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Practical Magic w/ Lizzie Logan · Everyone's A Critic

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to everyone's critics.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_00: The movie rated below 40% on Rotten Tomatoes.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_00: Tells us why critics got it wrong.
• 0:09
  SPEAKER_00: I'm your host, Yanit Co.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_00: 40% of Don't Fortune.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_00: Ten years later, it's the error of its way.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_00: I guess today is right to performer loaded.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_02: Hi, hello everyone.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_02: Happy to be here.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_02: Don't know what day it is where you guys are listening to it, but here in America, it's election day.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_02: And uh happy to be here.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_00: What a nice distraction this is today.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_02: Honestly, yes.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, I know at least one thing that I'm doing today.
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_02: That I mean, worst case scenario for between us is not that bad.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_02: Like it's gonna be fine.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_00: We need I needed something to distract me today.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_00: I when I sent when I um gave you the date and I was like, do you want to do this one?
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't even think about it being the day of the election, and you're like, Yes, I need a distraction.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I was like, that would be I don't know.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's always good to have plans to to anchor yourself in the rest of the world.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_00: I kind of think the worst thing about it though is I'm I'm like the second we finish this, I'm probably gonna turn on the news again.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_02: I don't even I mean, probably.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_02: I have play I'm going over to my dad's tonight and we're gonna like watch CNN and eat sandwiches, but I'm not gonna know anything for a couple days, so it's kind of like a fake election day.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_02: Like it's yeah.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, still vote, but yeah.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_00: And you were saying before that you do you do mail and ballot every time.
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I was saying so.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_02: I was registered in San Francisco, but living in Los Angeles during the first um presidential election that I was like eligible for.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_02: So I went online and I got a uh I like registered for mail and ballot, and they like send a thing to your house, and my dad picked it up or whatever.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_02: But one of the options was to become a permanent vote-by-mail voter.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_02: And I don't know why everyone doesn't do that because it's so easy.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_02: I've been doing that for 10 years, and it they just always I don't have to remember the primaries, they just send me a ballot, and then I just go online, I look up a progressive voting guide, and I fill it out, and it's so easy, and I don't know why everyone doesn't do that.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_00: They make it so hard for you as well, though.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I I at least here I'm uh like a three-minute walk from my polling station.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_00: I walk in and out, and that's it.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_00: I'm done in about a minute.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_02: I have no idea where my polling station is.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_02: Um yeah, I we should have automatic voter registration and not purge the registries, but I keep telling Congress and they don't listen to me.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_00: Well, let's see what happens with this one.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_02: And then maybe fingers crossed.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_02: I wrote some letters.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like I did my vote for it.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, did you?
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_00: Nice.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_02: I did my vote forward, I adopted my five letters, so Oh, that's cool.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, maybe.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_02: They were all in Florida, so if Florida goes blue, I can claim a little bit of credit.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_02: And if not, then I didn't do anything.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_00: Well, it's just it's certainly a possibility.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_02: I have had ever since the 2000 election, which I don't know as a non-American, you're familiar with, but Oh, I'm f I'm very familiar with that one.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_02: I have had a grudge against Florida ever since I was a child, and it was my first like um exposure to, you know, maybe this country is corrupt in ways that are like significant.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_02: And I it just all came down to Florida, and I was like, well, fuck that state.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I don't yeah.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so I'm still a little bit bitter towards which is not fair.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_02: There's I'm sure a lot of really good people who live in Florida, but too bad.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_02: I hate your whole state and probably always well, how are you doing other than outside of today?
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_00: How are you doing?
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I'm alright.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_02: I'm staying at my mom's right now, so I've had a lot of quality mom time.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_02: And um uh going back to New York probably next week.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_02: And um yeah, just kind of taking it day by day, taking it easy.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_02: My family is uh all healthy, so I'm very grateful for that.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_02: Trying not to complain because the big thing that is bad is not happening to my people.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_02: Not that I'm not not that I have no empathy for the people it is happening to, but I'm not gonna sit here and cry about the state of the world when other people have, you know, real problems.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_02: Um so I would say, yeah, I'm doing like a solid B, B to B plus.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_00: That's good.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_00: Are you?
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_00: That's good for this time.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_00: I I would say, yeah.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_00: I'm a I'm hovering around there right now.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_00: I like uh we are we are about to go into our second lockdown on um Thursday.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm like jealous of that though, because that is just like a baseline level of competency to even do that.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_02: Like, we should have done that.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_00: No, but he did come out and say that he exhausted every single option before that.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_00: So I I kind of I'm also kind of like, no, you you didn't.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, what are the options?
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_02: Just like contact tracing.
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_00: I mean they they tried to do it, but they they did they gave us some like app for contact tracing and it was just and it was it just hasn't worked.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't work.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I don't know.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_02: I've been watching um in addition to Twitter, I think my uh the way that I check in with your your home is every Friday they do an episode of the Great British Fake Off, and they're always NHS and stuff, so now I I feel a lot of fondness towards the NHS.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_02: Having never availed myself of their services, but y'all seem to like it, therefore I like it.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we love the NHS.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: That was the clapping every every week for it at one of the.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_02: I know, and then we did that even though we don't have I mean it was just for nurses, which is nice, but yeah.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: And then just like one day it just stopped, and I don't know why it just came out of nowhere, just and it just ended.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_02: Well, yeah, I mean we sort of had the same thing in New York where it was like a solid three months of like on your neighbors, do this, do that, and then you know, very understandably, like um police brutality became like the thing we were all talking about, which I have no I'm not saying one's more or less important than the other, but it was crazy how quickly we were like, and the nurse thanking is over, we're on to the next thing.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, it would have been cool to have like a little bit of both, but we can kind of only handle one like issue at a time.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_00: I know.
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_00: It was a lot to handle though as well.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_00: It was a lot.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_00: The summer was a lot.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: It's been a it's been a weird year, to put it lightly.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_00: But anyway, let's talk about something fun.
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_00: Let's talk about the movie.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_00: You you've come on the podcast to talk about the movie Practical Magic.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_02: Directed by Griffin Dunn.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_02: Um based on the novel by Alice Hoffman, which I've read and sort of remember.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_00: Cool, because I have no idea.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't know anything about this movie before I watched it today.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_00: What I'm I I mixed it up with another Sandra Bullock movie, which was while you were sleeping.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_00: I th I thought it was just a standard rom-com.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_02: Although, I mean, while you were sleeping is like a cute, good movie, but well, I there are I didn't know what it was.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't know it's about the search for love.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_02: Um kind of.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_02: What did you think going into it completely blind?
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_02: Were you just like, why are these women doing this?
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_00: So I I did read the synopsis before I sat down sit sat down and watched it, but I was really confused.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, oh wait, Nicole Kidman's in this.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, um, this is actually a w a movie about witches.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_00: I d I just didn't realise.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_00: And what did you think?
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_00: Were you like I just thought it was gonna be a rom com just a typical rom com.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_00: And it's I should have guessed it from the title.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_01: It's about magic, yeah.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, maybe magic.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's very literal.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um what is your history like that?
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, okay, let me let me go for the uh synopsis first before anyone hasn't seen it.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, and then we'll go into your your background of it.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_00: So it's a a movie about a uh a family of witches and uh these two girls that are witches, and they go they move in with their uh it's it's their aunts, isn't it, that they move in with.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_00: So they move in after their parents die, and they um they move in with them and uh they're raised in this like small island place.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um it's never clear where it is, but it's just somewhere in America, but it's like an island.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_02: I a little bit was on the lookout for that.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_02: They definitely they sort of allude to it being near Salem with like witch trials, and then the one thing is that when you'll get to this, one sister has to take a flight to go rescue the other sister, she's gonna fly out of Logan, which there's no reason you would know this, but that's the big airport in Boston.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_02: So we are firmly in New England.
• 10:08
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it does kind of have that New England feel to it.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_02: So I was just like, it's a it's I would I would put money on it being in Massachusetts.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_00: I thought it could be like somewhere around my thought was it was like somewhere around Maine.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_02: Those are right next to each other.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_02: That's all these places are very small and close together.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, just because I know people from like islands in Maine as well.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_01: Oh swanky.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_00: Really?
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um But they so basically they grow up in this small area and there's this whole thing of like the family have a curse on the uh there's a curse where um they cast this spell to like so women the women that in the family will um never uh so whoever they who whatever man they fall in love with that man will die at some like early on.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_02: Just like before his time, I guess.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I guess before his time.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, just quite young.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_00: And so one of them is like, oh I'm never gonna fall in love, and then one of them is like, oh, I really want love.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_00: And then they grow up and it's about the stuff that happens there.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_00: I guess that's kind of like the beginning of it, and then we can go we'll go into the like details.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_00: But what am I have I missed out anything really important?
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, they're like a little bit known in their community for being witches, and they're like outcasts.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_00: But it's not that like the they're kind of known for it, but they're not that the the rest of the public don't entirely believe it.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_00: They're kind of like not sure.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_02: There's a scene at the beginning where um like a local woman comes to the aunts because she like wants a love spell and she pays for it, but it's not like they don't have like a bustling business, it's sort of a word of mouth, a word of mouth um witch practice.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_00: I actually I kind of wish that had come back as well, because that didn't come back at all.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_00: And it and they said they say to her, like, be careful what you wish for.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_00: I know that I thought, oh, something's gonna happen here.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_02: I wish that as well.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_02: There was definitely a lot, I didn't get too far into the like making of, but I feel like there was a lot left on the cutting room floor because there's a lot of voiceover to like stitch scenes together.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_02: And there's a fair amount of ADR, which is like dialogue you record after.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_02: Like there's a couple scenes where you can see that someone's talking, but there's no dialogue, and I they clearly cut it.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, interesting.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_00: I missed that completely.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_02: I can only actually think of one scene where that happens, but it it didn't um like damage the movie watching experience for me.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_02: Like I didn't mind it, but it did make me think that probably someone had like fucked around in editing.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_02: And I will say they all of those things, um, like the nature of magic is a little bit more explored in the book, and they definitely have um you see like that character who at the beginning is like, I want a love spell.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_02: She, I remember from the book.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_02: She's one of the few parts I remember where Oh, she's in it.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, she gets it's I mean, or a woman like her, where it's like you get this guy to fall in love with you, and then he just like follows her around for 40 years and she hates it.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_02: Basically, the whole thing is that like it's very much about like careful what you wish for.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_02: Um but they don't, yeah, they didn't I don't know if they just didn't have the budget or whatever, but that woman, we do not see consequences to that in the movie.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_00: Well, one funny thing I read about I I read like a couple of bits of trivia on it, and one of them was that um Nicole Kidman had just come off of Eyes Wide Shut, and so um Sandra Bullock was going and doing like two or three takes and fine.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_00: Whereas Nicole Kidman had having just come off of that movie, was used to doing like 70 or 80 takes for each scene, and Bullock was so teased.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_00: So I I wonder if there was like they just wasted so much time that they ran out of they they and used up all their budget on like too many takes.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_02: Oh maybe.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_02: That's such a crazy.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, she is so intense in this movie and really good, I thought.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_02: Like the scene, we're now getting into spoilers too.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I assume people are listening to it.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_00: We're gonna talk about it.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_02: The scene where she's possessed by her ex-boyfriend, and you think that it's her, and then she just gives a look, and you can tell that she's like, ooh, this is acting.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_02: This is Nicole at her, I wouldn't say peak, she's still very good, but I was like, she's pulling out all the stops right now.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think she's definitely better than Sandra Bullock, who kind of like coasts through this movie and doesn't really do a whole lot.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_02: No, I hers is more the like, and I think it's good casting because Sandra Bullock in every movie she's ever been in, I think has just come across as like so responsible and so reasonable, and so she's the practical half, and Nicole's the magic half, and together practical magic.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_00: Now I understand the toilet.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's all coming together.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_02: Um, yeah, she's very much the like, she's not quite as fun, but she's so I can talk about this part of like why I love this movie.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_02: She's so good at being in love and like just like looking.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_02: There's so many shots of her just standing by a sunset, looking at a boy, and just loving him.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_02: And I every single time it happens, I'm happy.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just like, this is what life should be, and it all just being and every woman in this movie has so much hair, and they're just standing there with their hair, and it's beautiful.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_02: I love it.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_00: So let's get into let's get into then.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_00: What is your history with this movie?
