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Chandler Picot: From Overdose to Recovery Coach · Sober Readings

• Scott: My guest is Chandler Pico. He is a board certified addictions counselor, a recovery coach, and he's serving in the great state of North Carolina in the Piedmont region. So today he's gonna share his story with us. He has got a long list of credentials and community work. Very extensive, so much so that I'm not gonna go through it. Maybe if he wants to, that would be great. So let's get right to it. Chandler, thank you so much for joining us on on Silver Readings today. Chandler Picot: Thank you so much. I do want to let you know that about halfway through on my end, it was going five, four, three, two, one as you were doing the introduction. So I just want you to know. I just want you to be aware of that. Scott: And I've done it again. I'm gonna leave that in there this time. Chandler Picot: Perfect. Let's do it. That's fine. Let's do it. That's great. Scott: I'm I'm sure half the intro was cut off because of the countdown, but that's okay. We are on sober readings and we're gonna talk to Chandler Pico. All right, so Chandler Picot: Yes. Scott: let's let's get started with do you wanna share your st your story with us first? Awesome. Chandler Picot: Yes. Yes, please do. Thank you. So I'm from North Carolina. I love North Carolina. I've lived here my entire life. I've been to other states. I've checked it out. This is home. This will always be home. Well grew up in Greenville, North Carolina, which is the eastern part of the state. People think of East Carolina University. Now Mr. Beast has become such a major character in and around the world and social media that he's he's known for Greenville. That's where he lives, is where he grew up. That's it's crazy. That's one of our claims to fame. And it's partly cr crazy because I remember being younger, being in the subdivision of Windsor, which all of my Greenville natives will know what that is. That's a little subdivision, and that's all the same one that Mr. Beast was in. I started making social media content in two thousand six. A buddy of mine, Justin Conren, told me about YouTube and I fell in love. We started to make machinimas, which like Halo two was big back in the day, Halo C E. So we made a little machinima. I started to upload content. I encountered some issues later on as far as with executive dysfunction and addiction, but that's where I started. And I just think that's interesting. It's it's amazing how someone can do something. It doesn't matter where you're from, really what your circumstances are, you can do anything. So with that, I I I grew up in Greenville. I was born at Pitt Memorial Hospital, now known as ECU Hospital. ECU physicians bought it out. It was violent for a long time. And since day one, I I'm a I'm a believer that I I was born an addict or or an alcoholic. And what I mean by that is I have a genetic predisposition for that. And I'll give you an example. When I was a kid, when I was a baby, I was a baby, my parents lived in an apartment. They were trying to get a house. And I I was it was me and them, little baby Chandler, and they would give me cheese. I would always want to eat cheese and I would I was it was eating food. Food was a big thing for me. Food was actually my first addiction. Processed sugar, processed flour, that was my first addiction. I'm also sober from food as well, from sugar and and flower as well. I've been sober from that four plus years, October first. And I'm eternally grateful for that as well. because that was a big thing for me. I used to weigh three hundred and fifty plus pounds. So throughout my life, I I never felt like I fit in. I never felt like I was just a part I just never felt like I fit in. I think that's the best way to describe it. I could see other people functioning and having friendships and I could interface with people. I I was I had friends. I was friendly with people. I could befriend anybody. It didn't matter who they were. I I didn't see, these are the jocks or these are the cheerleaders. I don't I didn't care who you were. I would befriend you if I liked you. in preschool, my teacher, my kindergarten teacher, preschool and kindergarten teacher both said he just wants to play. And I like to think of that's the Chandler who I've I've been trying my whole life to get back to before the world got his hands on him, before the the stuff happened with childhood and and trauma and addiction, that's who I really am at my core is just someone who wants to have a good time, wants to be around people, wants to be a communal person who loves people and just cares about them. So I I started doing drugs when I was 14. Andarguably I was looking for drugs before then. What happened is I started to dabble in cannabis. I don't call it marijuana. I call it cannabis because I you know marijuana is it's a whole thing behind that of disinformation and thing to discredit it. So cannabis is something that I fell in love with. I loved it. I love getting high. Now this was two thousand four. This was around right in the middle of the Oxycotin epidemic where Oxycotin, Norco, Lore tabs, hydrocodone, opanas, what else? I mean, y just every every opioid was out there, right? I mean oxycodone, which is, you know, the generic form. and I tried it all. I really did. When once I found that out was so actually funny enough. I heard about that, but at first I was a cannabis purist. So I was like, I'm only gonna smoke cannabis. And then what happened is I finally decided to try it. And I remember the date that I tried it. I looked at I was hanging out with my friend. We had bought some from a dealer, and I put in some applesauce, and I think it was 2007, September 28th, 2007. I remember looking at my f my computer and thinking this. I have arrived. This is how I want to feel. This is what I was looking for my entire life. prior to that, I had been, I had gotten my wisdom teeth removed. I had I got prescribed hydrocodones. I loved those. I didn't know what was going on, but I loved