Latest / Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families / #983 Man or Bear?

Transcript

#983 Man or Bear? · Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families podcast.
• 0:05
  Speaker 2: It's the podcast for the.
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: Time poor parent who just once answers.
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: Now hello, it stock to justin course, I'm here with
• 0:12
  Speaker 2: my wife and mound to our six kids. Kighly Mishappy Families.
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: Just a quick note, today's content is probably if the
• 0:19
  Speaker 2: sensitive is if you've got little kids listening, you may
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: want to be judicious and discerning in terms of what
• 0:26
  Speaker 2: they listen to. In this podcast, non stop talking the
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: news at the moment around harm to women at the
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: hands of men. And this is doing the rounds on TikTok.
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: It's a fascinating conversation. Okay, if you.
• 0:40
  Speaker 3: Had to leave your daughter in the forest with either
• 0:45
  Speaker 3: a man or a bear.
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: Which would youious, Well, I think both options gonna suck.
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  Speaker 2: I don't know this man, Oh gosh, I don't know
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: anything about them now, anything about the bear.
• 0:58
  Speaker 3: Nothing about the bear. My gosh.
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: I feel he's an a possible choice, which just shows
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: you how much I don't trust other people.
• 1:04
  Speaker 3: I don't know the man. I was gonna say, Man,
• 1:07
  Speaker 3: the fine, Okay, if you had to leave your daughter
• 1:09
  Speaker 3: in the woods with a woman or a bear. Oh,
• 1:15
  Speaker 3: the facts that we live in a society where that's
• 1:18
  Speaker 3: what women have to deal with all the time. Of
• 1:21
  Speaker 3: the fear you felt, the fear of leaving your daughter
• 1:24
  Speaker 3: in the woods with a man. This is how women
• 1:27
  Speaker 3: feel walking to their cars at night.
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: Like the level of thinking one of my kids, trusting
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: my kid with a bear or a strange man is
• 1:34
  Speaker 2: a horrifying position.
• 1:37
  Speaker 3: Like, is that a horrifying walking to your car by
• 1:40
  Speaker 3: your there's a man there?
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: Oh?
• 1:42
  Speaker 3: You see like a man? Oh you see like a dude? Yeah?
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: Oh no, that makes sense?
• 1:46
  Speaker 3: And oh okay, okay again I know about it.
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: Is that shocking to you?
• 1:51
  Speaker 3: Yes, very shocking. That's very nigh over me.
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: Okay. So TikTok is primarily filled with a whole lot
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: of people who don't have any credentials or qualifications talk
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: about a whole lot of things that they're not really
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: qualified to talk about. Nevertheless, it's taking over the world.
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: It has taken over the world. But this particular thing
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: really grabbed me and I've been thinking about it NonStop
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: since I heard it. There's a lot that I don't
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: like about it, but boy, boy, is there's some really
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: important stuff here. Kylie. You haven't spoken yet in this
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: podcast because you're not feeling great.
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: Well after your warning at the beginning of the podcast,
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: I thought it might be because the kids would be
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: scared by my face.
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: So I don't know how this is. I know how
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: this is going to work out. But other than the
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: fact that you're feeling kind of awful, what are your comments?
• 2:36
  Speaker 2: What are your initial reactions when you think about that conversation.
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: How do you feel about handing over your child, one
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: of our daughters, to either a man or a bear,
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: leaving them in the forest with either a man or
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: a bear. How hard is that decision?
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: Well, you know, growing up with Jungle Book, there is
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: a little bit of romanticizing in my mind that maybe
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: it was.
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: Blue that I might be leaving my MUTI will be
• 2:59
  Speaker 2: safe with the wolves, It'll be okay.
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: But what really stood out to me as I listened
• 3:05
  Speaker 1: to that time and time again was just he eventually
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: got to the point where it's like, it's obvious, I'm
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: going to have to leave her with the man, but
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: I don't like it. But when it came to the
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: second question of whether he would leave it with a
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: woman or a bear, it was an instant, an instant easy, yes.