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_00: Like when do you remember when you first saw it?
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_02: Not specifically.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_02: I remember when I was very young, I think we had it on VHS.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, possibly it was just on TV a lot.
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_02: Because I had seen it a few times in my youth.
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and the thing that I like really, really remembered was just the scene at the end where they jump off the roof.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_02: Um I can see that being a very memorable scene.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, well, it was also like if you're a kid, that's like the one that looks the most fun.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_02: And it's also the only part where like the little kid characters get to do magic.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_02: Um, yeah.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_02: So, which that little red-haired girl is Evan Rachel Wood.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_00: I know.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_00: I was so surprised.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_02: Good cast in this movie.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_02: Margot Martindale's in this movie.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_00: Uh there's so many random people in it.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_02: So many good people.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_02: Um yeah, so that was my, and I just remembered thinking like, oh, so it was that, and I had a very distinct memory of when Sandra Bullock blows the candle on.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_02: Um which I still love and think is such a just I assume that they just had her blow out a candle and then played that footage in reverse.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it has to be.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_02: But it's still such a genius.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, I can't maybe someone has.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_02: I can't believe no one had ever used that before because it's such a great little moment.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_02: Um so I I remember that.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_02: I had like a vague memory of when they dance around to Lyman the Coconut, and there's like a black cat, and we had black cats growing up.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_02: I have a black cat now.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_02: So I was just like, yeah, this movie, I like it.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_02: And then I think probably I didn't watch it all through middle school or high school, and then maybe toward the end of college, I was like, Oh, I should, I should go back and watch.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I went back and I watched Practical Magic, and then like a couple years out of college, I read the book.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um, okay.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_02: And I sort of started because you know, when you're a kid, you don't really have like a critical brain.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_02: You just either like something you don't, you don't think of things as like good or bad.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and I think, yeah, so then when I rediscovered it, I was like, this movie's good.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_02: And then I like was like, oh, people don't really like this.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_02: This movie's not very well reviewed.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_02: But everyone I know who's seen it has liked it.
• 18:45
  SPEAKER_02: Possibly till today.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know if you liked it.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I was gonna say, like, the so you said like everyone likes it and then the crit the critics don't.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_00: So on Rotten Tomatoes, it's 22% from the critics, but it's 73% from the audience.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_00: Which is so different.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_02: Cause it's because I mean I don't have I haven't like sat down and looked at exactly what people did or did not like about it.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_02: Critics, I mean.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_02: But I will say, like, to me, this movie is operating on it doesn't make a ton of logical sense.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_02: It makes emotional sense.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_02: And like all of the beats and all of the turns are very like okay.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_02: This is so I'm gonna be slightly like nerdy and weird for a sec.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_01: It's fine.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_02: In Our Intend Why You Um in like a film class I took, they showed us the sequence from I guess it's Batman Returns or Batman Forever, one of the Keaton ones, the one with Michelle.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_02: Anyway, when Michelle Pfeiffer becomes Catwoman, there's no explanation given.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_02: Have you seen this movie?
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_02: There's no explanation given for why she has like some super powers or anything.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_02: She falls out a window, instead of dying, she lands among a bunch of cats, and then when she sort of comes to, she's just catwoman.
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_02: And they sort of explained how it's like you don't have to convince the audience intellectually why that would happen.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_02: Because Tim Burton has set up a world in which, like, these are the rules and the aesthetics and the performances all sort of serve to just take you on this journey that it just makes sense emotionally.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_02: Like in the sort of like reptile part of our brains, we get that she is now reborn as Catwoman and we don't need to know why.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_02: And to me, practical magic works the exact same way.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_02: Where it's like, if you kill someone, like, okay, what why would the spell to bring him back works, but then you hit him over the pan with a head, but now he can haunt you?
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_02: It's like because he's your ex-boyfriend and that's what ex-boyfriends do.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I don't, I don't care if it makes sense intellectually.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_02: Like, this whole movie for me is just like, yeah, it's like operating in the like like weird, like spooky part of my brain where it I don't know, like that to me is what maybe people could have missed is if they went in expecting, I don't know, maybe like you did, like a straightforward rom-com or like a um, I don't know, even like a Harry, which hadn't come out at that point, but like a Harry Potter where it's like very clear what the rules are.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, no, this is like it's directed by Griffin Dunn, but it's this is kind of like a Tim Burton movie where it's like you just kind of have to go with it that like like who cares why Edward has scissor hands?
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_02: Like who cares why the magic works this way?
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_02: Like it just does.
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that makes.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_02: Sense but that's my theory, is that it operates on Catwoman rules.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, yeah, I I I will say up front, I I liked all the magic stuff in it and I enjoyed all that.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't like the rom romcom aspect to it.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_02: Interesting, interesting.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think that side of it worked for me.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_02: The whole thing where it's like Aiden Quinn, will they, won't they?
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, because it to me that they didn't touch on it enough, and it kind of just went she likes him, and suddenly they're in like they're like obsessed with each other, and obviously, like that's part of the magic of it, but they don't know anything about each other.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, you mean the first guy, her husband?
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_00: No, no, no, I'm fine with that.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, Aiden Quinn.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, they're in she summoned him with her spell as a child.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_00: But like, so he's drawn to her and she's drawn to him.
• 22:59
  unknown: Yep.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_00: And that's it.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, but she's uh suspect in a murder case, and he is investigating it.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_02: These are complications.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_00: To me, that that's it, that's the part that didn't work to me.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_00: I I but I did really like I love the relationship of the two sisters.
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_00: I think they're great together.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, I think they were a dynamite pair.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_02: I will say the one part where it kind of because I hadn't until last night watched this movie in a couple years.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_02: And so I was like, I guess another thing that critics didn't like was that it like shifts tones very rapidly, where there will be like happy scenes followed by like very intense sad scenes.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_02: Again, that didn't bother me um so much as like the whole time the magic is kept on this very like um I'd say like a spooky level, like there's weird circumstances, and like the moon looks funny, and then like there's poisons and stuff.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_02: And so then the one thing where like the ghost like just pops out of Nicole Kidman, where it's like where I was like, Oh, you did slightly lose me there when it went to the like full supernatural aspect, yeah.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_02: And the whole fight with the ghost where his little badge, like I again, like that was I didn't hate it, but it didn't work for me.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_02: And then once they went back to like operating on like a more symbolic level, that yeah, that was where I was happy.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_00: So let let's go through from the beginning then and we'll talk about as it goes along.
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_00: Great.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so it opens with um a scene of like um from like 200 years ago, and it's supposed to be like kind of like Salem, like you said, and um it's and there's a voiceover of one of them saying the Owens women uh were blamed for over 200 years Blamed?
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_00: Is that saying blamed?
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, blamed.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_00: So I I made loads of notes and just rushed through them.
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_01: I made a little bit of notes.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_00: Oh nice.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_00: You made fancier notes than me.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_02: No, I just wrote Goodbye Earl because that's a Dixie Chick song about murdering um a man because he uh hits a woman, and I that also happens in this movie, and I think that it's justified every single time.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then yeah, they're they're blamed for two they're like targeted up for two over over 200 years for being being witches and everyone hates them, supposedly.
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_00: And there's then like one of the Owens is like being about to be like uh hung or hanged, um sorry, about to be hanged, and um as she's about to be hanged, she like uh casts some magic and the rope breaks and she like lands on her feet.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_00: And then um so she's given the gift of magic.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then she casts a spell of that she would never again feel the agony of love.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_00: Which is sad.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_02: It's sad, but it see that to me is just like a heightened version of like things that uh I can imagine a person doing.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I can imagine it happening.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_00: I just like I think it's sad.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_02: It is sad.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_02: But they break the curse.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um but then the this curse is supposed to be just read for her, but it like uh descends down through the Owens line and it goes to like every woman in the family.
• 26:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then you find out about um the uh death watch beetle.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_02: Which is the beetle that you hear when your man is about to die.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_00: And um they tell they tell the kids like uh keep working on your sp so the two kids go to live with the aunts at this point.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_02: So it's little some little red-haired girl and Camilla Bell, who was a thing for a sack.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know who that is.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_02: She was an actress.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_02: I would say she's primarily, well I would say the thing she's second most famous for was that she was in these ads for Verowang Princess, which was a perfume.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_02: And the thing she's probably most famous for is that Joe Jonas uh dated her either right after he dated Taylor Swift, and so there is a Taylor Swift song about her.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_02: Um that is not very nice, and to her credit, I don't think Taylor plays it anymore because it's it's a little bit, it's just a very teenager song that's kind of means fitting.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_02: But fun fact that's little young Camilla Bell playing young Sandra Bullock.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_00: That's actually quite interesting.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_02: These are your Taylor Swift fun facts from Lizzie Logan.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_00: But the fun the actually, one funny thing is I can imagine like Taylor Swift songs playing over this movie if it came out today.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_02: Uh yeah, because are we I mean are we gonna talk about the soundtrack?
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_02: Because the soundtrack's so good.
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_02: We got Faith Hill, we got Stevie Nicks, we got Joni Mitchell, hits all hits.
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_00: There's a lot of songs on this in the on the soundtrack.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_02: It's beautiful.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_02: I love it.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_00: But they're all very short.
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_00: They're all like they're all like you may be 30 seconds of each one of them you get.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I I think one of the things, yeah, I I made a note to myself, like everything that you just said that happens happens.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_02: I think in the first six minutes of the movie, like they burn through plot in this movie.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_02: They just rocket straight through the years.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_02: Um, we don't have time for full songs and that's we're we're hitting beats and moving on.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_00: And also it's like a what is it, like an hour 45, an hour fifty, something like that.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_02: It's not it's not terribly long, which I appreciate.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_00: No, yeah, it's not long, it's not short either.
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_02: Um it's the correct length.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't feel like feel long.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_02: A lot happens.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_02: No, no, no.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_02: Not boring.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_00: No, no, it's not boring.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_00: A lot happens.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_00: That's what that's the other thing.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_00: That there is a lot that happens.
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_00: I've I've read a paragraph of what happens.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_02: And we're like fully six minutes into the movie at this point.
• 29:28
  unknown: Yeah.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um so the girls go, they move in with the aunts, they're told to like um keep working on your spells.
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then that woman shows up and asks for like um asks for that's the spell of love to uh for that guy to be ups uh to to be interested in her.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_00: And so the girls are like sitting on the staircase watching the aunts perform the spell on this woman.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_00: And then the aunts say, like, I'll be careful what you wish for.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, and the woman is very distressed, and I think it's her agony that really impresses upon the young girl.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, like definitely.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's less about the aunt's warning and more about like this woman is just out of her mind because she's into some married dude.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_02: Um little baby Nicole Kidman's like, wow, uh I'm attracted to intensity because I have that kind of personality.
• 30:21
  SPEAKER_02: That that looks really good.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_02: And little Sandra Bullock is very type A, and she's like, that doesn't look good at all.
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_02: I want to keep my wits about me.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_02: I don't want to fall in love.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_00: So are they in the book, um, are they like kind of similar personality types of like type A and like type and like kind of wild?
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_02: I think so.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_02: I wish I remembered the book better because it's also there's a prequel now, which I do want to read.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_02: Um but the book is a lot more I would say it's maybe like less character driven, and it's more of like an overview of all of these women and their various spells that they do, um and the way that like they intersect with other people in their community.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_02: Interesting.
• 31:10
  SPEAKER_02: Um but it's yeah, the the the sisters are the focal point.
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um so I've I wrote down one of them casts a love spell.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_00: I don't remember if if that's the girls casting a love spell or not the sisters.
