Latest / The Paul Barron Crypto Show / Fear Trade vs Bitcoin & Gold🔥Andy Schectman INTERVIEW

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Fear Trade vs Bitcoin & Gold🔥Andy Schectman INTERVIEW · The Paul Barron Crypto Show

0:00
Speaker 1: Today we're going to get into is it the death
0:02
Speaker 1: of the fear trade? And what I mean by that
0:04
Speaker 1: is what's happening in Iran and with the US around
0:07
Speaker 1: sanctions and of course the global impact of that will
0:10
Speaker 1: break it down for you. We've got a good guest
0:12
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0:46
Speaker 1: All right, let's get into a couple of points I
0:48
Speaker 1: want to focus on before we bring on Andy Sheckman,
0:50
Speaker 1: who will be hopefully giving us some insights to what's
0:54
Speaker 1: really happening in the gold market. But safe Haven eccess
0:57
Speaker 1: gold silver plunge. Trump obviously is de escalation is igniting
1:02
Speaker 1: a little bit of a rally in terms of equities,
1:05
Speaker 1: meaning stocks and bonds.
1:06
Speaker 2: We're starting to.
1:06
Speaker 1: See a little bit of movement here. Has the de
1:08
Speaker 1: escalation started? A couple of points I want to highlight
1:12
Speaker 1: here in this article. The death of fear trade return
1:14
Speaker 1: of the FED factor is my big concern. What happens
1:17
Speaker 1: now if this starts to rotate back into the FED
1:20
Speaker 1: and how this may actually get us into a position
1:23
Speaker 1: of a rate hike. I'll talk about that in a second.
1:25
Speaker 1: Before we go there, I want to show you this
1:27
Speaker 1: right here, Intel. This is coming in from Iran setting
1:30
Speaker 1: five demands on the ceasefire. The biggest one is the
1:33
Speaker 1: secondary sanctions, which is the one I want to get
1:35
Speaker 1: Andy's question on because these sanctions, if they get lifted,
1:39
Speaker 1: this could be very.
1:40
Speaker 2: Impactful for gold.
1:41
Speaker 1: Remember that the Iranians have been using bitcoin for quite
1:44
Speaker 1: a while. They are one of the large bitcoin miners
1:47
Speaker 1: out there, one of the biggest bitcoin ecosystems, and even
1:51
Speaker 1: the regular citizens of Iran have been utilizing bitcoin. So
1:54
Speaker 1: what happens if we actually see something happening, Because if
1:59
Speaker 1: you go for my Ranian's turning bitcoin into money transfers,
2:03
Speaker 1: and now you have sanctions being lifted.
2:05
Speaker 2: What does that look like as you start to pivot out?
2:08
Speaker 1: So think about that because it starts to really change
2:12
Speaker 1: the dynamic here around a handful of assets. One I
2:16
Speaker 1: want to kind of focus in on is tokenized commodities.
2:18
Speaker 1: You can kind of see it right there. This is
2:20
Speaker 1: where we're seeing tokenized gold right now, living on mostly
2:24
Speaker 1: XRP and Ethereum as who largest networks out there.
2:29
Speaker 2: So what does that mean?
2:30
Speaker 1: That means that we've got some activity going and starting
2:32
Speaker 1: to brew, maybe for the first time. And before we
2:35
Speaker 1: get into all of this, I want to bring on
2:37
Speaker 1: our guests, and of course that is Andy Sheckman coming in.
2:40
Speaker 2: How are you there.
2:41
Speaker 3: I'm good, Paul, Thanks for having me, buddy, appreciate it all.
2:44
Speaker 1: Right, So we're setting this up the death of the
2:47
Speaker 1: fear trade. We might have sanctions being lifted. It's possible
2:52
Speaker 1: that this thing gets de escalated and things are going
2:54
Speaker 1: to start rotating, possibly in some other assets. This, of
2:57
Speaker 1: course is where Iran is right now. They've set up
3:01
Speaker 1: kind of a little bit of a toll booth there
3:02
Speaker 1: in the straight of Hormuz charging ships for safe transit.
3:05
Speaker 1: It's like two million dollars a tanker in China. I
3:08
Speaker 1: shouldn't say dollars two million in Chinese, yon, I guess
3:12
Speaker 1: equivalent to two million dollars per tanker. So it kind
3:15
Speaker 1: of supports your theory is that we're starting to see
3:18
Speaker 1: this movement in terms of how many countries around the
3:22
Speaker 1: world are starting to transition into this.
3:25
Speaker 2: Now, with that being said, you look.
3:27
Speaker 1: At what's going on with the potential of the FED
3:30
Speaker 1: right now in a little bit of a tough spot.
3:32
Speaker 1: We've got rising job issues, obviously the inflationary component of
3:36
Speaker 1: what we've seen already coming in from this conflict in Iran.
3:40
Speaker 2: What do you think is going to.
3:41
Speaker 1: Happen here in terms of a FED hike or rate
3:45
Speaker 1: cut coming as we get a new FED chair coming in.