them. And when they stopped, I was really sad. I searched through the the family medicine cabinet and found some what is it called? trauma doll. And I took a bunch of those and I was like, Yeah, buddy, here we are, man. This is what I'm talking about. So I I I kept wanting to get back to that. I figured that the the solution was there and I had to figure it out. it was ever since a young age, I was taught that you need to figure this shit out. Pardon my French, but that's what I was taught. And y Chandler has to figure it out. So that's what I strive to do. And it's part of the reason why I struggled to get help for so long. So I go through that experience and I I I become addicted. I say I'm gonna quit, da da da. End up going to a doctor. I had a legitimate back injury, started getting a prescription for that. I would always run out. And then I spent the next eight years, 10 years, going back and forth, back and forth. I wanted to quit multiple times, and ultimately what happened is I just continued down that road. I tried to self-medicate, I tried to detox thousands of times. I tried to stay stopped. I would go through the three day detox process, four day. It wasn't until I started doing heroin, fentanyl, cocaine crack that things really got to just a point of unst un it was just unsta I was unstable and it was un it was impossible for me to continue. Because the amount of money that it required, the amount of nursing and full-time job it had become with overtime mixed in. It is to get drugs, to acquire drugs, to get the money to get drugs. And I finally decided to stop. And I mean, there's more throughout there. you know, my sister was the one that really finally got me into treatment. She's the one that said, you know what, Chandler, we're gonna I I was desperate. I was ready and I was like, please help me, I can't do it. And she knew I couldn't do it. Before she may have been like, hey, could call this number, do this. But at this point, she was like, hey, I'm gonna do it. And that's what I needed because there was something inside of me that would not let me do it. I could not I she couldn't do it. It was like there was a demon or something in my head, in my body that would stop me anytime, or something that would start to manifest around the third day. Maybe I can do it. And I had tried everything before that. I had tried therapy. I had tried Going to a certified drug and alcohol abuse counselor, which I am now, which is ironic, nodding out on her couch. She sent me a a list of meetings, of NA and AA meetings, Alcoholics Anonymous, Narcotics Anonymous. And I thought I was too sick for that. I was like, that's I'm beyond what those folks are. I need treatment, right? 'Cause that's how bad I am. And honestly, I mean, in a way, yeah. knowing what I know now, AA and tw NA is amazing. you you can do anything in there. That that's the first line in my opinion, for me. But I'm so grateful that I went on the journey that I went on because I'm able to help and give back today. in twenty fourteen I experienced an overdose. I accidentally overdosed on a concoction of Xanax, sleeping medications, like Lunesta Ambien. And oxycodone. I was just trying to get high. I was trying to get outside of myself. And well, I woke up with a paramedic shining a light in my eye. He said, It's gonna be okay, buddy. And what's remarkable is that I came five to ten minutes away from dying, from full cardiac arrest. All my symptoms all everything had shut down, minus my hearing. and how I was found was miraculous. My sister went upstairs. To give me a bag of ice, had I not broken my foot a few days before, had my sister not gone up there to give me some ice at that exact moment, had my mom not been home and my dad not been home. My dad never was home. My dad never took a day off. Just so happened, he took one day off in like 10 years, 20 years, something like that. The man never took time off. And that and that those series of events happened at the same time. And my dad, who's a nurse and home administrator, one of the best in North Carolina, came in there and he saw me and he said, blee, he's dying. I think that was one of my biggest fears. I know that was one of my biggest fears for my dad is that I would end up like his brother, who died at forty three. and he just didn't want to see me go through that and die. And What what happened is the paramedics came, the cardiologist came too, which is another series of unfortunate of fortunate events. And they told me they s they told my dad, I said, Mr. Pico, your son had five minutes before he was dead. I was blue, gasping for air. And it's it's just amazing how I I I did read in the numbers one time of what are the chances that I'd still be here. And because I've had lost so many friends, so many fellows from overdose. And the numbers are one in thirty million of me, of all those things happening, of the fact that I don't have any brain damage. I didn't have any type of long-term damage from that. and then the craziest part, and I'll stop, is I the day before I go to rehab, right? That wasn't enough funny enough. It spent another four years going through the The horrible experience of addiction. The day before I go to go to to detox, I had been asking God for a sign. So had my my my family. My one of my old friends, Justin Conren, who hadn't called me in 10 years. He hasn't called me since, called me once in the past 20 years, right? He's got his own thing going on. That's just the way Justin is. Those of you who know Justin, this is how he is. He called me that night drunk, saying, God wanted me to talk to you. Now I How in the world Justin got that is insane. This man would never respond to my text. it's like asking for a sign and having a sign show up right in front of you, slap you in the face. I was in utter shock and disbelief. I had experienced the supernatural in the natural in my life. I it was so surreal that I was, I was like, I wish I had recorded that, and I I started to doubt it. Because of just how surreal it was. My brain could not compute. It's like one of