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, she does the thing with the flowers.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_02: And this to me, again, was like such a I mean, maybe young boys do this too, but like that was such a girl thing where like you would sit around talking about your perfect guy and all of the different traits he would have, where it would be like, oh yeah, I want a guy who's like tall and has this color hair and does this for a job, and does like when I find a boyfriend, he'll be like this.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, Yeah, if I were a baby witch, I would a hundred percent cast a spell being like, he's got one blue eye and one green eye, and he can what are the things?
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_02: He's got one blue eye and one green eye, he can ride a horse backwards, he can flip a pancake, and he like hears her song or whatever, which then comes back with the letter in a yeah, like a symbolic way.
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_02: And then I'll let you get back to the recap, but she's it's operating on a few levels because on the one hand, she's like clearly a little baby romantic because she's inventing this perfect guy, but she also thinks she's outsmarting love because she's like, I'll come up with this guy who doesn't exist, and then that way uh I won't fall in love with someone, and then he won't die because they're all scared from scarred, scared, scarred, whatever, from their parents dying.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_02: Again, like the the mom dies of a broken heart, which like isn't a real thing, but feels like a real thing, and so I accept it.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_00: I've I have heard that that can be a real thing, like traumatically, you can die from that.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_02: So well, there you go.
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_02: This movie is cracked.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so then it cuts to them as adults, and um Gillian, Nicole Kidman's character, is running away with a man.
• 33:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um, she's like throwing her like she's she's running away to like be with him, but then she's like and um she makes a blood pact with Sally that they're gonna stay with each other and she'll come back and everything.
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yep, they're gonna grow old together.
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_00: They're gonna grow old together, yeah.
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_02: As and as cat ladies, as she reverses, I would say that is a big part of why the world of this movie appealed to me, is there's just like when they're very young, there's like a little black kitten, and then when you see them older, there's a black, there's just the cats just always around, and I just always think there should be cats around.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_02: So I was like, these people know how to live.
• 33:51
  SPEAKER_02: Like, and they eat chocolate cake for breakfast.
• 33:54
  SPEAKER_03: I was like, this is yeah, 100% the lifestyle for me.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_02: That's what she says to them.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I was like, they drink margarites at midnight, they don't brush their teeth, they eat cake all the time, and they just hang out with cats.
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, that's a perfect world.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and then um uh they it cuts to like a um a little bit of time later, and um they find they get like a postcard from her or a letter or whatever, and she's like finds out they've you find out she's been dating like multiple men, and so she can't really, she's not settling down at all, she's just like going from man to man.
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_02: Um she's exploring the world and dating her way through it.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_00: And at that moment, uh Sally eyes up this guy who's just like she doesn't know, uh, but they seem to know everyone seems to know each other and she doesn't know him, and he doesn't know her, but they like look at they give each other a glance.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_02: He's the town apple seller, which I think is such a cute job.
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_00: That's all we learn about him though, as well.
• 34:54
  SPEAKER_00: He's a good dad, seems like seems nice, he seems seems friendly.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then as soon as she's like working in the garden, and she like jumps up and like runs runs to him at one point, and and all the dogs follow her.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and he looks up, and you you realize it's actually like later on down the line because they kiss immediately.
• 35:17
  SPEAKER_00: And um, or do you think it's like straight away?
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_02: They're being bewitched.
• 35:22
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, the aunts have like cast a spell that they will like wake up and be hot for each other, and so I think that that's like their second interaction, and then it cuts the they're just they're married three years later.
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, essentially, and they've got kids, and they've got two little girls, yeah.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_00: And meanwhile, J uh Jillian is partying with all these men, including Jimmy Angeloff, a a guy from somewhere near Transylvania.
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and they call it out, they're like, he's a Dracula cowboy, and I was like, Yeah, yeah, he's a he's a bad dude.
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_00: See, I thought that whole like Dracula sort of theme would come back as well.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_00: It's no I thought that's what they were going for.
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_02: He's a metaphorical vampire, kind of sucking the life out of them, but he there's no like he's an emotional vampire.
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, he's an emotional vampire, but there's no like I feel like if this movie were made today, they would be like, in the third act, Aiden Quinn has to be a werewolf, where it's like like nope, there's just witches and normal people, and we don't need to explain like the rest of the world.
• 36:35
  SPEAKER_00: But um, yeah, uh Sally, um Sandra Bullock's character overhears the Beatle uh Death Watch Beetle start making the noise.
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_00: So she like drags, she's like lifting up all the wood, trying to find it.
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_00: She's like, Oh, where is it?
• 36:49
  SPEAKER_00: Where is it?
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_00: At that moment, um, he's pushing his apples down in his car, and all these bikes come rushing past.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_00: It's like a race and manages to survive, but then suddenly a truck comes out of nowhere and hits him and and he dies.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_02: And you just see the apples go flying, yeah.
• 37:09
  SPEAKER_00: You see the apples go flying through the air like a like a 70s cop movie.
• 37:13
  SPEAKER_02: That or you know, it really reminded me maybe just because like of apples to me at that point it was operating on like Twilight Rules.
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_02: Like, um, I don't know.
• 37:25
  SPEAKER_02: That movie also operates with its own logic.
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_00: What do you mean by Twilight Rules there?
• 37:32
  SPEAKER_02: Like, have you seen the film Twilight?
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I've seen the first one.
• 37:37
  SPEAKER_00: I can't remember it too much.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_02: It just takes place in a very small town where it sort of seems like nothing dramatic would ever happen, but every single time something could happen, the most dramatic thing happens.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_02: Like if someone forgets to put on their parking brake one time, someone will get hit by a car and just explode.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_02: And so that to me like, yeah, like when you're trying to raise the stakes on like a love story, like you just die one day.
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um But but also here the other thing is it's like so I have a question about this.
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_00: Go ahead.
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_00: Is he supposed to die purely to get him out of the way because of um because the love spell is still in place?
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_01: What do you mean the love spell is awful?
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_00: So that her love's her love spell that she casts as a child is in place already.
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_00: So does that like counteract what the aunts have put into place and that's why he dies?
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_02: No, he dies because of the curse, because she loves him.
• 38:37
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, right, okay.
• 38:39
  SPEAKER_00: He does die because of the curse.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_02: Because that's what the aunts say.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_02: They're like, we didn't think well, like we thought they thought that they were also outsmarting the curse because they were like, we'll have you, and you'll be happy, and you'll be in this like spell love, but it won't be real love, so the curse won't come get him, but then she loves him for real.
• 38:59
  SPEAKER_02: And so then that's that's the curse, is she got to be super happy, and uh the nice apple boy died of it.
• 39:10
  SPEAKER_00: But she immediately wants to bring him back, and they because they there's a spell that you can bring back the dead, but they say, like the aunt say, Oh no, you can't we can't do it because even though we could do it technically, he won't be the Michael that you know, he'll be some like awful version of it.
• 39:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um so at that moment, but so she just decides not to do it, and she goes into like this very sad kind of feeling she's like sleeping in bed all day and not leaving.
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_02: Uh that's called depression.
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_02: Um I know what she is, but she's very sad and sleepy, and her husband's dead, so she's pretty depressed.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 39:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 39:56
  SPEAKER_00: She is depressed and not doing anything.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_00: And in the meantime, Gillian is with Jimmy, and she's to get him to like sleep, she puts um what they call it, Belladono, isn't it?
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_02: I think that she puts into which I think is a real plant, but she has it in crystal form.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_02: So who knows?
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_00: So she puts it inside his uh tequila bottles, uh, because that's what he drinks, and uh to get him to just like calm down and sleep, which is weird, awful that she has to do that to him because he's such an awful person.
• 40:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I it's again sort of like a not to victim blame, but it's a little bit of that like careful what you wish for thing where it's like she went out looking for attention from guys and she got way more than she could handle, where it's like this guy who wants to like talk to her and fuck her all the time and she can't even sleep, so then she's to like poison slash drug him, and then it turns out that he's not just obnoxious, but pretty evil.
• 40:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um and I wrote down at this point, like she smokes so much in this, and I realize it comes back later on, but like she was every scene she's in so far, she's been smoking.
• 41:11
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, well, she's living life on the edge.
• 41:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's just very noticeable because considering you don't see it as much in movies now, it's very noticeable.
• 41:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, in 1998, if you were a bad girl in a movie, you smoked a cigarette and you wore a crop top, and that's what she's doing.
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_00: Uh but at this point I wrote out, I also wrote down there's a weird, weird vibe to this movie, which is what you touched on earlier, with what the critic critics didn't like so much.
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um I felt like it was kind of like balancing between serious and comedic, and it didn't quite have its footing.
• 41:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I mean this is like such a longer discussion, but I feel like it almost came.
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_02: Did you see Aetanya?
• 41:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so there's a lot of like like bitter comedy in that where it's like her boyfriend's beating her and she's just like doing quippy asides to the camera.
• 42:11
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and a lot of people after that movie were like, you shouldn't make jokes about this abusive relationship.
• 42:18
  SPEAKER_02: But which is a good point, yeah.
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_02: But there's also this weird like reaction people have to like, oh, if you have any amount of violence in a movie, we must immediately turn it into like an after school special where we all learn a lesson or something.
• 42:38
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, I feel like you can my hope is that you can like trust the audience to like know that this dude is bad, even if we're having a funny scene that he's in.
• 42:50
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 42:51
  SPEAKER_02: And that like this happens to, you know, unfortunately, like a lot obviously most women I don't think are witches, but like a lot of women like victims of abuse.
• 43:02
  SPEAKER_02: And it's like, and sometimes there's also funny things that happen in the course of dealing with that, and like so I don't know.
• 43:10
  SPEAKER_02: I I feel like maybe critics felt like it was their duty to like point out that this movie tried to have a comedy scene right after a sad thing where me watching it, I'm just like, yeah, I get him, and then the next scene is a comedy scene, like that it just doesn't bother me because I'm like, I also I also think knowing the ending helps because I'm like, Yeah, he's he he get he gets his and Nicole's fine.
• 43:36
  SPEAKER_02: So like like if this is a movie that ended with him killing her, I would be like, How dare you make a joke along the way?
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_02: But she totally gets him at the end, so I'm like, yeah, she can make her little quips and like they can have like a funny sister scene in the middle of it.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I guess that's true, yeah.
• 43:54
  SPEAKER_00: It just felt kind of yeah, to me, it just felt like there was two there were two tones and And it was kind of kind of like trying to find it.
• 44:04
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it was trying to find which one it wanted, and it didn't it wasn't getting there at at this point for me.
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um this is also quite early on in it, so.
• 44:14
  SPEAKER_00: Um she opened but but um Sally opens her store that she she'd planned to open with her with Michael, her husband.
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_00: Uh and it's some kind of like um champ oil, shampoo, kind of.
• 44:29
  SPEAKER_02: She calls it botanicals, which I think just to me it's like the like Puritan New England version of like lush or like yeah body weight.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_00: Very much so.
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_02: Like she makes like organic soap.
• 44:42
  SPEAKER_02: There's oh, that's another thing I remember from the book is that they have the aunts make this black soap that's supposed to protect you, and you're supposed to wash with the black soap like at least once a week.
• 44:53
  SPEAKER_02: Um and that's like a very big thing in the book, is like every time Gillian's doing something crazy, they're like, we gotta send her this black soap, and she's gotta use the black soap.
• 45:03
  SPEAKER_02: And they don't have the black soap in the um movie, but they do have other soaps.
• 45:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, all they have is this like it's just like this very clean white shop.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 45:16
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like it's all the bottles that you can't, all the bottles are like clear liquids in them that you see.
• 45:22
  SPEAKER_00: It's very minimalist.
• 45:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's so minimalist.
• 45:26
  SPEAKER_00: And so even though when that guy comes in later, he's just like, uh okay, I'm yeah, he's fun of how expensive everything is.
• 45:36
  SPEAKER_02: Um why did I spend$14 on shampoo?
• 45:39
  SPEAKER_02: But that's also sort of her little witchy.
• 45:42
  SPEAKER_02: I think there's some guy who comes in for something, I think that'll make his hair grow, or that'll make something, and then he's not like reference to his pubes or something.
• 45:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I don't I didn't totally catch what that was.
• 45:55
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I don't I didn't get it what she was.
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_00: But it was like your power.
