enjoyment from them that I
• 8:53
  do from the eras on either side. And I think sometimes the more
• 8:57
  people double down on kind of this is the best, these are the
• 9:00
  the greatest ever, The more contrary I start to get because
• 9:05
  I could go on. I can't help myself.
• 9:06
  But when reading the comments that's coming in and people are
• 9:09
  saying, you know, season 13, it's the greatest ever.
• 9:12
  It's completely flawless. My brain is going no, it's not
• 9:14
  No, not flawless, no, no, no, it's it's got its problems.
• 9:19
  But if I put that to one side, it is hard to argue that this is
• 9:23
  a bloody strong season and there is a lot to enjoy in it and it
• 9:29
  is a production team that just knows what it's doing.
• 9:32
  So if I ignore the contrary busted in my brain, this is a
• 9:38
  great season. Oh, it took us on a right
• 9:40
  journey there from up to down to back up again.
• 9:44
  Get back in your seat. Well, he's keeping his powder
• 9:47
  completely dry by making us think that he's going to either
• 9:49
  love this or hate it or find it somewhere in the middle whilst
• 9:53
  dissing him appeal at the same time.
• 9:55
  What a guy. The hate mail will be coming in
• 9:58
  almost instantly. You just say you're not speaking
• 10:00
  Treary, didn't you? Yes, unfortunately that does
• 10:02
  come with consequences sometimes.
• 10:06
  Damn, season 13. Yeah.
• 10:10
  I suppose I'm going to, I think my comment is going to reveal a
• 10:13
  bit more about what I feel about this season perhaps than what
• 10:16
  what David just did. Because this for me is my
• 10:20
  favorite Tom Baker season, not my favorite season of Doctor
• 10:25
  Who, but but with my favorite Tom Baker one.
• 10:28
  And, and, and I think because it kind of borrows heavily from a
• 10:32
  lot of things that I really, really enjoy, you know, those
• 10:35
  sort of like horror films and sci-fi films from from the 50s
• 10:39
  and 60s, you know, like Forbidden Planet and invasion of
• 10:43
  the body snatches and so forth sort of thing.
• 10:44
  So it kind of it kind of vibes with the stuff that I like.
• 10:50
  Also, and I think this is David touched on this as well, is the
• 10:55
  both Holmes and Hinchcliffe, they have a plan for this, for
• 10:58
  what they want Doctor Who to be, what their version of Doctor Who
• 11:02
  is. And so because of that, it has
• 11:06
  an an identity. And I think the best eras of
• 11:09
  Doctor Who are those ones where the people running the show know
• 11:13
  what they they want it to be. And, and, and basically they,
• 11:18
  they've got a plan and boy do they kind of stick to that.
• 11:22
  I think also you've got like, I think Tom, he was the most alien
• 11:27
  of the doctors, and I think this is him probably at his most
• 11:31
  alien where he's, you know, the the the bulging eyes staring,
• 11:35
  staring into, you know, into space while the actions going on
• 11:39
  around him. You know, his reaction to things
• 11:42
  that are not human at all, to the point where where, you know,
• 11:46
  Sarah even tells me or sometimes you don't seem human, and that's
• 11:49
  because he's not. So I think there's there's so
• 11:51
  much to to love in this season. It's it's it's it's really good.
• 11:55
  The only thing I feel that they they got wrong was ditching
• 11:59
  Harry so, so early. I think you know that that
• 12:03
  season 12, that time this team was brilliant and we only get
• 12:06
  him for like 1 and one and a bit this season.
• 12:09
  I think we we should have seen more of him.
• 12:11
  But other than that. It's pretty good.
• 12:14
  Fabulous, Joe. You know, you say about the
• 12:17
  Doctor being sort of more alien than ever in this.
• 12:20
  You know that bit in Terror of the Zygos where he hypnotizes
• 12:22
  Sarah and sort of go? On all of this.
• 12:26
  That was scarier to me than anything else in that story when
• 12:30
  I first watched her. Why is this adult behaving in
• 12:32
  this very strange way? I was very young when I saw it.
• 12:36
  I've just sort of collected together a series of buzzwords.
• 12:39
  But I actually think season 13 is ideal.
• 12:42
  Doctor Who. So it's playful, it's funny,
• 12:45
  it's scary, it's violent, it's exhilarating, it's colorful,
• 12:50
  it's smart, it's handsome, it's very handsome to look at and
• 12:54
  very, very easy to love. This season was a smash hit
• 12:58
  ratings wise and I can absolutely see why.
• 13:01
  If I have come down hard on any stories this season, that is me
• 13:05
  being contrary because I love all of this season, but I refuse
• 13:09
  to love all of this season for this episode of Strictly Come
• 13:12
  Hamster. So I've set myself a series of
• 13:15
  challenges. Oh, you contrary that's.
• 13:18
  Right. Not as David, but you know.
• 13:20
  Never been known before. Well, yeah, this is it's you've
• 13:24
  all said, haven't you? It's a great, great season,
• 13:26
  Great companion pairing. I, Sarah, for me can't be
• 13:30
  matched, and Tom and Sarah are just brilliant together.
• 13:34
  The writing's great, The direction generally is bloody
• 13:37
  good. The characters are great, the
• 13:39
  acting's great, but you know what, as a as a nine year old
• 13:43
  watching this, what really stuck with me is the images.
• 13:47
  And it's those constant strong images that I think are, are so
• 13:51
  powerful in this era. You don't necessarily get in
• 13:54
  other eras. So there's just a look of the
• 13:56
  Zygons. I mean, they're so dramatic and,
• 13:59
  and startling. The plants of evil jungle,
• 14:03
  unbelievable. The mummies in the English
• 14:04
  countryside, Sarah's face being knocked off, the crinoid attack,
• 14:08
  the Morbius creature. They're all visually.
• 14:12
  They're such strong images. The design team and the
• 14:15
  directors absolutely working overtime on the series to get
• 14:20
  those images planted in the heads of the audience that are
• 14:23
  watching it. And my God, they're images that
• 14:25
  stay with you for life. But that image of Elizabeth
• 14:28
  Slade? Never her cheeks pulled back in
• 14:30
  Android Invasion as she's suffering from G Force.
• 14:33
  Maybe not that one. OK.
• 14:35
  You had to find the worst one. Yeah, sorry.
• 14:38
  Oh, that's not the worst one. That's.
• 14:40
  True. We'll we'll get there.
• 14:41
  We will get there, right. Let's go to our overall comments
• 14:44
  from our listeners, David and Dan, you are going to do the
• 14:47
  honours. David, would you like to kick us
• 14:49
  off? But.
• 14:50
  The question is, do we do it in the voices that we said we were
• 14:53
  going to do? Oh please.
• 14:54
  Oh, should we just play it straight?
• 14:55
  No, no, no, no. I want a cross of Philip
• 14:57
  Maddock, Cynthia Graham, full Tom Baker.
• 15:00
  Yeah. And Prentice Hancock for good
• 15:02
  measure. I don't think anyone ever has
• 15:05
  ever tried to do apprentice Hancock impression and that's
• 15:08
  probably a very wise decision. I would like you, David, to do a
• 15:12
  cross between Tony Beck Beckley and the woman who plays Ahika,
• 15:16
  please. And then if you can do a cross
• 15:18
  between Michael Spices Morbius and John Woodnut as Braton.
• 15:22
  Thank you very much. Takes away.
• 15:30
  I think, I think this is what just to play straight, you know?
• 15:35
  We don't like to do things straight on this on this show.
• 15:41
  OK, so Pete Lambert says at the Olympics they don't take medals
• 15:45
  away from a country that keeps winning just because people have
• 15:48
  got bored of hearing its anthem. This gets so much praise because
• 15:51
  it deserves it. Tom and Liz attain utter
• 15:54
  perfection as a double act and we get stories in the past,
• 15:56
  present and future, plus production values that never
• 15:59
  looks better. And next we have crashed dummy
• 16:04
  who says just not for me. I can appreciate a couple of the
• 16:08
  stories, but it's not an ERA or a Doctor stroke companion team I
• 16:12
  enjoy watching. It doesn't have the levity or
• 16:14
  the fun I'm looking for, making it my second least favorite Tom
• 16:18
  season. Not the Doctor companion team
• 16:21
  I'm looking for Crash dummy. I'll need to know the one you
• 16:24
  are looking for. Mike Bartlett says the most
• 16:28
  consistent tone. Perfect run of stories in the
• 16:30
  history of the show. Everyone at the height of their
• 16:33
  powers. Zygon and Seeds are best
• 16:35
  obviously, but even planets and and androids only seem met by
• 16:38
  comparison. Next up we've got Dylan Rees and
• 16:42
  he says some strong stories, but it's very nasty in places and
• 16:47
  does make you think Mary Whitehouse had a point.
• 16:50
  Apart from one story, it all feels a little samey.
• 16:55
  Charlie Bond says a strong contender for best season ever,
• 16:59
  part of the Golden Age. And see why you were getting a
• 17:02
  bit contrary at this point, David, hearing all this praise.
• 17:06
  There never was a golden age, Mike.
• 17:11
  Next up we got Simon Hart and he says yeah, it.
• 17:15
  It's pretty good, isn't it though Planet of Wretched Evil
• 17:18
  is one of the most boring, humorless, and wholly tedious
• 17:21
  stories. Otherwise, it's all consistent,
• 17:24
  isn't it? Lucy McCall says not only great
• 17:27
  stories, but also exceptional guest actors who lift the
• 17:30
  stories even higher. It's always hard to disagree
• 17:33
  with Lucy McCall, but you can't really disagree with that at
• 17:36
  all, can you? No, absolutely not.
• 17:39
  Prentice Hancock. Oh yeah.
• 17:42
  I'm feeling sorry for him already.
• 17:44
  Yeah, I think he's probably going to get the the boot quite,
• 17:48
  quite a lot tonight, to be honest with all of us.
• 17:51
  Unless you like chicken chess like me and then.
• 17:54
  Maybe not, John Arnold says the real monster season huddle,
• 18:01
  shallow but infused with the thrill of the target audience
• 18:04
  that they're watching horror films that they shouldn't.
• 18:08
  Jeff Goddard says having the same writer, director and
• 18:10
  composer for the 1st and final story really did does give a
• 18:13
  nice bookended and consistent tone for the season as a whole.
• 18:18
  Now next we've got Big Orange Michael and he says one of the
• 18:23
  most confident, entertaining seasons ever.
• 18:26
  Hinchcliffe and Holmes put their stamp on the show and give us an
• 18:29
  iconic season close to perfect. Peter Old says didn't used to
• 18:35
  like it, now love it. It's the Baker Sladen combo at
• 18:38
  its absolute apex. It's also quite ostentatious in
• 18:42
  its breath. James Lark says the pinnacle of
• 18:46
  the era, striking the perfect balance between entertaining the
• 18:49
  kids and scaring them silly. The only real flaw is the
• 18:53
  repeated failure to give stories the ending they deserve.
• 18:56
  I'm glad somebody said that. Not really.
• 18:59
  Midshore says the highlights of the two Robert Banks Stewart
• 19:02
  stories always felt it was a real shame he couldn't be
• 19:05
  persuaded back. Sure, Seeds feels a bit off in
• 19:08
  places, but Zygons is a vastly better template for a unit story
• 19:12
  than anything in the Pertweek era.
• 19:14
  Controversial. That's not really Midshire mean.
• 19:20
  In my. Sense Zygons is.
• 19:22
  No, no. What does the name mean?
• 19:24
  Oh, because he looks very similar to midshore from
• 19:27
  Ultravox. Doesn't he?
• 19:29
  I didn't know that was OK. Every time someone does a quote,
• 19:32
  people keep quoting things at me and I don't have a clue.
• 19:36
  Are they doing ultra rock songs? No.
• 19:38
  Oh. OK, you we go back and listen to
• 19:40
  the old episodes every time his name comes up.
• 19:42
  Phrase. What phrase does that means
• 19:45
  nothing to me? Oh, OK, sorry about that.
• 19:47
  Please continue. Matt Dennis says mostly bangers,
• 19:53
  Planet of Evil is meh aside from the great set design, and
• 19:58
  Androids runs out of steam pretty quickly.
• 20:00
  The season belongs to Campfield and Bank Stuart Low 2 Perfect
• 20:04
  collaborations. Dave Very says Hamahora is my
• 20:09
  bag and Holmes is the best writer who has ever had.
• 20:11
  So this is great stuff looking at it.
• 20:14
  Looking at it critically, though, there isn't much
• 20:16
  variety. Few female characters and
• 20:18
  Sarah's tortured every week. Best season ever.
• 20:21
  Now not so sure. Now come on, we've only got 2
• 20:24
  comments left guys, so I want your best Amelia Ducat, please.
• 20:27
  Oh yeah, come on. Oh, really?
• 20:30
  Yeah. I don't.
• 20:32
  I don't know if I can get it that high.
• 20:33
  Can shouldn't be available for any future Simon Sir.
• 20:37
  Robert, a bit like that. All right, so I'll I'll I'll say
• 20:44
  the the person's name in in in my voice, and then I'll try
• 20:47
  that. So it's gift.
• 20:49
  There is no worst best season, full stop.
• 20:53
  Pyramids is best story ever. Fabulous, fabulous, fabulous.
• 20:59
  You got a hard act to follow, David.
• 21:02
  So we have Saturn Gazer. There are no bad stories in
• 21:08
  Season 13. We just do.
• 21:11
  The rest of the episode. Like this?
• 21:12
  I think we ought to. Yeah.
• 21:15
  Fabulous, right? We're on to our first story.
• 21:19
  Damn. Kick us off.
• 21:21
  You've got a choice of six stories.
• 21:23
  Pick your favorite or your least favorite champion.
• 21:26
  Orkin Dam. Right.
• 21:28
  I'm, I'm going to jump right in at the very beginning.
• 21:31
  So I'm going to champion Terror of the Zygons that I think this
• 21:38
  was one of the first stories I had on VHS.
• 21:41
  So, so it feels like it's, it's been with me since since
• 21:46
  childhood. But I think the, the one thing
• 21:51
  that I really want to concentrate on is the Zygons
• 21:54
  themself. I mean, what what a great
• 21:58
  creation that they were, you know, and and it just feels like
• 22:03
  it. It was absolute madness by all
• 22:06
  the people that have done Doctor Who since him since now this
• 22:10
  point that they weren't used until was it was it 2013 at the
• 22:16
  the day of the doctor? It just seems really weird that
• 22:18
  such a well-rounded, beautifully created alien race and and they
• 22:24
  weren't used again in the classic series.
• 22:26
  It's just just. Can I ask a question?
• 22:29
  Wow, with all of that additional money, did they make them look
• 22:32
  so bad in the new series? I mean, I mean, that's the
• 22:35
  thing, 'cause like one of the design is brilliant and it, and
• 22:39
  it feels really organic in, in, you know, terror of the Zygons.
• 22:43
  But then when you, you know, Fast forward to, to to the, the
• 22:47
  modern series, they, they, they basically look like a guy in a
• 22:50
  rubber suit. Rubber monsters, yeah.
• 22:53
  And yeah, I really don't know how that is possible for them to
• 22:58
  to take this brilliant design and make it worse.
• 23:02
  I heard Douglas Canfield was on the set with a hose, just
• 23:05
  constantly hosing them down to make them look as if they were
• 23:08
  organic, you know? Well just compare the shot of
• 23:11
  Sister Lamont as a zycon running through the woods compared to
• 23:15
  2013 the Rubbery's icon running through the woods for Queen Les.
• 23:20
  It's like you'd you'd spin them round.
• 23:22
  If you just saw those two shots you'd say the Really Bad Robbery
• 23:25
  1 was the mid 70s. I say we've got a making
• 23:28
  television, haven't I? Yeah.
• 23:30
  Definitely. But I I think that's it for me
• 23:34
  that that's a problem with the new series.
• 23:36
  I think whenever they've taken classic monsters and updated
• 23:40
  them, they've never done them particularly well.
• 23:44
  I I think, and and it's it's not my favorite era, but I think the
• 23:48
  only, the only one out of Moffett, RTD and Chibbers that
• 23:52
  got it right was Chibbers. I think some of his
• 23:55
  reimaginings, like of the Cybermen and and what have you
• 23:59
  were, were really good. We were banging on, but but the
• 24:02
  other two seem to have, you know, whoever was designing for
• 24:05
  them just didn't, didn't quite, you know, get it right.
• 24:09
  But anyhow, that's, that's, that's by the by.
• 24:13
  So yes, so as well as well as that, that beautiful design,
• 24:15
  it's it's also the kind of the the the back story that they're
• 24:18
  kind of given. So that they're they're
• 24:20
  basically crashed on the planet. They're stranded here.
• 24:25
  They find out that their their home world has has been
• 24:28
  destroyed, but there was a refugee fleet.
• 24:31
  So they're kind of gone. Hey, come, come here, come, come
• 24:33
  to where we are. We, we can, we can make this
• 24:37
  just like our own world. Something.
• 24:38
  So it's a, it's a, it's like an invasion, but, but there's sort
• 24:42
  of like a slight skew on that. It's not irregular.
• 24:46
  They're just turning up to just destroy everyone and, and what
• 24:48
  they, they want to terraform the earth, make it their own and
• 24:52
  enslave the human race. And, and I think that that's
• 24:54
  really cool the, the voices as well.
• 24:58
  That's such a genius concept that rather than being big and
• 25:03
  shouty, they they're quite, it's quite low.
• 25:07
  They they, they whisper and it's sort of like really hoarse kind
• 25:11
  of kind of voices. Then obviously the actual
• 25:14
  spaceship that they've got with all the, the the, the sort of
• 25:17
  like mushroom kind of organic Y type fronds and stuff that they
• 25:23
  that they kind of, I want to say massage, but I don't know.
• 25:26
  I don't know if that's the right word to get correct.
• 25:28
  Yeah. Bundle, yeah.
• 25:31
  People say it looks like a pizza.
• 25:32
  If a pizza turned up from Domino's looking like that, I
• 25:35
  would send it straight. Back, send it back.
• 25:36
  Yeah, yeah, definitely. And and I and I think obviously
• 25:40
  that this should be like a kudos to to Douglas Campfield because
• 25:46
  he keeps them in the shadows for quite a long time.
• 25:49
  I think we don't actually see a Zygon properly until the end of
• 25:53
  episode 1. You just get like a, you know, a
• 25:56
  glimpse of their, their eyes or a hand or whatever.
• 25:59
  And, and I think that's, that's really, that's really clever as
• 26:02
  well to keep, keep them in the keep that suspense, keep it,
• 26:05
  keep it going for as long as they possibly can.
• 26:09
  And then I mean, I think also the, the, the three actors that
• 26:15
  play Zygon's Zygon, Zygon duplicates and, and humans as
• 26:22
  well. I think all of those deserve
• 26:25
  like a massive pat on the back because they're fundamentally
• 26:28
  playing 3, three different, different characters in a way.
• 26:32
  And, and I think that changed from being the Zygon duplicate
• 26:37
  and the human it, it's quite subtle, the changes in their
• 26:41
  personalities, but it's noticeable enough to go, yes,
• 26:44
  this, this is the human version and this is the Zygon version.
• 26:48
  So I think, I think there's, there's, there's, there's loads
• 26:51
  about the Zygons that's just just absolutely brilliant.
• 26:54
  Although I do wonder why a warlord of, of a, of the, of an
• 27:02
  alien race would stop to pick up hitchhikers.
• 27:06
  That does seem a little. Bit out of.
• 27:08
  Character, you know, but hey. He's got so good at playing a
• 27:13
  human being at that point. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 27:17
  Yeah, and then, and then obviously I think there's like a
• 27:19
  wonderful atmosphere in this as well.
• 27:21
  So I think I've, I've mentioned it on various other podcasts
• 27:25
  that I've been on. I really love it when, and I
• 27:28
  don't know whether it's because I was brought up in a in a rural
• 27:31
  countryside, but I, I love it when Doctor Who does the British
• 27:35
  rural locations, whether it's the demons or the awakening or
• 27:39
  whatever the it's just for me. I just love that because it's
• 27:43
  the monsters have turned up on my on my doorstep, But but you
• 27:48
  get that feeling of like isolation and and being cut off
• 27:52
  from from civilization and and I think they really play on that.
• 27:56
  And with this you, you've got like that unit soldier that's on
• 27:59
  the Moors and the mist comes in and you can hear the, the
• 28:02
  scarison bellowing in the, in the distance of thing and just
• 28:06
  just adds to the atmosphere and the suspense of it, which then
• 28:10
  kind of, you know, it's then accompanied by the brilliant
• 28:15
  incidental music on this as well, Which kind of brings me to
• 28:18
  my Third Point, because I really love the music that Jeffrey
• 28:23
  Bergen does for this and for seeds at at the end of the
• 28:29
  season. And, and it's kind of one of
• 28:31
  those things again. Why did, why did we only get him
• 28:34
  to do 2 seasons? It's 02 stories, Sorry, because
• 28:38
  it's, it's wonderful what he does.
• 28:39
  So he's got that kind of mixture of like Celtic kind of style
• 28:44
  themes weaved through and suspenseful kind of music and
• 28:48
  all this sort of thing. It's just magical.
• 28:50
  And, and, and I'd think because we we've just had this kind of
• 28:55
  steady flow of Dudley Simpson. And that's fine because Dudley
• 28:58
  did some really, really good music compositions for Doctor
• 29:03
  Who. But it's just nice to have that
• 29:05
  little bit of variety, especially as when you think,
• 29:08
  you know, from day one, we always have different directors,
• 29:11
  we always have a different writer, there's always different
• 29:13
  designers. But then we kind of stick with
• 29:15
  Dudley for quite some time. So it's just nice to have that
• 29:18
  variety. And he really does put his stamp
• 29:21
  on this story and the one at the end of the season.
• 29:23
  Makes you wish done it makes you wish more.
• 29:25
  Directors took exception to how much direction earned.
• 29:28
  Yeah. Yeah, definitely.
• 29:30
  How much did he? Earn for that router the last
• 29:33
  years and years. I don't know, but yeah, you
• 29:38
  know, so I just really love Terror of the Zygons and those
• 29:41
  are my kind of free, free reasons why.
• 29:43
  I just think it's just a a brilliant, brilliant story.
• 29:47
  Let us go to the comments, Mark, Booth says.
• 29:50
  Garrison aside, this gives us terrifying monsters.
• 29:53
  That scene in the barn with Sarah and duplicate Harry
• 29:55
  lingers long in the memory. And Tom, as imperious as ever,
• 29:59
  never was a doctor's alien as when he hypnotizes Sarah in the
• 30:02
  decompression chamber. Which what you said, Joe
• 30:05
  Affection. I'm going to try and do this in
• 30:08
  a Zygon voice. Let's see how it goes, all
• 30:09
  right, Kevin Bianco says. The Loch Ness Monster and
• 30:14
  Harry's goodbye scene. Oh shit, the Scottish setting,
• 30:19
  creepy atmosphere and Tommy Tartan makes for superb stuff.
• 30:25
  I can't do that. No, let's, let's go back to our
• 30:27
  voices. Very good.
• 30:30
  I just wanted to say shit in a zygote voice.
• 30:33
  Jeff Goddard says an all time great atmospheric music,
• 30:36
  stunning creature design, top level performances, beautiful
• 30:39
  location work. It's the best of the four
• 30:41
  episode Monster of the Week stories.
• 30:44
  James Holden Beditt says having the same actors in Zygon gear
• 30:48
  and playing their human counterparts mean they wipe the
• 30:50
  floor. Oh dear.
• 30:52
  Piss poor 21st century versions James, you never fail to get.
• 30:56
  In A Muppet. In somewhere.
• 30:59
  Lovely Joe Short says the last hurrah for the UNIT era and one
• 31:03
  of the best stories. The classic era plus the
• 31:05
  Brigadier and the Kilt. Paul Quinn says this may be Tom
• 31:09
  Bakers best performance. The alienness is at its peak
• 31:12
  here, but there's also a sly humor.
• 31:14
  Yes the Scarison hand puppet is shit.
• 31:16
  A lot of people saying shit. The stop motion model is much
• 31:19
  better, but the Zygons are the best design monster of the
• 31:21
  original RUM. Ron Hall says directed design
• 31:24
  scored and acted so brilliantly that not even the crummy
• 31:27
  scurrison can ruin it. But he's brought on always the
• 31:30
  Duke of Fogil until the real Duke is freed.
• 31:33
  If so, why does he pick up hitchhikers, as as Val was
• 31:36
  saying? And why does he wind up Huckel
• 31:38
  by deliberately mispronouncing his name?
• 31:40
  Is he bored and doing it just to pass the time until the fleet
• 31:43
  arrives? He has waited several centuries.
• 31:47
  Paul Cresser says. An all time favorite.
• 31:49
  Seeing UNIT in a Hinchcliffe story really highlights how far
• 31:52
  the show's moved on from those cosy per wee days.
• 31:55
  Jason Thompson says the duplicates and replace concept
• 31:57
  is unsettling. The location work is glorious,
• 32:00
  but as the last hurrah for units, it's a bit off and shows
• 32:03
  how the 4th Doctor doesn't really fit the mold for this
• 32:05
  kind of story. Keep it up with reservations.
• 32:09
  Jack Coyer says arguably the greatest trance story of all
• 32:12
  time, Canford is one of the greatest food directors, and
• 32:15
  Jeffrey Bergen's score is different and halting, really
• 32:18
  adding to the tone of the piece. But it but it should conclude
• 32:22
  Season 12 we're supposed to wasn't it?
• 32:24
  Featuring another race of desperate survivors and
• 32:26
  continuing the 4th Doctor's desperation to break free from
• 32:29
  UNIT. Yeah, it was until they decided
• 32:31
  to move the schedules around and move to a September start.
• 32:35
  James Larks as Camfield returns to Who for the first time since
• 32:37
  Inferno and pretty much ignores what happened to units in his
• 32:40
  absence. The cosy family vibe is gone and
• 32:43
  we're back to serious jeopardy and edgy paranoia.
• 32:45
  A perfectly paced story blessed with great design and perhaps
• 32:49
  the classiest score the series has ever had.
• 32:51
  Top tier Doctor Who. Daniel Knight says a talk
• 32:55
  thriller with one of the best monsters ever realized in the
• 32:58
  series. Douglas Canfield's direction and
• 33:00
  Jeffrey Bergen's music make this eerie and unsettling.
• 33:04
  Great. Doctor Who says why I'll be my
• 33:05
  least favorite of the season. It's still really enjoyable.
• 33:08
  Zygon sending a fake Loch Ness Monster to London.
• 33:11
  Bonkers, but great. Paul Dunn says what's not to
• 33:15
  love? Canfield's direction?
• 33:17
  The best Zygons I've ever looked.
• 33:18
  John would not turning in a fabulous performance and I love
• 33:21
  the scene with Harry branching a pitfall in the barn.
• 33:25
  Vote this out and you're bonkers.
• 33:27
  Lucy McCall said so many great performances.
• 33:30
  Evil Harry stands out for me, but so does John Woodnut as the
• 33:33
  sinister Breton and the twinkly eyed Duke.
• 33:36
  And As for Sister Lamont, terrifying the doctors.
• 33:39
  Quicksilver personality is becoming fully formed, switching
• 33:42
  between humor and seriousness. I love it where he vandalizes
• 33:45
  the Zygon ship. Luke Sims Jenkins This is a
• 33:48
  penultimate comet you'll be pleased to know, so it's one of
• 33:52
  the best season openers. A perfect end of the era.
• 33:55
  Sorry, a perfect end of an era. And Glen Fitzgerald says what an
• 34:00
  absolute banger this has got everything.
• 34:02
  The Dream Team, a story that makes me feel warm and cosy and
• 34:05
  yes, even old Nessie in the Thames.
• 34:07
  Surely it's a keeper, David. Assessed with bangers today.
• 34:11
  I know a lot of bangers and a lot of shit.
• 34:15
  David Banger or shit banger or. Shit, Oh dear.
• 34:20
  This is this is going to this is not getting us off to a good
• 34:23
  start, is it? So when I I rewatched this
• 34:26
  season, but we said we were going to do it.
• 34:28
  And obviously the joys of watching it with my husband,
• 34:31
  who's relatively new to Doctor Who ish 10 years and he was
• 34:37
  bored by this. And even when the stop motion
• 34:40
  scaris at the end of Part 2 comes up and it's like that this
• 34:43
  is the good one. This is the good effect.
• 34:45
  And he's like, really, that's the good effect, but he's wrong
• 34:50
  because this is great. And this I'm going to have to
• 34:53
  chime in and agree with what everybody else is saying.
• 34:55
  It does sort of doesn't fall apart in the final episode as
• 34:59
  much as some of the other stories this year.