those scenes from a movie where like the person gives the robot a logical fallacy and it just starts short circuiting. I started to short circuit because I could not understand how I had to ask for this because I didn't expect this to happen. I didn't expect to get a sign at all, much less a direct sign from from some type of higher power, you know, that hey, this is what you're supposed to do, buddy. You need to go get sober. You need to go to Asheville and go do this thing. You need to go to detox. And so that was, I was gonna go, but that gave me the the the the assurance that I was doing the right thing, that I was on the path that God wanted me to be on. Scott: That's amazing. thank you for that. Chandler Picot: So that's my that's my experience. Scott: And I love the way you tell your Chandler Picot: Course. Yeah. Scott: story. I love that I love the things that you that you point out in your story. There's there's so much that I could unpack from from all of that. I wrote down a bunch of stuff here. I'll just go over some things real quick that I can that I can relate to in that. And and you know, the first thing was about not fitting in, you know. I mean, from early on in high school, I didn't fit in. And and same with me, you were talking about the smokers crew and the and the jocks and all these different groups of people. I just wanted to fit in and I would I would be like a like a chameleon, a shapeshifter. I'll do whatever you want to be like you to fit into your group. I just wanted to fit in and I never felt felt comfortable in my own skin. One thing I one thing I cannot relate to, and that's the cannabis. I never got I I tried smoking pot, that's one of those things where they say, I tried to quit drinking by smoking more pot and and for me it was just it just wasn't gonna work. But what I did wanna ask you was, do you think and you call it cannabis, do you think cannabis is a gateway drug? Chandler Picot: No, I don't think cannabis is a gateway drug. I think addiction is a gateway drug. I think that there is no such thing as a gateway drug. Because like I told you earlier, I have an a a process addiction, which means it's a he it's here. So like sugar was my first thing. I mean, they're selling sugar on sugar's sugar's the gateway drug. I mean, if you want to be real, if you want me to be honest with you, it's everywhere. It's in the store. We've accepted it. It's in everything. So processed sugar is a gateway drug, right? The reality is our brain, right? The the someone who has addiction has a genetic predisposition. The brain is a certain way. The brain, typically, with someone who has addiction has there's a ton of comorbidities and there without a doubt is a lower dopamine level, period. So when you factor that in with whatever addiction is, because I don't know what it is, because I've met a ton of people who have lower levels of dopamine and they don't do what I did. I can tell you what I have is separate. And I can tell you it is genetic because I have family members who have it, who have had it, who have died from it. Okay. I had a uncle, great uncle Bobby, ran moonshine all the way up and down Appalachia, all the way from Georgia to God knows where. Has got children everywhere. We don't know half of them. You know, that was Uncle Bobby. you know, Moonshine, Peach Moonshine. my great-great-grandmother, she she made moonshine out still in Georgia, right? this is a common thing. Right. And and the the reality is I I I refuse that. I refuse the idea that it's a gay way drug. I think that's propaganda. I think that you know, when you really look into it, it's that's all it is is propaganda, right? Because I mean, let's be real, there's cannabis everywhere now. I mean, you know, if it's not real THC, it's it's TH9, it's Delta eight. So, I just don't believe that because that that's just it's that that that's refusing to acknowledge the root issue, which is that there's a lot of communal stuff that we're lacking. And I'm not against people using drugs, right? I'm just saying I can't use drugs. I'm a big believer in harm reduction. If that works for you, like I'm a beneficiary of harm reduction. I was narcant. I was someone where they could have said, you what, Chandler, we've given you too many chances, we're not gonna revive you, and I would be dead today. They didn't have to revive me. Well, they did, but let's say they had said, nah, we're good. We don't want to mess with you, man. You've been, on this path for nine years at that point. we're not gonna revive you. You're gonna die today. And and they could have let me die. And but that wasn't a part of God's plan. That wasn't the path. So that's one of the reasons why I'm a big believer in harm reduction. I just think you have the right to life, love, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. And I think that I who am I to tell you what you cannot do with your body? As long as you're not hurting anybody else, you know, and hurting any animals or anything like that. I mean, I believe you should be able to do what you want to do. I mean, I I I just I just don't believe that there's a such thing as a gateway drug. Scott: Yeah, and I yeah, I I a hundred percent gr agree with that. And I'm I'm glad you put it like that. And I'm also glad you brought up sugar, because yeah, I agree. sugar is a huge problem and causes well, I'm not gonna say way more problems than than drugs or alcohol, but if you look at the obesity rate, if you look at, you know, diet the di rate of diabetes in our in our society, that's a whole nother episode that we can go through. just on sugar alone and and the problems that it's causing in our society. yet it's legal. and they're making tons of money off of it, so that's not gonna change. Another thing I wanted to talk about real quick was was you mentioned something about figuring out figuring excuse me, figuring it out on your own, which you said you tried to do. And I think I mean what alcoholic or drug addict hasn't tried that? You know what mean? Like we've all been there. Like I of course tried