• 45:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's her little witchy thing that she does for extra cash, I think.
• 46:05
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
• 46:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 46:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um but then you find out she still wants love and she still wants to like meet someone which is nice.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_00: She still wants she's still ready to like go out and fall in love again.
• 46:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um and Gillian calls up and she says, uh, I I need to I need you, Sally, I need you to come here.
• 46:31
  SPEAKER_00: So she goes, she flies out to see her.
• 46:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then you find her in a hotel, in like a motel sort of situation, and she's like um hiding behind the bed, and she's like been beaten up by um Jimmy.
• 46:44
  SPEAKER_00: And so they like grab all their stuff, they go to run, and at that moment um Gillian realizes she's missing her like sp tiger.
• 46:53
  SPEAKER_00: So tiger eye stone, yeah.
• 46:55
  SPEAKER_00: Tiger eye.
• 46:56
  SPEAKER_00: And so she goes to get it from her car, and uh and Jimmy is hiding in the car and grabs her and kidnaps them both.
• 47:04
  SPEAKER_02: Anytime you I mean, you can't fault movies for being movies, they have to do this stuff, but like it's such a cliche.
• 47:14
  SPEAKER_02: Men popping up from the backseat of a car, check the backseat of your car.
• 47:18
  SPEAKER_02: No, always, you know.
• 47:21
  SPEAKER_02: I just recently re-watched Veronica Mars.
• 47:23
  SPEAKER_02: There's this very iconic moment where a guy pops up from the backseat of a car and that just uh word to the wise, check the backseat of your car for dastardly men.
• 47:37
  SPEAKER_02: Um whenever you can.
• 47:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um and so like she so they're all they've been kidnapped, and they make he makes Sally drive them.
• 47:48
  SPEAKER_00: Uh and at and then uh Gillian mouths to Sally that there's the um the Belladonna in her bag.
• 47:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, well they use their little witchy powers because it's like she like Oh is it a is it like a telepathic thing?
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think she like projects because they're looking in Sally's looking in the rear view mirror, and it's like they make eye contact and Sally can like see Jillian talking and hear her, but I don't think she's doing that out loud in a way that Jimmy could see.
• 48:21
  SPEAKER_02: So again, I think it's that's like a very clever level of supernatural, like that to me is the perfect level of um yeah, like magic to show.
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, definitely.
• 48:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um so Sally grabs the um the Belladonna stuff and she starts spiking his tequila.
• 48:40
  SPEAKER_00: Uh what so she grabs it away from him, first of all.
• 48:42
  SPEAKER_00: Tequila.
• 48:43
  SPEAKER_02: He offers it to her, I think.
• 48:45
  SPEAKER_02: Um because he wants her to like calm down or something.
• 48:48
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah, and she takes it.
• 48:50
  SPEAKER_00: I remember her grabbing it, like snatching it.
• 48:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but he's also trying to But you might be right, he might have given it to her, but she snatches it anyway.
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_02: He's also trying to brand Jillian with his ring that becomes like a pluff later.
• 49:02
  SPEAKER_02: Uh he is he has like a spooky skull ring, um, and he's trying to heat it up with his lighter so that he can burn his girlfriend, which is so creepy, and thank God he doesn't do it.
• 49:16
  SPEAKER_02: Although you find out later that he did it to another woman who he then killed and left by the side of the road, which is horrifying.
• 49:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um but thankfully this is as he's trying to but basically like he he drinks it, he goes uh he goes for uh he goes to P on the side of the road as he's and he's got like the keys on him so they can't get away.
• 49:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then they're like they're arguing, they're like, Oh, you um you can't agree with him enough, he's not passing out or anything.
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_00: And he gets back in the car and starts arguing with them, and they're like they get they get into a fight, um, he starts trying to choke Jillian and and then Sally jumps on his back and he dies.
• 50:01
  SPEAKER_01: He does, he croaks.
• 50:04
  SPEAKER_00: And uh I wrote down he dies question mark because at that point I was like, is he actually dead?
• 50:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, well his eyes are open.
• 50:14
  SPEAKER_02: And so then yeah, he did.
• 50:17
  SPEAKER_00: I wasn't sure if he'd passed out or if he died at that point, but yeah, he's definitely dead because they try him, they're like they're freaking out, they they bring him back uh to the house, and they're like, Oh, we gotta keep we've gotta bring him back to life with a spell with the spell that they would uh that we're gonna do to Michael.
• 50:33
  SPEAKER_00: And so this is quite a funny moment.
• 50:37
  SPEAKER_00: They get they get uh something white, and the only thing that they can find is white is whipped cream, and so they they make a star out of whipped cream, and uh he comes back to life, uh, but like he's so awful.
• 50:53
  SPEAKER_00: He starts strangling uh Sally.
• 50:56
  SPEAKER_00: No, Gillian, he starts strangling Gillian, um, and Sally runs up behind and whacks him with the frying pan and kills him again.
• 51:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 51:05
  SPEAKER_00: And so they have to bury him in the front yard.
• 51:08
  SPEAKER_02: That to me is um I made a note from that point.
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_02: I said, can't decide if you want a guy dead or not, which is like a perfect, like if you were plotting out this movie, I think I can imagine someone being like, what are the like they can't decide if they want him dead or not?
• 51:28
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, that is so relatable to me, where it's like where it's like some guy does something shitty and you're like, I wish that guy were dead, and then you're like, and that I mean to be clear, but maybe I went too far up, but then he does something shitty shitty, and then you're like, no, I do want him dead.
• 51:50
  SPEAKER_02: Which to be clear, they're not bringing him back out of any kind of like he deserves to live because he's a human.
• 51:56
  SPEAKER_00: No, they're being they're doing it to save themselves.
• 51:58
  SPEAKER_02: They're just trying to not uh have a murder on their hands, yeah.
• 52:03
  SPEAKER_02: But it is still very relatable to me where it's just like, God, like sometimes these these asshole dudes, it's like, I want you to die.
• 52:13
  SPEAKER_02: No, you can no, god damn it, you have to die.
• 52:18
  SPEAKER_00: But no, I was right the first time.
• 52:21
  SPEAKER_00: Look, you you are an awful person.
• 52:23
  SPEAKER_02: It to me is like, and not even to take the discussion in this direction, like there's so many times where it's like a man will fuck up in some public way, apologize, ask for forgiveness, and then just fuck up again, where it's like, didn't you learn the first time?
• 52:39
  SPEAKER_02: Like, they they went like Jimmy just could not get it through his head to not strangle Julian.
• 52:45
  SPEAKER_02: He did it once, he died, he came back, he did it again, you get killed again, you don't get unlimited chances.
• 52:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 52:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um it's very true.
• 52:59
  SPEAKER_00: And uh just my opinion.
• 53:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um but they bury him, basically they basically bury him in the front yard, and um Gillian then meets the girls who have been out with the aunts on a like a They've been out at the solstice celebration.
• 53:18
  SPEAKER_00: Solstice, yes.
• 53:18
  SPEAKER_00: I was trying to think of what it was.
• 53:19
  SPEAKER_00: They've been the solstice celebration where they dance naked.
• 53:23
  SPEAKER_02: The aunts make it very clear the nudity is optional.
• 53:26
  SPEAKER_02: Um yeah, they come back and the girls have like flowers in their hair.
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, to me, it seems like they had like a pretty chill time and like probably just climb trees.
• 53:38
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't seem it seems quite innocent and fun.
• 53:40
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't seem like anything's no.
• 53:42
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think they were exposed to anything too out there.
• 53:47
  SPEAKER_00: But but uh Gillian meets the girls for the what uh what feels like it's the first time, but it can't be.
• 53:54
  SPEAKER_02: The timeline is very odd because they say, I mean, she's like, you've gotten so big, which makes me think that I wish you saw pictures.
• 54:05
  SPEAKER_02: In the like montage of Sandra Bullock uh getting married, she says that it's her three-year anniversary, and her older daughter looks older than three, which is not to say that you can't have a kid before you get married, but it it seemed like they'd been together for maybe like five years, but then the older daughter is seems like she's at least seven.
• 54:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I was gonna say seven or eight is the old the older daughter, definitely.
• 54:28
  SPEAKER_02: Right, but it also had seemed like maybe Gillian made that call shortly after Michael died.
• 54:33
  SPEAKER_02: So the timing is very unclear here in terms of when they had time for these kids to grow up and potentially meet each other.
• 54:42
  SPEAKER_00: Um yeah.
• 54:44
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah, they're all in the house now.
• 54:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and um, and then it's the phone tree day.
• 54:51
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
• 54:52
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, have I missed something?
• 54:55
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 54:56
  SPEAKER_00: Just oh, I I thought I missed something based on your reaction there.
• 54:59
  SPEAKER_02: No, I mean I guess that is the next thing.
• 55:01
  SPEAKER_02: Like they spooky things start happening, like there's like toads everywhere, and there's roses, and the little red-haired Evan Rachel Wood can see um Jimmy's ghost.
• 55:14
  SPEAKER_00: Um Yeah, I think that's later on.
• 55:17
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe uh it's a little bit oh yeah, it is because it's like just after this, uh just after the phone tree stuff.
• 55:22
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, okay.
• 55:23
  SPEAKER_00: That all starts happening.
• 55:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um basically there's um so there's the phone tree day, and you find out like uh Sally never gets picked for this phone tree thing of like um they trust one person uh at the top, and then that person's supposed to feed doubts to all the uh other parents, uh all the other mothers uh what's happening at school.
• 55:46
  SPEAKER_00: Um and uh so she's sitting and she's sitting doing that, and she's not gonna she's obviously not gonna get picks, and then Jillian walks in, starts making a whole scene, making things about herself, and then and then she uh magically changes Stally to be the top of the phone tree list.
• 56:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yep.
• 56:08
  SPEAKER_02: They got little sister solidarity going on.
• 56:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 56:12
  SPEAKER_02: Um Nicole Kidman is being like very sexual at this meeting of mom.
• 56:19
  SPEAKER_02: Very which the fact that she had dust j just done eyes wide shut really makes sense.
• 56:24
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like that must have been the first scene they shot.
• 56:26
  SPEAKER_02: She was still in that mode of like, I'm at a sex party.
• 56:31
  SPEAKER_00: She's doing she does 70 takes of that.
• 56:34
  SPEAKER_00: Like, we just want to go home.
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 56:38
  SPEAKER_02: Nicole, we get it.
• 56:39
  SPEAKER_02: You're really hot.
• 56:43
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but it it's an echo back to the opening scene where they sort of imply that the I think Maria or Mariah is the name of Owen's ancestor, who they tried to kill but couldn't.
• 56:57
  SPEAKER_02: Um that basically she was like fucking everybody's husband, and that's why the other women in this small town didn't like her.
• 57:04
  SPEAKER_02: And so Jillian shows up and she storms into this, you know, the more things change, the more they stay the same.
• 57:11
  SPEAKER_02: She storms into this meeting of moms and she's like, I'm here, I'm sexy.
• 57:14
  SPEAKER_02: And if you're not nice to make, I'll fuck your husband.
• 57:17
  SPEAKER_02: Um which I don't think Sally likes, but is amused by.
• 57:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, she's definitely amused by it.
• 57:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 57:24
  SPEAKER_00: Um they go and have their like midnight margaritas.
• 57:29
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 57:30
  SPEAKER_00: Which is a really fun scene.
• 57:32
  SPEAKER_00: But they are like very, very drunk.
• 57:34
  SPEAKER_00: And I read that Nicole Kidman brought them all real uh tequila, and they and they all got very drunk in actuality.
• 57:44
  SPEAKER_02: I think the moral of this podcast episode is that Nicole Kidman's so cool, and I want to hang out with her.
• 57:50
  SPEAKER_02: I want to drink with her, and just I think Nicole Kidman might be a real witch.
• 58:01
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I I'm not gonna say it.
• 58:04
  SPEAKER_00: I believe it.
• 58:05
  SPEAKER_00: I believe that she could do spell.
• 58:10
  SPEAKER_00: And well, she got away from Tom Cruise, so yeah.