• 35:01
  But so the the first thing I had written down was just open scam
• 35:05
  fields direction. And I think this is contended to
• 35:08
  be one of the most atmospheric stories of the classic series.
• 35:11
  I think all that location work, the music, the use of the mist,
• 35:16
  the sense of tension, the hunt, the hunting of the Saigon in the
• 35:22
  woods, the when the nurse attacks the soldier with the
• 35:25
  Rockets, all just absolutely pitch perfect.
• 35:28
  And that cliffhanger to the first episode is the way it's
• 35:31
  all set up. There's that scene where the
• 35:33
  doctor's on the phone to Sarah as the cut in between Harry
• 35:37
  waking up and you've got him going no.
• 35:39
  And then it cuts to the doctor saying no on the phone.
• 35:42
  It's like Douglas Canfield isn't.
• 35:44
  It's not just pointing the camera and getting good shots.
• 35:46
  He knows how to cut as well and cut to create dramatic tension.
• 35:51
  People talked about Harry and the barn Ian Master playing
• 35:54
  duplicate. Harry is so bloody sinister.
• 35:58
  So the my first reason for keeping this is just the the
• 36:01
  direction, the atmosphere. And the second reason is I think
• 36:04
  this is when Tom Baker nails his performance.
• 36:08
  I mean, he was great in season 12 and he gets off to such a
• 36:11
  great start. And I think now someone will
• 36:14
  probably line up the dates, but this is probably around the
• 36:16
  point when they're recording. This is when it starts to go
• 36:20
  out. And I think this is before the
• 36:23
  IT all starts to go to his ego and to his head a little bit.
• 36:26
  So this is the beginnings of the I'm bloody good at this.
• 36:30
  And while I know you've all touched on the scene in the air
• 36:33
  in the decompression chamber, the most quintessential Tom
• 36:37
  Baker scene is in Part 1. And he has probably one of the
• 36:40
  most Tom Baker lines, whatever which is the sea may be calm,
• 36:46
  but he's never empty. And it's just the way he
• 36:48
  delivers that line, the way that Canfield shoots him saying that
• 36:52
  line that it's tight and it's close.
• 36:54
  You've got the music coming in. It's absolutely perfect.
• 36:59
  So it's. John Kalshaw out.
• 37:01
  David Gillespie Pratt in. So I'll take the work I could do
• 37:06
  with the money. This is Tom where he knows how
• 37:09
  to pitch it. He's he's humorous when he needs
• 37:12
  to be, he's serious when he needs to be, and he just gets
• 37:16
  that balance. Absolutely spot on.
• 37:18
  So, and I did write for a Third Point, the Zygon design, but I
• 37:21
  didn't write anything else. But I do think there's a sort of
• 37:23
  nervous twitch Doctor Who fans have is if when you're reviewing
• 37:27
  Terror the Zygons and you talk about Zygon design, you have to
• 37:30
  mention how shit the 2013 version is.
• 37:33
  It's almost like a reflex action.
• 37:36
  Are you keeping that reaction up?
• 37:39
  And no, they are pretty shit. I don't think any Doctor Who
• 37:44
  monsters look more rubbery than those Argons.
• 37:46
  I even including like the Marsh men and things like that.
• 37:50
  So yeah, that that's a definite, it's a keeper.
• 37:52
  It it's a classic. It's a, it's a top 10 classic
• 37:55
  series story for a reason. And that's because it's bloody
• 37:57
  good. You almost had me fold in at the
• 37:59
  start of that by bringing in your husband and his opinions,
• 38:02
  but I love his opinions so keep him coming.
• 38:06
  Joe, over to you. Yes.
• 38:09
  Can I, can I ask a series of questions and maybe you can ask
• 38:11
  them for me? Why is Broton destroying oil
• 38:15
  rigs and gaining attention to the Zygons at the start of this
• 38:19
  story? Why is he doing that?
• 38:21
  Because. He's got nothing to lose because
• 38:23
  he thinks he can win, so he's practicing and if anybody
• 38:26
  notices, they're just stupid humans.
• 38:28
  Didn't he say he was testing the power of the scarison as well?
• 38:31
  I think there is a throwaway line in that.
• 38:33
  Those are all good answers but I don't buy it.
• 38:35
  Sorry. Why are they we attacking the
• 38:38
  energy convention in this? What is the purpose of that?
• 38:41
  That is to show Earth so by the Scarison destroying the
• 38:46
  building, which it's intended to do is to show the power of the
• 38:49
  Zygons so they can hold the world to hostage.
• 38:51
  But. With one monster and six aliens.
• 38:55
  There's a whole army of them in the room next door.
• 38:58
  No, I think he says something. There's only 6 of you.
• 39:00
  That's the joke. There's a fleet on the way.
• 39:02
  How comes it's so easy to destroy a Zygon ship?
• 39:05
  You just twiddle a few knobs and it blows up.
• 39:08
  Yeah, that's the self destruct button.
• 39:10
  Whoever puts a self destruct button on a.
• 39:13
  Does your car have a self destruct button?
• 39:15
  No, I don't know. I don't know why spaceships
• 39:17
  have. Does this podcast have a self
• 39:19
  destruct button? I see people reaching out for it
• 39:21
  all the time. Why have the cycles waited for
• 39:24
  centuries to execute this plan? There you go, silence.
• 39:31
  Can six of them take over the world?
• 39:33
  What's all the fuss with removing the bug from the pub?
• 39:37
  Why don't they duplicate the bandage around Harry's head for
• 39:40
  God's sake? It's so obvious.
• 39:41
  I mean, the questions go on and on and on and on and on.
• 39:44
  I'm not sure this script has been fought through particularly
• 39:46
  well. Another issue I have with this
• 39:50
  is that the Scottish terrorist stereotypes in this because I
• 39:53
  visited Edinburgh and I expected everyone to be eating haggis,
• 39:57
  wearing tartan, playing bagpipes and when they were just all
• 40:00
  normal people with. Delicious accents.
• 40:03
  I was very confused, frankly. And so like the Welsh in the
• 40:07
  Green Death. I don't think this does any
• 40:09
  favours but the Scots. And how insulting to suggest
• 40:14
  that some dreary village in Sussex could Have you been to
• 40:17
  Scotland? It's absolutely beautiful, and
• 40:21
  this really is a script made-up of it's basically a heady
• 40:25
  doppelganger of old Doctor Who's, isn't it?
• 40:28
  Villages, villages under siege, alien invasions, duplicates
• 40:32
  unit. It's all the old Hackney cliches
• 40:35
  in there, all thrown into the wits.
• 40:36
  As a script, I think it's pretty bad and I was going to bin this,
• 40:44
  but I really I can't because I've just listened to the two of
• 40:47
  you talking and you're everything you say is right
• 40:50
  about the design, about the acting, about the direction.
• 40:54
  Like I think Douglas Scanfield comes in, he's so good, he
• 40:57
  papers over all of those cracks because every fucking scene is a
• 41:02
  banger. Creepy sister Lamont and her
• 41:05
  blood going down her arm when I was a kid that scared me.
• 41:08
  And that enormous rock that she brings the UNIT soldier with
• 41:12
  scared me so much as a kid. So yeah, unfortunately you guys
• 41:16
  have forced me to chicken out or daring to have been terror of
• 41:20
  the Saigon's by your compelling arguments.
• 41:22
  So despite my many, many issues with the script, and I don't
• 41:26
  think it's a great script, this really is great.
• 41:29
  It just goes to show the director can Polish a turd.
• 41:35
  It's like, because I was listening to your Arc in Space
• 41:38
  commentary you did with Sai and it's the how you don't mind the
• 41:42
  bubble wrap. You don't notice it because
• 41:43
  everything else is sort of. And I think in Doctor Who, if
• 41:47
  you've got 3 components, which is the writing, the acting, the
• 41:49
  production. And I think if they get two of
• 41:51
  those three things right, you can kind of ignore the other
• 41:55
  one. So if the direct, the direction
• 41:57
  in the acting is good, if the script or the story isn't
• 42:01
  strong, the other two are usually enough to carry you
• 42:04
  forward. Because in fact, I'm going to
• 42:06
  play that game now with every story.
• 42:09
  Do they get 2 right or not? I mean, I just came up come up
• 42:12
  with it on the fly, but but I just think why do why are we
• 42:17
  more forgiving a special effects in some stories than others?
• 42:19
  It's because something is working right to carry you
• 42:22
  through it and. I don't think the script you
• 42:25
  said. When the script's not strong, I
• 42:26
  don't think it's, it's an odd 1. I had exactly the same reaction
• 42:30
  watching in this time, Joe, because you're thinking more
• 42:31
  critically, because you know, we're coming on to talk about
• 42:34
  it. And I had exactly the same
• 42:35
  response that you did. And so I was thinking, hang on,
• 42:38
  that doesn't quite make sense. Why?
• 42:39
  Why have they been here? What was the whole set up for?
• 42:43
  I looked over it. But I did have exactly the same
• 42:45
  reaction. But I think there's so much, as
• 42:49
  you said, Dave, there's so much else going on you just can't
• 42:51
  get, can't help but get carried away with it.
• 42:54
  I'm putting it through as well. So it's definitely going through
• 42:56
  my three reasons. My first one is the Doctor,
• 42:59
  Sarah and Harry. Has there ever been a more
• 43:02
  glorious TARDIS trio than this? And I would say no, and I doubt
• 43:06
  there ever will be. The chemistry between those
• 43:09
  three actors is so evidence on the screen.
• 43:12
  It shines just when you watch it.
• 43:14
  Look how many times Liz Sladen breaks into a smile when she's
• 43:18
  with Tom or when she's with Ian. It feels like it's the actor
• 43:22
  shining through rather than the character.
• 43:25
  They're just such a great team. Is it you?
• 43:29
  Yeah. Is it really?
• 43:30
  You. I know it's brilliant in that.
• 43:33
  But in terms of companions and characters, well, these are, you
• 43:36
  know, Sarah and Harry. They are intelligent, capable
• 43:39
  people. We've lost the youth
• 43:41
  identification figure of a Vicky or a Dodo or a Victoria.
• 43:45
  You know we've now got three adults here and each of them's
• 43:48
  written with agency in this story.
• 43:50
  Anyway, as soon as they arrive, Harry takes charge of the
• 43:53
  medical investigation. Sarah's off, using her
• 43:55
  journalistic nails to talk to the villagers and find out
• 43:58
  what's going on. Then it's Harry that saves the
• 44:00
  doctor from the Scarison by launching himself onto the
• 44:03
  controls. Sarah's the one that works out.
• 44:05
  There's a bug in the end. She's the one that rallies the
• 44:07
  troop to go after the fake Harry.
• 44:10
  She's the one who single handedly rescues Harry from the
• 44:12
  Zygon spaceship. Working really well together as
• 44:16
  a team. That is a bit odd though.
• 44:18
  When she goes let's split up and the three soldiers go together
• 44:20
  and she goes in the other direction, she's asking for
• 44:23
  trouble, really. It's she knows she's in Doctor
• 44:25
  Who, that's why. Oh.
• 44:27
  That's, you know, in the barn. That scene in the barn is
• 44:31
  spectacular. Best directed scene in Doctor
• 44:33
  Whoever. It's so good.
• 44:37
  And the noise that the dying Zygon makes just.
• 44:41
  Could you please give us a? No, I've done, I've done,
• 44:45
  Amelia. Could you do could you do a
• 44:50
  dying Zygon in the style of Amelia Ducat?
• 44:57
  The the the sound of a dying Zygon is squatching hand
• 45:00
  cleanser, as the the more than 30 years in the TARDIS has would
• 45:04
  have you believe. Good old swarfieger.
• 45:06
  We should have brought some along with us, shouldn't?
• 45:08
  We I'm sure you've got plenty there, Joe Shut.
• 45:11
  Out you. So, Sarah, Harry, I'm the
• 45:14
  Doctor. My first one, second one.
• 45:16
  You've kind of all touched on the design, but there are some
• 45:18
  other things I want to pick up. The brilliant model work.
• 45:21
  I love the oil rigs, the beginning, The spaceship coming
• 45:24
  out of Loch Ness looks spectacular.
• 45:26
  The spaceship landing in the sand pit looks even better.
• 45:29
  Tremendous where? Is that though?
• 45:31
  You've got that, I agree with you.
• 45:33
  And then in Planet of Evil that Hoover going through space and
• 45:35
  it looks so vague. What?
• 45:38
  Different directors, different directors, different style isn't
• 45:40
  it? The sets are great, from the Inn
• 45:43
  through to the Dukes Castle got brilliant location shooting.
• 45:46
  Yes Joe, it is all set in West Sussex but you know you could,
• 45:50
  you can stretch. You imagine the music going.
• 45:52
  I don't mind. You believe it's Scotland?
• 45:55
  And Dan, as you said so eloquently, the Zygons, they are
• 45:58
  such a triumph. And yes, the ones in 2013 are
• 46:02
  shit. I will just add to that chorus,
• 46:05
  they are terrible. These look just amazing.
• 46:09
  You mentioned you know all the close-ups that the Campfield
• 46:12
  does when you just see the eyes surrounded by the mask.
• 46:14
  Brilliant. That really weird, strange round
• 46:18
  open mouth looks like almost like a baby doll.
• 46:21
  It's really disturbing. The thing that gets me as well
• 46:24
  is the body shape. I don't quite know how they did
• 46:26
  it because the chest is extended and and pronounced and then the
• 46:29
  neck goes in again. It almost looks like you can't
• 46:32
  contort a human body. I think it's.
• 46:34
  Actually sort of leaning back like that, but the costume.
• 46:37
  'S coming out. Costume comes forward and then
• 46:39
  you've got the the fake chin coming forward.
• 46:41
  It just looks so unusual. I mean, yeah, it's it's slightly
• 46:44
  based on a kind of distorted fetus, which is more than a
• 46:47
  little bit disturbing, but it just looks brilliant.
• 46:50
  And that gives you those brilliant scenes.
• 46:52
  Like you said, David, the cliffhanger at the end of
• 46:54
  episode 1 where we first see the Zygon for the first time and it
• 46:57
  attacks Sarah. The shot of it in the barn, it
• 47:00
  just looked they look wonderful. And then my last reason is, is
• 47:03
  unit. Yes, this is the end of unit.
• 47:05
  We can't count Android invasion because that's a very depleted
• 47:08
  unit. And we definitely can't keep
• 47:10
  count seeds because we don't see anyone there.
• 47:13
  This is last row. James Lark.
• 47:15
  I'm going to take exception to these that before this is all
• 47:18
  back to kind of the grittiness of of Season 7.
• 47:21
  Yes, we have got kind of blazing guns.
• 47:23
  We've got depth charges that Brig ends up shooting Proton.
• 47:27
  I think there is still some of that.
• 47:28
  I wouldn't call cozeness, but there's definitely some of that
• 47:31
  camaraderie. I think when Liz first walks in
• 47:33
  and she sees the brick in a kilt and she takes the Mickey out of
• 47:36
  him and he takes it with good humour.
• 47:38
  He's not spiky. That kind of camaraderie that
• 47:40
  we've got used to now in the UNIT family is definitely there,
• 47:43
  and it is prevalent apart from the Doctor.
• 47:46
  So the Doctor, he shouts at the Brigadier at the beginning, he's
• 47:49
  such a grumpy twat at the beginning.
• 47:51
  He's spiky, he's hostile. But this is a different Doctor
• 47:55
  now. I mean, just, it struck me his
• 47:57
  lash up to, to send a radio signal through to Unit by
• 48:01
  putting himself in the middle of the two bits of electricity, if
• 48:04
  you use a better word, and virtually electrocute himself to
• 48:07
  death so he can send a signal. It's so different to what poetry
• 48:10
  would have done, which would have probably involved a wine
• 48:12
  bottle and a Corkscrew. You know, it's a different style
• 48:16
  now. It's it's much more hard
• 48:17
  hitting. So it is time for Unit to move
• 48:20
  on. But I think this is a good
• 48:21
  goodbye to them. Do you, I don't know if you guys
• 48:23
  remember back in the I think it was in the 90s, there was an
• 48:28
  interview published with Nicholas Courtney talking about
• 48:31
  Tom Baker and Terra, those icons and how things were different
• 48:34
  from the Peril years. And he said in the interview
• 48:39
  that Tom had received feedback about his performance in the
• 48:43
  first year because it was the end of his first year.
• 48:45
  And he threw, it was a bit of paper.
• 48:48
  He threw it at him and said, what do you think of this, Mr.
• 48:51
  Livid? And I'm wondering if some of
• 48:53
  that grumpiness was him getting his first bit of feedback from
• 48:57
  the higher ups. But of course, you know, the
• 49:00
  ratings were in, the people were happy and he was soon learned he
• 49:03
  was much loved. And Courtney didn't get on.
• 49:06
  With Baker in the story. They it was not a happy shoot.
• 49:09
  Good friends later on though, weren't they?
• 49:10
  Oh, absolutely. Best of drinking, drinking.
• 49:12
  Buddy. It's amazing what a Pike can.
• 49:16
  Do but yeah, this is absolutely this is going through.
• 49:19
  I really was going to go for this one but.
• 49:21
  These two are too enchanting for me to resist David.
• 49:26
  Be enchanting on your. Story of choice.
• 49:29
  Now do. Do I've got a couple for the
• 49:32
  bin, so I do want to go positive or do I go negative and I'm I'm
• 49:38
  I'm going for the bin. And.
• 49:41
  It's one of the two really obvious been choices from this
• 49:44
  season, but what the hell, let's go for it because interesting to
• 49:47
  see what you make of the Android invasion and it is held up as
• 49:53
  one of the weakest stories of this season.
• 49:54
  Some people say it's the weakest Hinchcliffe.
• 49:58
  It's not the weakest. Hinchcliffe for.
• 50:00
  Me because that's the hand of fear, but we don't talk about
• 50:02
  that. One winner of Strictly Come home
• 50:05
  to season. 14 I'll have you now. This is.
• 50:09
  Going this is. Going in the crawl bin and this
• 50:13
  is real shame because it starts so well.
• 50:15
  I think we have a huge chunk of episode 1 on film.
• 50:19
  There's a nice atmosphere, Barry.
• 50:21
  Let's just directing it well. You've got the unit soldier
• 50:24
  stalking through the woods with that twitch in time to the
• 50:27
  music, which is really effective and it builds quite.
• 50:30
  Nicely, and there's a real. Sense of mystery going.
• 50:34
  But as soon as the crawls turn up and soon as other actors
• 50:38
  start to turn up, it just starts to fall apart.
• 50:42
  And by the time you get to part 4, it's just a bit of a mess.
• 50:46
  It makes no sense. Stigrund.
• 50:49
  It is a good plan. Stigrund.
• 50:54
  What, what? What on earth was on?
• 50:56
  With Barry, let's on to let some of these performances through.
• 50:59
  So first reason is it's not a bad performance, but it is the
• 51:04
  wrong performance, and that is Milton John's because Milton
• 51:08
  Johns actually doesn't do anything wrong, but I think he
• 51:11
  is really badly miscast in a part that is just does not work
• 51:16
  either as a script or as a character.
• 51:19
  So Guy Crayford is meant to be this astronaut, maybe a bit of a
• 51:23
  heroic character. Well, that's not Milton Johns.
• 51:25
  Why would you cast Milton Johns as a heroic astronaut?
• 51:27
  I have no idea. Then what sort of function is he
• 51:31
  playing in the story? Well, he's selling Earth out,
• 51:34
  and then there's this whole business with an eye patch,
• 51:35
  because he's been rebuilt. But apart from the eye, the eye
• 51:38
  patch, he's never looked underneath.
• 51:40
  And then he could have covered that with a lion, right?
• 51:43
  He'd been. Brainwashed to not take the eye
• 51:45
  patch off or something. Or don't.
• 51:47
  Just don't make it a cloth. Eye patch they can just pull
• 51:50
  aside or just not have it and. Have him and have him realise
• 51:54
  through the actions of the the crawls and the androids that
• 51:57
  stick runs up to no good. That would make a lot more sense
• 52:00
  actually. But no, no, we have to have an
• 52:02
  eye. Patch and everything, and you
• 52:04
  know, this sniveling character, he has that scene where he's
• 52:07
  trying to explain to Sarah why he's doing it, and it just
• 52:10
  doesn't work. Why would somebody who comes
• 52:13
  across as generally quite intelligent character, why is he
• 52:15
  falling so easily for the lies that Stigeron's feeding him?
• 52:19
  And they're clearly lies. And so it's just he's not bad.
• 52:23
  He's always good. He always plays great lines
• 52:25
  sniveling characters. He's great in End of the World
• 52:27
  as Bennick. He's one of the highlights of
• 52:29
  Invasion of Time as Kelner and I say he's not bad here, but I'm
• 52:34
  just the character just does not work and I think he's not the
• 52:38
  right actor to try and elevate this from being.
• 52:41
  What the hell is going on with this character in this part?
• 52:46
  So Guy Crayford is possibly one of the big missteps of the
• 52:49
  season. Second point, Harry and even
• 52:54
  Benton deserved better because if Harry had left at the end of
• 52:59
  Terence Zygons, that would have been sad.
• 53:02
  A really nice exit for him. He's had his time with the
• 53:05
  Doctor, he's getting British Rail back home.
• 53:08
  That's the end. But they bring Ian Marta back.
• 53:11
  Harry doesn't actually properly appear until part four, and even
• 53:14
  then he's not really doing very much in it.
• 53:16
  And then when he does get his final scene, I don't think he
• 53:19
  even gets a proper final line. Whether or not they they did
• 53:23
  anticipate this being Harry's final appearance or not, I don't
• 53:25
  know. But it was, and he deserved
• 53:29
  better. So did John Levine.
• 53:32
  Now we we could sit here for a long time talking about the
• 53:36
  merits of John Levine's contributions to the world of
• 53:38
  acting. I mean, like, wasn't it John
• 53:40
  Pertwee who said he was one of the greatest actors of his
• 53:43
  generation? Which might Somewhere, somewhere
• 53:46
  someone is telling a lie here, but I can't quite had a gun at
• 53:50
  his head a lot. And.
• 53:54
  You. Know he's been a semi regular
• 53:55
  for what, 6 years at this point? And you know when you've been a
• 54:00
  six year semi, I just. Wanted to use that line.
• 54:06
  You know, he gets knocked on. He gets knocked unconscious in a
• 54:09
  cupboard and that's it. And so no wonder he's a John
• 54:13
  Levine's just a little bit bitter about, you know, how he,
• 54:17
  he, he, I believe he says Tom Baker wrote him out personally,
• 54:21
  judging by some of his conventional appearance, he
• 54:23
  hates him, doesn't he? He says at every appearance now
• 54:27
  he just loathed Storm Baker. And so I just.
• 54:32
  Think there's two characters, one who's been a regular, who's
• 54:34
  been well established, well liked regular Heat, Harry and
• 54:37
  Ian and I said Ian Levine, Ian, Marta.
• 54:41
  Now that would be good. Casting that's.
• 54:43
  What happens when you start putting names together?
• 54:46
  Ian Marta deserve better and he has say, even Benton, as someone
• 54:51
  who's been around Mike Gates, got a bit of an exit.
• 54:54
  The Brigadier kind of came back later, Benton.
• 54:58
  Just sort of. Quietly fades away.
• 55:00
  And goes and sells used cars, although he does make an
• 55:02
  exceptional comeback in the spin off classic Wartime, but that's
• 55:07
  not for today. Third Point.
• 55:11
  I did mention part 4 and it is so it came up in some of the
• 55:16
  comments and. Everything this.
• 55:17
  Season has a couple of overarching issues.
• 55:19
  One. Which?
• 55:20
  Is it's almost a total sausage fest or we will come, Yeah.
• 55:26
  If I applied that to. Every single story that I
• 55:27
  applied to it would come up a lot, so I'm going to use that
• 55:29
  later on. So usually.
• 55:33
  It wouldn't be an issue, but I agree with you.
• 55:35
  It is an issue here and I think the other criticism that's
• 55:38
  levelled. It this year in particular,
• 55:39
  season is the part. Fours don't always work.
• 55:43
  And I think. This is probably one of the
• 55:47
  weakest because all of a. Sudden the doctrine.
• 55:52
  Sarah have Android double S, although when did the?
• 55:54
  It's never really clearly established when they were
• 55:56
  created. And then how were they sent to
• 55:58
  earth? So that's a bit confusing.
• 56:00
  The whole business with the eye patch, which doesn't really make
• 56:02
  sense. The Krall fleet, which is about
• 56:05
  to come and invade the Earth, bit like the Zygon fleet coating
• 56:08
  of the parallus gets conveniently forgotten about
• 56:13
  we've. Unfortunately, they couldn't get
• 56:15
  Nick. Courtney in.
• 56:16
  So they've ordered the Brigadier off Wish.
• 56:17
  And we've got Patrick Newell turning up, you know, playing
• 56:22
  really broadly as well. Also The Avengers connection,
• 56:26
  because he was obviously playing mother in The Avengers.
• 56:29
  And my husband is usually fantastic spotting actors and
• 56:32
  other things. But he couldn't recognise
• 56:33
  Patrick Newell because of the amount of weight he'd lost
• 56:36
  between finishing in The Avengers and turning up an
• 56:38
  Android Invasion. Because he looks like a totally
• 56:41
  different person. But yeah, he's he's not Nicholas
• 56:44
  Courtney. He's not the Brig.
• 56:45
  The story teases us with the name on the door, but instead we
• 56:48
  get this slightly bumbling character.
• 56:51
  It does show you don't it if they imagine.
• 56:53
  They cast him instead of Nicholas Courtney as the
• 56:56
  Brigadier. It just goes to show you
• 56:58
  everything that Nicholas Courtney brought to the role.
• 57:00
  It just goes to show if you cast.
• 57:02
  If you get your casting right, it works.
• 57:05
  There's some pretty shoddy direction in part four.
• 57:08
  I think the whole business, there's what what the what the
• 57:14
  listener cannot say is that Joe is doing an impression of
• 57:17
  Elizabeth Slayden in the G Force, you know?
• 57:20
  Previously, when the ambassador of.
• 57:22
  Death I think they blew a hose in the doctor's face, but I
• 57:24
  think this time, you know, she just basically stretches her
• 57:27
  face. Not, not an expression I wanted
• 57:30
  to use, but the the that whole confrontation in the rocket in
• 57:34
  the rocket Bay between the Android and sticker on is just,
• 57:39
  it feels like it's been done at the end of the end of the
• 57:41
  recording day, the lights are about to go out and they've just
• 57:43
  got to get something in the can. It just feels really rushed.
• 57:47
  And then it all of a sudden it ends and we cut to a film
• 57:49
  sequence and the doctor and Sarah are chuckling away and off
• 57:51
  they go so that it just sort of falls apart.
• 57:53
  It just feels like somebody gave up.
• 57:56
  So I'm, I'm curious to see what, if any defence is mounted.
• 58:02
  But for me, this is the weakest of the season.
• 58:05
  So the Android invasion in the bin.
• 58:08
  Now let's go to our comments. Mark Donaldson couldn't disagree
• 58:13
  with you more David. He says I'll fight anyone who
• 58:16
  says this is the worst as ever. Nation delivers a cracking
• 58:19
  episode 1 and whilst he might not deliver on the pay off, it's
• 58:23
  packed full of atmosphere and excitement.
• 58:25
  Also anyone who says the title is a spoiler is an idiot.
• 58:29
  Is called the Android invasion. Not rehearsal for an Android
• 58:32
  invasion. No, not the mind.
• 58:35
  Probe. Says.
• 58:36
  Left a big impression on me when I was a tot and caught snatches
• 58:39
  of spacemen with gun fingers, creepy alien eyes peering
• 58:42
  through letterboxes, and the doctor being strapped to the War
• 58:45
  Memorial in my street with a nuclear bomb.
• 58:48
  OK, it wasn't really my street, but little me thought this was
• 58:50
  happening right outside my front door and it terrified the
• 58:53
  fucking life out of me. No one does creepy English
• 58:56
  village quite like Nathan. Adrian Berry says Bennett,
• 59:05
  Barry, let's takes us back to the hurt We era all that guff
• 59:08
  with the eye patch. A replacement for the Brigadier.
• 59:11
  Tom getting a sore throat, although I think that's because
• 59:13
  the ginger pot, Garrett Robson says.
• 59:16
  Contender for the weak. Is Tom's story.
• 59:18
  Crawford removed his eye patch and his expression is the same
• 59:21
  as ours as the story's last shred of credibility disappears.