• 3:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And that's the problem, right, So I've been thinking
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: about it NonStop as well. And you don't even have
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: to hesitate woman or bear a woman absolutely man or beer?
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: Oh?
• 3:34
  Speaker 3: Can I?
• 3:34
  Speaker 2: Can I phind a friend? Can I have a lifeline?
• 3:36
  Speaker 2: Can I get a fifty to fifty here?
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: But what I actually found most interesting is it wasn't
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: a conversation between two women. It was a conversation with
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: a man. And even a man could see the challenge
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: of leaving their daughter with another man.
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: This really hurts me, though, so I want to I
• 3:57
  Speaker 2: wanted to sort of say, hashtag not all men, and
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: and that's a really common response by guys. Guys get
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: really defensive about this and they say, yeah, but I'm
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: not like that. We've got this national conversation happening around
• 4:08
  Speaker 2: gendered violence at the moment. And the reason this is
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: so effective is because when a man has to pause
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: and consider do I trust other men? That's when the
• 4:16
  Speaker 2: issue really rears its head. Now many men are not safe,
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: and far too many men are not safe, and that
• 4:21
  Speaker 2: number seems to be rising. We'll talk about that later.
• 4:24
  Speaker 2: But the thing that really hurts me is so many
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: men are and yet those ones who I mean, they
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: really ruin it for everybody, the men that I spend
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: time with, Like, across the weekend just gone, we spent
• 4:34
  Speaker 2: some time with several different friends and also part of
• 4:37
  Speaker 2: our church community. I was thinking, I was because of
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: this conversation. I couldn't stop thinking about how exceptional, like
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: how truly truly exceptional, those men were that we were with.
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: They're safe men, and I would absolutely, unflinchingly leave our
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: kids with pretty much all of it. It's certainly the
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: ones that we know without any hesitation at all, just yes.
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: But that's the thing. You don't get to choose that,
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: And when you're walking down the street, you don't get
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: to or even when you enter a relationship with a guy,
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: you don't get to say, oh, well this one I
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: can trust. It takes time. And we even know people
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: who the guys that they married suddenly changed within a
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: couple of weeks of being married. All of a sudden,
• 5:17
  Speaker 2: they were it was jackal and high. They weren't who
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: they'd been prior to the marriage. Really really really challenging.
• 5:23
  Speaker 2: And the other thought that I had was, even though
• 5:25
  Speaker 2: I'm thinking about all the good examples of great men
• 5:28
  Speaker 2: that I know, when I go surfing, For example, sometimes
• 5:32
  Speaker 2: depending on where I'm surfing and depending on who's in
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: the water, I look at the guys that I'm surfing with,
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: and I just think, Oh, my goodness, how terrifying. I
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: would absolutely under no circumstances, no way. Well, I lick
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: my daughters with some of these men. I mean that
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: they're intimidating for me, they're absolutely scary.
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: I know that for so many women this is real,
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: and the experiences that they have had or are in
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: the midst of having a life altering heartbreaking. But I
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: don't want to live my life where I have to
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: second guess the safety of half the human race based
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: on their gender. And I don't want my children being raised.
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: I have six daughters, and I want them to live
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: with confidence and with the notion that most people are
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: good people.
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: That's really tricky, though, because when you look at the
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: way our children have, Like we've got several children who
• 6:31
  Speaker 2: are our adults, and they've all had some pretty difficult
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: experiences with young men, Like they're dating experiences, they're being
• 6:41
  Speaker 2: out and about with young men. They haven't had universally
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: positive experiences there. And what they've learned is that overwhelmingly
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: you can't trust a guy when you're on a date
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: and you're alone with it. That's what they've learned.