a million different things to on my own, and I think a lot of it has to do with guilt and shame. I did not want anybody to know what I was doing. So I'm just gonna figure it out on my own. And as I know now, of course that's not gonna work. You know, I didn't I didn't get sober on my own. and I don't I don't stay sober on my own. You know, there's lots of people in my life that help me that help me stay sober every day. let's see. Chandler Picot: I agree with you. Scott: Is there a delay in our in our feed here? Chandler Picot: A little bit. It happens. Yeah. from time to time it will delay on your end. I'll see it lag. But it's probably doing it on my end too, right? But that that's probably something to do with the the internet or something. it's happening I'd say every two or three minutes. That's what I've noticed. Or right now it just happened. Scott: Okay. Yeah. Chandler Picot: What are you gonna do? I don't know. maybe it's riverside. I don't know. Scott: Out of our control. That's what it is. Chandler Picot: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. really, Scott: w Chandler Picot: that that that's that's what I've learned, Life is a series of that. Who knows? Scott: Yeah, this is a perfect z example of of something that's out of our control. another thing that that really Chandler Picot: Yeah. Scott: the most amazing part of your story is that day when everything on on your your your overdose when everything seemed to come together. yeah, I love the way you the way you explain that to be a higher power or to be God stepping in or whatever anybody wants to believe. And and it's just Th there's no coincidences, man. There's it's just not. It there's no way all of that could have come together on that day, not only to save your life, but to put it in your head, that you need to get sober or you're gonna die. You know? That's just amazing. Chandler Picot: I think so. I do. And it's taken me a long time to process it. At first I was really depressed because I didn't experience anything. You know, I was like, I didn't experience anything. I didn't, I didn't, as in, I didn't have a near-death experience. I didn't see anything. It was just nothing, right? But that's because I hadn't crossed over, right? I hadn't died. I was dying. I was in that process, but I hadn't died. One of the benefits is I've had mothers, fathers ask people. In groups and me, w w did my son suffer, did my daughter suffer when they overdosed and when they died? And I said, I can only share my experience, which is that I was not in pain at all. I didn't know I was dying. Had I been had I died, I I guess either I would never know or I would have been floating above my body, been like shit, right? I mean, because that's that's how I would have reacted, like, dang, I messed up. And Scott: Mm. Chandler Picot: that's that's just the reality of it. The reality is that we, the it's tough. It's tough. I I've honestly I'm on a lot of different committees with parents who have lost loved ones, children. and I've developed a real kindred spirit with them because I'm the person who has been through what their kid went through and I I survived. And honestly, I do have some survivors' guilt, honestly. It's uncomfortable and I do feel bad sometimes or questioning of like why why did I live where so many people died? Where so many people just died. I mean, I've I've had so many friends die, right? Well, Dalton. Dalton died. He was an amazing guy in Asheville, North Carolina. He died. Chris died, amazing guy, right? People I looked up to, I looked up to these guys. You know, one I know. That was crazy. Seeing Chris in a casket made me sick to my stomach. Like I I attended the funeral virtually. And to see someone that you knew die from this disease in a in a casket, God, twenty, I think it was twenty eight, something like that. You know, it's just disgusting. It's disgusting to to see that. It was a beautiful funeral, but I mean, you know what I'm saying? It's disgusting that this happened. It sucks. because he just had a return to use, right? I don't blame him. I don't fault him. I mean, I've had another situation. How about this John Cargyle? I still remember him. I still remember him. John Cargyle committed suicide in 2008. Someone made a Facebook group called Rip John Cargyle, and it's still up. I'll still go check it out every now and again. His mom will post every like once, every one or two years. And I still think about John. Because a lot of the buddies that he had in high school have gone on to do amazing things. Like some have opened up their own private equity firm and are making crazy money. And others are in high level jobs or realtors. And I just think John, you know, because he had a issue with alcohol, I think he had got some DWIs and he got the last one and he went went home and, you know, encountered a shotgun, right? I think he'd gotten in a a wreck or something and he just decided to pop it, right? Pop his top. And that one thing, that one instance, that one instance got him, right? And that one thing made and I don't fault him that, but I'm just saying that's that's how quick it it can happen. I also don't fault people. I say people died by suicide, not necessarily committed it, because suicide is absolutely a symptom that can occur of someone's you know experience, right? Of s of a d addiction, right? Of of all these different things. I mean, make no mistake about it. So I don't fault anyone, but I absolutely understand that he was an amazing man. And that guy had so much potential. and I think, man, where would he be today? Where would he be if he had stayed, if he had lived and but this is the reality. This is what happens. Scott: Yeah, when we talked on the phone, you used you used the word stigma once. W in our conversation we were talking about homeless people and and you know, and how you helped them and and we'll get to that, but I wanted to talk about that word stigma real quick. And my friend Vince, who recently a few months ago died of of cancer, was a couple months short of his thirtieth sober