3:50
Speaker 3: Well, you know, that's arguably what started the ball rolling
3:55
Speaker 3: is Powell's admission not only of not raising rates or
3:59
Speaker 3: lower rates rather but maybe even acknowledging having to raise rates,
4:03
Speaker 3: which seems kind of tough. I mean, look, the bond
4:07
Speaker 3: market is already kind of having gyrations, with the ten
4:11
Speaker 3: year treasury up to four point four percent from four
4:14
Speaker 3: percent forty basis points in less than a month bonds
4:17
Speaker 3: are being sold, and that is the Fed's nightmare. They
4:20
Speaker 3: cannot cut without reigniting inflation, which seems to be really
4:24
Speaker 3: gathering steam as we see oil prices already up to
4:27
Speaker 3: Biden era gas prices here in the States. You know,
4:31
Speaker 3: higher inflation leads to higher interest rates, but they can't
4:34
Speaker 3: do that without smashing into the ten trillion dollars in
4:38
Speaker 3: bonds that need to be refinanced this year. And I
4:43
Speaker 3: think this is a problem that the FED is certainly
4:46
Speaker 3: trapped as far as I'm concerned. And you saw what
4:49
Speaker 3: happened when rates got anywhere near five percent with Silicon
4:52
Speaker 3: Valley Bank and Signature Bank, and the FED pivoted away
4:55
Speaker 3: from it the minute we got there. So can they
4:58
Speaker 3: do it? I think they would have a very hard
5:00
Speaker 3: time doing But the funny thing is, Paul, that's really
5:02
Speaker 3: what needs to be done. Needs to be done because
5:05
Speaker 3: prices and asset prices are distorted through years of suppress
5:09
Speaker 3: interest rates, and you know, lowering interest rates to get
5:12
Speaker 3: new home buyers into buying homes by being able to
5:15
Speaker 3: borrow more at inflated prices is not the answer. No
5:19
Speaker 3: answer is to have real interest rates at a level
5:21
Speaker 3: that finds real price discovery with asset prices that have
5:25
Speaker 3: been I don't know, disjointed and screwed up for a
5:30
Speaker 3: very long time. So if it happens, you know, you're
5:33
Speaker 3: looking at you're looking at massive stagflation. You're looking at
5:37
Speaker 3: you know, massive inflation meets the Great Depression. If they
5:41
Speaker 3: were to let rates run where they actually should.
5:43
Speaker 1: Be, that's an intro well, and you're dealing with a
5:46
Speaker 1: lot of people who have been calling for this. Goolesby
5:50
Speaker 1: says he could see a circumstance for a rate hike.
5:53
Speaker 1: What you're talking about is probably more and more of
5:56
Speaker 1: the governors.
5:57
Speaker 2: To maybe go in this direction.
5:59
Speaker 1: How do you think this plays out with Trump's anointed
6:03
Speaker 1: one if Walsh, you know, when you look at Kevin
6:05
Speaker 1: Walsh coming in and changing the game or the script here,
6:09
Speaker 1: do you think that can even be done? Or do
6:11
Speaker 1: you think we end up with maybe you know, higher
6:14
Speaker 1: for longer kind of strategy here?
6:16
Speaker 3: Well, I mean, look, it's interesting, the timing is interesting.
6:20
Speaker 3: We're still a little bit early. But you look at
6:23
Speaker 3: the Genius Act which goes into effect next January. Yeah,
6:26
Speaker 3: which the movement of dollars anywhere in the globe will
6:30
Speaker 3: be blockchain based and backed by stable coins backed by
6:35
Speaker 3: ninety day or less short term treasuries. That synthetic demand
6:38
Speaker 3: for the front end of the curve. That sounds like
6:39
Speaker 3: neutering the Fed to me. Everyone says he's so hawkish,
6:42
Speaker 3: you know, they can only play with the front end
6:44
Speaker 3: of the curve, the overnight lending rate. Well, if money
6:47
Speaker 3: is moving and backed by short term treasuries ninety days
6:50
Speaker 3: or less, synthetically pushing rates down, what power does he
6:55
Speaker 3: have to do anything about that? Really? You know, I
6:58
Speaker 3: I just can't see an environment where Trump would have
7:05
Speaker 3: selected this guy with intentions of raising rates. You've seen
7:11
Speaker 3: how steadfast and adamant he is about rates being lowered.
7:15
Speaker 3: But that is what got us in this problem to
7:17
Speaker 3: begin with, the suppression of interest rates where it distorted everything,
7:20
Speaker 3: created all of these imbalances, misallocations of resource and capital,
7:25
Speaker 3: and distortions and asset prices. It is the root of
7:27
Speaker 3: all the problems.
7:29
Speaker 2: What do you make of this? Right here?
7:31
Speaker 1: I'm looking at tokenized commodities right now, seven billion in
7:34
Speaker 1: market cap. But the point is the absolute unbelievable growth
7:39
Speaker 1: that we're seeing here, and especially centered around gold. This
7:43
Speaker 1: is of course cause the COMACS or the World Goal
7:47
Speaker 1: Council to come in and launch gold as a service.
7:50
Speaker 1: I don't know if you can see that their framework
7:51
Speaker 1: standardizing a scale tokenized gold across digital financial system.
7:56
Speaker 2: So this simply means more asset holders. What is it?
8:00
Speaker 2: It's what's going to happen here.
8:03
Speaker 3: I think it is the future of the gold market. Ultimately,
8:07
Speaker 3: it's a way to bridge you know, old school with
8:10
Speaker 3: new technology. And when you look at those that are
8:13
Speaker 3: out there, the digital gold system that is out there already,
8:17
Speaker 3: and there are some big players, but they're too fragmented
8:20
Speaker 3: with you know, each user is I don't know. They
8:24
Speaker 3: all have different systems, complex different systems, and I think
8:29
Speaker 3: what the World Gold Council is trying to do here
8:32
Speaker 3: is have shared infrastructure that handles the back end of
8:36
Speaker 3: things where the issuer keeps the brand, the customer relationship,
8:40
Speaker 3: the pricing, the product, and even the technology. The interoperability
8:45
Speaker 3: is what they talk about quite a bit in that paper.