• 58:14
  SPEAKER_02: That's the magic.
• 58:16
  SPEAKER_02: That's a spell in itself.
• 58:18
  SPEAKER_02: That's some practical magic right there.
• 58:21
  unknown: Yeah.
• 58:22
  SPEAKER_00: Um so they had their make and margaritas, which is like a really fun scene of just of the aunts and the two sisters like dancing and drinking margarita uh drinking loads of margaritas and singing.
• 58:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um what are they singing?
• 58:35
  SPEAKER_00: What's the song they sing?
• 58:35
  SPEAKER_02: Lime and the coconut.
• 58:37
  SPEAKER_00: Lime and the coconut, yeah.
• 58:39
  SPEAKER_02: And then you find out it's spooky devil tequila.
• 58:44
  SPEAKER_00: That someone left on their porch.
• 58:47
  SPEAKER_00: Someone left so the aunts just like take the alcohol that someone left on a porch and just drink it.
• 58:54
  SPEAKER_00: Kind of like, I I don't think I would ever do that, but you know, hey, I don't know, whatever you want to do.
• 59:00
  SPEAKER_02: They're they're kooky old ladies.
• 59:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um and this is when Evan Rachel Wood's character sees Jimmy in the reflection.
• 59:09
  SPEAKER_00: They wake up the next morning and they um Evan Rachel's Wood character sees Jimmy in the like the window, yeah.
• 59:15
  SPEAKER_00: But like a kind of reflection sort of thing.
• 59:17
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, but none of them can see him except for her.
• 59:21
  SPEAKER_00: And so they run outside and he's like his boots are like rising from the ground and the roses have like grown everywhere seemingly overnight.
• 59:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, they're definitely and and and out of season, because later Aiden goes.
• 59:36
  SPEAKER_00: Very much out of season.
• 59:37
  SPEAKER_02: It's not Rose time of the year, yeah.
• 59:40
  SPEAKER_00: Because uh Sally goes to cut them all down, and that's when Agent Gary shows up.
• 59:44
  SPEAKER_00: And he's like, Oh, that's a strange time for roses to be growing.
• 59:48
  SPEAKER_02: And this is when the aunts leave, right?
• 59:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, they leave at this point.
• 59:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, they're like, go do do everything for yourselves.
• 59:54
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 59:55
  SPEAKER_00: After you've made your own mess.
• 59:57
  SPEAKER_02: They do margaritas and then they're like, and we're out.
• 1:00:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, because they get yelled at for uh the margarita stuff that and then they find everyone finds out about like what was going on and everything.
• 1:00:08
  SPEAKER_00: So they leave and they're like, Oh, you've got to sort out your own messes.
• 1:00:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um but Agent Gary shows up and he's like there, he's come from Arizona to like figure out why Jimmy is missing.
• 1:00:18
  SPEAKER_02: Um Yeah, and then you find out later he's trying to solve the murder of this of one of Jimmy's other exes.
• 1:00:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:00:27
  SPEAKER_00: I actually miss that.
• 1:00:28
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, he's there to um Jimmy like left this other girl for like left her body on the side of the road.
• 1:00:38
  SPEAKER_02: And um, I think she'd been maybe branded by that ring.
• 1:00:43
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and so he's now trying Jimmy, I guess, is like a person of interest in that case.
• 1:00:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:00:49
  SPEAKER_02: So he's trying to track down Jimmy uh because of that.
• 1:00:57
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
• 1:00:58
  SPEAKER_00: He's a bad dude.
• 1:01:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, he's a very bad guy.
• 1:01:01
  SPEAKER_00: Bad, bad dude.
• 1:01:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um but mean uh in the meantime, like Jillian flirts with Agent Carrie.
• 1:01:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:01:10
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, she doesn't flirt with him, she's hitting on, she's like seducing him.
• 1:01:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, she's trying to seduce him.
• 1:01:18
  SPEAKER_00: And he's just like not interested in the slightest.
• 1:01:20
  SPEAKER_00: No.
• 1:01:21
  SPEAKER_00: He's just like, give me my hand back.
• 1:01:24
  SPEAKER_00: And and he he leaves and go goes and questions the whole town, and they're all just like talking shit about the two sisters.
• 1:01:31
  SPEAKER_00: They're like, yeah, that family that's a family of witches.
• 1:01:33
  SPEAKER_00: There's something weird going on with them.
• 1:01:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, well, it because little Evan Rachel Wood had cursed some um a bully with chicken pox.
• 1:01:43
  SPEAKER_02: So then uh yeah, Agent Gary's like he doesn't really believe it, but he's also like these these women would lie because they're they're not to be trusted, these women.
• 1:01:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, he knows something something's up.
• 1:01:58
  SPEAKER_00: Something is up.
• 1:02:03
  SPEAKER_00: And uh Gillian does a banishing spell for him.
• 1:02:09
  SPEAKER_00: Or she goes to do a banishing spell.
• 1:02:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and she's setting up with the sh with the coup kids.
• 1:02:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 1:02:14
  SPEAKER_00: And uh Evan Rachelwood shows her the book from that uh Sally had as a child, and then she starts reading it, and it's like all this spell about this guy that she was gonna fall in love with and all this stuff, and it's like the green and blue eye, um, the pancakes and all these things.
• 1:02:31
  SPEAKER_00: And he knows how to flip a pancake and all that like everything you said before, and he's there to like he shows up at the door and they're gonna serve everything, and he starts like cooking the pancakes, and he does a flip, and he flips the pancakes, and the kids are like so amazed.
• 1:02:46
  SPEAKER_02: And he makes a pancake in the shape of a cactus, which is so cool.
• 1:02:51
  SPEAKER_02: So cool, and uh something I've never seen before, and probably something that wouldn't even work, but in this movie, why not?
• 1:02:59
  SPEAKER_00: Have you never seen pancake art before?
• 1:03:01
  SPEAKER_00: Uh not just like at no it's I've got like the squeezy bottles and like make someone like shapes them and then they can like do it.
• 1:03:11
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's very hard, but it's I've seen it before.
• 1:03:15
  SPEAKER_00: I've never seen it done as a cactus though.
• 1:03:17
  SPEAKER_00: Well I've seen it done as like characters from shows and things.
• 1:03:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:03:22
  SPEAKER_02: I remember people would make like Mickey Mouse pancakes, but that's I mean, those are just cool.
• 1:03:28
  SPEAKER_00: That's slightly easier than a than the cactus.
• 1:03:32
  SPEAKER_02: Anyway, anyway, Agent Gary's very impressive and cool, and the girls like him.
• 1:03:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, I mean, it's the only thing he does.
• 1:03:40
  SPEAKER_02: But he's also hot.
• 1:03:43
  SPEAKER_00: Is he?
• 1:03:46
  SPEAKER_00: He feels a lot older.
• 1:03:49
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, he's like a grizzled Arizona lawman.
• 1:03:53
  SPEAKER_02: Baked by the he's been baked by the Southern Sun, but yeah, Aiden Quinn is a good looking dude.
• 1:04:00
  unknown: Okay.
• 1:04:02
  SPEAKER_00: But then um, because they like essentially like poison the syrup with this smell, um, he goes to poison he goes to pour the syrup and the girls like grab it and like run to the uh run to the lake and like throw it out.
• 1:04:15
  SPEAKER_00: And and then very calmly Sally's like, oh well, I guess they don't like syrup.
• 1:04:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, she's like she's just trying to I think she is just trying to pretend like they're just so normal and not worth investigating.
• 1:04:29
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, that's weird that you wouldn't get angry at them for doing that.
• 1:04:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think she's just trying to like really project because there's also this thing where she can't lie to him.
• 1:04:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, because they're soulmates.
• 1:04:46
  SPEAKER_02: And so, like, whenever he asks her a question, she either has to deflect, or like there's this one very clever moment where she tells the truth, you know, in a tone that makes him think that she's kidding.
• 1:04:58
  SPEAKER_02: Where he goes, Um, did you and your sister kill Jimmy Angelo?
• 1:05:03
  SPEAKER_02: And she goes, uh-huh, a couple times, which is true, but he doesn't know that.
• 1:05:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um But he also says, Did you kill Did you kill them?
• 1:05:11
  SPEAKER_00: Uh Did you kill Jimmy?
• 1:05:12
  SPEAKER_00: And she went, Not in this house.
• 1:05:14
  SPEAKER_02: Oh yeah, he goes, uh, are you hiding him?
• 1:05:16
  SPEAKER_02: And she goes, Not in this house.
• 1:05:18
  unknown: Yeah.
• 1:05:18
  SPEAKER_00: He's in the and then he says, then she's like, Yeah, oh yeah, a couple of times.
• 1:05:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:05:23
  SPEAKER_00: Which is great.
• 1:05:24
  SPEAKER_00: I really like that.
• 1:05:25
  SPEAKER_02: Good screenwriting moment by it is, yeah.
• 1:05:27
  SPEAKER_02: Um I think this movie had three screenwriters.
• 1:05:30
  SPEAKER_02: One of them was Akiva Goldsman, who's one of our one of our nation's foremost screenwriters, wrote A Beautiful Mind, among others.
• 1:05:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but he's like a I don't know.
• 1:05:45
  SPEAKER_00: He he he's a very prolific screenwriter.
• 1:05:48
  SPEAKER_02: He's like one of the few like famous screenwriters.
• 1:05:51
  SPEAKER_02: Like there's not a lot of like well known screenwriters, it's mostly directors, and he's like a well known screenwriter.
• 1:05:59
  SPEAKER_00: I think he also writes I am legend.
• 1:06:01
  SPEAKER_00: I could be wrong.
• 1:06:01
  SPEAKER_02: Probably.
• 1:06:02
  SPEAKER_00: I think the girls throw out the syrup, and then the frog uh they see the frog down there, and it's the frog spits out his ring.
• 1:06:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then he immediately knows what the so Agent Gary immediately knows what this is, takes it, is like, something going on with you guys.
• 1:06:23
  SPEAKER_00: And and then leaves, and um Sally and and uh Gillian fight about this.
• 1:06:33
  SPEAKER_00: And she's and Sally's like, I'm gonna go tell him, I'm gonna tell him what's going on, and everything.
• 1:06:37
  SPEAKER_00: And she runs to his motel and tells him everything without explicitly saying it.
• 1:06:44
  SPEAKER_02: Well, it's also that to me was like I get that She doesn't directly say it.
• 1:06:52
  SPEAKER_02: Well, this thing, it's like he he busts out a tape recorder and he's like, this is the testimony of Sally Owens.
• 1:06:57
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, is this illegal?
• 1:06:58
  SPEAKER_02: Like, would this be admissible?
• 1:07:01
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I don't think that just like uh I guess he's like a marshal or maybe he works he's like a sheriff or something.
• 1:07:08
  SPEAKER_00: He's like a sheriff, he has to be a sheriff based on like the star.
• 1:07:11
  SPEAKER_02: Right, but he's I mean he has like interstate jurisdiction.
• 1:07:17
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think him just saying this is the testimony and then recording a statement, like I I don't think this is like a real confession.
• 1:07:26
  SPEAKER_00: Does that even you can't have a state to state like an interstate interstate?
• 1:07:31
  SPEAKER_02: Well, that's what the FBI is.
• 1:07:32
  SPEAKER_00: If you commit a Right, but he's not FBI.
• 1:07:35
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 1:07:37
  SPEAKER_02: The other thing is like it's very unclear because then he stops recording, he's like, you should get a lawyer.
• 1:07:41
  SPEAKER_02: So it's very it's just he's not gonna arrest her.
• 1:07:44
  SPEAKER_02: I think he went to get a warrant.
• 1:07:45
  SPEAKER_02: It's the vaguer the better, because this is not like a real he's not like a real cop.
• 1:07:52
  SPEAKER_00: Just make him a detective, it doesn't matter.
• 1:07:55
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 1:07:55
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, he could be a PI, I don't know.
• 1:07:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's what I mean.
• 1:07:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:07:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:08:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um and but they kiss at this point.
• 1:08:06
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah.