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: Just the other weekend, one of our daughters was out
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: with some friends at the beach and towards the end
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: of the evening it was now dark. Her and her
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: girlfriend went up to the car park to wait for
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: her friend's mum to come and get them, and her
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: mum was about twenty minutes away. As the boys left,
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: they checked in with the girls and found out that,
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: you know, they were going to be waiting for twenty minutes,
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: and the girls acknowledged that they were completely fine and
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: safe and they were happy for the boys to leave. Well,
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: the girls actually thought the boys had left, but what
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: they did was they went and sat in their car,
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: and from their car they could actually see the girls.
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  Speaker 1: But at some point in that twenty minutes, the girls
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: moved from where they were and our daughter got a
• 7:37
  Speaker 1: phone call to say, have you guys been picked up yet?
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: And our daughter said, no, no, we're still waiting. They said,
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: we just can't see where you are. And at that
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: point they realized that the boys had been waiting and
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: they said, why are you waiting for us? We're completely fine,
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: and they just said, we're not going to leave until
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: you go, And so they got off the phone after
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: they tried to convince the boys that it was okay
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: for them to leave, and it wasn't until they were
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: in the car with the girlfriend's mum that the boys
• 8:06
  Speaker 1: gave one what last one call and said, okay, you
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: guys are good. Great, we'll see at school on Monday.
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: So I love the goodness of those boys in the
• 8:13
  Speaker 2: car park. I think that's really important. But at some level,
• 8:16
  Speaker 2: when I hear that story, that also tells me that
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: those boys are there because of what they know about
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: the boys who aren't like them. That highlights to me
• 8:23
  Speaker 2: that there's some really really great kids out there, really
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: good boys, but they know that compared to the other boys,
• 8:29
  Speaker 2: they are different, they are good, and that there's a
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: whole lot of boys that they need to protect our
• 8:35
  Speaker 2: daughter and her friends from. I spoke with a girl
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: just in the last twenty four hours who is routinely
• 8:39
  Speaker 2: sat next to on public transport by boys and men,
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: even when there are spare seats nearby, because they like
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: the look of it. I mean, that's awful for me
• 8:49
  Speaker 2: when I'm traveling and I do a lot of travel.
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: If I see a woman walking down the street, often
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: my events finish at like nine o'clock at night or
• 8:55
  Speaker 2: something like that. I'm heading back to a hotel. I'm
• 8:57
  Speaker 2: walking into a hotel at ten o'clock at night. If
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: I see walking down the street towards me, I'll even
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: walk to the other side of the street, just so
• 9:03
  Speaker 2: that she doesn't have to wonder about the guy that's
• 9:06
  Speaker 2: walking towards her. If I'm getting into an elevator and
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: there's a woman waiting, I'll often just say, hey, you
• 9:10
  Speaker 2: grab this one, I'll get the next one. Because I
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: don't want a woman to feel uncomfortable. I don't want
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: to feel afraid. I don't think that she needs to
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: be afraid of me. Obviously I'm not someone to be
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: afraid of. But I get because I've got a wife
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: and six daughters and a mum and several sisters and
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: all that sort of thing. I get that for women
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: being around some men can be really intimidating.
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: This won't be a popular response, but when I look
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: at what we're dealing with and I hear this, I
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: can't put the blame all on men. There has been
• 9:36
  Speaker 1: such a massive breakdown of family over the years, and
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: it is having a devastating effect on everyone. But this
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: really comes down to parents stepping up and taking on
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: their role as parents, as moral leaders within our society,
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: and teaching our boys and our girl what it means
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: to live a moralistic life.
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: Once upon a time, a guy called Augustine of Hippo said,
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: right is right, even if no one is doing it.
• 10:08
  Speaker 2: Wrong is wrong, even if everyone is doing it. In
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: a post modern world, right is whatever feels good for you.
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: And as we've become increasingly individualistic and we shrugged our
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: shoulders and said, oh, well, whatever works for you as
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: long as you're not hurting other people. That has led,
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: in so many ways to that degradation. Walking away from
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: the values, walking away from what we know traditionally has
• 10:30
  Speaker 2: kept people, and specifically boys and men in check. Now,
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: I don't want to keep on forcing you to talk,
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: because I know how I saw your throat is. But
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: over the last couple of weeks there's been a whole
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: lot of rallies and a whole lot of people petitioning
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: the government saying we need to do something about this.