8:48
Speaker 3: Where as long as partners are working under common standards,
8:53
Speaker 3: you know, the goal is to make gold more redeemable,
8:57
Speaker 3: as I mentioned, inoperable, portable to use it in terms
9:01
Speaker 3: of collateral, collateral you know, it's very difficult to collateralize
9:07
Speaker 3: your goal that's held in your basement safe. This is
9:09
Speaker 3: a way to do it, and I guess it's really
9:12
Speaker 3: about you know, kind of look at it this way
9:15
Speaker 3: as it is right now. Each one of these these entities,
9:18
Speaker 3: whether it be tether or packs or any of the
9:21
Speaker 3: other it's like having different gift cards to different malls
9:26
Speaker 3: or different stores. They kind of want to make it
9:29
Speaker 3: a visa card where it's it can be used everywhere
9:32
Speaker 3: and they don't have to have the same technology, but
9:36
Speaker 3: they have to have the same at least the same
9:40
Speaker 3: shared standards. So it allows the ability of fungibility, It
9:46
Speaker 3: allows collateralization, it allows the ability to stand for delivery.
9:50
Speaker 3: It's an interesting thought where the World Gold Council basically says,
9:54
Speaker 3: you don't need to do everything will help you with
9:56
Speaker 3: the back end. You just need to be able to
9:58
Speaker 3: meet the set of criteria plus ug into it. And
10:01
Speaker 3: it really does if you are able to accomplish that
10:04
Speaker 3: with credibility, Where's it held, who's auditing it? How can
10:08
Speaker 3: I take possession of it? Can I use it for
10:11
Speaker 3: collateral is it fungible? Can I redeem it? All of
10:15
Speaker 3: these things I think they're trying to do to make
10:18
Speaker 3: gold more relevant instead of watching it fade away because
10:23
Speaker 3: it is in essence bulky and clunky as it pertains
10:28
Speaker 3: to modern financial world events.
10:31
Speaker 1: Do you think that this model that they're referencing would
10:35
Speaker 1: require KYC.
10:42
Speaker 3: The KYC would be on the end, so yes, I mean,
10:46
Speaker 3: but that wouldn't be their responsibility. That would be the
10:49
Speaker 3: responsibility of whoever is onboarding these people. So in essence,
10:53
Speaker 3: if you look like a company like Miles Franklin would
10:55
Speaker 3: be the front end facing with the clients who are
10:58
Speaker 3: helping bridge them into the new ecosystem, arguably it would
11:03
Speaker 3: be a company like mine or any other company that
11:05
Speaker 3: plugs into it that would need to do KYC. I
11:07
Speaker 3: don't think you're going to get away from KYC or
11:09
Speaker 3: AML legislation, regulation. It's a way I think to standardize
11:16
Speaker 3: it more than anything, and not just compliance, but liquidity reporting, redemption, vaulting, insurance,
11:25
Speaker 3: all of this stuff.
11:26
Speaker 1: Andy, how would they compete with paxos or an xaut
11:30
Speaker 1: from Tether because that you can go into a DeFi
11:33
Speaker 1: wallet or any self custody wallet and do that without KYC. Today,
11:38
Speaker 1: flip your bitcoin into gold, eth into gold doesn't matter.
11:41
Speaker 1: No KYC full flexibility in the DeFi ecosystem, how would
11:45
Speaker 1: they compete with that?
11:48
Speaker 3: I think it's more along the lines of redemption. It's
11:51
Speaker 3: more along the lines of liquidity in the respect of
11:58
Speaker 3: you know. Again, and I'm not exactly sure because paper
12:01
Speaker 3: is is. It's a theory, right, it's it's not it's
12:04
Speaker 3: nothing in stone. They're in fact, they're asking for people
12:07
Speaker 3: to come back with their input. But I think ky
12:10
Speaker 3: SE when it comes to a physical commodity, is something
12:13
Speaker 3: you'll never get around. And I can't see maybe I'm wrong,
12:16
Speaker 3: but you tell me, are you able to take gold
12:18
Speaker 3: out of packsos without any KYC? I would have a
12:22
Speaker 3: hard time believing you can redeem anything without it.
12:24
Speaker 1: No, there's no redemption, right, And so it's held as
12:28
Speaker 1: an asset that's going up in you know, it's a
12:29
Speaker 1: speculative asset. I wouldn't say it would be a store
12:32
Speaker 1: of value that you would correlate into either a stable
12:35
Speaker 1: coin or.
12:35
Speaker 2: Into another asset like bitcoin or eat whatever it might
12:38
Speaker 2: be to me, But that's me. That's what the kids want, Andy,
12:41
Speaker 2: that's what the kids want.
12:43
Speaker 3: I understand that. But the gold bug they don't care
12:47
Speaker 3: about these things. Maybe they will at some point. What
12:49
Speaker 3: they care about is where's the gold, who's auditing it?
12:51
Speaker 3: How do I get possession of it? You know, these
12:54
Speaker 3: kinds of things, and then bring it into the ability
12:57
Speaker 3: to to have it collateralized, bring it into the ability
13:01
Speaker 3: to you know, have that that that fungibility across the
13:07
Speaker 3: entire ecosystem. That hopefully would bring the young kids into it.
13:11
Speaker 3: But there is no way around k y C. If
13:15
Speaker 3: you ever plan to redeem it now setting up the account,
13:17
Speaker 3: maybe you can, maybe they will allow that. I would
13:20
Speaker 3: have a hard time believing it, But you know, I
13:22
Speaker 3: think anyone that I mean, you could.
13:24
Speaker 2: Want it easily.
13:26
Speaker 1: If somebody did want, I guess there is a way
13:28
Speaker 1: for for you to take custody if you were to
13:31
Speaker 1: flip out of your X, A U T into say bitcoin,
13:34
Speaker 1: and and they'll say you had an issue or someone
13:37
Speaker 1: like you that would take bitcoin for payment, And basically
13:41
Speaker 1: that's the off ramp.
13:42
Speaker 3: So yeah, but it's not because we use. It's not
13:45
Speaker 3: because we use, and that is the off ramp. We
13:48
Speaker 3: would use bit pay and bit pay does KYC on
13:50
Speaker 3: anything over twenty five hundred bucks?