• 59:25
  Oh, when the rocket lands upright and they immediately go
• 59:27
  off for a tea break? Well, it's very English, isn't
• 59:30
  it? James Larks is the English
• 59:32
  village frozen in time, the country pub, the repeating
• 59:34
  calendar. There's a hugely atmospheric
• 59:36
  Avengers style uncanny running through this shame Barry let's
• 59:40
  brings a late Poe era level of complacency to the direction and
• 59:43
  it's a bit of a rubbish counterpart to Zygons.
• 59:46
  Another village more look alikes but 0 pace or attention Michael
• 59:50
  Storm my. Arch nemesis says an utter mess
• 59:54
  plot wise with two of the most inept villains ever.
• 59:57
  Has Quad Crayford not tried to wash for a year?
• 1:00:00
  How do the crowds expect the androids to succeed if their
• 1:00:03
  faces fall off and they fall over?
• 1:00:06
  James Hadwin Bennis. As a total.
• 1:00:08
  Mess populated by gullible morons with an invasion plan
• 1:00:11
  that's embarrassingly awful and riddled with logical
• 1:00:14
  inconsistencies. Bennett Paul Cresser says it has
• 1:00:17
  plot holes big. Enough to fly an invasion fleet
• 1:00:19
  through, but it's a lot of fun. Love those location scenes with
• 1:00:23
  Tom and Liz. That's 70, sunshine, John Hall
• 1:00:26
  says. Dear, Oh, dear.
• 1:00:28
  The. Perfect argument for nations
• 1:00:29
  sticking to only writing dialect stories.
• 1:00:32
  I'll admit that Android Serra's falling off is chilling, but
• 1:00:35
  it's one of the story's few triumphs.
• 1:00:36
  Harry and Bentley deserved better access, Bennett, Dylan
• 1:00:40
  Reese says. A really odd last.
• 1:00:41
  Outing for some of the Unit family, but this story offers
• 1:00:44
  some much needed lightness to the season, Paul Dunn says.
• 1:00:47
  Superb. Very Avengers.
• 1:00:48
  In style, very perky in direction.
• 1:00:50
  Love it though. The whole eye patch business
• 1:00:53
  stretches believability. They copied that in the Mafia.
• 1:00:56
  Era as well, didn't they, with that Android in Journey to the
• 1:00:59
  Centre of the TARDIS? Do you remember?
• 1:01:01
  I thought you can say eye patch lady.
• 1:01:03
  Luke, since Jenkins I have a short.
• 1:01:04
  Spot for this, even though the villains are essentially lame
• 1:01:07
  Daleks. Creepy in atmospheric.
• 1:01:09
  Jason Thompson says the nonsense.
• 1:01:11
  Plot is barely worse than any other poorly plotted story, but
• 1:01:14
  the cheap The Doctor's dead. It was a double actually.
• 1:01:17
  Ending doesn't help. Nor does having UNIT headed by
• 1:01:20
  that awful Faraday bloke who's just a comedy puffed up cup of
• 1:01:24
  tea old chap officer type and not a suitable replacement for
• 1:01:27
  the Brig Bennett. Only Jason Thompson writes.
• 1:01:31
  Precisely how he sounds, doesn't it?
• 1:01:33
  Big orange Michael. Says.
• 1:01:35
  A good story is in there trying to get out, but a few leaps of
• 1:01:38
  logic keep it from being great. The cliffhanger depart zoo is
• 1:01:41
  nicely done. I guess if we have to bid one
• 1:01:43
  story from this season, this should be it, Anthony Carroll
• 1:01:46
  says. Feels like a per wee but.
• 1:01:48
  Good but good film scenes. Invasion plot is weak and the
• 1:01:51
  eye patches the plots blind spotlight where you did that but
• 1:01:55
  love the village scenes and farewell Benton Andy Parkinson
• 1:01:59
  says being. Late to found.
• 1:02:00
  Him allowed me to make up my own mind, which means I bloody love
• 1:02:03
  this. Yes, we can question Crafer's
• 1:02:05
  hygiene if he's never washed under the eye patch, but creepy
• 1:02:08
  androids and Terry Nation tropes are all brilliant Keep even when
• 1:02:12
  he's in bed and he. Turns over does.
• 1:02:14
  That eye patch, it's just a better cloth.
• 1:02:15
  Does he not kind of come away attention super glue?
• 1:02:19
  And Kev Blower says. After a wonderful episode 1, it
• 1:02:22
  dips sharply, and though the crawls are pretty good, it
• 1:02:24
  becomes a bit tedious compared to what surrounds it.
• 1:02:27
  This has to go. So damn does this have to go.
• 1:02:35
  It's a difficult. One this.
• 1:02:37
  So I think as has. Been kind of discussed.
• 1:02:41
  There are so there is so much wrong with with the the Android
• 1:02:45
  invasion. The, you know, it's, you know,
• 1:02:49
  UNIT kind of goes out with a whimper here, whereas it was
• 1:02:52
  quite triumphant with Tariff and Zygon.
• 1:02:55
  So it feels like, do we really need to include, you know, Harry
• 1:03:00
  and Benton and bring in like a replacement for the Brigadier
• 1:03:06
  and all this sort of stuff? Yeah.
• 1:03:11
  And like, you know, I totally agree with what David said about
• 1:03:17
  that, that that is a real miscasting for Milton Johns.
• 1:03:20
  He just, it just doesn't strike you as being the heroic
• 1:03:25
  pioneering astronaut and all, you know, it just it just, it
• 1:03:29
  just doesn't, he doesn't look it, he doesn't sound it.
• 1:03:31
  He doesn't act it. You know, so there's so much for
• 1:03:36
  this that is that is rubbish and wrong.
• 1:03:39
  Yet I find it tremendous fun. And yeah.
• 1:03:48
  And and I was like, why? What, what do I like about this
• 1:03:53
  that allows me to kind of overlook its massive, massive
• 1:03:58
  flaws and it it I. Think.
• 1:04:02
  I think it's already. Been touched upon in some of
• 1:04:04
  those comments from from from the listeners.
• 1:04:06
  You know where the? The stories around it are.
• 1:04:11
  Obviously, you know, you've got like pyramids, you've got
• 1:04:15
  Morbius, these ones that are really highly regarded by by
• 1:04:19
  fandom. So this one kind of falls
• 1:04:21
  through the cracks a little bit. It gets kind of forgotten about
• 1:04:24
  or, you know, kicked into touch because because it's not quite
• 1:04:28
  as good as those, but because it is a lighter tone to it to the
• 1:04:33
  rest of the season where it is that horror.
• 1:04:37
  It is that sort of, you know, quite taking Doctor Who quite
• 1:04:41
  seriously. Where is this one?
• 1:04:43
  It doesn't, it's, it's, it's a much more lighter touch to it
• 1:04:47
  and, and sort of so it, it feels like, I suppose it's sort of
• 1:04:52
  like the, the one that kind of adds a bit of light to the rest
• 1:04:54
  of the season. And, you know, I again, it's
• 1:05:00
  playing to my, to, to my likes because you've got that Rural
• 1:05:06
  England set or British setting and, and I think like, you've
• 1:05:11
  got a lot of kind of like iconic kind of moments in there.
• 1:05:15
  So to the, you know, the one where the doctor is kind of
• 1:05:21
  fighting a little bit with the, the Sarah Android and she falls
• 1:05:24
  to the floor and the face falls away.
• 1:05:26
  That's quite iconic. And it, it was kind of used in a
• 1:05:29
  lot of those sort of clip shows about Doctor Who and, and sort
• 1:05:33
  of the documentaries that we had, you know, doesn't she look
• 1:05:37
  funny when she sits? Up and she's got the gun in her
• 1:05:40
  hand and the terrible mask. On her.
• 1:05:43
  Face it's. Terrible.
• 1:05:45
  And the the the way the eyes. Kind of like oh.
• 1:05:49
  Man. We love this shit, right?
• 1:05:51
  Oh yeah. Yeah, definitely and.
• 1:05:53
  Then, you know, the, the doctor being tied to the, the War
• 1:05:56
  Memorial in the middle of the village and you know, and, and
• 1:06:00
  because that, that, that kind of always reminds me of the, the
• 1:06:03
  beautiful cover for the VHS for this, where it's got that lovely
• 1:06:07
  sort of orange background. There's the doctor, you know,
• 1:06:10
  strapped, strapped to the, the War Memorial.
• 1:06:13
  But so, so I, you know, there, there's so much that I love and,
• 1:06:17
  and, and I think it, it's right. It starts strong and it kind of
• 1:06:23
  falls away. But I think due to the strength
• 1:06:26
  of those first couple of episodes, and you've got that
• 1:06:30
  real mystery with it, you know, because here Sarah and the
• 1:06:37
  doctor, they've landed what they think is is the Home Counties.
• 1:06:44
  And as they're going, things aren't as they they aren't quite
• 1:06:49
  right, you know, like, like the the UNIT soldier sort of
• 1:06:52
  throwing himself off of the off of the.
• 1:06:55
  The well, I wouldn't. Say Cliff, but it's into the
• 1:06:58
  quarry. You then.
• 1:07:01
  You know, get go to the. Village and it's deserted and
• 1:07:04
  they go into the pub and, and all of the all of the money, but
• 1:07:07
  both in the soldiers wallet and also then in the in the till it
• 1:07:10
  it's all freshly minted. It's you know, you know, you've
• 1:07:13
  got the dart board that has never been used before and all
• 1:07:17
  of this sort of thing. And then you've got the, the
• 1:07:19
  truck turn up with and the villages just, you know, there's
• 1:07:23
  a mystery here and it and it's weird and it's and, and it, you
• 1:07:26
  know, and I think because of the strength of, of, of that, it
• 1:07:31
  kind of makes me want to put this through and, but, but I
• 1:07:35
  also, I totally agree with what David has said as well that they
• 1:07:39
  it's, it's. That there are plot holes and
• 1:07:43
  and. The direction and there's so
• 1:07:45
  much about it that's shit, but there's but I just love it.
• 1:07:50
  So I feel really. I feel really.
• 1:07:52
  Torn. About what to what to do with
• 1:07:54
  this so. I I kind.
• 1:07:57
  Of was thinking about this throughout the day and and I do
• 1:08:00
  think I'm going to put it through, but but it's, it's,
• 1:08:04
  it's one of those ones where I think like I don't want to bin
• 1:08:07
  it. But I don't know if I.
• 1:08:08
  Want to put it through? You could sort of tear.
• 1:08:11
  That away from Android. Evasion and apply it to Doctor
• 1:08:13
  Who. I know a lot of it's shit, but I
• 1:08:16
  love it anyway. Yeah.
• 1:08:18
  I mean, I think that's the thing.
• 1:08:19
  It's. It's sort of like so you know,
• 1:08:21
  if if I was to kind of like. Which stories from this?
• 1:08:26
  Season do I watch the most and I would say it's terror of the
• 1:08:31
  Zygons and Android invasion. I'd rather I'd rather watch the
• 1:08:35
  Android invasion then how to dry or.
• 1:08:41
  Or or. Other stories.
• 1:08:43
  There are other stories that I would rather watch, but I know
• 1:08:48
  that it's worse than those other stories.
• 1:08:50
  But so yeah, I'm, I'm putting it through because it's just fun
• 1:08:54
  and and it's hilarious. It it for all the wrong reasons,
• 1:08:58
  you know, like like the fact you know Crawford I mean.
• 1:09:02
  Man. Alive.
• 1:09:03
  I mean, what a gullible fool, you know, stick round.
• 1:09:07
  You're enough I. Betrayed me?
• 1:09:11
  Don't. Forget you've got Roy Skelton
• 1:09:13
  giving. Marshall to die, you just needed
• 1:09:16
  George. There, didn't you?
• 1:09:18
  Where was George? And the wonderfully.
• 1:09:21
  Martin friend as Stig Rod as well.
• 1:09:25
  There's just something about that name, but they've got the
• 1:09:27
  classic line of I will now activate the hostility circuits.
• 1:09:30
  I don't know why that line just cracks me up.
• 1:09:34
  Activates. Those every time we.
• 1:09:35
  Do one of these strictly. I do when we do when we do chip.
• 1:09:38
  No bloody. Hell right, Android invasion.
• 1:09:41
  I am going to champion it. So first of all, Dan, you've
• 1:09:46
  just taken what I was going to say, the mystery.
• 1:09:48
  I think parts one and two set up a brilliant, brilliant mystery.
• 1:09:52
  Like you said, you've got the twitching unit soldier, you've
• 1:09:54
  got those white clad guards with the guns in their fingers.
• 1:09:58
  I mean, that is such a kind of playground copyable fact, isn't
• 1:10:01
  it? You're shooting people with your
• 1:10:03
  fingers. You're right.
• 1:10:04
  There's the the village that's desert and people turn up on
• 1:10:07
  trucks and then suddenly they come to life when the clock
• 1:10:09
  chimes. You've got those weird black
• 1:10:11
  coffins in a couple of places, not one that opens and someone's
• 1:10:14
  inside. Grab Sarah's leg.
• 1:10:16
  You've got the TARDIS disappearing.
• 1:10:18
  Why is the TARDIS gone and marooned?
• 1:10:19
  The Doctor and Sarah, you've got Guy Crayford.
• 1:10:23
  We're told he should be dead, but he's there and he's clearly
• 1:10:25
  working for someone and we don't know who.
• 1:10:27
  You've got the Brigadier who's missing.
• 1:10:28
  And I think in this first part they make quite a bit of a play
• 1:10:31
  that the Brigadier is missing. And so that almost becomes a bit
• 1:10:34
  of a plot point and again, just feeds into this mystery.
• 1:10:38
  Does feel like you should get him at the end though right?
• 1:10:40
  Oh, you absolutely do. You've got that fluid, Elise.
• 1:10:44
  Landlord. He feels really suspicious.
• 1:10:46
  And then finally we get to see Stigron and Chidaki and we can't
• 1:10:50
  quite get a handle on what's going on.
• 1:10:51
  We don't know what they're planning at this stage, but by
• 1:10:54
  the time we get to the Episode 2 cliffhanger, we've learnt now
• 1:10:57
  that we're not on Earth. The androids can duplicate
• 1:11:00
  people that we know, like Sarah, and we've got a satisfying and
• 1:11:03
  engaging mystery. Right, My second reason is when
• 1:11:07
  it all falls to shit and I can't possibly put this through.
• 1:11:11
  It starts so well done. Oh my God.
• 1:11:17
  Right, so the next reason? Shoddy plot.
• 1:11:21
  So I've extolled all the virtues of this mystery, but Christ, it
• 1:11:24
  goes to shit as soon as the opening credits for episode 3
• 1:11:28
  come on. Right?
• 1:11:29
  Lots of questions. We know the Crawls now are
• 1:11:32
  planning to release a virus. So if they're releasing a virus,
• 1:11:35
  why have we bothered with the whole village set up?
• 1:11:38
  That was supposed to be a training ground.
• 1:11:40
  But if their plan is to release a virus, it's completely
• 1:11:43
  pointless. OK, you can argue that that's
• 1:11:45
  maybe to Con Crayford, but how would that work?
• 1:11:48
  He thinks they're going to divide up the world.
• 1:11:50
  So again, why would you bother with an English village?
• 1:11:53
  What's the point of those guards with their finger guns?
• 1:11:57
  I don't get what the point of them is.
• 1:11:58
  They're an awful environment. Why are they even there?
• 1:12:01
  Because it looks cool, Yeah. For episode 1, but this.
• 1:12:04
  Question of what's it fair for When we get to the real
• 1:12:06
  division, we see lots of areas of that that facility.
• 1:12:10
  We meet loads of people we've not seen before.
• 1:12:12
  Their plan is just to invade that space station.
• 1:12:15
  So surely all the people there we should have already seen as
• 1:12:18
  duplicates. The only people that copy over
• 1:12:20
  are Harry and Benson. But if if Crayford's been in
• 1:12:23
  space for two years, how does he know that Harry and Benson are
• 1:12:26
  going to be there? And in fact, why are Harry and
• 1:12:29
  Benson, they're not exactly the most, you know, prestigious
• 1:12:32
  representatives of units, are they?
• 1:12:33
  Why are they there? Then we talk about the poison.
• 1:12:36
  This poison is so contagious, it's going to kill the entire
• 1:12:39
  planet in three weeks. And yet we throw it round with
• 1:12:42
  gay abandoned. Sarah spreads it on the floor
• 1:12:45
  stick, Ron falls over it when they're fighting.
• 1:12:47
  In the end, no one cares. This is supposed to be the most
• 1:12:50
  contagious virus known to man, but it's just left here, there
• 1:12:53
  and everywhere. Why is there a second Sarah
• 1:12:56
  duplicate that suddenly appears on film?
• 1:12:58
  She just disappears. And most of all, what?
• 1:13:01
  How does the Android doctor work at the end when they've turned
• 1:13:04
  all the androids off? Makes no sense.
• 1:13:07
  So the plotting is terrible. The book does Terence covers.
• 1:13:10
  It with a lion. Well, of course he would.
• 1:13:12
  He's Terence. And he doesn't cover this with a
• 1:13:15
  lion. My third reason?
• 1:13:16
  The shoddy, shoddy production. Part 1.
• 1:13:19
  And two, yes, they're glorious with all those lovely locations,
• 1:13:22
  but it goes to shit very quickly.
• 1:13:24
  Let's start with the crawls, shall we?
• 1:13:26
  We start on that infamous shot of our shoes for about 5
• 1:13:30
  minutes, which are made with tinfoil wrapped around them.
• 1:13:33
  Then when we actually see them, Stickron, Stickron's OK, OK, his
• 1:13:36
  mouth doesn't sink with his words.
• 1:13:38
  But Chidaki and the other one who doesn't even get a name,
• 1:13:41
  they just look really unfinished.
• 1:13:42
  Their masks look as though they they've just come out too early.
• 1:13:46
  It's just mad. Philip Lindley designs this and
• 1:13:49
  Meg Loss. There is only two stories.
• 1:13:51
  Meg Loss is a million times better.
• 1:13:53
  The Kraal spaceship is awful. Again.
• 1:13:56
  It looks unfinished. It's got these really weird kind
• 1:13:58
  of comic strip lightning bolts in the background to give it a
• 1:14:01
  bit of design. They just look really weird and
• 1:14:04
  childish. Barry let's falls back into his
• 1:14:07
  CSO nightmare. Everything around the rocket is
• 1:14:10
  CSO. We've got them at the Central,
• 1:14:14
  the central command. Of the rocket.
• 1:14:16
  Is back to Mrs. Farrell's bloody kitchen again.
• 1:14:18
  It's all done as CSO and it's really echoey sound.
• 1:14:21
  The Rocket model doesn't match the stock footage of AUS Rocket
• 1:14:24
  going up. You got that dreadful shot of
• 1:14:27
  those three turd capsules coming to Earth really, really slowly
• 1:14:31
  across the skyline. As they come down, I think
• 1:14:34
  you'll find their sultanas. Actually, yeah, coming out the
• 1:14:38
  other end. And why is Patrick Mule so
• 1:14:41
  goddamn awful? Productions Just awful.
• 1:14:44
  Plottings Awful. Sorry, it's got to go, Joe.
• 1:14:48
  One apiece. You have the deciding vote.
• 1:14:51
  I would like to tell you a love story.
• 1:14:53
  For the ages, Once Upon a time I.
• 1:14:57
  Was on a zoom. Call to do an Android invasion
• 1:15:00
  commentary with a man called Mark and he turned up on the
• 1:15:04
  screen and horror of horrors, we both looked at each other a bit
• 1:15:08
  too long before one of us said oh hi yeah, all right, should we
• 1:15:12
  get going summit was afoot we did the.
• 1:15:16
  Commentary and we had a grand. Old time of it.
• 1:15:18
  Then we went on to a phantom convention and I thought to
• 1:15:21
  myself, yeah, he's a nice guy, whatever.
• 1:15:24
  Sat down in front of him in the lunch hall First time I met him
• 1:15:26
  face to face. Oh fuck he is beautiful.
• 1:15:30
  What the hell am I going to do? And this was all cemented where
• 1:15:34
  at one point he had to leave one of the talks to go off to
• 1:15:38
  another talk. And he got up and tiptoed across
• 1:15:40
  the room like Bilal from Death to the Daleks.
• 1:15:43
  And that's when I realized, oh shit, I think I might be in love
• 1:15:47
  with this man. Hang on, hang on.
• 1:15:49
  It was. It was the.
• 1:15:50
  Impression. Of Bilal from death to the
• 1:15:51
  Daleks. I couldn't stop laughing.
• 1:15:54
  Honestly, I was doing impressions for the rest of the
• 1:15:56
  trip anyways. I was like, how the hell am I
• 1:15:59
  going to see this guy again? And then it came to me.
• 1:16:02
  My God, the ultimate seduction technique, the Android invasion.
• 1:16:07
  I'm going to take that man to decock.
• 1:16:09
  I'm going to hire as a hotel. Oh dear.
• 1:16:12
  Oh, sorry. They've only got they've only
• 1:16:14
  got a double bed. They've got a twin room
• 1:16:16
  available. We go along to the.
• 1:16:19
  Android invasion. Location.
• 1:16:20
  We film all of our favorite scenes, even though I don't
• 1:16:23
  think too much of it. But you don't know that, you
• 1:16:26
  know? My face falls off.
• 1:16:27
  We're running through the woods. We have a grand old time.
• 1:16:29
  He even superimposes some sultanas coming down to earth in
• 1:16:33
  the video. I'll put the the video YouTube
• 1:16:36
  link in the in the notes when this comes out.
• 1:16:40
  Basically the Android invasion is the reason I'm with my other
• 1:16:43
  half. So whatever I think about this
• 1:16:46
  story. I've got a fairly low opinion of
• 1:16:51
  it. I have a lot to thank it for and
• 1:16:53
  actually it's the first example of me taking something.
• 1:16:57
  I hate seeing it through his eyes and now I really like it
• 1:17:02
  when he moved in. It's the first, like we did
• 1:17:04
  another commentary because that first commentary he did on the
• 1:17:07
  Android invasion, he didn't say a fucking word.
• 1:17:10
  He thought he only was only supposed to talk when when he
• 1:17:13
  had something to say. I was like, OK.
• 1:17:15
  Fine. So I just keep asking him
• 1:17:17
  questions. The second time after he'd moved
• 1:17:18
  in, I couldn't shut him up. So.
• 1:17:21
  So that was like one of the first things we did when he
• 1:17:23
  moved in. And then later on, me, Mark,
• 1:17:26
  Luke Malloy and Dylan went to Didcot for a for a weekend and
• 1:17:30
  it was the best audio I've ever had in my entire life.
• 1:17:33
  No, that didn't happen. But we didn't have a great time.
• 1:17:36
  I think David is right. This is pretty shocking.
• 1:17:40
  I think Rod is right. None of this makes any sense.
• 1:17:43
  I think Dan is right. Oh, this is a lot of fun to
• 1:17:46
  watch. And what Dylan said in the
• 1:17:48
  comments about this being like child friendly.
• 1:17:51
  I think it's the one story this season that is child friendly
• 1:17:55
  and there should be some stuff there.
• 1:17:56
  All that stuff with Sarah very obviously being a duplicate,
• 1:17:59
  drinking that sort of ginger pop in the convenience store and
• 1:18:03
  you're going, oh, please. But the kids would figure that
• 1:18:05
  out and go and you know it, It's for the kids.
• 1:18:08
  I kind of love it. So I'm putting it.
• 1:18:10
  Through it's going through Android invasion goes through
• 1:18:13
  and can I? Just say, Joe, you have coined
• 1:18:16
  my favorite euphemism for the night.
• 1:18:18
  And then I took him to Didcot. I won't lie, it was the best
• 1:18:24
  night of my life. So Android invasion.
• 1:18:28
  On that head, you know, Although I did notice you didn't actually
• 1:18:31
  say a fucking thing about the story.
• 1:18:32
  It's no, I know because how could I possibly defend that?
• 1:18:36
  Shit. But it's going through, yes.
• 1:18:40
  So Joe, pick your story. I would.
• 1:18:44
  Like. To champion the brain of
• 1:18:47
  Morbius, if I may, otherwise known as Splatty Brain, drives a
• 1:18:51
  Batty witch round the twist. And that's Mary Whitehouse, not
• 1:18:55
  Marin. I fucking love the brain of
• 1:18:59
  Morbius. This.
• 1:19:00
  I would hold this up as like my ideal Doctor Who.
• 1:19:04
  I think it's very funny. I think it's very disturbing.
• 1:19:08
  I think it's very clever. Let's start with the horror,
• 1:19:11
  right? Sloppy brain splattering to the
• 1:19:15
  floor. Condos chest exploding with
• 1:19:17
  blood. A solid pump bullets into him.
• 1:19:20
  Decapitated aliens stitched together monsters.
• 1:19:25
  Kondo's bloody, choked death. Sarah blinded and pushed down
• 1:19:29
  the stairs. The Doctor choked, solemn sigh,
• 1:19:32
  and I did. We like to think we're above all
• 1:19:34
  of this sort of horror and you know, but we're not.
• 1:19:37
  We love it. We absolutely love it.
• 1:19:39
  This is Doctor Who graphic horror I think probably at its
• 1:19:43
  most explicit in the entire series, even like Sword era.
• 1:19:47
  Aside that brain splatting on the floor.
• 1:19:50
  That is. Sick.
• 1:19:53
  Didn't this get a PG when it came out?
• 1:19:55
  I couldn't believe it. Blood flying.
• 1:19:58
  Anyway, I love the horror of it. I also would like to applaud
• 1:20:02
  Brandon Morpheus for the ladies. Yes, all the single.
• 1:20:06
  Ladies, all the single. Ladies, Cynthia Grenville who I
• 1:20:08
  think has given an outstanding performance as Marin.
• 1:20:12
  Apparently she was reasonably young.
• 1:20:13
  Looking at the time, she was in the mid early 40s.
• 1:20:16
  Unbelievable. She looks 100.
• 1:20:18
  Plus, doesn't she? But she does sort of genuinely
• 1:20:21
  convinced that she's got great age and wisdom.
• 1:20:24
  She plays that sort of wise and old tag brilliantly.
• 1:20:28
  I think a lot of effort has gone into the very the potentially
• 1:20:31
  awful idea of the sisterhood to look visually distinctive.
• 1:20:35
  I love all the bleached Reds, the whispering Sibilian chants
• 1:20:39
  and the ritual charts and dances.
• 1:20:41
  I love all of that stuff. It's got a real atmosphere to
• 1:20:44
  it. Compare this to the cult in The
• 1:20:48
  Power of Cruel and you can see how it can all go horribly
• 1:20:51
  wrong. I think this is this Barry Newby
• 1:20:54
  Newbury designing this. Yes, he does.
• 1:20:57
  A superb. Job at leaning into the sort of
• 1:21:00
  gothic horror of the peace. You've got those weird Askew
• 1:21:04
  pillars in in the in Solon's palace.
• 1:21:08
  Candles are flickering, there's cobwebs billowing bubbling
• 1:21:11
  laboratory equipment, statues, fires crackling.
• 1:21:15
  It is a a story thick with atmosphere from the second you
• 1:21:19
  appear. I even love that shitty obvious
• 1:21:22
  planetary. Service which is.
• 1:21:24
  A studio, right, But they filled it full of dry ice and
• 1:21:28
  electrical storms and even that is just full of atmosphere.
• 1:21:32
  As a as a Hammer Horror, Doctor Who, I don't think again, it
• 1:21:37
  could be more explicit than it is here.
• 1:21:39
  I think Tom Baker's at his best. I think Elizabeth Sladen's at
• 1:21:43
  her best. You've got astonishing guest
• 1:21:45
  performances from Philip Maddock, Michael Spice.
• 1:21:48
  I don't know who plays Rahika, but her eyes are absolutely
• 1:21:51
  extraordinary. You know, every time I get a
• 1:21:54
  shocked news, I'll try and do an impression of Fahika.
• 1:21:56
  No, no, I just think this. This works like.
• 1:21:59
  Gangbusters. It toes that very.
• 1:22:02
  Fine line. Between being really scary and
• 1:22:05
  really funny, because it's a really witty script, this, And
• 1:22:08
  I'm wondering if that's because Terence had the first pass at it
• 1:22:11
  and Robert Holmes had the second part of it.
• 1:22:13
  So you kind of get in the best of both worlds.
• 1:22:16
  I I think this is perfect Doctor Who, even down to the
• 1:22:19
  occasionally shoddy studio bounds, you know, production
• 1:22:23
  values. I love it.
• 1:22:24
  I love it, love it, love it. Splatty brains are go.
• 1:22:28
  Let's go to the comments, Jason. Thompson says.