date, you know. And So he'd been sober for 30 years and and 14 years ago his son died of an overdose of of heroin. And I know I can talk about this because they created this thing called the Ryan House in Sogarties, New York. And it's it's a it's a sober house. And it's I go there every single morning, at 6 45 a.m. for a meeting. They have over 40 meetings per week in that in that house, and it's just an amazing place. that was born out of tragedy. It was born out of, Ryan dying of an overdose and his parents, his dad was in in sobriety at that time and they didn't want, they wanted people to learn from that. And that's what they talk about a lot is breaking this stigma of addiction and recovery. And it's not like, you know, I I've heard people talk about how they don't understand it. Why don't you just stop doing it and and, you know, are you having fun doing it? And it's That can't can't be farther from the truth, For me anyway. it w it was the last thing that I ever wanted to do was was continue to pick up. But for something to be born like the Ryan House to be born out of out of some tragedy like that is thank God for for people like that, you know, that don't let don't let that stuff go, you know. and and because of the Ryan House, I can't even tell you how many people have have gotten sober and stayed sober for long periods of time because of it. so let's talk about that, the what you do, what you do in your in your daily life now. So you're a certified alcohol and drug counselor and a coach, a re recovery coach. Let's talk about that a little bit. Chandler Picot: You could say yeah recovery coach, Scott: First, how did how did Chandler Picot: peer support specialist. Scott: I was gonna say what l what led you to that? What how did you how did you how did all that happen? Chandler Picot: I well really I always knew that I wanted to be involved in this work in some way. I always knew that I wanted to talk for a living. I th I did an audit of myself when I was younger. What do I like to do? And I love to talk. I always enjoyed talking. So I thought maybe I could be a th counselor, a therapist, but I I went away from it. and I always loved to help people. So when I got into recovery, It me it seemed like a logical step. A lot of people do that. They get into recovery and they get their peer support, which is an amazing certification to get no matter what. It teaches you how to really come at someone like on the same level. but ultimately what got me into it was all the amazing men and women that were there when I was going through treatment. I mean, that included going through rehab at Crestview in Asheville, Alpharetta, Georgia. I went to Sunrise Detox. I went to Twelve Steps to Peace and Purpose in Asheville, North Carolina. Ronan O'Laughlin was a huge inspiration for me. Art, I mean, there's there's so many different people who who showed me the way. Danny, Danny Brown, he was a inspiration for me. Shout out Danny Brown. Danny number two, right? Or is it number one? I I miss I mess with him on that. But yeah, it's just it's it's really it it's those people that showed me. Kevin Mahoney, who was almost like the the the father of peer support for North Carolina, at least in my head, right? Someone who who really showed me what it was what it meant to be a ethical peer support specialist. He taught my training course. so these people just left an imprint on me. They left an imprint. as to what can happen when we all come together and help people and showed me what it meant to be a peer support, to be a peer, to relate to someone, to help someone, to support someone, no matter where they're at. Scott: And it's gotta be, you know, for you and your background and your story, I can imagine, you know, just from my work in twelve step recovery with, you know, as a sponsor, I can imagine the work that you do, it's just another level. It's gotta be so rewarding for you. And it and I can imagine how much it helps your sobriety. Chandler Picot: It does. It does help my sobriety. I will say this too though. You have to watch out for burnout because you can burn out. I mean, if you're giving all day and you're not replenishing your cup, you're not setting hard boundaries, you're not doing what you need to do to maintain, then you can absolutely burn out. But is it rewarding? Yeah, I love doing it. I love helping the guys that I help. you know, right now I'm the program director for a low intensity clinical residential program. And it's amazing. you know, we're growing, we're helping more guys, you know, we're gonna eventually open up a women's house, eventually down the line, even a a family house, right? To be able to keep families together through this process. I mean, there's special, it would be special cases, special situations where it's deemed appropriate. We do a lot of re-entry. I didn't think I I mean, when when I first come in here, I I didn't imagine that I would enjoy re-entry as much as I do. And re-entry for me Is usually around the the prison population, folks who are coming out of jail institutions, prison. And I love working with folks who have come from that part. And I've learned a lot. I've learned a lot. I've learned so much by working with them. And th that's become an amazing part for me is working with people who are formerly incarcerated. Scott: Yeah. I can imagine. How let's talk about families and family addiction because alcohol isn't isn't just a you know a w it's a family it's a family addiction. It's a family illness. It it affects obviously the entire family. And so you must do a lot of work with not just the addicts or the alcoholics, but also the family. So can you talk about that a little bit? Chandler Picot: Yeah, absolutely. I've identified that. And some people are starting to a lot of people are starting to come around to it, I suppose. The need for family treatment as far as so what they used to do in the 60s and 70s is anytime someone had an issue like this or mental health, what they would do is they would take the whole family and they would put the whole family into