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: I'm just wondering what people expect politicians to be able
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: to do in this scenario.
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: Yes, so they made five demands. Five demands at these rallies.
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: Number one, they wanted to declare domestic violence and national emergency.
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: I mean absolutely, no problem. All we need to be
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: able to say that this needs resources and this needs
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: time and effort. Number two mandatory victim blaming prevention training
• 11:08
  Speaker 2: for police, media and first responders. That means that they're
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: essentially saying, we want first responders to believe women when
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: they say there's something going wrong. I think that is right,
• 11:18
  Speaker 2: but there also is a risk associated with that, because
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: we've got good evidence that there are some people who
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: will use this as a weapon against men who haven't
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: done anything wrong. It's a minority of people, but it
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: does happen because people gain the system to get the
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: outcomes that they want. Nevertheless, I think overall that is
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: a really wise step. Number three alternative reporting options for
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: victims so that they don't have to just go through
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: the official channels. There should be other ways that they
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: can report what they're afraid of. Number four media to
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: wait forty eight hours before identifying victims. And number five
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: better funding. Now, my problem with most of these is
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: that their ambulances at the bottom of the cliff. It's
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: well intentioned, but I think that's missing the point. There
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: are actually things that can act as a fence at
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: the top of the cliff and stop boys and men
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: hurting women.
• 12:02
  Speaker 1: What would you suggest?
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: So I'm going to highlight a couple of things that
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: are not politically correct, but data certainly supports them. I'm
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: going to offend pretty much everybody with what I'm going
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: to say here, but number one, there's a lack of
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: security and family life for too many of our young
• 12:13
  Speaker 2: men and young women growing up, and that leads them
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: to seek support and relational belonging in places that are
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: not healthy and not safe. Reading a book at the
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: moment about a young man who went through the foster
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: care system in the United States, it's not much different
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: to Australia in terms of the unpredictability and the difficulty
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: that he had in forming good relationships, the lack of
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: male role models, the breakdown of community institutions that build
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: up and taught morality. As imperfect as many of them are,
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: and they are, we had community support, We had structures
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: in place, we had expectations in place for how people
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: would act I'm not suggesting we go back to the
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: bad old days, because there was a lot bad that happened. However,
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: we do know that things have gotten worse, there is
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: no doubt about that. I think one of the easiest
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: places to start is with the degradation of community standards.
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: It's a huge part of this. I'm going to get really, really,
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: really explicit for a second. If you've got kids listening,
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: this is the thirty to sixty seconds that you don't
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: want them to listen. I was speaking with a journalist
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: the other day and she was describing a family member
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: a conversation that she'd had with a niece of hers
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: young adult niece who was having a really hard time
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: in relationships and finding a guy that she could trust.
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: And the conversation turned explicit and extreme, very very quickly.
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: And this girl describes to her aunt, my friend the journalist,
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: about how in her relationships with these young men, choking
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: and hitting and anal sex were expected, even on a
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: first date. And this friend just looked through and said,
• 13:41
  Speaker 2: that's not normal, and her niece responded, no, but it
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: is normal. That is that's the expectation when we look
• 13:49
  Speaker 2: at the content that is being consumed by young people pornography.