13:52
Speaker 1: Well, Well, that's my thought is that once you got
13:54
Speaker 1: a physical you're at k y C level right there.
13:56
Speaker 4: Correctly, Yeah, correct, But that's any of these things, any
14:01
Speaker 4: of these things that have a shared infrastructure for digital gold,
14:04
Speaker 4: if you're going to take possession, that's the key.
14:07
Speaker 3: Can I get it in a small, fungible form that
14:10
Speaker 3: is recognized globally, and if so, where's it held and
14:13
Speaker 3: who's auditing it? And how do I get it? That's
14:15
Speaker 3: the key. If you solve that, you win. And I
14:18
Speaker 3: think if even the young kids thought about it, that's
14:21
Speaker 3: the most important part of it, because it really it
14:25
Speaker 3: in my mind, brings the whole thing together with credibility
14:28
Speaker 3: and authenticity.
14:30
Speaker 1: Interesting, well, it brings me to this topic, and that's
14:34
Speaker 1: that hyper Liquid came in and outperforms Comax in the
14:38
Speaker 1: silver market during this stress test. Do you think that
14:42
Speaker 1: kind of performance or that event was a wake up
14:46
Speaker 1: call for Comax? I mean, this is a company that
14:48
Speaker 1: is eighteen months old.
14:51
Speaker 3: Yeah, it should be, because the Comax is a system
14:54
Speaker 3: that is losing credibility rapidly, rapidly, and you're beginning to
14:58
Speaker 3: see that by the amount of de liveries and the
15:00
Speaker 3: amount of offloads we're seeing metal leave comes at a
15:05
Speaker 3: rapid pace, and I think that is indeed a I
15:11
Speaker 3: don't know if that was the wake up call as
15:13
Speaker 3: much as just the lack of trust in the system,
15:16
Speaker 3: where we've had four episodes since Thanksgiving that they call glitches,
15:20
Speaker 3: two on the upside and two on the downside where
15:23
Speaker 3: they say the circuit breakers glitched, and two on the
15:26
Speaker 3: upside where the market was roaring, it stops, you know,
15:29
Speaker 3: on Thanksgiving night, and then glitches for twelve hours and
15:32
Speaker 3: when it opens, it crashes. The same thing happened the
15:36
Speaker 3: thousand commodities are so traded on comex only the Golden
15:39
Speaker 3: Silver market where the server's overheat at eleven o'clock at
15:42
Speaker 3: night on Thanksgiving. Really interesting. These are the kind of
15:45
Speaker 3: things just like you know, Jeffrey Epstein the night before
15:49
Speaker 3: he passed away, his cellmate was transferred out and the
15:53
Speaker 3: guards fell asleep the next night and the cameras didn't work.
15:56
Speaker 3: So these are things that make you just say, Okay, interesting,
16:01
Speaker 3: how probable. And when we see metal leaving the Comex
16:05
Speaker 3: the way that it is. Just on Friday we saw
16:07
Speaker 3: two million ounces leave out of the register, I mean
16:09
Speaker 3: now the eligible category. In February we saw twenty six
16:14
Speaker 3: million ounces delivered, which was a very low amount for
16:17
Speaker 3: the last sixteen months, because February is not a primary
16:20
Speaker 3: delivery month. It's January, it's March, it's May. But of
16:25
Speaker 3: the twenty six million ounces, one hundred and sixty percent
16:29
Speaker 3: of that which deliveries could explain alone left comes thirty
16:33
Speaker 3: eight almost thirty nine million ounces, over two million pounds
16:36
Speaker 3: gotten trucks and drove away. That's never coming back. And
16:39
Speaker 3: the question is who the hell is doing that? And
16:41
Speaker 3: that's what the media is missing. This is the lack
16:44
Speaker 3: of credibility, I think. And when you see two million
16:48
Speaker 3: ounces leave the eligible category, which aren't even the bars
16:51
Speaker 3: backing the contracts that's registered, that's just people saying I
16:54
Speaker 3: want out, I don't trust it. Time to go. And
16:57
Speaker 3: I think that is what you will see as the
16:59
Speaker 3: extra angees in the bricks are built or Saint Petersburg
17:03
Speaker 3: or Moscow or Singapore or Shanghai, these vaults, which are
17:08
Speaker 3: largely cash and carry, are going to replace. In fact,
17:12
Speaker 3: as of April first, India said no more will we
17:15
Speaker 3: use the benchmark in London for our ETFs. We will
17:17
Speaker 3: use the Indian benchmark. It is a greater reflection of
17:21
Speaker 3: real prices. The Western system is being looked at, I
17:25
Speaker 3: think as something that is not only fractional, but as
17:28
Speaker 3: borderline a Ponzi scheme, And quietly the participants are exiting
17:33
Speaker 3: stage left.
17:33
Speaker 1: Well, that gets to the point of that, do you
17:35
Speaker 1: think this is tradfi just simply trying to play catch
17:39
Speaker 1: up right now with what's happening on the token is side,
17:41
Speaker 1: because we're going to have every commodity out there token
17:44
Speaker 1: is is. You're going to have these major power players
17:46
Speaker 1: moving into this beyond hyper liquid, which was crazy. They
17:50
Speaker 1: processed one point one five billion in silver perpse that
17:54
Speaker 1: was forty percent of the CME futures on data.
17:57
Speaker 3: It is and when you see the World Gold Councils
18:00
Speaker 3: standing behind it, behind it acknowledging this, it is legitimized.
18:05
Speaker 3: I do believe that. Look when you see every giving,
18:10
Speaker 3: just about every given month, as you get towards delivery
18:15
Speaker 3: the end of the contract, the open interest is eight, ten,
18:19
Speaker 3: twelve times the amount of bars that could stand for delivery.