treatment, right? Into the psych ward to because they realized there was a systemic issue. And I like to work with families now. I like to lurk. you know, work with moms, dads, brothers, sisters, and help them understand how they can work on themselves and how that will not only help them, but it will also help their loved one. And that's a process, right? I'm I'm going to be starting a family support group where family members can join. I mean, you can go to my website, you know, that's just my name, ChandlaPico.com, and you can find more information about that. because I I I just I really have a passion for that. I think about all the stuff that my family went through when I was in active addiction and the terror that they felt and the the fear, just the fear and not knowing how to help their loved one. And I I don't want that for other people. If there's a way I can help people, it's worth it. I remember thinking that when I was early on, if there's a way I can help one person, then I'll do it. And I'll do it. I don't care what it takes. If there's a way one person will get assistance, then it's worth it. Scott: Yeah, the the recovery center that you work for, right? You don't you work at a recovery center, is that correct? Chandler Picot: Mm. Don't own it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I work for it. Mm-hmm. I'm the program Scott: Okay. Chandler Picot: director. Scott: And and is Alcoholics Anonymous or narc and AA or NA a a big part of your programming? Chandler Picot: yeah, without a doubt. Yeah. We take guys to meetings. you know, I mean, they can do other options, right? They can do smart recovery, they can do this, they can do that. It it's fine. Whatever works for them is totally okay. It's just they gotta have some type of program that's working for them. I mean, if it's working for you, cool. If it's not, then then we need to talk. We need to figure out what it's. But we do, yeah, we we we we absolutely take the guys to meetings because that is it's a great way to connect with people and hopefully they get a sponsor and start working the program. Scott: Yeah. Yeah, and as much as AA for me, is like, you know, it saved my life, you know, it's given me a new life, taught me how to live a new way. I have to recognize that there are also other ways to get sober. And you mentioned one of them, SMART, smart recovery. So that's an acronym, correct? Chandler Picot: Yes, absolutely. SMART Recovery is an acronym. Don't ask me off the top of my head what it stands for, but Scott: Mm. Chandler Picot: yes, it is an acronym. Scott: glad you said that 'cause I was about to ask you, what does it stand for? okay, so can you talk about the difference between Chandler Picot: Yeah, yeah, I know. And you know what's crazy? I'm a facilitator too. Scott: That's okay. I Chandler Picot: Go ahead, I'm sorry. Scott: won't I won't judge you on it, man. Chandler Picot: Yeah, I'm actually a facilitator too. So that's so I I love the program. I always sometimes I don't remember, but it stands for self-management and recovery training. Bam. There we go. Self-management and recovery training. And what it is really is it's all about using practical skills to help yourself. And I always tell people you can be a 12-step member and still go to smart meetings. Just like you can be a Buddhist and you can be a Muslim or a Christian, right? It's a set of ideals, it's a set of practices. So, and it's great. It really works. That's the reason why I'm a huge fan of it. Scott: So it's not based on Mm-hmm. But it's not based on twelve step recovery, correct? Chandler Picot: Correct. It's not based on twelve step recovery. No. It's completely secular. Secular. It's based on just science and practical behaviors. I mean, that's really what they specialize in is what what does the evidence say? What does the scientific evidence say? So, and I mean it's beneficial. It's not like they don't pull stuff from twelve step. I'm sure, you know, if it's scientifically backed, they'll pull from it. But It's all about practicality and different things you can incorporate into your program. Scott: Yeah, and that's the great thing about sobriety. That's one thing I've learned is that everyone has their own way of staying sober, getting sober and staying sober. so you teach I don't know if that teach is the right word, but smart recovery and a 12 step program at your treatment center. So so how does that work with with do I call them patients? The people that are that are there, how do they decide? Is there a different path that they take that, some say I want to go twelve steps, some say I want to go recover smart recovery, how does that work? Chandler Picot: So we call them guest, but basically what what they do is we come in and we say, Look, okay, this is what we typically do. We go to meetings this day, that day, but we always give them an option. We say, look, if you want to do something different, if you come in here and you say, I want to try this, cool. We just we open the book and we ferry you to different pages. It's up to you to decide if you like that book. That's the narcotics anonymous book, that's the alcoholics anonymous book. That's a smart recovery facilitator manual book. I mean, there there's so many different options out there. Recovery Dharma. if you want to go to church and you're a big you know, Jesus fan, can do that. It's whatever works for you. Scott: Excuse me. So I mentioned earlier, when we were on the phone, we were talking about by the way, all all the great things that you do for for the sober community. Thank you for that. I mean, it's amazing. you know, not just being a a certified alcohol and drug counselor, that's amazing in its own, but like the people that you the and the families that you must help keep together is amazing. What about you mentioned homeless people? Is this something that you personally do or your treatment center branches out to help? Chandler Picot: I personally do. I personally enjoy helping folks. I've been a social worker for quite a few years. And I will work with