• 1:22:31
  As Dick said when he was asked for his name to be removed,
• 1:22:33
  Solom's plan makes no sense when he has the skill to just put
• 1:22:37
  Morbius's brain right into the doctor's head, and the ending
• 1:22:40
  relies on that conveniently being stuffed for a Time Lord
• 1:22:43
  mind bending contest just lying around.
• 1:22:45
  And then Morbius is chased off a Cliff, the story least deserving
• 1:22:49
  of the amount of law subsequently spun around it in
• 1:22:52
  it. Is he talking about war monger?
• 1:22:55
  Terence Stix's sequel to this He might be, Or maybe the multiple.
• 1:22:59
  Morbius stories that we now get from Big Finish and possibly
• 1:23:02
  even the Timeless Children. Do you remember in War Monger
• 1:23:05
  the Evil? Rambossi.
• 1:23:07
  Who could that possibly be? Dylan Reece.
• 1:23:10
  Says why does Solon? Need to stick together multiple
• 1:23:13
  bodies to house Morbius because it's fucking creepy.
• 1:23:16
  There were so. Many crash spaceships.
• 1:23:18
  Surely there should have been a suitable head somewhere in there
• 1:23:21
  and you wouldn't get the end of episode 1 where that monster
• 1:23:24
  lurches out at Sarah Jane with no heads.
• 1:23:27
  But great guest cast, great mythos building for the time
• 1:23:29
  laws, and it gave us, Oh dear, the superior timeless children
• 1:23:34
  plot. And we all just, you know.
• 1:23:36
  Take a moment to pay homage to Dylan Reece.
• 1:23:40
  Superior, my arse, Daniel Knight says.
• 1:23:43
  Wonderfully gruesome and gloriously camp.
• 1:23:45
  Philip Maddock is sublime as Solon the Morbius monster.
• 1:23:48
  Very effective. Not sure about the Doctor Gussen
• 1:23:51
  Solon to death, but is that because Maddock made him so
• 1:23:53
  effective as a character? Michael Storm says a strong.
• 1:23:57
  Story with solid performances. Solon and Morbius have an evil
• 1:24:00
  Harrod. Harold and Amber stepped over
• 1:24:03
  vibe about them. Michael Stone made me laugh.
• 1:24:05
  Well done. Direction and design are great.
• 1:24:07
  Keep great Doctor, Who said. I always wonder.
• 1:24:10
  Why people criticize the timeless children?
• 1:24:12
  Oh don't start me when this when this story suggests basically
• 1:24:16
  the same idea. And the design of the Morbius
• 1:24:19
  creature is great too. The big orange Michael.
• 1:24:22
  Says Holmes's theme of the Time Lord's being corrupt and
• 1:24:25
  duplicitous continues here with a tweak on the Centre Dr. on
• 1:24:28
  admissions storyline. Philip Magic choose the scenery
• 1:24:31
  brilliantly. The story shines in all the
• 1:24:33
  right ways. Keep Lucy McCall, says Philip
• 1:24:36
  Maddock. Solon is creepy, threatening,
• 1:24:38
  Craven, and hysterical. A perfect villain for this
• 1:24:41
  heightened Hammer Horror Story, John Hall says entertaining.
• 1:24:44
  On. Multiple levels For the kiddies,
• 1:24:46
  it's Frankenstein in outer space.
• 1:24:48
  Well, for the adults, says Robert Holmes.
• 1:24:50
  Morden, Morden. Good word.
• 1:24:52
  Dialogue excellently declaimed by Philip Maddock.
• 1:24:55
  Keep it. James Larks says Morbius may not
• 1:24:58
  be what? Dicks wanted, but it's
• 1:24:59
  impressive how he and Holmes effortlessly place a gothic text
• 1:25:03
  into the mythos of Who. The result is far more than
• 1:25:05
  pastiche. A lot of it's success hangs on
• 1:25:07
  Maddock playing it for real. A brilliant performance, Jack
• 1:25:11
  Koya says Kondo and Solon. Are a pretty funny double act.
• 1:25:14
  Solon is part Frankenstein, part Doctor Moreau, and more
• 1:25:17
  importantly, an impotent fool who happens to be surrounded by
• 1:25:20
  more foolish people. The most direct example of how
• 1:25:23
  Doctor Who has now become Homes Under the Hammer Horror.
• 1:25:26
  Very good, Jack. Glenn Fitzgerald says the first
• 1:25:29
  story to properly scare me as a child.
• 1:25:31
  That brain in a jar A story gets sinister and dark quite quickly.
• 1:25:35
  Scenery is fantastic and some good model shots for 70s Who?
• 1:25:39
  Philip Maddock is great as always.
• 1:25:41
  Paul Quinn says Mobius is proper.
• 1:25:43
  Gothic, a threat from the past, science versus superstition,
• 1:25:46
  anti Catholic tropes and Doctor Who as opera or Gran Guignol.
• 1:25:51
  I can never say that Gran Guignol ignore the crap
• 1:25:54
  experience and revel in the design, the performances of
• 1:25:57
  Maddock, Fry and Spice, and the casual extension of Time Lord
• 1:26:01
  Law. Although we should, we could
• 1:26:01
  probably live without Kondo's stomach exploding with blood
• 1:26:04
  when he gets shot. Andy Parkinson, says Philip
• 1:26:06
  Maddock. Shines and it's another story
• 1:26:08
  that barrels along nicely. It even has time to throw in
• 1:26:11
  some cannon breaking prehuntal doctors.
• 1:26:13
  Imagine a showrunner doing that today.
• 1:26:15
  Keep it, Luke Sims, Jenkins says.
• 1:26:17
  Hilarious. And funny, but also horrific and
• 1:26:20
  amazing. I love it.
• 1:26:21
  Maddie was so succinct after that bullshit.
• 1:26:24
  I just said one sentence. Paul Dunn, says Philip Maddock.
• 1:26:27
  Wonderful. And Oh yeah, I love the brain in
• 1:26:29
  a jar. And finally, Anthony Carroll.
• 1:26:32
  Says it's great fun, Solon is a superb villain, and poor old
• 1:26:36
  Condo gets a grizzly end. The brain in the jar is great.
• 1:26:39
  Spooky bum Rod. Can I say one more thing?
• 1:26:42
  Sorry, before we kick off to the guest.
• 1:26:44
  And that is, I just want to mention Christopher Barry's
• 1:26:46
  direction in this because I was so mean about him when I did a
• 1:26:49
  commentary on downtime because that was sort of 70s direction
• 1:26:52
  in the 90s and it was really, really bad.
• 1:26:54
  I actually think this is the best direction he ever gave us
• 1:26:57
  in Doctor Who, and one scene in particular I adore.
• 1:27:02
  And that's the bit where Solon's talking to Morbius.
• 1:27:07
  Sarah's blind. And the camera.
• 1:27:08
  Sort of roving down the stairs and and we're seeing things
• 1:27:12
  through the door and the levels of suspense that he builds up in
• 1:27:16
  all of those scenes. I don't think he's always
• 1:27:19
  brilliantly suited to Doctor Who.
• 1:27:20
  This is his genre. He's perfect in this.
• 1:27:23
  I just wanted to say that. Thank you, David.
• 1:27:27
  Reign of Morbius this is This is probably my favorite story of
• 1:27:33
  the season. Joe, you stole most of my.
• 1:27:37
  Points. No, I mean, it shows, shows
• 1:27:41
  we're In Sync. She's good.
• 1:27:42
  I look at this cast and this is probably the strongest cast of
• 1:27:47
  the season. You've got Philip, Phillip
• 1:27:50
  Maddox, Cynthia Grenville, who are the two key guest stars who
• 1:27:53
  are fantastic. I think somebody said Maddox was
• 1:27:56
  chewing the scenery. I don't.
• 1:27:57
  I think he's playing it pretty straight for the most part and I
• 1:28:01
  think. That's what.
• 1:28:02
  He gets what Solon needs to be and.
• 1:28:07
  Marin has the. One of the best voices.
• 1:28:09
  I mean, that's a voice you don't get in acting these days because
• 1:28:11
  nobody smokes that much anymore. Colin Faye as Condo just about
• 1:28:17
  gets him on the right side of pitiable, even though he's
• 1:28:19
  actually quite horrible character.
• 1:28:21
  Michael Spices. Morbius Oh, he has a little bit
• 1:28:26
  OTT, but you can just write go. She has a great line in part
• 1:28:31
  four and she delivers probably one of the funniest deliveries
• 1:28:35
  of a piece of dialogue and Doctor Who she's I didn't say.
• 1:28:40
  And if the Doctor is right, high 1, he will have given it the
• 1:28:43
  brain of our ancient enemy Morbius.
• 1:28:48
  With the hand action. It is just so really, it
• 1:28:51
  shouldn't. That should not work.
• 1:28:52
  That should just be. But it's brilliant.
• 1:28:55
  Tom is fantastic. Liz is brilliant.
• 1:28:58
  Sarah's really well written in this as well, because she's got
• 1:29:01
  lots of even when she's blind, she's still got agency, she's
• 1:29:05
  still getting herself around, she's still driving the story.
• 1:29:09
  Sarah. Liz is always good, but
• 1:29:11
  sometimes Sarah isn't well served in some of the scripts.
• 1:29:14
  This in this season. Not here.
• 1:29:16
  She's absolutely fantastic. Don't you love her lie Was it?
• 1:29:19
  I could always. Sell flowers?
• 1:29:20
  Couldn't I love licorice violets?
• 1:29:24
  And I I just want to kind. Of touching on the direction is
• 1:29:27
  this should be messier because Christopher Barry isn't or
• 1:29:33
  doesn't always get it right. And usually when they're making
• 1:29:37
  these episodes, they've still got some film, you know, they
• 1:29:40
  can cut away too. There's usually about 10 minutes
• 1:29:41
  of film in a story. But this is all done in the
• 1:29:44
  studio. They don't it's a single film
• 1:29:47
  sequence in this whole thing. So they've got to squeeze that
• 1:29:49
  90 minutes into the same amount of studio time that they would
• 1:29:52
  have a studio time for where they've got film.
• 1:29:53
  So they've got to cram all of that, all the scenes, all the
• 1:29:57
  effects and everything into that limited block.
• 1:30:00
  So there's probably a bit more pressure to get things right and
• 1:30:04
  get it right and get it right quickly.
• 1:30:06
  And they do. And there's apart from with a
• 1:30:09
  couple of slightly dodgy CSO shots in the final episode with
• 1:30:12
  the monster going down the chasm or the the mountain, it all
• 1:30:16
  looks really well that that exterior planet.
• 1:30:19
  Set shouldn't work. And in a way it does look a bit
• 1:30:22
  naff, but it's one of the great because everything else is
• 1:30:25
  working. So you you don't care it.
• 1:30:29
  I've actually written here probably Chris Barry's best
• 1:30:31
  production overall. So clearly, again, great minds.
• 1:30:36
  And and say. Not is it a great cast of great
• 1:30:38
  actors, they are incredibly well directed as well.
• 1:30:41
  So yeah, this is an absolutely. I think also because we touched
• 1:30:45
  on the part 4 is not quite working and some of the I think
• 1:30:48
  that this one ends quite satisfactorily as well.
• 1:30:51
  OK, why they got a mind bending machine.
• 1:30:53
  I'm noticing a theme of some of these stories of there are lots
• 1:30:56
  of questions as to what's going on.
• 1:30:59
  So it could it be that despite all the glossiness, the
• 1:31:01
  production and everything, that maybe some of the scripts aren't
• 1:31:05
  as tight as they could be? There'll probably be more of
• 1:31:08
  that and at least one of the story coming up.
• 1:31:11
  You can almost see Terrence. Dicks watching it as it going
• 1:31:14
  outgoing, taking notes. I shall tidy that up in the
• 1:31:17
  novel and that and that. He's got a whole list of things.
• 1:31:20
  It the, the the. Conclusion to this the.
• 1:31:23
  Climax. This story is probably the most
• 1:31:25
  satisfying of the six stories for me.
• 1:31:28
  I think it's one where it builds and it just works.
• 1:31:31
  And OK, we've got previous doctors, Timeless children, but
• 1:31:35
  I'm going to take that out of it.
• 1:31:36
  I'm going to judge this purely on its own merits.
• 1:31:39
  It's a definite keep for me. When I saw.
• 1:31:42
  That for the first time. Was nine?
• 1:31:45
  I just assumed they were all previous incarnations and
• 1:31:47
  Morbius. Why?
• 1:31:48
  When did they become previous incarnations to the Doctor?
• 1:31:51
  Because in the production notes they.
• 1:31:53
  Say that that was the intention, but I wasn't watching the
• 1:31:56
  production. That was the.
• 1:31:59
  Intention, because the odd thing is when you see all the.
• 1:32:01
  You know, the production staff in their Doctor costumes, that's
• 1:32:05
  the point at which it explodes and and Morbius creature pulls
• 1:32:08
  away in horror. So obviously he's been beaten
• 1:32:10
  because he's been pushed back. So surely those regenerations
• 1:32:13
  are Morbius? You would do anything to erase
• 1:32:17
  the. Timeless Children, would you
• 1:32:18
  erase? Erase or.
• 1:32:20
  Old chip? No.
• 1:32:21
  Perhaps I'll give them your. Head as a memento.
• 1:32:24
  Damn. Reign of Morbus, Yeah or nay?
• 1:32:27
  Yeah, the SO. Again, this was another early
• 1:32:32
  VHS purchase for myself. So I watched this one to death
• 1:32:39
  when I was little and I got bored with it.
• 1:32:43
  I got bored with it and, and I haven't watched it for years.
• 1:32:47
  But then obviously preparing for this.
• 1:32:50
  I, I, I watched all of the season and it, it was like
• 1:32:56
  meeting an old friend again. And, and, and, and how you just
• 1:33:00
  kind of slip into the, the old ways, you know, and it's it, it
• 1:33:04
  just feels right. So, yeah, coming into this, I
• 1:33:08
  was like, I don't know where I'm going to go with with with the
• 1:33:11
  brain of Morbius. But then like I say, rewatching
• 1:33:14
  it, there was so much in it that's just fantastic.
• 1:33:18
  You know, I mean, I, I love the. Design of stuff.
• 1:33:23
  And, and the, the Morbius creature, you know, with the,
• 1:33:26
  the, the massive claw, the, the human hand, and then the rest of
• 1:33:30
  it's all kind of like this sort of brown patchwork of bits of
• 1:33:35
  body and stuff. And then you've got that, I
• 1:33:38
  suppose. For want of a better.
• 1:33:40
  Word the, the, the goldfish bowl on the top with the brain in it
• 1:33:43
  and the, the two sort of stalks coming up and, and it's just
• 1:33:48
  just fantastic. And, and I mean, I was kind of
• 1:33:52
  like thinking like when character options released their
• 1:33:56
  first batch of classic figures. Morbius was one of those.
• 1:34:01
  And also. The Zygons and and so it's I
• 1:34:04
  think it's testament to this period of Doctor Who that from a
• 1:34:08
  design point of view that they were bang on.
• 1:34:10
  They were they really got got it right.
• 1:34:13
  So so I love I love that this week I bought that this.
• 1:34:16
  Week I got it at a convention that I was at last week I put it
• 1:34:20
  on the shelf and I've been reading a lot this week and I
• 1:34:22
  keep looking over the bloody eyes of this thing keep staring
• 1:34:25
  at me well I had to move it up a couple of shelves you're right
• 1:34:28
  there bang on yeah yeah, it's. Just brilliant.
• 1:34:34
  I, I think Elizabeth Slayden in this is absolutely amazing.
• 1:34:38
  But then she, she's got that, you know, she's got that
• 1:34:43
  standard pretty much throughout, you know, her run as, as Sarah.
• 1:34:48
  But I, I think with this, what I find really, really impressive
• 1:34:51
  is you totally buy into the fact that she is blind.
• 1:34:56
  Or or Sarah. Is blinded I I don't know how
• 1:35:00
  how she was able to do that but you're watching it and and you
• 1:35:03
  know she's bumping into stuff and and and you know groping for
• 1:35:08
  for you know you know doorways and what have you and and it's
• 1:35:12
  just like this is absolutely superb.
• 1:35:14
  You could you you really believe that the character has lost
• 1:35:19
  their sight and and and I think that's testament to to her
• 1:35:22
  acting ability. I think, like, like David said,
• 1:35:26
  that that she's the character of Sarah in this is, has been
• 1:35:30
  really written very well. There's a lot for for Sarah to
• 1:35:33
  kind of do because you know, a lot of the time she's getting
• 1:35:39
  getting the doctor's head out of the noose, you know, saves him
• 1:35:42
  on countless, countless amount of times in this.
• 1:35:46
  So yes, he's fantastic. Philip Maddock.
• 1:35:50
  I mean, I, I, I mean, I know obviously the, the, the Crotons
• 1:35:57
  and and power of Crow aren't well regarded, but I think
• 1:36:01
  again, he's another actor that whenever he appears in Doctor
• 1:36:04
  Who, he is on the money every time.
• 1:36:08
  And I think this is no different here when he's playing Solon
• 1:36:11
  and, and you, you get all of that, like his devotion to, to
• 1:36:16
  Morbius initially and then basically that then switches to
• 1:36:22
  basically his want to be revered as this, this the best surgeon
• 1:36:32
  that, that has ever lived. And, and, you know, to the point
• 1:36:34
  where he's going, you know, I created Morbius and, and, and
• 1:36:37
  words to that effect, you know, so, so it's sort of like, yes,
• 1:36:40
  he's devoted to that, but he's more devoted to making a name
• 1:36:44
  for himself. And you know, I love that bit
• 1:36:47
  where he goes in to beg for the doctor's life to the, to the, to
• 1:36:53
  the sisterhood and he's, he's getting nowhere.
• 1:36:56
  And then he's like, well, at least give me the head and, and
• 1:36:59
  he's really begging and he's, he's really whiny and all this
• 1:37:02
  sort of stuff. I just think it's a really
• 1:37:04
  brilliantly layered performance. I, I, I think what you said Joe
• 1:37:11
  about like the sisterhood could easily have been really, really
• 1:37:14
  annoying. But you know, I, I think they've
• 1:37:19
  obviously got great actresses in the you know, the, the, the
• 1:37:22
  Marin is the main 1 and Ohika is the second in command.
• 1:37:26
  They look beautiful. In those Reds.
• 1:37:29
  You know, because the, I think like the rest of the, the the
• 1:37:32
  rest of the, the story is, is quite sort of brown and kind of
• 1:37:36
  earthy tones, but then you've got these wonderful red costumes
• 1:37:39
  and it just looks brilliant when they're doing those those.
• 1:37:43
  Rituals. They've been so pony, but
• 1:37:46
  Christopher Barry over blaze them, doesn't it?
• 1:37:48
  So it's one after an hour after. So it just seems sort of weird
• 1:37:51
  and supernatural and with all the sound design as well.
• 1:37:55
  That's great. But do you know what?
• 1:37:56
  There is one really. To use your expression Joe Pony
• 1:37:59
  thing, when they when they attack the doctor, they use
• 1:38:02
  those Spears with like cutouts of the flame on it.
• 1:38:06
  You get really tacky. That looks so bad.
• 1:38:09
  But they get away with it. God, that looks.
• 1:38:12
  That's your Christmas. Present.
• 1:38:13
  What are you talking about? And, and I think we've also
• 1:38:17
  mentioned that, you know. That yes, it is a studio set and
• 1:38:20
  I think yes, that has limitations, but I think they
• 1:38:26
  they elevate it to beyond just being a studio set because
• 1:38:30
  you've got that. I don't know, I don't know how
• 1:38:33
  they were able to do it, but they, you've got the background
• 1:38:36
  and you, you've got like the the forks of lightning and
• 1:38:39
  everything lights up and, and yeah, you know, and again, I
• 1:38:44
  think you know, I, I, I. With the exception of.
• 1:38:48
  One story in. In this this season, I think the
• 1:38:52
  the designs are are just just fabulous and and it's, you know,
• 1:38:56
  it's something that really kind of speaks to me and I just I
• 1:38:58
  just love it. But yeah, please put Brain of
• 1:39:01
  Morbius through. I love it.
• 1:39:04
  Well, Brain discovered a friend, an old friend, Brain of Morbius
• 1:39:09
  is going to get a. 4 for four, because I'm putting it through
• 1:39:12
  as well. So look, this is probably the
• 1:39:16
  cheapest I would think of this year's productions.
• 1:39:18
  It almost looks. It reminds me when I'm watching
• 1:39:20
  it almost of a stage show on TV because some of those exteriors
• 1:39:24
  are terribly cardboard. Some of the sets are a little
• 1:39:28
  bit flimsy. They do wobble more than a bit.
• 1:39:31
  But the thing that really sells it for me is the beautifully
• 1:39:34
  rich dialogue that you've got and the fact that you've got Tom
• 1:39:37
  Baker, Philip Maddock and Cynthia Grenfell selling and
• 1:39:41
  speaking that language. I've written down a couple of
• 1:39:43
  lines. So this line from Philip
• 1:39:46
  Maddock, that squalid brood of harpies, the sisterhood, that's
• 1:39:50
  a cursed hag. Marron found I was holding a
• 1:39:53
  Time Lord and rescued him. May her stinking bones rot.
• 1:39:58
  I'll see her die, Condo. I'll see that pulsed, harrodden
• 1:40:01
  scream for death. Before Morbius and I are
• 1:40:04
  finished with her. That is, That is why people go
• 1:40:07
  to acting. School isn't it to say lines
• 1:40:09
  like that? Absolutely.
• 1:40:10
  You read on the page of it. Really.
• 1:40:12
  You're going to say that? But my God, he there.
• 1:40:15
  It's a lovely dialogue. And then the famous line that
• 1:40:18
  spawned Benny and Paul Cornell. Even the silent gas dirigibles
• 1:40:25
  of the Houthi are felt in our bones while still 1,000,000
• 1:40:28
  miles distant. It's just the use of language I
• 1:40:32
  think is beautifulness. It's really rich dialogue and
• 1:40:36
  you can just wallow in that dialogue.
• 1:40:37
  But I think what it does and what's really clever about it is
• 1:40:40
  it does so much the heavy lifting because it is selling
• 1:40:43
  you events and instance that they can't possibly show you.
• 1:40:46
  This isn't 21st century. We haven't got Disney money.
• 1:40:49
  We can't cut away see the history of the sister Lord and
• 1:40:52
  the Time Lords. So it's explained to us in this
• 1:40:55
  really extravagant and Florida dialogue.
• 1:40:58
  Actually, what that dialogue does is paints a really vivid
• 1:41:01
  picture and it gives extra scope and dimension to the story that
• 1:41:05
  sadly the the very two-dimensional sets can't give
• 1:41:08
  you. So I think the dialogue is the
• 1:41:09
  story fantastic, the mythology. As well this absolutely history
• 1:41:13
  of Morbius. And the time.
• 1:41:14
  Lords and the Sisterhood. We buy it and it's and it's
• 1:41:18
  gone. On to.
• 1:41:19
  To, you know, spawn 1000 sequels and it's just talking to you
• 1:41:23
  guys, I've realised just. How many things have sprung from
• 1:41:26
  the brain of Morbius? Absolutely.
• 1:41:28
  So I think. The dialogue is one thing.
• 1:41:30
  Secondly, Joe, you talked about this being horrific, but us
• 1:41:34
  loving it. There's one sequence in here.
• 1:41:36
  It's in episode 3. It's only 2 1/2 minutes in
• 1:41:39
  length. I think what it shows is how
• 1:41:42
  horrific, how bold, how crazy this program is.
• 1:41:48
  So it's towards the end of episode 3.
• 1:41:50
  Solon's now being persuaded by Morbius to put his brain into
• 1:41:53
  the goldfish bowl. So him and Condo are taking the
• 1:41:56
  brain into the lab. A blind Sarah strapped down.
• 1:41:59
  Condo then sees the patchwork body, realizes it's his arm, and
• 1:42:03
  goes to attack Solon. Solon shoots him, as you rightly
• 1:42:06
  said, shoots him in the stomach. Now bear in mind this episode
• 1:42:09
  started transmission position 5:45 in the evening, so we're
• 1:42:13
  now just about after 6:00. It's a dark January evening, so
• 1:42:17
  all the kids are at home watching TV.
• 1:42:20
  You can see the channel. Is going fuck the buggers.
• 1:42:24
  Exactly. There's 12.
• 1:42:25
  Million. Watching this.
• 1:42:27
  And you know, it's not just the shoot.
• 1:42:28
  It's not just because the shooting and the violence, it's
• 1:42:31
  the horror of the fact that Sarah is blinded and she's
• 1:42:34
  extremely distressed. She doesn't know what's going
• 1:42:37
  on. She's screaming what's going on
• 1:42:39
  as as Condo gets murdered. I mean, Condo, I think he's
• 1:42:43
  quite a sympathetic character. He would have been Colin Faye
• 1:42:45
  would have been one of the people.
• 1:42:46
  I think he gets overlooked a lot because there are so many
• 1:42:48
  bravado performances in this. But I think he gives a really
• 1:42:51
  good performance. And even even as a nine year
• 1:42:53
  watching this, I felt so much sympathy and compassion for
• 1:42:56
  Condo. So him getting killed is really,
• 1:42:58
  although he doesn't quite get killed at that point.
• 1:43:00
  He drags on for a bit longer, but we assume he's killed.
• 1:43:04
  But then in all this turmoil, Joe, as you rightly said, the
• 1:43:07
  bright brain spatters onto the floor, but worsener Saulon bends
• 1:43:11
  down. He recovers it.
• 1:43:12
  He caresses it like it's kind of been should act.
• 1:43:16
  It's throbbing in his house. It is more obvious.
• 1:43:19
  The greatest intellect. That's ever lived and it's
• 1:43:22
  throbbing in his hand. He's.
• 1:43:23
  Stroking, it's like, it's bizarre, it's gruesome.
• 1:43:25
  It's very funny as well though. It's very funny and it's totally
• 1:43:28
  enthralling. But then, without condo, Solon
• 1:43:32
  needs Sarah to operate the equipment.
• 1:43:33
  So he dragged so roughly by the neck and he holds that.
• 1:43:36
  I mean, you wouldn't shoot it like that today with a man
• 1:43:39
  treating a woman that roughly. And again, we're just after 6:00
• 1:43:43
  at night. It's brutal, it's powerful.
• 1:43:46
  It shouldn't be done like that, but it is done like that.
• 1:43:49
  I kind of love it for it. That's probably a bit wrong.
• 1:43:52
  Even Chris Barry, he says on the.
• 1:43:54
  Commentary. He as he was making it, he was
• 1:43:56
  like, am I going too far? Even the director was.
• 1:43:59
  I think he did. But why?
• 1:44:01
  You said we kind of love it in a weird, sick way.
• 1:44:03
  And then my third reason, Danny already said it.
• 1:44:05
  Elizabeth Slayden I could give Sarah.
• 1:44:08
  Sarah could be my recommendation pretty much for every one of
• 1:44:11
  these stories. She's, for me, the
• 1:44:13
  quintessential companion. And look at the way she pricks
• 1:44:16
  Tom's pomposity right to the beginning when he's doing his
• 1:44:18
  big grandstanding. She's lovely.
• 1:44:20
  Then she goes off to explore on her own.
• 1:44:22
  Of course she would. She's brave, she's resourceful,
• 1:44:24
  and we see that over and over again when she pretends to be
• 1:44:27
  drug from the wine, when she realizes what's going on the
• 1:44:30
  scene as, as you rightly said, down where she's blind, but
• 1:44:33
  she's still Sarah. The character is still desperate
• 1:44:35
  to get to the Doctor to save him.
• 1:44:37
  So yes, she's blind, she's on an alien world, but by God, she's
• 1:44:40
  still going to fight away across those rocks to go and save him.
• 1:44:44
  She is his best friend and and Elizabeth Slade just plays
• 1:44:48
  scared so well, she gets each of the three cliffhangers in this
• 1:44:51
  story and it's no wonder because she's magnificent.
• 1:44:54
  So yeah, Reign of Morbius is going through.
• 1:44:57
  He's sulky and she goes. I love that bit.
• 1:45:04
  He's just. Beautiful, and you know I'll
• 1:45:05
  steal. And it's such an old.
• 1:45:06
  Cliche now, because people sometimes say it before I'll say
• 1:45:09
  it. I'll say it so much.
• 1:45:10
  If it's raining out and I'll go in, I'll go.
• 1:45:13
  Can you spare a glass of water? A terrible.
• 1:45:16
  Line, but there we are. Makes us smile, right?
• 1:45:21
  I am going to go. I'm told not to go here, but I
• 1:45:24
  don't want to show my hands so I'm going to go.
• 1:45:28
  Seeds of Doom. So I could probably pick 100
• 1:45:34
  things positives to talk about this.