• 1:08:06
  SPEAKER_00: The first time, and then she notices his one green and one blue eye, and she's like, I can't do this, and runs back runs away.
• 1:08:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and he chases after her because he like knows something's wrong, and she goes back home and the girls are freaking out because J uh Gillian is now possessed by Jimmy.
• 1:08:25
  SPEAKER_02: That was such a cool shot when it was the winding staircase and Sally's running up the stairs and the girls are running down the stairs and the camera's like twisting, and I was like, Yeah, it's a really good scene.
• 1:08:36
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, this is good.
• 1:08:37
  SPEAKER_02: Good, good movie making.
• 1:08:39
  SPEAKER_00: Good job, Griffin Dunn.
• 1:08:40
  SPEAKER_02: Good job, Griffin Dunn.
• 1:08:42
  SPEAKER_00: I want to say Griffin Newman as well.
• 1:08:44
  SPEAKER_02: Uh Griffin Newman, if you're listening, good job.
• 1:08:51
  SPEAKER_02: You weren't in this movie, but just in general.
• 1:08:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, just good job with everything.
• 1:08:56
  SPEAKER_02: Good job.
• 1:08:56
  SPEAKER_02: Just good job.
• 1:08:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um but Jimmy can't Jimmy's like leaves the body and like um you see him as like a sort of like a you see him as himself.
• 1:09:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, he's like a ghost.
• 1:09:12
  SPEAKER_00: A ghostly figure.
• 1:09:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:09:14
  SPEAKER_00: And he attacks um he attacks uh uh what's his name, Gary, and grab puts his hand through his heart, but starts to scream and like takes his hand out, and you realize his hand has been like burnt by the badge.
• 1:09:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, because it's a silver star, and that's supernatural adjacent.
• 1:09:36
  SPEAKER_00: But I also wrote down copaganda.
• 1:09:42
  SPEAKER_02: Well, yeah, I mean has a line earlier where she talks about how it's like a talisman, um, and there's a lot of which we can get into like the magic of everyday things, and like um we all have a little witch in us, and but it's not not copaganda.
• 1:10:04
  SPEAKER_00: I wrote it down kind of as a joke, but it's also, yeah, you're right, it's not not.
• 1:10:08
  SPEAKER_02: Well, it's just weird because again, that scene is the one that worked the least for me in this.
• 1:10:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, this is also your least favorite scene.
• 1:10:15
  SPEAKER_02: It's my least favorite scene in the movie where the girls have been so like they've been kind of fucking up the whole movie, but they've really been driving all the action.
• 1:10:28
  SPEAKER_02: They're keeping him away, they're dealing with Jimmy, they're doing all this stuff, and then and in the final, final climax, it is they it is them who saves the day.
• 1:10:38
  SPEAKER_02: But just it felt like kind of a Deus Ex Machine had to have like, yeah, and Gary's gonna get rid of the ghost, even though he just found out about magic.
• 1:10:46
  SPEAKER_02: Like that to me was the scene where I was like, I feel like Sally should like embrace the craft and like do a thing to get rid of the ghost, where he just shows up, flashes his badge, and the ghost goes poof.
• 1:10:57
  SPEAKER_02: Where I was again, I don't mind men rescuing women in a scene in a movie.
• 1:11:02
  SPEAKER_02: Like we can live, but I was just like, why is this man do he you have not been it just felt very out of place for all of a sudden?
• 1:11:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I completely agree.
• 1:11:13
  SPEAKER_02: All of a sudden Gary's rescuing them because of his badge, and I guess his love for Sally, maybe it just doesn't work.
• 1:11:26
  SPEAKER_00: You find you you do find out at this point that he's read her letter a thousand times.
• 1:11:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, because that's her song that she put out in the world to summon him, and it's yeah, symbolic and beautiful.
• 1:11:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:11:39
  SPEAKER_00: And uh he tells her like curses only have power when you believe in them, and I don't.
• 1:11:47
  SPEAKER_00: And then he leaves.
• 1:11:52
  SPEAKER_01: Um I wonder if that'll come back.
• 1:11:58
  SPEAKER_00: Does it come back?
• 1:12:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, go ahead, go ahead.
• 1:12:06
  SPEAKER_00: But Gillian is still possessed.
• 1:12:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, which in her great acting moment, you think maybe the it's great.
• 1:12:13
  SPEAKER_02: You think maybe the ghost is gone, and Sally gives Gillian a hug, and then she just gives her a look, and you can tell she's possessed.
• 1:12:20
  SPEAKER_00: Not just a look, she gives her the look, and then she does this lick across her face.
• 1:12:25
  SPEAKER_00: It's so creepy.
• 1:12:28
  SPEAKER_02: Acting! I'm hocked from all the acting.
• 1:12:31
  SPEAKER_02: It's so good.
• 1:12:33
  SPEAKER_00: And then Sally turns around and punches her in the face, knocks her out, and the aunts are back at that moment, they're like, What are we walking to?
• 1:12:44
  SPEAKER_02: They're like, We didn't stay away long enough because you it got worse.
• 1:12:51
  SPEAKER_00: And the the aunts say to the say to Sally, um, the only way to get rid of uh to get rid of him is to summon uh is to have a coven.
• 1:13:02
  SPEAKER_00: And you need do you have any friends?
• 1:13:04
  SPEAKER_00: We need at least we need about 12 people.
• 1:13:07
  SPEAKER_00: And she's like, I will consult the phone tree.
• 1:13:10
  SPEAKER_00: The only people I know in this town.
• 1:13:12
  SPEAKER_02: Um Well, it's all the moms.
• 1:13:15
  SPEAKER_02: It's a very I know I that to me is like it's a sweet scene.
• 1:13:18
  SPEAKER_02: It's such a shortcut to my heart, where it's like I'm I'm like such a slut for women teaming up.
• 1:13:25
  SPEAKER_02: Like pretty much any movie, if you throw in a scene where women who didn't like each other come together to help each other, like I'm on the floor, I'm done.
• 1:13:34
  SPEAKER_02: Um give it to me.
• 1:13:36
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like that with any any movie.
• 1:13:38
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't even have to be just women, it can be like anything that happens, like with people that don't like each other like teaming up to battle a a greater evil.
• 1:13:45
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, yeah, I'm so satisfying.
• 1:13:47
  SPEAKER_02: It's so satisfying.
• 1:13:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um and so she calls up the phone tree and tells them everything and they gather uh and then like they call down, obviously, and like start explaining everything.
• 1:14:00
  SPEAKER_00: Like, see, I was right.
• 1:14:02
  SPEAKER_00: And they bring brooms, they bring brooms and they bring like a little uh mini vacuum like a dirt devil.
• 1:14:10
  SPEAKER_00: Duster.
• 1:14:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:14:13
  SPEAKER_00: And they all gather to perform a spell, and at that point, they the arms are boiled like this whole uh I don't know what it is.
• 1:14:23
  SPEAKER_00: It's some kind of like a potion, yeah.
• 1:14:26
  SPEAKER_00: And it stinks apparently, but and they get together in like a what's the what's the term for that?
• 1:14:34
  SPEAKER_00: It's a like a circle?
• 1:14:37
  SPEAKER_00: It's not a circle though, but because it's like a it is a it's a circle, but they like do something specific with it.
• 1:14:45
  SPEAKER_00: They're like crossing over each with each other.
• 1:14:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, they make like a it's like a ring of like protection and power.
• 1:14:55
  SPEAKER_00: Like I'm sure there's some kind of term for it though, that's what I mean.
• 1:14:58
  SPEAKER_00: Probably I don't know.
• 1:15:00
  SPEAKER_00: Anyway, they start doing that and Nicole Kidman goes into full acting mode again, just like screaming and like riding around the floor in pain and everything, and they're like, and then Sandra Bullock's like, oh no, you're killing her, we can't keep doing this, and like breaks it.
• 1:15:16
  SPEAKER_00: Nicole Kidman passes out on the floor, and uh Sandra Bullock lies next to her and starts explaining everything, and uh they decide she realizes I can lure him out with tequila with his tequila goofy but effective.
• 1:15:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:15:34
  SPEAKER_00: This man's an alcoholic, that's what we're gonna clear.
• 1:15:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, he's uh he's he's a bad dude who has a lot of not that alcoholics are bad people, but he's attractive to not not healthy side of life.
• 1:15:50
  SPEAKER_00: No um and it's not really working, but then they're like they do they've got uh so Sonny Bullet realizes oh I can do the blood pact.
• 1:16:01
  SPEAKER_00: And she brings the blood pact thing back from before.
• 1:16:02
  SPEAKER_00: She cuts her hand, she cuts Nicole Kidman's hand, grabs them together, and that's what saves the day.
• 1:16:10
  SPEAKER_00: His love it defeats him.
• 1:16:12
  SPEAKER_00: Sister woman Sitterly love.
• 1:16:15
  SPEAKER_00: Friendship love.
• 1:16:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:16:18
  SPEAKER_00: And it's what they promised each other, and it's what they what they got.
• 1:16:21
  SPEAKER_00: And the the women shout, and no Margot Martindale shouts, let's clean house.
• 1:16:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yep, and then it's a little payoff.
• 1:16:29
  SPEAKER_02: Why did they bring all these brooms?
• 1:16:31
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, to sweep the dust of his spirit into the yard.
• 1:16:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:16:37
  SPEAKER_00: And then they pour the uh the the potion over the over that and it like sucks down into the earth.
• 1:16:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:16:44
  SPEAKER_02: And he's gone for good.
• 1:16:46
  SPEAKER_00: He's gone for good.
• 1:16:48
  SPEAKER_00: And and then like later on, it cuts to like down the line, and uh, she gets a letter from Gary, and it's a letter clearing her of all charge, clearing them both of all charges.
• 1:17:00
  SPEAKER_02: Well, yeah, he planted the ring in some um like burned out warehouse or something.
• 1:17:08
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I'd miss that.
• 1:17:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so it's they're like, oh, he Jimmy's death was ruled an accident, and like the way we were able to Yeah, I got that bit.
• 1:17:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, like identify his bodies.
• 1:17:20
  SPEAKER_02: They found this ring at the scene, so it was like Got you.
• 1:17:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, he planted the ring at some I don't know if it was a fire, but some accident.
• 1:17:28
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:17:29
  SPEAKER_00: So that they could some kind of accident, yeah.
• 1:17:33
  SPEAKER_00: That's smart.
• 1:17:36
  SPEAKER_00: And then uh and then they talk, they start talking about like what would you do for and then Sally says to um to uh Gillian, what would you do for the right guy?
• 1:17:46
  SPEAKER_00: And she's like, What wouldn't I do for the right guy?
• 1:17:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and she's standing by the sunset holding a cat, and it is yeah, iconic and beautiful.
• 1:17:58
  SPEAKER_00: And Gary comes back, he returns.
• 1:18:02
  SPEAKER_02: Well, he is like hanging out in their yard, I guess, and Santa Bull like wearing um because she's been not frumpy, but she's been very like normal the whole movie.
• 1:18:13
  SPEAKER_02: Like she wants to be normal and she wears clothes from the gap.
• 1:18:15
  SPEAKER_02: And she's now wearing this like silky dress with like little roses on it.
• 1:18:21
  SPEAKER_02: She just emerges from the bushes looking got the forest, and she's like it looks like she comes out of the forest, yeah.
• 1:18:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, she just walks out of the bushes and she's like, What's up, Gary?
• 1:18:30
  SPEAKER_02: I'm the most beautiful thing you've ever seen.
• 1:18:32
  SPEAKER_02: Do you want to marry me?
• 1:18:33
  SPEAKER_02: It's like, all right, here we go.
• 1:18:36
  SPEAKER_02: Wrapping this movie up.
• 1:18:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it like it's wrapped up very quickly because they like he comes back, they that happens, they kiss, and then it cuts to Halloween, and they're standing on the rooftop as witches with all the with all the town watching them, watching over them.
• 1:18:51
  SPEAKER_00: And embracing them.
• 1:18:52
  SPEAKER_00: Including Gary.