people who are homeless and houseless. That's something I do privately. I go out and I support the community. We do work with homeless folks at at the place that I work for. Yes. And what I mean by that is I mean, we have folks who come off the streets who come to go to detox, go to treatment, and they come to us. So that's how we help the homeless directly is by housing. housing folks and giving them a different way to live. So that's that's one avenue. I also will personally go out and give people food that I know who live out in, you know, I mean, frankly in the wild, and support them and lend a ear. There are there's organizations that will do that throughout the the triad area. And I I've always been a big community advocate. So me going out there. is something that I really value. Going out there, supporting them, showing them that they're not alone, that they're not abnormal, that they're not that they're just like us. Scott: yeah, and you you also mentioned medical services through through Medicare. talk about that. Is that is that I can imagine that's an issue for a lot of people coming into your center. Like how do how do you deal with how do you specifically how would you deal with people that don't have that don't have insurance? Chandler Picot: So there the state set aside IPRS funding. Number one, you want to see if they do qualify for Medicaid. So we we take Medicaid. Medicare is more for we I think I'm gonna have to go back and look at that, but I know we take Medicaid. So basically what happens is people come in and if they don't have that, we have IPRS state funding, which that's funding that the state sets aside so you can pull from it. So you can pay for services or pay for, you know, whatever they got going on. but trying to get them on to that. I mean, because a lot of times they don't know they qualify. And there's so many different services that they qualify for. I mean, housing is not covered by Medicaid. It's it's the services that are covered, like group therapy, individual therapy, so you know, psychiatrist appointments, primary care, all that other stuff, right? So you want to just inform them of what's available to them and get them connected. That's the biggest thing. And that's what I've always done as a peer. Is connect people. Say, hey, you need to go to the doctor, let's set you up an appointment. Set you up on appointment with Motive Care, which is a non-emergency medical transportation company. you know, Medicaid will pay for parts of that. And y you've also seen, I don't know if you've seen this, but other people see it on social media, these idea this idea that you can up a so open up a sober living home or a group home and it's easy peasy and you can earn so much money. And every anyone I know who's been in this industry long enough will tell you. that it's not easy. It's a labor of love. You do it because you care. You're not going to make a ton of money. If you think you're going to make a ton of money, you're in wrong industry. You do this because you care, because you love it, because you feel called to it. and I've seen so many people who, you know, think they can get in this and it's going to be easy. And then they end up selling their homes or having to have someone come in there and fix it, get the people help, you know, try to get the people into treatment. I mean, because a lot of times they'll turn into people using. because you have to have a structured program. You have to have some type of accountability. and the reality is, it's it's not simple. It's not simple, but it's worth doing. It's worth doing. I mean, I definitely care. I love it. I've been doing it for almost two years. I love the guys that I'm working with. The owners are amazing. and to be able to be a part of the founding and seeing everything come together. and helping and being supportive has been just absolutely amazing. It's taught me so much. I've learned so much. I'm so grateful for this. It's opened me, opened my eyes to, you know, how you help people and what help can look like and to be a part of the change, to be able to house the homeless, to be able to help people who are coming from jails, institutions, and give them a second chance. I mean, a millionth chance like I was given is a is a blessing. It's such a blessing. So I love it. Scott: Yeah, it's interesting that you brought up social media posts because I just yesterday I saw one and they were mocking opening up you know, treatment facilities and you can make this much money and all you have to do is this and it's basically a scam. You know, they're scamming the government, lying to the government, just making up these fake, you know, treatment programs for people and and how much money you can make. And and then you open up twelve more, you know, after that first one and I don't know how true that is, how much truth there is, behind that, but you know, I don't I don't I don't doubt it. You know, people can make a make a buck on on you know any any way they possibly can. You know, what I was wondering, I don't know if anybody else is wondering this, but I am. So I'm gonna ask it. So you work in a treatment center, you're basic your life is basically surrounded by you know by sobriety, right? do Chandler Picot: Yes. Scott: you have a program outside of the treatment center? Like, do you have your own program? Chandler Picot: God, yes. There's no way. There's no way I could do this work and not recovery's everything to me. I have a sponsor, I have sponsees. You know, I work the steps. I practice the steps and work the steps daily. I mean I live this thing and that is not my stuff. That's not it. I don't consider going to meetings as going to meetings if I'm working. I do it on my own time. I meet with my sponsor, I sacrifice time to do it. Because it's important to me. I have service position. I have service work that I do. Because it's important to me. This is important to me. This is everything to me. This is how I've this is my medicine. To be honest with you, this is the best medicine I've ever had. God, why would I