• 1:45:37
  The concept of plant life, turning on animal life, the
• 1:45:40
  Doctor jumping through the skyline to save Sarah and the
• 1:45:44
  line. What do you do for an encore?
• 1:45:46
  Dr. I win brilliant line chase not.
• 1:45:50
  Seeing the error of his ways. We're used to Doctor Who bad is
• 1:45:52
  when the when things start turning on them.
• 1:45:54
  Like the Master changing opinion.
• 1:45:57
  Chase doesn't. He's still besotted with the
• 1:45:59
  crinoids, however bad and however big it gets.
• 1:46:02
  Amelia Ducat. How can you not love her?
• 1:46:04
  When she rips into civil servants, there's brilliant
• 1:46:06
  model work. Camfield's direction, Sarah,
• 1:46:09
  when she stands up to score, be brilliant.
• 1:46:12
  The cliffhangers, the sound of the sound that crinoid makes,
• 1:46:16
  that Gutchel sound. The two settings, the Antarctic
• 1:46:19
  base, the Manor, they're both bases under siege.
• 1:46:22
  A million and million things I could give as a positive, but
• 1:46:25
  I'm going to do something I've never done before.
• 1:46:27
  I'm going to give 3 reasons to Chuck it out, but I'm still
• 1:46:31
  saving it, if that makes any sense at all.
• 1:46:33
  Joe's look at me as though I'm mad.
• 1:46:35
  I love it. I can't Chuck it out.
• 1:46:37
  But probably because everyone's going to be positive about it.
• 1:46:40
  There are three things I do want to talk about that are negative,
• 1:46:43
  but it's still going through for me.
• 1:46:45
  It's the first one I'm going to quote.
• 1:46:47
  Mary Whitehouse, obscene vegetable matter.
• 1:46:50
  So Mary Whitehouse is one of her campaigns talking about
• 1:46:53
  strangulation by obscene vegetable matter.
• 1:46:55
  And look, yeah, this probably is one of the most gruesome Doctor
• 1:46:58
  Who's as a child, yes, it did make me very uneasy.
• 1:47:02
  And the one thing that got me more than anything else was that
• 1:47:05
  bloody compost machine. So we see it in Episode 4 when
• 1:47:09
  the doctors first put into it. And visually and even the
• 1:47:12
  direction, it's it's quite it's not particularly scary or
• 1:47:15
  dramatic, but it's, again, going back to what I said on brain and
• 1:47:18
  morbid. It's the language that
• 1:47:19
  absolutely sells it. So I'm going to read you this
• 1:47:22
  line because I just think this line is chilling from Harrison
• 1:47:25
  Chase. This is blood and bone contain
• 1:47:27
  the most valuable nitrogen elements.
• 1:47:30
  After shredding, your remains will pass automatically through
• 1:47:33
  my compost acceleration chamber, and within 25 minutes, you'll be
• 1:47:37
  pumped into the garden to become part of nature's grand design.
• 1:47:41
  I mean, it's fucking chilling. Just the dialogue alone is
• 1:47:44
  chilling. So then when we come back to
• 1:47:48
  that compost machine in episode 6, the first thing we see is
• 1:47:51
  Chase putting Sergeant Henderson into it.
• 1:47:54
  And I just thought, you know what, I wish they'd brought back
• 1:47:56
  Benson. For this because it's.
• 1:47:57
  A unit. If you brought back Benson and
• 1:47:59
  put Benson into the compost machine and had him cut up, my
• 1:48:03
  God, the stakes would have been raised high in Part 6.
• 1:48:06
  But we've got Salton Anderson, who we've never seen before, but
• 1:48:09
  he gets ground up, but he's unconscious when he grows ground
• 1:48:11
  up, which is, you know, probably more cold and dispassionate than
• 1:48:14
  any alien attack. But then obviously Sarah is then
• 1:48:18
  put in and the Doctor comes and rescues her and we end up
• 1:48:21
  obviously with Chase going into her.
• 1:48:23
  But Chase getting mangled is just one of the most horrific
• 1:48:27
  scenes in Doctor Who. It is prolonged scream, it is
• 1:48:30
  eyes bursting open in horror. It's just horrible and probably
• 1:48:35
  a bit too near the knuckle. Let's be here for a second.
• 1:48:38
  Though Yeah, of course. Well, because it's such a
• 1:48:40
  ridiculous scenario, like the violence is horrific, but the
• 1:48:45
  idea of someone being turned into fertilizer and pumped into
• 1:48:49
  the garden is so absurd. That sort of the comic, I don't
• 1:48:52
  know, I feel like it just takes the edge off.
• 1:48:54
  It is. It is explicit in how it's
• 1:48:57
  short. Although I'm surprised, I'm
• 1:48:59
  surprised I didn't show the bloods and all that because
• 1:49:01
  it's, it's a very dry compost machine when he runs through it,
• 1:49:05
  but it's it's industrial machinery.
• 1:49:07
  And it's turning and that can be quite realistic.
• 1:49:10
  I mean, just to give you. A you know.
• 1:49:14
  My my husband. 'S father was killed in.
• 1:49:16
  An industrial accident not that dissimilar to this?
• 1:49:20
  Well, I'm not going to continue this argument anymore.
• 1:49:22
  So do you know what I mean? There will be people.
• 1:49:25
  I I found here if I had no relationship to it at that point
• 1:49:28
  when I was watching it was nine. It's quite, I think it can be
• 1:49:32
  quite horrific. It certainly upset me as a kid.
• 1:49:36
  And that's before we get to all the body horror of the
• 1:49:37
  transformation, which is again, but again, we do as we do with
• 1:49:42
  the compost machine. You kind of get that dry run for
• 1:49:44
  it because you get Winlit being transformed in Antarctica before
• 1:49:48
  we come back and see Keeler being transformed in in England.
• 1:49:51
  And that's much worse because we get to know Keeler 1st and the
• 1:49:54
  whole thing is much more disturbing because he's chained
• 1:49:57
  down and he's fed raw meat. It's just horrible.
• 1:50:00
  And on top of that, we've got the strangulations and the
• 1:50:02
  drowning of Scorpy. I think possibly this does go a
• 1:50:05
  little bit too far, although I said I'm putting it through.
• 1:50:08
  The second reason, which I think is the most heinous problem that
• 1:50:13
  I've got with this story, is the ending.
• 1:50:15
  I don't think there's another Doctor Who story where I feel
• 1:50:18
  quite as let down by the ending as I do here.
• 1:50:21
  Even in episode 6, Sarah says to Scooby bullets and bombs aren't
• 1:50:25
  the answer to everything, and yet 10 minutes later the crinoid
• 1:50:28
  was being blown up by stock footage of RAF fighters.
• 1:50:31
  It's just such a lame ending. And now at that point, we're
• 1:50:34
  worrying how the Doctor and Sarah are going to escape from
• 1:50:37
  the house. This is the Doctor.
• 1:50:39
  I want my Doctor to come up with a clever plan to win the day.
• 1:50:42
  We've got that music sound system there.
• 1:50:44
  Use it. He uses steam to get out of the
• 1:50:46
  house. You steam somehow do something.
• 1:50:48
  Don't just rely on the army. That's not a Doctor Who ending
• 1:50:52
  for me. And worse than that, this is the
• 1:50:53
  end of a season and our hero's just been totally passive.
• 1:50:57
  So I think the ending here, of all of the stories, is the
• 1:51:00
  biggest, biggest let down. It's almost like they just run
• 1:51:02
  out of it. That episode's really short.
• 1:51:04
  It's only about 20 minutes. I just think they've almost run
• 1:51:07
  out of ideas at that point. And then the third reason to go
• 1:51:10
  against it is just the physical violence is that is that a
• 1:51:14
  coincidence that Chase Yell's Get Dunbar to Scorby when he
• 1:51:17
  runs after him with the gun? Because it's not long since Get
• 1:51:20
  Carter's been in the cinema, which is a very horrific British
• 1:51:23
  gangster film. Is there another story when guns
• 1:51:26
  are on on display so often? The doctor is brandishing
• 1:51:29
  multiple guns throughout this story.
• 1:51:31
  And yes, Sarah says, you know, you would never use them.
• 1:51:34
  We still see him punch up quite a few people and and almost
• 1:51:38
  break somebody's neck. It's just, I think it is going a
• 1:51:41
  bit too far this. But as I say, I am still putting
• 1:51:44
  it through because this story's got so much verve and energy and
• 1:51:47
  interest. I can't not put it through.
• 1:51:49
  But, you know, there has to be another way in future.
• 1:51:54
  Shall we go? To the comments.
• 1:51:56
  Lovely Lucy. McCaul says excellent.
• 1:51:58
  And nasty Tony Beckley is the horrible and grandiose chase.
• 1:52:02
  He's a recognisable Doctor Who villain with a violent and
• 1:52:04
  statistic edge. But for me, John Chalices Scorby
• 1:52:07
  gives the story it's bite. He's a really nasty piece of
• 1:52:10
  work. James Lark says this may have a.
• 1:52:13
  Superficial similarities with The Avengers, but tonally it's
• 1:52:16
  completely different. The body horror is played for
• 1:52:18
  real and Scorby is the most authentic thug in the show's
• 1:52:21
  history. And it's silly and scary, the
• 1:52:24
  Monday meeting of the surreal summed up by the bureaucrats
• 1:52:27
  grubby act of revenge resulting in him being eaten by a giant
• 1:52:30
  plant. The Doctor is heroic, Sarah is
• 1:52:33
  brave. Burgeon score is to die for,
• 1:52:36
  Michael Storm says. The solid classic.
• 1:52:37
  The utilizes the six parts well chasing Scorpio 2 very different
• 1:52:41
  but great villains chases an Avengers mastermind contrast by
• 1:52:45
  scorpy, who's wandered them from The Sweeney music and direction
• 1:52:48
  of top notch again keep it James Holden Bennett.
• 1:52:52
  The most back of a lorry Doctor Who story ever.
• 1:52:55
  That should have had a lot more gore than it does.
• 1:52:57
  More gore. As always, it gets the Antarctic
• 1:53:00
  wrong and just how Sea Pods know how to travel in pairs is a
• 1:53:03
  little weird. Cliche, but fun.
• 1:53:05
  Keep Paul Paul Cressus says this was one of the.
• 1:53:07
  First Target books I bought, I've always loved them.
• 1:53:10
  When I got to see it, it didn't disappoint even though the
• 1:53:12
  production tone makes it quite like quite unlike anything
• 1:53:16
  around it. The crinoid model work is great,
• 1:53:19
  Trey DW says. I don't.
• 1:53:21
  Value this one as much as others, but it's still amazing.
• 1:53:23
  The crinoids or green axons if I may are a great idea.
• 1:53:27
  Chase as a character is also good and he probably has the
• 1:53:30
  most gnarly death in the classic era.
• 1:53:33
  Good stuff. Jason Thompson.
• 1:53:34
  Says the best use. Of the 4 + 2 structure of six
• 1:53:37
  parts as Holmes preferred and seamlessly blends the campus of
• 1:53:40
  Chase and Amelia Dukar with a very real Scorby Keeler and
• 1:53:43
  Dunbar. Scorpion Particular is one of
• 1:53:46
  the best supporting characters ever and John Chalice gives him
• 1:53:48
  real menace. Liz Sladen scenes with him are
• 1:53:51
  superb. John Hall, another scare fest.
• 1:53:54
  Directed by Canfield and scored by Geoffrey Bergen in their
• 1:53:56
  final contributions, it's an odd one.
• 1:53:59
  With A2 physically violent doctor, obscene vegetable
• 1:54:02
  matter, and an on screen demo of how to make a Molotov cocktail,
• 1:54:06
  did busy body Mary Whitehouse actually have a point?
• 1:54:09
  Dylan Rees has really well structured.
• 1:54:10
  Six parts and lots of brilliant supporting cast.
• 1:54:12
  Fantastic direction, but this is where Sarah should have bowed
• 1:54:16
  out. Jack Koya.
• 1:54:17
  An epic summation of. The House of Style season 13
• 1:54:21
  with a little taste of story in two parts, followed by the main
• 1:54:23
  course in three to six. Tom gets to flip from cold,
• 1:54:26
  aloof authoritarian to grinning eccentric better than anyone
• 1:54:32
  other than Hartnell. His violence, punches,
• 1:54:34
  strangulation, neck breaking, etcetera is more real than
• 1:54:38
  Pertwee's Aikido. I got.
• 1:54:40
  I did. Well done, Joe.
• 1:54:41
  You did, Jane. Fitzgerald says another Corker.
• 1:54:44
  Great characters and good model work.
• 1:54:46
  Chases a Bond villain who will stop and nothing to fuel his
• 1:54:49
  obsession. A story that justifies 6
• 1:54:51
  episodes. Andy Parkinson, my second
• 1:54:54
  favorite. Ever Doctor Who story?
• 1:54:55
  I don't know if this is inspiring John Carpet as the
• 1:54:57
  thing it's true, but it deserves to be.
• 1:55:00
  A sublime guest cast elevates this to greatness and it never
• 1:55:03
  sags. It deserves to win again.
• 1:55:05
  Tom and Liz are on great form, Old Quinn says.
• 1:55:08
  The violence repulses. Me and the body horror is too
• 1:55:10
  extreme. John Charles is very good, but
• 1:55:12
  to make the Doctor match him in terms of violence was a mistake.
• 1:55:15
  Stick it in the grinder, Kev Blower says Tom and Liz do the.
• 1:55:19
  Avengers, with eccentric Amelia, deranged Harrison and Chalice
• 1:55:22
  turning a heavy row into a real character, claustrophobic
• 1:55:26
  Antarctic based vile body horror and brutal shredder scenes
• 1:55:30
  pushed the show to its horror limit and Hollingsworth says
• 1:55:33
  great, but not. Very Doctor Who he multiple
• 1:55:36
  foods say it's good. But the use of OB the exteriors
• 1:55:38
  robs it of atmosphere, and Canfield and Bergen seem to have
• 1:55:41
  lost that Zygon spark. And finally, Dave Rennie says
• 1:55:44
  yes, the doctor. Is unusually violent in this but
• 1:55:46
  what a script. A dangerous campy villain in
• 1:55:49
  Harrison Chase. The two then four part story
• 1:55:51
  split works well. Memorable alien race and Amelia
• 1:55:54
  Duca classic who at its finest. Dan is this classic who at its
• 1:55:59
  finest. It's it's it's up there.
• 1:56:04
  I don't know if. It's the finest but yeah, I I
• 1:56:08
  really like this one and what what I find really quite
• 1:56:16
  interesting is that I normally struggle with with six part is
• 1:56:21
  my my my attention starts to wander a little bit and and and
• 1:56:26
  what have you, but. This.
• 1:56:29
  Feels like a six parter in two parts, which I think some of the
• 1:56:33
  the comments kind of back that up.
• 1:56:35
  So you've got that, you've got two stories that are kind of
• 1:56:39
  linked by by a similar narrative.
• 1:56:41
  So you've got like that two-part of the set in the the Antarctic
• 1:56:46
  and that kind of reaches its conclusion at the end of of Part
• 1:56:50
  2. But oh, there's another part.
• 1:56:53
  So which then spills into the, the, the next 4 episodes, which,
• 1:56:58
  you know, then we relocate to, you know, the Home Counties.
• 1:57:04
  And therefore you don't get that saggy middle that the most six
• 1:57:10
  parties in Doctor Who have you. You kind of, you know, it's sort
• 1:57:15
  of it's able to kind of maintain itself because it's split into
• 1:57:19
  two and four. And you know, I'm not I'm not
• 1:57:22
  sure whether that was a conscious decision by by both
• 1:57:27
  Robert Holmes and and bank Stuart, but but yeah, it was, it
• 1:57:31
  was such a good idea because I think it kind of certainly for
• 1:57:34
  people with my kind of mind where I'm wandering off
• 1:57:38
  somewhere else, it really helps me to to stick with it.
• 1:57:42
  So so I think that was that was that was super, super cool.
• 1:57:46
  I think also I would argue, I think it was David that made the
• 1:57:51
  comment that that that Morbius had the best cast.
• 1:57:55
  I'm kind of I think this possibly had the best cast of
• 1:58:00
  the season. So you've got like Tony Beckley
• 1:58:03
  as as Harrison Chase. So I probably.
• 1:58:08
  Saw the the Italian. Job before I saw this this
• 1:58:12
  episode. So I I know him as camp Freddie
• 1:58:14
  in the in the Italian Job, but he's see pervert this in playing
• 1:58:19
  that sort of ice cold eccentric millionaire.
• 1:58:24
  And he, and despite things going on around him, he, he for most
• 1:58:28
  of the, the, the early part of his of the story, he maintains
• 1:58:33
  that calm, sort of composed, debonair kind of air about him.
• 1:58:39
  But that obsession with with the, the, the chrono pods kind
• 1:58:44
  of descends into madness. And in the end he's he's
• 1:58:47
  completely insane. You've then got Boise himself.
• 1:58:52
  You've got John Chalice in here as, as as score B.
• 1:58:56
  And and I think, you know, he's, he's that mercenary.
• 1:59:01
  You know, he loves the money, but he loves the violence even
• 1:59:04
  more. But he's also, I would say he's
• 1:59:07
  that classic bully where he's picking on people, he's hitting
• 1:59:12
  down, he's he's picking on people weaker than him, but he's
• 1:59:16
  a coward at heart because as soon as he can, he's he's out of
• 1:59:20
  there and, and making his own escape and not really caring
• 1:59:24
  about anyone else that's left behind.
• 1:59:28
  And then I think like Mark, Mark Jones playing Keela, I think
• 1:59:31
  that's a brilliant performance because you kind of really feel
• 1:59:37
  for Keila because I think at heart, he's probably a good man,
• 1:59:42
  but he's a weak man. And therefore, he ends up
• 1:59:46
  getting bullied into doing these awful things and going along
• 1:59:49
  with with the violence and, and, and, and, you know, tying
• 1:59:55
  Sarah's hand down so that that she will, to see what the
• 1:59:59
  Cranoid will will do when it, when it touches her.
• 2:00:03
  And then you've got because, and then you've got that bit like,
• 2:00:06
  you know, I think, I think Rod, you kind of mentioned it where
• 2:00:09
  he's, he's strapped down and basically they won't help him,
• 2:00:15
  you know, and, and they're just feeding him lumps of steak, you
• 2:00:19
  know, to, to kind of accelerate this, this, this body horror
• 2:00:23
  change into, into the chronoids, you know, sort of thing.
• 2:00:26
  And, and obviously we've, we've mentioned dear Rd.
• 2:00:29
  Amelia Dicar, what a, what a wonderful, wonderful character.
• 2:00:33
  I don't think the story, she, she moves the story along in any
• 2:00:39
  way, but she brings so much colour to the story and it's so
• 2:00:44
  much better for having her in it.
• 2:00:46
  And then obviously, you know, you've got like the the the
• 2:00:49
  lesser characters, you know, that you've got like Dunbar,
• 2:00:52
  who, you know, this civil servant that that's taken a
• 2:00:55
  bribe in a way, but then sees the error of his ways and, and
• 2:00:59
  he goes in to try and sort it. Obviously it doesn't doesn't
• 2:01:02
  work out for him. And then, you know, dear old Sir
• 2:01:05
  Colin Thackery, I mean, you know, he's I, I love it at the
• 2:01:10
  end that the doctor goes, Oh, do you fancy coming with us?
• 2:01:13
  You know, that that was that was how good that character is.
• 2:01:16
  So I think, you know, you've got this amazing cast there, all
• 2:01:19
  these performances that the characters in it, you know, and
• 2:01:24
  yeah, it's it's just just just an amazing story.
• 2:01:27
  And and I think obviously it's been touched on that I think
• 2:01:32
  some of the time it does overstep the mark with with the
• 2:01:36
  violence and with the horror, probably more so than any other
• 2:01:40
  story of this era. But I can I can, I can kind of
• 2:01:45
  forgive that a little bit. And and because I think there's
• 2:01:49
  so much more in it that kind of to love and to to cherish.
• 2:01:55
  So, yeah, I want to, I want to put it, put it through.
• 2:01:58
  David, over to you. I want to address the scorby in
• 2:02:03
  the room. John Challis plays Scorby
• 2:02:08
  brilliantly. He plays it completely straight,
• 2:02:13
  possibly a little bit too straight in that when you've
• 2:02:18
  got. Tom being flippant and.
• 2:02:19
  Giving his one liners and talking about vegetable soup and
• 2:02:22
  then you get scoreby turning up and he's just nasty.
• 2:02:27
  And when you've got, there's a sort of tonal.
• 2:02:30
  Issue at times in this story. Where you've got John Challis
• 2:02:33
  playing absolutely straight, someone said walked like he's
• 2:02:36
  he's walked off the set of The Sweeney or some like hard bitten
• 2:02:38
  cop thriller. And you've got Tom sort of
• 2:02:41
  making these jokes and being flippant and doing the whole
• 2:02:44
  thing about the house that Jack built.
• 2:02:45
  And he it's a great bit where he's like turn around to
• 2:02:48
  doctrine. There's a full 360, which is
• 2:02:50
  still one of the funniest bits of the story.
• 2:02:52
  But it just when you've got Scorby, who's demonstrated that
• 2:02:55
  he is just a cruel and violent piece of work, it really does
• 2:03:02
  jar quite a bit. There's the scene in Is It Part
• 2:03:05
  4 where the score beat Escorts. The doctor into the crushing.
• 2:03:09
  Room and then just throws him against the bins and I think he
• 2:03:12
  tries to stand up and he throws him back down again.
• 2:03:14
  There's a real I think it's been picked on.
• 2:03:16
  There's a real nasty streak. Not saying John Charles does a
• 2:03:20
  bad foot, I think he's brilliant in it, but I think at times it
• 2:03:25
  doesn't feel so jarring with Tony Beckley or Sylvia
• 2:03:29
  Coleridge's Mr. as. I mean Dakar, because they're
• 2:03:32
  slightly more eccentric, they're slightly more surreal.
• 2:03:35
  But it doesn't when they're playing against Tom's other
• 2:03:39
  worldliness, it doesn't jar as much.
• 2:03:41
  So I think yeah, some of the the the the violence and the cruelty
• 2:03:46
  and one bit no one's mentioned yet is talking of the.
• 2:03:51
  Violence. So they get taken to the quarry.
• 2:03:54
  They find the chauffeur and the doctor basically seems to knock
• 2:03:58
  him out with a punch. The dialogue later says he's put
• 2:04:01
  your chauffeur in hospital, so it's.
• 2:04:05
  Like either. He's got one.
• 2:04:07
  Hell of a punch. You've seen the size of Tom
• 2:04:09
  Baker. Or he just kept going.
• 2:04:12
  And just kept so there is there is a there's a some tonal issues
• 2:04:18
  I have with this as well. I am.
• 2:04:23
  Going to put it through because. This is the story that gives us
• 2:04:26
  Amelia Ducat, you mean? Yes, she does absolutely nothing
• 2:04:29
  to really advance the story when Philip Hinchcliffe adapted it.
• 2:04:33
  I've not read the novel, but I know that basically she's not in
• 2:04:37
  the book. She's that totally redundant.
• 2:04:41
  However, she brings colour and a bit of humour.
• 2:04:45
  That scene, her first scene when they talk about where they found
• 2:04:49
  the picture and it was her indignity when she thinks that
• 2:04:53
  her painting was sold in a car boot and that classic line, the
• 2:04:57
  car is immaterial. Absolutely brilliant.
• 2:05:02
  Lord, he never paid me that's. Just she does the full.
• 2:05:06
  Lady Bracknell as well, doesn't. She a car boot.
• 2:05:10
  A Daimler car boot. And she's brilliant.
• 2:05:14
  And The thing is, ignoring some of the tonal issues that the
• 2:05:18
  production is great, I actually think the the shooting the
• 2:05:22
  exteriors on video actually adds to some of the atmosphere as
• 2:05:25
  well. I think the night scenes are
• 2:05:26
  really good. It's a really.
• 2:05:30
  Strong production, I think. It's got great score as well, so
• 2:05:33
  I think this is the last non Dudley score for a good three or
• 2:05:36
  four years. So it's quite nice to have
• 2:05:38
  something different. I think all the location work
• 2:05:41
  trying to. I know they might get Antarctica
• 2:05:44
  wrong, but sod it, it doesn't matter, you know, it's a really
• 2:05:48
  good. Stuff in there, they spray a
• 2:05:50
  whole part of a quarry. The model work is fantastic.
• 2:05:54
  I. Think the the the the base the
• 2:05:57
  giant crinoid with on the House is fantastic until the stock
• 2:06:00
  footage comes along to blow it all up.
• 2:06:04
  Do you think the part is it the Cliff out of part 4 when the mid
• 2:06:07
  sized crinoid yomps towards the camera?
• 2:06:09
  I think that's probably could be cut a little bit sooner.
• 2:06:12
  So it's probably not strongest of the season.
• 2:06:15
  And I do think the points made about the violence and some of
• 2:06:20
  the tone being maybe just pushing a little bit too far, I
• 2:06:23
  can't disagree with. But there's just so much to
• 2:06:26
  enjoy in it and everyone's still trying at this point as well.
• 2:06:31
  And so Seeds of Doom goes through and so far no one's
• 2:06:35
  called it Seeds of Death. Of course not.
• 2:06:38
  We're a. Doctor Who Podcast.
• 2:06:41
  Gregory, Joe. I think back-to-back with.
• 2:06:47
  Braid of Morbius. It is 10 practically perfect
• 2:06:51
  episodes of Doctor Who. And the something that nobody's
• 2:06:55
  really mentioned too much is is how mesmerizing Tom Baker is in
• 2:06:59
  this. Now, you said that David, about
• 2:07:02
  him being flippant, like in front.
• 2:07:04
  I figured in those scenes, he's he's kind of attempting to
• 2:07:07
  humanize himself because he thinks he's going to get an edge
• 2:07:09
  with Keeler and Keeler might let them go and that's why he's
• 2:07:12
  behaving the way he is. But the second he thinks Sarah
• 2:07:16
  Jane is in deadly danger, he is hysterical.
• 2:07:20
  Isn't it a bit where he's? Going to score but he's
• 2:07:22
  screaming his head off. He is scarier than anything this
• 2:07:25
  story can throw at us. I think he's really, really
• 2:07:28
  funny as well. There's a scene that's written
• 2:07:31
  purely as a piece of exposition to get us from A to B, And I
• 2:07:35
  wrote down what Tom Baker does in this scene, right?
• 2:07:38
  It's a scene in Sir Colin Thackeray's office.
• 2:07:40
  He walks around with a chair on his head, puts it down, goes to
• 2:07:44
  sit on it, doesn't bother, criticizes the nature of greed,
• 2:07:47
  loses his temper. Sarah steps in, she loses her
• 2:07:51
  temper. He steps in, accuses them of
• 2:07:53
  having a security leak whilst staring the guilty party right
• 2:07:56
  in the face, insults the Colin, and then orders a car.
• 2:08:00
  And it's all in this one scene. And it's like jeez.
• 2:08:02
  If you want to see an example what Tom Baker can bring to
• 2:08:04
  Doctor Who in this very perfunctory scene, he's just
• 2:08:08
  amazingly. Good, he's really.
• 2:08:10
  Brooding and and quite dark, isn't it?
• 2:08:12
  In the first episode as well. Without talk of amputation and
• 2:08:15
  trying to convince them to do that, it really is pushing
• 2:08:17
  Doctor Who into a very adult direction.
• 2:08:21
  Probably as adults we can get. But I will say again, I'm sorry,
• 2:08:24
  this is about like homicidal gooseberries.
• 2:08:28
  So just how adult can this possibly be?
• 2:08:31
  Well, I'll tell you because the statistic edge of the story is
• 2:08:34
  the other thing I really love about this.
• 2:08:36
  And it's I'm confused by myself because it's the sort of thing I
• 2:08:39
  criticize in the Steven Moffett era.
• 2:08:41
  So I don't understand why tonally this is all right for
• 2:08:44
  me. And that isn't.
• 2:08:45
  I think there's a difference, though, between like, you know,
• 2:08:48
  twisting someone's neck and running away from OAV.
• 2:08:51
  And don't cremate me. I do think there is a world of
• 2:08:53
  difference between those two things.
• 2:08:55
  But I wrote another small list, if you will indulge me, of some
• 2:08:59
  of the more statistic moments in this story.
• 2:09:01
  Pods bursting open and spores infecting, windlit and eating
• 2:09:05
  through his body till he's mutated into a half man half
• 2:09:08
  plant hybrid. Someone amputating an arm.
• 2:09:11
  Strangulation. Casual destruction of valuable
• 2:09:15
  equipment. Scorby shoving a gun right in
• 2:09:18
  Sarah's face that's really quite disturbing.