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: The Open Easy government won't even age Kate at recommendations
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: from the e Safety Commissioner last year where that we
• 13:59
  Speaker 2: need to get at least to trial in place where
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: we age gate access to explicit content. They're doing it
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: in other countries around the world, other states of the
• 14:06
  Speaker 2: United States of America, and the Aubaneze government pushed back
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: and said no, we can't. Why because we're so worried
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: about the civil liberties of a handful of adults that
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: we're not going to look after our young people. We're
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: going to present them with every risk factor in the
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: world so that adults can have freedom of choice. It's
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: just ridiculous. Kyle and Jackie Oh have been on the
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: radio in Melbourne for a week now. Last week and
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: the week before I've had two reports. So Craig Bruce
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: is our executive producer. He once upon a time, back
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: in the olden days, he was the content director for
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: the entire Southern Cross Oisterea network, and he was the
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: content director when Kyle and Jackie came off the night
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: program and became the breakfast announced as at TODAYFM. Now.
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: Back then, Kyle called a woman and this is a
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: direct quote a fat slag and he was reprimanded. This
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: thing was sent to the advisory bodies of the Peak Body.
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: It was a big deal. In the last two weeks,
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: I've heard content from Kyle and Jackie's show because Craig
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: sent it to me where they've talked about anal sex.
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: They've talked about how big Jackie's vagina is. They've talked
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: about her walking around with seam and in fact they
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: didn't use the word semen. They used a much more
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: profane term for that, walking around all day with that
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: in her stomach. There is no filter. There is absolutely
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: no filter. Why is this a problem Because they're the
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: number one breakfast show in Sydney. Now they're in Melbourne,
• 15:20
  Speaker 2: They've got more than a million daily listeners. And these
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: discussions normalize sexualization and objectification. They were talking about being
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: on a dance floor and not knowing who was fingering you.
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: I'm sorry, I know I'm being really explicit, but our
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: kids are listening to this. They're the number one show.
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: This is not a podcast, This is not hidden behind
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: an age gate. This is content that is available for
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: everyone and what it does is it shifts expect that
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: this was between six am and eight am. It's blowing
• 15:47
  Speaker 2: my mind, and it shifts expectations and builds a belief
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: and changes subsequent behavior because people think this is what
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: people do, but it's normal if you go back to
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: the young woman that was talking to the journal's friend
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: of mine, but it's not. And this stuff matters so ultimately.
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: I mean, it sounds like I'm in a moral soapbox
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: right now, but parenting is a moral endeavor. And when
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: we remove morality from most of the institutions of our society,
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: including in too many cases our families, because of the
• 16:17
  Speaker 2: proliferation of pornography, because of the coarseness and degradation of
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: the community content, because of the breakdown of the institutions,
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: and because families just aren't talking about this sort of stuff.
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: This is the result. And people keep on saying, we
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: shouldn't have to teach our girls to stay safe, we
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: need to teach boys to stop hurting and being violent worse.
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: And that's true, that's absolutely true. But here's the thing.
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: The world is not perfect, and we actually need to
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: do both. Fewer perpetrators completely essential, absolutely needed, But we
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: can't tarnish your boys either, because there are some beautifully
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: good boys that are out there, and we interact with
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: many of them, and we're so grateful for them. There
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: was a school in Warnable a couple of years ago
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: that made all the boys stand up and apologize to
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: the girls for being boys because because of the terrible
• 17:01
  Speaker 2: things that boys do to girls, and that was appalling.
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: It was rightly condemned. But Kylie, this isn't going to
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: be quickly fixed at a national level. No level of
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: political involvement is really going to make this happen. It's
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: something that has to be fixed at an individual level
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: and at a family level. We've got the evidence and
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: we know that there are so many good men and
• 17:20
  Speaker 2: so many good boys. We've got to get to a
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: point where if you're asked if you would rather leave
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: your daughter with a man or a bear, you can
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: answer just as quickly as you can if you've given
• 17:31
  Speaker 2: the choice between a bear and a woman. Got to
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: be able to say a man and feel good about it.
• 17:37
  Speaker 2: The Happy Families podcast is produced by Justin Ruland from
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: Bridge Media. Craig Bruce is our executive producer. We hope
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: that this one's given you plenty of food for thought.
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: Thanks so much for listening. We'll be back tomorrow on
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: the podcast. Answering your questions from the podcast page at
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: happy families dot com dot au.