• 1:18:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:18:54
  SPEAKER_00: They're watching them, and the kids are down there, sat uh, Gary's down there, they're all watching, and the four witches jump down with their umbrellas and land, and then the whole town goes crazy and joy, yeah, and it ends.
• 1:19:09
  SPEAKER_02: Ends on Halloween, as all movies should.
• 1:19:12
  SPEAKER_02: I think all movies should end at either Halloween or a concert.
• 1:19:16
  SPEAKER_00: I like it ending on Christmas.
• 1:19:18
  SPEAKER_02: That's also cute.
• 1:19:21
  SPEAKER_00: That's that's always my preference, it's like ending on a Christmas on Christmas Day.
• 1:19:25
  SPEAKER_02: Well, we've talked about this before that Americans love Halloween and Brits love Christmas.
• 1:19:32
  SPEAKER_00: It's true.
• 1:19:34
  SPEAKER_02: You guys are like really into Christmas.
• 1:19:39
  SPEAKER_00: Because we don't like first of all, Halloween is not really a thing here.
• 1:19:43
  SPEAKER_02: Which it should be.
• 1:19:44
  SPEAKER_02: You're so close to kind of do it, but we don't spooky.
• 1:19:51
  SPEAKER_00: But also, like, we don't we don't have so we also don't have Thanksgiving as well, so like we don't have that kind of like big thing that you do there, so we celebrate it at Christmas.
• 1:20:02
  SPEAKER_01: I know.
• 1:20:03
  SPEAKER_00: Whereas like you're you're like, we just celebrated it a month ago.
• 1:20:06
  SPEAKER_02: I like Christmas a lot.
• 1:20:07
  SPEAKER_02: It's just it's always like every British thing just has a Christmas component where it's like it's all one thing.
• 1:20:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:20:18
  SPEAKER_02: Anyway, but it makes sense why you like your movies to end at Christmas then.
• 1:20:24
  SPEAKER_00: And I guess Halloween makes sense for you.
• 1:20:26
  unknown: Yeah.
• 1:20:27
  SPEAKER_02: Also my birthday's in October, so it's like a good month.
• 1:20:30
  SPEAKER_00: Uh but not on Halloween.
• 1:20:34
  SPEAKER_02: No, it's not on Halloween.
• 1:20:35
  SPEAKER_00: Uh uh.
• 1:20:38
  SPEAKER_00: My birthday is like three weeks after Christmas.
• 1:20:42
  SPEAKER_02: My birthday is October 11th, which is the same uh birthday that the twins have in the parent draft.
• 1:20:49
  SPEAKER_02: Which, much like us, one Brit, one American.
• 1:20:53
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:20:54
  SPEAKER_02: It's also a good movie.
• 1:20:56
  SPEAKER_00: I went to the UK premiere of that.
• 1:21:00
  SPEAKER_02: Really?
• 1:21:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:21:02
  SPEAKER_02: Do you know industry people?
• 1:21:04
  SPEAKER_02: What was the story?
• 1:21:05
  SPEAKER_00: No, my so my sisters are twins.
• 1:21:07
  SPEAKER_02: And invited twins.
• 1:21:10
  SPEAKER_00: And they were part of like a twins thing.
• 1:21:12
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know what it was, but um they were too young to go to it, so that me and my brother went to it instead.
• 1:21:19
  SPEAKER_02: I love that it's like all twins know each other.
• 1:21:22
  SPEAKER_02: Uh not that there's even twins in that movie.
• 1:21:24
  SPEAKER_02: Lindsay Lohan plays both roles, but just that there's like a twin community.
• 1:21:30
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know what it was.
• 1:21:31
  SPEAKER_00: It was some yeah.
• 1:21:33
  SPEAKER_00: I really don't understand it.
• 1:21:34
  SPEAKER_00: But also, like, my brother and I looked more like twins at that point than my sisters did.
• 1:21:39
  SPEAKER_00: So it's like, yeah, probably believable.
• 1:21:41
  SPEAKER_02: That's so funny.
• 1:21:42
  SPEAKER_02: My two best friends are twins, but they're they don't do any twin stuff.
• 1:21:47
  SPEAKER_00: Are they identical?
• 1:21:48
  SPEAKER_00: Because my sisters are not.
• 1:21:50
  SPEAKER_02: They are.
• 1:21:51
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I can tell them apart, and so can people if you like get to know them, but they're yeah, they look quite alike.
• 1:22:01
  SPEAKER_00: But anyway, this is the end.
• 1:22:03
  SPEAKER_00: Like the end.
• 1:22:03
  SPEAKER_00: That is practical magic.
• 1:22:04
  SPEAKER_00: That's practical magic.
• 1:22:06
  SPEAKER_00: Great.
• 1:22:06
  SPEAKER_00: Do you have uh any final thoughts on the movie itself?
• 1:22:09
  SPEAKER_00: Like you've you've defended it over the over the course of the movie, like unless you want to like have anything specific you want to defend about it.
• 1:22:18
  SPEAKER_01: I'm looking at um my notes.
• 1:22:22
  SPEAKER_01: We really hit all of the all of the things.
• 1:22:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:22:28
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I don't know.
• 1:22:30
  SPEAKER_02: I just think like what do people want in movies?
• 1:22:34
  SPEAKER_02: Like, do like good acting, some really good scenes, a great soundtrack, fantastic, like the house is so cool, and their yard with all the lanterns is so cool.
• 1:22:46
  SPEAKER_02: And like I think magic works.
• 1:22:49
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, we've talked about like the rules of the universe.
• 1:22:51
  SPEAKER_02: I think that works.
• 1:22:52
  SPEAKER_02: I think the plot is like pretty decent.
• 1:22:56
  SPEAKER_02: Like, it's about like what do you do in like a world of like love and death and magic, and like how do you cope with that?
• 1:23:02
  SPEAKER_02: And like, I don't know what what else do people want in a movie?
• 1:23:08
  SPEAKER_02: It's it yeah, it hits it as um Paul Hollywood might say, it ticks a lot of boxes.
• 1:23:17
  SPEAKER_00: For that you get a handshake.
• 1:23:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um what I was gonna say.
• 1:23:24
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah, for me it's it's just the the only thing missing, the only thing awful about it is it has a slightly weird tone, but it makes up for it with everything else.
• 1:23:33
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm okay with that.
• 1:23:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:23:35
  SPEAKER_00: I enjoyed it.
• 1:23:36
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's like you kinda gotta you kinda gotta know that going in and be ready for it.
• 1:23:46
  SPEAKER_02: And it also doesn't bother me as much as I'm trying to figure out why it doesn't bother me as much as like other movies with weird tones.
• 1:23:56
  SPEAKER_02: I think as it doesn't take itself like too too seriously, like it's not like they're doing this insane melodrama with like slapstick comedy.
• 1:24:06
  SPEAKER_02: It's just like there are some lighter moments and then it transitions very, very quickly to darker moments, but it still to me feels like it's all in the same world, like it doesn't I don't know.
• 1:24:22
  SPEAKER_02: The the the turns are not as sharp as I think maybe people think they are.
• 1:24:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:24:29
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, this was also my first time watching it, and you've seen it multiple times.
• 1:24:33
  SPEAKER_00: So maybe going it maybe going back to it.
• 1:24:36
  SPEAKER_02: Genuinely though, what was your like reaction?
• 1:24:38
  SPEAKER_02: Were you just like, why did she pick this weird movie?
• 1:24:42
  SPEAKER_00: Or like no, no, I I get why you would pick it, to be honest.
• 1:24:46
  SPEAKER_00: I I I never I try not to judge anyone's movies as well.
• 1:24:50
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I that's I mean that's the whole point of the whole point of this is like everyone has their own taste and also critics can be wrong.
• 1:25:00
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, did you think like I don't think this movie is like Citizen Kane or whatever, but doesn't 22% just seem really low for like a very competent movie?
• 1:25:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I would I would put it like somewhere around like 50%.
• 1:25:16
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's a perfectly like fine movie.
• 1:25:20
  SPEAKER_00: It's fine, it's like a C.
• 1:25:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and it's like if you're someone like me who really goes for that stuff, maybe you're more into it.
• 1:25:27
  SPEAKER_02: But I just can't imagine watching this movie and being like, that was bad and there was nothing good about it.
• 1:25:32
  SPEAKER_00: Like Yeah, that's what I don't understand.
• 1:25:35
  SPEAKER_02: When people are just like that movie was panned, and I'm like, how?
• 1:25:39
  SPEAKER_02: You don't like really good acting by beautiful women in cool sets with great music?
• 1:25:45
  SPEAKER_02: You who doesn't like that?
• 1:25:46
  SPEAKER_00: It's a it's fun, it's also fun movie.
• 1:25:48
  SPEAKER_00: It's like I didn't like there was no point where I was like, oh, this is bad, I don't enjoy this movie.
• 1:25:55
  SPEAKER_00: I was enjoying even when the tone shifts, I still enjoy the other side of it.
• 1:26:00
  SPEAKER_00: I just don't think like I don't know.
• 1:26:04
  SPEAKER_00: That they they just didn't match to me, but they I still enjoyed both sides of them.
• 1:26:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's like uh uh uh two good movies spliced together a little awkwardly, but they're still both good movies.
• 1:26:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, that's I think that's exactly it.
• 1:26:20
  SPEAKER_00: Great.
• 1:26:22
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so let's move on to the final segment then, which is um the reverse of this, which is uh do you have a movie that is well reviewed and loved that you think is a bad movie?
• 1:26:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 1:26:36
  SPEAKER_02: Gladiator.
• 1:26:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, thank you.
• 1:26:40
  SPEAKER_00: I I'm so glad someone has finally said that.
• 1:26:44
  SPEAKER_02: Don't get the hyper I mean I sort of get it.
• 1:26:49
  SPEAKER_02: I don't it the whole movie is like one note, right?
• 1:26:55
  SPEAKER_02: Like I feel like it has the opposite problem of practical magic, which is that there's no range at all.
• 1:27:01
  SPEAKER_02: Every single scene is just Russell Crowe being like, I want to kill this guy, and he has to overcome something.
• 1:27:10
  SPEAKER_02: Marking Phoenix is good and creepy, but I don't I don't think it's like that.
• 1:27:17
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think it's that hard to be creepy.
• 1:27:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:27:21
  SPEAKER_00: So it's more it's the easier role out of the two of you.
• 1:27:24
  SPEAKER_00: Certainly.
• 1:27:25
  SPEAKER_02: I just like there's no gladiator to me, it's it's okay.
• 1:27:30
  SPEAKER_02: Gladiator's boring.
• 1:27:31
  SPEAKER_02: So for that's the thing, is that it's very boring.
• 1:27:35
  SPEAKER_02: Not a lot really like changes for the guy.
• 1:27:40
  SPEAKER_02: Like he just wakes up and his wife is dead and he wants revenge, and at the end of the movie, he like has gotten the reven like he doesn't learn anything or help anyone.
• 1:27:52
  SPEAKER_02: There's like some like stereotypical magical Negro characters who like come in, help him and leave.
• 1:28:01
  SPEAKER_02: It's not like that cle like the final scene.
• 1:28:06
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, it's made by smart people, so it's not like a horrible movie.
• 1:28:10
  SPEAKER_02: Like the final scene where he's bleeding and you can't tell because he's all bandaged up.
• 1:28:13
  SPEAKER_02: Like, that's good.
• 1:28:15
  SPEAKER_02: But it's just, he just yells and it just angst.
• 1:28:19
  SPEAKER_02: And like, I feel like people just really responded to.
• 1:28:23
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
• 1:28:24
  SPEAKER_02: They just wanted like a I don't even know if it's like a gender thing where it's just like he's like just like a very manly man, and like the I was like, he needs like a love interest or a sidekick or something to like round this character out.
• 1:28:41
  SPEAKER_02: But it isn't.
• 1:28:44
  SPEAKER_02: I also think, and like, you know, Mel Gibson sucks, but like I feel like Braveheart is just so much better and the same plot.
• 1:28:52
  SPEAKER_02: Where I was like, why would you make Gladiator if like Braveheart's so good?