not take it? You know, it blows my mind. I'm not gonna tell you that doing this work, going to a meeting, I don't get any benefit from it because I do. But it never it never supplants the work that I do. Ever. Ever, ever, ever. Scott: Yeah, it's you know that that say one of the sayings that we have. anything that I put ahead of my sobriety, I lose. You know. Do you think that that so does that apply to your your work, right? I mean it's work. It it it's it's work in sobriety, but it's also it's work, you know? and I would imagine that that applies, you know, if you if you put that ahead of ahead of ahead of your own personal sobriety, which could be meetings. your sponsor, service work, whatever, Chandler Picot: Yeah, I would never do that. Never do that. It's always number one. I I will sacrifice for my recovery, period. No matter what I have to do. If I if I had to quit a job for it, I would, because that's how important it is to me. And if I had to move for it, I would. It's it's everything to me. I mean, it's my connection to God. It's my my ability to connect with people. It's my ability to help people. If I'm not taking care of me. If I'm not investing in myself and my health and my wealth and my spiritual side, then I I'm not going to be able to serve the people that I serve the best. It's just impossible. It's impossible to do. It's impossible. It really is. You have to be able to prioritize self-care yourself, focus on helping people, but also pouring into your own cup. That's just as valid as anything else. Scott: Yeah, I like the way you put that, pouring into your own cup. I I love talking about the the recovery aspect of alcohol and alcoholism and and addiction because, you know, for me, I've always been, you know, very ambitious and and you know, tried to do hard things, but but in sobriety, it's like it's like took taken that to a whole new level, which I would have never ever accomplish the things that I've been doing in sobriety had I of course had I been drinking or or or still using, and I think also my friend Vince, again, I love talking about this guy because he was such a he was such a huge part of the sober community around here. And one thing that he always used to say to everybody all the time was, well, a couple things. number one, if you want to hang out with sober if you want to stay sober, hang out with sober people. Pretty basic, right? And and the other thing was if I got what I thought I really wanted, I would have been selling myself way short. Which for me is a hundred percent true because I didn't even know what I wanted. I didn't know I wanted this kind of life that I'm living right now, doing a podcast talking to you about sobriety and all the the great things that come out of it and helping other people and doing service. I didn't know I wanted any of that. I didn't know it it exists existed, So it's it's just amazing what happens in sobriety. and and what we're capable of that we didn't even know. Chandler Picot: We're capable of a lot. We really are. There's so much that we can do, that we can be, that we can become. And I think a lot of it is finding out who you are, who you were before the drugs got to you, before this happened, before the world got to you. There's one thing I've learned in sobriety, it's that it's not about the drugs or alcohol or the substance. It's all about why we did that. Scott: Yeah, absolutely. they say that that drugs and alcohol are only a symptom. and like you said earlier, which to some people may sound harsh, excuse me, harsh, but suicide is a symptom, right? Of of of issues, of underlying issues. And you know, I can relate to that. My my sister died of suicide twenty six years ago. And and nobody could figure out why. we blamed it on we blamed it on a guy, we blamed it on other issues, you know, and and really no one talked about what she was going through. No one knew what she was going through, you know. so yeah. Chandler Picot: Sorry to hear that. Scott: Well thanks, man. Well, we're just about out of out of out of time here. Is there anything anything else you want to talk about before we close up here? Chandler Picot: I wanna say I really appreciate you taking time to talk to me and and I'm so grateful to be on this. I really am. I wanna let people know that it does get better. It is e it it does get easier too. I used to always want to know that. When I was in my throughout my journey, I wanted to know, does get does it get easier? Is it is it worth it? And it's worth it and it does get easier. So if you're struggling, reach out. Like I mentioned, my website. I'm on all the socials, Chandler Pico, Chandler.pico for Instagram. Type that in, P-I-C-O-T. that's also my website, Chandler Pico.com with a T, P-I-C-O-T.com. I'm building out resources out that that way on my website. I'm creating trying to create something amazing so that it can really help people, family members, loved ones, people you're going through addiction yourself, so you can find the treatment that you need. because that's my goal, right? Even if I can't help you directly, as in like come to this treatment center, come to that treatment center, we will ford somewhere where they can help you. because I I'm a big believer in that. So and thank you. Thank you for taking time. This this is important work and I appreciate you doing it. I really do. Scott: Well, thank you, man. I I I really appreciate you coming on and talking to me. And I will certainly put links in the show notes to all of your all of your sites, your social and and all of that stuff. I just want to say, to finish up, Chandler Picot: Thank you. Scott: to say it again, thank you for all the things you do for the sob sober community. You know, it is it is it is commendable, you know. I'm sure you're I'm sure you're making a huge impact down there in North Carolina and and they appreciate it. And I'm sure all my listeners are gonna appreciate what you do. So thank you so much. Chandler Picot: Thank you, man. I appreciate that. I really do. Scott: All right, Chandler. Chandler Picot: Thank you.