18:22
Speaker 3: And every month they find a way somehow, whether it's
18:25
Speaker 3: a glitch or just working down the open interest by
18:28
Speaker 3: you know, giving incentivizing cash settlement or whatever. The heck
18:32
Speaker 3: it is. We're getting to that point where I think
18:36
Speaker 3: you'd be silly to not look at it with cross
18:38
Speaker 3: eyes and say I don't feel comfortable leaven my metal
18:41
Speaker 3: there because force mature or games that are being played
18:45
Speaker 3: where the exchange does whatever they can to protect the exchange.
18:49
Speaker 3: These things are happening too often to see four glitches,
18:52
Speaker 3: so to speak. Since Thanksgiving. I think, fool me once,
18:56
Speaker 3: shame on you fool me four times and probably a
18:58
Speaker 3: fifth six and seven, you know, shame meet.
19:01
Speaker 1: Listen, there's big moves happening at Teather right now. They
19:04
Speaker 1: just sign an agreement with a Big four, which means
19:07
Speaker 1: full audit supposedly. Now we've I don't know that we've
19:10
Speaker 1: heard this before, but we've had, you know, inklings that
19:13
Speaker 1: there would be an audit. But of course there's pal
19:16
Speaker 1: Ardonio talking about this right here. When you look at
19:18
Speaker 1: Tether making a move here, because this would be their
19:21
Speaker 1: first ever real audit coming in. Do you and they
19:25
Speaker 1: are a major holder? I think they might be.
19:27
Speaker 2: Maybe they are the largest holder of gold.
19:29
Speaker 3: Now it's quite outside of central banks. They are the
19:32
Speaker 3: largest in the world outside of central bank holdings. They are,
19:35
Speaker 3: so with.
19:35
Speaker 1: That being the case, What kind of impact would this
19:39
Speaker 1: have if they become a truly audited platform, Because to
19:42
Speaker 1: your point, that's what a lot of goldbugs, you know, want,
19:46
Speaker 1: is they want verification that yeah, that's my gold is there,
19:49
Speaker 1: and I could hold a digital asset in replace of that,
19:52
Speaker 1: a token which is xa ut. Why would you know
19:56
Speaker 1: a goldbug not want to do that if it came
19:59
Speaker 1: to that level.
20:00
Speaker 3: I think some of them would. I think where they
20:02
Speaker 3: fall short is in redemption. I think that's the key.
20:05
Speaker 3: How do you redeem it in what form? I think
20:07
Speaker 3: they're in very large forms as far as I know,
20:11
Speaker 3: not an expert on that yet, I'm working on it.
20:13
Speaker 3: I've been studying it a lot, this whole ecosystem, I think.
20:18
Speaker 3: You know, there are a lot of coincidences, especially with
20:20
Speaker 3: USA tether and bo Hines as a CEO who was
20:23
Speaker 3: Trump's cryptos are their massive accumulation of gold, which is
20:27
Speaker 3: the way to devalue the dollar. And I think that
20:29
Speaker 3: is ultimately what this administration is trying to do, the
20:32
Speaker 3: debasement trade. Debase the dollar. How do you do it?
20:35
Speaker 3: You let gold go higher and higher and higher and higher.
20:37
Speaker 3: Take the interest that is not transferable. I'll of the
20:40
Speaker 3: Clarity Act and buy gold, which devalues the dollar, pushes
20:43
Speaker 3: gold much, much, much higher. And I wouldn't be surprised
20:46
Speaker 3: if some of this gold somehow wink wink nod nods
20:49
Speaker 3: and ends up being sold to the Treasury Department. Now
20:51
Speaker 3: that's just a guess, but a lot of these things
20:54
Speaker 3: are adding up. And if you look, for example, if
20:56
Speaker 3: you measure the Dollar index, the dollar only fell by
20:59
Speaker 3: ten percent. You measured against gold, which is the only
21:02
Speaker 3: neutral asset to measure against all currencies. The dollar was
21:07
Speaker 3: down eighty percent against gold last year. And you know,
21:11
Speaker 3: so that is what I think they're trying to do.
21:13
Speaker 3: When when Roosevelt confiscated gold in thirty three at twenty
21:16
Speaker 3: bucks an ounce, paid everyone twenty sixty seven, and back
21:19
Speaker 3: then a dozen eggs were nickels, so sixty seven cents
21:22
Speaker 3: was a lot of money to people in nineteen thirty three.
21:24
Speaker 3: He then immediately devalued the dollar by forty percent against gold,
21:27
Speaker 3: making gold thirty five bucks an ounce. That is how
21:30
Speaker 3: you debase the currency and devalue the dollar. So I
21:34
Speaker 3: would not be surprised if there is something here about
21:38
Speaker 3: tether being kind of given the pass. Yes, they are
21:41
Speaker 3: finally getting audited, but they were supposedly in some sort
21:44
Speaker 3: of hot water for a while that kind of went away.
21:47
Speaker 3: I don't know. I think they're part of what President
21:50
Speaker 3: Trump is trying to do, and that's why Bohines was
21:52
Speaker 3: slid into the CEO role of USA Tether, which is
21:55
Speaker 3: genius at Compliant. But as far as your question, I
21:59
Speaker 3: think they've a little bit short on redemption and that
22:03
Speaker 3: is one of the big keys. Where's it being held?
22:06
Speaker 3: Who's auditing it? You know, I don't know where Teather
22:09
Speaker 3: keeps their gold, but I think if you solve these
22:13
Speaker 3: questions and how can I get it in a fungible form,
22:16
Speaker 3: you win. And I think, well, they're very legit. I
22:20
Speaker 3: think for the retail side they fall a little bit
22:23
Speaker 3: short in terms of collateralization. In terms of all of
22:25
Speaker 3: the other things, they're well ahead of the game, yes well,
22:28
Speaker 3: but in terms of a tract gold bug, they may
22:31
Speaker 3: fall a little short at least right now.