• 2:09:21
  Strapping her to a bomb. The fight with the chauffeur, as
• 2:09:24
  David said, putting him in hospital with a right hook.
• 2:09:27
  Showers of bullets everywhere. A nasty neck twist for Scorby.
• 2:09:32
  Keeler's physical and psychological transformation.
• 2:09:35
  That bit where he's shivering, it's so scary.
• 2:09:40
  It's like he's caught the flu and he's really scabby and
• 2:09:42
  nasty. The doctor being shoved into
• 2:09:45
  garbage bins. As somebody said, there is a one
• 2:09:49
  point where there is blood dripping down the sides of that
• 2:09:51
  compost machine. So, Rod, you actually are right
• 2:09:54
  there. I was wrong earlier.
• 2:09:56
  Healer begging for help but being tempted with scraps of raw
• 2:09:59
  meat. The cycle a psychological
• 2:10:01
  horror. Chase communicating with the
• 2:10:03
  plant world. The plants coming live and
• 2:10:05
  swamping over. Sarah Jane, Scorpy and
• 2:10:07
  Hargreaves been strangled, Scorpy's death amongst the
• 2:10:10
  screaming plants, Sarah being attacked and shoved in the
• 2:10:13
  grinder chases horrendous fate. And of course a massive
• 2:10:17
  explosion at the end as the as the plant goes up in flames in a
• 2:10:21
  beautifully shot model shot like that creature.
• 2:10:24
  The stop animation for that creature on top of the building
• 2:10:27
  is so great. Yeah, it's really nasty.
• 2:10:30
  This. I fucking love it.
• 2:10:32
  I love every second of it. I wish Doctor was like this all
• 2:10:34
  the time. So yeah, I love how hard our way
• 2:10:38
  it is. I love how grumpy the Doctor is.
• 2:10:41
  And I think, David, you already said, but my Third Point was the
• 2:10:44
  score. I I genuinely think this is one
• 2:10:46
  of the best musical scores we ever had.
• 2:10:48
  It's unique, atmospheric, chilling and dynamic.
• 2:10:51
  I especially love the score at the end of Part 4.
• 2:10:54
  I do agree with you about that wobbly mattress coming towards
• 2:10:57
  the camera, but that whole chase sequence there, it's the sort of
• 2:11:00
  music, it's really dynamically pushing the action log in a way
• 2:11:04
  that Doctor E music doesn't usually do.
• 2:11:06
  Yeah, this is fabulous stuff. Half the time it doesn't feel
• 2:11:10
  like Doctor Who. I don't know if it feels like
• 2:11:12
  The Avengers either. It's it's somewhere between
• 2:11:15
  being a family entertainment and an adult drama and a horror.
• 2:11:19
  And The Sweeney and The Avengers.
• 2:11:22
  It's a big hybrid of all these things.
• 2:11:23
  But oh, it's delicious. And how has no one mentioned the
• 2:11:27
  Hargreaves? Is the same man who was the
• 2:11:29
  Chamberlain in The Twin Dilemma? Of course he is.
• 2:11:33
  How come no one's mentioned? That the joke at the end makes
• 2:11:36
  no sense when they turn up in Antarctica and the TARDIS when
• 2:11:39
  they never went there in the 1st place and it's a terrible joke
• 2:11:42
  even. If they had used the TARDIS, how
• 2:11:44
  comes nobody's mentioned invent? A code word.
• 2:11:47
  They love that. How about Operation Nut House?
• 2:11:50
  I love Emilia Dico, right, we're on to our.
• 2:11:54
  Last two stories sublimes are ridiculous.
• 2:11:57
  Maybe or maybe not. We've got Plants of Evil and
• 2:11:59
  Pyramids of Mars. So David, it's.
• 2:12:02
  Your. Choice.
• 2:12:04
  Oh what? Oh.
• 2:12:06
  This is this is because I I already went to try and bin
• 2:12:08
  something and failed. So should I go poster?
• 2:12:11
  Should I go decorative? Oh sorry, I'm going to do
• 2:12:15
  Pyramids of Wells. Because I freaky really love
• 2:12:20
  Pyramids of Mars. It's it's not perfect.
• 2:12:23
  It's it is a classic, another classic example of it's slightly
• 2:12:27
  falling apart at the end. I think part 4 is very much the
• 2:12:32
  run around that, you know, some of these stories turn into and
• 2:12:37
  I'm. Not going to talk about Empire.
• 2:12:38
  Death too much because I don't want to.
• 2:12:41
  And I've not watched the whole of the Tales of the TARDIS
• 2:12:45
  version because that he opened up with a bit of finger wagging
• 2:12:49
  from Russell. I don't know who wrote it, but
• 2:12:51
  imagine it would have come from Russell T Davies where it's like
• 2:12:53
  he was a grave robber and oh, he's such a bad man.
• 2:12:55
  Just just tell the bloody story, you know, let the audience make
• 2:12:58
  their mind up. I think there's just a little
• 2:13:00
  bit too much of that. We should also ignore the. 1980
• 2:13:06
  stuff because it's just going to cause a headache and I know what
• 2:13:11
  I'm. Reading interference by Lauren
• 2:13:12
  smiles at the moment and the amount of time that fucking joke
• 2:13:15
  comes up with Sarah Jane going Oh yeah, it was in the 70s.
• 2:13:18
  Or do I mean the 80s? Pyramids and Mars has a lot to
• 2:13:21
  answer. Yeah, but hang on, we've just
• 2:13:23
  had. We just had.
• 2:13:24
  Terror the Zygons when the Brigadier says the Prime
• 2:13:26
  Minister, yes ma'am. So it's obviously 1979 onwards.
• 2:13:30
  So you know we've already done it this season.
• 2:13:33
  I if you if you'd. Ever go onto Twitter and try to
• 2:13:36
  do anything about the unit dating?
• 2:13:38
  You'd say goodbye to your mentions for a good 72 hours.
• 2:13:43
  You know, the people take it incredibly seriously.
• 2:13:45
  So first reason to keep is Paddy Russell.
• 2:13:50
  I think she directs this incredibly well.
• 2:13:53
  Again, it's another story full of atmosphere, particularly in
• 2:13:57
  that first episode when they're exploring the house, the music,
• 2:14:03
  working alongside it. Great work on location.
• 2:14:08
  She directs Tom and Liz. Very well, I.
• 2:14:09
  Know she didn't always have the greatest of relationships with
• 2:14:12
  Tom Baker, but ignoring that she gets a good performance out of
• 2:14:16
  him and she didn't she get him in the Maui costume on location
• 2:14:21
  as well because bit of power play there and she won.
• 2:14:25
  So I've got to give her credit for that.
• 2:14:27
  So I just think it may not be the most showy direction at
• 2:14:31
  time. There might not be any like the
• 2:14:34
  most spectacular sequence you've ever seen, but it's just so well
• 2:14:37
  done. Second reason to keep is the.
• 2:14:42
  It's the mummies, somebody was saying just before the the
• 2:14:46
  Morbius creature became one of the character option figures.
• 2:14:48
  I think the mummies were quite early on as well.
• 2:14:50
  The the the design, the monster design in this season is just on
• 2:14:55
  point and I think the mummies look fantastic.
• 2:14:59
  Obviously there's always to talk about the Hammer Hammer
• 2:15:01
  influence and I've it was a handful of Hammer films and
• 2:15:05
  obviously their mummy looked a bit more like Christopher Lee
• 2:15:07
  kind of decaying cults and they didn't go down that route.
• 2:15:10
  They went for the servitors and. Those designs could be.
• 2:15:15
  Comical, particularly with the large protruding middle section,
• 2:15:20
  which does look slightly like breasts, and that shouldn't
• 2:15:26
  work. Now it works.
• 2:15:28
  Perfectly and much of the. Horror of being crushed to death
• 2:15:31
  by tits. I can't think of a worse way.
• 2:15:34
  To go oh God. You haven't really given it
• 2:15:36
  much. Thought.
• 2:15:37
  To be. Honest, it's how I work.
• 2:15:40
  We've got a split on the panel. There's the.
• 2:15:42
  Shock, I've actually written here.
• 2:15:44
  Death by. Chest, they're a great design
• 2:15:48
  and also just the way they move. There's that great bit where one
• 2:15:51
  gets caught up in the in the the man trap and it's just kind of
• 2:15:55
  trying to remove it. It's they're just.
• 2:15:59
  These great slow lumbering and for once slow and lumbering
• 2:16:02
  ended up to Monster working brilliantly for it.
• 2:16:07
  It's a very Doctor Who interpretation of the Egyptian
• 2:16:09
  mummy as well. They're robots.
• 2:16:11
  There's nothing inside them but a bit of wire.
• 2:16:14
  But it's just the mummies are brilliant and.
• 2:16:18
  We talk about them a lot. Tom and Liz, I think they are
• 2:16:23
  probably at the. Height in this.
• 2:16:24
  Season they're at the peak in this story as well.
• 2:16:27
  They are just bouncing off of each other their chemistry.
• 2:16:31
  That's that opening scene in the TARDIS where clearly that's a
• 2:16:35
  bit of a mission statement about we're moving on apart from a
• 2:16:38
  couple of trips back to UNIT later in the season.
• 2:16:40
  But let's ignore that. The Doctor wanted to break free
• 2:16:43
  of being scientific advisor. That's such a great scene
• 2:16:46
  between the two of them. It's play.
• 2:16:48
  He's brooding and then she's coming in.
• 2:16:50
  She's got her she's wearing quite conveniently a period
• 2:16:54
  relevant dress. But let's ignore that.
• 2:16:57
  But they are just great together.
• 2:16:59
  And another great scene is when they go in part is it Part 3
• 2:17:04
  where they go to the poachers Hut and they breakthrough the
• 2:17:08
  deflection barrier and there's the just the pouncing back of
• 2:17:12
  dialogue between the two of them when she throws the box of
• 2:17:15
  Jellic night at him. I mean, they get the humour of
• 2:17:18
  that absolutely spot on. I I just think they are
• 2:17:21
  absolutely brilliant in this. Story, I think it's.
• 2:17:26
  The, you know, when people do talk about the golden age of the
• 2:17:30
  Doctor and Sarah, and I think this story is a great example
• 2:17:34
  and there's a reason why this after Genesis, the dialects
• 2:17:37
  repeated this in 1994, because this is one of the very first
• 2:17:40
  Tom Baker stories I saw and I think I loved it back then and I
• 2:17:44
  still love it now because it's not perfect.
• 2:17:46
  Part 4. There's all the stuff with the
• 2:17:48
  game, the the puzzles and it does go on a bit and it does
• 2:17:54
  feel like they're just we've got 25 minutes.
• 2:17:56
  We need to drag this out maybe just a little bit.
• 2:17:58
  And then the, the, the conclusion with, you know, where
• 2:18:02
  the he does something with the time vortex and then he kind of
• 2:18:05
  has to explain it afterwards. And it's borderline and I'll
• 2:18:09
  explain later type ending. But because everything else
• 2:18:14
  works in the first 3 episodes, I've got to make this one
• 2:18:18
  through. This is a brilliant story.
• 2:18:22
  Let us go. To the comments James Lark says
• 2:18:26
  oozes atmosphere. Lovely period setting, fantastic
• 2:18:29
  location work. Dudley Simpson pulls out all the
• 2:18:31
  stops. Organ joke intended.
• 2:18:35
  Bernard Archer. Is memorably creepy and.
• 2:18:37
  Michael Shade runs the gamut of emotion, from childish delight
• 2:18:40
  to tragically conflicted. Yes, Part 4 dispense into game
• 2:18:44
  show format, but it's full of visual invention and pace, and
• 2:18:48
  Sladen and Baker sell it as more substantial than a series of
• 2:18:51
  children's puzzles. Jason Thompson says 3.
• 2:18:54
  Episodes. Of wonderful gothic horror with
• 2:18:56
  a superb supporting cast. Who doesn't want to give Michael
• 2:18:59
  Sheared a hug when he says you think I'll let you down again,
• 2:19:02
  don't you? With a final episode of a
• 2:19:04
  runaround and an arse Paul Mcguffin resolution.
• 2:19:07
  But keep it for Michael Sheared, Bernard Archer and Gabriel Wolf.
• 2:19:11
  Big Orange, Michael says. Suitech is one of the most
• 2:19:13
  engaging villains of the classic run. 4 episodes of sheer
• 2:19:16
  perfection. In a season marked by
• 2:19:18
  excellence, it shines as the best, Dylan Reece says.
• 2:19:22
  Tom and Liz are on. Fine form Sue Tech is brilliant
• 2:19:24
  but the mummies look ridiculous and the last episode let's it
• 2:19:27
  down. Michael Donahue says my all.
• 2:19:30
  Time favorite Comfort, too. When I was 10, it was released
• 2:19:33
  on VHS and I was when I was allowed to rent A film.
• 2:19:36
  I chose this most weeks as a result.
• 2:19:38
  I can still shoot, quote huge chunks of it and never tire of
• 2:19:41
  it, Michael Storm says, not wishing to be.
• 2:19:44
  An iconoclast, but the story has never engaged in me.
• 2:19:47
  It looks a bit static, the plot logic is a bit ropey, and the
• 2:19:50
  final episode is a poor remake of Deaf to the Daleks Part 4.
• 2:19:54
  Bin it. Let's remind ourselves one more
• 2:19:56
  time that Michael Storm did say Silver was the best side of man
• 2:20:00
  story of all time. James Hadwin.
• 2:20:03
  Bennett says I used to like it, now I hate it.
• 2:20:06
  The Doctor. I don't quite get this comment.
• 2:20:08
  The Doctor deliberately allows the timeline to come into
• 2:20:11
  existence where trillions die. No stay and fight, don't be a
• 2:20:15
  shit. Just to make a point to Sarah of
• 2:20:18
  episode 4 though. But Bennett, he does do that.
• 2:20:23
  Does he actually? Create the timeline.
• 2:20:25
  Or do they just go and then they put it?
• 2:20:28
  Right again, that evil. 15th Doctor does it.
• 2:20:30
  All over again, Bastard. Daniel.
• 2:20:34
  Knight. Peerless, dripping in atmosphere
• 2:20:36
  and tension. The scene between the Doctor and
• 2:20:38
  Sue Tech at the beginning of this, at the beginning of part
• 2:20:41
  4, is so simply achieved, yet harrowing and gripping.
• 2:20:44
  Show this. Show this to a non fan and
• 2:20:47
  they'd enjoy it. Unless you're my difficult to
• 2:20:49
  please ex-girlfriend. Oh I can sense some tension
• 2:20:52
  there. Revealing a bit.
• 2:20:54
  Too much there, Daniel. Difficult to please you say I.
• 2:20:58
  Think we need more details? Lucy McCall says the moment
• 2:21:02
  where what appears to be an overblown burst of soundtrack
• 2:21:04
  turns out to be Naheem playing the organ makes me laugh every
• 2:21:08
  time Andrew Parkinson says that. Egyptology was everywhere when I
• 2:21:12
  was growing up, so this ticks all the boxes.
• 2:21:14
  Isn't Tom sparkle? Especially in the scene where
• 2:21:16
  Sarah admonishes the doctor for not being human.
• 2:21:19
  Keep it, Anthony Carroll says Tom is at his best.
• 2:21:22
  And Sarah is superb, the Scarman's are great and the mum
• 2:21:25
  is a great idea. But episode 4 loses pace.
• 2:21:28
  Gareth Bowley A story drenched. In class of a warm mummies
• 2:21:32
  embrace. It looks great.
• 2:21:34
  It's mahogany. Good grief it looks great in its
• 2:21:37
  mahogany tones. And to live as one of the best
• 2:21:39
  villains ever. Plus Tom, that is most sombre
• 2:21:41
  and serious, which helps sell the danger backhoe says.
• 2:21:44
  Great production. Design some solid performances
• 2:21:47
  but that's about all I have. Every Doctor Who found has one
• 2:21:50
  classic that just doesn't do much for them.
• 2:21:52
  Sadly this is mine. Gabriel Wolf has a magnificent
• 2:21:55
  voice but Sue Tech does nothing for me.
• 2:21:57
  It's decent but too much running around in circles and an
• 2:22:00
  infamous rubbish ending. Glen Fitzgerald, big breasted.
• 2:22:03
  Mummies. Gothic scenery, great villain,
• 2:22:05
  great acting, brilliant musical score.
• 2:22:08
  The Doctor and Sarah are bouncing off each other
• 2:22:09
  brilliantly. Good storyline.
• 2:22:11
  Classic Who? Death blower says Top tier who?
• 2:22:14
  In a few short appearances, Gabriel goes from a paralyzed
• 2:22:17
  being in a mask to the most terrifying thing in existence
• 2:22:21
  shared his wonderful in his best who role and the doctor
• 2:22:23
  constantly sees the bigger picture.
• 2:22:25
  Know thine enemy chilling Dan Hollingsworth love it, but the.
• 2:22:29
  Recent Sutex gift to death where he kept the receipt and returned
• 2:22:33
  into the shop has decreased my enthusiasm, Luke Sims Jenkins
• 2:22:37
  says one of the. Best simple.
• 2:22:39
  The positives far outweigh any plot holes.
• 2:22:41
  The lovely Joe Short the. Lovely.
• 2:22:43
  Is that what she calls herself on?
• 2:22:45
  Yeah. Oh, she is lovely.
• 2:22:47
  The lovely Joe Short. Not as good as people think,
• 2:22:50
  Some good performances, but a lot of wandering around and the
• 2:22:53
  final episode is not good. And As for Sutek clinging on to
• 2:22:55
  the TARDIS, dot dot, dot, Right. Let's go over to Damn.
• 2:23:01
  Pyromontamont. Yeah.
• 2:23:02
  Or nay. Yeah, I've I've got to put this
• 2:23:04
  through. For quite a personal reason,
• 2:23:07
  actually. This was my mum's favorite
• 2:23:10
  Doctor Who story, so she loved history, especially, you know,
• 2:23:17
  Egyptology. And Tom Baker.
• 2:23:20
  Was her favorite doctor, so she absolutely adored this one.
• 2:23:25
  And I can remember we as a child, we took a couple of trips
• 2:23:31
  to up to up to Longley because it went too far away from where
• 2:23:34
  I where I lived. And I remember the one time we
• 2:23:37
  had gone through the Doctor Who exhibition and obviously has
• 2:23:42
  that wonderful shop at the end where it's a, it's a small
• 2:23:48
  doctor, small boys, Doctor Who dream all of the merchandise
• 2:23:52
  that you could get there. You know something.
• 2:23:54
  And I wanted to get a day Paul Remembrance of the Daleks Dalek
• 2:24:02
  whereas my mum tried and. Failed to.
• 2:24:06
  Convince me, wouldn't you rather have this VHS of Pyramids of
• 2:24:10
  Mars? There's something No I.
• 2:24:13
  Want my? Dalek, you know, so I only had
• 2:24:16
  enough pocket money for for one one or the other.
• 2:24:19
  And yeah, in the end I went with that Dalek.
• 2:24:24
  So Fast forward then to when we actually got the, the VHS of
• 2:24:28
  this and I, I used to, we watched it together quite a few
• 2:24:32
  times and mum was able to explain some of the, the, the,
• 2:24:35
  the history and the mythology and this sort of thing.
• 2:24:38
  So it was, it was, it was quite nice, you know, to kind of have
• 2:24:43
  those bit that bits of knowledge share and the gaps, you know,
• 2:24:47
  plugged for me by, by my mum's love of history.
• 2:24:51
  So I think every time I watch this, it feels like a warm hug
• 2:24:56
  from my mum. So, so I've got I've got to put
• 2:24:59
  it through just just really for that, that point of view.
• 2:25:03
  But obviously there I also think this is a damn good story as
• 2:25:08
  well. So I've got a lot of things that
• 2:25:09
  I really, really love about this.
• 2:25:11
  And, and I think I'm kind of going to piggyback some of the
• 2:25:16
  things that that David said in his analysis of this story,
• 2:25:22
  because I, I feel that this is portrays the doctor and Sarah's
• 2:25:31
  friendship so perfectly. So, you know, it's not a
• 2:25:36
  relationship that's bogged down with, you know, the, the
• 2:25:39
  romantic side of friendship that we get in the new series.
• 2:25:44
  This is two people that are absolute best friends and they
• 2:25:49
  would do anything to make sure that best friend was, was, was
• 2:25:54
  OK. And, and I, I think through
• 2:25:57
  this, I just love the, the banter between the two of them.
• 2:26:00
  And I think 2 of the things that David mentioned, the two scenes
• 2:26:04
  that I, I'd kind of picked out as well.
• 2:26:08
  So you've got that, that opening TARDIS scene where, you know,
• 2:26:12
  Sarah comes in with the, with the the dress on and, and, you
• 2:26:18
  know, the Doctor remarks that, Oh yeah, Vicky used to, Victoria
• 2:26:22
  used to wear it and, and she goes, well, as long as it wasn't
• 2:26:26
  Albert, you know, kind of thing. And so there was all these kind
• 2:26:29
  of nice jokes. And then, you know, when he's
• 2:26:31
  talking about that he's a Time Lord and he walks in eternity
• 2:26:35
  and that he's, you know, 750 years old and she remarks, Oh,
• 2:26:39
  you seem to be middle age then you know something.
• 2:26:41
  So there's loads of these lovely things.
• 2:26:42
  And then when they're in the the poachers Hut and she's putting a
• 2:26:46
  hand in the in the hutch and he goes, watch it.
• 2:26:49
  That might be a ferret. And she quickly pulls her hand
• 2:26:51
  out. It's just brilliant.
• 2:26:54
  And then like, yeah, again, when she froze the sweaty Jelly
• 2:26:58
  night. And the doctor goes like, you
• 2:27:00
  know, and he goes, one good sneeze could set it off.
• 2:27:02
  And then he goes, have you seen any detonators?
• 2:27:05
  She goes, no, but perhaps he sneezed.
• 2:27:07
  I love that a lot. Brilliant.
• 2:27:10
  You know, and then. Then later on you've got that
• 2:27:13
  scene of where the Doctor is disguising himself as a mummy
• 2:27:18
  and Sarah's kind of bandaging up and he goes, how do I look?
• 2:27:21
  And she goes, must have been a nasty accident.
• 2:27:24
  It's the Doctor goes, don't provoke me.
• 2:27:28
  It's just brilliant. And it and I think that really
• 2:27:31
  encaps those three things kind of really encapsulate the 4th
• 2:27:36
  Doctor and and Sarah Jane and and that's just amazing.
• 2:27:40
  And I don't think that. Doctor.
• 2:27:45
  Companion friendship has ever been better than this and before
• 2:27:50
  or since. It's just, it's just fantastic.
• 2:27:53
  Then I think additionally to that you you've then got the the
• 2:27:58
  beautiful period set design. So this is the BBC doing what
• 2:28:03
  the BBC does, does best, you know, ask them to create like a
• 2:28:08
  futuristic sci-fi kind of concept and you can see the
• 2:28:13
  budgetary restraints, whereas you ask them to, to kind of do
• 2:28:19
  something like this. And you can believe that that's
• 2:28:22
  a, you know, a Victorian house and, and, and, and, and what
• 2:28:26
  have you. But as well as that, they then
• 2:28:31
  bring in that, that, that gorgeous sarcophagus that is
• 2:28:35
  the, the space-time tunnel between the house and and Suitex
• 2:28:38
  team. And it's just just stunning.
• 2:28:41
  It's just beautiful. And then the way that they get
• 2:28:43
  the the blue bands to kind of they they put special effects on
• 2:28:48
  that to, to so that when Scarman is communicating with C tech,
• 2:28:52
  you know, it's just it's just fantastic.
• 2:28:54
  There, there. There is so much I could talk
• 2:28:57
  about this one for for years, but but I'll I'll leave it there
• 2:29:00
  and allow Rod and Joe there to but yeah, put it through
• 2:29:04
  Fabulous Joe. There's also a special effects
• 2:29:08
  shot. Which is so simply done by
• 2:29:10
  reversing the shot of Scarman with a bullet in his back and
• 2:29:14
  then that coming out with the puff of smoke going in.
• 2:29:18
  He's so brilliantly done. And there was just one Doctor
• 2:29:21
  Sarah moment that you didn't mention there that I've got on
• 2:29:24
  my list, which is the big you. Thought I was dead, didn't you?
• 2:29:29
  Yeah, yeah, you're always doing that, aren't you really, love?
• 2:29:32
  Because she is always doing that.
• 2:29:36
  I'm. Kind of on the fence for this
• 2:29:37
  one. And I do have a lot of reasons
• 2:29:39
  why I wouldn't put it through. I love it.
• 2:29:43
  I really, really love it. I think the period atmosphere is
• 2:29:45
  great. I think it's one of the most
• 2:29:47
  genuinely scary moments. I think the Deaths Warlock's
• 2:29:51
  horror when he realizes he's going to die is one of the
• 2:29:54
  scariest moments in Doctor Whoever.
• 2:29:56
  And Lawrence realizing he's going to die at the hands of his
• 2:29:58
  brother is really chilling. But my few issues are, I think,
• 2:30:05
  I do think all the characters are kind of sketchy.
• 2:30:08
  I don't really know who anybody is in this.
• 2:30:11
  They are just victims. So Marcus Garman, I know why he
• 2:30:15
  went to Egypt, but beyond that, I really know nothing about this
• 2:30:18
  man. The men, we don't learn anything
• 2:30:21
  at all. Collins, nothing.
• 2:30:23
  He's a Butler, that's it. Clements, he's a poacher.
• 2:30:25
  That's it. Like in a Robert Holmes script,
• 2:30:28
  you would normally have adeptly characterize people in it.
• 2:30:33
  Go to Rebus or something like that.
• 2:30:35
  And those people are are, you know, 3 dimensional ones,
• 2:30:37
  thoroughly believable. I think what makes those
• 2:30:40
  characters work here is they're just just so perfectly cast.
• 2:30:44
  But that doesn't. Change the fact.
• 2:30:46
  That why do I really care that these people die?
• 2:30:48
  Because I haven't got to know them.
• 2:30:49
  I don't know who they are, and frankly I'm not going to think
• 2:30:52
  about them after they're dead. I don't like the casual racism
• 2:30:55
  in this either. I think there's a really bad
• 2:30:58
  Arab stereotype in the mean, you know, the villain of the peace
• 2:31:02
  people would point at a talent of wing Chai.
• 2:31:03
  And we've had this custom before, haven't we, Rod?
• 2:31:06
  And I don't think it's great here.
• 2:31:07
  And the the frightened guy scraping around the pyramid in
• 2:31:12
  anyone who's not British in this, the British are all
• 2:31:14
  stalwart and smart and anyone else is either sniveling or
• 2:31:19
  evil. You know, I don't really like
• 2:31:22
  that there's no women in this apart from Sarah Jane.
• 2:31:24
  Where are the fucking women in this season?
• 2:31:27
  Apart from Brendan Morges? That is a problem.
• 2:31:31
  Home said he doesn't want to murder women, so he doesn't put
• 2:31:33
  women in the stories. But I ain't a good answer.
• 2:31:36
  I don't mind watching a few women die.
• 2:31:38
  Or maybe I'll let it that bit. No, no, but just I love women in
• 2:31:41
  Doctor Who. That's why I love the Graham
• 2:31:42
  Williams era. All those evil aunts turning up
• 2:31:44
  all over the place and it it does start to show.
• 2:31:48
  At this point after. Planet of Evil and this it does
• 2:31:51
  start to show. And Android invasion I think as
• 2:31:53
  well. Is there any other women in
• 2:31:55
  that, Andrew? There is.
• 2:31:57
  One character in episode 4 and she has she has about 3.
• 2:32:02
  Lines. But she does sort of stare.
• 2:32:04
  Quite. Flirtily at the other technician
• 2:32:06
  there. I mean, but me and Mark have
• 2:32:07
  created a whole back story that they were going out on a date
• 2:32:09
  later that night. But you know, if that's where
• 2:32:11
  we're scrabbling for that one person in three stories, we've
• 2:32:14
  got a problem. And I think there's just far too
• 2:32:17
  many contrivances in the last episode, like tricks.
• 2:32:21
  So, you know, we're tricked into thinking the Doctor's dead.
• 2:32:24
  No, he's got a reparative bypass system the TARDIS controls for
• 2:32:28
  isomorphic. Well, we've never heard of that
• 2:32:30
  before. Suddenly that's relevant in this
• 2:32:34
  Time Lord and a Siren technology are compatible.
• 2:32:36
  OK, That's how he stops them. The lame twist of the 5 minutes
• 2:32:40
  that it does all fall apart at the end.