• 1:28:58
  SPEAKER_00: I don't like Braveheart either.
• 1:28:59
  SPEAKER_02: Really?
• 1:28:59
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, I've only seen it once, and I just remember liking it a lot, so I might be wrong, but I remember thinking like this is that movie, but good.
• 1:29:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um I I start I think I just don't like these movies.
• 1:29:09
  SPEAKER_00: I don't like this, I don't like Gladiator, I don't like Braveheart, and I don't like 300.
• 1:29:13
  SPEAKER_00: And they to me they're all like very similar.
• 1:29:15
  SPEAKER_02: I've never seen 300.
• 1:29:16
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like just every like one day I went into school and like every dude in my class was like, I just saw the best movie I've ever seen.
• 1:29:27
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, what is this movie?
• 1:29:30
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 1:29:31
  SPEAKER_02: What?
• 1:29:32
  SPEAKER_02: I yeah, I don't know.
• 1:29:33
  SPEAKER_02: It it But do you remember like when it And I've watched Gladiator twice because I remember I watched it once and I was like, wait, that was bad, and then a few years later I watched it again to make sure I was right and I was it's bad.
• 1:29:47
  SPEAKER_00: The other thing I remember the other thing I associate with Gladiator as well is like it was when DVDs first came out, and then they would give it away with absolute So they gave they gave the the DVD of Gladiator right with um the PlayStation 2, a DVD player, um they if you bought a TV they would give it away.
• 1:30:07
  SPEAKER_00: So like we had multiple copies of it as well.
• 1:30:11
  SPEAKER_00: I do not like this movie, and and it's the one DVD we have.
• 1:30:17
  SPEAKER_02: I had a little bit of the same I mean I didn't get it for free, but um growing up, I had the Star Wars original trilogy on VHS and I would watch it all the time because I loved it.
• 1:30:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and then I got um episode two, Attack of the Clones on DVD, I think maybe it was on sale or something, and it was right around then that like I think we maybe like got rid of our VHS players something, but it was this thing where it was like I only had one Star Wars movie, it was Attack of the Clones.
• 1:30:52
  SPEAKER_02: So whenever my friend Nina came over, we would just watch that.
• 1:30:56
  SPEAKER_02: So that is the movie I love Star Wars, and Attack of the Clones is the one I've seen the most just because we had it on DVD and there wasn't a screen.
• 1:31:04
  SPEAKER_00: The very boring, overly political one.
• 1:31:07
  SPEAKER_02: Well, it's just like everyone sort of quotes it, and I'm like, I can do the whole sand monologue, like I can do all of these things because it's like kids today will never know what it was like to only have certain movies, and so you can just watch those movies over and over.
• 1:31:25
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, I will also say I think Attack of the Clones better than Gladiator.
• 1:31:31
  SPEAKER_02: More going on, more interesting.
• 1:31:34
  SPEAKER_00: I I don't agree with that, but to me, that's my like least favorite of of the Star Wars, but yeah.
• 1:31:45
  SPEAKER_03: I well it's my least favorite.
• 1:31:47
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think it's the worst one.
• 1:31:49
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think it's the lot, I don't think it's the worst one, but it's I think it's my least favorite.
• 1:31:53
  SPEAKER_02: I have like some bones to pick with the one-offs.
• 1:31:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so do I.
• 1:31:59
  SPEAKER_02: Rogue One and Solo, I think, made some blunders that I am mad about, but that's not on the table here.
• 1:32:13
  SPEAKER_00: Do you have any final thoughts uh about either well we we've gone on to final thoughts on practical magic, but do you have any final thoughts on Gladiator?
• 1:32:21
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I think if you make the big line from your movie, are you not entertained?
• 1:32:28
  SPEAKER_02: You're just asking for me to be like, no, I was not entertained.
• 1:32:33
  SPEAKER_02: Quite frankly, Ridley Scott, I was not entertained.
• 1:32:37
  SPEAKER_00: What do you want from that?
• 1:32:39
  SPEAKER_02: And didn't have enough girls or kissing or comedy or any of the things that I like in it.
• 1:32:47
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's that's all true of it.
• 1:32:48
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't have enough girls kissing or comedy.
• 1:32:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:32:51
  SPEAKER_02: I also really hate the movie Forrest Gump, but I think that that's Yeah, so do I.
• 1:32:57
  SPEAKER_02: There's there's a larger community of Forest Gump haters um than there are gladiator haters.
• 1:33:04
  SPEAKER_00: But but I do want to bring this up purely because I read it again the other day about Forrest Gump, which was that um the so you know it came from a book originally.
• 1:33:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 1:33:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um do you know about the sequel book?
• 1:33:19
  unknown: No.
• 1:33:20
  SPEAKER_02: What happens in the does he like do 9-11?
• 1:33:23
  SPEAKER_02: Because I feel like that's it's it's he's always showing up at historical moments.
• 1:33:28
  SPEAKER_00: It's not him doing 9-11, but it's stuff around that whole thing.
• 1:33:34
  SPEAKER_00: And but apparently the author wrote the sequel because he didn't want them to make a movie sequel because he didn't like the movie or something.
• 1:33:43
  SPEAKER_00: So he like wrote a sequel so bad that they were no they would just cancel it.
• 1:33:47
  SPEAKER_01: Uh well he should have done that with a lot of it.
• 1:33:50
  SPEAKER_00: No, sorry, I'm I I am getting things wrong about I'm getting the 9-11 stuff wrong.
• 1:33:54
  SPEAKER_00: He wrote it and then uh they were about to make it and then 9-11 happened.
• 1:34:02
  SPEAKER_00: But he did write, but it was all like very stupid stuff with him like in the like 90s, I guess.
• 1:34:09
  SPEAKER_02: He he was supposed to be.
• 1:34:10
  SPEAKER_02: He's the one who told everyone about Monica Lewinsky, I'm sure.
• 1:34:15
  SPEAKER_00: I I do remember there's a point there's supposed to be a point in it where he meets Tom Hanks.
• 1:34:24
  SPEAKER_02: That okay, we were talking about tone earlier.
• 1:34:27
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like if Forrest Gump had just been like a comedy with a slightly nostalgic underbelly, it would have worked fine.
• 1:34:35
  SPEAKER_02: But they tried to make it like a straight up heartwarming drama with very seriously that this guy could have done all this shit.
• 1:34:42
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, what the Yeah, you can't have both of them.
• 1:34:45
  SPEAKER_00: You can't have both of those.
• 1:34:46
  SPEAKER_02: I also I can go on a lot of rants about Forest Gump.
• 1:34:49
  SPEAKER_02: I think that there's a very so I'll just go on one.
• 1:34:52
  SPEAKER_00: Um go for it.
• 1:34:53
  SPEAKER_02: There's one thing that has always bugged me, which is that the story of like a very, very stupid man growing up in the 60s, I don't think is a particularly interesting story to tell.
• 1:35:05
  SPEAKER_03: No, no.
• 1:35:06
  SPEAKER_02: However, there is a very interesting story to tell in Forest Gump, which is Lieutenant Dan.
• 1:35:12
  SPEAKER_02: I would so much better.
• 1:35:14
  SPEAKER_02: So much better.
• 1:35:15
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 1:35:15
  SPEAKER_02: So much better.
• 1:35:16
  SPEAKER_02: Lieutenant Dan's story is that he has ancestors who have died in every American war, and he goes to Vietnam to die.
• 1:35:24
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 1:35:25
  SPEAKER_02: He gets his legs blown off, gets rescued against his will, and then has to deal with becoming a crippled anti-war activist.
• 1:35:34
  SPEAKER_02: And then he meets like a nice Asian lady and starts a family.
• 1:35:38
  SPEAKER_02: That's such a good movie! Like, that would have been such a better movie.
• 1:35:42
  SPEAKER_00: Where I'm like, why are we following this not very bright person who like I would rather follow, yeah, I would rather rather follow Lieutenant Dan, I would rather follow follow Jenny, I would rather follow um Bubba.
• 1:35:58
  SPEAKER_00: Any of them.
• 1:35:59
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, you've picked the least interesting character in the whole movie to follow.
• 1:36:07
  SPEAKER_02: And it is bad.
• 1:36:09
  SPEAKER_02: And so that was Gladiator.
• 1:36:13
  SPEAKER_00: Gladiator and Forest Gum.
• 1:36:15
  SPEAKER_00: Two movies I completely agree with you on.
• 1:36:17
  SPEAKER_01: Just just boring media movies.
• 1:36:22
  SPEAKER_02: Sorry.
• 1:36:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:36:23
  SPEAKER_00: That are like for some reason universally loved.
• 1:36:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, there's a great line.
• 1:36:28
  SPEAKER_02: Did you see The Big Sick?
• 1:36:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:36:31
  SPEAKER_02: There's a Ray Romano's character in that.
• 1:36:34
  SPEAKER_02: He's like talking about how the internet is like you can find complaints for anything.
• 1:36:39
  SPEAKER_02: He's like, you go on the internet, you can find people who don't like Forrest, greatest movie ever made.
• 1:36:43
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, yeah, exactly.
• 1:36:44
  SPEAKER_02: This is a movie for dads.
• 1:36:47
  SPEAKER_02: Although my dad hates it, um, because he Oh really?
• 1:36:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, because it's very anti-hippie.
• 1:36:52
  SPEAKER_02: It's like very anti-60s and like it has like a weird conservative undertone.
• 1:36:59
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but yeah, I wonder if that's what I I like had like against it as well watching it.
• 1:37:05
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, just this doesn't I don't agree with these.
• 1:37:09
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 1:37:09
  SPEAKER_02: Well it's all about it's like like well the hippies were a joke and the black panthers were mean, and you know who really helped America is like stupid men who didn't even realize they were doing it, and it's like I don't I wasn't alive back then, but I don't think that's true.
• 1:37:24
  SPEAKER_03: Like nope.
• 1:37:25
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like the hippies and the black panthers did a lot.
• 1:37:28
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but you know, prove me wrong, Robert Zanakis.
• 1:37:37
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah.
• 1:37:38
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so um how can we find you online?
• 1:37:42
  SPEAKER_00: And do you have anything that you want to promote at the moment?
• 1:37:44
  SPEAKER_02: Oh goodness.
• 1:37:45
  SPEAKER_02: Um I'm at LizzieLogan.com or at Lizzie Logan with five Z across all the social medias.
• 1:37:54
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't realize you had so many in your in your social media names.
• 1:37:58
  SPEAKER_02: Um yeah, Lizzie Logan was taken, so I just threw three more Z's in there.
• 1:38:03
  SPEAKER_02: And uh that was it.
• 1:38:06
  SPEAKER_02: Um yeah, I'm like maybe starting a Twitch show.
• 1:38:12
  SPEAKER_02: So you can, I don't know, look on my Twitter for details about that.
• 1:38:16
  SPEAKER_02: It's still sort of in the planning launching phase right now.
• 1:38:19
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know when this episode comes out, but maybe right now you can go look at it.
• 1:38:24
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe it's already out and it's huge.
• 1:38:26
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe I'm so famous.
• 1:38:27
  SPEAKER_02: Um and uh yeah, you know, find me there.
• 1:38:34
  SPEAKER_02: Say hi, argue with me about movies.
• 1:38:38
  SPEAKER_00: Argue, you can argue with both of us about Forrest Gump and Gladiator.
• 1:38:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:38:42
  SPEAKER_00: You won't make it practical magic.
• 1:38:44
  SPEAKER_02: Because we're right.
• 1:38:46
  SPEAKER_00: All right, thanks so much for coming on, Lizzie.
• 1:38:48
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you for having me.
• 1:38:50
  SPEAKER_00: That's the end of the podcast.
• 1:38:52
  SPEAKER_00: You can find me on Twitter for the username at YCove or at Yannis Cove on Instagram.
• 1:38:57
  SPEAKER_00: Please remember to rate and review us on iTunes if you enjoyed it, so I can end up making more.
• 1:39:02
  SPEAKER_00: And I'll see you next week for more movies that critics got wrong.