22:32
Speaker 1: I want to outline some recent investments that they've made,
22:37
Speaker 1: so you've got a lot of money going into rumble
22:39
Speaker 1: right there. But the one that we highlighted was gold
22:41
Speaker 1: dot com. They came in and grabbed an investment there
22:44
Speaker 1: of one hundred and fifty million anchors Digital Gold Royalty
22:49
Speaker 1: Speed one Paraffin. It appears that they are definitely on
22:54
Speaker 1: the move in terms of some architecture that's being built
22:58
Speaker 1: in and around this now that they're getting into a
23:00
Speaker 1: Big four accounting firm for an audit. I'm just saying
23:05
Speaker 1: there's some interesting things happening there.
23:07
Speaker 3: There are a lot of companies in this space right
23:09
Speaker 3: now that I'm aware of that are doing the same thing,
23:12
Speaker 3: and there is a race to do it and to
23:14
Speaker 3: do it right. Yeah, pretty darn close, Pretty darn close.
23:19
Speaker 3: I mean, look, Teather is a behemoth when you talk
23:21
Speaker 3: about fifteen billion in gold in their coffers. They are
23:26
Speaker 3: and they are ahead of the game certainly. But there
23:28
Speaker 3: are a lot of very big players that there have
23:30
Speaker 3: been press releases, a lot of big players that are
23:35
Speaker 3: entering this space with a common theme, and the World
23:39
Speaker 3: Gold Console wants to take all of these players and
23:42
Speaker 3: let them have their architecture, but the commonality at the
23:46
Speaker 3: back end to plug in so that you can have collateral,
23:50
Speaker 3: you can see different asset classes being shared, and you
23:54
Speaker 3: can do payments and all of the things that you
23:56
Speaker 3: would see with bitcoin. Or that you would see with dollar.
24:00
Speaker 3: Ultimately to bring gold into the modern era so that
24:05
Speaker 3: young kids don't look at it as something my grandfather
24:08
Speaker 3: used to hold, instead something that should be held that
24:10
Speaker 3: is a prudent way to hold it, but that gives
24:12
Speaker 3: you the liquidity, gives you the ability to transact across
24:16
Speaker 3: platforms or across borders very easily. The whole argument behind
24:21
Speaker 3: cryptocurrency and bitcoin would be the same argument here. That's
24:25
Speaker 3: what they're trying to do to standardize it while letting
24:28
Speaker 3: each company keep the client, keep the you know, their infrastructure,
24:33
Speaker 3: plugging into a common set of rules that everyone else
24:35
Speaker 3: would do. It's a it's a very ambitious, yet very
24:39
Speaker 3: interesting thought, and it is probably where this market ultimately
24:44
Speaker 3: is going. But we're early, but I can tell you
24:46
Speaker 3: I know that there are a lot of companies that
24:48
Speaker 3: are moving down this road right now.
24:50
Speaker 1: All right, let me go to this and then we're
24:52
Speaker 1: going to get into our lightning round. This is where
24:55
Speaker 1: you parking your wealth right now. In twenty twenty six,
24:57
Speaker 1: we've got like twelve hundred votes in on this. Right now,
25:00
Speaker 1: you're gonna pick metals here on this, so I'm gonna
25:03
Speaker 1: click that for you unless.
25:05
Speaker 2: You want to go another route, would you go in metal?
25:08
Speaker 3: No? I mean, look, you know that's that's where that's
25:12
Speaker 3: my that's my deal, and I'll fall on the sword
25:14
Speaker 3: for it. I don't, I don't, I don't apologize for it,
25:17
Speaker 3: but you know, real quick, having being on the show
25:20
Speaker 3: with you, and and Mark Moss is my buddy, and
25:23
Speaker 3: Natalie Burnell and and bit Swan Bitcoin and and Kyle Chase,
25:27
Speaker 3: all these people that I that I interact with and
25:30
Speaker 3: am on their shows are there on mine. My whole
25:33
Speaker 3: idea is bringing these two communities together, and it always
25:36
Speaker 3: has been, we're far better together than we are, divisive
25:39
Speaker 3: and at each other's throats, making mutual exclusivity of of
25:43
Speaker 3: what should be a shared existence and a stronger equalsystem.
25:47
Speaker 3: So I'm not atverse to those things. But my knowledge base,
25:51
Speaker 3: my world is metals.
25:53
Speaker 1: I understand we're gonna go to our lightning round. I
25:56
Speaker 1: got some good fast questions for you here. The first
25:59
Speaker 1: one is his biggest market risk to watch out for
26:02
Speaker 1: private credit or Trump's.
26:04
Speaker 3: Gut private credit for sure?
26:07
Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, I'm with you on that one.
26:09
Speaker 1: Actually, even though Trump could do some very interesting things, Uh,
26:13
Speaker 1: tether becomes the largest gold central bank.
26:22
Speaker 3: Maybe maybe you're on that. I'll give that one to
26:25
Speaker 3: Maybe there's gonna be a lot of challenges to them.
26:28
Speaker 1: I was gonna say I'd fall more in the no
26:30
Speaker 1: camp just because of the potential susceptibility two sanctions. Now,
26:34
Speaker 1: if they get audited and you know, kind of get
26:37
Speaker 1: in line with the US, that would change things up
26:40
Speaker 1: pretty quickly.
26:41
Speaker 3: I think they will. That's why bo Hines is there.
26:43
Speaker 3: Who was Trump's cryptos?
26:44
Speaker 2: Are they do that?
26:47
Speaker 3: I think they are be huge.
26:48
Speaker 2: That'd be huge.
26:50
Speaker 1: There will be more tokenized gold startups than there are
26:53
Speaker 1: total physical gold companies in the next couple of years.