• 2:32:42
  And that is cheap. That last episode, compared to
• 2:32:45
  the beautiful design and filming of episodes one to three, it is
• 2:32:50
  really, really cheap. I can't make a choice I've.
• 2:32:55
  Got to make a choice. You've got to and as well.
• 2:32:58
  I. Think this is who?
• 2:32:59
  Said earlier about when you watch something today, if it was
• 2:33:01
  you, Dan, wasn't it? I watch it so much it bores me a
• 2:33:04
  bit now because I know every line.
• 2:33:05
  I know every shot. In fact, I get confused when I
• 2:33:09
  watch it on the DVD because I watched the VHS originally with
• 2:33:12
  all those cliffhangers taken out and sort of extra bits thrown
• 2:33:15
  in. So I get very confused when I
• 2:33:17
  watch the DVD and I do get a bit bored just because I know it so
• 2:33:20
  well. But it is beautifully made, some
• 2:33:23
  of the best direction we've ever seen, brilliantly acted.
• 2:33:29
  Yeah. Keep it, keep it.
• 2:33:33
  Well. Because if Rod kicks it out.
• 2:33:35
  I don't know if I could forgive myself because it is brilliantly
• 2:33:38
  made. Well, I'm not going to Kick It
• 2:33:40
  Out so yet again. It's another 4 for four.
• 2:33:45
  I have the same problem with you, Joe, that it's not as great
• 2:33:49
  as its reputation is meant to be, I don't think.
• 2:33:53
  But. There's still.
• 2:33:54
  More than enough here for me to put it through.
• 2:33:57
  It's interesting when we're giving our our positives.
• 2:33:59
  No one mentions Episode 4 and those awful games because they
• 2:34:02
  are terrible. But yeah, I'm putting it through
• 2:34:05
  my first reason. It would probably be seen as a
• 2:34:07
  negative in most stories. So we usually told show, don't
• 2:34:10
  tell. But this does the opposite.
• 2:34:12
  It does an awful lot of telling, but not an awful lot of showing.
• 2:34:15
  It only really struck me when I was watching it through this
• 2:34:18
  time. This sets up Sutac as one of the
• 2:34:20
  greatest and most powerful enemies the Doctors ever faced,
• 2:34:23
  and yet we actually see very, very little of that power
• 2:34:26
  actually demonstrated. Yeah, we see the alternative
• 2:34:30
  timeline in 1980, which is what Sutac could potentially do.
• 2:34:34
  But apart from that, Sutac just possesses Scarman and contains
• 2:34:38
  the explosion. Everything else is done by his
• 2:34:41
  puppets or by the mummies, but we get this impression that
• 2:34:45
  Sutec is just one of the biggest bads.
• 2:34:48
  And why do we do that? The voice is the voice.
• 2:34:50
  But it's also because we get. Told continually, we continually
• 2:34:54
  get told he's the big bad. So think about it.
• 2:34:57
  As soon as the doctor learns that the threat is Sutec because
• 2:35:00
  he's gone to to Lawrence's cottage and use that equipment.
• 2:35:04
  I mean, come on, that equipment is so lame.
• 2:35:06
  Why does Lawrence suddenly have a radio telescope 40 years too
• 2:35:10
  early? That's not explored at all, just
• 2:35:12
  happens to be there for block convenience.
• 2:35:15
  But let's let's skip over that bit a bit.
• 2:35:16
  But at that point, the doctor uses it and tells us straight
• 2:35:20
  away. He knows it's Sutec tells us
• 2:35:21
  straight away. The world is facing the greatest
• 2:35:24
  peril in its history and I'm facing something more powerful
• 2:35:27
  and more dangerous than ever before.
• 2:35:29
  And his tone and he's so serious and so sombre.
• 2:35:32
  You believe it. You're buying what he's telling
• 2:35:34
  you. But we're not actually seeing
• 2:35:36
  anything. And because that scene with
• 2:35:38
  Tom's, you know, foreboding is cut as well, between the going
• 2:35:42
  back to the house with the Morgan and the music rising and
• 2:35:45
  the mummies raising their arms, the tone and the atmosphere.
• 2:35:48
  Again, you buy into it or we're not actually seeing anything.
• 2:35:53
  And it's the same in episode 2, the Doctor tells us
• 2:35:56
  miraculously, Suitex bake breaking free of his bombs.
• 2:35:59
  Nil, destroy the world. Again, we don't see any of that.
• 2:36:04
  And it's not just that the expositions limited to the
• 2:36:06
  Doctor. Suitex does it too.
• 2:36:08
  You know, in episodes three and four, he tells us, you know,
• 2:36:11
  where I tread. I leave nothing but dust and
• 2:36:13
  darkness. Fine.
• 2:36:14
  But we don't see it. Joe, You're right.
• 2:36:16
  It's the brilliance of his voice, the salsa plus the music,
• 2:36:20
  plus the menace. Absolutely.
• 2:36:24
  But we're just told it all again.
• 2:36:25
  It's almost stage play. You're just being told of this
• 2:36:28
  great power and this great threat, but which I don't.
• 2:36:31
  Maybe you should show and not tell because.
• 2:36:33
  I think when they did show it in Empire of Death it was nowhere
• 2:36:37
  near as effective. That's.
• 2:36:40
  A fairpoint. But I was just shocked, I was
• 2:36:43
  just surprised as I'm watching it, how little actual threat you
• 2:36:47
  see from Sutek himself. But yeah, we would walk away
• 2:36:50
  thinking the doctor just faced one of his biggest bads.
• 2:36:54
  My second reason is Ernie Clements real life father, of
• 2:36:58
  course, of Roberta Tovey from the Dialect films.
• 2:37:02
  Got to love him for that. Is there another Doctor Who
• 2:37:05
  character who does so much heavy lifting?
• 2:37:08
  He's got 3 lines. Holy Moses murdering swine.
• 2:37:12
  Professor Scarman. He's got 6 words.
• 2:37:16
  And yeah, he's not a pig bin Josh.
• 2:37:18
  He's not that Trump that gets run over by Pertwee and his
• 2:37:21
  hover craft. Actually, Ernie does so much
• 2:37:25
  heavy lifting in this story. So you first see him
• 2:37:26
  encountering the mummy, David. You refer to it where the
• 2:37:29
  mummy's got its leg in its trap. And that just establishes the
• 2:37:32
  threat and the power and the menace of the mummies because he
• 2:37:35
  pulls that trap open, throws it away and moves on.
• 2:37:38
  And Ernie witnesses that. You next see him run into the
• 2:37:41
  invisible force field. And again, it's a little bit of
• 2:37:43
  comedy effect there, but it's showing us that that point, our
• 2:37:47
  our heroes are all trapped in this house.
• 2:37:50
  Then he sees the murder of Warlock when he seeks to get his
• 2:37:53
  revenge by shooting Marcus. Joe, you talked about that
• 2:37:56
  brilliant, brilliant scene where the smoke comes out the chest
• 2:37:59
  and then goes back in again, fantastic.
• 2:38:01
  And again, that's demonstrating to us that how invincible
• 2:38:05
  Scalman is at that point. And then we get his death
• 2:38:08
  squashed by the twin bosoms of the mummies.
• 2:38:11
  And you know, joking aside, is quite a graphic death.
• 2:38:14
  And what he's doing there is setting up how powerful those
• 2:38:16
  mummies are because the next thing they do is go straight
• 2:38:18
  into the cottage, breakdown the walls, they're attacking Sarah,
• 2:38:21
  and there's the cliffhanger. And because you've seen how
• 2:38:23
  powerful they are, again, you buy into that cliffhanger.
• 2:38:27
  So all those little scenes that Ernie has done, yes, he's got 6
• 2:38:30
  words, but actually he sets up so much of that story.
• 2:38:34
  And then my last reason for doing it is Dudley Simpson.
• 2:38:36
  I'm not going to get another chance to shout about him, so
• 2:38:39
  I'm going to shout him out here. I love most of his music.
• 2:38:41
  I think he's he's really great at that point, this point.
• 2:38:44
  The rattle of the noise in the woods when you hear the mummies
• 2:38:47
  coming, the organ music absolutely evades this story.
• 2:38:52
  When he's on fire, as he is in this and most of this season, to
• 2:38:56
  be fair, I think Dudley is, it's quite hard to surpass him, to be
• 2:38:59
  honest. So he's my third reason.
• 2:39:01
  So yeah, Pyramids is going through oh God damn you people
• 2:39:05
  and my. Fatigued fanboy eyes.
• 2:39:07
  I fully endorse this after everything you've said.
• 2:39:10
  Man oh man, I've been weak tonight.
• 2:39:13
  Damn. You have the joy.
• 2:39:16
  That. Is Planet of Evil for it?
• 2:39:20
  I've been waiting. For this all night.
• 2:39:23
  Yes, so strap in lads because I've got my DMS on.
• 2:39:27
  I'm ready to put put the boot into this one.
• 2:39:30
  I've been waiting for you to say that for years.
• 2:39:32
  Come on. Basically.
• 2:39:36
  I don't like this one. I find it tediously dull.
• 2:39:42
  I think there's little or no humour in it, not even between
• 2:39:49
  Tom and Liz. And so, you know, we were
• 2:39:53
  talking about how how you know, yes, these have been quite
• 2:39:56
  serious, quite dark stories, but we've had that humor weaved
• 2:40:00
  through it, through the regulars.
• 2:40:02
  And I think it's what I feel it's kind of missing from this
• 2:40:05
  one. The suspense is taken away quite
• 2:40:11
  quickly because Saracen is portrayed as being clearly
• 2:40:17
  bonkers from the beginning. So, you know, it's kind of
• 2:40:22
  signposted. He he is the the main villain.
• 2:40:24
  He's the one that's caused caused all of this.
• 2:40:29
  And then it sort of becomes like almost like a tick box of
• 2:40:34
  cliches from from this point on. So you've got the the shouty out
• 2:40:41
  of their depth commander of a, of a, of a military group.
• 2:40:47
  You've then got he then clashes with his much more competent
• 2:40:53
  second in command. You've got the grumbling
• 2:40:57
  subordinates, but then you've also got soldiers that follow
• 2:41:02
  directions with with no question, even though they're
• 2:41:06
  going lately going to go straight to their to their
• 2:41:09
  death. You've then got the refusal of
• 2:41:13
  people to accept the evidence that's under their nose.
• 2:41:18
  And you know, on numerous occasions as well, it's obvious
• 2:41:22
  the doctor and Sarah are elsewhere.
• 2:41:24
  They were even with the the the the the commanding officers, but
• 2:41:30
  he still believes it's them that is causing this in some fashion
• 2:41:34
  or another. Lo, there's no evidence.
• 2:41:39
  You then got like at one point, you know, the doctor even kind
• 2:41:45
  of apes the the Lawrence Oats line.
• 2:41:50
  I'm going outside. I may be some time as he goes
• 2:41:53
  to, you know, to try and sort it, but it may may, you know,
• 2:41:57
  'cause his death. You've then got the the the mad
• 2:42:01
  commander at this point. He's mad, you know, making a bad
• 2:42:06
  situation worse by by trying to to solve it himself.
• 2:42:12
  And then you've got the villain of the piece, the one who's
• 2:42:19
  hubris has has caused all of these people to die.
• 2:42:25
  He he gets saved, he gets redeemed.
• 2:42:27
  And then the doctor even gives him an idea for how he can save
• 2:42:35
  his planet by by other means than than these crystals from
• 2:42:39
  from this planet. So it just feels like there's so
• 2:42:42
  much cliche in there. And, and despite a lot of people
• 2:42:47
  dying, I don't care because I don't care about any of those
• 2:42:52
  characters because they're so, you know, thinly sketched.
• 2:42:58
  They're not, you know, there's nothing there to kind of make
• 2:43:03
  you care about any of them. Then the design choices.
• 2:43:09
  So obviously design's a big thing for me.
• 2:43:11
  But then you've got, I think, I think Joe, actually you, you
• 2:43:15
  kind of mentioned it earlier on, you've got the model ship, model
• 2:43:19
  shot of this ship and it just looks like a Hoover attachment
• 2:43:23
  with a black, with a back, a black drape behind it kind of
• 2:43:27
  thing. And it's like, Oh, my life, you
• 2:43:29
  know, this is, this is terrible. Every time I get the Hoover out,
• 2:43:32
  you know? The rest of the street ship goes
• 2:43:34
  through my living room. Yeah, pretty much.
• 2:43:39
  Then you've got the interior of the ship and the, the design is
• 2:43:43
  so boring. It's just so plain and grey and,
• 2:43:47
  and, and it's a shame because you've got the multiple levels,
• 2:43:51
  which which I think you know, when you've got that in Doctor
• 2:43:54
  Who, that's a real good thing. But because it's so boringly
• 2:43:58
  designed, it doesn't matter. And, and when you compare it to
• 2:44:02
  like the, the arc in space designs last season, it's, it's
• 2:44:08
  even, it's, I think this is Robert Murray Leach as well,
• 2:44:11
  isn't it? I think, but it's just like it's
• 2:44:13
  lacking any of the, the verve, the, the, the sort of creativity
• 2:44:19
  of the, of that previous season. The control room.
• 2:44:24
  It's basically a glass topped table and a couple of chairs.
• 2:44:28
  It's, it's just just ridiculous. And then height of luxury.
• 2:44:32
  In the Maoistran empire, hasn't it?
• 2:44:34
  Yeah, yeah. High tech.
• 2:44:37
  And then you've got like the the costume designs, I mean like
• 2:44:42
  the, the low, the low, low neckline.
• 2:44:46
  I can't say that low neckline of, of the costumes.
• 2:44:49
  So that like you've got then the the chest hair of all of the
• 2:44:53
  actors waving over the top of you.
• 2:44:55
  You've just, you've just won us all over, Dan Put.
• 2:44:59
  It through it's going through trouble is they're all.
• 2:45:04
  Tedious. If they'd.
• 2:45:06
  Have hired really hunky men that that's that's my.
• 2:45:10
  Next point. The the designs of those
• 2:45:12
  costumes does favours to none of the actors in it, with maybe
• 2:45:17
  Prentice Hancock a little bit, but then he's the only one that
• 2:45:20
  seems to be allowed to wear his trousers outside his boots.
• 2:45:24
  The rest of them have got them tucked into those stupid white
• 2:45:27
  Wellington boots. Yeah.
• 2:45:31
  And I think that's the. Thing you know, like.
• 2:45:33
  If you had like big beefy kind of Space Marines that that it
• 2:45:38
  probably would be fine. But you've got like, you've got
• 2:45:42
  like the. You know a thin.
• 2:45:43
  Owed guy. The rest of them are quite,
• 2:45:45
  quite thin and lanky, aren't they?
• 2:45:47
  And you know, and then you've got is it Dahan?
• 2:45:51
  Obviously he's a chubby one. Yeah.
• 2:45:53
  And. You're thinking, oh, you.
• 2:45:54
  Know bless some poor guys. They they, they look so stupid
• 2:45:58
  in these in these costumes. Imagine if they pulled in like
• 2:46:01
  Sony. Codinas or somewhere like that,
• 2:46:03
  we all would have been absolutely so happy.
• 2:46:05
  Yeah, yeah. You know, and then.
• 2:46:08
  Like I think the the the creature obviously is a is a RIP
• 2:46:15
  off from the forbidden Planet film from like the 50s, isn't
• 2:46:20
  it? And I think it.
• 2:46:22
  It. It works as as the creature, but
• 2:46:25
  then when it becomes like the the duplicate copies of of of
• 2:46:29
  Soricen, it doesn't work. The outline doesn't doesn't work
• 2:46:35
  at all. And then I, I don't understand
• 2:46:38
  that weird decision that when the creature kills someone,
• 2:46:44
  they, they, they, the, the, the corpse disappears and then a few
• 2:46:51
  seconds later re this emancipated corpse reappears.
• 2:46:55
  It, it just feels like what you would have wanted is some sort
• 2:46:58
  of effect where, you know, it goes from the, the, the, the
• 2:47:01
  live human being to, to, to the, to the emancipated corpse.
• 2:47:05
  And it's just lying there, you know, so there's a lot.
• 2:47:08
  It doesn't even fade back in. It just goes there it is, and
• 2:47:14
  then. The.
• 2:47:15
  Jungle, I think on film it looks good but then when it goes back
• 2:47:23
  onto to video you can see the floors in it a little bit so.
• 2:47:31
  I don't know how. To feel about that, because I
• 2:47:33
  think I think it looks brilliant.
• 2:47:35
  You know, like I say, on, on, on, on film, you've got the dry
• 2:47:38
  ice. It's lit really well and, and
• 2:47:41
  and it looks alien. But yeah, you know, there's just
• 2:47:47
  so much I just don't like. It and then.
• 2:47:52
  We've already mentioned the guy and it seems it hardly seems
• 2:47:57
  fair really to pick on him. But Prentice Hancock?
• 2:48:01
  Why the hell do they keep casting him in Doctor Who?
• 2:48:04
  Because other than the 5 minutes that he's on screen in Spearhead
• 2:48:08
  Through Space, he's shit in in every single one of them.
• 2:48:13
  He's just a huge success in space. 1999 at the moment, you
• 2:48:16
  know, so on the other channel, yeah.
• 2:48:19
  Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I just, I just don't, you
• 2:48:25
  know, I think Planet of Daleks feels like it's the same
• 2:48:30
  character as he's playing in this.
• 2:48:32
  It's sort of shouty, aggressive, kind of.
• 2:48:36
  Yeah. Losing the plot, Yeah, you know.
• 2:48:40
  And you know. Yeah, I just I just don't rate
• 2:48:44
  him in Doctor Who at all. Part part from like I say, 5
• 2:48:47
  minutes and spearhead from space.
• 2:48:49
  So yeah, I really don't like this one at.
• 2:48:52
  All and I. Think we got that one go in the
• 2:48:54
  big impression. Yeah.
• 2:48:56
  If you just said I'm keeping. It now I would have.
• 2:48:59
  Been genuinely. Baffled.
• 2:49:02
  Right, let us go to. The comments Lucy McCall says a
• 2:49:05
  lot to like the story of a scientist so driven that he
• 2:49:08
  needs reminding of his responsibilities by the doctor.
• 2:49:10
  The jungle setting, the supporting cast, and the
• 2:49:13
  transformation effects are all excellent.
• 2:49:16
  Dylan Reece in harmony with. Dan says God, this is dull,
• 2:49:19
  loud, serious people doing loud serious things in space.
• 2:49:24
  Peter Old says it's a truth. Universally acknowledged that a
• 2:49:27
  single season in possession of scripts, good scripts in
• 2:49:30
  general, must be in want of a decent plot and effects for at
• 2:49:33
  least one story of. Course he loved it, Michael.
• 2:49:37
  Storm my nemesis Jekyll and Hyde means Forbidden Planet, what's
• 2:49:43
  not to love? Oh yeah, Prentice Hancock.
• 2:49:45
  However the rest of the cars make up for this.
• 2:49:48
  The jungle looks fantastic, as does the anti matter monster
• 2:49:51
  keep, James Lark says, strangely dull.
• 2:49:54
  It's not even very interesting to look at.
• 2:49:56
  I never understood the adulation for that jungle set.
• 2:49:59
  Give me Cloris any day. And why is Maloney cast Davros
• 2:50:02
  as a glorified extra? James Holden?
• 2:50:05
  Bennett really like. This one except for the fuck
• 2:50:07
  off. Huge rewriting of the Part 3
• 2:50:09
  cliffhanger in the part 4 reprise.
• 2:50:12
  Oh yeah, they just pulled the lever back don't they?
• 2:50:14
  And back they come. Love the unique look of the
• 2:50:17
  monster and any story where human greed is the real villain
• 2:50:20
  is good with me. Keep.
• 2:50:23
  Big Orange, Michael says. A deliberately paced story with
• 2:50:26
  superior set design and superb direction.
• 2:50:29
  Tom Baker's found his take on the Doctor and it works
• 2:50:31
  superbly. A great take on the Jekyll and
• 2:50:34
  Hyde story. Keep it, Paul Quinn.
• 2:50:36
  Says there's a beautiful moment when the.
• 2:50:38
  Doctor and Sarah held prisoner. The Doctor is staring into
• 2:50:41
  space. Sarah nudges him and says shall
• 2:50:43
  we go and then suggest the means of escape.
• 2:50:45
  It's a lovely example of how good Liz and Tom were, Daniel
• 2:50:49
  Nice says. A great jungle.
• 2:50:51
  Set. That's never been battered.
• 2:50:52
  Tom and Liz are peerless, and the guest cast are mostly good.
• 2:50:55
  It's unsettling and scary, but the lack of the big bad means
• 2:50:58
  it's not as memorable as others this season.
• 2:51:01
  Jason Thompson says the weird. Dichotomy between the superbly
• 2:51:04
  maiden film Jungle and the can't be arsed cheap plain white
• 2:51:08
  spaceship corridor sets is jarring.
• 2:51:11
  The various sources are mashed together without much thought
• 2:51:13
  and it's so dry and humorous and it uses and where we go science,
• 2:51:18
  Jason Thompson of science, and it uses antimatter to describe
• 2:51:22
  something that's in no way antimatter been he did.
• 2:51:26
  He did go into much more. Detail I hope did thank.
• 2:51:30
  God. You give me to that to say.
• 2:51:33
  John Hall says a Moody, chilling.
• 2:51:34
  Take on Jacqueline Hyde, that scared me silly as a young man.
• 2:51:37
  The desiccated corpses that the monster excretes, the anti men
• 2:51:41
  burning through bulkheads. Burr OK Sorensen's brown Velo
• 2:51:45
  tracksuit hasn't aged well, but man that jungle sat rocks.
• 2:51:49
  Epit Glenn Fitzgerald. Says one of the lows of the
• 2:51:52
  season. A boring, dull story I watched
• 2:51:57
  to make me sleep. A nothing story that's easy to
• 2:52:00
  forget, Ben. Thank you for the emphasis on
• 2:52:04
  that, Jack Coyer says not. Particularly fond of this,
• 2:52:07
  Maloney is one of Doctor Who's best directors and he's doing
• 2:52:10
  all he can to elevate the material and Tom is great.
• 2:52:13
  My problem is though, while some of Church, Hinchcliffe and
• 2:52:16
  Holmes stories prioritise style of the substance, rarely do they
• 2:52:19
  so heavily use it as a grudge like they do here.
• 2:52:22
  Art 4 is dull even though it's how these nothing stories
• 2:52:26
  always. Have the most comments?
• 2:52:27
  Yeah, Andy Parkinson says. One of the best space jungles
• 2:52:30
  we've ever seen, an invisible monster straight out of
• 2:52:32
  Forbidden Planet and buff grand buff Granddad Vashinsky.
• 2:52:37
  Served to make. Andy Parkinson.
• 2:52:40
  Served to make this another brilliant story mixed with a
• 2:52:42
  Jekyll and Hyde Sorosen for good measure, even Prentice Hancock.
• 2:52:47
  Can't. Ruin this, keep it great Doctor
• 2:52:50
  Who, said I. Really do like this one, the set
• 2:52:52
  work is brilliant, the antimatter is a fun concept and
• 2:52:55
  the whole pulling the antimatter back towards it part was very
• 2:52:58
  interesting. Anthony Carroll worst of the
• 2:53:01
  season. Good first episode and themes.
• 2:53:03
  Monster math all done says shit. Even more boring than the web
• 2:53:08
  planet, and that's saying something.
• 2:53:10
  You sure that wasn't a sigh or. No.
• 2:53:12
  Gareth Bowley finally says to us.
• 2:53:14
  It just looks and feels odd. Not often visited.
• 2:53:18
  By me. Due to this.
• 2:53:21
  Right over to David. Is it shit and more boring than
• 2:53:24
  the web planet David? Fucking hell. 11 avid fan of
• 2:53:35
  the. Podcast describes us as the
• 2:53:36
  planet of wretched evil. I was.
• 2:53:40
  Sigh hard. I cannot disagree with that.
• 2:53:43
  And I can't disagree with any of the points Dan made because I
• 2:53:46
  actually wrote most of the same things.
• 2:53:50
  I think the production design, the costume design for the most
• 2:53:53
  part, is really bad. OK, let's the jungle, the jungle
• 2:54:00
  looks good, the jungle on film looks good, but I think we get
• 2:54:03
  about 5 minutes of it and once that that can disconnect between
• 2:54:09
  how well lit and everything it is on film.
• 2:54:12
  Soon as they go into the studio it just doesn't work.
• 2:54:14
  It just goes. It just looks really shoddy.
• 2:54:18
  The costume, I mean, everything, pretty much everything,
• 2:54:21
  everything you said I've got here.
• 2:54:23
  The the necklines, that thin material, the plunging necklines
• 2:54:28
  with the wafts of chest hair, which normally I wouldn't mind
• 2:54:31
  but on this cast I boys would look fabulous in those.
• 2:54:34
  Costumes I I don't think anybody.
• 2:54:36
  Would be able to pull these. Costumes off, I think, I don't
• 2:54:39
  know. We'll do it for the next call.
• 2:54:40
  We should have. We should have made them come.
• 2:54:42
  Dressed in in character. That's right, we missed a trick
• 2:54:45
  that Joe it it's so 19th. September that that glass table
• 2:54:49
  got in the control deck and those chairs that have clearly
• 2:54:51
  been bought from like, you know, the local habitat or something
• 2:54:55
  like that. It just feels Roger Marie Leach
• 2:54:59
  is a great designer at times but this just feels so phoned in.
• 2:55:02
  I don't think it's David Maloney's finest direction and
• 2:55:06
  either I think it feels a bit half arsed.
• 2:55:11
  It's another part 4 where it just sort of falls apart.
• 2:55:15
  Sarah gets almost nothing to do. She sort of hangs around with
• 2:55:18
  fishing ski on the the flight deck and kind of helps him put
• 2:55:23
  some force field generators from a cupboard with a very flappy
• 2:55:26
  sign. I seem to remember as well.
• 2:55:28
  So the whole thing just feels a bit rushed, a bit shoddy.
• 2:55:32
  Prentice Hancock goes mad because the script says this is
• 2:55:35
  when the character goes mad and the doctor then is waving some
• 2:55:40
  sort of espresso maker around. You know, some reason that wards
• 2:55:45
  off the ad. Some of this is explained in the
• 2:55:47
  book and it's kind of outlined because I did try to read some
• 2:55:50
  of the books for the season and it helps outline why certain
• 2:55:54
  things happen but that it should be there.
• 2:55:57
  In in the. Production.
• 2:55:58
  It really should be. There's a scene we'll be talking
• 2:56:02
  a lot about going too far this year and there is a scene in
• 2:56:05
  Part 4 when the Doctor. Confronts.
• 2:56:09
  Soros and basically tells him to go and kill himself.
• 2:56:14
  And it's actually really well performed.
• 2:56:18
  I think it's actually quite a well written scene, but the
• 2:56:22
  doctor basically. Quite coldly.
• 2:56:24
  And bluntly saying yeah, off you go it.
• 2:56:28
  I don't know, it's at that beginning of that crossing the
• 2:56:31
  line of like, is this just a little bit much in a tea time
• 2:56:34
  adventure series? Interesting because obviously
• 2:56:37
  later in the season. He murders Solon himself in
• 2:56:41
  Brain and Morbius and then skip forward a year or two, he's
• 2:56:45
  given a gun to that fellow in image of the Fendile.
• 2:56:47
  We can't kind of go back to this a couple of times, maybe because
• 2:56:51
  Sorenson. Couldn't go, didn't go through
• 2:56:53
  with anything. He's kind of just decided in
• 2:56:54
  future say, oh, so I'll just do it myself in future.
• 2:56:59
  I think it's subtly done enough. Though that kids wouldn't know
• 2:57:01
  it's not like like image defend all the hands are gun over.
• 2:57:04
  This is much more implicit. So I think if you don't get it,
• 2:57:07
  you don't get it. There's nothing visually that's
• 2:57:09
  drawing your attention. So what actually saying and and
• 2:57:14
  it's just. A bit dull.
• 2:57:16
  I mean, we've got. It, it's that planet ZOG type,
• 2:57:19
  you know, the Maoistron crew, whether or not they're a lost
• 2:57:22
  Earth colony or not, because they, they sort of hints at it.
• 2:57:28
  You know, they've all got. Not quite space names.
• 2:57:30
  They've all got foreign names. So you, the, the, you've got
• 2:57:34
  O'Hara and Ponty and Dahan. They've all got kind of slightly
• 2:57:38
  international names. There's a very.
• 2:57:43
  Old thing. Obviously there's someone.