26:56
Speaker 3: What do you think, No, I think it'll be a
27:02
Speaker 3: consolidation of big entities. I'd say no. I'd say no
27:07
Speaker 3: on that, But there will be a lot of interest
27:09
Speaker 3: in a lot of big companies that are joining in
27:11
Speaker 3: that game.
27:11
Speaker 1: I'm on the fence because I think there will be
27:13
Speaker 1: a lot. I just don't know if tokenized startups will
27:17
Speaker 1: be as big. I mean, because there's probably how many
27:22
Speaker 1: are there Andy how many gold company physical gold companies
27:26
Speaker 1: out there, at least in the United States?
27:28
Speaker 2: What would you say.
27:28
Speaker 3: There's fifteen hundred? But what is The definition of a
27:31
Speaker 3: gold company could be a small company that does half
27:34
Speaker 3: a million in sales or a big company that does
27:36
Speaker 3: a billion in sales.
27:37
Speaker 2: Let's do the top twenty percent. What do you think
27:40
Speaker 2: it would be?
27:40
Speaker 3: The top ten or less? And I think most of
27:43
Speaker 3: those companies will find a way to connect to if
27:46
Speaker 3: there is something like what the white paper the World
27:49
Speaker 3: Gold Council is talking about, they will have no choice
27:51
Speaker 3: but to connect to an ecosystem like that.
27:55
Speaker 1: All right, here's one for you, Miss Franklin will choose
27:57
Speaker 1: to diversify gold holdings into a digital gold XAUT.
28:04
Speaker 2: You think I.
28:05
Speaker 3: Would say there's a high probability that we will do
28:08
Speaker 3: something like that, whether it's XAUT or something else. Okay, yeah,
28:12
Speaker 3: I do. I think that's the way the industry is moving.
28:14
Speaker 1: Yeah, Rumble is adding gold now for tipping for creator payments.
28:21
Speaker 2: What do you think the users will use?
28:23
Speaker 1: You think they'll use gold or do you think they'll
28:25
Speaker 1: use bitcoin because they've had bitcoin for a long time.
28:29
Speaker 3: I think for now they'll use bitcoin. I think over
28:32
Speaker 3: time you'll see gold being used more and more. And
28:34
Speaker 3: I love that. I love the fact that young people
28:37
Speaker 3: are beginning to understand what gold is all about.
28:39
Speaker 2: That's good.
28:40
Speaker 1: Legacy boomer gold companies are vastly underestimating the power of
28:45
Speaker 1: gold yields. In DeFi there's yields being paid out there
28:49
Speaker 1: on gold right now today.
28:53
Speaker 3: Yeah. I think the legacy gold companies underestimate the power
28:57
Speaker 3: of anything digital right now, and they go into a
29:01
Speaker 3: kicking and screaming. I understand that because I've had an
29:04
Speaker 3: open eye to all of this for a long time.
29:06
Speaker 3: So yes, for sure they underestimate it.
29:09
Speaker 1: Clarity Act is banning stable coin yields is a bullish
29:13
Speaker 1: move for gold as legal tender because there's no ban
29:16
Speaker 1: on gold yields right now.
29:18
Speaker 3: I think it is.
29:19
Speaker 1: Yes, that'd be a bull bull Okay, all right, I'm
29:22
Speaker 1: with you on that one too.
29:24
Speaker 2: I think that's a bullish move. Let's go into tether.
29:27
Speaker 1: Gold is on ethereum and XRP proves bitcoin is.
29:31
Speaker 2: Not the best home for gold bugs.
29:33
Speaker 1: So the alternative here is, if you want to diversify,
29:36
Speaker 1: you are going to whole gold physical. You're going to
29:38
Speaker 1: hold ether an XRP, which of course.
29:40
Speaker 2: Is backed by gold a lot.
29:43
Speaker 3: Yeah, and again, you know, being married to one ideology
29:47
Speaker 3: is not always the best path. I mean, I should know,
29:51
Speaker 3: I've been married to one ideology for a long time
29:53
Speaker 3: until I've opened my eyes and try and find Look
29:56
Speaker 3: the difference between intelligence and smart. You can be really intelligent,
30:00
Speaker 3: but you focus too much on too little, so you
30:02
Speaker 3: learn more and more about less and less till you
30:04
Speaker 3: know everything about nothing. Smart means you have the ability
30:07
Speaker 3: to open your eyes, learn, change your opinion. And yes,
30:11
Speaker 3: I think it isn't the best I think the answer is.
30:17
Speaker 2: Yes, here's a crazy idea.
30:19
Speaker 1: If a large enough percentage of US treasuries are held
30:22
Speaker 1: on eth. Okay, because you've got a potential here of
30:27
Speaker 1: Scott Bessen coming in and saying, okay, maybe eth is
30:29
Speaker 1: a strategic asset like silverm.
30:36
Speaker 3: No, I don't think so. I do not think so,
30:39
Speaker 3: because no, I'll just say no.
30:42
Speaker 1: All right, so with ether, because ethereum essentially is the
30:46
Speaker 1: background of the or the back end of this to
30:48
Speaker 1: where these assets, whether they're held against token I securities,
30:53
Speaker 1: which is what ethereum is. If you had all this
30:57
Speaker 1: token is securities being purchased up globally, remember USDC, all
31:01
Speaker 1: these stable coins. You still don't you wouldn't think that
31:04
Speaker 1: ETH would be Hey, this is a this is a
31:07
Speaker 1: critical asset that kind of runs our system.
31:10
Speaker 3: Now, who do we know what what system the Genius
31:16
Speaker 3: Act will work with.
31:19
Speaker 2: Well, it's designed with all.
31:21
Speaker 1: But eth is right now the winner when it comes
31:24
Speaker 1: to real world assets, token I securities, stable coins, it's
31:30
Speaker 1: by far the big leader right now.
31:32
Speaker 3: And then you have I mean, I guess if all
31:34
Speaker 3: of the world's assets and treasuries are trading over one platform, yeah,
31:38
Speaker 3: I guess it would be multi Again, now you're still
31:41
Speaker 3: now you're stepping a little bit outside of my purview
31:44
Speaker 3: and it would only be a guess, but I could
31:46
Speaker 3: see where you're going with that, and yeah, I guess
31:48
Speaker 3: it would probably make it more valuable because of the
31:51
Speaker 3: mass adoption and how relevant it is to the system.
31:55
Speaker 1: Well, it's it's the most right now. And again remember
31:58
Speaker 1: that all of this has yet to completely come on chain,
32:03
Speaker 1: and you know Larry Fink talks about this, it's eighteen
32:05
Speaker 1: months away.
32:06
Speaker 2: Once we get to that level.
32:08
Speaker 1: That's the question I was getting at, is if there's
32:10
Speaker 1: a large enough percentage of US treasuries that are out
32:14
Speaker 1: there being backed and run on ethereum, whether it's being
32:19
Speaker 1: backed by you know, stable coin, USDC, tether or USD
32:23
Speaker 1: at now or many other ones that are going to
32:27
Speaker 1: come to market that are going to have to go
32:28
Speaker 1: out and buy a security, and most likely we'll use
32:31
Speaker 1: Ethereum or a handful of blockchains. I guess the question
32:34
Speaker 1: is really boiling down. Could it become a strategic asset?
32:38
Speaker 3: So, yeah, I guess so. I mean, in the end,
32:40
Speaker 3: I think it's the one that offers the greatest speed
32:43
Speaker 3: and the greatest safety in the world of quantum computing
32:47
Speaker 3: and a world of increasing you know, technology, I guess
32:52
Speaker 3: the one that wins is the one that is the
32:53
Speaker 3: safest and the fastest and has the least friction. And again,
32:57
Speaker 3: if that is Ethereum, then absolutely it would have a
33:01
Speaker 3: I guess could have a critical value to it.
33:03
Speaker 1: Tokenized gold and treasuries are susceptible to government control.
33:08
Speaker 3: Meaning absolutely they are in the respect that even if
33:12
Speaker 3: they're issued by you know, third party companies like Tether,
33:16
Speaker 3: the plumbing goes in and out of the treasury. And
33:20
Speaker 3: so I had Katherine Austin Fits on my show and
33:23
Speaker 3: she said, more or less at stable coins are the
33:27
Speaker 3: way that the Genius Act reads is because they the
33:31
Speaker 3: Clarity Act does not limit programmability. They have KYC, KYT
33:35
Speaker 3: or your transaction and AML a technology already integrated into it,
33:39
Speaker 3: but there is no language that limits programmability. She says.
33:43
Speaker 3: They are a CBDC in stable coin clothing.
33:46
Speaker 1: So yes, interesting, Okay, all right, so you're kind of
33:49
Speaker 1: in that because I look at it in the censorship
33:52
Speaker 1: free area, which we think is going to be ethereum
33:55
Speaker 1: and a handful of others that would probably fall into
33:57
Speaker 1: that category. I know metallic is put hard in this area.
34:02
Speaker 1: Last question here, Tucker Carlson said bitcoin was created by
34:06
Speaker 1: the CIA. Then, of course he launched conveniently a gold
34:11
Speaker 1: company to rival the evil gold olive art companies that
34:15
Speaker 1: are out there opportunistic here legitimate business.
34:20
Speaker 3: Well only because I'm very very very good friends with
34:23
Speaker 3: the gentleman he went into business with. I know the backstory.
34:27
Speaker 3: He was offered twenty five million dollars by one of
34:29
Speaker 3: those evil companies. And I've spoken out a lot about
34:32
Speaker 3: said evil gold companies, and they are legit. They are evil,
34:36
Speaker 3: and they are evil, and they are hurting people at
34:39
Speaker 3: a level that I've never seen before. So I would
34:42
Speaker 3: say in this case, it's not as opportunistic as it
34:45
Speaker 3: would appear on the surface. There is some legitimacy in
34:48
Speaker 3: what he was trying to do, the gentleman that he
34:51
Speaker 3: had on his show, Dale Whittaker, I've interviewed on my
34:53
Speaker 3: show on Miles Franklin. What's that you too? Yeah, and
34:57
Speaker 3: he's no. He was the CFO of August of Medals
35:00
Speaker 3: and flat out names the other companies that I have
35:02
Speaker 3: been rallying against never mentioned their names. But I will
35:06
Speaker 3: tell you, honestly, Paul God is my witness, hand to God,
35:09
Speaker 3: I've seen the damage and carnage these companies do to people,
35:13
Speaker 3: all elderly folks in their iras exactly. It's flat out
35:17
Speaker 3: white collar crime to the nth degree. So I would say, no,
35:20
Speaker 3: I'm gonna give them. I'm gonna cut them some slack
35:22
Speaker 3: on that one.
35:23
Speaker 2: So legit business. I'm on the fence. I just don't know.
35:26
Speaker 3: I don't know, and I know that the person he's
35:28
Speaker 3: in business with, I love him like a brother. The
35:31
Speaker 3: guy he's in business with, and he's a good person.
35:34
Speaker 3: I say, it's legit.
35:35
Speaker 2: Thank you, Kyl. We appreciate it.
35:38
Speaker 3: Oh man, I wouldn't miss it. You're one of the
35:40
Speaker 3: smartest people I've ever met. I enjoy coming on this
35:43
Speaker 3: show with you. And anytime, I'm just a text away.
35:47
Speaker 3: We'll be talking soon, I hope. Until then, I'll look
35:49
Speaker 3: forward to picking up where we left off.
35:58
Speaker 1: If you like this video, like Abe, drop a comment
36:01
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36:04
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