• 2:57:44
  Mentioned about casting Michael Wisher in a bit of a non part,
• 2:57:47
  but of course he actually plays more than one part because he
• 2:57:49
  plays a couple of the comms voices, including one which is
• 2:57:54
  includes a very dodgy Indian accent, which when he comes on,
• 2:57:59
  it's clearly it's clearly Michael Wisher and you've got Oh
• 2:58:02
  dear, this is not the best era for.
• 2:58:05
  Representation is it, and that comes on to.
• 2:58:09
  The point which I think Joe you you mentioned in Pyramids of
• 2:58:12
  Mars, because this is the beginning of a basically it's an
• 2:58:15
  11 episode block of apart from Sarah, there are no female
• 2:58:22
  characters. In the story, that's 11.
• 2:58:24
  Episodes I, I, we were chatting and I was talking about my
• 2:58:27
  spreadsheets and I thought I'd actually go because this is
• 2:58:29
  always held up. The, the Hinchcliffe Holmes ear
• 2:58:31
  has always held up as being the worst for its female guest
• 2:58:35
  stars. And it's like, well, is that a
• 2:58:37
  justified criticism? The answer is absolutely.
• 2:58:40
  It really is a justified criticism according to I've got
• 2:58:45
  it on the screen and this is not a sign yet.
• 2:58:47
  Someone will probably come along and and point out the whole
• 2:58:50
  basically, I just went through the episodes and when there's a
• 2:58:52
  base, a woman credited, whether or not they speak or not, it's
• 2:58:55
  just whether or not they're credited.
• 2:58:57
  There are 12 out of 26 episodes in this season and it is the in
• 2:59:04
  terms. Of a percentage it.
• 2:59:05
  Is the lowest percentage in 26 seasons and the.
• 2:59:11
  Other two. Lowest can you if you would have
• 2:59:13
  a guess that the what came in joint second well from 14 yes
• 2:59:18
  it. Is.
• 2:59:21
  It was very nearly joint. 13 or 14 St.
• 2:59:25
  Venom. Then it was like, Oh yeah,
• 2:59:26
  Pamela Salem does a voice in one episode of face of evil, which
• 2:59:29
  makes it just makes it a non sausage fest story.
• 2:59:32
  But you know, it's yes, it's the voice part, but she's credited,
• 2:59:36
  so it counts. You annoys me about this whole
• 2:59:39
  thing about. The lack of women is, and I've
• 2:59:43
  seen arguments about it online, it's always men that are
• 2:59:47
  complaining about the people complaining.
• 2:59:49
  There are no women in this. Like it's a certain subset of
• 2:59:53
  fandom that are like, oh so fucking well, you want women in
• 2:59:56
  everything. Like that's a bad thing.
• 2:59:59
  You know, it might have brought the story up a bit to have, you
• 3:00:02
  know, Barrel Reed on the crew of the Maoist rooms.
• 3:00:05
  That would have. That would have given it some.
• 3:00:06
  Some life. The fact is it got it's gotten
• 3:00:08
  worse. It's not and it's not as if oh,
• 3:00:11
  it's got slightly worse. It's a huge dip.
• 3:00:14
  The per year might not be perfect for some of it, but it's
• 3:00:17
  still having a pretty high average of speaking parts for in
• 3:00:20
  might be one per story, but at least it's more than what these
• 3:00:24
  stories are doing. So yes, you know the be right.
• 3:00:28
  Oh, you're being woken. You're criticizing it, and it's
• 3:00:30
  like television at that. Point was also giving.
• 3:00:33
  Interesting parts for women as well.
• 3:00:35
  If you watch other shows of the time, OK, most of them might be
• 3:00:38
  his period dramas or kitchen sink dramas, but there were
• 3:00:42
  interesting roles for women out there.
• 3:00:43
  There was a conscious decision and we know there was a
• 3:00:46
  conscious decision because Robert Holmes had admitted it.
• 3:00:49
  They're not here and I think that is a bit of an elephant in
• 3:00:53
  the room with this season. It is one of the contributing
• 3:00:55
  factors to me why I can't really say this is the best season of
• 3:00:59
  Doctor Who because it has got this glaring gap of interesting
• 3:01:04
  parts for women. Android Invasion has one.
• 3:01:07
  She has three lines. I think it's 3 lines.
• 3:01:09
  So interesting that two periods of the.
• 3:01:11
  Show that are docked constantly. The Graham Williams era and the
• 3:01:17
  Chris Chibnall era are the best representation for women in the
• 3:01:21
  classic and new series by a mile, and I'm wondering who's
• 3:01:25
  doing the complaining about those eras.
• 3:01:28
  I had a. Similar thought I was trying to
• 3:01:30
  think. Of how to phrase that more
• 3:01:31
  delicately in terms of how many people saying this is the golden
• 3:01:34
  age are also the ones criticizing the more I don't
• 3:01:37
  mind upsetting those people elements that that perceive
• 3:01:39
  later. But yes, I think Hinchcliffe
• 3:01:44
  more than Holmes because obviously Robert Holmes script
• 3:01:49
  edited robot and you've got miss Winters in there.
• 3:01:52
  He also did you've got horrifying rock and you've got
• 3:01:54
  some characters in there. So there are so actually in
• 3:01:58
  terms of the producers, because somebody said I should I should
• 3:02:00
  try and categorize it by season by Doctor, by producer.
• 3:02:03
  Philip Hinchcliffe is in terms of the producer, he's the one
• 3:02:08
  produced era with the lowest cap percentage of female guest
• 3:02:12
  stars. So coming back to planet of
• 3:02:16
  evil, that is it's it's the beginning of a bit of a trend
• 3:02:21
  this this particular season as well.
• 3:02:23
  And it is a it is a real shame. But Planet of Evil, it's just
• 3:02:27
  or, and and maybe. Somewhat.
• 3:02:29
  And it's interesting people talk about the guest cast and the
• 3:02:32
  same strong guest apart from we remember Prentice Hancock
• 3:02:35
  because he's terrible. But I don't think you and Solon
• 3:02:38
  does anything terribly interesting.
• 3:02:41
  He's. There, he's reliable.
• 3:02:44
  Frederick Yeager, when? He's turning into anti man It's.
• 3:02:48
  It's quite funny when he's got the makeup on.
• 3:02:51
  Never. The antimatter monster is well
• 3:02:53
  done and that's how the Varbans should have been done a couple
• 3:02:56
  of years later. They, they, they could, that
• 3:02:57
  sort of energy monster would be done.
• 3:03:01
  They just didn't do it later. Anyway, I'm going to stop soon
• 3:03:04
  because I'm clearly I've given this story enough of a kicking
• 3:03:06
  and let's see what happens next. Well, I'm going to go next, Joe.
• 3:03:11
  You can make this deciding vote because I love Planet of Evil.
• 3:03:15
  What is wrong with everybody? We've watched it.
• 3:03:22
  Brilliant bastard. I love planet of.
• 3:03:25
  Evil. I don't know what you're all.
• 3:03:26
  Talking about right, my first reason for putting this through
• 3:03:30
  and championing it is the aliens.
• 3:03:34
  This is near us really heavily steeped in traditional rubber
• 3:03:37
  monsters. And yes, I love my traditional
• 3:03:39
  rubber monsters, but I think it's really refreshing to have a
• 3:03:42
  much more metaphysical foe in this story.
• 3:03:45
  And I think Zeta mine is probably one of the most alien
• 3:03:47
  worlds we've visited, certainly up to this point.
• 3:03:50
  This isn't, you know, this isn't another.
• 3:03:52
  This isn't metabolist 3 where we land and it's just human look
• 3:03:55
  alikes with a, you know, UK regional accent.
• 3:03:59
  This is something quite different.
• 3:04:00
  This is something quite daring something.
• 3:04:02
  It's something original pursuit. The very first scene, Sorenson
• 3:04:06
  is telling us that this planet is alive.
• 3:04:08
  It's able to change its geography, to hide its minerals
• 3:04:11
  from the colonists. And then as soon as the TARDIS
• 3:04:14
  arrives, Ceres affected in a way that we'd never seen before, is
• 3:04:17
  the presence of a planet in our mind.
• 3:04:19
  And of course we see that presence later on.
• 3:04:22
  And maybe it's not drawn out as well as it could be, but that
• 3:04:25
  presence that affects Cere also effects Sorenson, effects
• 3:04:28
  Salima. And they both have some form of
• 3:04:31
  mental breakdown, which is due to the effect of the planet.
• 3:04:34
  So it's doing lots of really interesting things here that
• 3:04:37
  aren't done elsewhere in this series.
• 3:04:39
  You know, the doctor describes this threat as nothing else.
• 3:04:42
  It's it's the antithesis of everything we know that's really
• 3:04:45
  interesting and different. You know, he looks down the
• 3:04:48
  camera and pretty much tells us at home that, you know, the
• 3:04:51
  restaurants are tampering with the balance of nature on this
• 3:04:53
  planet. I think it's setting up a really
• 3:04:56
  unique threat. And it's an intangible threat.
• 3:04:58
  And of course, that intangibility is reflected by
• 3:05:01
  the fact that in Monster you just get the out line, which I
• 3:05:03
  think works really well and again, feels very different.
• 3:05:07
  And we do get, you know, double bunk for our buck because in the
• 3:05:10
  last episode and a half obviously got more physical
• 3:05:12
  threat when Sorenson starts turning into anti man.
• 3:05:14
  But even they dispense with that quite quickly and the use of the
• 3:05:17
  neutron accelerator. Not a coffee machine.
• 3:05:20
  Thank you. Well, David, it takes us down a
• 3:05:22
  slightly more surreal path with the outlines of the figures
• 3:05:26
  attacking. So I think there's a lot of
• 3:05:27
  alienness in here that it doesn't get recognized for.
• 3:05:31
  My second, the reason for that is I think there's an awful lot
• 3:05:34
  of startling imagery in there. And I mentioned imagery right to
• 3:05:36
  the very top of that, and I think there's a lot of air in
• 3:05:38
  there. And again, that backs up the
• 3:05:40
  alienness that I've just talked about.
• 3:05:42
  So start with the jungle. You guys aren't?
• 3:05:45
  Right. Aren't.
• 3:05:45
  Wrong. I can't.
• 3:05:47
  I can't say that the jungle looks brilliant when it goes
• 3:05:50
  into studio, yeah, it looks quite small and not so
• 3:05:54
  successful. But when you've got it in its
• 3:05:56
  full form in Elstree, it's big, it's expansive, it's expensive,
• 3:06:00
  it's immersive, you've got pools of water, the Doctor and Sarah
• 3:06:04
  are walking through all that dry ice.
• 3:06:06
  It looks really big and expensive.
• 3:06:08
  Compare that to what was the last jungle probably planned the
• 3:06:12
  Daleks 2 years before, which was really small and static and
• 3:06:15
  studio based. I think this has got such
• 3:06:18
  atmosphere. The Elstree stuff.
• 3:06:20
  I think it looks fantastic. Even the stuff like the dark
• 3:06:23
  pool, yes, that's in studio. I think the facts used to it
• 3:06:27
  again, when the doctor falls into the dark pool, I think
• 3:06:29
  they're doing really interesting things with the with the camera
• 3:06:32
  works again to make you feel the the national the natural laws of
• 3:06:36
  physics don't apply apply on this planet.
• 3:06:38
  There's something different going on.
• 3:06:41
  Direction supports that. You know, I've talked about the
• 3:06:44
  scene when Sarah affected, the miniature comes out.
• 3:06:46
  The times you get that close up on her eyes and you can see, you
• 3:06:49
  know what? You can always see the hairs
• 3:06:50
  going up on the back of her hand.
• 3:06:52
  I think the outline preachers work well.
• 3:06:54
  The desiccated husks look really good.
• 3:06:56
  The Akaloy tracker, which could have been a really bad effect
• 3:06:59
  for this time, wobbling along actually is quite smooth when it
• 3:07:02
  works on moves along. So I think there's a lot of
• 3:07:04
  really good imagery in this. And finally, I I disagree with
• 3:07:08
  you all. I actually like the characters
• 3:07:10
  in this. I think Freddie Aiker Sorenson
• 3:07:12
  is 1,000,000 miles away from his exaggerated Mariners that we got
• 3:07:16
  a couple of years later. I think he plays it really well.
• 3:07:19
  He's not a man driven by power or conquest like pretty much
• 3:07:22
  everyone. Someone else this season, it's
• 3:07:24
  just about ego for him and he has this breakdown.
• 3:07:27
  No, it's not dissimilar to to Hindle from Kinder.
• 3:07:30
  So he's a great character. I like Vashinsky.
• 3:07:33
  Yeah, he doesn't have an awful lot on the page, but I think you
• 3:07:35
  win. Solon plays him very
• 3:07:37
  sympathetically and we earn his trust and even to hand.
• 3:07:40
  Daniel said there's no humour in this.
• 3:07:41
  Sorry. I love the hands lines.
• 3:07:43
  He's always grumpy, he's always miserable.
• 3:07:45
  He doesn't want to be there and he lets us know it.
• 3:07:48
  I can hide that person at. Work.
• 3:07:50
  There's always one at every job who's whingeing that they have
• 3:07:53
  to do their job. Yeah, but when you're watching
• 3:07:55
  it, it's quite a bit. David, David, just David's the
• 3:07:58
  one. So I think plant.
• 3:08:02
  Of evil's bright I think it's got a lot going for it and Yahoo
• 3:08:05
  sucks to the lot of you Joe hello Terry to.
• 3:08:11
  Shreds. I quote.
• 3:08:12
  Dylan Reese. Oh, do we have to boring, which
• 3:08:19
  is an opinion I. Do not agree with.
• 3:08:21
  Because I really like Planet of Evil and I'm not entirely sure
• 3:08:26
  why. This is my Christmas Doctor Who
• 3:08:29
  story of. All the stories I could have
• 3:08:32
  chosen. Every year, right, I put on, put
• 3:08:36
  up my Christmas tree, I put on the lights, I turn every other
• 3:08:39
  light off in the house and watch this story with the Christmas
• 3:08:42
  tree lights on. And it's just so atmospheric.
• 3:08:45
  It's a perfect winter Doctor Who story.
• 3:08:49
  I do think there's way more to the direction than you guys are
• 3:08:54
  suggesting suggesting. I I like little touches, like he
• 3:09:00
  does his really quick zoom into the pit, into the blackness of
• 3:09:04
  the pit, as if there's something really scary down there.
• 3:09:07
  And there's a scene which could have been so hokey where all the
• 3:09:10
  guards are shooting at a doctor and Sarah, but because they've
• 3:09:12
  got lights on the gums, they're sort of like strobe light
• 3:09:15
  lighting up the whole set. And it looks really visually
• 3:09:18
  arresting. I like the fact as well that,
• 3:09:21
  you know, when people are sucked to death by the antimatter
• 3:09:23
  creature. Oh, what a way to go.
• 3:09:27
  I like the fact that you see that he sort of lit it in a way
• 3:09:30
  that you see the shadow of Sorenson as the creature sort of
• 3:09:33
  up against the wall like that as he's sucking his way.
• 3:09:37
  Out, you know, turning them all. Into desiccated corpses.
• 3:09:40
  And I really love the bit where the atomic accelerator goes off
• 3:09:44
  and all of those creatures come tearing out, you know, when it
• 3:09:49
  creates all the different versions of it.
• 3:09:51
  And I just, I think the set looks great both on film and in
• 3:09:57
  on video. It looks like an actual sort of
• 3:09:59
  living thing. Reds and purples with a mossy,
• 3:10:03
  muddy floor, Horns of steam curling in the air, fronds
• 3:10:07
  hanging from the trees, disturbing phallic plants that
• 3:10:11
  the designer put in his garden one day and brought in the life
• 3:10:14
  out of his wife with in the morning.
• 3:10:16
  Yeah, I love it. But more than anything, I think
• 3:10:18
  the sound effects are the best thing in this.
• 3:10:21
  The the wind whistling through the trees, the clanking chains
• 3:10:24
  of the creature approaching, you know, the the blasts of the ray
• 3:10:28
  gun are maybe, you know, remember that.
• 3:10:29
  What the noise those pathetic guns made in the pirate planet
• 3:10:32
  rods. Oh God, yeah.
• 3:10:34
  So I think I. Think there's a lot going on to
• 3:10:36
  make this? Visually arresting and scary for
• 3:10:38
  the kids. The lights are down quite a lot.
• 3:10:40
  Obviously in the jungle, but in the sets as well the lights are
• 3:10:43
  down quite a lot. I think Sarah is brilliant in
• 3:10:46
  this. She.
• 3:10:47
  Says in her autobiography. Unbelievably, this and Monster
• 3:10:50
  of Peloton were the two stories she liked filming the most,
• 3:10:54
  where she was the most relaxed with her two respected doctors.
• 3:10:58
  And you can sort of see it here. They're not exactly responding
• 3:11:01
  to to the drama of the situation too badly, but I think she's
• 3:11:04
  really clever. She knows the windows open, she
• 3:11:07
  knows what a certain piece of equipment is.
• 3:11:09
  She volunteers to go back to the TARDIS.
• 3:11:11
  I just think she's written with lots of agents again, this story
• 3:11:15
  and it's let's say she's absolutely brilliant.
• 3:11:17
  And Rod, I'm not going to label the point, but I think your
• 3:11:19
  point about the sort of unknowable horror of this story,
• 3:11:24
  I just think that's so much more effective than any shitty
• 3:11:27
  monster they could have showed us.
• 3:11:29
  And I know they still show as a shitty monster, but whatever is
• 3:11:32
  lurking down in that pool. And I think we're just sort of
• 3:11:35
  seeing a version of it that that we would represent.
• 3:11:38
  I still don't think that's what it actually looks like.
• 3:11:41
  And that's a really scary idea. It is very, very boring this
• 3:11:45
  story because it's very serious. And I usually like Doctor Who
• 3:11:49
  Camp and funny and, you know, farm, Yeah, laugh a minute than
• 3:11:53
  this. But I really like this shit.
• 3:11:56
  So like, I want to put it through.
• 3:11:59
  So I'm pleased I'm 6 for six for the season.
• 3:12:02
  I'm smiling ear to it because I thought I was.
• 3:12:03
  Going to be the only alpha cut for plants I failed in my
• 3:12:06
  mission to be. Controversial.
• 3:12:08
  So we have put all. It's not often that happens, but
• 3:12:12
  all six stories are through. This is going to be a bit of an
• 3:12:15
  interesting battle now, I reckon.
• 3:12:17
  I don't think Planet of Evil is going to last long.
• 3:12:19
  Probably there are two of. Us for it depends.
• 3:12:21
  What he's up against, doesn't it?
• 3:12:22
  So QE camp music, Joe Camp music ago.
• 3:12:26
  Oh. This is 1 episode where I
• 3:12:27
  couldn't call what's going to win this mod count right, Let's
• 3:12:31
  spin. The wheel and we have Terror of
• 3:12:34
  the Zygons up against the Android invasion.
• 3:12:39
  I think that's probably going to be, what, an easy one?
• 3:12:43
  David Well, it's got to be terror of the.
• 3:12:47
  Zygons, isn't it? I think so.
• 3:12:49
  Damn. Yeah, terror of the Zygons.
• 3:12:52
  Joe. It.
• 3:12:53
  Was the best. Shag of my life, the Android.
• 3:12:55
  Invasion. Terror of the Zygons without a.
• 3:13:00
  Shadow of Without. Sorry, Joe.
• 3:13:03
  Android, in fact. I've still got the memories,
• 3:13:06
  don't worry. He's the. 1st to.
• 3:13:09
  Fall. Right, so we have next the brain
• 3:13:13
  of Morbius. Against pyramids of Mars.
• 3:13:18
  Interesting, interesting. Damn.
• 3:13:24
  Pyramids of Mars, David. Because.
• 3:13:29
  It has a stronger part 4. Brain of Morbius, Joe.
• 3:13:33
  Brain and Morbius. Every day.
• 3:13:35
  I'm Brain and Morbius for me. Pyramids falls apart and boy God
• 3:13:39
  that's it Tara second one to fall.
• 3:13:44
  OK, that's. A bit of a.
• 3:13:45
  Shocker, because that's the usual win.
• 3:13:48
  So Pyramids is out and we have Reign of Morbius again, and
• 3:13:54
  Morbius this time is up against planets of evil.
• 3:14:01
  David. Brain of Morbius.
• 3:14:04
  Dan. Yeah, Brain of Morbius.
• 3:14:07
  Joe. Yeah, Brain of Morbius.
• 3:14:09
  This time. I would.
• 3:14:12
  Be a contrary sod and go. For Plants of Evil, but Morbius
• 3:14:15
  takes us a Plants of Evil gets 4th possession 8.
• 3:14:19
  It's above pyramidism. In this very scientific way of
• 3:14:24
  eliminating things. So we're left with three real
• 3:14:26
  big hitters. Aren't we Zygons, Morbius and
• 3:14:29
  Seeds, which hasn't come up yet? So spin the wheel and it's
• 3:14:33
  brain. Of Morbius.
• 3:14:35
  Up against. Terror of the Saigon.
• 3:14:40
  Succeeds of Doom. Automatically is going through
• 3:14:44
  brain versus terror. I'll make it easy for me.
• 3:14:48
  Brain of Morbius David This is a tough one.
• 3:14:55
  They see it. Because you've got.
• 3:14:58
  Panfield on film, you've got all.
• 3:14:59
  That atmosphere. But you've got the cast in.
• 3:15:04
  Braid of Morbius says Braid of Morbius destroyed by a mindless.
• 3:15:10
  Brutes. Oh, come on down.
• 3:15:14
  Tear of the. Zygons, Nick, my way it is.
• 3:15:23
  Usually characters and you've got Marin and you've got Solemn,
• 3:15:30
  so it's going to be brain morbid.
• 3:15:32
  I'm afraid Cycons is going to fall.
• 3:15:35
  So we are. Left with the.
• 3:15:37
  Fine finale to end all finales. It is reign of Morbius against.
• 3:15:46
  I'm. Going to.
• 3:15:47
  Go first. I am keeping.
• 3:15:50
  Morbius because I think. Seeds of Doom has just got.
• 3:15:54
  I know I said that under reasons why I put it through, but I just
• 3:15:57
  think it is too problematic. And mainly even if I ignore the
• 3:16:01
  problematic bits that cop out of an ending we cannot put through
• 3:16:06
  a story's got such a a piss poor cop out ending.
• 3:16:09
  So it's not that bad a joke, Rod.
• 3:16:12
  It's going to be. Morbius for me.
• 3:16:18
  Everyone else goes silence. Damn.
• 3:16:21
  Seeds Ding. On the pace, David.
• 3:16:25
  I agree, really dull and stick with Brain and Morbius.
• 3:16:29
  Oh. No, I'm very.
• 3:16:30
  Rarely in the position of deciding the entire episode.
• 3:16:33
  Oh man. It's 10.
• 3:16:36
  Episodes of fucking gold, isn't it?
• 3:16:39
  Sarah are best brilliant actors, great action in Caesar, Doom,
• 3:16:43
  brilliant atmosphere and Brain and Morbius what I can put on
• 3:16:47
  right now, both of them fuck. The name is Dukar.
• 3:16:55
  Actually. Death, death, death.
• 3:16:57
  Oh my God, come on, you don't want your story to.
• 3:17:00
  End with some stock footage of an RAF fighter.
• 3:17:06
  Brain and Mobius. Brain and.
• 3:17:08
  Mobius wins, Morbius takes them. So Seeds is our second place and
• 3:17:14
  Brain and Morbius is our number one for season.
• 3:17:16
  What's the toughest call for me? Ever in this?
• 3:17:20
  Yeah. I think that, yeah.
• 3:17:22
  There's so much gold in 13, isn't that?
• 3:17:23
  And I think we have mined that gold aplenty tonight.
• 3:17:28
  Gentlemen, thank you very much indeed for your time.
• 3:17:31
  We have absolutely got a worthy winner for for that.
• 3:17:36
  Would you like to direct people? Where they can find?
• 3:17:38
  You online, David? Yes.
• 3:17:42
  This is the bit I. Always forget what my Twitter
• 3:17:43
  handle is. And then it's like, oh, OK, you
• 3:17:46
  can find me on Twitter X whatever we're calling it this
• 3:17:50
  month. And this is where, oh, you're Pi
• 3:17:53
  PI1. Nine.
• 3:17:55
  It took me 83, yeah. 83, yeah. It's Pi 188318831883 because 19.
• 3:18:03
  80. 3 was taken, so yes, I'm at Pi 1883 and you don't look that
• 3:18:08
  old David I feel. It sometimes.
• 3:18:11
  Is that when you was born 18? 83 he's looking for.
• 3:18:14
  No 1983. 1980. Three No.
• 3:18:18
  My God. What is your secret spectrox
• 3:18:20
  toxemia? Oh.
• 3:18:22
  Living a very quiet, very. Dull life until we came.
• 3:18:26
  Along. Until about until about 10.
• 3:18:29
  Years ago and then. Craziness happened, so I'm on
• 3:18:33
  there if the minutiae of random bits of Doctor Who by YouTube
• 3:18:39
  channel, which I usually promote on there, just finding the most
• 3:18:42
  obscure things, particularly from missing episodes in the
• 3:18:45
  60s. Come and find me there.
• 3:18:48
  I apologize. It is incredibly detailed at
• 3:18:51
  times, but I love it. I think you're talking to the
• 3:18:53
  right audience, David. And.
• 3:18:56
  Dan, I know people that. Salivate waiting.
• 3:18:58
  For your YouTube videos, you know, Yeah, he's downstairs.
• 3:19:02
  Right now you. And Terry Nation, Army.
• 3:19:04
  When those two turn up, that's it.
• 3:19:06
  All bets are off. I get nothing that night.
• 3:19:08
  I'm talking of salivating. Over to Dan.
• 3:19:12
  Yeah. I don't know where to go from
• 3:19:15
  there but. Yeah, yeah, I'm sort.
• 3:19:18
  Of kicking about. On social media, yeah, on
• 3:19:22
  Twitter it I'm yeah, I think more active on Twitter than
• 3:19:26
  anything else. So.
• 3:19:27
  And I think it's Devin, Dan O3. Yes, Yeah, I just talk.
• 3:19:34
  Nonsense. About Doctor Who.
• 3:19:36
  And sometimes I do illustrations of Doctor Who things and stick
• 3:19:41
  them on there. But yeah, that's where you'll
• 3:19:43
  find me. And of course, have you
• 3:19:45
  podcasted before? Pardon.
• 3:19:48
  Where else have you podcasted? You have.
• 3:19:52
  Done. I did an episode of Lost and
• 3:19:55
  Gallifrey before that wrapped up with with Luke Malloy.
• 3:20:00
  What else have I done? I've done kettle and and some
• 3:20:05
  string with with Dave Rennie. I've done what's in the box with
• 3:20:10
  with Jim Allenby. And a.
• 3:20:14
  Superb impression of the. Chief caretaker on a hamster?
• 3:20:16
  A blunt? Yes, you'll obviously have done
• 3:20:18
  hamster. As well.
• 3:20:19
  Yeah. So, yeah.
• 3:20:21
  And of course this. Team will be depending on when
• 3:20:24
  this podcast comes out or when the other podcast comes out.
• 3:20:28
  This team will be reuniting very shortly for a new book club plus
• 3:20:33
  Gareth Bowley. And I've got no clue really
• 3:20:36
  where you're all full with the books.
• 3:20:37
  So I cannot wait to sort of dig into this and see what you've
• 3:20:40
  read, what you have, and what your opinions are.
• 3:20:43
  I'll sort of know what you think, Rod.
• 3:20:44
  We'll have a few clashes here, I think.
• 3:20:46
  I think we probably and. Yeah, but the four of us?
• 3:20:50
  Plus the lovely Gareth Bowley as well.
• 3:20:53
  Fantastic. So we've got a worthy winner.
• 3:20:56
  Joe, next time we are also doing a cold, aloof, mysterious Dr.
• 3:21:02
  We're doing Series 8A with Peter Cole though.
• 3:21:06
  Oh. I quite like series eight.
• 3:21:08
  My God Series 8. You've got to think for a
• 3:21:10
  minute. I can.
• 3:21:10
  Endorse, but is it the half of the season I like?
• 3:21:14
  Well, we'll soon find out who's. On that one.
• 3:21:18
  Mark McManus. He loves Moffett.
• 3:21:20
  Oh, so does. He I've got no hope on that one.
• 3:21:23
  I may as well just go with the flow.
• 3:21:25
  Well, you usually do. That's what I've heard.
• 3:21:29
  OK, well. So.
• 3:21:31
  Let's just wrap it up then and thank our guests once again for
• 3:21:33
  giving fantastic insight into a brilliant season.
• 3:21:37
  And it just remains for us to say, until next time, keep
• 3:21:43
  Listen, Night night. You 2 went very quiet there.
• 3:22:27
  The. The.